Speaker 1: Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership
Speaker 1: with Reason Choice Media.
Speaker 2: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome.
Speaker 1: Welcome, welcome.
Speaker 3: Well, So set, what's up everybody. This is Andrew Gillham
Speaker 3: coming to you from a little bit of a change
Speaker 3: of scenery. I'm so tired of my office and doing
Speaker 3: these episodes out of the other like going to the
Speaker 3: living room today. But most importantly, we're continuing our conversation
Speaker 3: on this series of you know, organizing in the aftermath
Speaker 3: of Trump two point zero, and I was a little
Speaker 3: bit concerned about some of the recent writing I've seen
Speaker 3: on the black community sort of taking arrest break and
Speaker 3: not yet being willing to be on the front lines
Speaker 3: of organizing a movement. I reject that outright. I know
Speaker 3: that not to be true as a as a matter
Speaker 3: of fact, but we do see a lot of conversation
Speaker 3: and social media and elsewhere about basically, you know, for
Speaker 3: black women, Look, we're the ninety eight percent, we're the
Speaker 3: one ninety percent. We're there, We're tried and true. Now
Speaker 3: it's something for you all to do, so we know
Speaker 3: that it exists, it's not coming out of thin air.
Speaker 3: And today to help me sort of diagnose this to
Speaker 3: drill a little bit deeper for just a few minutes
Speaker 3: of our day, because I'm sure you all out there
Speaker 3: are engaging in this conversation as well. Is a fellow Floridian?
Speaker 2: Is that right?
Speaker 3: You're Jacksonville right.
Speaker 2: Raise in Jacksonville, Florida.
Speaker 3: Jacksonville native who happens to be striking it hot in Washington,
Speaker 3: d C. Even and gystopian Washington, d C. Under the
Speaker 3: Trump administration, you're finding a way to have impact and
Speaker 3: make change. I would love for you to just give
Speaker 3: your vita, but do it in a way that I
Speaker 3: know you know how to, which is by of just
Speaker 3: conversation introducing what your experiences have been that have led
Speaker 3: you to this particular political moment and how we're navigating it.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So, hey, y'all, my name is Dianna Burton, as
Speaker 2: mister Gilliman.
Speaker 3: And I Andrew Andrew, Oh gosh.
Speaker 2: I'm from the South. You know it's coming. But as
Speaker 2: he mentioned, I'm from Jacksonville, Florida. I now reside in DC.
Speaker 2: And prior to me getting in a little bit about myself,
Speaker 2: I do want to preface I do not have all
Speaker 2: the answers. I will try my best to engage in
Speaker 2: this conversation. I worked on a multitude of campaigns and
Speaker 2: multitude of offices, from the local state to the federal level,
Speaker 2: and now I'm here in BC where everything's happening, so
Speaker 2: happy to answer anything.
Speaker 3: Well, I'll tell you your involvement in Florida prior to
Speaker 3: going off to Washington, prior to becoming what we might
Speaker 3: describe as sort of professional staff on political campaigns, and
Speaker 3: so on and so forth. Many of our listeners are
Speaker 3: agitated and frustrated and want to know what they could
Speaker 3: do right where they are to disrupt what they see
Speaker 3: happening in the country. And I would argue probably not
Speaker 3: just at the federal level, but it's trickling down as
Speaker 3: Trump naseum continues into our local levels, our school boards,
Speaker 3: our city council meetings, the kind of divides that local
Speaker 3: government never had to experience. They're now coming fast and furious,
Speaker 3: and our heads are on a swivel, just trying to
Speaker 3: protect the little turf that we do have. What advice
Speaker 3: would you give to folks who are just starting out.
Speaker 3: They want to make an impact, they just don't know
Speaker 3: what to do.
Speaker 2: So to answer that question, I'm actually going to tell
Speaker 2: a story in reference to Michelle Obama famously saying do
Speaker 2: something back in twenty nineteen, twenty twenty, my apologies. I
Speaker 2: was elected senior class president of my high school, what
Speaker 2: was then Robert E. Lee High School. I'm seventeen. It
Speaker 2: was following the summer of twenty twenty, and we all
Speaker 2: know the activism and the activation that was happening there.
Speaker 2: Our school board introduced a docket to remove all Confederate
Speaker 2: tied names from public institutions. My school being named after
Speaker 2: Robert E. Lee, it was one of the most profound
Speaker 2: names and there I was also part of the student
Speaker 2: advisory council, So I attended a couple of meetings as
Speaker 2: part of the student Advisory Council member and this year
Speaker 2: class president. But one of the public hearings, I noticed
Speaker 2: that there were I was the only student there other
Speaker 2: than teachers and the principal. The auditorium was filled with alumni.
Speaker 2: My school was desegregated and I want to say the seventies,
Speaker 2: so we had a lot of angry alumni that stated
Speaker 2: that there was nothing wrong with the name Robert E.
Speaker 2: Lee and if there was something wrong or if somebody
Speaker 2: had a problem with the name. It's probably because it's
Speaker 2: a predominantly black school now, and maybe we should go
Speaker 2: back to segregation. Following that, right following that public hearing,
Speaker 2: we started getting more alumni with Confederate flags, with newses,
Speaker 2: screaming more and more racial slurs. And I was seventeen.
Speaker 2: I couldn't vote, couldn't sign my own name on certain documents.
Speaker 2: I still had to ask for my mom's permission. I
Speaker 2: was going through my own financial and personal issues. I
Speaker 2: was homeless at the time. It felt like I could
Speaker 2: do nothing until I could. We organized a protest in
Speaker 2: front of the school board building, and we had a
Speaker 2: couple of news outlets there and they wanted to hear more.
Speaker 2: So we started getting more students. We brought them to
Speaker 2: the public hearings. We made sure that they could be
Speaker 2: at the school board meetings. We had the superintendent, we
Speaker 2: had the principal, We had school board members be there
Speaker 2: and listen to the students. To the point where the
Speaker 2: school board could do nothing but host a vote vote,
Speaker 2: a vote in which students could participate in. We got
Speaker 2: community leaders, we got students, and on the day of
Speaker 2: my graduation, the superintendent made a recommendation to change the
Speaker 2: name of Robert E. Lee High School to Riverside High
Speaker 2: which it is now named. It has been named Riverside
Speaker 2: High School since twenty twenty one. I am the last
Speaker 2: senior class president of Robert E. Lee High School. All
Speaker 2: of that change happened within a few short months, within
Speaker 2: my graduation before I went to Florida State and I
Speaker 2: was a care student. So I went off to Florida
Speaker 2: State in the summer. That's an example of doing something.
Speaker 2: That's an example of speaking out. I had no money,
Speaker 2: no home, no notoriety, no nothing other than a voice
Speaker 2: and a will. If you care about something, it doesn't
Speaker 2: matter how niche it is, it doesn't matter how small
Speaker 2: it is. Sure post it, but also talk about it.
Speaker 2: Go to those meetings, go to your library, research it,
Speaker 2: Go to your city council meetings and stay. Sometimes they're
Speaker 2: long and we don't always know what they're talking about,
Speaker 2: but stay to the end. Speak to the members after,
Speaker 2: give them your number, give them your email. Be willing
Speaker 2: to have a conversation, because ultimately, action doesn't happen without conversation.
Speaker 2: I think we like to skip to the action part,
Speaker 2: but talking about it and making sure that it's pressing
Speaker 2: making sure that it is even if it's not hot news,
Speaker 2: making sure that it is still being talked about, still
Speaker 2: being known. That's half the battle, right there.
Speaker 3: I love that and I appreciate you sharing that story
Speaker 3: with us. It's amazing. When white Americans are asked the
Speaker 3: question whether or not this country is racist or rooted
Speaker 3: in a racist past, the immediate answer, no, of course
Speaker 3: not da. But you challenge the systems and the structures
Speaker 3: in the institutions that have given them great cover and
Speaker 3: comfort for as long a time as they've ever known,
Speaker 3: back to their ancestors. When you disrupt that, then it's
Speaker 3: all you know, the mass comes off. You start dealing
Speaker 3: with them in real fashion, and now you can go
Speaker 3: back to your country. Right after you've built this one
Speaker 3: and perfected it over time, you can go back. I'm
Speaker 3: curious to know. In the in the in the aftermath
Speaker 3: of the election, obviously the man I don't. I don't
Speaker 3: even know ground shaking, earth shaking moves. By the early
Speaker 3: months of the Trump administration, a lot of folks are
Speaker 3: feeling great despair. A lot of folks do want to
Speaker 3: check out, or they have checked out since the election,
Speaker 3: and frankly hadn't found a reason yet to check back in,
Speaker 3: choosing instead to be not as aware and not as
Speaker 3: informed of the day to day to protect their peace
Speaker 3: of mind and also to keep them focused on what's
Speaker 3: most important, which is probably the safety, security and support
Speaker 3: for their family. Right, How do we shake folks out
Speaker 3: of that or do we need to if we're about
Speaker 3: to fight this marathon of a fight over the next
Speaker 3: four years to keep what little we already have.
Speaker 2: Before hopping on here, you referenced something you said, two truths,
Speaker 2: and I think that's the perfect way to go about
Speaker 2: answering this. You know, running a marathon, you gotta pace
Speaker 2: yourself doing any endeavor. We have to plate pace ourselves
Speaker 2: because the seeds that we're selling now, we're often not
Speaker 2: gonna be able to see the fruits of our labor.
Speaker 2: And this isn't necessarily me doing the work for me
Speaker 2: or even for my kids. It might be for my kids'
Speaker 2: kids or their grandkids and so on. So I think
Speaker 2: the first part of that is acknowledging that the people
Speaker 2: on one side of a conversation, regardless of which side
Speaker 2: it is, they have a right to feel that way.
Speaker 2: You're right, a lot of people were in despair. A
Speaker 2: lot of people were tired. I was one of those people.
Speaker 2: I gave my all to that campaign, this Kamala Harris
Speaker 2: run for office. It was historic, of course, but that
Speaker 2: was the first presidential election I could vote in. As
Speaker 2: I mentioned a lot of the activism, especially for young people,
Speaker 2: especially for my peers, we were starting it without being
Speaker 2: able to be fully represented where you know, whether it
Speaker 2: was March for Our Lives and us just asking to
Speaker 2: not get gunned down in schools, or asking for school supplies,
Speaker 2: or asking for our schools to not be named after
Speaker 2: a racist Confederate. We are advocating, we are chanting, we
Speaker 2: are yelling, we're giving our all, but we can only
Speaker 2: do so much because we're not of age, because we
Speaker 2: don't have the status. Then then we finally can vote,
Speaker 2: We finally can be in college. Make some noise in SGN.
Speaker 2: I know, you know how that goes, make some noise
Speaker 2: in our community, and we're we're seeing this movement on TikTok,
Speaker 2: We're seeing this movement online where we're thinking that everybody
Speaker 2: you know knows the right answer to this very simple question,
Speaker 2: and it doesn't go that way. It's almost like it's
Speaker 2: almost like While it's not our fault that the election
Speaker 2: turned out the way it is, we owe it to
Speaker 2: ourselves to allow ourselves to feel all the emotions, to
Speaker 2: allow ourselves to go through the stages of grief, to
Speaker 2: come to terms with what that means. And it's not
Speaker 2: just it didn't just end in November, you know what
Speaker 2: I mean, because then we had the inauguration followed by
Speaker 2: several mandate, several executive orders. I have friends, I have
Speaker 2: family members that either don't know what their educational status
Speaker 2: is going to be, don't know what their citizen ship
Speaker 2: status is going to be. We have people getting their
Speaker 2: resources stripped away from them. We have people who don't
Speaker 2: know if they could continue going to school. I want
Speaker 2: to go to law school. I don't know if that's
Speaker 2: financially feasible for me anymore. I don't know if that
Speaker 2: matters anymore. I don't know if the rule of law
Speaker 2: matters anymore. And as big or symbolic as that may sound,
Speaker 2: you know, sometimes we just need to detach. You know,
Speaker 2: I'm not a technician or anything, but if my if
Speaker 2: you stop working, I'm gonna unplug it, give it a
Speaker 2: little time, and plug it right back in same thing
Speaker 2: with my computer. If it's not working, I'm gonna turn
Speaker 2: it off. If my phone freezes up, I'm gonna turn
Speaker 2: it off, give it a little second, and I'm gonna
Speaker 2: turn it right back on. Just because people are taking
Speaker 2: some time to enjoy homecoming, learn a few new trail
Speaker 2: ride dances, to do a few new hairstyles, to learn
Speaker 2: a new trend, to do whatever it may be. Just
Speaker 2: because people are expressing joy doesn't mean that they're not
Speaker 2: going to get back out there, because that's what our
Speaker 2: people have always done. And I the one thing I
Speaker 2: will say is that the idea that we just need
Speaker 2: to jump right back into action, that's harmful. Not saying
Speaker 2: stop it. I'm not saying stop caring, but take care
Speaker 2: of yourself, because how could you possibly how could you
Speaker 2: possibly complete the marathon if you're not, If you get
Speaker 2: injured on mile three and you're not taking care of yourself,
Speaker 2: we're we're I don't know how far we are in
Speaker 2: the race. I our ancestors laid the foundation and we're
Speaker 2: just gonna keep on pushing on. But part of that
Speaker 2: is finding the joy within it. And we know that
Speaker 2: some of us still seeing the slave hymns. You know
Speaker 2: what I mean. Some of us still have those recipes
Speaker 2: that were passed down from generations. We still have cookouts,
Speaker 2: we still have family reunions, We still run apart from
Speaker 2: each other when we laugh like it's embedded in us.
Speaker 2: It's embedded in us. And part of the need to
Speaker 2: keep on keeping on is taking rest, because rest isn't
Speaker 2: just revolutionary, it's needed. And rest can look like a
Speaker 2: multitude of things. But I don't believe that there's no
Speaker 2: liberation without fun, because what are we fighting for If
Speaker 2: I can't laugh? What are we fighting for if I
Speaker 2: can't go out to the protest and then go to
Speaker 2: my last appointment after, get my hair done after Because
Speaker 2: I don't feel like my best self when I'm not
Speaker 2: put together. And if I don't feel like my best self,
Speaker 2: I can't show up for the people. And part of
Speaker 2: showing up for the people is recognizing that as a person,
Speaker 2: I am the people, so I also have to show
Speaker 2: up for myself.
Speaker 3: I love that. I love that. Well, we know where
Speaker 3: you stand, and I hope nobody comes sideways toward you
Speaker 3: or your friends on this conversation. Welcome, Well, well let's
Speaker 3: do this. I want to invite in our mutual friend, Lolo.
Speaker 3: And as we wind down our few minutes, it really
Speaker 3: does go quickly. Deanna Butcher, you've inspired us with your
Speaker 3: own jewels and wisdom. And I can tell you from
Speaker 3: just personal experience, the idea, the fact that I so
Speaker 3: forcefully threw myself into leadership and the government and to
Speaker 3: change making, so much so that when it was gone,
Speaker 3: I had no real appreciation for who I was, and
Speaker 3: it was a spiral I would not wish on anyone.
Speaker 3: And so the self care piece is important here. And
Speaker 3: my only hope is that people aren't bandwagoning this thing,
Speaker 3: but are truly deepening into what their need is, seeing
Speaker 3: about their need and how it gets met, and then
Speaker 3: getting themselves strapped right back in for the fight. We're
Speaker 3: gonna have to sleep in shifts. We don't get the
Speaker 3: luxury of of of checking all the way out because
Speaker 3: we know that we sit in at the greatest epicenter
Speaker 3: of impact. Lolo, where are you? I don't know if
Speaker 3: you're here with us, all right? I think we're without
Speaker 3: Lolo at the very moment. But Dianna, if you if
Speaker 3: you had something, a note that you wanted to leave
Speaker 3: with the folks who have joined us and those who
Speaker 3: will listen when this is in a production post production form,
Speaker 3: what would you say to those like you who are
Speaker 3: disheartened to found you know it very difficult to sort
Speaker 3: of check back in although you have, what would you
Speaker 3: say as as the as the big push that made
Speaker 3: sense for you and for the things that you care about,
Speaker 3: and maybe others might take some wisdom from that as well.
Speaker 2: I'm a firm believer that to reach your target audience,
Speaker 2: or to reach the community, you have to know the community.
Speaker 2: And I want to correct you for just a brief moment,
Speaker 2: because you said what got me back in? And honestly,
Speaker 2: I'm not all the way in my candor my piece
Speaker 2: about taking care of yourself wasn't I read it in
Speaker 2: a book and all that just makes so much sense,
Speaker 2: or I heard it in passing, or I saw it
Speaker 2: on a billboard. It was because I had to stop,
Speaker 2: because I gave my all. So I come to this
Speaker 2: conversation as someone who wasn't sleeping, as someone who was
Speaker 2: always protesting, always activating on several zoom calls, sometimes on
Speaker 2: a multitude of calls. You can tell Nick, that's I
Speaker 2: learned my suitcase trick. But the multitude of calls, trying
Speaker 2: to get the resources to the people, whether that be food,
Speaker 2: whether that be knowledge, whether that be funding. I gave
Speaker 2: my absolute all at at the expense of myself. We're
Speaker 2: not talking about just losing our way. I was a
Speaker 2: machine for a candidate, multitude of candidates for a cause,
Speaker 2: and think these are all things that should be common sense.
Speaker 2: I was fighting for my livelihood, fighting to be represented,
Speaker 2: fighting to be seen as a person, and in turn,
Speaker 2: I wasn't treating myself like a person. I am not
Speaker 2: a therapist. I don't do yoga. I probably should, but
Speaker 2: I don't have all the answers in regards to self care.
Speaker 2: And when I hear people say that, I'm happy that
Speaker 2: it's a part of the conversation because it's also attached
Speaker 2: to mental health. Your mental health will take a toll
Speaker 2: if you don't do something for the outside and for
Speaker 2: the community and for the environment. But if you don't
Speaker 2: do something for yourself, I don't care. If showing up
Speaker 2: for yourself is deciding to take the day off if
Speaker 2: you can, I don't care. Doing something for yourself is
Speaker 2: doing your hair, is taking some rest, is going out
Speaker 2: and going to a crap well, I don't know what
Speaker 2: it is. I don't know what it is, but whatever
Speaker 2: it is, for you, every time you do something for
Speaker 2: the community, give it back to yourself. You have to. No,
Speaker 2: it's not worth there's no fight worth it without you.
Speaker 2: You can't fight without you. You can't abandon yourself. And
Speaker 2: I think it's and hopefully this is another topic for later,
Speaker 2: but I really want people to show up for themselves
Speaker 2: because I'm speaking from experience. We have a lot of people,
Speaker 2: we have a lot of organizers and leaders who have
Speaker 2: abandoned themselves and what you see is a vessel for
Speaker 2: the people, and they've forgotten that they are the people.
Speaker 2: So not to tune out of elections, not to tune
Speaker 2: out of activism, but it's it's a hard balance when
Speaker 2: you when people when every time you open your phone
Speaker 2: it's something that this administration is doing, and you can't
Speaker 2: even draft up a graphic quick enough, get out the
Speaker 2: word quick enough, because by the time time is posted,
Speaker 2: there's something else. If you look on any of my
Speaker 2: activism pages, there's there's time gaps in between it because
Speaker 2: I have to take time for me because sometimes news
Speaker 2: isn't the most helpful thing, but it's being ready for
Speaker 2: the fight. And I can't be ready without having myself
Speaker 2: to get there. So I just love that that'll preach No,
Speaker 2: I've seriously just hoped that people know I'm not just
Speaker 2: talking to them. I've been through it. And if they're
Speaker 2: not there right now, that's fine. Your body will let
Speaker 2: you know when you're ready. Your body will also let
Speaker 2: you know when you need to stop, and if you
Speaker 2: have to stop, stop, But just remember unplugging that TV.
Speaker 2: I'm plugging that core doesn't mean you're never gonna watch
Speaker 2: TV again. Just plug it right back in when you're ready.
Speaker 3: And activist leader, advocate, social justice warrior uh Deanna Burton,
Speaker 3: Florida native, homegrown Duval County, Jacksonville, Florida. Very successful. We're
Speaker 3: incredibly proud of you and for you, and thanks to
Speaker 3: just a few moments, especially at last minute notice, to
Speaker 3: share some pearls of wisdom with us and for the
Speaker 3: old heads, y'all, I think we heard pretty clear from
Speaker 3: Dianna that we should just take a beat before we batter.
Speaker 3: The next generation come in after us on what they
Speaker 3: are and aren't doing. Let's take a beat, let them
Speaker 3: rest into themselves and very quickly renew the fight and
Speaker 3: get back on the field. Y'all. It's been real and
Speaker 3: guess what. I'll be right back next week Monday. We'll
Speaker 3: have a consecutive back to back and we'll get back
Speaker 3: to our training curriculum on organizing. We'll catch up with
Speaker 3: you later, Deanna, thanks again for your time.
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 1: Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio and partnership
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