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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,

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Speaker 2: my name is Nola. They call me Ben.

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Speaker 3: We're joined with our guest producer, Ben the outlaw Hackett.

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Speaker 3: Most importantly, you are you. You are here. That makes

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Speaker 3: this the stuff they don't want you to know. Guys,

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Speaker 3: I guess this is sort of our real estate episode

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Speaker 3: in a very dark way.

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Speaker 4: Oh fine, it's sounds six.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's our urban planning episode.

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Speaker 4: Let's flip some properties, y'all.

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Speaker 3: Oh gosh, yeah, you know, before we get started. Have

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Speaker 3: you guys ever speculated on that. I don't think we've

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Speaker 3: ever talked about it, but if you ever wanted to

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Speaker 3: be a house slipper.

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Speaker 4: My girlfriend rely likes those shows, though I kind of

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Speaker 4: can't stand them. Frankly, Yeah, it's kind of weird energy.

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Speaker 4: I don't know what it is.

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Speaker 3: Weird energy is a good way to say it.

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Speaker 2: You have to have a certain amount of money in

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Speaker 2: standing to get the first one, right. Then once you

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Speaker 2: get that one, sure you can make some repairs, sell it,

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Speaker 2: get another one. But when you're doing it with like

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Speaker 2: ten twenty one hundred houses at a time, probably not

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Speaker 2: as an individual, right, But that's one of these giant

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Speaker 2: investment companies. We've talked about it just it verges on

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Speaker 2: an ick factor that I am very much not comfortable.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it sort of starts to get into slumlord territory

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Speaker 4: after a certain point, right.

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Speaker 3: Very quickly. Yeah, and shout out to I'm not going

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Speaker 3: to name him here, but shout out to one of

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Speaker 3: my old favorite landlords who was a self professed slum lord,

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Speaker 3: and he was like, a lot of people aren't going

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Speaker 3: to be honest with you about that, Ben, I run slums. Hell, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: that's what I do.

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Speaker 4: I never met a slum I didn't like.

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Speaker 2: Something we'd never well, I mean, I guess we've mentioned

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Speaker 2: it before, but we don't talk very much about the

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Speaker 2: massive corporations that have investments in real estate, both commercial

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Speaker 2: and residential, and how those companies also have like five

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Speaker 2: percent seven percent stakes in companies that manufacture cereal and

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Speaker 2: other foods like that and own restaurants and chains, and

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Speaker 2: it's all one big it becomes one big ownership thing.

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Speaker 2: And I think that's what that's what's at the heart

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Speaker 2: of this episode, the concept of ownership.

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Speaker 3: Yes, indeed nailed it and shout out to Blackrock in

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Speaker 3: the least polite way possible.

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Speaker 4: For sure, Halfaway and all these other we're like shouting

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Speaker 4: at Blackrock. There we go.

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Speaker 3: And also, of course, as we mentioned in previous episodes

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Speaker 3: with this, with these institutional investors are a big part

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Speaker 3: of the drive to get people working back in offices.

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Speaker 3: That's a big part of their calculus. And then also

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Speaker 3: there are algorithms now that automate the pricing of things

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Speaker 3: and it becomes a profit maximization thing, so it's going

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Speaker 3: to have terrible results down the line.

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Speaker 2: But in offices that somebody at some point walked onto

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Speaker 2: a piece of land, put a flag in the ground

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Speaker 2: literally and said this mine.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, let's go, let's get to it land.

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Speaker 4: I think it came up briefly on a previous episode,

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Speaker 4: just this idea of how it's so easy to take

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Speaker 4: for granted, the idea that land. You know, people can't

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Speaker 4: just walk up on your land anymore and say, hey,

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Speaker 4: you got to go, this is mine now, I mean,

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Speaker 4: but at the same time, you know, there is a

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Speaker 4: tenuousness to the nature of like owning property, and it's

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Speaker 4: all just your one document or misprint away from being

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Speaker 4: dispossessed of your land. You know, it's all kind of

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Speaker 4: a bit of an illusion of security. So maybe I

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Speaker 4: take back my whole thing where it's like, oh, we're

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Speaker 4: all good now, we're past that.

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Speaker 3: I don't know. We're in kind of a despite all

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Speaker 3: the dangers, we're in kind of a halcyon era of

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Speaker 3: stability in that regard, you know.

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Speaker 2: And you have to be a citizen of a recognized

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Speaker 2: sovereign country.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yes you do. And well we'll get to this,

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Speaker 3: we'll get to micronations, we'll get to all kinds of things,

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Speaker 3: but let's start. Let's start here with the idea that

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Speaker 3: that we're we're hitting on the right to live on land,

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Speaker 3: to move through it, to possess that land or the

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Speaker 3: things found upon or under it, and to sell that stuff.

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Speaker 3: It's one of the primary concerns of all human civilizations.

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Speaker 3: And it's not just humans. A lot of animals are

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Speaker 3: very territorial. Territorial as well.

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Speaker 2: It's a to me, yeah, yeah, they don't have attorneys

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Speaker 2: and laws, right, well.

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Speaker 3: I can't wait.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a law thing. That's all it is. That's

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Speaker 2: a law thing.

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Speaker 4: Well, and that's what I was getting at the idea.

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Speaker 4: The tenuousness of it is that we have these structures,

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Speaker 4: these things built into society that we accept to be true,

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Speaker 4: that give us certain guarantees. But it's all just kind

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Speaker 4: of a concept at the end of the day. And

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Speaker 4: if you're gonna get strong armed by someone who's got

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Speaker 4: more legal firepower than you, then it's certainly possible.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And just like the stock market or the global economy,

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Speaker 3: it's a collective story humanity tells itself, and as long

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Speaker 3: as the majority of people believe in that story, then

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Speaker 3: the magic works. So we're talking today about this weird

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Speaker 3: idea in this very crowded world. Fellow conspiracy realist, you

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Speaker 3: may be surprised to find that there is still some

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Speaker 3: land out there on planet Earth that officially nobody wants.

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Speaker 3: Here are the facts. I mean, I love the point

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Speaker 3: you bring up. Know that right now, most borders are

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Speaker 3: pretty set like there are tons of border disputes all

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Speaker 3: over the world, but for most of human history, borders

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Speaker 3: were likely to shift back and forth. And this always happened,

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Speaker 3: especially if there wasn't a geographical barrier like a river

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Speaker 3: or an ocean or a mountain range.

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Speaker 4: You know. A couple of months ago, construction started on

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Speaker 4: this lot next to my property that it had like

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Speaker 4: a burned out house on it, and they tore the

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Speaker 4: house down. Now they're building something new. And I got

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Speaker 4: a knock on the door and it was my neighbor

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Speaker 4: or the guy that bought the property, and he goes, hey,

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Speaker 4: this is kind of awkward, but looks like your fence

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Speaker 4: line is about ten feet Oh no, in the wrong place.

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Speaker 3: Oh boy.

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Speaker 4: And I'm like, I had a surveyor come out. He's like,

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Speaker 4: I know, it's a pain in the butt, but we

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Speaker 4: don't have to worry about it now. We'll deal with

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Speaker 4: it when the time is right. But in my mind,

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Speaker 4: I'm like, I do I have to hire a counter

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Speaker 4: surveyor to prove that this guy's telling the truth. And

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Speaker 4: I did.

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Speaker 2: It's like a weird micro border, dude, I don't want

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Speaker 2: to tell somebody that we work with. We all respect

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Speaker 2: a lot. Just dealt with this in Massachusetts and it

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Speaker 2: was really bad and it took a long time. No,

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Speaker 2: so just just be prepared or just it's it's a.

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Speaker 4: Weird democrawt, I'll move the thing. He said he'd paid

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Speaker 4: for the moving of the I'm not worried about it

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Speaker 4: as long as it's accurate, you know. I just like

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Speaker 4: I said, It's just it's just another little nuisance that

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Speaker 4: I have to deal with to hire somebody to confirm

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Speaker 4: what this guy's saying is true.

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Speaker 2: Well, let's shout out our Venezuela Giana episode, right, because

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Speaker 2: that's exactly what we're talking about here. And did you

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Speaker 2: guys see the news Exon Mobile has decided to go

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Speaker 2: ahead and move forward with drilling explorations right on that area,

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Speaker 2: like off the coast of that area, which is again

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Speaker 2: it all ties back into this episode.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, we kind of set it up with Venezuela

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Speaker 3: and Guiana, and Exon has some very important friends in

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Speaker 3: the US military industrial complex, so they gave they pretty

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Speaker 3: much gave Venezuela a f a FO. Notice, we'll trying

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Speaker 3: to keep us a family show on this one. But

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Speaker 3: since we have company over since Ben's.

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Speaker 5: Here uation, yes, sir, And it's weird because too if

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Speaker 5: for anybody speaking of going to the northeast map for

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Speaker 5: anybody who is uh living or traveling near the US

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Speaker 5: Canadian border, especially in rural areas.

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Speaker 3: You'll see the way that borders used to be for

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Speaker 3: most of human history. There's a there's a gradient, there's

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Speaker 3: a gradual change in culture. Like people who live on

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Speaker 3: the US side of the of the Canadian border often

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Speaker 3: they we saw this in our Maple Syrup episode. They

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Speaker 3: work in Canada. So every day they get up they

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Speaker 3: are an international traveler. They pass by like a little

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Speaker 3: equivalent of a phone booth, and then some very nice

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Speaker 3: customs officers like oh, hey Jerry, or hey Aaron or whatever,

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Speaker 3: and then they drive.

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Speaker 2: Back, especially as you get towards the Pacific, the Pacific Northwest,

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Speaker 2: My gosh, that's a quagmire of property rights issues and

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Speaker 2: like who gets to claim land out there, and which

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Speaker 2: sovereign country that once planted a flag now gets to

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Speaker 2: sell it to the United States.

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Speaker 3: And shout out to the dispossessed First Nations and Native

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Speaker 3: American communities who struggle today in the court system to

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Speaker 3: regain the land that was stolen from them under manifest destiny.

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Speaker 3: I mean back in the day. It might surprise a

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Speaker 3: lot of us to learn how recent modern borders are.

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Speaker 3: As more and more people populated the world, like, here's

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Speaker 3: how it used to work. You would travel probably by foot,

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Speaker 3: maybe on some animal, and the languages would start to

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Speaker 3: get mixed up. Different currencies would start to be accepted,

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Speaker 3: think of like the Silk Road. And then all of

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Speaker 3: a sudden, at some point that is not clearly demarcated,

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Speaker 3: you have left ancient land one. Now you're an ancient

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Speaker 3: land two. And it's there's not really unless there's a river,

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Speaker 3: unless there's a mountain or a desert, there's not a

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Speaker 3: way to have a hard border, which is what we

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Speaker 3: have today. The Roman Empire didn't even really fortify their

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Speaker 3: borders militarily. They were trading posts. They were there to

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Speaker 3: like make sure the taxes were paid. And if you

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Speaker 3: went to a place like England where there weren't a

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Speaker 3: ton of distinctive landmarks, that's where people built walls, like

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Speaker 3: Hadrian's Wall is where he said, okay, here, this is

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Speaker 3: going to be the spot.

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Speaker 4: Well, I mean, you know, there are certain elements in

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Speaker 4: modern politics that are all about bringing back walls. It's

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Speaker 4: like they think it's a surefire and history tested technology

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Speaker 4: and totally foolproof. Dare we say, impenetrable by something like

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Speaker 4: the common ladder.

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Speaker 3: Right, they haven't heard of the asymmetrical warfare called the ladder.

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Speaker 3: They're catching up with that one. But also, without getting

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Speaker 3: too political, I think a lot of people in the

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Speaker 3: US don't realize there have already been walls for a

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Speaker 3: long long time.

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Speaker 4: There was a big one in Berlin. I heard for

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Speaker 4: a long time.

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Speaker 3: I've got a little piece of it too. Yeah, yes, waits,

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Speaker 3: I didn't get one of the cool I'm sure that

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Speaker 3: was like a premium thing.

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Speaker 4: But they were getting wallchunk.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, they were getting traded all around when the wall fell.

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Speaker 3: It was kind of like how in the military they

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Speaker 3: hand people challenge coins and things like that. So you

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Speaker 3: got a little piece of wall. That was because capitalism

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Speaker 3: came in immediately when the wall fell, Like as soon

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Speaker 3: as the wall fell, a bunch of German people ran

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Speaker 3: up and grabbed little pieces of it and started selling

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Speaker 3: them on the streets side side hustle, gig economy. Right,

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Speaker 3: So most modern borders actually date back from just a

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Speaker 3: couple of centuries ago, like the modern versions of them,

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Speaker 3: and many only count their ages in decades. So to

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Speaker 3: the earlier point you made. As permanent as these things

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Speaker 3: may look, they're actually quite ephemeral. They have great capacity fluidity.

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Speaker 3: You know, borders blur, and even now borders are defined

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Speaker 3: as much by their disputes as they're agreed upon limits.

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Speaker 3: Right Like the hard borders that used to exist or

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Speaker 3: that still exist. A lot of those came from the

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Speaker 3: Cold War, the DMZ on the Korean Peninsula, Kashmir, the

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Speaker 3: Berlin Wall. Like you mentioned, we found a really cool

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Speaker 3: quote from a writer named Joshua Jelly Shapiro who talks

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Speaker 3: about borders writing for The New Yorker. As a matter

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Speaker 3: of fact, let's just summarize this and please read jelly

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Speaker 3: Shapiro's full article here. Joshua points out that these Cold

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Speaker 3: War scenarios are replicated with borders dividing countries who still have,

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Speaker 3: you know, the shared system of democracy. Their armies are

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Speaker 3: at peace, and they still really really want these borders,

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Speaker 3: Like look at the border between India Bangladesh, the way

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Speaker 3: that South Africa handles the Zimbabwe and border and I

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Speaker 3: didn't know this. In Hungary for a time, they lace

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Speaker 3: the potato fields with barriers to keep out refugees. And then,

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Speaker 3: like you mentioned, Noo, there's the cyclical US Mexico border panic,

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Speaker 3: which somehow seems to gain attention only during elections. Do

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Speaker 3: you guys notice that?

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Speaker 4: You know, I know, you're like a good poetry reference.

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Speaker 4: But Robert I didn't realize this until just now when

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Speaker 4: I was looking at up. But Robert Frost is actually

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Speaker 4: the originator of the line good fences make good neighbors

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Speaker 4: comes from a poem literally about mending a wall.

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Speaker 3: From something there is that doesn't love a wall.

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Speaker 4: That's right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, let's talk a little bit just about why governments

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Speaker 2: feel these borders are so important and why they feel

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Speaker 2: it's important to control the human beings migrating across a border.

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Speaker 2: And it goes back to law. Right, if you are

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Speaker 2: a citizen of a country, you are beholden through contract,

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Speaker 2: essentially to the laws of that country. If you're a

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Speaker 2: citizen of another and you enter into a new country,

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Speaker 2: you're not necessarily subject to laws in the same way. Often,

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Speaker 2: you know, the there would be an extradition process to

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Speaker 2: get you out of a country rather than charged with

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Speaker 2: a major crime or something if you if you were

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Speaker 2: to do it across the border. Right, So it's about.

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Speaker 4: Tidiness, right, It's sort of about like keeping things from

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Speaker 4: getting to messiuh, legally, I guess that's part of it.

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Speaker 2: But you're also not an economic battery for that country

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Speaker 2: that you're operating in in the form of taxes. Right,

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Speaker 2: So there's all there are, all of these legal reasons

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Speaker 2: and legal apparatus. Is the apparatus that are created to

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Speaker 2: make sure that the trafficking of humans across borders is controlled.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's resource extraction, I think is the primary,

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Speaker 3: the primary thing, and it's treating humans as a resource.

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Speaker 4: And I'm not really up on all of the minutia

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Speaker 4: of this, but I just got to wonder how something

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Speaker 4: like Brexit figures into this where exit you know, there

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Speaker 4: was all of this free movement, you know of United

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Speaker 4: Kingdom citizens throughout Europe. You know, bands that live there

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Speaker 4: could tour all throughout Spain and Amsterdam and all of

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Speaker 4: the countries that are connected, you know by rail, and

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Speaker 4: it was a very easy answer. And now with Brexit,

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Speaker 4: all that stuff's out the window and there's like basically

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Speaker 4: new borders that were like did not previously exist, even

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Speaker 4: though the UK is its own country.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, Brexit is interesting because it was talking with

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Speaker 3: some folks about it and the change was electric. It's

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Speaker 3: a Machavelian super move in the way that conspiracy was orchestrated.

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Speaker 3: The only people who support Brexit now are the very

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Speaker 3: wealthy who made a lot of money off of it

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Speaker 3: and then immediately relocated their assets to tax friendly.

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Speaker 4: Countries, which is so hypocritical because that's like the antithesis

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Speaker 4: of what the whole thing was supposed to be about.

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Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, well they manifested it. It works a lot

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Speaker 3: of people. Yeah, a lot of people who supported Brexit

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Speaker 3: didn't really know what they were getting into, so hoping

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Speaker 3: wishing them the best as the cost of living skyrockets and.

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Speaker 4: The but the argument was in some way to keep

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Speaker 4: that those economic batteries, you know, more benefiting the United

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Speaker 4: Kingdom rather than all of this free passage back and

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Speaker 4: forth throughout the other surrounding countries, right right.

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Speaker 3: The idea was that by being a member of the EU,

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Speaker 3: you are sacrificing your sovereignty as a country. And they

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Speaker 3: were feeling like, hey, we're an independent country. We don't

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Speaker 3: want to be treated like a state of a larger country.

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Speaker 3: And then you know, honestly, the vote hinged on a

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Speaker 3: ton of racism in theocraty English, right, very very v

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Speaker 3: for vendetta, very children of men. But this, with all

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Speaker 3: these things, and this is almost a separate episode itself,

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Speaker 3: it leads us to this other question. In a world

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Speaker 3: that's more crowded than ever before, with so many bored disputes,

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Speaker 3: so many things just on the tip of becoming hot wars,

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Speaker 3: is there really still land that nobody wants? Well answer

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Speaker 3: the question after a word from our sponsors, here's where

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Speaker 3: it gets crazy. Yes, this is our this is our

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Speaker 3: phrase for the evening. The concept is terra nullius, land

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Speaker 3: without a master or unclaimed land. We mentioned this in

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Speaker 3: a previous episode. It's an odd, sometimes conspiracy laden concept

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Speaker 3: that feels nerdy and, past a certain point, incredibly dangerous.

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Speaker 3: It's a group term. It can describe a couple of things.

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Speaker 3: It can describe land that nobody wants. It can also

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Speaker 3: describe the idea of sovereign powers exercising squatter rights like

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Speaker 3: literally as we as we said at the top of

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Speaker 3: the show, coming into a place, say dibbs for England.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I know we're gonna get there, but it's gotta

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Speaker 4: have something to do with If nobody wants it, it's

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Speaker 4: probably because it's inconvenient to own or to possess or

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Speaker 4: it's just not strategically of value, or perhaps it's you know,

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Speaker 4: Baron or something like that. I don't know. This is

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Speaker 4: a new concept for me, so we're kind.

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Speaker 2: Of well, it's the it's the thing England used to

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Speaker 2: roll into Georgia and say Tara Knowles under the doctrine

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Speaker 2: of discovery, this is now ours.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, manifest destiny is another example.

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Speaker 2: But that's this is the legal right that was claimed

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Speaker 2: by the Crown when they rolled into the New World

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Speaker 2: for the first time, and then as they contend, Thomas

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Speaker 2: Jefferson claimed Tara Nollis in doctrine of discovery as he

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Speaker 2: went as he sent people westward who was.

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Speaker 3: In clerk style. And also that's another example, like also

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Speaker 3: that is going to be spoiler, folks, that's kind of

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Speaker 3: our conspiratorial turn, and that's going to be one of

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Speaker 3: the most important parts of the exploration tonight because this

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Speaker 3: can be weaponized. I thought we would enjoy just a

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Speaker 3: little bit of the background of how humans got to

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Speaker 3: Tara nullius, because it's pretty recent relatively, like the phrase

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Speaker 3: being written in international law that only happens in the

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Speaker 3: late eighteen hundreds, but in practice it's obviously so much older.

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Speaker 3: And it's related to a concept I had never heard

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Speaker 3: of res nullius. That it's a Roman idea from Roman law,

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Speaker 3: and it literally means nobody's thing. What's that nobody's thing?

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Speaker 3: Do you want it?

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Speaker 4: It's nobody's yeah, exactly, So, I mean, if you wanted

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Speaker 4: to take it back to those earliest origins in the

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Speaker 4: Roman days, stuff that was considered res nulius was legally

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Speaker 4: up for grabs by anyone who happens upon it. And

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Speaker 4: this was a little tricky because Roman law only saw

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Speaker 4: certain people as people. And this is going to apply

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Speaker 4: to a lot of the manifest destiny stuff and some

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Speaker 4: other stories you know, from other parts of the world

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Speaker 4: that we're going to get to. It's very common that

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Speaker 4: the invading forces only recognize people who look like them

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Speaker 4: as being, you know, worthy of possessing things and anyone else. Nah,

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Speaker 4: you might as well just be livestock, you know, get

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Speaker 4: out of here. This is mine.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. And my understanding is it really did relate to

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Speaker 2: do you have an army that can tell us no

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Speaker 2: when we roll in?

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Speaker 4: Right?

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Speaker 2: Is there a small French occupation in a part of

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Speaker 2: this land? Right? If we're England rolling through. If there is,

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Speaker 2: then we've got a problem. If there's not, then we

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Speaker 2: get to claim it, right.

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Speaker 3: Or we'll have a war, why not?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, but.

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Speaker 2: It is weird, like I don't I know, it's not

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Speaker 2: directly related to Christianity in any way, but it does

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Speaker 2: seem like the Christian based powers that were practicing colonization

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Speaker 2: really were the ones that were out there claiming this stuff.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, using that term and ideology. Ideology has always been

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Speaker 3: a tremendously powerful tool of rationalization. You know, in the

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Speaker 3: dawn of the Great Caliphates or in the heyday of

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Speaker 3: the Great Caliphates, they did very much the same thing.

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Speaker 3: They just didn't call it terr nulius. They said, you know,

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Speaker 3: we are the people in the right right. Our belief

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Speaker 3: in Islam is justifies our expansionist tendencies and all the

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Speaker 3: violence we may enact upon the infidels.

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Speaker 4: That was certainly the case with Spanish as well, like

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Speaker 4: Spanish conquistadors, you know, who were out there murdering and

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Speaker 4: pillaging as well, in the name of God, because they

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Speaker 4: felt as though they were imbued with some sort of

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Speaker 4: like mystical power from God that gave them the right

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Speaker 4: to do this.

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Speaker 3: And if we if we look at the modern day.

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Speaker 3: This is a pretty surprising thing, because this is a

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Speaker 3: very dark topic. If you look at the modern day,

395
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Speaker 3: you can still do terra nullius. You can still claim

396
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Speaker 3: this like if we for some reason had a boat,

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Speaker 3: just for some reason, let's call it the USS Conspiracy,

398
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Speaker 3: and we're sailing the high seas, and our guest producer

399
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Speaker 3: Ben Hackett is like, you, guys, I would did not

400
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Speaker 3: sign up for all this, but we've conscripted him. We're

401
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Speaker 3: all in our tiny four person navy or five person

402
00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:33,360
Speaker 3: with you listening. D of course, why not. It has

403
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Speaker 3: all the stuff. And as we're sailing in international waters

404
00:22:37,119 --> 00:22:40,560
Speaker 3: that no one state controls, we see a newly formed

405
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Speaker 3: volcanic island. Maybe it's like way out in the Pacific,

406
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Speaker 3: like Round Point Nemo or something. And so we can

407
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Speaker 3: sail up to this island, we can occupy it ourselves,

408
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Speaker 3: or which more likely, we can claim it in the

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Speaker 3: name of another nation, another established state. And with just

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Speaker 3: that explanation and nothing else, we can we go around

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Speaker 3: and pitch the idea to other world powers. And I'm like, hey,

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Speaker 3: you know us, we found this island, we got your

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Speaker 3: flag in it, We put your flag in it. We

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Speaker 3: thought you would be cool with that. Is that all right? Like,

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Speaker 3: are you going to arrest us? Or do we get

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Speaker 3: a medal?

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Speaker 2: You know, it's so weird.

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Speaker 3: It is, and it's pretty uncool because we see examples

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Speaker 3: of it in the modern day and earlier. The question

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Speaker 3: was like, can you guess what parts of the world

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Speaker 3: are most likely to be quote unquote unclaimed today? Like,

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Speaker 3: and I say this as in parts of the world

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Speaker 3: that don't have people actively living on them. You Narctica,

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Speaker 3: You nailed it, You nailed it, nailed it. Yes, Antarctica.

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Speaker 3: It's not the coolest place to live, or I guess

426
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Speaker 3: technically it is one of the quallest places to live.

427
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Speaker 3: It's quite cool. Yeah, there's a place called marie Bird Island.

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Speaker 3: It's the largest case of ter Nulius on the planet.

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Speaker 3: It's huge. It's like sixty two hundred thousand square miles

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Speaker 3: in west Antarctica, and nobody wants it.

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Speaker 2: I want it, I'll claim it.

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Speaker 3: You got it?

433
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Speaker 2: Do that ice is gonna melt soon. Let's go. Let's see,

434
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Speaker 2: let's see what we find under there.

435
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:19,119
Speaker 3: There's there's there's one guy who has tried to claim it.

436
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:21,840
Speaker 3: There there are two guys instrumental in history. One is

437
00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:26,240
Speaker 3: Admiral Richard E. Byrd might be familiar, right Operation Hijump

438
00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:28,840
Speaker 3: shout out New Schwapia.

439
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:33,560
Speaker 2: Yes, when when German forces went down and occupied some

440
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:37,480
Speaker 2: land in Antarctica. And dude, we've talked about this many

441
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:40,520
Speaker 2: times in the past. But look at some point when

442
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:45,480
Speaker 2: you've got some free time, look at the territorial divides

443
00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:50,720
Speaker 2: that exist in Antarctica. Uh mostly, I guess the closest

444
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:57,119
Speaker 2: part is that is that right towards South America looking

445
00:24:57,119 --> 00:24:58,920
Speaker 2: after I'm trying to imagine the map in my head

446
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:02,160
Speaker 2: where it divide it up in these weird little pie

447
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:03,800
Speaker 2: It's a pie basically.

448
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:09,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, And this is this discovery goes before quote

449
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 3: unquote discovery. Every time we say discovery, folks, please picture

450
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:15,320
Speaker 3: a lot of air quotes and caveats because other people

451
00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:17,359
Speaker 3: are clearly aware of this and you don't need the

452
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:21,639
Speaker 3: Piirees map to prove it. So Admiral Richard E. Bird

453
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:25,879
Speaker 3: is flying over this territory in nineteen twenty nine and

454
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 3: he sees this expanse of desolate Arctic desert that is

455
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:33,840
Speaker 3: just horrible, like it's impossible to live there even now.

456
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:38,120
Speaker 3: It's so inhospitable that they can't even camp there temporarily,

457
00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:41,399
Speaker 3: so they have to go to the nearby Ross Eyeself

458
00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:46,680
Speaker 3: and sleep there. It makes you wonder why he named

459
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,120
Speaker 3: it after his wife, What was going on there?

460
00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:50,199
Speaker 2: I guess we'll never know.

461
00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean we can side with optimism and say

462
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:56,600
Speaker 3: maybe he just wanted to impress her, which is what

463
00:25:57,480 --> 00:25:59,359
Speaker 3: I think we all do in relationships. You want to

464
00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:03,280
Speaker 3: impress your part. Right, So hopefully it was happy, but

465
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:07,359
Speaker 3: not much has changed. The climate is warming. It's a

466
00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 3: good time to get in early. Some people might say,

467
00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:13,080
Speaker 3: but it's so much trouble to occupy this place, and

468
00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:16,320
Speaker 3: there aren't really proven resources that justify it, and you

469
00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:20,640
Speaker 3: would be gambling against the Antarctica treaties, so you would

470
00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:23,159
Speaker 3: run the risk of other nations getting really mad at you.

471
00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 3: Even if you were like you guys weren't using it.

472
00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:28,400
Speaker 3: Then they might say, hey, but you signed a piece

473
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:31,000
Speaker 3: of paper and then, like you said, Matt, it comes

474
00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:33,399
Speaker 3: down to the armies. There have been a couple of

475
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 3: expeditions since twenty nine, but most of the observation has

476
00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 3: to be from the air, and Noel. If Matt does

477
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 3: tried to take over and declare a micro nation. He's

478
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:48,719
Speaker 3: going to have one dissenting voice that we know of.

479
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:51,399
Speaker 3: One guy is going to be like, hey, I already

480
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:52,160
Speaker 3: called DIBs.

481
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,720
Speaker 2: Is it the guy that runs the ice cube observation thing?

482
00:26:55,840 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 2: That's nuts? Not there that we're talked about, because all

483
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,359
Speaker 2: that exploration is in the name of science, right, at

484
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:08,280
Speaker 2: least most of it is the army slash scientific exploration.

485
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:11,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, what happens if someone gets murdered in McMurdo, Right,

486
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:16,040
Speaker 3: there's that episode. No, there's a guy just learned about

487
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:21,040
Speaker 3: in two thousand and one and a seaman weird adults

488
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:26,280
Speaker 3: for the US Navy named Travis McHenry. He said, I'm

489
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:31,119
Speaker 3: gonna declare this my own nation. It is the Grand

490
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,120
Speaker 3: Duchy of West Arctica.

491
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:36,560
Speaker 4: I love a grand duchy. Yeah, I do love a

492
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:39,640
Speaker 4: grand duchy. Yeah, this story is super weird. He did

493
00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:42,920
Speaker 4: this while serving as a seaman. I'm a child in

494
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:45,960
Speaker 4: the United States Navy. When the Navy found out that

495
00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:51,920
Speaker 4: he was contacting foreign governments and you know, floating this

496
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:55,880
Speaker 4: new nation to them, they quickly told him to knock

497
00:27:55,920 --> 00:28:00,600
Speaker 4: it out. Yeah. I mean seriously, Today, this cro nation

498
00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:06,240
Speaker 4: has somewhere around three and fifty six citizens though none

499
00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:09,760
Speaker 4: actually lived there. I guess they're what citizens like in spirit.

500
00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:12,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's got the right idea. It's for them. It's

501
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:16,639
Speaker 2: post melt, post melt society, that's what it's gonna be.

502
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:20,400
Speaker 2: And everybody's gonna move there. About two hundred of them

503
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:23,400
Speaker 2: will make it there, and uh, it'll it'll prosper you guys.

504
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:24,000
Speaker 2: I can see it.

505
00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:28,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, Travis is a forward looking dude. He also

506
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 3: I don't like to recommend Wikipedia, but his Wikipedia page

507
00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:36,280
Speaker 3: is very interesting himself.

508
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:38,640
Speaker 4: He's like the kind of guy that would edited himself.

509
00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:41,800
Speaker 3: He might maybe in the talk section. So whenever you

510
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 3: whenever you have to look at a Wikipedia article, I

511
00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 3: can't recommend enough, go to the talk tab. That's where

512
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,000
Speaker 3: you see the Wikipedia wars. That's where you see the

513
00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:53,920
Speaker 3: editors beefed up with each other and mentioning very weird things.

514
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 4: I'm gonna do that.

515
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:58,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, I bet you'll find some cool stuff. But so yeah,

516
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 3: the US Navy says, hey, Bud, no, you know, stop

517
00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:05,840
Speaker 3: writing to these other countries trying to get them to

518
00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:10,280
Speaker 3: recognize you. And he bought some land in the Carolinas.

519
00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:13,680
Speaker 3: I believe you know, if you reach out to him,

520
00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:16,280
Speaker 3: you can petition to become a citizen of this sort

521
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:17,880
Speaker 3: of like what's that place off the coast of the

522
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,840
Speaker 3: UK Sealand right, like you can it's an old fort

523
00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:24,440
Speaker 3: that a guy made into a micronation and you can

524
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:26,840
Speaker 3: apply to be a member of the citizen of the

525
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 3: Principality of Sealand.

526
00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 2: That sounds familiar. But I cannot confirm.

527
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:36,160
Speaker 3: Micro nor I micronations will get there one day. If

528
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:37,480
Speaker 3: this US citizens.

529
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:40,200
Speaker 4: Trigulous history about it, that's for sure. It's been quite

530
00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 4: a minute. Yeah, I know there was one. There was

531
00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:45,400
Speaker 4: one story about a guy who established a micronation like

532
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:49,000
Speaker 4: on a raft. Yes, I do remember that one vaguely,

533
00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 4: but the details are escaping me.

534
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:55,760
Speaker 3: I think micronations might be big for us in Q four,

535
00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:58,760
Speaker 3: as they say. But there is a happy ending with

536
00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 3: this one because mckenry he turned West Arctica into a

537
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:08,320
Speaker 3: nonprofit and they advocate for biodiversity and Antarctic wildlife in

538
00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:09,800
Speaker 3: the face of climate change.

539
00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:15,000
Speaker 4: So that there is a highly nerdy looking board game

540
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 4: called Sealand and the tag is cleverly placed crops and

541
00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:25,360
Speaker 4: windmills to become the wealthiest burger in the Netherlands. It

542
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:26,920
Speaker 4: is all about claiming new land. Though.

543
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:28,920
Speaker 2: It sounds like Settlers to me.

544
00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:31,600
Speaker 4: But what it looks like Settlers, it looks exactly what.

545
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 4: Everybody's not targonal.

546
00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 3: And everybody's not a board game nerd. We're talking about

547
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:38,960
Speaker 3: Settlers of Katak, which I have never.

548
00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 4: Played, but I've heard it's good. I am. I'm a

549
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:43,960
Speaker 4: wingspan man. I think I've mentioned.

550
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I saw it on your table.

551
00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:51,320
Speaker 4: Damn right, it was unopened though. I actually just purchased

552
00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 4: the actual board game. We play it with our friends

553
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,160
Speaker 4: and also the online additions. But I just got the

554
00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 4: actual physical board game versus I'm gonna bust that out

555
00:30:58,640 --> 00:30:59,400
Speaker 4: this weekend, y'all.

556
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:01,440
Speaker 3: Maybe one day I'll be lucky enough to play with

557
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:01,840
Speaker 3: you guys.

558
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 4: We still have we o Matta a game night with

559
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 4: his fancy new gaming table. Yeah, so much room for activity,

560
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:14,080
Speaker 4: boatload of cash to dump out in the middle of

561
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:16,920
Speaker 4: that sucker, So much room for activities.

562
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:22,720
Speaker 3: Uh so, Okay, So there's another thing here that mckenry

563
00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:25,760
Speaker 3: teaches us, which is a lot of people hear this

564
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:28,479
Speaker 3: idea of Tarinolius or some version of it, and they

565
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 3: kind of take it as a challenge or an invitation,

566
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:33,320
Speaker 3: and it almost never works out. But here we get

567
00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:36,600
Speaker 3: to this guy's is one of my favorite ones. Here

568
00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:39,360
Speaker 3: we get to the most surreal and ridiculous and kind

569
00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:44,640
Speaker 3: of funny, uh story of Taraanlius beer ta Will, which

570
00:31:44,680 --> 00:31:47,760
Speaker 3: I am almost certainly mispronouncing because we are not native speakers.

571
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:50,720
Speaker 4: In my mind, I'm picturing a beer towel, you know,

572
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:54,200
Speaker 4: for that nice dabbing your mouth when you spill a

573
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:54,920
Speaker 4: little layer beer.

574
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:58,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's tiny. It's like less than eight hundred

575
00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:01,800
Speaker 3: square miles. And if you pull up the map you'll

576
00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:04,320
Speaker 3: see it looks like a postage stamp. It doesn't make

577
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:06,440
Speaker 3: sense it would be such a big deal. It's like

578
00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 3: a little quadrilateral area.

579
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 4: Well, isn't that interesting, though, Ben, Because a lot of

580
00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:17,400
Speaker 4: these things are almost more symbolic than they are actually

581
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 4: like of significance, you know, in terms of like you know,

582
00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:24,520
Speaker 4: commerce or whatever it might be. It's because that's the

583
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:28,480
Speaker 4: point that these borders, what they represent sometimes is more

584
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 4: meaningful than where the actual borders are.

585
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:32,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's a good observation.

586
00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:37,680
Speaker 2: So this thing, this tiny little thing, was a map mishap.

587
00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:40,720
Speaker 2: I guess that's also disagreement.

588
00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:44,960
Speaker 3: And for more than a century, Egypt and Saidan have

589
00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:49,240
Speaker 3: both been constantly saying no, you you take that one.

590
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,240
Speaker 3: They're constantly trying to foist this eight hundred like they

591
00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 3: beef up over it. They're trying to force the other

592
00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 3: nation to say, okay, I'll take this eight hundred square

593
00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:02,480
Speaker 3: miles because of the map discrepancy in like eighteen ninety

594
00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 3: nine and nineteen oh two or two maps that came out,

595
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:11,640
Speaker 3: and one said Beard ta Will is the land of Sudan,

596
00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:16,320
Speaker 3: and this other piece of land called the Halib Triangle

597
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:20,680
Speaker 3: is Egypt's. And the Hallib Triangle is way cooler, it's

598
00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:23,200
Speaker 3: much more attractive real estate, it's got access to the

599
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 3: Red Sea, it's much bigger, it's more friendly if you

600
00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:32,880
Speaker 3: want to live there. So each country, as like those

601
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:35,200
Speaker 3: in the second map, by the way, reversed it. So

602
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:38,320
Speaker 3: we have one map that says Egypt controls Beer ta

603
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:41,960
Speaker 3: Will but not the other triangle, and then the other

604
00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 3: map says Sudan controls Beard ta Will but not the

605
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:49,480
Speaker 3: other triangle. So if either nation takes ownership of this

606
00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:52,720
Speaker 3: one little tiny piece of land, then they automatically lose

607
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:55,600
Speaker 3: the land they really want. It's ridiculous.

608
00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:59,280
Speaker 2: Well, then who controls the land they all really want

609
00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:04,040
Speaker 2: right now, nobody, but the triangle is also the same.

610
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:08,200
Speaker 3: The triangle is well, if you ask them, they both

611
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:10,040
Speaker 3: they both will say they control it.

612
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 2: Well, which army is in there? Somebody's got military officers somewhere.

613
00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 3: I think it's like the line of actual control in

614
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:22,719
Speaker 3: China and India and the Himalayas. I feel like they

615
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:26,320
Speaker 3: have uneasy standoffs and the people living in the area

616
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:29,480
Speaker 3: are just kind of hoping the shoe doesn't drop in

617
00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:30,760
Speaker 3: their generation.

618
00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:33,080
Speaker 4: And just to kind of like hammer home. What a

619
00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:35,879
Speaker 4: big deal some of this stuff is, you know, for

620
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:40,440
Speaker 4: the countries that are kind of disputing them. Barbie. The

621
00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:46,120
Speaker 4: movie was unceremoniously pulled from release in China because of

622
00:34:46,200 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 4: a basically like crayon doodle of a map depicting a

623
00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:56,000
Speaker 4: version of China in that part of the country that

624
00:34:56,680 --> 00:35:00,160
Speaker 4: I believe was not to the liking of China these

625
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:03,360
Speaker 4: officials because of something to do with their claim on

626
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:07,320
Speaker 4: Vietnam or or part of like something that violates their sovereignty,

627
00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:11,520
Speaker 4: something called the the nine dash line. Oh my mistake.

628
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 4: It was Vietnam that had the issue because they believe

629
00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:19,160
Speaker 4: this claim of China on parts of the South China

630
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:22,200
Speaker 4: Sea violates their size. See, so they were like, no, no,

631
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:24,320
Speaker 4: this is not cool, Barbie. We're not letting you release

632
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:24,879
Speaker 4: your movie here.

633
00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:30,080
Speaker 2: Mm so, guys, are we gonna travel over there? Should

634
00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:33,680
Speaker 2: we plant a flag and just say no? Hey, guys,

635
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:37,799
Speaker 2: we understand. We'll take it well because I know it's

636
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:40,120
Speaker 2: hard to live there, but we if you put a

637
00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:43,440
Speaker 2: building on there that's got some hydroponics and I say, glue,

638
00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:44,920
Speaker 2: we can come on, let's do this.

639
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:50,440
Speaker 3: Yeah. Oh man, let's say we'll have to set up

640
00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:52,040
Speaker 3: Wi Fi too so we can record.

641
00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:55,400
Speaker 4: But uh, you see that show Murder at the End

642
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 4: of the World.

643
00:35:57,080 --> 00:35:58,279
Speaker 3: Yes, I think there's like.

644
00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:00,560
Speaker 4: An Elon Musk type figure, like you know, like it's

645
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:04,400
Speaker 4: like a big tech mogul good gajillionaire, and that he

646
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:07,640
Speaker 4: has this hotel that he builds. It's basically like, you know,

647
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:11,520
Speaker 4: part of it is above ground level and I forget

648
00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:13,719
Speaker 4: some really really frozen tundra part of the world, but

649
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:17,160
Speaker 4: the rest of it is underground, like so far down

650
00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:19,600
Speaker 4: that would protect you from like nuclear blasts. Basically like

651
00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:22,080
Speaker 4: a really really fancy fallout shelter. So we can get

652
00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:25,720
Speaker 4: the funds together to build something like that count me in. Boys.

653
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:28,719
Speaker 3: Okay, let's ride to it county. Let's just let's just

654
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:31,160
Speaker 3: pitch it right, there's nothing wrong with brainstorming.

655
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:34,440
Speaker 4: Asking costs nothing, and then.

656
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:37,239
Speaker 3: You know, maybe we can be actually, you know what,

657
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:39,279
Speaker 3: I'll do it as long as we can call it

658
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:40,760
Speaker 3: the El Tovar Hotel.

659
00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:43,759
Speaker 4: Oh like it also be Bentopia.

660
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,640
Speaker 3: Oh no, no, no, no, no, no, come on, that's got

661
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:49,120
Speaker 3: a rink in just because there are two bins in

662
00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:52,000
Speaker 3: the in the founding fathers here. I don't think we

663
00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:54,919
Speaker 3: should lean into that. We got to find a better name.

664
00:36:55,160 --> 00:36:58,120
Speaker 4: It's just the pitheist name. It's fine. Okay, we can

665
00:36:58,120 --> 00:36:59,120
Speaker 4: work shop. We can work shop.

666
00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:02,040
Speaker 3: We could call it beer tell will plus there you go.

667
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:07,879
Speaker 3: So to this question, you're you're absolutely right, Matt. There

668
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:12,600
Speaker 3: are no permanent residents. There are kind of desperate prospectors

669
00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:15,440
Speaker 3: who set up temporary mining camps to hunt for gold,

670
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:20,480
Speaker 3: and then there are nomadic communities that move through that

671
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:24,560
Speaker 3: area in their migration. But no, there's no static community

672
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:28,640
Speaker 3: living there because it's very hot. It's a desert. There's

673
00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:31,640
Speaker 3: not any surface water. It's like ad max style.

674
00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 2: But no wait, wait, well it's the perfect location for

675
00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:44,240
Speaker 2: where humanity sets up the first AI controlled sovereign area.

676
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 3: There we go. Yeah, right, let the robots figure out

677
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:48,719
Speaker 3: the waters like that.

678
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:51,359
Speaker 2: It's Animatrix, Baby, it's going to happen. It's just like that.

679
00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:58,400
Speaker 4: Oh man, I mean I did you just reference the Animatrix. Yeah,

680
00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:01,919
Speaker 4: it's goods just funny. It's just like that's a deep

681
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:04,480
Speaker 4: slightly deeper cut part one.

682
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 3: Yeah. Also, uh, I'm I'm legitimately concerned about listening to

683
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,080
Speaker 3: this episode a few years from now and realizing how

684
00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:17,760
Speaker 3: prescy that statement was, because that is good casting.

685
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:19,800
Speaker 4: As long as we don't accidentally turn on people's alexa.

686
00:38:20,719 --> 00:38:23,320
Speaker 3: Oh boy, yeah god, thanks everybody wrote.

687
00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:25,799
Speaker 2: In so god, No, you're right, it's gonna be. It's

688
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:29,000
Speaker 2: gonna be West Antarctica, isn't it because the cold temperatures

689
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:32,279
Speaker 2: are actually will be beneficial for the computing power they'll

690
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:34,000
Speaker 2: be Oh god, Okay.

691
00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:36,319
Speaker 3: Well, also North Pole because a lot of islands are

692
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:40,200
Speaker 3: coming out from under the ice. It's a great one. Yeah.

693
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:43,320
Speaker 3: What we're saying is invest in the polls. Guys, forget

694
00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 3: we're playing small time. If we're trying to flip houses,

695
00:38:45,719 --> 00:38:46,880
Speaker 3: let's start flipping poles.

696
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:50,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, pull shift.

697
00:38:51,360 --> 00:38:56,520
Speaker 3: This is the whole thing, baby square God, oh man,

698
00:38:56,560 --> 00:39:00,360
Speaker 3: I'm waiting in fear for an expert in magnet to

699
00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:04,880
Speaker 3: write to us. But anyway, the thing about this is

700
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:08,840
Speaker 3: Berta will. Although it is not paradise on Earth, and

701
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:11,799
Speaker 3: it is very hot and somewhat in the hospitable, it's

702
00:39:11,880 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 3: the most habitable quote unquote Terranolius around and multiple people

703
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:21,839
Speaker 3: have tried to create a micronation there, but the vast

704
00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:25,320
Speaker 3: majority of never visited. They post online, they start a

705
00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 3: website and they're like the nation butte will with your

706
00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:29,920
Speaker 3: buddy Johnny Bluejays.

707
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:37,279
Speaker 4: Yeah, keyboard warriors, go take a trip plant actual flag nerds.

708
00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:41,359
Speaker 3: Right, oh man, I wonder what our flag would look

709
00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:41,759
Speaker 3: like too.

710
00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:42,680
Speaker 4: But okay.

711
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:46,920
Speaker 3: There are other examples of this, especially around the Danube

712
00:39:47,080 --> 00:39:51,800
Speaker 3: post Serbia Croatian conflicts. There will probably be more examples

713
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:54,280
Speaker 3: in the future. Like you said, the idea of borders,

714
00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:57,080
Speaker 3: although they seem permanent, they're quite ephemeral. But there's a

715
00:39:57,160 --> 00:39:59,120
Speaker 3: darker side to the story, and I think it's one

716
00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:01,839
Speaker 3: that we all really wanted to talk about. This is

717
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 3: the most important aspect of Terranulius, past all the weird

718
00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:09,440
Speaker 3: jokes and the Joseph Heller kind of stuff. I propose

719
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:11,919
Speaker 3: we pause for word from our sponsor and then get

720
00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:23,080
Speaker 3: into the deep water. What do you say, Yes, we've returned,

721
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:27,680
Speaker 3: and you know we're fun. We're fun at parties. We

722
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:30,239
Speaker 3: like a good joke. We did the thing with beer

723
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:33,560
Speaker 3: to Will. That's kind of ridiculous. But the more important part,

724
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:37,600
Speaker 3: the frankly terrifying part, and the very real conspiracy is this.

725
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:41,280
Speaker 3: The idea of Terranulius in name and or in practice

726
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:46,239
Speaker 3: has often been used by very powerful expansionist forces to

727
00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:52,560
Speaker 3: justify atrocities, occupation, colonization. You think gentrification in your city

728
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:56,359
Speaker 3: is bad, imagine that wide scale on a nation, right

729
00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:00,319
Speaker 3: on a land somewhat, you know, one of the like

730
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 3: Apocalypto right an amazing film and one of the most

731
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:08,320
Speaker 3: frightening parts of Apocalypto, despite all of the crazy graphic

732
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:10,880
Speaker 3: violence in action, one of the most frightening parts is

733
00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:15,080
Speaker 3: the very very end. Spoilers, folks, three to one, the

734
00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:18,600
Speaker 3: real monster comes at the end. It's the Spanish colquistadors.

735
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:24,520
Speaker 4: Yeah. I know I'm gonna sound like total like you know,

736
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:29,480
Speaker 4: woke white dude or whatever, but I'm just so happy

737
00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:34,719
Speaker 4: to see how much representation indigenous people are getting in

738
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 4: pop culture over the last handful of years. I just

739
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:39,399
Speaker 4: feel like I just didn't see that much of it.

740
00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:41,919
Speaker 4: And now you've got like shows like Reservation Dogs and

741
00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:45,440
Speaker 4: even like The Curse, which is, you know, a weird,

742
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:48,400
Speaker 4: cringe worthy kind of satire. It deals with some of

743
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:51,400
Speaker 4: this stuff of cultural appropriation. And then specifically, I just

744
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:54,480
Speaker 4: watched Killers of the Flower Moon, which is about what

745
00:41:54,640 --> 00:41:59,880
Speaker 4: happened after it stopped being okay just to kill Native

746
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:03,279
Speaker 4: Americans outright and take their land. So they had to

747
00:42:03,280 --> 00:42:06,319
Speaker 4: do it a little more low key and covertly, but

748
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:10,560
Speaker 4: nothing actually changed. It was just kind of everything went underground,

749
00:42:10,760 --> 00:42:14,280
Speaker 4: you know, in terms of like the awful, despicable things

750
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:17,600
Speaker 4: that white people did in order to rob these folks

751
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:20,880
Speaker 4: of their livelihood and property and land.

752
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 3: Absolutely right, I would say, because the methods may change,

753
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:28,960
Speaker 3: but the aim remains constant and the same. You know,

754
00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:32,440
Speaker 3: it's still the days of rest nullius. Nobody's thing, And

755
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:36,760
Speaker 3: if you can convince yourself another powerful forces that something

756
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:42,239
Speaker 3: is nobody's thing, then you will you will get very

757
00:42:42,280 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 3: quickly to an argument of might makes right, which is

758
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:49,439
Speaker 3: evil and unethical but happens all the time. And when

759
00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:53,640
Speaker 3: we talk about this. Obviously, you know there are multiple examples.

760
00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:57,200
Speaker 3: One of the most notorious of terra nullius as a

761
00:42:57,239 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 3: conspiracy occurs in Australia, and Australian friends in the audience,

762
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:05,640
Speaker 3: fellow conspiracy realists, you are doubtlessly very well aware of

763
00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:07,680
Speaker 3: this and know more about it than we do. But

764
00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:11,680
Speaker 3: we're surprised to find that in the early days of

765
00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:15,200
Speaker 3: what we call modern Australia, the governor Captain Arthur Philip

766
00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:19,359
Speaker 3: proclaimed the creation of the Penal Colony right of New

767
00:43:19,400 --> 00:43:23,960
Speaker 3: South Wales and really leaned on the concept of terranulius

768
00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:28,080
Speaker 3: and said, look, we found this big empty continent. There

769
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:31,960
Speaker 3: are no real humans here, so we claim this. We're

770
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:35,280
Speaker 3: going to make it a prison camp for the British Empire.

771
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:39,880
Speaker 3: At the time, Aboriginal communities had lived on the continent

772
00:43:39,920 --> 00:43:43,000
Speaker 3: for more than fifty thousand years. I can't even imagine

773
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:45,200
Speaker 3: how long of a time that is. That hundreds of

774
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 3: different languages, they had a long, rich history. In what

775
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:51,880
Speaker 3: we call Sydney alone, there were like eight thousand people

776
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:57,400
Speaker 3: and the British said, well, they didn't call dibbs, so

777
00:43:57,520 --> 00:43:58,520
Speaker 3: now we are doing that.

778
00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:03,399
Speaker 4: Yeah, and they don't look like us. Yeah, As far

779
00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:06,719
Speaker 4: as we're concerned that they don't deserve this land that

780
00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 4: they've you know, settled and and made their home for generations.

781
00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:16,000
Speaker 2: Well, again, I think it goes back to that concept

782
00:44:16,040 --> 00:44:19,480
Speaker 2: of we do not recognize anybody that could claim sovereignty

783
00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:23,319
Speaker 2: over this land, so we therefore do claim it. And

784
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:27,880
Speaker 2: the human beings that we're encountering do not have the

785
00:44:27,920 --> 00:44:31,200
Speaker 2: weapons that we have, so we can exert force and

786
00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:34,040
Speaker 2: we can decide that it's ours. And it's really important

787
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:38,719
Speaker 2: to remember that they only legally claim sovereignty over the

788
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:43,640
Speaker 2: land right according to the laws recognized in the country

789
00:44:43,640 --> 00:44:47,600
Speaker 2: that's claiming right. And then any and Ben, as you said, any,

790
00:44:47,640 --> 00:44:51,319
Speaker 2: what is it the anyone who recognizes the authority of

791
00:44:51,360 --> 00:44:55,879
Speaker 2: that authority is then buying into this fiction that they

792
00:44:55,960 --> 00:45:00,799
Speaker 2: now own this land. It's just and it's so infuriating,

793
00:45:01,040 --> 00:45:04,040
Speaker 2: and this is the definitely the best example of it.

794
00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:07,360
Speaker 2: Then it comes to mind. But then when you start

795
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:10,360
Speaker 2: to peel back the onion and you look at the whole,

796
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:14,200
Speaker 2: but the whole of the world, and how this basic

797
00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:19,399
Speaker 2: concept has created everything that we everything that I as

798
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:24,000
Speaker 2: a human being love, this horrible concept created it.

799
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:28,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, the benefits that carry down you know, we often

800
00:45:28,960 --> 00:45:32,280
Speaker 3: don't realize the origin of those things.

801
00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:32,879
Speaker 4: Right.

802
00:45:33,000 --> 00:45:38,360
Speaker 3: The reason that you can live so far inland in

803
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:42,560
Speaker 3: the United States and get pretty much anything you want

804
00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:45,440
Speaker 3: so long as you can afford it, that comes from that.

805
00:45:45,640 --> 00:45:48,719
Speaker 3: The reason that the national parks are so awesome is

806
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:51,800
Speaker 3: because the indigenous communities that lived here thousands and thousands

807
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:53,960
Speaker 3: of years ago didn't wreck.

808
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:56,759
Speaker 4: It, to say, yeah, And it goes to show too

809
00:45:56,760 --> 00:46:00,480
Speaker 4: with the westward expansion, like how the idea, idea of

810
00:46:00,520 --> 00:46:03,840
Speaker 4: getting in on the ground floor like that and getting

811
00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:06,400
Speaker 4: your piece of the pie when it was all being

812
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 4: divvied up. You know, it was such an important thing,

813
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:13,160
Speaker 4: you know, because land is everything, you know, like, that's

814
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:16,160
Speaker 4: where you build your home, that's where you stake your claim,

815
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:17,600
Speaker 4: that's where you make your legacy.

816
00:46:18,719 --> 00:46:21,360
Speaker 3: It's very interesting to read. You know, we are of

817
00:46:21,400 --> 00:46:25,560
Speaker 3: a generation folks where the three of us I don't

818
00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:28,200
Speaker 3: know about you, Benh, but we grew up playing a

819
00:46:28,239 --> 00:46:32,799
Speaker 3: game called Oregon Trail in school and it was very

820
00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:40,640
Speaker 3: much a romanticization of manifest destiny, right, and in different

821
00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:45,000
Speaker 3: versions of this game, some things didn't age well, let's

822
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:47,440
Speaker 3: put it that way. It's also very interesting to read

823
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:53,760
Speaker 3: early advertisements for settlers or for pioneers, right that were saying,

824
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 3: travel from the west coast. We'll have a lottery on

825
00:46:56,640 --> 00:47:00,520
Speaker 3: this new territory, right and for peanuts. Hen he's on

826
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:04,000
Speaker 3: the dollar. You can get this massive homestead and all

827
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:06,319
Speaker 3: you have to do is get out there and live there.

828
00:47:07,200 --> 00:47:10,319
Speaker 4: And I think I've mentioned this show from BBC the

829
00:47:10,360 --> 00:47:15,279
Speaker 4: English It's it's it's a very very epic, sweeping kind

830
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:18,040
Speaker 4: of period piece. But there's a character who's who's a

831
00:47:18,120 --> 00:47:21,719
Speaker 4: Native American and his whole deal is that he is

832
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:24,880
Speaker 4: he has been promised this land that he is owed.

833
00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:27,400
Speaker 4: That was land that was taken away from his you know,

834
00:47:27,440 --> 00:47:32,040
Speaker 4: his tribe. But it becomes abundantly clear that they are

835
00:47:32,120 --> 00:47:34,799
Speaker 4: never going to pay him what he's owed because he

836
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:37,879
Speaker 4: is not in that club and they will never see

837
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 4: him in that way. And he kind of finally has

838
00:47:40,520 --> 00:47:43,800
Speaker 4: to make that realization, you know that like, no, I'm

839
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:46,719
Speaker 4: never going to be treated fairly. I have to make

840
00:47:46,760 --> 00:47:49,319
Speaker 4: my own way and and and realize that what's been

841
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:51,160
Speaker 4: taken from me is never going to be given back

842
00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:53,160
Speaker 4: to me because it is might makes right.

843
00:47:53,560 --> 00:47:58,000
Speaker 3: And you know Kissinger would agree, right. So the again,

844
00:47:58,280 --> 00:48:01,560
Speaker 3: the methods and the rationalisations may change, but the aim

845
00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:04,719
Speaker 3: has always been the same. It also reminds me in

846
00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:08,200
Speaker 3: the world of fiction of the excellent series Taboo. Do

847
00:48:08,239 --> 00:48:10,080
Speaker 3: you guys remember that one came out of the years?

848
00:48:10,320 --> 00:48:13,239
Speaker 4: I mentioned that recently too with Tom Hardy Boy. Is

849
00:48:13,239 --> 00:48:15,839
Speaker 4: that good? Dark dark dark dark start?

850
00:48:15,920 --> 00:48:20,200
Speaker 3: And there is a storyline there about trying to acquire

851
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:24,279
Speaker 3: land in the so called New World. We don't know

852
00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:26,279
Speaker 3: how it'll work because it's been years and years since

853
00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:29,320
Speaker 3: season two, but it's worth tuning in. And it's something

854
00:48:29,480 --> 00:48:35,040
Speaker 3: it's a conspiracy that really, without high hyperbole, Ternalius affects everyone.

855
00:48:35,400 --> 00:48:41,040
Speaker 3: Is a very successful set of conspiracies, intergenerational with ramifications

856
00:48:41,040 --> 00:48:43,960
Speaker 3: that continue today. And one of the questions I have

857
00:48:44,960 --> 00:48:48,759
Speaker 3: and this is something that kind of honestly keeps me

858
00:48:48,920 --> 00:48:51,440
Speaker 3: awake at night. I mean I'm already awakened that, you

859
00:48:51,480 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 3: know what I mean. I think about it a lot.

860
00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:56,480
Speaker 3: What happens in the future. You know what happens is

861
00:48:56,640 --> 00:49:01,279
Speaker 3: humanity expands into the moon. You know the first asteroid

862
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:02,080
Speaker 3: mind startup?

863
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:05,560
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, dude. It's hard to plant a flag in

864
00:49:05,719 --> 00:49:08,480
Speaker 2: space because there's really nothing to plant it on unless

865
00:49:08,520 --> 00:49:09,920
Speaker 2: you've got something flying around up.

866
00:49:10,040 --> 00:49:12,120
Speaker 3: We did it the USA.

867
00:49:12,560 --> 00:49:15,160
Speaker 4: But isn't there sort of a gentleman's agreement that like

868
00:49:15,239 --> 00:49:21,319
Speaker 4: nobody can own space? Sure, okay, yeah, we're good then, right,

869
00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:23,400
Speaker 4: that's got teeth.

870
00:49:23,800 --> 00:49:25,680
Speaker 3: Can I do it? Okay? Can I do one hot

871
00:49:25,719 --> 00:49:27,840
Speaker 3: take on that one, because I don't want to sound

872
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:33,279
Speaker 3: like a negative Nelson or whatever, But that to me

873
00:49:33,719 --> 00:49:36,839
Speaker 3: has always felt very well intentioned, and people worked very

874
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:41,160
Speaker 3: hard on the various treaties against the militarization of space

875
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:46,200
Speaker 3: or against owning land on the moon. But I am

876
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:53,760
Speaker 3: increasingly confident after several conversations, I'm increasingly confident that the powers,

877
00:49:53,960 --> 00:49:57,239
Speaker 3: the world powers that agreed to that simply did it

878
00:49:57,280 --> 00:50:00,160
Speaker 3: as a stop gap, as a wit baking in a

879
00:50:00,200 --> 00:50:03,800
Speaker 3: waiting time, and the moment that it becomes possibology arrived

880
00:50:03,840 --> 00:50:06,360
Speaker 3: at such a point that they act will.

881
00:50:06,600 --> 00:50:11,120
Speaker 2: And then whoever has the biggest flag in mine now.

882
00:50:12,120 --> 00:50:15,160
Speaker 2: We just did that project on the project for the

883
00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:17,680
Speaker 2: New American Century episode where we talked about in the

884
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:21,360
Speaker 2: year two thousand that think tank was calling for the

885
00:50:21,480 --> 00:50:24,520
Speaker 2: United States to create a space force so that we

886
00:50:24,640 --> 00:50:30,160
Speaker 2: might exercise sovereignty over all of space. And then guess

887
00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:32,959
Speaker 2: what we created, guys, Just a couple of years ago.

888
00:50:36,080 --> 00:50:37,080
Speaker 3: Have you seen the Badges?

889
00:50:37,960 --> 00:50:39,960
Speaker 2: Yes, and I've also seen the TV show, which I

890
00:50:40,080 --> 00:50:41,040
Speaker 2: very much enjoyed.

891
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:43,240
Speaker 3: Out I was runny.

892
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:46,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't think I got renewed, but I thought

893
00:50:46,120 --> 00:50:46,600
Speaker 4: it was very good.

894
00:50:46,600 --> 00:50:48,560
Speaker 3: It was too close to the truth. It got cut

895
00:50:48,600 --> 00:50:49,720
Speaker 3: down like that K Street.

896
00:50:52,160 --> 00:50:56,000
Speaker 2: But then, okay, so I'm going to quote somebody here,

897
00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:59,640
Speaker 2: Robert J. Miller, who's writing in the Wyoming Law Review.

898
00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:03,839
Speaker 2: This was from volume eleven, number two in the year

899
00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:05,640
Speaker 2: twenty eleven, Total Banker.

900
00:51:05,800 --> 00:51:08,799
Speaker 3: I haven't read it, I obviously read it.

901
00:51:08,840 --> 00:51:12,320
Speaker 2: Well, he's just shouting out two very specific uses recent

902
00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:18,960
Speaker 2: legal uses. We're talking international courts legal uses of Terra nolius.

903
00:51:19,480 --> 00:51:22,759
Speaker 2: That is, in August of two thousand and seven, when

904
00:51:22,840 --> 00:51:27,000
Speaker 2: Russia evoked well, they didn't invoke terrainulius. They involved the

905
00:51:27,040 --> 00:51:31,040
Speaker 2: discovery doctrine, which is like directly tied to this contant

906
00:51:32,719 --> 00:51:37,120
Speaker 2: they placed. According to Robert, they placed a titanium flag

907
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:40,000
Speaker 2: on the floor of the Arctic Ocean to claim the

908
00:51:40,160 --> 00:51:43,279
Speaker 2: estimated ten billion tons of oil and gas that is

909
00:51:43,360 --> 00:51:46,879
Speaker 2: right under the surface there. And then in twenty ten,

910
00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:51,920
Speaker 2: China did the same thing essentially by claiming sovereign rights

911
00:51:51,960 --> 00:51:55,520
Speaker 2: over the South China Sea by planting a flag at

912
00:51:55,560 --> 00:51:57,520
Speaker 2: the bottom of the ocean in the center of the

913
00:51:57,560 --> 00:51:58,680
Speaker 2: area that they are claiming.

914
00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:02,640
Speaker 3: You got a real flag this, Yes they did. There's

915
00:52:02,680 --> 00:52:04,879
Speaker 3: another there's an episode we did related to this where

916
00:52:04,920 --> 00:52:07,360
Speaker 3: I think we mentioned it, which is who will control

917
00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:14,120
Speaker 3: the North Pole as the as the northern passages become navigable? Right,

918
00:52:14,640 --> 00:52:18,359
Speaker 3: A lot of countries, I don't know if we need

919
00:52:18,400 --> 00:52:19,920
Speaker 3: to beat me here, ben, but a lot of countries

920
00:52:19,960 --> 00:52:22,960
Speaker 3: are getting left ass out because they didn't invest in

921
00:52:23,000 --> 00:52:26,120
Speaker 3: their ice breakers and they didn't put some teeth behind

922
00:52:26,160 --> 00:52:28,479
Speaker 3: their territorial claims. And if you look at the map,

923
00:52:28,640 --> 00:52:31,200
Speaker 3: just like you're describing with the South Pole, the North

924
00:52:31,239 --> 00:52:35,160
Speaker 3: Pole has a bunch of very ambitious pie slices, I

925
00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:38,359
Speaker 3: will say, because you know, the US is only real

926
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:43,520
Speaker 3: attempted a claim to sovereignity in the North Pole is Alaska,

927
00:52:43,880 --> 00:52:46,800
Speaker 3: and they tried to They tried to slice that pizza

928
00:52:46,840 --> 00:52:50,360
Speaker 3: slice bigger than it should be, just being honest. And

929
00:52:50,400 --> 00:52:54,120
Speaker 3: then Russia was all about putting down some flags. You know,

930
00:52:54,640 --> 00:52:57,799
Speaker 3: subs and icebreakers. They have the best ones, They have

931
00:52:57,840 --> 00:52:58,760
Speaker 3: the best ice breakers.

932
00:52:59,040 --> 00:53:01,520
Speaker 4: US has the best subs and sorry, sorry, this is

933
00:53:01,560 --> 00:53:05,480
Speaker 4: maybe a silly question, but like, are their territorial claims

934
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:10,600
Speaker 4: on like deep parts of the ocean, like other than

935
00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:13,080
Speaker 4: we're talking about here, like for resource extraction. But like,

936
00:53:13,160 --> 00:53:16,680
Speaker 4: you know what, what if technology comes uh to light

937
00:53:17,000 --> 00:53:19,040
Speaker 4: that will allow us to build some sort of giant

938
00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:23,200
Speaker 4: under sea dome, you know, civilization? Like when do we

939
00:53:23,239 --> 00:53:25,319
Speaker 4: start having those arguments and disputes?

940
00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:29,520
Speaker 2: Man, we had those millions of years ago, back in

941
00:53:29,600 --> 00:53:32,719
Speaker 2: the first civilization, when we had the domes underwater.

942
00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:36,279
Speaker 3: People are flipping domes. That's how everything went wrong.

943
00:53:37,320 --> 00:53:40,520
Speaker 4: Do you know, like the Gundam, the Gungam, the Gungan

944
00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:46,480
Speaker 4: city in the bad Star Wars movies, Boss Nass.

945
00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:50,520
Speaker 3: Oh, Sequest DSV Sequest was cool?

946
00:53:50,840 --> 00:53:53,400
Speaker 4: Yeah, hell sea Lab.

947
00:53:53,640 --> 00:53:58,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think Also, I know we're sorry, Ben,

948
00:53:58,760 --> 00:54:01,160
Speaker 3: because we're now we're cooking with guests. Like we mentioned

949
00:54:01,200 --> 00:54:04,200
Speaker 3: we might, we do have to end. But I love

950
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:07,680
Speaker 3: this direction because I got to ask, how likely do

951
00:54:07,760 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 3: you think it is that modern undersea cities or metropolis

952
00:54:12,760 --> 00:54:16,280
Speaker 3: will exist? I think it's increasingly likely as the surface

953
00:54:16,320 --> 00:54:21,680
Speaker 3: world gets more and more untenable, Like why wouldn't you

954
00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:22,640
Speaker 3: if you could make.

955
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:26,440
Speaker 2: It work, just got to show up and say this mine,

956
00:54:27,600 --> 00:54:29,479
Speaker 2: this my gun, I might have that.

957
00:54:29,840 --> 00:54:33,680
Speaker 3: Everybody study vexillology. Clearly you need a flag. We have

958
00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:35,520
Speaker 3: to have flag. If you want to send a flag

959
00:54:35,560 --> 00:54:38,520
Speaker 3: to us, pitch a flag. Idea for conspiracy stuff, for

960
00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:40,960
Speaker 3: stuff they don't want you to know. I'd be interesting.

961
00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:42,640
Speaker 3: I'd be in to seeing that.

962
00:54:42,640 --> 00:54:44,720
Speaker 4: I don't know. I think it'd be the creepy, drippy

963
00:54:45,239 --> 00:54:48,120
Speaker 4: six fingered hand. Oh no, we.

964
00:54:48,080 --> 00:54:48,960
Speaker 3: Gave away the secret.

965
00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:51,560
Speaker 2: Can I just get this out really fast?

966
00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:52,399
Speaker 4: Guys? Okay, good?

967
00:54:52,680 --> 00:54:58,160
Speaker 2: So the United States begins to form as a conspiracy

968
00:54:58,160 --> 00:54:59,280
Speaker 2: against the British Crown.

969
00:54:59,600 --> 00:54:59,799
Speaker 3: True.

970
00:55:00,040 --> 00:55:04,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, with the colonists who all came over here with

971
00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:09,120
Speaker 2: the doctrine of discovery at it like in their pocket

972
00:55:09,200 --> 00:55:11,799
Speaker 2: from the Crown. The Crown in England said, go over there,

973
00:55:11,920 --> 00:55:15,880
Speaker 2: here's our doctrine of discovery concept. Use it when you

974
00:55:16,040 --> 00:55:20,120
Speaker 2: encounter anyone or anything. You claim this land and all

975
00:55:20,160 --> 00:55:25,400
Speaker 2: the peoples who occupy that land it's yours. Now operate

976
00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:29,920
Speaker 2: in this way. Right, The thirteen original colonies are formed

977
00:55:30,000 --> 00:55:34,840
Speaker 2: through that doctrine of discovery. Then Thomas Jefferson, one of

978
00:55:34,840 --> 00:55:38,520
Speaker 2: the guys that wrote the Constitution, that fought against the

979
00:55:38,520 --> 00:55:42,520
Speaker 2: Crown and all those powers, looks in his pocket and goes, oh,

980
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:46,759
Speaker 2: here's this doctrine of discovery concept that the Crown, you know,

981
00:55:46,840 --> 00:55:49,479
Speaker 2: sent us over here with let's go west and let's

982
00:55:49,560 --> 00:55:51,799
Speaker 2: use this same idea and we'll do we'll do it

983
00:55:51,840 --> 00:55:53,319
Speaker 2: all over and we're going to claim all of this

984
00:55:53,360 --> 00:56:00,920
Speaker 2: for hours, just as they did. There's something so horrifying

985
00:56:01,160 --> 00:56:05,640
Speaker 2: about that to me. I just look at some point

986
00:56:05,680 --> 00:56:08,040
Speaker 2: when you get a chance look through the history, and

987
00:56:08,360 --> 00:56:10,960
Speaker 2: again it's that you guys have talked about the Lewis

988
00:56:10,960 --> 00:56:13,200
Speaker 2: and Clark expedition at length. I know you have on

989
00:56:13,360 --> 00:56:15,799
Speaker 2: ridiculous history, right, and we've talked about it a little

990
00:56:15,840 --> 00:56:18,520
Speaker 2: bit on this show and maybe for some other shows.

991
00:56:18,560 --> 00:56:20,799
Speaker 2: I just remember having conversations with you guys off air

992
00:56:21,560 --> 00:56:26,520
Speaker 2: about those expeditions. The Louisiana Territory a Storia, which is

993
00:56:26,560 --> 00:56:31,120
Speaker 2: a whole insane story on its own, John Asters, isn't

994
00:56:31,160 --> 00:56:34,600
Speaker 2: it John Aster? Maybe I'm wrong, the guy who founded Astoria,

995
00:56:34,719 --> 00:56:38,680
Speaker 2: the first thing in the Pacific north northwest. It was

996
00:56:38,719 --> 00:56:42,080
Speaker 2: like a settlement that became the reasoning behind oh, this

997
00:56:42,120 --> 00:56:47,200
Speaker 2: is the United States territory now right right, Like the

998
00:56:47,360 --> 00:56:49,600
Speaker 2: story behind all of that and the core of northwestern

999
00:56:49,680 --> 00:56:54,880
Speaker 2: just discovery, It all just It really is horrifying, and

1000
00:56:54,920 --> 00:56:57,440
Speaker 2: I do not like looking at it or thinking about it.

1001
00:56:57,520 --> 00:56:59,960
Speaker 4: What can we devil's advocate?

1002
00:57:00,480 --> 00:57:00,560
Speaker 2: Like?

1003
00:57:00,600 --> 00:57:02,799
Speaker 4: What is the alternative? Like?

1004
00:57:03,360 --> 00:57:05,200
Speaker 3: What what could have.

1005
00:57:05,360 --> 00:57:08,320
Speaker 4: Led us to have the civilization that we have today

1006
00:57:09,560 --> 00:57:12,320
Speaker 4: that involved playing nice and auditor conies?

1007
00:57:12,960 --> 00:57:17,479
Speaker 3: Okay, fair enough, which the US absolutely did, But then.

1008
00:57:17,400 --> 00:57:19,640
Speaker 4: We wouldn't I don't think we wouldn't be what we

1009
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:22,680
Speaker 4: are today if we had just played nice, you know.

1010
00:57:23,040 --> 00:57:24,480
Speaker 4: I just think it's I think it would it would

1011
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:27,720
Speaker 4: be it would be something completely different, not resembling, you know,

1012
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:30,120
Speaker 4: the world that we see today, which I'm not saying

1013
00:57:30,240 --> 00:57:30,760
Speaker 4: is good or bad.

1014
00:57:31,000 --> 00:57:34,160
Speaker 3: It could be different, but being different doesn't mean it

1015
00:57:34,200 --> 00:57:37,200
Speaker 3: would be unequal to the current day, right, Like there's

1016
00:57:38,120 --> 00:57:42,960
Speaker 3: I I understand the allure of zero sum calculation, and

1017
00:57:43,040 --> 00:57:47,720
Speaker 3: it does occur pretty often, but maybe it's kind of Pollyanna,

1018
00:57:48,040 --> 00:57:49,600
Speaker 3: Like I hear you, man, and I think you're right.

1019
00:57:49,760 --> 00:57:52,560
Speaker 3: I just wish there was a better way, you know,

1020
00:57:52,920 --> 00:57:55,280
Speaker 3: And just like the stock market, just like the current

1021
00:57:55,320 --> 00:57:59,960
Speaker 3: geopolitical order, that kind of better way is another collective fiction,

1022
00:58:00,240 --> 00:58:03,360
Speaker 3: and it only works if the majority of civilization participates.

1023
00:58:03,760 --> 00:58:05,400
Speaker 4: That's right now, That's well said, Ben.

1024
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:10,760
Speaker 2: I think to get what we have now, you need

1025
00:58:11,520 --> 00:58:14,760
Speaker 2: armies and or people with weapons to go into a

1026
00:58:14,880 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 2: territory to claim land that holds resources that some entity

1027
00:58:19,600 --> 00:58:24,720
Speaker 2: can then use to turn into goods, right, and services

1028
00:58:24,760 --> 00:58:28,280
Speaker 2: and all of that stuff to then build power to

1029
00:58:28,360 --> 00:58:31,600
Speaker 2: make more guns, do that in more places. Idea it

1030
00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:33,320
Speaker 2: is it feels like that has to happen.

1031
00:58:33,480 --> 00:58:36,960
Speaker 4: Well, a justification for the government saying your tax money

1032
00:58:36,960 --> 00:58:39,000
Speaker 4: has to be spent on all these tanks has to

1033
00:58:39,040 --> 00:58:41,720
Speaker 4: be spent and make our military the best military, because

1034
00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:46,760
Speaker 4: otherwise everything you have is you know, question.

1035
00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:48,520
Speaker 3: People hate when I say it, but there is a

1036
00:58:48,680 --> 00:58:52,600
Speaker 3: little bit of validity to that. The global economy works

1037
00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:57,240
Speaker 3: because the US Navy in particular ensures the passage of goods.

1038
00:58:57,880 --> 00:59:01,360
Speaker 3: It's not a good thing necess but it does work.

1039
00:59:01,400 --> 00:59:03,720
Speaker 3: And I would say one thing we're forgetting here too,

1040
00:59:04,320 --> 00:59:08,480
Speaker 3: is that you know how sometimes in a strategy game

1041
00:59:08,840 --> 00:59:11,320
Speaker 3: or a video game of any sort, you can find

1042
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:13,840
Speaker 3: a loophole and you can sort of break your character

1043
00:59:14,120 --> 00:59:16,600
Speaker 3: or break a battle. The US has kind of done

1044
00:59:16,600 --> 00:59:20,680
Speaker 3: that with the feedback loop of armament, and combined with

1045
00:59:20,800 --> 00:59:26,520
Speaker 3: the enormous geographical barriers, it is incredibly difficult to get

1046
00:59:26,560 --> 00:59:28,960
Speaker 3: all the way over the Pacific, all the way over

1047
00:59:29,040 --> 00:59:33,320
Speaker 3: the Atlantic right, let alone get inside the interior of

1048
00:59:33,400 --> 00:59:35,400
Speaker 3: the US, or it has been for quite some time,

1049
00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:38,800
Speaker 3: which is part of why the US benefited so greatly

1050
00:59:39,160 --> 00:59:42,640
Speaker 3: from the post World War two economic boom. The game

1051
00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:45,400
Speaker 3: was broken for a minute, right, and it led to

1052
00:59:45,440 --> 00:59:49,760
Speaker 3: a superpower that was able to exercise a feedback loop

1053
00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:56,080
Speaker 3: in a way that was unparalleled since maybe the Mongol

1054
00:59:56,120 --> 01:00:00,720
Speaker 3: Empire when they figured out horses and cavalry attack. I mean,

1055
01:00:02,440 --> 01:00:06,120
Speaker 3: we can say the US made a lot of terrible missteps,

1056
01:00:06,160 --> 01:00:08,240
Speaker 3: and that's true. We can say the US had a

1057
01:00:08,280 --> 01:00:12,160
Speaker 3: lot of well intentioned things, that's also true. But the

1058
01:00:12,200 --> 01:00:14,200
Speaker 3: one thing we have to point out is that the

1059
01:00:14,280 --> 01:00:17,760
Speaker 3: US was very, very lucky, just like in game, like

1060
01:00:17,800 --> 01:00:21,080
Speaker 3: in the game Civilization, where you sometimes luck out and

1061
01:00:21,120 --> 01:00:23,840
Speaker 3: you get you know, your civilization starts on a continent

1062
01:00:23,880 --> 01:00:29,160
Speaker 3: by itself. But the US didn't, obviously, because they committed genocide.

1063
01:00:30,800 --> 01:00:32,400
Speaker 3: I don't know, wheels within.

1064
01:00:32,240 --> 01:00:36,000
Speaker 2: Wheels, oh exactly. Let's point out just one thing that

1065
01:00:36,160 --> 01:00:40,800
Speaker 2: this website rule of law dot org dot au points out. Ben,

1066
01:00:41,040 --> 01:00:43,680
Speaker 2: you shared this link, but there's a I don't know

1067
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:48,600
Speaker 2: much about this, but according to that website, under European

1068
01:00:48,640 --> 01:00:53,680
Speaker 2: Settlement and Terranolius. In nineteen ninety two, the Australian High

1069
01:00:53,680 --> 01:00:58,880
Speaker 2: Court saw a case that basically legally overturned what that

1070
01:00:58,960 --> 01:01:02,880
Speaker 2: site calls the Tera Nolius fiction, right, which I think

1071
01:01:02,920 --> 01:01:05,680
Speaker 2: we've kind of pointed out it's all one big fiction.

1072
01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:10,840
Speaker 2: And they actually recognized in that year nineteen ninety two

1073
01:01:10,960 --> 01:01:15,360
Speaker 2: that indigenous peoples of Australia have a deep connection to

1074
01:01:15,400 --> 01:01:18,680
Speaker 2: the land and that led to this thing called the

1075
01:01:18,800 --> 01:01:23,320
Speaker 2: Native Title Act of nineteen ninety three that went through

1076
01:01:23,320 --> 01:01:27,720
Speaker 2: parliament there in Australia. So at least one good thing occurred, right,

1077
01:01:28,040 --> 01:01:32,200
Speaker 2: But you know, as we know, that's one happy little

1078
01:01:32,240 --> 01:01:34,440
Speaker 2: moment in a sea of tragedy.

1079
01:01:34,960 --> 01:01:39,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, sort of like how we discovered new species because

1080
01:01:39,840 --> 01:01:43,640
Speaker 3: the ecology of the world is on fire. I don't know,

1081
01:01:43,680 --> 01:01:46,680
Speaker 3: you got to take the winds right and with this,

1082
01:01:47,440 --> 01:01:49,320
Speaker 3: you know, we went in a lot of directions, folks.

1083
01:01:49,520 --> 01:01:51,480
Speaker 3: I think we could argue we're also setting up some

1084
01:01:51,520 --> 01:01:57,080
Speaker 3: episodes in the future regarding borders, regarding hidden history for

1085
01:01:57,160 --> 01:01:59,240
Speaker 3: lack of a better term. We would love to hear

1086
01:01:59,240 --> 01:02:02,040
Speaker 3: from you, to hear your opinions on this. We'd love

1087
01:02:02,080 --> 01:02:05,400
Speaker 3: to hear your whether you think this is a zero

1088
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:10,040
Speaker 3: sum world and somebody else's win is inherently someone else's loss,

1089
01:02:10,600 --> 01:02:13,440
Speaker 3: or whether there's a better way possible, perhaps most importantly,

1090
01:02:14,200 --> 01:02:17,920
Speaker 3: pitch us the flag. If this episode has proven anything,

1091
01:02:18,120 --> 01:02:19,920
Speaker 3: we are sorely in need of a flag.

1092
01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:20,640
Speaker 4: You know.

1093
01:02:21,200 --> 01:02:23,920
Speaker 2: Isn't that the term pitching a flag to raise a flag?

1094
01:02:24,880 --> 01:02:27,360
Speaker 3: It's both, it's both. I'm doing levels, we're doing on

1095
01:02:27,480 --> 01:02:30,680
Speaker 3: a love it and I think you know, personally, I

1096
01:02:30,680 --> 01:02:32,480
Speaker 3: think all you're right. I think we got a winner

1097
01:02:32,520 --> 01:02:35,800
Speaker 3: with the hand that just makes a big impression. Right,

1098
01:02:35,880 --> 01:02:38,920
Speaker 3: So we'll get to the moon, we'll get to the ocean.

1099
01:02:39,280 --> 01:02:40,360
Speaker 3: We can't wait to hear from you.

1100
01:02:40,600 --> 01:02:42,560
Speaker 4: That's right. And you can reach out to us in

1101
01:02:42,640 --> 01:02:46,400
Speaker 4: many different ways, innumerable ways, first and foremost via your

1102
01:02:46,440 --> 01:02:48,520
Speaker 4: social media platform of choice, where we exist in the

1103
01:02:48,560 --> 01:02:52,720
Speaker 4: handle conspiracy stuff, on Facebook, where we have our Facebook

1104
01:02:52,760 --> 01:02:56,040
Speaker 4: group Here's where it gets crazy. On YouTube, where we're

1105
01:02:56,160 --> 01:03:00,560
Speaker 4: chocol block with video content every single week, and also

1106
01:03:00,680 --> 01:03:02,840
Speaker 4: on x FKA Twitter.

1107
01:03:03,600 --> 01:03:06,760
Speaker 2: Hey, do you like calling people with your phone? You

1108
01:03:06,800 --> 01:03:09,640
Speaker 2: can call us. Our number is one eight three three

1109
01:03:09,720 --> 01:03:14,280
Speaker 2: std WYTK when you call in like Eagle Scout did

1110
01:03:14,560 --> 01:03:17,600
Speaker 2: to let us know about this rumor going around the

1111
01:03:17,640 --> 01:03:21,000
Speaker 2: Internet that Russia had declared the sale of Alaska to

1112
01:03:21,040 --> 01:03:25,400
Speaker 2: the United States as being illegitimate. Sue's folly turns out

1113
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:29,600
Speaker 2: to be a bit of misinformation. Disinformation rather that was

1114
01:03:29,640 --> 01:03:33,080
Speaker 2: spread around that is not true. Eagle Scout. We did

1115
01:03:33,080 --> 01:03:34,680
Speaker 2: some digging on that. If you want to call in

1116
01:03:34,760 --> 01:03:37,480
Speaker 2: like that, give us an update on this episode or

1117
01:03:37,520 --> 01:03:40,280
Speaker 2: anything we've covered in the past. Please do you've got

1118
01:03:40,280 --> 01:03:42,560
Speaker 2: three minutes, give yourself a cool nickname, and let us

1119
01:03:42,600 --> 01:03:44,680
Speaker 2: know if we can use your message on the air.

1120
01:03:45,080 --> 01:03:46,640
Speaker 2: If you've got more to say than can fit in

1121
01:03:46,680 --> 01:03:50,240
Speaker 2: three minutes, you've got links, attachments, whatever, why not send

1122
01:03:50,320 --> 01:03:51,600
Speaker 2: us a good old fashioned email.

1123
01:03:51,800 --> 01:03:54,600
Speaker 3: We are the people who read every email we get

1124
01:03:54,920 --> 01:04:15,960
Speaker 3: conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

1125
01:04:16,120 --> 01:04:18,200
Speaker 2: Stuff they don't want you to know. Is a production

1126
01:04:18,280 --> 01:04:22,840
Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1127
01:04:22,920 --> 01:04:25,760
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.