1 00:00:01,880 --> 00:00:06,400 Speaker 1: Now from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg Sound on 2 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:09,920 Speaker 1: supporting your craze ability to fight off Russian aggression to 3 00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:15,360 Speaker 1: defend his sovereignty and territorial integrity is a worldwide committment bookings. 4 00:00:15,480 --> 00:00:19,400 Speaker 1: Russia is desperate, the prolaton brave nation of Hukreen will preva, 5 00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:23,079 Speaker 1: I will look at a. Cameron directly tells Zelensky, you'd 6 00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:25,520 Speaker 1: better leave your hands off of our sons and daughters, 7 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 1: because they're not dying over there. Bloomberg Sound on Politics, 8 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 1: Policy and perspective from DC's top name. We're going from 9 00:00:33,800 --> 00:00:36,720 Speaker 1: today all the way back to Barisba. Are you tired 10 00:00:36,760 --> 00:00:39,240 Speaker 1: of waiting? No, we want from back. Let's be honest. 11 00:00:39,320 --> 00:00:42,920 Speaker 1: If you don't mind me saying so, I think vindication 12 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:47,839 Speaker 1: looks pretty good on me. Bloomberg Sound On with Joe 13 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:53,199 Speaker 1: Matthew on Bloomberg Radio President Biden Dance's soft Shoe with 14 00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:56,360 Speaker 1: the German Chancellor. Welcome to the fastest hour in politics 15 00:00:56,480 --> 00:00:59,320 Speaker 1: as Olaf Schultz visits the White House with no news 16 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 1: conference and no state dinner. As the two discuss arming 17 00:01:03,320 --> 00:01:06,759 Speaker 1: Ukraine and fending off the influence of China were joined 18 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,440 Speaker 1: by John Herb's former US ambassador to Ukraine now with 19 00:01:09,520 --> 00:01:12,720 Speaker 1: the Atlantic Council's Eurasia's Center. The chair of the SEC 20 00:01:12,959 --> 00:01:15,200 Speaker 1: says he's open minded when it comes to rewriting the 21 00:01:15,240 --> 00:01:18,480 Speaker 1: trading rules for Wall Street. It's a big project. We'll 22 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 1: talk about with Bloomberg's Kaylee Lions coming up and Spak 23 00:01:21,640 --> 00:01:24,560 Speaker 1: kicks into high gear. We're watching so you don't have to. 24 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:28,520 Speaker 1: With analysis from our signature panel. Bloomberg Politics contributors Rick 25 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:31,360 Speaker 1: Davis and Jeanie Schanzano are with us for the hour 26 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:34,039 Speaker 1: on this Friday to be a fly on the wall 27 00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:37,960 Speaker 1: today as President Biden meets with German Chancellor Oloff Schultz 28 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:41,400 Speaker 1: following some tensions if I can use that word over 29 00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:45,800 Speaker 1: arming Ukraine. Most recently, it was about tanks and you 30 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 1: might not have even known he was here. There was 31 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:53,000 Speaker 1: no news conference, no bilateral news conference with US and 32 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:58,040 Speaker 1: foreign correspondence. There was no state dinner, no big welcome ceremony. 33 00:01:58,160 --> 00:02:00,920 Speaker 1: This was all business and we heard from the two 34 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: leaders briefly. They did allow reporters into the Oval office 35 00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:06,120 Speaker 1: for a pool spray, as they call it, some brief 36 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:09,440 Speaker 1: prepared remarks. Here's President Biden together, we work lockstep to 37 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:14,919 Speaker 1: supply critical security assistance Ukraine and from everything from we've 38 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:18,760 Speaker 1: done it in a lockstep, ammunish artillery to armored tanks, 39 00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 1: air defense systems, a similar sentiment and tone from the 40 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:27,359 Speaker 1: German chance to listen, it's really a quoted that we 41 00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:31,919 Speaker 1: effected it together, that we organized our lockstep, that we've 42 00:02:31,960 --> 00:02:35,119 Speaker 1: made the feasible that we can give the necessary suppote 43 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: to ukrew. Okay, you can't even hear what there's something 44 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,480 Speaker 1: about lockstep eye to eye or this unity here. Obviously, 45 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:44,919 Speaker 1: this is the point Karine John Pierre, the Press Secretary, 46 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: asked a bit earlier about the meeting, and she really 47 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:51,080 Speaker 1: was driving home the point that these two people have 48 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:57,040 Speaker 1: a relationship. Here's Karine John Pierre. All right, Well you 49 00:02:57,080 --> 00:03:00,040 Speaker 1: can take it from me that she talked about the 50 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:02,639 Speaker 1: fact that they're in touch, have been in touch since 51 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 1: he became chancellor and talk frequently. Here this is where 52 00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:09,400 Speaker 1: we begin the conversation with the ambassador. John herbst Is 53 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:12,240 Speaker 1: with his former US Ambassador to Ukraine now senior director 54 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: of the Atlantic Council's Eurasias Center. Ambassador, it's great to 55 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: have you. The story coming out of the White House 56 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 1: today was before anything else don't make too much news apparently, 57 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:24,680 Speaker 1: but also to project some unity and not let anything 58 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:28,239 Speaker 1: else interfere with that. Do these two see eye to 59 00:03:28,320 --> 00:03:31,640 Speaker 1: eye when it comes to Ukraine or not? I think 60 00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:38,320 Speaker 1: their views are quite similar, although not identical. Okay, that's 61 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:42,080 Speaker 1: an efficient answer is have we made too much out 62 00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 1: of this being a strained relationship in the news media. 63 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 1: We focused on tanks, We've focused on longer range missile 64 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,320 Speaker 1: defense systems. There's been a lot of questions about Germany's 65 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:57,360 Speaker 1: speed on this issue. Well, point of fact, I think 66 00:03:57,400 --> 00:04:01,920 Speaker 1: that both Biden and Schultz have been too timid in 67 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:06,120 Speaker 1: dealing with the Putin threat to US and German security, 68 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 1: of course, mainly Ukraine security for this war. The items 69 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:18,400 Speaker 1: you just mentioned, longer range missiles and rockets, tanks and 70 00:04:18,480 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 1: for that matter, of fighter planes or all things Ukraine 71 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:26,120 Speaker 1: needs to defeat the Russians on the battlefield in Ukraine. 72 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:30,359 Speaker 1: Both Biden and Schultz have been reluctant to provide these things. 73 00:04:31,160 --> 00:04:34,239 Speaker 1: There was a little bit of a fuss about tanks 74 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 1: in January, but by and large neither Schultz nor Biden 75 00:04:38,440 --> 00:04:42,000 Speaker 1: wanted to send tanks to Ukraine again a failure because 76 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:44,640 Speaker 1: they're too timid in dealing with the Russian danger, and 77 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:48,479 Speaker 1: the reason why there were some differences that emerged publicly 78 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 1: is that the Brits forced the issue by saying naveging 79 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:53,560 Speaker 1: to send tanks. The Poles also and others in Europe, 80 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:57,880 Speaker 1: and that embarrassed I would say, the White House and 81 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:01,560 Speaker 1: the Chancery in Germany, and then the Biden administration for 82 00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 1: the first time began to push the Germans to send 83 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:06,880 Speaker 1: the LAYO parts, and the Germans still insisted they would 84 00:05:06,880 --> 00:05:09,080 Speaker 1: only send lay A parts if we sent our tanks 85 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:13,240 Speaker 1: to Abrams. Right, So, so at that point in time 86 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:15,800 Speaker 1: a difference emerged between the two, but both would have 87 00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:17,760 Speaker 1: preferred not to send the tanks, which again would be 88 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:20,840 Speaker 1: a serious error. They're refuting that now. You know, Germany 89 00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:22,520 Speaker 1: says we never had a mandate that you have to 90 00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 1: send Abrams tanks, but it was widely reported to your 91 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:28,479 Speaker 1: point that that's exactly what happened. I guess now that 92 00:05:28,520 --> 00:05:30,920 Speaker 1: the tanks are in place, though, is this a chance 93 00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:33,039 Speaker 1: for these two to rebuild or is it not about 94 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:35,240 Speaker 1: that ambassador, or was there a relationship to begin with, 95 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:42,039 Speaker 1: the relationship again has been fairly strong. I think the 96 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:45,839 Speaker 1: Biden administration as soon as they took power, privileged the 97 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:49,679 Speaker 1: Germans at the expense of our own interests. We saw 98 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:53,000 Speaker 1: that on the North Stream two project, which despite multiple 99 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 1: Russian violations of commitments that we said they needed to make, 100 00:05:57,520 --> 00:06:00,599 Speaker 1: we allowed that project to proceed because the Germans wanted it. 101 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:04,120 Speaker 1: Only it only died after the Russians launched a big invasion. 102 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:09,080 Speaker 1: So we saw a privileging of the Germans by the administration, 103 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:12,760 Speaker 1: not always to the unitality, to the benefit of American interests. 104 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:16,240 Speaker 1: And I think that's continued since. But again it's it's 105 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 1: continued in part because there's been a similar, similar, overly 106 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:25,120 Speaker 1: timid approach in both Berlin and Washington. Again to Moscow's aggression. 107 00:06:25,800 --> 00:06:27,719 Speaker 1: I think it's fascinating that you don't really draw a 108 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:30,479 Speaker 1: difference between the two we heard from the White House. 109 00:06:30,480 --> 00:06:34,320 Speaker 1: Difference is there, we're a little bit less timid, Okay, 110 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:37,280 Speaker 1: a little bit not enough to you know, to really 111 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:40,120 Speaker 1: make a point here. The White House said China was 112 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:42,279 Speaker 1: also on the agenda. They made that pretty clear ahead 113 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:44,560 Speaker 1: of the meeting. Is that's the real reason why these 114 00:06:44,680 --> 00:06:46,560 Speaker 1: two leaders had to get together in the same room. 115 00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:50,600 Speaker 1: I think I think it was important for them to meet. 116 00:06:51,040 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 1: Because Germany is a very important partner for the United 117 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:56,520 Speaker 1: States in Europe. We just shouldn't privilege them as much 118 00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:59,640 Speaker 1: as the White House has. China is part of the 119 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:03,400 Speaker 1: problem because I mean China policy towards China is one 120 00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 1: where the Germans are a good but a good bit 121 00:07:06,720 --> 00:07:10,360 Speaker 1: behind the United States. You have to credit Trump for 122 00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 1: really laying out the China danger, and Biden has more 123 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:15,520 Speaker 1: or less follow the Trump lead. I'll be it a 124 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:18,440 Speaker 1: little bit, a little bit less toughness, and the Germans 125 00:07:18,480 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 1: are away behind. But Biden of course has influence in 126 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 1: Berlin ways that Trump did not because Trump treated Merkel, 127 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:28,640 Speaker 1: Schultz's predecessor with a certain amount of disregard, which was 128 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:31,680 Speaker 1: a mistake who was Biden treats him with great, great respect, 129 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:35,080 Speaker 1: and we've managed to move the Germans in the right 130 00:07:35,120 --> 00:07:40,600 Speaker 1: direction in dealing with predatory Chinese practices, both economic and political. Well, 131 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 1: how about with regard to Ukraine, though with reports that 132 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:47,680 Speaker 1: they may be considering providing, you know, suicide drones to Russia, 133 00:07:47,760 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 1: which would clearly be used in Ukraine, this might be 134 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:53,400 Speaker 1: something on the docket for these two to talk about. 135 00:07:53,560 --> 00:07:57,240 Speaker 1: Maybe they know something, Ambassador, we need to prepare for this, 136 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:02,600 Speaker 1: and I credit the Biden administration for having intelligence reports 137 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 1: on this possibility and then threatening warning the Chinese don't 138 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:08,880 Speaker 1: do it. I suspect the Chinese will not do it. 139 00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 1: If in fact they do it, I believe that it 140 00:08:12,680 --> 00:08:14,960 Speaker 1: will be very important for the United States and our 141 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:18,880 Speaker 1: allies and partners to put serious sanctions on the Chinese. 142 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:22,280 Speaker 1: I think the Chinese do not want to worsen relations 143 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:26,040 Speaker 1: with Washington by sending weapons to Russia. But we'll see. 144 00:08:27,040 --> 00:08:30,200 Speaker 1: We should note on Thursday, Schultz warned China not to 145 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 1: arm Russia ahead of this meeting, expressing disappointment that Beijing 146 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 1: was no longer willing to join in a quote clear 147 00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:41,640 Speaker 1: condemnation of the Russian attack unquote. We certainly saw that 148 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:44,080 Speaker 1: this week in the G twenty meeting. Ambassador, how much 149 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:47,880 Speaker 1: of our problem is that? Look? I mean, I welcome 150 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:51,320 Speaker 1: that statements as good that the Germans are taking a 151 00:08:51,360 --> 00:08:54,680 Speaker 1: firm align with the Chinese, and again I would credit 152 00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:59,040 Speaker 1: the White House with helping move the Germans in that direction. Yeah, 153 00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:01,080 Speaker 1: glad you could come talk to us. John Herb's, former 154 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:03,320 Speaker 1: US ambassador to Ukraine, Thank you, sir for being with us. 155 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:06,160 Speaker 1: He's now with the Atlantic Council's Eurasia Center. In fact, 156 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,600 Speaker 1: he is senior director. I want to get back to 157 00:09:08,640 --> 00:09:10,400 Speaker 1: what we heard from Karine Jean Pierre today as we 158 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:12,720 Speaker 1: prepared to assemble the panel. Here's the press secretary at 159 00:09:12,760 --> 00:09:15,640 Speaker 1: the White House talking about Biden Schultz. They first met 160 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:19,840 Speaker 1: when he became German Chancellor early last year, I believe 161 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:23,559 Speaker 1: on February seventh, soon after he clearly took office, and 162 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 1: they met here at the White House. And over the 163 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:28,560 Speaker 1: past several years they've seen each other at the margins 164 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:32,000 Speaker 1: of the G seven, in the summit in Germany, at 165 00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:35,079 Speaker 1: NATO at the G twenty summit, and have talked by 166 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:38,160 Speaker 1: phone regularly. And so this is a clearly a relationship 167 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:41,480 Speaker 1: that has been that has been growing over the last year. 168 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:46,600 Speaker 1: There buzzombodies, Rick Davis and Jeanie Schanzano join us, I'm 169 00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:49,680 Speaker 1: happy to say, on a Friday here on Bloomberg Sound 170 00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:53,320 Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Politics contributors in our signature panel. What do 171 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:56,000 Speaker 1: you think, Rick, what's the significance of this meeting today 172 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:58,640 Speaker 1: and was it smart to have no news conference, no 173 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:02,440 Speaker 1: real public fa to this event at all. Well, I 174 00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:05,160 Speaker 1: definitely take it that it is a working visit in 175 00:10:05,200 --> 00:10:07,559 Speaker 1: the sense that they don't really have an intention of 176 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:09,880 Speaker 1: making a big public harangue about it, but are have 177 00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 1: things to talk about. And I think we've heard, you 178 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:15,000 Speaker 1: know from Investor Herbs about like some of those topics 179 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:18,560 Speaker 1: are very important to the ongoing presence of the war 180 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:21,720 Speaker 1: in the Ukraine. So uh, it makes all sense to 181 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:24,160 Speaker 1: to have that kind of a session and to follow 182 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:26,800 Speaker 1: up on the native conferences from last week and in 183 00:10:26,840 --> 00:10:29,280 Speaker 1: the visit. But um, I would say it is a 184 00:10:29,320 --> 00:10:34,320 Speaker 1: little insulting that the Chancellor Schultz doesn't get a better 185 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:38,080 Speaker 1: reception from the Americans. I think, you know, it's no 186 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:42,440 Speaker 1: fancy dinner, no big press conference, no bands. Um you know, 187 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:45,800 Speaker 1: here's a couple of any oars in a good night. 188 00:10:46,679 --> 00:10:48,760 Speaker 1: It's about all the guys getting on this trip. So 189 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:53,120 Speaker 1: hopefully that plays back home for him. Uh and uh 190 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:55,680 Speaker 1: and and that maybe that's part of the dynamic of 191 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:58,679 Speaker 1: German politics to go here and work and not to play. 192 00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 1: But uh, it does seem to be productive and hopefully 193 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:05,520 Speaker 1: they can get on the same script. They certainly said 194 00:11:05,559 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 1: they're on the same script. But I agree with Ambassador Herps, 195 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:11,200 Speaker 1: I think that script needs to be more aggressive. Yeah, well, well, okay, 196 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:14,280 Speaker 1: and that's that's another factor here too though. But about 197 00:11:14,280 --> 00:11:16,920 Speaker 1: the communications, Genie, Yeah, there's going to be some images 198 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:18,439 Speaker 1: of them in the Oval office together. I'm not sure 199 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:20,400 Speaker 1: anybody cares. You couldn't even hear what they were saying 200 00:11:20,840 --> 00:11:22,920 Speaker 1: on the reporter's shotgun. Mike's in there. They're kind of 201 00:11:22,920 --> 00:11:26,199 Speaker 1: looking at the floor. It's a very serious tone. If 202 00:11:26,240 --> 00:11:28,080 Speaker 1: you want to project unity, you why not put him 203 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:30,320 Speaker 1: out there in the East room for a news conference. Yeah, 204 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 1: I mean people were describing it as unusual, perplexing, you know, 205 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:38,080 Speaker 1: almost a low key to a point of baffling. And 206 00:11:38,200 --> 00:11:41,560 Speaker 1: to Rick's point, you know, you have you have the 207 00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:44,839 Speaker 1: Chancellor traveling with no press. We understand he's doing an 208 00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:48,160 Speaker 1: interview with CNN that won't even error until Sunday, and 209 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:50,960 Speaker 1: so the big question is, of course, why what is 210 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:54,439 Speaker 1: going on? You know? And some of the speculation is, 211 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:57,240 Speaker 1: of course that the Chancellor came over here to tell 212 00:11:57,360 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 1: Biden that he's got to really watch the rhetor that's 213 00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:03,359 Speaker 1: a ratcheting up in Congress and out of the administration 214 00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:06,480 Speaker 1: with China. That that is a real concern for Germany 215 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:09,320 Speaker 1: and the impact could be dramatic. But of course that 216 00:12:09,480 --> 00:12:12,120 Speaker 1: is all speculation, but I would just note, you know, 217 00:12:12,440 --> 00:12:14,520 Speaker 1: look at the op ed that Peter Baker, of all 218 00:12:14,559 --> 00:12:17,160 Speaker 1: people wrote in the New York Times the other day, 219 00:12:17,440 --> 00:12:22,120 Speaker 1: there is you know, decreasing support across the board for 220 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:24,760 Speaker 1: the effort in Ukraine. And the Ambassador made the good 221 00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:29,560 Speaker 1: point is Biden risking under resourcing this war to the 222 00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:32,200 Speaker 1: point where it is unwinnable because it is going to 223 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:34,760 Speaker 1: drag on too long. That is a big question as 224 00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:37,280 Speaker 1: we start a year or two of this thing. What 225 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:39,920 Speaker 1: do you think of that idea? Ricted all off, Schultz 226 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 1: come here with a message for Joe Biden. You know 227 00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:46,000 Speaker 1: he may have. I mean, he's been a pretty stalwart 228 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:50,320 Speaker 1: supporter of the Biden plan as it relates to the Ukraine, 229 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:54,079 Speaker 1: and maybe there are issues at home that are pushing 230 00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 1: him in a different direction. Certainly, there was enormous confusion 231 00:12:57,559 --> 00:13:01,520 Speaker 1: around this tank issue, and it didn't look good that 232 00:13:01,640 --> 00:13:05,600 Speaker 1: the NATO forces and the United States couldn't get on 233 00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 1: the same page repeatedly. So maybe this is a session 234 00:13:08,559 --> 00:13:12,480 Speaker 1: where they're just getting their messages and their actions aligned 235 00:13:12,679 --> 00:13:16,280 Speaker 1: so that there's no more public look like there's a 236 00:13:16,360 --> 00:13:21,680 Speaker 1: split in NATO. This is extremely important to Zelenski that 237 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:26,120 Speaker 1: there's a unified Europe, unified United States backing his effort 238 00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:29,520 Speaker 1: in the war, and any opening is exploited by the 239 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:32,679 Speaker 1: Russians and were in this instance. Rick and Janie are 240 00:13:32,679 --> 00:13:34,680 Speaker 1: with us on a Friday. It's Bloomberg Sound On. Thanks 241 00:13:34,679 --> 00:13:36,840 Speaker 1: for joining us here on Bloomberg Radio. We also got 242 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:38,760 Speaker 1: news late today from the White House that I need 243 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:43,319 Speaker 1: to ask you both about, not so much about the 244 00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:46,360 Speaker 1: impact of this, because it appears to be said and done. 245 00:13:46,400 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 1: The President had a cancerous lesion removed. It was from 246 00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: his chest, and this is just being disclosed a couple 247 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:58,760 Speaker 1: of weeks after the fact here on a Friday afternoon. 248 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 1: This is basil cell carcinoma, a common form of skin cancer. 249 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:07,960 Speaker 1: His doctor, Kevin O'Connor, issued a letter saying all cancer 250 00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:13,640 Speaker 1: is tissue was successfully removed, no further treatment necessary here. Genie, 251 00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:16,200 Speaker 1: my question for you is just the way it's rolled out. 252 00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:17,680 Speaker 1: Was this the right way to do it? Do you 253 00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:21,280 Speaker 1: do it after the news briefing has ended on a Friday, 254 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:24,120 Speaker 1: you kick out a letter like this. Obviously, this is 255 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:26,120 Speaker 1: not something he's going to be going into treatment for. 256 00:14:26,840 --> 00:14:30,520 Speaker 1: It's a closed event. If you will, is that well 257 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:33,240 Speaker 1: done for the White House Communications Office. Yeah, you know, 258 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:35,720 Speaker 1: it's good news for the president, his family. His health 259 00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 1: seems to be okay, and you know, everything is has 260 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:42,080 Speaker 1: been taken care of medically, politically. This is obviously a 261 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:44,680 Speaker 1: fraught time for this to occur, and I think there 262 00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:47,520 Speaker 1: will be questions raised as to why they waited this 263 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:49,960 Speaker 1: long to roll it out, you know, a couple of weeks. 264 00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 1: You know, obviously his health is the number one thing, 265 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 1: but this is somebody who is on the verge, we think, 266 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 1: at least according to his wife, of declaring for a 267 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:02,400 Speaker 1: next term. And he of course is the oldest president 268 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 1: we've ever had, so these are serious issues. I think 269 00:15:05,320 --> 00:15:08,720 Speaker 1: that they have to really manage this very very carefully, 270 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:12,360 Speaker 1: and I think waiting raises more questions than it's probably 271 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 1: worth unless there was a health reason to do it. Rick, 272 00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:17,520 Speaker 1: I know this might hit close to home for you. 273 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 1: The President's routine physical was on February sixteenth. That's when 274 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 1: the cancer was successfully removed according to the doctor. Was 275 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:30,000 Speaker 1: it right to wait until now? You know? Probably it's 276 00:15:30,040 --> 00:15:31,720 Speaker 1: kind of hard to second guess this when you don't 277 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 1: know what's going on behind the scenes. How long did 278 00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:36,360 Speaker 1: it take for the test to come back. It is 279 00:15:36,400 --> 00:15:38,800 Speaker 1: government healthcare, you know, so I wouldn't give a lot 280 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:43,200 Speaker 1: of credence to speed. But also look, I mean, remember 281 00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:45,440 Speaker 1: this is the president. I say, I think it's impressive 282 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:47,400 Speaker 1: that they would disclose this the way they've done it. 283 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:50,200 Speaker 1: I mean they we're getting in an era where a 284 00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:52,240 Speaker 1: lot of politicians don't think they need to talk about 285 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,320 Speaker 1: their taxes or their healthcare or anything like that, and 286 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 1: so I think the bar is out there that this 287 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 1: president is meeting. I don't think is one of those 288 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:02,600 Speaker 1: things they want a big public debate on. So I 289 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:06,280 Speaker 1: wouldn't argue with doing it on a Friday evening. In fact, 290 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:09,640 Speaker 1: I probably would have done it Saturday morning. So I 291 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:14,840 Speaker 1: just don't think unless there's a life threatening condition, why 292 00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 1: make a big deal out of it. But at least 293 00:16:16,880 --> 00:16:19,640 Speaker 1: they disclosed it, And so it sounds like you're both 294 00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:21,760 Speaker 1: good with this though, like this is probably as well 295 00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:24,400 Speaker 1: as it could have been handled. Genie, am I right, Yeah, 296 00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:26,560 Speaker 1: I mean it is. But I will say, you know, 297 00:16:26,680 --> 00:16:29,440 Speaker 1: the American public has a right to know. I know 298 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:31,240 Speaker 1: what Rick is saying. People don't want to talk about 299 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:33,160 Speaker 1: it and when they're in office, but we do have 300 00:16:33,280 --> 00:16:35,640 Speaker 1: a right to know. It is a big risk to 301 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 1: us if the president is not healthy. So there is 302 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:40,680 Speaker 1: that reality. Well, you're gonna hear a lot more about 303 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:43,640 Speaker 1: it on this campaign trail. You better believe the president's 304 00:16:43,640 --> 00:16:45,680 Speaker 1: health could be issue number one. It's something that came 305 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:49,680 Speaker 1: up today at Seapack cognitive tests anyone. That's what Nikki 306 00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:53,040 Speaker 1: Hailey says. We'll bring it a Seapack for more because 307 00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:55,200 Speaker 1: we're watching so you don't have to and more with 308 00:16:55,280 --> 00:17:01,600 Speaker 1: our panel. Next on sound On, This is Bloomberg. You're 309 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:05,200 Speaker 1: listening to the Bloomberg sound On podcast. Catch us live 310 00:17:05,280 --> 00:17:08,159 Speaker 1: weekdays at five Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the I 311 00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:11,040 Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, and the Bloomberg Business Adam. We're listen 312 00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 1: on demand wherever you get your podcast. Day two of Sepack, 313 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:19,960 Speaker 1: the Conservative Political Action Conference underway here in Washington National 314 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:24,359 Speaker 1: Harbor to be exact, where they pronounced Maga presence ahead 315 00:17:24,359 --> 00:17:27,320 Speaker 1: of the big keynote by Donald Trump this weekend. Today 316 00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:30,640 Speaker 1: we heard from some hardcore Trump supporters. We also heard 317 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:33,000 Speaker 1: from a couple of folks who well at least one 318 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:36,720 Speaker 1: of them is running against Donald Trump. Maybe two. And 319 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,640 Speaker 1: the headline on the terminal we love Trump Heckler's bar 320 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:45,399 Speaker 1: rate Haley at conservative gathering. Listen, this is as Nicky 321 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:51,040 Speaker 1: Haley is posing for a photograph signing autographs. We love Trump, 322 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:54,720 Speaker 1: they say. Bloomberg's Christian Hall captured it on Twitter. Thank 323 00:17:54,760 --> 00:17:56,840 Speaker 1: you for that, Christian. You can see it for yourself 324 00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:00,399 Speaker 1: on the terminal. This following a day of speed, and 325 00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:02,200 Speaker 1: there's still more to come. At this point, I think 326 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:04,760 Speaker 1: they knock it off. Actually, maybe they are done for 327 00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:07,040 Speaker 1: the day at this point. The big night is tomorrow 328 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:10,760 Speaker 1: and Donald Trump the keynote. Matt Gates opened things up 329 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:15,600 Speaker 1: early today. The congressman, of course from Florida, and an 330 00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:19,199 Speaker 1: interesting take on life here he is. Thank you for 331 00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:23,080 Speaker 1: that warm reception. If you don't mind me saying so, 332 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:30,320 Speaker 1: I think vindication looks pretty good on me. Yeah. Of course, 333 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:32,639 Speaker 1: this week you learned federal prosecutors were not going to 334 00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:36,760 Speaker 1: charge him in a long running sex trafficking probe, and 335 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:41,480 Speaker 1: why not open your speech with that? Marjorie Taylor Green 336 00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:45,560 Speaker 1: taking aim at Ukraine and specifically President Zelenski. This was 337 00:18:45,640 --> 00:18:49,159 Speaker 1: kind of a recurring theme and sticking with the MAGA trend. 338 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:53,240 Speaker 1: At this particular Seapack listened to the congresswoman from Georgia. 339 00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 1: And while I'm still committed to saying no money to 340 00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:00,840 Speaker 1: Ukraine and that country needs to find peace not war, 341 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:07,439 Speaker 1: I think applause is standing ovation there. And while I 342 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 1: will look at a camera and directly tells Zelinsky, you'd 343 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:13,200 Speaker 1: better leave your hands off of our sons and daughters 344 00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:18,600 Speaker 1: because they're not dying over there. Wow, all right, let's 345 00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:20,880 Speaker 1: reassemble the panel. We've got into some of this yesterday. 346 00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:22,920 Speaker 1: We have a little more time, and we have Rick 347 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:26,520 Speaker 1: Davis and Jeannie Schanzano on top of it. More where 348 00:19:26,520 --> 00:19:29,400 Speaker 1: that came from. I'll play as some comments from Nicky 349 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:32,639 Speaker 1: Haley and Mike Pompeo, both of whom spoke today. Both 350 00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:34,720 Speaker 1: likely will end up at least Nicky Haley is on 351 00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:40,040 Speaker 1: the presidential campaign trail. Rick. This cepack is a little 352 00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 1: bit different than ones we've seen before, but ever since 353 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:47,159 Speaker 1: the Trump phenomenon, it really has become a campaign tool 354 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:50,480 Speaker 1: for an individual, not so much the Republican Party. Is 355 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:52,359 Speaker 1: that how you see it? Yeah? Very much so. I 356 00:19:52,359 --> 00:19:54,760 Speaker 1: mean it's changed a lot. It's sort of surrounded the 357 00:19:54,800 --> 00:19:59,520 Speaker 1: culture personality of Donald Trump. There's no real conservative discussion 358 00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:02,639 Speaker 1: of issue, is there? In fact, the idea of calling 359 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:06,040 Speaker 1: it conservative is has been disavowed by almost every mainstream 360 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:10,000 Speaker 1: conservative you know. In the Republican Party, its attendance is 361 00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:12,840 Speaker 1: really limited to those people who sort of punch their 362 00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:15,479 Speaker 1: ticket with Donald Trump. In fact, I've really you know, 363 00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:19,000 Speaker 1: I'm still scratching my head as why Nicky Haley, who 364 00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 1: has talked about this generational change in the party, would 365 00:20:24,280 --> 00:20:28,040 Speaker 1: show up at a at an event where the head 366 00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:32,040 Speaker 1: of the event is under incredible scrutiny for inappropriate behavior, 367 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:37,399 Speaker 1: and that the entire participant group are committed Trump supporters. 368 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:40,199 Speaker 1: And I just it makes no sense to me that 369 00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:42,880 Speaker 1: she would do this versus some of the other options 370 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:46,520 Speaker 1: she had, like attending this the Club for Growth event 371 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:49,640 Speaker 1: that many of the other presidential bals are attending at 372 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:52,879 Speaker 1: the same time. So it's just an odd pick for me, 373 00:20:52,920 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 1: And I'm not surprised that she was heckled. Well, how 374 00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:59,200 Speaker 1: about that, as we discussed yesterday, Rhanda Santis not here, 375 00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:02,120 Speaker 1: he's at the Club for Growth of Mike Pence not here, 376 00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:06,919 Speaker 1: Kevin McCarthy not at seapack. Nicki Haley though again was 377 00:21:07,200 --> 00:21:09,159 Speaker 1: and listened to the room as she's speaking. You know, 378 00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:11,520 Speaker 1: Matt Gates and Marjorie Taylor Green, some of the others 379 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:15,920 Speaker 1: who spoke, really, including Donald Trump Junior, getting massive applause 380 00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:17,879 Speaker 1: and laughter and so forth, even though the crowd size 381 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:20,119 Speaker 1: was quite small. I'm sure I'll get tweets for saying that, 382 00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 1: but I mean, the pictures are there. But Nicky Haley 383 00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:26,320 Speaker 1: kind of went through some of the themes that we've 384 00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:29,280 Speaker 1: heard before and hit this one in particular, which, as 385 00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:32,119 Speaker 1: you know, is aimed at Donald Trump. Listened to the 386 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:36,199 Speaker 1: lack of crowd reaction from Nicky Haley. When I launched 387 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 1: my campaign, I said, every politician over seventy five years 388 00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:43,600 Speaker 1: old shouldn't be required to take a mental competency test. 389 00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:48,960 Speaker 1: Have you seen DC lately? We should start with Joe 390 00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:55,600 Speaker 1: Biden and we shouldn't stop there smattering of applause. Mike 391 00:21:55,680 --> 00:22:01,399 Speaker 1: Pompeo spoke as well and actually called out the Trump administration. Listen, 392 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:05,480 Speaker 1: every recent administration, Republican and Democrat, alight, added trillions in 393 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:09,760 Speaker 1: dollars to our debt. That is deeply unconservative. Trump administrations 394 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:13,160 Speaker 1: administration I served, added eight trillion dollars in new debt. 395 00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:19,560 Speaker 1: This is indecent and can't continue. Indecent, Genie, I'm not 396 00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:21,639 Speaker 1: sure where they're trying to go here, is this actually 397 00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:24,760 Speaker 1: where you go to draw the line between yourself and 398 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:28,240 Speaker 1: Donald Trump? Now, yeah, Mike Pompeo speaking truth to power, 399 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,280 Speaker 1: and it's like crickets out there. It's yeah, yeah, I 400 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:34,399 Speaker 1: mean it's very very bizarre. And you know, we also 401 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 1: heard from people that we don't talk a lot about, 402 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:40,400 Speaker 1: like Perry Johnson, this businessman who's running this long shot campaign. 403 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:43,520 Speaker 1: I thought it was just stunning. He said something benign 404 00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:47,400 Speaker 1: like I don't trust Putin and there was absolute silence 405 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:49,840 Speaker 1: in the room. I mean, this is where we've got 406 00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:53,240 Speaker 1: into Rick's point, into your point. This is a maga crowd. 407 00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:56,720 Speaker 1: But the problem for the Republican Party is and Sir, 408 00:22:56,880 --> 00:23:00,160 Speaker 1: somebody like Nicki Haley speaking to a half filled ballroom, 409 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:02,480 Speaker 1: this sort of silence that she was met with or 410 00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:04,399 Speaker 1: the heckling, which was yeah, I'm not sure which is 411 00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:07,080 Speaker 1: worth is? The fact is is the base of the 412 00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:10,200 Speaker 1: Republican Party has nowhere to go but with the Republican 413 00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:14,240 Speaker 1: nominee or stay home, they're going to lose unless they 414 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:17,280 Speaker 1: try to reach moderates and independence. And so why she 415 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:20,480 Speaker 1: is there when this is all about Trump? I heard 416 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:23,439 Speaker 1: from people everything there, even down to the T shirts, 417 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:26,480 Speaker 1: the cups, everything else is all Trump. Why she goes 418 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 1: there to seek support is baffling because it's not going 419 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:32,359 Speaker 1: to help her win the nomination, and it's certainly not 420 00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 1: going to help Republicans win in a general election. It's 421 00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:37,159 Speaker 1: called the vice presidential slot. I don't know. Listen to 422 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:39,920 Speaker 1: Mike Pompeo again here Rick, who's not calling out Trump 423 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,200 Speaker 1: by name, but everyone knows what he's talking about. Over 424 00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:45,000 Speaker 1: the last few years, I've heard some who claim to 425 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:48,800 Speaker 1: be conservative excuse hypocrisy by saying something like, well, we're 426 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:52,800 Speaker 1: electing a president, not a Sunday school teacher. That's true, 427 00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:55,640 Speaker 1: but having taught Sunday school, maybe we could get both. 428 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:01,159 Speaker 1: It's time. It's time for us. It's time for us 429 00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:03,320 Speaker 1: to make sure we're living out these very things we're 430 00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:06,480 Speaker 1: asking others to do. Does he want to be seen 431 00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:09,160 Speaker 1: as the crusader Rick who went into the lions den 432 00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:12,240 Speaker 1: and stood up to Trump here or I'm trying to 433 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:15,119 Speaker 1: figure out the strategy. Yeah, Look, there's a there's there's 434 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,000 Speaker 1: a strategy behind going into the lions den, as you say, 435 00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:22,680 Speaker 1: and and poking the lion and showing independence and resolve 436 00:24:22,800 --> 00:24:25,399 Speaker 1: and gets outlets to covering because they know they're going 437 00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:28,639 Speaker 1: to cover somebody there. And at least he's talking about 438 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 1: something that nobody else is talking about, right and so, 439 00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:34,400 Speaker 1: uh I think so. But but I gotta believe there's 440 00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:38,359 Speaker 1: a better, more positive way to convey your message, uh it, 441 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:40,840 Speaker 1: than going to see Pack and sort of being thrown 442 00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:43,640 Speaker 1: in with the bats that's there. Frankly, a day spent 443 00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:46,480 Speaker 1: in New Hampshire is a much better use of campaign 444 00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:50,639 Speaker 1: time and hanging around Washington, d C. At Spack, well, 445 00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 1: there's a lot to be said for that genie. You 446 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 1: know who else is going to be there, It's it's 447 00:24:55,760 --> 00:25:01,240 Speaker 1: the trump Ball Cinaro double Bill, I guess tomorrow night. 448 00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:04,680 Speaker 1: And this is something that we asked Senator Rick Scott 449 00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:08,000 Speaker 1: about It said he didn't even realize Balsonaro was on 450 00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:12,080 Speaker 1: the rundown. That too, says a bit about the Sepack 451 00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:15,760 Speaker 1: that we're coming to note, isn't it. It absolutely does. 452 00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:18,679 Speaker 1: And we have seen this over and over again the 453 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:22,760 Speaker 1: last few years, this hugging of these autocrats and Bolson 454 00:25:22,800 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 1: are a great example of this, and it speaks to 455 00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:30,199 Speaker 1: this huge division in the Republican Party. At the same time, 456 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:33,480 Speaker 1: we are aiding as a country Ukraine in this war 457 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:37,240 Speaker 1: against Russia. You have Seapack cozying up to somebody like Bolsonaro, 458 00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:40,680 Speaker 1: and this is a real dividing line. But of course 459 00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:43,320 Speaker 1: we don't see many members of Congress on the Republican 460 00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:46,879 Speaker 1: side at Seapack except for maybe Ted Cruz, Jdvenser's been 461 00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:49,000 Speaker 1: a few of them, none of the leaders. And in fact, 462 00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:53,760 Speaker 1: Mitch McConnell was really attacked by Rick Scott there yesterday. 463 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:56,520 Speaker 1: And of course even Kevin McCarthy has stayed away. So 464 00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 1: leaders are staying away. This is not, i think, anymore 465 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,720 Speaker 1: representative of the Republican Party. It's representative of a certain 466 00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:06,840 Speaker 1: wing of the party and probably losing a lot of 467 00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:09,400 Speaker 1: the import that it had going back to the time 468 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:12,800 Speaker 1: of say Ronald Reagan, you know, before and after the 469 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:15,679 Speaker 1: years in which Cepack really mattered. Yeah, what does it 470 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:18,159 Speaker 1: tell us than Rick about the base of support for 471 00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:21,560 Speaker 1: Donald Trump? Will it be enough to win a primary? Look, 472 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 1: I think it's a challenge for him. I think more 473 00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:26,880 Speaker 1: people see options to him, the more likely is that 474 00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:29,440 Speaker 1: they're going to think that these are positive options, both 475 00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 1: for electability reasons but also for leadership reasons. In other words, 476 00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: they have policies that mirror some of the more positive 477 00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:40,320 Speaker 1: things that Donald Trump did as present, but without all 478 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:44,159 Speaker 1: the baggage, without carrying around these these autocrats, without sucking 479 00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:47,879 Speaker 1: up to putin, without saying off color things from the 480 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,040 Speaker 1: Oval Office. I think America has grown weary of that. 481 00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:54,640 Speaker 1: And when they realize, certainly within a Republican party base, 482 00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:58,119 Speaker 1: that they have options that are as good, if not 483 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 1: better than Donald Trump, then will probably elect those options. 484 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:03,160 Speaker 1: And so I think you're seeing him at his high 485 00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:07,920 Speaker 1: water mark today in this campaign will only create contrasts 486 00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:10,040 Speaker 1: with him and other candidates who have something else to offer. 487 00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:14,840 Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the 488 00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:18,640 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at five pm Easter on Bloomberg Radio, 489 00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:21,520 Speaker 1: the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg 490 00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:24,880 Speaker 1: Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa 491 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:28,520 Speaker 1: from our flagship New York station, Just say Alexa Play 492 00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:33,560 Speaker 1: Bloomberg eleven thirty. Gary Gensler wants to hear from you, 493 00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:37,439 Speaker 1: the investor, about rewriting the rules on Wall Street. The 494 00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:40,000 Speaker 1: chair of the SEC says, give us your best advice 495 00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:43,520 Speaker 1: when it comes to proposed updates to the plumbing as 496 00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:47,000 Speaker 1: we see the plumbing in the markets, from order routing 497 00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:50,720 Speaker 1: to pricing to disclosures, would impact a lot of stuff here. 498 00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:54,000 Speaker 1: He talked about it on Bloomberg TV. Listen, we try 499 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:57,080 Speaker 1: to level this playing field because so much of the 500 00:27:57,119 --> 00:28:00,320 Speaker 1: market Now, if you're a working family and you're just 501 00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:02,320 Speaker 1: trying to invest in the market and you put an 502 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:07,960 Speaker 1: order in, it's going not to the transparent market, but 503 00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:12,720 Speaker 1: it's being routed off to host salers and what's called 504 00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:16,000 Speaker 1: the dark market, and trying to level up that competition. 505 00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:18,399 Speaker 1: So this is a pretty big deal. It could literally 506 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:21,240 Speaker 1: change the way some business is done on Wall Street. 507 00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:23,159 Speaker 1: And I'm so glad to say we're joined by Bloomberg's 508 00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:25,400 Speaker 1: Kaylee Lines to help us understand it a little bit more. 509 00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:28,200 Speaker 1: Kayley has just recently joined us here in Washington, and 510 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:29,879 Speaker 1: I'm glad to say you're going to be hearing a 511 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:32,199 Speaker 1: lot more from her in the weeks ahead. Kayley, it's 512 00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:34,400 Speaker 1: great to have you. The dark market. Most people don't 513 00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:37,159 Speaker 1: even I mean at least retail investors don't even know 514 00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:40,360 Speaker 1: that this exists. Actually, this goes back to a series 515 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:44,680 Speaker 1: of proposals unveiled in December, and I wonder if you 516 00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:48,360 Speaker 1: can envision the market and how it would actually change 517 00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:52,280 Speaker 1: things if it's adopted. Well, as you say, this is 518 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:55,760 Speaker 1: a series of proposals, there's four separate rulemakings that the 519 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:59,400 Speaker 1: SEC has proposed here. We're talking more than sixteen hundred pages. 520 00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:05,280 Speaker 1: This is dense. And how many individual investors do you know, Joe, 521 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,200 Speaker 1: that are worried about the market plumbing literally the mechanics 522 00:29:09,240 --> 00:29:11,880 Speaker 1: of how you trade stocks. But that's what Gary Gensler 523 00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:13,920 Speaker 1: is essentially saying here that he wants to make that 524 00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:17,280 Speaker 1: more transparent because most people generally probably don't know how 525 00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:19,080 Speaker 1: it works. And if you could recall back to the 526 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:22,560 Speaker 1: Memestock era of several years ago when Robin Hood was 527 00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:25,800 Speaker 1: in the spotlight all this issue around payments order hero 528 00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:28,680 Speaker 1: I know, right, it feels like it was a decade 529 00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:31,800 Speaker 1: ago and just last month all the same time. But 530 00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 1: Gensler's concern here is that these brokers are saying that 531 00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:37,920 Speaker 1: this trading is free, when really it's not, because ultimately 532 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 1: someone is getting paid because Citadel, for example, will take 533 00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:44,760 Speaker 1: a fee or will pay Robin Hood a fee in 534 00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:48,000 Speaker 1: order to execute that trade. Essentially, So it's about making 535 00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:50,600 Speaker 1: all of that a bit more transparent, so Gensler says, 536 00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:53,120 Speaker 1: but it has faced a lot of criticism within the 537 00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:56,400 Speaker 1: industry and that this is an overarching overhaul essentially that 538 00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:58,160 Speaker 1: he's proposing. He wants to make a lot of changes 539 00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:00,640 Speaker 1: all at once, and some are concerned about the breadth 540 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:04,800 Speaker 1: of that cost upgrade technology, for example, and potentially just 541 00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:07,600 Speaker 1: lower volumes for some of these existing players. He makes 542 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:09,880 Speaker 1: it feel like we're all kind of getting ripped off, 543 00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:13,760 Speaker 1: are we. It's a good question. I mean, in theory, 544 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 1: the trade is free for you if you're using one 545 00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:18,960 Speaker 1: of these free trading apps. The question is around whether 546 00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:21,640 Speaker 1: or not you are adequately informed of that, or if 547 00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:24,920 Speaker 1: you are being misled. That is really what Gensler's concerned. 548 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,040 Speaker 1: I will be very interested to see, because the comments 549 00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:31,120 Speaker 1: are still open for another couple of weeks, what individual 550 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:34,280 Speaker 1: investors actually are concerned about, if they too see this 551 00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:37,120 Speaker 1: as problematic, or if everybody just wants to enjoy their 552 00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 1: free trades. What I also find interesting about this is 553 00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:43,000 Speaker 1: Gary Gensler has framed this as a need to make 554 00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:46,040 Speaker 1: modern rules for modern markets, because things like e trade 555 00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:48,440 Speaker 1: weren't around more than twenty years ago. When some of 556 00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:52,480 Speaker 1: these rules first came into existence. But in other spaces, 557 00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,440 Speaker 1: like in crypto, he's talking about nineteen thirties era securities 558 00:30:56,480 --> 00:30:59,920 Speaker 1: laws being at being applicable to that market. So it's 559 00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:02,120 Speaker 1: interesting to see what he wants to modernize and what 560 00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:03,920 Speaker 1: he does not. I know he's not making a lot 561 00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:06,800 Speaker 1: of friends with the whole crypto conversation. Though. Could this 562 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:10,000 Speaker 1: conversation lead to an end of zero so called zero 563 00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:13,920 Speaker 1: commission trades, It depends on who you ask. Likely no, 564 00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:16,520 Speaker 1: it would just mean that the business model of some 565 00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:18,360 Speaker 1: of these companies like robin Hood would have to be 566 00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:23,560 Speaker 1: entirely different. Wow. Different and profitability is what really ultimately 567 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:27,200 Speaker 1: that comes down to. I don't necessarily know if that 568 00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:30,000 Speaker 1: is what the SEC is trying to achieve, because if 569 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:32,840 Speaker 1: it is about the democratization of markets, you do need 570 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:36,000 Speaker 1: to give individual investors the ability to trade for themselves, 571 00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:39,680 Speaker 1: not have to go through an institution, So you need 572 00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:41,920 Speaker 1: both to exist at the same time. In theory, if 573 00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:45,160 Speaker 1: what you are really wanting to accomplish is putting the 574 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,160 Speaker 1: power in the hands of the American consumer and investor, 575 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:52,840 Speaker 1: I'm not surprised he's actually asking for people's best advice, 576 00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:56,240 Speaker 1: and by that he really means investment firms and brokerage houses, 577 00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:59,400 Speaker 1: I think rather as opposed to you know, the retail bros. 578 00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:04,720 Speaker 1: But it's so impactful, it's such a big project, and 579 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:08,720 Speaker 1: so few people know about it or understand it that 580 00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 1: you'd think he'd want to put as much sunlight on 581 00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:14,600 Speaker 1: this now before it actually could be enacted. Yeah, exactly, 582 00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:18,760 Speaker 1: And Chairman Gensler has been very forward facing. I would say, 583 00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:20,800 Speaker 1: I don't know if anyone has seen his office hours, 584 00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:23,360 Speaker 1: these highly produced videos that he's putting out to try 585 00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:26,120 Speaker 1: to explain and more colloquial language, if you will, what 586 00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:29,240 Speaker 1: exactly the proposals are here, making it more digestible to 587 00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:31,840 Speaker 1: people who don't live and breed financial market stars here 588 00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:34,480 Speaker 1: all day every day. He got a good communications office, 589 00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:37,000 Speaker 1: obviously they know what they're doing with social media. Highly produced. 590 00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:38,600 Speaker 1: I want to know who his producers are as a 591 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:42,320 Speaker 1: TV person, Joe, because a lot of it is very impressive. 592 00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:44,680 Speaker 1: I will say though, that he has garnered a lot 593 00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:47,960 Speaker 1: of attention for these things, and there are those on 594 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:50,560 Speaker 1: Capitol Hill and elsewhere who have taken issue with the 595 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,760 Speaker 1: way the SEC is conducting business currently and this idea 596 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:58,080 Speaker 1: of regulating by enforcement, given how vocal and prominent, so 597 00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:01,520 Speaker 1: much of this is it hasn't gone unnoticed. She's going 598 00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:04,600 Speaker 1: to blow the lid off those videos, Kaylee Lines. Wait 599 00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:07,160 Speaker 1: for that story, right, Kaylee, I'm so glad you're here. 600 00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:08,680 Speaker 1: Thank you for coming to see me. Let's do a 601 00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:10,200 Speaker 1: lot more of this, and it's great to have you 602 00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:14,920 Speaker 1: in Washington. Bloomberg Financial Regulation reporter. To be formal about it. Here, 603 00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,840 Speaker 1: host of Bloomberg Crypto, you know, Kaylee Lines from Bloomberg TV. 604 00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:20,440 Speaker 1: She's going to be doing a lot of reporting from 605 00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:22,480 Speaker 1: the nation's capital now and we're stronger for it. Let's 606 00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:25,400 Speaker 1: reassemble the panel. Jenny Schanzano and Rick Davis are here, 607 00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:28,360 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Politics contributors. Of course, last time, guys, we talked 608 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:31,320 Speaker 1: about Gary Gensler. It was that last note from Kaylee 609 00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:33,360 Speaker 1: on how he's you know, not making a lot of 610 00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:38,640 Speaker 1: friends in his approach to not regulating crypto or doing 611 00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:42,000 Speaker 1: so through enforcement. How about this bigger plan for Wall 612 00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:44,840 Speaker 1: Street though this is an individual who's going to leave 613 00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:48,800 Speaker 1: fingerprints on it seems every corner of the market. Genie, 614 00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:53,440 Speaker 1: he can't get this wrong, Kenny, No, he certainly cannot, 615 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:56,520 Speaker 1: and you know it is fascinating how he is trying 616 00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,320 Speaker 1: to reach out, and you know, with your conversation with Kayley, 617 00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:03,200 Speaker 1: it's absolutely right. He is doing a great pr job 618 00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:05,680 Speaker 1: trying to get this out. But I think the big 619 00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:09,279 Speaker 1: question is is really, you know, when you look at 620 00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:12,520 Speaker 1: the SEC and you look at Gary Gensler, the questions 621 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:16,080 Speaker 1: around really whether he has the right and the power 622 00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:19,520 Speaker 1: and the authorization to do the wide scope and wide 623 00:34:19,640 --> 00:34:22,880 Speaker 1: ranging sort of engagements that he is trying to do 624 00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:25,799 Speaker 1: right now. And I think that's something we may in 625 00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:28,200 Speaker 1: the future see Congress wagh in on But of course 626 00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:31,239 Speaker 1: Congress weighing in on something takes a long time. But 627 00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:34,080 Speaker 1: you do hear inklings that he may be stepping, over 628 00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:37,280 Speaker 1: stepping what he should be doing on crypto and otherwise, 629 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:40,239 Speaker 1: and that remains a huge challenge. Well, we know he's 630 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:42,840 Speaker 1: again not a lot of people think he's overstepping or 631 00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:44,840 Speaker 1: stepping in the wrong direction when it comes to crypto. 632 00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:48,040 Speaker 1: How about the old fashioned stock market though, Rick, Yeah, Look, 633 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:49,440 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, if you're a friend of the 634 00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:52,080 Speaker 1: old fashioned stock market, you're gonna probably love these reforms 635 00:34:52,080 --> 00:34:54,879 Speaker 1: because he's basically trying to drive you know, people out 636 00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:59,000 Speaker 1: of these wholesale brokerages into the main exchanges, and you know, 637 00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:02,120 Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, I'm not buying the pr act, 638 00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:05,840 Speaker 1: you know, Yeah. Sure. And he's trying to communicate, and 639 00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:09,080 Speaker 1: he talks a lot in this release about wanting to 640 00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:11,920 Speaker 1: get individual investors. That's who we really care about, and 641 00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:15,200 Speaker 1: we want them to weigh in on this proposal. What 642 00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:19,520 Speaker 1: individual investor is going to read sixteen hundred pages of 643 00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:23,320 Speaker 1: government legalis and have any chance of knowing how to respond. 644 00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:26,799 Speaker 1: I mean, it's just the most disingenuous thing I've seen 645 00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: happen in a long time. Just being too cute by half, 646 00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 1: I think. So he's got a lot of explaining to 647 00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:37,120 Speaker 1: do with individual investors if they feel like they're being 648 00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:40,239 Speaker 1: taken you know, things that they had were being taken away. Well, 649 00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:42,239 Speaker 1: I'll tell you the videos are cute. I will say 650 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:44,319 Speaker 1: you can try. He'll see them on Twitter if you 651 00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:49,200 Speaker 1: haven't already. The Dark Market, My Gods save us. Kaylee Lyons. 652 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:56,960 Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast Catch us 653 00:35:56,960 --> 00:36:00,120 Speaker 1: live weekdays at five Eastern on Bloomberg dot Com, b 654 00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:02,799 Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app and the Bloomberg Business Appen. We're 655 00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:07,760 Speaker 1: listening on demand wherever you get your podcast. Something important 656 00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:11,880 Speaker 1: Today happened at the White House. President Biden awarded the 657 00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:16,239 Speaker 1: Medal of Honor. It's always a special event. Today it 658 00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:21,320 Speaker 1: went to retired Army Colonel Paris Davis for conspicuous gallantry 659 00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:24,279 Speaker 1: in the war in Vietnam. What a story, you know? 660 00:36:24,280 --> 00:36:27,040 Speaker 1: How this normally goes The President walks in with the recipient. 661 00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:29,680 Speaker 1: They or on the stage. Typically the medal is there 662 00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:35,120 Speaker 1: waiting for him for her, and then they tell the story. 663 00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:39,840 Speaker 1: The President told the story today. In the early hours 664 00:36:39,840 --> 00:36:44,279 Speaker 1: of June eighteenth, nineteen sixty five, that's where we're going 665 00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:50,040 Speaker 1: here with Paris Davis. Following a ten mile march the 666 00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:53,439 Speaker 1: night earlier. They're deep in the jungle of Bong Song. 667 00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:57,520 Speaker 1: Then Captain Davis and his team came under attack by 668 00:36:57,560 --> 00:37:01,239 Speaker 1: the viet Cong. President Biden says Davis rallied his team 669 00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:04,360 Speaker 1: to fight back, and all of his brothers in arms 670 00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:08,400 Speaker 1: became injured. They were all wounded, all taking bullets or shrapnel. 671 00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:11,319 Speaker 1: Davis carried one up a hill he was shot while 672 00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:14,560 Speaker 1: doing so, then went back down to help. Another saved him, 673 00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,640 Speaker 1: but his medic was still wounded and alone. That's when 674 00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:21,400 Speaker 1: a rescue helicopter landed and President Biden picks up the 675 00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:24,280 Speaker 1: story from there. Captain Davis commander gave him a direct 676 00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:29,879 Speaker 1: order get on board. Davids's response was just as direct, Sir, 677 00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:33,959 Speaker 1: he said, I'm just not going to leave. I still 678 00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:37,040 Speaker 1: have an American out there, I'm sure if he were 679 00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:39,600 Speaker 1: still alive. Captain Davis began to plan how he would 680 00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:42,960 Speaker 1: get his medic. Just the day before, the medic had 681 00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:45,840 Speaker 1: found out he was the good news he was a 682 00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:49,760 Speaker 1: new father. His wife had given birth to the first child. 683 00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:53,160 Speaker 1: Captain Davis was going to give him a chance to 684 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:57,400 Speaker 1: see his baby boy. He pinpointed the medic's position and 685 00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:00,799 Speaker 1: began crawling toward him, with gunfire and grenade is still 686 00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:05,840 Speaker 1: exploding around him. When he got there, the medics, still alive, 687 00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:09,880 Speaker 1: asked him, am I going to die? Am I going 688 00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:16,680 Speaker 1: to die? Capt? Davis? Not before me. Still fending off 689 00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:20,000 Speaker 1: the vietcom assailants, Captain Davis hauled as medic up the 690 00:38:20,080 --> 00:38:26,240 Speaker 1: hill and nearly twenty hours only twenty hours later after 691 00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:30,080 Speaker 1: that bugle first rang, Captain Davis had saved each one 692 00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:35,759 Speaker 1: of his fellow Americans, every single one. And so we 693 00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:40,319 Speaker 1: thank Colonel Paris Davis, a Green Beret who went on 694 00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:42,640 Speaker 1: to command the ten Special Forces Group and retired as 695 00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:45,920 Speaker 1: a colonel in nineteen eighty five. A pioneering black man. 696 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:48,719 Speaker 1: He received the Silver Star and Purple Heart for his 697 00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:51,640 Speaker 1: actions that day and now carries the Battle of Honors. 698 00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:54,520 Speaker 1: Pretty incredible. I wish we had more time with our panel. 699 00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:57,160 Speaker 1: Rick and Janie are here, and of course Rick, anytime 700 00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:58,960 Speaker 1: we see something like this happened at the White House, 701 00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:01,399 Speaker 1: that stops us in our track here in Washington. Now, 702 00:39:01,440 --> 00:39:03,719 Speaker 1: this is the best part of being in Washington is 703 00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:06,200 Speaker 1: that you get an up close sense of this kind 704 00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:10,360 Speaker 1: of pomp and circumstance around America's greatest heros and people 705 00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:14,000 Speaker 1: who live by the code duty, honor. Country are celebrated 706 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:16,040 Speaker 1: in moments like this, and it reminds us all of 707 00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:19,839 Speaker 1: our own mortality, but also a courage of all Americans. 708 00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,480 Speaker 1: He waited sixty years to be recognized, Genie. That's right. 709 00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:25,759 Speaker 1: It was not only a recognition of what he did, 710 00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:28,160 Speaker 1: but also the battle to get him the medal, which 711 00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:31,279 Speaker 1: was quite a feat in ad lost his paperwork after 712 00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:33,920 Speaker 1: they lost his paperwork, And here's somebody who committed himself 713 00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:36,880 Speaker 1: afterwards to civil rights and found it. A newspaper in 714 00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:41,720 Speaker 1: Virginia and it's a remarkable, remarkable story and obviously well 715 00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:45,600 Speaker 1: deserved after a long time. You're here, Rick Davis and 716 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:48,160 Speaker 1: Jeannie Chanzano, thank you for a great conversation. As always, 717 00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:49,839 Speaker 1: I've mentioned it a couple of times this hour. We're 718 00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:51,640 Speaker 1: going to a new time slot next week. That means 719 00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:55,200 Speaker 1: we're all free for cocktails starting Monday, right one pm 720 00:39:55,920 --> 00:40:00,320 Speaker 1: Eastern Time, Washington time. Sound on now. Two ho hours 721 00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:04,319 Speaker 1: Long starts Monday. I'm Dragon, Rick and Jeanie with me 722 00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:08,239 Speaker 1: and I hope you too. Subscribe to the podcast and 723 00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:13,080 Speaker 1: find us live here on Bloomberg Radio, the fastest two 724 00:40:13,160 --> 00:40:17,000 Speaker 1: hours in politics. This is Bloomberg