1
00:00:01,920 --> 00:00:05,359
Speaker 1: Wind Down with Janet Kramer and I'm Heeart Radio podcast.

2
00:00:06,519 --> 00:00:10,480
Speaker 2: We got a special guest on this week's Adult Education.

3
00:00:10,560 --> 00:00:12,280
Speaker 3: Her name is doctor Vivianna Coles.

4
00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:15,600
Speaker 2: She is a licensed marriage and family therapist and certified

5
00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:20,279
Speaker 2: sex therapists with over twenty years of experience. We've got

6
00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:23,720
Speaker 2: some juicy questions We're going to ask her and get

7
00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:27,920
Speaker 2: her hot hot takes on all of it her very

8
00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:32,000
Speaker 2: how should we say, knowledgeable and professional take.

9
00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:33,199
Speaker 3: Let's get her on.

10
00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:34,280
Speaker 4: Hello.

11
00:00:34,760 --> 00:00:35,319
Speaker 3: How are you.

12
00:00:35,479 --> 00:00:37,600
Speaker 4: Hello, Jenna?

13
00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:39,680
Speaker 3: How are you good? To see you good?

14
00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:40,760
Speaker 4: Thank you?

15
00:00:41,440 --> 00:00:41,919
Speaker 3: Have you been?

16
00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:48,080
Speaker 1: There's been a lot of fun stuff going on. But

17
00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:48,760
Speaker 1: life is full.

18
00:00:48,920 --> 00:00:49,440
Speaker 4: How about y'all?

19
00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:50,040
Speaker 3: Oh good?

20
00:00:50,159 --> 00:00:53,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, summer kids, the whole thing. So it's

21
00:00:54,200 --> 00:00:57,120
Speaker 2: it's interesting because finding time for sex is a little

22
00:00:57,160 --> 00:00:59,320
Speaker 2: bit harder when there's.

23
00:00:59,200 --> 00:01:02,040
Speaker 3: A lot of you know, when you are all out

24
00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:02,600
Speaker 3: of your.

25
00:01:02,560 --> 00:01:05,280
Speaker 2: Team, you know, because I feel like when it's I

26
00:01:05,319 --> 00:01:06,720
Speaker 2: was just talking to a girlfriend, it's like when it's

27
00:01:06,760 --> 00:01:09,480
Speaker 2: back to school, it's like, okay, I know, then buses

28
00:01:09,520 --> 00:01:11,480
Speaker 2: at this time, and then I can do workout at

29
00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:14,320
Speaker 2: this time. It's always a kind of a very scheduled

30
00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:18,080
Speaker 2: then thing, which you know, brings me to the topic

31
00:01:18,120 --> 00:01:22,039
Speaker 2: of then sex, because I'm curious for you and through

32
00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:24,360
Speaker 2: all your work, Like, I'm sure you've been asked this

33
00:01:24,440 --> 00:01:28,600
Speaker 2: a million times, but what I'm also sure it's different

34
00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:31,119
Speaker 2: for different couples. But what do you see as like, Okay,

35
00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:33,560
Speaker 2: this is the magic number that couples should be having

36
00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:37,679
Speaker 2: this amount of sex this time, like this many times

37
00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:38,039
Speaker 2: a week.

38
00:01:39,120 --> 00:01:43,560
Speaker 1: So you'd be surprised at how many people don't know

39
00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:46,640
Speaker 1: what works for them as a couple. They just kind

40
00:01:46,640 --> 00:01:50,720
Speaker 1: of do whatever or don't do whatever. So I think

41
00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:53,000
Speaker 1: a lot of couples need to be asking each other

42
00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:57,280
Speaker 1: this as partners. My recommendation, as an expert in this

43
00:01:57,360 --> 00:01:59,560
Speaker 1: field and having worked with at this point thousands of

44
00:01:59,560 --> 00:02:06,600
Speaker 1: couples is do something sensual or sexual or both at

45
00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:10,880
Speaker 1: least twice a week. And that does not have to

46
00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:15,160
Speaker 1: include intercourse each time, but you do want to be aiming,

47
00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:17,680
Speaker 1: of course, if you're capable in that way, if you

48
00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:22,240
Speaker 1: have that ability to have intercourse at least once a

49
00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:26,240
Speaker 1: week and then do something sensual for that other time. Hey,

50
00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:29,200
Speaker 1: if three or four times a week or daily works

51
00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:31,040
Speaker 1: for you, I am not going to tell you don't

52
00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:33,720
Speaker 1: do that, but if it works for you, I mean

53
00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:36,720
Speaker 1: as a couple, and that's not often the case some people.

54
00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:40,040
Speaker 1: You know, most people have different desire levels and want

55
00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:44,040
Speaker 1: to be able to connect with their partner whenever they're

56
00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:46,240
Speaker 1: not doing anything else.

57
00:02:46,280 --> 00:02:47,640
Speaker 4: It's like, okay, that's the go too.

58
00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:50,720
Speaker 1: But for most people, doing something twice a week can

59
00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:51,799
Speaker 1: be doable, even with.

60
00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:53,920
Speaker 3: Kids, right, Yeah, for sure.

61
00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:55,560
Speaker 2: It's almost like I always tell him, I like, you

62
00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:58,000
Speaker 2: got to get me though, like you can't if it's

63
00:02:58,040 --> 00:02:59,359
Speaker 2: too late, like I'm too tired.

64
00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:03,600
Speaker 4: You know, everybody is thinking ten o'clock, ten thirty.

65
00:03:03,639 --> 00:03:06,079
Speaker 1: They're like, Okay, that's when we're winding down from the day,

66
00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:08,399
Speaker 1: and that's when most people.

67
00:03:08,080 --> 00:03:09,840
Speaker 4: Are like, I don't want to be touched.

68
00:03:09,840 --> 00:03:10,400
Speaker 3: I'm tired.

69
00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:13,520
Speaker 2: I've been like asking questions all throughout the day, like

70
00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:15,640
Speaker 2: I'm like I'm done, Like I want to just.

71
00:03:15,919 --> 00:03:17,920
Speaker 4: Be done exactly.

72
00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:20,280
Speaker 1: And so the other thing is that most of our

73
00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:23,800
Speaker 1: testosterone levels are highest during those.

74
00:03:23,919 --> 00:03:26,919
Speaker 4: Morning early early mornings, so two to six am.

75
00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:30,639
Speaker 1: So a lot of people will say I usually feel

76
00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:34,399
Speaker 1: especially men especially, they will feel like having sex first

77
00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:37,400
Speaker 1: thing in the morning, but that's when their female partners

78
00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:40,840
Speaker 1: are usually like, Okay, I have this long list of

79
00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:43,320
Speaker 1: things to do before seven am, and sex is not

80
00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:43,800
Speaker 1: going to be.

81
00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:44,280
Speaker 4: One of them.

82
00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:46,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's yes. Yes.

83
00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:49,240
Speaker 2: The only time that sex is ever on the cards

84
00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:51,080
Speaker 2: for me in the morning is if we're on vacation

85
00:03:51,440 --> 00:03:53,680
Speaker 2: and he's like, oh, I don't like morning usually, and

86
00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:56,680
Speaker 2: I was like, because there's a laundry list literally of

87
00:03:56,760 --> 00:03:58,680
Speaker 2: things to do. So I'm like, but when we're at

88
00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:00,360
Speaker 2: this beautiful there's nothing to do.

89
00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:04,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so who cares if relate to the buffet,

90
00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:06,520
Speaker 1: I don't care exactly.

91
00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:07,720
Speaker 4: No.

92
00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:11,760
Speaker 5: Is that a thing where it's men who are predominantly

93
00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:16,520
Speaker 5: driving more for sex and the more than women. Is

94
00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:17,680
Speaker 5: that an actual yeah?

95
00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:19,839
Speaker 4: And it's going to put it out there.

96
00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:23,400
Speaker 1: A lot of men experience who are are feeling healthy

97
00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:26,120
Speaker 1: and still vigorous will have morning wood and they want

98
00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:26,880
Speaker 1: to do something with.

99
00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:38,279
Speaker 2: It makes sense. It's very cave manlike, you know you well,

100
00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:39,719
Speaker 2: you're here, you're.

101
00:04:39,640 --> 00:04:40,800
Speaker 4: High, I mean.

102
00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:45,200
Speaker 1: And unfortunately for most men who are struggling with their

103
00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:48,760
Speaker 1: partners with discrepancy or just timing or not being on

104
00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,840
Speaker 1: the same page about scheduling, or spontaneous desire all of that,

105
00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:55,160
Speaker 1: they will then be like, Okay, well I'm going to

106
00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:59,159
Speaker 1: go masturbate, which is fine. But they feel like it's

107
00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:01,800
Speaker 1: something that they're having to do, not something that they're

108
00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:04,599
Speaker 1: looking forward to. With self care, it's almost like a oh, well,

109
00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:08,440
Speaker 1: this is not a great option, but it's the only

110
00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:11,040
Speaker 1: option for a lot of men to feel like they

111
00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:13,839
Speaker 1: can release that tension first thing in the morning and

112
00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:14,800
Speaker 1: they can get their day going.

113
00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:18,520
Speaker 2: I'm curious, as you know, as a therapist in your field,

114
00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:23,080
Speaker 2: what percentage of women don't mind the other person masturbating

115
00:05:23,240 --> 00:05:29,760
Speaker 2: versus like like one that cares versus one that's like, oh,

116
00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:32,400
Speaker 2: I don't care at all. Like I'm just I'm curious,

117
00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:37,000
Speaker 2: like where women are? Good question, where women fall on

118
00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:37,520
Speaker 2: that line?

119
00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:41,839
Speaker 4: Great question? And I actually I can't give you a

120
00:05:41,880 --> 00:05:42,400
Speaker 4: good answer.

121
00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:44,559
Speaker 1: I can tell you what I know of just based

122
00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:47,560
Speaker 1: off of my experience talking to couples very openly about this.

123
00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:52,120
Speaker 4: Most women have issue with it. Yeah, they take issue with.

124
00:05:53,160 --> 00:05:57,560
Speaker 1: And they feel possibly threatened or like their partner is substituting,

125
00:05:58,200 --> 00:06:01,479
Speaker 1: or more often than not, it's because it has become

126
00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:05,440
Speaker 1: something where then their partner feels like, well, I can't

127
00:06:05,440 --> 00:06:09,200
Speaker 1: be with you because I just masturbated this morning or

128
00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:12,839
Speaker 1: this afternoon, or and then it's like oh great, you

129
00:06:12,839 --> 00:06:15,400
Speaker 1: know I don't want too often, but we get this opportunity,

130
00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:18,360
Speaker 1: and now you can't There's so much more to it, right,

131
00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:20,679
Speaker 1: You can't just say it's a post to be equal

132
00:06:20,760 --> 00:06:25,400
Speaker 1: c But it can become problematic when that is the

133
00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:27,599
Speaker 1: reason that they're not able to perform with their partner,

134
00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:31,520
Speaker 1: even if, like their partner only asked once that week,

135
00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:35,640
Speaker 1: and it just so happens coincide all of a sudden, Oh, well,

136
00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:37,880
Speaker 1: you know, you masturbate too much, and there are men

137
00:06:37,920 --> 00:06:40,960
Speaker 1: who do, and the men I haven't heard as much.

138
00:06:41,040 --> 00:06:43,039
Speaker 1: That doesn't mean that's not the case, but I know

139
00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:44,880
Speaker 1: that there are a lot of men who will start

140
00:06:44,920 --> 00:06:49,800
Speaker 1: to over time, just masturbate anytime that they're bored down time,

141
00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:51,200
Speaker 1: if they're at work.

142
00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:52,760
Speaker 4: Lunch hour.

143
00:06:53,279 --> 00:06:56,640
Speaker 1: It's kind of It can become habit. It can become

144
00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:58,680
Speaker 1: the go to, like, well, I have nothing else to do,

145
00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:03,200
Speaker 1: why not? It feels good, It's an escape. I'm so stressed.

146
00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:04,440
Speaker 1: This is a great stress reliever.

147
00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:08,039
Speaker 4: Sometimes that can cause problems for partners. Sometimes it's like,

148
00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:08,880
Speaker 4: go for it.

149
00:07:08,760 --> 00:07:11,640
Speaker 2: But in your office you see it more of a

150
00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:12,400
Speaker 2: problem than not.

151
00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:16,080
Speaker 1: It seems to come up as more of a problem.

152
00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:18,720
Speaker 1: A lot of couples what i'll tell you is they

153
00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:20,920
Speaker 1: just don't ever ask. It's like, don't ask, don't tell.

154
00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:23,320
Speaker 1: They just don't talk about it. They don't want to know.

155
00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:27,120
Speaker 1: They may not know how they feel about it or

156
00:07:27,760 --> 00:07:30,680
Speaker 1: would think like or they're just too embarrassed to share

157
00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,040
Speaker 1: about it. There's still a lot of shame surround being

158
00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:37,560
Speaker 1: masturbation and even mutual masturbation. A lot of people don't

159
00:07:37,600 --> 00:07:40,560
Speaker 1: talk about it, but they will do it, they just

160
00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:43,880
Speaker 1: don't want to like. I think there's also just the

161
00:07:43,920 --> 00:07:47,400
Speaker 1: connotation with the word masturbation as being something that is

162
00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:52,680
Speaker 1: a very, very base sort of experience. It's not something

163
00:07:52,720 --> 00:07:55,040
Speaker 1: that you know, people who are in charge of their

164
00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:57,080
Speaker 1: sexuality do very often when.

165
00:07:57,560 --> 00:07:59,119
Speaker 4: Self pleasure, self touch.

166
00:07:59,240 --> 00:08:01,480
Speaker 1: All of that is like, it's so good for you,

167
00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:04,440
Speaker 1: there's so many physiological and psychological benefits.

168
00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:07,440
Speaker 5: I think that. So if you flip that situation, and

169
00:08:07,880 --> 00:08:12,760
Speaker 5: I understand why a woman would not want her husband, boyfriend,

170
00:08:12,880 --> 00:08:16,240
Speaker 5: partner to masturbate, the same for guys as well. I

171
00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:18,320
Speaker 5: wouldn't want I wouldn't like it if I knew you

172
00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:25,440
Speaker 5: were masturbating. Really no, I mean not not. I don't

173
00:08:25,440 --> 00:08:27,480
Speaker 5: really ask, but there is a question.

174
00:08:27,480 --> 00:08:28,320
Speaker 3: I like that I don't.

175
00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:31,960
Speaker 5: No, not not ever. But if if I knew that

176
00:08:32,000 --> 00:08:34,400
Speaker 5: it was it was effecting as I knew that you

177
00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:36,880
Speaker 5: were wanting to do that more than you were wanting

178
00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:40,079
Speaker 5: to or I was to have sex, and would it

179
00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:40,960
Speaker 5: would be an issue.

180
00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:41,880
Speaker 3: Yeah.

181
00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:44,360
Speaker 1: Well, And that's the point Alan is like, if you

182
00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:48,520
Speaker 1: feel like it is becoming something that is coming between y'all,

183
00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:52,240
Speaker 1: then But that's kind of the case for anything. It

184
00:08:52,280 --> 00:08:54,520
Speaker 1: could be work, it could be the someone, it could

185
00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:58,360
Speaker 1: be you know, dependents or friends who are going through issues.

186
00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:01,480
Speaker 1: There's so many things that can between a couple. But

187
00:09:01,920 --> 00:09:08,760
Speaker 1: healthy sex, healthy sexuality, healthy you know, becoming physically healthy

188
00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:12,079
Speaker 1: mentally healthy does include our sexuality. So we don't want

189
00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:13,880
Speaker 1: to take it off of the table. I think a

190
00:09:13,920 --> 00:09:16,760
Speaker 1: lot of people will think, well, I don't want you

191
00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:17,840
Speaker 1: to ever masturbate.

192
00:09:18,160 --> 00:09:21,040
Speaker 4: You have me for that. Don't I hear that a lot.

193
00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:22,360
Speaker 4: I'm down here in Houston.

194
00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:24,520
Speaker 1: I don't hear it as much in LA or New York,

195
00:09:24,559 --> 00:09:27,160
Speaker 1: but I'm when I'm seeing my clients from here in Houston,

196
00:09:27,480 --> 00:09:30,320
Speaker 1: that comes up a lot, almost like a no, no, no,

197
00:09:30,400 --> 00:09:33,160
Speaker 1: like come to me first. And I think a lot

198
00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:35,800
Speaker 1: of men would say that that's how they feel it's like, look,

199
00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:39,600
Speaker 1: if you ever want to get off, come to me first,

200
00:09:39,640 --> 00:09:41,240
Speaker 1: Please give me first option.

201
00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:44,040
Speaker 4: And I get it.

202
00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:47,840
Speaker 1: But sometimes it's just easier to relax and to be

203
00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:50,199
Speaker 1: on your own. Typically a lot of women will have

204
00:09:50,679 --> 00:09:54,840
Speaker 1: responsive desire that includes relaxing at home and it's quiet

205
00:09:54,920 --> 00:09:56,920
Speaker 1: and nobody's here, and now I get to take a

206
00:09:56,960 --> 00:09:58,959
Speaker 1: shower and do my grooming and I can light a

207
00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:02,280
Speaker 1: cannel and listen to that audio erotica, you know, and

208
00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:04,160
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, it's like, oh, this is a

209
00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:07,240
Speaker 1: nice little self care moment, and I wouldn't want you

210
00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:08,800
Speaker 1: to begrudge anyone that.

211
00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:24,680
Speaker 5: Okay, So I I have a question, right, So since

212
00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:28,320
Speaker 5: I've met since I met Jana and we've subsequently get

213
00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:31,760
Speaker 5: married and had a baby and stuff, there's no point

214
00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:34,320
Speaker 5: and I can be really honest in this, right, there's

215
00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:37,840
Speaker 5: no point where I actually feel like master way, Oh,

216
00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:40,520
Speaker 5: we have a what I think is a healthy sex life,

217
00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:45,040
Speaker 5: so I would never like and I love being close

218
00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:48,200
Speaker 5: to and making love to her and having an essential

219
00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:51,200
Speaker 5: and physical moments. So there's a there's a part of

220
00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:54,080
Speaker 5: me is like, I'm not gonna I know it's going

221
00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:56,720
Speaker 5: to come, so I'm not going to ruin it by

222
00:10:56,960 --> 00:10:59,640
Speaker 5: doing what I need to do selfishly for myself to

223
00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:02,200
Speaker 5: then and the many shall ruin the time that we

224
00:11:02,280 --> 00:11:04,880
Speaker 5: have together. So I just therefore I just don't feel

225
00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:08,680
Speaker 5: like doing it because I would rather have hot and

226
00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:11,880
Speaker 5: then go into the bathroom or whatever it is.

227
00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:15,680
Speaker 3: And just I don't hate that answer.

228
00:11:16,080 --> 00:11:19,840
Speaker 5: Whether it's unless I would when I when I was single,

229
00:11:19,880 --> 00:11:25,520
Speaker 5: I would muster be a lot. Okay, Well I don't, Okay,

230
00:11:25,520 --> 00:11:26,800
Speaker 5: I don't feel like it.

231
00:11:26,800 --> 00:11:31,120
Speaker 1: It's very important, especially for men, because you know, the

232
00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:36,360
Speaker 1: AMA wants us to promote healthy prostate and public floor

233
00:11:36,400 --> 00:11:40,040
Speaker 1: functioning for everyone, but especially prostate obviously for men. And

234
00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:42,920
Speaker 1: so three to four times a week of having ejaculation

235
00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:46,800
Speaker 1: experiences can be really good for you. And some people

236
00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:48,800
Speaker 1: that's just not going to happen with a partner. Maybe

237
00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:51,880
Speaker 1: they don't live together, maybe they live and they're traveling

238
00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:54,760
Speaker 1: a lot for work, maybe they have health issues, whatever

239
00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:56,640
Speaker 1: it is, maybe they're going through a rough patch in

240
00:11:56,679 --> 00:12:00,840
Speaker 1: their relationship. So we always want to encourage that's sort

241
00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:03,640
Speaker 1: of bonding with yourself. I you know, you said the

242
00:12:03,679 --> 00:12:06,800
Speaker 1: word selfish. I guess it could be selfish if you

243
00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:09,600
Speaker 1: feel like you're intentionally doing it. As a way to

244
00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:12,559
Speaker 1: avoid time with Dana. I don't get the sense that

245
00:12:12,559 --> 00:12:14,040
Speaker 1: that would be the case, So I don't see it

246
00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:15,560
Speaker 1: as selfish.

247
00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:18,760
Speaker 4: Can you tell me? Have you like do y'all just

248
00:12:19,640 --> 00:12:20,480
Speaker 4: you're with each.

249
00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:23,559
Speaker 1: Other every day weeks on end, like there are no

250
00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:24,840
Speaker 1: times apart.

251
00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:28,480
Speaker 5: No, we don't really have really, No, they'll bepds, will

252
00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:31,959
Speaker 5: will travel a lot, but typically it's like.

253
00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:32,960
Speaker 3: It's a week.

254
00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:38,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I'm glad that's founds like just a flow

255
00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:41,360
Speaker 1: that works for y'all. For a lot of people that's

256
00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:44,160
Speaker 1: not the case. Or maybe maybe some men will say,

257
00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:46,280
Speaker 1: you know, I only really ever feel like masturbating three

258
00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:49,320
Speaker 1: or four times a month, and that's fine too. There's

259
00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:52,719
Speaker 1: no like magic number. I just wouldn't want anyone to

260
00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:56,120
Speaker 1: feel like they're doing something wrong or shaming them if

261
00:12:56,160 --> 00:13:01,000
Speaker 1: they do really enjoy having that pleasure and having that release,

262
00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:03,920
Speaker 1: because there is there is the physiological side of it

263
00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:08,240
Speaker 1: that our bodies may not ever get. Some people don't experience,

264
00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:12,480
Speaker 1: especially women have trouble experiencing orgasms, so they don't necessarily

265
00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:18,440
Speaker 1: get that full release without platorial stimulation, without possibly a vibrator,

266
00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:21,800
Speaker 1: and so if they're not able to masturbate they may

267
00:13:21,840 --> 00:13:23,680
Speaker 1: not ever have a partnered orgasm.

268
00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:25,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, is it true to say?

269
00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:28,440
Speaker 2: I mean a girlfriend had told me this that, like

270
00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:32,120
Speaker 2: she has to have a vibrator because she's actually law.

271
00:13:32,360 --> 00:13:34,679
Speaker 2: She just can't have sex with their husband now because

272
00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:38,839
Speaker 2: it's like the got used to the like vibration of

273
00:13:38,880 --> 00:13:39,520
Speaker 2: a vibrator.

274
00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:42,280
Speaker 4: Yeah, so that can happen.

275
00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:45,120
Speaker 1: I don't want anybody to be like, you know, ban

276
00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:48,360
Speaker 1: vibrators don't do that, but that can happen. So I

277
00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:52,960
Speaker 1: am constantly encouraging anyone who does use vibrators, men, women, whoever,

278
00:13:53,960 --> 00:13:57,599
Speaker 1: to make sure that they are also able to experience

279
00:13:58,280 --> 00:14:01,920
Speaker 1: their own you know, masturbatory sperience is without anything that

280
00:14:02,559 --> 00:14:09,280
Speaker 1: could not be replicated by a partner. Nobody's hands, fingers, tongues,

281
00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:13,000
Speaker 1: penises are ever going to be able to replicate that vibration.

282
00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:16,440
Speaker 1: So I would say at least one out of every

283
00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:19,880
Speaker 1: four masturbation experiences to not use a vibrator, just so

284
00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:22,920
Speaker 1: that you don't get desensitized to just using your fingers

285
00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:25,240
Speaker 1: or using your partner's hand or whatever.

286
00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:29,240
Speaker 2: What do you see as the biggest issue in a

287
00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:34,880
Speaker 2: relationship when couples aren't having sex orse you know, touch.

288
00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:42,200
Speaker 1: If it's not caused by relationship issues, which often it is,

289
00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:46,880
Speaker 1: and that's the majority of what I see. If it's

290
00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:50,120
Speaker 1: not that, then it's usually high levels of stress that

291
00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:56,320
Speaker 1: are killing desire. And most people are struggling with stress

292
00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:58,400
Speaker 1: at any given moment and they don't really know how

293
00:14:58,400 --> 00:14:58,840
Speaker 1: to get.

294
00:14:58,720 --> 00:14:59,120
Speaker 4: Out of it.

295
00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:01,240
Speaker 1: So for a all of you who want to avoid

296
00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:04,840
Speaker 1: having long term sexual issues with your partner, make sure

297
00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:06,400
Speaker 1: you're dealing with your stress levels.

298
00:15:06,680 --> 00:15:08,640
Speaker 4: Keep those as low as possible.

299
00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:12,760
Speaker 1: Non existent are the days where stress is just out

300
00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:14,840
Speaker 1: that you know, not even a possibility you're going to

301
00:15:14,880 --> 00:15:17,280
Speaker 1: be stressed. But how you deal with it is an

302
00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:20,400
Speaker 1: investment in your relationship and in your sexual life with

303
00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:23,560
Speaker 1: your partner. So I would just say work on your stress.

304
00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:26,360
Speaker 1: Anything that you can do to adminis stress and to

305
00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:29,280
Speaker 1: increase that like feeling of ease is really good for

306
00:15:29,320 --> 00:15:30,000
Speaker 1: your sex side.

307
00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:31,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you.

308
00:15:31,480 --> 00:15:33,120
Speaker 5: Talk to us about stealth seduction.

309
00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:35,840
Speaker 4: What is that stealth seduction?

310
00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:36,560
Speaker 3: Yeah?

311
00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:42,840
Speaker 1: Okay, so that it sounds like it's familiar, because I

312
00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:46,040
Speaker 1: tend to call that pillow talk. It's the instances in

313
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:50,200
Speaker 1: between sexual experiences where you feel like it's a look,

314
00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:54,120
Speaker 1: it's a touch, it's a joke, it's a this feeling

315
00:15:54,160 --> 00:15:57,520
Speaker 1: of like, you know, I want you, you know that

316
00:15:57,560 --> 00:16:01,120
Speaker 1: I could, I would if I could, and that you

317
00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:03,400
Speaker 1: feel the same way back. And I feel like it's

318
00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:05,720
Speaker 1: possible that the two of you have a lot of

319
00:16:05,760 --> 00:16:09,600
Speaker 1: that that feeling of like I'm going to wear this

320
00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:13,360
Speaker 1: color that I know he loves, or I'm going to

321
00:16:13,400 --> 00:16:15,600
Speaker 1: make sure that I've wiped.

322
00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:19,440
Speaker 4: Down the island and Albert to sea. I'm trying like

323
00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:21,600
Speaker 4: she likes. So you know, it's a little bit like

324
00:16:21,720 --> 00:16:23,960
Speaker 4: choor play. I would imagine it's also.

325
00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:28,160
Speaker 2: Like play sounds hot, that's like the hottest thing you've

326
00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:29,080
Speaker 2: said the entire time.

327
00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:33,360
Speaker 3: Chore play that gets you, that gets me, It.

328
00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:35,360
Speaker 5: Wouldn't it wouldn't be too play. If you've seen how

329
00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:38,960
Speaker 5: I load the dushwasher, you got to work on that one.

330
00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:44,560
Speaker 1: I loveashure because my way works, so when my husband

331
00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:45,000
Speaker 1: doesn't do it.

332
00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:46,160
Speaker 4: That is not seductive.

333
00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:52,840
Speaker 1: The idea that you are constantly seeking ways to attract

334
00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:56,280
Speaker 1: your partner, not in like a really pressure filled way.

335
00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:59,240
Speaker 1: That stealth seduction part of it is like just making

336
00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,280
Speaker 1: sure that you are respectful in your tone, that you're

337
00:17:02,360 --> 00:17:07,320
Speaker 1: avoiding scoffing or rolling your eyes, or that you're being

338
00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:11,000
Speaker 1: mindful of their mood and maybe do you need a hug.

339
00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:12,960
Speaker 4: All of that can be very attractive.

340
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:17,399
Speaker 2: You also work with people on a fair recovery, and

341
00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:19,840
Speaker 2: obviously a lot of people that have followed my journey

342
00:17:19,960 --> 00:17:23,280
Speaker 2: know what you know I went through, And so many

343
00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:25,800
Speaker 2: people still ask me, like, you know, do you think

344
00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:28,280
Speaker 2: it can work? And you know, I have my own

345
00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:31,320
Speaker 2: personal beliefs on it, and I do believe that it

346
00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:34,040
Speaker 2: can if it's a one time thing and the repeated

347
00:17:34,320 --> 00:17:38,719
Speaker 2: the repetitiveness of it, or like the act continuing over

348
00:17:38,760 --> 00:17:41,280
Speaker 2: and over is what I think kills it. But for you,

349
00:17:41,520 --> 00:17:44,639
Speaker 2: what is your biggest tip with a fair recovery for

350
00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:47,119
Speaker 2: people that are wanting to seek help or wanting to

351
00:17:47,240 --> 00:17:48,960
Speaker 2: know can it work?

352
00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:52,479
Speaker 4: Yeah? I think we first connected back in twenty twenty one.

353
00:17:52,640 --> 00:17:55,359
Speaker 1: It was a really tough time and I remember you

354
00:17:56,480 --> 00:18:02,120
Speaker 1: sharing so many helpful tips and ideas and just being

355
00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:04,119
Speaker 1: so vulnerable and the way that you shared about that.

356
00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:05,880
Speaker 1: And I think for a lot of people they don't

357
00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:10,920
Speaker 1: realize how it feels to be in a relationship where

358
00:18:11,080 --> 00:18:16,679
Speaker 1: trust is not just low but gone, but being tied

359
00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:21,080
Speaker 1: to that person, being either trauma bonded or love bonded

360
00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:24,480
Speaker 1: with somebody that you just don't trust. It's a really

361
00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:27,240
Speaker 1: weird foreign space and most people don't know how to

362
00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:28,880
Speaker 1: navigate it without professional help.

363
00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:32,040
Speaker 4: So top tip would be to reach out for help.

364
00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:33,440
Speaker 4: This is what I do.

365
00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:37,720
Speaker 1: Unfortunately, it's a part of my practice daily working with

366
00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:40,679
Speaker 1: people because there is no one way. You're not going

367
00:18:40,760 --> 00:18:43,040
Speaker 1: to read a book and know exactly how to work

368
00:18:43,080 --> 00:18:45,840
Speaker 1: through an affair. You're not going to speak to a

369
00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:49,000
Speaker 1: friend who's been through it and be able to work

370
00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:51,680
Speaker 1: through it. It's something that you're both going to have

371
00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:55,160
Speaker 1: to give a lot of yourselves, a lot of energy.

372
00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:57,920
Speaker 1: And look, it's okay if you don't want to. Some

373
00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:02,160
Speaker 1: people don't want to spend the next three months, three years,

374
00:19:02,280 --> 00:19:06,159
Speaker 1: thirty years working through the aftermath of an affair, and

375
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:09,040
Speaker 1: that's okay too. I know that it can be very

376
00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:11,680
Speaker 1: difficult to do that, and for both parties, not just

377
00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:13,560
Speaker 1: the betrayer but the betrayed partner.

378
00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:16,360
Speaker 4: And it's not a straight road.

379
00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:21,119
Speaker 1: Just because one party says, hey, I'm going to give

380
00:19:21,119 --> 00:19:24,960
Speaker 1: you a second chance, how that looks may not work

381
00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:29,159
Speaker 1: for the person who did the wrong, and they may

382
00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:33,080
Speaker 1: decide six months a year down the road, especially come

383
00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:36,920
Speaker 1: the anniversary time of disclosure. They may decide like, hey,

384
00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:40,000
Speaker 1: I can't live like this anymore. I've decided I don't

385
00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:42,159
Speaker 1: want to be in a relationship where trust is just

386
00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:46,960
Speaker 1: not possible, and every that's obviously everyone's right. Just because

387
00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:48,960
Speaker 1: you give somebody a second chance doesn't mean that they

388
00:19:49,080 --> 00:19:51,639
Speaker 1: want it. So checking in about that can also be

389
00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:53,600
Speaker 1: important too, just so that it doesn't feel like one

390
00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:54,760
Speaker 1: person's overfunctioning.

391
00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:58,920
Speaker 2: What is your number one kind of tip for that though,

392
00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:01,960
Speaker 2: to be going through? Is it like, what do you

393
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:04,520
Speaker 2: say that you think helps the most?

394
00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:07,760
Speaker 4: Yeah, I say this all the time.

395
00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:13,879
Speaker 1: When you've cheated on your partner, you need to imagine

396
00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:18,639
Speaker 1: that you grab them and threw them into a pile

397
00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:23,920
Speaker 1: of crap. You threw them in there and it's deep

398
00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:27,960
Speaker 1: and they're struggling to get out of it, just because

399
00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:31,040
Speaker 1: you have stopped cheating. If that's your reality, you have

400
00:20:31,119 --> 00:20:34,440
Speaker 1: stopped cheating, and you're outside of the pile of crap

401
00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:35,800
Speaker 1: and you're over here and.

402
00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:39,640
Speaker 4: You're telling them, hey, come here, get out of there.

403
00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:42,640
Speaker 4: You can breathe over here. It's so much better over here.

404
00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:45,680
Speaker 4: Just because you feel that way doesn't mean it's possible

405
00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:46,399
Speaker 4: for them to do this.

406
00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:49,920
Speaker 1: You have to get into the pile of crap, hold

407
00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:54,240
Speaker 1: their hand, lift them up, push them out, hold walk

408
00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:54,800
Speaker 1: with them.

409
00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:55,920
Speaker 4: Assuring them all the way.

410
00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:58,080
Speaker 1: And a lot of people are not up for that task,

411
00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:00,960
Speaker 1: but that's exactly what needs to happen in order to

412
00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:03,280
Speaker 1: even remotely have a chance to work through it. So

413
00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:05,639
Speaker 1: if you know yourself and you know that you're not

414
00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:09,040
Speaker 1: going to be able to hold your partner's hand through

415
00:21:10,119 --> 00:21:14,119
Speaker 1: whatever they're going to go through, then don't ask for

416
00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:14,960
Speaker 1: a second chance.

417
00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:16,200
Speaker 4: Just move on.

418
00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:18,960
Speaker 1: Let them move on, because otherwise it's going to be

419
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:20,560
Speaker 1: a world of hurt over and over again.

420
00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:21,879
Speaker 3: Amen to that.

421
00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:27,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, agreed, Agreed again. Love having you on. You are fantastic.

422
00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:30,000
Speaker 2: Where can our listeners? Do you do telehealth at all

423
00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,160
Speaker 2: or are you just based in Texas?

424
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:35,400
Speaker 4: No, Actually it's an interesting time.

425
00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:38,919
Speaker 1: I'm going to start seeing clients in New York in person,

426
00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:43,159
Speaker 1: California in person, in La So Manhattan, LA, and of

427
00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:45,920
Speaker 1: courseon here in Houston in person. I usually see couples

428
00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:47,919
Speaker 1: in person for that first session and then we move

429
00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:50,760
Speaker 1: into virtual just it's easier that way. But yes, I'm

430
00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:53,840
Speaker 1: seeing clients every day in one way, shape or form.

431
00:21:53,960 --> 00:21:55,720
Speaker 1: All they have to do is go over to doctor

432
00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:59,520
Speaker 1: Viviana dot com. You can spell out doctor or LA

433
00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:03,160
Speaker 1: Relationship Ship Therapy dot com, n YC Relationship Therapy dot

434
00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:05,320
Speaker 1: com or Houston Relationship Therapy dot com.

435
00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:07,600
Speaker 4: But yeah, you can find me. Just google me, doctor

436
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:08,960
Speaker 4: Vivian Coles and Ashawa.

437
00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,440
Speaker 3: Awesome. Thank you so much much. You appreciate you.

438
00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:16,159
Speaker 4: Guys, I appreciate you. Take care and well, thank you