1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:04,720 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,800 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:24,600 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. Hello, 4 00:00:24,640 --> 00:00:26,560 Speaker 1: and welcome back to the show. My name is Matt. 5 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:28,960 Speaker 1: My name they call me Ben. You are you? And 6 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:32,920 Speaker 1: that makes this stuff they don't want you to know. Now. 7 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:38,800 Speaker 1: We are looking at a developing situation and in the past, guys, 8 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:43,920 Speaker 1: we've been hesitant to cover things like as they're unfolding 9 00:00:44,320 --> 00:00:46,919 Speaker 1: because peek behind the curtain here of course, and our 10 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:50,960 Speaker 1: super producer Paul Decan will agree with us, hopefully, I'm sure. 11 00:00:51,320 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 1: And I'm looking at his body language. Oh he's he's wishing. 12 00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 1: Was he's hedging, he's hedging his bats. I respect that. Um. 13 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 1: We we feel just terrible if we report on something 14 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:09,360 Speaker 1: that is occurring in the news, right, and by the 15 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:13,480 Speaker 1: time our episode comes out, the situation is completely changed 16 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:17,360 Speaker 1: because like spoiler you guys, this is not live correct, right, 17 00:01:17,560 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 1: we did this like a week ago. The good thing 18 00:01:19,600 --> 00:01:23,520 Speaker 1: about this specific topic is that the occurrence happened in 19 00:01:23,680 --> 00:01:27,040 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty three, So that makes it fifty plus years 20 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:29,680 Speaker 1: of history that we can cover and then bring in 21 00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:33,679 Speaker 1: some of this new stuff that actually occurred around Yeah, 22 00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 1: and you know, we don't want to be old beans 23 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:38,440 Speaker 1: that I'm I'm saying that now, I don't think so 24 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:43,039 Speaker 1: you don't think I think it's gonna beans? Yeah, well, 25 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:45,760 Speaker 1: right in and let us know are they moldy or 26 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:49,040 Speaker 1: just stale? It's just like I'm using it as like 27 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:52,480 Speaker 1: a just a term of figure of speech. You guys 28 00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:55,080 Speaker 1: are skeptical about bag of badgers, but that took off, 29 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:57,760 Speaker 1: it really did. What are we talking about today? Can 30 00:01:57,760 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: we get to the thing for crying out loud? Yes, 31 00:02:00,280 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 1: let's let's start with the facts. The brass Tax President 32 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:10,480 Speaker 1: John F. Kennedy was assassinated on November twenty two, ninety three, 33 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:14,320 Speaker 1: about twelve thirty in the afternoon in Dallas, Texas, while 34 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:18,800 Speaker 1: they were writing in a presidential motorcade and in uh, 35 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:24,679 Speaker 1: the probably the biggest understatement of our entire show, All 36 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:27,919 Speaker 1: hell broke loose? Yeah, it's true. And then you fast 37 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:32,800 Speaker 1: forward several decades and there's a survey by a site 38 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:35,079 Speaker 1: called five thirty eight dot com and they found that 39 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:38,840 Speaker 1: only thirty of the people responding actually believed the findings 40 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:42,120 Speaker 1: of the official Warren Commission. That's the one that concluded 41 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:47,080 Speaker 1: in nineteen sixty four that the lone gunman, Lee Harvey Oswald, 42 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 1: was responsible for the death of President Kennedy, and today 43 00:02:51,639 --> 00:02:56,720 Speaker 1: sixty one percent of the US public believe that at 44 00:02:56,800 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 1: least one other person was involved. Yes, not justice single gunman. 45 00:03:00,680 --> 00:03:02,440 Speaker 1: So you guys know, I'm kind of a Kennedy novice. 46 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:05,440 Speaker 1: Can you catch me up on the Warran Commission? Sure? 47 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:09,640 Speaker 1: The Warren Commission, We've talked about this before on the show, 48 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:12,920 Speaker 1: officially is known as the President's Commission on the Assassination 49 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 1: of President Kennedy, which I don't know. I feel like 50 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:18,079 Speaker 1: one too many presidents in there, but that's fine. I 51 00:03:18,120 --> 00:03:19,919 Speaker 1: didn't name that. Can you make it into an acronym 52 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:22,679 Speaker 1: for me? That helps me digest it a little better? Ben? Oh, 53 00:03:22,760 --> 00:03:28,240 Speaker 1: the T PC O T A O P K better before. Anyway, 54 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:32,680 Speaker 1: it was formed by the president that immediately followed uh 55 00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:36,680 Speaker 1: the President's death. Lyndon Johnson, correct, by the way, was 56 00:03:36,760 --> 00:03:39,720 Speaker 1: a real pill. Apparently he was a pill. A lot 57 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:42,480 Speaker 1: of accusations have been made about him and his involvement 58 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:45,240 Speaker 1: with the assassination of JFK over the years. We have 59 00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:47,880 Speaker 1: not found any of them to be completely true, but 60 00:03:47,920 --> 00:03:50,160 Speaker 1: there are some juicy details in there, but has a 61 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:52,840 Speaker 1: very pleasant sounding name. When you say the initials lb J, 62 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:56,840 Speaker 1: it's very mellifluous. It is. I just what you know. 63 00:03:56,920 --> 00:04:01,080 Speaker 1: There was a thing listeners, friends and neighbors that Lyndon 64 00:04:01,160 --> 00:04:03,880 Speaker 1: Johnson used to do. It was called the Johnson treatment. 65 00:04:04,040 --> 00:04:06,840 Speaker 1: He would get in people's faces, like grabbed them by 66 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:11,480 Speaker 1: their lapels four heads inches away. He followed one guy 67 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:16,039 Speaker 1: into a bathroom, busted into this stall. That wouldn't fly today. Yeah, 68 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:18,880 Speaker 1: while he was doing his business. Well, he's a large 69 00:04:18,960 --> 00:04:21,720 Speaker 1: gentleman as well, very tall and imposing, bit of a 70 00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:24,280 Speaker 1: bull in the china shop kind of scenario. Absolutely what 71 00:04:24,680 --> 00:04:28,240 Speaker 1: LBJ do? Okay. So he formed the President's Commission on 72 00:04:28,240 --> 00:04:31,799 Speaker 1: the Assassination of President Kennedy on November twenty nine, nineteen 73 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:35,359 Speaker 1: sixty three, just a few days after President Kennedy was shot, 74 00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:38,040 Speaker 1: and it was all the whole reason to have this 75 00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 1: was to investigate what happened on that day, right because 76 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:45,120 Speaker 1: people wanted answers, and the Commission acted as quickly as 77 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:50,960 Speaker 1: they could. To this day, you can read their full report. Well, yeah, 78 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:54,440 Speaker 1: they're quote unquote full report. All the information it was 79 00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:59,040 Speaker 1: given to the Commission quickly in government time. Isn't like days, right, 80 00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 1: I mean this rep were likely took many months to yea, yeah, 81 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 1: this is not quickly in people's time, it's quickly in 82 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:08,720 Speaker 1: government time. So they were racing to determine whether there 83 00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:12,600 Speaker 1: was any truth, any stands to the multitudinous rumors surrounding 84 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 1: this assassination, and the commission eventually concluded that Lee Harvey 85 00:05:18,279 --> 00:05:23,359 Speaker 1: Oswald acted alone under his own power, no assistance from 86 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: any criminal organization, intelligence agencies, eating shady dude or foreign 87 00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 1: government or foreign government. That's very important, And that Jack Ruby, 88 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:37,680 Speaker 1: the man who would later assassinate Oswald, had no previous 89 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:43,039 Speaker 1: relationship with that guy either, So Jack Ruby apparently the story. Yeah, 90 00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:45,840 Speaker 1: the story was that the lone gunman was killed by 91 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 1: a lone gunman and nothing is related. Nothing to see here, 92 00:05:50,320 --> 00:05:53,200 Speaker 1: folks know, none of the conspiracies have been reading about, 93 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 1: or anyone's been saying in papers of these weird rumors. 94 00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:59,040 Speaker 1: None of that's true. Please continue with your regularly scheduled programming, 95 00:05:59,320 --> 00:06:02,120 Speaker 1: and when when the When the three of us started 96 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: this show, one of the things that we wanted to 97 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:08,880 Speaker 1: do was to explore the stuff on the fringes, right, 98 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:14,320 Speaker 1: and and we stay away from the JFK assassination because 99 00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:18,599 Speaker 1: there has already been so much work done on it, right, 100 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:21,520 Speaker 1: And there's Stone comes in and makes a movie, and 101 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:24,120 Speaker 1: then a whole bunch of other conspiracy theories back into 102 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:27,799 Speaker 1: the left and nothing, you know, nothing that we would 103 00:06:27,800 --> 00:06:31,159 Speaker 1: have found would have been new news. It would have 104 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 1: been old beans. I'm not giving up on it. I'm 105 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:41,080 Speaker 1: telling you guys, it's going to see. Nobody gets old 106 00:06:41,080 --> 00:06:43,760 Speaker 1: beans yet. But that's just because this episode hasn't come out. 107 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 1: I'm a I'm I'm telling you guys. Invest now get 108 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 1: in on the ground floor of these various catchphrases. So 109 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:56,279 Speaker 1: the Commission, the Commission has a quote where they they 110 00:06:56,400 --> 00:07:02,480 Speaker 1: sum up this relationship quote. The Commission made intensive inquiry 111 00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:05,240 Speaker 1: into the backgrounds and relationships of Oswald and Ruby to 112 00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:08,120 Speaker 1: determine whether they knew each other or were involved in 113 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:10,880 Speaker 1: a plot of any kind with each other or others. 114 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:14,400 Speaker 1: It was unable to find any credible evidence to support 115 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:17,680 Speaker 1: the rumors linking Oswald and Ruby directly or through others. 116 00:07:17,880 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 1: The Commission concluded that they were not involved in a 117 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:24,640 Speaker 1: conspiratorial relationship with each other or with any third party. 118 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 1: In quote and there is some very important information that 119 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 1: will get to towards the close of this show to 120 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:35,320 Speaker 1: discuss specifically what may have been held to the Chess, 121 00:07:35,920 --> 00:07:39,200 Speaker 1: to some of the intelligence agencies and not given to 122 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:44,760 Speaker 1: the warr In Commission specifically. Right, So they're doing their best, 123 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:47,040 Speaker 1: people on the Warring Commission, and doing their best. I 124 00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:49,760 Speaker 1: hate to steal a line from Beauty and the Beast, 125 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:53,320 Speaker 1: but the typical conspiracy stuff you'll go you're going to 126 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:55,920 Speaker 1: hear about the JFK assassination might as well be tale 127 00:07:55,920 --> 00:08:00,160 Speaker 1: as old as time. At this point, however, very recent Lee, 128 00:08:02,280 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 1: there were documents, files a plethora and I am using 129 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:13,120 Speaker 1: that word correctly of files pertaining to the assassination that 130 00:08:13,200 --> 00:08:18,800 Speaker 1: were classified for decades and again, like in the past 131 00:08:19,000 --> 00:08:22,360 Speaker 1: couple of weeks, as we record this, as Noel pointed 132 00:08:22,400 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 1: out earlier, Uh, this is a bit of a time 133 00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:28,320 Speaker 1: travel experience. Whenever you're listening to a podcast, we're in 134 00:08:28,400 --> 00:08:32,600 Speaker 1: early November when we're recording this. It's November. It's November. 135 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:35,160 Speaker 1: What year is only just okay, year of our Lord 136 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:40,480 Speaker 1: two thousand and seventeen. Oh whoa the whole time we 137 00:08:40,559 --> 00:08:45,400 Speaker 1: are then? Uh so recently, uh, several of these documents 138 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 1: a pleathor of these documents were release, were declassified, and 139 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:54,680 Speaker 1: for years people who do not believe the official story 140 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 1: or the findings of the War in Commission have been 141 00:08:57,679 --> 00:09:02,080 Speaker 1: um have been convinced that there will be some sort 142 00:09:02,160 --> 00:09:06,360 Speaker 1: of great revelation that that comes forth right in the 143 00:09:06,400 --> 00:09:09,640 Speaker 1: public eye. I have to put myself in that camp. Yeah, honestly, 144 00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:13,280 Speaker 1: because we've talked about these records being released by the 145 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:17,000 Speaker 1: past at least two presidents. UM. When when there's a 146 00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 1: date that comes up, that's essentially, hey, if the president decides, uh, 147 00:09:21,520 --> 00:09:25,160 Speaker 1: he or she can release these documents, And every time 148 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 1: that has happened up until this year, they have said, uh, no, 149 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:33,280 Speaker 1: we're not going to release the documents. Yeah. Something something 150 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:36,160 Speaker 1: always comes up. Yes. So there was this thing, this 151 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:41,160 Speaker 1: act that Congress passed called the JFK Assassination Records Collection Act, 152 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:47,880 Speaker 1: which they passed in Yes, George Bush, George H. W. Bush, 153 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:51,120 Speaker 1: that is a George W. Bush's father, UM, gotta do 154 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:55,600 Speaker 1: the voice. Do you do the voice? You were doing well? Um? 155 00:09:56,280 --> 00:10:02,080 Speaker 1: On October, my daddy passed, uh this act, he signed 156 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:05,199 Speaker 1: it and UM. The final release date, because it's fifty 157 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:11,480 Speaker 1: fifty years after is Uh, October two thousand seventeen. So 158 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:14,600 Speaker 1: uh that that was a date that uh, the current 159 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:18,360 Speaker 1: president used to release his documents. Mr President, Mr President. Uh. 160 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:21,319 Speaker 1: Question from the front, Hi, Ben Bolen stuff. They want 161 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:24,360 Speaker 1: you to know what does this collection consist of? I'm 162 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:33,079 Speaker 1: gonna call you all beans. Alright, let's let's jump back 163 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:35,440 Speaker 1: into a real world. Matt. So I could I just 164 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:37,200 Speaker 1: need to go through some of this? Sure, what is? 165 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 1: But what's in this collection? Okay? So this collection, uh, 166 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:44,760 Speaker 1: it's basically all of the intelligence agencies and federal government 167 00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 1: organizations and agencies in US. They got all the documents 168 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 1: relating to the assassination of JFK, and they collected them 169 00:10:50,640 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 1: all and they sent him over to the National Archives. Okay, 170 00:10:53,559 --> 00:10:57,880 Speaker 1: So in this collection, it's approximately five million pages of records, 171 00:10:57,880 --> 00:11:01,320 Speaker 1: like printed pages. Yeah, we're talking in Indiana Jones style 172 00:11:01,440 --> 00:11:04,559 Speaker 1: vaults just going all the way up to four stories 173 00:11:04,640 --> 00:11:09,160 Speaker 1: or whatever. Of these records are open and full. So 174 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 1: that's a huge amount of five million records. No one 175 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:15,800 Speaker 1: accidentally used a black highlighter. Well, according I don't think 176 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:17,720 Speaker 1: there's any such thing as a black highlighter. It's an 177 00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 1: awesome Onion article where it says the where it's like 178 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:25,160 Speaker 1: FBI and CIA realized that they've been using black highlighters 179 00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:29,880 Speaker 1: for decades, so wonderful, So no black highlighters, and in 180 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 1: eleven percent of them they're released in part with the 181 00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:36,400 Speaker 1: black highlighters going through, which would be stuff like proper names, 182 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:40,800 Speaker 1: dresses maybe you know, it's usually proper names and proper places, 183 00:11:41,120 --> 00:11:43,760 Speaker 1: specific places that would be like a little dangerous, or numbers. 184 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:46,640 Speaker 1: That's where you see stuff like blank met with blank 185 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 1: approximately twelve forty PM that blank on this blank exactly 186 00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:58,560 Speaker 1: that they blanked about about. Yeah. So then one percent, 187 00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 1: there's a remaining one percent of this five million pages 188 00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:07,880 Speaker 1: that is identified as assassin related and they remain completely 189 00:12:07,920 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 1: sealed or at least up until this year. And there 190 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:17,400 Speaker 1: was a governing board that that made the call here, 191 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:25,199 Speaker 1: So it whenever we deal with government related documentation or filing, 192 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:28,800 Speaker 1: we run into all these dry names. So here's another one. 193 00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:33,200 Speaker 1: The Assassination Records Review Board, the a r R being 194 00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:37,920 Speaker 1: they they are the ones who said you have to 195 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:44,200 Speaker 1: you have to redact these these eleven percent documents, and 196 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:48,480 Speaker 1: then this one percent nobody can see. Ever, who do 197 00:12:48,520 --> 00:12:51,240 Speaker 1: you think they get to do? The manual redacting. It 198 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:53,000 Speaker 1: has to be can't just be some intern it has 199 00:12:53,040 --> 00:12:55,840 Speaker 1: to be something pretty high level. Yeah, you have to 200 00:12:55,840 --> 00:13:00,920 Speaker 1: have at that level, compartmentalized, crappy, kind of sloggy job. 201 00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:03,000 Speaker 1: Can you imagine just having to go through thousands of 202 00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:07,559 Speaker 1: pages and just like X stuff out. It's very process oriented, 203 00:13:07,679 --> 00:13:11,240 Speaker 1: and I bet it's viewed as highly important. I I 204 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:13,240 Speaker 1: can imagine. I think, I think you're right. I don't 205 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:15,360 Speaker 1: mean to diminish it. I just in terms of process 206 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:19,920 Speaker 1: what age sure, UM and that agency the it was 207 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:21,960 Speaker 1: a temp agency. It just it was there for a 208 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:24,400 Speaker 1: time and then it went away after it fulfilled its job. 209 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 1: Talking about Yeah, are only lasted from and according to 210 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:35,080 Speaker 1: the act itself that Congress passed UM, all the records 211 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:38,280 Speaker 1: that would that were previously withheld, the one in the 212 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:42,720 Speaker 1: eleven percent, all of those records should be released on 213 00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:48,200 Speaker 1: October seventeen unless further authorized by the President of the 214 00:13:48,280 --> 00:13:51,000 Speaker 1: United States, which will be withholding, yes for withholding, So 215 00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:56,040 Speaker 1: unless the President decided or was told to decide to 216 00:13:56,200 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 1: not release these documents. Slippery sloop, right, which happened again 217 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 1: previously at the other a little what do you call 218 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:06,800 Speaker 1: on the road the markers, the other markers where it 219 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:09,080 Speaker 1: could have been released or at least in sure. Yeah, 220 00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 1: and this as as you said, Matt, was signed by 221 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 1: President George H. W. Bush, who was just in the 222 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:22,760 Speaker 1: studio with us a moment ago on October nineteen. Uh. 223 00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:29,000 Speaker 1: In July of seventeen, the National Archives released almost four 224 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:33,280 Speaker 1: thousand records right that included stuff from the FBI and 225 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:38,680 Speaker 1: the CIA, and somewhere some have been withheld in full 226 00:14:38,720 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 1: in the past and somewhere released redacted. And I gotta 227 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:44,920 Speaker 1: tell you, ladies and gentlemen, friends and neighbors, the three 228 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 1: of us spend a lot of time reading these terrible 229 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:55,240 Speaker 1: scans from like the vault, the FBI vault, where you 230 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:58,680 Speaker 1: can you can see someone has made some scribbled notes 231 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:03,520 Speaker 1: in the margins, gone over, gone over it to blackout 232 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 1: different parts of things, and they're they're tough to read, 233 00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:10,480 Speaker 1: you know, it's it's a it's a pain to read 234 00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:12,840 Speaker 1: all this context. I mean too, I mean like there's 235 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:16,040 Speaker 1: so much redactive that it literally strips it of largely 236 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:18,800 Speaker 1: any meaning. You know, it's very frustrating. Yeah, not to 237 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:22,120 Speaker 1: mention you're dealing with intelligence agencies that are making these 238 00:15:22,680 --> 00:15:25,040 Speaker 1: producing these documents, and a lot of times there are 239 00:15:25,640 --> 00:15:30,520 Speaker 1: like crypto cryptograms there, there are uh anagrams, they're like 240 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:32,680 Speaker 1: they're they're weird. There's weird stuff that goes on in 241 00:15:32,680 --> 00:15:35,200 Speaker 1: some of these documents, not to mention they're already pretty dry. 242 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:40,920 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh So this the banality of 243 00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 1: evil aside, which is what I'm going to categorize a 244 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:49,120 Speaker 1: lot of this redaction stuff as the banality of evil aside, Right, 245 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:54,680 Speaker 1: the inactions of good people aside. Uh. There is still 246 00:15:55,520 --> 00:16:00,560 Speaker 1: a struggle to release this information, yes, whatever it might contain, right, 247 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:04,640 Speaker 1: And a lot of people wondered whether there would be 248 00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:07,640 Speaker 1: some smoking gun, whether there would be some sort of 249 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 1: memo from you know, nineteen sixty two where one one 250 00:16:13,040 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 1: intelligence operatives says to another, Hey, I just got off 251 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:20,960 Speaker 1: the phone with so and so and they said that 252 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:25,160 Speaker 1: it's going down in Dallas. You know. Yeah, that is 253 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:29,080 Speaker 1: not the case. There's some stuff that's kind of close 254 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:32,880 Speaker 1: to that, but it's not it's not that specific. And 255 00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:35,920 Speaker 1: that wasn't the only release that that July release was 256 00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 1: actually jumping the gun a bit on that October date 257 00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:43,800 Speaker 1: because on the actual date, the National Archives released another 258 00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:48,080 Speaker 1: almost three thousand documents, which is huge and This included 259 00:16:48,160 --> 00:16:50,720 Speaker 1: a bunch of other stuff that they also released that 260 00:16:50,880 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 1: was pertaining to that Assassination Records Review Board. A lot 261 00:16:54,680 --> 00:17:01,000 Speaker 1: of the emails, well they're emails from so I wonder 262 00:17:01,040 --> 00:17:04,840 Speaker 1: what that even looked like. I like forward forward for Yeah, yeah, 263 00:17:04,920 --> 00:17:08,119 Speaker 1: I don't know. But they released fifty two thousand plus 264 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:12,880 Speaker 1: emails and almost seventeen thousand files from the from that 265 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:15,640 Speaker 1: review board that actually decided what was going to be 266 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:19,520 Speaker 1: redacted and not. And then on November three, just a 267 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:22,639 Speaker 1: few days ago, there was another release from the National 268 00:17:22,720 --> 00:17:27,600 Speaker 1: Archives of six hundred and seventy six records and this 269 00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:32,000 Speaker 1: was Central Intelligence stuff they were previously denied entirely the 270 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:35,280 Speaker 1: CIA stuff. Yeaheah, the the CIA stuff. And you also 271 00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:38,280 Speaker 1: have Department of Justice, Department of Defense, how Select Committee 272 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,600 Speaker 1: on Assassinations, and even stuff from the National Archives like 273 00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:46,040 Speaker 1: a single document. So what does this all mean? You 274 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:49,240 Speaker 1: can also, I think that was excellent review of the 275 00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:53,200 Speaker 1: chronology of this. Uh you can, by the way, uh 276 00:17:53,520 --> 00:17:57,080 Speaker 1: take a take a line from Matt and view all 277 00:17:57,080 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 1: these files yourself. You can read along. Yeah, you can 278 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:03,280 Speaker 1: it along if you are if you are willing to 279 00:18:03,480 --> 00:18:07,200 Speaker 1: again put up with some poor quality reproduction some scrolled 280 00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:11,760 Speaker 1: newes and margins, and a lot of a lot of 281 00:18:12,119 --> 00:18:15,480 Speaker 1: missing pieces. Right, it's a crueling journey if you want 282 00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 1: to go on it. But I really do think it's 283 00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:21,960 Speaker 1: worth seeing the history. And the big question is to 284 00:18:22,040 --> 00:18:25,680 Speaker 1: what end does this matter? Was there anything worth reading 285 00:18:26,000 --> 00:18:28,840 Speaker 1: in there? We will tell you after a quick word 286 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 1: from our sponsors, assuming we don't get assassinated during the break. 287 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:39,880 Speaker 1: We're back and I think we'll just jump right in 288 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:43,160 Speaker 1: with a couple of selected articles. A lot of these 289 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:46,600 Speaker 1: come from various news sources because we've kind of had 290 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:49,320 Speaker 1: to go through and research via the news with all 291 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:53,080 Speaker 1: of the official researchers who are going through all this stuff. There. 292 00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:55,840 Speaker 1: There's a gentleman being interviewed on CBS. I was just 293 00:18:55,840 --> 00:18:57,960 Speaker 1: watching just before we went in the studio, and he 294 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:01,520 Speaker 1: said he has this massive team of researchers and interns 295 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:03,439 Speaker 1: and all these people going through the documents and he 296 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:06,200 Speaker 1: says they've been working on it since that July release 297 00:19:06,280 --> 00:19:08,639 Speaker 1: and they've gotten through about eight percent of the newly 298 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:12,199 Speaker 1: released documents. Why didn't we sick our team of interns 299 00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:15,960 Speaker 1: and researchers on that, Well, I mean, I guess we 300 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:18,960 Speaker 1: could have. We don't have one. We just sicked ourselves 301 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:21,639 Speaker 1: on it, which you know, it's that's fine. So we 302 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:25,480 Speaker 1: went to all the top, top notch news sources that 303 00:19:25,560 --> 00:19:30,840 Speaker 1: you're familiar with, Daily Mail, to Vogue, National Enquirer has 304 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,040 Speaker 1: been killing it lately. By the way, I know, I'm 305 00:19:33,080 --> 00:19:35,879 Speaker 1: not kidding. I'm not kidding. Seriously, good journalism coming out 306 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:38,679 Speaker 1: of teen Vogue. I don't know what we did. We 307 00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:40,399 Speaker 1: did look around, and that's what we can't tell. If 308 00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:44,560 Speaker 1: he's joking, I'm not, it's true. Ask anybody she's okay, yeah, 309 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 1: all right. See, and you're probably wondering because we are 310 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:51,959 Speaker 1: moving a little quickly on this stuff. You're you're probably thinking, Matt, no, Ben, 311 00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:56,840 Speaker 1: you you guys obviously just checked with someone off Mike 312 00:19:56,880 --> 00:20:01,280 Speaker 1: about teen Vogue sign. You got the sign. Who is 313 00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:04,639 Speaker 1: this mystery person? It is our new coworker, Kathleen Quillian, 314 00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:07,639 Speaker 1: who is sitting in with super producer Paul helping to 315 00:20:07,680 --> 00:20:10,440 Speaker 1: engineer this session, and she's going to play a big 316 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:17,240 Speaker 1: part in the stuff media family very soon. Right, Yes, yes, indeed, welcome, spoiler, welcome, welcome. 317 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 1: So point being, the point remains that when you're looking 318 00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:25,480 Speaker 1: at this sort of stuff, it is paramount to investigate 319 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,679 Speaker 1: every single new source you can find. Yes, you should, 320 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:37,880 Speaker 1: regardless of whatever you're starting point, maybe ideologically, um, experientially, etcetera. 321 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:43,320 Speaker 1: You owe it to yourself to check as many things, 322 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:46,520 Speaker 1: especially things that come from places that you might disagree with. Yeah, 323 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:48,160 Speaker 1: you gotta get a lay of the land. You got 324 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:49,919 Speaker 1: to kind of be your own aggregator too. And it's like, 325 00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:51,639 Speaker 1: because you know, this is the kind of stuff where 326 00:20:51,680 --> 00:20:53,840 Speaker 1: there are going to be, it's going to be mired 327 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:55,720 Speaker 1: in various opinions on all side of the other, so 328 00:20:55,920 --> 00:20:57,760 Speaker 1: you kind of get the full picture. It's best to 329 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 1: kind of like have a broad spectrum of material, which 330 00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:03,200 Speaker 1: is what we tried to do, what Matt largely tried 331 00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:05,159 Speaker 1: to do. This is his baby, right, Yeah, that's our 332 00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 1: bloodhound on Well, and I actually found, um, just gonna 333 00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:11,080 Speaker 1: let everybody know, I found a CNN article that was 334 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:14,719 Speaker 1: the in my opinion, the best kind of middle ground 335 00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:17,160 Speaker 1: for all the sources I had been finding everything from 336 00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 1: the Intercept to the Guardian and just everything in between, 337 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:23,600 Speaker 1: the Fox News. Uh, the CNN article hit the main 338 00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:27,800 Speaker 1: I guess, the main documents that I found to be pertinent. 339 00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:30,960 Speaker 1: Does that make sense? It does give it to us. Okay. 340 00:21:31,520 --> 00:21:35,639 Speaker 1: So the first document involves a telephone call that was 341 00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:40,919 Speaker 1: intercepted on September nineteen sixty three, allegedly from Lee Harvey 342 00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:44,800 Speaker 1: Oswald to a KGB agent in Mexico City. This is 343 00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:48,400 Speaker 1: a good one. Oh yeah, so uh this memo from 344 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:52,479 Speaker 1: the day of Kennedy's assassination. Um. It talks about this 345 00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:55,840 Speaker 1: call that was intercepted to the Russian embassy in Mexico. 346 00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:59,399 Speaker 1: He spoke to the console, um that I'm not gonna 347 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:05,280 Speaker 1: try and pronounce the name Vali. Yes, this was an 348 00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:10,359 Speaker 1: identified KGB officer, and the gentleman was speaking in broken Russian. 349 00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:14,479 Speaker 1: Can I can I interject here? There is there is 350 00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:20,160 Speaker 1: one Um Oddly, I hesitate to use the word funny, 351 00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:22,480 Speaker 1: but I think it is funny. There is one odd 352 00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:29,400 Speaker 1: side note in this. In this conversation, Oswald insisted that 353 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:35,159 Speaker 1: the conversation be held in Russian, and his Russian was 354 00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:40,399 Speaker 1: cartoonishly bad. It's like it's it's like like on the 355 00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:44,160 Speaker 1: level of saying, uh, bonus nachos instead of buenos nchez 356 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:47,480 Speaker 1: if actually speaks Spanish, and to the point where the 357 00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:54,919 Speaker 1: KGB folks like having difficulty understanding him and probably going Lee, 358 00:22:54,960 --> 00:22:58,600 Speaker 1: you mind the speak English and he's and he's like yeah. 359 00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:01,199 Speaker 1: But it seems like per Apps they knew there was 360 00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:04,399 Speaker 1: some you know, some eavesdropping going on, and maybe that 361 00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 1: was one of the reasons. But again, you're speaking to 362 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:10,600 Speaker 1: a console at the Russian embassy in Mexico and you're 363 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:13,080 Speaker 1: gonna speak Russian. So I don't know, Maybe it's just 364 00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:16,000 Speaker 1: I guess to hide amongst all the other conversations that 365 00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:19,520 Speaker 1: occurred today. Sure, and the person who wrote the memo 366 00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:24,320 Speaker 1: has said that relayed the belief on the FBI's part 367 00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:27,399 Speaker 1: that Oswald was trying to get out, right, who was 368 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,479 Speaker 1: trying to get to the USSR, yes, or you know, 369 00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:33,240 Speaker 1: or somewhere else who knows exactly want to get a 370 00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:37,040 Speaker 1: visa right for some reason, possibly even to get into Cuba. 371 00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: And this whole trip that Lee Harvey Oswald took to 372 00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:46,439 Speaker 1: Mexico City very close to when the assassination occurred, is 373 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 1: one of those things that just has a ton of 374 00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:51,960 Speaker 1: conspiracy theories surrounding it, and rightly so, I mean, that's 375 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 1: completely understandable, especially because the US government spent quite a 376 00:23:57,600 --> 00:24:01,640 Speaker 1: lot of blood, sweat and tears. I'm trying to convince 377 00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:04,520 Speaker 1: people otherwise, and now all of a sudden the story 378 00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:07,080 Speaker 1: has changed, like, oh, wait, we did know he was 379 00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:10,439 Speaker 1: in Mexico City, and like, ah, we did, we didn't, 380 00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:13,200 Speaker 1: we did, and we didn't. Well, yeah, and especially when 381 00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:15,960 Speaker 1: you bring into account the tumultuous relationship that the US 382 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,760 Speaker 1: had with Cuba, especially you're right around that time and 383 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:25,280 Speaker 1: specifically involving President Kennedy. So what's next. I really appreciate 384 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:28,679 Speaker 1: that you mentioned Cuba here exactly. There's a cable from 385 00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:32,960 Speaker 1: the FBI in nineteen sixty seven, and it's just a cable. 386 00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:36,320 Speaker 1: So it's like, I don't know something that can you 387 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:39,400 Speaker 1: explain cables really fast? We've talked about these before. Telegram 388 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:42,320 Speaker 1: kind of. It's just almost just a quick communication kind 389 00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:46,240 Speaker 1: of thing coming from an operative or from a diplomat 390 00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 1: or something. It's a lot of times you'll hear hear 391 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:53,680 Speaker 1: cables used with diplomatic community, right, cable will depending on 392 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:58,080 Speaker 1: the context. A cable can function as a straight point 393 00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:00,080 Speaker 1: A to point B thing that he's not going to 394 00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,879 Speaker 1: be vulnerable in theory, vulnerable to the same sort of 395 00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 1: surveillance techniques that could be used in a traditional letter 396 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,879 Speaker 1: or something happening over an open line, so it's very 397 00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,440 Speaker 1: much like a telegram. But the thing is with a telegram, 398 00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:19,159 Speaker 1: for instance, you know, um, Johnny Johnny Q public could 399 00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:22,040 Speaker 1: with the right equipment just tune in and then also 400 00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:25,439 Speaker 1: hear whatever is happening. Right. Uh, So a cable is 401 00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:31,800 Speaker 1: supposed to be a little bit uh, not like leak proof, 402 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:36,119 Speaker 1: but more sustent more yeah, yeah, yeah, leak resistant, more secure. 403 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 1: And that's why you hear the folks at Wiki leaks 404 00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:46,879 Speaker 1: Julian Osane, is he still locked up? I think the 405 00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:51,239 Speaker 1: treadmill at the embassy. Yeah, okay, Well, Wiki Leaks, you know, 406 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:56,919 Speaker 1: lives on cables, right, reporting cables, And I bring that 407 00:25:57,040 --> 00:26:00,960 Speaker 1: up to point out again that cables are in theory 408 00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:03,720 Speaker 1: more secure. And surely I would think that the cable, 409 00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:06,239 Speaker 1: the term cable probably doesn't mean the same thing as 410 00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:09,280 Speaker 1: today as it did then. Uh And actually it just confirmed. 411 00:26:09,280 --> 00:26:13,480 Speaker 1: It looks like it just refers to a confidential text message. 412 00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:16,080 Speaker 1: So I'm wondering if maybe today it might just be 413 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:19,399 Speaker 1: some kind of encrypted person to person communication. See and 414 00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: now on the document itself, in big bolded type, it 415 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:29,639 Speaker 1: says sent by coded teletype. So there you go. So 416 00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:34,760 Speaker 1: what happened? Oh, so this was talking about a Cuban 417 00:26:34,840 --> 00:26:39,760 Speaker 1: gentleman who is being interrogated. Um, there's a lot to 418 00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:42,280 Speaker 1: go through with this one document for this tiny little thing. 419 00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:48,280 Speaker 1: But anyway, this gentleman who was being interrogated, UM was 420 00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:52,600 Speaker 1: asked about whether or not Oswald was a good shot, 421 00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:55,040 Speaker 1: like just hey, is he you know, is he good 422 00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:59,280 Speaker 1: with the rifles and a good sniper? And the gentleman replied, oh, 423 00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:02,320 Speaker 1: he was good. And then when you know, he was 424 00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:05,159 Speaker 1: further asked like, well, why would you say that, and 425 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:08,800 Speaker 1: this gentleman said, well, I knew him, Cuban Cuban officer. 426 00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:14,240 Speaker 1: So that's that's another interesting thing because you will find 427 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:16,399 Speaker 1: a lot of experts and people who spend their entire 428 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:19,680 Speaker 1: careers researching just this one day in Dallas in n 429 00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:25,119 Speaker 1: uh They believe that Oswald was actually a terrible shot, 430 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:28,040 Speaker 1: and a lot of the evidence indicates that he was 431 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:31,880 Speaker 1: he was not the world's best sniper. And then you'll 432 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:35,360 Speaker 1: find opposing evidence or opposing people with the opposing view 433 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: that he was actually an amazing crack shot. So maybe 434 00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:40,800 Speaker 1: one of those theories implies that he was some kind 435 00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:45,119 Speaker 1: of stooge or patsy, a fall guy or whatever. Or 436 00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:50,080 Speaker 1: was in communication with Cuba or the Soviet Union via Cuba. 437 00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 1: It amazing, It's like, it's crazy. It goes on. So 438 00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:58,320 Speaker 1: remember what we said at the top. The official Warrant 439 00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:04,920 Speaker 1: Commission conclusion was at Jack Ruby acted acted alone, right, 440 00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:09,399 Speaker 1: and uh just did what he saw as his patriotic duty. 441 00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:12,000 Speaker 1: I'm killing the guy who killed the president. You know, 442 00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:16,560 Speaker 1: instant karma is gonna get you, etcetera. Someone. It turns out, 443 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:20,120 Speaker 1: as this was revealed in these classified files, someone called 444 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,280 Speaker 1: the FBI threatening to kill Lee Harvey Oswald a day 445 00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:28,639 Speaker 1: before his murder. Wow. So a document from November sixty 446 00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 1: three indicated that j Edgar Hoover Um actually addressed Oswald's death, 447 00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:38,840 Speaker 1: specifically referencing that it was at the hands of Jack Ruby, 448 00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 1: and the quote goes as follows quote there is nothing 449 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:45,160 Speaker 1: further on the Oswald case except that he is dead, 450 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:50,240 Speaker 1: which Alex Hoover. Hoover then indicated that agents in the 451 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:54,400 Speaker 1: FBI's Dallas Field office received a call from a gentleman 452 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:59,240 Speaker 1: speaking in a very calm tone, who claimed to be 453 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:04,160 Speaker 1: a member of a committee that was responsible for Oswald's 454 00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:09,120 Speaker 1: assassination or there were a committee that wanted to kill Oswald. Hello, 455 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:13,120 Speaker 1: I am a member of a committee of concerned patriots, 456 00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:17,840 Speaker 1: and we want you to know that as patriots, we 457 00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,760 Speaker 1: are planning to kill the assassin of John F. Kennedy. 458 00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:24,920 Speaker 1: Thank you for your time. All right, then gonna logg 459 00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:33,800 Speaker 1: that call. So this, this situation develops further. Right now, 460 00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:37,560 Speaker 1: we're getting into of course, we're getting as jagg Or 461 00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:42,680 Speaker 1: Hoover creep. Why is he a creep? He's a creepy dude? 462 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:45,560 Speaker 1: Are you serious? Maybe? Why do you think he's agreed 463 00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:51,840 Speaker 1: because he killed Martin Luther King Jr. Pretty obviously, whoa dude, 464 00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,040 Speaker 1: I've never heard you that resolute about something like that. 465 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:58,240 Speaker 1: Well he okay, sorry, he didn't pull the trigger, but 466 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:05,160 Speaker 1: he ran. He ran active and illegal campaigns against against 467 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:07,960 Speaker 1: people that he saw as a threat to his version 468 00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:10,200 Speaker 1: of the status. Quote you know he didn't he like 469 00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 1: have files on like John Lennon even and then like 470 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:18,600 Speaker 1: he was basically responsible for tailing anyone he saw it. Yeah, racist, 471 00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:24,800 Speaker 1: ultra nationalists, power mad unlike all that. But you use 472 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:28,440 Speaker 1: the term creep, I you know. So Anyway, the FBI 473 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:32,360 Speaker 1: at this point contacted the Dallas Police just to reiterate 474 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,720 Speaker 1: to them, Hey, somebody just called us and was really 475 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:37,840 Speaker 1: really creepy on the phone, talking about how they want 476 00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:41,000 Speaker 1: to kill Oswald. Just do us a favor and protect him, 477 00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:45,640 Speaker 1: like really protect him, please, Okay, Yeah, And they said, yeah, well, 478 00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:49,680 Speaker 1: we'll totally do that, and they did not. Yeah. Quote 479 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:52,480 Speaker 1: Ruby says no one was associated with him and denies 480 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:55,520 Speaker 1: having made the telephone call to our Dallas office last night. 481 00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:58,280 Speaker 1: That's something Hoover said. And Hoover went on to say 482 00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 1: that the FBI had evidence of Oswald's guilt and intercepted 483 00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:07,920 Speaker 1: communication he had with Cuba and the Soviet Union. Hoover 484 00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:10,000 Speaker 1: went on to say he was concerned that there would 485 00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:13,400 Speaker 1: be doubt in the public sphere about Oswald's guilt and 486 00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:18,640 Speaker 1: the President Johnson would point a commission to investigate the assassination, 487 00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:25,520 Speaker 1: which that actually did happen. However, Yeah, However, I think 488 00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:28,000 Speaker 1: at this point it's important for us to note UH 489 00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:32,040 Speaker 1: something we've mentioned on the show before. It's a fascinating 490 00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:35,720 Speaker 1: thing about the evolution of the the phrase the thought 491 00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 1: terminating cliche conspiracy theory. So, in the wake of the assassination, 492 00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:49,360 Speaker 1: U S Intelligence agencies sent UH confidential memos two various 493 00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:54,880 Speaker 1: media institutions of note like New York Times, Chicago Papers, 494 00:31:55,640 --> 00:32:00,480 Speaker 1: San Francisco, et cetera, and they said, look, here's the story, 495 00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:05,040 Speaker 1: is the official story. If anyone says something different, uh, 496 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:09,440 Speaker 1: make sure to make sure to dismiss it and make 497 00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:14,480 Speaker 1: sure to call it quote a conspiracy theory. It's the 498 00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:18,760 Speaker 1: originating place of this, right, and that's how it entered 499 00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:23,600 Speaker 1: the mainstream lexicon of the United States. And that's why 500 00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:27,440 Speaker 1: you have to be very careful. You know, like we 501 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:29,719 Speaker 1: live in a world where there's an information glut, and 502 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:33,200 Speaker 1: it's very very easy for someone to go make a 503 00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:37,480 Speaker 1: website that purports to be uh, some sort of legit 504 00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:41,000 Speaker 1: news source, right, and then just write all kinds of 505 00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:45,719 Speaker 1: cockamami stuff. Right, But you gotta be very careful when 506 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:50,719 Speaker 1: you hear everybody, and I mean everybody in the West 507 00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:56,240 Speaker 1: calling something a crazy conspiracy or a person a conspiracy 508 00:32:56,280 --> 00:33:00,840 Speaker 1: theorists writer shutting the stuff down because you know, alright, 509 00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:02,560 Speaker 1: I feel like I have to do the rent just briefly, 510 00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:05,479 Speaker 1: just briefly, just briefly. Okay, yeah, we've got like two 511 00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:07,960 Speaker 1: more hours in the studio, right, We're good, Okay, sorry, 512 00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:11,720 Speaker 1: but just just briefly. It is it is a lack 513 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:16,800 Speaker 1: of critical thinking to say that anything called a conspiracy 514 00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:22,360 Speaker 1: theory is automatically um is automatically bullpoop, right, because we're 515 00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:26,120 Speaker 1: a family show, so you know, saying that saying that, 516 00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:31,080 Speaker 1: for instance, the the Royal family of the United Kingdom 517 00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:35,560 Speaker 1: is descended from some secret race of half reptilian alien 518 00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:38,840 Speaker 1: half human hybrids, is that that would be called a 519 00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:43,000 Speaker 1: conspiracy theory, right, Shout out to David Ike. But then 520 00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:46,280 Speaker 1: people are also calling a conspiracy theory to say that, uh, 521 00:33:46,360 --> 00:33:49,800 Speaker 1: international banks are laundry money for drug cards, just like 522 00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:52,080 Speaker 1: the whole use of like fake news right now, you know, 523 00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:55,800 Speaker 1: I mean, all stories and theories are not created equal, 524 00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:58,040 Speaker 1: and especially when a term is applied is like a 525 00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:01,200 Speaker 1: term of abuse or like a diminutive of that's when 526 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:04,000 Speaker 1: things start getting sketchy. So it's like a conspiracy theory 527 00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:07,360 Speaker 1: versus a fringe notion or something, you know what I mean. Like, 528 00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:09,359 Speaker 1: I don't know when you when you apply that term, 529 00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:13,360 Speaker 1: it seems to to large large proportions of the population 530 00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:17,040 Speaker 1: discount the idea and you know the whole sure, yeah, absolutely, 531 00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:19,839 Speaker 1: and that's a mistake. Yeah, And you know, I really 532 00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:23,280 Speaker 1: appreciate you bringing up the fake news concept because we're 533 00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:30,080 Speaker 1: absolutely right. Psychologically, we our species are built to seek classification, right, 534 00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:34,080 Speaker 1: to seek hierarchy, to seek order, which means that it's very, 535 00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:38,360 Speaker 1: very convenient to uh wrap everything up in a symbolic 536 00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:41,560 Speaker 1: phrase and throw that phrase in as a shortcut to 537 00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:44,080 Speaker 1: critical thinking. It's like, I like jazz, but I don't 538 00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:50,399 Speaker 1: like fusion. It's just like that. Uh So, now we're 539 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:52,480 Speaker 1: already in the thick of it. We're finding out from 540 00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:58,160 Speaker 1: these released files that at least several things at least 541 00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:00,640 Speaker 1: in a few cases, the things that the War in 542 00:35:00,719 --> 00:35:04,640 Speaker 1: Commission and the US at large we're saying it turned 543 00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:07,320 Speaker 1: out not to be true. They don't quite jad. No, 544 00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:11,440 Speaker 1: there's no fusion. There's just jazz. So let's insert right here. 545 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:14,400 Speaker 1: If you haven't already listened to our episode on or 546 00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:16,000 Speaker 1: maybe watched our video, I don't know if we have 547 00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:20,080 Speaker 1: an episode on it on uh the Central Intelligence agencies 548 00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:24,520 Speaker 1: and the US government's plans and tactics to assassinate Fidel 549 00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:27,719 Speaker 1: Castro of Cuba, because you need to you need to 550 00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:30,160 Speaker 1: get that information right now. We did do a video 551 00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:33,440 Speaker 1: on that. Yeah, pause, go watch that video then come back. Well, 552 00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:36,439 Speaker 1: maybe if you're driving, just hang out an ad break 553 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:39,000 Speaker 1: to give them time to do it. We can. Yeah, 554 00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:42,200 Speaker 1: what do you say, what better time than the present? 555 00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:50,920 Speaker 1: And we've returned, let's say you want to do a 556 00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:53,799 Speaker 1: couple more specific files. Yeah, we have to keep going. 557 00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:56,520 Speaker 1: There's so much stuff here, right, I don't know, I 558 00:35:56,600 --> 00:35:58,480 Speaker 1: candidly do not know if we were going to get 559 00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:00,600 Speaker 1: to all of it, So we don't. We do want 560 00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:02,840 Speaker 1: your help after you listen to this episode of Folks. 561 00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:06,440 Speaker 1: If there's something that you feel your fellow listeners need 562 00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:09,200 Speaker 1: to know about this release, please write to us and 563 00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:11,560 Speaker 1: let us know and we'll we'll put it on the 564 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:16,320 Speaker 1: air as well. So the CIA did consider placing mafia 565 00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:20,920 Speaker 1: hits on Castro. Yeah, mafia hits. So they Now that 566 00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:24,160 Speaker 1: you've listened or watched that video, you know that there 567 00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:28,279 Speaker 1: were some crazy theories or some crazy plans brought up 568 00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:32,040 Speaker 1: by the government in the United States to kill Fidel Castro. 569 00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:37,440 Speaker 1: Exploding cigars, weird umbrellas, stuff in wet suits that yeah, 570 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:42,520 Speaker 1: like from like the Novelty store. Well but but but 571 00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:46,000 Speaker 1: but really crazy stuff that doesn't seem true. In the 572 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:48,120 Speaker 1: National Spy Museum, I think you can see some of 573 00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:49,840 Speaker 1: that stuff. For a couple of other places where we 574 00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:55,080 Speaker 1: can find it. Um. But this specifically was a the 575 00:36:55,160 --> 00:36:59,239 Speaker 1: Rockefeller Commission, a document from nine and he was detailing 576 00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:02,720 Speaker 1: the c a's role in all kinds of foreign assassinations 577 00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:06,120 Speaker 1: and specifically plans to assassinate Castro in the early days 578 00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:09,200 Speaker 1: of the Kennedy administration. And the report said that Attorney 579 00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:14,759 Speaker 1: General Robert Kennedy, the brother of President JFK also assassinated Yes, 580 00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:17,759 Speaker 1: and a whole other story, a whole series of episodes, 581 00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:20,120 Speaker 1: but we'll get into that some other time. Uh. He 582 00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:24,040 Speaker 1: told the FBI that he learned the CIA hired some intermediary, 583 00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:27,440 Speaker 1: another person, a third party to come through an approach 584 00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:31,919 Speaker 1: sam gen Kanna Gian Kanna. Do he does that sound 585 00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:38,560 Speaker 1: familiar to from m No, this is a prominent mafia 586 00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:42,160 Speaker 1: person and known mafia person at the time, with the 587 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:44,680 Speaker 1: proposition they broach this guy saying, Hey, we're gonna pay 588 00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:48,719 Speaker 1: a hundred and fifty thousand dollars to get somebody with it, 589 00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:52,160 Speaker 1: either within your organization or somebody else to kill Castro 590 00:37:52,320 --> 00:37:55,640 Speaker 1: in Cuba. Like that's crazy. The government was gonna hire 591 00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:58,040 Speaker 1: mafia hitman. Well, I mean it probably like you know, 592 00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:00,640 Speaker 1: it gives them plausible deniability or I mean I if 593 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:03,160 Speaker 1: it's not like if it's someone that's completely not not 594 00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:05,640 Speaker 1: connected to the government. Oh yeah, sure. In this case, 595 00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:07,839 Speaker 1: it would probably be layer upon layer upon layer. If 596 00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:11,600 Speaker 1: you're talking about the government hiring a mafia guy to 597 00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,720 Speaker 1: hire some other guys. And I know the fifty grand 598 00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:19,760 Speaker 1: doesn't sound like a really big amount of money, but today, 599 00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:24,280 Speaker 1: right today, it's today. Yeah, I did the inflation calculation 600 00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:27,319 Speaker 1: work in this Uh it's it's about one point two 601 00:38:27,360 --> 00:38:30,719 Speaker 1: million dollars. Wow, I do a hit for that. Well, 602 00:38:31,280 --> 00:38:33,839 Speaker 1: what well, here's the here's the problem, don't it. Don't 603 00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:38,200 Speaker 1: ever say that. Here, here's the issue. The Attorney General 604 00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:43,040 Speaker 1: Robert Kennedy had been trying to prosecute this gentleman. He 605 00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:45,400 Speaker 1: he you know, he's a Sicilian mobster. They've got files 606 00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:47,480 Speaker 1: on him. They've been trailing him, they've been tracking him, 607 00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:49,839 Speaker 1: they've been listening to him. They've been trying to get 608 00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:52,799 Speaker 1: him on something big. And if the government is going 609 00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:56,000 Speaker 1: to pay him that much money to go do an assassination, 610 00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:58,719 Speaker 1: it makes the state's case, or the you know, the 611 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,560 Speaker 1: government's case a little it harder to prosecute um quote. 612 00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:05,560 Speaker 1: Attorney General Kennedy stated that CIA should never undertake the 613 00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:08,160 Speaker 1: use of mafia people again without first checking with the 614 00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:15,280 Speaker 1: Department of Justice. Check in. Yeah, just check in, because 615 00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:18,040 Speaker 1: it would be difficult to prosecute such people in the future. 616 00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:22,400 Speaker 1: But that's so weird though. They didn't say never do this. No, 617 00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:25,799 Speaker 1: they just said, guys, just check in your dad first, 618 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:28,759 Speaker 1: ask your dead first. Yeah. It was Robert Kennedy, So 619 00:39:28,840 --> 00:39:32,200 Speaker 1: I was like, uh. The report also said that the 620 00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:36,240 Speaker 1: CIA was later interested in using mobsters to deliver poison 621 00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:40,239 Speaker 1: pale to castro uh, to order to kill him. Than 622 00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:43,680 Speaker 1: you got you know, that was that was fantastic And 623 00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:46,120 Speaker 1: I feel like there's a little bit of President Obama 624 00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:50,560 Speaker 1: influence in there. There was the cadence I think you are, 625 00:39:50,719 --> 00:39:54,200 Speaker 1: I think Matt is just you just got a promotion, 626 00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:59,319 Speaker 1: my friend whoa whoa, and I impersonator in chief. Yes, 627 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,880 Speaker 1: so pretend to be a president and call the CIA 628 00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:06,400 Speaker 1: for us and get this sorted out. Okay, good, Okay, 629 00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:10,040 Speaker 1: Well we're done here. Everybody have a great week. No. Uh. 630 00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:15,360 Speaker 1: Continuing though on this, this one thing that's hugely important 631 00:40:15,360 --> 00:40:18,839 Speaker 1: about this point in specific is that this sort of 632 00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:25,000 Speaker 1: um contradictory, uh, this contradictory set of pursuits by various 633 00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:27,840 Speaker 1: government agencies. This situation where the left hand does not 634 00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:30,399 Speaker 1: know what the right hand is doing, lends a lot 635 00:40:30,440 --> 00:40:33,200 Speaker 1: of credence and gives a lot of sand to the 636 00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:36,919 Speaker 1: claims that intelligence agencies in the US and in other 637 00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:42,400 Speaker 1: countries function as their own independent governments. Yeah. Absolutely, And 638 00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:45,920 Speaker 1: then you imagine that these independent governments, you know, in 639 00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:49,120 Speaker 1: their own functionings, sometimes doing the same work, or at 640 00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:54,000 Speaker 1: least overlapping, sometimes just doing vastly different stuff. But is 641 00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:58,120 Speaker 1: there anyone in charge? When you think about the government 642 00:40:58,160 --> 00:41:00,680 Speaker 1: that we've elected, the for the people, by the people, 643 00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:05,480 Speaker 1: democracy that we have in this country, Like you've got 644 00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:10,040 Speaker 1: these operating hands, if you will, in this octopus, Like 645 00:41:10,120 --> 00:41:13,240 Speaker 1: where is the head? I don't think it's the elected official. 646 00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:14,960 Speaker 1: This is the point that if you cut off one 647 00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:17,160 Speaker 1: head and grows somewhere else, so that there's so many 648 00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:19,000 Speaker 1: heads that you don't know which one is the real head. 649 00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:22,759 Speaker 1: Oh my god, what is happening? I am seriously, I 650 00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:26,480 Speaker 1: am waiting at some point, I you know, I know 651 00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:29,799 Speaker 1: not everybody loves Marvel movies, but at some point I'm 652 00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:33,680 Speaker 1: hoping that a stranger like shakes my hand and like 653 00:41:33,719 --> 00:41:37,439 Speaker 1: whispers hal Hiram, you know, you should just start doing 654 00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:39,279 Speaker 1: that with people. I can't do it. No, No, it's 655 00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:42,319 Speaker 1: over real. Well at parties, it's like you can't give 656 00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:44,799 Speaker 1: yourself a nickname. You can't be the one who goes 657 00:41:44,880 --> 00:41:47,239 Speaker 1: up to people and says, hell, hi got you. Well, 658 00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:49,440 Speaker 1: like started started, the conversation would be like, hey, did 659 00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:51,880 Speaker 1: you hear Taylor swift new stuff? Man? I was jamming 660 00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:56,359 Speaker 1: on it all day. Not The Deiled too much, Best, 661 00:41:56,560 --> 00:41:58,800 Speaker 1: this Great Mean this Morning where it was squid word 662 00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:01,600 Speaker 1: from SpongeBob and it split screen where it's like his 663 00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:04,719 Speaker 1: eyes closed and it says you when you're asleep and 664 00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:07,239 Speaker 1: realized Taylor Swift's new album comes out at midnight, and 665 00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:11,520 Speaker 1: the next frame was the same as eyes my wife 666 00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:15,920 Speaker 1: is because he was stoked about it. The single tier 667 00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:19,360 Speaker 1: oh my gosh oh and Maria Bamfer's new show or 668 00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:22,920 Speaker 1: the second season comes out to check it out. It's 669 00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:29,120 Speaker 1: okay plugging other shows and albums. Yes, well, it's important. 670 00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:36,040 Speaker 1: This is important stuff, you know, and we are we 671 00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:40,400 Speaker 1: are very conscious that this kind of sifting through archival 672 00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:46,080 Speaker 1: information can be dry, right, and we also acknowledge that 673 00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:50,640 Speaker 1: we're talking about stuff that's dangerous implications in the present day. Uh, 674 00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:54,000 Speaker 1: and we're we're trying to keep our chins up about it. 675 00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:57,400 Speaker 1: But the situation is dire as we record this, and 676 00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:01,160 Speaker 1: there are a ton more documents we didn't discuss, I 677 00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:04,640 Speaker 1: mean literally thousands, and each of them probably has a 678 00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:07,600 Speaker 1: tiny little story to tell. And that's why we're encouraging 679 00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:09,680 Speaker 1: you to go in and do some of the research yourself, 680 00:43:09,840 --> 00:43:13,080 Speaker 1: or at least sift through the news sites. Well let's 681 00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:15,080 Speaker 1: we're not even to the crazy, but let's laundry list 682 00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:19,359 Speaker 1: a couple of Okay, so FBI director, and again this 683 00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:21,880 Speaker 1: is this is a lot of Matt's research and needed 684 00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:25,400 Speaker 1: spot on job man, Thank you so much, you got it. 685 00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:29,719 Speaker 1: So uh. FBI Director Hoover Ran forwarded a memo to 686 00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:33,600 Speaker 1: the White House in sixty three, right after Kennedy's death, 687 00:43:34,880 --> 00:43:37,600 Speaker 1: and it was this memo was classified as top secret 688 00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:44,560 Speaker 1: for years, and it's it's it's exploring the U. S 689 00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:51,000 Speaker 1: intelligence agencies best guesses toward the Soviet Union's reaction to 690 00:43:51,120 --> 00:43:55,400 Speaker 1: the assassination. Yeah, and we have a quote here. According 691 00:43:55,440 --> 00:43:57,799 Speaker 1: to our source, officials of the Communist Party of the 692 00:43:57,800 --> 00:44:01,440 Speaker 1: Soviet Union believe that there was some well organized conspiracy 693 00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:04,200 Speaker 1: on the part of the ultra right in the United 694 00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:07,520 Speaker 1: States to affect a coup. They seem convinced that the 695 00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:10,080 Speaker 1: assassination was not the deed of one man, but that 696 00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:13,399 Speaker 1: it arose out of a carefully planned campaign in which 697 00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:19,120 Speaker 1: several people played a part. WHOA, Now, are they falling 698 00:44:19,239 --> 00:44:24,200 Speaker 1: prey to the conspiracy theories? Are they spreading propaganda? Because 699 00:44:24,200 --> 00:44:29,160 Speaker 1: we do know after the assassination the USSR did pretty effectively, 700 00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:36,480 Speaker 1: uh capitalize on the opportunity to spread dissent and shout 701 00:44:36,520 --> 00:44:40,120 Speaker 1: out to General Smedley Butler. We do know that there 702 00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:43,160 Speaker 1: have been coup attempts in the United States. You're typically 703 00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:45,840 Speaker 1: not going to read about them in your history books. 704 00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:50,200 Speaker 1: Smedley Smedley M E. D L. E. Y sounds like 705 00:44:50,200 --> 00:44:53,120 Speaker 1: a made up name. I love it. Speaking speaking of 706 00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:57,800 Speaker 1: my daddy, George H. W. Bush, his daddy, my grandpa, 707 00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:02,080 Speaker 1: my Grandpapi. He's a guy who supposedly went through and 708 00:45:02,200 --> 00:45:06,319 Speaker 1: decided to do the business plot. Isn't that crazy? My 709 00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:08,680 Speaker 1: daddy was a business man and his daddy was a 710 00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:12,560 Speaker 1: business man. My daddy was CEI a man. President President Bush. Yeah, yeah, 711 00:45:12,560 --> 00:45:14,760 Speaker 1: thank you for coming by. We're we're in the middle 712 00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:17,400 Speaker 1: of the show though. Oh well, I'm sorry. I'll just 713 00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:19,880 Speaker 1: go in the corner and do some paint. Okay, all right, 714 00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:26,000 Speaker 1: all right, I'll be over here. Okay, hey, can you slip, Matt? 715 00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:28,560 Speaker 1: Why do you keep bringing that guy to this? Why 716 00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:30,279 Speaker 1: do you keep letting push you around like that? And 717 00:45:30,560 --> 00:45:32,560 Speaker 1: he just pushes you out of your chair and then 718 00:45:32,600 --> 00:45:35,040 Speaker 1: does this is a little creepy laugh. I gotta admit. 719 00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:37,600 Speaker 1: When he was in office, just I know it's okay. 720 00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:39,719 Speaker 1: I can hear you talking about me over there? I know, 721 00:45:39,920 --> 00:45:43,080 Speaker 1: just give me two seconds. Um. When he was in office, 722 00:45:43,080 --> 00:45:45,560 Speaker 1: I wasn't the biggest fan. But afterwards, like this guy 723 00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:48,800 Speaker 1: is chill, like he is so cool. He's just painting. 724 00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:50,360 Speaker 1: He likes to go to Gagley, he likes to go 725 00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:52,120 Speaker 1: to Brieves game. Did you know he can play the 726 00:45:52,200 --> 00:45:55,080 Speaker 1: rhythm guitar part for every three eleven song? Dude, I've 727 00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:57,400 Speaker 1: been trying to learn the piano. Did you know that 728 00:45:57,440 --> 00:46:01,000 Speaker 1: amber is the color of his energy? He keep saying that. 729 00:46:01,480 --> 00:46:03,760 Speaker 1: I feel like he thinks that that was his idea, 730 00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:07,600 Speaker 1: but it's clearly a lyric from three eleven. Right, Okay, 731 00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:12,080 Speaker 1: so point pete yes before we get through derailed. Uh, 732 00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:16,319 Speaker 1: these various these various pieces of information are coming out, 733 00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:20,799 Speaker 1: and in many cases, if they are not contradicting the 734 00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:24,719 Speaker 1: official narrative, they are at the very least complicating it. Yes, 735 00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:28,959 Speaker 1: you know, so uh we have we have people who 736 00:46:29,080 --> 00:46:33,640 Speaker 1: are saying, uh, never mind this official stuff called all 737 00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:36,800 Speaker 1: the conspiracy theory. But that then at the same time 738 00:46:37,920 --> 00:46:43,560 Speaker 1: we are finding secret communications between people where an intelligence 739 00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:48,960 Speaker 1: agency is saying, ah, pretty much everybody thinks, like the 740 00:46:49,000 --> 00:46:52,040 Speaker 1: world's other superpower is pretty convinced that not one guy 741 00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:54,959 Speaker 1: did this exactly. And then they're like, Okay, well, don't 742 00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:58,239 Speaker 1: tell anybody. I just wanted you to know, and let's 743 00:46:58,239 --> 00:47:02,000 Speaker 1: just keep it secret. That's so strange. It feels strange now, 744 00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:03,799 Speaker 1: But we have to we have to understand. One of 745 00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:09,200 Speaker 1: the one of the most vulnerable points of any any 746 00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:14,239 Speaker 1: state powers existence is always going to be the succession, right, 747 00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:18,640 Speaker 1: the passage of power from one typically one individual to another. 748 00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:22,360 Speaker 1: So for instance, in the case of the Democratic People's 749 00:47:22,360 --> 00:47:25,719 Speaker 1: Republic of Korea, North Korea, one of the things that 750 00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:29,839 Speaker 1: is always a big flash point and really dangerous part 751 00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:32,920 Speaker 1: of time for the world, not just in that region, 752 00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:36,799 Speaker 1: is when they pass from father to son. I don't 753 00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:39,040 Speaker 1: know what's going to happen. You know, look at look 754 00:47:39,080 --> 00:47:43,759 Speaker 1: at Turkey, right, look at Italy. The this so in 755 00:47:43,800 --> 00:47:47,480 Speaker 1: the context of the time, this is very, very dangerous 756 00:47:47,520 --> 00:47:49,439 Speaker 1: for the US. It is vulnerable now in a way 757 00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:54,239 Speaker 1: that it has not been right at least for a 758 00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:58,480 Speaker 1: long long time since the probably the death of Lincoln 759 00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:02,319 Speaker 1: is the last time that it was that vulnerable. And uh, 760 00:48:02,600 --> 00:48:05,800 Speaker 1: let's see one more example. Maybe absolutely okay, So for 761 00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:10,040 Speaker 1: our last entry for the day, we have a document, 762 00:48:10,160 --> 00:48:14,440 Speaker 1: a top secret document from n that was created for 763 00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:18,400 Speaker 1: the Rockefeller Commission. And in this document there is a 764 00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:23,120 Speaker 1: transcript of a testimony of a former CIA director by 765 00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:26,920 Speaker 1: the name of Richard Helms. And in this document, um 766 00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:32,720 Speaker 1: Helms says that he believes that former President Richard Nixon, 767 00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:37,760 Speaker 1: old Tricky Dickey, believed that the CIA was actually directly 768 00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:44,960 Speaker 1: responsible for assassinating the South Vietnamese president Go Den Dean, 769 00:48:45,000 --> 00:48:48,719 Speaker 1: who died after a coup that was linked to the 770 00:48:48,840 --> 00:48:54,359 Speaker 1: Central Intelligence Agency. And we've got a quote from Helms himself, right, 771 00:48:54,960 --> 00:48:58,600 Speaker 1: we do. Indeed, it goes as follows quote there's absolutely 772 00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:01,000 Speaker 1: no evidence of this in the agency records, and the 773 00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:03,560 Speaker 1: whole thing has been I mean, rather, what is the 774 00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:07,000 Speaker 1: word I want heated by the fact that President Johnson 775 00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:10,480 Speaker 1: used to go around saying that the reason President Kennedy 776 00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:14,239 Speaker 1: was assassinated was that he had assassinated President Team and 777 00:49:14,280 --> 00:49:18,319 Speaker 1: this was just justice. And then Helms ads, uh, where 778 00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:22,040 Speaker 1: he got this from? I don't know, and just yeah, 779 00:49:22,120 --> 00:49:26,759 Speaker 1: this is during a deposition. Uh, And that was the 780 00:49:26,800 --> 00:49:30,839 Speaker 1: context of the conversations that Helms was asked if there 781 00:49:30,880 --> 00:49:34,080 Speaker 1: was any way Oswald was in some way a CIA 782 00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:40,040 Speaker 1: agent or an asset or an operative or an agent 783 00:49:40,040 --> 00:49:42,520 Speaker 1: of something else. And that's right when the document ends. 784 00:49:43,120 --> 00:49:45,920 Speaker 1: But is this when the story ends? We've given just 785 00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:49,640 Speaker 1: a few examples, right, And I know that this episode 786 00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:53,640 Speaker 1: is running a little a little long because we're digging 787 00:49:53,680 --> 00:49:57,480 Speaker 1: into this stuff. But the big question is is this 788 00:49:57,600 --> 00:50:01,040 Speaker 1: the whole story? That's where one document ends. Where does 789 00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:04,680 Speaker 1: the story end? Are we finally in seventeen up to 790 00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:09,680 Speaker 1: speed on exactly what the US Intelligence Agency did or 791 00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:15,359 Speaker 1: did not know regarding this assassination? I don't. I don't 792 00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:19,439 Speaker 1: think we're there. Here's where it gets crazy. Some of 793 00:50:19,520 --> 00:50:23,359 Speaker 1: these files that we mentioned right are still secret. They 794 00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:26,440 Speaker 1: were all supposed to be released, and they were released 795 00:50:26,520 --> 00:50:28,200 Speaker 1: under If you're listening to this in the future. They 796 00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:33,000 Speaker 1: were released under the auspice of the Trump administration, right, 797 00:50:34,160 --> 00:50:37,080 Speaker 1: but not all of them were released they were supposed 798 00:50:37,120 --> 00:50:40,919 Speaker 1: to be. And we have no idea when more even 799 00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:44,680 Speaker 1: if the other stuff will ever make it into the 800 00:50:44,800 --> 00:50:50,200 Speaker 1: public sphere. In the eleventh hour, right before this stuff 801 00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:56,920 Speaker 1: went public became declassified. Intelligence agencies, the FBI, the CIA, 802 00:50:57,280 --> 00:51:02,440 Speaker 1: all your favorite alphabet soup members of the U. S. Government. 803 00:51:03,040 --> 00:51:07,400 Speaker 1: They pressured Trump successfully or in pressure the administration, I 804 00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:12,040 Speaker 1: should say successfully too, keep some of this stuff secret 805 00:51:12,239 --> 00:51:19,160 Speaker 1: past the due date. Uh. In light of everybody's favorite boogeyman, 806 00:51:19,719 --> 00:51:24,680 Speaker 1: national security? National security? What does that mean? It's just 807 00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:29,040 Speaker 1: like tagging base, you know, you know, like uh, anytime 808 00:51:29,080 --> 00:51:30,960 Speaker 1: you don't want to tell the public something you own, 809 00:51:31,080 --> 00:51:34,879 Speaker 1: national security, you know, I'd say, I wish I could 810 00:51:34,880 --> 00:51:36,759 Speaker 1: do that in my private life for the good of 811 00:51:36,800 --> 00:51:40,279 Speaker 1: the realm. Can we just say that from now on? 812 00:51:41,000 --> 00:51:43,239 Speaker 1: We can, we can try it. Let's have let's uh, 813 00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:45,640 Speaker 1: let's let's call up some of our friends over there 814 00:51:45,640 --> 00:51:48,239 Speaker 1: in the intelligence agencies and just say, hey, man, from 815 00:51:48,239 --> 00:51:51,160 Speaker 1: now on, if you're gonna say national security, those guys 816 00:51:51,160 --> 00:51:53,279 Speaker 1: are not your friends. I've been on the phone with 817 00:51:53,280 --> 00:51:56,280 Speaker 1: the FBI field office a couple of times now working 818 00:51:56,320 --> 00:51:59,040 Speaker 1: on this other stuff. I think I've got some sway. 819 00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:02,120 Speaker 1: I know Paul. Paul's got sway all over Atlanta right now. 820 00:52:02,160 --> 00:52:04,680 Speaker 1: Super producer Paul. Yeah, he can make some calls and 821 00:52:04,680 --> 00:52:07,000 Speaker 1: just be like, guys, it's now for the good of 822 00:52:07,040 --> 00:52:11,200 Speaker 1: the realm. One call. That's Paul. That's pretty good. That's 823 00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:17,960 Speaker 1: pretty good. So so unless you are as fortunate as 824 00:52:18,280 --> 00:52:21,239 Speaker 1: the three of us to have a super producer like 825 00:52:21,280 --> 00:52:26,400 Speaker 1: Paul right in your circle, uh, you're probably lost at 826 00:52:26,440 --> 00:52:29,080 Speaker 1: sea a little bit. Conceptually, when you hear the phrase 827 00:52:29,160 --> 00:52:32,440 Speaker 1: national security, it's one of those words that just gets 828 00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:35,319 Speaker 1: thrown around willy nilly, the same way that people used 829 00:52:35,360 --> 00:52:39,520 Speaker 1: to add the descriptor digital in front of everything in 830 00:52:39,560 --> 00:52:42,520 Speaker 1: the nineties. Didn't matter what it was, it was digital, 831 00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:46,719 Speaker 1: you could charge five dollars. More So, national security in 832 00:52:46,760 --> 00:52:51,359 Speaker 1: this context could mean several things. Uh, let's break down 833 00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:54,880 Speaker 1: into let's say three or four things. First is preventing 834 00:52:54,920 --> 00:53:00,480 Speaker 1: the spread of intelligence techniques, strategies, spycraft highly important, absolutely, 835 00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:04,799 Speaker 1: the methods of gathering intelligence, not the intelligence itself, right right, 836 00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:08,560 Speaker 1: because if somebody else knows how this stuff was gathered, 837 00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:10,960 Speaker 1: then the jig is up, they can protect against it, 838 00:53:11,239 --> 00:53:16,799 Speaker 1: right exactly. This is an understandable concern. Right forever, we're 839 00:53:16,800 --> 00:53:20,560 Speaker 1: talking about what nineteen sixties and prior to that, maybe 840 00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:22,520 Speaker 1: a little bit after that, but mostly you're dealing with 841 00:53:22,560 --> 00:53:27,279 Speaker 1: before the assassination, so late fifties, early sixties technology. So 842 00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:31,359 Speaker 1: if this stuff is held back to protect techniques from 843 00:53:31,440 --> 00:53:35,760 Speaker 1: the nineteen forties literally on display in spy museums around 844 00:53:35,800 --> 00:53:41,040 Speaker 1: the country, right, then the question becomes, can you plausibly believe, right, 845 00:53:41,200 --> 00:53:43,960 Speaker 1: apply critical thinking, can you plausibly believe that some of 846 00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:48,080 Speaker 1: the world's most well funded intelligence operatives would still be 847 00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:52,880 Speaker 1: using the same techniques for decades? Well, I have to 848 00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:55,920 Speaker 1: just interject here and say I think some of the 849 00:53:55,920 --> 00:54:00,480 Speaker 1: techniques are very much human and psychologically based chap perhaps 850 00:54:01,320 --> 00:54:05,880 Speaker 1: maybe existing in some of these documents humans, right, yes, yes, exactly, 851 00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:11,040 Speaker 1: which are the shortened terms for human intelligence versus signals intelligence. 852 00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:17,040 Speaker 1: The second, the second um category here genre of national security, 853 00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:20,960 Speaker 1: would be to protect the existing relationship between the United 854 00:54:21,040 --> 00:54:25,000 Speaker 1: States and a foreign government. Clearly very important. Yeah, and 855 00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:29,520 Speaker 1: you know we have a lot of what did uh 856 00:54:29,640 --> 00:54:32,239 Speaker 1: somebody just called this on NPR called the China and 857 00:54:32,239 --> 00:54:35,839 Speaker 1: the United States frenemies, but it's we have a lot 858 00:54:35,880 --> 00:54:39,520 Speaker 1: of those that we've cultivated over the years. Those relationships. 859 00:54:39,600 --> 00:54:42,880 Speaker 1: There is no such thing as friendship in the geopolitical sphere. 860 00:54:42,880 --> 00:54:47,160 Speaker 1: There are interests that aligned exactly, interested aligned temporarily or 861 00:54:47,200 --> 00:54:51,120 Speaker 1: you know, maybe in a long term for a specific thing. Sure, so, yeah, 862 00:54:51,320 --> 00:54:56,080 Speaker 1: I completely agree. Now we have another question. If information 863 00:54:56,160 --> 00:55:00,279 Speaker 1: is being withheld to protect the relationship, the conf dental 864 00:55:00,320 --> 00:55:04,200 Speaker 1: relationship between two countries, then this would mean that there 865 00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:09,480 Speaker 1: could either be privileged knowledge somebody maybe has a skeleton 866 00:55:09,560 --> 00:55:13,120 Speaker 1: in the closet, right, maybe maybe the Soviet Union knows 867 00:55:13,160 --> 00:55:17,839 Speaker 1: something that the U s public doesn't, right, or there 868 00:55:17,880 --> 00:55:21,239 Speaker 1: could be collusion on the part of another country. Right, 869 00:55:21,600 --> 00:55:24,400 Speaker 1: that would never happen. No, I'm not here, man, it's crazy. 870 00:55:25,040 --> 00:55:28,600 Speaker 1: It's crazy talk, right. Uh. And one example of this what, 871 00:55:28,680 --> 00:55:31,320 Speaker 1: of course, as we mentioned, the be the u SSRs 872 00:55:31,400 --> 00:55:37,920 Speaker 1: efforts to spread propaganda after the assassination, or of course, 873 00:55:38,560 --> 00:55:43,200 Speaker 1: similar attempts by the US in other foreign countries, very 874 00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:48,400 Speaker 1: similar attempts, the worst similar work. So there's here's the 875 00:55:48,680 --> 00:55:52,560 Speaker 1: here's the here's the third genre. Uh. It could be 876 00:55:52,760 --> 00:55:56,879 Speaker 1: when they say national security, it could mean protecting the 877 00:55:57,120 --> 00:56:02,879 Speaker 1: lives of current or former government officials. Right. So let's 878 00:56:02,920 --> 00:56:05,319 Speaker 1: say one of the theories we hear a lot about 879 00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:10,480 Speaker 1: JFK is that a secret service member accidentally fired the 880 00:56:10,520 --> 00:56:14,200 Speaker 1: fatal shot. That theories as one of the theories, right, 881 00:56:14,200 --> 00:56:19,640 Speaker 1: again unproven, Right. So what is when we talked about 882 00:56:19,640 --> 00:56:25,120 Speaker 1: government conspiracies? There's people often go to the idea of 883 00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:30,360 Speaker 1: some great collusion in advance. Right. The same the same 884 00:56:30,400 --> 00:56:34,040 Speaker 1: institution that cannot, for the life of it figure out 885 00:56:34,160 --> 00:56:39,560 Speaker 1: how to do effective policy, is also capable of these 886 00:56:39,800 --> 00:56:48,040 Speaker 1: supervillain level Rube Goldberg machinations, right, or lends itself to 887 00:56:48,400 --> 00:56:52,320 Speaker 1: covering up a mistake. Right, So how much more realistic 888 00:56:52,400 --> 00:56:55,960 Speaker 1: is it that someone screwed up and the people are 889 00:56:55,960 --> 00:57:00,920 Speaker 1: trying to remove that from history. So imagine being a 890 00:57:00,920 --> 00:57:08,920 Speaker 1: retired official and the public learns that you did something negligent, right, accidental, unintentional, 891 00:57:09,600 --> 00:57:13,080 Speaker 1: and then you find yourself up a very dangerous creek 892 00:57:13,440 --> 00:57:19,000 Speaker 1: with no paddle whatsoever, especially in the age of cheap information. Totally. 893 00:57:19,360 --> 00:57:23,680 Speaker 1: So in conclusion, here, guys, the craziest thing is that, 894 00:57:24,440 --> 00:57:28,600 Speaker 1: at least according to Trump's Twitter feed, he has released 895 00:57:28,680 --> 00:57:33,480 Speaker 1: everything and long ahead of schedule. That's what he's saying, however, 896 00:57:34,760 --> 00:57:39,000 Speaker 1: it seems pretty certain that there's at least a small 897 00:57:39,120 --> 00:57:44,240 Speaker 1: number of documents that remain hidden. Uh, it seems pretty clear. 898 00:57:45,440 --> 00:57:49,560 Speaker 1: But what we do have is thousands more documents to 899 00:57:49,600 --> 00:57:56,160 Speaker 1: tread through. And you know, as researchers and historians and 900 00:57:56,280 --> 00:57:59,440 Speaker 1: interns are going through all of this stuff, you know, 901 00:57:59,600 --> 00:58:03,200 Speaker 1: per ups, there's going to be some new revelation. Maybe 902 00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:05,680 Speaker 1: not the kind of thing that I'm was hoping for 903 00:58:06,040 --> 00:58:09,400 Speaker 1: after all of these years, but something. Surely they wouldn't 904 00:58:09,480 --> 00:58:11,720 Speaker 1: let it out though, man. I mean, you know, they 905 00:58:11,840 --> 00:58:15,000 Speaker 1: know what's in there. They're giving people something to play 906 00:58:15,000 --> 00:58:17,920 Speaker 1: with and and you know, feel good about or whatever, 907 00:58:18,120 --> 00:58:20,960 Speaker 1: feel like informed. But there's not going to be an answer. 908 00:58:21,080 --> 00:58:23,840 Speaker 1: The government wouldn't allow that to happen. I don't. I 909 00:58:23,840 --> 00:58:25,880 Speaker 1: don't think. And if it's a if it's a case 910 00:58:25,920 --> 00:58:30,400 Speaker 1: of national security, then again the implications are dangerous. It's 911 00:58:30,440 --> 00:58:34,960 Speaker 1: twenty seventeen, and if that stuff still applies, I think 912 00:58:34,960 --> 00:58:37,520 Speaker 1: we can all agree. I think we can all agree, 913 00:58:37,520 --> 00:58:41,320 Speaker 1: folks that the idea of protecting a spycraft technique from 914 00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:44,240 Speaker 1: the forties to the sixties doesn't pan out. It's like 915 00:58:44,320 --> 00:58:47,200 Speaker 1: tape recorders and suitcases dude, like they're they're on display 916 00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:50,760 Speaker 1: like in the music you see. It's I don't know. Well, 917 00:58:50,800 --> 00:58:53,920 Speaker 1: in my opinion, there's still the possibility that there's a 918 00:58:53,960 --> 00:58:57,640 Speaker 1: needle inside this haystack. But just we there hasn't been 919 00:58:57,760 --> 00:59:00,880 Speaker 1: enough time and enough human hands and I is working 920 00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:03,080 Speaker 1: through it. So will you at least agree with me 921 00:59:03,120 --> 00:59:08,200 Speaker 1: that the government knows exactly what's in there? Again, we're 922 00:59:08,200 --> 00:59:12,080 Speaker 1: dealing with the octopus with the So yeah, I don't 923 00:59:12,080 --> 00:59:16,560 Speaker 1: know if everybody knows, because there are there are factions 924 00:59:17,080 --> 00:59:20,280 Speaker 1: at play, their factions and it's been a long time 925 00:59:20,360 --> 00:59:23,640 Speaker 1: and humans die. That's the one thing we all do now, 926 00:59:23,760 --> 00:59:27,400 Speaker 1: is there is there something there? There must be there, 927 00:59:27,480 --> 00:59:30,280 Speaker 1: There must be otherwise the intelligence agencies would not have 928 00:59:30,880 --> 00:59:35,000 Speaker 1: pressured the current administration so strongly not to release some 929 00:59:35,080 --> 00:59:38,480 Speaker 1: stuff in the previous several ran the previous several So 930 00:59:38,600 --> 00:59:42,160 Speaker 1: there is there is something. Something is rotten in this 931 00:59:42,240 --> 00:59:46,160 Speaker 1: particular Denmark, right, So are you planning on going through 932 00:59:46,160 --> 00:59:49,640 Speaker 1: these files? You can do it. You can find them literally, 933 00:59:49,680 --> 00:59:52,680 Speaker 1: search new JFK files and you will find the National 934 00:59:52,840 --> 00:59:56,000 Speaker 1: Archives link that has a spreadsheet in it, and it 935 00:59:56,040 --> 00:59:59,760 Speaker 1: also has every single file on that website. So if 936 00:59:59,800 --> 01:00:03,120 Speaker 1: you have internet connection and a little hotza, you can 937 01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:05,640 Speaker 1: get in there and just start doing it. Because I've 938 01:00:05,720 --> 01:00:07,640 Speaker 1: been going through it for the past several days just 939 01:00:07,680 --> 01:00:12,000 Speaker 1: trying to find things, but there's just too much. And 940 01:00:12,040 --> 01:00:13,960 Speaker 1: like we said, you're gonna find all kinds of weird 941 01:00:14,000 --> 01:00:16,920 Speaker 1: phrases in there. Um. And there's something I want to 942 01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:19,720 Speaker 1: point everyone too if you're gonna look into this. It's 943 01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:24,320 Speaker 1: the Merry Feral Foundations ci A cryptomes two point Oh. 944 01:00:24,480 --> 01:00:26,720 Speaker 1: It's a really cool website. You can go to m 945 01:00:26,760 --> 01:00:29,000 Speaker 1: A R Y F E R R E l L 946 01:00:29,080 --> 01:00:31,400 Speaker 1: dot org and you can find this thing. And it 947 01:00:31,480 --> 01:00:36,280 Speaker 1: has a huge list that's crowdsourced of all these different 948 01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:39,120 Speaker 1: acronyms and stuff that are used by all the intelligence 949 01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:43,800 Speaker 1: agencies to represent certain things. And it's fascinating when you 950 01:00:43,800 --> 01:00:45,840 Speaker 1: go through these documents and you see the legend kind 951 01:00:45,840 --> 01:00:48,120 Speaker 1: of like like it actually gives you like a little yeah, exactly, 952 01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:52,640 Speaker 1: and it's it's not just a you know ibex o 953 01:00:53,360 --> 01:00:57,080 Speaker 1: O bi ibex equals this or you know whatever it is. 954 01:00:57,160 --> 01:00:59,240 Speaker 1: It gives you a full description of all the different 955 01:00:59,240 --> 01:01:01,960 Speaker 1: ways that it can be, things that it can refer to. 956 01:01:02,080 --> 01:01:04,240 Speaker 1: It's it's really neat I'm on that as soon as 957 01:01:04,280 --> 01:01:07,840 Speaker 1: we wrap here, So tell us what you find and 958 01:01:08,040 --> 01:01:11,600 Speaker 1: while you're online, find us if you haven't already. You 959 01:01:11,640 --> 01:01:14,720 Speaker 1: can find us on Instagram, you can find us on Twitter, 960 01:01:14,800 --> 01:01:17,440 Speaker 1: you can find us on Facebook. We have names that 961 01:01:17,480 --> 01:01:22,080 Speaker 1: are all approximations of conspiracy stuff, you know, and we 962 01:01:22,120 --> 01:01:26,560 Speaker 1: would love to hear your opinion specifically. Have you already 963 01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:29,880 Speaker 1: looked into this? Do you think that there is something 964 01:01:29,920 --> 01:01:33,880 Speaker 1: important yet to be revealed? Did we miss something? Let 965 01:01:33,960 --> 01:01:36,720 Speaker 1: us know and we'll put it in the shoutout. And 966 01:01:36,960 --> 01:01:40,200 Speaker 1: speaking of shout outs, we want to thank everybody who 967 01:01:40,400 --> 01:01:45,919 Speaker 1: wrote in to us via various different things, you know, uh, 968 01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:52,080 Speaker 1: social media, snail mail, mirrors in the dark at midnight, cables, 969 01:01:52,400 --> 01:01:56,760 Speaker 1: cables in actually for this episode, but it is run 970 01:01:57,040 --> 01:01:59,080 Speaker 1: pretty excessively long afore we're going to hold it back 971 01:01:59,120 --> 01:02:01,400 Speaker 1: for the next one. But we you know, I know, 972 01:02:01,480 --> 01:02:03,240 Speaker 1: we don't do it every episode, but we're gonna try 973 01:02:03,240 --> 01:02:05,320 Speaker 1: to get back into doing the shoutout corner. We have 974 01:02:05,360 --> 01:02:09,680 Speaker 1: a we have a actually we have a a astonishing 975 01:02:10,600 --> 01:02:14,280 Speaker 1: piece of correspondence that we received recently, uh, and we 976 01:02:14,320 --> 01:02:16,640 Speaker 1: want to give it its full do so please do 977 01:02:16,800 --> 01:02:21,640 Speaker 1: tune in next week because unlike the US government, we 978 01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:26,160 Speaker 1: actually release revelatory things. That's right, until we get shot. 979 01:02:26,160 --> 01:02:28,440 Speaker 1: It was a sick burn on the US government. You know, 980 01:02:28,480 --> 01:02:32,240 Speaker 1: I'm punchy today man. With without actually going to shout 981 01:02:32,240 --> 01:02:34,400 Speaker 1: out corner, we want to give a huge shout out 982 01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:37,040 Speaker 1: to Samuel who sent us something in the snail mail. 983 01:02:37,880 --> 01:02:40,840 Speaker 1: So can we just say what it is? Signet rings 984 01:02:41,000 --> 01:02:43,720 Speaker 1: They go on your pinky and you can seal documents 985 01:02:43,760 --> 01:02:46,320 Speaker 1: with wax with them. I took the one that has 986 01:02:46,360 --> 01:02:49,480 Speaker 1: the alien head. I'm very excited about it. Mine sort 987 01:02:49,480 --> 01:02:52,120 Speaker 1: of like a looks sort of like a Coca pelee 988 01:02:52,280 --> 01:02:54,160 Speaker 1: kind of figure. I don't think that's what it is. 989 01:02:54,200 --> 01:02:57,000 Speaker 1: But Samuel, what is it? What's what's the squiggly one? 990 01:02:57,200 --> 01:02:58,840 Speaker 1: I took it because I thought it was meat looking, 991 01:02:58,840 --> 01:03:00,640 Speaker 1: but I don't quite know what it is. Ben's yours 992 01:03:00,720 --> 01:03:06,560 Speaker 1: is a Illuminati triangle, right you'll see. Uh So we 993 01:03:06,600 --> 01:03:09,960 Speaker 1: will put pictures of these rings up and go check 994 01:03:10,000 --> 01:03:13,840 Speaker 1: us out on Instagram. Uh our our producers giving us 995 01:03:14,320 --> 01:03:16,000 Speaker 1: a little bit of a where you're going with These 996 01:03:16,000 --> 01:03:17,600 Speaker 1: guys got to wrap it up, and we're getting to 997 01:03:17,640 --> 01:03:20,280 Speaker 1: wrap it up. So we are going to wrap it 998 01:03:20,360 --> 01:03:23,120 Speaker 1: up and We're going to end this with the most 999 01:03:23,160 --> 01:03:27,600 Speaker 1: important piece of information for you, which is, hey, guess 1000 01:03:28,000 --> 01:03:31,240 Speaker 1: oh man, yeah, George. If you don't want to do 1001 01:03:31,320 --> 01:03:34,840 Speaker 1: all the social media rick and roll, you can find us, 1002 01:03:35,240 --> 01:03:38,480 Speaker 1: write us an email. We are conspiracy and how Stuff 1003 01:03:38,520 --> 01:03:58,520 Speaker 1: Works dot com.