WEBVTT - Before They Were Stars 0:00:02.160 --> 0:00:05.240 Welcome to the solid verbal home. 0:00:05.080 --> 0:00:08.160 That for me. I'm a man, I'm forty. 0:00:08.240 --> 0:00:10.119 I've heard so many players say, well, I want to 0:00:10.119 --> 0:00:12.080 be happy. You want to be happy for a day? 0:00:12.520 --> 0:00:17.800 Edith Steak is that woo woo? And Dan and Tye. 0:00:18.760 --> 0:00:21.439 Welcome back to the solid verbal Boys and girls. My 0:00:21.560 --> 0:00:24.480 name is ty Hildebrand, joining me as always over there 0:00:24.480 --> 0:00:30.440 in beautiful Chicago, Illinois, the one, the only Dan Rubinstein, Sir. 0:00:30.320 --> 0:00:32.159 How are you? I'm good. 0:00:32.240 --> 0:00:35.080 It actually has been pretty beautiful. It's been sunny, and 0:00:35.080 --> 0:00:37.240 in the sixties and seventies, we went over to the lake. 0:00:37.720 --> 0:00:39.199 It's hard for me to call it the beach, but 0:00:39.240 --> 0:00:41.440 we went over to the lake and little Man stomped 0:00:41.479 --> 0:00:44.680 around a bus, you know, did an Easter egg hunt, 0:00:44.960 --> 0:00:48.800 did all sorts of fun stuff outside, and I'm I'm 0:00:48.800 --> 0:00:50.760 doing pretty good. I'm very excited for this show. With 0:00:50.840 --> 0:00:53.440 the draft ahead, I always get very annoyed at the 0:00:54.080 --> 0:00:56.040 all the articles that come out that say or the 0:00:56.080 --> 0:00:59.440 tweets and people saying, ah see, stars don't matter. This 0:00:59.600 --> 0:01:02.560 this two star got drafted number eight overall, when obviously 0:01:02.680 --> 0:01:05.760 the math would indicate differently that you're far more likely 0:01:05.800 --> 0:01:08.600 to be drafted and drafted highly if you are a 0:01:08.600 --> 0:01:10.920 blue chip athlete, just because there are fewer of them 0:01:11.200 --> 0:01:13.560 and the percentages are in your favor that way. But 0:01:14.400 --> 0:01:17.800 I like to know individual stories at the same time, 0:01:17.880 --> 0:01:21.280 why guys get passed over as you know high school recruits, 0:01:21.280 --> 0:01:25.959 and what is behind the tape and the numbers and 0:01:26.160 --> 0:01:28.840 the history of these guys as recruits. I'm fascinated by 0:01:28.840 --> 0:01:32.000 all of this because, as I'm sure Brandon will point out, 0:01:32.959 --> 0:01:36.720 if NFL gms and scouts were in charge of vetting 0:01:36.840 --> 0:01:40.800 all actual important positions in life, we'd be living in 0:01:40.840 --> 0:01:41.720 a much better way. 0:01:42.360 --> 0:01:43.319 Well, they do their homework. 0:01:43.319 --> 0:01:47.039 They do their homework because it's an investment in their future, 0:01:47.160 --> 0:01:49.800 especially if you're picking high up in the draft. It 0:01:50.400 --> 0:01:53.800 really does have a domino effect. So we wanted to 0:01:53.800 --> 0:01:56.440 bring Brandon on this is Our Like Before They were 0:01:56.520 --> 0:01:59.520 Stars kind of show, because Brandon's evaluated all these kids. 0:02:00.000 --> 0:02:01.720 Perhaps he can give us a little bit of insight 0:02:01.840 --> 0:02:05.840 into their college career as we saw it as fans, 0:02:05.880 --> 0:02:09.520 what he projects forward into their NFL career. It is 0:02:09.560 --> 0:02:12.200 the month of April now, and as we forge ahead, 0:02:12.360 --> 0:02:14.079 there's going to be a lot of talk in football 0:02:14.120 --> 0:02:17.239 circles about the NFL Draft. That's just the way it is, 0:02:17.480 --> 0:02:19.920 whether you're an NFL fan or not. There is a 0:02:19.919 --> 0:02:22.400 connection into college football, and this is something that I 0:02:22.440 --> 0:02:24.760 know you and I have seen over the last couple 0:02:24.760 --> 0:02:27.960 of years, I think increasingly so as the draft has 0:02:27.960 --> 0:02:31.320 become more prominent. But there are people college football fans 0:02:31.440 --> 0:02:34.320 maybe don't have any bent towards the NFL who like 0:02:34.400 --> 0:02:37.000 to follow along, like to look at mock drafts like 0:02:37.040 --> 0:02:40.200 the enter pools, because there is that college football tie 0:02:40.200 --> 0:02:43.120 in some of our favorite players moving on getting to 0:02:43.160 --> 0:02:45.480 that next level. One of the questions I know we're 0:02:45.480 --> 0:02:47.960 going to ask him that you have for Brandon is 0:02:48.480 --> 0:02:51.000 who you're rooting for? Like, this is a fan as 0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:54.320 somebody who's rated these guys out, Who are you rooting 0:02:54.320 --> 0:02:56.400 He's been around them, he's been around them, all of them. 0:02:56.400 --> 0:02:59.240 Who are you rooting for just on a personal human 0:02:59.360 --> 0:03:02.640 level to succeed at the next level more so than 0:03:02.680 --> 0:03:05.959 maybe some others given your affiliation. So yeah, he definitely 0:03:06.000 --> 0:03:09.079 brings a unique insight that I don't think we've ever 0:03:09.120 --> 0:03:11.680 fully tapped into in all the years that we've been 0:03:11.720 --> 0:03:13.880 doing this show. We're going to bring him on here 0:03:13.919 --> 0:03:16.680 momentarily to talk about some of these prospects and the 0:03:16.800 --> 0:03:19.720 NFL Draft. Don't forget follow along on social media if 0:03:19.720 --> 0:03:22.680 you haven't already, follow along the solid verbal on your 0:03:22.720 --> 0:03:28.200 podcasting app of choice and wink wink, nudge nudge going 0:03:28.240 --> 0:03:31.200 out to verbalers dot com. That is our Patreon. That's 0:03:31.200 --> 0:03:34.400 why we're doing some bonus stuff. We've got an off 0:03:34.600 --> 0:03:39.160 topic Q and a show coming up pretty soon. I 0:03:39.200 --> 0:03:41.320 have to check the calendar exactly when that is. But 0:03:42.000 --> 0:03:45.240 that has been a big hit thus far in this 0:03:45.320 --> 0:03:47.640 year off season, some of those off topic shows that 0:03:47.640 --> 0:03:50.360 we've done. Always excited to do the next one with you. 0:03:50.360 --> 0:03:53.240 Because we had talked about doing kids sports movies from 0:03:53.280 --> 0:03:57.480 the nineties. Is that a preference? Or is kids game 0:03:57.560 --> 0:04:01.720 shows from the nineties? Oh like Nickelodeon, nick Arcade and 0:04:01.880 --> 0:04:05.200 Legend Temple. I you know what, I desperately you can 0:04:05.280 --> 0:04:06.440 make an executive decision here. 0:04:06.440 --> 0:04:06.840 I don't know. 0:04:06.920 --> 0:04:07.200 I want to. 0:04:07.200 --> 0:04:09.160 I want to take it in from the verbowler at 0:04:09.200 --> 0:04:11.440 soliverable at gmail dot com, reach out in social or 0:04:11.760 --> 0:04:14.960 through Patreon. I desperately wanted to go on where in 0:04:14.960 --> 0:04:19.200 the world is Carmen san Diego? Desperately desperately that show 0:04:19.279 --> 0:04:22.760 so much desperately, and I can speak to it first person. 0:04:23.240 --> 0:04:24.280 Going on a game show as. 0:04:24.160 --> 0:04:26.320 A kid, So a couple game shows as a kid too, 0:04:26.680 --> 0:04:31.919 as a legitimate kid. Yeah, legitimate kid, right, okay, legitimate kid. 0:04:32.160 --> 0:04:35.560 Brandon Hoffman, National recruiting editor from twenty four to seven, 0:04:35.640 --> 0:04:39.760 Sports stopping on by. Let's have a listen, all right, 0:04:39.839 --> 0:04:43.119 Dan joining us Now we have them on a couple 0:04:43.160 --> 0:04:43.760 times a year. 0:04:44.200 --> 0:04:48.839 Frankly, it's not enough. It's our friend, Brandan Hoffman from 0:04:49.120 --> 0:04:51.240 twenty four to seven and tour a high school time 0:04:51.440 --> 0:04:55.720 tour a high school. Usually we bring you on, Brandon 0:04:55.760 --> 0:05:00.240 to talk about all things recruiting. This show is isn't 0:05:00.320 --> 0:05:03.320 too far of a departure from that. But obviously with 0:05:03.360 --> 0:05:05.520 the NFL Draft coming up, there are a lot of 0:05:05.640 --> 0:05:08.400 names that you see in your mock drafts, some guys 0:05:08.400 --> 0:05:11.200 that maybe you aren't familiar with. And Dan and I 0:05:11.240 --> 0:05:14.120 had this concept, like, what were some of these guys 0:05:14.279 --> 0:05:17.279 like in high school, you know, before they were stars? 0:05:17.320 --> 0:05:22.479 What kind of I don't know, foreshadowing is out there. 0:05:22.520 --> 0:05:25.279 Maybe that you saw that some of the others out 0:05:25.279 --> 0:05:27.839 there are doing mock drafts didn't have access to so 0:05:27.880 --> 0:05:30.400 we thought we'd bring you on here again. The month 0:05:30.400 --> 0:05:33.719 of April is like all about the NFL mock drafts, 0:05:33.760 --> 0:05:36.320 and clearly there's a tie in with college football there 0:05:36.360 --> 0:05:38.640 as well. So we're excited to talk with you. How 0:05:38.640 --> 0:05:40.840 are you though, before we get any further, what are 0:05:40.839 --> 0:05:44.440 you doing with yourself in this yere early part of April. 0:05:45.920 --> 0:05:48.120 You know, it's a unique kind of year for me, 0:05:48.160 --> 0:05:50.560 as it is in a normal spring, there's a lot 0:05:50.600 --> 0:05:53.240 of camps, seven on seven tournaments, showcases to yodu, but 0:05:53.279 --> 0:05:55.559 now I get the addeds onus of having high school 0:05:55.560 --> 0:05:58.880 football games up and around the West Coast in California 0:05:58.880 --> 0:06:01.840 and Oregon and Washington in actual seasons going on. So 0:06:02.160 --> 0:06:04.800 I've had about three weekends or I've went to three 0:06:04.880 --> 0:06:07.440 or four one weekend with the five high school games 0:06:07.480 --> 0:06:11.120 over the span of three days, all while sandwiching in 0:06:11.240 --> 0:06:14.279 a Arizona for the underarmer camp. So it's kind of 0:06:14.279 --> 0:06:17.159 that unique blend of you know, the fall and the 0:06:17.200 --> 0:06:19.200 spring all happening at once. 0:06:19.279 --> 0:06:21.120 But hey, it's good. I waited a long time to 0:06:21.120 --> 0:06:23.839 watch high sea football and I'm finally geting that opportunity 0:06:23.880 --> 0:06:24.240 to do it. 0:06:24.520 --> 0:06:26.920 So one thing I wanted to always ask you as 0:06:26.960 --> 0:06:31.360 it relates to NFL mock drafts. Do people consult with 0:06:31.400 --> 0:06:35.800 you before putting their round by round things together? Or 0:06:36.120 --> 0:06:38.719 that's my point exactly, But I'm wondering, like to what 0:06:38.880 --> 0:06:41.360 end do people hit you up and be like, yo, Brandon, 0:06:41.560 --> 0:06:44.680 what do we know about this guy? 0:06:45.160 --> 0:06:47.679 To be completely frank with you, I will have talked 0:06:47.680 --> 0:06:54.120 to a number of NFL agents and mostly regional scouts, 0:06:54.160 --> 0:06:56.080 not necessarily the director of scouting, but a guy who 0:06:56.120 --> 0:06:59.200 may be the area scout for you know, an AFC 0:06:59.360 --> 0:07:01.920 Central team might reach out to me, or an area 0:07:01.920 --> 0:07:04.400 scout for an NFC team might reach out to me, 0:07:04.560 --> 0:07:07.760 and mostly just learn about the player that they're looking 0:07:07.839 --> 0:07:11.160 for and what his background was like as a high 0:07:11.200 --> 0:07:13.880 school player, what was his you know what was not 0:07:13.960 --> 0:07:16.360 his charge? But like what was the company he kept? 0:07:16.440 --> 0:07:18.880 You know who? What did his high school coaches think? 0:07:18.960 --> 0:07:20.600 What did you think him as a high schooler? What 0:07:20.640 --> 0:07:23.760 were the people that were around him? Like? And I 0:07:23.760 --> 0:07:27.160 mean when people say that NFL front offices do their 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:32.520 homework on potential drafts draft they're lying. I mean it 0:07:32.640 --> 0:07:35.120 is if you're going to call a slappy like me 0:07:35.240 --> 0:07:38.240 who hasn't deublet some of these guys in five six years. 0:07:38.480 --> 0:07:40.560 You know, they really do want to make sure that 0:07:40.720 --> 0:07:44.720 no stone is left unturned. And I'll talk to another 0:07:44.760 --> 0:07:46.480 of them after a pro day. You know, there's been 0:07:46.480 --> 0:07:48.640 a couple of proteins I've gone to in years past 0:07:48.800 --> 0:07:50.920 and I'll have an area of Scots constany and say, hey, 0:07:50.960 --> 0:07:52.480 here's I never get be called after. I want to 0:07:52.480 --> 0:07:54.520 talk about those sort of guys, plus the four guys 0:07:54.840 --> 0:07:57.600 at this school. So it happens all the time, but 0:07:57.640 --> 0:08:00.280 it's mostly just kind of a union before where they 0:08:00.280 --> 0:08:01.280 became a college process. 0:08:01.280 --> 0:08:03.120 What'd you think of them then? Well, you know, how 0:08:03.160 --> 0:08:04.280 were their parents. 0:08:03.880 --> 0:08:07.920 How were their coaches, how were their trainers? Blah blah blah, 0:08:08.320 --> 0:08:11.040 Just to give them any kind of insight that they 0:08:11.120 --> 0:08:13.480 think they can take back to the war room and 0:08:13.600 --> 0:08:14.600 make the right pickoff. 0:08:15.200 --> 0:08:18.760 The follow up question then, is based on that advice 0:08:18.800 --> 0:08:21.760 that you've given out in the past, as you've seen 0:08:21.840 --> 0:08:24.280 some of these guys go on into the league and 0:08:24.360 --> 0:08:27.040 try to make their mark. How accurate do you feel 0:08:27.080 --> 0:08:27.960 your advice has been. 0:08:29.440 --> 0:08:31.160 I see my advice is always accurate. 0:08:31.200 --> 0:08:33.240 The NFL team it up all the time. 0:08:33.720 --> 0:08:35.760 Correct, good answer, good answer. 0:08:36.240 --> 0:08:38.520 Thank you, thank you. But you know, but I will 0:08:38.559 --> 0:08:41.000 say that it is the one time of year where 0:08:41.080 --> 0:08:43.640 when people say stars don't matter and this and that, 0:08:43.840 --> 0:08:45.600 and you know, this guy was a two star at 0:08:45.600 --> 0:08:48.240 every lect. So the past progressive tweets about, oh well. 0:08:48.200 --> 0:08:49.400 JJ Watt was a two star warll. 0:08:49.520 --> 0:08:52.040 Jj Watt was also a walk on and one hundred 0:08:52.080 --> 0:08:53.800 and fifteen schools missed out on him when he was 0:08:53.800 --> 0:08:56.280 a high schooler. And the same thing with Aaron Rodgers. 0:08:56.720 --> 0:08:59.000 General managers screw up the NFL dress all the time. 0:08:59.000 --> 0:09:01.040 I mean, I'm a Cleveland Browns. I watched it happen 0:09:01.080 --> 0:09:05.360 for about thirty seven straight years. And it's amazing how 0:09:05.800 --> 0:09:07.920 the mons draft analysts can get a free pass, but 0:09:08.080 --> 0:09:11.880 the folks that are in charge of stars and ratings don't. 0:09:12.120 --> 0:09:15.640 When NFL games are screwing this thing up. Some of 0:09:15.720 --> 0:09:17.880 these NFL games can screw up a glass of water. 0:09:18.080 --> 0:09:21.320 And so it's fascinating that all the intel that they have, 0:09:21.480 --> 0:09:23.880 all the information they have, they still can make bad 0:09:23.920 --> 0:09:25.640 decisions in bad and drafting. 0:09:26.360 --> 0:09:28.440 One of the fascinating things because we do get those stories. 0:09:28.480 --> 0:09:31.559 We do get those stories where you know, JJ Watt 0:09:31.600 --> 0:09:34.040 was a two star tight end at Central Michigan and 0:09:34.080 --> 0:09:35.880 you know, became what he became at Wisconsin when he 0:09:35.920 --> 0:09:39.680 moved over to defense. And usually there's context to why 0:09:40.120 --> 0:09:42.600 a recruit is rated the way they are be it 0:09:42.720 --> 0:09:46.040 like they have a very late weight gain, or they 0:09:46.040 --> 0:09:49.199 shoot up their growth spurt, happened super late in high 0:09:49.240 --> 0:09:52.040 school or junior college, or they're hurt this year. 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:52.560 What is the. 0:09:53.720 --> 0:09:57.120 Percentage of time that you would say you and the 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:01.520 twenty four to seven whatever ESPN rival community just full on, 0:10:01.800 --> 0:10:04.520 flat out miss on a guy. And how much of 0:10:04.559 --> 0:10:06.920 it it is like circumstantial, Like we didn't think he 0:10:06.920 --> 0:10:09.640 would qualify. He was five seven as a junior, and 0:10:09.679 --> 0:10:11.320 then he was six too as a senior. Like how 0:10:11.400 --> 0:10:15.160 much is it? How much is explained away with easy context. 0:10:15.480 --> 0:10:17.839 I mean, I would say that more and more, we're 0:10:17.880 --> 0:10:21.280 becoming much more accurate. We're having much better hits and 0:10:21.360 --> 0:10:24.640 what we're seeing as high schoolers and then projecting three 0:10:24.720 --> 0:10:26.880 or four years down the line. But you're gonna have 0:10:26.960 --> 0:10:30.240 guys that through the cracks. You're gonna have situations, you know, 0:10:30.280 --> 0:10:32.319 and I've talked about this one over the last year. 0:10:32.320 --> 0:10:34.360 You know, Justin Herbert is a great example. 0:10:34.679 --> 0:10:36.960 You know, when I was on lead his senior year 0:10:36.960 --> 0:10:39.920 in high school, dealing with my daughter's illness, So I 0:10:39.960 --> 0:10:40.440 never got. 0:10:40.280 --> 0:10:41.720 To see him play his senior year. 0:10:41.760 --> 0:10:44.520 And you know, some of the biggest ls that I 0:10:44.679 --> 0:10:49.960 took in rankings happened in that twenty and sixteen recruiting 0:10:50.000 --> 0:10:53.720 class with Taylor rep with Justin Herbert, with you know, 0:10:53.760 --> 0:10:57.760 guys like Evan Weaver, and you know, there's situations like that, 0:10:58.120 --> 0:11:00.000 you just don't get eyes on these guys. You don't 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:02.320 see him at anyth In the case of Herbert, you know, 0:11:02.360 --> 0:11:04.000 he broke his leadi as a junior, he didn't do 0:11:04.080 --> 0:11:06.439 a lot of camps, he didn't do seven on seven, 0:11:06.520 --> 0:11:08.200 So it was just kind of one of those hues, 0:11:08.240 --> 0:11:10.360 out of side, out of mind, and then nobody had 0:11:10.400 --> 0:11:13.120 a chance to see him play his senior year at 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:16.000 Sheldon High School. And you know, four years later he 0:11:16.080 --> 0:11:18.319 ends up a top five pick and an NFL Rookie 0:11:18.360 --> 0:11:20.760 of the Year and all anybody wanted to talk about 0:11:20.760 --> 0:11:21.960 out West that year. 0:11:22.080 --> 0:11:22.839 Was Jacob Meson. 0:11:23.240 --> 0:11:27.360 So there are still cases like that through the cracks 0:11:27.360 --> 0:11:30.160 and they needing the big school will land guys that 0:11:30.320 --> 0:11:32.680 nobody's trying to do, or they'll land a guy like 0:11:32.679 --> 0:11:35.640 a Matt Jones, who was essentially a throw in, a 0:11:35.679 --> 0:11:38.360 guy who's bet on himself realizing hey, I'm going there 0:11:38.400 --> 0:11:40.800 at the same time too is and I could go 0:11:40.880 --> 0:11:43.400 to Kentucky and everything will be great. And you still 0:11:43.440 --> 0:11:44.839 just think the kid's going to see the field and 0:11:44.880 --> 0:11:46.960 now he's a potential first round pick. I mean even 0:11:47.000 --> 0:11:50.240 the big schools have those guys that kind of surprise everybody, 0:11:50.320 --> 0:11:51.800 including the school that landed him. 0:11:53.000 --> 0:11:56.160 So who are the big crack slippers for lack of 0:11:56.240 --> 0:11:58.559 a better term, and this year's draft, when you look 0:11:58.559 --> 0:12:00.760 at the guy who's projects to go first night or 0:12:00.800 --> 0:12:03.160 the first couple of days, who are those guys where 0:12:03.200 --> 0:12:06.240 you're like, not nobody could see this coming because a 0:12:06.280 --> 0:12:09.040 college coach and a college program or programs obviously saw 0:12:09.080 --> 0:12:12.280 something coming, saw some sort of glimmer. But who who 0:12:12.440 --> 0:12:17.160 seems to be the furthest away from the recruiting community's 0:12:17.240 --> 0:12:20.840 radar that is now considered a blue chip NFL prospect. 0:12:21.800 --> 0:12:25.760 I mean Jack Wilson, there's probably no better player here, 0:12:25.840 --> 0:12:28.320 and he can make a case too that you know, 0:12:28.360 --> 0:12:31.520 there's a guy like Trey Lance, who I think is 0:12:31.640 --> 0:12:35.360 now probably cemented the fact that every North Dakota State 0:12:35.440 --> 0:12:39.560 quarterback moving forward will end up being rated highly because 0:12:39.600 --> 0:12:43.280 of him, because of uh oh gosh, what's our guy 0:12:43.320 --> 0:12:44.880 in Philadelphia's. 0:12:44.200 --> 0:12:46.520 Name, Carson Wentz Carson. 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:50.640 Yeah, yes, so there may be you know, a closer 0:12:50.640 --> 0:12:52.880 love given in North Dakota State quarterback. But you know 0:12:52.880 --> 0:12:55.760 it's not like Jack Wilson was a No Namer at 0:12:55.800 --> 0:12:58.280 the time. He was committed to Boise State and he 0:12:58.400 --> 0:13:00.920 ended up putting the BYU late wanted to go to Utah, 0:13:01.000 --> 0:13:03.199 and I mean think about Utah for a second. His dad, mom, 0:13:03.280 --> 0:13:05.920 welcomes to Utah, the kid Juna playing for Utah, and 0:13:06.080 --> 0:13:09.319 Utah would all in on Jack Tuttle. Meanwhile, Zach Wilson 0:13:09.400 --> 0:13:12.679 ends up at Boise State, cal decides to bring in 0:13:12.760 --> 0:13:15.040 jay Z Shroud over him, and Jake Shout ends up 0:13:15.080 --> 0:13:18.120 decommitting going to test. In fact, I ran into Zach 0:13:18.160 --> 0:13:20.599 Wilson's dad last weekend at the under Our camp in 0:13:20.640 --> 0:13:23.199 Phoenix and we had a good lass. And by saying we, 0:13:23.360 --> 0:13:25.600 I mean he had a good laugh at how Zach's 0:13:25.600 --> 0:13:29.480 recruitment was so boring early on and how it's all 0:13:29.520 --> 0:13:31.400 turned out. It was the day after his pro day 0:13:31.720 --> 0:13:34.760 and you know he's on thirds of Cal basically saying, hey, 0:13:34.800 --> 0:13:36.520 we got a quarterback, you don't need to ring the 0:13:36.520 --> 0:13:39.880 Camp Boise skate, then essentially driving to Boise to try 0:13:39.920 --> 0:13:43.880 to get seen by the coaches, and then BYU gives 0:13:43.960 --> 0:13:46.720 a late offer to Zach Wilson and the rest is history. 0:13:46.960 --> 0:13:49.200 You know, he was a mid the solid three star 0:13:49.320 --> 0:13:51.839 tip guy. Wasn't the biggest guy, wasn't the biggest arm 0:13:52.320 --> 0:13:55.600 and I would say that because of what Zach Wilson 0:13:55.679 --> 0:13:58.240 did at BYU. And then you look at the season 0:13:58.280 --> 0:14:00.360 that Jackson Dark had at the same Eyes school at 0:14:00.360 --> 0:14:03.800 Corner Canyon up in draper Uta, who again, he too 0:14:03.920 --> 0:14:06.040 was a late bloomer, and he had the benefit of 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:08.040 having a senior season when a lot of the West 0:14:08.040 --> 0:14:11.080 Coast teams weren't. He was the hottest quarterback recruit in 0:14:11.120 --> 0:14:13.120 the country by the fall, and part of that was 0:14:13.160 --> 0:14:16.400 because of Look what Zach Wilson did at YU. So 0:14:16.880 --> 0:14:18.960 there's nobody in this question. You look at the Trevor 0:14:19.040 --> 0:14:22.120 Lawrence as, the Jamar Chases, the Canay Seols, the Justin Fields, 0:14:22.120 --> 0:14:25.160 Michael Parsons, all those guys were consensus top ten, top 0:14:25.160 --> 0:14:28.440 fifteen all American type guys. And then Zach Wilson's kind 0:14:28.440 --> 0:14:29.880 of the old Destiny Street. You know, one of these 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:30.880 guys is not like the other. 0:14:32.520 --> 0:14:34.920 One of the things are maybe the thing that makes 0:14:35.280 --> 0:14:38.760 quarterback or projecting quarterback success as a high schooler to 0:14:38.800 --> 0:14:41.480 college and then college to the pros is you only 0:14:41.560 --> 0:14:43.720 have one quarterback on the field at a time. So 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:46.280 that means there's only opportunity for so many guys to 0:14:46.360 --> 0:14:49.480 prove themselves and to prove themselves in the right situation 0:14:49.600 --> 0:14:51.640 and to have injury luck and to you know, have 0:14:52.040 --> 0:14:55.080 receiver injury luck, offensive line injury luck, a coordinator sticking 0:14:55.120 --> 0:14:57.520 around or having the right coordinator. There's so many different 0:14:57.520 --> 0:15:00.720 factors that go into the cocktail of quarterback success, and 0:15:00.760 --> 0:15:04.280 so it's it's understandable why that position is so difficult 0:15:04.320 --> 0:15:09.320 to evaluate. What is the next most difficult position? I mean, 0:15:09.440 --> 0:15:12.080 you see you mentioned Pine Sewel, he was a clear 0:15:12.200 --> 0:15:15.360 high blue chip, elite recruit. And then it's Rashaun Slater 0:15:15.440 --> 0:15:18.800 at Northwestern, who I don't think anybody saw coming when 0:15:18.800 --> 0:15:20.320 you look at his offer list in the schools that 0:15:20.360 --> 0:15:23.120 he was down to was Northwestern in Illinois and Kansas 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:26.560 and some G five schools. Is it offensive line? Is 0:15:26.600 --> 0:15:29.480 there a different position that's hard that's just as hard 0:15:29.480 --> 0:15:32.360 to project his quarterback. What position group stands out as 0:15:32.400 --> 0:15:34.360 just being kind of a crap shoot? 0:15:35.280 --> 0:15:37.200 Yeah, I mean I would say with that question, it's 0:15:37.240 --> 0:15:40.040 offensive line, and it always has it, because where the 0:15:40.160 --> 0:15:43.240 danger starts to lie is that you see a guy 0:15:43.600 --> 0:15:47.960 who is dominant in high school and dominant maybe in college, 0:15:48.000 --> 0:15:51.720 but then doesn't necessarily have the projectable traits to the NFL. 0:15:51.960 --> 0:15:53.640 Then the flip said, you might see a guy who's 0:15:53.680 --> 0:15:56.880 two forty playing left tackle out of necessity for his 0:15:56.920 --> 0:15:58.520 high school team. He gets to college and now he's 0:15:58.520 --> 0:16:01.440 playing at two sixty to seventy eighty. Then by the 0:16:01.440 --> 0:16:03.560 time the carline comes around, he's two ninety, but he's 0:16:03.600 --> 0:16:05.480 still moving like the two hundred and forty times tight 0:16:05.560 --> 0:16:05.840 end he. 0:16:05.840 --> 0:16:06.240 Used to be. 0:16:06.880 --> 0:16:10.600 There's just so much development. It's funny, though, because if 0:16:10.640 --> 0:16:13.320 I look back at someone like my best hit, they 0:16:13.360 --> 0:16:16.640 were offensive linement, and I look back my biggest Smiths 0:16:16.720 --> 0:16:18.920 ever was a running back, and all three of those 0:16:18.920 --> 0:16:20.600 guys in the same draft class are in the same 0:16:20.600 --> 0:16:23.440 recruiting boss. Who was yere GARYL. Scott number one out 0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:26.120 West and I actually had the lowest of any recruiting site, 0:16:26.200 --> 0:16:28.080 but he was another one running back, but then two 0:16:28.080 --> 0:16:30.920 and three went Tyron Smith and Nat will who both 0:16:31.040 --> 0:16:33.560 ended up being the first half of picks and consecutive drafts. 0:16:33.960 --> 0:16:36.880 So there's easy to kind of maybe see the elite guys, 0:16:36.920 --> 0:16:39.240 but you know, you have in. 0:16:39.200 --> 0:16:42.320 Recent years there's been this real shift. 0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:43.920 Toward finding the guys that are a little bit on 0:16:43.960 --> 0:16:47.000 the center side as high schoolers that maybe aren't the 0:16:47.680 --> 0:16:50.720 no doubt, no brainers the day they get on campus, 0:16:50.920 --> 0:16:53.320 they developed into that, and you know, you look at it, 0:16:53.480 --> 0:16:55.840 it's like a Mitch Hyatt. Mitch Higat started with four years. 0:16:55.840 --> 0:16:58.640 It comes in on two national championship teams and three 0:16:58.680 --> 0:17:01.560 that played a national championship games and probably some of 0:17:01.600 --> 0:17:04.760 the best offenses of the last decade and didn't get drafted. 0:17:05.119 --> 0:17:07.760 And you know, he was the elite offensive lineman coming 0:17:07.800 --> 0:17:09.800 out of high school. But then you see that there's 0:17:09.840 --> 0:17:11.760 the other guys, like those Seawan Platers that kind of 0:17:11.800 --> 0:17:14.320 just develop and they put on the good weight. And 0:17:14.359 --> 0:17:15.359 there's been some some. 0:17:15.400 --> 0:17:17.560 Analytics done over the last few years. 0:17:17.760 --> 0:17:19.760 I think there's a four year gap in the NFL 0:17:19.880 --> 0:17:23.280 draft where not one offensive lineman was drafted in the 0:17:23.320 --> 0:17:26.440 first round who weighs over three hundred pounds as a 0:17:26.520 --> 0:17:29.320 high schooler, and I mean you think about offensive lineman. 0:17:29.440 --> 0:17:32.000 You look at the three hundred plus pounders in high school, 0:17:32.000 --> 0:17:33.760 they look like they got the bodies that are ready 0:17:33.760 --> 0:17:37.520 to withstand the collegiate grind. And now you're seeing this 0:17:37.600 --> 0:17:41.679 shift and more and more players are, you know, center 0:17:42.040 --> 0:17:45.360 as high schoolers, and coaches want to put the good 0:17:45.400 --> 0:17:48.040 weight on them, they want to develop them in the 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:50.640 size that they want. Then you've got a guy that today, Sewell, 0:17:50.640 --> 0:17:53.400 who's the opposite. It took Organ taking the bad weight 0:17:53.440 --> 0:17:56.360 off of him and now he's a potential top two, 0:17:56.440 --> 0:17:57.080 top three pick. 0:17:59.240 --> 0:18:01.479 So who are some names when you look back at 0:18:01.480 --> 0:18:05.440 their recruitment that you think it was a particularly fascinating 0:18:06.600 --> 0:18:10.320 trajectory that they had as recruits and as college players 0:18:10.480 --> 0:18:13.919 now seeing the sort of end of their evaluation period 0:18:13.920 --> 0:18:16.320 as NFL draft prospects. What are the names that stand 0:18:16.320 --> 0:18:19.560 out that you'll always remember their recruitment and story. 0:18:20.720 --> 0:18:22.800 Yeah, I mean, you know, there's there's a couple of guys. 0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:25.199 I'm gonna go kind of West Coast as strong on this, 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:28.440 but it makes sense. One was whyatt David And part 0:18:28.480 --> 0:18:31.679 of that was because you know why it's older brother, David, 0:18:31.760 --> 0:18:35.600 played at Peninsular Palis Bridi's high school, was lightly recruited, 0:18:35.920 --> 0:18:38.480 played at Washington State, was at cal and I remember 0:18:38.560 --> 0:18:40.400 talking to his dad and dad said, hey, you've always 0:18:40.440 --> 0:18:41.960 been so helpful. There's anything you can you know, do 0:18:41.960 --> 0:18:44.160 you ever need for me let me know? I said, well, 0:18:44.280 --> 0:18:46.760 I already know the answer this question. But asked, were 0:18:46.800 --> 0:18:48.120 you Alvin Max in the program? 0:18:48.359 --> 0:18:49.879 And he said, yeah, I used to do a. 0:18:49.880 --> 0:18:52.720 Little action back in the day. And like he was 0:18:52.760 --> 0:18:55.919 the greatest college football player in the history of the 0:18:56.000 --> 0:18:58.960 cinema by far, Like you will never find a more 0:18:59.000 --> 0:19:02.400