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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,

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Speaker 2: my name is Noah.

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Speaker 3: They call me Ben. We're joined as always with our

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Speaker 3: super producer Dylan the Tennessee pal Fagan. Most importantly, you

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Speaker 3: are you. You are here That makes this the stuff

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Speaker 3: they don't want you to know. Previously, on Stuff they

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Speaker 3: don't want you to know, in our weekly listener mail program,

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Speaker 3: which informs a lot of our future episodes, we were

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Speaker 3: contacted by our fellow conspiracy realist Uncle Benny. And guys,

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Speaker 3: I don't know if we all remember this, but it was, uh,

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Speaker 3: it was late July this year when Uncle Benny hipped

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Speaker 3: us to one of the most bizarre UFO stories in

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Speaker 3: modern history. With full disclosure, none of us have been

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Speaker 3: to New Zealand, is that correct?

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Speaker 4: No, but y'all have been practicing your Kiwi accents and

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Speaker 4: I can't wait to hear your roll them out. And

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Speaker 4: do you like the Michael Caine off of Kiwi accents?

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Speaker 2: Well, I think it's gonna come out accidentally as we're

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Speaker 2: saying like names.

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Speaker 3: Accent is how we Yeah, I only just got the

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Speaker 3: hang of narr as well? Or is that just exclusively ausy.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's a big country, It's true. I'm sure

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Speaker 3: there's someone.

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Speaker 4: A lot of sheep apparently a lot of yes, yes,

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Speaker 4: a lot of works to watch.

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Speaker 3: Out for them.

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Speaker 2: Everything I know came from them. What we do in

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Speaker 2: the Shadows, Out of the Concords tv SO.

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Speaker 5: And Lord of the Rings come on, you're leaving out?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but like they didn't have New Zealand accents.

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Speaker 5: It wasn't New Zealand is set in Atlanta.

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Speaker 3: Right right, right, Although that would be great, give us

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Speaker 3: your head cannon, give us your fandom of Lord of

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Speaker 3: the Rings being New Zealand.

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Speaker 2: A remake with accents us.

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Speaker 3: Make entirely with accents, right we maybe some bits. We'll

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Speaker 3: get to that and that's yeah, we'll chount for the beats.

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Speaker 3: Uh So, levels, folks, levels, we're doing levels tonight. We

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Speaker 3: also want to, of course, as we're affectionately describing here,

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Speaker 3: we want to point out that we do not have

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Speaker 3: anything other than painfully American accents. When we may mispronounce

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Speaker 3: or cartoonishly pronounce a thing. It is for comedic value.

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Speaker 3: It is with great respect to our friends in New Zealand,

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Speaker 3: especially our friends on New Zealand's South Island.

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Speaker 4: So that was a mouthful, man, I could feel it

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Speaker 4: rolling around in there.

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Speaker 3: Well yeah, like an anzac biscuit exactly.

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Speaker 2: I'd love to do a quick shout out here to

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Speaker 2: a TV show that I think we've mentioned once or

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Speaker 2: twice before, because a lot of us know what we

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Speaker 2: do in the shadows, A lot of us know the

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Speaker 2: Concords right. Not many of us, I think, know about

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Speaker 2: Wellington Paranormal.

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Speaker 3: Oh yes, yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, fantastic show and fantastic

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Speaker 3: in this episode, we're headed to Wellington. We're headed to Wellington.

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Speaker 3: We also want to shout out our good friends at

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Speaker 3: Hanti Donna and can I also shout out a podcast

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Speaker 3: that is kind of nerd culture stuff from some lovely

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Speaker 3: dudes called The Weekly Planet, and they seem to be

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Speaker 3: friends with the Aunty Donna guys.

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Speaker 4: So if you like their shenanigans and you're into nerd

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Speaker 4: culture stuff, highly recommend the Weekly Planet podcast.

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Speaker 3: And to be clear, our friends at Auntie Donna are Australian.

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Speaker 3: Will get into this. But let us shinan together, folks.

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Speaker 3: Tonight's episode takes us on a journey through time and

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Speaker 3: earthly space to the final days of December nineteen seventy

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Speaker 3: eight on New Zealand's South Island. We're gonna pause for

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Speaker 3: a word from our sponsors. Here are the facts. Let's

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Speaker 3: start by kicking some geography. Okay, So, since not everybody

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Speaker 3: has a world map directly behind their monitor or directly

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Speaker 3: in front of them while they're listening, New Zealand is

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Speaker 3: not Australia. New Zealand is very close to Australia. It's

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Speaker 3: often been called the Canada of Australia. And by often called,

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Speaker 3: we mean specifically by us on this show.

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Speaker 4: Oh okay, god, okay, who's saying that fighting words always

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Speaker 4: have a specific source?

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Speaker 2: Yes? But also it is pretty far away. There's a

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Speaker 2: whole sea in between, right, And it's not like the

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Speaker 2: Black Sea or some of the smaller seas out there.

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Speaker 2: This is at it's pretty much ocean, y'all. But but

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Speaker 2: it is close, right, But it's but it's not so

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Speaker 2: close that you can just take a quick flight over

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Speaker 2: the way you can, you know, in the UK and

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Speaker 2: to a lot of other places in Europe.

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Speaker 4: It's right remote, right, I mean it's it certainly still

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Speaker 4: feels that way, at least looking at it on the map.

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Speaker 3: It has an outsized global impression on culture. It's also

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Speaker 3: most famous for a lot of non Aussi conspiracy realist

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Speaker 3: or non Kiwi conspiracy realist by being a place where

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Speaker 3: the world's current billionaires are bunkering up. And so you

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Speaker 3: may hear it mentioned often in that reg guard in

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Speaker 3: shows of a similar milieu.

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Speaker 2: And when you're looking at this place from above right

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Speaker 2: to the southeast of mainland Australia, there you're going to

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Speaker 2: see two primary large islands. Essentially, I'm thinking a little

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Speaker 2: bit of a comparison to Japan with the way it's

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Speaker 2: set up there perhaps, And we are talking, as you said, Ben,

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Speaker 2: about the south of those two islands.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, by far the largest of the two islands. In fact,

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Speaker 3: the South Island is technically the twelfth largest island on

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Speaker 3: the planet. And if you're looking at the map overhead

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Speaker 3: right you're getting sat NAV or something. This may not

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Speaker 3: look Titanic from your perspective, but it's important to remember

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Speaker 3: it's a big place and for most of human history

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Speaker 3: it was very sparsely populated, but it's home to stunning

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Speaker 3: geography and natural wonders. True story, folks, the South Island

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Speaker 3: is home to something called the Southern Alps. That's how

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Speaker 3: amazing the mountains are. That's why to your earlier point.

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Speaker 3: Now they filmed Lord of the Rings there lush, you

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Speaker 3: can get it.

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Speaker 2: You can get a bit of a sense of it

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Speaker 2: from the map. But like of that mountain range, but

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Speaker 2: it is not. It doesn't look like that. It looks

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Speaker 2: like Lord of the Rings.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, especially because of the plains surrounding the mountains. That

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Speaker 3: that's why it becomes so majestic. Our story tonight takes

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Speaker 3: place in a curious area called the Kaikoura Mountain Ranges.

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Speaker 4: Uh.

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Speaker 3: This is spelled k a I k o u r A. Again,

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Speaker 3: we're not doing the accents unless it's for comedy. Uh.

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Speaker 3: And it's These mountains are named after a small coastal

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Speaker 3: town also called Kaikoura. Uh. It's an interesting thing because

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Speaker 3: the ranges here, the Paikoura Ranges, are two parallel groups

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Speaker 3: of mountains and they're in the northeast of the South Island.

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Speaker 6: Uh.

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Speaker 3: They are so big because they're surrounded by plains. Right

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Speaker 3: and rolling hills. They're so big that you can see

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Speaker 3: them from the south of the smaller, much more populous

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Speaker 3: North Island. And here we have a cameo from our

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Speaker 3: pow James Cook. Captain James Cook. Excuse me who originally

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Speaker 3: when he was one of the Captain Cook the yes

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Speaker 3: of the of the Captain Cook famu to be confused

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Speaker 3: with James Kirk. This is different. This is right explorer

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Speaker 3: and not to be confused with Jesse Pinkman from Breaking Bad,

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Speaker 3: which I just rewatched. I was watching it last night too.

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Speaker 4: Was the episode where they're kind of weighing whether or

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Speaker 4: not to execute that that crazy.

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Speaker 3: Spoilers. I didn't say whether they did. Internet guys, we've

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Speaker 3: said it in the past, just twenty years old at

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Speaker 3: this point that I think we've reached.

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Speaker 5: The statute of limitations on okay, well the Internet.

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Speaker 3: Here's the thing, we've discussed it on the show in

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Speaker 3: the past. Breaking Bad is essentially car stuff but with

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Speaker 3: meth hmmm, got to get that pseudo getting that pseudo, Sorry, Captain,

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Speaker 3: I'm sorry. He puts the chili pee.

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Speaker 5: In the in the yes, Breaking Bad coded right.

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Speaker 3: Now, So this has uh these pop culture references are

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Speaker 3: hopefully valuable to someone and thank you for tuning in

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Speaker 3: the The The thing is, the ranges themselves are still

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Speaker 3: pretty rural. As of some of the most up to

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Speaker 3: date information from the New New Zealand Census, there are

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Speaker 3: a little less than two thousand people living there day

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Speaker 3: to day.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, crazy, and these ranges are really important. Not

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Speaker 2: many people there. There are two towns that we have

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Speaker 2: to focus in on, Wellington and christ Church. Wellington is

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Speaker 2: on the very southern tip of that the more northern island,

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Speaker 2: the smaller island, a heavily populated place, lots of air

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Speaker 2: traffic control going on there, lots of radar, lots of

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Speaker 2: checking out what's going on.

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Speaker 4: And you may recognize the name christ Church, which the

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Speaker 4: same way that I did. It was the site of

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Speaker 4: a really awful terrorist attack back in twenty nineteen at

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Speaker 4: two mosques and it was a huge deal because it

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Speaker 4: was a horrible situation, but also just things like that

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Speaker 4: just don't happen there and it's such a you know,

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Speaker 4: rural very like you said, kind of what's the word

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Speaker 4: adyllic kind of you know place part of the world

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Speaker 4: that it was just really shock.

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Speaker 3: To hear about something like that coming. But we're talking

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Speaker 3: about two big cities. So christ Church has a population

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Speaker 3: of over three hundred and fifty thousand or so, and

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Speaker 3: that makes it the third largest city in the country. Uh.

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Speaker 3: The first one is Auckland and the second is as

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Speaker 3: we mentioned, Wellington. They have a lot of toys that

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Speaker 3: are going to be important for tonight's exploration exactly.

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Speaker 2: And because they have a lot of toys and they're

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Speaker 2: on that more populous island up there in the north,

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Speaker 2: there are regular standard flights, huge cargo plains that travel

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Speaker 2: from Wellington with a bunch of stuff to christ Church

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Speaker 2: and they land and then they turn around and they

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Speaker 2: go back to Wellington and Kaikura. This mountain range we're

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Speaker 2: talking about is kind of smack dab in between these

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Speaker 2: two christ Church by the way, on that southern island

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Speaker 2: past Kaikoura.

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Speaker 3: In the mount you have to traverse the mountains right, yes,

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Speaker 3: you have to find the mountain pass.

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Speaker 2: Or essentially go right over the ocean there right next

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Speaker 2: to them.

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Speaker 3: Or skirt skirt. Yeah. So the issue here is that

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Speaker 3: most locals, most New Zealand nationals know of these mountains

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Speaker 3: to one degree or another, but they gain national attention on.

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Speaker 3: You know, I was thinking of the way to say it.

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Speaker 3: Kaikora Mountain Ranges. For a lot of people pre nineteen

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Speaker 3: seventy eight in New Zealand, they were like the Grand

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Speaker 3: Canyon in the United States. They were a wonder you

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Speaker 3: knew about. Right. You might know about the Adirondacks, but

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Speaker 3: you never visit, right because maybe I haven't at the time.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, the chairs are mega uncomfortable, right, they're.

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Speaker 3: No AAMS chairs. I agree. It's late in the evening,

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Speaker 3: about eleven pm local time on December twentieth, nineteen seventy eight,

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Speaker 3: when a guy named Ian Ulfindel of the New Zealand

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Speaker 3: RAF Royal Air Force reports unusual lights in the sky

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Speaker 3: and he says, I can do the voice. He says,

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Speaker 3: three objects. There's one big one and there are two

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Speaker 3: smaller things like orbes well lighty boys, and they're making

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Speaker 3: controlled movement and they're flying in some sort of pattern together.

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Speaker 4: And this immediately, you know, has credence to it the

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Speaker 4: way like the tic Tac stories did, because of who

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Speaker 4: it's coming from. It's not just some like crackpot, you know,

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Speaker 4: stargazing and seeing some weird and they're telescope. It's like

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Speaker 4: someone who is used to monitoring these types of situations

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Speaker 4: and is absolutely qualified to say this is a little.

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Speaker 3: Weird, right, yeah, yeah, and he adds they're not aircraft.

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Speaker 2: Well yeah, at least they don't seem like it, right.

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Speaker 2: And the craziest thing is that the person he's talking

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Speaker 2: to when he is reporting this stuff is the person

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Speaker 2: who's manning the radar, and that person is also seeing

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Speaker 2: stuff out there. So it's not like some of those

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Speaker 2: UFO sightings that we've heard about in the past, where hey,

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Speaker 2: we're not getting anything on radar, but there are weird lights.

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Speaker 2: There's something physically out there.

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Speaker 3: It's pinging on the radar. And this is when we

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Speaker 3: fast forward to the part of the lore that may

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Speaker 3: be most familiar, or the origin story that's most familiar

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Speaker 3: to ufologists. It's December twenty, first wee hours, nineteen seventy eight.

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Speaker 3: A small crew is flying cargo plane in Argacy, this

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Speaker 3: type of plane and the company they're flying for is

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Speaker 3: called Safe Air Limited. Weirdly enough, they're delivering creates of

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Speaker 3: newspapers and they're flying and they start clocking strange objects

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Speaker 3: that seem to be bird dogging their craft, and they say,

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Speaker 3: you can hear the clips from the and the crew

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Speaker 3: themselves where they're saying, look, this is they're calling atc

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Speaker 3: air Traffic Control and they're saying, look, these there are

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Speaker 3: things around us, these strange orbs in the sky. They're

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Speaker 3: not uniform in size. One is as large as a house,

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Speaker 3: and they are tracking us, and then they're disappearing, and

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Speaker 3: then they're inexplicably appearing somewhere else minutes later, and they're saying,

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Speaker 3: these are blowing red or orange orbs. Some of them

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Speaker 3: are pulsing like white beacons. And it kind of goes

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Speaker 3: back to what you were saying there earlier, NOL. It's

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Speaker 3: oddly not that unusual for isolated groups of people, even

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Speaker 3: aviation experts, to witness aerial phenomena they can't immediately explain.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but it is pretty striking that this is all

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Speaker 2: occurring on the same night. All of this is happening.

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Speaker 2: So we've got an officer at a base seeing something

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Speaker 2: that he thinks are just planes. Oh wait, those aren't

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Speaker 2: just planes, but they are on radar. And then you've

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Speaker 2: got actual human beings in a flight over these mountains

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Speaker 2: seeing the stuff. Pretty nuts.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's one of the primary reasons so there are

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Speaker 3: three big reasons why the Kaikora lights are different from

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Speaker 3: most reports. First, as you said, Matt, they're clocked by

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Speaker 3: air traffic Control, they're out of Wellington. The argasy crew

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Speaker 3: naturally calls in the event and ATC is able to

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Speaker 3: confirm something is there, which means something was material enough

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Speaker 3: to ping on a radar. They show up on the

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Speaker 3: aircraft radar as well.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and you also have all of these human beings

264
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Speaker 2: who saw all this stuff later gave interviews where they

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Speaker 2: said directly into a camera and microphone exactly what they saw.

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Speaker 2: So Ian Uffindel, John Cordy, the guy who was in

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Speaker 2: the radar control room, they're in Wellington.

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Speaker 3: Sure they're pilots, Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Vern Powell and Ian Pierre Peiri, I think is how

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Speaker 2: you say his name. They all will talk about it openly.

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Speaker 2: It's not like this thing that everybody's nervous about, because

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Speaker 2: we've seen that before as well, right with UFO reports.

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Speaker 2: People are nervous to talk about it, or they feel

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Speaker 2: as though they might be shunned or looked at differently

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Speaker 2: for seeing something like this and then saying it out loud.

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Speaker 2: We don't see that happening with this case, we don't

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Speaker 2: see a lot of the telltale things that make more

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Speaker 2: skeptically minded of us think, oh, well, this is probably

279
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Speaker 2: a hoax, or this isn't real, or you know, the

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Speaker 2: way those people are talking, it doesn't seem right. We're

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Speaker 2: not seeing that here.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. And the second of these three things is that

283
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Speaker 3: these lights eventually are cited by hundreds of other people,

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Speaker 3: not on the specific planes. And we're using the word

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Speaker 3: planes as a plural on purpose because the third big

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Speaker 3: thing that differentiates this event is that it is a

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Speaker 3: series of events. There are multiple instances of these lights

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Speaker 3: being observed over the next few days, with all of

289
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Speaker 3: the doodads we just mentioned, so.

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Speaker 2: Maybe we get into film cameras.

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Speaker 3: The second most famous sighting, which is December thirtieth, same year.

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Speaker 3: Just a few days later, it's almost nineteen seventy nine,

293
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Speaker 3: there's an Australian television crew recording a similar event, also

294
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Speaker 3: a board of cargo aircraft. This one is flying between

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Speaker 3: you guessed it, folks, Wellington and christ Church. This is

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Speaker 3: where we introduce a three person team, reporter Quentin Fogerty,

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Speaker 3: a cameraman named David Crockett, and Nigher Crockett. The audio

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Speaker 3: tech who is also David Crockett's wife. They are literally

299
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Speaker 3: on the plane because get this, they're shooting b roll

300
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Speaker 3: for a TV show about the earlier sightings, and lo

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Speaker 3: and behold, they witness their own Kaikora lights at the time.

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Speaker 3: This time they're able to film on sixty millimeter from

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Speaker 3: the plane in color and this is again confirmed by

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Speaker 3: Wellington Air Traffic Control. It's being observed by numerous witnesses.

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Speaker 3: Do we want to play a clip of Fogerty talking

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Speaker 3: about this. I've been on the edge of my seat

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Speaker 3: waiting for it.

308
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Speaker 2: Yeah, we have several clips here, and let's go ahead

309
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Speaker 2: and cite the source. We found these on a YouTube

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Speaker 2: channel called Marlborough Video Vault. The video is titled the

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Speaker 2: Kaikora UFOs Dash nineteen seventy eight and at least according

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Speaker 2: to attribution on the description there, it was written and

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Speaker 2: produced by Paul Davidson. So thank you Paul for doing this.

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Speaker 2: The actual clips here are from nineteen seventy eight, there

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Speaker 2: in late December, and this is nuts. So this first

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Speaker 2: one we're just going to hear from Quentin Fogerty, who

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Speaker 2: is there. I've seen him cited as being a Channel

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Speaker 2: zero or Channel O Reporter, but also for TV one

319
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Speaker 2: also News at six, so.

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Speaker 3: Change their name a couple times over the decades as well.

321
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Speaker 2: Yeah. So, to my understanding, it was recorded as part

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Speaker 2: of a television news broadcast after they had heard of

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Speaker 2: this original sighting.

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Speaker 3: Yer twenty first is the one the public knew about. Yeah.

325
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Speaker 7: Yeah.

326
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Speaker 2: The producer there, Leonard Lee, got got permission to go

327
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Speaker 2: up on one of these flights, on one of these

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Speaker 2: Argacy flights. So let's jump to this. This is Quentin Fogerty,

329
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Speaker 2: just during the initial trip, describing what they're seeing through

330
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Speaker 2: the windows of the Argusy cockpit. Oh, this is one

331
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Speaker 2: of the pieces of information we need to know. This

332
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Speaker 2: is a cargo plane, so it's not like maybe a

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Speaker 2: plane you've flown in where you've got windows all down

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Speaker 2: the sides and stuff. This is imagine just a big

335
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Speaker 2: metal tube and then you can see out the front

336
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Speaker 2: of it.

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Speaker 3: Does that make sense, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

338
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Speaker 2: So everything they're seeing is the cockpit through the windows

339
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Speaker 2: that the pilots are using to fly the plane in

340
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Speaker 2: real time. Yes, So here we go.

341
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Speaker 6: The very first thing we saw was these sort of

342
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Speaker 6: falls of light that would just appear in the sky,

343
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Speaker 6: and I mean it was really just looking through small

344
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Speaker 6: windows at a very very black sky and seeing pulsating

345
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Speaker 6: lights that started usually as a very very small pinprick

346
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Speaker 6: of light and then would go into like a great

347
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Speaker 6: globe of light.

348
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Speaker 3: Now, that's the so we originally said, the real time report.

349
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Speaker 3: That is Fogerty looking back and recalling in an interview

350
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Speaker 3: where a documentary we saw. But if you check out

351
00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:44,560
Speaker 3: this thing, which is freely available any anywhere you want

352
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Speaker 3: to look online, you will see the lights that he

353
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Speaker 3: is describing, and he appears to be describing those with accuracy.

354
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Speaker 2: Yeah, you can hear kind of in the moment him

355
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Speaker 2: describing it, but it's just not as eloquent. It's just,

356
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Speaker 2: you know, he as even states in those later interviews,

357
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Speaker 2: he's kind of he's a bit flum mixed experiencing this

358
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Speaker 2: whole thing and just trying to describe it in real

359
00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:10,800
Speaker 2: time there, but he's just not doing a great job.

360
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:13,880
Speaker 2: There are several pieces of that you can here though,

361
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Speaker 2: mm hmm.

362
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Speaker 3: Yeah. And here's the kicker, folks, here's the badger in

363
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Speaker 3: the bag. They land the plane and we'll get into

364
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Speaker 3: more of this as we continue. They land the plane,

365
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Speaker 3: and in this instance, one of the objects, these inexplicable orbs,

366
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Speaker 3: appears to follow the plane right up until it lands.

367
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Speaker 3: And when they land, their camera guy is reloading his

368
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Speaker 3: film right, he's getting better film stock. We're working live.

369
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Speaker 3: The plane takes off once more and now it's followed

370
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Speaker 3: by a quote orb like object for another fifteen minutes,

371
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Speaker 3: also caught on film.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and we have one more clip. You don't mind, guys,

373
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Speaker 2: of that moment, because this is one of the actual

374
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Speaker 2: film clips from nineteen seventy eight. It's the moment that

375
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Speaker 2: they're in the radar room in christ Church and they're

376
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Speaker 2: getting word from Wellington that the lights are still out there.

377
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Speaker 2: And in this moment, you have to imagine what's going

378
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Speaker 2: through the minds of you know, these pilots and this

379
00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:19,040
Speaker 2: film crew in this moment, they are kind of terrified

380
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Speaker 2: because of this thing. We have to mention here that

381
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Speaker 2: happened very recently to the moment. This is happening in

382
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Speaker 2: December nineteen seventy eight. What happened to Frederick Valentich in

383
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Speaker 2: October of nineteen seventy eight, And this has happened in Australia,

384
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Speaker 2: so not very far from them. As we said, where

385
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Speaker 2: a pilot. There's a lot of scuttle but a lot

386
00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:44,920
Speaker 2: of rumors about this pilot that radioed in that he

387
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:48,480
Speaker 2: was seeing something that was metal and not an aircraft

388
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Speaker 2: right before he disappeared. So these pilots were aware of this,

389
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Speaker 2: This news crew was aware of this, and now they're

390
00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:59,879
Speaker 2: up there seeing these lights and interacting with them. They

391
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:04,159
Speaker 2: imagined that perhaps they might meet the same fate that

392
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Speaker 2: Frederick met right just disappearing plane and all.

393
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Speaker 3: Yeah, nineteen seventy eight. Checkout our episode from twenty twenty three,

394
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Speaker 3: the disappearance of Frederick Valentich.

395
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Speaker 2: Absolutely absolutely so. Here is a quick clip of that

396
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Speaker 2: moment right before they took off for the second time.

397
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Speaker 8: We're now on the radar room at christ Church Airport.

398
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Speaker 8: It's about quarter to two, and in about another twenty

399
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Speaker 8: minutes we intend to take off again in the agacy

400
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Speaker 8: and retrace the route we took only a few moments earlier.

401
00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:38,160
Speaker 8: We've just heard from Wellington Radar that there are still

402
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,200
Speaker 8: targets in the kai Kura area, So this time we're

403
00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:43,200
Speaker 8: hoping to get at a film than we did last time.

404
00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:46,240
Speaker 8: And all I can say is we'll see what happens.

405
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Speaker 2: There we go and so you can almost hear the

406
00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:54,000
Speaker 2: nerves there and it was such a heroing experience that

407
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:58,439
Speaker 2: the sound record is Gary Krockett, the wife of David Krogett,

408
00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 2: the cameraon chose not to go back on the return flight.

409
00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:05,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, and again they're a freelance team, uh, not expecting

410
00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,600
Speaker 3: this double tap. These are b roll They're there for

411
00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:12,639
Speaker 3: b roll in interviews, you know, in situ in the moment.

412
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Speaker 3: So we've got to applaud crocket there for being for

413
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Speaker 3: being the person who said, look, I'm here in a

414
00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:22,560
Speaker 3: professional capacity and I don't want to be one of

415
00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 3: those suckers in the first act of a possible horror film,

416
00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:26,600
Speaker 3: you know what I mean?

417
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 5: Can we also just acknowledge that it's badass that his

418
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:29,960
Speaker 5: name is Davy Crockett.

419
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Speaker 3: I just can't. Sorry, Well, I think we were all

420
00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:37,840
Speaker 3: working it more impressive to us. Maybe maybe probably he

421
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:39,240
Speaker 3: was a little sick of hearing about it.

422
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:43,080
Speaker 2: Dave noted that there's some weird stuff when they got

423
00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:46,399
Speaker 2: off the plane the first time, where he states that

424
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,879
Speaker 2: the exterior the exterior of the plane seemed to be

425
00:25:50,080 --> 00:25:55,680
Speaker 2: magnetized or energized in some way, and like he it

426
00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:56,400
Speaker 2: just felt weird.

427
00:25:57,160 --> 00:25:58,720
Speaker 3: He says this after the fact.

428
00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:00,760
Speaker 2: He does say it out after the fact, but he

429
00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:03,560
Speaker 2: says he noted getting out of the plane and even

430
00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:07,040
Speaker 2: was talking to his spouse at the time about how

431
00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:10,440
Speaker 2: weird even the plane felt after experiencing that stuff.

432
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:14,880
Speaker 3: Right, was something too close to the craft. So from here,

433
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:20,840
Speaker 3: the case Garner's international attention and the December thirtieth incident

434
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:27,680
Speaker 3: is really responding to a spate of multiple instances that

435
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:30,840
Speaker 3: have been reported on some level from the twenty first

436
00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:34,800
Speaker 3: to the thirtieth. The authorities feel they have to respond,

437
00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:38,879
Speaker 3: and so the local police, the Carter Observatory out in

438
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:42,800
Speaker 3: Wellington again, the town with all the toys, the Royal

439
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:46,440
Speaker 3: New Zealand Air Force, the Ministry of Defense. It's like

440
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:50,760
Speaker 3: our Department of Defense here, or excuse me, kaugh cough,

441
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:56,960
Speaker 3: Department of War cough cough. And so they all get involved.

442
00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:59,920
Speaker 3: And then this is in addition to scads of amit

443
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:04,040
Speaker 3: to our ufologists, established scientific experts with a lot of

444
00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:07,399
Speaker 3: bona fides and related fields. The New Zealand Air Force

445
00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:12,080
Speaker 3: literally puts a Skyhawk on standby in case we need

446
00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:15,560
Speaker 3: somebody to scoop scoop for further sightings and half a

447
00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:20,240
Speaker 3: world away, our friends at the company are analyzing later

448
00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:24,360
Speaker 3: reports from a Lackey P three Orion, a real spoopy

449
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:28,760
Speaker 3: doop ship that was sent to monitor the area. Those

450
00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:33,080
Speaker 3: two things, the Skyhawk and the Ariot, those occur away

451
00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:37,480
Speaker 3: from the public eye. And right now as we're recording

452
00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:41,760
Speaker 3: these lights, whatever they may be, they get sighted or

453
00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:46,199
Speaker 3: reported every now and again in the year sense, often

454
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:49,240
Speaker 3: toward the end of the year, with sub reports being

455
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:53,520
Speaker 3: as recent as twenty to fifty makes you wonder makes

456
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:58,119
Speaker 3: first question would be, is this due to a recurrent

457
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 3: meteorological condition, right that happens around that time of year,

458
00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:03,280
Speaker 3: or something like.

459
00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 4: That ghost lights type situation or like swamp gas not that,

460
00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 4: but like that, right, Yeah.

461
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:12,719
Speaker 2: I mean this news report went out to the public,

462
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:16,399
Speaker 2: so people got to see the actual filmed footage of

463
00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:20,119
Speaker 2: UFOs in nineteen seventy eight above this area. So you

464
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 2: have to imagine that's increasing traffic maybe to look for things,

465
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:27,960
Speaker 2: more eyes on the skies as it were.

466
00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:30,480
Speaker 3: It's it's priming interest.

467
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:33,280
Speaker 5: It's priming interest, but it could also be priming perception.

468
00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:36,440
Speaker 4: You know, there could be same thing, right, right, And

469
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:39,040
Speaker 4: it also reminds me of the drone situation where we

470
00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 4: had a Jersey I believe, where there were drones sighted

471
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 4: and these weird lights sighted and it was determined to

472
00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:49,200
Speaker 4: be like an array of drones or whatever. But by

473
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 4: virtue of all the reporting, more amateur dronists got their

474
00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:56,320
Speaker 4: drones out there and just added to the situation, therefore

475
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:58,560
Speaker 4: upping the number of people citing them.

476
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:00,640
Speaker 3: It's just like kind of a self feeding system. Yes,

477
00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:04,720
Speaker 3: it's a social dynamic. It's related to It's actually one

478
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:08,120
Speaker 3: of the primary reasons law enforcement never likes to say

479
00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:12,280
Speaker 3: a serial murderer unless it's unavoidable. So we have a

480
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 3: mystery afoot here or a sky if you like, dude, awesome,

481
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 3: that worked out. We can keep that part that So

482
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 3: there's While there has been to date new material evidence

483
00:29:25,880 --> 00:29:31,480
Speaker 3: recovered or at least publicly disclosed, this case checks all

484
00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 3: of the other boxes for a good UFO instance. We

485
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:39,400
Speaker 3: have multiple occurrences, we have a contained region, we have

486
00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:43,800
Speaker 3: multiple witnesses, some of whom are aviation or radar experts.

487
00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:48,280
Speaker 3: We have electronic confirmation, you name it. We've got everything

488
00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:50,680
Speaker 3: but the physical evidence. And so it must be no

489
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 3: surprise that almost half a century after that initial December twentieth,

490
00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:01,480
Speaker 3: nineteen seventy eight clocking. People around the world are still asking,

491
00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 3: what on or off earth happened? Can we explain that

492
00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:07,960
Speaker 3: Kaikora lights?

493
00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 5: Maybe we'll try, after I ward from my sponsor.

494
00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 3: Here's where it gets crazy. I thought it was already crazy.

495
00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:25,000
Speaker 3: Ben thought it's been crazy this whole time.

496
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:26,080
Speaker 8: Just now.

497
00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:30,440
Speaker 3: It's where we get to the explanation. Fair for uphold,

498
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:34,480
Speaker 3: and so often the well we have a soul to uphold.

499
00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:39,360
Speaker 3: So often the uh, the conspiracies are found in the

500
00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:42,320
Speaker 3: attempts to cover up things, right, not the original act.

501
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:46,239
Speaker 3: So uh yeah, it depends upon whom you ask. If

502
00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 3: we want to be technical, we'll get to the official

503
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 3: conclusions and why experts still question those, But maybe we

504
00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:57,920
Speaker 3: spend some more time on the primary source information about

505
00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:03,360
Speaker 3: the sightings. The first person to visibly clock those lights, Yeah,

506
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:07,160
Speaker 3: that would be Bill Startup. That's his name.

507
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:11,240
Speaker 4: That's his name, Bill started We got Davy Crockett and

508
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 4: Bill start old Billy Startup. But he was not a

509
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 4: tech bro. In fact, when Bill and the crew first

510
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:20,880
Speaker 4: reported the lights, he was at a loss for what

511
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:24,520
Speaker 4: this thing might be. He did not have words to

512
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 4: describe it. So he was left a bit flummoxed, much

513
00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:29,840
Speaker 4: like the fellow in that clip we heard, and so

514
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:30,920
Speaker 4: he said, what it was?

515
00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 3: We do not know? That's all I wish I knew.

516
00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:39,440
Speaker 2: He's one of the pilots, along with Bob guard right, who.

517
00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:42,280
Speaker 3: Was in the clip though, Matt, did we hear from

518
00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 3: this guy?

519
00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:44,280
Speaker 6: We have not heard of.

520
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 3: We haven't heard from Bill startup? Bill Bill startups. The

521
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 3: pilot who has to who has to call this in

522
00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:54,800
Speaker 3: and it has to say, as you as you do, Oh,

523
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:56,400
Speaker 3: what it was? We don't know?

524
00:31:57,040 --> 00:31:58,240
Speaker 5: I had to say, we do not know.

525
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:00,880
Speaker 3: It's so intense. I wish I do.

526
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:05,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, yeah, it's so interesting to see those guys

527
00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:08,080
Speaker 2: in interviews after a long time and recalling it and

528
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 2: just saying, dang, I really wish we knew what the

529
00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:12,160
Speaker 2: heck that was, Like, yeah, that would be awesome if

530
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:12,920
Speaker 2: we knew what that was.

531
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:16,880
Speaker 3: They're not pissed, they're professionals. They're not wing nuts. They

532
00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:21,480
Speaker 3: are people trying to do their job. And when you're

533
00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 3: doing when you are working in aviation, your least favorite

534
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:32,960
Speaker 3: thing is an unanswered question. That's that's the issue, because

535
00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 3: if you know what a problem is, if you can

536
00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:39,720
Speaker 3: identify what's happening. Then you you are on third base

537
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 3: to the home run of figuring out how to fix

538
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,840
Speaker 3: it right. But if it's inexplicable, then you don't know

539
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:48,840
Speaker 3: which questions to begin asking. So let's go to John

540
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:52,800
Speaker 3: Cordy briefly mentioned earlier. This is the radio operator out

541
00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:55,720
Speaker 3: of Wellington on the first night of the sightings, and

542
00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:58,480
Speaker 3: he had a bit of humor about the strange event

543
00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:03,760
Speaker 3: because atc guys are so cool man, so stressed out,

544
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 3: but you gotta let stress roll off your back like

545
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:11,640
Speaker 3: water off a duck. So this guy says, we saw

546
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:16,240
Speaker 3: some little targets on a radar just Dowt off of Blenheim.

547
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 3: Part of my pronunciation Cape Campbell Way. And we joked

548
00:33:19,840 --> 00:33:23,200
Speaker 3: there was Father Christmas having a practice run with Rudolph

549
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 3: in the front because it was just before Christmas. And

550
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:28,720
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, come on, man, you're cool. I

551
00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:30,800
Speaker 3: was that always does this.

552
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,240
Speaker 5: Live updates, stand up there having a laugh, Give.

553
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:40,640
Speaker 3: Me a break, it's amazing. He continues in a more

554
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 3: serious tone too, after he does the Father Christmas bit,

555
00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:48,520
Speaker 3: which again, nice one, John, He says, this target then

556
00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:51,840
Speaker 3: moved toward the argacy. Let's remember that's our cargo plane

557
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:55,520
Speaker 3: carrying the newspaper crates. The target quote turned with it.

558
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:58,600
Speaker 3: The argacy then quote tracked it with it for a

559
00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:01,640
Speaker 3: good twenty to thirty min files. The target and the

560
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:05,560
Speaker 3: aircraft were at ninety degrees to each other the whole time,

561
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:10,880
Speaker 3: and Vern Powell's aircraft said that they could see a

562
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:14,480
Speaker 3: big red light that was definitely airborne, and we got

563
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:18,000
Speaker 3: to hit that factor real quick. There was another aircraft

564
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:21,160
Speaker 3: that was close enough to observe this as well. So

565
00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:23,759
Speaker 3: now we don't just have one group of people in

566
00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:26,200
Speaker 3: the skies. We have two planes in the sky.

567
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:30,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, Vern Powell and Ian Peiri, they were the first

568
00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:34,520
Speaker 2: plane that saw this. Those are the fellows right that

569
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:38,840
Speaker 2: were actually hanging out with John Cordy in the very beginning,

570
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:44,680
Speaker 2: having that communication. Then those other two officers startup and guard.

571
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:48,200
Speaker 2: They are pilots. When the news crew went up on

572
00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:49,560
Speaker 2: the thirtieth and.

573
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:52,480
Speaker 3: I think we have another quote da ling. Yeah, fast

574
00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 3: forward to the thirtieth. We mentioned that TV crew on

575
00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:59,840
Speaker 3: the plane. We mentioned one of them, the journalists, Quentin Fogerty,

576
00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:05,440
Speaker 3: and he is like everybody else on the craft, he

577
00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 3: is watching in alle bewilderment and no small degree of

578
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:14,200
Speaker 3: helplessness as these lights are. And I keep using this term, guys,

579
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:16,920
Speaker 3: it's just perfect for it. The lights are bird dogging

580
00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:20,280
Speaker 3: their craft like Foo fighters in World War Two. Totally.

581
00:35:20,719 --> 00:35:24,320
Speaker 5: And we do have a quote from Fogerty where he

582
00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:26,120
Speaker 5: says the word pin pricks.

583
00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:28,640
Speaker 4: I think again, And I'm sorry, guys if I didn't

584
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:30,440
Speaker 4: clock the audio of that, because that, to me is

585
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:33,400
Speaker 4: the classic test of a Kiwi accent. But here he

586
00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:35,440
Speaker 4: says on the flight down, I'm not going to do

587
00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:38,480
Speaker 4: the voice as well. What we basically saw were pin

588
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:42,000
Speaker 4: pricks of light that turned into great globes of light.

589
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:45,040
Speaker 4: We did hear him talking about globes of light earlier,

590
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:47,880
Speaker 4: and they were airborne and they were between us and

591
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:50,279
Speaker 4: the coast because we could see the coast and we

592
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:53,640
Speaker 4: could see the sea and we could see these things

593
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:55,759
Speaker 4: shining down. There's a lot of seas there.

594
00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:59,200
Speaker 3: And then we have another sound clip we'd like to

595
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:02,560
Speaker 3: play from you from again to some of the footage

596
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:03,920
Speaker 3: we were referencing earlier.

597
00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can find this on the Kai Kora UFOs

598
00:36:07,560 --> 00:36:10,480
Speaker 2: Dash in nineteen seventy eight, written and produced by Paul Davidson.

599
00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:14,560
Speaker 2: Find it on YouTube. Here is a clip of these fellows.

600
00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:17,279
Speaker 2: I think it's a couple of different people describing what

601
00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:21,000
Speaker 2: they were seeing on that return flight from christ Church

602
00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:21,800
Speaker 2: to Wellington.

603
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:26,759
Speaker 7: They were brilliant white, silvery white starbus.

604
00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 1: Was unusual that they were going vertically up and down

605
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:33,280
Speaker 1: at a rate that, in my view, precluded.

606
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:34,640
Speaker 3: Them from being any thing that I've known about, like

607
00:36:34,719 --> 00:36:35,640
Speaker 3: helicopters already.

608
00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:38,880
Speaker 7: I'm now looking over towards the right of the aircraft

609
00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 7: and we have an object inferred by Weddings Breda. It's

610
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 7: been following us quite a while. It's about four miles

611
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:47,960
Speaker 7: away and it looks like the very faith start. But

612
00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:51,920
Speaker 7: then it's a very bright, white, brillant light.

613
00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:57,160
Speaker 6: I said, this is just a little bit fine.

614
00:36:57,200 --> 00:36:59,120
Speaker 2: Then there we go.

615
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:05,600
Speaker 3: Mmm. Yeah. So again we're hearing different instances of people

616
00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:08,719
Speaker 3: reporting very similar experiences.

617
00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, the first voice you heard was Bob Guard, who's

618
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:13,440
Speaker 2: one of the pilots on that flight. And then you

619
00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:17,319
Speaker 2: hear Quentin Fogerty replying with exactly what he's seeing doing

620
00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:18,960
Speaker 2: the reporter in situ thing.

621
00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:24,040
Speaker 3: And so now we have people with firsthand experience speaking

622
00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:29,480
Speaker 3: with specific knowledge and specific description of what they witnessed.

623
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:34,360
Speaker 3: The witnesses here all report seeing similar things. They're not

624
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:38,759
Speaker 3: changing or really embellishing their stories, and it doesn't sound

625
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:42,280
Speaker 3: like they had time to work together right and hatch

626
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:46,719
Speaker 3: some sort of universal narrative. They all are saying there

627
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:51,120
Speaker 3: are large, brightly lit things that are moving to high speeds,

628
00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:55,320
Speaker 3: that are making sudden turns which would be impossible for

629
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:59,640
Speaker 3: physical human made craft at the time type stuff.

630
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:04,000
Speaker 4: They're behaving in ways that science cannot fully explain. The

631
00:38:04,080 --> 00:38:06,600
Speaker 4: speed with which they go from the water to the air,

632
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:08,319
Speaker 4: and then this, you know, the speed, the way they're

633
00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:09,440
Speaker 4: maneuvering exactly.

634
00:38:09,160 --> 00:38:12,120
Speaker 3: Where they appear to and they're explained from their perspective rights.

635
00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:14,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, it should be noted that many of the witnesses

636
00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:18,239
Speaker 2: saw one larger bright light and then several at least

637
00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:22,000
Speaker 2: two smaller lights. Yes, that were they're seeing at the

638
00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:24,759
Speaker 2: same time, and those three lights would come together, and

639
00:38:24,840 --> 00:38:27,239
Speaker 2: sometimes they would shoot off into different directions and then

640
00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:28,400
Speaker 2: return back together.

641
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:29,520
Speaker 3: Very strange.

642
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:33,640
Speaker 4: That's like that's close encounters type vibes, or like that's

643
00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:35,319
Speaker 4: the way we've seen UFOs depict.

644
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:37,000
Speaker 3: I think there was an episode of The X Files too,

645
00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:38,520
Speaker 3: where there were those kids that were.

646
00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:41,839
Speaker 4: Kind of spying on the site where there were these

647
00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:44,279
Speaker 4: like spinny light things kind of moving around, and then.

648
00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:47,000
Speaker 3: I forget exactly how that episode went. But well, the

649
00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:50,600
Speaker 3: idea too is we're telling you the most consistent stuff.

650
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:54,320
Speaker 3: So the number does change based on the eyewitness accounts.

651
00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:57,320
Speaker 3: We're not even counting the hundreds of folks on the

652
00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 3: ground who confirm sightings multiple sites around the same time.

653
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:05,400
Speaker 3: It's definitely not counting the count I can't believe here

654
00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:08,520
Speaker 3: with that. It's not counting the countless other folks, including

655
00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:12,880
Speaker 3: experts who later analyze the film footage from the plane

656
00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 3: from the ground, especially after so many people are primed

657
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:20,400
Speaker 3: to expect this right, are turning their eyes to the

658
00:39:20,520 --> 00:39:27,360
Speaker 3: night sky and wondering if they two, we'll see something incomprehensible. So, riddle,

659
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:31,479
Speaker 3: is this, what do the authorities say after it gets

660
00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:34,719
Speaker 3: after it gets past a certain threshold of attention, you

661
00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:38,480
Speaker 3: as the government do have to make some kind of response,

662
00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:42,480
Speaker 3: even if you just say, nah, it's a windy house,

663
00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:43,399
Speaker 3: no ghost here.

664
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:49,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, you saw what your eyes thought were UFO, but

665
00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:52,200
Speaker 2: really it was an illusion.

666
00:39:52,560 --> 00:39:59,800
Speaker 3: Michael David blamed them, Yeah, David blained and David blamed

667
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 3: them because the Ministry of Defense publicly initially said, Hey,

668
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:09,759
Speaker 3: these sightings are merely optical illusions, perhaps the result of

669
00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:16,120
Speaker 3: atmospheric phenomena. How many of you are meteorologists, bump bump up.

670
00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:20,880
Speaker 3: But witnesses who are involved, especially our primary aviators, are

671
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:25,080
Speaker 3: protagonists to the story. They're not having it. They feel

672
00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:28,879
Speaker 3: if we're being honest, they feel there's an attempt at gaslighting,

673
00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:32,600
Speaker 3: and they're professionally offended. Yes they should be.

674
00:40:33,239 --> 00:40:36,680
Speaker 2: Well, somebody came over and said, you've forgotten about the

675
00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:37,480
Speaker 2: radar You.

676
00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:44,400
Speaker 3: Exactly exactly, I mean Startup in particular, just for that,

677
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:49,720
Speaker 3: I just love the name. Startup in Particular went on record,

678
00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:53,200
Speaker 3: and you can hear him. We're jumping around time a

679
00:40:53,239 --> 00:40:56,440
Speaker 3: little bit, but you can hear him listening out various

680
00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:59,880
Speaker 3: proposed explanations. He's like, Oh, they said it was v

681
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:02,680
Speaker 3: they said it was Jupiter, they said it was harbor

682
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:06,640
Speaker 3: lights or squid boats. But I saw these lights doing

683
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:10,280
Speaker 3: like one hundred and forty knots, and harbor lights don't

684
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:15,960
Speaker 3: do that. Usually they're stationary if they're built the way

685
00:41:16,080 --> 00:41:17,360
Speaker 3: they're supposed to be built.

686
00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:21,680
Speaker 2: Oh, you know, and that explanation in particular, calling out

687
00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:25,279
Speaker 2: other planetary bodies. That's something that came into play with

688
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:30,360
Speaker 2: Frederick Valentich over in Australia. The primary explanations of that

689
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:33,800
Speaker 2: early on were that he got really confused when he

690
00:41:33,880 --> 00:41:36,680
Speaker 2: saw some of the planet lights. He thought they were

691
00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:40,440
Speaker 2: following him, and then he put his plane into basically

692
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:43,960
Speaker 2: a downward spiral as he's watching these lights that are

693
00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:47,239
Speaker 2: now reflected off the ocean. But you know, come on,

694
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:51,680
Speaker 2: that just seems I mean, I get it that people

695
00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:56,360
Speaker 2: are looking in this instance, the mod Ministry, defense, whoever

696
00:41:56,640 --> 00:41:58,759
Speaker 2: that's looking at this stuff is trying to find an

697
00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:03,560
Speaker 2: explanation that makes right. It doesn't have to be anything weird, guys,

698
00:42:03,600 --> 00:42:06,719
Speaker 2: it could be this, but it just seems so insulting

699
00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:10,840
Speaker 2: to anybody who can fly a plane like that, right.

700
00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:15,080
Speaker 3: Right, and again, if you listen to our episode on Valentich,

701
00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:22,000
Speaker 3: you will see similar proposed explanations for what occurred in

702
00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:24,719
Speaker 3: that tragedy. His body has yet to be recovered, by

703
00:42:24,760 --> 00:42:27,800
Speaker 3: the way, here in twenty twenty five as we record.

704
00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:29,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I'm saying. It was the exact same

705
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:33,520
Speaker 2: explanations given just a couple of months before this thing

706
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:34,000
Speaker 2: went down.

707
00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:40,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, and the idea here is battle of narratives. Perhaps again,

708
00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:45,360
Speaker 3: please do check out that episode on Valentich. I agreed,

709
00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:49,000
Speaker 3: there's an eerie parallel which makes us worth a re listen.

710
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:54,839
Speaker 3: We also know that, as we're going to learn after

711
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:59,520
Speaker 3: our break here, the official initial conclusion of the Ministry

712
00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:04,160
Speaker 3: of Defense was not entirely true, very Emily Dickinson style,

713
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 3: tell the truth, but tell it slants, because you see,

714
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:10,440
Speaker 3: the whole time they were saying this to the public,

715
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:13,959
Speaker 3: New Zealand and a few other groups, few other friend

716
00:43:14,040 --> 00:43:18,959
Speaker 3: groups were intensely interested in figuring out what the heck

717
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:22,880
Speaker 3: was going on, and so away from the press, they

718
00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 3: launched that inquiry we mentioned earlier. We'll take a break

719
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 3: for a word from our sponsors and tell you what

720
00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:37,440
Speaker 3: they found. We're back first theories, squid votes, all right,

721
00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:42,200
Speaker 3: just the bubble here real quick, because I don't know

722
00:43:42,239 --> 00:43:44,560
Speaker 3: about you guys. I was really excited in the very

723
00:43:45,960 --> 00:43:50,000
Speaker 3: downtrodden when I learned that they did not mean squids

724
00:43:50,080 --> 00:43:54,000
Speaker 3: piloting squid made craft. I know I was thinking that too.

725
00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:57,360
Speaker 3: It was a fun image. Though that's a cool We

726
00:43:57,520 --> 00:44:01,720
Speaker 3: always have that moment where we thought we will always

727
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:07,879
Speaker 3: have that moment. Well, squid boats are cool, though sure, yeah, yeah, yeah,

728
00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:11,600
Speaker 3: they're a big part of the maritime economy. There's that

729
00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:15,960
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, we're trying to be cool dads, all right, Yeah.

730
00:44:16,160 --> 00:44:19,319
Speaker 2: Well, let's talk about why they thought maybe that was it. Yeah,

731
00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:24,440
Speaker 2: squid boats use big old lights shining down into the

732
00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:27,839
Speaker 2: water to try and attract squid. So you can imagine

733
00:44:28,040 --> 00:44:30,759
Speaker 2: that if there's some kind of reflection in glass. If

734
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:35,440
Speaker 2: there's some that's usually one of the proposals. Right, The

735
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:40,040
Speaker 2: pilot sees light that's actually on the water reflecting off

736
00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:43,399
Speaker 2: their glass, and it appears to be moving around if

737
00:44:43,440 --> 00:44:46,879
Speaker 2: the plane changes course in any way, it's like, oh wow,

738
00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:49,160
Speaker 2: it's moving across my screen.

739
00:44:48,920 --> 00:44:52,480
Speaker 3: There, or reflecting off cloud cover. M you know what

740
00:44:52,600 --> 00:44:55,880
Speaker 3: I mean. This is the thing I do with with

741
00:44:56,200 --> 00:44:58,560
Speaker 3: my cats. You know, you take a shiny mirror or

742
00:44:58,600 --> 00:45:01,239
Speaker 3: reflect light and they chase the image of the light

743
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 3: the way they chase a red dot or something like that.

744
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:08,399
Speaker 3: So the explanation is similar there, and we can see

745
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:12,320
Speaker 3: why that would be offensive to some professional aviators and

746
00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:18,600
Speaker 3: the other thing. Okay, so this inquiry doesn't end in

747
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:24,440
Speaker 3: a specific, ironclad conclusion. It ends in something like a

748
00:45:24,560 --> 00:45:26,840
Speaker 3: pitch meeting. So they say, oh, you don't like the

749
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:31,160
Speaker 3: squid boat explanation, Well, what about this? What if they're

750
00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:33,920
Speaker 3: like unburned meteors.

751
00:45:34,600 --> 00:45:39,000
Speaker 2: Ah, now we're getting somewhere, because that would clock radar, right,

752
00:45:39,239 --> 00:45:43,440
Speaker 2: unlike the squid boat reflection. We don't get radar from that. Okay.

753
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:47,640
Speaker 2: And there was a meteor shower around that time in

754
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:48,200
Speaker 2: that area.

755
00:45:48,680 --> 00:45:52,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, okay, sure, big swing. Getting closer as far

756
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:56,520
Speaker 3: as explanations go. And then they said something, you know,

757
00:45:56,760 --> 00:46:00,120
Speaker 3: very similar to the squid boat idea. They said, this

758
00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:04,800
Speaker 3: could have been lights from trains or other earthly vehicles,

759
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:12,000
Speaker 3: atmospheric shenanigans, cloud physics. You guys know about planes. About

760
00:46:12,000 --> 00:46:14,280
Speaker 3: how much do you know about astrophysics?

761
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:16,960
Speaker 2: Huh, cold, cold, they are right.

762
00:46:17,239 --> 00:46:19,680
Speaker 3: And then they said, or what if it was light

763
00:46:19,840 --> 00:46:23,239
Speaker 3: from planets like Venus and Jupiter. And at this point

764
00:46:23,280 --> 00:46:25,640
Speaker 3: the pilots are going, I hate you guys. Why are

765
00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:26,160
Speaker 3: you like this?

766
00:46:27,960 --> 00:46:29,880
Speaker 2: Why aren't you do this? Can it just be we

767
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:32,200
Speaker 2: saw something crazy that we don't know about yet?

768
00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:37,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, right exactly, which would be the Okham's razor of it.

769
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:44,640
Speaker 3: Governmental institutions generally do not like admitting they cannot explain

770
00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:49,880
Speaker 3: a thing, right, So by this point there's the mass

771
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:53,040
Speaker 3: of the public. The Hoi polloi right, the vox popular.

772
00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:57,960
Speaker 3: The Kaikoro lights have become a cultural phenomenon. So from

773
00:46:58,080 --> 00:47:02,600
Speaker 3: the eighteen nineteen eighties, sorry I'm dating myself the nineteen

774
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:06,759
Speaker 3: eighties to now, even the most skeptical of locals in

775
00:47:07,120 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 3: Kiwi communities will occasionally look up into the night sky

776
00:47:11,280 --> 00:47:16,359
Speaker 3: around December and they'll say, hey, maybe it'll happen again,

777
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:19,400
Speaker 3: Maybe I'll see some UFOs visit at the end of

778
00:47:19,480 --> 00:47:22,600
Speaker 3: the earthly year. Before we go, though, we do have

779
00:47:22,680 --> 00:47:26,919
Speaker 3: to give a shout out to, of course, various researchers

780
00:47:27,200 --> 00:47:30,320
Speaker 3: who have analyzed the footage. Countless people have done this.

781
00:47:30,520 --> 00:47:33,000
Speaker 3: You can see it all over the internet. One of

782
00:47:33,080 --> 00:47:38,520
Speaker 3: the most prominent is a moufon guy scientist named doctor

783
00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 3: Bruce mccabee.

784
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:45,440
Speaker 4: That's right, doctor Bruce maccabee, American scientists and ufologist with

785
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:49,560
Speaker 4: an MS and PhD in physics. Got some bona fides there,

786
00:47:50,480 --> 00:47:54,600
Speaker 4: who's also just you know, as a little bonus an

787
00:47:54,680 --> 00:47:57,040
Speaker 4: optical data processing expert.

788
00:47:57,520 --> 00:47:59,560
Speaker 3: He concluded that the footage had.

789
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:05,040
Speaker 4: Captured the images and movements of the genuine article UFO.

790
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:09,359
Speaker 3: H yeah, and we've got quotes from him you can

791
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:14,960
Speaker 3: again read these or see them in various documentaries. He

792
00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:18,480
Speaker 3: notes some of the same stuff we're saying that a

793
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 3: big differentiator here is that radar plays a role in

794
00:48:22,800 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 3: these sightings, So unlike a lot, here's what you get.

795
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:33,840
Speaker 3: Often you will often get UFO reports that are radar

796
00:48:34,080 --> 00:48:38,200
Speaker 3: only right, so there's an ATC somewhere, or there's a

797
00:48:38,480 --> 00:48:45,239
Speaker 3: totally legitimate thing abroad for some reason that gets a

798
00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:50,600
Speaker 3: little pupupew on its radar and there's no eyewitness accounts

799
00:48:50,880 --> 00:48:53,600
Speaker 3: because it happens in a place where people don't usually

800
00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:54,160
Speaker 3: hang out.

801
00:48:54,719 --> 00:48:58,600
Speaker 2: Yes, and you know who has really good radar technology, militaries,

802
00:48:58,960 --> 00:49:02,320
Speaker 2: So it's often a military that goes, hey, what the

803
00:49:02,360 --> 00:49:05,440
Speaker 2: heck is that over there, as in the instance in

804
00:49:05,600 --> 00:49:08,880
Speaker 2: nineteen fifty three with Felix Monclaw where there was a

805
00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:11,520
Speaker 2: radar blip in an area where there shouldn't be a

806
00:49:11,680 --> 00:49:15,040
Speaker 2: radar blip because it's controlled airspace. So you send out

807
00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:17,560
Speaker 2: a pilot to go check out what's going on, and

808
00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:22,279
Speaker 2: in Felix's case, he and his plane disappeared. But that's

809
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:25,960
Speaker 2: beside the point. The whole point is the radar sightings

810
00:49:26,040 --> 00:49:29,000
Speaker 2: occur a crazy number of times that we will never

811
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:29,960
Speaker 2: hear about.

812
00:49:30,080 --> 00:49:35,520
Speaker 3: Right, because they're internal and there as a result, they're

813
00:49:35,719 --> 00:49:39,239
Speaker 3: something that would maybe not be helpful to report to

814
00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:44,160
Speaker 3: the public because in doing so, you're revealing your surveillance capability,

815
00:49:44,400 --> 00:49:50,120
Speaker 3: your collection methods, all your fun stuff. Going back to maccabee,

816
00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:56,479
Speaker 3: the next thing he reports is that it is more

817
00:49:56,680 --> 00:50:00,200
Speaker 3: interesting to see. So we've got two things, right. Our

818
00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:04,640
Speaker 3: only identification often internal for governments, and we've got visual

819
00:50:04,840 --> 00:50:10,680
Speaker 3: only identification, often associated with civilians or non aviation experts.

820
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:14,440
Speaker 3: And when they are reporting something, there's often not a

821
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:18,200
Speaker 3: lot of instrumentation. We're not dismissing, we're just saying there's

822
00:50:18,239 --> 00:50:21,440
Speaker 3: often not a lot of instrumentation that would confirm what

823
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:24,920
Speaker 3: they were saying happened at that time. So this means

824
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:27,880
Speaker 3: that we've got a golden goose here. We've got a

825
00:50:28,080 --> 00:50:33,120
Speaker 3: ven diagram of a radar visual case. Witnesses are reporting

826
00:50:33,239 --> 00:50:38,120
Speaker 3: something going in the same direction, obeying the same dynamics,

827
00:50:38,200 --> 00:50:42,400
Speaker 3: the same trajectory and path as a target identified or

828
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:47,520
Speaker 3: a thing identified on radar. This is winning the lottery twice.

829
00:50:48,080 --> 00:50:51,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, man, because that's why this one is so exciting.

830
00:50:52,600 --> 00:50:55,399
Speaker 2: So then you've got this amazing person, Macabe who's looking

831
00:50:55,440 --> 00:50:59,840
Speaker 2: at the film footage that this camera person, Davy Crockett,

832
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:05,640
Speaker 2: Dave he saw and filmed again with a handheld film

833
00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:08,920
Speaker 2: camera in a cockpit that's you know, in an airplane

834
00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:12,840
Speaker 2: that's in flight. And if you're serious, like a sixteen

835
00:51:12,840 --> 00:51:17,759
Speaker 2: millimeters yes, insane, So imagine the heft and weight of

836
00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:20,680
Speaker 2: this huge film canister above the lens.

837
00:51:20,520 --> 00:51:21,040
Speaker 3: And he's.

838
00:51:22,680 --> 00:51:27,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, and he's leaning over people and through instrumentation

839
00:51:27,480 --> 00:51:29,880
Speaker 2: to try and get footage. And when you look at

840
00:51:29,920 --> 00:51:34,600
Speaker 2: the footage, it looks like that what you're imagining, crazy jumpy. Uh,

841
00:51:34,960 --> 00:51:37,960
Speaker 2: you do see objects as he's trying to get focus

842
00:51:38,239 --> 00:51:40,279
Speaker 2: in the black sky with a tiny little thing.

843
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:43,480
Speaker 4: When you're bouncing around like that and you're filming items

844
00:51:43,520 --> 00:51:45,440
Speaker 4: that are way off in the horizon, you're gonna get

845
00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:46,000
Speaker 4: all kinds of.

846
00:51:49,600 --> 00:51:49,839
Speaker 3: Yeah.

847
00:51:50,120 --> 00:51:54,080
Speaker 2: So that's why it's massively important and incredible that we

848
00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:57,239
Speaker 2: have the words here of mister maccabee, who is a

849
00:51:57,800 --> 00:52:00,919
Speaker 2: specialist in checking out that kind of stuf. Knowing, Okay,

850
00:52:01,120 --> 00:52:03,719
Speaker 2: is the is that a lensing effect, is that the

851
00:52:03,880 --> 00:52:06,680
Speaker 2: movement of the camera, Is that the actual shape of

852
00:52:06,719 --> 00:52:09,440
Speaker 2: the object or is it out of focus? He's he's

853
00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:13,160
Speaker 2: looking at all of this stuff. And he continues with

854
00:52:13,239 --> 00:52:14,239
Speaker 2: a quote saying.

855
00:52:14,400 --> 00:52:19,360
Speaker 4: These New Zealand sightings may be the most quote unquote instrumented.

856
00:52:20,120 --> 00:52:24,839
Speaker 4: What's unpack that in civilian ufology with multiple witnesses, two

857
00:52:25,000 --> 00:52:29,640
Speaker 4: independent tape recordings made during the sightings, color movie film,

858
00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:33,280
Speaker 4: and ground and air radar instrue.

859
00:52:33,320 --> 00:52:34,680
Speaker 5: I guess he's just referring to like.

860
00:52:34,760 --> 00:52:37,200
Speaker 4: All of the cross check kind of like you know,

861
00:52:37,520 --> 00:52:40,799
Speaker 4: parallels and and verifiable data points.

862
00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:45,440
Speaker 3: Objective non qualitative confirmation that.

863
00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:47,960
Speaker 4: Line up, and that there's like a timeline that can

864
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:51,080
Speaker 4: be confirmed for that is a big doub I'm shocked,

865
00:52:51,160 --> 00:52:53,600
Speaker 4: guys that I'd not heard of this outside of this discussion.

866
00:52:53,719 --> 00:52:57,239
Speaker 3: This is seems like it would be a bigger deal that, Yeah,

867
00:52:57,600 --> 00:53:04,040
Speaker 3: the radar has has one opinion, yes this is here

868
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:07,279
Speaker 3: or no this is not. It's not going to give

869
00:53:07,360 --> 00:53:12,200
Speaker 3: you some sort of laborious interview process about how it

870
00:53:12,320 --> 00:53:14,400
Speaker 3: felt when a clock to a thing going from a

871
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:15,920
Speaker 3: to his head exactly exactly.

872
00:53:15,960 --> 00:53:18,200
Speaker 4: And frankly, I mean the reports from these guys are

873
00:53:18,239 --> 00:53:19,400
Speaker 4: pretty dispassionate too.

874
00:53:19,800 --> 00:53:20,759
Speaker 3: We're not seeing a.

875
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:23,399
Speaker 5: Whole lot of like hyperbolic kind of talk.

876
00:53:23,520 --> 00:53:28,240
Speaker 4: They seem real, steadfast, and they're you know, reporting their observations.

877
00:53:28,320 --> 00:53:31,239
Speaker 3: You got to keep it together, ye crying. Crying is

878
00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:32,080
Speaker 3: for when you land.

879
00:53:33,640 --> 00:53:36,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, and you see a real desire to know

880
00:53:36,680 --> 00:53:40,279
Speaker 2: what the heck happened. In later interviews, several of the

881
00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:43,960
Speaker 2: pilots were approached by Maccabee with you know, his findings

882
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:47,759
Speaker 2: after he analyzed the footage, and these pilots had given

883
00:53:47,880 --> 00:53:51,440
Speaker 2: initial estimates of like how large they think the object

884
00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:54,279
Speaker 2: is in the moment, how far away they think it is,

885
00:53:54,400 --> 00:53:57,520
Speaker 2: and how fast it's traveling. One of the pilots comes

886
00:53:57,560 --> 00:54:00,880
Speaker 2: forward and says, Maccabee told him that the object was

887
00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:04,680
Speaker 2: around five miles away from your plane and it was

888
00:54:04,800 --> 00:54:08,680
Speaker 2: probably as big as a two story building. After he's

889
00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:12,279
Speaker 2: analyzed the optics, which again you have to take an

890
00:54:12,320 --> 00:54:15,920
Speaker 2: expert's you know, viewpoint and say, Okay, that expert knows

891
00:54:15,960 --> 00:54:18,200
Speaker 2: what they're talking about, knows what they're seeing. You also

892
00:54:18,239 --> 00:54:21,239
Speaker 2: are taking into account the pilot's you know, vision and

893
00:54:21,400 --> 00:54:24,800
Speaker 2: their estimates based on knowledge and wisdom. But at the

894
00:54:24,840 --> 00:54:27,440
Speaker 2: same time it does make you realize, in the moment,

895
00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:30,680
Speaker 2: when a human being, any of us, is experiencing something

896
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:34,360
Speaker 2: like this, we're trusting our eyes and our ears and

897
00:54:34,400 --> 00:54:36,560
Speaker 2: all of our senses, but they may be a little

898
00:54:36,600 --> 00:54:39,680
Speaker 2: off right, and you may also remember it a little off.

899
00:54:40,600 --> 00:54:43,279
Speaker 2: But having a piece of footage and that radar like

900
00:54:43,360 --> 00:54:46,600
Speaker 2: that let somebody even out of space and time observe

901
00:54:46,680 --> 00:54:49,759
Speaker 2: it and say, oh my god, I think it was

902
00:54:49,920 --> 00:54:51,960
Speaker 2: this because of you know, X, Y and Z.

903
00:54:53,280 --> 00:54:57,800
Speaker 3: Yeah. And we also, as we mentioned with his bona fides,

904
00:54:58,120 --> 00:55:02,160
Speaker 3: doctor mccabee is a as a career long member and

905
00:55:02,280 --> 00:55:05,400
Speaker 3: champion and move on. So that might put some folks

906
00:55:05,440 --> 00:55:09,080
Speaker 3: in the crowd automatically off, but we can tell you

907
00:55:09,600 --> 00:55:12,600
Speaker 3: his findings. And he wrote a ton of stuff, by

908
00:55:12,600 --> 00:55:16,080
Speaker 3: the way, not just about this but about other dodgy

909
00:55:16,239 --> 00:55:23,120
Speaker 3: cases of UFO observations. And he was publicly ignored by

910
00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:26,439
Speaker 3: the government of New Zealand. So you could say, hey,

911
00:55:26,600 --> 00:55:31,040
Speaker 3: this is a cultural moment like Mothman out in Point Pleasant,

912
00:55:31,080 --> 00:55:35,879
Speaker 3: West Virginia. You could say that, except that in twenty ten,

913
00:55:36,239 --> 00:55:40,080
Speaker 3: the New Zealand military released a treasure their own Project

914
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:44,520
Speaker 3: Blue Book, really a treasure trove of previously classified reports

915
00:55:44,920 --> 00:55:48,439
Speaker 3: that dated from two thousand and nine all the way

916
00:55:48,520 --> 00:55:52,000
Speaker 3: back to nineteen fifty four, which means it naturally includes

917
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:56,719
Speaker 3: the Kakolites, and was released due to the Official Records Act,

918
00:55:56,800 --> 00:55:59,959
Speaker 3: which is sort of the New Zealand version of FOYIA,

919
00:56:00,480 --> 00:56:05,000
Speaker 3: the Freedom of Information Act. It's heavily redacted. Everybody got

920
00:56:05,040 --> 00:56:08,280
Speaker 3: a deal on black highlighters right when they made these laws,

921
00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 3: so that you won't see a lot of specific names

922
00:56:11,760 --> 00:56:16,240
Speaker 3: or other sensitive material. But we're talking two thousand pages

923
00:56:16,280 --> 00:56:22,200
Speaker 3: of documents, most of which involves weird stuff in the sky,

924
00:56:22,400 --> 00:56:26,759
Speaker 3: weird lights of the sky. And we found a we

925
00:56:26,880 --> 00:56:31,080
Speaker 3: found a funny moment from from just prior to the

926
00:56:31,200 --> 00:56:35,279
Speaker 3: release of this from the Royal Air Force themselves, and

927
00:56:35,360 --> 00:56:37,000
Speaker 3: they were trying to get in front of it so

928
00:56:37,239 --> 00:56:39,200
Speaker 3: hard we can we do the quote.

929
00:56:39,560 --> 00:56:43,439
Speaker 2: Air Force Squadron leader Cave Tamriiki said the Defense Force

930
00:56:43,560 --> 00:56:47,120
Speaker 2: did not have the resources to investigate UFO sightings and

931
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:49,920
Speaker 2: would not be commenting on the files contents.

932
00:56:50,160 --> 00:56:55,960
Speaker 3: Mike, come on, come on, I hate when people do that,

933
00:56:56,520 --> 00:57:00,279
Speaker 3: right Like, Hey, I'm gonna tell you something and that's

934
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:04,360
Speaker 3: it and no more questions. So speaking to the dominion Post,

935
00:57:04,760 --> 00:57:09,120
Speaker 3: Tamriki notes, quote, this is understandable, all right, I'm being

936
00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:12,560
Speaker 3: a jerk. This is understandable. Quote. We've just been a

937
00:57:12,719 --> 00:57:17,160
Speaker 3: collection point for the information. We don't investigate or make reports.

938
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:20,800
Speaker 3: We haven't substantiated anything.

939
00:57:20,720 --> 00:57:22,600
Speaker 2: In them, but here you go.

940
00:57:23,080 --> 00:57:26,880
Speaker 3: But here it is. So we're not in charge of this.

941
00:57:27,960 --> 00:57:33,080
Speaker 3: We have no comment. But you asked, have we complied?

942
00:57:33,240 --> 00:57:34,800
Speaker 3: You can see why they wanted to get in front

943
00:57:34,840 --> 00:57:38,080
Speaker 3: of it. The documents have a lot of wild stuff,

944
00:57:38,320 --> 00:57:42,040
Speaker 3: again none of which is co signed by the Air Force.

945
00:57:42,880 --> 00:57:47,360
Speaker 3: Alleged examples of alien writing, drawing, draw it, yeah, I know,

946
00:57:47,560 --> 00:57:50,600
Speaker 3: drawings of flying saucers. And then here's one for the

947
00:57:50,640 --> 00:57:54,880
Speaker 3: stargate fans in the crowd, in depth descriptions of extraterrestrials

948
00:57:55,040 --> 00:57:57,160
Speaker 3: wearing Pharaoh mask.

949
00:57:57,680 --> 00:57:57,840
Speaker 2: Oh.

950
00:57:59,240 --> 00:58:05,760
Speaker 3: Oh, that's amazing. That's amazing. It's a good story from

951
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:09,520
Speaker 3: what the Air Force is telling us here. They for

952
00:58:09,760 --> 00:58:12,880
Speaker 3: decades they got these reports and then they just put

953
00:58:12,920 --> 00:58:15,440
Speaker 3: them here. Let me get one. They put them in

954
00:58:15,480 --> 00:58:17,800
Speaker 3: a file folder. You know what I mean. I'm holding

955
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:22,480
Speaker 3: up a file folder, all right. That one's about cattle.

956
00:58:22,960 --> 00:58:23,720
Speaker 8: So the U.

957
00:58:26,400 --> 00:58:31,200
Speaker 3: So any agency, of course, is going to take pains

958
00:58:31,240 --> 00:58:34,640
Speaker 3: to say, look, we just got what came in because

959
00:58:34,680 --> 00:58:38,360
Speaker 3: we drew the short straw right and we didn't verify anything.

960
00:58:39,120 --> 00:58:42,760
Speaker 3: But they also spend a lot of time in these

961
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:48,120
Speaker 3: documents on kai Kora specifically, on Kaikora specifically. The evidence

962
00:58:48,240 --> 00:58:51,520
Speaker 3: gives lie to the original story. Guys. The original story

963
00:58:52,200 --> 00:58:56,400
Speaker 3: is that New Zealand said stop panicking over weather phenomena.

964
00:58:57,000 --> 00:59:01,200
Speaker 3: The real story is that internally they lost their bag

965
00:59:01,360 --> 00:59:04,920
Speaker 3: over this. You know, they launched this inquiry because they

966
00:59:05,000 --> 00:59:07,800
Speaker 3: were concerned. And I love the point of context we're

967
00:59:07,800 --> 00:59:10,560
Speaker 3: bringing up here. It's still Cold War, right, They're concerned

968
00:59:10,600 --> 00:59:15,959
Speaker 3: that there might be some vaguely described intruders. They don't

969
00:59:16,000 --> 00:59:21,120
Speaker 3: define the intruders. They just say intruders, sort of like

970
00:59:21,160 --> 00:59:24,120
Speaker 3: when your dog barks, it just says stranger.

971
00:59:24,360 --> 00:59:26,880
Speaker 5: And anytime someone comes into my house, whether it's my

972
00:59:26,960 --> 00:59:27,800
Speaker 5: kid or to Frida, I.

973
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:32,120
Speaker 3: Just go intruder, show yourself. You know, that's do you really?

974
00:59:32,280 --> 00:59:32,440
Speaker 2: I do.

975
00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:37,000
Speaker 3: It's sort of a bit. It's a joke. That's why

976
00:59:37,000 --> 00:59:37,920
Speaker 3: I'm so paranoid.

977
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:38,160
Speaker 6: Man.

978
00:59:38,640 --> 00:59:40,520
Speaker 3: We used to hang out. I would. I would get

979
00:59:40,560 --> 00:59:42,600
Speaker 3: in front of your house and then text you to

980
00:59:42,720 --> 00:59:45,080
Speaker 3: let out. You know, I was there before I touched

981
00:59:45,080 --> 00:59:45,400
Speaker 3: the At.

982
00:59:45,360 --> 00:59:48,040
Speaker 5: Least I didn't have one of those like paint cannon things.

983
00:59:48,560 --> 00:59:51,840
Speaker 4: You remember those security cameras that would like pelt like

984
00:59:52,280 --> 00:59:54,200
Speaker 4: intruders with paintballs.

985
00:59:54,760 --> 00:59:56,520
Speaker 3: That's kind of cool. Oh, we talked about it. It

986
00:59:56,640 --> 00:59:58,880
Speaker 3: was a really bad idea. It was like some strange

987
00:59:58,920 --> 01:00:03,120
Speaker 3: news thing we talked about. Well, mack, cool idea. Well,

988
01:00:03,360 --> 01:00:06,800
Speaker 3: depending on which side of the door you're on, So

989
01:00:07,240 --> 01:00:12,160
Speaker 3: the inquiry here does make some Again, they end with

990
01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:14,360
Speaker 3: a bunch of pitches laying well, maybe it's blah blah

991
01:00:14,360 --> 01:00:16,640
Speaker 3: blahor moybees blah blah blah have you thought about blah

992
01:00:16,640 --> 01:00:22,120
Speaker 3: blah blah. But their inquiry reaches one interesting thing. They

993
01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:26,800
Speaker 3: eventually say, okay, we'll play if then. So the if

994
01:00:26,880 --> 01:00:31,840
Speaker 3: then game. If the objects did exist, and if the

995
01:00:32,120 --> 01:00:37,480
Speaker 3: multiple observations of those objects are correct, if they are accurate,

996
01:00:38,000 --> 01:00:42,040
Speaker 3: then those objects logically have to be traveling at around

997
01:00:42,400 --> 01:00:47,520
Speaker 3: ten eight hundred miles per hour, which for anybody playing

998
01:00:47,520 --> 01:00:49,280
Speaker 3: along at home, is pretty fast.

999
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:52,680
Speaker 2: Yes, maybe too fast for a lot of the stuff.

1000
01:00:53,640 --> 01:00:55,240
Speaker 2: You know, we were going to bring in stuff about

1001
01:00:55,280 --> 01:00:58,439
Speaker 2: drone technology that we talked about that was in full

1002
01:00:58,480 --> 01:01:01,160
Speaker 2: effect in the eighties and they're been tests on like

1003
01:01:01,360 --> 01:01:06,360
Speaker 2: radio controlled drone like things since World War Two. So

1004
01:01:06,480 --> 01:01:08,320
Speaker 2: like there's all kinds of weird stuff that could be

1005
01:01:08,440 --> 01:01:13,040
Speaker 2: up there that maybe some other governments operating and testing. Sure,

1006
01:01:13,120 --> 01:01:14,800
Speaker 2: sure would be weird to be testing it that close

1007
01:01:14,920 --> 01:01:16,560
Speaker 2: New Zealand if you're another country.

1008
01:01:17,520 --> 01:01:21,120
Speaker 3: But you know, I don't know. I mean, if it's

1009
01:01:21,200 --> 01:01:24,600
Speaker 3: Cold War, right, and it's the Allies against the Axis,

1010
01:01:25,120 --> 01:01:28,560
Speaker 3: you know, just think.

1011
01:01:28,560 --> 01:01:31,240
Speaker 2: Again, nineteen seventy eight is like high time there.

1012
01:01:31,200 --> 01:01:33,640
Speaker 3: For some of that stuff. Maybe it takes a village

1013
01:01:34,120 --> 01:01:39,480
Speaker 3: later later Nole's friends at the company, the CIA will

1014
01:01:40,000 --> 01:01:41,800
Speaker 3: do you like I just three, I mean the US there.

1015
01:01:42,400 --> 01:01:49,680
Speaker 3: That's so they they analyzed this stuff on their own

1016
01:01:50,200 --> 01:01:54,160
Speaker 3: and they said, similar to what doctor mcabee said, who

1017
01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:58,040
Speaker 3: I suspect may have had some conversations, they said the

1018
01:01:58,600 --> 01:02:02,360
Speaker 3: quote large amount of docum minary evidence includes the recollection

1019
01:02:02,520 --> 01:02:05,920
Speaker 3: of seven witnesses to tape recordings made during the sightings,

1020
01:02:06,400 --> 01:02:10,280
Speaker 3: the detection of some unusual ground and airplane radar targets,

1021
01:02:10,320 --> 01:02:15,960
Speaker 3: and a sixteen millimeter color movie. So while they reached

1022
01:02:16,800 --> 01:02:21,040
Speaker 3: similar conclusions to those of New Zealand, the case is

1023
01:02:21,160 --> 01:02:24,520
Speaker 3: still out there. There's a curious wrinkle because we're telling

1024
01:02:24,520 --> 01:02:28,520
Speaker 3: you about this now declassified report as of twenty ten,

1025
01:02:29,320 --> 01:02:35,160
Speaker 3: or anthology of reports, but the documents, the original documents

1026
01:02:35,280 --> 01:02:40,000
Speaker 3: those reports are based on, are currently sealed up, still

1027
01:02:40,080 --> 01:02:45,920
Speaker 3: classified in New Zealand's national archive. Unless something changes, some

1028
01:02:46,160 --> 01:02:49,920
Speaker 3: of these original reports are not going to be released

1029
01:02:50,120 --> 01:02:54,520
Speaker 3: until twenty eighty. Are we still going to be making

1030
01:02:54,560 --> 01:02:57,640
Speaker 3: the show in twenty eighty? Guys? What are we? What's

1031
01:02:57,680 --> 01:02:58,280
Speaker 3: our situation?

1032
01:02:58,440 --> 01:02:59,000
Speaker 2: Who are we?

1033
01:02:59,280 --> 01:02:59,480
Speaker 7: Man?

1034
01:03:00,040 --> 01:03:00,640
Speaker 2: What is this?

1035
01:03:01,000 --> 01:03:01,840
Speaker 3: What even are we?

1036
01:03:02,840 --> 01:03:06,320
Speaker 2: Well, we've got less than two thousand days until the singularity,

1037
01:03:06,400 --> 01:03:09,840
Speaker 2: according to some, So you know, we'll see what happens there.

1038
01:03:10,480 --> 01:03:13,200
Speaker 3: Whenever we say some we meet according to us in

1039
01:03:13,360 --> 01:03:15,400
Speaker 3: an earlier episode of our show.

1040
01:03:17,720 --> 01:03:21,520
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, Well all those billionaires hanging out on

1041
01:03:21,600 --> 01:03:25,360
Speaker 2: New Zealand might get a real close encounter. We'll see

1042
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:28,040
Speaker 2: what happens with all of that stuff. I do want

1043
01:03:28,080 --> 01:03:32,120
Speaker 2: to point really quickly just to that original broadcast that

1044
01:03:32,360 --> 01:03:37,400
Speaker 2: happened in nineteen seventy eight. I couldn't find an actual

1045
01:03:37,440 --> 01:03:40,000
Speaker 2: clip of that recording or an archived version of that.

1046
01:03:40,160 --> 01:03:43,600
Speaker 2: Did you guys locate that anywhere? Just a full stop.

1047
01:03:43,680 --> 01:03:44,760
Speaker 2: This is holding in one video.

1048
01:03:45,360 --> 01:03:48,920
Speaker 3: It's been You can find clips of it in larger things.

1049
01:03:49,120 --> 01:03:50,400
Speaker 3: I think that's what we both found.

1050
01:03:50,640 --> 01:03:53,520
Speaker 2: We are looking for the original one. We're not sure

1051
01:03:53,720 --> 01:03:57,280
Speaker 2: if it is titled UFO The Closest Encounter, if that

1052
01:03:57,360 --> 01:03:59,240
Speaker 2: was the original broadcast or if that was like a

1053
01:03:59,320 --> 01:04:02,560
Speaker 2: rebroadcast right as we talked about, this footage was shown

1054
01:04:02,600 --> 01:04:06,280
Speaker 2: many many a time. If you can gain access to that,

1055
01:04:06,440 --> 01:04:09,120
Speaker 2: or you find it, please send it our way. We'll

1056
01:04:09,120 --> 01:04:10,680
Speaker 2: tell you how to contact us in a minute. But

1057
01:04:10,840 --> 01:04:12,280
Speaker 2: we want to see the full thing.

1058
01:04:12,960 --> 01:04:15,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, and for now, we'd love to ask for some

1059
01:04:15,520 --> 01:04:20,000
Speaker 3: help from our Kei week Conspiracy Realist spelled with ks.

1060
01:04:20,960 --> 01:04:24,200
Speaker 3: Do people in your neck of the Global woods still

1061
01:04:24,320 --> 01:04:30,120
Speaker 3: think of the Kaikoro Lights? How do people typically explain it?

1062
01:04:30,440 --> 01:04:34,800
Speaker 3: Is there anybody on the South Island who you know? Pops,

1063
01:04:34,880 --> 01:04:41,600
Speaker 3: open some wine or get some coffee as December waxes

1064
01:04:41,680 --> 01:04:44,680
Speaker 3: on and spend some time looking at the night sky?

1065
01:04:45,760 --> 01:04:49,560
Speaker 3: Why are certain things still classified? Was there at least

1066
01:04:49,600 --> 01:04:53,400
Speaker 3: some point stuff New Zealand didn't want you to know.

1067
01:04:54,080 --> 01:04:56,760
Speaker 3: We can't wait to your thoughts. You can always send

1068
01:04:56,880 --> 01:04:59,840
Speaker 3: us an email, especially if you want a random fact.

1069
01:05:00,080 --> 01:05:02,680
Speaker 3: You can call us on a telephone. You can find

1070
01:05:02,760 --> 01:05:03,920
Speaker 3: us on the line.

1071
01:05:04,200 --> 01:05:07,320
Speaker 4: Do find us in all of those places first and foremost,

1072
01:05:07,400 --> 01:05:09,720
Speaker 4: not necessarily foremost, but first at least all on the

1073
01:05:09,800 --> 01:05:12,200
Speaker 4: lines at the handle conspiracy stuff where we exist on

1074
01:05:12,280 --> 01:05:14,640
Speaker 4: Facebook with our Facebook group. Here's where it gets crazy

1075
01:05:14,720 --> 01:05:17,960
Speaker 4: on x FKA, Twitter and on YouTube with video content

1076
01:05:18,080 --> 01:05:22,600
Speaker 4: galore for YouTube peruse and hopefully enjoy on Instagram and TikTok. However,

1077
01:05:22,800 --> 01:05:24,240
Speaker 4: we're conspiracy stuff show.

1078
01:05:24,760 --> 01:05:27,840
Speaker 2: Yes, one tiny little piece of information we forgot to

1079
01:05:27,880 --> 01:05:32,160
Speaker 2: add into this thing. There was a moment when these

1080
01:05:32,280 --> 01:05:36,000
Speaker 2: pilots with the journalists were flying and they're attempting to

1081
01:05:36,160 --> 01:05:41,479
Speaker 2: capture these lights. There's a moment when Wellington Radar told them, hey, guys,

1082
01:05:41,680 --> 01:05:44,640
Speaker 2: just heads up one of the lights. One of the

1083
01:05:44,920 --> 01:05:48,560
Speaker 2: objects is immediately behind you now so you can't physically

1084
01:05:48,640 --> 01:05:52,320
Speaker 2: see it, and it's doubled in size, so you know,

1085
01:05:53,520 --> 01:05:54,280
Speaker 2: get home safe.

1086
01:05:55,040 --> 01:05:56,080
Speaker 3: Do with that information?

1087
01:05:57,120 --> 01:06:00,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, just imagine call us, tell us how you would

1088
01:06:00,800 --> 01:06:03,280
Speaker 2: feel in that moment. That would be amazing. Call one

1089
01:06:03,400 --> 01:06:07,240
Speaker 2: eight three three st d WYTK. When you call in,

1090
01:06:07,320 --> 01:06:10,200
Speaker 2: it's a voicemail system. You've got three minutes. Give yourself

1091
01:06:10,240 --> 01:06:12,320
Speaker 2: a cool nickname and let us know within the message

1092
01:06:12,360 --> 01:06:14,320
Speaker 2: if we can use your name and message on the air.

1093
01:06:14,760 --> 01:06:16,640
Speaker 2: If you want to send us an email, you can

1094
01:06:16,720 --> 01:06:16,960
Speaker 2: do that.

1095
01:06:17,280 --> 01:06:21,680
Speaker 3: We are the entities that read each piece of correspondence

1096
01:06:21,800 --> 01:06:24,200
Speaker 3: we receive before we get to the rest of that.

1097
01:06:24,840 --> 01:06:28,440
Speaker 3: We have talked about the official inquiry some of those documents.

1098
01:06:28,560 --> 01:06:30,640
Speaker 3: If you'd like to read more on your own, you

1099
01:06:30,800 --> 01:06:33,720
Speaker 3: can find by emailing us directly. We'll give you the link,

1100
01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:37,200
Speaker 3: which is awkward to just announce on the air because

1101
01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:42,000
Speaker 3: it's government stuff. But if you yourself want to engage

1102
01:06:42,080 --> 01:06:46,120
Speaker 3: with the Official Information Act Request of New Zealand, just

1103
01:06:46,240 --> 01:06:51,600
Speaker 3: go to FYI dot org dot NZ and while you're online,

1104
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:55,040
Speaker 3: hit us up for random fact here in the dark

1105
01:06:55,320 --> 01:06:57,680
Speaker 3: conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

1106
01:07:16,240 --> 01:07:18,280
Speaker 2: Stuff they don't want you to know is a production

1107
01:07:18,400 --> 01:07:22,880
Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1108
01:07:23,000 --> 01:07:25,880
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.