WEBVTT - Elections, Technology & Their Driving Forces 0:00:01.440 --> 0:00:06.720 From Mahard where Innovation, Money and Power colle in Silicon Valley, NBN. 0:00:07.040 --> 0:00:11.559 This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde and Ed Ludlow. 0:00:25.480 --> 0:00:27.680 Live from New York and San Francisco. This is Bloomberg 0:00:27.680 --> 0:00:29.920 Technology coming up in video games to become the most 0:00:30.000 --> 0:00:32.479 valuable tech company. Amid plans to add it to the 0:00:32.560 --> 0:00:35.640 Dow Jones index, Intel will be removed from the one 0:00:35.720 --> 0:00:37.640 hundred and twenty year old XD benchmark. 0:00:38.360 --> 0:00:41.360 A day out from the US election, cyber officials fight 0:00:41.479 --> 0:00:44.720 to curb vote distrust and the risks of AI. 0:00:44.800 --> 0:00:48.200 Chap Watson minors. We speak to the lawyer suing character AI, 0:00:48.600 --> 0:00:51.400 claiming it's responsible for the death of a fourteen year old. 0:00:52.200 --> 0:00:56.520 But first we check in on markets on Edge ahead 0:00:56.520 --> 0:00:59.280 of the all important US election. Ed I shannelight on 0:00:59.320 --> 0:01:02.560 crypto coin because the Nasdaq is not doing very much, 0:01:02.600 --> 0:01:04.760 bitcoined off by sevent tens percent, many feeling this is 0:01:04.800 --> 0:01:07.039 a proxy, of course, for the Trump trade. We're at 0:01:07.080 --> 0:01:09.120 sixty eight thousand, six hundred and seventeen. 0:01:09.560 --> 0:01:10.360 What are you watching? 0:01:11.240 --> 0:01:13.560 Yeah, there's a few news items out there. One you 0:01:13.600 --> 0:01:16.200 already mentioned right in video being added to the Dow 0:01:16.360 --> 0:01:19.720 Jones at Intel's expense, and that is driving the name 0:01:19.840 --> 0:01:22.280 higher one point seven percent in the session, and as 0:01:22.319 --> 0:01:24.760 you point out, at this moment in time, it is 0:01:24.880 --> 0:01:28.039 leapfrogged above Apple in terms of market cap or value. 0:01:28.040 --> 0:01:29.720 I think we'll talk a bit more about that in 0:01:29.760 --> 0:01:32.240 the show with a very nice chart also looking at 0:01:32.240 --> 0:01:34.759 Tesla down four tenths of a percent. It had been 0:01:34.840 --> 0:01:39.160 down more significantly than that data from China shipments slipping 0:01:39.160 --> 0:01:42.040 in the month of October. But I wonder how much 0:01:42.120 --> 0:01:44.199 this name Coro will be at the center of the election. 0:01:44.280 --> 0:01:47.200 And again throughout the hour, we should probably talk about that. 0:01:47.680 --> 0:01:49.240 We're going to talk about the election. 0:01:49.480 --> 0:01:52.960 It is centerfold here presidential candidate's Donald Trump Kamala Harris 0:01:53.240 --> 0:01:56.160 making their final appeals to voters before election day tomorrow, 0:01:56.280 --> 0:01:58.960 both campaigns targeting critical swing states. 0:01:59.000 --> 0:01:59.800 As a flurry of. 0:01:59.720 --> 0:02:03.200 Poll project very tight race from all bluegs KDE line. 0:02:03.200 --> 0:02:05.040 Some piece to say is right here in New York 0:02:05.080 --> 0:02:07.440 for US and the latest poll that you've gone an 0:02:07.480 --> 0:02:08.679 ie on, well. 0:02:08.480 --> 0:02:09.359 There's a number of them. 0:02:09.400 --> 0:02:11.639 One of the polls that is really the marque pole 0:02:11.639 --> 0:02:13.519 for the swing states, the New York Times Siena poll 0:02:13.600 --> 0:02:15.520 came out over the weekend and shows no surprise that 0:02:15.560 --> 0:02:17.960 this thing is a dead heat. While there's marginal leads 0:02:18.000 --> 0:02:21.280 for Harris in a trio of states Nevada, North Carolina, Wisconsin, 0:02:21.280 --> 0:02:24.600 Trump leading in Arizona, them effectively tied in the remaining three, 0:02:24.639 --> 0:02:26.360 all of that is within the margin of error, So 0:02:26.360 --> 0:02:28.680 this race is just too close to Callwood Perhaps is 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:31.160 most telling though about that poll is that among the 0:02:31.200 --> 0:02:33.560 eight percent of voters in these battleground states that said 0:02:33.600 --> 0:02:36.600 they only recently decided who they were voting for, those 0:02:36.680 --> 0:02:39.800 broke to Harris by eleven points, fifty five to forty 0:02:39.800 --> 0:02:42.519 four percent. So as we consider the very small basket 0:02:42.600 --> 0:02:45.040 of undecided voters ahead of election day tomorrow, it does 0:02:45.080 --> 0:02:47.600 suggest that some of those late breakers are more in 0:02:47.760 --> 0:02:49.440 her favor. The other thing I would just note, as 0:02:49.480 --> 0:02:52.600 we consider how late this is breaking, more than seventy 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:55.440 eight million people have already voted in this election. That 0:02:55.520 --> 0:02:57.560 is more than half of all of the electorate who 0:02:57.639 --> 0:02:59.680 voted in twenty twenty. And when you look at some 0:02:59.680 --> 0:03:03.119 of these battleground states, North Carolina and Georgia have each 0:03:03.160 --> 0:03:06.040 had more than four million people vote already, that's eighty 0:03:06.080 --> 0:03:08.840 percent of what the total electorate was in twenty twenty, 0:03:08.880 --> 0:03:12.280 so it does suggest that turnout is quite high. 0:03:12.320 --> 0:03:15.280 That's important data throughout the course of this election. True 0:03:15.320 --> 0:03:18.320 to the show's name, we focused on technology policy. Yeah, 0:03:18.360 --> 0:03:20.680 but we should probably note that both candidates are out 0:03:20.680 --> 0:03:23.560 on the road and over the weekend you continue to 0:03:23.600 --> 0:03:27.079 make their message to the voting base. What did the 0:03:27.120 --> 0:03:30.000 weekend look like and where are Harris and Trump as 0:03:30.040 --> 0:03:30.480 we speak? 0:03:30.919 --> 0:03:33.160 Well, Trump is in North Carolina to start his day. 0:03:33.200 --> 0:03:35.760 Harris will be spending basically all of her day crisscrossing 0:03:35.760 --> 0:03:38.000 the swing state of Pennsylvania, where Trump will also be 0:03:38.000 --> 0:03:40.040 spending time before the day is out, before ending his 0:03:40.160 --> 0:03:43.240 day in Michigan. No surprise to see them centering their 0:03:43.280 --> 0:03:46.680 concentration in the battlegrounds. I would point out that over 0:03:46.720 --> 0:03:49.040 the weekend we did see a number of attention grabbing 0:03:49.080 --> 0:03:52.600 headlines generating from Donald Trump and his campaign suggestions that 0:03:52.640 --> 0:03:55.040 he doesn't think he should have ever left the White 0:03:55.040 --> 0:03:58.160 House what was seen as a threat to the presses. 0:03:58.200 --> 0:04:00.600 He suggested a shooter could shoot through what he called 0:04:01.080 --> 0:04:04.600 the fake news, while Kamala Harris yesterday, when speaking in Michigan, 0:04:04.600 --> 0:04:06.320 didn't mention Trump by name at all, which is a 0:04:06.320 --> 0:04:08.360 bit of a change to her final closing argument. We 0:04:08.400 --> 0:04:10.960 have seen as she takes that as he does to 0:04:10.960 --> 0:04:12.960 the battleground states. I would point out we also got 0:04:13.000 --> 0:04:15.360 an additional poll that is not in a state that 0:04:15.560 --> 0:04:18.000 was thought to be a battleground this cycle because Donald 0:04:18.040 --> 0:04:20.600 Trump easily won it in twenty twenty and twenty sixteen, 0:04:21.040 --> 0:04:23.280 that is Iowa. But the new des Moin Register poll 0:04:23.320 --> 0:04:25.920 that came out over the weekend actually showed Harris up 0:04:25.960 --> 0:04:28.839 three points in Iowa, forty seven to forty four percent 0:04:29.200 --> 0:04:31.240 for Trump. And what was most telling, because this is 0:04:31.279 --> 0:04:33.800 seen as an outlier, is what the demographics in that 0:04:33.800 --> 0:04:36.760 poll actually looked like. Harris leading with women by a 0:04:36.800 --> 0:04:40.440 margin of twenty points, and more specifically, senior women support 0:04:40.440 --> 0:04:42.920 her by a margin of two to one, sixty three 0:04:42.960 --> 0:04:46.080 percent to just twenty eight percent who support Donald Trump. 0:04:46.160 --> 0:04:49.919 So that voters sixty five and older favoring Harris is 0:04:49.960 --> 0:04:51.760 really important to note as that is one of the 0:04:51.880 --> 0:04:55.479 highest propensity groups of voters more likely to actually show 0:04:55.560 --> 0:04:57.240 up and vote on election day, and as we know, 0:04:57.279 --> 0:04:59.279 this election is going to be all about turnout, So 0:04:59.320 --> 0:05:00.040 statistics like. 0:05:00.040 --> 0:05:04.080 That or keep Kaylee Elon Musk is playing a role 0:05:04.080 --> 0:05:06.720 in this election. In the last two hours in Pennsylvania, 0:05:06.760 --> 0:05:09.919 there's been a hearing about his one million dollar sweep 0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:13.960 stakes for registered voters. What's the latest there and any 0:05:14.040 --> 0:05:15.080 impact that it's having. 0:05:15.839 --> 0:05:18.400 Well as we consider the sweep takes itself, which of course, 0:05:18.480 --> 0:05:21.239 is is in legal jeopardy or has at least brought 0:05:21.240 --> 0:05:24.640 this lawsuit because the Philadelphia District Attorney is contending that 0:05:24.680 --> 0:05:27.640 it violates election law because you can't actually pay anyone 0:05:27.640 --> 0:05:29.640 to vote or register to vote. So this idea that 0:05:29.680 --> 0:05:32.520 it's limited to registered voters is what has caused this 0:05:32.600 --> 0:05:34.440 legal issue. I would point out the hearing today is 0:05:34.520 --> 0:05:37.039 back in state court. Despite America pack which is the 0:05:37.040 --> 0:05:39.679 group that is running this back by Elon Musk's effort 0:05:39.720 --> 0:05:41.479 to move it to federal court that was denied by 0:05:41.520 --> 0:05:43.280 a judge. So it is now back in the hands 0:05:43.520 --> 0:05:45.359 of the state. It's unclear if this will all be 0:05:45.440 --> 0:05:48.480 resolved in time considering election day as tomorrow that is 0:05:48.520 --> 0:05:51.880 the day the sweepstakes was set to end. But obviously 0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:54.479 it puts a spotlight on the money and influence Elon 0:05:54.560 --> 0:05:57.800 Musk has had for Donald Trump in this campaign. He's donated, 0:05:57.839 --> 0:06:00.360 of course, tens of millions of dollars to the group, 0:06:00.400 --> 0:06:03.320 which is also organizing part of Donald Trump's ground game. 0:06:03.400 --> 0:06:05.320 Keep in mind Trump's campaign. 0:06:04.920 --> 0:06:06.640 Has outsourced a lot of that get out the vote 0:06:06.640 --> 0:06:09.800 effort in this cycle. Elon Musk's group has paid a 0:06:09.800 --> 0:06:12.080 massive role in that, and it'll be interesting to see 0:06:12.120 --> 0:06:15.120 how when the final results are in, we decide whether 0:06:15.160 --> 0:06:17.320 or not that was a strategy that worked for him. 0:06:17.320 --> 0:06:20.359 At Trump ling those Kadie lines at the start of 0:06:20.400 --> 0:06:22.920 a critically important week, Thank you very much. Let's get 0:06:22.920 --> 0:06:27.480 the market's perspective and bringing Nancy Tengler of Lafetengla Investments 0:06:27.480 --> 0:06:29.400 and Nancy, I do want to start with Tesla as 0:06:29.440 --> 0:06:33.560 a case study if Donald Trump were to claim a 0:06:33.640 --> 0:06:36.400 second term in the White House. The idea is that 0:06:36.400 --> 0:06:39.160 Elon Musk takes on some sort of role in the 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:43.719 Department of Government Efficiency. You're a Tesla investor, right, how 0:06:43.880 --> 0:06:48.120 do you prepare for either scenario with the name like 0:06:48.160 --> 0:06:49.360 Tesla in the center of it. 0:06:50.640 --> 0:06:54.000 Well, you know, the rhetoric is hard to parse through 0:06:54.040 --> 0:06:57.560 because we hear, you know, tariffs, we hear cost cutting 0:06:57.640 --> 0:07:01.880 up two trillion just that side of the aisle, and 0:07:01.960 --> 0:07:04.200 yet we have no idea what's really going to happen. 0:07:04.360 --> 0:07:07.200 So I think what Elon has been able to do 0:07:07.240 --> 0:07:11.760 pretty effectively is run multiple companies and do it pretty well. 0:07:11.920 --> 0:07:15.000 So as a Tesla investor, I'm not alarmed at this point. 0:07:15.080 --> 0:07:17.520 I think you sit back. You know, we've talked in 0:07:17.560 --> 0:07:20.480 the past about the Mega pac business. That was the 0:07:20.560 --> 0:07:24.119 fastest growing business and it is the most profitable. That's 0:07:24.160 --> 0:07:26.560 the utility grade battery storage. 0:07:26.640 --> 0:07:28.680 So while EVS may come under some. 0:07:28.800 --> 0:07:30.520 Pressure, I think you're going to see other parts of 0:07:30.560 --> 0:07:34.440 his business benefit. And also, I think everyone ultimately acts 0:07:34.480 --> 0:07:37.800 in their own best interest, and that includes Donald Trump 0:07:37.880 --> 0:07:41.360 and Elon Musk, So if this election goes in that direction, 0:07:41.800 --> 0:07:43.040 I think they'll figure it out. 0:07:43.840 --> 0:07:46.680 Nancy, what everyone is going to wonder about is the 0:07:46.720 --> 0:07:49.640 relationship with US and China going forward post this election. 0:07:50.280 --> 0:07:52.880 And we get that sort of case study with Tesla 0:07:52.920 --> 0:07:56.840 today with a Shanghai output in their manufacturing in China 0:07:56.880 --> 0:07:59.040 and just not living up to the expectations and many 0:07:59.040 --> 0:08:01.960 warring that they're going to hit that full year record 0:08:02.000 --> 0:08:05.240 amount of deliveries for twenty twenty four. What did you 0:08:05.280 --> 0:08:08.160 make of the data coming out of Tessa's manufacturing in China. 0:08:09.320 --> 0:08:10.680 Yeah, I mean, I think that was a bit of 0:08:10.680 --> 0:08:13.080 a disappointment. The stock doesn't seem to be under a 0:08:13.120 --> 0:08:16.720 lot of pressure, but I think we've also seen over 0:08:16.800 --> 0:08:22.240 time these fits and starts historically with not hitting numbers, 0:08:22.360 --> 0:08:26.080 not hitting deliveries, even in the US. So I haven't 0:08:26.080 --> 0:08:28.360 had a chance to really dig into it, Caroline. We will, 0:08:29.040 --> 0:08:31.920 But the stock is trading as though everything is going 0:08:31.960 --> 0:08:33.679 to go perfectly. I mean, I think it's trading at 0:08:33.679 --> 0:08:36.160 a peg of price earnings to growth ratio of about 0:08:36.160 --> 0:08:40.280 forty times, and so we do need earnings, and we 0:08:40.320 --> 0:08:43.599 do need earnings growth, and we did get margins expanding. 0:08:43.679 --> 0:08:46.120 I didn't think the report was that great, but I 0:08:46.120 --> 0:08:48.040 think it was a relief rally in the stock, and 0:08:48.080 --> 0:08:50.480 so we'll see what happens, Nancy. 0:08:50.559 --> 0:08:52.760 I promise there is much more we need to discuss. 0:08:52.840 --> 0:08:55.760 But our colleagues at Bloomberg Intelligence put out some basic 0:08:55.840 --> 0:09:00.160 research this morning that if Trump is to win, it's 0:09:00.320 --> 0:09:04.199 likely will impact the scope of the IRAV tax credits. 0:09:04.480 --> 0:09:05.360 Do you model for that? 0:09:07.200 --> 0:09:10.440 We will if it happens, I think. I think one 0:09:10.480 --> 0:09:11.240 of the things you have. 0:09:11.160 --> 0:09:14.040 To remember, though, is it's very difficult to a lot 0:09:14.040 --> 0:09:16.960 of these analyzes are done in a static environment and 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:20.280 it's very difficult once the new administration, whoever they are, 0:09:20.360 --> 0:09:23.840 comes in to go back and make adjustments to bills 0:09:23.840 --> 0:09:26.240 that have already been passed. And we saw that when 0:09:26.240 --> 0:09:31.160 the Republicans swept in twenty sixteen, they promised to fix 0:09:31.280 --> 0:09:34.160 or do away with Obamacare and they did nothing. So 0:09:34.640 --> 0:09:38.360 I don't necessarily think that that's a big threat. 0:09:38.080 --> 0:09:40.160 To the stock price, but we are aware of it, 0:09:40.200 --> 0:09:41.320 and we are looking at. 0:09:41.160 --> 0:09:44.680 It talking about things that are in flux and not static. 0:09:44.920 --> 0:09:48.520 Market capitalizations of US today, it looks like if Nvidia 0:09:48.600 --> 0:09:52.680 holds at these levels, it will be more than Apple 0:09:52.720 --> 0:09:56.000 in terms of worth three point three four three six 0:09:56.080 --> 0:09:59.560 trillion dollars. As Apple slips on the day, what do 0:09:59.600 --> 0:10:00.720 you make of and video being. 0:10:00.640 --> 0:10:01.440 Added to the Dow? 0:10:01.640 --> 0:10:04.880 What do you make of it when crucially also who 0:10:04.920 --> 0:10:07.320 comes out of it, and of what was happening Intel? 0:10:08.800 --> 0:10:12.080 Well, sadly, Caroline, I remember when Intel was added to 0:10:12.120 --> 0:10:15.880 the Dow in nineteen ninety nine, and talk about bad timing, which, 0:10:15.880 --> 0:10:19.600 by the way, this committee that makes the selections often 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:22.680 does not necessarily time these things very well. 0:10:23.320 --> 0:10:26.040 Intel is down cumulatively. 0:10:25.320 --> 0:10:28.000 Since nineteen ninety end of nineteen ninety nine, three and 0:10:28.040 --> 0:10:31.160 a half percent. So this is a company that has 0:10:31.200 --> 0:10:36.280 has not pivoted to new technologies, has squandered innovation, and 0:10:36.360 --> 0:10:38.600 so we've been out of the stock for quite some time. 0:10:39.640 --> 0:10:41.839 Think of Xerox who developed. 0:10:41.520 --> 0:10:44.319 The mouse but didn't commercialize it. Who commercialized it, Apple 0:10:44.360 --> 0:10:47.000 and Microsoft. So I think Nvidia has stepped in the 0:10:47.040 --> 0:10:51.040 wings or has stepped onto the stage, and Intel is 0:10:51.040 --> 0:10:53.000 fading to the wings. That doesn't mean the company will 0:10:53.000 --> 0:10:55.040 go out of business, but I mean we've seen recently 0:10:55.080 --> 0:10:58.599 it's in fact a takeover target. So I think you 0:10:58.760 --> 0:11:01.240 want to be long in video here. The earnings growth 0:11:01.320 --> 0:11:04.840 is remarkable, and again on a price earnings to growth basis, 0:11:05.000 --> 0:11:07.079 which is really how you have to look at this stock. 0:11:07.320 --> 0:11:10.600 It's trading at one point one times versus as I mentioned, 0:11:10.679 --> 0:11:13.280 Tesla over forty and Microsoft. 0:11:12.840 --> 0:11:15.400 At two point two times. So I think it was 0:11:15.440 --> 0:11:17.360 a good ad. I don't know about the timing. 0:11:17.400 --> 0:11:19.160 We'll see, but I do think we're early in the 0:11:19.240 --> 0:11:22.480 runway and of generative AI and computing. 0:11:22.640 --> 0:11:23.719 I'll just say one last thing. 0:11:23.960 --> 0:11:26.160 I loved the story Larry Elson told about him and 0:11:26.200 --> 0:11:28.960 Elon Musk going to dinner with Jensen and just saying, 0:11:29.200 --> 0:11:31.520 please take our money, please take more of it. 0:11:31.640 --> 0:11:34.479 We please give us more GPUs. 0:11:34.520 --> 0:11:37.760 So I think the backlog in Blackwell's pretty significant and 0:11:38.080 --> 0:11:40.880 ambidious poise to do very well in the coming years. 0:11:41.280 --> 0:11:43.560 We always love you bringing the story and indeed the 0:11:43.600 --> 0:11:46.599 way to invest around it. And that's Leffetango Investments. 0:11:46.960 --> 0:11:47.240 Thank you. 0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:51.520 Coming up warnings on voting confidence. Why the Director of 0:11:51.559 --> 0:11:55.880 the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency says we may have 0:11:55.920 --> 0:12:00.079 to wait before final election results. This is what my technology. 0:12:09.679 --> 0:12:13.080 As the US election looms, the director of the Cybersecurity 0:12:13.120 --> 0:12:18.640 and Infrastructure Security Agency warns of potential threats to voting confidence, 0:12:19.120 --> 0:12:22.319 urging the public to ready themselves for a potential waiting 0:12:22.400 --> 0:12:25.160 game before results could be finalized. Let's go out to 0:12:25.200 --> 0:12:28.240 Bloomberg's Jamie Tarra Bay and we'll get to the role 0:12:28.320 --> 0:12:31.000 Jenniesli and all of this. But let's help our audience 0:12:31.080 --> 0:12:35.120 understand what is the problem here or the instruction that 0:12:35.240 --> 0:12:37.640 officials are asking the electorate to brace. 0:12:37.360 --> 0:12:40.040 For right now? 0:12:40.160 --> 0:12:42.320 I think the question and that what they really are 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:46.000 trying to tell everyone is trust the process, the election 0:12:46.120 --> 0:12:49.480 system and all of the networks are secure and resilient, 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:53.120 and the idea of you're a vote being hacked or 0:12:53.160 --> 0:12:55.960 being rigged or taken away from you is a fallacy, 0:12:56.320 --> 0:12:58.480 and they have spent the better part of the last 0:12:58.559 --> 0:13:02.520 year preparing to refute those claims and push back against 0:13:02.640 --> 0:13:06.079 any question of the integrity of the election system. 0:13:06.679 --> 0:13:10.920 What's interesting is about who leads SISSA and how it's 0:13:10.960 --> 0:13:13.679 become sort of a personalized agency as well. 0:13:13.720 --> 0:13:16.160 In many ways, that's right. 0:13:16.240 --> 0:13:19.360 Jenny Silly has come on board as the head of SISSA, 0:13:19.440 --> 0:13:24.040 the Cybersecurity Infrastructural Security Agency, in twenty twenty one, and 0:13:24.120 --> 0:13:27.840 she has really sort of centralized the focus of the 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:30.880 agency on her herself. She's a West Point graduate. She's 0:13:30.920 --> 0:13:33.560 done tours in Iraq and Afghanistan. One thing that I 0:13:33.600 --> 0:13:35.720 didn't really know about about her is that she can 0:13:35.760 --> 0:13:38.240 actually solve a Rubik's cube behind her back, which I 0:13:38.240 --> 0:13:41.520 thought was very interesting. But she has literally tried to 0:13:41.559 --> 0:13:44.320 make this I know, right, she's trying to make this 0:13:44.440 --> 0:13:49.800 a very personal effort because, as she's said, people trust people, 0:13:50.280 --> 0:13:53.600 and she's been very forward facing. She's been out, she 0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:57.960 goes to conferences, she's been speaking before Congress. Her whole 0:13:58.679 --> 0:14:02.440 sort of posture is transparency and candor, and she's doing 0:14:02.480 --> 0:14:06.040 everything she can to really build relationships not just with 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:08.960 the private sector, but also with public sector and with 0:14:09.040 --> 0:14:10.160 the public at large. 0:14:11.000 --> 0:14:13.320 Jamie, let's talk a little bit more about the threats themselves. 0:14:13.400 --> 0:14:14.880 You've come on the show, the team have come on 0:14:14.880 --> 0:14:18.240 the show and talked about literally voting technology in the 0:14:18.280 --> 0:14:23.800 cybersecurity contexts, threats online. Where is their most risk in 0:14:23.840 --> 0:14:25.040 this week of the election. 0:14:26.880 --> 0:14:29.880 I think one of the real big challenges that not 0:14:30.160 --> 0:14:33.000 just folks like Jennie Stily have been facing, but state 0:14:33.040 --> 0:14:36.480 election officials, local election officials have been dealing with, is 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:39.800 really where people are getting their information from, how they 0:14:39.800 --> 0:14:43.720 are verifying their relation that information, and the question of 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:46.720 whether people will see something through social media and actually 0:14:46.760 --> 0:14:48.960 believe it, and really it's got to be a. 0:14:49.000 --> 0:14:50.200 Question of trust. 0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:53.520 But verify and look at where look at what your 0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:56.160 state election officials are saying, look at what they're doing, 0:14:56.760 --> 0:14:59.440 and it's going to come from everywhere, and it's already 0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:02.680 we're already seeing it. It's online, it's on x it's 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:05.680 on TikTok, it's on YouTube, it's on all of your 0:15:05.680 --> 0:15:08.360 social media platforms, which, by the way, has taken a 0:15:08.400 --> 0:15:11.480 bit of a backward step in terms of mediating and 0:15:11.520 --> 0:15:17.160 being more involved in sort of political transparency. So just 0:15:17.200 --> 0:15:21.680 being able to trust those institutions themselves is harder these days. 0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:24.160 But it really becomes a question that if you see 0:15:24.160 --> 0:15:28.520 something online that doesn't look right, ask look, try to 0:15:28.560 --> 0:15:31.280 find out go to your state election official website and 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:34.160 see what they're saying, particularly when it comes to the 0:15:34.280 --> 0:15:38.800 voting process, and also the idea that the election is 0:15:38.880 --> 0:15:41.200 not going to be decided on the day, we may 0:15:41.200 --> 0:15:43.000 not have a result on the day. 0:15:43.440 --> 0:15:45.560 Hang tight and just. 0:15:45.560 --> 0:15:48.560 Don't let that overwhelm you have faith in the institutions 0:15:49.840 --> 0:15:50.200 to that. 0:15:50.240 --> 0:15:54.440 Point, many don't have faith in institutions, and that is 0:15:54.440 --> 0:15:57.960 interestingly why Easterly has made it so much about herself 0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:00.960 correct sort of the face to an agency that she 0:16:01.080 --> 0:16:03.760 doesn't have much bang, well, doesn't have much bark, but 0:16:03.800 --> 0:16:05.000 it's certainly trying to have more bang. 0:16:06.520 --> 0:16:10.280 Definitely, she's definitely done more in terms of being much 0:16:10.320 --> 0:16:13.520 more outward speaking, trying to push you know, you're right, 0:16:13.560 --> 0:16:17.360 it's voluntary guidelines for a large part of industry. We've 0:16:17.360 --> 0:16:20.160 seen so many hacks and so many compromises of critical 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:24.000 infrastructure and it really is a question of what private 0:16:24.080 --> 0:16:27.760 sector can do, what organizations can do, and she's been 0:16:27.800 --> 0:16:31.600 really at the forefront of trying to get everyone on board, 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:34.960 and she's had some success there. But it really is 0:16:35.000 --> 0:16:37.840 a question of how much how much everyone will meet 0:16:37.880 --> 0:16:40.320 in the middle. But also, you know, I mean, she's 0:16:40.400 --> 0:16:42.640 just it's she's got a long way ahead of her. 0:16:42.960 --> 0:16:47.320 Everyone is not going to sort of you know, it's 0:16:47.360 --> 0:16:49.880 really going to be a question of sitting time and 0:16:49.920 --> 0:16:52.720 looking to see and trusting the results and waiting to 0:16:52.800 --> 0:16:55.400 see what these elections are not going to be decided 0:16:55.440 --> 0:16:57.520 in one day. It's going to take a long time 0:16:57.560 --> 0:16:59.840 for every single vote to be counted, but that's really 0:16:59.880 --> 0:17:02.520 the integrity of the process, for every single vote to 0:17:02.600 --> 0:17:03.240 be counted. 0:17:03.960 --> 0:17:06.160 Jamie Taabey, we thank you so much. 0:17:14.240 --> 0:17:17.280 In the world of social media, both x and Meta 0:17:17.359 --> 0:17:20.399 have indicated they went too far on content moderation back 0:17:20.440 --> 0:17:24.000 in twenty twenty. Now academics say all the elements are 0:17:24.040 --> 0:17:27.040 in place for abuse of those platforms despite efforts to 0:17:27.040 --> 0:17:30.840 suppress misinformation around this election. Let's discuss with Bloomberg's social 0:17:30.840 --> 0:17:35.200 media reporter Alexandro Levine, who has some really interesting perspectives 0:17:35.240 --> 0:17:39.040 on how the landscape has changed from twenty twenty four 0:17:39.240 --> 0:17:40.719 versus twenty twenty, how has it. 0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:44.000 I say the biggest changes have really occurred across three 0:17:44.000 --> 0:17:49.320 main platforms, being Meta, Twitter, now, X, and TikTok. So 0:17:49.440 --> 0:17:52.119 just to start for X, back in twenty twenty, it 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:55.640 was still really the center of the political universe. 0:17:55.760 --> 0:17:57.600 It was the online. 0:17:57.040 --> 0:18:00.480 Political capital, the digital water cooler, if you will, where 0:18:00.560 --> 0:18:03.840 journalists always were spending their time, where political figures public 0:18:03.880 --> 0:18:06.640 figures were spending their time, and really a primary destination 0:18:06.680 --> 0:18:09.240 for funding news. When Elon Musk took over a couple 0:18:09.240 --> 0:18:11.480 of years ago, I think a lot of that really changed. 0:18:11.880 --> 0:18:13.960 And in addition to him deciding that he did not 0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:16.200 want to build off a lot of the election integrity 0:18:16.240 --> 0:18:19.040 work and safeguards that hadn't been built by Twitter for 0:18:19.200 --> 0:18:21.600 twenty twenty and also for twenty sixteen and even earlier 0:18:21.640 --> 0:18:24.000 than that, Elon Musk has also really been using the 0:18:24.040 --> 0:18:28.359 platform to rally support for Republican candidate Donald Trump, and 0:18:28.400 --> 0:18:30.440 so that has completely changed the nature of the platform 0:18:30.480 --> 0:18:33.800 for many people. The second being Meta, Meta really saw 0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:37.560 its role. Mark Zuckerberg saw Meta's role in previous elections 0:18:37.600 --> 0:18:41.920 as really being proactive and really being proactive in allowing discourse, 0:18:41.960 --> 0:18:45.160 but also protecting it and being very forward thinking about 0:18:45.240 --> 0:18:49.920 labeling and trying to really fight proactively missin disinformation around 0:18:49.920 --> 0:18:52.600 the election. Now Meta is actually doing really a hard 0:18:52.600 --> 0:18:56.080 one to eighty. They are moving away from promoting political 0:18:56.080 --> 0:18:59.080 content altogether. They are really now favoring posts that don't 0:18:59.119 --> 0:19:01.159 have anything to do with pout. So when I was 0:19:01.200 --> 0:19:03.600 on my Instagram feed this morning, I actually saw nothing 0:19:03.600 --> 0:19:06.200 related to the election. And then the third big piece 0:19:06.200 --> 0:19:09.080 of this that is totally different from where we were 0:19:09.080 --> 0:19:12.200 at in twenty twenty is was TikTok. TikTok was around 0:19:12.240 --> 0:19:14.480 during the last election, but it was nowhere near as 0:19:14.520 --> 0:19:17.760 big and as powerful as it is today. Now we're 0:19:18.000 --> 0:19:21.119 you know, roughly twice the size. TikTok is roughly twice 0:19:21.119 --> 0:19:23.320 the size in the US today. 0:19:23.080 --> 0:19:25.280 That it was, you know, in twenty twenty. 0:19:25.280 --> 0:19:27.399 There's more than one hundred and seventy million users, and 0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:29.200 I think that a lot of the political discourse has 0:19:29.240 --> 0:19:30.120 really moved over there. 0:19:30.920 --> 0:19:33.480 You know, it's strangely to say, it feels like yesterday, 0:19:33.520 --> 0:19:36.080 the twenty twenty election cycle, and how often on this 0:19:36.160 --> 0:19:41.480 program we were covering misinformation that names themselves. But it's 0:19:41.480 --> 0:19:43.879 a different time. Is there anything that's sort of specific 0:19:44.040 --> 0:19:47.880 or unique to this election cycle, Alexandra, that you've been 0:19:47.920 --> 0:19:49.600 focused on in that Business Week piece. 0:19:50.280 --> 0:19:52.400 Yeah, well, I think miss in disinformation to your point, 0:19:52.440 --> 0:19:54.760 it's been talked about now for a lot longer, Like 0:19:54.800 --> 0:19:56.720 people are much more savvy about it than they were, 0:19:56.960 --> 0:20:00.119 both people consuming misindisinformation and also the social media comp 0:20:00.160 --> 0:20:02.160 and He's trying to handle it, and also the journalists 0:20:02.200 --> 0:20:03.840 and researchers trying to understand it. 0:20:04.160 --> 0:20:06.000 I think what's different is just the role. 0:20:05.920 --> 0:20:09.160 That the platforms are choosing to take this time, and 0:20:09.200 --> 0:20:12.119 also our ability as the public to be able to 0:20:12.600 --> 0:20:14.760 understand what we are seeing, where it is coming from, 0:20:14.840 --> 0:20:17.879 and who's behind it. Both Twitter and Meta as I 0:20:17.960 --> 0:20:19.959 just said, they are taking a much more hands off 0:20:19.960 --> 0:20:23.639 approach this time to the election. Both Mark Zuckerberg and 0:20:23.680 --> 0:20:27.320 Elon Musk have slashed members of the teams that were 0:20:27.359 --> 0:20:30.120 responsible for protecting the election, the Election Integrity and Trust 0:20:30.160 --> 0:20:33.440 in Safety teams. And then on top of that, our 0:20:33.520 --> 0:20:36.800 ability to actually understand what is trending on the platforms 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:40.359 has gotten worse so in the last year, last couple 0:20:40.359 --> 0:20:44.200 of years, Elon Musk, for example, has turned has made it. 0:20:44.160 --> 0:20:46.240 A lot harder for folks who. 0:20:46.080 --> 0:20:49.240 Previously had to access, like researchers to all of the 0:20:49.240 --> 0:20:52.520 analytics that shows what is trending on Twitter. He's made 0:20:52.520 --> 0:20:54.679 it much much more expensive for most research to be 0:20:54.680 --> 0:20:56.080 able to researchers to be able. 0:20:55.960 --> 0:20:56.560 To access that. 0:20:56.960 --> 0:21:00.320 Earlier this year, Meta shut down crowd Tangle, which has 0:21:00.400 --> 0:21:03.360 basically made it harder for misinformation research just to track 0:21:03.359 --> 0:21:04.600 what's going on the platform. 0:21:04.640 --> 0:21:06.560 And last but not least, TikTok. 0:21:06.800 --> 0:21:12.040 Just earlier this year as well removed video, sorry video 0:21:12.040 --> 0:21:14.159 of view acounts on viral hashtags on the platform, so 0:21:14.160 --> 0:21:16.399 you can no longer look at a hashtag and know 0:21:16.480 --> 0:21:18.600 how many people around the world are looking at it 0:21:18.640 --> 0:21:21.760 at one time. And I think, on top of that, 0:21:21.840 --> 0:21:24.480 because so much of the conversation that floy twenty was 0:21:25.000 --> 0:21:28.000 fixated on just a couple of main platforms, being Facebook, Twitter, 0:21:28.040 --> 0:21:31.040 and YouTube, now you've got everything happening on TikTok, on 0:21:31.119 --> 0:21:33.760 truth Social Trump's platform, and on many small or less 0:21:33.800 --> 0:21:36.240 moderated forms as well, just creating a lot more of 0:21:36.280 --> 0:21:40.040 a chaotic atmosphere where all of this missing disinformation that 0:21:40.080 --> 0:21:42.440 people have grown more accustomed to is just becoming harder 0:21:42.480 --> 0:21:44.159 to understand, it harder to track. 0:21:44.600 --> 0:21:47.119 Blim begs Alexandra Levine, who's worked with the team on 0:21:47.160 --> 0:21:49.399 this in an upcoming business sweep piece, thank you very 0:21:49.520 --> 0:22:01.040 much for doing coming out important Reportingcome back to Bluemotechnology. 0:22:01.040 --> 0:22:02.399 I'm Karen Hyde and New York. 0:22:02.880 --> 0:22:05.600 Named Ludlow in San Francisco. It is November fourth or 0:22:05.600 --> 0:22:08.600 November fifth. We have a US election, and when you 0:22:08.600 --> 0:22:10.960 look at markets, particularly in the context of tech and 0:22:11.040 --> 0:22:15.240 then index level, we're treading water, not really having any direction. 0:22:16.080 --> 0:22:18.640 It's a dead heat. We've talked about that throughout the program. 0:22:18.800 --> 0:22:20.600 But what I find so fascinating carriage if you look 0:22:20.600 --> 0:22:24.280 at single names or specific examples. That's also reflected. Right, 0:22:24.320 --> 0:22:28.879 we just talked about social media policy on misinformation sharing 0:22:28.920 --> 0:22:32.800 election related content. Well, Meta is completely flat in the 0:22:32.840 --> 0:22:36.000 session this Monday. Snap is down one point seven percent, 0:22:36.040 --> 0:22:38.760 but remember it rallied hard last week on earnings, and 0:22:38.800 --> 0:22:42.480 then there's the Trump trade DJT, the parent company, a 0:22:42.520 --> 0:22:45.879 true social modestly higher three tenths of one percent, but 0:22:46.000 --> 0:22:48.040 not the sort of big move in either direction that 0:22:48.080 --> 0:22:51.320 we've seen as a barometer maybe of sentiment in the 0:22:51.400 --> 0:22:54.480 markets that any outcome. It's a dead heat. Keep saying it, 0:22:54.480 --> 0:22:56.359 but I think there's a lot to discuss for both 0:22:56.400 --> 0:22:57.920 campaigns throughout the rest of the show. 0:22:58.200 --> 0:23:00.119 There is, we'll get to it, but first up in 0:23:00.160 --> 0:23:02.159 his time now for Talking Tech, and we're going to 0:23:02.200 --> 0:23:05.200 discuss the EU regulators saying that they'll review an Apple 0:23:05.400 --> 0:23:08.840 report showing that its iPad operating system now complies to 0:23:08.880 --> 0:23:11.840 the Digital Markets Act. According to the Act, Apple must 0:23:11.880 --> 0:23:14.760 allow users to set a default web browser of their choice, 0:23:14.880 --> 0:23:18.760 allow alternate app stores on its operating system, and allow 0:23:18.840 --> 0:23:21.960 accessories to access iPad os features. 0:23:22.760 --> 0:23:23.119 Plus. 0:23:23.160 --> 0:23:25.919 In a surprise move, Schneider Electric has outsaid its CEO 0:23:26.040 --> 0:23:29.520 Peter Herwork after only a year and a half in 0:23:29.560 --> 0:23:32.479 the role. Now Herk will be replaced with group veteran 0:23:32.480 --> 0:23:36.120 Olivier Bloom, effective immediately. In the company's statement, Schneider, which 0:23:36.119 --> 0:23:39.600 has focused a lot on AI energy management, cites disagreements 0:23:39.640 --> 0:23:42.119 with the board over the strategic direction for the ouster 0:23:43.160 --> 0:23:45.680 and in ol Musk was dealt a setback in court. 0:23:45.720 --> 0:23:48.480 A judge ruled late Friday that former Twitter CEO parag 0:23:48.520 --> 0:23:50.400 Agrowl and other high ranking. 0:23:50.080 --> 0:23:51.920 Officers could proceed. 0:23:51.520 --> 0:23:54.240 With claims that must terminate them as he closed the 0:23:54.280 --> 0:23:57.359 buyout deal, cheating them out of severance pay before they 0:23:57.400 --> 0:23:59.560 could submit regasignations. 0:24:00.000 --> 0:24:01.480 A little bit more on in a Musk. 0:24:01.240 --> 0:24:04.080 Now, and yeah, let's stay with Elon Musk's recent pro 0:24:04.160 --> 0:24:08.439 Trump packed sweepstakes have been undiscrutinated amid a heated election 0:24:08.600 --> 0:24:12.359 season and are now being contested in court. Bloomberg's Tony Aaron's, 0:24:12.359 --> 0:24:15.240 a legal editor, joins us. Now, we're talking about legal 0:24:15.280 --> 0:24:19.080 proceedings happening in Pennsylvania playing out in the last two 0:24:19.119 --> 0:24:21.040 hours or so. What's the latest, Tony, Oh. 0:24:21.000 --> 0:24:21.800 The hearings there. 0:24:22.160 --> 0:24:24.720 The judge indicated he's not going to rule, probably before noon, 0:24:24.760 --> 0:24:26.159 so it's going to be a little while until we 0:24:26.240 --> 0:24:29.720 know what's going to happen. The question is how significant 0:24:29.760 --> 0:24:32.840 the ruling's going to be. Today's the last day that 0:24:32.880 --> 0:24:35.639 he was going to have the sweepstakes, And even if 0:24:35.680 --> 0:24:38.200 the judge stops it, that's one payment and it'll probably 0:24:38.240 --> 0:24:39.920 go ahead and the other sweep stakes. So the only 0:24:39.960 --> 0:24:42.520 thing that will probably happen is one person from Pennsylvania 0:24:42.520 --> 0:24:43.800 won't be able to get a million dollars. 0:24:44.359 --> 0:24:48.080 What is the legal elements to this? What is so 0:24:48.240 --> 0:24:48.840 taught around it? 0:24:48.840 --> 0:24:51.520 Well, but when people were talking about the federal issues, 0:24:51.560 --> 0:24:55.480 it was whether Elon Musk was buying voters and that's 0:24:55.480 --> 0:24:57.520 not what's going on in Pennsylvania, and Pennsylvania are doing 0:24:57.600 --> 0:25:01.040 two state laws. Which that's why it was thrown out 0:25:01.040 --> 0:25:03.560 of federal court because it's just about these two state issues. 0:25:03.840 --> 0:25:06.600 It's one is it a consumer protection issue? Is he 0:25:06.680 --> 0:25:10.679 taking advantage of consumers? And two is it an illegal lottery? 0:25:10.760 --> 0:25:12.480 There are certain there are a lot of rules about 0:25:12.480 --> 0:25:14.600 how you have a lottery and how you ensure it's 0:25:14.640 --> 0:25:18.480 really random. And that's what the Philadelphia District Attorney is saying, 0:25:18.880 --> 0:25:19.840 isn't happening here. 0:25:23.840 --> 0:25:27.200 Ed, I think we've taught a lot about that particular 0:25:27.200 --> 0:25:29.080 face that we've got plenty more on the election next though. 0:25:29.840 --> 0:25:32.800 Yeah, the election's fast approaching, and we have been speaking 0:25:32.840 --> 0:25:37.080 to voices in technology in venture capital on both sides 0:25:37.119 --> 0:25:39.080 of the race. I want to bring back to the 0:25:39.119 --> 0:25:43.080 show Shannon Nash, co founder of the Tech for Kamala Group, 0:25:43.119 --> 0:25:46.840 supporting the bid of Vice President Kamala Harris for president, 0:25:47.000 --> 0:25:50.160 and your support of Vice President Harris is well known. 0:25:50.440 --> 0:25:53.159 I wondered if we could move the conversation forward and 0:25:53.240 --> 0:25:54.960 all of the time that you've spent on the road 0:25:55.000 --> 0:25:58.359 with the campaign and with your peers in industry. Have 0:25:58.480 --> 0:26:02.120 you a firm or understanding of the Vice president's policy 0:26:02.160 --> 0:26:04.640 platform as it relates to the technology industry. 0:26:04.720 --> 0:26:06.680 Yeah, and you know, thanks for having me back. 0:26:06.720 --> 0:26:09.400 I think we've gotten a lot from Kamala Harris over 0:26:09.440 --> 0:26:11.560 the last it's only been two months, by the way. 0:26:11.880 --> 0:26:13.800 A lot of it has been a focus on just 0:26:13.960 --> 0:26:17.880 the approach on how she in that in her administration 0:26:18.200 --> 0:26:22.679 will be open and collaborative to technology, to innovation, to 0:26:22.760 --> 0:26:26.120 hearing different voices. You know, Look, there's lots of people 0:26:26.160 --> 0:26:28.280 who have done a lot of coverage on the big 0:26:28.320 --> 0:26:31.119 billionaires with the microphones, but not enough coverage on the 0:26:31.160 --> 0:26:34.840 seven million people who make up the fabric of tech 0:26:35.160 --> 0:26:38.600 and what their voices say and what they want to 0:26:39.119 --> 0:26:41.680 see in a new administration. And that's what she's been 0:26:41.760 --> 0:26:42.800 very open to listening to. 0:26:43.200 --> 0:26:46.159 I think people want specifics. So, for example, our colleagues 0:26:46.160 --> 0:26:48.960 at Bloomberg Intelligence, which is our in house research arm, 0:26:49.440 --> 0:26:52.600 say that if former President Trump reclaims the White House, 0:26:53.040 --> 0:26:59.640 the ira EV incentives will be impacted. Conversely, with Vice 0:26:59.640 --> 0:27:03.320 President Harris, they basically see continuity that nothing will change. 0:27:03.400 --> 0:27:06.280 But that's not in and of itself policy. It's just 0:27:06.359 --> 0:27:07.560 maintaining the status quo. 0:27:07.760 --> 0:27:10.520 It's that policy, and quite frankly, I think you have 0:27:10.560 --> 0:27:12.280 to look at things like let's go to climate tech, 0:27:12.280 --> 0:27:15.880 for example, and look at what her opponent has said 0:27:15.960 --> 0:27:18.680 about climate tech, and of course Project twenty twenty five 0:27:18.720 --> 0:27:20.920 has said about climate tech. One of my co founders 0:27:21.000 --> 0:27:24.119 is Julia Collins, who is the CEO of a climate 0:27:24.119 --> 0:27:27.359 tech company called Planet Forward, and we're very concerned about 0:27:27.359 --> 0:27:29.800 not climate tech just for it's good for the economy, 0:27:29.960 --> 0:27:32.359 but what it really spurs in terms of innovation and 0:27:32.400 --> 0:27:35.760 growth for our economy. Her opponent has said that they're 0:27:36.119 --> 0:27:40.159 willing to dismantle the EPA, FEMA, ETCA. Kamala Harris has 0:27:40.160 --> 0:27:43.080 come out and said, no, we're actually going to support 0:27:43.080 --> 0:27:46.119 climate tech. We're going to look at growing this industry. 0:27:46.320 --> 0:27:48.520 And so she has come out and actually been very 0:27:48.640 --> 0:27:52.080 vocal about certain areas in tech. For sure, I could 0:27:52.080 --> 0:27:54.119 also talk about AI. She's come out and talked about 0:27:54.119 --> 0:27:58.199 being very collaborative in terms of looking at how we 0:27:58.280 --> 0:28:02.560 approach AI regulation in a way to stifle competition, but 0:28:02.680 --> 0:28:04.760 a way to be ethical, in a way to be 0:28:04.840 --> 0:28:07.960 supportive of a very new technology that we're all just 0:28:08.000 --> 0:28:09.359 really trying to wrap our arms around. 0:28:09.440 --> 0:28:10.200 But let's just talk. 0:28:10.040 --> 0:28:12.640 About regulation for a moment and place. He went there, Shannon, 0:28:12.720 --> 0:28:16.200 because we had Vivik Ramaswami, of course, who is a 0:28:16.240 --> 0:28:18.480 supporter of Trump and the campaign there on the show 0:28:18.520 --> 0:28:21.200 on Friday, and his main focus is the fact that 0:28:21.280 --> 0:28:22.760 we need to reduce regulation. 0:28:22.880 --> 0:28:23.960 Just take a listen to what he said. 0:28:24.800 --> 0:28:27.160 Problem with Washington, DC is every time they pass one 0:28:27.160 --> 0:28:30.160 of these laws, the Inflation Reduction Act or the Chips Act, 0:28:30.359 --> 0:28:32.919 there's so much other baggage they sneak into there that 0:28:32.960 --> 0:28:35.240 it dilutes the original vision or purpose of the Act 0:28:35.240 --> 0:28:37.840 in the first place. You want to foster semiconductor production 0:28:37.880 --> 0:28:39.760 in the United States, as I do, Here's how we 0:28:39.800 --> 0:28:43.920 do it, mass deregulation that lifts those regulatory constraints in 0:28:43.960 --> 0:28:45.160 the United States. 0:28:45.760 --> 0:28:48.880 Is there a risk that people believe that Vice President 0:28:48.920 --> 0:28:52.520 Harris is synonymous to more regulation and therefore lack of innovation. 0:28:53.520 --> 0:28:57.080 I think the risk is that having this wild wild 0:28:57.160 --> 0:28:59.600 West where we have no regulation is very dangerous for 0:28:59.640 --> 0:29:03.280 in the v is very dangerous for progress for our country. 0:29:03.400 --> 0:29:05.400 And I also think that it actually will stifle our 0:29:05.400 --> 0:29:08.360 competitive advantage. So I think it's actually the opposite I 0:29:08.360 --> 0:29:13.160 think that when industries have guardrails that are balanced in 0:29:13.360 --> 0:29:16.040 the way that don't stifle competition, but in a way 0:29:16.040 --> 0:29:18.960 that give us like a playing field, I think we 0:29:19.120 --> 0:29:22.280 do better as an industry, if you will. So I 0:29:22.320 --> 0:29:25.120 disagree with that in quite frankly, I think that Kamala 0:29:25.120 --> 0:29:29.400 Harris is really working on policies that will allow us 0:29:29.400 --> 0:29:31.760 to come up with those guardrails in a way that 0:29:31.800 --> 0:29:34.560 we can continue to be competitive and stay innovative. 0:29:34.960 --> 0:29:37.440 What about the people that need to be surrounded if 0:29:38.480 --> 0:29:42.240 she does become the next president leads an administration many 0:29:42.360 --> 0:29:44.960 many would say synonymous with her as vice president were 0:29:45.000 --> 0:29:47.520 those that lead the SEC those that lead the FTC. 0:29:47.920 --> 0:29:49.600 And therefore that's an issue for m and A for 0:29:49.640 --> 0:29:52.960 your sector. It's also an issue for regulation, particularly around 0:29:52.960 --> 0:29:55.959 the crypto area. How do you want to see change, 0:29:56.000 --> 0:30:00.000 if any, of leadership of those sorts of areas. 0:30:00.360 --> 0:30:02.440 I do think that some of those areas do need 0:30:02.480 --> 0:30:04.840 a change of leadership, and I think that's healthy that 0:30:05.320 --> 0:30:07.520 I think that that will. You know, we are in 0:30:07.080 --> 0:30:10.440 a different age, if you will, for the next four years, 0:30:10.440 --> 0:30:12.600 in terms of even how you look at, you know, 0:30:12.640 --> 0:30:15.080 things like generative AI. So we do need to have 0:30:15.120 --> 0:30:17.320 some new leaders, but I think that she is open 0:30:17.480 --> 0:30:21.360 to bringing together different voices to do that, So I 0:30:21.400 --> 0:30:24.479 think you'll see some changes. Look, you know, she's been 0:30:24.600 --> 0:30:27.080 very vocal about she's going to be her own president 0:30:27.120 --> 0:30:29.840 that just because certain things happen during the Biden administration 0:30:29.880 --> 0:30:32.120 doesn't mean it's just going to be status quo and 0:30:32.200 --> 0:30:34.640 just the same old thing. She's a new person, a 0:30:34.720 --> 0:30:40.040 new president, with different experiences. She's very qualified in terms 0:30:40.080 --> 0:30:42.480 of what I think about candidates qualified to be president, 0:30:42.600 --> 0:30:45.880 having served you know, our beautiful state of California as 0:30:45.880 --> 0:30:47.880 the Attorney General. So what I think you'll see is 0:30:47.880 --> 0:30:51.200 some changes needed changes, quite frankly, but you'll also see 0:30:51.200 --> 0:30:53.560 more innovation in more people at the table. 0:30:54.000 --> 0:30:56.440 Shannon, there are high profile individuals in the world of 0:30:56.480 --> 0:30:59.480 technology and bench capital on both sides. Right and last 0:30:59.480 --> 0:31:01.880 week Read Hoffman was on the program the LinkedIn co 0:31:02.000 --> 0:31:04.080 found a grey Lock partner. One of the points he 0:31:04.160 --> 0:31:08.440 made was this has been divisive. It's caused tension in relationships, 0:31:08.920 --> 0:31:12.840 you know, literally between LPs and the bench caps as 0:31:12.840 --> 0:31:16.080 they work with or getting in on deals. What's your 0:31:16.120 --> 0:31:19.680 experience been of that, you know, somebody established in the industry, 0:31:19.720 --> 0:31:20.400 I got to tell. 0:31:20.240 --> 0:31:22.640 You my experience has been and I've been out there, 0:31:22.680 --> 0:31:25.040 I've been cam As saying, I've gone to different states. 0:31:25.080 --> 0:31:29.560 My experiences, even starting with being at the Democratic National Convention, 0:31:29.880 --> 0:31:33.280 is that she's bringing in more joy to politics. I'm 0:31:33.320 --> 0:31:36.320 actually seeing, you know, out there when I talk to people, 0:31:36.360 --> 0:31:38.920 even if they don't agree with you, people are willing 0:31:38.960 --> 0:31:41.560 to listen one on one in a way that is 0:31:41.600 --> 0:31:44.760 not divisive. You know, Kamala Harris has recently even said 0:31:44.800 --> 0:31:46.600 that it's okay that you don't agree with her. She 0:31:47.000 --> 0:31:49.080 wants to be the president for all. She knows that 0:31:49.120 --> 0:31:50.520 there's people out there that there aren't going to vote 0:31:50.560 --> 0:31:51.800 for her. She knows that there's people out there that 0:31:51.880 --> 0:31:54.040 are not going to agree with her, and that's okay. 0:31:54.360 --> 0:31:56.360 And I think that's how we've been approaching this, is 0:31:56.400 --> 0:31:59.960 that we still need to come together as one United America. 0:32:00.400 --> 0:32:02.880 And so that is what I'm hearing. 0:32:02.560 --> 0:32:04.800 When I talk to people one on one about this, 0:32:05.000 --> 0:32:07.200 not this deviceive like kind. 0:32:06.960 --> 0:32:07.800 Of hate speak. 0:32:07.840 --> 0:32:11.200 If you will, you come with experience in the financial 0:32:11.240 --> 0:32:14.160 areas and startup CFO of wing of other businesses you're 0:32:14.200 --> 0:32:18.280 on the boards. How have you talked about companies strategizing 0:32:18.400 --> 0:32:22.680 for this. If indeed Kamala doesn't become the next president 0:32:23.320 --> 0:32:27.240 and we know instead a Trump presidency, how do you navigate? 0:32:27.320 --> 0:32:30.440 Yeah, I think that, you know, we will have to 0:32:30.680 --> 0:32:34.320 you know, we we will have to navigate if that 0:32:34.360 --> 0:32:36.160 does happen. But I don't like to put those type 0:32:36.160 --> 0:32:38.600 of things out there in the universe. So we do 0:32:38.640 --> 0:32:41.120 believe that Kamala Harris is going to win, and we 0:32:41.160 --> 0:32:43.080 do believe that we will have a seat at the table. 0:32:43.080 --> 0:32:44.600 And that's what's really important. 0:32:44.840 --> 0:32:47.840 And so honestly, that's what we've been focusing on, is 0:32:47.920 --> 0:32:51.400 how do we bring together these diverse voices, get them 0:32:51.440 --> 0:32:54.640 at the table and really talk about spawning and continuing 0:32:54.720 --> 0:32:56.760 the innovation in our competitive advantage. 0:32:57.280 --> 0:33:00.719 Shanna Nash, we appreciate your time. Texta Comma co founder 0:33:01.320 --> 0:33:04.200 coming up plenty more when it comes to the election 0:33:04.440 --> 0:33:11.520 and the United States and technology, the SI Blomberg technology. 0:33:18.360 --> 0:33:20.760 We just talked with someone on the Democratic Party side 0:33:20.800 --> 0:33:23.280 of this election. Let's bring in someone on the other side. 0:33:23.320 --> 0:33:26.920 All Off VC founder Crystal mckeller, who's supporting the Republican 0:33:26.960 --> 0:33:29.840 ticket of former President Donald Trump along with JD Vance, 0:33:30.520 --> 0:33:33.400 whom mckeller has previously worked with and welcome back to 0:33:33.440 --> 0:33:34.120 the program. 0:33:34.200 --> 0:33:35.480 Thank you so much for having me back. 0:33:35.600 --> 0:33:37.360 I think what we're trying to find out is that 0:33:37.400 --> 0:33:42.200 in the time that's passed, has anything changed or developed. 0:33:42.840 --> 0:33:46.840 You've emphasized deregulation, as of many other Trump surrogates and 0:33:46.880 --> 0:33:50.200 Trump himself, is that the totality of why you think 0:33:50.240 --> 0:33:54.280 President Trump, former President Trump is best for the technology industry. 0:33:54.560 --> 0:33:57.400 So deregulation is an important part of the story. The 0:33:57.480 --> 0:34:00.680 regulations that are promulgated by the administrative state, the unelected 0:34:00.720 --> 0:34:06.680 administrative state is certainly a problem, but more globally, the 0:34:06.720 --> 0:34:09.200 reason that I support President Trump and JD. Vance is 0:34:09.239 --> 0:34:11.920 because they are going to implement not just they're not 0:34:12.000 --> 0:34:15.280 going to just roll back regulations that are stifling American industry, 0:34:15.400 --> 0:34:18.959 but they're actually going to actively implement policies that will 0:34:19.239 --> 0:34:23.839 stimulate growth and encourage innovation. I encourage American ingenuity, which 0:34:23.880 --> 0:34:28.120 is absolutely essential to usher in a boom in American 0:34:28.400 --> 0:34:29.640 industrial manufacturing. 0:34:29.840 --> 0:34:30.959 And this is an issue not. 0:34:30.920 --> 0:34:34.719 Only of American prosperity, but also of national security. Is 0:34:34.760 --> 0:34:37.160 something that people like myself who invest in the national 0:34:37.239 --> 0:34:40.120 security space spend a lot of time thinking about because 0:34:40.160 --> 0:34:43.000 the policies of the current administration which have led to 0:34:43.080 --> 0:34:47.600 the continued offshoring of critical components of American manufacturing, of 0:34:47.640 --> 0:34:51.480 the American defense industry, as well as our disastrous energy policies. 0:34:51.520 --> 0:34:54.960 They've made the United States less prosperous and less safe, 0:34:54.960 --> 0:34:56.880 and that goes beyond just regulation. 0:34:57.120 --> 0:35:00.360 Well, some might say, on the other hand, you have 0:35:00.400 --> 0:35:03.920 the Chips Act, the Inflation Reduction Act that has legislated 0:35:04.360 --> 0:35:07.880 to unsure those two specific industries. Companies like Anderil have 0:35:08.000 --> 0:35:09.800 thrived in the last four years. 0:35:10.800 --> 0:35:13.279 I would argue that Anderil has thrived despite the last 0:35:13.320 --> 0:35:15.160 four years. I mean, what do you need for a 0:35:15.160 --> 0:35:19.040 healthy manufacturing base. You need cheap, abundant energy, you need 0:35:19.080 --> 0:35:20.879 low inflation, you need low interest rates. 0:35:20.920 --> 0:35:21.560 And the current. 0:35:21.320 --> 0:35:24.000 Administration gets a CNS on all of this. So, yes, 0:35:24.080 --> 0:35:27.200 tech founders will find a way despite the policies of 0:35:27.239 --> 0:35:31.360 the current administration, not because of them. You can't legislate growth, 0:35:31.520 --> 0:35:32.760 you can legislate policies. 0:35:33.000 --> 0:35:33.960 And I'll give an example. 0:35:34.120 --> 0:35:37.480 So, for example, one of the critical inputs for manufacturing 0:35:37.520 --> 0:35:42.040 is energy. Nuclear is the cheapest, safest, most energy dense 0:35:42.160 --> 0:35:44.840 form of energy based a form of baseload power that 0:35:44.880 --> 0:35:47.080 we have here in the United States, and yet the 0:35:47.160 --> 0:35:50.600 Harris Biden administration has blocked the development of a million 0:35:50.640 --> 0:35:54.640 acres on the Arizona, Utah border, which is the sole 0:35:54.800 --> 0:35:59.200 source of US based high grade uranium. And so rather 0:35:59.239 --> 0:36:02.520 than sure this absolutely critical domestic source, what. 0:36:02.520 --> 0:36:03.080 Are we doing. 0:36:03.239 --> 0:36:07.080 We are the largest buyer of Russian You're enrich uranium. 0:36:07.239 --> 0:36:09.840 I mean, this is just bananas that not only have 0:36:09.920 --> 0:36:15.520 we made ourselves reliant on a foreign adversary for American 0:36:15.600 --> 0:36:19.880 base load power, but we've also were also literally funding 0:36:19.960 --> 0:36:24.719 the Russian nuclear weapons complex because why because of a 0:36:24.760 --> 0:36:29.080 policy decision, Because the Harris Biden administration, that White House 0:36:29.080 --> 0:36:32.919 decided to bow to the very well funded lobbying of 0:36:33.880 --> 0:36:36.319 a particular interest group in the United States, and they 0:36:36.440 --> 0:36:39.719 chose that interest group above the national security interests of 0:36:39.760 --> 0:36:42.360 the United States and our allies. That is one example 0:36:42.560 --> 0:36:44.440 that's not regulation, that's a policy. 0:36:44.960 --> 0:36:48.319 Now, I don't know the nuances of exactly that particular 0:36:48.800 --> 0:36:52.319 investment in nuclear however, I'm pretty sure that limitations on 0:36:52.400 --> 0:36:53.280 imports from Russia. 0:36:53.280 --> 0:36:54.520 And I'm also certain. 0:36:54.239 --> 0:36:57.440 That we've seen deals from Microsoft, from Google, announcements from 0:36:57.440 --> 0:37:01.000 Amazon saying that they will invest in nuclear energy, and 0:37:01.000 --> 0:37:03.880 that happens under this current administration, not a future potential 0:37:03.880 --> 0:37:04.319 Trump one. 0:37:04.360 --> 0:37:04.880 And so I'm. 0:37:04.760 --> 0:37:08.319 Interested more broadly about what you're trying to articulate when 0:37:08.320 --> 0:37:11.160 it comes to actual policies that you think will be 0:37:11.239 --> 0:37:13.640 brought in that bring the innovation you talk. 0:37:13.560 --> 0:37:18.360 To absolutely, and that is and it's a great development 0:37:18.400 --> 0:37:21.800 that there is an understanding that nuclear is one hundred 0:37:21.800 --> 0:37:25.360 percent the answer not only for United States manufacturing, but 0:37:25.400 --> 0:37:27.520 also frankly, how are we going to keep up with 0:37:27.560 --> 0:37:30.640 the energy requirements of AI, which is a good thing, 0:37:30.719 --> 0:37:32.880 and how are we also going to respond to the 0:37:32.920 --> 0:37:34.920 concerns about climate change? How are we going to mitigate 0:37:34.920 --> 0:37:37.360 climate change? Nuclear is an essential part of that. And 0:37:37.400 --> 0:37:39.840 one thing I should mention is that six members of Congress, 0:37:39.880 --> 0:37:42.440 I mean, to your point, we should not be enriching 0:37:42.680 --> 0:37:46.480 the Russian state, and six Republican members of Congress earlier 0:37:46.520 --> 0:37:48.880 this year passed a bill limit. 0:37:48.800 --> 0:37:51.120 Carrie's point was that we're enriching the Russian state. I 0:37:51.160 --> 0:37:54.919 think her question was sure Russia is subject to both 0:37:54.960 --> 0:37:56.280 export and import controls. 0:37:56.400 --> 0:37:57.640 It is, it should be. 0:37:57.800 --> 0:38:00.560 And so six members of Congress passed a bill earlier 0:38:00.600 --> 0:38:03.799 this year to limit our import of uranium because we 0:38:03.840 --> 0:38:07.400 shouldn't be buying it from Russia under any. 0:38:09.040 --> 0:38:10.240 Rationale point of view. 0:38:10.480 --> 0:38:12.600 And yet what does this bill do. The Bill of 0:38:12.680 --> 0:38:16.719 the White House sign includes an enormous waiver that mandates 0:38:16.719 --> 0:38:20.160 that continue or essentially Mandy's to continue purchase of uranium 0:38:20.200 --> 0:38:23.319 from Russia through twenty twenty eight. So I agree, we 0:38:23.360 --> 0:38:25.799 should not be buying uranium from Russia. We should not 0:38:25.840 --> 0:38:29.080 be dependent on a critical input for energy in the 0:38:29.160 --> 0:38:32.200 United States from Russia, and yet we are. So that 0:38:32.360 --> 0:38:36.120 is a direct result of the Biden Harris administration's policies. 0:38:36.560 --> 0:38:39.080 I spoke with the Energy Sectory a month or so ago, 0:38:39.200 --> 0:38:42.600 and she was very much focused on bringing nuclear energy 0:38:42.600 --> 0:38:45.560 back to power data centers back here in the United States. 0:38:45.680 --> 0:38:47.920 I just want to go to perhaps some of the 0:38:48.040 --> 0:38:52.400 level of tension and indeed ongoing relationships with people when 0:38:52.440 --> 0:38:54.440 it comes to November six, seventh, eighth, no matter what 0:38:54.480 --> 0:38:56.640 the outcome is. We had read Hoffmann on of course 0:38:56.920 --> 0:39:00.360 key bench capitalist founder, but also someone who supports the 0:39:00.440 --> 0:39:03.239 Harris campaign. Now he articulated he's worried that there might 0:39:03.280 --> 0:39:04.880 be some sort of form of retribution. 0:39:04.960 --> 0:39:06.239 Can you just take a listen. 0:39:07.040 --> 0:39:11.760 Trump and Trump presidency won you know his early presidency 0:39:11.800 --> 0:39:12.840 has shown a certain. 0:39:12.600 --> 0:39:13.840 Amount of grift or capitalism. 0:39:13.880 --> 0:39:17.840 It's like trying to penalize his opponents using the instruments 0:39:17.840 --> 0:39:18.160 of state. 0:39:18.600 --> 0:39:19.880 We have about thirty seconds. 0:39:19.920 --> 0:39:22.760 But do you worry about penalization no matter what happens 0:39:22.760 --> 0:39:23.240 on the other. 0:39:23.120 --> 0:39:25.319 Side, I don't think so. 0:39:25.560 --> 0:39:25.719 No. 0:39:26.800 --> 0:39:29.320 You know, I am a patriot, I am an American 0:39:29.360 --> 0:39:32.600 crew and threw I mean, first of all, I don't 0:39:32.600 --> 0:39:34.960 think that it's notable that he could not point to 0:39:35.000 --> 0:39:38.239 a single example of retribution by Donald Trump. 0:39:38.320 --> 0:39:39.319 The current administration. 0:39:39.480 --> 0:39:44.600 We had seen a tremendous uptick in prosecutions of people 0:39:44.600 --> 0:39:48.520 who are associated with the Trump administration. So perhaps, I mean, 0:39:48.560 --> 0:39:50.719 perhaps that there is some concern if the Democrats come 0:39:50.719 --> 0:39:52.920 back in office. But I'm optimistic enough to think that 0:39:53.239 --> 0:39:55.400 I don't think that the Democrats are going to retaliate 0:39:56.040 --> 0:39:59.360 against people who, you know, who voted their conscious and 0:39:59.400 --> 0:40:02.160 who spoke our conscience, and who spoke out against the 0:40:02.200 --> 0:40:04.880 policies that we believe are crushing American industry. 0:40:04.960 --> 0:40:07.080 I just want to point out that on May thirteenth, 0:40:07.480 --> 0:40:09.920 President Joe Biden signed into a law of ban on 0:40:10.000 --> 0:40:11.520 imports of uranium into. 0:40:11.320 --> 0:40:13.320 This country exactly. But we waiver. 0:40:13.760 --> 0:40:15.920 We are our time, but I promise we will have 0:40:16.000 --> 0:40:19.440 you back again. Russell mckella, l our VC, founder. 0:40:21.040 --> 0:40:24.399 Tech focused hedge fund KOTO, is looking to raise one 0:40:24.440 --> 0:40:27.680 billion dollars to amplify bets on artificial intelligence, first time 0:40:27.719 --> 0:40:30.120 it's looked for cash for its flagship fund in the years. 0:40:30.360 --> 0:40:33.120 No mag Tamma Palmer reports us out, joins us. 0:40:33.239 --> 0:40:35.160 How big a deal is it that they're reopening. It's 0:40:35.160 --> 0:40:36.040 a significant move. 0:40:36.120 --> 0:40:38.600 This is their flagship hedge fund, it's got fourteen billion 0:40:38.640 --> 0:40:41.280 dollars and they're looking to raise a whole billion dollars 0:40:41.320 --> 0:40:44.239 more to invest in AI. And it's been years since 0:40:44.239 --> 0:40:46.399 they've opened up their main hedge funds to new cash, 0:40:46.440 --> 0:40:47.560 so it's a significant move. 0:40:48.520 --> 0:40:50.880 Hemmer. I feel like Felipe Lafont's name comes up a 0:40:50.880 --> 0:40:53.120 lot in the context of AI. Talk to us about 0:40:53.200 --> 0:40:55.080 him as a champion of the sector. 0:40:55.280 --> 0:40:59.239 Yes, he has been a bullish, an avid enthusiast for 0:40:59.640 --> 0:41:04.120 AI and as technology and its potentiality. And you see 0:41:04.120 --> 0:41:05.759 it in their investments and the video is one of 0:41:05.760 --> 0:41:08.600 their biggest holdings and videos one of their biggest holdings. 0:41:09.120 --> 0:41:11.600 You see it in the way he speaks about the space. 0:41:12.000 --> 0:41:15.280 He has talked about how he thinks that humanoid robots 0:41:15.280 --> 0:41:18.040 are going to be part of the future in fifteen years. 0:41:18.480 --> 0:41:21.720 He sees a lot of opportunity when it comes to AI, 0:41:21.800 --> 0:41:25.920 but also peripheral areas like AI infrastructure and technology and 0:41:26.080 --> 0:41:29.120 energy sectors. So what you're seeing now is that really 0:41:29.200 --> 0:41:30.759 come to play in his portfolio. 0:41:31.320 --> 0:41:34.600 Very briefly, the relationship with Raymond James, Well, does that 0:41:34.719 --> 0:41:35.479 signal yes. 0:41:35.560 --> 0:41:37.239 So it's part of a broader trend we're seeing in 0:41:37.320 --> 0:41:40.080 the hedge fund space where they are increasingly turning to 0:41:40.280 --> 0:41:43.879 bank wealth platforms to raise money. This is a group 0:41:43.920 --> 0:41:45.920 of people that hadn't had access to hedge funds and 0:41:45.920 --> 0:41:49.000 private equity and venture capital for many years, and so 0:41:49.400 --> 0:41:51.480 it's also a space where they can these funds can 0:41:51.560 --> 0:41:54.440 raise money as institutional investors have become a little bit 0:41:54.440 --> 0:41:55.879 more cautious on the space and. 0:41:55.840 --> 0:41:58.319 Have been a little bit more reticent. And that was 0:41:58.320 --> 0:41:59.279 individuals helping me. 0:42:00.560 --> 0:42:03.400 Yeah, big thanks to Bloomberg's Hemma Palma with another big breaker. 0:42:04.000 --> 0:42:05.880 Wow, what a show, and that does it. 0:42:05.920 --> 0:42:10.000 With this very special Ed Ludlow Birthday edition of Bloomberg Technology, 0:42:10.040 --> 0:42:11.480 we wish you a very happy. 0:42:11.200 --> 0:42:11.759 Birthday, Ed. 0:42:12.520 --> 0:42:15.040 Yeah, It's quite a week to celebrate a birthday, which 0:42:15.080 --> 0:42:18.839 seems inconsequential. Things considered recap on the podcast, so many 0:42:18.880 --> 0:42:21.160 important discussions and pieces of reporting. You know where to 0:42:21.160 --> 0:42:24.040 find the pod online on Apple, Spotify, and iHeart, and 0:42:24.120 --> 0:42:26.600 of course on the Bloomberg platforms. Thank you to the 0:42:26.640 --> 0:42:28.600 team in New York City and all the team out 0:42:28.600 --> 0:42:31.360 here in San Francisco. This is Bloomberg Technology.