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Speaker 1: Welcome to the show. Thanks for joining. This is going

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Speaker 1: to be a fun one. Well we're about to blow

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Speaker 1: the lid up but open on some really interesting stuff.

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Speaker 2: In terms of the Maha movement.

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Speaker 1: Which is a very very very popular movement in America

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Speaker 1: right now. I have to say, and Steve and I

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Speaker 1: have talked about this beforemat I have a number of friends,

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Speaker 1: including family members, who are die hard Maha. You know,

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Speaker 1: they really believe that a lot of the things that

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Speaker 1: are FK Junior and Callie Means have been saying about

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Speaker 1: the food industry and vaccines are legitimate, and some of

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Speaker 1: it is specifically on the food industry. You know, I

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Speaker 1: lived in Europe for a few years and I definitely

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Speaker 1: noticed that when you live in a place where there

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Speaker 1: are more regulations for your food, you are healthier. It's

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Speaker 1: not a proven thing, but you can just it's just

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Speaker 1: a feeling. You know, the fruit and isn't as beautiful,

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Speaker 1: but it's not you know, any pesticide. You know that

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Speaker 1: the skincare has two hundred products that can't go and

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Speaker 1: it's regulated. Here in America, we have fairly anything compared

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Speaker 1: to that. Even when they try to do a t

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Speaker 1: tip deal with Obama a transatlantic partnership deal back in

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Speaker 1: two thousand and fourteen. The Europeans didn't want to do

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Speaker 1: it because they thought they don't like that we actually

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Speaker 1: chlorinate our chicken. They think that we have too many

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Speaker 1: hormones in our beef. So there's a lot of there's

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Speaker 1: a lot to it that makes the MAHA movement compelling.

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Speaker 1: There are a lot of questions about what causes autism,

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Speaker 1: and so there are a lot of questions about what

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Speaker 1: causes a lot of disease, right And I think the

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Speaker 1: questions are where people come in and they try to

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Speaker 1: fill in the answers, and some of them do it dishonestly.

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Speaker 1: And that's sort of the direction of this show. Because

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Speaker 1: Steve has firsthand knowledge about Callie.

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Speaker 2: Means and who he is.

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Speaker 1: And you know, I first learned about him through friends,

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Speaker 1: through my aunt who's a nurse practitioner, told me she

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Speaker 1: was like, no, no, no, no, no, go read Callie Means book.

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Speaker 1: And and she and all a lot of the nurses

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Speaker 1: in her hospital is top hospital in North Carolina and Charlotte.

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Speaker 1: You know, they're all big believers in him. And she's like,

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Speaker 1: he was a lobbyist. He works for Coca cola. You

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Speaker 1: got to read it. Don't listen to anyone Tara, trust me,

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Speaker 1: trust me to trust me. And she's a smart woman.

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Speaker 1: Have other friends too that you know, they they're they're

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Speaker 1: they're worried about their children. They're like, why are why

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Speaker 1: are we giving them red red dyes? You know, why

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Speaker 1: are the Why are the fruit loops in Canada not

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Speaker 1: as bright? Why is you know, why is it different

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Speaker 1: when you go to another country when it comes to food.

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Speaker 1: But then there are the there are the fallacies that

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Speaker 1: are filled in the middle. And the people, the people

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Speaker 1: who are spreading some of these things, you know, they

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Speaker 1: have they make money from it. You know what I

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Speaker 1: mean that they make money from a lot of the

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Speaker 1: fall students that they spread or the theories that they

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Speaker 1: spread that don't have any backing, scientific backing. And so

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Speaker 1: this is all to say, and I'm laying this groundwork

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Speaker 1: to say that, like we're not saying that we should

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Speaker 1: not be regulating food. We are not saying that food products,

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Speaker 1: everything that you ingest should not have come with regulations.

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Speaker 1: But we have to be careful about the messengers and

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Speaker 1: their agendas. And so Steve so Vanity Fair comes out

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Speaker 1: with this huge piece. It's it's an expose on Calli Means.

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Speaker 2: Catherine Ybon.

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Speaker 1: I don't know her personally, but I've heard that she's

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Speaker 1: a good reporter and she's been working on this for

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Speaker 1: a long time.

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Speaker 2: And I'm just going to read you the quote from

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Speaker 2: the top of the piece.

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Speaker 1: The Dizzying rise of Maha Warrior, Calli Means, RFK Junior's

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Speaker 1: right hand man and one of the primary architects of

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Speaker 1: the Make America Healthy Again takeover of the federal health

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Speaker 1: app bratus. Means has risen to power and part on

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Speaker 1: the strength of his personal narrative. He was a big

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Speaker 1: food and big Barma lobbyist who saw the light. And

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Speaker 1: yet a six month Vanity Fair investigation raises questions about

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Speaker 1: whether Means had embellished his personal story. And this is

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Speaker 1: where Steve comes in, saying, Kelly Means is not a whistleblower.

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Speaker 1: He's an opportunist peddling junk science to make millions. So, Steve,

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Speaker 1: I think this is a good place for you to

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Speaker 1: jump in there and explain to our listeners what did

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Speaker 1: you mean by that.

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Speaker 3: Well, Calli Means was never a lobbyist ever, and he

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Speaker 3: never worked for Coca Cola. And the reason I know

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Speaker 3: that is because Calli Means was my assistant. And I

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Speaker 3: first met Callie Means on the McCain campaign. And Callie

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Speaker 3: Means was an ambitious young guy. There's lots of people

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Speaker 3: like that on a political campaign. And over the course

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Speaker 3: of the summer in the f Cali would pick me up,

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Speaker 3: drive me around in Crystal City, Virginia, And when the

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Speaker 3: campaign was over, I brought him back. I hired him

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Speaker 3: to be my assistant at Mercury Public Affairs, and I

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Speaker 3: was the founding partner of Mercury California. And at Mercury

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Speaker 3: Public Affairs, he was in charge of my logistics. I

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Speaker 3: was traveling three hundred and fifty thousand miles a year globally,

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Speaker 3: and he did my expenses. He did not lobby. Mercury

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Speaker 3: did not lobby. Mercury never represented Coca Cola or Pepsi,

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Speaker 3: and in fact represented clients on the opposite sides of

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Speaker 3: where those where those companies were. I left Mercury and

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Speaker 3: I joined Edelman, the global public relations firm, and I

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Speaker 3: was the vice chairman at Edelman, and I got Calli

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Speaker 3: a job at Edelman, and I curated Calli's acceptance process

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Speaker 3: to Harvard Business School. Personally, Wow made sure he had

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Speaker 3: the right letters of recommendation. One of my clients was

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Speaker 3: doctor Michael Porter, is one of the foremost business professors

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Speaker 3: in the United States. And there was a project that

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Speaker 3: we was working on. The Harvard Business School is involved

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Speaker 3: in Richard Edelman, who is the CEO of the company,

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Speaker 3: and I say to Richard, Kelly is a smart, capable

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Speaker 3: young guy wants to go to Harvard Business School. Richard

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Speaker 3: was an alumni of Harvard Business School, and so at

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Speaker 3: any rate, Calli did everything I could to curate Calli's

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Speaker 3: admission into Harvard Business School. Calli goes to Harvard Business School,

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Speaker 3: like not alone in this he meets the woman he

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Speaker 3: loves there gets married. She is a plant manager at

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Speaker 3: the time. Is if I would call the story correctly.

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Speaker 3: She was running an apple plant and was the youngest

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Speaker 3: plant manager ever to run one of these factories an

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Speaker 3: American in Asia. And what they figured out together and

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Speaker 3: it was kind of genius, is that there's this one

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Speaker 3: town this is after Harvard Business School in China, that

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Speaker 3: where ninety eight percent of all the world's wedding dresses

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Speaker 3: are made and if you know, it doesn't matter, right,

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Speaker 3: you're your twenty five thousand dollars wedding dress, your three

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Speaker 3: hundred thousand dollars wedding dress, You're three hundred dollars wedding dress.

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Speaker 3: They're all made in the same place and.

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Speaker 2: Cow like eyeglasses in that town in Italy. It's so crazy.

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Speaker 3: One one town makes all the wedding dresses. And he

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Speaker 3: came up with this, with this idea that you could

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Speaker 3: basically have a customized wedding dress made curated. He sold

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Speaker 3: that business, but Calli was never a lobbyist, and Edelman,

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Speaker 3: the global PR firm, their client was Pepsi, not Coca Cola. So,

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Speaker 3: just as a matter of the space time continuum, from

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Speaker 3: the end of the McCain campaign through today, Callie Means

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Speaker 3: just did none of the things that he said he did.

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Speaker 3: And yet the New York Times last week and other

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Speaker 3: news organizations on a constant basis introduced Calli Means as

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Speaker 3: having done these things. And he is as big a

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Speaker 3: fabulous with regard to having done those things as Elizabeth

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Speaker 3: Holmes or Sam Bankmin Freed or George Santos. And so

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Speaker 3: we sit here, we scratch our heads as a society

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Speaker 3: and in the media, how is it right that this

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Speaker 3: report is just released Public Health Lives of the American

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Speaker 3: People at Stake by MAHA, the Great Maja Report. And

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Speaker 3: it turns out right that it's written by an AI

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Speaker 3: and there's made up citations, made up of medical reports,

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Speaker 3: junk science all over it. Well, and it turns out

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Speaker 3: that the guy who spearheaded the effort was my assistant

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Speaker 3: who used to do a bad job with my expenses.

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Speaker 3: And I promise you, right if you care about these issues,

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Speaker 3: I care about these issues. I think that it's important

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Speaker 3: to remember that the FDA created a highly permissive environment

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Speaker 3: for a company to wipe out a million American lives

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Speaker 3: with with opioids and corrupt deals. Right, so there's a

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Speaker 3: lot of corruption. But the point is is the guy

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Speaker 3: that has become a real zealot, intimidating reporters, shouting down people,

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Speaker 3: has has no credentials whatsoever. And his sister is the

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Speaker 3: Attorney general, excuse me, is the Surgeon general nominee now,

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Speaker 3: And what they are is wellness influencer. She did not

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Speaker 3: finish her residency. She rang the bell, she quit, right,

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Speaker 3: she didn't measure up. I don't know what to say.

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Speaker 3: She didn't finish the program, and so I should be

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Speaker 3: disqualifying for a young physician who didn't complete their residence.

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Speaker 3: C top surge in general, but at any rate, they

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Speaker 3: have a sprawling wellness business empire. Cally has no credentials whatsoever,

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Speaker 3: and he is conflicted from a business perspective one hundred

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Speaker 3: different ways to Sunday. And he's making these policies sitting

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Speaker 3: there in the White House's special government employee and is

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Speaker 3: Robert Kennedy's top advisor, and all of it is nonsense.

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Speaker 3: And people who have entertained Kelly, who've had him on

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Speaker 3: Megan Kelly looks at Joe Scarborough and criticizes him for

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Speaker 3: coverage on Joe Biden. Well, Megan Kelly has celebrated means

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Speaker 3: And I'm here to tell you just as a matter

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Speaker 3: of fact, under the sun because I know because he

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Speaker 3: was my assistant, that he has no credentials whatsoever and

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Speaker 3: he made up this entire story and I want to

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Speaker 3: get that type.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's exactly what I want to talk

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Speaker 1: about with you, Steve, Like, not only I read in

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Speaker 1: this piece, did he completely mess up your expenses?

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Speaker 2: So it sounds like he really just did.

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Speaker 1: There's an anecdote in which scene is trying to get

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Speaker 1: a Starbucks coffee and his credit card is denied because

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Speaker 1: his assistant of the Z I'm calling means it's alleged

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Speaker 1: healthcare lobbyists at the time at Mercury, which was not

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Speaker 1: lobbying for a beverage company at the time, right, you.

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Speaker 2: Know, they that he wasn't filing your expenses.

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Speaker 1: But like, let's really talk about what you were working

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Speaker 1: on the time, what he was doing. How if in

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Speaker 1: any way he could conflate this or confabulate this, Like

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Speaker 1: what how could he have just completely you know, pulled

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Speaker 1: this out at the there?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I know that at Edelman they.

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Speaker 1: You did work for Pepsi, so that meant it would

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Speaker 1: be a conflict of interest to work for for coke.

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Speaker 1: But at Edelman, like what kind of meetings would he

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Speaker 1: even could he have even had access to as an assistant.

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Speaker 3: Well, he wasn't an assistant at Edelman whatever whatever title

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Speaker 3: he had. But he was a young guy in his

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Speaker 3: in his twenties. He was working on research projects, making

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Speaker 3: decks and on anyone of a number of different things

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Speaker 3: he was working on. So for example, that Harvard competitive

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Speaker 3: project with Michael Porter, who's a who's a towering intellect.

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Speaker 3: Calli was intellectually engaged. He's a he's a very smart guy.

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Speaker 3: He was doing complicated research projects for companies. Uh that

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Speaker 3: people would say, hey that you know, whether it's in

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Speaker 3: you know what whatever space. Ge General Electric was a

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Speaker 3: big client of mine, but Kelly didn't work on it.

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Speaker 3: But whatever projects he worked worked on the one, the

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Speaker 3: one that was most significant was this competitive project with

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Speaker 3: Harvard Business School. He was absolutely not involved in brokering

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Speaker 3: financial transactions that were corrupt acts between Coca Cola or

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Speaker 3: Pepsi or any company and the NAACP. You know, Calli

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Speaker 3: means has invented this story like he's Jeffrey Wygan, the

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Speaker 3: tobacco whistleblower of sixty minutes fame. And this reads almost

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Speaker 3: like a movie script of his own invention that he

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Speaker 3: saw the light after all these corrupt deals. It never happened.

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Speaker 3: You know. At Mercury, I did projects when I was

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Speaker 3: doing that type of work. I was the lead strategist

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Speaker 3: for the San Francisco forty nine ers and the construction

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Speaker 3: of their stadium. As they exited San Francisco, A lot

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Speaker 3: of politics. I was the chief strategist for a coalition

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Speaker 3: of companies for Blu Ray DVD in the format war

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Speaker 3: versus HDA DVD. I represented the studios and the writers strike.

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Speaker 3: I represented Indian tribes in the gaming compacts. I did

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Speaker 3: not represent any of the interests that he is talking about.

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Speaker 3: And specifically, Edelman has a no lobbying policy. Edelman is

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Speaker 3: an independent family business. Richard Edelman is the CEO and chairman.

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Speaker 3: Dan Edelman was the founder of the company. Edelman does

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Speaker 3: not lobby and has not lobbied, though Richard today is

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Speaker 3: a registered is a registered lobbyist, But that's a different

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Speaker 3: but that's a different story and a different requirement from

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Speaker 3: work that he.

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Speaker 2: Does and to be a lobbyist.

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Speaker 1: Just to be clear to everyone here, if you are

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Speaker 1: a registered lobby you have to file, you have to report.

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Speaker 1: It is a public document if you are a lobbyist.

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Speaker 1: And there are there any documents that show that CALLI

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Speaker 1: means was ever a registered lobbyist?

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Speaker 3: None, none, whatsoever.

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Speaker 2: He's a hole in the story.

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Speaker 3: He's no more a registered lobbyist than I'm a tree, right,

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Speaker 3: I look like one today? You look like a bush exactly.

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Speaker 3: First bush got that question once he was He was

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Speaker 3: asked on the campaign trail, if you were a tree,

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Speaker 3: what type of tree would you be? And he looked

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Speaker 3: back at the reporter and he said, I'm a bush,

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Speaker 3: I thought, which it was pretty quick witted.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a good one.

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Speaker 3: Man. No, but he was never. He was never. He

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Speaker 3: was never a lobbyist, and he never did any of

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Speaker 3: that type of work right at Edelman or at Mercury.

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Speaker 3: And I can account for every minute of his employment

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Speaker 3: between the John McCain campaign and his exit to Harvard

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Speaker 3: Business School, which I helped him get into. I was.

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Speaker 3: You know, his father came up to me at a

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Speaker 3: campfire outside the rich Carlton resort in Half Moon Bay,

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Speaker 3: which is another thing. You know, Calli grew up with

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Speaker 3: a lot of affluence, and his father said to me,

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Speaker 3: you know, you're the most important figure in Callie's life.

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Speaker 3: You made him a man, right like I, Calli worked

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Speaker 3: for me for years. I stewarted Calli's career, right Calli

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Speaker 3: Kelly was a very awkward, twenty twenty three year old,

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Speaker 3: and taught him how to pay attention to detail and

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Speaker 3: function in society. Basically, it was first three months at

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Speaker 3: work he gave everybody a snuggie, right, this type of

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Speaker 3: blanket right that I guess was the gift of the year.

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Speaker 3: It was not appropriate for the workplace. And he was

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Speaker 3: just this kind of awkward, really smart Standford kid trying

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Speaker 3: to trying to feel his way. And you know, it's

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Speaker 3: interesting when you hear and talk about all of Robert. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: when he says Robert Kennedy, he makes his pronouncements the

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Speaker 3: most important habist secretary in history, you know, like more

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Speaker 3: important than George Marshall. Right, it's a come on, And

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Speaker 3: it's so you see this guy, the rhetoric that he

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Speaker 3: employs and the hyperbole he routinely engages in, and it's

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Speaker 3: all nonsense. It's all a con it's all made up,

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Speaker 3: and it's it's very very discouraging for a lot of

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Speaker 3: people who knew this guy, who have all sorts of

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Speaker 3: different different opinions and all sorts of different issues. You know,

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Speaker 3: we have people that we worked with, you know, back

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Speaker 3: in those years, We have special needs kids that struggle

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Speaker 3: with OBCD themselves that whatever the issue is, right, there's

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Speaker 3: a broad sympathy, is what you said at the beginning.

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Speaker 3: For Yeah, Right, there's like the food in the country's

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Speaker 3: messed up, right, there's a lot of corruption in all

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Speaker 3: of this, and it's a disaster. But this guy selling

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Speaker 3: snake oil and saying that he did these things when

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Speaker 3: in fact he was given a lot of opportunities and

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Speaker 3: now he's take taking those opportunities and twisted them into

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Speaker 3: something villainous, which is completely imaginary, and right, made up

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Speaker 3: this story to make to make millions of dollars, and

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Speaker 3: it's it's a palling, it's.

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Speaker 1: A paul Yeah, yeah, I mean, do you ever regret

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Speaker 1: how you helped him?

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Speaker 3: Well, like you know, I have I have another guy,

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Speaker 3: right who was at the same time as my as

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Speaker 3: an assistant. And this guy goes to law school and

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Speaker 3: joins the Navy and becomes the number one defense attorney

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Speaker 3: in the Pacific Fleet. And then he decides, well, I

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Speaker 3: hear a different calling, and he becomes a priest, and

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Speaker 3: he goes to the Pope's seminary and Vatican and he's

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Speaker 3: he's going to be a chaplain right back on active

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Speaker 3: duties at a parish in San Diego, deploying with the Marine.

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Speaker 3: So you know, I don't you know, I'm not his dad, right,

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Speaker 3: I'm not as I'm not a family. Right, he worked

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Speaker 3: for me, that gotffded opportunities. But when it's extraordinary to

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Speaker 3: watch the delusion of somebody who's made up this story

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Speaker 3: and gotten deeper and deeper and deeper and deeper into

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Speaker 3: it without a seeming care in the world that the

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Speaker 3: people that know the truth about it at some point,

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Speaker 3: who are all involved in politics at somewhat, and particularly me, right,

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Speaker 3: is that is not going to call is not going

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Speaker 3: to call it out. And and to me, what's so

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Speaker 3: offensive about him in this moment is when when you

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Speaker 3: talk about this issue at the core and obesity, and

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Speaker 3: you can look at all the crazy things he's said

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Speaker 3: about it. This is fundamentally an issue related to poverty

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Speaker 3: in America. This is this is a socioeconomic issue. Right,

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Speaker 3: if you live in Marine, you have a lot of

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Speaker 3: good food choices, Right, if you if you grew up

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Speaker 3: in the places that Cali means grew up in. Right,

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Speaker 3: if you have your own shaman. Right, you're in a

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Speaker 3: sweat lodge with Robert Kennedy having visions about bringing Robert

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Speaker 3: Kennedy and Donald Trump together and all this good for you?

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Speaker 2: You're right, right, You're right.

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Speaker 1: They don't like they're not using those skin products and

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Speaker 1: have all this shit in it. They're not eating the

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Speaker 1: chicken with all the hormones from Tyson's. They're not eating

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Speaker 1: you know, They're they're eating their farm fresh chickens from

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Speaker 1: their backyard that their chefs are cooking and they're living

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Speaker 1: their organic high life. And you're right and claiming that

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Speaker 1: they're fighting for the rest of the country so that

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Speaker 1: they can be healthier. And I again like believe in

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Speaker 1: the regulation of food, big food, big pharma. They're stopping

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Speaker 1: a lot of this. It is insane. It's like the

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Speaker 1: it's like the military industrial complex, how powerful it is

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Speaker 1: in DC, and it should it needs to be challenged,

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Speaker 1: but like, are these the right people to.

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Speaker 2: Be challenging it?

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Speaker 1: And then and it's just like and then they're selling

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Speaker 1: their supplements, they're selling their products, they're selling their stories,

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Speaker 1: and some of them are dangerous, especially the anti vax

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Speaker 1: stories without having any science behind them. And then you

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Speaker 1: hear about people like believing that they can cure their

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Speaker 1: cancer without gutting treatments. They're like, there needs to be

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Speaker 1: we can't ignore the science either. I think it's helpy

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Speaker 1: to question science. I think it's helpy to question where

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Speaker 1: money is coming from, who's paying for what? I think

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Speaker 1: like the root of what they were trying to do

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Speaker 1: resonates with people because they feel it. They feel that

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Speaker 1: there is something off right. Otherwise they wouldn't it wouldn't resonate.

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Speaker 3: So so when you think about the decision to go

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Speaker 3: to the moon right as a country, like, we're gonna

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Speaker 3: we're gonna fly a rocket, right, a space capsule to

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Speaker 3: the moon, And so getting to the moon right is

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Speaker 3: as as that capsule physically arriving at the moon, right,

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Speaker 3: that's an aeronautical engineering challenge. And then and then that

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Speaker 3: capsule separates and there's a landing craft and that that

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Speaker 3: thing's got to touch down on the mood and that's

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Speaker 3: a that's a piloting challenge. The decision about whether to

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Speaker 3: go to the moon, that's politics, right, And so when

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Speaker 3: we think about science and we think about the pandemic,

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Speaker 3: there was assertions of science as fact that may have

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Speaker 3: been correct, may not have been correct. But at the

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Speaker 3: end of the day, a scientist saying well, this is

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Speaker 3: what the science says is not the same thing as

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Speaker 3: what the politics says. Because there were a lot of

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Speaker 3: people in the country who didn't comprehend why they couldn't

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Speaker 3: walk on that trail in the woods or on the

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Speaker 3: beach or in the park. Right, that was a political decision, Right,

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Speaker 3: that was wrapped up. Well, the scientists or the doctor

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Speaker 3: or the public health expert said that. And when you

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Speaker 3: say enough of that, and it doesn't make sense because

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Speaker 3: the person is told, well, hey, I'm out here in

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Speaker 3: this fucking park at seven in the morning with Mike

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Speaker 3: Dogg and I'm not within a quarter mile of another person.

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Speaker 3: Why am I being chased out of the park here? Oh,

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Speaker 3: because there's been some pronouncement from some public health official

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Speaker 3: and so yeah, did it make sense? Right? So the

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Speaker 3: choices in the lanes and everything got scrambled, and there

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Speaker 3: has been a revolution against science and against these agencies

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Speaker 3: that's been stoked by demagogues. And let's face it, right,

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Speaker 3: I think one of the most powerful political shows that

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Speaker 3: has been made in the twenty first century, it explains

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Speaker 3: Donald Trump is Danny Strong's Dope Sick with Michael Keaton

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Speaker 3: that tells the story of the opioid crisis through the

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Speaker 3: prism of Appalachia. Is in this Virginia.

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Speaker 2: I started watching that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a stop we didn't talk about any of

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Speaker 3: this stuff in the country to twenty and sixty ye

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Speaker 3: million people died. A million people died, and the FDA said, hey,

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Speaker 3: this stuff was good, it wasn't addicting. And the person

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Speaker 3: who said it at the FDA worked for the company, right,

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Speaker 3: and then went to the FDA and back and forth,

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Speaker 3: and it's all corrupt. Yeah, So what you're doing when

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Speaker 3: you think about the journalism of this independent journalism, the

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Speaker 3: muck rackers in the early twentieth century up in Sinclair

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Speaker 3: looks like in jungle. They were all about the food supply.

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Speaker 1: That's exactly what they went for because it's about the people, right,

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Speaker 1: It's about the poorest people. It was when the robber

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Speaker 1: barons were controlling the country, the Rockefellers, you know, the

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Speaker 1: oil barons, and the people the minority, a lot of

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Speaker 1: them coming from you know, actually are people, a lot

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Speaker 1: of them coming from Europe at that time, living in

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Speaker 1: the tenements, living in the slums. And it was at

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Speaker 1: the time when there was a real progressive revolution, and

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Speaker 1: it was through journalism, often yellow journalism. It was it

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Speaker 1: was Bulletzer, Joseph Pultzer and what he was doing at

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Speaker 1: the time, and these journalists were going undercover and they

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Speaker 1: were exposing the these you know, these atrocities like in

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Speaker 1: the asylums like Nelly bly and and in the meatpacking.

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Speaker 1: So it's like the root of the root of the

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Speaker 1: exploration is important, right, but like we need to make

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Speaker 1: sure that the people that are the messengers are not

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Speaker 1: you know, grifting from this, are not well. And Steph,

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Speaker 1: I think the thing that shocks me's like, how did

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Speaker 1: the New York Times not get this when they just

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Speaker 1: published a post on calling.

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Speaker 3: Me it is one of the things that I talked

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Speaker 3: about all the time. I've written about it hundreds of times. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: we don't. We don't have Donald Trump without a lot

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Speaker 3: of eruption in our political system. And the one of

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Speaker 3: the foremost areas of corruption is access media, right, And

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Speaker 3: what access media is is the transaction, right that occurs

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Speaker 3: when that reporter does a profile on Cali Means for

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Speaker 3: the purposes of achieving access to the things that cali

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Speaker 3: Means can help that person easily access in their reporting.

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Speaker 3: And so what cali Means is doing needs to be confronted,

431
00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:43,359
Speaker 3: not coddled, and not explained on Cali's terms, because what's

432
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:48,119
Speaker 3: happening at HHS and in the Trump budget is the

433
00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:58,000
Speaker 3: decimation of research across a dozen areas, hundreds of diseases impacted.

434
00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 3: And so if you if you think about the clime

435
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:09,159
Speaker 3: of human knowledge, you know, to me, what really they

436
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 3: kind of almost had an emotional impact was it was pondering.

437
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:15,359
Speaker 3: It was really like deep out in the woods looking

438
00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:19,479
Speaker 3: up at the sky thinking about the web telescope that

439
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:23,640
Speaker 3: our country made it. And it's the most complex scientific

440
00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:28,200
Speaker 3: instrument ever built. And it's and it can literally see

441
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:32,600
Speaker 3: back to the origins of the universe, to the beginning

442
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:38,040
Speaker 3: of time, and it's a thing of wonder and marvel

443
00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:40,280
Speaker 3: and right, you know, I think that Paul Simon song, right,

444
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 3: we live in an age of miracle and wonder, right,

445
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:47,440
Speaker 3: And so this upward trajectory, but in a one hundred and

446
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:52,480
Speaker 3: fifty days, right, whatever that trajectory is, it's reached its

447
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 3: apagy and it's falling back or it's coming over the parabola. Right.

448
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:01,480
Speaker 3: The disease that was on a track to be cured

449
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 3: is no longer on a track to be cured because

450
00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:11,760
Speaker 3: of the vandalism, the arson, the insanity, the nihilism, and

451
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 3: the guy who's a principal agent of it, incredibly was

452
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:21,520
Speaker 3: my assistant. But his whole origin story that's given him

453
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:25,920
Speaker 3: the license to do this stuff is a fabrication.

454
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, Steve, that is like a lot to swallow. Also,

455
00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:34,080
Speaker 1: as I as I've been sick for a week wondering

456
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:36,160
Speaker 1: if i have the second strain of COVID and I'm

457
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,000
Speaker 1: about to go out, no seriously, because it's back, and

458
00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:41,320
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm about to go act out today and

459
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:47,560
Speaker 1: get a task. But yeah, this is as it's frightening.

460
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:48,680
Speaker 2: You don't mess with help.

461
00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:50,959
Speaker 1: I mean, it impacts everybody, and you know what, it

462
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 1: impacts the rich people to eventually and that's eventually, but

463
00:29:57,320 --> 00:30:02,200
Speaker 1: it's usually it's not it's from the bottom and it

464
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:04,320
Speaker 1: starts with the bottom, and it's it's.

465
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:06,400
Speaker 2: A it's a sad fact.

466
00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:09,200
Speaker 1: I mean, these things that they want to reform and change,

467
00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:11,200
Speaker 1: they can be done. They don't need to be smeth

468
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:16,480
Speaker 1: apart with a sledgehammer. You know, they can be explored.

469
00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:20,160
Speaker 1: We can have scientists debating things, we can go back

470
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:26,040
Speaker 1: into research there, we can talk. Frankly, we should be

471
00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:29,760
Speaker 1: talking about regulation and how we I haven't really seen

472
00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:31,640
Speaker 1: any of that from them either. The stuff that I

473
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:33,560
Speaker 1: was like almost hoping you would see It's not like

474
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 1: you're seeing that right away.

475
00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 2: You're not.

476
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:38,560
Speaker 1: You're not seeing what kind of progress that could be made.

477
00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:42,480
Speaker 1: I think that there was something with the dyes. They definitely,

478
00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:47,440
Speaker 1: you know, have banned red dye.

479
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:47,920
Speaker 2: And that's that's probably a good thing.

480
00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 1: I mean, there's no if it's if it's banned in

481
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:51,840
Speaker 1: other countries, there's no reason that we should have it

482
00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:53,520
Speaker 1: in our country.

483
00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:56,200
Speaker 2: But I think.

484
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,480
Speaker 1: It's just it's it's a lot of destruction that's really

485
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:04,040
Speaker 1: hard to reverse. And then when you lose these these scientists,

486
00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:07,800
Speaker 1: these doctors, these these dedicated professionals that frankly could be

487
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,560
Speaker 1: making a lot of money elsewhere you don't need to

488
00:31:10,560 --> 00:31:14,440
Speaker 1: work in government. I mean, they're highly qualified people. Have

489
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:16,600
Speaker 1: you guys hoot talent.

490
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:21,640
Speaker 3: Back watching Kelli means become a world class Twitter bully,

491
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:27,200
Speaker 3: tormenting some of the world releading research scientists, right and

492
00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 3: alleging conspiracies. And you know, the common theme is to

493
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:35,560
Speaker 3: accuse everybody being on the take of this insidious industry.

494
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:38,400
Speaker 3: And and you know the really the reality is Robert

495
00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:42,440
Speaker 3: Kennedy is is ethically compromised and he serves, you know,

496
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 3: the most ethically compromised administration. Right that that there's that,

497
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 3: there's that there's ever been right, it's it's astonishing, and

498
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:57,160
Speaker 3: so at any rate, it's a free country. Right, there

499
00:31:57,200 --> 00:32:00,680
Speaker 3: is an intolerance right in the politics. If you want

500
00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 3: to go live in the woods and not vaccinate yourselves, right,

501
00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:09,680
Speaker 3: good for you, and I mean it right with no

502
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:12,880
Speaker 3: with no with no condescension. Right. But if you want

503
00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:16,760
Speaker 3: to access the public school, right, we can't. You can't

504
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 3: have epidemics breaking out on cure diseases that were thought extinct,

505
00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 3: right because of insanity of a mob that's trying to

506
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 3: impose their neolism as public health policy on the same population.

507
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 3: And so the people that are doing this and are

508
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 3: doing it for profit, and Robert Kennedy has a lot

509
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:45,640
Speaker 3: of ethical issues with regard with regard to all of this.

510
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:49,000
Speaker 3: And the reality is is that you're going to have

511
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:54,000
Speaker 3: as a political issue, how do we fix and how

512
00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 3: do we restore America as a foremost leading nation scientifically?

513
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:03,040
Speaker 3: I mean European Union, as you know, is giving away

514
00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:07,880
Speaker 3: enormous incentives now at cash to lower American scientists. There's

515
00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:12,640
Speaker 3: going to be an enormous immigration incentive structure. You know,

516
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:16,000
Speaker 3: to get the American entrepreneur, to get the American scientists,

517
00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 3: to get the American researcher into European labs, into Canadian labs,

518
00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:26,400
Speaker 3: in two labs where none of this insanity exists, Right.

519
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:31,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, Steve, I'm not really feeling that well.

520
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:34,080
Speaker 1: I don't know if anyone can tell from my eyes

521
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:36,160
Speaker 1: my dog's having a meltdown.

522
00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:39,600
Speaker 2: But this was really really enlightening.

523
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:43,400
Speaker 1: I'd love to pick this up again, but like all like,

524
00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:45,880
Speaker 1: thank you for your bravery because I read that article

525
00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:48,200
Speaker 1: and there are a lot of people that were on background.

526
00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:50,360
Speaker 1: I understand for a lot of reasons why people don't

527
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:52,640
Speaker 1: go on the record. I think there were about nine

528
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 1: people on background in that article that I've worked with.

529
00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:59,480
Speaker 1: CALLI at some point you were on the record, and

530
00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:01,960
Speaker 1: I think another person, Yeah, I believe there was one

531
00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:05,160
Speaker 1: other person, So yeah, I think I'm sure it's not.

532
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:06,760
Speaker 2: Going to You're going to get heat for that. So

533
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 2: you know, as a.

534
00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 1: Journalist, we need our sources to come out and speak

535
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:15,400
Speaker 1: because often if you don't have someone willing to go

536
00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 1: on the record, a story like that dies and you

537
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:21,160
Speaker 1: never know about it. So thank you to the with

538
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:24,839
Speaker 1: the real whistleblowers really and appreciate that.

539
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:27,440
Speaker 3: I feel better at Tara and until it's good to

540
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:30,200
Speaker 3: be with you, and you know, again, everyone who joined us,

541
00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:34,600
Speaker 3: you know, wherever you think about the issue, you should

542
00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:37,520
Speaker 3: be guided by a person who at least did the

543
00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:40,480
Speaker 3: things they said they did as part of their credential

544
00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:43,279
Speaker 3: to tell you about the things that you should be

545
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:46,160
Speaker 3: doing with your health. That the last person you ever

546
00:34:46,200 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 3: want to be listening to is a person who made

547
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 3: up all their credentials while they're simultaneously telling you how

548
00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 3: you ought to live your life and how you ought

549
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:58,560
Speaker 3: to live your life with regard to your healthcare and

550
00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:01,680
Speaker 3: what's put in your mouth and who's doing what to you,

551
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:05,400
Speaker 3: and so the fraudulence is important to see, and we

552
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:07,840
Speaker 3: live in an age of real dishonesty, and so it

553
00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:10,520
Speaker 3: was my pleasure to speak out on the record and

554
00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:13,480
Speaker 3: call it out. But yeah, Tar and feel better.

555
00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:16,799
Speaker 1: Thank you, and thank you all for joining, and thanks

556
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:18,719
Speaker 1: to everyone who'said feel better and very kind of you.

557
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:21,799
Speaker 2: And of course you can support both of our journalism.

558
00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:24,520
Speaker 1: You can support Steve at the Warning Excuse Me, and

559
00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:27,320
Speaker 1: you can support me at the Red Letter by becoming subscribers.

560
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:30,640
Speaker 1: We appreciate your time and that you tuned in for

561
00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:31,840
Speaker 1: this incredible story.

562
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:35,920
Speaker 3: I'm Steve Schmidt. This is the warning. I invite you

563
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:39,920
Speaker 3: to join this community, where I promise to be honest, blunt,

564
00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 3: and direct about what is happening in this country. America

565
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:47,960
Speaker 3: is in crisis. Follow and subscribe to this channel and

566
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:50,920
Speaker 3: on substack. Thank you,