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Speaker 1: Quanty times, but Joseph Scott more.

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Speaker 2: So. This past Saturday, I was mentioned in a post

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Speaker 2: on X and you know, I look down, my handle

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Speaker 2: is on there and everything and saying it's just gonna

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Speaker 2: be some comment about, you know, some case that's floating

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Speaker 2: around there. Well, yeah, it was about a case. And

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Speaker 2: not only was it about a case, it was about

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Speaker 2: a very specific case. Because this was on Saturday, and

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Speaker 2: on Friday night apparently Dateline did an episode on the

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Speaker 2: Idaho four and of course the accused is Brian Coberger. Boy,

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Speaker 2: do I have a tale to tell you, guys, because

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Speaker 2: apparently apparently I have been viewed by certain individuals that

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Speaker 2: I'm prepared to discuss right now. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan

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Speaker 2: and this is body Backs. Dave kidnap me over with

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Speaker 2: a feather. I'm sitting there with my Queen of the

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Speaker 2: Homestead and we're having our morning coffee as we do

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Speaker 2: every day, my favorite time of day, by the way,

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Speaker 2: and I'm scrolling through the night's events, catching up on

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Speaker 2: X formerly known of course as Twitter, and lo and behold,

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Speaker 2: I've been tagged, and there before me, I see a

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Speaker 2: picture that is a screen grab off of Dateline and

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Speaker 2: it's my image. Apparently Ryan Coburger. According to them at Dateline,

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Speaker 2: they have information that states that he's watching or listening

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Speaker 2: to things on YouTube relative to true crime and specifically

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Speaker 2: these four homicides in which he is accused of perpetrating.

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Speaker 2: David got to tell you, brother, not too many things

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Speaker 2: send a chill up and spine. It got my attention

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Speaker 2: real quick when the Idaho case kicked off. When we

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Speaker 2: first had a national awareness of it, my wife and

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Speaker 2: I were just as shocked. It was on a Sunday

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Speaker 2: and it hit the news that afternoon. The next day

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Speaker 2: that Monday, I was on national television and it seemed like,

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Speaker 2: for oh my lord, it was like solid for like

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Speaker 2: three weeks. I just had phone calls coming in from

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Speaker 2: all of these different networks, podcast, YouTube channels, and all

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Speaker 2: this sort of thing. So the fact that I would

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Speaker 2: pop up on his radar, I guess because he's seeking

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Speaker 2: I think if you continue with this line of logic here,

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Speaker 2: that Dateline is putting forward. This isn't me putting this forward,

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Speaker 2: is date Line. I would think that he's seeking information

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Speaker 2: from individuals that may have practiced in the past, because

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Speaker 2: if you're you know, if you're in kind of the

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Speaker 2: atmosphere that I'm in right now. I don't work in

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Speaker 2: the field anymore. I'm a teacher and then I do commentary.

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Speaker 2: So I bring my knowledge from, you know, as a

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Speaker 2: practitioner and as an educator to most of the stuff

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Speaker 2: that I do, and I just talk about it. And look,

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Speaker 2: I'm not the only one. I'm sure that there were multiple,

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Speaker 2: multiple locations that he visited along the way and just

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Speaker 2: a glean information. And I find that's very interesting what

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Speaker 2: you mentioned, Dave. People throw around that term narcissism quite

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Speaker 2: a bit, and it seems like it's in every other

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Speaker 2: sentence now then everybody's making a diagnosis of narcissism. I

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Speaker 2: don't know if that's the same as being egocentric or

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Speaker 2: I guess there's shades of this involved in everything. But

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Speaker 2: I'm interested in what you have to say about. Was

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Speaker 2: he seeking information about the case potentially or was he

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Speaker 2: scratching that edge to see his name or see not

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Speaker 2: his name. We wouldn't have known it at that time,

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Speaker 2: but to see the shock that it elicits from the

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Speaker 2: general public. You know, every time there's some breathless reporter

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Speaker 2: that comes on the air, to talk about some little

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Speaker 2: new thing that has developed.

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Speaker 3: I wonder why John, Yeah, why he But not I

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Speaker 3: kind of I'm more like, I wonder why he's listening

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Speaker 3: or watching that particular show. But I really I think

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Speaker 3: it's feeding his ego, you know, getting his name mentioned.

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Speaker 3: But I think it's also you got to remember he's

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Speaker 3: also a student, so almost a professional student in his life.

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Speaker 3: You know, he didn't really go out of the educational atmosphere.

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Speaker 3: But I think based on what we know of him,

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Speaker 3: and it makes sense that he would be driven to

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Speaker 3: watch or listen to a professor give a breakdown as

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Speaker 3: opposed to a clinician. It just makes sense to me

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Speaker 3: that he would be that he. I don't want to

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Speaker 3: say that he's a you know, he's drawn to you,

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Speaker 3: but it makes sense to me that he would care

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Speaker 3: what your opinion was because as a student, he wants

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Speaker 3: to impress the professor, and as a suspected killer, you know,

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Speaker 3: he wants as much fame. He's not gonna get away

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Speaker 3: with it. At this point that they've pretty much made

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Speaker 3: sure that the judge has made sure that everything that

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Speaker 3: they didn't want in is coming in. And so at

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Speaker 3: this point I think they're trying to mitigate the death penalty.

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Speaker 3: You know, is there a way that we can avoid that?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean Exhibit one A is autism, right, yeah,

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Speaker 2: because autism has nothing to do with him his appearance

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Speaker 2: in court.

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Speaker 1: You mentioned.

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Speaker 2: I love that word mitigate. By the way, they're trying

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Speaker 2: to mitigate the death penalty here, they're trying to say

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Speaker 2: that he's he's not eligible because he's diagnosed with autism,

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Speaker 2: which you know is.

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Speaker 3: You're mentally handicapped. Because of that, then how did you

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Speaker 3: get to be in to be in a college level

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Speaker 3: a program you know, that just doesn't hold wall. That

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Speaker 3: is just a bucket full of holes man?

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Speaker 1: Really?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: And that based on listen listen.

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Speaker 2: People that would that would make a different argument will say, well,

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Speaker 2: you don't understand the spectrum is nuanced. I I mean,

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Speaker 2: how many times have we heard that? And look, that's

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Speaker 2: gonna be The people that say that are making the

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Speaker 2: same argument that the defense is making.

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Speaker 3: You and I have had this conversation about the on

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Speaker 3: the spectrum with regard to my grandson.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 3: As soon as that started coming out on this, I went, really, you're.

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Speaker 1: Going to play this card.

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Speaker 3: Let's see how far they go, and having seen it

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Speaker 3: up close and personal, I wasn't shocked that they tried

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Speaker 3: to play it. I'm thankful that nobody bought it. Well,

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Speaker 3: I'm not shocked the game looking for you.

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Speaker 2: I want to interject one more thing and about this

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Speaker 2: as well. People throw around this term in cell. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 2: so you know they'll say, uh, you know, I'll just

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Speaker 2: see random comments that will pop up on social media

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Speaker 2: and they'll say classic insul And I'm thinking, Okay, how

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Speaker 2: did that? How'd you arrive at that? Dogno is because

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Speaker 2: I can tell you this. There is a manual that

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Speaker 2: mental health workers use. It's called the DSM, and it's

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Speaker 2: in multiple iterations, and I think they're in like the

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Speaker 2: third third. I'm sorry, excuse me, they're in the fifth

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Speaker 2: iteration of this now nowhere in that manual or you

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Speaker 2: can go in there and find the term in cell.

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Speaker 2: And the way this manual, the DSM works is that, yeah,

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Speaker 2: it helps you make diagnoses, but you know what else

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Speaker 2: they do. There's a code in there so that when

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Speaker 2: mental health people are making a diagnosis, they have to

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Speaker 2: enter that code onto their insurance forms in order to

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Speaker 2: get reimbursed. So if there was money to be made

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Speaker 2: with a diagnosis of being an in cell And I

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Speaker 2: don't even know what you would call it, in cell titis,

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Speaker 2: in cell itis. I have no idea that that implies

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Speaker 2: an infection. There's no such thing in the mental health

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Speaker 2: world as being an in cell. This is a uh,

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Speaker 2: a term that has been created to categorize a certain

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Speaker 2: group of men. And so they've used this term for him,

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Speaker 2: and you know, they just kind of throw these terms

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Speaker 2: around like that.

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Speaker 3: If you don't know what in cel means, it means

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Speaker 3: involuntarily sulibate.

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Speaker 1: It's for guys who have trouble with girls.

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Speaker 3: And and to be honest with you, they would have

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Speaker 3: a problem with most guys, you know, based on the

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Speaker 3: way they talk, act and think. They're not the type

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Speaker 3: of individual I know anybody would hang out with. And

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Speaker 3: so I think made up.

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Speaker 1: It's weird.

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Speaker 2: I mean, most of the time people are you know,

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Speaker 2: you come across somebody in there, you know, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: eccentric maybe.

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Speaker 1: But that's a great term.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, eccentricity, you know, And uh, I have a

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Speaker 2: touch of that in me. I'm a college professor. I'm

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Speaker 2: it's actually mandated in my contract every year you must

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Speaker 2: be eccentric because you're a college professor. But you know,

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Speaker 2: back to this idea of him. Can I tell you

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Speaker 2: one other thing that happened to me on Saturday morning

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Speaker 2: as I sat there with my with my bride and

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Speaker 2: my cup of Joe's.

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Speaker 1: Weird to hear you call it a cup of Joe.

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Speaker 2: I know it is kind of weird, isn't it. I

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Speaker 2: sat there and as I'm sipping on my coffee and

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Speaker 2: I'm kind of absorbing this thing, the first thing that

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Speaker 2: jumped into my mind's eye was what did I say?

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Speaker 2: What did I say? Did I Did I say anything

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Speaker 2: that could have been taken by this individual and had

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Speaker 2: some kind of utility for them? And you can't think

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Speaker 2: that way. But that's not it's not outside. I mean,

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Speaker 2: we go to crime con and I actually have people

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Speaker 2: that will walk up to me. Happens almost every crime con.

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Speaker 2: They'll say, do you feel like that you're teaching killers

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Speaker 2: out there? Perspective killers? And no, I'm teaching forensics. I mean,

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Speaker 2: all are welcome at the table, I guess, but you know,

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Speaker 2: you can't tell who's out there in the audience when

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Speaker 2: you're making any kind of comment. You could say the

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Speaker 2: same thing. I guess about the people that are on Dateline.

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Speaker 2: I mean, they do this, They've done this for years.

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Speaker 2: You know, they have that sloted time and there are

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Speaker 2: people that can't go without watching Dateline. Hey, that's cool

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Speaker 2: if that's what you're what you're all about. But you

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Speaker 2: know they're disseminating information as well. But you know, I

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Speaker 2: had that, I've had that thought. You know, that's come

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Speaker 2: up in my mind, you know, over the years, you know,

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Speaker 2: thinking about you know, who's within the sound of my voice.

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Speaker 2: And I look, if you think that's bad, I think

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Speaker 2: now about my academic colleagues that are at the Sales University.

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Speaker 2: And now all of these years later, after this massacre

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Speaker 2: in Moscow, Idaho took place, I really wonder are they thinking,

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Speaker 2: are they thinking, what do we teach you? Well, brother Dave,

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Speaker 2: aside from my mug appearing on television and the shock

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Speaker 2: my own personal pearl clutching that took place over it,

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Speaker 2: they did. They did have information that they revealed and

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Speaker 2: a lot of stuff with stuff that we had not

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Speaker 2: heard before, you know, kind of this as it applies

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Speaker 2: to what was going on within the house. And you

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Speaker 2: know my question, I think one of my big questions

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Speaker 2: is how'd they come into this information Dateline, that is,

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Speaker 2: was there a source within some department up there, you know?

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Speaker 2: And I don't know. I'm not going to even state

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Speaker 2: any department. I'm just going to say that there are

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Speaker 2: multiple departments that are involved in the investigation of these

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Speaker 2: four homicides. If the folks at Dateline, the producers felt

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Speaker 2: this strongly that they would produce this thing. And I

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Speaker 2: bet you dollars to know, Netes Brother that this episode,

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Speaker 2: I bet they had some of the highest ratings they've

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Speaker 2: had in a while, just simply based on this, on

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Speaker 2: this particular episode, because there were a couple of really

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Speaker 2: big reveals in this day.

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Speaker 1: And they built it up right.

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Speaker 3: They did a good job promoting it, you know, And

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Speaker 3: there's a zeitgeist here with this particular killing, this murderer

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Speaker 3: of whatever.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 3: To call a topic popular when you're dealing with the

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Speaker 3: deaths of four college students is mind numbing. It shows

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Speaker 3: you a lot about how we look at things. But

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Speaker 3: you know, every time now that we talk about the

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Speaker 3: Coburger story, the murders, I'm gonna be honest, Joe, I

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Speaker 3: have a twinge of hurt for you over what happened

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Speaker 3: in Orlando at crime Con when you were giving an

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Speaker 3: incredibly you did a loving tribute to the students, to

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Speaker 3: the victims. You talked with a lot of care about

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Speaker 3: what they went through and what happened, and you kind

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Speaker 3: of got at the very end, you know, I felt

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Speaker 3: like that you were not treated the way you should

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Speaker 3: have been treated.

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Speaker 1: By somebody, and that bothered me.

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Speaker 3: And so every time we cover this story, I think

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Speaker 3: about how, no matter hard you work to take care

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Speaker 3: of talking about the individuals, you and I are both victim,

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Speaker 3: the kids, and whenever we're not seen that way, it

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Speaker 3: bothers me.

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Speaker 2: And yeah it does. And listen, it's like I said before,

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Speaker 2: you know, not turning down any kind of offer that's made,

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Speaker 2: even in those circumstances, which, by the way, I think

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Speaker 2: I've made mentioned this before. But it was in a

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Speaker 2: room of thirty four hundred people. Yeah, I don't think

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Speaker 2: that I've ever spoken to a crowd that large before.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't see the back of the room. You know,

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Speaker 2: first off, there's lights in your eyes. It was awesome,

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Speaker 2: but I could tell there were a lot of people,

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Speaker 2: and so I couldn't I couldn't see beyond it. But yeah,

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Speaker 2: and it was a learning experience and you never know,

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Speaker 2: you know, you never know what's going to bubble up

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Speaker 2: out of that. But when you think about what Dateline

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Speaker 2: has done in talking about this case, thirty four hundred people,

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Speaker 2: is nothing that happened that night or that afternoon, you know,

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Speaker 2: with me me, you think about the people that they reach,

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Speaker 2: and there's not going to be aybody standing up and

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Speaker 2: making some kind of comment in the crowd. This is

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Speaker 2: going to be about something else. You know, there might

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Speaker 2: be people at home screaming at the television screen for

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Speaker 2: all I know. I have no idea. But when you

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Speaker 2: get into like that kind of real granular detail about

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Speaker 2: what they are being told, and I have to think

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Speaker 2: that they're being told because they're not investigators. I think that,

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Speaker 2: you know, the most striking thing that came out of

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Speaker 2: this is that there was one part I believe where

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Speaker 2: they they allege that Xanna may have gone upstairs when

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Speaker 2: she heard a noise. Now I don't know how they

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Speaker 2: validate that. I don't know how they come up with that.

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Speaker 2: And then of course she is perhaps is kind of

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Speaker 2: implied that maybe she was chased back downstairs by Coburger.

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Speaker 2: He goes into the room attacks her. You know, she

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Speaker 2: had been up, she had received the order, that they

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Speaker 2: had done the food order. She was awake, And it

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Speaker 2: deviates from what we had heard about Ethan because now

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Speaker 2: they're saying that Ethan most likely was asleep in bed.

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Speaker 2: And we know what we have been what we have

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Speaker 2: heard previously about Xanna and her injuries where you've got

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Speaker 2: these sharp force injuries that literally go down to the

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Speaker 2: cartilage in her fingers where there's either blade grabbing going

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Speaker 2: on in a defensive posture or she's been stabbed in

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Speaker 2: the hand, and of course she's brutalized at that point.

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Speaker 2: And then you know, my lord, the information that Dayline

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Speaker 2: is saying, again not Morgan saying it. What they're talking

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Speaker 2: about relative to Ethan. You know, we've heard that Ethan.

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Speaker 2: I think there was one iteration where they said Ethan

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Speaker 2: was on the floor and uh, just adjacent to the

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Speaker 2: door and he'd had a really nasty injury to his neck.

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Speaker 2: That according to that doesn't square with what Dayline is saying,

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Speaker 2: because Dayline, and correct me if I'm wrong. Dave Dayline

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Speaker 2: said that Ethan's leg or legs were carved up with

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Speaker 2: sharp force injury and that he was in the bed,

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Speaker 2: so that it completely changes the dynamic of what we

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Speaker 2: had known about this case to begin with. Am I

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Speaker 2: am I right? Isn't that what I said?

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Speaker 3: And you know when I saw that, I thought, this

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Speaker 3: is new. This is not information that we have had

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Speaker 3: up to this point. As a matter of fact, a

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Speaker 3: lot of the stuff that we're being told now are

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Speaker 3: things we had didn't know or things that they don't

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Speaker 3: make sense to be honest with you. You know, we

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Speaker 3: were told at first that Dylan Mortenson, you know, the

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Speaker 3: the bushy the one who described the bushy eyebrows, that

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Speaker 3: Dylan you know, that she heard something and went back

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Speaker 3: and went to sleep and woke up around noon.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 3: Now we find out that Dylan Mortenson was on the

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Speaker 3: phone all the time.

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Speaker 1: So there's a lot of things.

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Speaker 2: Actually, And I think that information actually came out prior

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Speaker 2: to the Dateline special.

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Speaker 1: It did, and that was like week week or week

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Speaker 1: before last.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I think it was a slow trickle of things

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Speaker 2: and that has that has gone gone on.

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Speaker 3: You know, Joe, I remember back to the Scott Peterson case,

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Speaker 3: and do you remember what happened between the first day

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Speaker 3: of the trial and the last day, other than all

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Speaker 3: the evidence, there was a really big reveal, a really

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Speaker 3: big change happened. And it's because that that whenever I

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Speaker 3: see a trickle of information coming out or something that

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Speaker 3: is really counter to what we believe up to this moment,

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Speaker 3: I realize that investigators don't have all the truth yet

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Speaker 3: they're still figuring it out. In the Peterson case, the

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Speaker 3: investigators the prosecutors open by saying they believe Lacy Peterson

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Speaker 3: was killed on December twenty third. Yeah, and by the

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Speaker 3: end of the trial it was proved that no, she

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Speaker 3: wasn't killed in she was killed on Christmas Eve.

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Speaker 1: That's a pretty big difference.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And that's why when something like that can happen

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Speaker 3: in a major crime that had all the world's attention

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Speaker 3: and still does. Peterson still has huge ratings. The guy's

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Speaker 3: got the La Innocence Project. I mean, everybody's working on

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Speaker 3: this thing. And you know, I'll be honest with you, Joe,

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Speaker 3: if investigators had that part wrong, I got a feeling.

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Speaker 3: Look I think he did it, but go ahead and

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Speaker 3: look at it again. But in this case, how do

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Speaker 3: you go from saying the reason we didn't get a

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Speaker 3: nine one one.

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Speaker 1: Call until noon. Is because the roommate was asleep.

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Speaker 3: After she sees a guy with bushy hair is bolting

337
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Speaker 3: out the door, she just goes and lays down and

338
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Speaker 3: crashes out. But then we find out she was on

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Speaker 3: the phone the whole time. It can't be both, It

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Speaker 3: has to be one of the other.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this is not one of these things where two

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Speaker 2: things can be right at the same time. You know.

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Speaker 2: I hear that phrase come up a lot now in

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Speaker 2: our conversations all around, And so what do you think, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I don't. I don't think that. I don't. I guess

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Speaker 2: that if you're stating not you. But they, if they

347
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Speaker 2: are stating that they have information now that indicates that

348
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Speaker 2: there was phone activity. Remember we got those text you know,

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Speaker 2: talking about run run to me expletive, you know, all

350
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Speaker 2: these sorts of things. And there was even one one

351
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Speaker 2: bit that came out recently. And I don't know how

352
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Speaker 2: they concluded this that Dylan actually saw Xana's body and

353
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Speaker 2: maybe thought she was sleeping. But I got to tell you,

354
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Speaker 2: I don't know what the degree of lighting was in

355
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Speaker 2: that environment. And I know she's not a trained professional,

356
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Speaker 2: at least I don't think she is. She in my estimation,

357
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Speaker 2: the area around her would have been super saturated with blood.

358
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Speaker 2: So how can you merely, when you're looking over your

359
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Speaker 2: shoulder just say, yes, she was sleeping, And why would

360
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Speaker 2: she be sleeping on the floor. I mean, what are

361
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Speaker 2: you thinking she passed out? She passed out drunk, because

362
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Speaker 2: that doesn't seem like something she would have done necessarily.

363
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Speaker 2: She staid with her boyfriend. And look, I know that

364
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Speaker 2: there's we don't know yet alcohol had been imbibed. I

365
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Speaker 2: mean they had come from a fraternity party, you know,

366
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Speaker 2: and every one of my fraternity parties, I can tell

367
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Speaker 2: you they were not teetotalers there neither was I was

368
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Speaker 2: chief among sinners. And so I got to tell you,

369
00:23:09,080 --> 00:23:13,960
Speaker 2: I think about this, and I think about the information

370
00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 2: that has been provided along the way at about the

371
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Speaker 2: circumstances that night, maybe even leading up to that day's events,

372
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Speaker 2: and what happened afterwards. I'm still I still think, Dave,

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Speaker 2: that at this point in time, I still have more

374
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Speaker 2: questions than I do answers. Let's see adage, Dave, A

375
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Speaker 2: picture's wors what one thousand words is that? What they

376
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Speaker 2: say is that I get confused sometimes.

377
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Speaker 1: Your paints a thousand words come.

378
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Speaker 2: On, this is David Gates.

379
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Speaker 1: And bread un I had record.

380
00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:11,760
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, Telly was singing it too.

381
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:14,520
Speaker 1: Uh picked your pains. That does.

382
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:25,040
Speaker 2: Uh these images that have come out of Coburger, listen,

383
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Speaker 2: I gotta tell you. And I'm uh, I'm in no

384
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Speaker 2: way pro Coburger, but these are and I don't know

385
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:36,040
Speaker 2: if these are going to be admitted into evidence because

386
00:24:36,080 --> 00:24:38,520
Speaker 2: on one level, you know, just when you see the

387
00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:41,880
Speaker 2: sinister nature of them, because they do, they do look sinister.

388
00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:45,439
Speaker 2: And remember we've been warned not to look at his eyes.

389
00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:50,400
Speaker 2: You know, we can't. Defenses sucked, you can't because of

390
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:53,679
Speaker 2: his condition. You know, he's got that blank stare. You know,

391
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:56,840
Speaker 2: he wears he's you know, he stares off in the distance.

392
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Speaker 2: You know. I've been locked up in a room with

393
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Speaker 2: a lot of people over the years, uh when I'm lecturing,

394
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:06,159
Speaker 2: and they've got blank stares as well, you know. So

395
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:08,439
Speaker 2: I don't know how much can be read into that.

396
00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:13,840
Speaker 2: And and but when they did release these, these these

397
00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:18,280
Speaker 2: images of him, you know, with the hoodie on and

398
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:22,160
Speaker 2: he's got like a watchcaps knit cap to bogging thing

399
00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:25,720
Speaker 2: on under it, and you know he looks like you know,

400
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:28,040
Speaker 2: he's very dark looking at it. You know, he's got

401
00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:30,919
Speaker 2: the thing kind of drawn down like a Holocaust cloak,

402
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 2: you know, like monks used to wear. Uh, it's got that,

403
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:37,400
Speaker 2: it's got that weird, you know, kind of vibe to it.

404
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:39,919
Speaker 2: Is that part of the evidence. Is this the trove

405
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,439
Speaker 2: of evidence, some of the electronic evidence, it's going to

406
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:48,399
Speaker 2: be presented in court? And if it is, how on

407
00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:50,280
Speaker 2: the whole dateline get their hands on it?

408
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:52,840
Speaker 1: I don't know how they got it. I don't know.

409
00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:54,800
Speaker 3: I do know that I've made a number of calls

410
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:57,639
Speaker 3: trying to find out it's some information to verify things,

411
00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:01,840
Speaker 3: and I'm I'm not finding it out, but you know,

412
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:06,160
Speaker 3: you do have an investigation that if you remember early on,

413
00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 3: remember they had the the person who was the not

414
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:16,159
Speaker 3: the medical examiner, but they were like voted in on

415
00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:19,480
Speaker 3: the corner, like yeah, the corner. Yeah, how the corner

416
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:23,160
Speaker 3: gave out information yes, early on that we would never

417
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,480
Speaker 3: hear before, you know, from a No, I don't want

418
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:27,840
Speaker 3: to say a legitimate source, but you know what I'm saying,

419
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:31,240
Speaker 3: that was a very unusual way to get information.

420
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Speaker 1: The way it was.

421
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:37,600
Speaker 2: Little God, it was when I when that dropped, when

422
00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 2: that person dropped that information. First off, she actually stated

423
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:46,960
Speaker 2: that they all appeared to have been asleep, you know,

424
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Speaker 2: and my you know, I thought at that time, now,

425
00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:54,640
Speaker 2: if we were to believe what's going on with this

426
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:58,200
Speaker 2: new data that's coming out, it's confirmation to me, did

427
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:00,639
Speaker 2: you even go to the scene and see the you know,

428
00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:02,960
Speaker 2: how long were you there with the bodies that you

429
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:07,520
Speaker 2: would make these observations because I got to tell you,

430
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:14,159
Speaker 2: I don't know what appears to have been asleep means

431
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:16,520
Speaker 2: did Xana sleep on the floor?

432
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 1: Is that what you mean?

433
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:22,080
Speaker 2: Because and again it's it's skewed. That's an area that

434
00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:26,560
Speaker 2: the corner never should open up about on any kind

435
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:28,679
Speaker 2: of case. And Dave, I don't care how in what

436
00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:31,959
Speaker 2: far flung area of the country you're in. That's like

437
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 2: a minimal that's kind of a baseline of knowledge that

438
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:39,760
Speaker 2: every corner has. We've had the national standards in place

439
00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 2: now for medical legal death investigators since nineteen ninety eight.

440
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 2: That's like a one of the things that we kind

441
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:50,000
Speaker 2: of pound into people's heads in that training that we

442
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:53,000
Speaker 2: established all those years ago was that you worked together

443
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 2: as a team when you're talking about a homicide day,

444
00:27:56,119 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 2: particularly especially one that is unsolved. You're an elected official,

445
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:06,720
Speaker 2: you're separate from the cops. You can say what you

446
00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:10,960
Speaker 2: want to say. But let me tell you this, I

447
00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:14,199
Speaker 2: don't see her getting Christmas cards in the future, you

448
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:16,119
Speaker 2: know what I mean. She ain't gonna be invited to

449
00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:19,320
Speaker 2: the Christmas party all right in the wake of this,

450
00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 2: because that is it's foreboden. You don't do this, You

451
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:27,000
Speaker 2: don't step outside what I refer to as the investigative bubble,

452
00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:34,120
Speaker 2: because there's no telling who's listening. And unless they told

453
00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:37,280
Speaker 2: her just to say these things, and I can't imagine

454
00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:41,440
Speaker 2: anybody would would have done that, I don't understand why

455
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 2: she felt compelled to begin to talk about these things

456
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:51,520
Speaker 2: that seem to be inaccurate exactly that that's the most

457
00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:53,120
Speaker 2: gentle way that I can put that.

458
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:54,960
Speaker 1: I think you're being kind.

459
00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:58,720
Speaker 3: I think that there's a number of issues here that

460
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,080
Speaker 3: this dayline's special. Again, I don't know where they got

461
00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 3: their information, but they felt comfortable enough with it from

462
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 3: a legal standpoint to put it on national network television

463
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:10,400
Speaker 3: and nobody has come out to scream about it. So

464
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:14,080
Speaker 3: it kind of makes you believe that there is information

465
00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:18,240
Speaker 3: that is available somehow. But a couple of questions I

466
00:29:18,280 --> 00:29:20,560
Speaker 3: still have, Joe, is that again? I go back to

467
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 3: Dylan Mortenson, and I really I don't want to beat

468
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:28,360
Speaker 3: this dead horse. They tore the building down, they tore

469
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 3: the house down, and we have no way of going

470
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:35,080
Speaker 3: in there to verify anything, because I have real questions

471
00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:38,960
Speaker 3: about the people they call survivors. I have real questions,

472
00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 3: mainly because I haven't heard what actually transpired. But now

473
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 3: we've been told about Dylan being on the phone the

474
00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:49,840
Speaker 3: whole time, texting back and forth and on Indeed or

475
00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 3: Facebook or whatever, and you know that seems to be

476
00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 3: a little odd thing to do for eight hours and

477
00:29:56,400 --> 00:29:58,520
Speaker 3: then get up and you have this carnage going on.

478
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:03,120
Speaker 3: You don't call nine one one. But again, stepping over that,

479
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 3: the timetable puts Xanakernodle ordering food at four o'clock in

480
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:14,360
Speaker 3: the morning, yes, and it being delivered at four oh

481
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:20,720
Speaker 3: eight something like that. So the timetable we're looking at

482
00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:28,520
Speaker 3: begins there with Xena and ends before four thirty according

483
00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:31,480
Speaker 3: to what we've been told. Right, so you've got a

484
00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 3: twenty minute window where one guy is going to come

485
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:37,840
Speaker 3: into a house with six people and he is going

486
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:45,120
Speaker 3: to be able to brutally kill very quickly enough that

487
00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:47,560
Speaker 3: it was quick enough that he didn't wake up Ethan,

488
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:49,840
Speaker 3: because they say Ethan was asleep when he was attacked.

489
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 3: Although I'm still wondering, how does he get something carved

490
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:55,000
Speaker 3: into his leg if he is the last victim and

491
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 3: he slept through the whole thing again, Yeah.

492
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:00,880
Speaker 2: Just a whole lot response, Ale owned, you would think

493
00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:03,920
Speaker 2: that that would be something that would, you know, jolt

494
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:07,960
Speaker 2: you away. Of course, we don't know about sequencing. Think.

495
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 2: Let's okay, let me let me throw.

496
00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:11,240
Speaker 1: This at you. I was just going to ask you

497
00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:12,560
Speaker 1: figured that one out.

498
00:31:12,680 --> 00:31:14,760
Speaker 2: Well, well, just let me throw this at you. Yeah,

499
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:18,280
Speaker 2: if what date this is not Morgan saying this date line,

500
00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:23,040
Speaker 2: If what dateline is saying is accurate, okay, then what

501
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:26,280
Speaker 2: are the what are the fatal wounds that Ethan would

502
00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:29,240
Speaker 2: have sustained. It's it's not going to be a carving

503
00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:32,920
Speaker 2: of the leg. Okay, that's not going to be fatal,

504
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 2: at least in the immediate You might exanguinate after a

505
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:41,520
Speaker 2: period of time depended upon how deep, how deeply your

506
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 2: legs might have been cut. However, here's here's a here's

507
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 2: something I want to throw at you. What if he

508
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:51,760
Speaker 2: was attacked in another area of his body and then

509
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:54,960
Speaker 2: after the fact this is done to him. You know,

510
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 2: that goes into an area of mutilation. And again I

511
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:02,240
Speaker 2: know I'm projecting here. He's a male, He's only male

512
00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:08,880
Speaker 2: in domsaw wow. And I think back to a comment

513
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 2: that was made in this program by this person that

514
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 2: knew him over at Washington State, and she had invited him,

515
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:23,560
Speaker 2: allegedly to a pool party and his eyes, according to her,

516
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:26,200
Speaker 2: had locked on to these two young women that were

517
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 2: clad and mkini's and was just focused on them. He

518
00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 2: knows nobody. This is like, we feel sorry for this guy.

519
00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:39,120
Speaker 2: We want to invite him in kind of introduce him

520
00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 2: to It's probably other graduate students thasga's, those sorts of

521
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:46,320
Speaker 2: people that are working toward the same goals, or maybe

522
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:50,720
Speaker 2: employees that work in the department, and he can't take

523
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:52,480
Speaker 2: his eyes off of them. As a matter of fact,

524
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:56,800
Speaker 2: he interjects himself into a conversation with one of these

525
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:01,440
Speaker 2: young women allegedly that was there with her husband. Never

526
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:06,120
Speaker 2: acknowledged the husband. The entire conversation is having a conversation

527
00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:10,959
Speaker 2: like her with her allegedly, Like it goes something like

528
00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:14,000
Speaker 2: you do you like rock climbing, do you like hiking?

529
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:18,120
Speaker 2: You know, just completely inappropriate And I think about that,

530
00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 2: and you're dismissing the male that's there, And if what

531
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 2: they're talking about really and I don't know if this

532
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:29,280
Speaker 2: was their point with a dateline special that they maybe

533
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 2: perhaps are intimating that he did something to Ethan because

534
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:37,480
Speaker 2: he's a male, he was there and there were these

535
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 2: other females. Maybe that's a long shot. I have no idea,

536
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:44,000
Speaker 2: but I don't know. It's it's certainly something to think about.

537
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:46,560
Speaker 3: I don't think he was just out tuling around looking

538
00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:48,600
Speaker 3: at stars at four o'clock in the morning and said, hey,

539
00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 3: there's a nice house.

540
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:50,920
Speaker 1: I think i'll go in and see. I can't kill anybody,

541
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:51,520
Speaker 1: you know.

542
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:55,520
Speaker 2: No, no, this is this is a location that whoever

543
00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:59,920
Speaker 2: did this, whoever did this, had some level of familiarity

544
00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 2: with it. And you know, that's another interesting bit that

545
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:06,720
Speaker 2: they dropped here, Dave, is fact that now and I

546
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:09,000
Speaker 2: don't know, this might be bigger than anything else, that

547
00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:13,959
Speaker 2: now we've got new surveillance photos or surveillance video from

548
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:17,440
Speaker 2: an adjacent house where you can and we've never seen

549
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 2: this before. That was one of the other big reveals

550
00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 2: here where you can see what appears to be a

551
00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:26,640
Speaker 2: white Lantra that's that's making loops and passive. Do you

552
00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:29,080
Speaker 2: remember some of the other footage that we had initially

553
00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 2: that we've talked about before, and it's real blurry. This

554
00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:42,040
Speaker 2: is not quite as blurry, and you can see the

555
00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:47,560
Speaker 2: car pass in multiple directions from that static camera that

556
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 2: was on an adjacent house. My wife and I were,

557
00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:54,000
Speaker 2: you know, kind of watching it the other other day,

558
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,760
Speaker 2: just the video because I haven't seen the entire episode

559
00:34:57,760 --> 00:35:03,800
Speaker 2: of the dateline thing, and you know, we were saying, well,

560
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 2: if they have this camera, this videography, and here's where

561
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 2: I kind of will leave this. If they have this

562
00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:14,760
Speaker 2: videography and we've never seen it before, A big question

563
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:20,080
Speaker 2: is what else do the police have that we haven't

564
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 2: seen yet. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is bodybacks