1 00:00:03,680 --> 00:00:07,040 Speaker 1: From the heart of where innovation, money and power collive 2 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:12,319 Speaker 1: in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with 3 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:28,479 Speaker 1: Emily Jay I'm Taylor REGs in New York and for 4 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:31,639 Speaker 1: Emily Chang, this is Bloomberg Technology coming up for the 5 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: next hour, getting a better deal. Elon Musk now saying 6 00:00:35,360 --> 00:00:38,160 Speaker 1: that he might try to renegotiate the sale price for Twitter, 7 00:00:38,440 --> 00:00:41,480 Speaker 1: causing this doctor ball even further, as many questions remain 8 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:45,880 Speaker 1: over how viable this takeover actually is. Plus billions wiped 9 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 1: out in Terra USD in that crash, why can we 10 00:00:49,000 --> 00:00:50,720 Speaker 1: learn from it? What does it mean for the future 11 00:00:50,760 --> 00:00:53,360 Speaker 1: of stable coins. We'll discuss all of this and more 12 00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: with John Woo from Eva Labs and while Doctor Strange 13 00:00:56,800 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 1: in the multiverse of Madness, it talk box office record 14 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 1: here for the second straight week our movie theaters back. 15 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:06,440 Speaker 1: Are there still head winds ahead? More on that later 16 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:08,560 Speaker 1: this hour. But of course, and we cannot go on 17 00:01:08,760 --> 00:01:11,119 Speaker 1: for at least two minutes into this show without talking 18 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 1: about the latest drama between Elon Musk and of course 19 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:17,440 Speaker 1: his takeover and the proposed takeover of Twitter. Really interesting 20 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:20,200 Speaker 1: comments coming out of Elon Musk today hinting that he 21 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:22,640 Speaker 1: might want to renegotiate the deal at a lower price, 22 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:25,320 Speaker 1: saying that it quote wouldn't be out of the question. 23 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:28,679 Speaker 1: And these latest comments, of course coming from Elon Musk 24 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:32,560 Speaker 1: via a video conference at a summit over down in Miami, 25 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:35,399 Speaker 1: and it was hosted by a podcast called all In 26 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:38,640 Speaker 1: for more on these comments, of course, where the deal stands. 27 00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:40,440 Speaker 1: I'm so pleased to be joined here by our very 28 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:43,440 Speaker 1: own mandage seeing of course over from Bloomberg Intelligence and 29 00:01:43,520 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 1: Kurt Wagner joining us from Bloomberg News. Kurt, can I 30 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:48,920 Speaker 1: just start with you from someone who's been following and 31 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:51,559 Speaker 1: covering this company and of course Elon Musk and solve, 32 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:53,520 Speaker 1: how do you think just sort of the way that 33 00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:55,720 Speaker 1: this has played out in the drama that it's putting 34 00:01:55,720 --> 00:01:59,280 Speaker 1: really on the company too? I Mean, doesn't this just 35 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 1: feel like the mos Twitter thing of all time to happen? Right? 36 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 1: It's just, uh, this deal that just continues to be 37 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:09,720 Speaker 1: a roller coaster um and the fact that we now 38 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 1: have Ellen kind of coming out today and suggesting, Hey, 39 00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:15,840 Speaker 1: I might be you know, interested in negotiating a lower 40 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 1: price for this deal, even though I just offered something 41 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:20,799 Speaker 1: else a few weeks ago. It just all feels like 42 00:02:21,280 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 1: this is kind of cascading in a negative way for Twitter. 43 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:27,840 Speaker 1: I always have said that the worst case scenario for 44 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:29,639 Speaker 1: them would be that this deal falls apart and they're 45 00:02:29,720 --> 00:02:34,200 Speaker 1: kind of left standing there without anybody to come acquire them, 46 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:36,320 Speaker 1: And it feels like that's becoming more and more likely 47 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:38,400 Speaker 1: every day. And man, Deep, let me bring you in 48 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:40,920 Speaker 1: on that, because, similar to what we just heard from Kurt, 49 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:43,000 Speaker 1: I was hearing from Dan Eves over a web butch 50 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:46,680 Speaker 1: earlier saying again, serve this worst case scenario, they're going 51 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:49,000 Speaker 1: to be left at the altar alone. Right. How do 52 00:02:49,040 --> 00:02:51,200 Speaker 1: you think about the lack of no bidders and is 53 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: this Elong's way of negotiating down in price. I do think, 54 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:58,239 Speaker 1: you know, he doesn't have a way out of paying 55 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:02,080 Speaker 1: that billion dollars and breakup termin NTIONC in case he 56 00:03:02,120 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: wants to walk away. But at the same time, the 57 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:08,160 Speaker 1: odds of the deal happening are higher than they were 58 00:03:08,200 --> 00:03:10,919 Speaker 1: probably three weeks back when the deal was announced. And 59 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 1: the reason I say that is because at least he 60 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:16,520 Speaker 1: has six point five billion in commitments from you know, 61 00:03:16,639 --> 00:03:20,280 Speaker 1: co partners, and what he really wants to do here 62 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:23,320 Speaker 1: is to you know, move away from that margin loan. 63 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:27,320 Speaker 1: So right now he doesn't have about you know, trolls 64 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 1: to thirty billion dollars in financing. He has already sailed 65 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:34,079 Speaker 1: a bunch of sold a bunch of stock, so that's 66 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:37,200 Speaker 1: about you know, eleven billion. He's got six point five 67 00:03:37,240 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 1: billion in commitments, so it really wants to move away 68 00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:43,480 Speaker 1: from that troll flowing five billion margin loan. And that 69 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:47,280 Speaker 1: is what I think he's looking to renegotiate here to 70 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:50,480 Speaker 1: bring that price flaw. Very interesting and Curt, I think 71 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:52,680 Speaker 1: at the heart of this issue comes down to the 72 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 1: percent of users that are represented by bods when you 73 00:03:56,720 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: think about Twitter, whether that number is five or relative 74 00:03:59,920 --> 00:04:02,839 Speaker 1: to meta, snap TikTok, I mean sort of the other 75 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 1: social media covers companies that you cover. How does that 76 00:04:06,960 --> 00:04:11,400 Speaker 1: bought relationship fit into this narrative. Yeah, he talked a 77 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 1: lot about that today. He was at a conference in Miami. 78 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:17,640 Speaker 1: Are Bloomberg reporters. My colleagues were not at the conference, 79 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:19,800 Speaker 1: but we're able to listen in to the conference as 80 00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 1: it was happening, and he brought this up. You know, 81 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:25,000 Speaker 1: he was saying, Hey, this is an issue. Um, I 82 00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:27,719 Speaker 1: don't believe that the bots are less than five percent 83 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 1: of the total user base, which is what Twitter says, 84 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 1: and earnings and there are and Facebook says something similar. 85 00:04:32,360 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 1: To be clear, this is not a unique situation for Twitter, um, 86 00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 1: but Ellen has had an issue with bots. He has 87 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:41,880 Speaker 1: made it part of his kind of campaign of how 88 00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:43,680 Speaker 1: he's going to clean up the service and what he's 89 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 1: going to do to change Twitter. And he's saying he 90 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:48,040 Speaker 1: believes it's to be a lot higher. And we saw 91 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:50,719 Speaker 1: CEO Parague Augura Wall from Twitter kind of going back 92 00:04:50,720 --> 00:04:54,200 Speaker 1: and forth with Ellen today trying to explain, Hey, here's 93 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:58,600 Speaker 1: how we measure bots, and Elon replied with a poop emoji. Right. 94 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:02,960 Speaker 1: He clearly was not int listed in Auger Wall's explanation here, 95 00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:05,440 Speaker 1: and I think that's a big sign as to why he's, 96 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:07,880 Speaker 1: you know, saying this is on hold. He wants more answers. 97 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:10,240 Speaker 1: You're not allowed to use that emoji with me, Kurt, 98 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:13,680 Speaker 1: Neither is Mandy. Never. I would never do that, Mandy. 99 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:16,839 Speaker 1: You've been commenting on this. Similarly, you take a look 100 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:20,280 Speaker 1: at the bottom up analysis of these companies, the actual 101 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:24,919 Speaker 1: fundamentals user growth, revenue growth, profitability, How, MANDYEP do you 102 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:27,640 Speaker 1: think about the percentage of boughts at the impact on 103 00:05:27,680 --> 00:05:31,080 Speaker 1: the health of this company all. So clearly it's a 104 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:34,240 Speaker 1: bigger problem with Twitter. And when you take out let's 105 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 1: say five of the users are bought, so the e 106 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:40,360 Speaker 1: v per user goes up that Elon is paying with 107 00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 1: this deal. And when you look at a complex Snapchat 108 00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:45,719 Speaker 1: or Pinterest right now, the e v per user is 109 00:05:45,760 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 1: close to a hundred dollars there, as with the four 110 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:52,480 Speaker 1: billion deal, it comes down to around two hundred dollars 111 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:55,160 Speaker 1: for Twitter. And look, could have had this problem of 112 00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:59,000 Speaker 1: you know, basically exaggerating their user numbers and they had to, 113 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:02,120 Speaker 1: uh enough, come out and say that the actually using 114 00:06:02,200 --> 00:06:05,120 Speaker 1: numbers are lowers. So it's not a new problem. But clearly, 115 00:06:05,160 --> 00:06:07,800 Speaker 1: if you're valuing a company based on the total number 116 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:10,159 Speaker 1: of users, then you have to think about, you know, 117 00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:13,120 Speaker 1: revising the price lower because the actual number of users 118 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:16,280 Speaker 1: are lawer Amand it just a follow to you on this. 119 00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:19,000 Speaker 1: I think we're having a broader discussion, and this broader 120 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:23,120 Speaker 1: discussion is underway about if that price target set a 121 00:06:23,200 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 1: floor for how we think about valuing these companies. And 122 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:28,359 Speaker 1: the broader market is telling you, at least today in 123 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:32,279 Speaker 1: the last few weeks, we're rethinking valuations on every level, 124 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 1: not just because yields are higher on the discount rate falls, 125 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:38,599 Speaker 1: but the big valuations of growth at any cost. How 126 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:41,440 Speaker 1: then sort of is this played out in the also 127 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:43,920 Speaker 1: thinking about the way that we're valuing these companies and 128 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:48,159 Speaker 1: these tech companies. Well, so clearly, you know, social media 129 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:52,000 Speaker 1: companies aren't really growth companies anymore. If you have to 130 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:55,360 Speaker 1: think about you know, growth, really it has to the 131 00:06:55,400 --> 00:06:57,720 Speaker 1: next leg all social media would be more on the 132 00:06:57,720 --> 00:07:01,720 Speaker 1: meta word side right now. Valuation have gone down everywhere, 133 00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:05,440 Speaker 1: But I think Twitter isn't a high growth company anymore. Yes, 134 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:09,560 Speaker 1: it can sustain it EBITDA, but we're not talking about 135 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:13,200 Speaker 1: forty growth even if it goes private. So that is 136 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 1: where you know, you have to really think about which 137 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:19,120 Speaker 1: is actually growth going forward as opposed to what can 138 00:07:19,200 --> 00:07:22,120 Speaker 1: generate pre cash flow to pay off the you know, 139 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:25,360 Speaker 1: interest payment and current come back in here, I think 140 00:07:25,400 --> 00:07:27,760 Speaker 1: as you think about pushing this story forward, what do 141 00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:29,760 Speaker 1: you want to see next? What are you looking for 142 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:32,840 Speaker 1: if what can we do private that we couldn't do public? 143 00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:34,680 Speaker 1: What do you want to see in terms of leadership? 144 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 1: What are you really looking for to understand if this 145 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 1: company really can turn it around. Well, I think the 146 00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:44,560 Speaker 1: best way to grow the business is not going to 147 00:07:44,600 --> 00:07:48,800 Speaker 1: be to abandon advertising altogether, which is what it feels like. Ellen, 148 00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:51,640 Speaker 1: what kind of wants to do? He's talked about a 149 00:07:51,640 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 1: subscription product. I think that's fine, but really I think 150 00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:56,560 Speaker 1: what you need to do if your Twitters, you need 151 00:07:56,600 --> 00:07:58,440 Speaker 1: to figure out how to get the kind of user 152 00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:02,320 Speaker 1: data that works with targeted ads, that works with direct 153 00:08:02,440 --> 00:08:05,680 Speaker 1: response ads, right. That is what Facebook and Google do 154 00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:08,000 Speaker 1: really well. It's something that Twitter has always struggled with. 155 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:11,600 Speaker 1: They already have an ad business, They have advertisers who 156 00:08:11,640 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 1: are interested. They just need more granular data in order 157 00:08:14,600 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 1: to do that direct response type stuff. And now it's 158 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:19,760 Speaker 1: easier said than done. But I think that's the one 159 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:21,440 Speaker 1: thing that if they can figure that out, I think 160 00:08:21,440 --> 00:08:26,160 Speaker 1: the business could really benefit from that. Mandy, do you agree, Well, clearly, 161 00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:29,240 Speaker 1: I think subscriptions is part of the story here, and 162 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 1: but we've seen subscription businesses aren't easy. Look at Netflix. 163 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:35,280 Speaker 1: You know Netflix is moving into adds. Do you really 164 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 1: need a combination of ads and subscriptions? Moving away completely 165 00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 1: from ads would be a mistake. Really appreciate that both 166 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 1: of you great insight fundamental analysis. So appreciate the conversation 167 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:50,600 Speaker 1: Mandy seeing of course, and our very Kurt Wagner out 168 00:08:50,640 --> 00:09:03,320 Speaker 1: there in our beautiful San Francisco office. We want to 169 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:05,560 Speaker 1: talk now about a new social media law out of 170 00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 1: Texas that has many in the tech world fearful of 171 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:11,400 Speaker 1: what might be allowed to flow on your feed all 172 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 1: in the name of censorship. Groups representing Twitter, Facebook, and 173 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:19,360 Speaker 1: YouTube warned the Supreme Court that unless this Texas law 174 00:09:19,520 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 1: is blocked, anything from Russia propaganda as well as neo 175 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:26,559 Speaker 1: Nazi post denying the Holocaust could show up. Insiders of 176 00:09:26,640 --> 00:09:29,480 Speaker 1: course now warning that these extremest views could cause social 177 00:09:29,520 --> 00:09:33,400 Speaker 1: media companies to lose millions in advertising for more. I'm 178 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:37,640 Speaker 1: joined back Techonomy founder David Kirkpatrick, who thankfully you've been 179 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 1: sort of all over this and I am curious to 180 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:42,560 Speaker 1: think about. I believe a Supreme board who can decide 181 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 1: what cases they want to hear and what cases they 182 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:47,800 Speaker 1: want to rule on. What at the heart of this 183 00:09:47,840 --> 00:09:51,719 Speaker 1: issue really is going on for some of these tech companies, Well, 184 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 1: thanks Taylor. Basically, what the tech industry is asking the 185 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:59,959 Speaker 1: Supreme Court to rule that a tech that a federal 186 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 1: appeals courts ruling last week which allowed this law to 187 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:06,960 Speaker 1: take effect, was it must be removed and vacated because 188 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:11,520 Speaker 1: the impact that it would have on tech companies is 189 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:14,800 Speaker 1: so extreme that it would almost make it impossible to 190 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:19,720 Speaker 1: operate any kind of website where there is conversation if 191 00:10:19,760 --> 00:10:22,600 Speaker 1: that site has more than fifty million users. It's a 192 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:30,920 Speaker 1: truly inane, idiotic and illogical and crazy effort to change 193 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:35,120 Speaker 1: the rules for what seems to be just partisan advantage. 194 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:38,040 Speaker 1: It talks us about the advertising, of course, that we 195 00:10:38,080 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 1: mentioned in the introduction. The companies, of course benefit from 196 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 1: the advertising. What would stop sort of that flow of advertising? 197 00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:49,960 Speaker 1: In your opinion, well, that's a great question, because obviously 198 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:54,800 Speaker 1: advertisers only want to appear in an environment that's rational 199 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 1: and makes their products look good in contexts. If if 200 00:10:59,400 --> 00:11:02,960 Speaker 1: websites are prevented from taking down any kind of extreme 201 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:06,640 Speaker 1: statement by any user, it could really make these sites 202 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:12,040 Speaker 1: much less kind of culturable for advertising, and I could 203 00:11:12,080 --> 00:11:14,560 Speaker 1: see it having an effect, although the problem is even 204 00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 1: more basic than that. Essentially, the companies are being told 205 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:21,720 Speaker 1: by this Texas law, if it were to really take effect, 206 00:11:22,160 --> 00:11:25,000 Speaker 1: that they can't make any real decision about what kind 207 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:29,120 Speaker 1: of contact flows. Content flows across their own networks. But 208 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:32,560 Speaker 1: these are commercial companies who built these commercial websites for 209 00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:35,880 Speaker 1: commercial reasons. They have every right under the Constitution to 210 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:38,720 Speaker 1: operate their sites as they see fit, and this law 211 00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:42,000 Speaker 1: attempts to remove that right from them, which is just 212 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 1: plain wrong and and on constitution clear, Let's talk about 213 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:48,640 Speaker 1: something else I'm reading here in your notes. It really 214 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:51,480 Speaker 1: speaks out to me that it allows people to also 215 00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:55,480 Speaker 1: sue these companies as well if they're censored for their viewpoints. 216 00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:58,080 Speaker 1: How does this sort of open up and I know 217 00:11:58,160 --> 00:12:00,160 Speaker 1: that we're not lawyers here to sort of open the 218 00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:02,720 Speaker 1: floodgates for these potential lawsuits as well. And then the 219 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:06,280 Speaker 1: impact that has on businesses and consumers. Well, there's so 220 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:09,240 Speaker 1: many crazy aspects to this law, but one way to 221 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:12,240 Speaker 1: think about it is that that companies wouldn't be able 222 00:12:12,280 --> 00:12:14,960 Speaker 1: to do well no matter what they did. They would 223 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:16,840 Speaker 1: be damned if they do and damned if they don't, 224 00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:21,480 Speaker 1: because the law allows anyone who's viewpoint, which is the 225 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 1: term they use, has been used as a basis for 226 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:28,240 Speaker 1: removing their content, to sue the company. Okay, however, if 227 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:33,720 Speaker 1: those viewpoints are hateful, racist, uh, show some kind of 228 00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:37,120 Speaker 1: libel or whatever. They will then probably which they're but 229 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 1: they're prohibited from taking them down. Remember, people who are 230 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:44,280 Speaker 1: affected by those posts will almost certainly then sue the 231 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:48,800 Speaker 1: sites because they are being affected by these posts that 232 00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:52,120 Speaker 1: have not been removed. So in effect, the sites can't 233 00:12:52,160 --> 00:12:56,959 Speaker 1: win either way. It just underscores yet again how fundamentally 234 00:12:56,960 --> 00:13:00,600 Speaker 1: illogical the law is. But it's worth remembering. It seems 235 00:13:00,679 --> 00:13:03,319 Speaker 1: like the whole point of these laws, and there was 236 00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:06,080 Speaker 1: an attempt at a similar law in Florida, is to 237 00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:12,000 Speaker 1: get back at the website, particularly Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, etcetera, 238 00:13:12,320 --> 00:13:15,360 Speaker 1: because they're perceived to have an anti conservative bias. And 239 00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:19,760 Speaker 1: the conservative majority in the Texas legislature has passed this 240 00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:23,400 Speaker 1: law and the conservative Texas governor has signed it. But 241 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:27,800 Speaker 1: the fact is it simply cannot work, and it's it's 242 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:32,679 Speaker 1: being done for pure political partisanship and and and without 243 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:37,400 Speaker 1: enough thought. David, it's interesting you mentioned Meta of course 244 00:13:37,440 --> 00:13:41,320 Speaker 1: formerly we knew that as Facebook, you mentioned YouTube. We're 245 00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:43,439 Speaker 1: talking a lot about Twitter of course right now when 246 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:45,920 Speaker 1: in the sitegeist with Elon Musk of course stepping in 247 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:49,839 Speaker 1: and giving a price potentially to take private of all 248 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:52,960 Speaker 1: the companies you've been studying for decades over the years, 249 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:56,360 Speaker 1: who would be most impacted and who is most susceptible 250 00:13:56,520 --> 00:13:59,199 Speaker 1: to getting a hit? Of course from this, well, the 251 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 1: law is meant to a li to any company that 252 00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:04,080 Speaker 1: has fifty million or more users, But it really is 253 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:07,960 Speaker 1: intended it's aimed at Facebook and Twitter primarily and YouTube 254 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:11,280 Speaker 1: because those are the sites where speech, so to speak, 255 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:15,760 Speaker 1: is most frequently taking place, and they do frequently make 256 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:22,800 Speaker 1: judgments when pate speech or political incitement or violence is 257 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:26,880 Speaker 1: endorsed or whatever to remove posts now, but it would 258 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:30,360 Speaker 1: it could affect any site that has over fifty million users, 259 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:34,840 Speaker 1: which could be for example, Netflix or Disney Plus if 260 00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:37,720 Speaker 1: if there's any kind of content or conversation, well, I 261 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 1: guess those are probably not good examples. But any site 262 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:43,760 Speaker 1: that has any kind of dialogue, say the Near Times 263 00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 1: or any kind of Bluebird for that matter, if if 264 00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:50,200 Speaker 1: the number of users is big enough, there will be 265 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 1: no allowance for moderation. In effect, so it's it's taking 266 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,840 Speaker 1: away a fundamental right for any company that is attempting 267 00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 1: to foster a safe and rational conversation online. David, what 268 00:15:05,240 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: do you think is you think about sort of the 269 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:10,680 Speaker 1: next step pushing the story forward. Do you want to 270 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:15,560 Speaker 1: see changes to the fundamental businesses so that this isn't 271 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:18,120 Speaker 1: an issue. We we talked a lot about Twitter having 272 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:21,040 Speaker 1: its crisis that it's going through right now. What are 273 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 1: you really looking for as you look to these companies, Well, 274 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:29,200 Speaker 1: there are really big questions, and the reason the situation 275 00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:32,960 Speaker 1: has arisen does flow in part from the failure of 276 00:15:33,080 --> 00:15:37,120 Speaker 1: management by these companies. I don't think that Facebook in particular, 277 00:15:37,320 --> 00:15:40,640 Speaker 1: or any of the social media companies for the most part, 278 00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:43,840 Speaker 1: although some extent I'd leave Snap and maybe even TikTok 279 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 1: out of this. But certainly Facebook and Twitter have not 280 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,400 Speaker 1: done as good a job as they should have of 281 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:52,760 Speaker 1: articulating what is allowed and what is not allowed and 282 00:15:52,840 --> 00:15:56,360 Speaker 1: sticking to very clear standards. From the beginning. They let 283 00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:59,600 Speaker 1: themselves get into a place where there's a sense of 284 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 1: k us and I think part of it was they 285 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:04,680 Speaker 1: were trying to placate the Trump administration and didn't want 286 00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:07,760 Speaker 1: to seem to be anti conservative, and they really allowed 287 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:10,840 Speaker 1: a lot. I think they allowed a lot of inappropriate 288 00:16:10,880 --> 00:16:15,000 Speaker 1: content that was supposedly conservative but was really inciting um. 289 00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:17,920 Speaker 1: But now because they took down enough of it that 290 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:21,160 Speaker 1: it got the right angry there are legislators all over 291 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:24,640 Speaker 1: the country trying to take these rash moves against them, 292 00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:28,720 Speaker 1: really out of partisan dislike. But I think the long 293 00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: term issue is the companies have to establish clear standards 294 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:37,880 Speaker 1: for what is and is not allowed, and communicated clearly 295 00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:41,200 Speaker 1: and stick to it. It's very, very hard. I don't 296 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:43,720 Speaker 1: think most of these companies anticipated when they got into 297 00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:47,000 Speaker 1: these businesses how complicated the decisions they'd have to make 298 00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:49,880 Speaker 1: would become. But that's where they are, and that's just 299 00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:52,880 Speaker 1: the fact a complicated issue. We're grateful that you're here 300 00:16:53,040 --> 00:16:56,320 Speaker 1: to give us your expert analysis and insights to Economy 301 00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:59,520 Speaker 1: founder David Kirkpatrick really appreciate it, and we're going to 302 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 1: have more to come, of course, including a report on 303 00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:04,680 Speaker 1: the impact of well the China lockdowns. What that means 304 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:32,359 Speaker 1: for us, This is Bloomberg. China's economy is paying the 305 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:36,000 Speaker 1: price for the government's COVID zero policy, with industrial output 306 00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:39,040 Speaker 1: and consumer spending sliding into the worst level since the 307 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:42,760 Speaker 1: pandemic began. Our very own Bloomberg Stephen Eagle has more 308 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:49,040 Speaker 1: clear sign China's economy contracted sharply in April as continued 309 00:17:49,119 --> 00:17:54,679 Speaker 1: COVID zero lockdowns hammered industrial and consumer activity nationwide with 310 00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:58,719 Speaker 1: its too wealthiest cities, though Shanghai and Beijing under COVID 311 00:17:58,760 --> 00:18:03,359 Speaker 1: restrictions read tails. Sales nationwide plummeted a worse than expected 312 00:18:03,480 --> 00:18:06,520 Speaker 1: eleven point one percent last month as tens of millions 313 00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:10,440 Speaker 1: of people were confined to their homes. Factory output two tanked, 314 00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:14,360 Speaker 1: falling two point nine percent, the largest and only second 315 00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:18,000 Speaker 1: year of a year monthly contraction of industrial production in 316 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:23,080 Speaker 1: thirty two years. Yes, since n now, the consensus estimate 317 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:26,600 Speaker 1: was for a modest rise, but clearly China's industrial might 318 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 1: was slowed by the lockdowns and those supply chain issues. 319 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:34,480 Speaker 1: China's nationwide jobless rate also taking up to six point 320 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:37,879 Speaker 1: one percent now. Shanghai has been in lockdown for nearly 321 00:18:37,960 --> 00:18:40,919 Speaker 1: two months, but this week is starting to relax some 322 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:44,720 Speaker 1: of the most strict curbs as COVID caseloads and inter 323 00:18:44,800 --> 00:18:49,840 Speaker 1: community infections start to fall. Now. Beijing has signaled policymakers 324 00:18:50,200 --> 00:18:53,239 Speaker 1: will step up support for the economy, as evidenced by 325 00:18:53,280 --> 00:18:57,159 Speaker 1: the PBOC on Sunday, cutting mortgage rates for first time homebuyers. 326 00:18:57,400 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 1: China's National Bureau of Statistics, also admitting that COVID outbreaks 327 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,399 Speaker 1: in April had a big impact on the economy, but 328 00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:08,919 Speaker 1: claims that the negative effect will be short term and 329 00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:14,240 Speaker 1: that economic activity should start recovering gradually. Still, the economic 330 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:18,360 Speaker 1: shocks from she dimpaying zero tolerance approach to virus containment 331 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 1: are obvious, pushing China's ambush ambitious full year growth target 332 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:25,679 Speaker 1: of around five and a half percent further out of reach. 333 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 1: Stephen Engel, Bloomberg News, Hong Kong are very on Bloomberg 334 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:33,920 Speaker 1: Steve Nigle. Now, of course, talking about those supply chains 335 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,520 Speaker 1: ahead of the port of Los Angeles, cargo flows from 336 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:39,719 Speaker 1: China to the busiest port in the US appear consistent 337 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:43,240 Speaker 1: despite that ongoing pandemic. Here's some of what Jean Siroka 338 00:19:43,359 --> 00:19:47,680 Speaker 1: told Bloomberg. This is gonna take some time. There's an 339 00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:50,639 Speaker 1: episode just about every day that impacts us in the 340 00:19:50,680 --> 00:19:53,680 Speaker 1: supply chain, whether it's on the ground, the atrocities in 341 00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:59,600 Speaker 1: Ukraine impacting energy and agriculture goods flow, the lockdowns in Shanghai, 342 00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:04,920 Speaker 1: point three percent inflation, producer prices going up eleven All 343 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:10,520 Speaker 1: of this is in the supply chain equation. Soroka says 344 00:20:10,520 --> 00:20:12,359 Speaker 1: that there are no imminent signs of course of a 345 00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: slowdown in demand from American consumers based on the number 346 00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:19,119 Speaker 1: of full shipping containers that they are seen arrived in 347 00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 1: the port. Coming up. We're still on that theme. Inflation, 348 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:25,440 Speaker 1: of course, still on the rise, interest rates climbing, tech 349 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:28,240 Speaker 1: stocks falling. What's next on the horizon, We have all 350 00:20:28,320 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 1: of that more and next. This is Bloomberg. This is 351 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:49,240 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Technology. I'm Taylor Regg's in New York and for 352 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:51,720 Speaker 1: Emily Chang. Let's get an update now on the markets. 353 00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:54,440 Speaker 1: The sell off, Katie of course still joining us now, 354 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:57,320 Speaker 1: Katie Greifeld. It just continues. I mean, we're looking to 355 00:20:57,359 --> 00:21:00,280 Speaker 1: attack in the NAZAC one hundred often addition a one 356 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:03,639 Speaker 1: percent today hard to catch a break. Absolutely, Friday's bounce 357 00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:05,880 Speaker 1: it came, and it went very quickly, of the SMP 358 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:09,080 Speaker 1: five hundred, ending four tenths of percent lower. Big tech 359 00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:11,919 Speaker 1: felt even bigger. You have the NASZAC one hundred finishing 360 00:21:12,160 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 1: well one point two percent lower. And that was even 361 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:16,840 Speaker 1: as some of the steam came out of treasury yields, 362 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:19,840 Speaker 1: the ten year treasury yield falling about four basis points 363 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:22,920 Speaker 1: or so on the day. And you have bitcoin it's 364 00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 1: rally a little bit after hours, a little bit of 365 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:28,960 Speaker 1: a nudge. But yesterday or this current day, Monday, it 366 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:32,360 Speaker 1: fell over three percent. You can see it's below that 367 00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:36,080 Speaker 1: thirty thou dollar per coin mark. And what called my 368 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:39,439 Speaker 1: eyes that you actually saw the cbo ET Volatility Index, 369 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:41,800 Speaker 1: the VIX. It actually fell a little bit today it's 370 00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:46,520 Speaker 1: mac below thirty. That's still above its one year average 371 00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:49,159 Speaker 1: about twenty one, but still a little bit of a 372 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:51,840 Speaker 1: breath there today even as you did see that sell 373 00:21:51,840 --> 00:21:54,200 Speaker 1: off resumed. But the question becomes, I mean, how much 374 00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:58,080 Speaker 1: can volatility really fall as stocks continue to fall. If 375 00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:00,479 Speaker 1: you look year to day, you can see the NAZAC 376 00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:03,920 Speaker 1: one hundred down about twenty five per cent, so big tech, 377 00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:06,359 Speaker 1: those growth names really taking the brunt of the selling. 378 00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 1: The SMP it continues to flirt with that bear market 379 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:13,960 Speaker 1: again that is at it's getting closer tailor at about 380 00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:17,239 Speaker 1: six year today losses. And of course Katie were so 381 00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: excited to have you tomorrow joining us on Bloomberg markets. 382 00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:22,760 Speaker 1: I can't close from two to five pm. It is 383 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 1: our pleasure, so really appreciate that. Katie gry felt, of 384 00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 1: course joining us here with more on these markets and 385 00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:30,480 Speaker 1: then sort of leads us right into our next conversation. 386 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:32,440 Speaker 1: We've talked a lot about this sell off. What does 387 00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:35,680 Speaker 1: it mean for a new round of fundraising? Right when 388 00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:37,879 Speaker 1: you think about all the belt tightening around the corner, 389 00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 1: does that cascade into another big problem? Doesn't mean to 390 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:44,200 Speaker 1: slow down in enterprise technology spending? Does this drive down 391 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:47,679 Speaker 1: another leg in the industries earnings outlook? Well, if you 392 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:50,720 Speaker 1: have earnings, that's the first problem with some of these companies. 393 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,359 Speaker 1: Be Capital co founder and managing partner Raj Gongly of 394 00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:56,920 Speaker 1: course joining us here for more. Can we just start 395 00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:59,680 Speaker 1: big picture when you think about just the pressure of 396 00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:03,160 Speaker 1: broad based on these valuations, maybe it's risk of recession, 397 00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:06,560 Speaker 1: maybe it's rising yield. How are you thinking about portfolios 398 00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:09,160 Speaker 1: of some of these new companies and well, the pressure 399 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:11,359 Speaker 1: now they may not be worth what we thought they were. 400 00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:14,720 Speaker 1: I think that it's the exact right question that everyone's 401 00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:18,159 Speaker 1: asking in VC is um what are your company is 402 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: truly worth? You may have paid something for them six 403 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:23,720 Speaker 1: or twelve months ago, but I think where the market 404 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 1: is going is actually very healthy. We're resetting to a 405 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,280 Speaker 1: set of valuations that are going to make more sense 406 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:33,480 Speaker 1: and actually help us build better companies. And while there's 407 00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 1: going to be some short term pain. I think that 408 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:37,919 Speaker 1: eventually you're going to see some of the sectors that 409 00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:43,359 Speaker 1: are traditionally resilient, like healthcare cybersecurity bounced back first, but 410 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:44,920 Speaker 1: we're gonna have to go through a bit of pain, 411 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,719 Speaker 1: and a path to profitability is going to be one 412 00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:50,800 Speaker 1: of the most important discussions that everyone is happening. Talk 413 00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:52,840 Speaker 1: to me about that. So I remember, I think I 414 00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:55,280 Speaker 1: was in San Francisco in and we were talking a 415 00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:57,080 Speaker 1: lot about we work at the time, and it was 416 00:23:57,119 --> 00:24:00,520 Speaker 1: about growth at any costs no longer works. That any 417 00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:03,160 Speaker 1: cost has to be reevaluated because we need to see 418 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,680 Speaker 1: some free cash flow soon and we need to see 419 00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:08,400 Speaker 1: it sooner rather than later. Is that the same conversation 420 00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:11,040 Speaker 1: we continue to have now here. You're exactly right. I 421 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:14,520 Speaker 1: mean growth at any cost has never worked. Uh, it's 422 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:18,119 Speaker 1: I don't think we are dramatically shifting to survival at 423 00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:20,520 Speaker 1: any costs. You still want growth, but you want growth 424 00:24:20,520 --> 00:24:23,320 Speaker 1: at a much more resonable cost um. And what that 425 00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:25,920 Speaker 1: means is thinking looking at things like the burn rate 426 00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:28,199 Speaker 1: of the business are going to be really important. I mean, 427 00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:31,080 Speaker 1: that's things that if you're not a profitable business you've 428 00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:33,399 Speaker 1: got to be managing or burn during times like this. 429 00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:37,240 Speaker 1: And frankly, if you're a late stage business that was 430 00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:40,280 Speaker 1: hoping to IPO, you better have at least eighteen months 431 00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:43,280 Speaker 1: of runway because IPO markets could take a while to 432 00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 1: come back. I've been reading a lot of to sort 433 00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:48,720 Speaker 1: of the market analysis about how to prepare for a 434 00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 1: recession if it's conserving capital of even if a recession 435 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:54,719 Speaker 1: isn't company coming, how do you plan for it? How 436 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:58,040 Speaker 1: do you think about that capital, the balance sheet, the employees, 437 00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:00,840 Speaker 1: the culture, and making sure that the able around you 438 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:04,879 Speaker 1: are appropriate. What should some of these big founders be 439 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,520 Speaker 1: thinking about when they're trying to manage a business through 440 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:11,720 Speaker 1: this volatility? You know, I think these big founders, that's 441 00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:14,680 Speaker 1: where they are because they're great leaders. And I think 442 00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:18,000 Speaker 1: over the next six, twelve, eighteen months, you're going to see, 443 00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:20,439 Speaker 1: you know who amongst this group really knows how to 444 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 1: manage and management morale is going to be difficult when 445 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:27,840 Speaker 1: some of morale was built around if you're a public company, 446 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,080 Speaker 1: it was built around stocks and stock options, and if 447 00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:32,560 Speaker 1: your private company was still built around your shares and 448 00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:35,359 Speaker 1: the valuation in the private market, and now you're gonna 449 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:38,720 Speaker 1: have to motivate employees who primarily were being paid through 450 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,240 Speaker 1: stock private or public, and motivate them to work harder 451 00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:45,800 Speaker 1: than potentially they've even ever worked before in a much 452 00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,159 Speaker 1: more challenging environment. I think the great leaders are the 453 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:50,280 Speaker 1: ones who are going to do it by telling people 454 00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:53,200 Speaker 1: that stay focused on our purpose and our mission, and 455 00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:55,240 Speaker 1: we'll all make it through this together and we'll come 456 00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:58,240 Speaker 1: out the other side of better company. We've long often 457 00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:01,720 Speaker 1: talked about the if you want to use the word bubble, 458 00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:03,520 Speaker 1: and we don't have to use that word, but a 459 00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:07,960 Speaker 1: lot of that sort of inflation of the evaluations came 460 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:13,000 Speaker 1: from too much capital chasing too few too much cash right, 461 00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:15,919 Speaker 1: chasing too few companies. How do you think about the 462 00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:18,679 Speaker 1: deployment of that cash and the best use of cash? 463 00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:23,119 Speaker 1: Then at this moment, well since sinceurity went there, and 464 00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:27,000 Speaker 1: you use the word, what I would say is that, Yeah, 465 00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:30,280 Speaker 1: what I would say is that, um, you know, cash 466 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:33,399 Speaker 1: now is going to be for very core activities. You 467 00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,040 Speaker 1: seem businesses that have gone into a lot of non 468 00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:39,720 Speaker 1: core activities. I think you're gonna see a retrenchment to 469 00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:42,760 Speaker 1: the court. You're gonna see companies focus on the regions 470 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:46,080 Speaker 1: that really makes sense and already are profitable or have 471 00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:49,200 Speaker 1: a shorter path to profitability. And you're going to see 472 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,520 Speaker 1: more add on businesses that can be launched for much 473 00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:55,400 Speaker 1: lower cost first things that are far from the core. 474 00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 1: You know, specifically for us in software, healthcare, and fintech, 475 00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:01,840 Speaker 1: the three areas that we best. We think healthcare is 476 00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:04,159 Speaker 1: probably one of the most Brazilian sectors. We're going to 477 00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:07,240 Speaker 1: continue to invest there, and frankly, for some of our 478 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:09,680 Speaker 1: businesses that have a lot of capital, this is the 479 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 1: time's play offense and look at how you can acquire 480 00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 1: companies for lower valuations. And I think you'll see corporates 481 00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:18,520 Speaker 1: do that too over the next twelve months. I really 482 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:21,480 Speaker 1: appreciate your time, your perspective, your knowledge and insight. Speak 483 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:26,360 Speaker 1: Capital co founder and managing partner Gongli thank you. As always, 484 00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 1: of course, we want to go back to maybe private companies, 485 00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:31,360 Speaker 1: back to some of the big public companies that we've 486 00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:35,119 Speaker 1: been following. Microsoft is set to boost employees paychecks in 487 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:38,679 Speaker 1: an effort to combat inflation. The company announced its plans 488 00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:42,000 Speaker 1: to nearly double its budget for employee salaries and boost 489 00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:44,760 Speaker 1: the range of stock compensation it gives to some workers. 490 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:47,959 Speaker 1: By at least tw This is all in an effort 491 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:51,360 Speaker 1: to retain staff. The move said is to mainly affect 492 00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:55,120 Speaker 1: early to mid career employees, all at the software giants. 493 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:57,720 Speaker 1: And of course, coming up, what is the future of 494 00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:01,040 Speaker 1: stable coins after the Terro Luna to blackled last week, 495 00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:17,359 Speaker 1: we'll discuss this bloomberg time now for our crypto report, 496 00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:19,320 Speaker 1: we have to get back to that meltdown that followed 497 00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:24,040 Speaker 1: the Terra usc algorithmic stable coins collapse, and total investors 498 00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:27,320 Speaker 1: may have lost as much as forty two billion dollars 499 00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:30,600 Speaker 1: in that crush. This is according to Elliptic. Our crypto 500 00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:33,320 Speaker 1: contributortional E. Bostick is here with more. And I think 501 00:28:33,359 --> 00:28:37,240 Speaker 1: my favorite line from Katie Greyfield on Twitter was ust 502 00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 1: no longer means US treasuries. How the heck is this 503 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:42,720 Speaker 1: all about crypti? Yeah, I mean that's a great question, 504 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:44,800 Speaker 1: especially because there's a lot of stable coins to keep 505 00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:48,240 Speaker 1: an eye on, US, d C, Tether and USC is 506 00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:50,240 Speaker 1: the one we're certainly talking about now because that's the 507 00:28:50,280 --> 00:28:52,320 Speaker 1: one where the DP pagging has really led to a 508 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:56,840 Speaker 1: lot of losses among the Terra ecosystem investors. And you 509 00:28:56,880 --> 00:29:01,520 Speaker 1: have Tara now talking about restructuring the plan here so 510 00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:03,760 Speaker 1: that people can recoup some of their funds potentially or 511 00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 1: at least start to build on the network and a 512 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:07,959 Speaker 1: broad away. But if you look since the initial d pegging, 513 00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:13,240 Speaker 1: almost nine percent of a decline and ripple effects indeed 514 00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:16,640 Speaker 1: across the DeFi ecosystem. But let's just take a look 515 00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:19,719 Speaker 1: at bitcoin itself for a second tailor, because Bitcoin is 516 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:22,800 Speaker 1: of course the largest of cryptocurrencies. We've seen it bounce 517 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:26,080 Speaker 1: back quite a bit since the initial fears about the 518 00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 1: crypto ecosystem that large, and now only down about sixteen 519 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:31,920 Speaker 1: percent over the nine day period. We have seven days 520 00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:34,600 Speaker 1: of gains. We have about three percent worth of losses 521 00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 1: over twenty four hour period, but again just coming off 522 00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:40,920 Speaker 1: that low again but still just hovering around thirty's and 523 00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:43,440 Speaker 1: such a wild swing show. You've been all over it, 524 00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:44,960 Speaker 1: so I want you to stick with me here. I 525 00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,360 Speaker 1: want to bring in John Wu of course into this conversation, 526 00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:50,200 Speaker 1: president of all the Labs of course, lead developer of 527 00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:54,360 Speaker 1: the Avalanche blockchain, and just big picture to kick us off. 528 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:56,960 Speaker 1: I think some of the biggest questions is if it's 529 00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:59,600 Speaker 1: a stable coin and it's not stable, what is it? 530 00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:02,800 Speaker 1: How do you think about that. Well, first of all, 531 00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:05,400 Speaker 1: there's a couple of types of stable coins. There's ones 532 00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:08,600 Speaker 1: that are actually backed by US dollar reserves like USDC, 533 00:30:09,280 --> 00:30:12,640 Speaker 1: and then these algorithmic stable coins like the Terra Luna, 534 00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:16,680 Speaker 1: which was, you know, an innovative experiment. Unfortunately, we can 535 00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:20,400 Speaker 1: all say it didn't work out. Um, But in the 536 00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:23,440 Speaker 1: back of all of our minds, I think every crypto native, 537 00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:26,760 Speaker 1: web free person really has a hope that someone could 538 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:29,320 Speaker 1: figure out a minetary system or a stable coin. It 539 00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 1: doesn't rely on existing things that you know, are traditionally 540 00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:36,880 Speaker 1: out there as reserves. So we all rooted for it. 541 00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:40,520 Speaker 1: Unfortunately it did not work out. It's still very early 542 00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:42,720 Speaker 1: in the space and I'm sure there will be more 543 00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:46,440 Speaker 1: experiments and innovation now. Uh. In terms of the latest 544 00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:50,000 Speaker 1: restructuring plan, from why I understand, um, they are trying 545 00:30:50,040 --> 00:30:53,720 Speaker 1: to figure out who are the smaller holders and use 546 00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:57,240 Speaker 1: whatever is left in reserves to basically give back to 547 00:30:57,280 --> 00:30:59,680 Speaker 1: those smaller holders. So that would be my number one 548 00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:01,840 Speaker 1: thing this point. It is what it is, but use 549 00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:04,960 Speaker 1: whatever reserves to give back to the retail people that 550 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:07,120 Speaker 1: were left holding the bag, if you will, And that's 551 00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:09,360 Speaker 1: the best thing to do at this point. I want 552 00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:11,280 Speaker 1: to ask you more about that, John, because what does 553 00:31:11,320 --> 00:31:15,520 Speaker 1: it say about the restructuring of crypto ecosystem? Who should 554 00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:17,760 Speaker 1: get paid, who has claim on the assets at the 555 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:21,320 Speaker 1: end of the day, and what does the what does 556 00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:24,440 Speaker 1: the company, what does the protocol actually owe to its investors? 557 00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:28,080 Speaker 1: How does this play out? Sure that needs more clarity 558 00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:31,640 Speaker 1: over time, But to me, at least from a common 559 00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:36,560 Speaker 1: sense perspective, the this is the one industry where the 560 00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 1: retail investor have actually call it front run investor institutions. 561 00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:45,480 Speaker 1: For years, it's been retail investors globally that's supported this 562 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:52,080 Speaker 1: ecosystem until very recently, if you will so Um philosophically, 563 00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,640 Speaker 1: I think again, the right move is to use whatever 564 00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:58,080 Speaker 1: is left to figure out who are the small bag 565 00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:01,560 Speaker 1: holders or wallet holders and try to make them whole 566 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,800 Speaker 1: as much as possible. So what about the idea that 567 00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:08,120 Speaker 1: other stable coins can be made with new models? You 568 00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 1: talked about experimentation here for a second. To what extent 569 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:14,960 Speaker 1: does the industry needs something like an algorithmic stable coin 570 00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:18,880 Speaker 1: or a partial algorithmic stable coin in order to scale, John, 571 00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,120 Speaker 1: So the industry right now does not need it. What's 572 00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:26,080 Speaker 1: going to come out of this situation is USDC, which 573 00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:28,360 Speaker 1: has a lot of transparency backed one to one with 574 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:32,160 Speaker 1: the US dollar. Wild game market share um USDT was 575 00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:35,240 Speaker 1: tested a little bit um, but they need to come 576 00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:38,040 Speaker 1: out with better transparency and they will do that. And 577 00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:40,440 Speaker 1: then you have other stable coins, you know, facts, so 578 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:44,520 Speaker 1: they've all held up. Actually, so it would be nice 579 00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:48,400 Speaker 1: to have an algorithm stable coin. But just like any economy, 580 00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:52,000 Speaker 1: economy needs a certain unit of account for a medium 581 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,120 Speaker 1: of exchange that is stable and not as volatile, and 582 00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:57,640 Speaker 1: for now, maybe one that's tied to the US dollar 583 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:00,720 Speaker 1: and has transparency is the best thing. You know. I'm 584 00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:04,440 Speaker 1: curious about certainty in other ways besides regulatory I'm curious 585 00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:09,440 Speaker 1: about the technology itself, potential hacks, potential chains, depegging, if 586 00:33:09,440 --> 00:33:12,160 Speaker 1: it's a stable coin. I'm wondering about your thoughts on 587 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:16,280 Speaker 1: Layer one protocols in general year and investor appetite for 588 00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:19,480 Speaker 1: them after some of the mishaps we've seen. Great, great question, 589 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,000 Speaker 1: And if you look at UM the space and the 590 00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:26,840 Speaker 1: many cycles, let's not confuse cyclical issues with secular growth 591 00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:31,160 Speaker 1: in times like this this when actually the quality companies 592 00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:35,280 Speaker 1: or quality protocols or quality applications that actually gain market 593 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:39,200 Speaker 1: share and have even more innovation and build better UM. 594 00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:42,400 Speaker 1: So my opinion is it's unfortunate. No one likes to 595 00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:45,840 Speaker 1: see crypto asset prices go down, but the benefit of 596 00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:50,000 Speaker 1: it is the guys or the people with quality products 597 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:53,360 Speaker 1: to have better utility and are really building something real 598 00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:56,640 Speaker 1: will take market share and also come out stronger and 599 00:33:56,680 --> 00:34:00,600 Speaker 1: provide more utility in the end. Also when it comes utility, 600 00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:02,800 Speaker 1: you know, I know tomorrow in our Crypto show, our 601 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:06,560 Speaker 1: weekly Crypto show one thirty every week on Tuesday's, we're 602 00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:09,520 Speaker 1: gonna be talking about etherory on the merge and gas 603 00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:11,840 Speaker 1: fees and whether they can come down in light of 604 00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,640 Speaker 1: new projects. I mean, I'm wondering how this also pertains 605 00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:18,160 Speaker 1: to you and Avalanche and the ability to bring down 606 00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:20,759 Speaker 1: gas fees at the end of the day. So, first 607 00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:23,080 Speaker 1: of all, great show or a DVR that and I 608 00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:25,480 Speaker 1: watch it all the time, so thank you for putting 609 00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:27,839 Speaker 1: that on. And in terms of what the merge will 610 00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:31,359 Speaker 1: be doing, it's really ethereum will get to where Avalanche 611 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:34,680 Speaker 1: already is the first part. It will come in stages 612 00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:36,719 Speaker 1: and the first part for them will be going to 613 00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:39,880 Speaker 1: proof a stake. But it's still gonna miss out on 614 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:43,840 Speaker 1: the instant settlement that Avalanche has or the scalability that 615 00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:47,840 Speaker 1: Avalanche has. I mean, just this weekend, the Avalanche plockchain 616 00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:51,920 Speaker 1: had a scaling function called a subnet, and these gaming 617 00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:56,360 Speaker 1: companies actually launched on these subnets. Transactions on Avalanche increased 618 00:34:56,360 --> 00:35:01,799 Speaker 1: twenty five while prices went down like twenty fold. There's 619 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:05,200 Speaker 1: more transactions now an Avalanche on the daily basis there 620 00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:08,399 Speaker 1: are on Ethereum. So with the merge and with all 621 00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 1: these things that you're trying to improve, there will get 622 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:14,120 Speaker 1: to at some point a place where many newer generation 623 00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:17,840 Speaker 1: layer ones are already at such as Avalanche. I should 624 00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:20,840 Speaker 1: say the show also is at one pm. My bad, John, 625 00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:23,440 Speaker 1: but thank you so much. We also um the speaking 626 00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:26,080 Speaker 1: of Avalanche and the ability to kind of make it 627 00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:30,680 Speaker 1: through this down market. I'm wondering from your perspective, as 628 00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:33,120 Speaker 1: things are kind of cooling down in the crypto market, 629 00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:36,400 Speaker 1: what do you take this time to do? Take this 630 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:40,719 Speaker 1: time to focus again? The ones is similar to the 631 00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:43,840 Speaker 1: segment previous when you had the venture capital sign the 632 00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:47,600 Speaker 1: good companies that have a good call it balance sheet, 633 00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:50,759 Speaker 1: they have the ability now to gain share and to 634 00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:54,240 Speaker 1: continue to build. Maybe instead of thinking about eighteen months 635 00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:56,319 Speaker 1: or twenty four months for the next race. You want 636 00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:59,919 Speaker 1: to be a little more frugal and last for thirty. 637 00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:02,480 Speaker 1: But with that said, the ones with the good balance 638 00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:04,919 Speaker 1: sheet and the ones with good products should go out 639 00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:07,640 Speaker 1: there and innovate and take some share. So that's how 640 00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:11,279 Speaker 1: Avalanche Novel Labs is treating this down term. Such a 641 00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:13,560 Speaker 1: pleasure for both of you. John Wu of course, present 642 00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:16,800 Speaker 1: of Alva Labs nor Vera and bloomberg sationality Bostic joining 643 00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:28,920 Speaker 1: us for Crypto show as she does as always, Doctor 644 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:32,040 Speaker 1: Strange in the Multiverse of Madness topped the box office 645 00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:36,279 Speaker 1: for the second straight week, underscoring the appeal of superhero films. 646 00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:38,759 Speaker 1: But the theater business it is still struggling to come back. 647 00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:41,600 Speaker 1: Let's get into all of this their very own Bloomberg's 648 00:36:41,719 --> 00:36:45,280 Speaker 1: Lucas Shaw. Could this be seen as a bell weather 649 00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:50,160 Speaker 1: for the way the industry is recovering well? The performance 650 00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:52,239 Speaker 1: of the new Doctor Strange movie is a really good 651 00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:56,279 Speaker 1: sign for the movie business. It's it's outperforming its predecessor, 652 00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:58,680 Speaker 1: the you know, the the initial Doctors Strange by quite 653 00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:00,319 Speaker 1: a bit. It's already grossed more than it in just 654 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:03,600 Speaker 1: a couple of weeks. Uh. That being said, you know, 655 00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,799 Speaker 1: the comic book movies are those that we know people 656 00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:09,120 Speaker 1: are coming back to see comic book movies. The most 657 00:37:09,160 --> 00:37:11,360 Speaker 1: recent Spider Man movie is one of the most successful 658 00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:13,880 Speaker 1: movies of all time. The real question is are people 659 00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,080 Speaker 1: going to come in between those comic book movies? And 660 00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:19,480 Speaker 1: I'm not sure Dr Strange helps us answer that interesting. 661 00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:23,319 Speaker 1: I'm also thinking big picture about what we learned from 662 00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:26,239 Speaker 1: Netflix and the decline of maybe the quote stay at home, 663 00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:30,319 Speaker 1: the streaming the subscribers there is that a sign that 664 00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:32,480 Speaker 1: maybe we're not watching it at home, but we are 665 00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:37,000 Speaker 1: indeed thinking about going back and seeing theaters outside. Yeah, 666 00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:39,600 Speaker 1: and people are definitely going out into the world, you know. 667 00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:41,680 Speaker 1: I'm sure you guys have have had folks on TV 668 00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:44,959 Speaker 1: talking about you know, hotel stays being pretty close to normal, 669 00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:47,520 Speaker 1: lots of you know, travel is up. People are going 670 00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:50,960 Speaker 1: out into the world to concerts, theme parks. Um. I 671 00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:54,120 Speaker 1: don't know that that movies are everyone's first choice. You know, 672 00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:57,120 Speaker 1: the movie business is on track to do better than 673 00:37:57,160 --> 00:38:00,279 Speaker 1: it did in one that's of course not saying all 674 00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:02,640 Speaker 1: that much. It's still well beloved right now. The numbers 675 00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:06,040 Speaker 1: from twenty nineteen, Yeah, I mean, that's that's not saying 676 00:38:06,040 --> 00:38:08,040 Speaker 1: a lot. I think, as you appropriately put talk to 677 00:38:08,080 --> 00:38:11,480 Speaker 1: me about Netflix specifically, a strategy to look at releasing 678 00:38:11,560 --> 00:38:15,600 Speaker 1: movies in theaters, maybe take advantage of the reopening. They 679 00:38:15,640 --> 00:38:18,160 Speaker 1: haven't really done that before. What is that telling you? 680 00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:21,800 Speaker 1: How do you gauge the success? Yeah, you know Netflix 681 00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:25,880 Speaker 1: has released movies in theaters, but not kind of globally 682 00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 1: in the major chains. They've had to pick off a 683 00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:33,040 Speaker 1: lot of the smaller chains and the independent theaters. Um, 684 00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:36,160 Speaker 1: there is a desire in certain corners of Netflix to 685 00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:38,359 Speaker 1: take at least a handful of their titles and give 686 00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:40,279 Speaker 1: them what we think of as a normal release or 687 00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:42,439 Speaker 1: would be only in theaters for a month or forty 688 00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:45,520 Speaker 1: five days. There'd be a real marketing campaign behind it 689 00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:47,319 Speaker 1: so that people actually knew that it was coming out, 690 00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:49,960 Speaker 1: because Netflix often to save its marketing for after a 691 00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:53,240 Speaker 1: title it is out. But the big question is whether 692 00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:55,400 Speaker 1: the people at the very top of Netflix want to 693 00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:57,680 Speaker 1: do this. You know, movie theaters as as we just discussed, 694 00:38:57,680 --> 00:38:59,960 Speaker 1: want fresh product. They would love to get their hands 695 00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:02,880 Speaker 1: the Netflix movies. For all their talk about how Netflix 696 00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:05,319 Speaker 1: is killing their business, but they're only going to take 697 00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:08,560 Speaker 1: those movies if Netflix commits to marketing them, specifically those 698 00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:12,799 Speaker 1: in theaters. And I'm hoping that we'll see some resolution 699 00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:14,400 Speaker 1: on this in the next few months. I know that 700 00:39:14,440 --> 00:39:17,719 Speaker 1: Netflix is talking about are exploring testing a couple of 701 00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:19,800 Speaker 1: big titles in the fall, say that the sequel to 702 00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:21,960 Speaker 1: Knives Out, which was a huge hit a few years ago, 703 00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:25,600 Speaker 1: But we don't know the resolution just yet. Really appreciate it. 704 00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:29,839 Speaker 1: Our very own Lucashaw joining us as always, and well, 705 00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:32,759 Speaker 1: that does it for this edition of Bloomberg Technology. But 706 00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:34,880 Speaker 1: don't worry. We're back tomorrow and we are going to 707 00:39:34,880 --> 00:39:38,240 Speaker 1: be live from Boston, starting with the Clothes to PM Eastern. 708 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:40,680 Speaker 1: I'll be joining us. Then we'll take you through Triple 709 00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:43,319 Speaker 1: Take and then finishing off with the triple threat that 710 00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:47,080 Speaker 1: is Bloomberg Technology. It'll be two to six pm live 711 00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:50,640 Speaker 1: of course from Boston, so make sure to check it out. Also, 712 00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:52,799 Speaker 1: don't forget to check out our new podcasts. You can 713 00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:57,080 Speaker 1: find it on the terminal as well as online on Apple, Spotify, 714 00:39:57,160 --> 00:40:03,920 Speaker 1: and I Heart This is Bloomberg at sett