1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:02,040 Speaker 1: The presidential candidacy of Robert F. 2 00:00:02,120 --> 00:00:06,400 Speaker 2: Kennedy Junior did not leap to the forefront of political 3 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:10,000 Speaker 2: news because the Democrats kept him off of the ballot 4 00:00:10,080 --> 00:00:10,560 Speaker 2: most days. 5 00:00:10,560 --> 00:00:13,280 Speaker 1: He had to fight like hell to get back. 6 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:15,320 Speaker 2: On the ballot, and now they won't take him off 7 00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:19,080 Speaker 2: even though he has endorsed President Trump. One of the 8 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 2: areas in probably the primary area where I think he 9 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:23,759 Speaker 2: has made a huge difference. 10 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:25,079 Speaker 1: And I don't agree with Robert F. 11 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 2: Kennedy Junior on every issue, I want to be clear 12 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:31,120 Speaker 2: on that, but he has been a person who has 13 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:35,360 Speaker 2: brought our attention to what goes in our foods, what 14 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:38,640 Speaker 2: we're feeding our children, what we're putting into our bodies, 15 00:00:39,240 --> 00:00:44,200 Speaker 2: and what we're calling quote unquote medicine. You know, when 16 00:00:44,200 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 2: you go to the doctor. My mother desperately wanted me 17 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:50,519 Speaker 2: to be a doctor because she had such respect and 18 00:00:50,760 --> 00:00:54,600 Speaker 2: admiration for doctors. She was a nurse's aide when we 19 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:57,120 Speaker 2: were little, to help pay the bills, and we had 20 00:00:57,120 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 2: the physician's desk reference and that was everything that was before. 21 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 2: That was before the med MD or whatever, where you 22 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 2: could go in there and find all the things you 23 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:06,680 Speaker 2: were going to die of. But doctors were healers. They 24 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:10,520 Speaker 2: were trusted. There are a cross between a scientist and 25 00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:13,960 Speaker 2: your pastor. And there was such respect for the doctor 26 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:18,560 Speaker 2: and the medical establishment and vaccines and pharmaceuticals and all 27 00:01:18,560 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 2: these scenes were gonna help us live longer and be happier. 28 00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:26,120 Speaker 2: And somewhere along the way it all went wrong, and 29 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 2: that misplaced trust is a legacy, sadly of a time 30 00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:35,920 Speaker 2: that is long gone, or maybe maybe never really existed. 31 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:40,080 Speaker 2: We came across the name of Kim Whitsas and she 32 00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:42,160 Speaker 2: has a funny spelling. It's polish. For those of you 33 00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:43,880 Speaker 2: who are polished, you're like, not funny it all. I 34 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:47,200 Speaker 2: know exactly how spelling. She sued viser and she is 35 00:01:47,240 --> 00:01:51,080 Speaker 2: the reason we have black box suicide warnings on SSRIs. 36 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:56,040 Speaker 2: She's become a drug safety advocate and this is her passion. 37 00:01:56,520 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 2: And I'll tell you, hell hath no fury like a 38 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:03,360 Speaker 2: woman's gooring. Hell hath twice the fury as a woman 39 00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:06,400 Speaker 2: on a mission. And she is a woman on a mission. 40 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:09,000 Speaker 2: Honored to have you, Kim Whitsacks, welcome to the program. 41 00:02:09,440 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 3: Oh thanks for having me. Thank you so much. And 42 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 3: I like your introduction when you talk about the trust 43 00:02:15,560 --> 00:02:17,800 Speaker 3: because I think, you know, that is a very common 44 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:22,600 Speaker 3: and I still think there's that's a pretty common attitude today. 45 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:24,839 Speaker 3: Maybe a little bit different than you know the last 46 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 3: couple of years. But yeah, you know, I'm glad, I'm 47 00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 3: glad you're having this conversation. 48 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:32,079 Speaker 2: Let's go to the toughest thing we're going to have 49 00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:36,119 Speaker 2: to talk about today. On August six, two thousand and three, 50 00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:39,760 Speaker 2: my world came crashing down on me. Can you tell 51 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:43,120 Speaker 2: what happened and what spurred you to commit your life 52 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:43,400 Speaker 2: to this? 53 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 3: Sure? I like to call myself the accidental advocate because 54 00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:50,600 Speaker 3: I never set out to do the work, the drug 55 00:02:50,639 --> 00:02:53,400 Speaker 3: safety work that I do today, but sometimes our greatest 56 00:02:53,400 --> 00:02:56,679 Speaker 3: purposes choose us. On August sixth, two thousand and three, 57 00:02:57,040 --> 00:02:59,080 Speaker 3: over twenty one years ago, I was out of town 58 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:01,840 Speaker 3: on business and I got a call from my dad 59 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:04,360 Speaker 3: because I hadn't heard from my husband all day. And 60 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:06,079 Speaker 3: I'd say, hey, Dad, do me a favorite go over 61 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 3: and chuck and see if my if what he was, 62 00:03:08,880 --> 00:03:12,239 Speaker 3: you know, because he had just started a new job 63 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:15,399 Speaker 3: and was having trouble sleeping. So my dad goes over 64 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:18,360 Speaker 3: to my house and I get a call. I'm still 65 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:21,640 Speaker 3: on set shooting at like eight o'clock at night in Detroit, 66 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:25,240 Speaker 3: and it was my dad and the phone call it's bad, 67 00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:27,079 Speaker 3: it's bad. I'm like, what do you mean it's bead 68 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:29,000 Speaker 3: like what he's dead. I'm like, what do you mean 69 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:30,960 Speaker 3: what he's dead? He's like, I go, how do you 70 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:35,080 Speaker 3: know he's done? He's like, he's hanging, and literally, in 71 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:40,240 Speaker 3: one like second, my entire world, everything that I had planned, 72 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 3: everything that I knew, came crashing, crashing down, and literally 73 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:49,280 Speaker 3: those words to this day, twenty one years later, still 74 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:52,600 Speaker 3: you know, ring in my head because I still can't 75 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:54,720 Speaker 3: believe it. And I've been doing this work for twenty 76 00:03:54,760 --> 00:03:58,080 Speaker 3: one years, but you know, everything intuitively in my body 77 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:00,240 Speaker 3: when my dad's like he's dead and hanging and I'm 78 00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 3: like what. He wasn't depressed. He had no history of 79 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:06,160 Speaker 3: depression or anything else. He had just started his dream 80 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:09,880 Speaker 3: job with a startup company five weeks or earlier in 81 00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:12,480 Speaker 3: the year, but five weeks earlier he went to the 82 00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:15,120 Speaker 3: doctor because he was having trouble sleeping. So he was 83 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:17,159 Speaker 3: one of those guys that you were just talking about, 84 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:21,039 Speaker 3: like your mother, who blindly trusted the doctors, right. His 85 00:04:21,160 --> 00:04:23,720 Speaker 3: doctor would was a big athlete. They put him together, 86 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:26,320 Speaker 3: you know, after he got injured playing sports. You know, 87 00:04:26,360 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 3: he got stitches, they stitched them up, you know, fixed 88 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:32,240 Speaker 3: his knees. He didn't think that they got paid enough 89 00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:34,680 Speaker 3: because they got him back up and running and playing 90 00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 3: on the basketball court, et cetera. So he went to 91 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:43,360 Speaker 3: his GP, you know, about five weeks earlier, and was 92 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:47,000 Speaker 3: telling him how he was having trouble sleeping, and his doctor, 93 00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:50,919 Speaker 3: who he trusted, gave him a three week sample pack 94 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:54,240 Speaker 3: of an antidepressant, Zoloft, and said that it would take 95 00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:57,839 Speaker 3: the edge off and help him sleep. And I happened 96 00:04:57,839 --> 00:05:00,920 Speaker 3: to be it was my busy time of my work, 97 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 3: and I happened to be out of the country the 98 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 3: first three weeks. What he was put on those drugs, 99 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:09,159 Speaker 3: and the drug that he came home with the sample 100 00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:14,359 Speaker 3: pack automatically doubled the dose after week one. And so 101 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:17,920 Speaker 3: that's really kind of the precipitus of this what he 102 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:20,040 Speaker 3: had no history. But literally, when I got that call, 103 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:22,560 Speaker 3: I'm like, there's no Everything in my body was like, 104 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 3: there's no way that what he was hanging like, it 105 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:29,040 Speaker 3: just didn't even make it didn't even compute with my body. 106 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:33,599 Speaker 3: But literally that night when my life fell apart. The 107 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:36,800 Speaker 3: corner called and asked me a question and asked if 108 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,520 Speaker 3: what he was taking any medication. The only thing he 109 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:43,040 Speaker 3: was taking was Zoloft, and she said, we're going to 110 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 3: take it with us. It might have something to do 111 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:49,000 Speaker 3: with his death. That was clue number one. Clue number 112 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:52,120 Speaker 3: two was, ironically, the same day what he was found, 113 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 3: the front page of our Minneapolis Star Tribune had an 114 00:05:56,080 --> 00:06:00,080 Speaker 3: article that said the UK finds link between antidepressants and 115 00:06:00,160 --> 00:06:04,920 Speaker 3: suicide in teens. And that literally happened the same night 116 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:09,200 Speaker 3: that my husband's death. That made no sense happened. So 117 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:14,280 Speaker 3: you know, that became really the start of it. As 118 00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:16,600 Speaker 3: I'm trying to get back from Detroit where I was, 119 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 3: back to Minneapolis, my brother in law goes home and 120 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 3: googles Zoloft and suicide. And we had no idea that 121 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 3: the FDA held hearings in nineteen ninety one when it 122 00:06:29,240 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 3: was only Prozac on the market, and at that time, 123 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 3: every one of the Advisory board members took money from 124 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 3: pharmaceutical makers make an antidepressants, and they said, nope, we 125 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:45,520 Speaker 3: don't see any link between violence and suicide with prozac. 126 00:06:46,120 --> 00:06:50,600 Speaker 3: So the FDA said told Eli Lilly Let's study suicidality. 127 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 3: Of course, they never did or never never got brought 128 00:06:54,680 --> 00:07:00,560 Speaker 3: to the forefront. And meanwhile, the FDA approved additional antidepressants 129 00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:05,760 Speaker 3: from Pfizer being Zoloft and Paxel from glaxvill Smith Klein 130 00:07:05,960 --> 00:07:10,000 Speaker 3: and approved it for children. And so that was Woody 131 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:12,440 Speaker 3: was two thousand and three. This was in nineteen ninety one. 132 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 3: So almost immediately this became our mission because Woody loved life, 133 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:20,880 Speaker 3: and there was no way that this was going to 134 00:07:20,880 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 3: be the legacy that was going to be, you know, 135 00:07:24,120 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 3: for him. He loved you know, we were just starting 136 00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 3: to try to have kids and and everything. So this 137 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 3: became our mission, my brother in law and I's mission, 138 00:07:33,840 --> 00:07:38,400 Speaker 3: and started almost immediately going out to DC and we 139 00:07:38,480 --> 00:07:41,160 Speaker 3: call it the Battle for Woody, and it became, you know, 140 00:07:41,520 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 3: meeting with everybody from the FDA, Congress, anybody who would 141 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:49,240 Speaker 3: listen to tell our story, and then ultimately had a 142 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:51,680 Speaker 3: lawsuit which was part of it, and got documents out 143 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:55,080 Speaker 3: from under seal. But it's a pretty tragic story and 144 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:58,240 Speaker 3: it's one that still is going on, you know, twenty 145 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 3: one years later, and it's become just part of who 146 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:06,920 Speaker 3: I am today because we didn't know. We blindly trusted, 147 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:10,239 Speaker 3: and if I could do anything to help another family 148 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:14,200 Speaker 3: not have to discover what we discovered after the fact, 149 00:08:14,680 --> 00:08:16,400 Speaker 3: I will do that the rest of my life. 150 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:19,640 Speaker 2: Hold right there. Kim Witsex is our guest. If you 151 00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 2: want to find her, it's online. It's Kim Whitsex dot com. 152 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 2: And I'll spell it for you. Kay, I am obviously 153 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:32,440 Speaker 2: w I t czak, w I t czak more. 154 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 1: With Earth coming up? 155 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:34,520 Speaker 3: Remember me? 156 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:44,720 Speaker 2: Okay, remember Scott make Kim Witsex is our guest. A 157 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:49,120 Speaker 2: quote attributed to her sickness used to happen to you. 158 00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 2: Now we live in a world where it is being 159 00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:57,880 Speaker 2: sold to us. It sounds very reminiscent of what Robert F. 160 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:02,560 Speaker 2: Kennedy Junior has said over the last few years, and 161 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:06,200 Speaker 2: that is, there's nothing more profitable than a sick child. 162 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 1: Kim. 163 00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 2: We talked about the impetus for this activism on your part. 164 00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:16,160 Speaker 2: I'm guessing it doesn't pay well, if at all. But 165 00:09:16,280 --> 00:09:19,200 Speaker 2: you know, there is something about a ministry as zeal 166 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 2: a person has when they see wrong and they have 167 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:27,160 Speaker 2: to write it. Do you see any hope in your 168 00:09:27,200 --> 00:09:30,160 Speaker 2: twenty one years of advocacy, are we seeing I want 169 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:32,440 Speaker 2: to go deeper into what you have to say, But 170 00:09:32,559 --> 00:09:34,319 Speaker 2: is there any light at the end of the tunnelies, 171 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:36,480 Speaker 2: are you collecting any winds along the way. 172 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:42,440 Speaker 3: Sure, you know it's been a long journey, but you 173 00:09:42,440 --> 00:09:44,360 Speaker 3: know some of the winds along the way where the 174 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:48,040 Speaker 3: fact that we did get the warnings added to antidepressants 175 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:50,280 Speaker 3: in two thousand and four, in two thousand and six, 176 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,679 Speaker 3: but to this day there are no there are no 177 00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:56,960 Speaker 3: warnings that exist for all ages. And the reality is 178 00:09:57,360 --> 00:10:01,800 Speaker 3: with antidepressants, the risk of side violence, all of any 179 00:10:01,840 --> 00:10:07,000 Speaker 3: of those kind of neuropsychiatric side effects happened at all ages, 180 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 3: so everybody should be worn. So there's you know, that 181 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 3: was a light. I think the fact that I got 182 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:16,680 Speaker 3: appointed and was you know, I sit on the FDA 183 00:10:16,760 --> 00:10:20,040 Speaker 3: Advisory Committee, the same one that in nineteen ninety one 184 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:22,760 Speaker 3: didn't do their job. I sit on that committee today 185 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:25,680 Speaker 3: and I'm off in the loan vote, but at least 186 00:10:25,720 --> 00:10:28,600 Speaker 3: I'm there, you know, So these are some small wins. 187 00:10:29,480 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 3: And then I would also say, you know, I feel 188 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:34,079 Speaker 3: like I've been banging my head for a long time 189 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:37,160 Speaker 3: on these issues as well as you know, I thought 190 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:39,480 Speaker 3: it was truly when when it first happened. I mean, 191 00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 3: I was kind of one of those people that blindly 192 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 3: trusted to to be honest, and I thought it was 193 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:47,360 Speaker 3: just an issue with antidepressants, but I realized, oh no, no, no, 194 00:10:47,800 --> 00:10:52,160 Speaker 3: this is a systemic problem with our whole drug safety system. 195 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:54,840 Speaker 3: It is you know, health as I always say, healthcare 196 00:10:54,920 --> 00:10:59,040 Speaker 3: is of business and they need patients to go to, 197 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 3: you know, as custom And so I do think the 198 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 3: last couple of years of you know, with what happened 199 00:11:06,160 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 3: with COVID and the rushed the you know quote unquote 200 00:11:10,679 --> 00:11:16,440 Speaker 3: vaccine uh that I think we've now opened. I think 201 00:11:16,440 --> 00:11:19,880 Speaker 3: that was the light that kind of spotlighted what's been 202 00:11:19,880 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 3: going on for and for people like Kennedy, people like 203 00:11:23,120 --> 00:11:27,760 Speaker 3: myself who've been in this, the lawyers, other advocates and 204 00:11:27,800 --> 00:11:30,520 Speaker 3: that have been advocating for the ugly side of medicine, 205 00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 3: the harms. This has been going on for a long time. 206 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:36,000 Speaker 3: But I think there's all these new people that have 207 00:11:36,160 --> 00:11:40,040 Speaker 3: come into the system and are now seeing like whoa 208 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:42,520 Speaker 3: even like I love when I hear doctors that have 209 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:45,200 Speaker 3: like are starting to learn wait, I didn't even know 210 00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:48,000 Speaker 3: what I didn't know. And I think that to me 211 00:11:48,400 --> 00:11:51,480 Speaker 3: is a bright spot that we have to continue to 212 00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:56,280 Speaker 3: shine the light and and bring more people into the fold, 213 00:11:56,320 --> 00:11:58,520 Speaker 3: because ultimately, at the end of the day, you know, 214 00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:03,079 Speaker 3: you know, keeping people sick is a great business strategy. 215 00:12:03,160 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 3: It's an awful strategy for living well, into you and 216 00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:10,280 Speaker 3: aging well. 217 00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:14,280 Speaker 2: You know, it's a they call it planned obsolescence in 218 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:17,960 Speaker 2: the consumer product market, the idea that we could make 219 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:21,960 Speaker 2: a tire that would last a million miles, one hundred years, 220 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:25,559 Speaker 2: whatever the period of time is. But where's the profit 221 00:12:25,679 --> 00:12:31,320 Speaker 2: in that? It's much better to treat the symptoms than 222 00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:34,360 Speaker 2: to heal the patient, because when you heal the patient, 223 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 2: you don't keep him on a monthly subscription. Once you 224 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 2: understand how often that is the case. And I want 225 00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:45,080 Speaker 2: to be very clear, there are a number of doctors 226 00:12:45,080 --> 00:12:48,480 Speaker 2: and medical professionals listening to our show, and I don't 227 00:12:48,520 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 2: want you to think that we think that every one 228 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:54,240 Speaker 2: of you is evil. In fact, very few are. But 229 00:12:54,280 --> 00:12:58,360 Speaker 2: it's enough to make a difference, and the business side 230 00:12:58,400 --> 00:13:00,720 Speaker 2: of this doesn't have to be terrible. I want people 231 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:02,800 Speaker 2: to make money. I want them to make money. I 232 00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:05,440 Speaker 2: want their patents protected, I want them to engage in 233 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:09,040 Speaker 2: research and development. I want them seeking cures to things. 234 00:13:09,360 --> 00:13:13,080 Speaker 2: But I cannot pretend any longer that we live in 235 00:13:13,120 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 2: a world where it's not the case that people are 236 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 2: being allowed to suffer and die when there are cures. 237 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:23,680 Speaker 2: People are being injected with what's being called a vaccine 238 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:27,120 Speaker 2: that is not a vaccine. They're getting boosters. I don't 239 00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:29,560 Speaker 2: know what number they're on. Now we find out that 240 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:33,840 Speaker 2: eleven thousand governmental officials were exempted from it. 241 00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 1: It's nonsense. It's crazy. 242 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 2: And if you love humanity and you love your neighbor, 243 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:42,160 Speaker 2: you have to be willing to study and enter into 244 00:13:42,160 --> 00:13:45,760 Speaker 2: some very difficult conversations. And that's what I hope we're 245 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:47,880 Speaker 2: talking about today. That's what I hope you'll be willing 246 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:52,760 Speaker 2: to be open minded about. I read of you, Kim Witsex. 247 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:56,439 Speaker 2: My drug safety FDA reform advocacy was born out of 248 00:13:56,480 --> 00:13:59,320 Speaker 2: nothing but a deep knowing that something didn't make sense 249 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:01,200 Speaker 2: about what he's done. And if you're new to the show, 250 00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 2: that's her late husband who hanged himself. So I started 251 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:05,839 Speaker 2: to dig into the one only thing that changed my 252 00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:10,720 Speaker 2: husband's life, being prescribed zoloft. This journey for the truth 253 00:14:10,760 --> 00:14:13,400 Speaker 2: took me to the FDA, HHS, Congress of Courts and 254 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:17,120 Speaker 2: the media. What I learned shocked me. Someone had to 255 00:14:17,160 --> 00:14:21,360 Speaker 2: do something, So why not me talk a little more 256 00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:26,320 Speaker 2: about what you learned about the pharmaceutical industry side effects, 257 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:28,880 Speaker 2: because I know somebody who took his own life, who 258 00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:33,600 Speaker 2: was on an antidepressant it precededoloft, and you never get 259 00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:34,280 Speaker 2: that person back. 260 00:14:34,320 --> 00:14:36,360 Speaker 1: The pain never heals. 261 00:14:38,320 --> 00:14:41,600 Speaker 3: Yeah. Absolutely, well, I have to say I was pretty shocked, 262 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 3: you know, just even I will go back to just 263 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 3: knowing that in nineteen ninety one there were hearings at 264 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 3: the FDA, like how come I we didn't know? I mean, granted, 265 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:52,360 Speaker 3: in nineteen ninety one, I was like, just so you 266 00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:55,120 Speaker 3: know in college, like that was the furthest thing from me. 267 00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:57,960 Speaker 3: I had no history of any of these medications. But 268 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:00,240 Speaker 3: you know, the biggest thing, and I think what was 269 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:06,120 Speaker 3: really potent in helping get and push for the black 270 00:15:06,120 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 3: Black suicide warnings as well as there were big congressional 271 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 3: hearings that were happening at that time too, to do 272 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 3: with all of the moneies that were flowing between the companies, 273 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 3: academic institutions, the FDA and the and the companies, and 274 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:29,080 Speaker 3: so that was happening at the same time. But really 275 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:35,359 Speaker 3: what was potent was the drug company and FDA internal 276 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:39,920 Speaker 3: documents that the judge in My Wrongful Death Failure to 277 00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 3: Warned lawsuit released that showed that the FDA advisor black 278 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:50,040 Speaker 3: Closmith's client, they've known about the risk of suicide and 279 00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:53,440 Speaker 3: violence as well as the lack of efficacy from the 280 00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:56,240 Speaker 3: early days. Like when you see it in black and 281 00:15:56,280 --> 00:15:59,000 Speaker 3: white on their letterhead. It's not about you know, what 282 00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:01,400 Speaker 3: are being gone and meeting all these other families that 283 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:06,400 Speaker 3: had very similar examples, you know, similar situations. It's when 284 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:10,080 Speaker 3: you see that on letterhead and you're like somebody new 285 00:16:10,960 --> 00:16:14,840 Speaker 3: and you know, people like Woody and countless and thousands 286 00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:18,080 Speaker 3: of others and probably hundreds of thousands of others were 287 00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:23,440 Speaker 3: considered the cost of doing business collateral damage because you know, 288 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 3: they'll always be risk with medicine. So they just kind 289 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:29,720 Speaker 3: of factored in almost like an actuarial you know, it's 290 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:33,040 Speaker 3: a business decision, but you know what for for somebody 291 00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:35,560 Speaker 3: like me and our family, like those were that was 292 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:38,960 Speaker 3: somebody's husband, that was somebody's son, that was somebody's uncle, 293 00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:42,800 Speaker 3: that was somebody's friend, that's somebody's kid, and so those 294 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:45,880 Speaker 3: you know, once you put it in that kind of frame. 295 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:50,120 Speaker 3: You have to do something, and I'm all about making money, 296 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 3: but doing it the right way. And when you know, 297 00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:55,360 Speaker 3: and this is what I'll never understand, even back then, 298 00:16:55,800 --> 00:16:57,880 Speaker 3: when they'll be like, oh, well, these drugs just make you. 299 00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:00,720 Speaker 3: They make you feel better, so you're going to to 300 00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:03,480 Speaker 3: you know, act on your impulses, I'm like, well that 301 00:17:03,520 --> 00:17:06,320 Speaker 3: should have been number one warning. You should have done 302 00:17:06,320 --> 00:17:09,800 Speaker 3: that from the beginning. But again when you look at 303 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:14,280 Speaker 3: the documents where you know, like one of them was 304 00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 3: just this that I didn't realize that. In Germany, prozac 305 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 3: was never approved initially for two reasons, risk of suicide 306 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:25,439 Speaker 3: lack of efficacy. Eventually it did get approved, but it 307 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:28,400 Speaker 3: had to be prescribed with a sedative, and that is 308 00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:34,399 Speaker 3: to to offset this like akathesia, which is this side effect, 309 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:39,720 Speaker 3: which is what they kept from GPS and Fizer actually 310 00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:43,200 Speaker 3: talked about it as if a patient or somebody gets 311 00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 3: this side effect to akathesia, which is like what Wood 312 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 3: he told me three weeks after he started taking the drug, 313 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:52,040 Speaker 3: where he was standing outside his head looking a body 314 00:17:52,119 --> 00:17:59,680 Speaker 3: looking in and I had no idea what was happenings. 315 00:17:57,200 --> 00:17:59,560 Speaker 2: Any more to talk about Kim Whitsack is with Kim 316 00:17:59,560 --> 00:18:03,720 Speaker 2: Whitzack is our guest. Will continue our conversation with her. 317 00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:06,880 Speaker 2: Her comment that sickness used to happen to you. Now 318 00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:09,400 Speaker 2: we live in a world where it is being sold 319 00:18:09,640 --> 00:18:10,360 Speaker 2: to us. 320 00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:14,800 Speaker 1: I don't care if somebody disrespects you. You can't shoot Michael. 321 00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:18,920 Speaker 1: It's been refolk. Kim Whitsacks is our guest. 322 00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:21,440 Speaker 2: It's an odd spelling, but if you can figure it out, 323 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:22,640 Speaker 2: you can find her online. 324 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:23,439 Speaker 1: You can connect with her. 325 00:18:23,480 --> 00:18:26,399 Speaker 2: You can learn a lot more about her passion and 326 00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:31,280 Speaker 2: zeal and activism for the health of her fellow man, 327 00:18:32,040 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 2: for information and transparency. 328 00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:36,840 Speaker 1: I understand there. 329 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:40,480 Speaker 2: Are side effects to every drug. I understand that there 330 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:43,120 Speaker 2: can be a downside to a drug that can heal 331 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:48,239 Speaker 2: a lot of people. But consumers, patients, Americans should know 332 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:51,520 Speaker 2: what those things are. They shouldn't be hidden from you. 333 00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:55,960 Speaker 2: You shouldn't be lied to. Kim Whitsacks is spelled Kim 334 00:18:56,080 --> 00:19:02,000 Speaker 2: obviously Wi t cza. Let's spell that again, Wi t 335 00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:07,960 Speaker 2: cz ak kimwhitsas dot com. Kim, you were finishing talking 336 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:12,359 Speaker 2: about what his death. That's her late husband. He hanged himself. 337 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:16,520 Speaker 2: He was on zoloft that set her off on a 338 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:20,600 Speaker 2: over two decade long journey of activism and we're the 339 00:19:20,680 --> 00:19:21,239 Speaker 2: better for it. 340 00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:22,960 Speaker 1: But I think I had to interrupt you in the middle. 341 00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:28,000 Speaker 3: Oh sure. So I was talking about the side effect akathusia, 342 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 3: and one of the documents that we got out from 343 00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 3: the lawsuits that was written by Pfizer's chief medical officer. 344 00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:37,680 Speaker 3: It's a journal article that it talked about if patients 345 00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:42,439 Speaker 3: get the side effect akathesia, it's quote unquote death can 346 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 3: be a welcome result. So that was public, But what 347 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:48,479 Speaker 3: was in public was the fact that he wrote a 348 00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:53,200 Speaker 3: memo to his sales field staff saying that the attached 349 00:19:53,280 --> 00:19:59,560 Speaker 3: journal article is not suitable for general practitioners, but maybe 350 00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:05,560 Speaker 3: of inter neurologically inclined by psychology or psychiatrists. Well, the 351 00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,160 Speaker 3: bulk of these drugs were written by GPS, so they 352 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 3: intentionally kept that from GPS. And so once you started 353 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 3: digging in, and I would, because I love traveling, and 354 00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:18,240 Speaker 3: I would go to all these conferences around the world 355 00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:22,640 Speaker 3: with my lawyers, and I would go to the one 356 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:26,720 Speaker 3: that had a huge profiund impact on me. That also 357 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:29,600 Speaker 3: was what I ended up bringing the conference here to 358 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:33,400 Speaker 3: the States. It was called Selling Sickness and it was 359 00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 3: put on by the Dutch government, attended by people from 360 00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:41,639 Speaker 3: all over the European, EU, Australia, all over. There's a 361 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 3: handful of us from the US and they were mostly 362 00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:48,800 Speaker 3: attorneys and activists and myself, and every example that they 363 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:52,040 Speaker 3: were using of selling sickness was from the US. And 364 00:20:52,119 --> 00:20:55,320 Speaker 3: I remember thinking, why isn't this conversation happening in the US. 365 00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:59,440 Speaker 3: And then I started realizing, oh, wait, our whole system 366 00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 3: is built on this. Like I call it the spider web, 367 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:05,680 Speaker 3: and I now have a spider web that I've created 368 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:09,000 Speaker 3: with the doctor and the patient in the middle. And 369 00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:14,560 Speaker 3: it's the system from like academics to how the academic institutions, 370 00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:19,000 Speaker 3: how advertising and marketing, the FDA, who are they working for? 371 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:22,760 Speaker 3: It's basically the system, and you know, the spider web, 372 00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:27,080 Speaker 3: and it really keeps people trapped. But if you don't know, 373 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:29,720 Speaker 3: you know, like spider webs, you walk right into them. 374 00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:32,920 Speaker 3: You don't know that you're even part of it. But 375 00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:36,679 Speaker 3: once you start digging in, you see the marketing. And 376 00:21:36,720 --> 00:21:39,080 Speaker 3: I always find this interesting and I always love working 377 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:41,920 Speaker 3: with attorneys, and that's probably why I have a lot 378 00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:46,920 Speaker 3: of respect for somebody like Kennedy is because he's an attorney. 379 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:49,720 Speaker 3: He's been inside these company files. He knows how they work, 380 00:21:50,119 --> 00:21:52,679 Speaker 3: he knows the game. And it's not just Big Pharma, 381 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:56,480 Speaker 3: it's Big Fluid, it's Big m it's all of the industry. 382 00:21:56,800 --> 00:22:00,560 Speaker 3: But they use the same playbook. And it's interesting because 383 00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:02,760 Speaker 3: when you work with these attorneys, you find out one 384 00:22:02,760 --> 00:22:05,679 Speaker 3: of the first places that they go looking for documents 385 00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:10,480 Speaker 3: is in the marketing department. And so my whole background, 386 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:13,359 Speaker 3: you know, like you said, I didn't choose to do 387 00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:16,480 Speaker 3: this work, and I've never This isn't how I make 388 00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:20,280 Speaker 3: my living. I make my living. I'm in advertising and marketing. 389 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:24,320 Speaker 3: I'm still in the in the profession. So when I 390 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:29,200 Speaker 3: see it and I'm like, whoa, my business what I 391 00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:33,240 Speaker 3: do every day? Marketing is a huge part of the problem. 392 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,880 Speaker 3: Even just starting out with advertising, most people don't realize 393 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:39,520 Speaker 3: that the US is one of only two countries in 394 00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:44,200 Speaker 3: the world that allow drug ads on TV. Then you're like, oh, wait, 395 00:22:44,359 --> 00:22:48,359 Speaker 3: what about all the advertising that happens to doctors and 396 00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:52,280 Speaker 3: the way that they're being sold. Then you start learning 397 00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:57,240 Speaker 3: about like, oh, marketing key opinion leaders, which is basically 398 00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:00,920 Speaker 3: paying the doctors. Again, this was another concept I learned 399 00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:04,560 Speaker 3: out of my lawsuit because Pfizer had all of the 400 00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:09,159 Speaker 3: journal publications already planned. They knew when this article was 401 00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:13,680 Speaker 3: going to run about solof being good for social anxiety disorder, 402 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:15,719 Speaker 3: and they already knew what day when it was going 403 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:19,439 Speaker 3: to run. But they but it said author TVD and 404 00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:21,720 Speaker 3: I was like, what does that mean? Well, only to 405 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,040 Speaker 3: find out that they needed to put a doctor on there. 406 00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:26,720 Speaker 3: But they already had it written and they knew when 407 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:28,600 Speaker 3: it was running, but they had to put somebody in. 408 00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:32,520 Speaker 3: Those are called key opinion leaders or even ghostwriting. So 409 00:23:32,600 --> 00:23:34,639 Speaker 3: you start seeing it and you're like, oh, this is 410 00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:40,600 Speaker 3: all marketing, and so you know once once you've seen that, 411 00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 3: then you start seeing patterns, and you know when COVID 412 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:49,000 Speaker 3: came along. I do not have children. I know there's 413 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:53,040 Speaker 3: a lot of other people that do vaccine advocacy. I've 414 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:57,479 Speaker 3: never done that. But when the whole idea of the 415 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:00,520 Speaker 3: COVID JAB came and I was like, wait, you're giving 416 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:06,000 Speaker 3: these companies like Pfizer complete legal immunity. Wait, these are 417 00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:08,600 Speaker 3: the same companies that have paid more fines and most 418 00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:11,879 Speaker 3: of the findes that have come from that they paid 419 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:17,040 Speaker 3: in big litigation was from in marketing, off label marketing 420 00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:20,520 Speaker 3: and a lot of it in marketing keeping the side 421 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:24,480 Speaker 3: effects from the public. And I was like, well, that 422 00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,399 Speaker 3: seems like a really bad idea because even if they 423 00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:30,040 Speaker 3: knew about it in the clinical trials, which by the way, 424 00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:33,360 Speaker 3: they do know about a lot of these side effects, 425 00:24:33,359 --> 00:24:36,320 Speaker 3: but it's when millions of people start taking them. And 426 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:39,320 Speaker 3: that's why when the marketing or the hope that you're selling, 427 00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:42,440 Speaker 3: the hope of this solution, that's when you start seeing 428 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,480 Speaker 3: some of these side effects emerge. And so the fact 429 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:47,480 Speaker 3: that you know, so that was like one of the 430 00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:51,760 Speaker 3: big kind of like flags for me was just the 431 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:55,200 Speaker 3: fact that you start seeing patterns and once you see 432 00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:58,200 Speaker 3: a pattern, you know you and I always say, once 433 00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:02,200 Speaker 3: you've seen, you can unsee. And so it's the perspective 434 00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:05,320 Speaker 3: that now I look at everything that I see that 435 00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:09,680 Speaker 3: comes out and especially you know, even looking at ozempic 436 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:13,520 Speaker 3: and all the marketing for weight watching, you know, the 437 00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:17,640 Speaker 3: weight and overweight and then you follow the business side 438 00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:21,760 Speaker 3: of things and what are the two uh Like JP 439 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,680 Speaker 3: Morgan just had their annual and I always tell people 440 00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:26,920 Speaker 3: go look and see what Wall Street's talking about. Go 441 00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:31,800 Speaker 3: look at these conferences. Well, JP Morgan has their big 442 00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:35,680 Speaker 3: healthcare conference every January. And what are the two big 443 00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:39,439 Speaker 3: areas that they're looking at, obesity and Alzheimer's And what 444 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 3: are we seeing all of the new drugs treatment. 445 00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:46,840 Speaker 2: That's the discussion of our next and last segment. Kim 446 00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:49,880 Speaker 2: Witsex is our guest. We'll continue our conversation with. 447 00:25:49,840 --> 00:26:05,480 Speaker 1: Her Michael Berry Change and Witsas is our guest. 448 00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:09,560 Speaker 2: She after her husband hanged himself and only thirty seven 449 00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 2: years old. He was taking Zoloft for insomnia, and she 450 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:17,080 Speaker 2: started digging in. She started talking to people, and she 451 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:22,119 Speaker 2: started finding very, very troubling things. And she did not 452 00:26:22,320 --> 00:26:28,120 Speaker 2: simply go away. She dug in, She learned, she engaged, 453 00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:32,400 Speaker 2: she read, and she has come to be an expert 454 00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:36,280 Speaker 2: on the matter. She speaks at length on. 455 00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:39,800 Speaker 1: The concept of selling sickness, and folks, I want you 456 00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:41,000 Speaker 1: to understand, if you're. 457 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:44,200 Speaker 2: A medical professional or just a person who thinks I'm 458 00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:47,359 Speaker 2: a whack job conspiracy theorist, I don't. I have a 459 00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:49,560 Speaker 2: doctor for every part of my body. I have them 460 00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 2: on speed dial. I love and adore them, I consider 461 00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:56,600 Speaker 2: them family members, I respect them, but I also disagree 462 00:26:56,640 --> 00:27:00,360 Speaker 2: with them on occasion, and I question everything I had 463 00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:01,560 Speaker 2: a doctor years ago. 464 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:03,000 Speaker 1: It's not my doctor any longer. 465 00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:08,680 Speaker 2: I asked him about I was having a little trouble sleeping, 466 00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:12,200 Speaker 2: and I said, you know, is there something you would 467 00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 2: suggest I do? 468 00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:14,280 Speaker 1: Foods I should eat? 469 00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:16,960 Speaker 2: And he wrote me a script and sent me on 470 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:20,240 Speaker 2: my way, and I went up to the front and 471 00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:22,639 Speaker 2: got it, and she said, I'll call it in for you. 472 00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:25,280 Speaker 1: And I said, well, I can't read what it is. 473 00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:31,879 Speaker 1: And it was Prozac. Is that the anxiety drug? Is 474 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:32,879 Speaker 1: it Prozac? Yeah? 475 00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:37,439 Speaker 2: And so I said, whoa, I don't feel that. I 476 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:42,199 Speaker 2: don't want to be on an anxiety drug. And you know, 477 00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:44,399 Speaker 2: I talked to him later and he said, well, I 478 00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:46,000 Speaker 2: was trying to do you a favor. Most people want 479 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:50,560 Speaker 2: a prescription because they have anxiety, and I said, I 480 00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 2: don't have anxiety per se. 481 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:54,639 Speaker 1: I'm wound tight. 482 00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:57,879 Speaker 2: I could drink less coffee, I could focus on my 483 00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:01,560 Speaker 2: career more, I could work out more. I could get 484 00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:04,480 Speaker 2: more sleep. But I do not want a pill to 485 00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:09,040 Speaker 2: solve my problem. I want and I learned breathing exercises, 486 00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:12,880 Speaker 2: turn off the phone earlier, eat earlier, exercise. 487 00:28:12,359 --> 00:28:13,480 Speaker 1: More means you sleep more. 488 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:18,560 Speaker 2: I started taking natural solutions, finding natural solutions to make 489 00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:23,480 Speaker 2: myself happier so that I'm built for longevity. That doctor 490 00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:27,360 Speaker 2: wasn't evil. He was doing what doctors have grown to do, 491 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:29,679 Speaker 2: and that is you walk in and tell them what 492 00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:33,000 Speaker 2: your problem is. They send you to a prescription to 493 00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:36,920 Speaker 2: solve it. But that often causes others and that's very disturbing. 494 00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:38,600 Speaker 1: Anyway. Kim Whitsacks is our guests. 495 00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:40,640 Speaker 2: If you'd like to learn more about her, her website 496 00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 2: is Kimwhitsas dot com, which is. 497 00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:47,479 Speaker 1: Wi cz Ak. We were talking about. 498 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:49,520 Speaker 2: You said, look at where the money's going, Look at 499 00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:54,840 Speaker 2: JP Morgan what they're looking at. Obesity and Alzheimer's. Those 500 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:57,640 Speaker 2: are the two big issues where you can make the 501 00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:01,360 Speaker 2: most money going forward. And what did you find from 502 00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 2: your studies? 503 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:06,840 Speaker 3: Oh? Well, it was fascinating because you go look at 504 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:10,160 Speaker 3: what's happening right now with ozepic, right or any of 505 00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 3: the what are some you you know, all of the 506 00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:21,240 Speaker 3: yes and so like. Now you've got businesses popping up 507 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:23,800 Speaker 3: all over. But I've heard from again going to the 508 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:27,320 Speaker 3: lawyers that they're talent. They're being told by the insurance 509 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:31,320 Speaker 3: companies to put set aside like half a billion dollars 510 00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:35,600 Speaker 3: every quarter for potential lawsuits that are going to be coming. 511 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:37,560 Speaker 3: So of course they know lawsuits are going to come, 512 00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 3: but why not make you know, it seems that the 513 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:44,040 Speaker 3: strategy is, let's make hay while the sunshines, right, But 514 00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:46,160 Speaker 3: then there will be people who will be hurt and 515 00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,360 Speaker 3: they'll come after the fact and learn like I didn't 516 00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:51,920 Speaker 3: and then they wonder why didn't I ever question or 517 00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:55,440 Speaker 3: push back? And so same with like all looking at 518 00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:58,840 Speaker 3: the alzheimer drugs that are that have come out that 519 00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:03,120 Speaker 3: have a controversy and have already been removed, like there 520 00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:05,760 Speaker 3: was one that has already been removed and they're using 521 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:09,920 Speaker 3: they're all using so looking at breakthrough, they're using fast 522 00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:13,920 Speaker 3: tracking mechanisms, which is what we saw with the COVID jabs, 523 00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:17,280 Speaker 3: right they're using and which this has been going on 524 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,040 Speaker 3: for a while, and this was some you know, this 525 00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:24,280 Speaker 3: was back during like twenty first century Cures Act, which 526 00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:27,080 Speaker 3: is like during Obama days. So it's like going back 527 00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:29,280 Speaker 3: and really kind of paying attention to what's happening in 528 00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:34,240 Speaker 3: Congress because it's all kind of flowing through this entire system. 529 00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:38,280 Speaker 3: But you start looking and that allowed because you know, like, oh, 530 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:40,960 Speaker 3: there's so much pressure we need, we need better drugs 531 00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:45,080 Speaker 3: for people, faster innovation, like using all those words that 532 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:50,840 Speaker 3: are buzzwords, right, and they're motivators to like fast track. 533 00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:54,120 Speaker 3: And so you're getting a lot of these alzheimer drugs. Well, 534 00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:56,560 Speaker 3: then I still say we got to take a step 535 00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:58,840 Speaker 3: back or I always go you know, like you know 536 00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,160 Speaker 3: that whole thing with like who's throwing the baby and 537 00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:03,200 Speaker 3: the you know, we're pulling babies out of the river 538 00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:05,600 Speaker 3: down and we're like, wait, we got to go upstream. 539 00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:08,360 Speaker 3: Who's throwing the babies in the river? Right? So I 540 00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:10,840 Speaker 3: want to say we got to go upstream and wonder 541 00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:14,080 Speaker 3: even why we're even in this place where now we 542 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:20,120 Speaker 3: have downstream problems Alzheimer's and obesity. You know where's that 543 00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:23,600 Speaker 3: coming from? We need to go upstream and start looking 544 00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:27,360 Speaker 3: at what is causing it. But again I come back 545 00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:32,280 Speaker 3: to you know, this concept of healthcare is big business 546 00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:36,520 Speaker 3: and we are customers. There's a cradle to grave strategy 547 00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:42,200 Speaker 3: that keeps us constantly meeting medications. And so this is 548 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:46,000 Speaker 3: where I challenge people like, you know, people do whatever 549 00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:49,840 Speaker 3: they want, but you know, giving your powerway to a doctor, 550 00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:52,440 Speaker 3: to a to a pen, to a quick fit, you know, 551 00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:54,520 Speaker 3: like the pen and paper that'll give you your script 552 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,240 Speaker 3: to the quick fixed pill. You know, we need to actually, 553 00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:02,800 Speaker 3: you know, we have to take our sovereignty back, and 554 00:32:02,840 --> 00:32:05,120 Speaker 3: not because I think there are a lot of amazing 555 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 3: doctors out there that you know, are just doing you know, 556 00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:10,880 Speaker 3: thinking they're doing their job because people want, you know, help. 557 00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:14,239 Speaker 3: But you know, I think it's okay to challenge, and 558 00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 3: I tell people all the time to challenge and just 559 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:20,480 Speaker 3: because they have an MV behind their name that we 560 00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:23,760 Speaker 3: there's no one who will care more about our health 561 00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:28,200 Speaker 3: and our loved one's health, then we will care. And 562 00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:30,440 Speaker 3: you know you were telling that story about how you 563 00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:32,760 Speaker 3: got a quick script. And I remember after wood he died, 564 00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:35,640 Speaker 3: I went to my doctor and she said do you 565 00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:38,240 Speaker 3: think you do you think you need anything? And I 566 00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:39,640 Speaker 3: looked at her, I go, well, I think this is 567 00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:42,320 Speaker 3: what killed my husband. And then I go, but more importantly, 568 00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 3: shouldn't I hurt like my husband died? And she looked 569 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:47,800 Speaker 3: at me and she said, yes, but you don't need 570 00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:50,720 Speaker 3: to and I was like, yeah, I do need to. 571 00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:53,520 Speaker 3: This is how you heal, you have to go through. 572 00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:57,000 Speaker 3: But she was going to quickly give me an antidepressant 573 00:32:57,280 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 3: to help me, like numb and sure there are times 574 00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:04,240 Speaker 3: and places for meds. And I'm not anti med, I'm 575 00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:09,120 Speaker 3: just pro information, pro transparency. Give us the truth, like, 576 00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:12,440 Speaker 3: tell us the truth like we are not we can handle. 577 00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:15,560 Speaker 3: We can handle like if there's a potential for warning, 578 00:33:16,600 --> 00:33:19,560 Speaker 3: we can We can handle the truth, But we can't 579 00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:24,440 Speaker 3: handle if we don't know what is potentially an issue. Right, 580 00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:29,960 Speaker 3: So again I go back to its big business, and 581 00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:33,360 Speaker 3: there will be no one that will care more about 582 00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:35,760 Speaker 3: our health than you and I ourselves. 583 00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:42,040 Speaker 2: I think that's a perfect way to conclude a very 584 00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:48,720 Speaker 2: wonderful hour long discussion about issues. And folks, KIM can't 585 00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:50,720 Speaker 2: solve your problems, and I can't solve your problems, and 586 00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:53,640 Speaker 2: doctors can't solve your problems, and pharmaceutical companies can't solve 587 00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,840 Speaker 2: your problems. These are things you have to invest time 588 00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:59,600 Speaker 2: in to learn, to read, to make the best judgments 589 00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:02,960 Speaker 2: for you, because there is no one size fits off. 590 00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:04,880 Speaker 1: I respect your advocacy. 591 00:34:06,120 --> 00:34:10,440 Speaker 2: You took an unfortunate circumstance of lemons and made lemonade 592 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,719 Speaker 2: out of it, and I think you're genuinely focused on 593 00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:17,480 Speaker 2: trying to help other people through your work, and I 594 00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:18,320 Speaker 2: admire you for that. 595 00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:20,520 Speaker 1: Kimwitsas dot com. 596 00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,640 Speaker 2: Thanks for being our guest and thanks for what you've done. 597 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:25,399 Speaker 3: Oh, thank you so much.