Speaker 1: When I got to college, I started to study religion
Speaker 1: on a quest to find more knowledge about God, and
Speaker 1: I left knowing less than when I went in. Dead ass.
Speaker 1: And I can empathize with you because we took that
Speaker 1: religion class together being being purposeful about seeking the knowledge,
Speaker 1: and then with the abundance of knowledge, realized that we
Speaker 1: were totally confused. Hey, I'm Cadine and we're the Ellises.
Speaker 1: You may know us from posting funny videos with our
Speaker 1: boys and reading each other publicly as a form of therapy. Wait,
Speaker 1: I'll make you need therapy most days. Wow. And one
Speaker 1: more important thing to mention, we're married. We are. We
Speaker 1: created this podcast to open dialogue about some of life's
Speaker 1: most taboo topics, things most folks don't want to talk
Speaker 1: about through the lens of a millennial married couple. That
Speaker 1: ads to the term that we say every day. So
Speaker 1: when we say dead ass, we're actually saying facts, the truth,
Speaker 1: the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Were about
Speaker 1: to take billows up to a whole new level. Dead
Speaker 1: ass starts right now. So when I was eighteen years old,
Speaker 1: I decided to go to college, as most people do
Speaker 1: when they want to just get away from their family.
Speaker 1: But I grew up in a Baptist household. I grew
Speaker 1: up with family who are deacons, ministers, ministers of music.
Speaker 1: So I just knew that God existed. And I met
Speaker 1: this beautiful woman by the name of Caneia might know
Speaker 1: her maybe somewhere around him, but um, I found out
Speaker 1: that she was a Seven Day Adventist, and I was
Speaker 1: just like, Hmmmm, if I'm going to have kids, are
Speaker 1: they going to grow up Seven Day Adventists or they
Speaker 1: going to grow up uh Baptist? Uh, well, Christian Baptist.
Speaker 1: So then I started to wonder, right, because we go
Speaker 1: to church on different days, right, So you go to
Speaker 1: church on Saturdays. I go to church on Sundays, So
Speaker 1: it's gonna be a whole weekend in church, a whole
Speaker 1: weekend in church. But I do remember thinking, right, if
Speaker 1: her beliefs don't match my beliefs based on what my
Speaker 1: beliefs are, does that mean that her and all of
Speaker 1: her people going to Hell? Because ultimately that's what you think,
Speaker 1: right growing up in a in a Baptist, especially a
Speaker 1: Southern Baptist church, you feel like everyone who doesn't agree
Speaker 1: with what you agree going to Hell. So the fact
Speaker 1: that you didn't go to church on Sunday. I was wondering,
Speaker 1: does that mean Candee going to Hell? And you know what,
Speaker 1: I thought, the same exact thing they promise you. I
Speaker 1: was like, so, how is this going to work? Based
Speaker 1: on everything that I've thought I've been taught, even though
Speaker 1: I wasn't following it per se, I was like, how
Speaker 1: is this going to work? How do you raise two
Speaker 1: children or our children, or how do two people have
Speaker 1: children and then begin to raise these children when they
Speaker 1: may not be on the same page or in the
Speaker 1: same book. And the rest is history. We figured it out,
Speaker 1: we're trying to figure it out. So in honor of
Speaker 1: karaoke today, and we want to sing one of my
Speaker 1: favorite songs. Pull out the gospel playlists you read, Okay,
Speaker 1: now we follow down, but we get up. We folled down,
Speaker 1: but we get up. We folled down, but we get
Speaker 1: up for a same' is just singa who felled Down?
Speaker 1: That's like your favorite? And God, God the values to
Speaker 1: thing this to the kids at night when they were
Speaker 1: like they were crying and I was like, singing a
Speaker 1: song and he's like, we've older. I'm like, that's one
Speaker 1: of my favorite songs that don clerking I believe so yeah,
Speaker 1: is it right? I think so? Don't if I'm wrong,
Speaker 1: please please miss If that was an active choir member
Speaker 1: back in the day, with shout out to Debbie, we
Speaker 1: love her rage forever he rangs, she would be mad
Speaker 1: that note. That note was terrible, Debbie, I'm sorry. My
Speaker 1: favorite was Jesus Love is bubbling Over. That was a
Speaker 1: Sabba school joint for me. That's a Sunday school to day. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then you would just like be like I was
Speaker 1: able to clap in Seven Day Adventure Church because y'all know,
Speaker 1: y'all got mad rules. It was a very conservative clap.
Speaker 1: There was a very conservative You couldn't ship me with it.
Speaker 1: You couldn't bop, you couldn't drive, you couldn't double class.
Speaker 1: You couldn't double class. No, you know, because Baptist. We
Speaker 1: bet it may be different now, but back in the
Speaker 1: day when I used to go, it was very like,
Speaker 1: very rigid. So in a time when information is readily
Speaker 1: available to us, as we know now with social media,
Speaker 1: so many things are instant access, does faith take a
Speaker 1: backseat to knowledge? Which is kind of ironic because if
Speaker 1: the knowledge is there and people are seeking or maybe
Speaker 1: not seeking the knowledge when it comes to faith. Where
Speaker 1: does Where are people lying? Now? With that? So today
Speaker 1: we have with us a dynamic spiritual leader, Pastor Reginald
Speaker 1: Wayne Sharp Junior. He is the pastor of Fellowship Ministry
Speaker 1: Baptist Church in Chicago, where he has been lauded for
Speaker 1: his commitment to service to the church community and commitment
Speaker 1: to bridging the gap um between spirituality and social activism,
Speaker 1: which is particularly key in the times that we're in.
Speaker 1: So even if you're not in Chicago, you may have
Speaker 1: been introduced to Pastor Sharp uh this year when part
Speaker 1: of his sermon actually went viral, And we'll play a
Speaker 1: little bit of that for you guys. Now in this season,
Speaker 1: the church is still open, We're still worshiping, We're still
Speaker 1: doing ministry every week, and I thank God for but
Speaker 1: we will not return to this building unto the Lord himself.
Speaker 1: Wakes me about of my sleep, slaps me three times,
Speaker 1: pours water from Heaven on my face, and warms my
Speaker 1: feet with the fire of the Holy Ghost. And I
Speaker 1: have no choice but to jump out of my bed
Speaker 1: and saying, yes, God, welcome moment. Pastor Reginald. But you
Speaker 1: said we can call you Reggie. I feel like, are
Speaker 1: we there yet? Right? And we made ourselves comfortable, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean. Typically we would love to have
Speaker 1: you in studio, but considering the time we're in, zoom
Speaker 1: is the way. So we're happy that you're taking time
Speaker 1: out of your busy schedule to chat with us, for sure,
Speaker 1: you know, Um, and I wanted to talk a little
Speaker 1: bit about your shift from you know, being in the
Speaker 1: sanctuary to now being on YouTube every Sunday and how
Speaker 1: the dynamics have shifted for you a little bit, um,
Speaker 1: and about your viral moment. Tell us how that's changed
Speaker 1: your online presence so far. Well, first let me say
Speaker 1: thank you. I think y'all are dope. You all represent
Speaker 1: my shirt. I feel like you're playing that out? Did
Speaker 1: you play that out? I didn't. My wife bought the shirt.
Speaker 1: I put it on, and your wife you sound like like, hey, hey,
Speaker 1: we gotta thank God for good, good women in our lives.
Speaker 1: But but but no, it's it's been a journey this year,
Speaker 1: passed her in through a pandemic. And actually that viral
Speaker 1: clip was me giving an announcement. People give church announcements
Speaker 1: every Sunday, and so I was given an announcement letting
Speaker 1: the people know we would not come back into the
Speaker 1: building until the White House opened, until the tours that
Speaker 1: the Governor's mentioned opened, and it just took off, and
Speaker 1: it was kind of humorous in the way I said,
Speaker 1: until their stuff open, none of our stuff will be open.
Speaker 1: And so it was humorous but yet so truthful. And
Speaker 1: we're still we're still moving on with ministry, but the
Speaker 1: building is closed because we we wanted to put the
Speaker 1: people's health above the church's finances and and our own desires.
Speaker 1: So it was a call that I had to make
Speaker 1: as a shepherd, because we're called to guard and protect
Speaker 1: God's sheep people. So that was my choice. But moving
Speaker 1: from physical being in the person in person worship to
Speaker 1: the virtual experience, it has been an adjustment. But my
Speaker 1: favorite word for all leaders this year is you. We've
Speaker 1: all had to learn how to pivot. You don't hey
Speaker 1: if you don't know how to pivot, if you don't
Speaker 1: know how to adjust, if you don't understand what the
Speaker 1: word innovation means, you're gonna be lost in the sauce.
Speaker 1: So regardless of what organization you lead or run, we've
Speaker 1: all had to shift and be open to change, and
Speaker 1: really in many ways it's been beautiful. That's what's so,
Speaker 1: you know, in the in the realm of pivoting, allow
Speaker 1: me to pivot for a minute, real quick. We talk
Speaker 1: about sheep and you're leading god sheep. But in when
Speaker 1: you call someone to sheep, they're normally that's normally a
Speaker 1: negative connotation that normally since the people who are pretty
Speaker 1: much sleep and just follow anything blindly. So, as a
Speaker 1: leader of faith, how do you balance between the changes
Speaker 1: that society has made with regard to how we lead
Speaker 1: people and still continue to be um truthful to the
Speaker 1: word you know, and and truthfully speaking, I understand some
Speaker 1: connotations with the word sheep. How people can say no
Speaker 1: that means you're just blindly following no. But I think
Speaker 1: the the onus and the responsibility is more so on
Speaker 1: the shepherd. Uh, we're we're called under shepherd's In my context,
Speaker 1: I'm not the main shepherd, but I am called to shepherd,
Speaker 1: which means I fight wolves. We feed sheep, and we
Speaker 1: fight wolves. So that's on the prophetic side of ministry,
Speaker 1: not prophecy in the sense of I'm going to tell
Speaker 1: you what your future is. You know, I speak what
Speaker 1: I try to speak to people, what God Will wants said.
Speaker 1: So that means I stand in some tense places. We
Speaker 1: have wolves of white supremacy, wolves of voter suppression, wolves
Speaker 1: of of gender inequality. And so when I view myself
Speaker 1: as a shepherd, is not that I'm saying the sheep
Speaker 1: aren't smart, because I got more smart. I have more
Speaker 1: people with more degrees than I have sitting in the pew.
Speaker 1: So I know means that my meaning by that people's
Speaker 1: intelligence or demeaning people, I'm saying my responsibility is still
Speaker 1: fighting wolves and making sure that I do the job
Speaker 1: I have to protect the people that God has called
Speaker 1: me to lead. So it is a new day, um
Speaker 1: and and the folks are smart. People are intelligent. So
Speaker 1: even if I had kept even if I had kept
Speaker 1: my church open after the people weren't coming, you, you're
Speaker 1: not up on the latest. Two hundred thousand people have
Speaker 1: lost their lives this year. Trump's lost his mind if
Speaker 1: you stayed open, like listening past his tone deaf, he
Speaker 1: don't see what's going on in the world right now.
Speaker 1: And so if anybody is sleep, I think some preachers
Speaker 1: and pastors have been sleep. And uh, and and and
Speaker 1: so we have to wake up to the changing of
Speaker 1: the times, stand up on what's current, what's flowing, and
Speaker 1: you can have faith and still be aware of the facts.
Speaker 1: That I found my balance in that tension, like I
Speaker 1: just because I'm a man of faith doesn't mean I
Speaker 1: ignore all the facts. Right, Absolutely, we we deal with
Speaker 1: that faith verse facts. But we call it a religion
Speaker 1: versus spirituality because we both grew up in different denominations,
Speaker 1: because she was seven day Events and I grew up Baptist.
Speaker 1: So it was like, how do we decide which one
Speaker 1: we're going to choose for our children? And did we
Speaker 1: have to particularly did we have to you know what
Speaker 1: I mean? So I guess in your expert opinion, would
Speaker 1: you say that there's a difference between just faith and religion? Um?
Speaker 1: If so, what's the difference? If not, how do they relate?
Speaker 1: So faith is an experience that we all have every day.
Speaker 1: We we've used this word faith to help people understand religion.
Speaker 1: But when you sat down in that chair and you
Speaker 1: didn't check to see if the screws were tightened, Uh,
Speaker 1: if that chair will hold you up, you have faith
Speaker 1: in their chair. You just sat down in it. When
Speaker 1: you get on the airplane. When you get on the
Speaker 1: airplane and you didn't check the pilot's credentials, that was faith.
Speaker 1: So we all exhibit faith in every walk of life.
Speaker 1: And I think the faith is just an experience of
Speaker 1: our religion, of our spirituality. Religion is more of the
Speaker 1: set of rules that are set in place that are
Speaker 1: supposed to help us experience the Holy other. Spirituality is
Speaker 1: more so without all the rules, without all the rituals,
Speaker 1: without of the creeds and the codes. It's just my
Speaker 1: experience with something greater than myself or with myself. Different
Speaker 1: people experience spirituality in different ways. And so now because
Speaker 1: the times are changing and you're dealing with this word
Speaker 1: called pluralism, you know, you know, religious pluralism. We are
Speaker 1: all growing. Buddhists can live right next door to you,
Speaker 1: You can work with the Muslim somebody in Islam, and
Speaker 1: so we're all having to understand how you can hold
Speaker 1: onto what you believe without damning, without demeaning, or without
Speaker 1: diminishing what somebody else believes. So, real quick, can I
Speaker 1: just interject real quickly, one of the major issues that
Speaker 1: I had growing up as a as a child of God,
Speaker 1: because up in a Baptist Church was the belief that
Speaker 1: if you don't accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and savior,
Speaker 1: then everyone else you're going to hell. So for me,
Speaker 1: that was hard for me to wrap my mind around
Speaker 1: because I felt like there's so many other people in
Speaker 1: the world who probably have never been introduced to Jesus
Speaker 1: Christ because they may believe in another religion. Say you're
Speaker 1: say you're Buddhist. You know, um, I know. Um. The
Speaker 1: Jews believe that Jesus Christ was maybe a prophet, but
Speaker 1: he isn't the son of God. So then my thought
Speaker 1: process growing up was does that mean that Jews are
Speaker 1: going to Hell? And I remember trying to ask questions
Speaker 1: growing up, and my the adults and my children look
Speaker 1: at me like, why would you even ask that question?
Speaker 1: And no one would give me an answer. So it
Speaker 1: made me feel lost. What do you say to people
Speaker 1: now who who have those same questions you are looking
Speaker 1: for the right way to have a walk with God. First,
Speaker 1: I want to say, I want to apologize for all
Speaker 1: the people who were so fearful of a question that
Speaker 1: would upset their equilibrium that they silenced you. But the
Speaker 1: truth is if we walk by faith and not by sight.
Speaker 1: Then the very essence of faith suggests I have to
Speaker 1: ask questions because I don't have certainty. So yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: faith in his answers means there's no certainty, right, and
Speaker 1: so that that there are elements where as we walk
Speaker 1: with God, as we journey where God. God is not
Speaker 1: often intimidate. God has never intimidated by our questions, but
Speaker 1: the people who speak for God sometimes are intimidated by questions,
Speaker 1: and so we try to silence people. But what I
Speaker 1: want to say is it is nobody's place to determine
Speaker 1: an eternity for anybody. My walk with God is my walk.
Speaker 1: I believe that Jesus Christ I acknowledge him, is my
Speaker 1: Lord and Savior. And because I know who Jesus is
Speaker 1: for me, I invite people to journey with Jesus if
Speaker 1: that's what you choose to do. But I don't spend
Speaker 1: my time, you know, bashing other faiths and other faith traditions,
Speaker 1: because for those people, that's real for them, that's that's
Speaker 1: that's real for them. And while they may experience the
Speaker 1: Holy that way, I experienced the Holy my way. I think, Um,
Speaker 1: instead of us getting caught up in the name, why
Speaker 1: don't we all just find a way to learn to
Speaker 1: love each other affirm each other, and they are basic
Speaker 1: principles that are true and transcending in all faith traditions.
Speaker 1: You can't limit joy just to Christianity. You can't limit
Speaker 1: justice just to Christianity. You can't limit peace and understand
Speaker 1: and being affirming and positivity just to one religion. So
Speaker 1: if we get down to the essence of all of
Speaker 1: these religions, which I taught religion in more House, I
Speaker 1: studied religion and more House, and to build all this stuff,
Speaker 1: if you get down to the essence of it all,
Speaker 1: they're all trying to say the same thing. That's what
Speaker 1: we saw, that's what we came to. I'm telling you
Speaker 1: passed away. We were in college and we were studying religion,
Speaker 1: and we studied Islam. We studied you Days, and we
Speaker 1: studied Christianity simultaneous. It was one of those things that
Speaker 1: when we started dating, we knew that we it was
Speaker 1: going to be the core of our relationship and our
Speaker 1: marriage one day. So we wanted to get on the
Speaker 1: same page about it. And we realized and talking to
Speaker 1: each other that we had so many um similar beliefs.
Speaker 1: But it was just a different way of teaching that
Speaker 1: it kind of came across to us. I remember, and
Speaker 1: I spoke about this on a former podcast that we
Speaker 1: did when I first met a Vault and I brought
Speaker 1: him home. Um, my family whose Seven Day Indventists says
Speaker 1: in raising the West Indies on both sides, my parents
Speaker 1: particularly weren't as strict in the following of the teachings
Speaker 1: and the rules that went with Seven Day Inventist because
Speaker 1: there are a lot of those. Um. However, I did
Speaker 1: have an aunt who is a devout you know, Seven
Speaker 1: Day Adventists and very you know, um serious about her walk.
Speaker 1: She said to me like, oh, he's a nice guy,
Speaker 1: but he goes to church on the wrong day. And
Speaker 1: I was like, there's a wrong day to go to church.
Speaker 1: And that really just like was off putting for me
Speaker 1: because I'm like, okay, so he's a nice guy from
Speaker 1: an amazing family and all that, but the fact that
Speaker 1: he goes to church on a Saturday, not of Sunday,
Speaker 1: I mean on a Sunday, not of Saturday, was reason
Speaker 1: for her to be like, I don't know, you know,
Speaker 1: and to me, that was very disheartening. So that what
Speaker 1: that's what led us to do these religion courses to
Speaker 1: really try to seek for ourselves what was happening? You
Speaker 1: know what? What what is it that we wanted to believe?
Speaker 1: Believe in? Religion is too often put labels, limits and
Speaker 1: lids on people. Yes, labels, limits and lids so so
Speaker 1: and the whole time the only al we're supposed to
Speaker 1: be exhibiting is love. Like I just read before I
Speaker 1: jumped on here with you all this scripture and John thirteen,
Speaker 1: one of my favorite scriptures. Jesus is like, they will
Speaker 1: know your my disciples by how you love right there
Speaker 1: at the end of John chapter thirteen, Like forget all
Speaker 1: the other stuff. He's like, they're gonna know that you
Speaker 1: rock with me because of how you love each other.
Speaker 1: Like love one another. That's this is the new commandment.
Speaker 1: So I know you can quote the Ten Commandments. I
Speaker 1: know you can quote all the law and all that stuff.
Speaker 1: He's like, I got one. I got a new commandment
Speaker 1: for you love one another. Do you know how much
Speaker 1: stuff we can solve in the world if we could
Speaker 1: get down to the what my grandma will call the
Speaker 1: treaty gritty. That's true, that is true. This is what
Speaker 1: we struggle with a lot, because we want our boys
Speaker 1: to to grow up with love in their heart. You know,
Speaker 1: one thing that people say all the time is that
Speaker 1: they can notice our oldest son who's nine, that he
Speaker 1: has a lot of empathy towards other people. That you
Speaker 1: can tell that how other people feel matters to him.
Speaker 1: And what I feared growing up was putting him into
Speaker 1: a church environment where that that loss and empathy is gone,
Speaker 1: because now it becomes a judging thing where you look
Speaker 1: at people to see who's sinning, and you start counting sins.
Speaker 1: Because I remember a point where, you know, when you
Speaker 1: at nine and ten years old, you start to understand
Speaker 1: what the ten commandments are, and you start to understand
Speaker 1: what's right and what's wrong. You start to look at
Speaker 1: people differently, and every time you see somebody, you see
Speaker 1: a sinner, you know, And I feared putting them in
Speaker 1: that element to where now they grow up just looking
Speaker 1: at people at at faults. How many faults did you
Speaker 1: commit today? So you know, my question to you is
Speaker 1: where does faith lie in the nuclear family, especially the
Speaker 1: nuclear black family, when it comes to how do you
Speaker 1: raise your children and how do you pick a significant other?
Speaker 1: Where does faith lie on that list? And to double
Speaker 1: down on that, how have you seen faith in religion?
Speaker 1: I guess change from generation to generation, meaning from our
Speaker 1: parents or grandparents generation to us and the now us
Speaker 1: raising children today. You know that is a deep question.
Speaker 1: We need two hours version, but yeah, I'm gonna give
Speaker 1: you from give you some foot notes and the cliff note. So,
Speaker 1: my my grandparents faithful people, um, you know, very faithful
Speaker 1: grouping church. My mother, my father again another generation of
Speaker 1: Christianity and I kind of inherited the faith initially and
Speaker 1: then I made a decision in college to stay with
Speaker 1: the faith. Um, we're my generation, some of these millennials
Speaker 1: and younger people, we're not as rigid in our beliefs,
Speaker 1: like we will listen to Cardi B And turn on
Speaker 1: gospel in a matter of two minutes past oh oh
Speaker 1: my god. Because for us, we've really embraced some Africa
Speaker 1: can traditions and that is there is no separation between
Speaker 1: secular and sacred. That that that it's been a diffusion
Speaker 1: over time between sacred and secular because the truth is
Speaker 1: it's all sacred. African traditions, particularly in our community, give
Speaker 1: us space to say they're sacred and everything, Like you
Speaker 1: can hear a rapper get up and get an award
Speaker 1: and he just cussed and called girls bees and ages,
Speaker 1: and he wins an award for his song, and he'll
Speaker 1: get up and say, hey, y'all, I just want to
Speaker 1: thank God for giving me this gift. And we're like, well,
Speaker 1: but but it's very profound because he does not separate
Speaker 1: God giving him a gift to what is song and
Speaker 1: maybe perpetuating in his music, Like even if it is
Speaker 1: kind of edgy, even if I did cuss, even if
Speaker 1: I did throw some stuff in, it might be you know,
Speaker 1: looked at as secular or or risk ay or even profane.
Speaker 1: I know God gave me the gift to wrap. I
Speaker 1: know God gave me this gift from music. So there's
Speaker 1: no separation. So you can see younger people saying I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go out here to work, enjoy myself at the
Speaker 1: club and I and I'll go to church the next day,
Speaker 1: and like God is and all of this, and absolutely,
Speaker 1: I really think my generation and our age group, we're like, no,
Speaker 1: don't don't try to separate what's secular and sacred for us,
Speaker 1: it's all sacred and God is in it. All our
Speaker 1: older generation they were more. This is how you dress,
Speaker 1: this is how you talk. You have to marry this person.
Speaker 1: You can't love you know, same gender loving relationships. Oh no,
Speaker 1: the Bibles against it, and we're like, but y'all do
Speaker 1: know God, it's too big to be little. We do
Speaker 1: know that God is love and you can't control people
Speaker 1: and that so science has impacted us. Uh, updates and
Speaker 1: research has impacted us. People are growing, people are evolving,
Speaker 1: and some people are against it. But the newer generation,
Speaker 1: I think, are saying, Hey, God is so big, so loving.
Speaker 1: Let's stop judging people by who they love, how they dress,
Speaker 1: how they talk, what they believe, and let's be bigger
Speaker 1: than that. Jesus is too big to be little either.
Speaker 1: So I don't know if they answered your question. Let
Speaker 1: me go and one more thing, specifically about your children.
Speaker 1: I understand how I've talked to so many couples my age, like,
Speaker 1: what do we do? You know? I want them to
Speaker 1: come into their own I want them to believe on
Speaker 1: their own whatever they choose to believe. At the same time,
Speaker 1: if you lay a foundation UH in Christianity, the best
Speaker 1: of Christianity is what we give our children. You know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying? It's just the basics grace, love, mercy, giveness.
Speaker 1: So Christianity at his best is what we can instill
Speaker 1: in our children. And even if you know you are choose,
Speaker 1: you all a free now, so you can choose another
Speaker 1: faith tradition. I'm not here to judge. I will raise
Speaker 1: my children in a Christian setting because the best of
Speaker 1: Christianity is what helped me build my foundation and I
Speaker 1: believe that up with child now, when they get to
Speaker 1: certain moments on their journey, I can say, hey, let's
Speaker 1: talk about this. Let's wrestle with this, because it's gonna come.
Speaker 1: It's gonna come organically. So when it comes organically and
Speaker 1: attention hits to two rows diverge into the woods, as
Speaker 1: Robert Frost said, you can stand there and help them
Speaker 1: negotiate that. Am I making any sense? No? You are. No,
Speaker 1: You're absolutely making a lot of sense. And I'll tell
Speaker 1: you what what made the most sense for me. We're
Speaker 1: taking notes and whatnot. I'm gonna have to listen to
Speaker 1: this episode again myself. Does these these four words that
Speaker 1: you said, grace, love, mercy, and forgiveness on this podcast,
Speaker 1: If there's one thing people heard heard me say a
Speaker 1: lot is grace. I always talk about giving your parents, grace,
Speaker 1: giving each other, but love, mercy and forgiveness, and also
Speaker 1: um not separating between sacred and secular. What what I
Speaker 1: think that allows people to do is to not feel
Speaker 1: isolated and judged while trying to go through their walk
Speaker 1: the current of what you know allowed because growing up
Speaker 1: in Flatbush, Brooklyn, our church was in the middle of
Speaker 1: the hood, so there were a lot of people, people
Speaker 1: who only knew a secular lifestyle, who felt uncomfortable coming
Speaker 1: into church because they feared that they wouldn't be accepted,
Speaker 1: and me being kind of like a bridge between those
Speaker 1: folks and the church folks because my father was a deacon,
Speaker 1: my my aunt, my uncle were all pastors and ministers.
Speaker 1: I could see both sides. So that's what made me
Speaker 1: kind of realize that there has to be something different
Speaker 1: than the rigid traditions that existed, you know, back in
Speaker 1: the day. But that but that leads me to a question.
Speaker 1: You look at faith right now in politics right and
Speaker 1: you see where we are in politics, and you can see,
Speaker 1: you know, all the Trump supporters are using Christianity is
Speaker 1: their way to say the reason, you know, where the
Speaker 1: solid Christian conservative people and they're leaning on faith in
Speaker 1: religion is the reason why they'll continue to vote this way.
Speaker 1: But then also if you look at you know, our
Speaker 1: side Black Lives Matter, is that faith is what makes
Speaker 1: us believe that you have to treat all people equally.
Speaker 1: How is it that two people can be so polar
Speaker 1: opposite and use Christianity as the reason why they believe
Speaker 1: and what they believe, Like, can you talk about because
Speaker 1: I had Jackson asked me this question, my son, nine
Speaker 1: years old, because he saw we were watching them. We
Speaker 1: were watching CNN and they were a Trump rally and
Speaker 1: a dude had a cross on his shirt and he
Speaker 1: talked about God. And then Jackson, now, just like most people,
Speaker 1: when he sees and make America Great Again hat, he
Speaker 1: automatically assumes that that person is racist. You know. It's like,
Speaker 1: it's so it's so bad that we do this to
Speaker 1: our own, that we do this to people. You know,
Speaker 1: you just everyone is monolithic. You got on the red hat,
Speaker 1: you're racist, you got on a BLM hat. Then you're
Speaker 1: a socialist, you're a Marxists. Is bad, It's terrible. But
Speaker 1: I was trying to explain to him that you can
Speaker 1: be you can be a Christian but have different political views.
Speaker 1: What are your thoughts and how would you explain to
Speaker 1: children about being a Christian or being anything and still
Speaker 1: having different political views and the people who may agree
Speaker 1: that God is the one. But the best way I
Speaker 1: can explain is simply I would explain to a child.
Speaker 1: And I did this to my students at moor House.
Speaker 1: I held up a bottle of water and I had
Speaker 1: him stand in different parts of the room and I said, now,
Speaker 1: what do you see where from where you're standing, and
Speaker 1: what do you see from where you're standing? And some
Speaker 1: saw the the Shauny label, some saw the ingredients on
Speaker 1: the back, some on this side saw that the bottle
Speaker 1: was recycled. I said, now, depending on where you're standing
Speaker 1: impacts what you see. But what we all need, regardless
Speaker 1: of what you see, is the water on the inside. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And so what happens is if I'm white, my context
Speaker 1: is gonna influence what I see. If I'm black from
Speaker 1: the South Side of Chicago, that impacts how I If
Speaker 1: I'm a woman, if I'm a black woman, that impacts
Speaker 1: It's called your social location. So if I'm doing even
Speaker 1: in religion, even even when you read the Bible. You
Speaker 1: bring your story, you bring your experiences to the text,
Speaker 1: and so me, as a black preacher, I don't preach
Speaker 1: the Bible like a white preacher would. Who has been,
Speaker 1: who's experienced privilege, and who's experienced Uh easy, go with life.
Speaker 1: I'm from Lathonia, Georgia. I'm from the South. Uh So
Speaker 1: I I see God as a liberator. I see God
Speaker 1: from my context is one that gets on the side
Speaker 1: of the oppressed and struggles with us. And somebody else
Speaker 1: may see God is hey, God wants me to fight
Speaker 1: for white people to stay in power. God wants me
Speaker 1: to fight for anti abortion laws, and God wants me
Speaker 1: so depending on where you're standing at the same time,
Speaker 1: what's going to heal this country is when, regardless of
Speaker 1: where you're standing looking at the label on the bottle
Speaker 1: of water, when we're all able to humble ourselves and
Speaker 1: listen to each other and and hear each other out,
Speaker 1: and say, tell me what you see from where you're standing,
Speaker 1: and then I'll tell you what I see from what
Speaker 1: I'm standing. Because until we're able to hear each other,
Speaker 1: listen to each other, there will be no healing in
Speaker 1: this country. You know what that that right, there is
Speaker 1: the the explanation. Because we were talking about the different
Speaker 1: forms of religion when it came to Islam, Judaism, Christianity,
Speaker 1: and we all kept saying, it sounds like they all
Speaker 1: praying to the same God. But depending on where they
Speaker 1: were in the globe during the times, the stories were
Speaker 1: a little bit different and even open to interpretation. You
Speaker 1: interpret it based off of your own life perspective. Where
Speaker 1: you were standing, that's what you saw. So if you're
Speaker 1: a Christian, when you looked at Jesus, you saw the
Speaker 1: Son of God. If you were Jewish, where you saw
Speaker 1: you to a prophet. If you were a Muslim, when
Speaker 1: you were watching Jesus, you saw a prophet. If you
Speaker 1: saw allow you to a prophet. So it doesn't mean
Speaker 1: that they're all wrong or one is wrong. It's just
Speaker 1: where I was standing when I saw that made me
Speaker 1: see God. But it made me see God through this
Speaker 1: perspective that that makes a lot of Sometimes your own lens,
Speaker 1: you gotta just wipe that fog off sometimes and be like, oh,
Speaker 1: I see that a little blurry, but I see and
Speaker 1: and and let me tell you what's so beautiful is
Speaker 1: when you know what changed my opinions about even people
Speaker 1: in the LGBTQ community, because they're standing where they're staying.
Speaker 1: I stand where I stand when I'm able to finally
Speaker 1: see them as human beings and not an object and
Speaker 1: not a subject and not a topic a spectacle. And
Speaker 1: when and when people able to see us in other
Speaker 1: races it's not just a subject. But when I'm able
Speaker 1: to finally one day walk over to them and saying, now,
Speaker 1: tell me what you see from your place, and they
Speaker 1: explain it. And then they walk over to me and
Speaker 1: I said, now, this is what I see from where
Speaker 1: I'm sitting. Do you understand the kinds of record, the
Speaker 1: kind of reconciliation, the kind of of understanding, the kind
Speaker 1: of grace, Come on, grace that we would end up,
Speaker 1: the grace that we would give everybody, because at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, regardless of your race, your religion,
Speaker 1: your gender, your sexual orientation, we all need some water
Speaker 1: to quench our thirsty souls. I don't care who you are.
Speaker 1: Everybody needs water. And that's why the example of the
Speaker 1: water bottle was so powerful, because like you need what's
Speaker 1: on the inside, we need the main thing that keeps
Speaker 1: all of us alive and that's water. And you can
Speaker 1: call that God, call that spirit, call that divine, call
Speaker 1: it what you wanna call it, but you need it. Well.
Speaker 1: I think it's amazing about what you've been saying a
Speaker 1: couple different things. UM, is that you meet people pretty
Speaker 1: much where they are. And I come from a background where,
Speaker 1: you know, there's a lot of evangelizing that happens, and
Speaker 1: that we had crusades where they're like trying to convert
Speaker 1: the masses and you know, trying to see allowing people,
Speaker 1: getting people to see what you see and buy into it. Um.
Speaker 1: And for me, I remember feeling as a child being
Speaker 1: in a Sabbath school or you know, going to these
Speaker 1: crusades that were happening during the week and the summertime,
Speaker 1: and they're just trying to like, you know, convert as
Speaker 1: many people as possible. And there was like a pressure
Speaker 1: that I had sitting in the chair, like Okay, do
Speaker 1: I get up and go up now or or do
Speaker 1: I not remember one time trying to go up and
Speaker 1: my mom was like sit down and I was like, well, wait, okay,
Speaker 1: do you want me to be here and be a
Speaker 1: seven day adventus? Do you want me to sit down
Speaker 1: and just be here because I'm here. I also remember
Speaker 1: feeling the almost shame sometimes sitting in the pews and
Speaker 1: feeling like the pastor was like talking at me. I
Speaker 1: remember very vividly one Sunday, Saturday, I went into church
Speaker 1: and I um had on a little like you know,
Speaker 1: business suit that I was wearing, you know, no air rings. No,
Speaker 1: I actually had airrings in when typically seven day Adventus
Speaker 1: you're not supposed to wear airrings, so I had errings
Speaker 1: in my air. I had on a business suit that
Speaker 1: was fitting well. I had on some heels. I felt good.
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm a show up for the Lord
Speaker 1: today because I was feeling good, and I remember sitting
Speaker 1: towards the middle of the church, the sanctuary, and the
Speaker 1: pastor started talking about like Jezebel and like also I
Speaker 1: just remember feeling really small because it's almost as if
Speaker 1: he was preaching at me in that moment um, and
Speaker 1: it talked about like material things and like out of
Speaker 1: our parents, and I just it's almost as if I
Speaker 1: felt like the walls of the sanctuary was closing in
Speaker 1: on me and he was preaching at me. And I
Speaker 1: felt such a shame after that because I felt like, well,
Speaker 1: now They're not gonna want me to be converted into
Speaker 1: whatever it is. Or I had to convert myself into
Speaker 1: whatever it is they needed me to be to be
Speaker 1: able to sit in a church sermon for the day. Um,
Speaker 1: So would you say that you? I say all that
Speaker 1: to say, would you say that you are more about
Speaker 1: meeting people where there are and joining them they or
Speaker 1: is it about trying to evangelize and convert and spread
Speaker 1: the word? How how does that look for you now
Speaker 1: as a millennial And how is it different now for you?
Speaker 1: How do you how do you preach differently? Yeah? I
Speaker 1: think that question is so profound. Um. You know one
Speaker 1: of my mentors said, preaching doesn't convert people. And I
Speaker 1: was like, we all, look, what do you main Preaching
Speaker 1: doesn't convert. We were called to preach to convert. He said, no,
Speaker 1: preaching doesn't convert. He said, what converts people is when
Speaker 1: they see your life and they see you deal with
Speaker 1: certain situations and they see God in you through your
Speaker 1: own struggle, through your own humanity. Hm. It blew my
Speaker 1: mind because because even Jesus said, even when Jesus has
Speaker 1: described you know, for those that know the Bible, John
Speaker 1: chapter one, he said and the word became flesh. Like
Speaker 1: what converts people in this day and time is when
Speaker 1: they're able to see the preacher and see you as
Speaker 1: human and see you dealing with the same stuff that
Speaker 1: they deal with, and you you push through it and
Speaker 1: you get through it and you're able to find God
Speaker 1: in it. Like that's how I that's how I am
Speaker 1: so right now, you know, I told the church a
Speaker 1: few weeks ago during this pandemic, I've been depressed. I
Speaker 1: started going to therapy, and so on one end, I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: my lord, I have told this church I felt with
Speaker 1: depression that I've told him I've had therapy. And you
Speaker 1: won't believe the number of people to hit me up,
Speaker 1: Black Pastor you just freed me. Thank you, because because
Speaker 1: I've been depressed. I did a lesson on grief and
Speaker 1: and one of our friends, my wife and I as friends,
Speaker 1: who was in our wedding, she took her life four
Speaker 1: weeks ago, and I did a lesson on grief and
Speaker 1: I just was vulnerable. I'm like, y'all, this has been
Speaker 1: something to deal with, and so many people, like in
Speaker 1: the middle of a pandemic who ain't grieving, and grief
Speaker 1: is not just about the grief is about loss. So
Speaker 1: when you lose is your normalcy, When you lose your routine,
Speaker 1: your rituals, the stuff that's sacred to you, your traditions.
Speaker 1: You can't go to church for some people, can't go
Speaker 1: to mass, whatever. Wherever you go, everybody is grieving. So
Speaker 1: what I've discovered and what I love about this question
Speaker 1: is what has converted people for me is not me bamming,
Speaker 1: banging people upside the head saying you better believe Jesus.
Speaker 1: It's me saying, hey, let me tell you what God
Speaker 1: has done for me. Let me tell you what Jesus
Speaker 1: means to me in my suffering and my tears, in
Speaker 1: my low moments, in my high moments. And if you
Speaker 1: relate to that, I want you to come join me
Speaker 1: on this journey of humanity. And yes, and that has
Speaker 1: converted more people for me than me saying you're going
Speaker 1: to hell if you don't believe it. I believe that.
Speaker 1: But here's another thing, because what you just spoke on
Speaker 1: is the reality. People tend to follow other people who
Speaker 1: show their humanness. They don't stand from a place of
Speaker 1: conviction and say you're bad. Your soul is deemed someone
Speaker 1: you should. We've experienced that even with the content that
Speaker 1: we create and the stories we put out and that
Speaker 1: we tell through our our platform. You know, we're just like, Hey,
Speaker 1: we're just like any other like married millennial couple of
Speaker 1: trying to raise these kids and figure your life out,
Speaker 1: and here's what we're going through, and a lot of
Speaker 1: people can relate. The more real you become, the more
Speaker 1: people tend to follow you because they understand that if
Speaker 1: this person is going through it and I go through
Speaker 1: it too, I could learn how they deal with what
Speaker 1: they're going through. But this leads me to a huge question,
Speaker 1: which is the business of faith, Because the business of
Speaker 1: faith is what terms a lot of people off. And
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie. It has turned me off. You know.
Speaker 1: I grew up in a church, Selar Missionary Baptist Church
Speaker 1: in Flatbush, Brooklyn, where the pastor, Pastor Boyd, he grew
Speaker 1: a twenty million dollar church from nothing from nothing all
Speaker 1: but by his business acumen he was able to do
Speaker 1: things and use the resources from the congregation to build it.
Speaker 1: But in the church he was able to provide resources
Speaker 1: to the community, which is why you understand why the
Speaker 1: church has to be a business. Because you're also providing resources.
Speaker 1: But then if you look, now there's megachurches, churches worth
Speaker 1: hundreds of millions of dollars, but then there's people in
Speaker 1: the congregation who don't have much. And it makes you wonder,
Speaker 1: how is it that a pastor can live in abundance,
Speaker 1: have a private jet, have a twenty million dollar home,
Speaker 1: and have all of these things, but then have people
Speaker 1: in his flock who have nothing and you have nowhere
Speaker 1: for them to go. For example, remember the hurricane hit.
Speaker 1: The hurricane hit in Houston, and who's the I forgot
Speaker 1: the name of the preacher, but as a white preacher,
Speaker 1: but he refused to open up the doors of his church. Okay,
Speaker 1: good thing, I can remember. But it was on. It
Speaker 1: was on, It was on media takeout and it was
Speaker 1: on it was on TV. And it was just like,
Speaker 1: you have your church the size of a stadium. There's
Speaker 1: a hurricane, people in your flock have nowhere to go,
Speaker 1: and you refuse to open the doors of the church.
Speaker 1: Isn't that what the church is for? So that made
Speaker 1: me think, well, there goes the business of faith. The
Speaker 1: business of faith has become a money grab to a
Speaker 1: lot of people. How do you tell people how to
Speaker 1: deal like, how do you teach your people how to
Speaker 1: deal with the business of what faith has become? Well,
Speaker 1: I simply put, I just tell them the church. Um,
Speaker 1: there is business that the church handles, but the church
Speaker 1: is not a business. It's all it's all about and
Speaker 1: and and and it differs for different people, you know.
Speaker 1: For me, I don't leave my church as a business.
Speaker 1: It's a ministry. But I know, but I know, just
Speaker 1: because we have business to handle does not mean we
Speaker 1: are a business business. Yeah, And that's how I've done it.
Speaker 1: And then I think, too, we cannot allow the greed
Speaker 1: and the excessive lifestyles of a few to make us
Speaker 1: think that everybody is doing that, because I promise you
Speaker 1: the majority of pastors, uh, they are not millionaires. They
Speaker 1: do not have enough money or even the desire to
Speaker 1: buy a private jet. But I think the ones that
Speaker 1: get the attention, the ones they get depressed, those are
Speaker 1: the ones I know. So many pastors right now through
Speaker 1: this pandemic, are are every week with their fingers crossed
Speaker 1: praying they can keep their doors open because they don't
Speaker 1: have They don't they want to do ministry on a
Speaker 1: major level, but they're but they're struggling because if you
Speaker 1: want the ministry to go forth, you do need money.
Speaker 1: And so what I wanna do is just give a
Speaker 1: shout out to the UH, the, the the, not the
Speaker 1: mega ministries, but the ministries that are doing mega ministry.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. It's it's a difference, like
Speaker 1: I don't have to be a mega church to do
Speaker 1: mega ministry, and and so there are something that are
Speaker 1: trying to do that, and then the pastors, we cannot
Speaker 1: be caught up in it in our own flesh are
Speaker 1: greed leaders is we have to remember that God put
Speaker 1: us in place to care for people, not for the
Speaker 1: people to pack our pockets. We're here to be a blessing.
Speaker 1: And so I'm very you know, shout out to the
Speaker 1: one of the greatest churches on this side of Heaven,
Speaker 1: Fellowship Chicago. I'm so proud that in the middle of
Speaker 1: a pandemic, we donated twenty thousand dollars to the food
Speaker 1: depository here in Chicago. We gave raid fifty dollars plus
Speaker 1: to twenty high school graduates. We gave we gave every
Speaker 1: high school graduate who applied on time two thousand dollars
Speaker 1: towards their their journey in college and in the military.
Speaker 1: So every Wednesday we gave food away for free. Partner
Speaker 1: with the Food Depository, opened up our food pantry and
Speaker 1: gave over three thousand families food between the months of
Speaker 1: March and July. You see that to me is that
Speaker 1: to me is where the church is a business but
Speaker 1: has to be a business in a way, because in
Speaker 1: order to be a nonprofit organization, you have to run
Speaker 1: it as a business. The church I grew up in
Speaker 1: Sealle Missionary Baptist Church, this man did so much for
Speaker 1: the community. Past the pastor Boyd Man, He's he's one
Speaker 1: of my favorite people in the world. He christened our
Speaker 1: first child and he blessed him and in his in
Speaker 1: his home. But he was so smart because he was
Speaker 1: able to use his influence and not only just give
Speaker 1: money back, but also to be influenced in political realms
Speaker 1: to say, you know what, if you want to have
Speaker 1: access to my flock or you wanta have access here,
Speaker 1: this is what we're gonna need from you. And I
Speaker 1: think in times like this there are a lot more
Speaker 1: churches that could be doing a lot more when it
Speaker 1: comes to the political realm. Because I do ask this question,
Speaker 1: where are all the huge like we have in the
Speaker 1: back in the day. We should have a lot of
Speaker 1: political leaders who were pastors right nowadays as a lot
Speaker 1: of social activism. But I don't see the same political
Speaker 1: power from our our faith leaders. And I wonder where
Speaker 1: it's gone, especially these faith leaders who have these huge,
Speaker 1: mega churches. How do we not hear from these these
Speaker 1: men and women who have these huge followings who make
Speaker 1: a ton of money to say, you know what, we
Speaker 1: need legislation to be changed, and I'm going to be
Speaker 1: in the forefront of that even if it's not you know,
Speaker 1: I have to go on TV and say it. But
Speaker 1: why is it not getting done? Because I knew that's
Speaker 1: what was part of the church I grew up in.
Speaker 1: I know that Pastor Boyd had people in political office
Speaker 1: where he could say, Hey, something is going wrong with
Speaker 1: this precinct. We need to have this conversation. What has
Speaker 1: happened to having the relationship with political leaders? And absolutely,
Speaker 1: I mean Dr Martin Luther King was a pastor. You know,
Speaker 1: he was before anything else, you know, before Reverend Dr
Speaker 1: Martin Luther King Jr. He's a reverend. He used his
Speaker 1: ability to speak to people in lead a flock to
Speaker 1: to get us access. You know what I'm saying. If
Speaker 1: you think about Malcolm X. Malcolm X is a part
Speaker 1: of the Nation of Islam, which was a religious group,
Speaker 1: and I'm just wondering where is that in That's why
Speaker 1: I asked the question. His faith kind of dissipated. You know,
Speaker 1: you know, you know. It's a powerful book exactly on
Speaker 1: what you're talking about. It's called Where Have All the
Speaker 1: Profits Gone? By a great scholar by the name of
Speaker 1: Dr Marvin McMichael. And he wrote this book as if
Speaker 1: to say, you know, where of all the profits gone?
Speaker 1: Where are all the people who are supposed to be
Speaker 1: on the front lines fighting for God's people and speaking
Speaker 1: truth to power? So he writes, he writes this book
Speaker 1: maybe ten plus years ago, and I think it'd be
Speaker 1: great for to answer your library, where have all the
Speaker 1: profits gone? And to be honest with you, a lot
Speaker 1: of our profits, a lot of our leaders who could
Speaker 1: be on the front lines. I hate to say it,
Speaker 1: but we've been bought. We've been bought, and and and
Speaker 1: and when cash, when cash means more to you than Christ,
Speaker 1: When when your priorities And I've heard a powerful leader
Speaker 1: say this once. He says, I want to be able
Speaker 1: to function in all jungles, so I don't say things
Speaker 1: that are divisive. I don't want to make I don't
Speaker 1: want to make this group upset. And I don't want
Speaker 1: to make this group upsets. No, no, no, you don't.
Speaker 1: So so the sin watch this. Now, I'm about to
Speaker 1: get real deep, but I'm gonna make a light. One
Speaker 1: of the greatest sins of our culture is the sin
Speaker 1: of neutrality. Yes, you just you know, you just yeah,
Speaker 1: you're just neutral. You're right in the fence. No, that
Speaker 1: comes a day where you have to get off the
Speaker 1: fence and take a stance. And if everybody didn't agree
Speaker 1: who I was about to say something I was about
Speaker 1: to say. I was about to say, hey, these but
Speaker 1: what they feel? Yeah, I mean because because that wasn't Jesus, Like,
Speaker 1: I'm a Christian, so just excuse me for speaking out
Speaker 1: of my faith tradition. Jesus took stances like he ticked off.
Speaker 1: He Rome was after him, the Jews were after him,
Speaker 1: like everybody was trying to shut this man down because
Speaker 1: he didn't care about your position, your power, your platform,
Speaker 1: your privilege, whatever, if it was wrong, if it was unethical,
Speaker 1: if it was a moral, if it wasn't helping people,
Speaker 1: Jesus wanted it. And I'm in that faith tradition. That's Jesus.
Speaker 1: Jesus was a gangster like he was. He wasn't with
Speaker 1: the foolishness and uh and that's where I am. And
Speaker 1: so I take people off all the time. But I
Speaker 1: love it. Come back here. We've barely scratched it. We
Speaker 1: have bach. I mean, I was even looking through some
Speaker 1: questions we have here for you that we don't even
Speaker 1: have time for in this episode. But I love to
Speaker 1: have you back. I'm here, you know. And that's your wife.
Speaker 1: Buy you another dope T shirt? Um, made a different
Speaker 1: thing now that you get our vibe, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean? And it could be it'll be a vibe,
Speaker 1: but it'll be a whole vibe. But we're normally doing
Speaker 1: this letters um during our episodes where people right in
Speaker 1: and they have questions. Do you mind sticking around with
Speaker 1: us for another five ten minutes so we can just
Speaker 1: address these questions real quick. Let's do it all right? Awesome,
Speaker 1: So we're gonna take a quick break and move into
Speaker 1: listener letters, but we'll be back and we will have
Speaker 1: Reggie with us. Past to Reggie, you know, he'll be
Speaker 1: back with us to answer some of your questions. So
Speaker 1: let's get into these ads and stick around. All right,
Speaker 1: So we're back. We paid some bills because this is
Speaker 1: a business. Um, this is a podcast, so we had
Speaker 1: to pay some and we're back to the favorite part
Speaker 1: of the show. We still have passed the redge with us.
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna get into the listener letters. We have
Speaker 1: one here. How do I tell my family and friends
Speaker 1: I no longer believe in adventis um or most things
Speaker 1: beyond the core Christian values. I was born and in
Speaker 1: the Seven Day Advantage Church, and my family has been
Speaker 1: in the church from multiple generations here in the West Indies.
Speaker 1: Both my spouse and I come from extremely involved families
Speaker 1: who are strong in their faith and church ministries, and
Speaker 1: many of them will be heartbroken. Our fear is how
Speaker 1: coming out as agnostic might damage our relationships with our families.
Speaker 1: For people who don't know what agnostic means, that means
Speaker 1: that they don't know whether there is a God or
Speaker 1: not a God. They're not taking a stance on whether
Speaker 1: God exists or not. They're just like I'm not sure. Um,
Speaker 1: we're otherwise really close to them, but I know we're
Speaker 1: hiding part of who we really are by hiding our
Speaker 1: lack of faith. We have no problem going to church
Speaker 1: or sharing in religious practices, and we do want to
Speaker 1: expose our children to it. But I know we're hiding
Speaker 1: who we really are by hiding our lack of faith.
Speaker 1: Should we rip the band aid or slowly expose our truth?
Speaker 1: Pastor reg what you think? I think that's a great question. Um.
Speaker 1: Whenever we go through personal evolutions, whether it being our faith,
Speaker 1: in our lives and our relationships, it is always a
Speaker 1: painful process. But I want to tell this person, standing
Speaker 1: your truth, and whenever you choose to be authentic, whenever
Speaker 1: you choose to be authentic, you attract the people you
Speaker 1: need in your life. Whenever you choose to be false
Speaker 1: or faith or pretending, you attract the people who want
Speaker 1: you for who they think you are. But you don't
Speaker 1: need the people in your life who want you because
Speaker 1: of what they think you are. You need the people
Speaker 1: in your life for who you really are. And only
Speaker 1: when we choose to be authentic, only when we choose
Speaker 1: to stand in our truth and accept that hey, this
Speaker 1: is an evolution. I don't know if I'll end up here,
Speaker 1: but this is where I am right now. Hopefully our family,
Speaker 1: our friends, and those who love us don't stop their
Speaker 1: love or cease their love because we are in a
Speaker 1: place of evolution. I have a friend that left the
Speaker 1: Baptist church and now she is I want to say,
Speaker 1: seven day of Venice. She so, she grew up Baptist
Speaker 1: and now she's seven day of Venice. And you were
Speaker 1: scared to tell me because we grew up together. And
Speaker 1: I said, don't you know I still love you regard
Speaker 1: I said, if you come to me tomorrow and tell
Speaker 1: me you're atheist, I still love you. And tears almost
Speaker 1: almost well up in her eyes. I know you're my friend,
Speaker 1: you're my sister, and what you choose to believe will
Speaker 1: not impact my love for you. So hopefully you're met
Speaker 1: with somebody who will love you through your evolution. That
Speaker 1: that that little life tip there can work with any
Speaker 1: aspect of your life, whether it's not just religion, sexual orientation,
Speaker 1: political values. Allowing people to accept you for who you
Speaker 1: really are rather than trying to be their version of
Speaker 1: who they want you to be, will give you peace.
Speaker 1: Or who think you all will give you peace. That's dope.
Speaker 1: And also not taking it personally. You know, I have
Speaker 1: a really I had a really great friend who, in
Speaker 1: her walk with finding out her relationship with the Lord UM,
Speaker 1: totally excommunicated herself for me. UM, and I for a
Speaker 1: long time struggled with why or what I've done to
Speaker 1: deserve to be outcasts and I I was really backtracking.
Speaker 1: I was doing a lot of the reaching out. She
Speaker 1: was just like a whole listen to let it right here, UM.
Speaker 1: But it was like, you know, I was like, UM,
Speaker 1: really trying to figure out what I did to to
Speaker 1: cause a detriment to this relationship. And I even reached
Speaker 1: out to some of her family and they're like, don't
Speaker 1: take it personally, kidding, because she's pretty much removed herself
Speaker 1: from us as well, and she won't attend certain family
Speaker 1: functions and she won't do certain things because her her
Speaker 1: vision right now is one, you know, one way and
Speaker 1: one dimensional, and she sees nothing else. So I kind
Speaker 1: of had to step back and respect the fact that
Speaker 1: I would no longer be a part of her life,
Speaker 1: even though I know I had nothing but genuine love
Speaker 1: for her. UM. I thought she was an amazing person.
Speaker 1: I felt like we could have grown together and you
Speaker 1: know all that, but I had to respect the fact
Speaker 1: that she no longer wanted to to participate in our relationship,
Speaker 1: and that was hard for me to deal with in
Speaker 1: the beginning. But I just you know, I didn't judge
Speaker 1: her for it, and it was hurt full in the
Speaker 1: beginning for me. But I've learned that maybe I'm not
Speaker 1: supposed to be a part of her life or a
Speaker 1: part of her walk for whatever reason, and I had
Speaker 1: to just kind of kind of eat that. You know.
Speaker 1: Another great book is The Four Agreements. That's my favorite book.
Speaker 1: Oh man, that's that's my book, and my wife loved it.
Speaker 1: We can tell everybody about it. But my favorite agreement
Speaker 1: is don't take it personally. People are on their journey
Speaker 1: and you cannot You can't take people's evolutions and transitions personally.
Speaker 1: There you go, man, we got a lot of a
Speaker 1: lot of synergies me and you passed away. Let me
Speaker 1: tell you. And I'm not gonna lie. I have I
Speaker 1: lost faith for lost faith in faith leaders? I did.
Speaker 1: I I felt I went through a transition. And it's
Speaker 1: funny when you talked about going through a transition and
Speaker 1: understanding that people are going through transitions, so maybe at
Speaker 1: this point in her life she may be agnostic, but
Speaker 1: understanding that she may not stay agnostic. I went through
Speaker 1: a transition in my life where I did not trust
Speaker 1: any faith leaders. I was like the crooks that come in,
Speaker 1: they're they're all selfish, and but it wasn't even just them,
Speaker 1: it was just people in general. I felt that all
Speaker 1: people were crooks, income and not don't trust anybody. And
Speaker 1: I was reading the Four Agreements and I came across
Speaker 1: not taking things personal and understanding enlightenment, and I ended
Speaker 1: up I wrote, actually wrote this down, but this is
Speaker 1: what I came up learning to accept that religion requires
Speaker 1: and understanding that you are you are looking to become
Speaker 1: enlightened when you're when you're looking for really you're looking
Speaker 1: become enlightened, right, But enlightenment doesn't mean you're understanding that
Speaker 1: you know more than others. It's understanding that other people
Speaker 1: know more than you. So sometimes you have to change
Speaker 1: your position. You may know more than this person, but
Speaker 1: when you're really enlightened, you realize that I may know
Speaker 1: more than this person, but I don't know as much
Speaker 1: as that person, so let me change my perspective and
Speaker 1: seek that. That's when I really started to change my
Speaker 1: idea about judging people. And you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: So speaking to you today has has kind of solidified
Speaker 1: my strength in knowing that I can trust people who
Speaker 1: are faith leaders because you don't hear I don't hear
Speaker 1: many faith leaders speak like this. You know, typically it's
Speaker 1: and and it may be where I'm listening to faith leaders,
Speaker 1: but typically it's very rigid. Oh they're agnostic, their atheists,
Speaker 1: they're sinners. You need to separate yourself from that type
Speaker 1: of people. It almost become a cult. Like you know,
Speaker 1: if they don't believe what you believe, cut that person
Speaker 1: out like a cancer, because you want to remove all
Speaker 1: of that toxicity. The minute someone doesn't agree with you,
Speaker 1: they're toxic and listening to you speak, it's more like, no,
Speaker 1: just because someone doesn't believe the same thing you believe,
Speaker 1: you can give them grace to learn why why they
Speaker 1: think that way, and let's see what we can figure
Speaker 1: out together. So the Lord makes no mistakes and there's
Speaker 1: a reason why other guests maybe didn't pan out for today,
Speaker 1: and we were able to end up with Pastor Reggie,
Speaker 1: because I know, in me seeking some things recently in
Speaker 1: my own life, I think I might have found you,
Speaker 1: might have gained you a old new member, you know,
Speaker 1: seriously wary. I mean, I'll tune in because together we
Speaker 1: were thinking about where to go when we were figuring
Speaker 1: this out, and we were just like, who are we
Speaker 1: going to bring on the show. And it wasn't until
Speaker 1: I was was reaching out to people this don't work,
Speaker 1: that don't work in and Charles was just like, you know,
Speaker 1: my passes dope, and it's like, well, loose up. And
Speaker 1: then he's been dope. He sent me a page And now, look,
Speaker 1: things don't happen by accident, not by accident, so I
Speaker 1: think there's no coincidences. I mean, we had an amazing
Speaker 1: time with you. We normally like to end the episode,
Speaker 1: like we said, with a moment of truth. We normally
Speaker 1: will give our perspective on what we take away from
Speaker 1: the episode. But I feel like, given the flow that
Speaker 1: we've had, we'd love to you for you to give
Speaker 1: us I guess some parting words. Give us a devotion, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, give us a devotion out you know than
Speaker 1: you know y'all of my new family members I can't
Speaker 1: wait to meet you in person. I can't wait to
Speaker 1: just sit down and have dinners winter time because we
Speaker 1: heard about that. So she does not like the code, Well,
Speaker 1: I'll come, We'll come to y'all. We'll come to y'all.
Speaker 1: Word but uh but but let me just say this.
Speaker 1: A lot of people have lost faith, so much faith
Speaker 1: and faith and leaders that they don't even seek us
Speaker 1: out for the real hard questions, the real existential questions
Speaker 1: that everybody wrestles with. And I want to say on
Speaker 1: behalf of all faith leaders, UM, I want to apologize.
Speaker 1: I want to say that we you know, I repent
Speaker 1: and um, and I'm more cognizant that we have a
Speaker 1: lot of work to do. We have to make sure
Speaker 1: that we're caring for the whole person, caring for people's
Speaker 1: mental health, caring for people's physical health, caring for people
Speaker 1: enough to give them space to grow develop. Uh relearn unlearned.
Speaker 1: And I want to say that as we journey together, Um,
Speaker 1: the beautiful part about nature is that it teaches us
Speaker 1: a lesson. The sun rises, sun goes down, Clouds come,
Speaker 1: clouds dissipate, um, weather comes, snow comes, rain comes. All
Speaker 1: of this weather comes. But everything is passing, and so
Speaker 1: even in this pandemic, except that nature is a teacher,
Speaker 1: and that we are learning how to change with the times.
Speaker 1: Except that seasons come and seasons go. But if you
Speaker 1: stay strong in the essence of all of these faith traditions,
Speaker 1: if you keep your joy, work on keeping your peace,
Speaker 1: work on being the change you want to see. Work
Speaker 1: on being loved, not just loving, be loved, be peace,
Speaker 1: be be understanding, purport yourself and present yourself as a
Speaker 1: person that exudes these principles. Man, it'll be so many
Speaker 1: people running to you, no matter what faith tradition you have,
Speaker 1: because every time they're in your presence, they will feel
Speaker 1: better about themselves because they've crossed your path. So instead
Speaker 1: of critiquing everybody else, work to become a person that's
Speaker 1: worth listening to. Work to become a person that's worth beings.
Speaker 1: Saw that you know, you know and I may really
Speaker 1: you know. We we can critique everybody else, we can
Speaker 1: we have a we have a judgment on everybody. But
Speaker 1: stop all that look within, work on yourself and let
Speaker 1: God get the glory. Speak to me eyes no no,
Speaker 1: no crying that they don't cry A little moved you
Speaker 1: know we appreciate you, bro. Please tell everything they can
Speaker 1: find Yes, please tell everybody that they can find you. Hey,
Speaker 1: follow us and Fellowship Chicago every Sunday attend am the
Speaker 1: Virtual Ship. We are known as the Virtual Ship is
Speaker 1: taken off on YouTube. Facebook, follow us on Instagram and
Speaker 1: Fellowship Chicago. Follow me on Instagram at r W. Sharp Junior. Um,
Speaker 1: I am on Facebook. I need to become public, so
Speaker 1: just give me a minute on that because I'm running
Speaker 1: out of I'm running out of space for new friends
Speaker 1: with Drake's Yeah, Drake said no new friends, so I
Speaker 1: guess I'm following that right now. But but I'm on Instagram.
Speaker 1: Follow me on Instagram at r W. Sharp Junior and
Speaker 1: follow us a Fellowship Chicago and I can't wait the
Speaker 1: journey with you sounds amazing. Episode. I want your cash,
Speaker 1: happy Venmo, your quick paypals. I can say I got
Speaker 1: I got some some words today. So thank you again
Speaker 1: so much for joining us, Um pastor Reginald Sharp. Wait,
Speaker 1: I'm missing your middle name, Reginald Wayne R. Sharp Junior.
Speaker 1: All right now, thank you so much. Be blessed, love
Speaker 1: to your family and thank you for thank you for
Speaker 1: chilling with us Today. Dead As is a production of
Speaker 1: I Heart Media podcast network and is produced by Dinorapinia
Speaker 1: and Triple Follow the podcasts on social media at dead as,
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