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Speaker 1: Pushkin. Most people know Rivers Cuomo as Weezer's brilliant, quirky

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Speaker 1: bleed sing chops of water flood cascading from the sky

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Speaker 1: and it streaks my winship who I opened up the door.

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Speaker 1: But one thing you may not know is that several

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Speaker 1: years ago a bizarre conspiracy theory started to make its

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Speaker 1: way around the web. The Rivers was actually Kurt Cobain,

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Speaker 1: as in Kurt stage Is suicide in nineteen ninety four

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Speaker 1: and carried on living his life as Rivers Cuomo. While

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Speaker 1: Nirvana and Weezer at seemingly opposite ends of the nineties

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Speaker 1: music spectrum, a close look reveals they're actually a lot

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Speaker 1: more similar than you might think. In anticipation of Weezer's

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Speaker 1: ambitious and incredibly catchy new album Okay Human, Rivers explains

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Speaker 1: to Rick Rubin why the band ditched their classic guitar

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Speaker 1: based style for an orchestral sound. They also talk about

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Speaker 1: the specific substances that Rivers took to write the hit

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Speaker 1: song hash Pipe, and Rivers entertains the Kurt Cobain conspiracy

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Speaker 1: and plays along with Rick as if it were all true.

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Speaker 1: This is broken record. Liner notes for the digital age

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Speaker 1: I'm justin Richmonds. Here are old friends Rick Rubin and

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Speaker 1: Rivers Cuomo talking over zoom. Have you seen the website,

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Speaker 1: the conspiracy website that says that Kurt Cobain did not

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Speaker 1: kill himself and that it's actually you are Kurt Cobain.

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Speaker 1: Have you seen that? Yeah, I've heard of that is

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Speaker 1: I hadn't seen the website before, and then just just

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Speaker 1: yesterday somebody forwarded it to me. Is that like suddenly

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Speaker 1: going around for some reason? It's I know that conspiracy

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Speaker 1: has been around for a long time. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I just thought. I just thought the other day, and

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Speaker 1: I thought interesting, and I thought it might even be

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Speaker 1: interesting if I were to ask you questions as if

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Speaker 1: it were true, because that could be fun for both

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Speaker 1: of us. Yeah. So, if if you were Kurt, tell

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Speaker 1: me how you imagine you would have transformed yourself into Rivers. Well,

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Speaker 1: first of all, I'd have to stage my death, which

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Speaker 1: seems seems easy enough. And then yeah, the Blue album

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Speaker 1: came out a month later after he died. You could

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Speaker 1: have been you could have been working on that like

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Speaker 1: for years. Yeah, and I know he was. He seemed

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Speaker 1: to be very interested in very like innocent naive music,

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Speaker 1: like they covered the Raincoats, which is not that different

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Speaker 1: from Wheezer. I guess, you know, major key and we

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Speaker 1: kind of picked up picked up that ball and ran

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Speaker 1: with it. So yeah, I think kind of running the

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Speaker 1: opposite direction from grunge and you know where the button

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Speaker 1: down shirts and cut your hair short and and sing

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Speaker 1: with a very pure voice rather than rock voice. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it seems like that would be a nice um if you, like,

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Speaker 1: if you're tired of being Kurt Cobain, this might be

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Speaker 1: a nice career decision, like get away from all that madness,

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Speaker 1: essentially canceled the past and starting new with no none

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Speaker 1: of the old pressure of being in this the band

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Speaker 1: that changed the world, and where you could just have

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Speaker 1: fun and write pop songs and enjoy yourself. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: guess the grass is always greener, but yeah, and I

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Speaker 1: think for for everyone outside of Nirvana, it seemed like

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Speaker 1: he had did pretty good. Like that's what we all wanted, right,

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Speaker 1: We want to be not only the band that's selling

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Speaker 1: ten gazillion records, but like the band that everyone knows

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Speaker 1: like they revolutionized music and culture. You know, they're always

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Speaker 1: going to be that band and the rest of us

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Speaker 1: We're just like little little dwarfs kind of dancing around

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Speaker 1: their heels. But it looks like it felt bad enough

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Speaker 1: for him to either end his life or decide to

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Speaker 1: become you. One of the two, which is better? She

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Speaker 1: is different stylistically. Did you have any in the transition

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Speaker 1: from the songs you wrote for Nirvana versus the Weezer

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Speaker 1: songs you wrote you decide to, like really clear the

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Speaker 1: decks and and think of it in a new way.

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Speaker 1: I think it all it all came about because I

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Speaker 1: changed my style of singing. Now. When I was singing

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Speaker 1: the very thick rock voice, so many overtones and all

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Speaker 1: this distortion. Naturally in my vocal chords, I was able

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Speaker 1: to sing one melody four times in a row and

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Speaker 1: call that a verse four times in a row and

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Speaker 1: call that a chorus, and no one would get tired

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Speaker 1: of my voice because it was so rich. But once

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Speaker 1: they started singing with a very pure voice, like a

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Speaker 1: choirboy voice like you hear in say Buddy Holly, I

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Speaker 1: had to change my melody writing in my chord writing

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Speaker 1: because the voice just wasn't as rich. You gotta put

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Speaker 1: the variation and the richness into the composition. So At

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Speaker 1: that point I started writing a lot more involved chord

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Speaker 1: progressions and melodies. Interesting, did you let anyone at all

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Speaker 1: know what was going to happen or to be played? All?

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Speaker 1: Pretty close to the best? I let my lawyer, No.

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Speaker 1: But apart from that, I wanted to complete break. Were

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Speaker 1: there any things that happened early on where you felt

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Speaker 1: like you might get caught? No, there's there's been these

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Speaker 1: conspiracies and movies about me, about my death, and I

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Speaker 1: don't think anyone's really ever come close to figuring it

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Speaker 1: out because it's Wheezer is just so different from Nirvana.

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Speaker 1: Yes and no. Yes, I mean you both do the

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Speaker 1: soft loud thing. You've sort of kept that in the repertoire. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I did that without even noticing. Honestly, Yeah, it's just habit.

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Speaker 1: I hadn't yet broken. I thought the idea of adding

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Speaker 1: the glasses was a great idea because it really is,

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Speaker 1: like it's a perfect It camouflages your face in a

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Speaker 1: way that it really does create a new persona. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but I did wear them in the big Nirvana video

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Speaker 1: I was in Bloom, So it's just like a little

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Speaker 1: breadcrumb for people who are really paying attention. I guess foreshadowing. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, I was actually shooting that video that gave

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Speaker 1: me the whole idea. I was looking back at it

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Speaker 1: and I was like, you know what, I look pretty

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Speaker 1: pretty cool man. This is just like the biggest fu

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Speaker 1: to what everyone wants from Nirvana is me and these

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Speaker 1: dorky glasses. Yeah. I remember meeting you backstage at a

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Speaker 1: at a Chili Pepper concert, and I didn't make the

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Speaker 1: connection when I met you the Rivers you. I didn't

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Speaker 1: make the connection then, But now looking back, it all

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Speaker 1: makes perfect sense. Yeah. I was probably pretty out of

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Speaker 1: it when you met me the first time. Right, You're

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Speaker 1: pretty out of it when I met you the first time.

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Speaker 1: You pretty out of it both times, actually both times

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Speaker 1: in a different way, in a different way. Let's talk

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Speaker 1: about how your songwriting has progressed over the years. You

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Speaker 1: can start back as far as you're as you want,

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Speaker 1: if you want to include the thinner running years or not,

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Speaker 1: up to you. But your relationship to music and how

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Speaker 1: your songwriting has evolved. Well, started out just about the guitar,

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Speaker 1: really and wanting to shred and thinking if I get

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Speaker 1: fast enough on with these harmonic minor scales, if I

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Speaker 1: if I get my metronome setting up high enough, then

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Speaker 1: I'm going to be a huge rock star and it's

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Speaker 1: going to be great. So I moved with my band

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Speaker 1: to LA and we've tried to shred our way to

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Speaker 1: a record deal and nobody was interested. They were they

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Speaker 1: were interested, and like something called songs and hooks and lyrics,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, what the heck is all that about?

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Speaker 1: But that became like technique for me. I was like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: if if that's what it is, and I'll practice that,

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Speaker 1: I'll work on that and until I in shred shred

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Speaker 1: of Chorus. Basically, what were you listening to at the

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Speaker 1: time that the shredding was going on? What we were inspirations?

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Speaker 1: Then that would have been Ingvy Malmstein and Paul Gilbert

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Speaker 1: and there's a number of other lesser known shredders. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's all instrumental guitar solos, and the band felt apart

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Speaker 1: that it was tough. It's five guys in a one

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Speaker 1: room studio apartment on Cherokee right off Hollywood Boulevard, and

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Speaker 1: you know, you turn the lights on it when you

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Speaker 1: come home at night and thousands of cockroaches would scatter

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Speaker 1: all over the kitchen counter. You know, it's just no

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Speaker 1: fun for most guys. For me, I was like, this

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Speaker 1: is amazing. Where did you move from in this story?

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Speaker 1: I moved from a small town in northeastern Connecticut. And

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Speaker 1: when most people think Connecticut, they think in New York.

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Speaker 1: But New York seemed about as far away as La.

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Speaker 1: To me, I was I was closer to like Providence,

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Speaker 1: or you know, there was really no city around me

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Speaker 1: is a college, rural college town right where Yukon is.

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Speaker 1: There was a strange number of really talented musicians, like

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Speaker 1: talented technically because we all just sat around and practice

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Speaker 1: scales and our peggios and metronomes. And so eventually five

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Speaker 1: of us moved to LA. And when that fell apart,

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Speaker 1: I got a job at Tower Records and it was

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Speaker 1: there that every every day, for eight hours a day,

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Speaker 1: I was being exposed to quote cool music, and at

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Speaker 1: first it just sounded like complete noise to me. It

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Speaker 1: was like Thonic Youth Pixies as well as early Nirvana

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Speaker 1: and Beach Boys. Pet Sounds reissue came out around or

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Speaker 1: CD version came out around that time, and they hammered

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Speaker 1: it into me day after day, and gradually it came

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Speaker 1: to sink in and have a real influence. And I'd

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Speaker 1: go home at night, pretty tired on the bus and

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Speaker 1: get to my apartment and I got an eight track recorder,

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Speaker 1: and actually that's when I started singing. I was like, well,

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Speaker 1: my band broke up to that point, I'd just been

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Speaker 1: the lead guitar player, and I was like, well, somebody's

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Speaker 1: got to sing. So I tried to sing, and it

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Speaker 1: sounded like somebody trying to sing early Nirvana basically, and

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Speaker 1: I came to really love what I was doing. I'm

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Speaker 1: sure nobody else would have, but it was very cathartic,

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Speaker 1: and I would sit there and listen back to my

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Speaker 1: cassettes and just I don't know if I literally shed tears,

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Speaker 1: but I felt very emotional listening to my own voice

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Speaker 1: and my own songs. It's like, yes, that's exactly how

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Speaker 1: I feel, which in retros act you know, of course

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Speaker 1: that's how I feel. I wrote that it was about

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Speaker 1: how I feel. I knew that's why I wanted to

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Speaker 1: do at that point. So and it was also through

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Speaker 1: that job at Tower that I met my friend there

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Speaker 1: who knew the other guys in Weezer, so he got

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Speaker 1: he got me to jam with him and included those

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Speaker 1: other guys. And there are a few false starts, a

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Speaker 1: few strange iterations, including sixty wrong sausages, But eventually it

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Speaker 1: turned into Weezer amazing lyrically, when you when you started

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Speaker 1: writing those first songs on your eight track and you

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Speaker 1: said that if the song sounded like you felt, do

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Speaker 1: you remember lyrically what you were writing about. Would it

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Speaker 1: have been based on something that you saw or something

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Speaker 1: that you felt? Would it have been a diary line?

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Speaker 1: In other words? Yeah, not so much external um observations,

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Speaker 1: just more like my own feelings and my own philosophies,

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Speaker 1: my own points of view, my own realizations. That's what

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Speaker 1: it mainly is. It's like, oh, this is this is

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Speaker 1: what's going on in the situation. Beautiful that you were

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Speaker 1: able to feel it and happen to it and express it,

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Speaker 1: and I imagine cathartic for you to give it voice

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Speaker 1: and get it out, as opposed to just having it

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Speaker 1: inside and drilling a hole in your in yourself. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think I often use the word cathartic. I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure that's exactly what it is. It's it's more like

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Speaker 1: when I clarify exactly what's going on, and I'm specific

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Speaker 1: about it, and I get it in words and melody.

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Speaker 1: It's almost like I've got an outside of me now

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Speaker 1: and now I'm in a way I'm healed, and I

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Speaker 1: don't I don't necessarily have to fall into that pattern anymore.

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Speaker 1: There's an example on a New Right. We're working on

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Speaker 1: a record right now called Okay Human, and there's a

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Speaker 1: song called numbers, and that one I just I found myself.

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Speaker 1: I don't know what what song we had out, but

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Speaker 1: every day I was checking checking a chart, like some

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Speaker 1: radio chart. Well, you know, at first it's like it's

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Speaker 1: going up, it's going up, this is amazing. And then

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Speaker 1: of course it's going down. It's like, oh this this

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Speaker 1: other band is getting higher than us and we're falling.

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Speaker 1: And it was very painful. And then you know, it's

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Speaker 1: like checking Instagram or how many likes or followers do

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Speaker 1: I have and how many people retweeted this tweet I posted,

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Speaker 1: and I realized, So it's just spending a lot of

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Speaker 1: time and emotional energy looking at numbers, which we're telling

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Speaker 1: me what my worth was in. So I wrote a

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Speaker 1: song specifically about that. There's always a number that'll make

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Speaker 1: you feel bad about yourself, and so what since I

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Speaker 1: wrote that song, I don't Maybe as soon as I

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Speaker 1: start to feel that instinct check a number, I'm like, now,

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Speaker 1: you know, I don't need to do that. I know

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Speaker 1: what's going to happen. Beautiful. Is there ever, or always

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Speaker 1: a relationship between the valence of the lyrics and the

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Speaker 1: sound of the music. I remember hearing very frequently when

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Speaker 1: we put out our first album that there was a

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Speaker 1: big mismatch between the emotion of the lyrics and the

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Speaker 1: emotion of music. Many people said, oh, the music is

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Speaker 1: so happy, it just makes you want to smile and

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Speaker 1: jump around, and but man, these lyrics are depressing. So

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Speaker 1: I don't know how it happened. But when I'm writing it,

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Speaker 1: there's definitely a match, But when people were hearing it,

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Speaker 1: there's a mismatch. And I think sometimes there's something really

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Speaker 1: interesting about that, Like hearing an energetically happy song with

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Speaker 1: really sad lyrics is much more interesting than one that

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Speaker 1: where it's everything's match. It plays on different levels and

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Speaker 1: it gives it depth. Yeah, And I just I think

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Speaker 1: I just love happy music or happy Maybe happy is

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Speaker 1: the wrong word. It's more like triumphant and uplifting. I

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Speaker 1: don't like music that's too like weak and sad, you know, Matt.

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Speaker 1: Matt always would say, what do you love? My about

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Speaker 1: my music writing was that it sounded like somebody waving

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Speaker 1: a big flag from across a stadium, just in Triumph,

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Speaker 1: so he called it my my flag waving. Yeah, we

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Speaker 1: would use the word anthemic sometimes, so we would talk

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Speaker 1: about some of your hooks when you wrote one of those, like, wow,

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Speaker 1: that really sounds anthemic. That's right, it's a great, great feeling. Well,

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Speaker 1: I've certainly tried many different approaches in the how many

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Speaker 1: years has been? Twenty twenties years? Wow, I could be

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Speaker 1: a decade off that math is not my strong suit.

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Speaker 1: But this album I'm talking about, okay Human is all piano,

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Speaker 1: not just piano compositions. But I don't play any guitar

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Speaker 1: on the whole album. It's just all on piano and

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Speaker 1: with an orchestra. That is that is very different. And

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Speaker 1: I'm able to do all this stuff that I just

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Speaker 1: can't do on a guitar. And I just posted this

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Speaker 1: cover of my song heart shape Box or my d

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Speaker 1: quotes song heart shape Box from my album in Utero.

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Speaker 1: When I first started practicing. It was I was doing

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Speaker 1: on guitar, and you know, it sounded like what you'd expect.

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Speaker 1: It is basically like Nirvana cover. And then I was like, heck,

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Speaker 1: I'll try it on piano, and man, I was like

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Speaker 1: doing all this crazy stuff as background music on the piano.

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Speaker 1: It's like playing this symphony orchestra on the piano, and

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Speaker 1: it feels like this massive new frontier for me to explore.

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Speaker 1: Did you originally write that one on piano? Uh? No? Um,

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Speaker 1: I wrote that on my on my Fender Mustang UM

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Speaker 1: and I did not even play piano back then. Cool.

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Speaker 1: When did you learn to play piano? I learned to

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Speaker 1: play piano. Um, right around the time, right after a

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Speaker 1: stage my death. It was like, okay, let's let's try

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Speaker 1: something totally different here, good idea. Yeah yeah, no one,

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Speaker 1: No one would expect Kirt to play piano. The glasses

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Speaker 1: the piano, it's like you're home free. It's a good disguise.

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Speaker 1: And now the mustache, Yeah yeah, I almost didn't recognize it.

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Speaker 1: I feel like it's a Beatles era mustache. I can't

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Speaker 1: remember which one, but if we look at the Letter

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Speaker 1: B album, someone has that mustache. Yeah, might be Paul

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Speaker 1: maybe or it may have been Georgia. I can't remember.

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Speaker 1: It definitely feels like yeah, and they had glasses too, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and then the hair could work. I mean you could

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Speaker 1: be Yep, so be Nirvana, Weezer, Beatles would be your

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Speaker 1: order of wow, three favorite bands right there? Can you?

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Speaker 1: Can you be in one of your favorite bands? Is that?

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Speaker 1: Does that work? Are you allowed to be on your

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Speaker 1: list of favorite bands? You let to put yourself in it.

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Speaker 1: I feel like if your band is unique enough, because yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, no other band makes me feel like Weezer,

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Speaker 1: so they have to be. I just love I love

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Speaker 1: the music so much and there's nothing else quite like it,

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Speaker 1: so they have to be on my list. After a

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Speaker 1: quick break, we'll be back with Rivers Cuomo and Rick Rubin.

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Speaker 1: We're back with more from Rivers Cuomo. There was a

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Speaker 1: point where you decided, even after being a very successful musician,

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Speaker 1: to go back to school. Yeah, tell me what you

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Speaker 1: were thinking. Now. This is the time, like mid two thousands,

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Speaker 1: as we were finishing up Make Believe. Is that is

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Speaker 1: that the time you were talking about I think so, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I remember there was a moment where we talked about

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Speaker 1: the schedule had to be around the Harvard schedule because

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Speaker 1: you were going back, right, Okay, I seem to remember

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Speaker 1: I really wanted to get married, and it seemed like

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Speaker 1: a good, good place to meet somebody if you want

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Speaker 1: to get married. Maybe not so much anymore, but there

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Speaker 1: was there was a time when that was the result

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Speaker 1: of going to college, as you'd find somebody and get married,

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Speaker 1: and you find a lot of like minded people there,

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Speaker 1: you know. Of course I have many motivations for anything

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Speaker 1: I do, for whatever breakfast serial I pick in the morning,

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Speaker 1: but that I think that was near the top of

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Speaker 1: my list for reasons. And also I just like finishing stuff.

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Speaker 1: I start like in a slightly OCD way, like, gosh,

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Speaker 1: I'm so close to having a degree. It doesn't really matter,

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Speaker 1: I don't really need it, but why not just finish

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Speaker 1: it up? And then, of course I love learning, and

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Speaker 1: that's why I went back in the first place. In

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Speaker 1: the mid nineties, at the height of the Blue album success.

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Speaker 1: This is so bored going around the country over and

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Speaker 1: over in a tour bus. There's no intellectual stimulations. So

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Speaker 1: we were we happened to be in Boston and I

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Speaker 1: went to Harvard, and I was like, man, this place

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Speaker 1: is great. Let me get an application. I filled it

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Speaker 1: out and I got accepted, so it's like, yeah, I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna do this, and it was fun. It's really stimulating.

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Speaker 1: And even now every morning, first thing I do is

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Speaker 1: log into con Academy and start working on algebra. Totally useless.

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Speaker 1: I was right when I was fourteen and not doing

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Speaker 1: my homework that you know, there's there's no use for

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Speaker 1: this in my life as a rock star. But I

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Speaker 1: just like these little puzzles and working on them and

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Speaker 1: keeps my brain occupied and stretched out and tickled. This

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Speaker 1: is the opposite of what you just said, but I'll

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Speaker 1: ask it just occurs to me. Was there any part

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Speaker 1: of you that felt like, well, I guess you said

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Speaker 1: the boring aspect of repetitive nature of being on tour.

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Speaker 1: Was there any sense of escaping your rock star life

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Speaker 1: by going back to schools? Well, definitely. The first time

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Speaker 1: I went there, we were we were at our low

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Speaker 1: point interpersonally, and the whole experience of becoming a rock

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Speaker 1: star was pretty disillusioning, as it was for apparently so

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Speaker 1: many musicians of our generation, like you finally get this

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Speaker 1: thing you always wanted, and then you're miserable. I don't.

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Speaker 1: It seems like that doesn't happen as much anymore. But

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Speaker 1: one of the many motivations was I want to get

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Speaker 1: away from this and I don't know if I'm ever

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Speaker 1: coming back, and I just want to disappear and screw

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Speaker 1: that whole life. Basically, well, I'm glad you decided to

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Speaker 1: go back to school instead of feigning your suicide again,

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Speaker 1: because I would be really sad if if Rivers was

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Speaker 1: believed not to be alive. I admssed you a lot. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: thank you. We talked a little bit about the way

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Speaker 1: you've written in the way that it has. You've tried

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Speaker 1: different things, but essentially the way you wrote on your

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Speaker 1: new album and the way you wrote on your first

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Speaker 1: album are pretty close. Is the way you appreciate music

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Speaker 1: the same. No. I think in the early nineties I

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Speaker 1: was I would get obsessed with a record or a

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Speaker 1: few records, and often it would be an artist or

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Speaker 1: a few artists. I remember I was just mad about

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Speaker 1: Jesus Christ Superstar soundtrack, all the Beach Boys stuff, especially

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Speaker 1: pet Sounds, all the Beatles stuff. Then there was Van Morrison,

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Speaker 1: astral Weeks and Love Forever Changes, so I'd go through

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Speaker 1: these phases of real deep obsession with a particular album

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Speaker 1: or artist. And now I've gotten really into computer programming,

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Speaker 1: and I wrote this program that creates a Spotify playlist

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Speaker 1: for me every day, and it's extremely eclectic and wide

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Speaker 1: ranging and anything I could possibly be interested in, it

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Speaker 1: will take a sampling of it, and then it mixes

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Speaker 1: it all together and presented to me every day. And

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Speaker 1: so I just listened like that, and I'm just I

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Speaker 1: just very quickly go through songs like because it's easy

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Speaker 1: for me to mark, like Okay, I don't want to

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Speaker 1: hear this again for another eight hundred songs, or I

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Speaker 1: never want to hear this again, I never want to

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Speaker 1: hear this artist again, or I want to hear more

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Speaker 1: of this album. I can give it these all the

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Speaker 1: instruct to the algorithm very easily, and so the playlist

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Speaker 1: is constantly evolving for my taste every day. And I

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Speaker 1: guess it's a it's a very different way to take

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Speaker 1: things in. Tell me how will tell you more about

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Speaker 1: the algorithm. How does it decide to what to add

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Speaker 1: to your lists? Okay, so it gets some songs from

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Speaker 1: pop radio and alternative radio, some songs from top songs

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Speaker 1: on iTunes and some of the playlists on Spotify Today's

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Speaker 1: Top Pits, and then any songs I've heard, you know,

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Speaker 1: sometimes I just hear a song, happen to hear a song,

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Speaker 1: and I like it, so it will add those, and

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Speaker 1: then songs from New Music Friday, and then there's a

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Speaker 1: bunch of specific playlists. I like to take examples from Beethoven, Bach,

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Speaker 1: heavy Metal, bubblegum pop, Rolling Stones, Top five hundred album

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Speaker 1: and then whatever albums I happen to be interested or

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Speaker 1: checking or I'm checking out, like right now Mitski is

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Speaker 1: in there, and The White Reaper, then alternative nineties, hot country,

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Speaker 1: Lauretta Lynn, and then I have a cool playlist called

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Speaker 1: Obscure Wheezer, which is basically every Weezer or Rivers solo

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Speaker 1: song that is not in the top forty songs I

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Speaker 1: always have to play. So it's 'lb songs I may

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Speaker 1: not have heard for for years, and it's really cool

404
00:26:41,036 --> 00:26:43,996
Speaker 1: to hear them pop up randomly in this in this

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00:26:44,196 --> 00:26:48,356
Speaker 1: context of that is so wide ranging. Suddenly I hear

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Speaker 1: this song, a song I made ten years ago, and

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Speaker 1: it's like I can hear it with these really fresh

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Speaker 1: ears it's great. Does it ever do do they ever

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Speaker 1: come on? And does it take you a moment to

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Speaker 1: realize that it's one of yours? Yeah? Sometimes it's a

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Speaker 1: real treat, like, wow, this sounds amazing, what is it?

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Speaker 1: And then and then I realized, oh, yeah, that's that's us.

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Speaker 1: That's cool. Yeah, it's a great feeling when when that happens. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the surprise aspect of it. I can remember once she's

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Speaker 1: amming a song that I couldn't that was just so

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00:27:20,436 --> 00:27:22,836
Speaker 1: cool and I couldn't figure out what it was the

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00:27:22,956 --> 00:27:26,716
Speaker 1: record I produced a long time ago, like completely blanked

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Speaker 1: on it. That's great. In the world of being a

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Speaker 1: rock star, what's the most fun part of it for you? Man,

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00:27:33,996 --> 00:27:37,556
Speaker 1: It's really hard to pick. There's just so much stuff

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00:27:37,556 --> 00:27:40,956
Speaker 1: that's so great. So maybe I'll just rattle some things off.

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Speaker 1: I don't I don't know if I can rank them.

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Speaker 1: But the high of singing a song for an audience.

424
00:27:49,836 --> 00:27:51,996
Speaker 1: You know, you have some stage fright, you have some

425
00:27:52,156 --> 00:27:55,916
Speaker 1: extra hormones coursing through your blood, so you're you're just

426
00:27:56,036 --> 00:28:00,756
Speaker 1: operating on like peak efficiency, and your brains is so

427
00:28:00,876 --> 00:28:07,636
Speaker 1: concentrated and you can hear like the subtlest little movement

428
00:28:07,716 --> 00:28:10,676
Speaker 1: of spittle in your mouth against your tongue when you're

429
00:28:10,676 --> 00:28:14,396
Speaker 1: pronouncing a word, and it's it's just such a high

430
00:28:14,436 --> 00:28:18,356
Speaker 1: to be in that concentrated state. I love that. I

431
00:28:18,436 --> 00:28:24,436
Speaker 1: still love writing, getting my observations out very precisely. And yeah,

432
00:28:24,556 --> 00:28:27,156
Speaker 1: it's maybe precisely because I have such a hard time

433
00:28:27,236 --> 00:28:29,516
Speaker 1: explaining it with words. If I get it in a song,

434
00:28:29,556 --> 00:28:33,516
Speaker 1: it's like, ah, yeah, that's that's my mode of communication.

435
00:28:34,116 --> 00:28:38,116
Speaker 1: So maybe the biggest ego reward you get is when

436
00:28:38,476 --> 00:28:41,676
Speaker 1: you're in front of a giant audience, not even giant, okay,

437
00:28:42,036 --> 00:28:44,196
Speaker 1: even in a small club. I still play these little

438
00:28:44,236 --> 00:28:49,796
Speaker 1: shows and when the audience is singing along and it's

439
00:28:49,796 --> 00:28:52,756
Speaker 1: a B side or an obscure album, old album track,

440
00:28:52,796 --> 00:28:57,876
Speaker 1: and everyone's singing every word like they believe it and

441
00:28:57,916 --> 00:29:00,476
Speaker 1: they mean it so much and it's so important to them,

442
00:29:01,036 --> 00:29:03,636
Speaker 1: and they're just declaring it to the world. In unison

443
00:29:03,756 --> 00:29:07,996
Speaker 1: is this big chorus and you know, like this is

444
00:29:08,796 --> 00:29:11,476
Speaker 1: this is something I came up with, Like I put

445
00:29:11,516 --> 00:29:14,316
Speaker 1: those words on paper, and look at what it's doing

446
00:29:14,356 --> 00:29:17,556
Speaker 1: for all of the for all of us. And I mean,

447
00:29:17,596 --> 00:29:21,476
Speaker 1: that is just a the greatest reward for an art

448
00:29:22,196 --> 00:29:23,756
Speaker 1: that was one of the things that I found really

449
00:29:23,756 --> 00:29:27,756
Speaker 1: interesting when we've met, you explain the different ways that

450
00:29:27,956 --> 00:29:30,876
Speaker 1: the lengths he would go to to write songs. You

451
00:29:30,916 --> 00:29:33,516
Speaker 1: want to share with us how you wrote hash Pipe

452
00:29:34,316 --> 00:29:38,876
Speaker 1: the process. Yeah, so, well, at that time, I was

453
00:29:38,916 --> 00:29:42,676
Speaker 1: taking very careful notes on all the parameters that went

454
00:29:42,676 --> 00:29:48,156
Speaker 1: into the us any given songwriting session, and like what

455
00:29:48,196 --> 00:29:50,356
Speaker 1: time and day it was, or what I had eaten,

456
00:29:51,196 --> 00:29:54,956
Speaker 1: or what kind of drama I'd lived through in the

457
00:29:55,036 --> 00:29:59,316
Speaker 1: last twenty four hours. And it's somehow in my chain

458
00:29:59,356 --> 00:30:04,396
Speaker 1: of experimentation, I had the idea to try riddling, and

459
00:30:05,036 --> 00:30:08,636
Speaker 1: not connected that I was also reached the point where

460
00:30:08,636 --> 00:30:13,716
Speaker 1: I wanted to try three shots of tequila. So that

461
00:30:13,956 --> 00:30:17,436
Speaker 1: day I had a riddling and three shots of tequila,

462
00:30:17,516 --> 00:30:20,836
Speaker 1: and you know, a few minutes later, I went into

463
00:30:20,836 --> 00:30:24,156
Speaker 1: my backyard, sat down with a paper and pencil, and

464
00:30:25,156 --> 00:30:28,076
Speaker 1: in about two minutes wrote the song from start to

465
00:30:28,076 --> 00:30:32,196
Speaker 1: finish in my head and then onto the paper, not

466
00:30:32,316 --> 00:30:36,196
Speaker 1: even a guitar in my hand, and my whole nervous

467
00:30:36,196 --> 00:30:40,036
Speaker 1: system was on fire and it was a total frenzy

468
00:30:40,356 --> 00:30:43,316
Speaker 1: and felt exhausted right after, and I went up and

469
00:30:43,476 --> 00:30:48,796
Speaker 1: took a long bath. Yeah, I wouldn't recommend that, and

470
00:30:48,836 --> 00:30:52,476
Speaker 1: I haven't tried it since maybe I should. We'll be

471
00:30:52,596 --> 00:30:55,476
Speaker 1: right back with more from Rivers Cuomo after this break.

472
00:30:59,756 --> 00:31:02,996
Speaker 1: We're back with the rest of Rick's conversation with Rivers Cuomo.

473
00:31:03,676 --> 00:31:07,316
Speaker 1: Tell me about the history of this album. What's the

474
00:31:07,356 --> 00:31:12,156
Speaker 1: beginning of the Okay, human story? Okay, I'm bad at

475
00:31:12,236 --> 00:31:16,076
Speaker 1: history because everything I'm you know, like you very in

476
00:31:16,116 --> 00:31:18,076
Speaker 1: the moment, and then I just kind of forget everything

477
00:31:18,116 --> 00:31:22,876
Speaker 1: that happened. But let's see, I remember, I guess a

478
00:31:22,876 --> 00:31:25,076
Speaker 1: couple of weeks, a couple of years ago, I went

479
00:31:25,116 --> 00:31:30,036
Speaker 1: to Jake's house Jacob. Jake is the producer Jake Sinclair.

480
00:31:30,596 --> 00:31:34,476
Speaker 1: He produced our album called The White Album with two

481
00:31:34,756 --> 00:31:40,076
Speaker 1: two albums ago and he's he's more known for um

482
00:31:40,876 --> 00:31:44,476
Speaker 1: Fallout Boy and Panic at the Disco. He did that

483
00:31:44,556 --> 00:31:47,356
Speaker 1: really big song High Hopes by Panic at the Disco.

484
00:31:48,036 --> 00:31:50,956
Speaker 1: But I know him as the guy the frontman for

485
00:31:50,996 --> 00:31:55,996
Speaker 1: a Weezer cover band called Wanna Beezer. So he's like

486
00:31:56,036 --> 00:32:01,476
Speaker 1: a real hardcore Weezer fan. But um, very very talented

487
00:32:01,516 --> 00:32:05,796
Speaker 1: young producer. So I went over to his house and

488
00:32:06,436 --> 00:32:10,756
Speaker 1: without even an invention of starting a project, as just

489
00:32:10,996 --> 00:32:14,156
Speaker 1: going to say hi, and he said he had an

490
00:32:14,196 --> 00:32:18,236
Speaker 1: idea for an album for Weezer, and he described it

491
00:32:18,276 --> 00:32:21,396
Speaker 1: to me, and it's basically what we just finished making

492
00:32:21,556 --> 00:32:25,876
Speaker 1: is exactly what he set out to make. It is

493
00:32:25,916 --> 00:32:29,516
Speaker 1: really his vision from the beginning. And what he said

494
00:32:29,676 --> 00:32:32,356
Speaker 1: was no electric guitar. It's just going to be you

495
00:32:32,476 --> 00:32:35,636
Speaker 1: on piano, and you're going to bring in all your

496
00:32:35,756 --> 00:32:38,396
Speaker 1: love of classical music and we're going to use an

497
00:32:38,516 --> 00:32:42,716
Speaker 1: orchestra and you're just gonna totally go for it with

498
00:32:42,796 --> 00:32:46,076
Speaker 1: the songwriting and the lyrics and don't try in any

499
00:32:46,076 --> 00:32:49,396
Speaker 1: way to be successful. You're just going to make your weirdest, wildest,

500
00:32:49,876 --> 00:32:53,956
Speaker 1: most riversy weezery record you can make as a songwriter.

501
00:32:54,316 --> 00:33:00,076
Speaker 1: And he gave me a reference album too, is obscure

502
00:33:00,116 --> 00:33:04,356
Speaker 1: album called Nielsen Sings Newman, which I'd never heard before,

503
00:33:05,236 --> 00:33:08,636
Speaker 1: and it's it's similar to what I just described. Is

504
00:33:08,956 --> 00:33:17,236
Speaker 1: very quirky, odd, unsuccessful commercially but super interesting album. We're

505
00:33:17,316 --> 00:33:21,916
Speaker 1: all of the songs written specifically for this project. Yeah, okay, okay,

506
00:33:22,036 --> 00:33:24,716
Speaker 1: just about every answer I'm gonna give you, it's gonna

507
00:33:24,756 --> 00:33:29,036
Speaker 1: have an asterisk by it, which which is except for

508
00:33:30,036 --> 00:33:33,756
Speaker 1: the song called all my Favorite Songs so that one

509
00:33:34,076 --> 00:33:38,636
Speaker 1: is like that kind of last second. Here is a

510
00:33:38,636 --> 00:33:43,076
Speaker 1: song that we that just came up, wasn't written specifically

511
00:33:43,076 --> 00:33:45,596
Speaker 1: for this album, but it sounds like it could be

512
00:33:45,636 --> 00:33:50,636
Speaker 1: a big song, have a much broader audience, and it

513
00:33:50,796 --> 00:33:52,716
Speaker 1: sounds like it could go on the album with a

514
00:33:52,756 --> 00:33:56,236
Speaker 1: few tweaks. I guess we have yet to see whether

515
00:33:56,276 --> 00:33:59,356
Speaker 1: it's going to be the song that everyone actually knows

516
00:33:59,396 --> 00:34:03,436
Speaker 1: from the album or not. But that's that's the intention.

517
00:34:03,676 --> 00:34:08,716
Speaker 1: It's the first single, and you know, there's like no

518
00:34:09,636 --> 00:34:11,796
Speaker 1: rules when it comes to the first single. Yeah, well

519
00:34:11,796 --> 00:34:15,756
Speaker 1: the Beauty of I listened to the album without knowing that,

520
00:34:16,996 --> 00:34:21,036
Speaker 1: and I absolutely love that song. And if anything, I

521
00:34:21,076 --> 00:34:23,756
Speaker 1: felt like that was the template for the whole album.

522
00:34:23,836 --> 00:34:28,356
Speaker 1: So it did not it did not stand out as

523
00:34:28,436 --> 00:34:32,036
Speaker 1: not belonging, just the opposite. It felt like, oh, this

524
00:34:32,116 --> 00:34:34,236
Speaker 1: is the perfect song, and now we're going to do

525
00:34:34,276 --> 00:35:04,276
Speaker 1: a whole album like this. Fantastic. Oh my favorite songs

526
00:35:04,316 --> 00:35:11,436
Speaker 1: are slow in oh my favorite people made me man,

527
00:35:14,276 --> 00:35:21,356
Speaker 1: everything that feels so good is bad. All my favorite

528
00:35:21,436 --> 00:35:25,436
Speaker 1: songs are slow and said, I don't know what's wrong

529
00:35:25,476 --> 00:35:36,596
Speaker 1: with me? What's wrong with me? So let's talk about

530
00:35:36,596 --> 00:35:39,836
Speaker 1: that song? How did that song come up? What was

531
00:35:39,876 --> 00:35:42,516
Speaker 1: going on? When did it happen? Tell me the story

532
00:35:42,516 --> 00:35:46,556
Speaker 1: of that song. I think that one came up really recently,

533
00:35:46,636 --> 00:35:49,236
Speaker 1: like maybe four or five months ago, and we were

534
00:35:49,276 --> 00:35:52,476
Speaker 1: actually working on another record. We were finishing our heavy

535
00:35:52,516 --> 00:35:57,436
Speaker 1: metal record called Van Weezer, and my manager sent me

536
00:35:57,716 --> 00:36:01,116
Speaker 1: an early version of the song with a chorus. It

537
00:36:01,196 --> 00:36:05,596
Speaker 1: was written by one of his favorite writers. Her name's Elsie,

538
00:36:06,036 --> 00:36:09,516
Speaker 1: and it was actually like a country song, and actually

539
00:36:09,516 --> 00:36:13,916
Speaker 1: sent me a small batch of country songs like song starters,

540
00:36:14,556 --> 00:36:17,796
Speaker 1: and I just started playing around with all these country songs,

541
00:36:17,836 --> 00:36:22,676
Speaker 1: not really knowing what they're for, and that one, for

542
00:36:22,716 --> 00:36:26,516
Speaker 1: some reason, when I sang it, it just it sounded like, Wow,

543
00:36:26,596 --> 00:36:29,996
Speaker 1: this sounds like a big universe versal song. It still

544
00:36:30,036 --> 00:36:35,276
Speaker 1: sounds like Rivers and Weezer, And we could kind of

545
00:36:35,636 --> 00:36:38,636
Speaker 1: massage it onto a couple of different albums. It could

546
00:36:38,636 --> 00:36:40,956
Speaker 1: be on a metal album, it could be on Okay Human,

547
00:36:42,036 --> 00:36:44,596
Speaker 1: we could make a country album and let's just start

548
00:36:44,596 --> 00:36:47,356
Speaker 1: fooling around with it. So we tried. We tried to

549
00:36:47,356 --> 00:36:49,876
Speaker 1: put it on I think we tried on Van Weeds

550
00:36:49,916 --> 00:36:53,116
Speaker 1: or first, but in any case, it just as we

551
00:36:53,196 --> 00:36:57,556
Speaker 1: shifted years into making Okay Human. We realized, as much

552
00:36:57,556 --> 00:37:00,236
Speaker 1: as we love the album, it would really benefit from

553
00:37:00,276 --> 00:37:06,756
Speaker 1: having that big flag waving single that that brings in

554
00:37:06,796 --> 00:37:12,236
Speaker 1: a wider audience to But it's probably a pretty difficult album.

555
00:37:12,516 --> 00:37:15,836
Speaker 1: So we started tweaking it to fit an on there

556
00:37:15,876 --> 00:37:19,836
Speaker 1: and it worked out really well. Yeah, it fits like

557
00:37:19,876 --> 00:37:22,476
Speaker 1: a glove. And again, not knowing the backstory, I would

558
00:37:22,476 --> 00:37:25,236
Speaker 1: have assumed that was just one of the batch that

559
00:37:25,276 --> 00:37:27,316
Speaker 1: you wrote, and it was a particularly great one, and

560
00:37:27,396 --> 00:37:30,116
Speaker 1: it sounds really like you, And the fact that that

561
00:37:30,276 --> 00:37:33,116
Speaker 1: started with someone else's shocking to me because it sounds

562
00:37:33,156 --> 00:37:39,516
Speaker 1: like a perfect Rivers, perfect Rivers song. Great. Do you

563
00:37:39,516 --> 00:37:42,716
Speaker 1: remember by any chance? I know we we history is

564
00:37:43,236 --> 00:37:46,276
Speaker 1: neither of our long suits. Do you have any idea

565
00:37:46,276 --> 00:37:48,636
Speaker 1: what the first song that you wrote for this for

566
00:37:48,716 --> 00:37:53,276
Speaker 1: the Okay Human album was? Any memory? Did you hear

567
00:37:53,316 --> 00:37:56,716
Speaker 1: the song bird with a Broken Wing? That might okay,

568
00:37:57,676 --> 00:38:01,556
Speaker 1: that might be one of the first or playing my piano? Yeah,

569
00:38:01,716 --> 00:38:06,556
Speaker 1: playing my pianos spectacular, It's cool. It's one of my favorites.

570
00:38:07,076 --> 00:38:08,916
Speaker 1: Can we can we you mind if we listen to

571
00:38:08,916 --> 00:38:11,796
Speaker 1: that right now? No, I'd love to you. Let's listen

572
00:38:11,836 --> 00:38:18,236
Speaker 1: to playing my piano? Okay, my wife finds upstairs. My

573
00:38:18,396 --> 00:38:23,356
Speaker 1: kids are upstairs, and I haven't washed my hair in

574
00:38:23,596 --> 00:38:32,236
Speaker 1: three weeks. I should get back to these zoom interviews,

575
00:38:33,076 --> 00:38:42,356
Speaker 1: but I get so absorbent time fly, I just can't

576
00:38:42,556 --> 00:38:56,596
Speaker 1: I go. When I'm playing my piano, I'm playing my piano,

577
00:38:59,476 --> 00:39:03,036
Speaker 1: I'm counting at the bass, singing at the too. I

578
00:39:03,196 --> 00:39:07,556
Speaker 1: never see the song that I'm I'm playing my pian

579
00:39:17,676 --> 00:39:30,436
Speaker 1: Heaven cancer, man, Heaven can help this man. Heaven, Heaven

580
00:39:30,836 --> 00:39:36,636
Speaker 1: turns his back on this man, Heaven shuts the door

581
00:39:36,836 --> 00:39:43,236
Speaker 1: on this man. Actually about that, Um, so I'm I'm

582
00:39:43,236 --> 00:39:49,116
Speaker 1: imagining that ending was an improvisation of looking for lyrics.

583
00:39:49,236 --> 00:39:54,796
Speaker 1: Is that correct? Yeah, that's my that's my original voice. Note. Um,

584
00:39:54,996 --> 00:40:00,236
Speaker 1: when I was writing the idea and I couldn't come

585
00:40:00,316 --> 00:40:02,036
Speaker 1: up with the lyric for the last line, and I

586
00:40:02,116 --> 00:40:04,196
Speaker 1: was trying all these things, and finally I gave up

587
00:40:04,196 --> 00:40:06,316
Speaker 1: and I just sent it to Jake because I like

588
00:40:06,396 --> 00:40:09,956
Speaker 1: the melody. He's like, yeah, this is great, And there's

589
00:40:09,956 --> 00:40:12,236
Speaker 1: a couple of spots on the album where he's like,

590
00:40:12,476 --> 00:40:15,316
Speaker 1: includes these things where you're like, you're not supposed to

591
00:40:15,356 --> 00:40:18,636
Speaker 1: show that to people. There was one spot in uh

592
00:40:19,836 --> 00:40:24,636
Speaker 1: was it LaBrea tarpits where we were tracking the basic

593
00:40:24,676 --> 00:40:27,636
Speaker 1: tracks with Pat on the drums, and right in the

594
00:40:27,636 --> 00:40:30,356
Speaker 1: middle of the song, his wife calls, so he just

595
00:40:30,396 --> 00:40:33,436
Speaker 1: stops playing. He picks up the phone, he starts talking,

596
00:40:34,236 --> 00:40:36,596
Speaker 1: and Jake puts it on the album, like the song

597
00:40:36,636 --> 00:40:38,916
Speaker 1: where we're playing the song and the song stops and

598
00:40:38,956 --> 00:40:41,516
Speaker 1: then you hear Pat talking to his wife on the phone.

599
00:40:42,636 --> 00:40:44,356
Speaker 1: I think that those might be some of the best

600
00:40:44,396 --> 00:40:47,396
Speaker 1: parts on the album. I mean, it does. It creates

601
00:40:48,156 --> 00:40:52,236
Speaker 1: a reality. It's like, this is really happening. You know,

602
00:40:52,276 --> 00:40:57,596
Speaker 1: it's not This is not this plastic thing rapped on

603
00:40:57,636 --> 00:41:02,876
Speaker 1: a shelf. This is a live moment in time, and

604
00:41:03,076 --> 00:41:06,116
Speaker 1: it's a real sense of reality. And I was I

605
00:41:06,196 --> 00:41:09,556
Speaker 1: was really moved by that ending. I thought it was beautiful.

606
00:41:10,436 --> 00:41:14,796
Speaker 1: You're looking for the words, and how each of the

607
00:41:14,876 --> 00:41:17,996
Speaker 1: choices was good in a different way and all equally

608
00:41:18,556 --> 00:41:26,796
Speaker 1: hopeless in their message. I like what I eventually settled on,

609
00:41:26,876 --> 00:41:29,756
Speaker 1: not in the voice note, but months later it finally

610
00:41:29,756 --> 00:41:31,516
Speaker 1: occurred to me. It's one of those things where like

611
00:41:31,556 --> 00:41:33,876
Speaker 1: I know the answer is going to come, but there's

612
00:41:33,876 --> 00:41:36,596
Speaker 1: just no way I can sit here and try to

613
00:41:36,636 --> 00:41:39,196
Speaker 1: force it. I just have to put it away for

614
00:41:39,236 --> 00:41:41,516
Speaker 1: a while and then one day it'll just pop into

615
00:41:41,556 --> 00:41:44,556
Speaker 1: my head and hopefully that's before we released the album,

616
00:41:44,756 --> 00:41:48,796
Speaker 1: and that's what happened. Luckily. This really feels like an

617
00:41:48,996 --> 00:41:52,116
Speaker 1: entirely different world, even though it still sounds like you,

618
00:41:52,236 --> 00:41:54,996
Speaker 1: and it still sounds like your songs. How did you

619
00:41:55,036 --> 00:41:58,676
Speaker 1: go about recording these songs? Obviously it's different than the

620
00:41:58,676 --> 00:42:01,756
Speaker 1: way you've recorded anything else because a whole different it's

621
00:42:01,836 --> 00:42:04,556
Speaker 1: essentially a different band, even though it's the players of

622
00:42:04,636 --> 00:42:09,996
Speaker 1: the players. It was the most insane recording problems. It

623
00:42:10,156 --> 00:42:13,796
Speaker 1: just made me so anxious through the whole thing. I

624
00:42:13,876 --> 00:42:17,036
Speaker 1: just really had to trust Jake because he had a

625
00:42:17,156 --> 00:42:20,596
Speaker 1: very strong idea for how he wanted to do it,

626
00:42:21,036 --> 00:42:27,076
Speaker 1: and it's just totally asked backwards. Forgive my pardon my French,

627
00:42:27,196 --> 00:42:31,556
Speaker 1: but he okay, So this is what we did. We

628
00:42:31,636 --> 00:42:34,916
Speaker 1: got together at his house, me and Pat and Jake

629
00:42:35,236 --> 00:42:40,436
Speaker 1: and Pat never heard the songs before, and they handed

630
00:42:40,476 --> 00:42:44,636
Speaker 1: me an acoustic guitar actually in a microphone and said, okay,

631
00:42:44,956 --> 00:42:46,996
Speaker 1: play your songs, and then Past is going to play

632
00:42:46,996 --> 00:42:49,996
Speaker 1: along like he's like right across from me in the

633
00:42:50,036 --> 00:42:53,676
Speaker 1: same room. No baffles. He's just kind of playing softly

634
00:42:54,436 --> 00:42:58,916
Speaker 1: and we did like two, three, maybe four takes of

635
00:42:58,956 --> 00:43:03,476
Speaker 1: each song, and that those were the drum takes. So

636
00:43:03,956 --> 00:43:05,956
Speaker 1: I mean, what you're hearing on the album is pat

637
00:43:05,996 --> 00:43:08,396
Speaker 1: like hearing the songs for the first time and trying

638
00:43:08,436 --> 00:43:12,236
Speaker 1: to figure out like how it goes, and talking to

639
00:43:12,276 --> 00:43:18,476
Speaker 1: his wife on the phone, and it's just kind of

640
00:43:18,596 --> 00:43:21,156
Speaker 1: terrifying as as a songwriter, like you want, you want

641
00:43:21,156 --> 00:43:27,276
Speaker 1: everything to go right. And so from there and they

642
00:43:27,396 --> 00:43:31,356
Speaker 1: really love, they really love that vibe, like that kind

643
00:43:31,396 --> 00:43:35,876
Speaker 1: of exploratory and not not too self conscious or not

644
00:43:35,916 --> 00:43:38,876
Speaker 1: playing a part. You already know how it goes, so

645
00:43:38,916 --> 00:43:42,636
Speaker 1: it has a real sense of vitality to it, I guess.

646
00:43:43,756 --> 00:43:48,116
Speaker 1: So then they take those drums and he goes to

647
00:43:48,996 --> 00:43:51,156
Speaker 1: the he brings it to the arranger and they listen

648
00:43:51,196 --> 00:43:54,876
Speaker 1: to all my piano arrangements and they turn that into

649
00:43:54,996 --> 00:43:59,876
Speaker 1: orchestra arrangements and they bring they bring the session to

650
00:44:00,476 --> 00:44:06,916
Speaker 1: Abbey Roads Studios in London and record all the strings

651
00:44:07,476 --> 00:44:11,316
Speaker 1: and then they ditch my basic acoustic and vocal tracks.

652
00:44:11,796 --> 00:44:14,156
Speaker 1: And so at that point you have all you have

653
00:44:14,236 --> 00:44:19,916
Speaker 1: her drums and this massive orchestra and it I mean,

654
00:44:19,956 --> 00:44:22,516
Speaker 1: obviously that orchestra is usually the last thing you put

655
00:44:22,556 --> 00:44:25,836
Speaker 1: on once you have a really solid foundation. Then they

656
00:44:25,876 --> 00:44:29,996
Speaker 1: did bass, and then I did all my vocals, and

657
00:44:29,996 --> 00:44:34,556
Speaker 1: then finally and then Brian did all his stuff, little

658
00:44:34,556 --> 00:44:38,836
Speaker 1: flourishes here and there, a lot of Hammond and acoustic guitar,

659
00:44:39,956 --> 00:44:42,476
Speaker 1: and then finally I did my piano, which was supposed

660
00:44:42,516 --> 00:44:45,196
Speaker 1: to be the centerpiece of the album. But in the

661
00:44:45,236 --> 00:44:47,996
Speaker 1: final version, when you have so many tracks like this,

662
00:44:48,076 --> 00:44:50,396
Speaker 1: you end up mute. It's the more you mute, the

663
00:44:50,436 --> 00:44:52,756
Speaker 1: better it ends up sounding. So we've muted so much

664
00:44:52,796 --> 00:44:56,756
Speaker 1: stuff and one of the things that got sacrificed was

665
00:44:56,836 --> 00:45:00,276
Speaker 1: my piano, which is shocking to me because it was

666
00:45:00,316 --> 00:45:02,716
Speaker 1: really supposed to be the centerpiece along with the orchestra.

667
00:45:03,436 --> 00:45:06,756
Speaker 1: But the orchestra really took over what I was doing

668
00:45:06,916 --> 00:45:09,676
Speaker 1: and it ended up being much more interesting to listen to.

669
00:45:11,076 --> 00:45:15,996
Speaker 1: So all of the orchestrations are based on your piano parts. Yeah,

670
00:45:16,676 --> 00:45:19,396
Speaker 1: I'm really When I listened to it, I'm amazed, like,

671
00:45:19,796 --> 00:45:23,116
Speaker 1: how many of these cool little counterpoint parts and melodiasy

672
00:45:23,196 --> 00:45:26,516
Speaker 1: here weaving in and around my vocal actually from my

673
00:45:26,556 --> 00:45:30,796
Speaker 1: original piano demos like um. But then there's some that

674
00:45:30,956 --> 00:45:33,476
Speaker 1: are not me that they came up on their own,

675
00:45:33,836 --> 00:45:38,556
Speaker 1: so my ego is totally satisfied because I feel like, Wow,

676
00:45:38,596 --> 00:45:42,476
Speaker 1: I didn't I did some amazing stuff. I really contributed

677
00:45:42,516 --> 00:45:47,236
Speaker 1: to the orchestration. And at the same time, I'm really

678
00:45:48,196 --> 00:45:52,356
Speaker 1: pleased with the string the orchestra arranger, because he contributed

679
00:45:52,396 --> 00:45:57,796
Speaker 1: a lot of incredible stuff too. It's fantastic. Yeah, let's

680
00:45:57,836 --> 00:46:02,516
Speaker 1: talk about rock my audible cool. Where the idea come from?

681
00:46:03,476 --> 00:46:06,276
Speaker 1: I guess for a couple of years, I'd been every

682
00:46:06,356 --> 00:46:11,276
Speaker 1: night listening to classic novel on Audible, and I'm not

683
00:46:11,316 --> 00:46:13,076
Speaker 1: a great sleeper, so often i'd wake up in the

684
00:46:13,076 --> 00:46:15,556
Speaker 1: middle of the night and I'd continue the novel then,

685
00:46:15,596 --> 00:46:20,956
Speaker 1: and I it's a really pleasurable state where I'm I'm

686
00:46:20,996 --> 00:46:23,916
Speaker 1: not I'm like not not even have asleep, maybe a

687
00:46:23,996 --> 00:46:28,876
Speaker 1: quarter asleep, not not really getting the benefits of deep sleep.

688
00:46:28,956 --> 00:46:33,116
Speaker 1: But I'm in this very like open what is it

689
00:46:33,236 --> 00:46:36,076
Speaker 1: some kind of beta wave thing. I'm just very open,

690
00:46:36,156 --> 00:46:41,196
Speaker 1: like I'm living in these novels, and it's such a

691
00:46:41,276 --> 00:46:44,076
Speaker 1: wonderful experience like it. But during the day, forget it.

692
00:46:44,116 --> 00:46:46,836
Speaker 1: I can't. I don't have the the calmness or the

693
00:46:46,876 --> 00:46:53,156
Speaker 1: concentration to read like a thousand page novel or something,

694
00:46:53,196 --> 00:46:55,756
Speaker 1: and really get focused and drawn into it, or even

695
00:46:55,796 --> 00:46:58,436
Speaker 1: listen to it on audible. But it's just these nighttime

696
00:46:58,476 --> 00:47:02,476
Speaker 1: audible sessions that we're so great for me, And so

697
00:47:02,516 --> 00:47:05,236
Speaker 1: I wrote a song about it. Great. Can we do

698
00:47:05,236 --> 00:47:07,596
Speaker 1: you mind if we listen to that one? No, let's

699
00:47:07,596 --> 00:47:21,236
Speaker 1: listen to that one. I can feel my breathing. It's

700
00:47:21,276 --> 00:47:28,556
Speaker 1: so nice. It's like a blanket on my life. Let

701
00:47:28,596 --> 00:47:33,076
Speaker 1: me stay here for forever. In the state of classical denial,

702
00:47:36,956 --> 00:47:41,476
Speaker 1: I'm cranking Missus doll Away, Moby Dick, drip on the world.

703
00:47:41,996 --> 00:47:45,596
Speaker 1: He's dyna just like me, with thirsty, folded deep. I'm

704
00:47:45,636 --> 00:47:51,516
Speaker 1: gonna round by houdible headphone grapes up five ships off

705
00:47:51,596 --> 00:47:55,516
Speaker 1: to a blabon. I just don't care. I just don't care,

706
00:47:55,796 --> 00:48:00,556
Speaker 1: Like my houdoball head phone grapes up five ship off

707
00:48:00,596 --> 00:48:04,596
Speaker 1: to a blabion. You think I care, I just don't care.

708
00:48:05,796 --> 00:48:11,476
Speaker 1: I just don't care. I'm paying. That's so nice. What

709
00:48:11,596 --> 00:48:16,676
Speaker 1: a great song that The chorus is really a super

710
00:48:16,916 --> 00:48:21,356
Speaker 1: duper anthemic chorus. And it's so funny to hear those

711
00:48:21,436 --> 00:48:26,516
Speaker 1: lyrics on that chorus and it works great, But it's

712
00:48:26,556 --> 00:48:31,036
Speaker 1: really haven't heard that before? Yeah, I can't remember what

713
00:48:31,076 --> 00:48:34,276
Speaker 1: it was like. I remember I went online. I was like, okay,

714
00:48:34,276 --> 00:48:37,036
Speaker 1: I got to write a chorus. And I just went

715
00:48:37,076 --> 00:48:42,036
Speaker 1: online and I searched for like inspirational phrases and it was,

716
00:48:42,236 --> 00:48:44,036
Speaker 1: oh gosh, I'd have to go back and see what

717
00:48:44,076 --> 00:48:47,756
Speaker 1: it was. But some really cheesy inspirational phrase like get

718
00:48:47,836 --> 00:48:50,956
Speaker 1: up and go or some something like that. And so

719
00:48:50,996 --> 00:48:53,076
Speaker 1: that's how I came up with the music and the melody.

720
00:48:53,716 --> 00:48:56,276
Speaker 1: And then I was like, well, that lyric is not

721
00:48:56,276 --> 00:48:59,036
Speaker 1: going to work, so I just kind of grafted my

722
00:48:59,116 --> 00:49:04,396
Speaker 1: other story onto it, onto the uplifting music. It really

723
00:49:04,436 --> 00:49:11,596
Speaker 1: works like it's unbelievable. And interestingly, also by using the

724
00:49:11,636 --> 00:49:16,076
Speaker 1: current reference of Audible, it almost has a hip hop

725
00:49:16,156 --> 00:49:20,116
Speaker 1: like modernity because it's not unusual in a hip hop

726
00:49:20,156 --> 00:49:23,996
Speaker 1: song to hear, you know, Audible as a brand, to

727
00:49:24,116 --> 00:49:28,876
Speaker 1: hear a brand flaunt it in a song, yeah yeah,

728
00:49:29,036 --> 00:49:33,396
Speaker 1: or like Insta or something. But in my case it's Audible. Yeah.

729
00:49:33,396 --> 00:49:36,196
Speaker 1: It makes it very modern. It really does. It's really

730
00:49:36,236 --> 00:49:39,276
Speaker 1: good cool. I can't wait for people to hear it.

731
00:49:39,356 --> 00:49:42,516
Speaker 1: I think it's really I think it's really really good

732
00:49:42,676 --> 00:49:47,116
Speaker 1: and it's wow. It's refreshing to hear it sounds so

733
00:49:47,236 --> 00:49:49,716
Speaker 1: different yet so much like you, and for the songs

734
00:49:49,756 --> 00:49:54,276
Speaker 1: to be so great. It's, i mean, one of my

735
00:49:54,316 --> 00:49:59,076
Speaker 1: favorites of your work. Wow, that means so much coming

736
00:49:59,116 --> 00:50:03,596
Speaker 1: from you. Thank you. Yeah, it's really beautiful, great work. Well,

737
00:50:03,636 --> 00:50:05,996
Speaker 1: I've got to give Jake a lot of credit because

738
00:50:05,996 --> 00:50:08,836
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm the same person I was for

739
00:50:10,876 --> 00:50:15,116
Speaker 1: It was really his vision and I immediately realist, oh

740
00:50:15,116 --> 00:50:18,516
Speaker 1: that's a really cool idea, let's do that, and turned

741
00:50:18,516 --> 00:50:21,196
Speaker 1: out just like he imagined. So a lot of credit

742
00:50:21,236 --> 00:50:25,236
Speaker 1: to him. Great. Please thank him for me for making

743
00:50:25,276 --> 00:50:30,396
Speaker 1: something that I love so much. I will He'll be

744
00:50:30,476 --> 00:50:35,956
Speaker 1: very excited to hear hear you sid that thanks the

745
00:50:36,036 --> 00:50:39,396
Speaker 1: Rivers Cuomo for entertaining that puzzar conspiracy theory for us.

746
00:50:40,116 --> 00:50:42,036
Speaker 1: You can hear all of our favorite Weezer songs on

747
00:50:42,076 --> 00:50:45,636
Speaker 1: my playlist at Broken Record podcast dot and be sure

748
00:50:45,676 --> 00:50:48,396
Speaker 1: to subscribe to our YouTube channel at YouTube dot com

749
00:50:48,436 --> 00:50:51,836
Speaker 1: slash Broken Record Podcast, where we can find extended cutstuff,

750
00:50:51,876 --> 00:50:54,956
Speaker 1: new and old episodes. Broken Record is woods would help

751
00:50:54,956 --> 00:51:00,676
Speaker 1: Fumy Arose Jason Gambrell, Martin Gonzalez, Eric Sandler, and Jennifer Sanchez,

752
00:51:00,996 --> 00:51:04,236
Speaker 1: but engineering help from Nick Chafee and his executive produced

753
00:51:04,236 --> 00:51:06,756
Speaker 1: by me a label. Broken Record is a production of

754
00:51:06,756 --> 00:51:10,076
Speaker 1: Pushkin Industries and if you like Broken Record, remember to share, rate,

755
00:51:10,116 --> 00:51:12,716
Speaker 1: and review us on your podcast at What the Music

756
00:51:12,716 --> 00:51:15,236
Speaker 1: Is by Kenny Beats. I'm Justin Richmond, bass