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Speaker 1: Welcome back to another episode of Cutting the Distance. Today,

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Speaker 1: I've got maybe my favorite guest on my most my.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, hey there he is, Hey Dirt, Oh hey there.

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Speaker 1: Uh no, I think I was looking. I said, you're

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Speaker 1: by far my most repeat guest. You've probably had twelve

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Speaker 1: or thirteen episodes with me that I've posted.

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Speaker 2: Holy count. Wow.

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Speaker 1: I appreciate having me back.

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Speaker 2: Do What is this kind of like on YouTube when

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Speaker 2: you get so many appearances, you get like a little

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Speaker 2: cool plaque and yeah, mail, I can, I can put

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Speaker 2: it on social media and put hanging on my wall.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah. No. In reality and all transparency, what happens

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Speaker 1: is when nobody else wants to be on my podcast

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Speaker 1: with me, I resort to Dirk so we can have conversations.

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Speaker 1: So you're playing second fiddle here, Dirk. But it's kind

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Speaker 1: of a pat on the back and a slap in

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Speaker 1: the face at the same time.

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Speaker 2: There. Well, I mean, I mean you stood, you've been

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Speaker 2: my boss for how long? And then you're just like, hey,

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Speaker 2: you need to do this and that, and you just

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Speaker 2: boss me around and I'm like, yess.

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Speaker 1: I felt like it was early this morning we're recording.

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Speaker 1: Here is all the Sportsman shows are getting kicked off,

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Speaker 1: and we've got got our workers traveling around and I

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Speaker 1: kind of came to you with my tail between my legs, like, Dirk,

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Speaker 1: do you mind hopping on the podcast here early this

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Speaker 1: morning so I don't just talk to myself? And here

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Speaker 1: we are.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you interrupted my my morning procedure. You know, you

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Speaker 2: put you put the avovocado mask and the cucumbers on

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Speaker 2: your face, over your eyes and stuff and had to

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Speaker 2: wipe all that stuff off to do this. So I mean,

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Speaker 2: you look good.

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Speaker 1: You look good. It's been working. Yeah, and then you're

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Speaker 1: right here avocado toast after you I did. Yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: such a weird, weird food, but I'm gonna leave that alone.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I wouldn't know what it tastes like, and I

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Speaker 2: never will.

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Speaker 1: I do like avocados, I do like toast. I just

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Speaker 1: never thought that we put those two together, right, all right? No,

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Speaker 1: we got Dirk here, and it's actually probably the most

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Speaker 1: perfect episode, or one of the most we've We've disagreed

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Speaker 1: and debated, and we may disagree and we may agree

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Speaker 1: on a lot of these issues, but we want to

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Speaker 1: talk about technology and how it relates to hunting. If

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Speaker 1: there should be aligned drawn if there shouldn't be aligning

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Speaker 1: drawn how we should how we look at it. I

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Speaker 1: don't want to say how we should look at it

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Speaker 1: as a group because I think everybody's going to like

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Speaker 1: have their own opinions. Right, there's no right or wrong answer,

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Speaker 1: And ultimately it may be up to these fish and

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Speaker 1: wildlife departments that we all love to bag on. But

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Speaker 1: it's not a very easy decision at times, right, how

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Speaker 1: are you going to handle this? Or how you going

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Speaker 1: to handle that? And I think a lot of just

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Speaker 1: personal opinion, ethics, morals, your definition of fair chase comes

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Speaker 1: into these. So we got a list of things, and

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Speaker 1: it's going to be more like a yay, nay, a

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Speaker 1: discussion on the wire, how come, and then we'll move

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Speaker 1: on to the next one.

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Speaker 2: So you realize, no matter what your opinion is, that

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Speaker 2: I'm going to take the opposite.

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Speaker 1: I there's some of them you can't here though. I

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Speaker 1: don't think I think we're we're gonna have to agree

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Speaker 1: on some but I know right off about we're going

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Speaker 1: to disagree on on on the first topic, okay at time,

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Speaker 1: and we will have a good discussion. I think we've

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Speaker 1: had this discussion before and maybe.

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Speaker 2: I'll even fight you a little bit and then secretly

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Speaker 2: agree with you.

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Speaker 1: Agree, like just real quick.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So the first thing, and we've had a lot of

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Speaker 1: conversations on this. Some states have band that some haven't

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Speaker 1: like your own. To my knowledge, it's the thermal vision,

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Speaker 1: thermal scopes, thermal imagery movement. You know, there's I live

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Speaker 1: in the Pacific Northwest where if nobody's hunted here, similar

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Speaker 1: to probably how you hunt in northern I know, for

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Speaker 1: white tills, it's industrial timberlands, clearcut timber jackfur type country. Right,

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Speaker 1: You've got different stages of fur trees, hemlock trees in

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Speaker 1: different stages of growth. So the way we hunt typically

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Speaker 1: is you pull up to a landing where you're looking

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Speaker 1: across the canyon, across the draw and you're trying to

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Speaker 1: look into the face of the clearcut and spot deer. Well,

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Speaker 1: after three or four years, it gets very grown up.

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Speaker 1: And so like around home, the better blacktail hunters or

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Speaker 1: the guys that are able to spot you because you

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Speaker 1: could sit there all day and if these deers aren't

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Speaker 1: you know, these deers deer aren't moving, you may not

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Speaker 1: spot them. Versus if you can do a quick scan

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Speaker 1: with thermal, move to the next one, even behind somebody

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Speaker 1: that's already looked at first in the morning, you're more effective.

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Speaker 1: You know, we've we've talked to or met people that

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Speaker 1: are using them in Idaho like effectively. You know, you

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Speaker 1: might be on a hike in in the morning like oh, shoot,

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Speaker 1: here's deer here, like let's not disrupt them, or like

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Speaker 1: I'm having to make the decision, like I just need

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Speaker 1: to get to this point by daylight. Right, So there's

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Speaker 1: this thermal where it has its its pros. Collns. What's

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Speaker 1: your opinion on thermal? Should it be allowed? Should take uh?

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Speaker 1: Should states take that stand and start to limit them?

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Speaker 1: Are you? Are you in your opinion? Should it be

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Speaker 1: separated between big game versus predators? Like where you're at

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Speaker 1: on night vision or and thermal?

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Speaker 2: Right? I think selfishly, I think they're awesome, and they

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Speaker 2: they're cool, and they're just they'd be really fun to

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Speaker 2: have a buddy of mine last fault, him and I

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Speaker 2: went deer hunting and in North Idaho, and there's just

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Speaker 2: you know, you just don't steal a lot of deer.

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Speaker 2: But in your mind you think, yeah, but these white tails,

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Speaker 2: you know, they're all, they're all caked up. You know,

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Speaker 2: they're nocturnal or this or that or you know, and

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Speaker 2: you can glass across the big canyon into some brushy

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Speaker 2: pockets and stuff, and you can sit there all day

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Speaker 2: and you're just like, I'm not seeing no deer. They're

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Speaker 2: just not moving today. Well, you pull out the thermal,

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Speaker 2: and you know, thermals have their limitations, you know, if

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Speaker 2: it's warm, you know, like in September, for instance, once

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Speaker 2: the sun rises, you'd have a hard time seeing stuff

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Speaker 2: to just the ground gets too warm. But when they're

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Speaker 2: snow on the ground and the sun comes up, you

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Speaker 2: can you have some you have time to to to

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Speaker 2: check things out. But you know, so you pull up

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Speaker 2: to one of these places and you start glassing around

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Speaker 2: with that thermal, and you you soon realize there are

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Speaker 2: no deer over there. If there were, I mean, you

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Speaker 2: can see rabbits, Like at eight hundred yards you can

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Speaker 2: see a rabbit. So it's they're kind of crazy. But

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Speaker 2: we did spot some deer and we were we would

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Speaker 2: sit there, we'd spot a deer and be like, oh man,

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Speaker 2: that one's in a brush pile somewhere. I bet it's

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Speaker 2: a really big old buck. Just hiding out. So you

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Speaker 2: get out the spotter and you can sit there for

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Speaker 2: thirty minutes with a spotter and just tear that piece

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Speaker 2: of brush apart, and then finally you catch an ear.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that's a dough whatever. So I think, I

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Speaker 2: think if we weren't really successful finding a big well,

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Speaker 2: we did see some bucks and one was like a

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Speaker 2: butter light shooter, but then it was you know, too

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Speaker 2: far away. It was a cross. You know, we were

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Speaker 2: able to you know, find it with our glass and

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Speaker 2: and find it with the glass even in the open

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Speaker 2: sometimes can be hard. The deer really blend in and

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Speaker 2: you know, we've been hunting for a long time. We're

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Speaker 2: pretty good with spotting stuff, but you know, they blend

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Speaker 2: in good. But it was it was a no brainer,

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Speaker 2: super easy with the thermal. But the deer was still

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Speaker 2: a long ways away, so there was no shooting. But

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Speaker 2: I guess the point, like you know, selfishly, you know, yeah,

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Speaker 2: heck yeah, you know, when especially when there's not a

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Speaker 2: lot of deer a large deer population, you really you

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Speaker 2: really want any legal advantage you can get. But ethically, man,

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Speaker 2: I always liked, I always like to err on the

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Speaker 2: side of the deer, and I know, I know you've

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Speaker 2: always said this, and you and I've had a lot

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Speaker 2: of debate about this, and I just egg you on

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Speaker 2: because I want to piss you off, because you feel

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Speaker 2: pretty passionate about it. So I always take the I

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Speaker 2: always take the opposite side, just to wind you up,

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Speaker 2: just like you do sometimes with me. But honestly, you know, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I think, definitely think they should be out lowed. I

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Speaker 2: don't think that should be legal. I mean, and they're expensive,

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Speaker 2: you know, for the good ones. They're eight thousand, ten

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Speaker 2: thousand dollars for one, So then it becomes back to

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Speaker 2: that game of only rich guy can afford to do

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Speaker 2: it right. So it's just it's bad all the way across.

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Speaker 2: In my opinion, it's bad. It's bad optics, it's not ethical,

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Speaker 2: and it's not you know there again, you're excluding the

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Speaker 2: everyday hunter, the every day working Joe who can't afford

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Speaker 2: that kind of crap, and so it's just an unfair

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Speaker 2: advantage in my opinion. Definitely.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And then we're gonna talk about some of these

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Speaker 1: other things. But when you couple thermal in with maybe

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Speaker 1: long range ability or a scope that can dial itself,

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Speaker 1: You're like, at what point did I do anything that

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Speaker 1: required some skill or some hunting ability. You know, when

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Speaker 1: when we talked to Grandpa, you know, he was always like,

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Speaker 1: you know, working in the woods, being a good woodsman,

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Speaker 1: being able to walk on logs, being able to be

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Speaker 1: absolutely silent in his white new balanced tennis shoes, white elkhunts,

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Speaker 1: like those were the things that made him successful. And

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Speaker 1: now you're like, somebody shows up scans with thermal, gets

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Speaker 1: their long range you know, five thousand dollars long range

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Speaker 1: gun out clicks their scope so it adjusts the radical form.

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Speaker 1: They didn't have to do that. They ordered their AMMO

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Speaker 1: from some custom Ammo place that maybe you know, so

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Speaker 1: you know where I'm getting is like this person did

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Speaker 1: nothing but ultimately squeeze the trigger and maybe they drove

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Speaker 1: to that spot at some point, right, And that's where

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Speaker 1: I struggle, And not that I've I've been. I've gotten

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Speaker 1: a lot better over the last five years of like

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Speaker 1: hunting no longer competition, So I'm not jealous of these guys, right,

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Speaker 1: I've I do have the means. If I wanted to

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Speaker 1: have a ten thousand dollars thermal, I would have one.

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Speaker 1: I mean it's just the reality I could. I could

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Speaker 1: do it if I wanted to. So it's the jealousy

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Speaker 1: of that. It's just it goes back to what you

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Speaker 1: just touched on, and I'm getting better recognizing it and

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Speaker 1: hopefully it doesn't go full swing and I end up

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Speaker 1: on peda side protecting the animals. But like I'm I

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Speaker 1: root for the animals even when I'm hunting them. And

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Speaker 1: it's crazy for a hunter to be like rooting for it.

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Speaker 1: But like last year Idaho, you know, you know where

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Speaker 1: we were at and on that buck hunt, mildiar hunt,

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Speaker 1: I got whipped a couple of times by by this

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Speaker 1: big buck and why it sucked at the time, and

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Speaker 1: I was trying to do everything in my power to

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Speaker 1: figure it out. Like at the end of that day,

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Speaker 1: or you know, even the next day when you're reflected,

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Speaker 1: you're like, man, that that's a cagyal buck. I'm glad

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Speaker 1: I get a chance to hunt him. Yeah, and he

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Speaker 1: may win and I may never kill him, but it

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Speaker 1: was cool that he lived and I could get a

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Speaker 1: chance to hunt him, and maybe it'll make a great

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Speaker 1: story for next year when I come back and find him,

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Speaker 1: you know, And and I just I feel like and

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Speaker 1: this is where where do you draw the line? Like,

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Speaker 1: all right, well, then should I be able to use

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Speaker 1: a three by nine scope on a seven mag Should

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Speaker 1: I have to use open sites in a lever gun?

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Speaker 1: Like at some point in this and this is where

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Speaker 1: this conversation always goes. Well then it's like all right,

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Speaker 1: and we're gonna get there in a little bit, but

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Speaker 1: like where do you draw the line? And so that's

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Speaker 1: what we're going to kind of look at as we

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Speaker 1: go through these these next few topics.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well hit the thermal thing again too. It's like

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Speaker 2: you know, I said, you know, I didn't. We didn't

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Speaker 2: see a lot of deer and we didn't see any

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Speaker 2: any real big bucks. We saw one shooter. But have

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Speaker 2: other people with thermals been hunting that and they did

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Speaker 2: shoot the big ones? I mean you have to think

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Speaker 2: that too. Like that always went through my mind. It's like, man,

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Speaker 2: did somebody already already cream these bucks out?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Because they had thermals and they knew, Like, you know,

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Speaker 2: So I don't like it. I don't. I don't. I

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Speaker 2: don't like I say I always vote for the deer.

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Speaker 2: I was always advocate for the deer. If that means

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Speaker 2: shortened my season a little bit. That means, you know,

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Speaker 2: making some radical changes. That way we still have deer

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Speaker 2: to hunt. You know, I will help protect those deer.

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Speaker 2: That way we can hunt them tomorrow. Like I'm not

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Speaker 2: enjoyed to be to like you said, but yeah, but

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Speaker 2: damn it, I I really I want there to be

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Speaker 2: to deer here tomorrow or elk here tomorrow to hunt.

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Speaker 2: But now for predators during non big game if it's

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Speaker 2: not big game season and you're out there with one

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Speaker 2: of those or it's like nighttime and you are really

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Speaker 2: doing it, I mean, I feel like poachers are gonna proach.

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Speaker 2: You know, if you didn't have a thermal rifle scope,

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Speaker 2: you'd be out there with a spotlight shooting deer or

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Speaker 2: elk at night. Yeah. But like I'm all for that,

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Speaker 2: you know, shooting, you know, predator management because those you know,

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Speaker 2: that needs to happen, you know, they those numbers need

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Speaker 2: to be kept in check so they don't eat too

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Speaker 2: many of our deer milk.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. And then the culmbination of those two is what's

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Speaker 1: creating the issue in Washington right now, is because thermals

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Speaker 1: are legal for predators, not legal for big game but yet,

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Speaker 1: who's going to just shove one in the center console

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Speaker 1: of their truck? And oh, I was just in here

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Speaker 1: from my hunt the other night. You know, the only

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Speaker 1: thing we don't allow is thermal scopes to be used

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Speaker 1: to shoot you know, the animals at night is the

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Speaker 1: only thing protecting them. But you know, as long as

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Speaker 1: you can have daylight optics joined in with those, like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's illegal, but I don't know, it's a slippery slope

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Speaker 1: of is it being it can't be managed And there's

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Speaker 1: there's you know, I didn't just make up this, uh

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Speaker 1: you know this example of the thermals being shoved in

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Speaker 1: the center council like that's how it's being done for

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Speaker 1: people to exploit that.

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Speaker 2: Right right, Well, they have to draw a hard line,

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Speaker 2: you know for the bad apples. The bad apples, they

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Speaker 2: ruin everything all in every case of every everything you

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Speaker 2: talk about, there's always some jerk that ruins it for everybody.

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Speaker 2: So there you go. I mean, if if it means,

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Speaker 2: you know, during big game season, you're not allowed to

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Speaker 2: have one of those on your person, possession in the

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Speaker 2: field at all, period, zero zip, that's the only way

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Speaker 2: to manage it.

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Speaker 1: Yep, yep, and the only thing is if this was

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Speaker 1: legal for everybody, which it makes it an unfair advantage

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Speaker 1: once again to people with money, is we ma end

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Speaker 1: up with a two day year season, and I don't.

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Speaker 1: I love being out there more than that, like, and

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Speaker 1: that's the you know, so yeah, and all of these

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Speaker 1: things could ultimately affect you know, it's just the effectiveness

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Speaker 1: of of a hunter is ultimately the only result if

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Speaker 1: the fish and wildlife is doing their job is the

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Speaker 1: limit seasons shortened dates, limit tags, reduce to take because

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Speaker 1: of the effectiveness. And that's my biggest concern is I'd

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Speaker 1: rather be out there if you told me I could

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Speaker 1: hunt all three months, you know, September, October, November, but

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Speaker 1: I'd use a thirty thirty. I might pick that, you know,

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Speaker 1: get prime seasons or whatever. Oh yeah, you told me

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Speaker 1: if you use the rifle, we can only hunt for

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Speaker 1: four days. I'd be like, Ah, that doesn't sound near

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Speaker 1: as cool, you know. And so that's where my head's

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Speaker 1: at on all of this is I just want opportunity

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Speaker 1: for people, and the kill isn't necessarily does not outweigh

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Speaker 1: the time, the adventure, the experience. For me.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, I agree.

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Speaker 1: Okay, moving into range finding scopes that you know, the

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Speaker 1: precision is at an unfair advantage, should technology be removed? Now,

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Speaker 1: I know some states do have laws, and I apologize

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Speaker 1: I didn't go look at like every state. This is

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Speaker 1: just a discussion about the ethics and our own opinions

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Speaker 1: on this. But like I know, like range finding scopes.

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Speaker 1: You know, I believe Buris has like an optical or

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Speaker 1: oculus or something. Sour has one that talks and automatically

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Speaker 1: moves radicals correctly. Yeah, correct, I'm not fully up, but

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Speaker 1: I do know there's technology, a burst eliminator, the bd

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Speaker 1: X from SIG coupled with weather stations takes any hold

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Speaker 1: on I'm gonna choose my words carefully. They take the

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Speaker 1: skill out of being the marksman that, like, you know,

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Speaker 1: just range finding, you know, find a true line of sight,

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Speaker 1: whether the elements putting it into a calculator. But then

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Speaker 1: some may say that that in itself, just having the

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Speaker 1: ability to shoot that far accurately is the advantage. What's

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Speaker 1: your take on? Like specific to range finding scopes that

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Speaker 1: adjust radicals, there's no dialing, no math being done well.

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Speaker 2: First and foremost, I think you have to be a

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Speaker 2: good enough shot a good enough guy pulling the trigger

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Speaker 2: to actually make some of these shots, right. I know,

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Speaker 2: you know you can take ten people, line them up

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Speaker 2: and say, right, grab your old hunting rifle, bess, and

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Speaker 2: shoot that that gong at three hundred yards and you

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Speaker 2: guys got you know, we've had this debate since elementary school, right,

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Speaker 2: And I bet there'd be a very few that would

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Speaker 2: just be able to like, you know, grab grab their

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Speaker 2: old hunting rifle and hit that, you know, with without

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Speaker 2: movable turrets, without you know, uh, without a smart scope

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Speaker 2: or whatever. That's gonna gonna change the point of impact,

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Speaker 2: you know, for for trajectory, for wind, et cetera. So

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Speaker 2: but those same people I still think would struggle with

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Speaker 2: you know, they had a ten thousand dollars rifle and

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Speaker 2: all the program and all the stuff. I still think

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Speaker 2: they would struggle to maybe make a good make a

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Speaker 2: good shot. They might make a bad shot. And I

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Speaker 2: think this is kind of where it kind of goes

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Speaker 2: a little right for me, is maybe people push the

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Speaker 2: envelope of their actual effective range. Of course, ethics is always,

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Speaker 2: you know, ethics, it's kind of got to be something

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Speaker 2: you judge on your own. You know, your own perceived ethics.

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Speaker 2: But then again, like some people don't have that moral

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Speaker 2: compass inside their heads, so they may take a you know,

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Speaker 2: it's like, oh, it's eight hundred yards. I'm really good

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Speaker 2: to six hundred, but it's eight hundred and that's a

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Speaker 2: really big buck or a really big bull. So I'm

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Speaker 2: gonna push it. I'm gonna take that. I'm gonna try

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Speaker 2: for it. Yeah, and they make a bad hit or

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Speaker 2: maybe they miss. But the the ones that you're talking about,

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Speaker 2: that that are self, that the redical, you know, you

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Speaker 2: range it like the range finding scopes or the range

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Speaker 2: finding You have a rangefinder connected to the scope and

359
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Speaker 2: the radical and you you range it and then the

360
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Speaker 2: lights up on the radical lights up and the correct

361
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Speaker 2: hold over in the scope. Those kind Yeah, they they

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Speaker 2: work pretty good. They're they I've seen them work before.

363
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Speaker 2: I've seen them work good in Idaho. They're illegal, and

364
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Speaker 2: I'm okay with that. I'm okay with that. I feel

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Speaker 2: like I feel like there still has to.

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Speaker 1: Be some.

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Speaker 2: Mystery and some do your own do your own diligence

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Speaker 2: and do your own work on the side to where

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Speaker 2: it's like, Okay, I'm gonna make a very very accurate shot,

370
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Speaker 2: and maybe that kind of sort of filters out some

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Speaker 2: people that maybe would would it, wouldn't put in the practice,

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Speaker 2: wouldn't put in the time, you know, to make it

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Speaker 2: a good clean shot. Just personally, I know, you know,

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Speaker 2: I don't know if I can sit here and back

375
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Speaker 2: it up and just say, you know, this is why

376
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Speaker 2: I don't like it. But I just don't really like

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Speaker 2: that myself. I feel like there's yeah, I don't I'm

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Speaker 2: not for it.

379
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't like the idea of it. But then

380
00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:54,720
Speaker 1: I also think when I go into my ballistics app

381
00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:56,840
Speaker 1: entering all the data that either I have to get

382
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Speaker 1: off of weather station or something I do at the

383
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Speaker 1: beginning of the day, and I'm gonna be hunting for

384
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Speaker 1: this elevation. It's about this temperature, it's about this humidity.

385
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Speaker 1: And then I've got to go in there and make

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Speaker 1: the adjustments based on you know, what I what I

387
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Speaker 1: feel is right, and what I feel the wind is

388
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Speaker 1: make the wind call. And one thing that I do

389
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Speaker 1: recognize is up and down or drop is a very

390
00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:20,240
Speaker 1: simple calculation, right right, bullet drop is It's the art

391
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Speaker 1: all comes into win for the most part, unless you

392
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Speaker 1: know you're in steep canyon country overridges, and you got

393
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Speaker 1: ups and downs you're trying to figure out, but the

394
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Speaker 1: majority of the skill comes in your left and right

395
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Speaker 1: and wind. So I just I don't know if it's

396
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Speaker 1: the skill because you just enter in parameters. But there's

397
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Speaker 1: something about going to an app that's on a you know,

398
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Speaker 1: the iPhone fifteen, so like you're trying to take technology

399
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Speaker 1: out of it, but at the same time, like I'm

400
00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:52,520
Speaker 1: going to an iPhone to do my calculations. Why I'm hunting.

401
00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:57,000
Speaker 1: I just I don't know. I don't I don't like

402
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Speaker 1: the idea of like instantaneous adjustments so that a guy

403
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Speaker 1: that maybe you said was proficient at five hundred, but

404
00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:06,400
Speaker 1: he's like, oh, this scope will just move to eight

405
00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:09,000
Speaker 1: hundred for me. I'll just shoot it wherever that dot

406
00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:11,320
Speaker 1: ends up or the crossair ends up, I'll be fine.

407
00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:15,000
Speaker 1: Like the you know, I don't like it. I don't

408
00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:17,640
Speaker 1: like where it's you know that it takes that little

409
00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:21,840
Speaker 1: bit of skill out. And one thing that you talked

410
00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:24,680
Speaker 1: about people overshooting, I've always wondered about this. I don't

411
00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:26,920
Speaker 1: know how you administer it and if it's too much overreach,

412
00:20:27,359 --> 00:20:31,400
Speaker 1: but I would love to have like some shooting efficiency test,

413
00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:32,720
Speaker 1: but then I don't know how you you.

414
00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:33,160
Speaker 2: Know what I mean.

415
00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,040
Speaker 1: But then, yeah, if the guy only wants to shoot

416
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Speaker 1: a hundred yard deer in the timber, why should he

417
00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:40,520
Speaker 1: have to take that test necessarily? Maybe he needs to,

418
00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:42,760
Speaker 1: But then the guy that wants shoot five hundred needs

419
00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:44,719
Speaker 1: to take a test. But then it's not like when

420
00:20:44,760 --> 00:20:46,280
Speaker 1: you get out in the woods, it stops you from

421
00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:48,680
Speaker 1: shooting that seven hundred yard you know, shot that you're

422
00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:51,719
Speaker 1: only proficient to five hundred. I just sometimes I wonder,

423
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Speaker 1: like I wish there was a way, but there isn't

424
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Speaker 1: until you start to limit optics, grains of powder like

425
00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:01,000
Speaker 1: in a piece of brass, Like there's there's ways, But

426
00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:03,359
Speaker 1: then then you may just be forcing people to like

427
00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:05,119
Speaker 1: test their six and a half creed more on a

428
00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:07,760
Speaker 1: you know, fifteen hundred yard shot. I don't know it

429
00:21:08,040 --> 00:21:10,000
Speaker 1: because if people have the ethics or morals they do,

430
00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:12,800
Speaker 1: you may never change at And so I know, I

431
00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:15,160
Speaker 1: know the conversations going a little sideways here, but I don't.

432
00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 1: I just don't like the idea of range finding scopes

433
00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:21,280
Speaker 1: for the reasons that there's doesn't seem like there's a

434
00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:22,720
Speaker 1: lot of skill involved.

435
00:21:22,560 --> 00:21:25,920
Speaker 2: Right, right, I feel like maybe people put a little

436
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:30,960
Speaker 2: less time and effort into mastering the craft, and maybe

437
00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:33,600
Speaker 2: there's the potential for making a bad shot or pulling

438
00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:38,119
Speaker 2: off a bad shot. I don't know. I think for predators, absolutely,

439
00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:41,960
Speaker 2: you bet use them on predators all you want. It's

440
00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:45,760
Speaker 2: like wolves, coyotes, bobcats, whatever, because typically you're not going

441
00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:48,520
Speaker 2: to eat those, right, you know, big game but big

442
00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:51,040
Speaker 2: game animals, yeah, they deserve I think they deserve more.

443
00:21:52,280 --> 00:21:54,480
Speaker 2: And then one more little little point like to throw

444
00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:59,199
Speaker 2: in to like dial in your turrets and stuff. But

445
00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:01,240
Speaker 2: the guy that said, oh yeah, I'm really good at

446
00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:03,400
Speaker 2: six hundred yards, but eight hundred yards but still might

447
00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:05,920
Speaker 2: make try to take that shot, he's probably the same

448
00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:07,560
Speaker 2: guy that had the old three by nine with a

449
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:10,960
Speaker 2: duplex radical and holding that thing, you know, seven feet

450
00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:13,200
Speaker 2: over its back saying I think I can hit that thing.

451
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:17,920
Speaker 2: Like I feel like there's always going to be those people, unfortunately,

452
00:22:18,760 --> 00:22:22,360
Speaker 2: But but I don't know how you police that. I mean,

453
00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:26,359
Speaker 2: I mean, teacher sons and daughters better, right, and you know,

454
00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:28,880
Speaker 2: just create a we I think as hunters we need

455
00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:33,160
Speaker 2: to to. That's how you make your changes is educate

456
00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:37,000
Speaker 2: and instill those values in the young the next generation.

457
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:48,880
Speaker 1: All right, let's move into maybe one of the newer,

458
00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:51,159
Speaker 1: newer things we've seen, and it's going to be a

459
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:53,520
Speaker 1: two part in our our I think our answers would

460
00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:56,000
Speaker 1: be a little bit different. Drones for scouting and then

461
00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:59,880
Speaker 1: drones for recovery. What's your opinion on on these.

462
00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:04,399
Speaker 2: I haven't really thought about it too much. I know

463
00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:08,080
Speaker 2: drones are cool for all the cool shots for cinematography,

464
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:10,760
Speaker 2: you know, and there's laws that say you can't use

465
00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:14,159
Speaker 2: those for hunting, which I agree with. I mean, like,

466
00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:16,760
Speaker 2: if you're let's say, your standing at the very bottom

467
00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:19,840
Speaker 2: of River Valley and it's a two thousand vertical climb

468
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:22,879
Speaker 2: up to where the elk may live, I mean, you

469
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:25,320
Speaker 2: could just shoot your drone up there. I guess if

470
00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:28,520
Speaker 2: it had those if it had those abilities, your drone,

471
00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:31,840
Speaker 2: particular drone, shoot it up there. Scope arounds like, oh yeah,

472
00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:33,879
Speaker 2: there's no elk around here, Well let's not. Let's go

473
00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:36,840
Speaker 2: to the next place. I mean that you definitely could

474
00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 2: use it in that in that way. Now is that

475
00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:42,280
Speaker 2: I don't I don't think that should be legal. I

476
00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:45,840
Speaker 2: think that's you know, you're just letting excuse me you're

477
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:48,760
Speaker 2: letting the drone do the dirty work, and you know

478
00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:50,760
Speaker 2: you don't have any skin in the game. I'm there again.

479
00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:53,200
Speaker 2: Let's let's give these animals a chance. Now, let's say

480
00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,159
Speaker 2: you did hike up there, you still got to hike up,

481
00:23:55,240 --> 00:23:59,920
Speaker 2: find them again and kill them, which can sometimes still

482
00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:04,040
Speaker 2: be very, very difficult. But since they do move, it's

483
00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:08,080
Speaker 2: not like they're tied up. But still, I don't really

484
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:12,800
Speaker 2: like that, honestly. Yeah, now, now for now, And then

485
00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:15,399
Speaker 2: you said for recovery. So let's say you have a

486
00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 2: drone with a thermal and you want to runt around.

487
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:19,880
Speaker 2: Let's say you had a marginal hit or a bad

488
00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:21,800
Speaker 2: hit on an elk or a deer or whatever. You

489
00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:25,920
Speaker 2: want to rent it around. I think that's permissible, right.

490
00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:28,600
Speaker 2: You know, you're gonna, you're gonna, you're trying to you're

491
00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:30,760
Speaker 2: trying to make sure that animal doesn't go to waste.

492
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:32,800
Speaker 2: You know, the law says, you know, I'd go to

493
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:38,680
Speaker 2: every every legal length to get that animal taken back home,

494
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:40,560
Speaker 2: and I and I would think that would be that

495
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:45,000
Speaker 2: would be fine. It would be a slippery slope though,

496
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:46,560
Speaker 2: for the folks who are going to try to use

497
00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:48,919
Speaker 2: that drone again. To scout. You know, they got that

498
00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:51,359
Speaker 2: thermal thing on there, they're gonna fly it up. Look around,

499
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:53,600
Speaker 2: hold man, there's a whole field full of deer over there,

500
00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:56,880
Speaker 2: and we'll just go on over there or whatever. Yeah.

501
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:00,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, that we're agreeing way too much. This isn't

502
00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:01,760
Speaker 1: how I intended this podcast to go.

503
00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:04,600
Speaker 2: But maybe you should give your opinion first and then

504
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:06,480
Speaker 2: I can I can chop you out at the knees.

505
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:09,520
Speaker 1: No, No, I'm a kidding. Yeah, here, I'll try this,

506
00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:11,680
Speaker 1: but it's I'm lying. Yeah, I think you should be

507
00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:13,400
Speaker 1: able to just sit in a spot in the unit

508
00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:15,359
Speaker 1: and fly your drone until you find elk and then

509
00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:18,880
Speaker 1: finally walk up that. No, I'm in complete agreement with Dirk.

510
00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:22,920
Speaker 1: I hate the idea of not having to sweat have

511
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:25,440
Speaker 1: a little bit of sweat equity, and like Dirk said,

512
00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:28,480
Speaker 1: there is I do recognize there is a difference between

513
00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:31,560
Speaker 1: knowing where elk are at and killing them, but I

514
00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 1: don't think that the advantage of the knowing and killing.

515
00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 1: You shouldn't just get to go be an elk right

516
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:38,639
Speaker 1: away because you didn't climb up the ridge, or you

517
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 1: didn't climb up maybe the ridge acrossway that's only a

518
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:43,240
Speaker 1: five hundred foot gain, but you needed to be able

519
00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:46,760
Speaker 1: to glass over something. And like, in my opinion, there

520
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:51,760
Speaker 1: should be some work required before this is gonna sound weird,

521
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:53,639
Speaker 1: like have a chance, like take that Elk's life. Like,

522
00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:58,480
Speaker 1: I don't feel that it's fair or fair chase that

523
00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 1: that Elk quote unquote gets found under exposed because you

524
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:05,520
Speaker 1: can run two little controllers from your truck and you know,

525
00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 1: and imagine if you did do that and we're always

526
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:12,639
Speaker 1: on elk, like, it changes the game, right because even

527
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:16,840
Speaker 1: with our you know, people think we're always on Elk. Right,

528
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:18,679
Speaker 1: I can go a day or two and just be

529
00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:21,240
Speaker 1: like riding the struggle bus of not being able to

530
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:23,239
Speaker 1: find an elk, not hearing a bugle. Yeah, there are

531
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:25,280
Speaker 1: real times versus like hell with this, I'm gonna go

532
00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:27,360
Speaker 1: back to my truck, get my drone all charged up.

533
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:29,439
Speaker 1: I'm gonna have four batteries ready so I can take

534
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,640
Speaker 1: four to twenty five minute flights. And by god, next

535
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:34,480
Speaker 1: time I get out of this truck, I'm hiking straight

536
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:34,920
Speaker 1: into Elk.

537
00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:36,920
Speaker 2: Right, I mean, how hard would it be just to

538
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:38,879
Speaker 2: send that thing just open over a ridge, you know,

539
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 2: a thousand feet or or whatever, you know, especially in

540
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:43,240
Speaker 2: open country, you could just shoot it over the next

541
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:45,600
Speaker 2: ridge and oh, shoot, there's elk right there. I had

542
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:46,960
Speaker 2: no idea elk even lived there.

543
00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and that's I don't like that now. I'm

544
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:53,920
Speaker 1: I'm also on board with drones for recovery, especially the

545
00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:57,679
Speaker 1: use of thermal drones at the point where that deer

546
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:04,119
Speaker 1: is wounded, wounded or dead dead for sure, I was.

547
00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:07,199
Speaker 1: I was questioning my stance on wounded because there is

548
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:09,440
Speaker 1: some escapement on marginal shots that like, maybe that deer

549
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:11,800
Speaker 1: will leaven live and be just fine. Maybe it's bettered down,

550
00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 1: Maybe we shouldn't let people know where it's at. But

551
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:17,200
Speaker 1: if I had to just make a decision and wounded

552
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:18,760
Speaker 1: had to be in there, because you don't know whether

553
00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:20,680
Speaker 1: it's dead or wounded or you made a good shot,

554
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:27,240
Speaker 1: I would air towards thermal recovery or drone recovery if if,

555
00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:30,159
Speaker 1: if you have the access to it, because I just

556
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:32,960
Speaker 1: I'm not for one like to let the animal's life

557
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:35,800
Speaker 1: go to waste. You know, if you did make a shot,

558
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:39,800
Speaker 1: you do have blood by all means, you know, get

559
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 1: the drone up, see if you can find it, and

560
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,320
Speaker 1: if it's maybe then the rule is, I don't know

561
00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:46,760
Speaker 1: how you police that either, you know, wounded, you can't

562
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:48,760
Speaker 1: go after it dead, you can go recover it, but

563
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 1: going to go yeah, people are good. I guess if

564
00:27:51,520 --> 00:27:53,639
Speaker 1: it's sitting up versus laying on its side, would be

565
00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:54,320
Speaker 1: the only way.

566
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:56,800
Speaker 2: Right, Well, maybe you have to like, Okay, I have

567
00:27:56,880 --> 00:27:59,159
Speaker 2: to come back in three hours and check it in and.

568
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:00,879
Speaker 1: Check on it. I can check it in the daylight

569
00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:04,359
Speaker 1: maybe or whatever it might be daylight, you know, and

570
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:06,440
Speaker 1: then have to sneak up on and give another shot.

571
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:09,840
Speaker 1: But I'm all for that. I would love to see,

572
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 1: you know, critters, you know, be recovered end up on

573
00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: somebody's table versus turn into coyote bait or you know,

574
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 1: die a miserable death over the next week, two weeks, month,

575
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:21,680
Speaker 1: whatever it may take.

576
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:25,800
Speaker 2: Right right, No, I agree. Now, I will say some

577
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:30,399
Speaker 2: naysayers would be like, yeah, but now with you saying

578
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:34,240
Speaker 2: that I can take those marginal shots, all I have

579
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,760
Speaker 2: is a butt shot. It's okay, I'm gonna shoot that

580
00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:38,680
Speaker 2: thing square in the butt and then I'm gonna use

581
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:40,840
Speaker 2: my drone and find it and then I'll get it later.

582
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:46,040
Speaker 2: People will say that, but I think those same people

583
00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:48,280
Speaker 2: that would do that are the same people that are

584
00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:50,720
Speaker 2: gonna shoot too far. They're gonna be the You know,

585
00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 2: you can't. It's really hard to change the heart someone's

586
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 2: heart and change their personal ethics unless back back to

587
00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:01,680
Speaker 2: the point of we have to teach our sons and

588
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:05,720
Speaker 2: daughters better and then that that's where change starts. But

589
00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 2: I mean, there's there's there's the people have bad hearts

590
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:12,959
Speaker 2: in every situation, whether you're talking about mugging somebody or

591
00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:16,560
Speaker 2: whatever it is. You know, there's people have a bad heart.

592
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:22,320
Speaker 2: So you know, you can't let it change the law

593
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:22,880
Speaker 2: that much.

594
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:26,760
Speaker 1: I think, yep. Yeah, And you know, and some of

595
00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:29,920
Speaker 1: these seem easy to talk about. You're like, I'm not

596
00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 1: a lighted knock guy, but I know, like you're a

597
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:33,720
Speaker 1: big proponent of lighted knocks, And that isn't one of

598
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 1: my topics because I feel like that one's well past

599
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:40,160
Speaker 1: the point of controversy. It just it just lets you

600
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 1: know whether or not you It lets you see your

601
00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:45,120
Speaker 1: arrow right right, and no happened, versus you just dug

602
00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 1: it into the ground and can't find the thing and

603
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 1: you need to go start blood trailing, or maybe there

604
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:51,760
Speaker 1: isn't blood but you got blood on your arrow. Some

605
00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:55,160
Speaker 1: of these things, like drone recovery seems to be clean cut.

606
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: We should allow it just like that. But there's always there.

607
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:00,880
Speaker 1: I think there's all going to be a group that

608
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:04,200
Speaker 1: just wants it to be as like traditional and primitive

609
00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:04,880
Speaker 1: as possible.

610
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and.

611
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 1: They don't want a drone, you know, flying over deer

612
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,040
Speaker 1: country even you know, maybe we should allow it on

613
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 1: private not I don't know. I don't know what you

614
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:14,720
Speaker 1: do there. But my point is like I feel like

615
00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 1: thermal recovery should be an easy one to allow, But

616
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 1: I can also see the other side on why they

617
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:24,520
Speaker 1: wouldn't want, you know, drones and technology involved in hunting

618
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 1: at all.

619
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:30,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I almost feel like maybe they make rulings

620
00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 2: like excuse me, on the drones, almost like flying flying

621
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:37,760
Speaker 2: an airplane and then hunting. You know, you have a

622
00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:40,960
Speaker 2: tont you can't hunt again for twenty four hours, yep,

623
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 2: you know once you try, and then the drones are

624
00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 2: going to log all that in right there. They they

625
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,880
Speaker 2: log your sessions. They know when you fly. So let's

626
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:52,440
Speaker 2: say you fly it, well, you can't hunt for twenty

627
00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:57,000
Speaker 2: four hours. I mean with that that would be totally admissible. Yeah, Unfortunately,

628
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:01,360
Speaker 2: like for recovery, loose some heat, you would lose you know,

629
00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:04,000
Speaker 2: you may not you may lose your animal. It may

630
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:05,000
Speaker 2: may go bad on you.

631
00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 1: So yeah, okau. This next one's kind of a combo

632
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:14,920
Speaker 1: AI and kind of that AI powered scouting and we're

633
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:16,800
Speaker 1: going to tie that into cell trail cams to kind

634
00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 1: of tackle this all at once. So so there's apps

635
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:23,080
Speaker 1: and AI models. You know, when we go to when

636
00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:24,880
Speaker 1: we go to Kansas, some of those guys run an

637
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:28,480
Speaker 1: app like Drewy's Whitetail app. I think Onyx has like

638
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 1: conditions and and you know people have time, moon phase

639
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,760
Speaker 1: and whatever it may be. But like apps that tell

640
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:38,760
Speaker 1: you when dear movement should be best. All of these

641
00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:43,560
Speaker 1: things based on all of these environmental factors coupled with

642
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:46,400
Speaker 1: some of these things. And I don't claim to know

643
00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:48,479
Speaker 1: all of multi mobiles, Like I just use their cameras,

644
00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:51,520
Speaker 1: love I love their cameras. But like there's there starts

645
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: to be like patterning, you know, whether all you're getting daylight, nighttime,

646
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:59,240
Speaker 1: you know, if they're on these what's your opinion on that?

647
00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:04,960
Speaker 1: Like AI generated planning and then sell cams and we'll

648
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,720
Speaker 1: kind of it might be a complex one, but we'll

649
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 1: kind of chunk it up and go through that.

650
00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:13,040
Speaker 2: Well, I think you can, like, let's say your white

651
00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:15,560
Speaker 2: tail on and I think you can log in and

652
00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:18,239
Speaker 2: get like any kind of information you want as far

653
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:19,880
Speaker 2: as like, oh, this is the best time, this is

654
00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:21,720
Speaker 2: the best day, or this is the best two days

655
00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:23,480
Speaker 2: to hunt. You should do this, you should do that.

656
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:28,840
Speaker 2: I've never seen that be consistently accurate with any of

657
00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:31,800
Speaker 2: that kind of stuff, So I don't know, I mean,

658
00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:36,280
Speaker 2: until they get the kinks worked out, I guess I'm

659
00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 2: not really against it.

660
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:40,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think just looking at it, trying to,

661
00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:42,760
Speaker 1: you know, kind of peek over somebodys shoulder, like how

662
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:44,959
Speaker 1: does this app work? I think the biggest driving factor

663
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:47,480
Speaker 1: is just weather. And I think most white tail hunter

664
00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:49,719
Speaker 1: know you get that big you know, weather push like,

665
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:51,520
Speaker 1: oh now it says it's gonna be great deer hunting

666
00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:52,880
Speaker 1: for three days. Well, yeah, it's because you've got a

667
00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 1: big cold front moving in.

668
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:57,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, weather change, the barometric pressure changed. I mean, all

669
00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:00,480
Speaker 2: the signs that Grandpa used, they're the same stuff. It's

670
00:33:00,520 --> 00:33:03,760
Speaker 2: just maybe maybe delivered in a different manner.

671
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:06,360
Speaker 1: But let's roll to the next level, like you've got

672
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:09,200
Speaker 1: a camera set up it I think the you know,

673
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 1: you're getting to the point where they've identified certain deer

674
00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:14,400
Speaker 1: and it's starting to tell you like, yeah, I think you.

675
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:16,840
Speaker 1: I don't know how it works exactly. I wish I

676
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:18,920
Speaker 1: was more versed on this, but basically like, oh, if

677
00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 1: you want to hunt George, George would be best hunted

678
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 1: at this time because this is this is a showing

679
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:26,560
Speaker 1: patterns like are you okay with that? Or is that

680
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 1: something somebody come up on their own? Should they have

681
00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:29,600
Speaker 1: to figure that out on their own? Or should they

682
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:32,480
Speaker 1: just be hunting whenever they can and it might just

683
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:33,720
Speaker 1: happen to be during that time.

684
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 2: Well, I guess if you're looking at your pictures, you

685
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,440
Speaker 2: would know I already know what the best time, Like

686
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:42,840
Speaker 2: you would see like okay, he's daylighted now at this time,

687
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:45,360
Speaker 2: you know it's time stamped on your on your on

688
00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 2: your images. I I guess. I mean if you if

689
00:33:51,040 --> 00:33:54,560
Speaker 2: you were running seventy five cameras and you were you know,

690
00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:56,600
Speaker 2: you didn't have time to go through all that data,

691
00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:58,320
Speaker 2: which I'm sure a lot of people do run a

692
00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:01,280
Speaker 2: lot of cameras and might be hard to manage all

693
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:05,640
Speaker 2: that Sure right, I mean, yeah, I don't know.

694
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 1: Yeah.

695
00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:11,200
Speaker 2: Well, and for instance, the cell phone cameras, that's kind

696
00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:13,400
Speaker 2: of a hot hot topic whether you should be able

697
00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:14,000
Speaker 2: to use them or not.

698
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:18,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, and cell phone cameras or cell trail cameras are

699
00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:19,600
Speaker 1: going to roll into that. I think we're going to

700
00:34:19,640 --> 00:34:22,680
Speaker 1: get a big technology push and AI here in the

701
00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:25,319
Speaker 1: next three years where they can identify specific deer by

702
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:28,640
Speaker 1: horn configuration, their time. And then what we're just looking

703
00:34:28,640 --> 00:34:30,720
Speaker 1: at is maybe when we look at a trail cam picture,

704
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:33,040
Speaker 1: we don't know whether bariometric pressure. It's going to add

705
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:35,000
Speaker 1: all that in and start to create this recipe to

706
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:35,640
Speaker 1: kill that deer.

707
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:39,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, especially if you have a network of cameras that

708
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:41,920
Speaker 2: it would be too hard to manage, you know, just

709
00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 2: you know, just checking them all. If you had like

710
00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:49,720
Speaker 2: let's say, twenty cameras, thirty cameras whatever, on every trail,

711
00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:54,320
Speaker 2: on every point pinch point, on every food source, and

712
00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:58,759
Speaker 2: then collaboratively your AI generated Okay, if you want to

713
00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:01,520
Speaker 2: shoot this deer, be at this pinch point at x

714
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:05,200
Speaker 2: y Z time on XYZ you know, I feel like, yeah,

715
00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:07,920
Speaker 2: that could probably that it'll probably work.

716
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 1: Having a tracking collor on the thing. If he shows

717
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 1: up on multiple cameras too, you know. And then one

718
00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:14,600
Speaker 1: thing I talked with a guy that hunts blacktails around

719
00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:17,440
Speaker 1: here is like he does it on his own, but

720
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:20,400
Speaker 1: he always looks at like when a deer, what direction

721
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:23,560
Speaker 1: a deer approaches from? And then if he's not getting

722
00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:25,880
Speaker 1: there early enough, So if it's a nighttime picture, he

723
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 1: will go in that direction and set out like he'll

724
00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:31,120
Speaker 1: scatter three more cameras and like, but if the AI

725
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:33,160
Speaker 1: tells you, like go put a camera four hundred and

726
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:35,400
Speaker 1: seventy yards in this direct, you know, like it starts

727
00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 1: to take all of that out, you know, versus just

728
00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:39,799
Speaker 1: being a skilled hunter and trying to like reduce it

729
00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:41,400
Speaker 1: down to like how the hell do I kill this

730
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:47,759
Speaker 1: deer in daylight or elk or whatever. Yeah, people can

731
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 1: do it on their own, but like just using the

732
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:51,879
Speaker 1: technology sometimes I hate it, Like I want the guy

733
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:54,399
Speaker 1: if you're out there smashing one hundred and eighty ins

734
00:35:54,400 --> 00:35:56,560
Speaker 1: whitetail bucks every time, like I would love to be like, yeah,

735
00:35:56,600 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 1: Dirk Man, he gets into Excel, he's got all this plotted,

736
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:02,040
Speaker 1: like he's got his own system, Like I don't know,

737
00:36:02,080 --> 00:36:05,279
Speaker 1: I like that story better versus like, yeah, this technology

738
00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:08,560
Speaker 1: told them to be at pinch point you know X,

739
00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:12,640
Speaker 1: you know X at such and such time, and right.

740
00:36:12,840 --> 00:36:15,080
Speaker 2: I feel like I don't like the don't I don't

741
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:17,239
Speaker 2: like the theory of it. Let's say, you know, the

742
00:36:17,239 --> 00:36:23,600
Speaker 2: theory of that working like we've just described, that's an

743
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:27,719
Speaker 2: unfair advantage. I don't like it. And I typically I

744
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,439
Speaker 2: typically don't like the poo poo on things unless I've

745
00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:34,759
Speaker 2: had some experience with it. You know, for instance, you know,

746
00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:39,280
Speaker 2: some states outlawed trail cams of any kind during hunting season,

747
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:44,719
Speaker 2: and you know, because wildlife managers like, oh, you'll just

748
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:48,040
Speaker 2: an unfair ad mantager. But have you even ran trail cameras,

749
00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:50,160
Speaker 2: Like they tried this in Idaho? They wanted out LOHM

750
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:53,319
Speaker 2: in Idaho. Now I was like, well, the cell phone ones,

751
00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:55,480
Speaker 2: I'd probably be fine because that's more real time. You're

752
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:57,600
Speaker 2: getting messages, Hey there's a deer or elk over here,

753
00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:00,239
Speaker 2: blah blah blah. But they're just just standard when where

754
00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:01,840
Speaker 2: you have to walk in, you have to commit the

755
00:37:01,840 --> 00:37:03,880
Speaker 2: time you got to walk in and check that camera

756
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:06,200
Speaker 2: and be like okay, well by then. A lot of

757
00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:09,160
Speaker 2: times that from my experience because I run a lot

758
00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:12,719
Speaker 2: of trail cameras. By that time it's old data. It

759
00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:14,880
Speaker 2: may be a week week gone by, And especially for

760
00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:17,359
Speaker 2: like elk Rut, right, they may be there for two

761
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:19,719
Speaker 2: or three days and then they're gone. You don't see

762
00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:24,760
Speaker 2: them again until next September. So I don't I feel

763
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:27,160
Speaker 2: like I hate to like poo poo on something I

764
00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:30,279
Speaker 2: don't have any real experience with. But I don't like

765
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:32,480
Speaker 2: the concept what we're talking about this AI and I

766
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:35,680
Speaker 2: think that'll be one of those things until they it

767
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 2: gets clicked and it's refined and it's working good, don't

768
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:42,560
Speaker 2: I don't think we know it might sound good on paper,

769
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:44,480
Speaker 2: but the guy go sits his tree stand, he's like, yeah,

770
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 2: this is stupid, this doesn't work at all. Who cares

771
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:49,520
Speaker 2: then at that point? But if it is working, if

772
00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:51,239
Speaker 2: it does work like they say it would work, I

773
00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 2: wouldn't be a good I wouldn't be for it now.

774
00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:58,680
Speaker 2: I mean. And also maybe if it was public land

775
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,680
Speaker 2: versus private land, you know, of a land, people maybe

776
00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:04,040
Speaker 2: have the advantages say hey, what's my property? Should all

777
00:38:04,080 --> 00:38:06,719
Speaker 2: do whatever I want with it? In America? Right? And

778
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 2: I do kind of feel for those folks too. It's

779
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:13,360
Speaker 2: like you know it is private, you know, but overall

780
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 2: I don't like it.

781
00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:17,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, okay, this is my This was my first year.

782
00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:20,200
Speaker 1: Everyone in cell cams. Everything else was like all right,

783
00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:23,319
Speaker 1: you know, boot leather butt, grease, you know, I gotta

784
00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:25,399
Speaker 1: go check my check my camera. And it was really

785
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:27,000
Speaker 1: just to see what elk we're in the area or

786
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:29,759
Speaker 1: deer we're in the area before and so I'm not

787
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:31,799
Speaker 1: gonna lie like cell cams were nice. It was in

788
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:34,000
Speaker 1: an area I didn't want to hike too. Every time

789
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:37,239
Speaker 1: I happen to have some cell service there. But one thing,

790
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:40,360
Speaker 1: I'm gonna kick this one off. One thing I wasn't

791
00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:46,200
Speaker 1: expecting was almost additional anxiety of nothing's there for a week,

792
00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:48,960
Speaker 1: what's going on right, you know? Versus I'm sure if

793
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:50,600
Speaker 1: I was there, like I would just spot the elk

794
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:53,879
Speaker 1: up bedding on a slightly different slivery timber for that week,

795
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:56,640
Speaker 1: and then they'd chow back up right like, oh this

796
00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:59,120
Speaker 1: is a bad spot during huntings. You know, it is

797
00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:01,839
Speaker 1: legal in Washington to have them up during season. Like

798
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 1: they had me doing the wrong thing. More so than

799
00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:05,880
Speaker 1: just letting my eyes tell me what to do, right,

800
00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:08,400
Speaker 1: we would make a play based on what was in

801
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:10,120
Speaker 1: such and such basin, and then you'd go over there

802
00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:12,200
Speaker 1: and like, ah, this isn't what we thought it was there.

803
00:39:12,280 --> 00:39:14,560
Speaker 1: You know, they're they're back, but the right bowl isn't there.

804
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:20,480
Speaker 1: We should have stayed there. What's what's your opinion on

805
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 1: cell cams and the states that allow it, where you

806
00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:28,040
Speaker 1: can make instantaneous decisions on where you need to be

807
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:32,440
Speaker 1: and what's probably within quarter mile half mile of that location.

808
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:35,760
Speaker 2: So I have have a little experience with cell cameras.

809
00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:38,560
Speaker 2: For instance, our buddy Randy, he runs a pretty good

810
00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:42,640
Speaker 2: network of cell cameras in Kansas. Let's talk about turkey season.

811
00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:45,160
Speaker 2: He's like, hey, you boys need to go down to

812
00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:48,160
Speaker 2: the the four hundred there and there's those turkeys in

813
00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:50,719
Speaker 2: that one spot. You'll go down there and you'll kill them,

814
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:54,279
Speaker 2: all right, Well, because he's been seeing them on camera, Like,

815
00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:56,960
Speaker 2: and I don't know how many times we've gone down

816
00:39:57,000 --> 00:39:59,840
Speaker 2: there set up call, we're not even seen a turkey.

817
00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:03,160
Speaker 2: It's like it's almost like you're kind of chasing, like

818
00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:06,560
Speaker 2: chasing your tail, like you go from this one to

819
00:40:06,600 --> 00:40:08,799
Speaker 2: that one, of this one of that one. It's not

820
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:12,360
Speaker 2: always it's not always a slam dunk. I guess what

821
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:13,920
Speaker 2: I'm saying. You still got to hunt them up right,

822
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:16,960
Speaker 2: And it's back to your point. Like you know, I

823
00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 2: sometimes feel like you make some bad decisions just because like, Okay,

824
00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:24,200
Speaker 2: they should be here, but they were there, but where

825
00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:26,399
Speaker 2: did they go? Well, it doesn't mean they're just hanging

826
00:40:26,440 --> 00:40:28,520
Speaker 2: around that camera. You know, they could be two miles

827
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:31,960
Speaker 2: away in a complete different drainage. If you're talking about elk.

828
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 2: This last fall, I had to sell camera out like

829
00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:39,239
Speaker 2: the first time in history, well for a lot in

830
00:40:39,360 --> 00:40:41,640
Speaker 2: my adult life, I've hunted where you would be able

831
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:43,920
Speaker 2: to get cell phone service. And I had a camera

832
00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:48,040
Speaker 2: out and the elk. You know, all September there'd been

833
00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:50,160
Speaker 2: bowls and cows in there. But I wasn't hunting that

834
00:40:50,239 --> 00:40:51,960
Speaker 2: unit at all. I'm just kind of I was more

835
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:54,080
Speaker 2: scouting it. But I did have a rifle tag for

836
00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:58,960
Speaker 2: that unit. But I go up to the trailhead to

837
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:01,920
Speaker 2: a completely different area where I had thought like, all right,

838
00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:05,120
Speaker 2: we're gonna go back in here and and and you know,

839
00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 2: it's not the kind of the front country. It's kind

840
00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:09,839
Speaker 2: of the back country, and we're gonna go hiking, We're

841
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 2: gonna stay all night and hunt. Well, we get there,

842
00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:14,239
Speaker 2: there's seven pickups and lots of dirt bike tracks and

843
00:41:14,320 --> 00:41:18,080
Speaker 2: people's bootprints, and there's it looked like there was a

844
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:20,080
Speaker 2: lot of people going to the into the spot that

845
00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 2: I intended to go. I'm like, we gotta go waiting.

846
00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 2: I don't want to hunt here. I don't want to

847
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 2: compete with these guys, these other guys for this hunt.

848
00:41:29,239 --> 00:41:32,279
Speaker 2: So we go back out. So we drive, you know,

849
00:41:32,719 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 2: an hour back into service and and I check my

850
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:41,120
Speaker 2: trail cam and oh, holy cow, this big six point

851
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:43,400
Speaker 2: that I've been seeing in September that kind of disappeared.

852
00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:45,960
Speaker 2: He's back and he'd been all he had been nocturnal

853
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:49,799
Speaker 2: all September. He's back hunting. He's on he's daylighted. Look

854
00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:53,560
Speaker 2: at him like, wow, I know we're hunting tomorrow. We're

855
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:55,239
Speaker 2: gonna go hunting up there. So we get up there.

856
00:41:55,239 --> 00:41:59,480
Speaker 2: There's people everywhere hunting, but we I do hear in

857
00:41:59,560 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 2: bugle and it's over in the area by the cell

858
00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:04,640
Speaker 2: cell cam. So we go over there hone him up.

859
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:08,319
Speaker 2: Of course, you know, as great of an elk kinter,

860
00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:13,279
Speaker 2: I like to consider myself ha ha, oh guess what

861
00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:15,920
Speaker 2: the elk give us? The slip? Right? You know, and

862
00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:19,920
Speaker 2: bugling during rifle season. I would just worry that there

863
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:22,239
Speaker 2: was enough people around that that thing bugling his head

864
00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:24,680
Speaker 2: off was gonna, you know, drag in another person. So

865
00:42:24,760 --> 00:42:27,120
Speaker 2: I got too aggressive and blew him out of there.

866
00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:31,800
Speaker 2: And guess what, my cell camra my cell camera said,

867
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:34,799
Speaker 2: these elk are long gone. They're not here anymore. So

868
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:38,440
Speaker 2: we stopped hunting that spot and went on to another one.

869
00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:41,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I mean, maybe debate you a little bit here,

870
00:42:41,719 --> 00:42:45,560
Speaker 1: but not so my we we we've talked about this,

871
00:42:45,719 --> 00:42:49,040
Speaker 1: like knowing the animals there doesn't necessarily get it dead,

872
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:51,480
Speaker 1: but then we can maybe make that argument, and you

873
00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:53,600
Speaker 1: might you might agree, you might tell me I'm I'm

874
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:57,040
Speaker 1: an idiot, but I would make the argument like, but

875
00:42:57,080 --> 00:42:59,320
Speaker 1: if you didn't have the cell camera there, would you

876
00:42:59,360 --> 00:43:01,160
Speaker 1: even went to spot? You know? And so that's the

877
00:43:01,200 --> 00:43:01,680
Speaker 1: other thing.

878
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:02,400
Speaker 2: That's a good argument.

879
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:04,560
Speaker 1: It's it's fifty percent, but it's not one hundred percent.

880
00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:07,959
Speaker 1: So it does expose that elk or put pressure on

881
00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:10,560
Speaker 1: them at that time, versus like if you would have

882
00:43:10,560 --> 00:43:12,440
Speaker 1: had to walk in there or you're like, you know,

883
00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:14,880
Speaker 1: we've all been there, like, oh, this camera's been dead cold,

884
00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:16,320
Speaker 1: Like I'll just get it at the end of season

885
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:18,319
Speaker 1: versus like, no, I actually had to walk in there,

886
00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:22,840
Speaker 1: put some scent on the ground. You know, potentially, you know,

887
00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:24,480
Speaker 1: risk blowing the spot out for a day or two

888
00:43:24,560 --> 00:43:26,399
Speaker 1: to check that SD card and then get back out,

889
00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:28,839
Speaker 1: Like is there a difference? And then some people may

890
00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:31,160
Speaker 1: may argue like, well, you shouldn't even have the SD

891
00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:33,440
Speaker 1: card camera up, like no cameras just ton of them

892
00:43:33,440 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 1: where they're at.

893
00:43:34,320 --> 00:43:39,160
Speaker 2: Right right, which, yeah, and I can I can see

894
00:43:39,160 --> 00:43:41,920
Speaker 2: that point. Definitely. Would I have gone to that spot

895
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:44,160
Speaker 2: or what have I? You know, I have you know,

896
00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:48,000
Speaker 2: just like everybody, I got ABC d EFG spots that

897
00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:51,799
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go for opening morning. Yeah, that that did

898
00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:56,520
Speaker 2: steer me to that spot. Now also you know past

899
00:43:56,680 --> 00:43:59,319
Speaker 2: data showing that I did. I did know that there

900
00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:02,640
Speaker 2: was ELK equitting the area ll September. I probably would

901
00:44:02,640 --> 00:44:04,520
Speaker 2: have went in there now. One thing though, it's kind

902
00:44:04,520 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 2: of that front country, easy accessible, a lot of people around.

903
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:13,759
Speaker 2: I was almost even with that one debate with that

904
00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:15,719
Speaker 2: one daylight. I was debating its like I don't know

905
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:17,600
Speaker 2: if I want to go in there because I don't

906
00:44:17,719 --> 00:44:19,680
Speaker 2: want to compete for ELK with other people. I just

907
00:44:19,680 --> 00:44:21,440
Speaker 2: don't like I just want to go find my own spot,

908
00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:24,399
Speaker 2: but I did, so I feel like, yeah, it does

909
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:28,680
Speaker 2: give you an unfair advantage, like you know, you still

910
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:30,960
Speaker 2: have to hunt them up, but it puts you in

911
00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:34,279
Speaker 2: the right area at the right time. And so I

912
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:36,839
Speaker 2: feel like if they said in Idaho they said next

913
00:44:36,920 --> 00:44:40,560
Speaker 2: year you can't use cell phone trail cameras, it wouldn't

914
00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:42,600
Speaker 2: hurt my feelings. I mean, well it would just a

915
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:47,760
Speaker 2: little bit because it's still fun. Because man, there's nothing

916
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:51,239
Speaker 2: better than checking trail cameras and like being like Christmas, well,

917
00:44:51,239 --> 00:44:53,160
Speaker 2: it's like Christmas every day when you got one of

918
00:44:53,200 --> 00:44:55,719
Speaker 2: them things. Every morning, I'd wake up the first thing

919
00:44:55,719 --> 00:44:57,680
Speaker 2: I had to open up. I open up my multie

920
00:44:57,680 --> 00:45:00,600
Speaker 2: app and I'm looking. I'm like, oh, oh, yeah, there's

921
00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:02,880
Speaker 2: elk oh look at that little deer. Oh there's a weasel.

922
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:05,080
Speaker 2: Like you know, it's like Christmas. Every day. I'm still

923
00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:07,520
Speaker 2: getting messages, you know, I left them up there at

924
00:45:07,520 --> 00:45:09,480
Speaker 2: this one or there's a rabbit that's been going by

925
00:45:09,480 --> 00:45:11,200
Speaker 2: this one. The other one's completely snowed in.

926
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:14,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, so yeah, oh mine are buried in snow now.

927
00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:16,160
Speaker 1: But I I was the same way, like I loved

928
00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:18,480
Speaker 1: it and then it gave me anxiety more than I thought,

929
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:20,239
Speaker 1: because if I just didn't know what was up there,

930
00:45:20,280 --> 00:45:22,960
Speaker 1: i'd be doing better at times. And then you're like, oh,

931
00:45:23,040 --> 00:45:25,000
Speaker 1: that bowl's not quite big enough yet, like we'll leave

932
00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:27,120
Speaker 1: it alone, like a bigger one will show up eventually,

933
00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:29,759
Speaker 1: you know, more into September. And so, yeah, it let

934
00:45:29,800 --> 00:45:31,680
Speaker 1: you kind of. I loved everything about it. But then

935
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:35,560
Speaker 1: if you really just take back and like it does

936
00:45:35,600 --> 00:45:38,080
Speaker 1: give you more information and having to put some boot leather,

937
00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:40,960
Speaker 1: you know, similar to plying a drone up. Besides, you're

938
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:43,560
Speaker 1: locked to one location on a tree, I guess right,

939
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:46,200
Speaker 1: but you are technically scouting over and over and over

940
00:45:46,239 --> 00:45:48,640
Speaker 1: without having to climb back into a spot. So I

941
00:45:49,040 --> 00:45:51,680
Speaker 1: like them. I don't think I'm in a position to

942
00:45:51,719 --> 00:45:54,960
Speaker 1: say like I would be like an advocate for outlawing them.

943
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 1: I don't think I would like you. I would be

944
00:45:56,520 --> 00:46:00,279
Speaker 1: necessarily upset if they went away, But I do. I

945
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:04,120
Speaker 1: do love using them for now, and I honestly felt

946
00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:06,560
Speaker 1: like at least how I worked, they didn't give me

947
00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:10,240
Speaker 1: like a huge advantage. And I'm stoked to keep running

948
00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:12,200
Speaker 1: those those cell cameras as long as I can here

949
00:46:12,200 --> 00:46:12,800
Speaker 1: in Washington.

950
00:46:13,040 --> 00:46:13,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly.

951
00:46:23,040 --> 00:46:24,759
Speaker 1: Okay, we're gonna go to our final two. We're kind

952
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:25,960
Speaker 1: I don't want to say we run out of time,

953
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:29,800
Speaker 1: but we got two big ones left. We'll save the

954
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:32,680
Speaker 1: biggest one for last. But this next one, we're gonna

955
00:46:32,680 --> 00:46:35,759
Speaker 1: switch to bow hunting, which is considered by most to

956
00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:38,160
Speaker 1: be more of a primitive weapon. But then you start

957
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:41,279
Speaker 1: to see technology show up on that. We're talking like

958
00:46:41,320 --> 00:46:43,600
Speaker 1: the new smart bow sites. You know, the Garment zero.

959
00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:47,399
Speaker 1: I think we got the Burists Oracle for that. That's

960
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:49,800
Speaker 1: the one that they put on like the crossbows and stuff.

961
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:53,640
Speaker 1: But you got these range finding sites that will instantaneously

962
00:46:53,719 --> 00:46:59,040
Speaker 1: give you a range. And I don't even know. Does

963
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:03,480
Speaker 1: you know if the the the pin actually moves on

964
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:05,200
Speaker 1: that like holographic type.

965
00:47:05,440 --> 00:47:08,239
Speaker 2: I think it does. And there again, like I said,

966
00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:11,839
Speaker 2: I have I've never I've never even held a held

967
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:13,600
Speaker 2: one in my hand that wasn't on a bow. I've

968
00:47:13,640 --> 00:47:15,080
Speaker 2: never even looked at one, honestly.

969
00:47:15,200 --> 00:47:18,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, but I do know they're they're expensive, eight

970
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:21,240
Speaker 1: and nine hundred bucks and they let you know right now,

971
00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:24,360
Speaker 1: I mean everybody knows in order to get a range,

972
00:47:24,400 --> 00:47:26,600
Speaker 1: you pre range everything trees, and then you got to

973
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:29,080
Speaker 1: try to remember the seven trees you range and try

974
00:47:29,160 --> 00:47:31,239
Speaker 1: to build. I build like little semi circles out in

975
00:47:31,239 --> 00:47:33,480
Speaker 1: front of me, Like these trees all connect for thirty

976
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:36,880
Speaker 1: these trees connect for forty yep, build mountain. Try to

977
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:38,719
Speaker 1: remember it and hope he doesn't walk somewhere else. And

978
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:41,880
Speaker 1: if he does, then I've got to, like sneakily, like

979
00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:44,360
Speaker 1: get to my range finder, lift it up, get a

980
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:46,200
Speaker 1: new range on the elk, put it back down, draw

981
00:47:46,239 --> 00:47:48,360
Speaker 1: my bow and do all of that. Where now the

982
00:47:48,400 --> 00:47:50,120
Speaker 1: only thing you got to focus on is drawing your

983
00:47:50,120 --> 00:47:53,600
Speaker 1: bow and getting a range right on that elk in

984
00:47:53,640 --> 00:48:00,440
Speaker 1: clear view. I don't like that. Is like I'm more

985
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:04,560
Speaker 1: opposed to smart bo sites. I like the idea of

986
00:48:04,600 --> 00:48:07,680
Speaker 1: it being more primitive, if we're getting the best seasons.

987
00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:11,480
Speaker 1: Once again, I like the idea that not every elk

988
00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 1: I call in I'm gonna get to kill because of

989
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:15,560
Speaker 1: brush or because of range, or because he doesn't go

990
00:48:15,640 --> 00:48:19,000
Speaker 1: into the the perfect spot I had planned for him.

991
00:48:19,000 --> 00:48:21,560
Speaker 1: What's your opinion on on you know, these smart bo

992
00:48:21,719 --> 00:48:24,800
Speaker 1: sites and UH and their use in in archery.

993
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:28,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I said, I've never used one, but the

994
00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:34,040
Speaker 2: concept if it were, if it's just like anything you know,

995
00:48:34,080 --> 00:48:37,000
Speaker 2: any kind of gadget seems like does it work like

996
00:48:37,040 --> 00:48:39,400
Speaker 2: they say at work or was intended to work? Now,

997
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:41,959
Speaker 2: if that thing is works flawless, it's like worked really

998
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:45,680
Speaker 2: really good. Yeah, I just I'm not I'm I'm against it.

999
00:48:45,719 --> 00:48:47,359
Speaker 2: I don't. I don't like it. I don't. I think

1000
00:48:47,400 --> 00:48:50,359
Speaker 2: I think you still have to you know, fixed sites

1001
00:48:50,400 --> 00:48:51,680
Speaker 2: are good. I don't think you should be able to

1002
00:48:51,760 --> 00:48:57,480
Speaker 2: use that, but you know, who knows. I know I

1003
00:48:57,520 --> 00:48:59,360
Speaker 2: know people who have had those and like, yeah that

1004
00:48:59,440 --> 00:49:02,879
Speaker 2: things sucked. Don't like it, but who knows they might

1005
00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:06,400
Speaker 2: have got better. I don't know, but I I personally

1006
00:49:06,440 --> 00:49:09,480
Speaker 2: have no no qualms about I don't want to use them.

1007
00:49:09,520 --> 00:49:11,160
Speaker 2: I don't want to see I don't want to see

1008
00:49:11,160 --> 00:49:14,920
Speaker 2: those in the marketplace. Yeah, in Idaho, you know, we

1009
00:49:15,600 --> 00:49:17,279
Speaker 2: you know, they try to keep things as primitive as

1010
00:49:17,280 --> 00:49:19,320
Speaker 2: they can. You can't have any kind of battery anything

1011
00:49:19,360 --> 00:49:22,000
Speaker 2: on your boat. So if you want to film yourself

1012
00:49:22,120 --> 00:49:24,440
Speaker 2: shooting your bow hunting, well you're hunting, you know, put

1013
00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:26,799
Speaker 2: a goprol on your camera or on your on your bow.

1014
00:49:26,920 --> 00:49:30,520
Speaker 2: You can't do it, which to me is stupid. But

1015
00:49:31,680 --> 00:49:34,440
Speaker 2: their opinion is, well, if we allow that, then it

1016
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:36,960
Speaker 2: allows other things to creep in, which I don't agree

1017
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:39,080
Speaker 2: with that concept or mentality. I mean, you guys make

1018
00:49:39,120 --> 00:49:42,880
Speaker 2: the laws right, just say a camera is fine as

1019
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:45,120
Speaker 2: long as it you know. But no rangefinders know this,

1020
00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:47,799
Speaker 2: no that I mean, just define it. But they kind

1021
00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:50,279
Speaker 2: of just like to take the easy route sometimes.

1022
00:49:50,520 --> 00:49:53,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, no, I that's kind of where I'm at

1023
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:56,680
Speaker 1: on on smart bo sites like it is. We're the

1024
00:49:56,680 --> 00:49:58,960
Speaker 1: same in Washington, like no electronics, so you can't run

1025
00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:02,120
Speaker 1: attacked camra o pro or any any like you know.

1026
00:50:02,200 --> 00:50:04,160
Speaker 1: Back I think it was even seven eight years ago,

1027
00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:06,279
Speaker 1: somebody was trying to like mount the range finder on

1028
00:50:06,320 --> 00:50:08,400
Speaker 1: your stabilizer. You click a little button on your riser

1029
00:50:08,440 --> 00:50:11,120
Speaker 1: and it would report on a little screen. And I'm like,

1030
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:14,920
Speaker 1: I just I mean, it's cool, but I don't like it.

1031
00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:17,680
Speaker 2: It's just more crap. I mean, it's it's a it's

1032
00:50:17,680 --> 00:50:18,840
Speaker 2: a gimmick, it's a gadget.

1033
00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:22,880
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I I want there to be some skill

1034
00:50:22,920 --> 00:50:25,759
Speaker 1: in that moment of truth as an archer, like you

1035
00:50:25,760 --> 00:50:28,719
Speaker 1: either know the range, you don't know the range, and

1036
00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:30,880
Speaker 1: you don't take the shot. You take the risk of

1037
00:50:31,000 --> 00:50:33,320
Speaker 1: reaching for your range finder and getting a new range.

1038
00:50:34,160 --> 00:50:35,959
Speaker 1: Like all that's part of the game. And I think

1039
00:50:36,239 --> 00:50:40,000
Speaker 1: when you if you can take that out it it

1040
00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:43,080
Speaker 1: changes the chance for escapement on the rules that were

1041
00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:47,319
Speaker 1: put in place for that season for that opportunity. I

1042
00:50:47,320 --> 00:50:49,520
Speaker 1: don't like the hunter having that much advantage.

1043
00:50:49,600 --> 00:50:52,320
Speaker 2: I guess, yeah, yeah, I agree.

1044
00:50:52,640 --> 00:50:55,600
Speaker 1: Then we're we're gonna let the elephant in the room

1045
00:50:55,840 --> 00:51:01,919
Speaker 1: speak and yeah, well we'll just talk about it. Long

1046
00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:07,360
Speaker 1: range hunting and the technology changes over the last fifteen

1047
00:51:07,440 --> 00:51:10,799
Speaker 1: years on long range hunting? Can you police it? Can

1048
00:51:10,840 --> 00:51:12,880
Speaker 1: you not police It's it got to be self policed.

1049
00:51:14,680 --> 00:51:17,319
Speaker 1: It would almost be impossible to police. But like, how

1050
00:51:17,320 --> 00:51:18,719
Speaker 1: do you deal with long range hunting or do you

1051
00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:21,200
Speaker 1: just let it run its course and start to shorten

1052
00:51:21,239 --> 00:51:26,200
Speaker 1: seasons and limit opportunity. And I don't even have my data,

1053
00:51:26,680 --> 00:51:30,680
Speaker 1: but I'm just got to speculate, like as a as

1054
00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:33,279
Speaker 1: just common sense, and maybe somebody's gonna correct me. I

1055
00:51:33,280 --> 00:51:36,319
Speaker 1: hope you do if I'm wrong. But I've got to

1056
00:51:36,400 --> 00:51:40,880
Speaker 1: imagine that more animals die because of the increased accuracy

1057
00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:44,040
Speaker 1: and performance of rifles than they did before when we had,

1058
00:51:44,239 --> 00:51:47,040
Speaker 1: you know, a seven mag with a three by nine,

1059
00:51:47,160 --> 00:51:50,200
Speaker 1: no ability to move radical like that's what you had.

1060
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:57,759
Speaker 2: Right I kind of look at it like this, we

1061
00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:00,719
Speaker 2: haven't seen, at least in Idaho. I don't have the

1062
00:52:00,760 --> 00:52:02,759
Speaker 2: numbers in front of me, but we haven't seen some

1063
00:52:03,120 --> 00:52:07,000
Speaker 2: giant leap in success rates since people have been able

1064
00:52:07,040 --> 00:52:08,719
Speaker 2: to shoot a thousand yards, you know, for the last

1065
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:11,800
Speaker 2: twenty years, people have been able to shoot long range

1066
00:52:12,719 --> 00:52:14,799
Speaker 2: and beyond that. But they'll be able to shoot long

1067
00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:20,239
Speaker 2: range here in Idaho. But we haven't seen a dramatic

1068
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:24,040
Speaker 2: uptick in some success rates in any of the units.

1069
00:52:24,040 --> 00:52:30,160
Speaker 2: I don't think so. To me, like some hunters, and

1070
00:52:30,200 --> 00:52:33,000
Speaker 2: I don't want to sound like a condescending jerk. Like

1071
00:52:33,160 --> 00:52:36,760
Speaker 2: some hunters, you could almost like do just about anything

1072
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:38,600
Speaker 2: to give them an advantage, and they're still not going

1073
00:52:38,640 --> 00:52:40,319
Speaker 2: to get it done. They're not going to get an elk.

1074
00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:43,280
Speaker 2: You know. It's you know, they say, you know, uh,

1075
00:52:43,480 --> 00:52:45,400
Speaker 2: ten percent of the hunters are killing ninety percent of

1076
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:50,880
Speaker 2: the elk, and the success rates they hover depending on

1077
00:52:50,920 --> 00:52:53,120
Speaker 2: the units. Some units are ten percent, some are more

1078
00:52:53,160 --> 00:52:55,160
Speaker 2: than that, depend on the weapon, depend on the units.

1079
00:52:55,360 --> 00:52:57,239
Speaker 2: Some of the units, you know, they're really good, you know,

1080
00:52:58,200 --> 00:53:01,880
Speaker 2: trophy class management units. You know, success rates are high,

1081
00:53:02,280 --> 00:53:05,400
Speaker 2: but there's also you know, uh, you know, less hunters

1082
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:09,000
Speaker 2: in the in the average, and then there's more animals

1083
00:53:09,160 --> 00:53:12,400
Speaker 2: than average, so your your success rates go up. So

1084
00:53:14,120 --> 00:53:17,759
Speaker 2: I'm not one hundred percent against it, I think I

1085
00:53:17,800 --> 00:53:24,040
Speaker 2: think the biggest disparency or the biggest line that gets

1086
00:53:24,080 --> 00:53:28,400
Speaker 2: drawn here is the people who can't shoot long range

1087
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:32,279
Speaker 2: and have no desire to shoot lang range. They'd like

1088
00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:34,879
Speaker 2: they like to hunt traditional with a three three by

1089
00:53:34,960 --> 00:53:38,359
Speaker 2: nights go. That's why they hunt. If they if they

1090
00:53:38,400 --> 00:53:40,359
Speaker 2: want to, they want to get closer. If they can't

1091
00:53:40,360 --> 00:53:42,160
Speaker 2: shoot from where they're at, they just want to get closer.

1092
00:53:42,239 --> 00:53:46,200
Speaker 2: And that's that's how they like to hunt. And they

1093
00:53:46,239 --> 00:53:50,400
Speaker 2: think it's not good if somebody can shoot along a

1094
00:53:50,440 --> 00:53:54,919
Speaker 2: longer shot. The long range aspect. Back what I said

1095
00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:57,960
Speaker 2: earlier in the beginning of the podcast. It does open

1096
00:53:58,080 --> 00:54:02,239
Speaker 2: up opportunity for people to shoot, you know, past their

1097
00:54:02,320 --> 00:54:06,239
Speaker 2: effective range, But so does shooting the old three by

1098
00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:10,960
Speaker 2: nine scope without moveable turrets. Like I grew up in

1099
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:13,200
Speaker 2: an era, everybody had a three by nine scope or

1100
00:54:13,560 --> 00:54:15,560
Speaker 2: a four power scope or whatever. And when you've seen

1101
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:17,759
Speaker 2: a buck or at a bowl at a long range,

1102
00:54:17,760 --> 00:54:21,520
Speaker 2: we didn't have rangefinders, we didn't have movable turrets, and

1103
00:54:21,680 --> 00:54:25,800
Speaker 2: people just held over and most people didn't hit anything

1104
00:54:26,080 --> 00:54:28,080
Speaker 2: unless they had one on a big open hill side

1105
00:54:28,120 --> 00:54:30,000
Speaker 2: and they emptied two boxes of shells on it and

1106
00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:33,760
Speaker 2: they shot it and the ass or and then finally

1107
00:54:33,800 --> 00:54:35,480
Speaker 2: they would go over there and finish it off. So

1108
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:39,360
Speaker 2: I mean back to like, you can't change the hearts

1109
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:42,759
Speaker 2: of people, right, So people there were bad apples doing

1110
00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:45,320
Speaker 2: bad stuff before we could have the capability to shoot

1111
00:54:45,320 --> 00:54:49,719
Speaker 2: in long range. And now we still have some of

1112
00:54:49,719 --> 00:54:52,080
Speaker 2: those same people around. But I feel like a lot

1113
00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:54,640
Speaker 2: of the guys who were like doing it right and

1114
00:54:54,680 --> 00:54:57,040
Speaker 2: are successful at it and doing it they do it right.

1115
00:54:57,080 --> 00:55:00,400
Speaker 2: They're not like, you know, we know some of the

1116
00:55:00,400 --> 00:55:02,440
Speaker 2: best shooters, you know, long range shooters in the world,

1117
00:55:02,719 --> 00:55:04,719
Speaker 2: and those guys would be like, they can shoot a

1118
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:07,320
Speaker 2: thousand yards, no problem, they can shoot fifteen hundred yards

1119
00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:10,000
Speaker 2: no problem. But they'll say when I'm hunting, I really

1120
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:12,280
Speaker 2: like to reel that back and I don't really feel

1121
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:14,160
Speaker 2: like I should be shooting far on an animal, and

1122
00:55:14,160 --> 00:55:19,600
Speaker 2: they usually won't. They they don't. So I don't know,

1123
00:55:19,800 --> 00:55:21,120
Speaker 2: and I don't know how you would police it.

1124
00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:22,760
Speaker 1: Would you couldn't?

1125
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:26,160
Speaker 2: Would you outlaw range finders? Well, if you outlawed range finders.

1126
00:55:26,760 --> 00:55:31,600
Speaker 2: Then people with radicals and a first focal plane scope

1127
00:55:31,600 --> 00:55:33,439
Speaker 2: would be able to measure well even the second focal

1128
00:55:33,440 --> 00:55:35,839
Speaker 2: plane scope, you would be able to measure distance by

1129
00:55:35,920 --> 00:55:39,520
Speaker 2: counting the the tics on your on your on your radical,

1130
00:55:39,640 --> 00:55:43,880
Speaker 2: like there's a there's a way around every everything, unless

1131
00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:47,960
Speaker 2: you just outlawd moveable turret scopes, and then somebody would

1132
00:55:48,000 --> 00:55:52,480
Speaker 2: then we're back to holding over seven feet with your duplex.

1133
00:55:52,640 --> 00:55:54,719
Speaker 2: So I don't know what the right answer it is.

1134
00:55:55,440 --> 00:55:58,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, I struggle with it because I've got custom built

1135
00:55:58,320 --> 00:56:00,840
Speaker 1: guns and I haven't shot an animal over a thousand

1136
00:56:00,920 --> 00:56:03,560
Speaker 1: yards yet, but I shoot regularly over one thousand yards

1137
00:56:03,560 --> 00:56:05,920
Speaker 1: with you know, on paper and make sure I've got

1138
00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:08,960
Speaker 1: all my my dope charts and drop charts and everything

1139
00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:13,640
Speaker 1: figured out and wind drifts. But yeah, I try, you know,

1140
00:56:13,640 --> 00:56:15,319
Speaker 1: similar to those others. I try to reel in as

1141
00:56:15,400 --> 00:56:17,439
Speaker 1: much as possible. It's still on a hunt. And one

1142
00:56:17,440 --> 00:56:19,160
Speaker 1: thing that like I try to check off of my

1143
00:56:19,280 --> 00:56:22,040
Speaker 1: brain is like, did I challenge that animal? Did I

1144
00:56:22,200 --> 00:56:24,640
Speaker 1: you know his senses? Did he you know, did I

1145
00:56:24,640 --> 00:56:26,200
Speaker 1: sneak into three hundred yards? Well, then he had a

1146
00:56:26,239 --> 00:56:27,799
Speaker 1: chance to see me, or smell me, or do some

1147
00:56:27,840 --> 00:56:29,640
Speaker 1: of these things, and you some people will say, well,

1148
00:56:29,680 --> 00:56:31,360
Speaker 1: like the whole point is not to challenge any of

1149
00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:34,239
Speaker 1: their senses right and climb up over the ridge. And

1150
00:56:34,280 --> 00:56:35,719
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, but you know what I mean, Like

1151
00:56:35,760 --> 00:56:37,479
Speaker 1: if I got within three hundred yards, like I feel

1152
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:39,480
Speaker 1: better about that versus if I shot him from nine

1153
00:56:39,560 --> 00:56:42,120
Speaker 1: hundred and he didn't know I existed, you know, or

1154
00:56:42,160 --> 00:56:45,839
Speaker 1: had no no reason to be concerned. But yeah, I've

1155
00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:47,919
Speaker 1: always taken things to extremes, like where do you draw

1156
00:56:47,920 --> 00:56:50,839
Speaker 1: the line? Like let's say some new weapon and it's

1157
00:56:50,840 --> 00:56:53,240
Speaker 1: not outlied by any game commission, Like your gun shoots

1158
00:56:53,239 --> 00:56:56,160
Speaker 1: a laser or something, right, and you can shoot something

1159
00:56:56,160 --> 00:57:00,840
Speaker 1: at four thousand yards and you're like, well, does the

1160
00:57:00,840 --> 00:57:03,040
Speaker 1: guy have the skill? Are we gonna let that happen?

1161
00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:05,319
Speaker 1: Like is it a choice? Like is is it a

1162
00:57:05,440 --> 00:57:09,799
Speaker 1: range thing? Is it effectiveness thing? Like how do we

1163
00:57:10,440 --> 00:57:13,400
Speaker 1: where do we police it? Because let's just say, for instance,

1164
00:57:13,400 --> 00:57:15,080
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna talk through this, it won't ever happen

1165
00:57:15,120 --> 00:57:17,240
Speaker 1: because of the math and the physics involved. But you

1166
00:57:17,280 --> 00:57:20,160
Speaker 1: know there's these like extra long range matches right where

1167
00:57:20,160 --> 00:57:23,320
Speaker 1: people are making hits at four thousand yards or something. Yeah,

1168
00:57:23,320 --> 00:57:25,200
Speaker 1: you know, two and a half miles.

1169
00:57:24,760 --> 00:57:25,959
Speaker 2: And the king of two mile.

1170
00:57:26,400 --> 00:57:30,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, what if that becomes common technology or there's an

1171
00:57:30,200 --> 00:57:32,800
Speaker 1: app that like, oh, yeah, these guys have figured this

1172
00:57:32,880 --> 00:57:35,480
Speaker 1: all out. There's a lot of environmental factors, but like

1173
00:57:36,080 --> 00:57:39,160
Speaker 1: we got it dialed, like you know, let's say and

1174
00:57:39,240 --> 00:57:42,960
Speaker 1: I'm I'm this is me and my imagination, but like,

1175
00:57:43,000 --> 00:57:45,880
Speaker 1: all right, we build the AI in the on X

1176
00:57:46,320 --> 00:57:48,640
Speaker 1: in the wind and weather, and like they know that

1177
00:57:48,640 --> 00:57:51,400
Speaker 1: we're shooting over these ridges from this elevation to that elevation.

1178
00:57:51,760 --> 00:57:53,920
Speaker 1: This is what the wind's doing in all those draws. Like, oh,

1179
00:57:53,920 --> 00:57:55,840
Speaker 1: we'll come up with a solution for you. Just your

1180
00:57:55,880 --> 00:57:58,160
Speaker 1: scope's going to move right to this. Like do we

1181
00:57:58,240 --> 00:58:00,440
Speaker 1: let everybody take a shot at a four thousand the

1182
00:58:00,520 --> 00:58:03,400
Speaker 1: yard animal and kill it? Like I don't know if

1183
00:58:03,400 --> 00:58:05,440
Speaker 1: we ever get there, I don't know, but it's like

1184
00:58:05,640 --> 00:58:07,800
Speaker 1: at some point there's gotta be some self policing. And

1185
00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:09,880
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's a yardage thing, if it's

1186
00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:14,720
Speaker 1: a season length thing, how will that work. So I

1187
00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:17,320
Speaker 1: love long range hunting for the fact that it really

1188
00:58:17,400 --> 00:58:19,760
Speaker 1: sharpens your skills and it makes my three hundred you know,

1189
00:58:19,800 --> 00:58:22,840
Speaker 1: my typical three hundred yard hunting shots very easy. With

1190
00:58:22,920 --> 00:58:24,960
Speaker 1: the equipment that I have that's built for a thousand

1191
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:28,840
Speaker 1: plus yards. But I don't know, it's a tough one

1192
00:58:28,840 --> 00:58:33,960
Speaker 1: to tackle. I don't got the right answers. I don't know.

1193
00:58:34,160 --> 00:58:37,240
Speaker 1: I like it, but I wish it was like could

1194
00:58:37,240 --> 00:58:38,920
Speaker 1: be policed or managed somehow.

1195
00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:42,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was just thinking about what you were saying

1196
00:58:42,120 --> 00:58:46,640
Speaker 2: about that, you know, the AI figured out atmosphere conditions

1197
00:58:46,680 --> 00:58:49,400
Speaker 2: between you and the target. Man, I would have to

1198
00:58:49,480 --> 00:58:54,320
Speaker 2: think there's some smart person out there already working on this,

1199
00:58:54,520 --> 00:58:57,800
Speaker 2: like be able to project a beam or project something

1200
00:58:57,840 --> 00:59:01,520
Speaker 2: between you and the target and somehow of measurable feedback

1201
00:59:01,680 --> 00:59:04,680
Speaker 2: of atmospherics between you and there, and then have the

1202
00:59:04,760 --> 00:59:07,880
Speaker 2: AI calculate all that. I mean, maybe somebody already the government,

1203
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:09,760
Speaker 2: the government probably already has Yeah, right.

1204
00:59:09,640 --> 00:59:13,240
Speaker 1: I'm sure Brian Lets is working on it for the government. Yeah,

1205
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:16,480
Speaker 1: that's why when that's why our buddy John, Brian probably

1206
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:18,600
Speaker 1: has that in that new applied ballistics app. And that's

1207
00:59:18,640 --> 00:59:20,320
Speaker 1: why John couldn't figured it out the other day. It's like,

1208
00:59:20,560 --> 00:59:23,120
Speaker 1: all right, you you've you've got all this extra stuff.

1209
00:59:23,200 --> 00:59:26,560
Speaker 1: He's parameter. But yeah, I mean there's there are geniuses

1210
00:59:26,560 --> 00:59:28,920
Speaker 1: out there, like you know those guys, And I'm sure

1211
00:59:29,000 --> 00:59:30,680
Speaker 1: at some point or maybe we just gave them their

1212
00:59:30,680 --> 00:59:33,480
Speaker 1: next idea is like, yeah, if you had like a

1213
00:59:33,600 --> 00:59:37,880
Speaker 1: rangefinder that could report back environmental conditions at one hundred

1214
00:59:37,920 --> 00:59:39,720
Speaker 1: yards two hundred yards to hundred yards and you could

1215
00:59:39,760 --> 00:59:42,880
Speaker 1: get like a whatever, it would be like a mean difference,

1216
00:59:43,560 --> 00:59:44,720
Speaker 1: you know, and like, well, this is what you really

1217
00:59:44,720 --> 00:59:46,440
Speaker 1: need to dial for even though you're shooting two thousand

1218
00:59:46,520 --> 00:59:50,400
Speaker 1: yards across these canyons, like I can't. I would not

1219
00:59:50,640 --> 00:59:54,120
Speaker 1: be surprised if we got a Facebook announcement tomorrow that says,

1220
00:59:54,160 --> 00:59:57,000
Speaker 1: look what's now developed right right? You know, It's just

1221
00:59:57,080 --> 01:00:02,520
Speaker 1: it's not beyond you know, beyond that level of technology

1222
01:00:02,600 --> 01:00:03,360
Speaker 1: right now. I don't believe.

1223
01:00:03,960 --> 01:00:06,680
Speaker 2: But one thing, you know, people have to consider too,

1224
01:00:06,840 --> 01:00:09,960
Speaker 2: and I think a lot of people do. But shooting

1225
01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:14,920
Speaker 2: long range is actually what you I mean, hitting the

1226
01:00:14,920 --> 01:00:18,360
Speaker 2: animal is one thing, but then recovering it. Let's say

1227
01:00:18,400 --> 01:00:21,360
Speaker 2: you're by yourself, you don't have a spotter, or maybe

1228
01:00:21,360 --> 01:00:23,320
Speaker 2: you do have a spotter. For instance, I kind of

1229
01:00:23,360 --> 01:00:25,720
Speaker 2: talked about earlier in the thing about the thermal and

1230
01:00:25,720 --> 01:00:27,320
Speaker 2: we spotted a shooter, but we did is too far

1231
01:00:27,400 --> 01:00:29,600
Speaker 2: to shoot? Well, it wasn't that we couldn't hit it

1232
01:00:29,680 --> 01:00:32,400
Speaker 2: at that far it was like seven hundred yards. But

1233
01:00:33,000 --> 01:00:38,160
Speaker 2: this buck, it was late in the evening. You shoot it,

1234
01:00:38,160 --> 01:00:41,440
Speaker 2: it goes down. We got to drop eight hundred vertical feet,

1235
01:00:41,640 --> 01:00:45,760
Speaker 2: climb six hundred vertical feet and try to find that

1236
01:00:45,800 --> 01:00:50,520
Speaker 2: thing in the dark. That's just irresponsible and unethical. Like, no,

1237
01:00:50,680 --> 01:00:54,680
Speaker 2: that's stupid, Like we could we have found it. I'd

1238
01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:57,760
Speaker 2: like to say maybe probably, but I'm not going to

1239
01:00:57,840 --> 01:01:00,320
Speaker 2: gamble on that. I respect the animal too much. All

1240
01:01:01,160 --> 01:01:04,880
Speaker 2: I feel like there again, you know, long range shooting,

1241
01:01:05,160 --> 01:01:07,000
Speaker 2: you have to be able to recover it too without

1242
01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:08,400
Speaker 2: just losing animals.

1243
01:01:08,680 --> 01:01:11,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, I I feel like you were taking a job

1244
01:01:11,640 --> 01:01:13,800
Speaker 1: at me. Direk on that mountain view Elk count there

1245
01:01:13,840 --> 01:01:15,720
Speaker 1: with some of those last comments, because we shot it

1246
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:17,280
Speaker 1: and then had to leave it overnight, but we had

1247
01:01:17,360 --> 01:01:22,160
Speaker 1: specific environmental things working for us. But yeah, that is

1248
01:01:22,240 --> 01:01:24,360
Speaker 1: it was a concern. You know. We we thought about

1249
01:01:24,400 --> 01:01:26,800
Speaker 1: it and where it died, and we're like, well, you know,

1250
01:01:26,800 --> 01:01:28,560
Speaker 1: we had to make the decision for the safety of

1251
01:01:28,600 --> 01:01:31,040
Speaker 1: all of us in the rocky country and where it

1252
01:01:31,080 --> 01:01:32,600
Speaker 1: was at. We had to come back. But thankfully we

1253
01:01:32,680 --> 01:01:35,640
Speaker 1: had fifteen degrees at night and the elk landed on

1254
01:01:35,680 --> 01:01:39,400
Speaker 1: its belly, you know. And you know we didn't waste

1255
01:01:39,440 --> 01:01:40,760
Speaker 1: hardly any of that meat. You know, a little bit

1256
01:01:40,760 --> 01:01:44,080
Speaker 1: around the hip sockets, but not much. But yeah, that

1257
01:01:44,080 --> 01:01:48,400
Speaker 1: that is a major concern, you know, especially in the mountains.

1258
01:01:49,000 --> 01:01:50,760
Speaker 1: You know, being able to shoot long range is great,

1259
01:01:50,800 --> 01:01:52,960
Speaker 1: but recovery and recovery in a time where you don't

1260
01:01:52,960 --> 01:01:55,080
Speaker 1: waste any meat is also a big concern.

1261
01:01:55,520 --> 01:01:56,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, definitely.

1262
01:01:57,240 --> 01:01:59,600
Speaker 1: But I will give a plug to one of our partners,

1263
01:02:00,000 --> 01:02:03,200
Speaker 1: Loopole's got a great new spotter that helps in this process.

1264
01:02:03,320 --> 01:02:05,600
Speaker 1: If you do shoot that thing, go ahead and range,

1265
01:02:05,600 --> 01:02:07,320
Speaker 1: find it and mark it on your on X and

1266
01:02:07,320 --> 01:02:08,600
Speaker 1: then just walk over to that point.

1267
01:02:08,920 --> 01:02:10,240
Speaker 2: Bama.

1268
01:02:10,360 --> 01:02:13,760
Speaker 1: Hey, there you go. That's a that's as as sponsorshippy

1269
01:02:13,800 --> 01:02:15,920
Speaker 1: as I'm gonna get or a plug in a product.

1270
01:02:16,040 --> 01:02:18,680
Speaker 1: But no, it is that it is a game changer.

1271
01:02:18,760 --> 01:02:20,440
Speaker 1: Like I didn't think I would necessarily use that as

1272
01:02:20,520 --> 01:02:22,480
Speaker 1: much as I have, but man, it makes it awesome.

1273
01:02:22,480 --> 01:02:24,360
Speaker 1: And if your friends don't know you have that technology,

1274
01:02:24,360 --> 01:02:26,120
Speaker 1: it makes you look like a freaking genius.

1275
01:02:27,560 --> 01:02:29,840
Speaker 2: How you you're that good?

1276
01:02:30,400 --> 01:02:32,640
Speaker 1: Yeah? Hey, I looked at the point of the ridge

1277
01:02:32,640 --> 01:02:34,680
Speaker 1: and I knew where this tree was and that, and

1278
01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:37,920
Speaker 1: use it on my muzzle at or Bowl Recovery, used

1279
01:02:37,920 --> 01:02:39,520
Speaker 1: it on a few ques deer last year when we

1280
01:02:39,520 --> 01:02:42,120
Speaker 1: were testing it, and makes you look way smarter than

1281
01:02:42,160 --> 01:02:46,160
Speaker 1: you really are. Yeah, No, I appreciate you having you on,

1282
01:02:46,800 --> 01:02:48,360
Speaker 1: you know, and just walking through these Some of these

1283
01:02:48,400 --> 01:02:50,440
Speaker 1: things are tough and there's no right or wrong answers.

1284
01:02:51,040 --> 01:02:53,760
Speaker 1: I think, you know, we we use some of this technology,

1285
01:02:53,960 --> 01:02:56,440
Speaker 1: we we grow with it, and sometimes I'm a hypocrite

1286
01:02:56,440 --> 01:03:00,320
Speaker 1: because it's like, well, I'm gonna use it until it's illegal,

1287
01:03:00,360 --> 01:03:04,280
Speaker 1: even though I don't necessarily agree with it. But yeah,

1288
01:03:04,360 --> 01:03:07,040
Speaker 1: everybody's got to make their own decision on what's too much,

1289
01:03:07,360 --> 01:03:10,440
Speaker 1: how much is too much, and then you know, make

1290
01:03:10,440 --> 01:03:13,400
Speaker 1: their decisions on that. But yeah, I appreciate having you on,

1291
01:03:13,440 --> 01:03:16,720
Speaker 1: and I do want to let everybody know don't forget

1292
01:03:16,720 --> 01:03:19,480
Speaker 1: the sportsman shows we've got going on. We will this.

1293
01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:22,800
Speaker 1: This is airing on the thirteenth, I think is a Thursday,

1294
01:03:22,840 --> 01:03:27,040
Speaker 1: Is that correct? Yeah, which both shows will be active.

1295
01:03:27,080 --> 01:03:30,560
Speaker 1: Will be at Western Hunt in Salt Lake City, Utah,

1296
01:03:30,720 --> 01:03:32,840
Speaker 1: and then we'll also be at the Pacific Northwest Sportsman

1297
01:03:32,920 --> 01:03:35,920
Speaker 1: Show in Portland, Oregon. So if you're in the area, board.

1298
01:03:36,600 --> 01:03:39,440
Speaker 1: Head on out, you can take a look for the

1299
01:03:39,440 --> 01:03:41,680
Speaker 1: first time at some of our new products. We will

1300
01:03:41,720 --> 01:03:44,600
Speaker 1: have the new carbon fiber Beagle tube. At these shows.

1301
01:03:44,640 --> 01:03:46,920
Speaker 1: We will have a select amount for sale other carbon

1302
01:03:46,960 --> 01:03:51,840
Speaker 1: fiber tubes, fifty of them each show. Nice. We've got

1303
01:03:51,840 --> 01:03:55,640
Speaker 1: our new Kivian tube, which is collapsible, smaller than an

1304
01:03:55,680 --> 01:04:00,520
Speaker 1: algaene bottle, extends out into a full sized tube. Sound

1305
01:04:02,200 --> 01:04:07,080
Speaker 1: amazing in my opinion, amazing sound and good back pressure.

1306
01:04:07,440 --> 01:04:11,040
Speaker 1: We've got a new product, the Easy One, that will

1307
01:04:11,040 --> 01:04:14,840
Speaker 1: accompany kind of be the the Little Brother, little Sister,

1308
01:04:14,880 --> 01:04:16,320
Speaker 1: whatever you want to call it to the Easy Sucker.

1309
01:04:16,440 --> 01:04:19,480
Speaker 1: And then we will have some new trial packs of

1310
01:04:19,560 --> 01:04:22,520
Speaker 1: some new diaphragm frames that we have at all these shows.

1311
01:04:22,560 --> 01:04:26,200
Speaker 1: So a big year for Phelps on our ELK category.

1312
01:04:26,520 --> 01:04:28,040
Speaker 1: I don't want to say we've stayed away from it,

1313
01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:30,000
Speaker 1: but I would say this has like been the big

1314
01:04:30,880 --> 01:04:33,120
Speaker 1: you know since twenty sixteen we brought the unleashed to

1315
01:04:33,320 --> 01:04:36,640
Speaker 1: the ANT frames, Like this is probably our biggest This

1316
01:04:36,720 --> 01:04:40,320
Speaker 1: is probably our biggest you know year category expansion for ELK.

1317
01:04:40,360 --> 01:04:42,960
Speaker 1: I would say, so pretty stoked to see see what

1318
01:04:43,000 --> 01:04:46,160
Speaker 1: everybody thinks on those. And yeah, head out the show,

1319
01:04:48,160 --> 01:04:50,640
Speaker 1: pick yourself up a new tube or you know, at

1320
01:04:50,680 --> 01:04:54,200
Speaker 1: least just talk to us, and yeah, we'd appreciate seeing you.

1321
01:04:54,560 --> 01:04:58,000
Speaker 2: And if you see Jason Phelps please he'll be at

1322
01:04:58,000 --> 01:05:01,320
Speaker 2: the Portland show. Please ask him, Hey, are you gonna

1323
01:05:01,320 --> 01:05:05,560
Speaker 2: address I call Cocain again and go all hunting? Give

1324
01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:07,800
Speaker 2: the people what they want, Jason. I mean, you really

1325
01:05:07,840 --> 01:05:09,920
Speaker 2: need to make it. But if we got enough people

1326
01:05:10,160 --> 01:05:12,520
Speaker 2: going up and asking for him to hunt in a

1327
01:05:12,680 --> 01:05:15,600
Speaker 2: call Cogain outfit again, we might get to see it again.

1328
01:05:16,360 --> 01:05:19,480
Speaker 1: Oh we might not get to see it again. No,

1329
01:05:19,880 --> 01:05:22,520
Speaker 1: if I get here, I'll say, if I get fourteen

1330
01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:25,440
Speaker 1: thousand people tell me I should hunt in a in

1331
01:05:25,520 --> 01:05:27,920
Speaker 1: a whole Cocain outfit, I'll do it.

1332
01:05:29,200 --> 01:05:31,520
Speaker 2: So you know the email to send it into what

1333
01:05:31,680 --> 01:05:32,000
Speaker 2: is it?

1334
01:05:33,400 --> 01:05:38,720
Speaker 1: But let's not let's not get an overwhelming there with emails. Yeah,

1335
01:05:38,760 --> 01:05:42,040
Speaker 1: we'll see, we gotta we'll have to see see how

1336
01:05:42,080 --> 01:05:43,480
Speaker 1: much Oak Coming I get to do this year. We've

1337
01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:45,400
Speaker 1: got some pretty big plans in the cooker that I

1338
01:05:45,480 --> 01:05:47,480
Speaker 1: might have to say for a future episode.

1339
01:05:47,600 --> 01:05:48,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely.

1340
01:05:49,080 --> 01:05:52,200
Speaker 1: So all right, appreciate it, Dirk, take care and we'll

1341
01:05:52,200 --> 01:05:53,000
Speaker 1: catch up with you later.

1342
01:05:53,120 --> 01:06:01,200
Speaker 2: Yeat