1 00:00:01,480 --> 00:00:04,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to stuff you should know, a production of I 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, 3 00:00:13,560 --> 00:00:18,520 Speaker 1: and there's Charles W. Chuck Bryant over there. Bryant, Really, 4 00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:20,200 Speaker 1: would you say the first time? I pronounced it with 5 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:24,680 Speaker 1: a real hard te Bryant. Yeah, you only do that 6 00:00:24,680 --> 00:00:27,400 Speaker 1: when you're mad at me, you know, like kissing through 7 00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:30,760 Speaker 1: a clenched teeth, kind like I say, Josh Clark, Right, 8 00:00:31,200 --> 00:00:35,559 Speaker 1: Marge Simpson even know the one where that guy came 9 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 1: in and introduced Marge's substitute teacher. Oh yeah, yeah, um 10 00:00:41,159 --> 00:00:44,839 Speaker 1: so wait what did you say? Boy? This is this 11 00:00:44,920 --> 00:00:48,239 Speaker 1: is great podcasting. Right now, I'm clearing my throat and 12 00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:51,560 Speaker 1: asking you what you said ten seconds ago. Uh? Well, 13 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 1: I do have a couple of weird announcements, if let's 14 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:59,320 Speaker 1: do that before we actively get going. One is just 15 00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:02,240 Speaker 1: a quick listener shout out. And you remember in the 16 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:05,399 Speaker 1: Hell Hell Hell episode when I couldn't think of the 17 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:08,759 Speaker 1: Pixar movie where if you were forgotten you go away, 18 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:12,560 Speaker 1: It's Coco. Yeah, I saw somebody right then, And is 19 00:01:12,560 --> 00:01:14,479 Speaker 1: that a good movie? I've seen nothing but good things, 20 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:19,240 Speaker 1: but I've never watched it. Dude, Coco is easily the 21 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:23,959 Speaker 1: best looking animated film I've ever seen. It's amazing. It 22 00:01:24,040 --> 00:01:26,560 Speaker 1: is striking. And that's from Joe Brown. He's a movie crusher. 23 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:29,000 Speaker 1: I felt so dumb because the main song from that 24 00:01:29,040 --> 00:01:35,280 Speaker 1: movie is called remember Me. Think it's about being remembered. 25 00:01:35,360 --> 00:01:39,360 Speaker 1: The title of the song is remember Me chuck. Uh. 26 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 1: And also, uh, we wanted to announce that we are 27 00:01:43,560 --> 00:01:49,080 Speaker 1: edging close to one hundred thousand books sold. Yeah that's 28 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:52,440 Speaker 1: pretty good, huh it is, and we would really like 29 00:01:52,560 --> 00:01:56,600 Speaker 1: to hit that number. Oh okay, yeah, I mean like 30 00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: we uh, I mean you don't Yeah, yeah I do. 31 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:01,520 Speaker 1: I totally do know, I totally do. Um. It's just 32 00:02:01,640 --> 00:02:03,640 Speaker 1: usually we coordinated with stuff like this so I can 33 00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:08,120 Speaker 1: prepare some remarks. Uh, you know, come on, let's see 34 00:02:08,120 --> 00:02:13,240 Speaker 1: what you gotta say. Selling book, good bye book, good you. 35 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:18,240 Speaker 1: Hundred thousand, big number, that's what I have to say 36 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:20,400 Speaker 1: off the cup. Yeah, we'd like to hit a hundred 37 00:02:20,440 --> 00:02:22,680 Speaker 1: thousand because that would, um, that would please a lot 38 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:25,600 Speaker 1: of people. It's a good round number. And just because 39 00:02:25,639 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: the holidays have come and gone, you still can go 40 00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:31,120 Speaker 1: out and get that thing, the stuff you should know 41 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:36,080 Speaker 1: Book of Interesting Facts and Figures. What it's called bit's 42 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 1: close stuff you should know Invisible colon uh, an incomplete 43 00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:43,799 Speaker 1: compendium of mostly interesting things. We took some grief for 44 00:02:43,919 --> 00:02:47,960 Speaker 1: not actually putting a colon on there. Oh really after 45 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 1: our colon heavy speak over the past few years. Yeah, 46 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: my response is that it's invisible and silent, invisible in silent, 47 00:02:56,880 --> 00:03:01,239 Speaker 1: much like us. Yeah, yeah, not at all. But the 48 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:03,560 Speaker 1: thing is, I wonder if we shot ourselves in the 49 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:06,160 Speaker 1: foot by making the thing bright red so people are 50 00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:10,359 Speaker 1: confused and think it's it's only a Christmas present m m, 51 00:03:11,280 --> 00:03:13,639 Speaker 1: because you're right, it's not. Just because Christmas is over, 52 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:15,800 Speaker 1: it doesn't mean you can't get it. So it's available 53 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: everywhere still, and you can get it from indie booksellers 54 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 1: to Giant uh, global monopolies. Everywhere has it anywhere you 55 00:03:24,000 --> 00:03:26,920 Speaker 1: can buy books. That's right. Uh. And then my final 56 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:29,920 Speaker 1: little quick shout out because this is an episode on 57 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 1: the fin Treasure. Actually know a guy who looked for 58 00:03:33,200 --> 00:03:35,920 Speaker 1: this thing, and it's my old pal from my film 59 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:40,080 Speaker 1: industry days, Kim bro and I remember when this well, 60 00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:42,200 Speaker 1: we don't want to ruin anything, but I remember him 61 00:03:42,240 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 1: posting on Facebook about it some that he had looked 62 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:46,680 Speaker 1: for it. He didn't quit his job like some people, 63 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:52,560 Speaker 1: but he was a UM, a casual to moderately intense 64 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 1: UM explorer for the Finn Treasure. So that's really neat man. 65 00:03:57,360 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 1: Big shout out to kimbro Yeah listen, Actually, oh even better, 66 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:04,080 Speaker 1: you won't have to email and be like you should 67 00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: really listen to the Finn Treasure episode. So you just 68 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:10,560 Speaker 1: kind of let the cat out of the bag. You 69 00:04:10,680 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: and the title of the episode. We're talking about the 70 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 1: Fen Treasure, and it's probably familiar to a lot of people. 71 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:21,719 Speaker 1: It made the news pretty widely over the decade that 72 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 1: it was ongoing. But for those of you who aren't 73 00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:26,159 Speaker 1: aware of it, it was a treasure hunt, like a 74 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 1: real live treasure hunt. There was a chest of treasures 75 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:34,760 Speaker 1: literally treasures of gold and jewels and gems and are 76 00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:39,880 Speaker 1: like archaeological artifacts hidden somewhere by a very eccentric art 77 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:44,880 Speaker 1: dealer named Forest Finn, hence the name Finn Treasure. And 78 00:04:44,880 --> 00:04:47,840 Speaker 1: he published something in his book which is basically a 79 00:04:49,240 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 1: puzzle map full of clues I think nine clues, and 80 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 1: said you got everybody go find it and kick back 81 00:04:56,440 --> 00:05:00,920 Speaker 1: and and watched by the highest count I've seen about 82 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:05,839 Speaker 1: three fifty thousand different people search for this treasure, some 83 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:08,840 Speaker 1: of whom, like you mentioned, quit their jobs moved out 84 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 1: to the rockies so that they could um search more frequently. 85 00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:17,440 Speaker 1: Most people, though, just kind of were casually involved or 86 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 1: maybe followed it on the message boards that kind of thing. 87 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:22,880 Speaker 1: But but the people who actually did go out and 88 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:26,640 Speaker 1: look for it, we're kind of fulfilling this vision that 89 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:29,560 Speaker 1: Forest Fin had, which was, you know, we're also just 90 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:33,000 Speaker 1: kind of stuck on our couches in front of multiple 91 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:36,159 Speaker 1: screens all the time, and there's so much natural beauty 92 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:39,920 Speaker 1: out there that's just passing people's lives by. UM. And 93 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:41,559 Speaker 1: he said, well, you know, if you put a chest 94 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:43,680 Speaker 1: of treasure worth a couple of million dollars out there, 95 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:46,640 Speaker 1: tell people it's somewhere out there, it might actually get 96 00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:48,680 Speaker 1: some people to go look for it. And and that 97 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:52,640 Speaker 1: was the definite result of that whole thing. Yeah, I mean, 98 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:54,839 Speaker 1: it's a very cool thing. I did not know about 99 00:05:54,880 --> 00:05:58,720 Speaker 1: it until the end, and I'm still trying to sort 100 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:02,360 Speaker 1: of dance around a spoil alert. UM. But you know, 101 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 1: anything could have happened. It could have exploded, yep, could 102 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 1: have never been found and been a hoax, right, don't 103 00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:12,520 Speaker 1: forget Martians could have been Martians, it could have been found. 104 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:16,040 Speaker 1: You'll have to listen to find out. But eventually when 105 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:19,480 Speaker 1: things came to a conclusion is when I learned about it, 106 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:21,440 Speaker 1: and I was kind of mad that I didn't know 107 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 1: about it before. I definitely would not have gone and 108 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:28,680 Speaker 1: looked for it, but I would have done a lot 109 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:32,040 Speaker 1: of online sleuthing just to sort of poke around because 110 00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:34,400 Speaker 1: it's kind of fun. Treasure hunts are neat Well, yeah, 111 00:06:34,520 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 1: that was the cool thing about this too, is like 112 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:41,039 Speaker 1: you could do a lot of it through online sleuthing 113 00:06:41,240 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 1: and you could just kick back and like join the 114 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:45,039 Speaker 1: forums and help out like that. But if you had 115 00:06:45,080 --> 00:06:48,679 Speaker 1: your own salves is what they're called, where you figure 116 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:51,920 Speaker 1: out different solutions to the clues UM and you put 117 00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 1: them all together. That's a solve, and you know, different 118 00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:58,560 Speaker 1: people had multiple solves UM. To prove whether it was 119 00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 1: correct or not, try to find the you had to 120 00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:04,480 Speaker 1: actually get out there and look follow the solve that 121 00:07:04,520 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 1: you would come up with UM, And so a lot 122 00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:09,000 Speaker 1: of people did do that, and I think that's really 123 00:07:09,040 --> 00:07:10,760 Speaker 1: cool because it drew a lot of people out to 124 00:07:10,840 --> 00:07:15,040 Speaker 1: the Rockies, and the Rockies are indeed quite beautiful they are. Uh, 125 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:18,560 Speaker 1: should we talk about the man himself? I think we should. Man. Yeah. 126 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:22,880 Speaker 1: So Forest fen f E double n FO double R 127 00:07:23,520 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 1: as Well was born in Texas and he was always 128 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:30,280 Speaker 1: into the great outdoors. Apparently when he was a kid, 129 00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:33,200 Speaker 1: they used to vacation at Yellowstone National Park and it 130 00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 1: really made a pretty big impact on him. He went 131 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 1: through high school and then joined the Air Force and 132 00:07:38,480 --> 00:07:42,360 Speaker 1: became a pilot. Uh served in Vietnam, and after about 133 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:46,920 Speaker 1: twenty years of service in the military, got out, moved 134 00:07:46,920 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 1: to Santa Fe, New Mexico, and got into the art 135 00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:53,400 Speaker 1: dealer business, which is something he really didn't know anything 136 00:07:53,400 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 1: about it first. No, but he, I guess, had started 137 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:02,120 Speaker 1: collecting art um even though he wasn't like a particularly 138 00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:05,480 Speaker 1: enthused by art itself. But he liked the business of 139 00:08:05,600 --> 00:08:07,400 Speaker 1: art and art collecting. I think he liked the art 140 00:08:07,440 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 1: world and um, I get the impression also that it 141 00:08:10,080 --> 00:08:12,960 Speaker 1: brushed up against celebrities and you could, you know, get 142 00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:15,760 Speaker 1: rich people to part with their money pretty easily. So 143 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:17,880 Speaker 1: sure that has something to do with it. Yeah, I 144 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:19,960 Speaker 1: think he really liked that a lot. Um. One thing 145 00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:22,120 Speaker 1: I do want to say, I saw about his time 146 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: in Vietnam was that he said that he had flown 147 00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:28,640 Speaker 1: three hundred and twenty eight combat missions in three hundred 148 00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:31,320 Speaker 1: and forty eight days while he was there, which is 149 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 1: just astounding. And then apparently that drove him to become 150 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:37,920 Speaker 1: a pacifist because he after he left the military, he 151 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:42,520 Speaker 1: became a certified self proclaimed pacifist from from Fur the 152 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:45,559 Speaker 1: rest of his life from what I understand, Yeah, which 153 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:48,160 Speaker 1: that quite a few Vietnam vets went down that path. 154 00:08:48,920 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 1: I've heard a lot of those stories. So he uh 155 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:56,880 Speaker 1: moves to Santa Fe in ninety two, and like you said, 156 00:08:56,920 --> 00:08:59,600 Speaker 1: by that time, he had already collected some art. What 157 00:08:59,640 --> 00:09:03,319 Speaker 1: he would you is go out and buy art from 158 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 1: um little known artists and then up sell it, which 159 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:09,600 Speaker 1: is I guess the whole nut racket. But that's the 160 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:12,960 Speaker 1: business of art collecting, as you buy low hopefully and 161 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:17,400 Speaker 1: sell high, right. And uh. He specialized in Native American 162 00:09:17,520 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 1: art and also artifacts and opened the Aerosmith Finn Gallery 163 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:25,560 Speaker 1: with his partner Rex Aerosmith. Um. Eventually he just became 164 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:29,439 Speaker 1: the Finn Galleries with his wife Peggy, and he sold 165 00:09:29,520 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 1: art for you know, about eight or nine years. UM. 166 00:09:32,559 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 1: While he kept selling art, but in eight or nine 167 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:37,720 Speaker 1: years he started uh selling it to really famous people 168 00:09:37,760 --> 00:09:39,559 Speaker 1: and was making a lot of money doing it. Yeah, 169 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:42,160 Speaker 1: and he would actually he had a pretty cool tactic actually, 170 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:45,680 Speaker 1: um where you know, if you were of some certain 171 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 1: level of rich or famous, he would put you up 172 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 1: at his gallery, which is, you know, a compound which 173 00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:55,560 Speaker 1: had lots of guest houses that were filled with art 174 00:09:55,559 --> 00:09:57,960 Speaker 1: and everything was for sale, and um he would just 175 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:01,960 Speaker 1: kind of like, uh bathe you in luxuriousness while also 176 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:06,079 Speaker 1: simultaneously trying to to sell you art. Um. So he 177 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:10,199 Speaker 1: he seemed to have been living a pretty kush lifestyle 178 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:12,400 Speaker 1: in Santa Fe for a while, and he was making like, 179 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:15,320 Speaker 1: I think grossing back in the eighties six million a 180 00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:18,920 Speaker 1: year um in eighties money too, which is you know, 181 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:21,840 Speaker 1: that's a lot of cheese for somebody who just came 182 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 1: into the art world because he said, I guess I'll 183 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:26,640 Speaker 1: go try this next. You know, the dirtiest money too. 184 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:29,600 Speaker 1: It's pretty dirty. Yeah, And a lot of people are 185 00:10:29,640 --> 00:10:33,200 Speaker 1: like that guy is no hero. He's very widely celebrated, 186 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:37,640 Speaker 1: but a lot of um Native American communities, including I 187 00:10:37,679 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 1: believe the Pueblo, UM, say, you know, this guy is 188 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:44,400 Speaker 1: a plunderer. And archaeologists too are not a big fan 189 00:10:44,440 --> 00:10:48,320 Speaker 1: of him either, because he would excavate UM, you know, 190 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,800 Speaker 1: our archaeological sites, but without any documentation whatsoever. He just 191 00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:53,960 Speaker 1: wanted to get to the artifacts and then he would 192 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:56,360 Speaker 1: take it and sell it. He would he would ruin 193 00:10:56,640 --> 00:11:00,839 Speaker 1: an archaeological site UM to to get to the art 194 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 1: and then make some money off of it. So he 195 00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: didn't have He wasn't beloved universally in that sense, for sure. 196 00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:11,520 Speaker 1: It's worth pointing out. Yeah, I mean the FBI actually 197 00:11:11,559 --> 00:11:16,319 Speaker 1: investigated him. They did an undercover operation where an informat, 198 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:20,080 Speaker 1: a wired informat just like you seen the movies, went 199 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:22,800 Speaker 1: over to his house. I assume sort of posing is 200 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 1: some kind of a rich art collector, and he was 201 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:30,280 Speaker 1: like here, like, look at all this cool stuff, like 202 00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:33,079 Speaker 1: here's some eagle feathers, which I'm not supposed to have, 203 00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:37,240 Speaker 1: and here's some human hair from antiquity, and here's some 204 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:41,959 Speaker 1: chain mail and some prehistoric sandals and a basket and 205 00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:44,280 Speaker 1: and don't tell anyone, but I'm not supposed to have 206 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: any of this stuff. And after the raid UH in 207 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:51,959 Speaker 1: two thousand nine, apparently no charges were brought. It says 208 00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:56,040 Speaker 1: in our article that UM people assume that the artifacts 209 00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: were hidden or sold, but he had stuff confiscated, so 210 00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:02,440 Speaker 1: there was definitely only some of it there. And I'm 211 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:05,760 Speaker 1: just not sure why no charges were ever levied against him. 212 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:08,680 Speaker 1: He was a part of a bigger um investigation with 213 00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 1: a lot of people, but that might have something to 214 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:13,360 Speaker 1: do with it. I have no idea that well, he 215 00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:18,080 Speaker 1: seems to have been slick and rascally like in the 216 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:21,960 Speaker 1: way that you know, those kind of people attract admirers 217 00:12:22,080 --> 00:12:24,720 Speaker 1: far and wide and tend to like get off the 218 00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:29,080 Speaker 1: hook in situations that other people necessarily wouldn't. So who knows. 219 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:32,440 Speaker 1: I have no idea exactly why he wasn't prosecuted if 220 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:34,760 Speaker 1: he was, you know, caught with that kind of stuff, 221 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:38,240 Speaker 1: but it would kind of um be in step with 222 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:41,959 Speaker 1: his larger personality, which is, you know, I saw him 223 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 1: compared to the Native American coyote archetype, you know, the 224 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:49,280 Speaker 1: kind of the trickster, the the slick when you can 225 00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: never quite pin down. He definitely had a thread of 226 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:56,080 Speaker 1: that going through him, if not that being like you know, 227 00:12:56,559 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 1: his main trait. Yeah, I mean, he was definitely extent 228 00:13:00,040 --> 00:13:03,160 Speaker 1: rick He kind of flouted the rules of the art world. 229 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:05,720 Speaker 1: He thought they were kind of stagy and he was 230 00:13:05,720 --> 00:13:08,320 Speaker 1: going to do his own thing. Um. Apparently in his 231 00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:11,080 Speaker 1: galleries he had signs that said please touch the art, 232 00:13:11,520 --> 00:13:16,560 Speaker 1: we are responsible. Um. He sold Master forgeries like as 233 00:13:16,640 --> 00:13:20,080 Speaker 1: Master forgeries and basically said, hey, if you like the painting, 234 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:23,200 Speaker 1: by the painting the real fakes of those people who 235 00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:26,320 Speaker 1: just by it because of the real signature of the 236 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 1: real artist, which is interesting. Um. And he said he 237 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:35,160 Speaker 1: had a roster full of celebrities Jessica Lang, Michael Douglas, 238 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:39,880 Speaker 1: Steve Martin, Robert Redford, and as everyone knows, the largest 239 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 1: art collector on the planet, Suzanne Summers. Yeah, who he 240 00:13:43,240 --> 00:13:47,000 Speaker 1: was trying to help find a Georgia O'Keefe. Um. And 241 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,960 Speaker 1: I don't from a profile of him and People magazine 242 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:54,040 Speaker 1: that that hadn't been successful yet. But who knows what 243 00:13:54,120 --> 00:13:56,960 Speaker 1: the nineties brought. You know. Well, she had that thime 244 00:13:56,960 --> 00:13:59,920 Speaker 1: Master money, so yeah, she was rolling in the thime 245 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:04,600 Speaker 1: as her money. She wasn't hurt. Um. So so Forest 246 00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 1: Fin is kind of going along living his life just 247 00:14:07,120 --> 00:14:10,559 Speaker 1: being Forrest Fin from what I can tell. And he 248 00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:14,840 Speaker 1: was diagnosed with cancer. His father had had developed cancer 249 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:19,880 Speaker 1: and uh, when when Forrest was younger, and his father 250 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:25,560 Speaker 1: decided that rather than UM undergo uh potentially losing battle 251 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:29,720 Speaker 1: with with cancer, UM, he would take his own life. 252 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:31,800 Speaker 1: So he took a bunch of sleeping pills and he died. 253 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 1: And Forrest Uh decided he wanted to do the same. 254 00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:38,960 Speaker 1: But rather than like his father dying at home, he 255 00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:42,680 Speaker 1: knew of a spot that he wanted to die in 256 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:45,440 Speaker 1: in the rockies, and so his idea was he was 257 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:48,600 Speaker 1: going to put together a chest of treasure uh, and 258 00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:50,600 Speaker 1: when the time came, he was going to walk out 259 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:53,840 Speaker 1: to this spot, UH, take a bunch of sleeping pills himself, 260 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:56,400 Speaker 1: and lay there and die. And then at some point 261 00:14:56,520 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 1: somewhere sometimes somebody was going to come along, probably and 262 00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 1: find this treasure chest being clutched by an old skeleton. 263 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:08,640 Speaker 1: That was his idea. But the whole idea kind of 264 00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 1: took a left turn, Chuck, because he actually got better. 265 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:16,080 Speaker 1: He didn't he didn't die from cancer. He actually beat it. 266 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:17,800 Speaker 1: And I think that came as a bit of a 267 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 1: surprise to him. Yes, I imagine pretty pleasant surprise. Uh. 268 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,640 Speaker 1: So he wrote a self published memoir called The Thrill 269 00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:33,760 Speaker 1: of the Chase Publishing, and he um In it contained 270 00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:37,120 Speaker 1: a poem with six rhyming stanzas printed on the map 271 00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:39,360 Speaker 1: of the Rockies. And I think we should take a 272 00:15:39,400 --> 00:16:04,520 Speaker 1: break and read this poem right after this. All right, 273 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:08,480 Speaker 1: Fenn has written a poem, and I think we should 274 00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:12,080 Speaker 1: just read it. You want to take turns? Oh? Sure? 275 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 1: Are we going to do our voices like the Halloween episode? 276 00:16:14,840 --> 00:16:18,840 Speaker 1: Or you can do whatever you want to know? I agree, 277 00:16:18,840 --> 00:16:21,720 Speaker 1: we'll skip that one. I'm not going to read it 278 00:16:21,720 --> 00:16:26,120 Speaker 1: as Sammy Davis Jr. You want to go first to me? Uh, 279 00:16:26,440 --> 00:16:29,000 Speaker 1: dealer's choice. Okay, I'm gonna go you ready, all right? 280 00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:32,280 Speaker 1: As I have gone alone in there and with my 281 00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:36,360 Speaker 1: treasures bold, I can keep my secret ware and hint 282 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:42,880 Speaker 1: of riches new and old. My turn, Ye begin it 283 00:16:43,080 --> 00:16:46,880 Speaker 1: where warm waters halt. That's the first clue of where 284 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:49,400 Speaker 1: to start, by the way, and take it in the 285 00:16:49,480 --> 00:16:53,240 Speaker 1: canyon down not far but too far to walk. Put 286 00:16:53,280 --> 00:16:57,480 Speaker 1: in below the home of Brown Capital b. Yeah, that's 287 00:16:57,480 --> 00:16:59,920 Speaker 1: a big one. From there, it's no place for the me. 288 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:03,560 Speaker 1: The end is ever drawing nigh. There'll be no paddle 289 00:17:03,640 --> 00:17:08,400 Speaker 1: up your creek, just heavy loads and water high. If 290 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:11,600 Speaker 1: you've been wise and found the blaze, look quickly down 291 00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:16,159 Speaker 1: your quest to cease, but Terry scant with marvel gaze, 292 00:17:16,840 --> 00:17:20,760 Speaker 1: just take the chest and go in peace? Okay. Uh 293 00:17:20,800 --> 00:17:23,000 Speaker 1: so why is it that I must go and leave 294 00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:26,400 Speaker 1: my trope for all to seek the answers? I already 295 00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:31,240 Speaker 1: know I've done it, tired, and now I'm weak and finally, 296 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:34,400 Speaker 1: so hear me all and listen, good, your effort will 297 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:36,879 Speaker 1: be worth the cold if you are brave and in 298 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 1: the wood, I give you title to the gold. This 299 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:43,800 Speaker 1: is really exciting, I gotta say, sure, especially the back 300 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:47,080 Speaker 1: and forth. You know, I'm really appreciative of us doing 301 00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:51,560 Speaker 1: that was a really amazing literary device. So what this 302 00:17:51,720 --> 00:17:55,879 Speaker 1: was was a very cryptic poem about this treasure that 303 00:17:56,000 --> 00:18:00,560 Speaker 1: he's hidden, and uh, it was a real treasure, like 304 00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:03,080 Speaker 1: you said it was. I mean some people say possibly 305 00:18:03,160 --> 00:18:06,920 Speaker 1: up to three million dollars worth of golden loot. Um. 306 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:09,960 Speaker 1: I imagine just being a part of the fin treasure 307 00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:12,440 Speaker 1: makes it even more valuable at auction. So who knows 308 00:18:13,359 --> 00:18:16,240 Speaker 1: what it would fatch? You know? Yeah, I think, um, 309 00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:19,280 Speaker 1: from what I've seen that there's a pretty wide belief 310 00:18:19,359 --> 00:18:24,320 Speaker 1: that the treasure sold intact as the finn Treasure, would 311 00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:27,919 Speaker 1: be worth way more than its estimated market value of 312 00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:31,480 Speaker 1: the combined parts. Oh totally. There's some rich person that's 313 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:33,480 Speaker 1: just like, I want to have this in my house. 314 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:36,880 Speaker 1: I'll pay ten million bucks for it. Uh, we should 315 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:41,680 Speaker 1: say the box itself was actually a treasure as well, right, Yeah, 316 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:45,600 Speaker 1: it was a twelfth century bronze treasure chest basically, I 317 00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 1: think a ten inch by ten inch treasure chest or chest. 318 00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:51,879 Speaker 1: The fact that it contained treasure made it a treasure 319 00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:54,159 Speaker 1: chest by definition, but I don't know if that's what 320 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:56,840 Speaker 1: it was originally built for. But yeah, it's a remarkable 321 00:18:56,880 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 1: looking box just just on its own. It's the kind 322 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:04,080 Speaker 1: of heft and size and just shape that you would 323 00:19:04,119 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 1: imagine opening and being like, wow, there's hundreds of rare 324 00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:12,400 Speaker 1: gold coins among other things in here. Yeah, so, uh, 325 00:19:12,680 --> 00:19:17,040 Speaker 1: rare gold coins, um two gold nuggets supposedly as big 326 00:19:17,080 --> 00:19:19,399 Speaker 1: as a hen's egg. That that's pretty neat to look at, 327 00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 1: I imagine. And then artifacts like pre Columbian figurine, some 328 00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:28,520 Speaker 1: jade carvings from China, antique jewelry, emeralds, rubies, like the 329 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:30,600 Speaker 1: kind of thing that you would open up in. I 330 00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:32,040 Speaker 1: think he you know, he wanted a bit of a 331 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:35,200 Speaker 1: wow factor and not just like a stack of cash. Yeah, 332 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: well apparently he was originally going to put thousand dollar 333 00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 1: bills in there, but but yeah, but he was like, 334 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:44,240 Speaker 1: I don't know when this thing is going to be found, 335 00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 1: and who knows what kind of you know, uh, what 336 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:50,040 Speaker 1: kind of shape those those that paper currency is going 337 00:19:50,080 --> 00:19:53,040 Speaker 1: to be in. And also he's like, who knows if 338 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:55,639 Speaker 1: there'll be banks accepting that kind of currency any longer. 339 00:19:55,720 --> 00:20:00,480 Speaker 1: So he decided to put in more, um, everlasting treasures 340 00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:03,320 Speaker 1: like gold and things like that. So he takes this 341 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:06,959 Speaker 1: box chuck and this treasure chest. He goes to the 342 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:10,880 Speaker 1: spot somewhere in the Rockies where he he was he 343 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:13,320 Speaker 1: wont he was going to go lay down and die, 344 00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:15,800 Speaker 1: but rather than lay down and die, he just leaves 345 00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:19,760 Speaker 1: the chest there, comes back, publishes this book and then 346 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:22,080 Speaker 1: you know, let's everybody know about it. And it takes 347 00:20:22,080 --> 00:20:23,959 Speaker 1: a few years to catch on because I believe he's 348 00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:26,639 Speaker 1: self published the book. Um, so he didn't have a 349 00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:29,200 Speaker 1: lot of marketing behind it. But word of mouth started 350 00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:32,600 Speaker 1: to spread that there was a man from Santa Fe 351 00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:35,479 Speaker 1: who claimed to have put a two million dollar treasure 352 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,879 Speaker 1: chest out in the woods somewhere and had published a 353 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:42,159 Speaker 1: poem that that contained all the clues you needed to it, 354 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:46,920 Speaker 1: and so people started really getting into this, right, Yeah, 355 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:49,440 Speaker 1: I mean he didn't um. He gave away a few 356 00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:52,600 Speaker 1: extra little clues, but basically said, the clues are in 357 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:56,320 Speaker 1: this poem. Uh. There are nine of them. They are 358 00:20:56,440 --> 00:21:00,199 Speaker 1: listed in consecutive order, and they are you know, there 359 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:02,080 Speaker 1: are a series of steps that you have to take, 360 00:21:02,840 --> 00:21:06,520 Speaker 1: um starting with that second stanza. Um. He did also 361 00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:09,440 Speaker 1: say it's somewhere in the rocky mountains between Santa Fe 362 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:14,400 Speaker 1: and Canada. Another big clue was that it's an elevation 363 00:21:14,440 --> 00:21:17,040 Speaker 1: of about five thousand feet, so that that's a big 364 00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:19,040 Speaker 1: one that rules a lot of stuff out. And then 365 00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:22,080 Speaker 1: this last extra clue is also pretty big. He said, 366 00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:24,720 Speaker 1: it's not in a mine or in a graveyard or 367 00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 1: near any man made structure. And he said that last 368 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,159 Speaker 1: part from what I saw, because people were starting to 369 00:21:30,640 --> 00:21:34,719 Speaker 1: do really dumb things and and going for really far afield. 370 00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:38,320 Speaker 1: And he kept reminding people because so this is something 371 00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 1: that kind of um emerged from from reading about this stuff. 372 00:21:42,480 --> 00:21:46,959 Speaker 1: He became part of this community. People would call him up, 373 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:50,120 Speaker 1: they'd text him, they'd email him, like he became friends 374 00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:53,800 Speaker 1: with a lot of the most hardcore searchers. Um. And 375 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:56,280 Speaker 1: you know, sometimes they would ask him for clues or 376 00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:58,879 Speaker 1: hints and he would just ghost him. But others just 377 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:00,679 Speaker 1: were kind of like, you know, I'm sitting in this 378 00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:03,880 Speaker 1: one spot and you know, thinking of you right now 379 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:06,760 Speaker 1: because you you sent me here through this. This treasure 380 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:08,720 Speaker 1: hunter just wanted to thank you. Like he became a 381 00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 1: friend to a lot of these people. Um. But the 382 00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:16,240 Speaker 1: one thing he kept saying to this crowd was, I 383 00:22:16,280 --> 00:22:20,760 Speaker 1: was eighty years old carrying a forty pound treasure chest 384 00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:24,640 Speaker 1: when I went out to this place, Like like, this 385 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:26,480 Speaker 1: is not a place where you have to climb up 386 00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:30,119 Speaker 1: any sort of precipice or go down a precipice. Um, 387 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:33,880 Speaker 1: it's not that hard to get to. Just remember, like, 388 00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:35,760 Speaker 1: it's the kind of place that an eighty year old 389 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:38,560 Speaker 1: man carrying a treasure chest weighing forty pounds can get 390 00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 1: to by himself because there was no one there. There 391 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:45,280 Speaker 1: were no witnesses, um. And it was just his word 392 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:47,200 Speaker 1: that this was actually there that people had to take 393 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:51,000 Speaker 1: it for for you know, on face value. Yeah, one 394 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:55,840 Speaker 1: of his friends supposedly saw what he claimed was the 395 00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:58,920 Speaker 1: treasure chest in his walking close at once. But that's 396 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:01,520 Speaker 1: kind of the only verification and that this wasn't some 397 00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:03,920 Speaker 1: big hoax. I think people took him at his word. 398 00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:07,240 Speaker 1: And you know, if you're gonna figure something like this out, 399 00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:09,720 Speaker 1: you have to start. If you don't get that first 400 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,440 Speaker 1: clue right, then you might as well not even bother. 401 00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:15,240 Speaker 1: So it really comes down to begin it to where 402 00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:19,240 Speaker 1: waters I'm sorry, begin it where warm waters halt and 403 00:23:19,320 --> 00:23:22,439 Speaker 1: take it in the canyon down. You gotta find that place. 404 00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:26,119 Speaker 1: And people like, what does that mean? Are their rivers converging? 405 00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:29,320 Speaker 1: Is it a hot springs going into a river? Um? 406 00:23:29,359 --> 00:23:32,200 Speaker 1: The first thing I thought was like, maybe he's being cheeky. 407 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:37,160 Speaker 1: Maybe it's like, uh, some primitive National park bath house 408 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:42,560 Speaker 1: that doesn't have hot water, right, you know, like, don't 409 00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 1: don't look in nature it's a bathroom. That's Some people 410 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:48,280 Speaker 1: actually took um below the home of Brown to mean 411 00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:52,439 Speaker 1: an outhouse. I'm not kidding. I saw that in a 412 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:56,160 Speaker 1: couple of places, but Brown is capitalized. Yeah, I know, 413 00:23:56,640 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 1: I know, But that's the like that that like you're 414 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:02,920 Speaker 1: idea about, you know, it being like a place without 415 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:06,200 Speaker 1: hot water. This pretty pretty mainstream thinking actually, like the 416 00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:09,439 Speaker 1: like there were people who really got into this and 417 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:13,240 Speaker 1: started seeing things that just were not there. Yeah, of course, 418 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:17,639 Speaker 1: so um there. The whole thing is there was a 419 00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:20,719 Speaker 1: lot of question about how you should interpret this and 420 00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:23,680 Speaker 1: like I didn't see that that, like the whole thing 421 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:27,199 Speaker 1: actually did start with beginning where warm waters hault. A 422 00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 1: lot of people suspected that the real first clue was 423 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:34,080 Speaker 1: in the first stanza, but apparently that's not the case. 424 00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:39,600 Speaker 1: It is um, as I have gone alone in there 425 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:42,280 Speaker 1: and with my treasures bold I can keep my secret 426 00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:45,120 Speaker 1: ware and hint of Rita's new and old. People were 427 00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:48,119 Speaker 1: looking at things like, um, so in that first line, 428 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 1: as I have gone alone in there, they're like, well, 429 00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 1: if you look at um the word gone and the 430 00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:58,359 Speaker 1: word alone, the number one is spelled out, and those 431 00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:01,720 Speaker 1: two words, maybe these are some sort of coordinates that 432 00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:04,879 Speaker 1: start with one one Like this is the level of 433 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,800 Speaker 1: thought that bating too much into it, way too much. 434 00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:10,480 Speaker 1: And yeah, I think he even kind of tried to 435 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:13,280 Speaker 1: help guide people away from that, like you don't need 436 00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:16,600 Speaker 1: to be a cryptologist to get this right. This is 437 00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:19,800 Speaker 1: you know, uh, it's it's not that kind of a 438 00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:23,359 Speaker 1: puzzle like it's it's it's different than that. Um yeah, 439 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:25,640 Speaker 1: I mean he said there were no codes, no anagrams. 440 00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:29,720 Speaker 1: It was just like warm waters, dummy, right, But that 441 00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:33,120 Speaker 1: didn't stop anybody from from saying like, no, no, you're 442 00:25:33,119 --> 00:25:36,040 Speaker 1: a liar. And that's clearly one one or the first 443 00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:42,320 Speaker 1: two numbers in whatever coordinates you're giving us. Interesting. So, uh, 444 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 1: he did accomplish his goal as far as getting people 445 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:47,400 Speaker 1: out there. Um, like you said, like he got emails 446 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:51,080 Speaker 1: where people talked about these amazing places they never would 447 00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 1: have seen otherwise. And I imagine that brought him a 448 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,120 Speaker 1: lot of joy because that was the whole point for him, 449 00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:58,760 Speaker 1: was to was to get people out there. And uh, 450 00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:01,560 Speaker 1: I think he had the idea initially during the financial 451 00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:05,760 Speaker 1: crisis when everyone was feeling down about stuff, and he said, 452 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:08,800 Speaker 1: this is really gonna uh if people find out about it, 453 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:10,720 Speaker 1: this is gonna spice up a lot of people's lives 454 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,000 Speaker 1: and get them out into nature. Yeah. Because again, like 455 00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:14,919 Speaker 1: you could sit there and be like, Okay, this is 456 00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:17,720 Speaker 1: you know, this is where I think the starting point is, 457 00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:19,760 Speaker 1: and I'm gonna go on to Google Earth and start 458 00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:21,680 Speaker 1: here and try to find the next clue and put 459 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 1: together a solve. But again, if you had thought that 460 00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:27,600 Speaker 1: your your solve was onto something you had to go 461 00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,440 Speaker 1: out to the rockies and go see for yourself. Um. 462 00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:32,720 Speaker 1: So it really did get all those people out to nature. 463 00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,840 Speaker 1: And you know there there were so many like, um, 464 00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:43,360 Speaker 1: thanks and messages and you know, um just kind of uh, 465 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:45,720 Speaker 1: what's the word I'm looking for where you honor somebody 466 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:51,639 Speaker 1: with thanks or something like that. Yeah, there were accolades 467 00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:53,639 Speaker 1: for a forest friend for doing this because you know, 468 00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:56,920 Speaker 1: he helped change a lot of people's lives. But um, 469 00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:00,880 Speaker 1: there were definitely cases where things went far enough off 470 00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,320 Speaker 1: the rails that some of these treasury hunters did not 471 00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:06,640 Speaker 1: come back from, you know, going to verify their solves 472 00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:09,840 Speaker 1: in the in the woods in real life. Yeah, I 473 00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:14,000 Speaker 1: mean sadly, it looks like there were five people that died. 474 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:18,160 Speaker 1: Certainly others that were rescued that could have died. Um. 475 00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:20,439 Speaker 1: One man named Jeff Murphy I think died from a fall. 476 00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:23,720 Speaker 1: A man named Eric Ashby was found in the Arkansas River. 477 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:28,600 Speaker 1: There was a man named Randy Bill you who he 478 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:30,399 Speaker 1: was one of these full timers. He moved from Florida 479 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:34,359 Speaker 1: to Colorado and he died and was found near the 480 00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:38,000 Speaker 1: Rio Grand River. There was a preacher named Paris Waller 481 00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:41,920 Speaker 1: Um um, sorry Wallace a priest who was Um, he died. 482 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:46,080 Speaker 1: And then just before this thing came to its conclusion 483 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:50,199 Speaker 1: in March, there were two men found. Uh. One of 484 00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,280 Speaker 1: them was alive and one of them, named Michael Sexon, 485 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:56,160 Speaker 1: was actually dead. They went out as a pair, which 486 00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:58,720 Speaker 1: is what he always recommended, like go out with a buddy, 487 00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:01,520 Speaker 1: don't be dangerous. Um. But one of these guys died 488 00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:04,720 Speaker 1: near a Dinosaur National Monument in Utah. Yeah, and Um, 489 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:07,080 Speaker 1: the other guy, like you said, was rescued. That was 490 00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:09,320 Speaker 1: the second time that pair had had to be rescued 491 00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:13,560 Speaker 1: in the area in a month. Man. Yeah, so you 492 00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:16,200 Speaker 1: can imagine that law enforcement in some of these places 493 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:20,600 Speaker 1: around Colorado in New Mexico where people were getting lost 494 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:25,280 Speaker 1: or dying. Um called on Fenn to say, like just 495 00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:27,960 Speaker 1: stop this, just call us off, like tell everybody where 496 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 1: it is, like this has gotten dangerous. People are are 497 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:33,919 Speaker 1: losing their lives now because of this, Like people have died, 498 00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:40,240 Speaker 1: and Forest Fen had um a fairly libertarian response to that. 499 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:43,440 Speaker 1: He said, there's there's not Um. He said, life is 500 00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 1: too short to wear both a belt and suspenders. If 501 00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:48,920 Speaker 1: someone drowns in the swimming pool, we shouldn't drain the pool. 502 00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:52,720 Speaker 1: We should teach people to swim, which has a certain homespun, 503 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:57,920 Speaker 1: wild West folksy sensibility to it, for sure. Um, it 504 00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:01,320 Speaker 1: makes sense like he wasn't he. It's not like he 505 00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:05,160 Speaker 1: was the original Tom Fool who was sending people to 506 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:08,400 Speaker 1: their death in the quicksand that he knew was going to, 507 00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 1: you know, catch them on their way to find this treasure. 508 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,800 Speaker 1: Like he was. He was trying to get people out 509 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:16,800 Speaker 1: of doors, and he was trying to guide them as 510 00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:21,360 Speaker 1: best he could in a safe manner without giving anything away. Um. 511 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:24,760 Speaker 1: And you can make a case one way or the 512 00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:28,120 Speaker 1: other that he was responsible or not responsible for those 513 00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:30,280 Speaker 1: people's deaths. I think it just comes down to your 514 00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:37,920 Speaker 1: philosophy on personal responsibility or you know, um, indirect responsibility. Yeah. 515 00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 1: And he also after that quote said why do I 516 00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:42,920 Speaker 1: have to pay school taxes when I don't have kids? Right, 517 00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:46,120 Speaker 1: I don't care about your kids. And now I'm going 518 00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:50,200 Speaker 1: to get emails from libertarians. Yeah, I don't think libertarians 519 00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:53,880 Speaker 1: listening to this anymore. We discussed them. Oh, who knows, Now, 520 00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:55,800 Speaker 1: I'm sure there's some out there. I'm just kidding. Of course, 521 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:59,400 Speaker 1: we have libertarian listeners. So there was some other you know, 522 00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:01,920 Speaker 1: aside from the deaths, there's some other darker sort of 523 00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:05,640 Speaker 1: aspects to this story. Um. When you have hundreds of 524 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 1: thousands of people looking for something in national parks and 525 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:11,440 Speaker 1: in wildlife, you're gonna get some people that are not 526 00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:14,600 Speaker 1: accustomed to being in these places and treating them with 527 00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:19,520 Speaker 1: their respect they deserve, and uh damaging protected spaces and 528 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 1: uh species. There was one person charged with the misdemeanor 529 00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:27,440 Speaker 1: for digging under a memorial cross owned by the New 530 00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:30,680 Speaker 1: Mexico State Game Commission. Um. They had to actually backfill 531 00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:34,440 Speaker 1: the space to stabilize the monument. Um. There was other people. 532 00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:37,360 Speaker 1: There were other people arrested over the years for digging 533 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:41,520 Speaker 1: in national parks, digging in cemeteries, people being indicted on 534 00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:45,720 Speaker 1: federal charges. Um. You know this is what you're gonna 535 00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:48,200 Speaker 1: get when you sort of have a wild West treasure 536 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:51,880 Speaker 1: hunt in in very kind of sacred areas. Yeah. Especially, Yeah, 537 00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:54,440 Speaker 1: you're gonna attract some nuts and kooks for sure, who 538 00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 1: who don't listen and who just stopped thinking you're using 539 00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:02,520 Speaker 1: their brains. Um. One I was, I believe, got a 540 00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:05,480 Speaker 1: restraining order UM taken out against him by Fenn and 541 00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:08,800 Speaker 1: his family because he had decided that the real treasure 542 00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:12,240 Speaker 1: was fens granddaughter and that that was the key to everything, 543 00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:16,680 Speaker 1: and had started stalking Fens home. Um, which is kind 544 00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:19,719 Speaker 1: of scary. Yeah, did you see anything else about that guy? 545 00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:24,560 Speaker 1: About the stalker? Yeah, I had. His name was Francisco 546 00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:29,520 Speaker 1: Paco Chavez. Paco was his nickname, and uh, he was 547 00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:33,800 Speaker 1: just clearly had had issues. I don't want to like 548 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:37,000 Speaker 1: diagnose him or anything, but um, it wasn't just about 549 00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:40,560 Speaker 1: this treasure hunt. He at one point has sent pictures 550 00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 1: of hearts, the treasure chest and a shoe with a 551 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:50,040 Speaker 1: message that said one shoe can change your life Cinderella me. Um. 552 00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:53,240 Speaker 1: He said he wanted to marry his granddaughter. He eventually 553 00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:56,800 Speaker 1: was put on three years probation in and then in 554 00:31:56,840 --> 00:31:59,800 Speaker 1: twenty nineteen showed up at his house again on on 555 00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:02,280 Speaker 1: the like, Uh, you know, he had a gate at 556 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:04,640 Speaker 1: home and I was trying to get buzzed in. They 557 00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:06,560 Speaker 1: saw who it was and he just sort of disappeared 558 00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:09,440 Speaker 1: before the cops could show up. But um, that that 559 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:13,120 Speaker 1: pretty scary. Yeah, I can't imagine. Um, I mean, that's 560 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:17,440 Speaker 1: super duper scary to have somebody zeroed in on you 561 00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:21,480 Speaker 1: like that, under any circumstance, you know. Yeah, Um, I 562 00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:23,960 Speaker 1: think there was another guy who tried to gain entry 563 00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:26,280 Speaker 1: into the house with an axe and had to be 564 00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:30,160 Speaker 1: held at gunpoint by Fen's daughter. Um. But he was 565 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:33,960 Speaker 1: the kind of guy who inspired love and support by 566 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:38,080 Speaker 1: his family. And I saw a uh quote from his grandson, 567 00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:42,000 Speaker 1: whose name is shiloh Old, which is pretty wide wild 568 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,160 Speaker 1: West name, uh, and he said, you know, this has 569 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:47,160 Speaker 1: been you know, really hard on the family, but you know, 570 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:51,920 Speaker 1: we we fully support our grandfather. Um. It's I thought 571 00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:53,160 Speaker 1: that was kind of neat, and it says a lot 572 00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:56,560 Speaker 1: about his family that they were willing to endure all 573 00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:59,600 Speaker 1: this without you know, being like, just tell him where 574 00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:02,560 Speaker 1: the where the treasure is? Like, this has gotten out 575 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,680 Speaker 1: of hand, so should we take another break and then 576 00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:09,000 Speaker 1: talk about this mysterious conclusion you've been talking about totally? 577 00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:34,280 Speaker 1: So people are still looking for this thing, it's um, 578 00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:40,000 Speaker 1: I believe twenty right June of Yeah, you're speaking in 579 00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:43,680 Speaker 1: a you know, past tense. Well, no, actually, I think 580 00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:46,000 Speaker 1: there are people still looking at this for this as 581 00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:48,960 Speaker 1: we'll see, but they're not necessarily looking for the treasure anymore. 582 00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:52,920 Speaker 1: Because in June of there was an announcement made by 583 00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:57,440 Speaker 1: forest Fen that said, it's been found. It's over. Somebody 584 00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:04,240 Speaker 1: found fair and square and and um. Thus began this frustrating, 585 00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:11,239 Speaker 1: maddening slow trickle of vague confirmations that this had been 586 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:15,759 Speaker 1: found and it had been found legitimately. That actually encouraged 587 00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:20,680 Speaker 1: conspiracy theories about whether the treasure had even existed at all, 588 00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:25,080 Speaker 1: or had ever been out there in the wilderness at all. Um. 589 00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 1: That still kind of persisted among some people of this day. 590 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:30,799 Speaker 1: But from what I saw, most of the people who 591 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,719 Speaker 1: were involved in the treasure hunt are satisfied that it 592 00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:36,160 Speaker 1: was found and that it was found fair and square. 593 00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:38,920 Speaker 1: Are you saying there are people in this country that, 594 00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:43,080 Speaker 1: in the face of hard facts and truth, Uh, still 595 00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:46,479 Speaker 1: believe in the conspiracy. Chuck, believe it or not. That 596 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:49,640 Speaker 1: may be true. I think the jury is still out, 597 00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:54,040 Speaker 1: so UM. I think it's kind of interesting what he 598 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:56,600 Speaker 1: said when when they did find it, he said, Uh, 599 00:34:56,640 --> 00:34:58,520 Speaker 1: it has been found under a canopy of stars and 600 00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:02,040 Speaker 1: the lush forced vegetation the Rocky mountains, and had not 601 00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:04,319 Speaker 1: moved from the spot where I hit it more than 602 00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:06,480 Speaker 1: ten years ago. I do not know the person who 603 00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:08,920 Speaker 1: found it. That would change. But the poem in my 604 00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:12,200 Speaker 1: book led him to the precise spot, and uh, like 605 00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:18,200 Speaker 1: you said, because of the conspiracy um individuals, he said, Uh. 606 00:35:18,239 --> 00:35:20,960 Speaker 1: He posted a picture of it and he's like, here 607 00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:23,440 Speaker 1: it is. Here are some of the objects. They have weathered. 608 00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:25,759 Speaker 1: It's darker than it was ten years ago when I 609 00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:28,120 Speaker 1: left it in the ground and walked away. Here's like 610 00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:31,279 Speaker 1: a bracelet that's been tarnished. And yet some people still 611 00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:34,319 Speaker 1: were like, Nope, I don't believe the facts in front 612 00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:36,799 Speaker 1: of my face. This is a hoax. Yeah, I mean 613 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:39,200 Speaker 1: the fact. The fact is that the guy who um 614 00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:42,319 Speaker 1: found it didn't want to be named. So now you 615 00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:46,040 Speaker 1: had an anonymous person named the Finder who said that 616 00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:49,160 Speaker 1: you know, he had found it. He wouldn't reveal how 617 00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:51,359 Speaker 1: he found it because he was saying that he had 618 00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:54,239 Speaker 1: been to this place obviously to get the treasure, and 619 00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:56,920 Speaker 1: it was so beautiful and pristine that he said it 620 00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:59,759 Speaker 1: was not an appropriate place to become a tourist destination. 621 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:02,239 Speaker 1: He and want people going out there and looking for 622 00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:05,719 Speaker 1: maybe treasure that was dropped along the way um, or 623 00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:08,640 Speaker 1: just you know, trying to see for themselves this place. 624 00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:11,200 Speaker 1: It was a sacred place in his opinion, and he 625 00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:15,760 Speaker 1: wanted to defend it so um to this day. Uh, 626 00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:18,839 Speaker 1: the second part has still held true. People don't know 627 00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:21,680 Speaker 1: where he found this thing, which is why I said, 628 00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:23,760 Speaker 1: some people are still looking for this. They're not looking 629 00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:26,239 Speaker 1: for the treasure anymore. They're looking for the spot, like 630 00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:29,920 Speaker 1: the spot has become you know, the treasure. UM. And 631 00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:32,560 Speaker 1: there was something that that we left out before that 632 00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:36,640 Speaker 1: I think is worth mentioning um because Forest Fen was 633 00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:40,359 Speaker 1: in correspondence with a lot of these people who are 634 00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:43,239 Speaker 1: searching for this hard core UM. They would tell him 635 00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:45,480 Speaker 1: like where they'd been or whatever, and he wouldn't give 636 00:36:45,520 --> 00:36:48,040 Speaker 1: him anything in response. He'd just take the information, you know. 637 00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:51,640 Speaker 1: But then later in interviews he said that multiple people 638 00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:55,240 Speaker 1: had been within a couple hundred feet of the treasure 639 00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:59,040 Speaker 1: and just hadn't been able to find it. Um. And apparently, 640 00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:02,880 Speaker 1: uh one of the reasons why is this anonymous finder 641 00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:06,040 Speaker 1: said that somebody had gone out that way and put 642 00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:09,880 Speaker 1: a misleading blaze. Ablaze is one of the clues, but 643 00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:12,319 Speaker 1: it's also something that marks trail, and it was the 644 00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:15,520 Speaker 1: penultimate clue. I believe if you found the blaze, you 645 00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:18,120 Speaker 1: were very close to the treasure and somebody had put 646 00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:21,440 Speaker 1: some other misleading blaze out there to be a jerk, 647 00:37:21,520 --> 00:37:24,880 Speaker 1: I guess, or throw other people off the trail. Um, 648 00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:26,640 Speaker 1: but there are a lot of people who had come 649 00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:31,520 Speaker 1: really really close and just walked right past it. Basically, Yeah, 650 00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:35,080 Speaker 1: and apparently the original blaze had been damaged over the decade, 651 00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:39,040 Speaker 1: so I don't think it was even visible to begin with. 652 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:43,200 Speaker 1: Then you had the misleading blaze and this mystery person 653 00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:46,120 Speaker 1: would eventually be out of though because of a lawsuit. Uh. 654 00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:48,360 Speaker 1: There was a woman, a real estate attorney from Chicago 655 00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:53,520 Speaker 1: named Barbara Anderson who said that treasure is mine. Um, 656 00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:57,759 Speaker 1: I solved it, and somebody hacked into my email and 657 00:37:57,880 --> 00:38:02,520 Speaker 1: my cell phone and stole I solve and it's this person, 658 00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:06,799 Speaker 1: whoever it is. And so because of this lawsuit, uh, 659 00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:10,120 Speaker 1: Jack stuff, a thirty two year old medical student had 660 00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:14,480 Speaker 1: to be revealed and and go to court, and um, 661 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:17,280 Speaker 1: we have we are one degree removed from Jack Stupe. 662 00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:19,480 Speaker 1: I was wondering if friend Dazzo knew him or not. 663 00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:21,920 Speaker 1: They they're there, they worked there around the same time, 664 00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:24,600 Speaker 1: I would guess, right, Yeah, so he was a writer 665 00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:26,439 Speaker 1: for The Onion and we knew folks from The Onion, 666 00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:29,640 Speaker 1: and uh, I didn't text our buddy Joe Randazzo. But 667 00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:34,160 Speaker 1: I did text Joe garden Um, former Onion writer, and 668 00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:37,239 Speaker 1: he knew him, and he said after uh, and asked 669 00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:39,279 Speaker 1: him if I could quote him on all this, and 670 00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:41,759 Speaker 1: he said, after he found it. He said, we had 671 00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:45,360 Speaker 1: a nice little Onion alumni chat about him. And he 672 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:47,319 Speaker 1: said he's a decent enough guy. And he said, but 673 00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:49,840 Speaker 1: as my uh, he said, as my friend John Harris 674 00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:52,520 Speaker 1: for The Onion put it, I didn't not expect him 675 00:38:52,560 --> 00:38:57,200 Speaker 1: to find buried treasure. So uh. He said that he 676 00:38:57,320 --> 00:38:59,120 Speaker 1: was the kind of guy. And you know, I read 677 00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:02,200 Speaker 1: a little bit more about him. He was, um apparently 678 00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:03,719 Speaker 1: into this kind of thing. When he was a kid. 679 00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:08,000 Speaker 1: He was obsessed with the show Push Nevada, which was 680 00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:12,560 Speaker 1: a TV show reviewers could solve a real million dollar mystery. Um. 681 00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:16,160 Speaker 1: Joe said he admired his pluck. Uh. He had gained 682 00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:20,600 Speaker 1: some notoriety before I'm sorry, after The Onion when he 683 00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:24,319 Speaker 1: wrote for something called The Wonket and uh he was 684 00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:27,440 Speaker 1: the person who in two thousand and eight made a 685 00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:31,759 Speaker 1: drogatory term about Sarah Palin's uh special needs son and 686 00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:34,239 Speaker 1: kind of got a lot of grief for that. Um 687 00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:37,960 Speaker 1: got out of journalism, went to medical school, and then 688 00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:41,720 Speaker 1: started searching for this treasure. Yeah, I guess he liked 689 00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:46,320 Speaker 1: um only meeting with patients everything else. He hated about 690 00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:49,560 Speaker 1: medical school from what I read. UM, But yeah, he 691 00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:52,520 Speaker 1: just kind of dedicated his life to this. From what 692 00:39:52,560 --> 00:39:55,879 Speaker 1: I saw, he didn't really share how into it he 693 00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:59,239 Speaker 1: was with friends and family, UM, because he didn't know 694 00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:00,680 Speaker 1: if he was ever going to find it, and it 695 00:40:00,760 --> 00:40:03,160 Speaker 1: was just a weird thing to to be into this 696 00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:05,040 Speaker 1: deep as far as he was concerned. So he seemed 697 00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:09,680 Speaker 1: to have some perspective. But UM, I saw some some 698 00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:12,680 Speaker 1: of the other treasure hunters were like this guy, Jack Stuf. 699 00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:16,480 Speaker 1: He he was kind of a lone wolf, but at 700 00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:20,000 Speaker 1: some points he went on and like and joined some 701 00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:23,920 Speaker 1: groups that were trying to solve UM the treasure hunt 702 00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:27,239 Speaker 1: as a group UM. And there were questions at first 703 00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:31,399 Speaker 1: about whether he had basically taken a solve from one 704 00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:33,560 Speaker 1: of the groups that he participated in and solved it 705 00:40:33,640 --> 00:40:37,360 Speaker 1: himself and wasn't sharing the treasure. But um that group 706 00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:41,759 Speaker 1: was involved in basically looking at like alone has the 707 00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:45,280 Speaker 1: number one, and they were just totally off. What Stuf 708 00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:49,239 Speaker 1: apparently did was apply his UM degree in English and 709 00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:54,000 Speaker 1: literature and did a close reading and studied forest Fan 710 00:40:54,520 --> 00:40:57,320 Speaker 1: and watched all the interviews with him, read every interview 711 00:40:57,360 --> 00:41:00,399 Speaker 1: he could find to see if he slipped up or um, 712 00:41:00,440 --> 00:41:03,319 Speaker 1: just to kind of understand who he was more, and 713 00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:05,960 Speaker 1: then applied that to it and treated it less like 714 00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:10,440 Speaker 1: a cryptogram and more like a poem that was that 715 00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:15,279 Speaker 1: was symbolic, and that apparently is how he cracked the code. Yeah, 716 00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:17,680 Speaker 1: I mean um. He said that he he did notice 717 00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:20,040 Speaker 1: a couple of slip ups and interviews that Forrestment had 718 00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,440 Speaker 1: made and that he said, I just guess no one 719 00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:26,319 Speaker 1: else noticed these. Um. And he said his like, he 720 00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:29,920 Speaker 1: obviously used the poem to to follow the steps, but 721 00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:32,920 Speaker 1: in his mind it seemed like um. And there's that 722 00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:35,839 Speaker 1: great Outside magazine article that if you want to read 723 00:41:35,880 --> 00:41:39,400 Speaker 1: more about it, it's pretty in depth about him. But um, 724 00:41:39,440 --> 00:41:41,239 Speaker 1: he said, what he really wanted to figure out was 725 00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:44,799 Speaker 1: the where he thought he might want to die. Uh. 726 00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:46,480 Speaker 1: And he thought that was sort of the biggest clue 727 00:41:46,560 --> 00:41:49,399 Speaker 1: of all and that it would probably be some really 728 00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:53,320 Speaker 1: beautiful place and not you know, like a rocky, dusty 729 00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:56,520 Speaker 1: hillside or something like that. Uh. And it turns out 730 00:41:56,560 --> 00:41:59,279 Speaker 1: that he was right. And um, you know, he said 731 00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:01,719 Speaker 1: that that one A's had worn away over the years. 732 00:42:01,760 --> 00:42:04,480 Speaker 1: But he went to the spot where he said, I 733 00:42:04,520 --> 00:42:06,239 Speaker 1: think this is the spot where he wants to die. 734 00:42:06,680 --> 00:42:08,759 Speaker 1: He went there about twenty five times over a couple 735 00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:12,719 Speaker 1: of years, and I just, you know, finally found it. 736 00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:16,520 Speaker 1: Pretty neat story. Yeah that that, Um, that Outside magazine 737 00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:18,920 Speaker 1: article on him is pretty interesting. I found one I 738 00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:22,160 Speaker 1: think is even better. Um. It was in New York 739 00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:26,880 Speaker 1: Magazine by Benjamin Wallace called the Great twenty one century 740 00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:30,719 Speaker 1: treasure Hunt. I believe, um that was that it was 741 00:42:30,840 --> 00:42:33,520 Speaker 1: really provide a lot of extra details in different ways 742 00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:35,560 Speaker 1: of looking at it that I hadn't seen elsewhere. So 743 00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:38,520 Speaker 1: and it also profiled a different hunter who didn't find it, 744 00:42:38,760 --> 00:42:41,400 Speaker 1: by the last name of Posey Um, but is a 745 00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:46,240 Speaker 1: pretty interesting cat himself too. Yeah, so Stuf ended up. Um. 746 00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:50,200 Speaker 1: He said he became friends, like legit friends with Fenn 747 00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:56,120 Speaker 1: before he died in September September seven. Um, he was 748 00:42:56,200 --> 00:43:00,480 Speaker 1: ninety years old. And uh, he said, you know, I'm 749 00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:03,040 Speaker 1: hanging onto this for now. I may split it up 750 00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:05,600 Speaker 1: and may display some of it. I may sell some 751 00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:07,279 Speaker 1: of it. He's really not sure what he's gonna do. 752 00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:10,080 Speaker 1: I think I'm with you. Like, if he really wants 753 00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:13,200 Speaker 1: to bring in the windfall, he should sell it all 754 00:43:13,280 --> 00:43:17,239 Speaker 1: as one big package to some super rich person who 755 00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:19,839 Speaker 1: wants to display this thing. But right now he's kind 756 00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:23,560 Speaker 1: of hanging onto it. And um, it was really seemed 757 00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:27,280 Speaker 1: like genuinely broken up when when Fenn died. Oh yeah, 758 00:43:27,320 --> 00:43:31,400 Speaker 1: that guy was very much beloved in the community for sure. 759 00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:34,720 Speaker 1: Like there there was one of those guys who went missing, 760 00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:38,960 Speaker 1: one of the searchers who went missing, I believe um. Oh, 761 00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:40,560 Speaker 1: I don't remember which one it was, but he was 762 00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:44,960 Speaker 1: missing for seven months and after the initial official search 763 00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:48,640 Speaker 1: and rescue UM was called off forest Fenn paid for 764 00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:52,160 Speaker 1: a chartered helicopter to continue the search, and a lot 765 00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:55,400 Speaker 1: of the treasure hunters searched for him too. So it 766 00:43:55,480 --> 00:43:57,400 Speaker 1: was a very tight knit community and this guy was 767 00:43:57,480 --> 00:44:01,080 Speaker 1: like this kind of homespun odd figure to them that 768 00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:05,800 Speaker 1: they could text and say hi to. He was super approachable, um, 769 00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:08,680 Speaker 1: and yet he he wouldn't give you anything. He wouldn't 770 00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:11,960 Speaker 1: give you any hint as to where the treasure was. 771 00:44:12,320 --> 00:44:14,560 Speaker 1: So it must have been really interesting for him too 772 00:44:15,320 --> 00:44:19,160 Speaker 1: to um to kind of put himself in that kind 773 00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:21,040 Speaker 1: of jeopardy or put the treasure in that kind of 774 00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:26,080 Speaker 1: jeopardy by interacting with people who we're spending tons of 775 00:44:26,120 --> 00:44:29,960 Speaker 1: their waking hours looking for this treasure UM and not 776 00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:33,120 Speaker 1: giving them anything, not a single clue. It must have 777 00:44:33,160 --> 00:44:35,279 Speaker 1: been pretty fun for him to to that that's how 778 00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:38,920 Speaker 1: he spent his last days, you know. Oh, totally. Uh. 779 00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:42,719 Speaker 1: And if you're thinking in terms of movies, like I 780 00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:45,480 Speaker 1: always think, there is a documentary which I wasn't able 781 00:44:45,520 --> 00:44:49,759 Speaker 1: to watch, called The Lure from that UM obviously before 782 00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:52,160 Speaker 1: it was found. They made this documentary about people who 783 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:55,640 Speaker 1: were searching uh. And you cannot stream it online, but 784 00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:57,560 Speaker 1: I think you can actually buy it from the website, 785 00:44:58,280 --> 00:45:02,000 Speaker 1: and they are making supposedly a movie about it. UM 786 00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:05,800 Speaker 1: director Jake Zamanski has been hired to make a movie 787 00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:12,080 Speaker 1: based on journalist Hudson Morgan's misadventures looking for this thing himself. Uh. 788 00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:14,040 Speaker 1: And it's about a group of millennials who set out 789 00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:17,239 Speaker 1: to find it and getting wacky misadventures. And it's described 790 00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:23,080 Speaker 1: as uh an action comedy Goonies meets the Hangover. Oh. 791 00:45:24,160 --> 00:45:26,120 Speaker 1: I never thought I would hear those words put the 792 00:45:26,239 --> 00:45:30,439 Speaker 1: other on the sid So who knows, maybe we'll see 793 00:45:30,440 --> 00:45:34,160 Speaker 1: that one day. Uh. Wow, Okay, well, um, let's see 794 00:45:34,239 --> 00:45:37,800 Speaker 1: you got anything else. Nothing else, let's the find treasury. 795 00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:39,080 Speaker 1: But if you want to know more about it, go 796 00:45:39,200 --> 00:45:42,000 Speaker 1: check out that outside article in the New York Magazine 797 00:45:42,080 --> 00:45:44,400 Speaker 1: article and then just prepare to dive in and you 798 00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:47,719 Speaker 1: can still join it and figure out where the spot is. 799 00:45:47,840 --> 00:45:52,160 Speaker 1: Just be safe, you know, be smart. And since I 800 00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:54,040 Speaker 1: said be safe and be smart, that means it's time 801 00:45:54,040 --> 00:46:00,239 Speaker 1: for listener mail. I'm gonna call this layoff Cisco guy eyes. 802 00:46:01,280 --> 00:46:05,719 Speaker 1: So uh, in our Buffets episode, I think you specifically 803 00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:10,120 Speaker 1: sort of bagged on Cisco the restaurant delivery service. I 804 00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:13,680 Speaker 1: was bagging on restaurants that use Cisco's pre made ingredients 805 00:46:13,680 --> 00:46:15,759 Speaker 1: and try to pass it off as if it's just 806 00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:20,800 Speaker 1: sure you know their own stuff. Alright, So take that, Brandon. 807 00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:23,799 Speaker 1: But Brandon says this, Greetings guys have listened to many 808 00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:26,040 Speaker 1: years and rarely needed it right in. But on the 809 00:46:26,080 --> 00:46:29,040 Speaker 1: Buffet episode, that was a massive misconception of the role 810 00:46:29,040 --> 00:46:31,560 Speaker 1: of Cisco at restaurants. I have worked for Cisco for 811 00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:35,560 Speaker 1: thirteen years, delivery for ten, and now a shuttle driver 812 00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:38,920 Speaker 1: hauling food from Salt Lake City to Grand Junction, Colorado 813 00:46:39,040 --> 00:46:41,840 Speaker 1: every day. I love my job. Cisco was portrayed on 814 00:46:41,840 --> 00:46:46,759 Speaker 1: the show as a prepackaged, frozen microwave food company. Uh. 815 00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:48,680 Speaker 1: While we do have select items that are ready to 816 00:46:48,719 --> 00:46:50,960 Speaker 1: eat and frozen, the vast majority of our food supply 817 00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:56,719 Speaker 1: our fresh foods, fresh foods and vegetables. We supply restaurants, hospitals, schools, etcetera. 818 00:46:57,040 --> 00:47:00,520 Speaker 1: With everything needed for kitchens to become successful. Our trucks 819 00:47:00,520 --> 00:47:04,000 Speaker 1: are dual zone refrigerators for frozen and fresh items. I 820 00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:06,040 Speaker 1: hope you can do an episode on food delivering how 821 00:47:06,080 --> 00:47:09,240 Speaker 1: semitrucks are used to keep the cold chain supply and action. 822 00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:11,760 Speaker 1: I hope this didn't go on for too long. Didn't, 823 00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:15,680 Speaker 1: And I hope your perception of Cisco will change for 824 00:47:15,719 --> 00:47:19,480 Speaker 1: the better. Sure, yeah, I mean I love Cisco. Now 825 00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:25,520 Speaker 1: let's all go to Cisco lots of love. That's from 826 00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:28,880 Speaker 1: Brandon writer in Colorado, and he saidps, can you plug 827 00:47:28,920 --> 00:47:32,440 Speaker 1: my very small gaming channel on YouTube? Sure? It is 828 00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:36,120 Speaker 1: Brandon due to gaming and that is d O O 829 00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:40,520 Speaker 1: D all one word Brandon dude gaming on YouTube. Yes, 830 00:47:40,840 --> 00:47:43,719 Speaker 1: I haven't seen his gaming channels, so let's just go 831 00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:48,320 Speaker 1: ahead and hope that it's all above boards. That's a 832 00:47:48,360 --> 00:47:52,360 Speaker 1: good point. You should probably do that. Yeah, we should, 833 00:47:52,440 --> 00:47:54,759 Speaker 1: we'll get we'll get busy on that. You go and 834 00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:57,439 Speaker 1: click on it in the first video, is right. Yeah, 835 00:47:57,920 --> 00:48:00,320 Speaker 1: that would be the least of my worries. Actually, actually 836 00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:03,360 Speaker 1: that'd be fine. Uh. Well, thanks a lot, Brandon. Sorry 837 00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:07,560 Speaker 1: for really kind of I guess indirectly talking smack about Cisco. 838 00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:10,439 Speaker 1: That was my intent. So thank you for calling me out. 839 00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:12,719 Speaker 1: Uh And if you want to be like Brandon and 840 00:48:12,760 --> 00:48:14,879 Speaker 1: call me out or call Chuck out too, you can 841 00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:16,400 Speaker 1: do that to you once in a while. If you like, 842 00:48:17,080 --> 00:48:19,279 Speaker 1: you can send us an email. The Stuff podcast at 843 00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:24,759 Speaker 1: iHeart radio dot com. Stuff you Should Know is a 844 00:48:24,760 --> 00:48:27,520 Speaker 1: production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts for my 845 00:48:27,560 --> 00:48:30,360 Speaker 1: heart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or 846 00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:32,000 Speaker 1: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.