Speaker 1: Hi again and welcome to the Highlights for a season
Speaker 1: two of this podcast. Man, this was a fun season
Speaker 1: to put together, and we really appreciate all the nice feedback.
Speaker 1: We did not start out with a coherent plan. That's
Speaker 1: pretty typical. It just worked out that this season featured
Speaker 1: some of my favorite people, old friends, telling stories, sharing
Speaker 1: insights and wisdom. People like Cheryl Crow, Matthew McConaughey, Clinton,
Speaker 1: Kelly Eddie, George Kirk, curb Street and the Bear, Chris Felika,
Speaker 1: Mike Terriko, Mike Mills, Brian Coppelman, Bob Woodruff. We had
Speaker 1: fun throughout. It was a challenge to listen to all
Speaker 1: these episodes and pick out just these highlights, but I
Speaker 1: think you're gonna enjoy it. Any one of those books
Speaker 1: could have been in lead up position, but we went
Speaker 1: with Mr McConaughey and the Art of Living. His stories
Speaker 1: and wisdom and revelations and prescriptions and confessions and adventures
Speaker 1: are truly unique. He talked about a solo trip down
Speaker 1: the Amazon when he was at a crossroads in his
Speaker 1: life and had a very profound experience alone in the jungle.
Speaker 1: It was about day twelve actually, and no that was
Speaker 1: that was there's nothing outside of my body of anything.
Speaker 1: It was a purge of getting everything out and there
Speaker 1: was no There was no ayahuasca, no peyote involved in it.
Speaker 1: It was me and me. UM twelve days into a
Speaker 1: trip that was a solo journey of my own, and
Speaker 1: a trip that the first twelve days I was not
Speaker 1: enjoying my company. I was not able to be present.
Speaker 1: I didn't like where my mind was going. I was
Speaker 1: feeling guilt, I was feeling shame. I was feeling like
Speaker 1: sins of action, sins of the mind. I didn't know
Speaker 1: where I was going in life or or what my
Speaker 1: track was. UM my mind was in a low place,
Speaker 1: and again in I felt like that was okay. Endure this,
Speaker 1: endure this, and I put myself into place so far
Speaker 1: out that I didn't have like the Australian tip. I
Speaker 1: didn't have the parachute to pool. I was out there.
Speaker 1: I was like, No, you're gonna you're You're gonna sweat
Speaker 1: this out and you're gonna go through this in a
Speaker 1: bad day twelve And this has happened to me multiple times.
Speaker 1: A bat day twelve, I wake up and I have
Speaker 1: a purge. I've I've I've thrown up, I've gotten rid
Speaker 1: of every talisman that I've that defined me. I wake
Speaker 1: up and I go for this walk, and I'm feeling
Speaker 1: present for the first time, and all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: I'm seeing the light and I'm forgiving myself for certain
Speaker 1: things I should forgive myself. I've I've shaken hands with
Speaker 1: myself about things. Hey, buck stops here on that. We're
Speaker 1: not gonna keep doing that one. We're changing, We're gonna
Speaker 1: evolve as a as a young man. And I came
Speaker 1: across that story, that that that whole huge blue neon
Speaker 1: blue floor on the jungle floor, which when it moved
Speaker 1: turned out to be ten two thousands of butterflies. And
Speaker 1: that's when I first found the Amazon. That's why I
Speaker 1: went for that swim in the Amazon, to go put
Speaker 1: myself in the place that I that was actually in
Speaker 1: that eleven second dream I had, which I had now
Speaker 1: had for the second time, which is what got me
Speaker 1: to peru Um and the rest of that trip. The
Speaker 1: next say, they're twenty two days. The next ten days
Speaker 1: were glorious. I was present, I was being fair with myself,
Speaker 1: I had forgiven myself. I was seeing the beauty all
Speaker 1: around me. Everything I wanted was what I could see,
Speaker 1: and what could I could see was right in front
Speaker 1: of me. It was simple. I was present. People call
Speaker 1: it zen whatever I had found that learned some lessons
Speaker 1: there about we gotta put ourselves in a position to
Speaker 1: hear the truth cross us. It's hard with all the
Speaker 1: stimuli and frequency all around us all the time. When
Speaker 1: can you When can you have you give yourself a
Speaker 1: little forced winter of quiet solitude where you may not
Speaker 1: like the company. And that's good because hanging there until
Speaker 1: you do like the company, because there's only one s O. B.
Speaker 1: We can't get rid of us there the only person
Speaker 1: we can't we you know, there's only one person that
Speaker 1: we're like, well, I'm stuck with you no matter what.
Speaker 1: And so that's what that that's to happen on that trip.
Speaker 1: And then it happened again three years later when I
Speaker 1: had the exact same dream again and went off to Africa. Yes,
Speaker 1: it's also in the episode of the story about Matthew's
Speaker 1: trip to Molly and the wrestling match against the Village Champion,
Speaker 1: And I thought about what Matthew says is the moral
Speaker 1: of that story a lot since we recorded the episode,
Speaker 1: and he says that if you rise to meet a
Speaker 1: significant challenge, you've already won. The outcome doesn't matter. Rising
Speaker 1: to meet the challenge is a victory in and of itself.
Speaker 1: I like that a lot. We also talked about his
Speaker 1: film career and a lesson that Matthew had to learn
Speaker 1: the hard way early on. There's a great story in
Speaker 1: there about how I embarrassed myself from lack of preparation
Speaker 1: um and did not prepare for a scene on purpose,
Speaker 1: thinking my bright idea was that I am nothing but
Speaker 1: an extincial, instinctial actor. I don't need to study the lines.
Speaker 1: My career started days confused, and I just improv to
Speaker 1: all that ship. Man, here, let's do it again, and
Speaker 1: not when you got a four page monologue in Spanish
Speaker 1: put in front of you that you didn't know it
Speaker 1: was gonna be there. Oh jees o, man, I remember
Speaker 1: the beat of sweat going on the back of my neck, going,
Speaker 1: oh my, you said you took a twelve minute walk
Speaker 1: and prep Did you really come back and know that
Speaker 1: ship in twelve minutes in Spanish? Hell? No, I mean
Speaker 1: twelve I remember, I see twelve minutes? Can I get
Speaker 1: twelve minutes my mind thinking, oh, that's enough time not
Speaker 1: to be inconsiderate to the crew who's ready to go.
Speaker 1: But maybe it's also enough time to learn a four
Speaker 1: page monologue in Spanish, because hey, I took Spanish first
Speaker 1: semester in the eleventh grade. Well look it was not true. No.
Speaker 1: I came back and I don't know what kind of
Speaker 1: hacked up spanglish crap I did, but I did something
Speaker 1: and it embarrassed the hell out of me, and I said,
Speaker 1: I never want to feel that again. And from that
Speaker 1: day on I learned that value of preparation. And now
Speaker 1: I tried to come in you know, even a preparation.
Speaker 1: If I get come like I got it. I got it,
Speaker 1: I got it. I'm like, when maybe you need to
Speaker 1: look at an even more different way because I don't
Speaker 1: want to I want to go into I don't know
Speaker 1: about you, but I want to go to the set
Speaker 1: every day having the right kind of butterflies going all right, man,
Speaker 1: I'm m I'm catching my breath here. This is good.
Speaker 1: I don't want to feel like, dude, whatever, I got it.
Speaker 1: We know each other basically through Texas football. Um first
Speaker 1: met at a at a Longhorn game game day was there.
Speaker 1: There's one memorable game where Texas beach Nebraska. It's the
Speaker 1: Top five showdown. It's a it's a massive party in Austin.
Speaker 1: We got done with our work. We were invited to
Speaker 1: join you at a saloon if you're choosing, in downtown
Speaker 1: Austin to begin the postgame celebration, which we did. But
Speaker 1: then they said, you don't have to go home, but
Speaker 1: you gotta get out of here. You you graciously invited
Speaker 1: us to continue the party along with others at your house.
Speaker 1: We saw a yellow light and which the yellow light
Speaker 1: was responsibility and an early flight. And I don't know,
Speaker 1: I'm not a man of regrets, but damn I mean,
Speaker 1: and we had seen a green light there. That was
Speaker 1: the infamous beginning of the thirty two and a half
Speaker 1: hour bender that ended with the story that all of
Speaker 1: America knows. Man. Yes. So it wasn't that night that
Speaker 1: I decided to get neck and play congas in my
Speaker 1: birthday suit. It even wasn't the next night. It was
Speaker 1: two thirty six am the Monday morning, and I had
Speaker 1: not gone down yet. I was still celebrating our great
Speaker 1: victory when I decided to make some music with myself
Speaker 1: and wine donned down. Figured it was time to lay
Speaker 1: it on down and get some sleep. But before so,
Speaker 1: let me have a good jam session. Well, I had
Speaker 1: left a window open. Neighbor heard it, called the cops.
Speaker 1: They came in. I resisted pretty heavily, and yes, that
Speaker 1: was uh. I mean I we would definitely, definitely not
Speaker 1: hung around till the next night, the next night, the
Speaker 1: next morning. But I mean I was, like part of
Speaker 1: me wanted to say, damn, I was there at the
Speaker 1: be at least at the beginning. That was a fun
Speaker 1: seventy four minutes with Matthew, lots of stories and of
Speaker 1: course the Naked Congo's story. When I did not see
Speaker 1: one of life's green lights to quote matthews book title, uh,
Speaker 1: and chose to exercise prudence. And you can tell I
Speaker 1: regret it a little bit now, my colleague of twenty
Speaker 1: five college football seasons. If you can believe that Kirk
Speaker 1: herb Street was also there in the early stages of
Speaker 1: McConaughey's Naked Congo's Night also peeled away, of course, but
Speaker 1: Kirk and the Bear Chris Felika got together for episode
Speaker 1: one of the season to relive stories from four hundred
Speaker 1: fall saturdays together. It's incredible, including Kirk's first year on
Speaker 1: game day and what should have been a celebratory return
Speaker 1: to Ohio State but almost never happened. The only memory
Speaker 1: I have is waking up Saturday morning, fourth week of
Speaker 1: my career, and being terrified that I'd been out way
Speaker 1: too late and you made me have way too many
Speaker 1: drinks and I I couldn't really, I was just like,
Speaker 1: I don't even want to go. I'm good. I was
Speaker 1: not gonna go. Alice rescued you man. One of the
Speaker 1: great careers in sports broadcasting almost got like cut short
Speaker 1: in a week four of year one. Listen to this,
Speaker 1: I somehow bang I make it into the r O
Speaker 1: t C Building next to next to St. John's arena.
Speaker 1: You guys have no idea what's going on? My sunglasses
Speaker 1: on some idea. I had some idea, But you're going,
Speaker 1: you know, you and Becker are arguing about something, and
Speaker 1: I'm my stomach is like not feeling good, and I'm
Speaker 1: trying to like keep it together, trying not to get
Speaker 1: fired just because of the way I am in the meeting.
Speaker 1: So I'm just holding on for dear life going through
Speaker 1: this little production meeting before our show starts on Saturday,
Speaker 1: and in the middle know of it, ran down the
Speaker 1: hallway and just got sick, really bad for a long time,
Speaker 1: and I was pale white, like I was banged up.
Speaker 1: I had Bama Dave bring me. He brought me a Bama.
Speaker 1: Dave was one of the guys on our crew. A
Speaker 1: game day, he was worried about me. He brought this
Speaker 1: trash can for me, and he put it just to
Speaker 1: the left of my seat during the show, so if
Speaker 1: I have to vomit during the show, at least I
Speaker 1: had a trash can to turn my head over to
Speaker 1: and and throw up during the show. Thank god, the
Speaker 1: show was an hour back then. Thank total pro, total pro.
Speaker 1: Remember the first time we swung the camera around and
Speaker 1: like the Bears now an icon. But but he was
Speaker 1: a valuable part of the team, but not in front
Speaker 1: of the camera. Was it your idea? What we all
Speaker 1: of a sudden we're sitting over there and we're like,
Speaker 1: there's a lull or something. It was his calves. I
Speaker 1: wanted to shoot the calves, like wait that that that
Speaker 1: was the whole impetus for you. Let's let's show his calves,
Speaker 1: not his calves are like that big and he had
Speaker 1: shorts on, and I, you know, that's when we used
Speaker 1: to just a lot of times with fitting in the chair,
Speaker 1: we get off the rails, and he loved it. He
Speaker 1: encouraged it. So I hit talk back and I was like,
Speaker 1: you gotta you gotta get the camera on bears calves.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say something. He goes, oh, that's great, that's great,
Speaker 1: bring the camera over to his calves, and I just
Speaker 1: started talking about bears calves and I'm just like, look
Speaker 1: at this. No, I forgot about the calves part. Bear,
Speaker 1: I knew, I knew you. I thought we were gonna
Speaker 1: talk some football, but then think about from one calf
Speaker 1: cutaway comes the empire. That is the exactly it's really
Speaker 1: the former offensive lineman at me now, Kirk Bear and
Speaker 1: I also spoke plenty about our dear friend Mike colleague
Speaker 1: in college game day for twenty five years. The Corsow
Speaker 1: coming up there is the blooper for the Ages and Houston,
Speaker 1: but also the story of how Lee recovered from a
Speaker 1: stroke somehow after being robbed of the ability to speak
Speaker 1: in spring of two thousand nine, after arduous work in
Speaker 1: three and a half months he was ready for the
Speaker 1: season debut of Game Day that fall. It's a really
Speaker 1: powerful moment and we we we all have such you know,
Speaker 1: deep love and affection for him and respect for him,
Speaker 1: learned so much from him. When he had the stroke.
Speaker 1: I thought that was one of the most courageous things
Speaker 1: that anybody's done. A guy who spoke so effortlessly he was,
Speaker 1: it was so natural, and he was such a great
Speaker 1: ad lib and to be robbed at that And the
Speaker 1: first show back after his stroke, and this wasn't that
Speaker 1: many months, and he had gone to speech therapy that
Speaker 1: he says is the hardest thing he's ever had to
Speaker 1: do to relearn how to speak. And we weren't sure
Speaker 1: if the gears were gonna mesh when the light went on.
Speaker 1: And this season debut of the show is in Atlanta,
Speaker 1: and we're outside and there's a big crowd around, and
Speaker 1: I think all of us were so anxious and holding
Speaker 1: our breath, and how is this gonna go for him?
Speaker 1: Is he going to be uncomfortable? Is he going to
Speaker 1: be able to get the words out? And And that
Speaker 1: was I think a two hour show at that point,
Speaker 1: and the fact that he was able to get through
Speaker 1: that and it got better and better from from that
Speaker 1: point on. That year. Uh god, I just remember the
Speaker 1: tension Kirk, you know, just loving this guy so much
Speaker 1: and just hoping things are gonna go okay. Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1: I can remember like it was yesterday, I mean really
Speaker 1: to me, when he had his stroke and he was determined.
Speaker 1: Nobody was like, are you sure you're okay? And he
Speaker 1: wasn't letting anybody stop him from getting back to that show.
Speaker 1: And his motivation was his love for that job, his
Speaker 1: love for that show, his love for the sport and
Speaker 1: what he had become, you know, within the sport, and
Speaker 1: he was not going to be slowed down. People asked
Speaker 1: the time, I'll tell the story about else and Houston
Speaker 1: and the f bomb. At this point, it's well established
Speaker 1: he's gonna put the headgear and picked the team. And
Speaker 1: at this point, Kirk he had already was he had
Speaker 1: already perfected the fake left go right things. So he
Speaker 1: was gonna build up one team and then picked the
Speaker 1: other team. SMU has got no chance in this. I mean,
Speaker 1: there's no way they're gonna win in Houston. That Cougar
Speaker 1: has had a great team. They're scoring fifty points. A game, uh,
Speaker 1: and and they're working to stop him. But he tried
Speaker 1: to build up SMU and he was looking look at
Speaker 1: that red, white and blue. Look at that sm You
Speaker 1: look at what a team? What? And he was trying
Speaker 1: to kind of take the audience in one direction. The
Speaker 1: director wasn't getting it, and he was a great director,
Speaker 1: but he wasn't cutting all the things that Lee was talking.
Speaker 1: He wasn't building up SMU. So there was that, and
Speaker 1: that's what kind of frustrated him and he finally figured
Speaker 1: enough of this ruse and that's when he just said,
Speaker 1: fuck it, give me that Houston and he put on
Speaker 1: the Houston hat. And Carl Lewis was the guest picker.
Speaker 1: They're kind of falling over and um, I put my
Speaker 1: head down. You shoved your chair away. You you you
Speaker 1: instinctively you had to distance yourself. I didn't even know
Speaker 1: what I I think I threw a pen in the air.
Speaker 1: I remember Carl Lewis going. He leaned over in the
Speaker 1: midst of that chaos, and he goes to me. He's
Speaker 1: like he looked at me. He's like a good thing.
Speaker 1: We're on delay. And I was like, yeah, you look,
Speaker 1: you looked at the mascot. You look, you looked, you
Speaker 1: opened the cougar's mouth and like looked in there, and
Speaker 1: it was very I mean all of us that you know,
Speaker 1: something like that is like possible on live television, but
Speaker 1: they had never happened before, so I was kind of
Speaker 1: the funnier ac. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that's the best part
Speaker 1: of it. When we were we had about a seven
Speaker 1: hour flight to Eugene for USC Oregon that night. That
Speaker 1: that's the best part of the story, where we get
Speaker 1: to Eugene. Kirk, Yeah, we we land in Eugene. Well,
Speaker 1: first of all, ESPN makes him, uh, issue an apology?
Speaker 1: How did that? He? Fitting comes out? Everyone's hi. You know,
Speaker 1: at the end of the game day, we're always like,
Speaker 1: good show, that was fun, that was fine, good job,
Speaker 1: And then Fitting comes out. He's like, coach, good job,
Speaker 1: that was great. Listen real quick, hey, he kind of said,
Speaker 1: He goes, what what what? What? What you you said
Speaker 1: the f fort he goes, so what he well, I
Speaker 1: can't really say that on TV. So we've written out
Speaker 1: this three sentences just saying your apology and let's look
Speaker 1: into the camera. Goes okay, no problem. He looks into
Speaker 1: the camera. He's like earlier today on college game day,
Speaker 1: I said something I shouldn't have for that reason, I'm
Speaker 1: very very sorry doing like we're doing a coke commercial
Speaker 1: like he does, like his home home depot, you know,
Speaker 1: and we're all, he's just so innocent with this. We're like, coach,
Speaker 1: I was great, that was great. Good good On the
Speaker 1: back end this time, how about we just don't smile.
Speaker 1: How about we just kind of look, you know, just
Speaker 1: looking at the camera. He's like, okay, good good. So
Speaker 1: he does that, or we get through that. By now
Speaker 1: all of America's you know, googling Lee Corso, F bomb
Speaker 1: and all this. And we fly. We fly all the
Speaker 1: way out to Eugene. We land. As soon as our land,
Speaker 1: the U S see a good U s c. P.
Speaker 1: Carroll team against Oregon and Chip Kelly. We get out
Speaker 1: of the plane, go into the FBO stop in use
Speaker 1: a quick bathroom, and as we're coming out, this guy,
Speaker 1: he looks like he's driving like a driver, says, hey, um,
Speaker 1: you do you mind if Phil Knights says hello real quick,
Speaker 1: he's he's on his way over. He just landed. He's
Speaker 1: on his way because we saw his plane when we landed.
Speaker 1: But we didn't realize he was there. So, yeah, he
Speaker 1: wants to say hello real quick. Yeah, because we met
Speaker 1: him a few times on game day, no problem. So
Speaker 1: as we're walking out to get to our car, Phil
Speaker 1: Knight's big r V. He comes jogging down the stairs.
Speaker 1: You can see him, comes jogging over to us, and
Speaker 1: he's like, he high fives me, and he's like, manly Corso,
Speaker 1: I can't believe that. S ob he's my hero. I can't, man,
Speaker 1: what was what happened? Tell me? I mean he want
Speaker 1: to sit there and hear all about it. He was
Speaker 1: so like fired up, you know. And then I'm like, man,
Speaker 1: you know, everyone's like because before we got to there,
Speaker 1: everyone's like he might be is he gonna get suspended?
Speaker 1: You know, would they fire him all? You know, that's
Speaker 1: the all the talk. Then we then we drive the stadium.
Speaker 1: We get in there, Lane kill it was Lane Kiffin.
Speaker 1: Actually he was over. He says something to me about man.
Speaker 1: Of course, so I can't believe it. And then Chip
Speaker 1: Kelly literally is at the other into the stadium. He's
Speaker 1: the's me at the other twenty walking towards the fifty.
Speaker 1: I'm talking white visor, all black outfit, full sprint over
Speaker 1: to me and Darren to like, high five us and
Speaker 1: tackle us, and he wants to hear about it. I'm
Speaker 1: just like Lee course is the only guy that can
Speaker 1: see the F bomb and his his Q rating goes up.
Speaker 1: Kirk and the Baron I could have sat around for
Speaker 1: three or four hours and told stories. There's so much
Speaker 1: in the episode. If you've enjoyed college game day at
Speaker 1: all over the years, I think you'll enjoy going along
Speaker 1: for the ride. Also should tell you that Kirk has
Speaker 1: a new book coming out out the Pocket, very good,
Speaker 1: very powerful read. Now. Almost as important to me throughout
Speaker 1: my life as the power of sports has been the
Speaker 1: power of music. I love this topic and I love
Speaker 1: visiting with a musical legend and dear friend, Cheryl Crowe.
Speaker 1: We talked a lot about her life in her career,
Speaker 1: but also about the power of music to connect us,
Speaker 1: unite us, inspire us, heal us, and transport us back
Speaker 1: to a very specific time and place. Well, my kids
Speaker 1: say I was born in the Jurassic period, and that's
Speaker 1: probably is true. You know, It's funny. I think about that,
Speaker 1: and I think, are my kid's going to have that
Speaker 1: same relationship when they hear like a post alone song
Speaker 1: song where they can actually, you know, completely envisioned where
Speaker 1: where they were when they heard it. For me, like
Speaker 1: I can hear Baker Street by Jerry Rafferty, and I
Speaker 1: can smell Mike Brown's bucket seats in his Monte Carlo,
Speaker 1: you know, and I can envision sitting at the Dairy
Speaker 1: Queen hot August night. Um, I can hear I Want
Speaker 1: to Be Your Lover by Prince and thinking I was
Speaker 1: listening to like porn um at a track meet in uh,
Speaker 1: you know, when I was a freshman in high school.
Speaker 1: You know, I want to Be Your Lover? Was? I
Speaker 1: mean that was risque. I mean it's nothing like whop
Speaker 1: you know, which I'm trying to like keep my kids
Speaker 1: from seeing or hearing. And Yeah, music, I I think
Speaker 1: about it um a lot when I think about Carlos
Speaker 1: Santana in a hotel lobby once saying, you know, I
Speaker 1: watched your show girl. You really know how to are
Speaker 1: you really change the molecules in the room. And I've
Speaker 1: always thought about that because I do think that music
Speaker 1: is a physical experience where you know, all the science
Speaker 1: and all the studies they've done around meditation and around
Speaker 1: music and how it changes the shape of the cell
Speaker 1: um and how it can create a physical, uh, really
Speaker 1: a physical reaction. And I do leave that. I want
Speaker 1: to go to the Michael Jackson because it's amazing that
Speaker 1: that was your that was your first record, and then
Speaker 1: you began to sort of experience the power of music
Speaker 1: on this incredibly large scale when you're singing back up
Speaker 1: on that tour and and and singing. Um, I just
Speaker 1: can't stop loving you a duet or now the focus
Speaker 1: is on you and Michael and you seventy thou faces
Speaker 1: are right there singing, and there's a girl from Kenneth,
Speaker 1: Missouri kind of experiencing this. I think it's you're probably
Speaker 1: your first time abroad, right and now who you are
Speaker 1: in front of what do they feel like? I did
Speaker 1: get a passport. I mean I've never been out of
Speaker 1: the country. In fact, I had really I was a
Speaker 1: school teacher before that, and I basically was like, Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go to l A. I'm gonna go to
Speaker 1: New York, LA. Seems nice and I'm gonna go there.
Speaker 1: And um, I crashed the audition long story short, um,
Speaker 1: and I went up getting it and you know, That's
Speaker 1: an interesting thing too, because I feel like what I
Speaker 1: witnessed with Michael um and the power of music was
Speaker 1: so much bigger um And also having watched him since
Speaker 1: he was younger than me and he was five and
Speaker 1: six years old, when you would see him see him
Speaker 1: on UM you know, uh TV variety shows singing these
Speaker 1: like Frank Sinatra songs, you know, and singing ben and
Speaker 1: then doing this incredible R and B that we all
Speaker 1: grew up with. And then I went up singing with him,
Speaker 1: and to watch how people would just lose their ship.
Speaker 1: I mean, it was like they were witnessing a deity,
Speaker 1: you know. And there's something I guess that's a whole
Speaker 1: other show, but that's it's it's so weird to see.
Speaker 1: It was a little bit like watching what was going
Speaker 1: on with the Beatles, you know, all that old footage
Speaker 1: of people passing out and girls crying. And but the
Speaker 1: thing that was interesting to me was standing behind him
Speaker 1: and seeing he could just see in him that fragile
Speaker 1: little guy who was so damaged. But then when he
Speaker 1: would step into something bigger than him, you just could
Speaker 1: feel like, Okay, there's a difference between ego and the divinity.
Speaker 1: And the art part of it certainly. I mean, if
Speaker 1: you believe in God or something bigger, that's where that
Speaker 1: comes in. And that's where all those people, strangers are
Speaker 1: just wrapped up in the molecular thing that Carlos Santana
Speaker 1: talks about, you know, and um, and they come away
Speaker 1: from that feeling changed. And that that for me was
Speaker 1: an incredible thing to witness. I mean, I'll never know
Speaker 1: what that's like to have my whole life be based
Speaker 1: on on that, being a small child and being so famous, um,
Speaker 1: but watching that was was powerful for me as seeing
Speaker 1: what what music can be and and and and how
Speaker 1: it can wield a lot of emotion and power and strength. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean powerful, intoxicating and firing a cautionary tale, I'm
Speaker 1: sure as well. It's kind of the whole package. So
Speaker 1: when you are now playing your own songs and you
Speaker 1: are in the spotlight and their faces are looking at
Speaker 1: you and singing back words that you wrote on a
Speaker 1: base in some lonely time and place years ago, and
Speaker 1: it's different generations that are doing it. I mean for
Speaker 1: those of us that we'll never know what that's like.
Speaker 1: You're doing a job up there. You've got to play
Speaker 1: the song. But do you ever just allow yourself to
Speaker 1: take all that in Chris, It's interesting watching all those
Speaker 1: men out there crying and fainting, yes, throwing underwear on
Speaker 1: the stage. Um. Yeah, I know it's different when you're
Speaker 1: a girl rock star. You don't get the perks that
Speaker 1: the guys get. Um, but yeah, I mean there was
Speaker 1: a time early out, early on, when I really was
Speaker 1: feeling pretty burnt out that I couldn't see the audience
Speaker 1: as being a sort of benevolent being. You know. I
Speaker 1: always felt like the critics were after me, and uh,
Speaker 1: and then I wound up being diagnosed with breast cancer
Speaker 1: and it totally reset everything I wanted to. I wanted
Speaker 1: to I wanted the lights on all the time. I
Speaker 1: wanted to make contact with people and their faces and
Speaker 1: their eyes and their stories and um, you know, there
Speaker 1: there is a really odd thing that happens when when
Speaker 1: you have a hit song and you travel to other
Speaker 1: countries where they don't even speak your language language like
Speaker 1: Japan or whatever, and you see them doing their best
Speaker 1: to sing along they know the words in a totally
Speaker 1: different language, and just how it's not like anything you
Speaker 1: can ever measure as a kid as to what you
Speaker 1: perceive success would be like, you know, Like to me,
Speaker 1: I did pour over rumors and I did get my
Speaker 1: hair cut in a total shag, and I was like
Speaker 1: intrigued with Stephen Knicks maybe being a witch, and you know,
Speaker 1: I've got the shawls, and I wanted to be that,
Speaker 1: you know, and that was to me. It wasn't I
Speaker 1: didn't envision like the audience. I always envisioned me as her.
Speaker 1: It's a different thing when you're on stage and there
Speaker 1: are nights where you feel overwhelmed with the energy that's
Speaker 1: coming back at you, and then there are other nights
Speaker 1: where you feel like this is a job and am
Speaker 1: I in this? And I don't want to short change anybody,
Speaker 1: you know. Um. I think after breast cancer and kind
Speaker 1: of rebooting my life and who I was and who
Speaker 1: I saw myself as, I could really feel the enjoyment
Speaker 1: of going out and sharing as opposed to having to deliver.
Speaker 1: It's not every day you're not talking about that kind
Speaker 1: of thing with such candor. And I really appreciated the
Speaker 1: time to Cheryl gave us. It was just pure enjoyment
Speaker 1: to record that episode. By the way, Sheryl has a
Speaker 1: new recording out live at the Ryman, the legendary Auditorium
Speaker 1: in Nashville, So check that out next up. Whatever I
Speaker 1: most listened to episodes Reinvention, that's because of the two
Speaker 1: tremendous guests, football legend Eddie George and TV host style
Speaker 1: icon Clinton Kelly. They have very different backgrounds, but each
Speaker 1: of them shared some very smart ideas on reinventing yourself
Speaker 1: pivoting in life, something that so many of us are
Speaker 1: facing these days, being forced to ask tough questions like
Speaker 1: is this still what I want? Or even bigger question,
Speaker 1: who am I? That's what Eddie wondered the moment he
Speaker 1: realized his great career was over when he was kicked
Speaker 1: out of a Dallas Cowboys practiced by Bill Parcels as
Speaker 1: a member of the scout team. Oh well, it felt,
Speaker 1: um like I was in the twilight zone a little bit,
Speaker 1: because what I've known for so long, how prepared for
Speaker 1: each season, how I got my mind right for my
Speaker 1: training in the different phases of getting ready for NFL
Speaker 1: season or football season. I've been doing it my entire
Speaker 1: life up to that point, and I was already won.
Speaker 1: And um, when I once I realized that that my
Speaker 1: playing days were done. It was it was a gut
Speaker 1: riching feeling. I mean, I saved my money. I had
Speaker 1: a roof up from my head. I wasn't fearful in
Speaker 1: that regard of of being financially broke, but it was like, well, damn,
Speaker 1: you know what's next? Or really you know who am I? Well,
Speaker 1: it turns out the former football star is also a
Speaker 1: pretty talented actor. He got the bug attending some Shakespearean plays,
Speaker 1: and after some embarrassing experiences trying to adjust to a
Speaker 1: new career, he got good reviews playing some very serious parts,
Speaker 1: and then a lightning bolt moment when he caught a
Speaker 1: live performance of the musical Chicago. So I go, I'm
Speaker 1: an audience, and I've went with the songs like okay,
Speaker 1: this is kind of fun. And then it was time
Speaker 1: for Billy Flinner come, you know, and the girls come
Speaker 1: out and since we what dly give us deally that's
Speaker 1: the great opening, right And he hits the stage, comes out,
Speaker 1: does it still does a song I care about? His
Speaker 1: love does the scenes. And I was like, oh man,
Speaker 1: that that said that, Now that looks like fun, you know,
Speaker 1: I said, Now that's one day I'm gonna do that.
Speaker 1: So she hears me. She's like interesting, she says, well,
Speaker 1: can you sing? Well I took singing lessons before, so yeah,
Speaker 1: I can say. I'll figure it out this well, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna call the White Slers in New York and get
Speaker 1: you an audition. I said, okay, you do that at
Speaker 1: LO and behole. Two weeks later, she calls me back.
Speaker 1: She's Eddie, I got you an audition for to play
Speaker 1: the World with Billy Finley or for the Bielers. I'm like, really,
Speaker 1: when is it's just in two weeks. I'm like, oh, ship,
Speaker 1: I had to study. I hadn't worked on my voice
Speaker 1: and them over maybe five or six months. So I'm Tannis,
Speaker 1: but I gotta take this opportunity. So I worked on
Speaker 1: the songs. I get with my acting coach. We listen
Speaker 1: to the music. I'm doing everything I can. I go
Speaker 1: up there in November of two thousand and fourteen. I
Speaker 1: get my best suit, Chris, I get my my my
Speaker 1: top hat, got my suit on. I go in. There
Speaker 1: is Billy Flynn. I going to the Ambassador Theater. I
Speaker 1: walk out on an empty stage and an empty theater,
Speaker 1: the lights on me and total darkness and I'm like,
Speaker 1: holy shit, I am really intimidated. I'm thinking of all
Speaker 1: the great actors that were on this stage, like I,
Speaker 1: I don't belong here, you know, like us shere was
Speaker 1: on the stage, and you know, just going down the
Speaker 1: list of who played this role, and it's intimidating to me.
Speaker 1: And I'm and I have to sing, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: all right, just whatever you do, it is gonna be
Speaker 1: a great story with our getting or not. So the
Speaker 1: piano player comes out. He's very professional. He's warming up,
Speaker 1: you know, doing his thing, and I'm thinking, should I
Speaker 1: be doing the same things here? So I just sit
Speaker 1: back a week till he stunts. Is all right, Mr George,
Speaker 1: we're gonna start the top. All I care about his love?
Speaker 1: What key are you in? And I said, uh, I
Speaker 1: don't know. He say, picking pick one. We'll figure it out.
Speaker 1: So we figure out, like he we wore them up.
Speaker 1: And I just have a good time, cracktic notes everywhere.
Speaker 1: I'm just laying it all out there and just doing
Speaker 1: what I have to do. And unbeknownst to me, Barry Weiss,
Speaker 1: the Leite producer, was in the audience. He was like
Speaker 1: way in the back and we're done. About thirty minutes
Speaker 1: we go through the whole thing. He comes down cent
Speaker 1: Arouse like this, Oh my god, that was magnificent. Let's
Speaker 1: do it. I'm like, really, really, you want to be
Speaker 1: on Broadway? And that's how I got the Broadway. Every
Speaker 1: night it must have been close to the feeling of
Speaker 1: being in the tunnel running out in the field when
Speaker 1: when you're in the wing, so that the tunnel and
Speaker 1: the wing of the theater had to be a little
Speaker 1: bit familiar to you. Just before that that live juice
Speaker 1: is going. Not without a doubt, Opening Night was was
Speaker 1: magical because I'm underneath the stage and it's like literally
Speaker 1: be a shot out of the cannon. The energy just waiting,
Speaker 1: and it's like, oh my god. And that's where the
Speaker 1: fear really comes in because you're like, oh my god, Okay,
Speaker 1: I just prayed to God one that I'm making up
Speaker 1: the stairs clean. Two, I don't forget my fucking words rehearsals.
Speaker 1: One thing, the line deal is completely tip. You're just
Speaker 1: thinking everything will kick it downstairs clean and now let
Speaker 1: it go. You know. It's it's compared that to the
Speaker 1: Super Bowl. Compare Opening Night on Broadway to that feeling
Speaker 1: because the super Bowl has brought accomplished, brilliant hall of famers,
Speaker 1: made them shaking their boots. What was it like? How
Speaker 1: would you make the comparison? Very very similar? Uh, you know,
Speaker 1: the energy, the nerves, because that's that's the that's the
Speaker 1: granddaddy of them all, the super Bowl and and UM,
Speaker 1: and going into that knowing that all eyes are on
Speaker 1: all the celebrities, UM, every everybody around the world is
Speaker 1: watching this one game and you have sixty minutes to
Speaker 1: show what you can do. And the same holds true
Speaker 1: on Broadly. Every night you have people from all over
Speaker 1: the world from China, London, UM, Japan, uh, South America.
Speaker 1: Every single night there's somebody from around the world coming
Speaker 1: to look at this show, uh and their critics in
Speaker 1: the audience. So there's a lot of pressure on you.
Speaker 1: And I'm thinking, yeah, you know, they're gonna come see
Speaker 1: with a football player is doing on this stage and
Speaker 1: if he can actually has the chops to do it.
Speaker 1: So it's very similar. The energy everything every receiving all
Speaker 1: night in every performance on Broadway is definitely like the
Speaker 1: super Bowl. Now, since we record of the episode, Eddie
Speaker 1: pivoted again back to football. He's the new head coach
Speaker 1: of the Tennessee State Tigers, and they'll play their home
Speaker 1: games in the same stadium where Eddie started for the
Speaker 1: Titans for all those years. So certainly wishing him the
Speaker 1: best in his debut season, but I also think that,
Speaker 1: because of his passion for acting, his career on the
Speaker 1: stage isn't quite over yet. Now. The whole idea for
Speaker 1: this reinvention episode came from conversations with Clinton. Kelly Clinton
Speaker 1: is a dear friend for twenty some years. He and
Speaker 1: my wife Jennifer are the best of friends. But I
Speaker 1: still learned a lot about Clinton and his ideas on
Speaker 1: reinventing himself and facing fear, fear of the unknown, fear
Speaker 1: of the unfamiliar. I think that knowing what you want
Speaker 1: um and having a plan on how to get it
Speaker 1: is really powerful. I think that you have to like
Speaker 1: really ask yourself, what do I want from life? Am
Speaker 1: I even close to achieving that? And if not, how
Speaker 1: can I get there? And so then you have to
Speaker 1: ask yourself, are all of my behaviors serving that purpose,
Speaker 1: like moving me toward that goal? Or are they moving
Speaker 1: me away from that goal? And I felt like I
Speaker 1: am slowly feeling my goals slipping away from me because
Speaker 1: I just am afraid. Like that's what it boils down to.
Speaker 1: It's like, you know, people change for you know, people
Speaker 1: don't change. I would say for two reasons. Like one is,
Speaker 1: you don't change if you're happy, Like if you just
Speaker 1: love your life the way it is, there's really no
Speaker 1: reason to change, right. And then I think the other
Speaker 1: reason people change don't change is that like they're afraid.
Speaker 1: They're literally afraid of change. And that is a very
Speaker 1: human response to change, like we are wired to keep
Speaker 1: the status quo, like that's what our egos want for us,
Speaker 1: like do not change. If things change, you might die. Um.
Speaker 1: And so that's why a lot of us are just
Speaker 1: terrified of change. That's the thing that most people could
Speaker 1: do pretty easily. Just find one baby step that you
Speaker 1: could take to move you closer to the dream of
Speaker 1: the you that you want to be. One baby step
Speaker 1: and see what happens. And I always play this, Oh,
Speaker 1: here's another this is the thing that I love. I'm sorry, Chris,
Speaker 1: I'm there's a ramblin on here. Luckily you have an editor.
Speaker 1: I always play a little game with myself, which is
Speaker 1: what's the best thing that could happen? What's the worst
Speaker 1: thing that could happen? Okay, that's It's pretty much a
Speaker 1: methodology that I use every day in my life, just
Speaker 1: to a certain degree, Like when I whenever I'm pushing
Speaker 1: myself to do something I haven't done before. What's the
Speaker 1: best thing that can happen? When you say hello to
Speaker 1: a stranger? You might make a best friend? You know. Um,
Speaker 1: what's the worst thing that can happen? When you say
Speaker 1: hello to a stranger they tell you to you know,
Speaker 1: screw off? Um, you know, I don't want to talk
Speaker 1: to you. Generally, what happens is something in the middle.
Speaker 1: Like every time, something in the middle is going to happen,
Speaker 1: Like maybe you'll just have a boring interaction where they
Speaker 1: say hi, you say hi, You part ways, But that's
Speaker 1: the beauty of life. Like the things on the extreme
Speaker 1: really really rarely happen. So do you this this is
Speaker 1: something you've carried on whether or not it's a question
Speaker 1: much later in life, if you've overcome your shyness. Should
Speaker 1: I start a fashion line? Should I take this TV opportunity?
Speaker 1: Should I say no to this public appearance? Do you
Speaker 1: have this conversation? What's the best and worst every time
Speaker 1: I have that all the time. That's what's the best
Speaker 1: and what's the worst is basically how I lived my
Speaker 1: entire life, Like, what's the worst thing that can happen? Okay,
Speaker 1: well that's probably not gonna happen. What's the best thing
Speaker 1: that can happen? Well, that's probably not gonna happen togither.
Speaker 1: But you know, I'm pretty comfortable with all the stuff
Speaker 1: in the middle. So many people have gone through upheaval.
Speaker 1: It's not just the planet, it's within workplaces, within households
Speaker 1: of all sorts in the last year or so, and
Speaker 1: so many people clinton have had not just doors closed,
Speaker 1: but doors slammed in their face and they can no
Speaker 1: longer go through that when they have to stand in
Speaker 1: there in the corridor and figure out how to open
Speaker 1: a new door and what that door is going to
Speaker 1: look like and feel like, and where that next door
Speaker 1: leads to? What? What? What advice would you have for
Speaker 1: people that that are are forced to make changes and
Speaker 1: very uncomfortable or anxious about that? Yeah, I mean, first
Speaker 1: of all, we're living through an unprecedented time and at
Speaker 1: least in modern history. Um Like, yeah, people, a lot
Speaker 1: of people are going through a really, really tough time,
Speaker 1: and it's easy to say, like just make a pivot
Speaker 1: and you'll, you know, you'll your whole life will change
Speaker 1: with the pandemic going on. So you know, there's that,
Speaker 1: But you know, I think that now is a good
Speaker 1: time for people to take stock of how they would
Speaker 1: like to re emerge from this. You know, like, if
Speaker 1: you've got a little bit of downtime, you know, take
Speaker 1: out a notebook and grab a pen and just write
Speaker 1: on the top of the page, what do I want
Speaker 1: my life to look like post pandemic? And then really
Speaker 1: just create this vision of yourself in your new life,
Speaker 1: and then on the next page, maybe the next day
Speaker 1: or a few days later, just ask yourself what little
Speaker 1: steps can I take to get there? You know, um,
Speaker 1: because this is going to end at some point, and
Speaker 1: it's a perfect opportunity for you to say to yourself,
Speaker 1: you know, everything that I did pre pandemic is does
Speaker 1: it work for me anymore? So I'm gonna I'm gonna
Speaker 1: have a different outlook. And the thing is, nobody's gonna
Speaker 1: be paying attention to you and the changes that you
Speaker 1: made after the pandemic, Right, It's a perfect opportunity for
Speaker 1: you to make some slide changes that can sort of
Speaker 1: slip under the radar. Everybody's gonna be like going through
Speaker 1: their own changes, going to be re emerging in their
Speaker 1: own way, being excited about that that you're just gonna
Speaker 1: be able to sort of do whatever it is that
Speaker 1: you want to do. So take advantage of the opportunities
Speaker 1: that will come to you eventually, even if you don't
Speaker 1: have them right now. But I would say, right now,
Speaker 1: be as creative as you possibly can. If a door
Speaker 1: is slammed in your face, you know, either you you
Speaker 1: break down the door or you cut a hole in
Speaker 1: the wall next to the door to get into the door.
Speaker 1: You know, like you have to say to yourself, like
Speaker 1: just because somebody says no, you can't do this, that
Speaker 1: doesn't mean that you can't do this. Like you're letting
Speaker 1: other people have too much control over you if they
Speaker 1: have told you you can't do this and you have
Speaker 1: agreed with them, like you basically relinquished all of your
Speaker 1: control over your life over there or to another person.
Speaker 1: Before we wrap, is there a mic drop moment or
Speaker 1: a state when you want to make about reinvention of
Speaker 1: someone that's gone through it? So so successfully yourself and
Speaker 1: help so many other people do it. Um away to
Speaker 1: to sum up the messaging, get to the bottom of
Speaker 1: your fear. Really ask yourself, what are you afraid of?
Speaker 1: Do I want to be afraid of this anymore? And
Speaker 1: then take steps not to be afraid of it. I
Speaker 1: think that's that's what it boils down to, like tackle
Speaker 1: the fear, beat the crap out of it. You know,
Speaker 1: look it in the eye. You're like, you're ugly, um
Speaker 1: and you're not going to have any control over me.
Speaker 1: I think that's that's that's the biggest thing, Like get
Speaker 1: in touch with your fear. Oh I haven't I know?
Speaker 1: May I have something more profound to say? That's pretty good?
Speaker 1: Are you afraid of dying or you how about this, Chris?
Speaker 1: Are you afraid of dying or are you more afraid
Speaker 1: to die not having done everything you wanted to do?
Speaker 1: That's that's what I realized. I know we're getting to
Speaker 1: this at the end of the interview, but that's what
Speaker 1: I realized was a big motivating factor for me. I
Speaker 1: didn't want to die knowing that I didn't do something
Speaker 1: because I was afraid of doing it. Clip that is
Speaker 1: just so smart and he has a lot more to say,
Speaker 1: and I really urge you to listen to the entire
Speaker 1: Reinventioned episode if you're at that place in life right
Speaker 1: now or you know someone who is, because both Clinton
Speaker 1: and Eddie offered tremendous ideas that a whole lot of
Speaker 1: people already have found really, really helpful. Next up the
Speaker 1: episode TV Music Moments, combining two of my passions, and
Speaker 1: the topic here is how music is used in important
Speaker 1: ways and some of the greatest TV series ever The Sopranos,
Speaker 1: Breaking Bad, The Wire, mad Men, The Americans, on and on.
Speaker 1: And the perfect guy to lead off this episode is
Speaker 1: my buddy, Brian Koppelman. First of all, he's a true
Speaker 1: savant in music, that's where his career began. But he's
Speaker 1: also had accomplished TV writer and producer and director, co creator,
Speaker 1: show runner, co writer of the brilliant series Billions on Showtime.
Speaker 1: I could play you a scene from one of my
Speaker 1: shows or anybody's show that I could play with. And
Speaker 1: if we just watched the scene, uh, someone sitting there
Speaker 1: and the camera's pushing in on them and there's no score,
Speaker 1: no music playing, You're asking yourself, what's happening? What am
Speaker 1: I being told, but the moment that I put the
Speaker 1: right and and if I put one kind of track,
Speaker 1: you would feel one way. In another kind of track,
Speaker 1: you feel another way. And then when I found the
Speaker 1: right track, you would feel exactly the way the story
Speaker 1: wants you to feel. Um, And I've seen it over
Speaker 1: and over giin me. That's why David and I my
Speaker 1: creative partner, David Levin and I spend so much time
Speaker 1: thinking about the music in our show. But we were
Speaker 1: talking this morning about The Crown. I don't know if
Speaker 1: you and Jen, how far into the Crown you are.
Speaker 1: I love that show. And Amy and I were watching
Speaker 1: episode five no I think God sorry earlier in the season.
Speaker 1: This was episode three. Maybe, Um, I'm not gonna spoil
Speaker 1: the show, but a bad thing happens to an older character.
Speaker 1: And uh, but right before that, for like the three
Speaker 1: minutes before, you see some scenes that are very prosaic
Speaker 1: scenes like where just people are doing very mundane things.
Speaker 1: But there's this music building as we cut from scene
Speaker 1: to scene two scene, and Amy and I looked at
Speaker 1: each other on the couch and we're like, what the
Speaker 1: fund is going on here? Because it was building in
Speaker 1: a way that that just let us know, and it
Speaker 1: was the way it was cut too, but but the
Speaker 1: music was pushing in a way where it was like, Okay,
Speaker 1: something is about to happen here, and it wasn't pushed
Speaker 1: so much. Because if you use that do that badly,
Speaker 1: you as the viewer get annoyed and tired with it.
Speaker 1: But if you do it right, suddenly you start feeling
Speaker 1: in your body a question before your brain even asks
Speaker 1: the question. I mean, that's the thing, Christoph, You get
Speaker 1: to do this stuff, and I'm sure it's the same
Speaker 1: with David Chase. I know it is in the Sopranos
Speaker 1: and Matt Weiner um on on on his show, Um
Speaker 1: mad men, m hm. You are lucky enough. If you're
Speaker 1: lucky enough to get to make stuff like this, you
Speaker 1: want every moment to just have maximum emotional impact, and
Speaker 1: you want to empty the tool kit. You know, you
Speaker 1: just want to leave it all out there, and you
Speaker 1: want to just put every last bit of thought meaning
Speaker 1: effort into it. And your record collection is just about
Speaker 1: the best weapon you have once you've cast it correctly
Speaker 1: with an incredible group of actors, and you know the
Speaker 1: best craftspeople at every post. The last tool you have.
Speaker 1: The thing at the end is your record collection and
Speaker 1: your composer's score. And those are unbelievably valuable tools. And
Speaker 1: and we just try to get the most we can
Speaker 1: out of them. Brian and I also got talking about
Speaker 1: something that's almost an endangered species these days, the TV
Speaker 1: themes on. Man, I mean, you just cannot underestimate the
Speaker 1: power of the theme song or the Sopranos. I mean,
Speaker 1: talk about something that just immediate. I put that on
Speaker 1: right now, it would change your state. Your state would
Speaker 1: just change if we put the Sopranos theme song up.
Speaker 1: But all you had, you hear the first jingle, and
Speaker 1: you woke up this morning got yourself a gun. But
Speaker 1: but how does it come to pass that that is
Speaker 1: seen as a genius choice? That song was written about
Speaker 1: a woman who I think she killed her Husband's a
Speaker 1: female empowerment song and nothing to do with the gangsters, right,
Speaker 1: But that you put that that song, I get. I
Speaker 1: get got goose bumps just thinking about that, because that's
Speaker 1: how much the Sopranos meant. You know, no to me too, man,
Speaker 1: And and and and if you think of like, yes,
Speaker 1: David Chase's Bob Dylans songs, he's great, great songs and
Speaker 1: to incredible effect. But right from the beginning Got Myself
Speaker 1: a Gun. You are in the feeling of the track
Speaker 1: to which works like score. As Tony's driving and beginning
Speaker 1: his day through that toll booth um, you are locked in, man,
Speaker 1: and you're locked in and identified with Tony, and it
Speaker 1: just starts you going. Now. Among his many projects, Brian
Speaker 1: also has an excellent podcast, The Moment, and he's been
Speaker 1: very helpful in helping me get this podcast going. We're
Speaker 1: talking about this topic and he suggested getting the artist's
Speaker 1: perspective and how music is used in TV, and so
Speaker 1: I reached out to our mutual friend Mike Mills of
Speaker 1: R E M, one of my favorite all time bands.
Speaker 1: I've known Michael longtime. Usually talk sports. He's a huge
Speaker 1: fan of the Georgia Bulldogs, his alma mater, and the
Speaker 1: Atlanta Braves, but here we find they got a chance
Speaker 1: to talk music, and it got to kind of geek
Speaker 1: out on my passion for R. E M songs and
Speaker 1: when you create something that does feel personal and in
Speaker 1: some ways has been described as deliberately non commercial, and
Speaker 1: then it sends tens of millions and wins awards and
Speaker 1: is is used in all kinds of films and TV shows. Um,
Speaker 1: what do you feel then? I mean, it's it's gone
Speaker 1: beyond this little boat that you put in the water,
Speaker 1: and it's drifted around the world through the currents. You know, well,
Speaker 1: you know it's It's the thing is, once you release
Speaker 1: a song, it's not yours anymore. I mean, it belongs
Speaker 1: to everyone to a degree, and it's there's to interpret.
Speaker 1: It's theirs to ignore, it's theirs to listen to as
Speaker 1: much as as little as they want to. So, um,
Speaker 1: you know, and then there are always misinterpretations. You know.
Speaker 1: The most famous one the one I Love, which was
Speaker 1: one of our early hits. It's not a love song
Speaker 1: in the real sense, so that it's it's a bitter
Speaker 1: song of of stalking. Uh, you know, not of stalking,
Speaker 1: but it kind of a rejection. Um, and it's it's
Speaker 1: really dismissive. But unless you listen closely, you won't know that.
Speaker 1: So it was always really fun to do shows and
Speaker 1: we start playing that song and couples would put their
Speaker 1: arms around each other and hug each other and dance
Speaker 1: and kids and a segment. But really, what what the
Speaker 1: guy is saying she's telling the girl to piss off
Speaker 1: or whoever it is. What do you think a simple
Speaker 1: prop to occupy my time? That's sort of that turns
Speaker 1: the thing around one it gets worse because the last
Speaker 1: line is another prop to occupy my time. So I mean,
Speaker 1: it starts bad and gets worse. But that's the kind
Speaker 1: of thing that we'll be used in a film or
Speaker 1: a TV show because people would latch onto the one
Speaker 1: I love and that that's what they want to let
Speaker 1: And then then you find out, wait a second, that
Speaker 1: this has nothing to do with what you were trying
Speaker 1: to say, And that's fine. It's fun to be subversive.
Speaker 1: Mike and I also talked about how R. E. M
Speaker 1: made two very funny, very unlikely appearances in two very
Speaker 1: iconic television series, Sesame Street and The Simpsons. I'll tell
Speaker 1: you that the story about how that came about was
Speaker 1: was really fun. We were filming a video at some
Speaker 1: warehouse in Brooklyn and nearby Mike Scully when the executive
Speaker 1: producers of the Simpsons was filming an nrb Q documentary.
Speaker 1: Uh Now, Peter and I especially loved NRBQ, as does
Speaker 1: Mike Scully, so I ran into him in the hallway
Speaker 1: and we got to talking and he said, well, look,
Speaker 1: were you guys, you know, talk to me for my
Speaker 1: INTERBQ documentary. I said, sure, if you put us on
Speaker 1: the Simpsons. He said, okay, so that's that's how we
Speaker 1: got on there, and uh and you know, and that's
Speaker 1: still you had no intention of that actually happening, right,
Speaker 1: You're just I was dead serious about might happen to Really,
Speaker 1: I that was a deal I was making. I said, yes,
Speaker 1: we'll do that. We'll do an interview for you for
Speaker 1: your INTERBQ documentary, but you gotta put us on the
Speaker 1: Simpson's um And that was you know, that's a career
Speaker 1: highlighted to be in there, uh, doing those doing the
Speaker 1: voice over with a couple of folks from the cast.
Speaker 1: But you're kind of a butt of the joke. You
Speaker 1: guys allowed yourselves to be kind of your your reputation
Speaker 1: for embracing environmental causes. He was Homer was kind of
Speaker 1: making fun of that. And then Michael ends up, you're
Speaker 1: very mad in the scene. So so you weren't You
Speaker 1: weren't averse to sort of poking fun at yourselves there.
Speaker 1: You have to if if you'd say the trouble is. Uh,
Speaker 1: you know, rock and roll is littered with the carcasses
Speaker 1: of musicians who took themselves too seriously. It's it's it's
Speaker 1: it's off putting, it's distasteful. Uh, it's like, you know,
Speaker 1: Peter used to say this thing and I don't. It's
Speaker 1: not entirely true, but to a point, it is just
Speaker 1: like rock and roll is a joke and if you
Speaker 1: don't get the joke, then you're the butt of the joke.
Speaker 1: But you know, and I believe that, but I also
Speaker 1: believe that rock and roll can save your life. It literally,
Speaker 1: And so it's it's one of those things that that
Speaker 1: is in a way one of the most important things
Speaker 1: in the world, and in a way is not one
Speaker 1: of the most important things in the world. And you
Speaker 1: have to be able to race both sides of that
Speaker 1: coin to really understand it. Is there a separation when
Speaker 1: you create the music and then you appear in in
Speaker 1: shows like The Simpsons and we haven't even gotten into
Speaker 1: Sesame Street yet, when you guys are are doing a
Speaker 1: kind of an altered version of Shiny Happy People, which
Speaker 1: is a very unexpected r M pop up at that time.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's those are the arenas when you can
Speaker 1: sort of hey, we get it, we are in on
Speaker 1: the joke, we're not the butt of it. Absolutely, And
Speaker 1: again that also depends on the song. I mean, Shiny
Speaker 1: Happy People was a song. It was basically written for kids.
Speaker 1: It's like stand, you know, people go, oh, those are
Speaker 1: stupid suey ari um songs. Well, yeah, they're for children,
Speaker 1: you know. I mean, adults can enjoy them too, but
Speaker 1: they're primarily aimed at kids. Look at the videos you
Speaker 1: know those are you know, those are two appealed to children,
Speaker 1: and that's and that's great. So why the heck not
Speaker 1: do furry Happy Monsters on Sesame Street, which was I
Speaker 1: think still one of the most popular things we ever did.
Speaker 1: I get people still coming up to me on the
Speaker 1: street saying how much they've still watch that with their kids,
Speaker 1: as even as their and their kids are showing it
Speaker 1: for their kids. Now, you know, it's it's just it
Speaker 1: was such a it had such a long life. It's incredible.
Speaker 1: It's amazing. The landscape has changed so much. But there's
Speaker 1: so many usages for songs now that they do have
Speaker 1: a second and third and even a fourth life. Sometimes
Speaker 1: when people become aware of them that were way too
Speaker 1: young to hear him the first time. Have you ever
Speaker 1: come across some usage when you weren't I'm not. I'm
Speaker 1: not thrilled by the way that that's been interpreted, either
Speaker 1: the visual images that's been married to or or the
Speaker 1: way it's used in the plot. Is there any example that, yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: we did it. We gotta put our money where our
Speaker 1: mouth is. But I'd rather not see our song kind
Speaker 1: of use that way. I was a little ambivalent about
Speaker 1: Independence Day. I think I think Into the World is
Speaker 1: an independence day? Is that right? Um? You know, big
Speaker 1: dumb blockbuster movies are. They're a little too lowest common
Speaker 1: denominators sometimes for feeling really good about it. On the
Speaker 1: other hand, and uh, if it worked, it fit the
Speaker 1: money wasn't bad. I won't lie about that. Um. But
Speaker 1: but again, it's it's a huge movie. A lot of
Speaker 1: people are going to see that movie. And at that point,
Speaker 1: it's not about selling the music. It's just about having
Speaker 1: it heard, you know. Being a part of the zeitgeist
Speaker 1: or whatever is is nice, And um, I don't know,
Speaker 1: there are a lot of good things that come of that.
Speaker 1: You're you're part of the culture. It means you're gonna
Speaker 1: last longer, more people will have heard of you. It
Speaker 1: gives you more freedom to do other things. Um, and
Speaker 1: you know, and again, I just like the fact that
Speaker 1: in ten years somebody's gonna watch Independence Day and go,
Speaker 1: holy crap, there's an r M song or what is
Speaker 1: that song? I gotta go find that song. It's it's
Speaker 1: just it's it's a little easter egg that sneaks up
Speaker 1: on people sometimes once another song. Obviously that's been downloaded
Speaker 1: and listened to a lot because of what we're going through.
Speaker 1: But it's pretty amazing that one artistic creation there, this
Speaker 1: a few minutes long, could be used for Independence Day too,
Speaker 1: big bang theory to the film Buffy the Vampire Slayers,
Speaker 1: I mean, the Simpsons we talked about. That's that. That's
Speaker 1: one piece of music interpreted that many different ways. Yeah. Oh,
Speaker 1: and that's and that's the great thing about music is
Speaker 1: you can it means what you think it means. Mike
Speaker 1: is such a wise and thoughtful guy on lots of topics,
Speaker 1: and was fun to hear his thoughts on music. This
Speaker 1: episode is an absolute must for fans of r e
Speaker 1: M or fans of how TV shows use music. Period.
Speaker 1: Next up, the latest in a subset of episodes in
Speaker 1: this podcast, storytelling at the nineteenth Hole with the ultra
Speaker 1: talented Mike Terko. Now, we had a lot of ground
Speaker 1: to cover in a thirty year friendship in TV sports broadcasting.
Speaker 1: We recorded this just before Mike went off to Tokyo
Speaker 1: to host the Olympics for NBC. But we begin with
Speaker 1: the story from another global sporting event, the World Cup
Speaker 1: in Brazil. Hey. The true highlight of the World Cup
Speaker 1: and Brazil, though, I think, came when we were hanging
Speaker 1: out in the bar of one of the lobby hotels there,
Speaker 1: the the couc command of Beach and my wife Jennifer
Speaker 1: had the idea, you brought back the old days of
Speaker 1: Sports Center. Why not text her old friend, long lost
Speaker 1: Craig Kilbourne because we had we had we were sure
Speaker 1: what happened to Craig. He kind of went away and
Speaker 1: went underground and we hadn't heard from him. And it's
Speaker 1: one of those after a couple of drinks and you're
Speaker 1: you're kind of euphoric to be there, she has the
Speaker 1: idea and lone boat, you do it, and he responds,
Speaker 1: I mean from the other world where he'd been spending
Speaker 1: the last few years. And it follows with connect in touch,
Speaker 1: follow him now on Instagram and every day, every day
Speaker 1: there's something good. There's Craig enjoying, enjoying lives. But the
Speaker 1: picture that he sent you, the picture that he take
Speaker 1: freight nally he texted, he texted you a picture which
Speaker 1: was a precursor of his genius Instagram feed where he's
Speaker 1: very much in care Arcter, this kind of cocktail swirling renaissance. Man.
Speaker 1: Here we are in freaking rio and Craig Kilborne emerges
Speaker 1: from a secrecy to like send you this text of
Speaker 1: enjoying a cocktail and you you were so you came
Speaker 1: and knocked We had we had parted way and that
Speaker 1: you came down the hallway knocked on the door from
Speaker 1: kilborn sorright, and that that was That's the funny part
Speaker 1: I think for all of us over time is we
Speaker 1: were we were there and you're still there at ESPN.
Speaker 1: Obviously we were there at such a really cool time.
Speaker 1: The talent that was found was truly unique, and everybody
Speaker 1: couldn't be a Chris Burman copycat, but a lot of
Speaker 1: people figured out what their lane was with their personnely.
Speaker 1: What Oderman and Patrick did was brilliant, was absolutely bright.
Speaker 1: There's no way though that Chris Myers and I could
Speaker 1: follow and pull that off. So you kind of did
Speaker 1: what was in your personality and what was different, and
Speaker 1: that that was I think. I think it helped us
Speaker 1: all learn how you had to have a little bit
Speaker 1: of a little bit of every club in the bag
Speaker 1: that you could play, but you had to have your
Speaker 1: own swing. You couldn't copy Berman's swing. You couldn't be Olderman.
Speaker 1: You just can't. You just can't do that, And that,
Speaker 1: to me is what helped our whole generation succeed and throve.
Speaker 1: We we would be different people in different times like now,
Speaker 1: but for what it was back then, where I think
Speaker 1: we're all blessed that we not only had the place,
Speaker 1: but we all had each other to learn from too,
Speaker 1: push each other to take the best of and put
Speaker 1: it in the way I do things. And I think
Speaker 1: that's why so many of us are lucky enough to
Speaker 1: still be doing this thirty years after we started. Maybe
Speaker 1: you had a chance to ever reflect what you've been
Speaker 1: able to do. You've been able to cover golf in
Speaker 1: the era of Tiger NFL in the era of Brady
Speaker 1: and Manning and Breeze and so many others, Kobe and
Speaker 1: Lebron calling NB. I don't know. I don't think you
Speaker 1: were a little bit too late for Jordan and Jordan
Speaker 1: had retired by the time you got there, but actually
Speaker 1: got the back end the back end of Jordan. Jordan
Speaker 1: too in Washington. Okay, I consider his career end when
Speaker 1: he was a bull. But but we've talked about in
Speaker 1: Serena and Roger and Rafa in tennis. I mean just
Speaker 1: the gratitude that I'm sure we share for being around
Speaker 1: and being able to see that and never taking that
Speaker 1: for granted for a day. You're right, Uh, do count
Speaker 1: myself lucky for the service. But you've done. There's other
Speaker 1: things you've done. I just named just the name. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm with you. And what it What it made me
Speaker 1: think of right away was I get asked, Austin, what
Speaker 1: players do you like to talk to or what players
Speaker 1: are the best in meetings? Right? And I say to folks,
Speaker 1: my favorite meetings with players that there's something that you enjoy,
Speaker 1: but the meetings that are the ones that you walk
Speaker 1: away and go okay, that that guy's wired differently, that
Speaker 1: woman is different than the others who I cover. Is
Speaker 1: that all these great athletes see sports to me differently
Speaker 1: than the others do. In addition to their physical abilities
Speaker 1: which are extraordinary, their minds are powerful, very broad and
Speaker 1: wide in the scope of what they take in and
Speaker 1: their ability to take the mental and match it with
Speaker 1: the physical. Like if you if you ask me, what
Speaker 1: what football meetings do you look forward to? Uh? For
Speaker 1: NFL games Peyton when he was playing Brady Rogers Breeze,
Speaker 1: Like those guys, you just have a different quality of
Speaker 1: meeting with them. It's because they mentally do it so well.
Speaker 1: And it was the same thing we uh, God rest
Speaker 1: his soul. Kobe's last game, it was a game that
Speaker 1: it was me, Hugh be and Lisasulters got to call
Speaker 1: in l A and Kobe sat with us for a
Speaker 1: half hour at five. Bishop was our producer and he
Speaker 1: had covered Kobe all the way back in his early day.
Speaker 1: Is Uh. We sat with with Kobe for like twenty
Speaker 1: five to thirty minutes and talked about career, of life,
Speaker 1: everything else. And he really he said, I don't know
Speaker 1: what I have in me tonight. I don't you know.
Speaker 1: And he ended up having an incredible game that you know,
Speaker 1: you were reminded the mentality of the athlete and their
Speaker 1: mental approach to He knew exactly how much he had
Speaker 1: in the tank, and if he got going, he could
Speaker 1: he could get to sixty in the tank. Right what
Speaker 1: he did exactly exactly. You Be said, you know, I
Speaker 1: had it. I had it. I had a dream. I
Speaker 1: was shaven, and I remembered my dream. I thought, I
Speaker 1: thought Kobe could have like a fifty sixty point kind
Speaker 1: of game. And he threw that out like in the
Speaker 1: first quarter, and Kobe is going there. I told you,
Speaker 1: I told you it was was one of those. But
Speaker 1: it's the athletes that the athletes who are so smart.
Speaker 1: And that's what I've learned to appreciate about Lebron. You
Speaker 1: talked to Lebron about basketball, Oh my gosh, it's a
Speaker 1: master class. He's he's so much. That's why he's an
Speaker 1: unbelievable assist guy and rebounder, and he's made so many
Speaker 1: teams so much better over the years. And that's what
Speaker 1: I feel so fortunate is not just being able to
Speaker 1: call the events that these folks have been involved with,
Speaker 1: but to hear what makes them so great and it's
Speaker 1: an understanding. As the the axes cross between ability and
Speaker 1: mental acuity, the greats are able to maximize it longer
Speaker 1: because they know how to get the most out of
Speaker 1: their body. They know how to handle situations like Tiger
Speaker 1: winning the Masters in twenty at forty four forty three
Speaker 1: that at that time, excuse me, I mean that that
Speaker 1: was stunning given what he had gone through physically, But
Speaker 1: Tiger's mental approach around Augusta and on the second nine
Speaker 1: on Sunday when they got to the twelfth and all
Speaker 1: the other guys hit it in the water and Tiger
Speaker 1: ended up over the bunker middle of the green made
Speaker 1: three and he just played smart golfful everybody else try
Speaker 1: to go win the Masters, and his mental abilities the
Speaker 1: reason he won that Masters, and just to be able
Speaker 1: to tap into that briefly every once in a while
Speaker 1: is what I take away from the best of the
Speaker 1: best in this era of great efforts. Much more of
Speaker 1: the episode with Mike Terriko on the early days together
Speaker 1: at ESPN, and also the great events that Mike has covered.
Speaker 1: Next up twin episodes in season two that we call
Speaker 1: Prowess and Perseverance. They focus on complicated issues that both
Speaker 1: Jennifer and I find incredibly important how to help and
Speaker 1: support our combat veterans. He had two brave, tremendous guests,
Speaker 1: ABC News correspondent Bob Woodruff, who was nearly killed on
Speaker 1: the roadside explosion will embedded with troops in Iraq, and
Speaker 1: Marine Corporal Kiante's story he lost part of his legol
Speaker 1: on patrol in Afghanistan. Kiante went on to become a sprinter,
Speaker 1: a marathoner, and a mountain climber. His story of trying
Speaker 1: to make the final push to the summit of an
Speaker 1: Arctica's highest mountain, Mount Vincent, is incredibly compelling and emotional.
Speaker 1: I got really tired and I started to doubt my
Speaker 1: abilities because it became harder and harder, like as we're
Speaker 1: getting to the base of the summit um or right
Speaker 1: before the last push for the summit, so we had
Speaker 1: to rest camp and then wake up early that morning
Speaker 1: and pushed for the summit. But that was where it
Speaker 1: kind of kicked in for me, where I was just like,
Speaker 1: you know, is can I do this? And it was
Speaker 1: kind of a moment for me where I looked at
Speaker 1: it I was just just like, hey, I made it
Speaker 1: this far. I'm proud of myself, Like I'm I'm I'm
Speaker 1: really proud of myself making this far. I never thought
Speaker 1: i'd make it this far in a mountain. This is
Speaker 1: kind of cool. Um, Like, if I couldn't go any further,
Speaker 1: I'm still happy that I did this. But I don't
Speaker 1: ever half assid anything, And so it was just like, no,
Speaker 1: I can't set up for that. We're getting to the summit.
Speaker 1: And it got to a point where there was a
Speaker 1: section of it where I was just like, I I
Speaker 1: really don't know, like kind of like that marathon field too,
Speaker 1: where I was like, I don't know if I can
Speaker 1: do this, Like I truly don't know, because if I
Speaker 1: get to a certain point, we have to get back down.
Speaker 1: You know, there's no vehicle coming to get me. There's
Speaker 1: no helicopter that's going to airlift me down. There's that's
Speaker 1: just not an option here at all. So I kept
Speaker 1: telling myself, I was like, what do you What do
Speaker 1: we do? And I'm like, well, we don't quit. So
Speaker 1: we're getting to the summit and the only thing I
Speaker 1: can do is try to find motivation. And I always
Speaker 1: go back to this because it makes me laugh. But
Speaker 1: I always thought of my Marines because I had the
Speaker 1: Marine Corps flag in my backpack, and that's what that was.
Speaker 1: Another motivation of mine was getting that to the summit.
Speaker 1: But I always thought of my my Marines, how they
Speaker 1: would laugh at because I don't like the cold, and
Speaker 1: being an African American, like on the coldest mountain on
Speaker 1: the in the coldest place on Earth. It was just like, oh,
Speaker 1: there's so many jokes, so many jokes. I just kind
Speaker 1: of laughed in my own head and just kind of
Speaker 1: took those names and the people that I remember who
Speaker 1: did pass away and even to you know, the names
Speaker 1: of my friends that they're still alive, um, and kind
Speaker 1: of just envisioned them like walking next to me or
Speaker 1: hiking with me and we're just kind of like laughing, um.
Speaker 1: And it it gave me that feeling of being back
Speaker 1: during those hard times where like I would even question
Speaker 1: in the Marine Corps like can I do this? And
Speaker 1: I find my way to push through. And that was
Speaker 1: my motivation was doing it for them, doing it for me.
Speaker 1: But then also the other piece of that puzzle that
Speaker 1: clicked as I was walking up there, was like I'm
Speaker 1: doing this for other veterans who are wounded as well,
Speaker 1: who are in the hospital, who didn't think that, you
Speaker 1: know who, who don't know what's beyond or what's at
Speaker 1: the scope with their limit. Like when I saw Marks one,
Speaker 1: I didn't think that was an option for me, you know.
Speaker 1: So to me that was motivation. I want to be
Speaker 1: that motivation for other Marines, other people. And so I
Speaker 1: was just like, no, this is this I wanted this
Speaker 1: is going to be something bigger than me, UM, but
Speaker 1: this is it's still a challenge for me. UM. And
Speaker 1: so as I'm going up to the summit, UM, I
Speaker 1: you know, it's funny because actually Tim, he kind of
Speaker 1: hit it for me for a while. He didn't want
Speaker 1: to tell me what the summit was, even though it's
Speaker 1: like you're running out of space ward to go. Uh.
Speaker 1: But we get to the summit and I just break.
Speaker 1: I am truly in all and just just it was
Speaker 1: a surreal experience that I actually did it UM with
Speaker 1: all the doubt that kind of came in my mind
Speaker 1: and all the questions that I had, I was actually
Speaker 1: on top of Mount Vincent and the icing on the cake.
Speaker 1: And this is kind of another great story, is that
Speaker 1: I got to actually call my mom on that mountain.
Speaker 1: The biggest, the biggest accomplishment I feel I've ever done
Speaker 1: was being on that mountain and I got to call
Speaker 1: the biggest inspiration and my biggest motivation. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: as soon as I got there. So to me, it
Speaker 1: is like the highlight of all my athletic feats. So
Speaker 1: that to me was a great feeling. Computer reflect back
Speaker 1: now more than a decade and that that September morning,
Speaker 1: when part of your right leg was taken from you,
Speaker 1: how would you say that incident made you grow as
Speaker 1: a person? What did you gain from that experience from
Speaker 1: having part of your like taken away? Being injured is
Speaker 1: honestly one of the best things that's ever happened to me.
Speaker 1: I have to be honest with that, because I've done
Speaker 1: so much. I've done so much in my life that
Speaker 1: I would have never thought was possible, and finding myself
Speaker 1: through these challenges because of my injury, just to me
Speaker 1: has made me a better person. Like if I had
Speaker 1: to say, well, if you were to ask me and
Speaker 1: then I wasn't injured at all, what would I be?
Speaker 1: I probably say back home in Stockton, where I was,
Speaker 1: you know, my hometown might be in school, might not
Speaker 1: be in school. You know, I might you know, I
Speaker 1: might have like tim kids right now, I don't know.
Speaker 1: You know, I couldn't. I couldn't truly answer that because
Speaker 1: I truly I didn't live the best life like being injured.
Speaker 1: At this point, I've lived a lot of my best
Speaker 1: life that I would have never dreamt possible, And so
Speaker 1: my injury has really pushed me. But it also want
Speaker 1: made me want to push myself to be better and
Speaker 1: help others, because I feel like everyone should experience living
Speaker 1: life and not and not being stuck in place like
Speaker 1: you can be when you get injured. You can get
Speaker 1: stuck in place and think, oh, life's over, life's not
Speaker 1: great anymore. You know, you could be depressed. You really
Speaker 1: spiral downwards. But I really continue to do these things
Speaker 1: to show other people their challenges for me, but to
Speaker 1: show other people that you can do it, whether you're
Speaker 1: missing limb or not. We all, we're all human. We
Speaker 1: all go through something mentally. You know, we all have
Speaker 1: a brain as far as I'm aware, but we so
Speaker 1: we all go through something. You know upstairs, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe it's a hard day, maybe you're going through a
Speaker 1: tough time. I I want to show that you you know,
Speaker 1: even when times get hard, you can get through it.
Speaker 1: You just you just really got to keep moving forward.
Speaker 1: We have a choice in the matter of how we
Speaker 1: go about situations in our lives, how we you know,
Speaker 1: choose to make a plan, take action, or not do something.
Speaker 1: It's all a choice. But that's that's really the reality
Speaker 1: of you being in charge of your own life is
Speaker 1: that you have a choice. Even if you feel like
Speaker 1: someone else is dictating it, have your you have a choice.
Speaker 1: You know, you have a choice of how you go
Speaker 1: about handling it. Really, I like kante story. Bob Woodrow
Speaker 1: spoke with great candor, in great detail about the day
Speaker 1: that his life path was changed suddenly and forever. He
Speaker 1: talked about the dark times, the despair, and the fear,
Speaker 1: but also about ways in which his near fatal head
Speaker 1: injuries changed him in ways that he could not have imagined.
Speaker 1: My little daughter, Norah. I've got twin adorable little girls,
Speaker 1: and they were five years old when I was hit
Speaker 1: and about you know, six months after I came back,
Speaker 1: still had all of these wounds all over my body,
Speaker 1: and I couldn't remember a lot of things. Um and
Speaker 1: she my daughter asked me. She asked. She was talking
Speaker 1: to my wife Lee, and she says, Mom, you know, ah,
Speaker 1: dad's head seems to have that because they cut off
Speaker 1: part of my skull. You've got that dented head. And
Speaker 1: mom says, don't worry. That's They're gonna put that skull
Speaker 1: back on. It'll be fun. And mommy's got all of
Speaker 1: these scars all over his back, don't worry. See that'll
Speaker 1: get better. And my dad's got all these little pieces
Speaker 1: of metal and rocks, you know, implanted in the left
Speaker 1: part of his jaw. She she says, don't worry those
Speaker 1: popping out one at a time. That's gonna be fine.
Speaker 1: And she said, you know, mom, noll the I think
Speaker 1: my dad loves me even more than he did before. Now,
Speaker 1: whether that was an expression of it, um, maybe it
Speaker 1: indicated something. I felt so lucky to be alive. So
Speaker 1: that was a positive part. I think. I think maybe
Speaker 1: in some ways maybe I did change personality wise. I
Speaker 1: don't know. I'm sure there's always with depression. There's all
Speaker 1: sorts of snaps that happened. This is not a comb
Speaker 1: bay a story, but there are some things that maybe
Speaker 1: are better about me. Bob says, that his injuries didn't
Speaker 1: just change his path, had changed his per us lug.
Speaker 1: With his wife Lee, they formed the Bob Woodriff Family Foundation,
Speaker 1: an incredibly important nonprofit organization focusing on veterans issues. The
Speaker 1: organizations known for thinking outside the box, filling in the
Speaker 1: gaps between government programs, being flexible and adaptable as the
Speaker 1: landscape changes. Much of the focus now is on the
Speaker 1: crisis of food insecurity for vets. His voice is both
Speaker 1: passionate and pragmatic. I just want to make sure that
Speaker 1: people know that too. When I talk about the wounded
Speaker 1: in Iraq and Afghanistan, you know, this is you know,
Speaker 1: one one quarter maybe of those who served that have
Speaker 1: gone through something like this. You know, most of them
Speaker 1: have come back, you know, healthy, you know, and and
Speaker 1: the last thing they want to think is that we
Speaker 1: all think that they were at the war and they're wounded,
Speaker 1: and they're they're not able to do the same as
Speaker 1: they did before. I just want to make sure that
Speaker 1: that's that that's clear. But those that did have something
Speaker 1: that happened over there, it's been really double a double whammy. Listen.
Speaker 1: I mean, respect and congratulations and all of that are
Speaker 1: really good for for everybody. But yeah, I mean, I
Speaker 1: guess you just don't don't assume that there's something, you know,
Speaker 1: some mental issue that had or physical thing that's you know,
Speaker 1: that's invisible. But yes, I think yes, we make sure
Speaker 1: you look because this is one again that they don't
Speaker 1: want to come back and admit. So if you do
Speaker 1: notice something, then try to do if you can to
Speaker 1: convince them to seek some help or for that. But
Speaker 1: I do talk to a lot of veterans, and they
Speaker 1: love it when people have raised the flags and say
Speaker 1: thank you for serving our country and giving them the
Speaker 1: ability to get on the plane before the rest and
Speaker 1: all that. But some also say, well, you know what,
Speaker 1: just let us kind of just just kind of go
Speaker 1: into this different world, civilian world we're now back at.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm not sure we I couldn't even tell
Speaker 1: you the percentage who love that and those who don't
Speaker 1: really want that. What they really want they want to
Speaker 1: get the job, They want a job, you know, they
Speaker 1: want to have their life better, not just somebody shouting
Speaker 1: out and say, you know you serve thank you so much.
Speaker 1: But I'm not going to do anything more than that,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm not going to do anything else to
Speaker 1: help you. Uh, the big thing is not just to
Speaker 1: say or to show how much you love them. It's
Speaker 1: really more about doing something behind the curtain, to do
Speaker 1: something for them. I think it's a motivation for Americans
Speaker 1: to do something for them because there's a point where
Speaker 1: this system may not continue anymore if it looks like
Speaker 1: we're not going to really treat them with dignity. Those
Speaker 1: that do volunteer to take the risk, whether it's in
Speaker 1: the hospital, where it's in the stands of the war.
Speaker 1: You know, if we that doesn't happen, if we just
Speaker 1: stop supporting those that are still needs after serving, then
Speaker 1: maybe the next system will be a draft again. You know,
Speaker 1: then we will people are not gonna want to volunteer,
Speaker 1: and therefore we're gonna have to make your grandchild do
Speaker 1: it instead. You know, even though he doesn't want to,
Speaker 1: it doesn't have to build. Let's do so. So I
Speaker 1: think there's a there's a motivation to continue to do
Speaker 1: something for the for the military if you can. I'm
Speaker 1: so grateful for Bob's friendship and for his example of
Speaker 1: resilience and generosity, and I should learn more about the
Speaker 1: Bob Winder Family Foundation. Now. The final episode of Season
Speaker 1: two also focuses on family, three generations of Van Winkle's,
Speaker 1: who created, rescued, and resurrected the family whiskey business that
Speaker 1: now produces one of the most coveted bottles of spirits
Speaker 1: on the planet. It's Kentucky Derby Day, and the bizarre
Speaker 1: chapter in American history known as Prohibition has just ended.
Speaker 1: A whiskey salesman, Julian Van Winkle, merges two smaller companies
Speaker 1: and forms the Stitzelweller Distillery not far from Louisville. The
Speaker 1: man's preferred recipe for bourbon is a little different. He
Speaker 1: likes wheat as the secondary grain to corn. Not right.
Speaker 1: The man knows what he wants. He demands quality. He says,
Speaker 1: we will make fine bourbon and a profit if we can,
Speaker 1: at a loss if we must, but always find bourbon.
Speaker 1: The company flourishes. He passes it along to his son,
Speaker 1: Julian Jr. But then tough times sales drop. Bourbon becomes
Speaker 1: uncool to drink in the sixties and seventies, and Julian Jr.
Speaker 1: Has to sell. Eventually, his son Julian Van Winkle, the
Speaker 1: third Pappy's grandson, takes over the company and with some
Speaker 1: help and some good fortune, but mainly just plenty of
Speaker 1: hard labor, stubbornness, and faith. He rebuilds the van Winkl
Speaker 1: brand and reclaims the family legacy. It's an honor and
Speaker 1: a lot of fun to have Julian as my guest
Speaker 1: on this podcast that his story of how Pappy Van
Speaker 1: Winkle became one of the most coveted bottles of spirits
Speaker 1: in the world. It is really incredible. It was. It
Speaker 1: was stressful. You can ask uh as my wife Cissy,
Speaker 1: and our and our children even um, you know, I
Speaker 1: don't know um what they thought of what I was
Speaker 1: going back then, but I was just hanging on with
Speaker 1: my fingernails. And it's the only thing I really knew
Speaker 1: how to do. UM, so I wouldn't ah, And I
Speaker 1: knew it was good a good product. I mean I
Speaker 1: knew damn well as a good product. So UM, I
Speaker 1: just was gonna go down with the ship, so to speak,
Speaker 1: if it didn't work out. But kept trying and trying
Speaker 1: and trying, and and I you know, I am stubborn.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna ride this baby all the way down down
Speaker 1: to the grave or up to the to the heavens.
Speaker 1: But it luckily worked out with a lot of help
Speaker 1: from a lot of people talked about in the book.
Speaker 1: But it's um it was, you know, it's it's do
Speaker 1: or die. But I believed in it, which is the
Speaker 1: main thing. These days. Pappy van Winkle Bourbon is producing
Speaker 1: the Buffalo Trace Distillery. We'll get into all that with Julian,
Speaker 1: why Pappy's is so delicious and why it's so damned
Speaker 1: hard to find even in Kentucky, whereas legend has it,
Speaker 1: there are two barrels of bourbon for every person. I
Speaker 1: also bringing some rate stories of that episode. A good
Speaker 1: buddy and the superb writer, right Thompson, who wrote the
Speaker 1: book Pappy Land, a story of family, fine bourbon, and
Speaker 1: things that last. Well, that's it for our season to
Speaker 1: highlight show. Hope you had a quarter of as much
Speaker 1: fun listening to it as we had putting it together.
Speaker 1: Now we're excited about the return of this podcast with
Speaker 1: season three, brand new episodes. We're gonna launch with the
Speaker 1: return of full fledged football, not the games on the field,
Speaker 1: but all the things that surround college football that make
Speaker 1: it great. The top tailgating scenes in the country, the
Speaker 1: best bands in the land back performing in stadiums and
Speaker 1: the mascots on the sideline has got some unbelievable stories
Speaker 1: about some very famous mascots. Football is back. This episode
Speaker 1: is going to be a real celebration of that, and
Speaker 1: it's coming very very soon, so keep an eye out
Speaker 1: for it. In the mean time, write you to subscribe
Speaker 1: the feedback on my Instagram and get ready for season three.
Speaker 1: I'll talk to you very soon.