Speaker 1: Welcome to another edition of the Dave Pash Podcast. I'm
Speaker 1: your host, Arizona Cardinals announcer ESPN broadcaster Dave Pash. Our
Speaker 1: guest this week is our twenty seventh and year one
Speaker 1: of the Dave Pash Podcast, and it's JJ Reddick, who
Speaker 1: was one of the great college basketball players of all time.
Speaker 1: Terrific NBA player, fifteen years in the league, currently a
Speaker 1: podcaster as well as an analyst for ESPN on several platforms.
Speaker 1: One of the reasons I wanted to get Jj on
Speaker 1: was on the heels of Duke's run to the Final four.
Speaker 1: Wanted to get JJ's thoughts on Mike Shashevsky's final season,
Speaker 1: what coach k meant to JJ, his thoughts on Duke
Speaker 1: going forward. I was around him for four years. I
Speaker 1: never saw him have a bad day and that was
Speaker 1: the biggest lesson that I learned from him, as well
Speaker 1: as being adaptable, and by adaptability as a coach, I
Speaker 1: mean year to year, he was willing to work with
Speaker 1: what he had. We'll also talk about the NBA Playoffs
Speaker 1: and all the awards that will be announced here in
Speaker 1: the next few weeks, specifically with regard to the Phoenix Suns.
Speaker 1: Where does Devin Booker fit into the MVP conversation? What
Speaker 1: about Monny Williams for Coach of the Year. We'll also
Speaker 1: talk about JJ's podcast, The Old Man and the Three,
Speaker 1: how it started and where it's headed. We are presented
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Speaker 1: Here's our guest on this week's Dave Pash Podcast episode,
Speaker 1: JJ Redick. So, JJ, Since the last time I saw you,
Speaker 1: I watched Tenant again and I still can and figure
Speaker 1: it out. And you're telling me that Robert Pattinson is
Speaker 1: at his name, the lead actor who just played the
Speaker 1: lead and the Batman, which was really good, by the way,
Speaker 1: So you're telling me he's supposed to be the son
Speaker 1: because I still can't figure it out. And now I
Speaker 1: need to go back and watch it again, but I
Speaker 1: get more and more frustrated every time I watch it.
Speaker 1: So the prevailing one of the prevailing fan theories about
Speaker 1: the movie is that Neil played by Robert Pattinson, is
Speaker 1: actually Max, and Max, of course, is the young son
Speaker 1: of Kat. And when I like something, I just deep dive.
Speaker 1: And we've talked about this when we did our games
Speaker 1: together in March. But in anything I do in life,
Speaker 1: when I like it, it's just becomes an obsessive deep dive.
Speaker 1: So not only did I watch Tenant I think six
Speaker 1: times in the first ten days it came out, but
Speaker 1: I spent hours on YouTube watching fan theory videos and
Speaker 1: spend some time on Reddit of course. But yeah, that's
Speaker 1: I mean, that's how I operate my life. Unfortunately, I
Speaker 1: don't do that with everything. It's just the things that
Speaker 1: I'm really into. And one of those things that I'm
Speaker 1: really into is Christopher Nolan movies. Well, the way he
Speaker 1: does the movies, it makes you think, and it makes
Speaker 1: you question it, and then you watch it again and
Speaker 1: you question the theory that you came up with. Like Inception,
Speaker 1: it seems like it's one or two things either it
Speaker 1: was a dream the entire time or it was real.
Speaker 1: But Tenant, there can be like ten different theories about
Speaker 1: who is playing who and what's actually happening. Like I
Speaker 1: thought the first time I saw it that he dies,
Speaker 1: like when they show Tenant, you know, that's when they're
Speaker 1: pulling his teeth out, And I thought it died, And
Speaker 1: this was just again some state that he's in, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe on his deathbed. And I know Interstellar is your favorite,
Speaker 1: right because that's what you have on your emoji for Twitter.
Speaker 1: My advata, yes digital avatar is is a picture of
Speaker 1: Matthew McConaughey and his space suit. Um. Yeah, Interstellar is
Speaker 1: my favorite Nolan movie. I I when Inception first came out,
Speaker 1: that sort of was it for me, And I look,
Speaker 1: I was a fan of all of the Batman movies,
Speaker 1: specifically The Dark Knight, the second one in the trilogy
Speaker 1: that Nolan did. Prestigi is amazing, Mementos, amazing m But
Speaker 1: for me, it's it's Interstellar. And I always say this, like,
Speaker 1: to me, it's the greatest combination of storytelling science And
Speaker 1: obviously you can argue whether not the science is real,
Speaker 1: but science and then the visual effects you know, and
Speaker 1: to some degree, you can't beat that soundtrack. There's some
Speaker 1: moments where the music and what you're what you're seeing,
Speaker 1: the auditory and visual experience, the combination of both those
Speaker 1: scenes are just they're chilling. Man. It's I just I
Speaker 1: just love that movie. I'm very passionate about it. Well,
Speaker 1: this is technically a football podcast, but we have had
Speaker 1: JJ as I told you, a number of basketball related guests.
Speaker 1: We've had an actor on, We've had Frank kelliendo on.
Speaker 1: But every time we have somebody on that's either not
Speaker 1: connected to football directly or has no connection whatsoever to football,
Speaker 1: I still at least ask who your team was growing up.
Speaker 1: And I think I know the answer to this one.
Speaker 1: If you played football. I think I remember you said
Speaker 1: something about your parents wouldn't let you. Then they eventually
Speaker 1: did and you broke your wrists you couldn't play anymore.
Speaker 1: Is that right? Yeah, it's so I had asked them
Speaker 1: my whole childhood. Once I started playing sports, started playing sports.
Speaker 1: When I was eight, I got into baseball, I got
Speaker 1: into basketball, and I was like, I can I play football?
Speaker 1: My friends play football? Can play football? And they I
Speaker 1: was very frail. I was very skinny, and they said no,
Speaker 1: and they said no, And then the summer between seventh
Speaker 1: and eighth grade they said I could play football well
Speaker 1: at nationals that year, I got undercut and I broke
Speaker 1: my right wrist. And right when school started, I was
Speaker 1: going to go out for the football team, and I
Speaker 1: was playing pick up and I broke my left wrist
Speaker 1: getting undercut on the basketball court. So that pretty much
Speaker 1: ended my football career. But I was gonna go play
Speaker 1: wide receiver. That was what I was going to play.
Speaker 1: We already had a really good quarterback. My high school
Speaker 1: randomly had this two year stretch to class above me
Speaker 1: and then my class where we had a ton of
Speaker 1: Division one athletes. We were a relatively small public school
Speaker 1: in Ronoke, Virginia, but we had multiple ACC athletes, a
Speaker 1: number of low D one football players. We actually had
Speaker 1: an ACA player that played a wake Forest. But we
Speaker 1: just had this influx of high level Division one athletes,
Speaker 1: and I think I think I would have been fine
Speaker 1: in football. I don't think I would have continued to
Speaker 1: play football throughout high school because because I would have
Speaker 1: gotten so many chiefs, somebody was going to try to
Speaker 1: take me out. Because at that point by the end
Speaker 1: of my freshman year in basketball, you know, I was
Speaker 1: nationally ranked and pretty good, and you know, similar to Duke,
Speaker 1: the other schools probably didn't like me that much, and
Speaker 1: so somebody would have taken a dirty shot at me,
Speaker 1: and I probably would. I probably would have quit football.
Speaker 1: Baseball was my passion, though baseball was my passion. Really, yeah,
Speaker 1: baseball was my passion I was. I pitched, and it
Speaker 1: was the first sport I remember watching. I started watching
Speaker 1: basketball and ninety two, that Duke team and then subsequently
Speaker 1: that Bulls playoff run when they beat the Blazers. But
Speaker 1: I started watching baseball the year prior, and I was
Speaker 1: a huge Atlanta Braves fan. Eventually became a huge Indians
Speaker 1: fan because of Manny Ramirez and then when he went
Speaker 1: to the Red Sox, I started watching the Red Sox
Speaker 1: and Pedro Martinez was my favorite pitcher. They went within
Speaker 1: two years, they both go to the Red Sox, and
Speaker 1: from that point on, I was a Red Sox fan.
Speaker 1: To answer your question about football, though I never had
Speaker 1: a team professional sports, a lot of times I just
Speaker 1: rooted for athletes. So I would root for specific players
Speaker 1: and run us in this weird place where you know,
Speaker 1: we're three and a half hours from Charlotte, where four
Speaker 1: hours from Washington, DC, So there wasn't the hometown team
Speaker 1: that I could root for sure. Well, obviously things worked
Speaker 1: out for you with basketball. He became one of the
Speaker 1: greatest players in the history not only a Duke but
Speaker 1: of college basketball. Leaving Duke is the all time leading scorer,
Speaker 1: not just there but in the conference. Four year player.
Speaker 1: I know you didn't win a championship, but you accomplished
Speaker 1: so much there and I know how much Coach k
Speaker 1: still means to you. It was really thrilling to watch
Speaker 1: that run. It was a neat story for everybody, even
Speaker 1: if you're not a Duke fan, because of what Mike
Speaker 1: Shazowski's meant to the game to see that team go
Speaker 1: to the Final four. What do you I'm sure you've
Speaker 1: spoken with him, and I know you were at his
Speaker 1: last home game, which, like the final four game, the
Speaker 1: national semifinal game was. You know, it was a loss
Speaker 1: in North Carolina. What do you think it meant to
Speaker 1: him JJ to get this group in his last go
Speaker 1: around to the final four. It was very meaningful and
Speaker 1: coach always has he talked about it, but y'alls has
Speaker 1: a next play, next team mentality. I was around him
Speaker 1: for four years. I never saw him have a bad day.
Speaker 1: That was the biggest lesson that I learned from him,
Speaker 1: as well as being adaptable. And by adaptability as a coach,
Speaker 1: I mean year to year, he was willing to work
Speaker 1: with what he had. There wasn't a system, it was
Speaker 1: how do I make this group good? And on top
Speaker 1: of that, he was very invested in each group. And
Speaker 1: so I know with this particular group, a very young team.
Speaker 1: Obviously Wendel Moore was a junior, but mainly playing young
Speaker 1: players to get to the final four was a huge deal.
Speaker 1: And the growth that they showed, you know, anytime you're
Speaker 1: a coach and you see your team grow in a
Speaker 1: period of time as they did over the last six
Speaker 1: weeks of the season was huge. That that Michigan State
Speaker 1: game in the to go to the Sweet sixteen, the
Speaker 1: Texas Tech game to go to the lead eight, those
Speaker 1: were two of the best duke wins that I've seen
Speaker 1: in a long long time, in several years. So just
Speaker 1: I was really proud of the group. And of course
Speaker 1: Carolina wins the game and Cameron and they beat us
Speaker 1: in the Final four. And by the way, I was
Speaker 1: at the Final four game to fantastic basketball game, high
Speaker 1: level college basketball, and it's very sad as a Duke
Speaker 1: fan because in this rivalry for them to win probably
Speaker 1: the two biggest games ever in that rivalry, the first
Speaker 1: time we've met in the tournament in the final four,
Speaker 1: potentially coaches last game turns out to be his last
Speaker 1: game as well as his last home game. For them
Speaker 1: to win those two games, oh, it's soul crushing. I'll
Speaker 1: have to hear about it the rest of my life.
Speaker 1: I certainly feel for you on that one. Well, on
Speaker 1: the other side, I was just with Vince Carter the
Speaker 1: other night doing the game, and he was obviously upset
Speaker 1: about what happened Monday with them. But here's a part
Speaker 1: of him that I think a lot of Carolina for
Speaker 1: Carolina players and Carolina fans field the same way. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we lost in the championship game, but you know what,
Speaker 1: we beat Duke. Well, they can definitely hang their hat
Speaker 1: on that. And for a team that didn't necessarily have
Speaker 1: high expectations and ended up being an eight seed, which
Speaker 1: turn you know, selection committee a terrible job with seating
Speaker 1: the ACC Miami should not have been a ten seed
Speaker 1: and Carolina should have been an eight seed, But to
Speaker 1: be an eight seed and get to the championship game,
Speaker 1: that that team huge accomplishment for them, big moment for
Speaker 1: Hubert Davis, really really really really happy for him. You
Speaker 1: know that that that rivalry, the the meaning of playing
Speaker 1: at a school, and now John Shire will get to
Speaker 1: go through this as Hubert's going through it right now.
Speaker 1: That playing in that rivalry, playing for that school and
Speaker 1: then going back and coaching and getting to beat Duke
Speaker 1: just a huge moment for him. Huge moment. Well, as
Speaker 1: you and I talked about, I've worked with so many
Speaker 1: different analysts over the years, and one of my first
Speaker 1: analysts on college basketball at ESPN was Hubert Davis. I
Speaker 1: did two years with Hubert. We were doing a lot
Speaker 1: of games out west, and he was living in Chapel
Speaker 1: Hill and then eventually went to studio and then wanted
Speaker 1: to get into coaching, went back working for Roy at
Speaker 1: North Carolina, and I was so happy for him. He's
Speaker 1: such an encouraging guy, positive guy. You can see his
Speaker 1: imprint on that team over the course of the season.
Speaker 1: I got to imagine when you're struggling and you're at
Speaker 1: a place like North Carolina and the pressure is high
Speaker 1: and your head coach is constantly encouraging you and being positive,
Speaker 1: and then you start to see some results. It builds confidence,
Speaker 1: and I don't feel like he's getting the credit held
Speaker 1: when you take over for a legend like Roy Williams.
Speaker 1: I mean, imagine if John Shire next year goes to
Speaker 1: the championship game replacing Mike Shashevsky, what people will say
Speaker 1: about him. I feel like it will be disproportionate maybe
Speaker 1: to reality, because both jobs are incredibly hard when you
Speaker 1: consider who you're replacing. I always felt that playing at
Speaker 1: Duke it felt like living in a fishbowl, and at
Speaker 1: the time, college basketball, maybe in terms of sports culture,
Speaker 1: maybe was a little more popular just because of the
Speaker 1: one and done era has kind of changed college basketball.
Speaker 1: So my takeaway from this season and specifically with March Madness,
Speaker 1: was that was one of the best tournaments period that
Speaker 1: we've seen in a few years in terms of the upsets,
Speaker 1: high level basketball, clutch shot making. We saw it on
Speaker 1: the wim inside as well, a number of amazing games
Speaker 1: that I got to watch in the women's tournament as well,
Speaker 1: And so I think there's been a narrative around the
Speaker 1: demise of college basketball, and I am so happy that
Speaker 1: we're getting back to high level college basketball. And I
Speaker 1: think when this transfer portal thing happened, oh it's going
Speaker 1: to ruin college. But what's happened as actually is there's
Speaker 1: older players. It's not just eighteen and nineteen year old kids,
Speaker 1: and so you're seeing guys the added value of staying
Speaker 1: in school and learning the game and being coached. And
Speaker 1: then you have this influx like Hubert Davis who are
Speaker 1: bringing modern concepts to basketball. I went on an epic
Speaker 1: not an epic rant. Our video producer put that in
Speaker 1: the title of the video, but I went on a
Speaker 1: rant on the podcast this week with Kevin Durant about
Speaker 1: what I view is as archaic strategy in college BASKETBA.
Speaker 1: And there's such a stark difference between watching a team
Speaker 1: that implements modern concepts offensively and defensively versus teams that don't.
Speaker 1: And so watching UNC for me was actually a real
Speaker 1: pleasure because I thought they ran great sets, they have
Speaker 1: great spacing, they have shooting, they have guards that can
Speaker 1: break you down off the dribble, a rim running big,
Speaker 1: and then they ice everything in pick and rolls, which
Speaker 1: is another NBA concept like we need to we need
Speaker 1: to sort of get some more modern concepts into college basketball,
Speaker 1: and so for a guy like Hubert Davis to bring
Speaker 1: that into it, I think is phenomenal. Well, most of
Speaker 1: my career at ESPN doing college basketball has been the
Speaker 1: one and done era, and I remember doing I did
Speaker 1: Kevin Durance McDonald's All America game and then a bunch
Speaker 1: of his games that first year at Texas. I remember
Speaker 1: doing a game at Texas Tech when Bob Knight was
Speaker 1: a coach there and Durant goes for thirty seven and
Speaker 1: twenty three rebounds, and obviously he was so talented he
Speaker 1: wasn't going to stay. Needed to go. And that's the
Speaker 1: case with most guys that are that you know anywhere
Speaker 1: in that same realm in terms of talent level. You
Speaker 1: just go. And I think a lot of people like
Speaker 1: I struggle with trying to present like every year it's
Speaker 1: a new team every year college basketball, unless you're a
Speaker 1: diehard Duke fan or North Carolina fan, blue chip programs
Speaker 1: like Kentucky, Syracuse even it's you kind of bounce around
Speaker 1: and it's hard to really get you fall in love
Speaker 1: with Saint Peter's the coach leaves. You're not gonna remember
Speaker 1: the players' names once they lose. And you know, back
Speaker 1: when you played, I mean you got attached to guys,
Speaker 1: and I know you didn't like being disliked, but there
Speaker 1: were a lot of people that were attached to you
Speaker 1: because they wanted to root against you, and it's really
Speaker 1: hard to do that now in college basketball. What are
Speaker 1: the things that people inherently enjoy about watching sports is
Speaker 1: watching athletes grow. They grow through adversity, they grow through failure,
Speaker 1: they grow through success, but watching growth over a three
Speaker 1: or four year period, that's the attachment. You know, I
Speaker 1: remember watching this kid as a freshman. Now look at
Speaker 1: him as a senior. I remember when he rode the
Speaker 1: bench as a freshman. Now he's starting and he's all conference.
Speaker 1: There's something that's really enjoyable as a sports fan to
Speaker 1: see that. We have that, of course in pro sports,
Speaker 1: where guys have a much longer runway and we can
Speaker 1: see that maturation and that growth. Jannis is a great
Speaker 1: example of that. To watch him early in his career
Speaker 1: as the number one option in the playoffs, and then
Speaker 1: to see him last year close out of Finals with
Speaker 1: a fifty ball in game six. There's that growth and
Speaker 1: it's fun to root for that. And when you're seeing
Speaker 1: guys for one season thirty games, it's it's harder to
Speaker 1: get that attachment. And by the way, the other thing
Speaker 1: I wanted to add is I've always said that, but
Speaker 1: guys should be able to leave out of high school
Speaker 1: go to the pros. I really believe that. The negative
Speaker 1: byproduct to me of the one and done era is
Speaker 1: if you're a highly touted, highly recruited McDonald's all American,
Speaker 1: you go to a school, there's almost an expectation or
Speaker 1: an obligation to leave school early. We've created this sort
Speaker 1: of demarcation line. Now it's like one and done era. Okay,
Speaker 1: I go for a year, I leave, And really it
Speaker 1: should be culturally it should be more about you leave
Speaker 1: when you're ready. Maybe some guys that's high school. Maybe
Speaker 1: some guys it is after your freshman year, maybe you
Speaker 1: need another year. But now it's it's part of the
Speaker 1: culture that you go to school for a year. And
Speaker 1: Duke's had a number of guys do this where they
Speaker 1: go to school for a year and you know it
Speaker 1: doesn't pan out. I would have loved to see them
Speaker 1: stay for an extra year or two. I'm glad you
Speaker 1: brought up, you know, the enjoyment for fans of seeing
Speaker 1: a player grow over the course of his or her
Speaker 1: collegiate career. And you've been pretty open and honest and
Speaker 1: humble about some of the mistakes that you made in
Speaker 1: college that maybe people at the time didn't know about.
Speaker 1: And I'm curious for you, when did you recognize that.
Speaker 1: Was it while you were at Duke after meetings with
Speaker 1: coach k or was it once you're in the NBA
Speaker 1: and you grew up a little bit? When when did
Speaker 1: I recognize the growth or yeah? Like, when did you
Speaker 1: look back and say, wow, you know I made I
Speaker 1: made a mistake when I was a freshman or so
Speaker 1: I spent too much time focused on other aspects besides basketball,
Speaker 1: Like when you and coach when when things started to
Speaker 1: click for you, when you kind of figured things out.
Speaker 1: Did you know it at the time or did you
Speaker 1: have to look back once you're in the NBA, And like, man,
Speaker 1: I could I can pinpoint that moment at Duke when
Speaker 1: I figured it out And here's why I figured it out, right,
Speaker 1: I figured it out at the end of my junior year.
Speaker 1: And so I'll try to be very succinct with this
Speaker 1: explanation and story. But my whole life I got you know,
Speaker 1: I was a massive Duke fan, die hard Duke fan.
Speaker 1: I wanted to go to Duke. I wanted to play
Speaker 1: a Duke. I get to Duke and everybody hates me.
Speaker 1: I'm taken aback by it. I take on this persona,
Speaker 1: this brash, cocky, arrogant persona on the court that creates
Speaker 1: a cycle of more hatred, of more animosity towards me,
Speaker 1: and there was this feeling of this isn't what I
Speaker 1: signed up for. I didn't realize it was going to
Speaker 1: be this hard. I thought this was supposed to be fun.
Speaker 1: And so I went into what I would like to
Speaker 1: call a rebellious phase my sophomore year, and I wanted
Speaker 1: to quit. My sisters talked me out of it. I
Speaker 1: spent most of that season on antidepressants. I was also
Speaker 1: behaving in a way that was coming of of a
Speaker 1: of a collegiate athlete period, much less a duke basketball
Speaker 1: player where the standard is so high and coach and
Speaker 1: I had a number of meetings after my sophomore year
Speaker 1: that culminated in a meeting around May twentieth, and he
Speaker 1: brought me into his office with Woejoe and Collins, and
Speaker 1: it was it was a come to Jesus moment, and
Speaker 1: he laid out a plan for me. I started seeing
Speaker 1: a therapist weekly. They gave me a schedule to the hour,
Speaker 1: and I stuck to that schedule the entire summer. I
Speaker 1: went from about two hundred and twenty pounds at the
Speaker 1: end of my sophomore year, I started first practice weighing
Speaker 1: about one ninety two. I was an unbelievable shape. I
Speaker 1: won every conditioning drill that offseason, and I got National
Speaker 1: Player of the Year, ACC Player of the Year. And
Speaker 1: there was a moment in Coach's hotel room in Austin,
Speaker 1: Texas after we Austin the Sweet sixteen where two things happen.
Speaker 1: I realized that it worked, and I realized that Coach
Speaker 1: and I were now friends, that we weren't just player coach,
Speaker 1: we were real friends. And I lived that out the
Speaker 1: rest of my career. There was no going back. I
Speaker 1: saw what being diligent and being disciplined and being fully
Speaker 1: invested in being fully committed, what the result of that
Speaker 1: was Now I didn't always get the result that I wanted,
Speaker 1: but I knew that that was my benchmark, that was
Speaker 1: my standard that I had to have in order for
Speaker 1: me to play at a high level. So you leave Duke,
Speaker 1: you come to the NBA, you're the eleventh overall pick.
Speaker 1: And I remember when he came into the NBA and
Speaker 1: there were a lot of people, and I'm sure you
Speaker 1: heard it that said, JJ Reddick, great shooter in college?
Speaker 1: You know, is that going to translate to him being
Speaker 1: around in the NBA for a long period of time?
Speaker 1: Is he just going to be a role player? Can
Speaker 1: he do anything else besides shoot? And you played fifth
Speaker 1: teen years, you had a great NBA career, And I'm curious, JJ,
Speaker 1: do you think you would have lasted as long in
Speaker 1: the NBA and it had as much success as you
Speaker 1: did in the NBA if you didn't go through that
Speaker 1: transition at Duke and didn't learn from those mistakes that
Speaker 1: you talked about at Duke. No chance. Now I think
Speaker 1: I would have played in the NBA. And if I
Speaker 1: had gone to University of Florida or the University of
Speaker 1: Virginia or Texas or Stanford or any of the other schools,
Speaker 1: that were really recruiting me. I would have had a
Speaker 1: good college career and I would have played in the NBA.
Speaker 1: I would not have had the success that I had
Speaker 1: in college or the success that I had the NBA
Speaker 1: if I hadn't gone through what I went through. And
Speaker 1: so I'm grateful for it. And you know, there was
Speaker 1: a lot of there was a lot of guilt, There
Speaker 1: was a lot of low moments. There was a lot
Speaker 1: of self doubt. There was that in my NBA career too,
Speaker 1: but I intuitively understood at that point what it took,
Speaker 1: and so there was always that work to go back to.
Speaker 1: There was always that discipline, getting my sleep, eating right,
Speaker 1: being in the gym, taking care of myself. So if
Speaker 1: the results weren't there, if the self doubt was there,
Speaker 1: if the guilt was there over missing a shot laid
Speaker 1: or letting my man score, whatever it was, I just
Speaker 1: went back to work and I went back to the things.
Speaker 1: I guess they were my grounding principles of my career.
Speaker 1: And so to learn that at nineteen, that was the
Speaker 1: biggest boost I ever could get for having success in
Speaker 1: the NBA. One of the things I've appreciated in the
Speaker 1: short time working with you and then just kind of
Speaker 1: watching you operate when I see you in the studio.
Speaker 1: Is you take the craft of broadcasting seriously? When I
Speaker 1: listened to your podcast, like you sound like you've been
Speaker 1: doing this for twenty five years. I said the same
Speaker 1: thing to you after we did our two games together.
Speaker 1: It just you're a natural, but you take it seriously
Speaker 1: and you care. And I know this was something you
Speaker 1: were thinking about doing while you were still playing. But ultimately,
Speaker 1: when you made the decision to stop playing, something you
Speaker 1: had been doing for twenty plus years, more than twenty
Speaker 1: if you include high school, was it a difficult decision?
Speaker 1: Was there a transition period where you were missing, you know,
Speaker 1: being with the guys on the road, you know, playing
Speaker 1: cards on the road, talking wine, movies with your teammates,
Speaker 1: or do you still miss that? I still miss that.
Speaker 1: I'll always miss that, and I don't know that I
Speaker 1: can replicate that in any other way in my life.
Speaker 1: There's something that's very sacred to me about being on
Speaker 1: a team. It's weird because I fell in love with
Speaker 1: basketball as a as a home schooler who would get
Speaker 1: his work done early in the morning and have the
Speaker 1: rest of my day because I had. You know, my
Speaker 1: parents didn't make a lot of money, so both my
Speaker 1: parents worked. You know, my mom would teach us some days.
Speaker 1: I would go to work with her and do my
Speaker 1: work there. One of five kids, so there was a
Speaker 1: lot of autonomy that I had in my childhood, and
Speaker 1: I had to fill time. And I liked going out
Speaker 1: on a basketball court and shooting for hours. And that's
Speaker 1: initially how I fell in love with it. And then
Speaker 1: I started playing AU basketball and I would travel and
Speaker 1: we'd stay in hotel rooms and I'd stay up late
Speaker 1: with people that came from a different background of me,
Speaker 1: and we'd talk about life. And I did that for
Speaker 1: thirty years. I made so many great friendships. I had
Speaker 1: so many great moments off the court. I'll miss that.
Speaker 1: I missed you mentioned card games. I missed the action.
Speaker 1: I missed the action. I missed the action a lot.
Speaker 1: And it was it was I was ready to retire
Speaker 1: for a while. It wasn't about that. It was about
Speaker 1: just squeezing every last bit I could out of my
Speaker 1: career and my inherent love for the game. I wanted
Speaker 1: to keep doing it. The decision to retire ultimately came
Speaker 1: down to a time value. Proposition, you know, what, what
Speaker 1: is it I want to do with my time? And
Speaker 1: because my kids were getting older, and because I had
Speaker 1: missed so much over the last few years and specifically
Speaker 1: in the bubble year. Once I started doing those exercises
Speaker 1: about being in a hotel room in Cleveland in February
Speaker 1: versus taking my kid to Florida for spring break, it
Speaker 1: became pretty clear to me that it was time. And
Speaker 1: I was fried physically, emotionally, mentally. I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: my wife and I always talk about this, Like I
Speaker 1: even when I was home, I was still thinking about
Speaker 1: the game and practicing and training. It was just it
Speaker 1: was all compassing all the time, and I was ready
Speaker 1: for a break. I was ready for change. And I
Speaker 1: had no idea that I'd be busier in retirement somehow
Speaker 1: than I was as a player. And so the camaraderie
Speaker 1: and the team thing is what I'll miss the most.
Speaker 1: And then the second thing, which I'm still navigating, and
Speaker 1: I think it takes time to navigate. But the second
Speaker 1: thing is we've talked about the structure. I need structure
Speaker 1: in my life, and I enjoyed the structure of being
Speaker 1: a professional athlete so much. I enjoyed knowing every day
Speaker 1: where I was supposed to be, when I was going
Speaker 1: to train, when I was going to go to sleep,
Speaker 1: when my meals were going to be. I sometimes forget
Speaker 1: to eat now, you know. I'm like, oh, it's five o'clock.
Speaker 1: I forgot to eat lunch, you know. So I really
Speaker 1: those are the two things that obviously I'm miss shooting
Speaker 1: a basketball, but those are the two things that I'm
Speaker 1: I'm still working my way through and I look up.
Speaker 1: Maybe I'll never be able to replicate that first thing
Speaker 1: ever again, but certainly grateful that I got to do
Speaker 1: it for so long days like this. Maybe you miss
Speaker 1: it more when you're spending time a pile and flooring
Speaker 1: for your house. It was enjoyable. It was enjoyable. It
Speaker 1: was enjoyable. I learned a lot about about Limestone today
Speaker 1: your podcast The Old Man in the Three. When did
Speaker 1: you come up with the idea, how did it start?
Speaker 1: And what are your plans for because obviously given your
Speaker 1: connection to so many different current players, I remember the
Speaker 1: game I did with you in Philly, the embrace that
Speaker 1: you had with Joel Ebid. I can just see the
Speaker 1: love that he has for you and all the players
Speaker 1: that come up to you. Clearly you built some deep
Speaker 1: friendships and great relationships with a lot of guys. What
Speaker 1: are the plans ultimately long term for the podcast? You know,
Speaker 1: you can't it's hard to have It's hard to have
Speaker 1: a podcast. We've talked about this. It's hard to have
Speaker 1: a podcast without an audience. So I don't think about
Speaker 1: anything else sides building an audience, and I in some
Speaker 1: ways got lucky because of timing. I was the first
Speaker 1: active player to have a podcast, so there was a
Speaker 1: novelty in that. Working at the Ringer and you know,
Speaker 1: being associated with the scale of that company in sports
Speaker 1: and media culture was important. We launched The Old Man
Speaker 1: in the Three. We started our own company. We launched
Speaker 1: The Old Man of Three. We owned, We owned the podcast.
Speaker 1: We launched that in the middle of the bubble. There
Speaker 1: was no other player that was doing a podcast out
Speaker 1: of the bubble. Like, there's just been a bunch of
Speaker 1: things that I've just gotten lucky on. There's no there's
Speaker 1: not a grand vision ever for the podcast. It's something
Speaker 1: that I enjoyed doing. And what I realized about a
Speaker 1: year and change into doing The Old Man of the
Speaker 1: Three is I really just enjoyed basketball. I enjoyed talking
Speaker 1: about basketball. So we we sort of made a strategic
Speaker 1: shift in late October. Let's just focus on NBA content.
Speaker 1: Let's focus on having guests on that are associated with
Speaker 1: the NBA, mainly players, And we've seen our audience grow
Speaker 1: because of that, so you know, we're going to continue
Speaker 1: to sort of use that model to continue to grow
Speaker 1: our audience. You know, I think about when you start
Speaker 1: something in media, it's it's driven really by two things.
Speaker 1: It's driven by content. Do you have good cut content?
Speaker 1: And can you build a community? And that's what we're
Speaker 1: trying to do with the podcast, and whatever comes of that,
Speaker 1: that's great. You know, besides the podcast, there's a lot
Speaker 1: of other things that I'm working on actively right now,
Speaker 1: including a I don't know how to describe it, but
Speaker 1: it's a TV show. It's a TV show, so we're
Speaker 1: working on it. It would be it's called Eat, Prey, Dunk,
Speaker 1: and you know, it's it's about capturing the essence of
Speaker 1: a player. It's out trying to answer the question of
Speaker 1: why sports matter, why athletes are who they are. We
Speaker 1: do that to some degree on the show, but on
Speaker 1: the podcast, but this would be a more a more
Speaker 1: visual experience, I think. And uh so we're talking. We're
Speaker 1: talking with different high level production companies, streaming services, etc.
Speaker 1: To try to try to get this thing made. Um.
Speaker 1: But you know, it's funny because you mentioned the media
Speaker 1: stuff and I didn't even I didn't plan on getting
Speaker 1: into media, and I was hesitant to even start at ESPN,
Speaker 1: and and Dave Roberts, who who you know. Dave was
Speaker 1: more than accommodating with just creating a schedule for me
Speaker 1: this this year. That wasn't too taxing because I was like,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna take a year off. But then I'm like,
Speaker 1: I got a podcast that I got to do weekly
Speaker 1: and I need something else to fill my time. And
Speaker 1: so it kind of all happened organically. I Dave. My
Speaker 1: life plan is not like I wanted to be an
Speaker 1: NBA player. I put everything into it, and right now
Speaker 1: it's just like just flow with the river. You know, Well,
Speaker 1: I don't know where the river is going to take me.
Speaker 1: I don't know where I'll be in three years. Do
Speaker 1: any of us really know? We think we do, We
Speaker 1: think we can control. You've had Chris Paul on and
Speaker 1: you know this podcast. As I said, is primarily Arizona
Speaker 1: Cardinals based. We do branch out beyond just the NFL,
Speaker 1: and obviously people that you know a lot of people
Speaker 1: that live in Arizona or Cardinal fans are also Suns fans.
Speaker 1: So we had mckel bridges on, we had James Jones,
Speaker 1: al McCoy, they've all been on and with the run
Speaker 1: to the finals last year and then having the best
Speaker 1: record in the NBA this year, there is a there's
Speaker 1: an appetite for Suns content. And because you probably know
Speaker 1: Chris Paul as well as anybody, maybe you can put
Speaker 1: your finger on it more than weekend. Because the transformation
Speaker 1: of the organization from when Chris prior to Chris's arrival
Speaker 1: to what they are now, it's remarkable. I'm not sure
Speaker 1: we've seen anything quite like this, like you see a player.
Speaker 1: When Kurt Warner came to the Cardinals, he led them
Speaker 1: to a super Bowl, but it wasn't like they went
Speaker 1: fifteen and one. But because of Kurt and how good
Speaker 1: he is, and obviously there were other talented players around him,
Speaker 1: we went to the Super Bowl the next year, which
Speaker 1: was Kurt's last year, had even a better record, ended
Speaker 1: up losing the Saints who win the Super Bowl. But
Speaker 1: it wasn't like you went from the worst team in
Speaker 1: football to the best. The Sons were the worst team,
Speaker 1: close to the worst team, if not the worst. They're
Speaker 1: not the best team. Now, they don't won a championship.
Speaker 1: They're close last year, maybe they win it this year.
Speaker 1: And everybody tries to say, well, here's why they're different,
Speaker 1: here's what Chris Paul brings to the table. But you
Speaker 1: know this, you played with him, you know him. Well,
Speaker 1: what do you think it is that goes beyond what
Speaker 1: we can see the fan in the media. Well, I'll
Speaker 1: answer that question. But there's another really important ingredient to
Speaker 1: the formula for their success over the last few seasons,
Speaker 1: and that's Monny. Because Monny, in some ways is they're
Speaker 1: not the same, but in some ways it is very
Speaker 1: similar to Chris. The attention to detail, the basketball intelligence.
Speaker 1: Monny has that at the highest level, and I think
Speaker 1: the combination of them. Chris, of course, being an extension
Speaker 1: of a coach on the floor, is really important. In
Speaker 1: regards to Chris. He is as demanding of a teammate
Speaker 1: as I've had, and I loved that he has a
Speaker 1: way of getting your best every night. There was there
Speaker 1: was no not that I did this ever, but like
Speaker 1: for all of us, there was no I'm going to
Speaker 1: go into the game and half ass like because Chris
Speaker 1: was there and so he wasn't gonna half ass it,
Speaker 1: and he was gonna tell you if you were half
Speaker 1: asking it. So there's there's an accountability to Chris as
Speaker 1: a teammate and as a player because he does it
Speaker 1: and because his agenda ultimately is to win. Now there's shenanig.
Speaker 1: It's Chris is Chris. You know, he's gonna he's gonna
Speaker 1: talk to other players. He's gonna he's gonna do the
Speaker 1: rip through move and draw fouls. He's gonna talk to
Speaker 1: the refs like there's other things Chris. You know, Chris
Speaker 1: is an annoying little pest. We all know that. But
Speaker 1: but in terms of the agenda, Chris is as competitive
Speaker 1: of a player as I ever played with. And he's
Speaker 1: an incredible strategist. And we talked about this, I think
Speaker 1: when he was on the podcast, but I know I've
Speaker 1: mentioned it in other episodes. Chris is probably the best
Speaker 1: cards player that I've played against. You know, in anything
Speaker 1: he does, he figures out how to win. What gives
Speaker 1: him the best chance to win. I saw this great graphic.
Speaker 1: You may have seen this as well on Twitter. You
Speaker 1: know New Orleans that franchise franchise wins when he was there,
Speaker 1: franchise record for wins when he was there, Houston franchise
Speaker 1: record for wins when he was there, Phoenix franchise record
Speaker 1: for wins when he was there, Clippers franchise record for
Speaker 1: wins when he was there. So, although he hasn't want
Speaker 1: to ring and I think they're the clear favorites to
Speaker 1: win one this year, he is as good of a
Speaker 1: winner as we've had in this era of sports. Now,
Speaker 1: he doesn't have the championship. I get that, and that
Speaker 1: may be controversial thing to say, but he is as
Speaker 1: good of a winner as we've had in sports. So
Speaker 1: I have a vote for MVP and all the NBA
Speaker 1: awards that I have to turn in here, and I'm
Speaker 1: waiting till the last possible second to turn it in
Speaker 1: as you should. That's you know what, You're being the
Speaker 1: responsible voter. And I appreciate that the money for you
Speaker 1: guys that now is attached to these awards, which I think,
Speaker 1: by the way, I know Adam Silver the commissioner came
Speaker 1: out and said NBA players aren't playing enough games. They're
Speaker 1: trying to figure out ways to fix that. A solution
Speaker 1: that I think would would work, or at least would help,
Speaker 1: would be if you put for the voters, you say, okay,
Speaker 1: to be the MVP, you have to play at least
Speaker 1: sixty eight games or whatever, or to make All NBA
Speaker 1: you have to play sixty eight games. You can't vote
Speaker 1: for somebody if they play fewer than sixty eight games.
Speaker 1: There is an incentive now because there's so much money
Speaker 1: attached to contracts. If you make All NBA, maybe that
Speaker 1: will result in guys playing more games because they want
Speaker 1: to make sure they're getting their max contracts. So I
Speaker 1: don't hate the idea, but in any sort of games
Speaker 1: played scenario, context matters. You know, if a guy breaks
Speaker 1: his wrists and miss a month of the season and
Speaker 1: the Aliens up playing in sixty five games, but that
Speaker 1: team has the best record and he's got great stats,
Speaker 1: that guy should probably still be All NBA. You know,
Speaker 1: the context betters might change, might change to the All
Speaker 1: NBA voting is just to have the fifteen best players
Speaker 1: have three teams of five, but make it about the
Speaker 1: five best players should be first team All NBA, the
Speaker 1: next five players should be second team ALLANBA, the positional stuff,
Speaker 1: and then now they're complimentating things like why why is
Speaker 1: Joe Ellenbiad and Yokich? Why are they? Can you vote
Speaker 1: for them as forwards? They haven't played a minute of
Speaker 1: four at all season. They're centers. But you know what,
Speaker 1: they both should be a first team All NBA, and
Speaker 1: there's a good chance that one of them won't be.
Speaker 1: The other part that's tied to it, of course, is
Speaker 1: that you reference is max contract extensions, being eligible for
Speaker 1: a super max that's tied to All NBA, and then
Speaker 1: and then the rookie supermax, which you have to reach.
Speaker 1: You know, obviously you know in your rookie contract to
Speaker 1: to uh sort of trigger that that supermax, So guys
Speaker 1: will sign for it'll be reported two hundred million dollars,
Speaker 1: but if they don't reach it, they get one sixty five.
Speaker 1: Trey Young is a great example of this. You know,
Speaker 1: he's eligible for the supermax, that's what he signed um,
Speaker 1: but if he doesn't make All NBA this year, he
Speaker 1: loses out on thirty five million. This is what happened
Speaker 1: to Jason Tatum. Jason Tatum when a long run on
Speaker 1: the podcast about this um, this is something that was
Speaker 1: collective collectively bargain bier union. I don't I don't know
Speaker 1: that there's a solution to that outside of renegotiating that
Speaker 1: with the NBA UM. And I think where where players
Speaker 1: get frustrated is in some of the voting. What I
Speaker 1: think doesn't get appreciated by the players is how serious
Speaker 1: the voters are taking it. You guys all know about
Speaker 1: these clauses in the contract. You know, Howard Beck when
Speaker 1: the pod came out with Jason and his rant kind
Speaker 1: of went viral. Howard Beck, He's like, Jason, I don't
Speaker 1: like it either, you know, he tweeted, I don't like
Speaker 1: it either. I don't want my vote to be tied
Speaker 1: to whether or not you get the money. Good. Look,
Speaker 1: you can't tell me that Jason Tatum in his fourth
Speaker 1: year didn't do his job. He did a MAX level
Speaker 1: worthy job and he should have gotten paid according to
Speaker 1: his market, which was as a MAX player. So outside
Speaker 1: of renegotiat I don't think you can you can do it.
Speaker 1: The all NBA stuff this year is really interesting, and
Speaker 1: you know you mentioned you've mentioned Chris, I know, off
Speaker 1: the air we're talking about stuff. It's like, where where
Speaker 1: do we figure out how some of these players go?
Speaker 1: And Trey Young is a great He's had an unbelievable season,
Speaker 1: an unbelievable season. He should be All NBAUM. But it's
Speaker 1: really hard, it's really hard. The MVP this year is
Speaker 1: probably as hard as this in a long time trying
Speaker 1: to figure that out. So I don't have Trey Young
Speaker 1: on my All NBA team as of this moment, and
Speaker 1: if I end up not voting that way, I feel
Speaker 1: badly that it could cost him thirty five million dollars.
Speaker 1: But looking at their record and some players on some
Speaker 1: other teams that maybe the numbers aren't as gaudy, but
Speaker 1: their teams are better. I mean, to your point, you
Speaker 1: only have six guards the front court, you can fudge
Speaker 1: it a little bit because like I've got Janis embating,
Speaker 1: Yokis All first Team. Yeah, none of those guys have
Speaker 1: played I mean, Mbat never plays forward. I mean, you
Speaker 1: could you could make the case that Yoki he's he's whatever.
Speaker 1: He's a guard, he's a forward, he's a center. But
Speaker 1: right DeMar de Rosen will probably make an all NBA team,
Speaker 1: but he'll make it as a forward, even though nominally
Speaker 1: he functions as the primary playmaker in the half court.
Speaker 1: This is why, you know, the defining lines of position
Speaker 1: has been so skewed because of the way the modern
Speaker 1: NBA works now, which is why I think the solution
Speaker 1: is you just vote for the fifteen best players. My
Speaker 1: comment on Trey and my comment towards the MVP as well.
Speaker 1: We talked about this last night on Countdown with Jalen is.
Speaker 1: You know, perceived value is relative to expectations, and I
Speaker 1: think with Trey this year, because of what was a
Speaker 1: surprising run last year, there were more expectations on Trey
Speaker 1: and the Hawks this year and they probably underperformed to that.
Speaker 1: But he has not. He has not, and I probably
Speaker 1: one of the six best guards in the NBA. Problem is,
Speaker 1: as I know, we brought up my Yannis comment on
Speaker 1: the Joel Pod when we were off air, and you know,
Speaker 1: the problem, as I said this on the pod, there's
Speaker 1: too many good players, Like there's too many good players.
Speaker 1: I can remember even in my career five six years ago,
Speaker 1: we're like, oh man, there's thirteen guys that are really
Speaker 1: all NBA and there's like five guys that you're kind
Speaker 1: of like, I could I could fit them in. I could,
Speaker 1: I could make an argument to put them in the
Speaker 1: last two spots. Now there's like twenty guys, and you're like,
Speaker 1: how do we how do we make this fair and
Speaker 1: fit it in fifteen slots with positions? It's tough, it's
Speaker 1: very tough. Well, I've already kept you much longer than
Speaker 1: I was anticipating, but I do want to just get
Speaker 1: a couple more in here. How do you think you'll
Speaker 1: if you had to pick the MVP, W how do
Speaker 1: you think you'll land? Like? Does it? Is it based
Speaker 1: on Devin Booker? To me? Deserves consideration. Now, I don't
Speaker 1: think that's how I'm going to vote number one, but
Speaker 1: he's going to be in my top five. I think
Speaker 1: ultimately it's Yokich, Giannis and Embed but there's no real criteria.
Speaker 1: Like I'm inconsistent when I look at how I vote
Speaker 1: for MVP or Coach of the Year, Rookie of the Year,
Speaker 1: even the all NBA teams. I mean, I'm in consistent.
Speaker 1: Most voters are most voters are most voters are? You know?
Speaker 1: With books specifically, there's been nine previous players that have
Speaker 1: averaged twenty five, five and five on a team that
Speaker 1: had a winning percentage of eight hundred or better. I
Speaker 1: think the Suns are a little under eight hundred, and
Speaker 1: he's averaging four point nine assists, so he could end
Speaker 1: up being the tenth, but he's right there to be
Speaker 1: the tenth player. Ever, eight of the previous nine guys
Speaker 1: that have done that have one MVP. Look Book is
Speaker 1: a deserving MVP. In any other year, he's probably the MVP.
Speaker 1: The problem is the three most dominant players have had
Speaker 1: historical seasons in Janie mbid and historical you know, the
Speaker 1: numbers don't lie, and book is going to get hurt
Speaker 1: because of advanced stats. That's just a reality. He's third
Speaker 1: on his team in winshields. Mcel Bridges has more win
Speaker 1: shares than Devin Booker. That's just how analytics work. And
Speaker 1: more than enough voters now factor in analytics. So when
Speaker 1: you talk about analytics, well, then the clear guys Yokich,
Speaker 1: when you talk about narrative, it's probably embed and you
Speaker 1: talk about you know more, I test in moments right
Speaker 1: now it feels like it's Yannis I test and the
Speaker 1: last two three weeks of the season when you talk
Speaker 1: about those moments, those MVP moments, that that three against
Speaker 1: the nets, whatever it may be, it's probably Yannis. I
Speaker 1: tend to land on today, whatever it's, you know, Thursday,
Speaker 1: the seventh of April. I tend to land on a
Speaker 1: fluctuation between Yokich and Yannis for MVP, and it sucks
Speaker 1: because there's like, there's legitimately four guys that should be MVP.
Speaker 1: How many it takes when you did the State Farm
Speaker 1: commerce and you're the mad professor talking to the coffee
Speaker 1: pot for people that have seen that, it's very good,
Speaker 1: by the way, how many takes did you need? We
Speaker 1: filmed a bunch of different lines. I had about ten
Speaker 1: or twelve lines, and then we filmed all of the
Speaker 1: lines at three different camera angles, so there were probably
Speaker 1: forty or fifty takes total. The other thing to note
Speaker 1: is in the video in the final cut, I should
Speaker 1: say in the final commercial there's a there's about an
Speaker 1: inch left of coffee in that coffee pot. Well, I
Speaker 1: spent about twenty minutes doing takes where instead of talking
Speaker 1: to the coffee pot, I would chug the coffee. So
Speaker 1: that was my second pot of coffee that I was
Speaker 1: on and it was lukewarm coffee. It was room temp coffee.
Speaker 1: But look, I was just my I didn't look at
Speaker 1: the call sheet till I got in the car to
Speaker 1: It was a busy week. We had Draymond in San
Speaker 1: Francisco that week. I flew to LA. I did NBA
Speaker 1: to Day on Tuesday, at NBA to Day on Wednesday,
Speaker 1: and I and I was set to go film the
Speaker 1: commercial right after my second day at NBA to Day,
Speaker 1: so I did not have time to look at the
Speaker 1: call sheet. And I looked at the call sheet on
Speaker 1: the five minute right over to where we were shooting
Speaker 1: the commercial, and it's like, I'm by the way, my
Speaker 1: hair's done, I've got you know, I've got my makeup.
Speaker 1: My groomer came, I got my makeup done. I'm wearing
Speaker 1: a great suit, just looking looking like I'm ready for
Speaker 1: a photo shoot. And I read the call sheet. It's
Speaker 1: like JJ is manic. He's he's disheveled, his shirts unbuttoned,
Speaker 1: his hair's messed up. We're gonna draw black circles under
Speaker 1: his eyes. I'm like, oh God, I did not know
Speaker 1: any of this. So there's this moment I'm like, do
Speaker 1: I just I just gotta lean in. I just gotta
Speaker 1: lean into the crazy guy. And I went for it.
Speaker 1: You really had to act because that's not you, like,
Speaker 1: it's the anti Jake. No, no, it's not me at all.
Speaker 1: But I thought, you know, the the director was he
Speaker 1: had the same voice and laugh as Charlie Day from
Speaker 1: Uh It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. And there's that gift
Speaker 1: of Charlie Day with the board where he's like pointing
Speaker 1: the thing, and I was like, that's that's my inspo,
Speaker 1: Charlie Day. I'm going for that, all right. Last one
Speaker 1: had during the football season, Carson Palmer and Drew Stanton
Speaker 1: on the podcast together. They were both together here with
Speaker 1: the Cardinals at the same time. And asked them towards
Speaker 1: the end, because they're big wine guys, as are you.
Speaker 1: And I asked them towards the end, okay, for people
Speaker 1: that are listening that maybe you know, don't want to,
Speaker 1: you know, spend a thousand dollars on a bottle of wine,
Speaker 1: give me some good value buys. And I think Carson
Speaker 1: threw out like opus one. I'm like, that's not people lessening,
Speaker 1: They're not going to that's that doesn't qualify. I don't
Speaker 1: know if you've got anything, because you I know you're
Speaker 1: white Burgundy, red Burgundy guy, which you'll but you'll drink anything, right,
Speaker 1: But I know you have some particulars I do, I do, um,
Speaker 1: So I'll say this Alborino. It's a native to Portugal,
Speaker 1: but in northwest Spain. It's called Alberino in Spain. Alvarino
Speaker 1: in Portugal, but in northwest Spain, Alberino is a white wine.
Speaker 1: Good Alberino, like high level Alberino, is under thirty bucks,
Speaker 1: and you can find good bottles for fifteen to twenty bucks.
Speaker 1: That's that's to me, is like an ultimate value to
Speaker 1: sit by the pool. Um, maybe you're gonna go grab
Speaker 1: some Moisters bottle Alborino phenomenal in red wine. I think
Speaker 1: one of the greatest values is Brunello de Montecino. And
Speaker 1: you can find phenomenal producers in great years for fifty
Speaker 1: bucks fifty five bucks. Look, I know for a lot
Speaker 1: of people that's insane for a bottle of wine. Well,
Speaker 1: let me tell you about Burgundy. And look, there's a
Speaker 1: bunch of people that ask me for wine recommendations. To me,
Speaker 1: the best place to start in Burgundy because that's what
Speaker 1: I collect. That's what ultimately if I'm going to spend
Speaker 1: money on wine and I and I have a collection,
Speaker 1: you know, I have a seller all that stuff. But
Speaker 1: when I say I'm gonna buy and I'm gonna spend
Speaker 1: my hard earned money on wine, I'm going to spend
Speaker 1: it on Burgundy. That to me is the greatest wine
Speaker 1: in the world. I love red Burgundy, which is made
Speaker 1: from pino, and I love white Burgundy, which is made
Speaker 1: from chardonnay. And a lot of people say I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't like pinot, I don't like Chardonnay. That's because
Speaker 1: you're drinking swill made in America. All right, you're drinking swill.
Speaker 1: You're drinking mass produced swill. But the best value to
Speaker 1: me in Burgundy is there's four classifications of Burgundy. There's
Speaker 1: a grind crew, which is you know, expensive at every level,
Speaker 1: premiere crew, where you can find some decent deals. And
Speaker 1: then there's village and regional. And so if you see
Speaker 1: borgone on a bottle, that is a regional that is
Speaker 1: the fourth sort of bottom tier. If you go up
Speaker 1: one level to a village level red or a village
Speaker 1: level white made by a great producer. You can find
Speaker 1: phenomenal wine in the like eighty to ninety range. Again,
Speaker 1: I know that's crazy, but if you can find like
Speaker 1: a furry A or you know lair Wag, which is
Speaker 1: you know their grond crews go for thousands of dollars,
Speaker 1: she skirts the rules and when she makes her village
Speaker 1: level and regional white burgundy, she takes the leftover grapes
Speaker 1: from the ground crew and premier sights and she mixes
Speaker 1: it in. She's not technically allowed to do that, but
Speaker 1: she sort of runs Burgundy and and that so that
Speaker 1: to me is like the ultimate value. It tastes like
Speaker 1: a five hundred dollars bottle of wine and you spend
Speaker 1: eighty bucks. Well, it's certainly more in depth than we
Speaker 1: got from Carson. Appreciate it man, Thanks so much, JJ
Speaker 1: for doing this. Always fun, great stuff from JJ talking
Speaker 1: about his relationship with Mike Shashevski, how coach K helped
Speaker 1: JJ turn his life around at Duke and how that
Speaker 1: translated into a lengthy NBA career and now a successful
Speaker 1: new life as a podcaster and broadcaster. We are presented
Speaker 1: by Ben MGM, the official sports betting partner of the
Speaker 1: Arizona Cardinals and by Hila River Hotels and Casinos. We
Speaker 1: will get back into the football space next week. On
Speaker 1: the Dave Pash Podcast, we talk with Daniel Jeremiah from
Speaker 1: NFL Media. He's also the radio analyst for the Los
Speaker 1: Angeles Chargers. We'll talk about the offseason for the Arizona
Speaker 1: Cardinals so far and look ahead of the twenty twenty
Speaker 1: two NFL Draft. Thanks again at jj Reddick, and thanks
Speaker 1: to you for listening to another edition of the Dave
Speaker 1: Pash Podcast.