1 00:00:04,200 --> 00:00:07,320 Speaker 1: To be sent to MZ, you have to commit the 2 00:00:07,320 --> 00:00:08,880 Speaker 1: worst of the worst crimes in Idaho. 3 00:00:10,160 --> 00:00:13,720 Speaker 2: He's holding on that anchor and as things got more chaotic, 4 00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:14,159 Speaker 2: what do you do? 5 00:00:14,200 --> 00:00:17,040 Speaker 3: You go back to your anchor more He does have 6 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:18,720 Speaker 3: a target on his back. One hundred percent. 7 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 4: This is the Idaho Massacre. A production of KAT Studios 8 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:39,199 Speaker 4: and iHeartRadio, Season three, Episode six, Behind Bars. I'm Courtney Armstrong, 9 00:00:39,240 --> 00:00:43,120 Speaker 4: a producer at KAT Studios, with Stephanie Leideger, Gabriel Castillo, 10 00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:48,800 Speaker 4: and Alison Bankston. On July twenty third, twenty twenty five, 11 00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 4: Brian Coberger officially became inmate number one six three two 12 00:00:53,840 --> 00:01:00,360 Speaker 4: one four at the Idaho Maximum Security Institution in Kuna, Idaho. 13 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:05,440 Speaker 4: It's a notorious facility that lands it on Security Journal 14 00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 4: America's twenty twenty four list of the worst prisons in 15 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:13,520 Speaker 4: the United States. It's built to contain the state's most 16 00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:17,920 Speaker 4: violent and unpredictable offenders. This prison has a reputation for 17 00:01:18,040 --> 00:01:27,120 Speaker 4: relentless conditions, solitary confinement, overcrowding, and frequent lockdowns inside. Inmates 18 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:32,880 Speaker 4: have few opportunities for social interaction, education, or rehabilitation. The 19 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:36,400 Speaker 4: facility has also been criticized as an environment that often 20 00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:41,080 Speaker 4: breeds severe behavioral issues for harsh treatment and lack of 21 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:45,000 Speaker 4: adequate mental health care. Reports of inmate on inmate violence 22 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:49,440 Speaker 4: are common, and allegations of excessive force by correctional officers 23 00:01:49,640 --> 00:01:54,480 Speaker 4: continue to hang over the institution's legacy. It's a place 24 00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:58,400 Speaker 4: where survival is a daily struggle. To help us understand 25 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:00,560 Speaker 4: what life behind these walls will really be like for 26 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:04,920 Speaker 4: Brian Kobecker, we turn to bail bondsman Kevin Corson, a 27 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:08,160 Speaker 4: man who knows the inner workings of this infamous facility. 28 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:12,320 Speaker 4: He's joined by a KT Studios producer, Alison Bankston. 29 00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:18,080 Speaker 5: If you can tell me about your background, what you 30 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 5: do with your bail company, how you related to the prison. 31 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:26,320 Speaker 1: I've been doing this for about ten years and I 32 00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:30,000 Speaker 1: love it. And we have a lot of people that 33 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:33,519 Speaker 1: get sent to prison. Obviously, the clients that we work 34 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,920 Speaker 1: with and we hear back from them. You know a 35 00:02:36,919 --> 00:02:39,280 Speaker 1: lot about the conditions and stuff like that that we 36 00:02:39,360 --> 00:02:42,360 Speaker 1: hear about, and you know just kind of what it's 37 00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:42,880 Speaker 1: like there. 38 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:45,919 Speaker 5: Well, can you tell me about the Idaho Maximum Security 39 00:02:45,960 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 5: Institution for someone who's never been there, can you paint 40 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:51,880 Speaker 5: kind of a very detailed picture of it, walk me 41 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 5: through it. 42 00:02:53,120 --> 00:02:57,640 Speaker 1: So it was constructed in nineteen eighty nine. It is 43 00:02:57,680 --> 00:03:03,000 Speaker 1: currently set up to house roughly five hundred and thirty prisoners. 44 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:07,040 Speaker 1: So when you pull up to the South Boise Prison 45 00:03:07,080 --> 00:03:13,360 Speaker 1: Complex where IMSI, the Maximum Security Institution is housed, it's 46 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 1: seven different buildings that you're you're kind of pulling up 47 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 1: to there, and it ranges from alternative placement to work release, 48 00:03:22,720 --> 00:03:27,239 Speaker 1: to a women's prison, to a general prison, to community 49 00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:33,959 Speaker 1: and reintroducement facilities. And the Maximum Security Institution is one 50 00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 1: of seven of those buildings out there, and it is 51 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:42,200 Speaker 1: the one with double fencing around it. It's got razor wire, 52 00:03:42,600 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 1: it has electronic monitoring on the outside. It has twenty 53 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:49,600 Speaker 1: four hour guards on the outside that are armed fully 54 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 1: watching the perimeter at any given time. To be sent 55 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:59,200 Speaker 1: to MZ, you have to either commit murder or a rape, 56 00:03:59,480 --> 00:04:04,119 Speaker 1: or you know, several different things stacking up really extreme 57 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 1: cases of drug trafficking and stuff like that. Definitely the 58 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 1: worst of the worst crimes in Idaho, not just not 59 00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:16,599 Speaker 1: just a theft or beating somebody up and stuff like that, 60 00:04:16,880 --> 00:04:21,359 Speaker 1: or aggravated assault, or it's gonna be somebody that they 61 00:04:21,440 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 1: see as a high risk for reoffense, or they have 62 00:04:23,960 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 1: an entire lifetime a rap sheet of this and there's 63 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:33,200 Speaker 1: just no turning this person around. So everybody in IMSI 64 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:38,200 Speaker 1: is under very strict housing, but not everybody has the 65 00:04:38,240 --> 00:04:42,600 Speaker 1: twenty three hour a day rule. There are some inmates 66 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 1: that are like in close custody, that are able to 67 00:04:45,800 --> 00:04:49,479 Speaker 1: have more freedom within the facility and be housed with 68 00:04:49,520 --> 00:04:53,840 Speaker 1: each other, eat their meals somewhat normally, not in their 69 00:04:53,880 --> 00:04:55,200 Speaker 1: cell for the rest of their life. 70 00:04:57,120 --> 00:04:59,640 Speaker 5: And how about Brian Coberger? Where is he housed? What 71 00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:01,160 Speaker 5: is his custody situation? 72 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:05,680 Speaker 1: Like Coberger's now housed on J Block. J Block is 73 00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 1: as secure as it gets. 74 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:09,440 Speaker 3: It's very bare bones. 75 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:12,840 Speaker 1: There's only the stuff you need. It's not a comfy bed, 76 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:15,560 Speaker 1: it's not a comfy toilet to sit on. It's a 77 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 1: dirty sink and a slot for your food to come 78 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:20,279 Speaker 1: through for every meal. 79 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 3: That you're gonna eat. 80 00:05:21,480 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: J Block is where the death row inmates are housed, 81 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 1: as well as the max of the max. 82 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:28,479 Speaker 3: Prisoners are kept. 83 00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:31,680 Speaker 1: So there's a section for death row and there's also 84 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:35,560 Speaker 1: a section for people that are up there with that 85 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:39,800 Speaker 1: security level but not on death row, and they eat 86 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:43,679 Speaker 1: in their cells every meal or however long they're there. 87 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:47,800 Speaker 5: What is life like in these cells? What do these 88 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:49,280 Speaker 5: inmates do for entertainment? 89 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:53,279 Speaker 3: You don't have access to a TV in the cell. 90 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:56,640 Speaker 1: You can get an iPad and you can come out 91 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:59,679 Speaker 1: into the open area outside of the cell. 92 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:02,120 Speaker 3: You're one hour a day that you're allowed out. 93 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:06,479 Speaker 1: You can either go exercise, you can buy a tablet 94 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 1: and have access to visit people on that. Limited access 95 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:14,160 Speaker 1: to the internet, limited access to TV shows, but you're 96 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:17,000 Speaker 1: only allowed an hour out a day. So you better 97 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:19,240 Speaker 1: choose wisely what you want to do. When you're watching 98 00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:21,440 Speaker 1: this iPad, you're going to be in a cage in 99 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:24,520 Speaker 1: the middle of this room, and so you can't just 100 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:25,240 Speaker 1: walk around with it. 101 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 3: You can't bring it back to your cell. 102 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:29,479 Speaker 5: I'm intrigued what you said about the tablets. So I 103 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:31,880 Speaker 5: think a lot of people so they can't bring the 104 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 5: tablets into their cells. No, because I think when I 105 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:37,520 Speaker 5: first read that he had a tablet and maybe get 106 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:39,840 Speaker 5: a TV, I'm thinking, Oh, he's just gonna watch movies 107 00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:42,440 Speaker 5: all day in his cell and be entertained. But so 108 00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 5: I think that's a good distinction, is that they're only 109 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:47,719 Speaker 5: allowed one hour and they can play with their tablet. 110 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:55,880 Speaker 1: Then essentially yep, one hour a day tablet visitation, exercise, 111 00:06:56,680 --> 00:07:00,440 Speaker 1: watching a show on the tablet, watching you know, limited 112 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:05,599 Speaker 1: internet and books. But other than that, that other twenty 113 00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:08,440 Speaker 1: three hours a day you're staring at a wall. 114 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:10,800 Speaker 5: Do you know what kind of like TV shows they 115 00:07:10,840 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 5: have access to and what websites they can go on. 116 00:07:13,960 --> 00:07:18,520 Speaker 1: So the websites are mainly going to be informational. If 117 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:21,640 Speaker 1: an inmate wants to appeal their case, they have access 118 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 1: to stuff like that, Like I said, just purely informational. 119 00:07:25,080 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 3: No Facebook. 120 00:07:27,040 --> 00:07:29,080 Speaker 1: As far as the TV shows, it's going to be 121 00:07:29,080 --> 00:07:33,120 Speaker 1: nothing of violence, nothing that kind of pertains to why 122 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:37,240 Speaker 1: they're there, Nothing that they can sort of enjoy. 123 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:42,560 Speaker 3: Right, he gets to shower every other day. It's kind 124 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:45,800 Speaker 3: of odd to think about, but that sucks. 125 00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 1: But that's where you are, and it's pretty much the 126 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:50,120 Speaker 1: same for the rest of the inmates. 127 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:52,200 Speaker 5: One thing that really stood out to me is, you know, 128 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 5: there's been this document dump and we're kind of learning 129 00:07:54,840 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 5: some things about what his life was like at the 130 00:07:57,680 --> 00:08:00,679 Speaker 5: Leita County Jail. I guess he was known for taking 131 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 5: like our showers and he would just sit in there 132 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:06,679 Speaker 5: and you know, wash his hands aggressively all the time. 133 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:10,840 Speaker 5: That's not something he could do at IMSI. It sounds like, so. 134 00:08:10,920 --> 00:08:14,880 Speaker 1: He does have access to a sink, but you know, 135 00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:18,080 Speaker 1: it sounds like he's kind of a germophobe and needing 136 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:20,800 Speaker 1: to wash the hands all the time, and he's kind 137 00:08:20,800 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 1: of maybe a little bit ocd about stuff. And he's 138 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: gonna probably not have a lot of soap that they're 139 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:31,280 Speaker 1: gonna be providing him all the time. That's kind of 140 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 1: a luxury as far as he's doing it. But yeah, 141 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 1: he does have access to a sink and the shower 142 00:08:38,200 --> 00:08:40,440 Speaker 1: thing probably really bugs him every other day. 143 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:44,800 Speaker 5: Do you know anything about the food in there, like 144 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 5: the fact that he's, you know, a very strict vegan. 145 00:08:47,840 --> 00:08:50,120 Speaker 5: What could he be seen, how could he how could 146 00:08:50,120 --> 00:08:52,640 Speaker 5: the rest of his life look from from that standpoint? 147 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:58,600 Speaker 1: The dietary requirements for an individual, whether they be vegan vegetarian, 148 00:08:58,760 --> 00:09:02,720 Speaker 1: the prison does accommodate that, and they do have certain 149 00:09:02,800 --> 00:09:05,959 Speaker 1: menus that they are able to give the inmates if 150 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:08,760 Speaker 1: you get too picky, though it's clearly says on the 151 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 1: website we're not going to jump through hoops for you, 152 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 1: but they do provide what they're required to as far 153 00:09:14,520 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: as dietary restrictions. And yeah, I actually have a menu 154 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 1: right here for mzy. 155 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 5: I'm so curious. Yes, please share. 156 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:25,360 Speaker 3: I mean it's not a bad menu. 157 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:31,240 Speaker 1: Biscuits and gravy for breakfast, peanut butter pancakes another day, 158 00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:33,960 Speaker 1: French toast, coffee cake, pumpkin bread. 159 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:37,439 Speaker 3: And this is stuff that not only the. 160 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:40,559 Speaker 1: Close custody people are getting, but also on J Block 161 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 1: death row. And you know, the worst of the worst there, 162 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 1: all the way down to lower level. Day two of 163 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:48,360 Speaker 1: the month, you're gonna get mac and cheese, you know, 164 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 1: day six, pizza, barbecue, chicken, chili, beef, tacos, meat loaf. 165 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:57,080 Speaker 3: So it doesn't sound very bad. 166 00:09:57,120 --> 00:10:04,559 Speaker 1: You know, there's visitation there, in person visitation, but it's 167 00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:07,559 Speaker 1: very limited. It's very strict as far as who can go. 168 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:11,640 Speaker 1: There's a whole application process for somebody. 169 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:13,400 Speaker 3: Coming to visit an inmate there, and. 170 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:17,760 Speaker 1: Coberger's days will be Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday that 171 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:18,520 Speaker 1: he's limited to. 172 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 5: Oh wow, so yeah, actually has quite a few days 173 00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:23,240 Speaker 5: for visitors to show. 174 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:27,280 Speaker 1: Up, correct, But it all has to be approved and 175 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:30,760 Speaker 1: it's not you know, the prison system, they're. 176 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:34,720 Speaker 3: Liable for these people's safety. They have to provide food, water, shelter. 177 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:40,120 Speaker 1: And beyond that, a limited amount of exercise. If the 178 00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 1: prisoner is, you know, behaving well, they can do that. 179 00:10:43,679 --> 00:10:48,600 Speaker 1: As far as visiting, they can easily deny people coming 180 00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:50,000 Speaker 1: or even video. 181 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:53,679 Speaker 5: Some of the people that you work with, they come 182 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:56,680 Speaker 5: back to you and they tell you what IMSI is like. 183 00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:58,800 Speaker 5: What are some of the stories they've shared with you 184 00:10:58,840 --> 00:10:59,960 Speaker 5: about their experiences there. 185 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:07,199 Speaker 1: The status of the living situation there has been kind 186 00:11:07,200 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 1: of a contentious issue with the Department of Correction here. 187 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 1: There's been many complaints about the living conditions, the excessive 188 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:20,840 Speaker 1: use of wars, the excessive use of solitary confinement for 189 00:11:20,920 --> 00:11:24,240 Speaker 1: inmates that you know. The stories are they did nothing 190 00:11:24,280 --> 00:11:26,440 Speaker 1: wrong and it's been investigated and there's been a couple 191 00:11:26,480 --> 00:11:29,960 Speaker 1: of lawsuits about it against the Department of Correction here. 192 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 1: And it's not a nice place. It's not clean. Coburger 193 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:38,800 Speaker 1: is going to hate that. The vents, We've all heard 194 00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:41,680 Speaker 1: about PCs being shoved into the vents and the event 195 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:45,199 Speaker 1: system goes around to the entire place. I have heard 196 00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:49,600 Speaker 1: about people communicating through vents from clients and inmates urinating 197 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:51,439 Speaker 1: on the floor. And it's just kind of a constant 198 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:56,240 Speaker 1: game of cleanup there. And these people have nothing left 199 00:11:56,240 --> 00:11:58,960 Speaker 1: to lose, you know, they're already being put in solitary 200 00:11:59,040 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 1: and stuff like that. 201 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:05,240 Speaker 3: Wor can you do? And it's a very very dark place. 202 00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:10,600 Speaker 4: Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in 203 00:12:10,640 --> 00:12:22,240 Speaker 4: a moment. On July twenty third, twenty twenty five, Brian 204 00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:25,640 Speaker 4: Coberger began the rest of his existence inside the Idaho 205 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:30,320 Speaker 4: Maximum Security Institution after being sentenced to four consecutive life 206 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 4: terms for the brutal murders of Madison Mogen, Kaylie Gonsalvez, 207 00:12:34,960 --> 00:12:40,040 Speaker 4: Xana Kernodle, and Ethan Shapin. Known as IMSI, this facility 208 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:43,839 Speaker 4: is reserved for Idaho's most violent and dangerous inmates. It's 209 00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:46,840 Speaker 4: a place that has garnered a reputation for its harsh, 210 00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:52,280 Speaker 4: hell like conditions, overcrowding, extended lockdowns, and criticism over the 211 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:58,120 Speaker 4: poor treatment of inmates. For many, life at IMSI is isolating, grueling, 212 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:02,640 Speaker 4: and relentless. Now that's the world Brian Coberger is facing 213 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:06,240 Speaker 4: every single day, and it seems he's struggling to adapt. 214 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:11,480 Speaker 4: Reports indicate he's been firing off complaint after complaint to 215 00:13:11,520 --> 00:13:16,480 Speaker 4: prison staff, detailing his discontent with his new reality. Here's 216 00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:20,760 Speaker 4: Stephanie Laideker with crime analyst Body Movin breaking down Coberger's 217 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:26,320 Speaker 4: latest prison quarrels and what they might reveal about him. 218 00:13:26,440 --> 00:13:29,400 Speaker 6: This is why I'm calling him Brian Karenberger. His handwriting 219 00:13:29,559 --> 00:13:32,280 Speaker 6: is literally the worst thing ever. But I'm going to 220 00:13:32,360 --> 00:13:34,280 Speaker 6: read them to you. You're going to get so crazy. 221 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:36,400 Speaker 6: Just by the way, trigger alert. This is going to 222 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:40,440 Speaker 6: make everybody nuts. I feel so enraged right now, and 223 00:13:40,480 --> 00:13:42,960 Speaker 6: that's a rare feeling for me. I'm not really the 224 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:45,840 Speaker 6: enraged one. But you really know, you're very level headed. 225 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:48,840 Speaker 6: This was dated on July twenty seventh, and he was 226 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 6: still in medical on the twenty seventh. Okay, so we 227 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 6: need to keep all that in mind. Okay, So this 228 00:13:54,679 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 6: is written on the twenty seventh, and he says, I 229 00:13:57,920 --> 00:14:00,640 Speaker 6: need access to the JPay system to act access and 230 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:04,840 Speaker 6: complete an order created on I think it's or crafted 231 00:14:04,880 --> 00:14:07,160 Speaker 6: on a full commissary menu. 232 00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:08,160 Speaker 4: Commis hungry. 233 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 6: When attempting to access JP, I am given an error 234 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:15,200 Speaker 6: that I am not set up in the system at 235 00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:17,760 Speaker 6: the Sea Block. Again, he's in medical at this time. Okay, 236 00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:22,840 Speaker 6: at the Sea Block, Kiosk may I temporarily moved in 237 00:14:23,200 --> 00:14:26,760 Speaker 6: the system to do so. Thank you for your assistance. 238 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 7: So that's all. 239 00:14:28,680 --> 00:14:33,560 Speaker 6: That's one complaint, Okay. The next one is, okay, I 240 00:14:33,640 --> 00:14:35,880 Speaker 6: did not receive my lunch on seven thirty, twenty twenty 241 00:14:35,880 --> 00:14:40,960 Speaker 6: five despite inquiring. Although I understand that the something became hectic, 242 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:43,800 Speaker 6: it was never communicated to me that I would be 243 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 6: unable to receive a new bag. The next shift was 244 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 6: not aware of this either. I wish to access this 245 00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 6: as I have a right to this meal. Thank you. 246 00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:57,720 Speaker 6: And then it says I have tried to solve this 247 00:14:57,800 --> 00:15:01,440 Speaker 6: problem informally by and then he's says speaking with staff 248 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:03,920 Speaker 6: several times. And then the next thing, it says, I 249 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 6: suggest the following solution for the problem. And he says, 250 00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 6: in the future, I wish to receive my lunch without exception. 251 00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:13,600 Speaker 6: This could be accomplished by sending for the replacement as 252 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:14,800 Speaker 6: rapidly as possible. 253 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:17,520 Speaker 7: What a great solution. That's the whole Thank god you're 254 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:20,160 Speaker 7: here right. Well, listen, I would suggest you don't murder 255 00:15:20,240 --> 00:15:23,200 Speaker 7: four people. I would tend go to prison and expect 256 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 7: your vegan meal. The end exclamation point. That story is over. 257 00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:30,640 Speaker 6: Right, And he had said something like, you know, if 258 00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:32,960 Speaker 6: I don't receive everything on my tray, you're not meeting 259 00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:37,360 Speaker 6: the nutritial requirements as documented by your own policy. And immediately, 260 00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:39,360 Speaker 6: immediately I was like, what I wonder if you know 261 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:43,440 Speaker 6: the children or the young adults that you murdered, you know, 262 00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:46,640 Speaker 6: wonder about you violating their policy for you know, the 263 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:49,480 Speaker 6: right to live and the people that you arrassed to 264 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:52,520 Speaker 6: wsu the policy of violating Title line media. 265 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:55,880 Speaker 7: How about being a total creeper and making everybody super uncomfortable. 266 00:15:55,880 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 7: And then you're taking the lives of four extraordinary human beings, 267 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 7: wrecking GEDI generations of lives for all of their families, 268 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:05,280 Speaker 7: all of those who knew them and loved them. The 269 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:07,840 Speaker 7: ripple effect of that will go on for generations and 270 00:16:07,880 --> 00:16:12,240 Speaker 7: generations and generations. And this clown feels it's appropriate to 271 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:15,320 Speaker 7: be upset about his meals, right, Yeah, I gotta tell 272 00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:17,960 Speaker 7: you the nerve. It feels to me like it's not 273 00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:21,720 Speaker 7: sinking in entirely to Brian Coburger, that he's not getting 274 00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:24,720 Speaker 7: the fact that he was spared his life and he 275 00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:27,720 Speaker 7: took a coward's way out by not sharing any of 276 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:30,880 Speaker 7: the details or any of the information for reasons we'll 277 00:16:30,920 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 7: never know, and now he just wants to be treated 278 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:38,920 Speaker 7: per the law for prison conduct. Give me a break. 279 00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:42,600 Speaker 6: So in addition to the meal complaints, which I think, 280 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:45,080 Speaker 6: you know, I mean, listen, I do think that we 281 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:47,840 Speaker 6: need to feed these people, but he's also complaining about 282 00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:50,840 Speaker 6: being taunted in prison by the other inmates. He's saying 283 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 6: he's being sexually harassed. Coburger accused one inmate of saying 284 00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:58,400 Speaker 6: I'll but f you, and another stating that the only 285 00:16:58,520 --> 00:17:01,600 Speaker 6: ass we're going to be eating is He requested a 286 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:04,080 Speaker 6: transfer out of the J block, got moved up one 287 00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:07,439 Speaker 6: floor to J two, which is the second level. He 288 00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:09,800 Speaker 6: filed a complaint saying that he was being subjected to 289 00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:13,760 Speaker 6: minute by minute threats and harassment. His cell was flooded. 290 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:16,560 Speaker 6: He told the committee that he wants to eventually be 291 00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:19,240 Speaker 6: allowed to work and be productive in prison and have 292 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:23,359 Speaker 6: shared recreation, just like any other high profile resident on 293 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:27,920 Speaker 6: J two does. And you know, listen, in ten years, 294 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 6: people probably will have forgotten about Brian Coberger and he 295 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:34,840 Speaker 6: might get that privilege. But for right now, he's exactly 296 00:17:34,880 --> 00:17:38,520 Speaker 6: where he belongs by himself in a cell only allowed 297 00:17:38,560 --> 00:17:41,920 Speaker 6: out one hour day in shackles and only allowed to 298 00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:43,440 Speaker 6: shower every other day. 299 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:49,280 Speaker 4: And Coburger's entitled behavior didn't start at the Idaho Maximum 300 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:54,160 Speaker 4: Security Institution. Documents released by the Moscow Police Department and 301 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 4: the Idaho State Police show that even in county jail, 302 00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:01,920 Speaker 4: he was a constant nuisance, pushing boundaries and acting entitled. 303 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:05,359 Speaker 4: To break down what these reports reveal about him, here's 304 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:09,280 Speaker 4: crime Analyzed body move in. Along with Kat's Studio's producer 305 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:12,960 Speaker 4: Alison Bankston, we. 306 00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:17,639 Speaker 6: Learned the documents tell us that Brian Koberger was annoying 307 00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:21,040 Speaker 6: in Leaytal County jail. The people that were in jail 308 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:24,480 Speaker 6: with him found him incredibly annoying. He would pace his cell, 309 00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:26,879 Speaker 6: he would wash his hands constantly. 310 00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:29,679 Speaker 5: And I guess when he first was admitted into Leyta 311 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 5: County he just walked into the pod and saw himself 312 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:35,600 Speaker 5: on TV and was like, Wow, I'm on every channel. 313 00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:38,919 Speaker 5: What a bizarre thing to say for your grand entrance. 314 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:41,480 Speaker 5: And this is before he even pled. You know, he's 315 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:44,320 Speaker 5: presumed innocent. He's acting all proud that he's on TV. 316 00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:47,399 Speaker 5: Odd behavior. And you know the weird thing too in 317 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 5: this particular report is that you know this inmate is saying, 318 00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:52,800 Speaker 5: Brian loved watching the news when it was just him 319 00:18:53,280 --> 00:18:55,720 Speaker 5: on it. You know, news stores just surrended his case. 320 00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:59,440 Speaker 5: But he would have immediately changed the channel if his 321 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:02,639 Speaker 5: family would mentioned, like, immediately he'd turn it off. And 322 00:19:02,680 --> 00:19:05,560 Speaker 5: these fellow inmates are also saying, you know that he'd 323 00:19:05,560 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 5: spent hours and hours on the phone with his mom. 324 00:19:09,119 --> 00:19:12,760 Speaker 6: Right And in one instance, one of the inmates was 325 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:15,640 Speaker 6: watching TV like kind of in like their day room, 326 00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:18,240 Speaker 6: I'm imagining, and Brian Coberger was on the phone with 327 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:21,480 Speaker 6: his mother and you know, he's watching sports on TV 328 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:24,439 Speaker 6: and he's yelling at the TV shut up or you know, 329 00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:27,720 Speaker 6: something along those lines. And Brian Coberger kind of rushed 330 00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:30,159 Speaker 6: over and put his you know, head between the bars 331 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 6: and said, what did you say? 332 00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 4: Are you taking? 333 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,360 Speaker 6: You know, kind of implying that the inmate was talking 334 00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:39,240 Speaker 6: about Brian Coberger's mom and Brian got incessant about it. 335 00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:41,919 Speaker 6: That's pretty scary, listen. I'm not a psychologist, so I 336 00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:44,159 Speaker 6: don't know the answer. Is there something weird there with 337 00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:48,159 Speaker 6: his mom? Does he have some sort of reverence for 338 00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:51,920 Speaker 6: his mom and maybe women don't live up to his 339 00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:55,080 Speaker 6: mom's you know image, like is he modonifying his mom 340 00:19:55,119 --> 00:19:56,399 Speaker 6: in some way, I don't know. 341 00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 4: We brought in Robin Drea, a retired FBI special agent 342 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:06,800 Speaker 4: and former head of the bureau's counter Intelligence Behavioral Analysis program, 343 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:11,240 Speaker 4: to offer his perspective on Brian Coberger's complicated and potentially 344 00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:13,400 Speaker 4: strange relationship with his mother. 345 00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:19,280 Speaker 5: His relationship with his mom is really interesting, you know, 346 00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:21,600 Speaker 5: and we see these with other serial killers too, Like 347 00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:24,879 Speaker 5: Brian Coberger's mom seems like a normal person. What is 348 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:28,920 Speaker 5: it about someone's relationship with their mom and this idolization 349 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:31,600 Speaker 5: of their mom that would make like a hatred for 350 00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:33,639 Speaker 5: women or a want to kill? What is it with 351 00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 5: serial killers and mothers? 352 00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:36,439 Speaker 3: They're all different, you know? 353 00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:38,679 Speaker 2: The only sense I get again, no data points on 354 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 2: this because the mother's not sharing anything, but from what 355 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:44,040 Speaker 2: we see from the family dynamic and limited data points, 356 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:45,919 Speaker 2: you know, So it's all conjecture. I don't get the 357 00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:48,199 Speaker 2: sense of a Norman Bates kind of thing here with 358 00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:51,760 Speaker 2: a domineering mother. To me, this is in one I've 359 00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:55,000 Speaker 2: seen other A few psychologists online say it's not necessarily 360 00:20:55,040 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 2: mother fixation. I just think this is his only sense 361 00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:01,480 Speaker 2: of emotional anchoring, he gets, his only sense of anchoring 362 00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:04,840 Speaker 2: he has because life in his brain is just chaos, 363 00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:06,840 Speaker 2: I think, and he can't and that's why he's OCD. 364 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:09,320 Speaker 2: That's why he fixates on things is try to try 365 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:12,200 Speaker 2: to control that. And the only thing that's that's been 366 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:16,240 Speaker 2: stable that doesn't bring chaos to his brain. My estimation 367 00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:20,240 Speaker 2: is his mother, because what a mother does, or just 368 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:25,840 Speaker 2: any any compassionate, empathetic individual will do is not judge. 369 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:29,440 Speaker 2: And when you're not being judged, that becomes an anchor 370 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 2: for you that no matter what happens, I can go 371 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:33,440 Speaker 2: back to my ancher, no matter what happens, to go 372 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,240 Speaker 2: back to my anchor. And so I my estimation, my 373 00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:39,760 Speaker 2: conjecture is she is just that anchor that was there 374 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:41,960 Speaker 2: no matter what he did, no matter what kind of 375 00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:44,359 Speaker 2: day he's having. You know, Dad's the one that's gonna 376 00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:47,159 Speaker 2: help me by taking action, by turning me into the 377 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:49,640 Speaker 2: police when I steal my sister's cell phone and take 378 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:51,880 Speaker 2: actions to drive across the country with me, because he's 379 00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:54,480 Speaker 2: a carrying dad. But dad's a dad in this case, 380 00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:57,439 Speaker 2: looks like a problem solver. Mom just looks like the anchor. 381 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:00,720 Speaker 2: And so he's holding on that anchor. And as things 382 00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 2: got more chaotic, what do you do you go back 383 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:04,560 Speaker 2: to your anchor more. That's why I think he called 384 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:06,080 Speaker 2: her more and more and more in prison. 385 00:22:06,520 --> 00:22:08,480 Speaker 5: Yeah, that makes total sense. Thank you. You know, I 386 00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:10,520 Speaker 5: honestly really feel for his mom. That has to be 387 00:22:10,520 --> 00:22:12,840 Speaker 5: such a tough situation to be in. No mothers are 388 00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:15,360 Speaker 5: supposed to love their sons. She can't just ignore his 389 00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:19,680 Speaker 5: phone calls. I'm sure this is heartbreaking and devastating for her. 390 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,000 Speaker 5: I honestly don't know what I would do. I also 391 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 5: wanted to ask you another question about Brian Colberger's prison 392 00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:29,760 Speaker 5: life from a behavioral standpoint, Just something I was wondering about. 393 00:22:29,840 --> 00:22:32,320 Speaker 5: You know, he seems like such a cocky person. You know, 394 00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:34,480 Speaker 5: we read earlier reports that he was bragg you know, 395 00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:37,320 Speaker 5: a being on TV to his fellow inmates. A lot 396 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:39,280 Speaker 5: of people who knew him said he always had to 397 00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:42,159 Speaker 5: be the smartest person in the room. Going into prison, 398 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:43,800 Speaker 5: do you think that he thought, I'm going to be 399 00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:46,560 Speaker 5: the most popular person there, I'm going to be notorious. 400 00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:48,720 Speaker 5: I did the worst thing. What do you think was 401 00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:51,800 Speaker 5: going through his mind before he decided to plead guilty 402 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:53,680 Speaker 5: and say, you know, I'm going to spend the rest 403 00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:55,080 Speaker 5: of my life in prison. 404 00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:58,440 Speaker 2: So one of things that I believe are a motivation 405 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,320 Speaker 2: for the behavior he had is and he said it 406 00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:04,400 Speaker 2: earlier in life, he wasn't stimulated by anything. So you're 407 00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:07,400 Speaker 2: constantly going for some sort of emotional stimulation. That's why 408 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:09,919 Speaker 2: he experimented and got into drugs. It's why we do 409 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:12,840 Speaker 2: everything in life, kickboxing and will give you, you know, stimulation. 410 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 2: So I think he was always seeking some sort of stimulation. 411 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:18,639 Speaker 2: So I think when he resolved to finally admit guilt, 412 00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:23,240 Speaker 2: he was looking forward to being stimulated by being notorious 413 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:25,359 Speaker 2: in prison. So his mind started shifting. It's like I 414 00:23:25,400 --> 00:23:28,359 Speaker 2: will be this famous person. But because he thinks in 415 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:32,080 Speaker 2: a stovepipe, he wasn't really fully appreciating the fact of 416 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 2: how prisons generally run about. And if you kill women 417 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:37,240 Speaker 2: or children. 418 00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:42,119 Speaker 4: Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in 419 00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:53,600 Speaker 4: a moment. Brian Coberger may have believed his name would 420 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:57,520 Speaker 4: carry weight behind bars, but prison life doesn't work that way. 421 00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:02,840 Speaker 4: To explain why we back bail bondsman Kevin Corson, he 422 00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:07,440 Speaker 4: spent years around inmates and understands the reality of surviving inside. 423 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:13,400 Speaker 1: He goes to this facility and there's you know, there's 424 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:16,480 Speaker 1: people in there. This is their home, and when you're 425 00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:20,200 Speaker 1: in these places, you're you're the biggest and baddest person 426 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,160 Speaker 1: in there, and that's that's how you survive. 427 00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:26,000 Speaker 3: And he's the new guy there. Yeah, he probably does have. 428 00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:29,480 Speaker 1: That thinking, I'm gonna have notoriety when I get there, 429 00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:32,439 Speaker 1: and I'm gonna be this guy that did this, and 430 00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:34,760 Speaker 1: all these other bad people are gonna look up to me. 431 00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:38,120 Speaker 1: That's not the case. You're coming into their house where 432 00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:41,840 Speaker 1: they live, and you know, you better play by the rules. 433 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:44,320 Speaker 1: And that's the number one reason why they have to 434 00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:48,040 Speaker 1: keep him away from other people, because it's not notoriety 435 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:51,720 Speaker 1: that he has there. It's these people that are the 436 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,920 Speaker 1: biggest and the baddest that would love to hurt him. 437 00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:57,600 Speaker 1: Stick him with a fork, stick him, you know, with 438 00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:01,440 Speaker 1: a shaved down blade, to make a name for themselves 439 00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:04,119 Speaker 1: because this is their home and it has been for 440 00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:07,520 Speaker 1: a while. So you get so institutionalized with the way 441 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:11,240 Speaker 1: you deal with stuff, and it's technically a you know, 442 00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:12,000 Speaker 1: a disrespect. 443 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:15,040 Speaker 3: You're coming into my home and we're going to make 444 00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:16,600 Speaker 3: sure you play by our rules. 445 00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:19,280 Speaker 1: Otherwise, if we have the chance to get you, we will. 446 00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:21,520 Speaker 1: And he does have a target on his back one 447 00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:22,680 Speaker 1: hundred percent. 448 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:30,280 Speaker 4: And it's a target he will likely carry for the 449 00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:34,359 Speaker 4: rest of his life. There is very little chance that 450 00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,919 Speaker 4: Brian Coberger will ever see the general prison population again. 451 00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:42,040 Speaker 4: His future is one of permanent solitary confinement, a world 452 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:46,200 Speaker 4: of cement walls, endless lockdowns, and hours that bleed together 453 00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:54,000 Speaker 4: into gray, monotonous days. No redemption, no freedom, no escape, 454 00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:58,160 Speaker 4: just the consequences of his own choices haunting him every 455 00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:02,159 Speaker 4: single day. What's the existence he created? This is the 456 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,479 Speaker 4: life he will endure, and this is the legacy he 457 00:26:05,560 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 4: leaves behind. Next time, on the Idaho Massacre, we're joined 458 00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:15,480 Speaker 4: by sociologist doctor Michael Kimmel, a leading expert on men's 459 00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:20,000 Speaker 4: studies and masculinities. Some have speculated that Brian Colberger could 460 00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:22,399 Speaker 4: have been part of the in cell movement, But is 461 00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:25,360 Speaker 4: that really true or is it just another label being 462 00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:29,760 Speaker 4: placed on him? Next week we'll explore the evidence and 463 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 4: the uncertainty surrounding this theory. More on that next time. 464 00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 4: For more information on the case and relevant photos, follow 465 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:45,560 Speaker 4: us on Instagram at Kat Underscore Studios. The Idaho Massacre 466 00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:50,760 Speaker 4: is produced by Stephanie Leideker, Alison Bankston, Gabriel Castillo and 467 00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 4: me Courtney Armstrong. Editing and sound design by Jeff Toois, 468 00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:59,240 Speaker 4: music by Jared Aston. The Idaho Masacer is a production 469 00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:03,239 Speaker 4: of Kat Student Dios and iHeartRadio. For more podcasts like this, 470 00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:07,520 Speaker 4: visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen 471 00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:08,800 Speaker 4: to your favorite shows.