Speaker 1: Look man, oh I see you? Why why? And look
Speaker 1: over there? How is that culture? Yes, goodness, dull, I
Speaker 1: was teasing you about a surprise I had for you,
Speaker 1: my sister. You said you would surprise me with something.
Speaker 1: It's now time for the surprise to be revealed. And
Speaker 1: that's always the best part of the surprise, I feel,
Speaker 1: is the review of culture. Oh it's rule culture number
Speaker 1: what six six? The best part of the surprise reveal.
Speaker 1: So I have in my hands right here. Um, this
Speaker 1: is a result of our conversation with rose Dam. And
Speaker 1: this is also me reviewing to rose Dam that I
Speaker 1: own these now. Um A reader reached out. They somehow
Speaker 1: we're able to get their hands on these. Joe Anne
Speaker 1: Trattoria World Pride. We were given three. Okay, so these
Speaker 1: are the v Joe and Trattoria Degaga's restaurant, World Pride,
Speaker 1: her father her Well, yes, we can assume that she's
Speaker 1: in some way getting some ownership over that. What does
Speaker 1: it say on the back? I didn't read that properly.
Speaker 1: It says, okay, there are Italians everywhere, my god, Because
Speaker 1: lady Gaga famously an Italian girl first and foremost, just
Speaker 1: an Italian girl from New York. Now we let's just
Speaker 1: describe this visually to the listeners, to the readers. We
Speaker 1: have podcast our visual medium. The lock up is Joanne
Speaker 1: and then this and then tritoria under that a Rose
Speaker 1: vector are underneath makes the joe in a little bit
Speaker 1: eligible to be honest. But then you have the strike
Speaker 1: graphic design notes I'm sorry, I'm you know, I'm just
Speaker 1: giving them. And then it's sort of laid out as
Speaker 1: if the Joeann Trattoria is in the top left section
Speaker 1: of the U. S. Flag, but the stripes instead of red,
Speaker 1: white and blue are the Pride colors and white and
Speaker 1: says at the bottom twenty nine World Pride Parade. At
Speaker 1: the back. As we've said, there are Italians every where
Speaker 1: in bold read letters. I really this is just thank
Speaker 1: This is the side im and there are three larges
Speaker 1: and we're all I'm gonna bring it to you when
Speaker 1: I see you in New York and I will see
Speaker 1: you in New York soon. And this actually is my
Speaker 1: way of getting Rose to have coffee with me. Oh
Speaker 1: my god, you guys have to meet that. This is
Speaker 1: my gun to her her proverbial head um, to get
Speaker 1: her out of the house, to get coffee with me girl.
Speaker 1: The culture that has sort of befallen us in the past.
Speaker 1: We could say seven days, but really twenty four hours
Speaker 1: wild we had the Oscar nominations, we had the Grammys.
Speaker 1: Now come on, now we were recording during the Megan
Speaker 1: Oprah and really shame but we haven't even like assessed that.
Speaker 1: But really quickly, I mean an interview that we will
Speaker 1: talk about for a long time as a culture. I mean,
Speaker 1: who is having that conversation, who ever really came through
Speaker 1: that conversation. I will say both of our I don't
Speaker 1: think so, honey, is from last week. We're actually, without
Speaker 1: having even watched the interviews, very prescient because mine was
Speaker 1: I don't think so honey, people who are only just
Speaker 1: now realizing Oprah is quote good at interviewing, which was
Speaker 1: happening on Twitter, and yours was, I don't think so honey.
Speaker 1: Royal family, and I would say decidedly those are standing tall. Absolutely.
Speaker 1: Mine was very broad, yours was very specific. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think we balanced both of those scopes very well.
Speaker 1: But I don't think so Honey, the Royal family they
Speaker 1: gotta go. I think they gotta go. Grammy's I thought,
Speaker 1: what an interesting night. What an interesting night. That's not
Speaker 1: a glowing review. I really enjoyed that the the awards
Speaker 1: were evenly distributed. Thank you. I always love whenever they
Speaker 1: don't go all to one person. I love an even
Speaker 1: distribution and do a got her moment. Taylor got her moment.
Speaker 1: I'm wearing my Taylor swift to sort of commemorate the
Speaker 1: third Album of the Year win for Folklore. Snaps to you, Taylor,
Speaker 1: you joined the legends Megan. Megan got awarded nicely, also
Speaker 1: arguably got snubbed at the end. But I don't think
Speaker 1: our opinion matters. I think we can say was everything
Speaker 1: you want to buy Billie Eilish the Record of the
Speaker 1: Year to the Grammys? Yes, so, I think the rest
Speaker 1: of the world probably not. But on a production level,
Speaker 1: was it like an incredible like are they being are? Are?
Speaker 1: Are are they still? Like? Hard for Phineas? Maybe incredibly
Speaker 1: hard for him. Mr Harry Styles got a nice and
Speaker 1: I was really hard for him. That's so hard that
Speaker 1: I had to make him my phone background. He's actually
Speaker 1: my phone background on today. That's like you can't really
Speaker 1: see because they got sort of icons in the way.
Speaker 1: He really he was really looking good. It's really wild
Speaker 1: that even yea, even even through the screen, through the camera,
Speaker 1: he can bradiate that it's it's it's really wild. It
Speaker 1: really works. Did you see the clip of him catching
Speaker 1: up with Taylor. I did see the clip with him
Speaker 1: catching up with Taylor. They were gesticulating very in a
Speaker 1: very friendly ways, were very fun. They they seem to
Speaker 1: be on good terms. They were very we're we're seeing
Speaker 1: each other and this is normal energy. Yeah, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: And I mean that's that's the thing. I mean, have
Speaker 1: haven't we all mastered that? There is like an extra
Speaker 1: layer of conversation now where it's like we all have
Speaker 1: to like in the moment adjust to like the pinching
Speaker 1: of the mask up all that. There's just little ticks
Speaker 1: now that we've all Oh, I see the sort of
Speaker 1: a state of being that is conversating with the mask,
Speaker 1: with the mask with and then and then you know,
Speaker 1: like trying to like pull it down sometimes when it's
Speaker 1: like I want you to read my lips and it's
Speaker 1: like a little bit dangerous, yeah, or like this is
Speaker 1: the part of conversation where I'm letting you know it's
Speaker 1: actually just me and you because I'm pulling down the
Speaker 1: mask a little bit and like sort of defying what
Speaker 1: society and the quote unquote c d C says we
Speaker 1: should be doing. Understand I supposed c d C. Now
Speaker 1: I just before we bring it, before we're in the guests,
Speaker 1: then I want to know how hard were you for
Speaker 1: the oscars fully erect or like sort of chub chub,
Speaker 1: Regina King got snubbed, Wee night in Miami got snubbed.
Speaker 1: Um otherwise otherwise really really fund nominations in there. Steven Stephen, Um,
Speaker 1: Young Junune fantastic um and Leaa Chung really really fun
Speaker 1: and Lucas brothers are Oscar nominees for Judas in the
Speaker 1: in the Black Messiah, Like this is this is really fun.
Speaker 1: Make Boner was throbbing, for sure. Make Boner was throbbing.
Speaker 1: But anyway, speaking of awards, we were talking to Um,
Speaker 1: a decorated person, Tony Award winner among other things, and
Speaker 1: speaking of throbbing. To be honest with you, now, oh
Speaker 1: my god, we said, currently I've been I've been throbbing
Speaker 1: all day, never robbing. We are never throbbing with when
Speaker 1: it comes to this person. And this is someone who
Speaker 1: has really um really takes to being objectified gracefully. I think, well,
Speaker 1: I mean it's been happening for decades, so I would
Speaker 1: imagine that he's adjusted, And if he hasn't adjusted, i'd
Speaker 1: tell him to get help, get help, because it's not
Speaker 1: gonna stop anytime soon, certainly not going to stop in
Speaker 1: the next eighty minutes, not at all. Um he I mean,
Speaker 1: it's it's an exercise and futility to even try to
Speaker 1: like give you the highlights of his credits. But he's
Speaker 1: he's a treasurer of the theater of television, of film. Everyone,
Speaker 1: please welcome into your ears. Well you're not even when
Speaker 1: you're not even gonna try. You're going to say it's
Speaker 1: an exercise of futility, but I'm gonna try. No, no,
Speaker 1: you aren't even going to try. Stand by, We're gonna
Speaker 1: get into the credits and see. I know that we are.
Speaker 1: But I was like, I thought that was I thought
Speaker 1: that was like sort of so bold of you, because
Speaker 1: this is a legend. We have to say, this is
Speaker 1: an icon, but this is this is like you know,
Speaker 1: Letterman or whoever, being like my next guest, and yes
Speaker 1: it is. I really don't. But I mean, alright, alright,
Speaker 1: well we're about to do it anyway. We're gonna just
Speaker 1: hash this out. Everyone. Welcome, b D, welcome, high, come on,
Speaker 1: you know who you are. Okay, hello, gentlemen, you want
Speaker 1: to um push back against this? What what are you?
Speaker 1: What are you pushing back again? You know. I'm definitely
Speaker 1: not like, like false modestying it necessarily, but I do
Speaker 1: go into a situation every once in a while I
Speaker 1: think we'll really do people really know they do? And
Speaker 1: sometimes I'm absolutely sure they do, and then other times
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, okay, I think somebody needs to kind
Speaker 1: of like maybe whisper to that person. You know, they're
Speaker 1: gonna know, they're gonna know you for your people. Your
Speaker 1: people are people, Yeah, Yeah, we're in there now, they're
Speaker 1: in there. They're the right people. Yeah. And by our people,
Speaker 1: you mean Jurassic Park fanatics enthusiasts. Matt wants. Matt wanted
Speaker 1: to ask you, Oh, I have something, but not directly.
Speaker 1: Well he will, He'll let him miss here. No, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: I really wanted to ask. There's a million things to
Speaker 1: talk with you about, but there's something very specific that
Speaker 1: I need to know. So I am a person who
Speaker 1: and this is one of my goals One of my
Speaker 1: dreams is to book a franchise big enough that there
Speaker 1: will be a theme park ride made after it, so
Speaker 1: that I can be acting on the videos that play
Speaker 1: in the line for all of time. You are one
Speaker 1: of the few people who has sort of um achieved this.
Speaker 1: So you are on a loop at all times, well
Speaker 1: not seven, maybe some special days of the year. But
Speaker 1: let's just say if if, if there, if the theme
Speaker 1: park known as Universal Studios is open and b D
Speaker 1: is performing in it, you are on a loop in
Speaker 1: the Jurassic World attractions. I've never seen this, by the way,
Speaker 1: but I've never seen it. I've never but something by
Speaker 1: the time it, I mean, it's not that old. And
Speaker 1: then yeah, I haven't been to l A and they
Speaker 1: have to have a lot pandemic and all that stuff,
Speaker 1: So I have not seen it. But what was the
Speaker 1: experience of shooting the footage of a theme park? Very
Speaker 1: strange because it's way after the fact, it's not part
Speaker 1: of the movie. It has to be separate from the movie,
Speaker 1: but have to have all the approvals and it has
Speaker 1: to adhere to all of the story points and blah
Speaker 1: blah blah, and Colin Trobarrow the director of the Jurassic World,
Speaker 1: two of the three directors World movies, has to approve
Speaker 1: of what is being said. But at the same time,
Speaker 1: costume and wardrobe and like, these people are just kind
Speaker 1: of hired to do put it together, and they kind
Speaker 1: of watched the movie and kind of recreated but you
Speaker 1: don't have like your real costume or or you know
Speaker 1: that it's not like it's not as you can imagine
Speaker 1: you think about it from a production standardpoint, it's a
Speaker 1: whole new, separate production. Yeah, okay. I didn't know that though,
Speaker 1: because I heard the Marvel people that it's sort of
Speaker 1: built into their like Guardians of the Galaxy, and they
Speaker 1: shot footage for the Disney ride while they were shooting
Speaker 1: the new Guardians, like and I didn't know if that
Speaker 1: was the case for YouTube. It wasn't. And that was
Speaker 1: and I think that was only just because this one
Speaker 1: was made after the fact, you know, like they the
Speaker 1: time we figured out that they wanted to make this ride,
Speaker 1: the movies were done or the movies were coming and
Speaker 1: they were coordinating it. But it wasn't bad. It wasn't
Speaker 1: It was just kind of as as the performer. It's
Speaker 1: odd because you think you're done with it, and then
Speaker 1: you come back and it's like okay, And then then
Speaker 1: you find yourself in the strange position where you're explaining
Speaker 1: to them very basic things or reading the script and saying, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know. It doesn't really feel like that feels
Speaker 1: like the writing is exactly what he might say, so
Speaker 1: maybe I would. So then I got involved in that.
Speaker 1: So there was like writing involved, and um, there's nothing
Speaker 1: wrong with that either, but it isn't what you would assume,
Speaker 1: like you'd get the script and go, oh, I see
Speaker 1: they're all fully aligned already and everything is together there.
Speaker 1: They have a learning curve to the people that are
Speaker 1: putting it together, and there are three of them. Oh,
Speaker 1: this is what's really interesting. There's a Florida one and
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's open yet or not, but
Speaker 1: you did shoot new footage for that Velocity coastution. Okay,
Speaker 1: this is this is really what I wanted to ask about,
Speaker 1: because I'm this roller coaster looks intense. B D. You're
Speaker 1: gonna have to get down there. You're gonna have to
Speaker 1: get down there to watch yourself. Weren't gonna weekly different ride,
Speaker 1: completely different audience experience prior to the ride. I forget
Speaker 1: what it's called. It's kind of acronym. And and then
Speaker 1: so that each each team is completely different, the director
Speaker 1: and everybody, everything's just completely different. The first one, the
Speaker 1: one that we did, had a lot at first, had
Speaker 1: a lot of like improv and there was a little
Speaker 1: bit of a wink to it. And then then I
Speaker 1: started as a shoot went on, I got the impression
Speaker 1: they were, Oh, they don't like this, They're going to
Speaker 1: like use all the very serious stuff. So I don't
Speaker 1: even know what it's like. What is it like? Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: the thing is, it's sort of like it's sort of
Speaker 1: like this. It's like we're walking through the queue and
Speaker 1: I I look up to the screens and I see
Speaker 1: that it's you b D. And there's like a lot
Speaker 1: of children screaming around me, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: So you can't really hear it. So while I think
Speaker 1: that they did appreciate all the improv, I think that
Speaker 1: they thought to themselves, but you know, kids are going
Speaker 1: to be screaming over well, maybe it's still in there,
Speaker 1: and you know you know what, I hope it's you
Speaker 1: improvising about whatever the funk and the kids just screaming
Speaker 1: over it so that they can't even hear it, and
Speaker 1: they don't even know You're not talking about raptors or nothing.
Speaker 1: You're talking about some crazy and exactly I'm talking about
Speaker 1: you guys, exactly, I hope. So, but are the stakes
Speaker 1: lower to you? And maybe this is an unfair question,
Speaker 1: but are the stakes lower to you because it's not
Speaker 1: canonical and because to the children who are like populating
Speaker 1: these parks, they can't track what's going on in the queue,
Speaker 1: like no, well, yes, and no, I mean, let's one
Speaker 1: has to be kind of like not. If I put
Speaker 1: everything into everything all the time, I would never make
Speaker 1: it because there's just so much, you know, like like
Speaker 1: I like I I wanted, I want to do a
Speaker 1: really good job, and I wanted to be as good
Speaker 1: as possible, and I overthink and I over commit and
Speaker 1: like stay up too late whatever I do to prepare.
Speaker 1: But at the same time, it is what it is
Speaker 1: after a certain time. And the best example, Boon, you
Speaker 1: would probably appreciate this. It's the third one. You know
Speaker 1: what the third one is Dominion Dominion Park. Oh, what
Speaker 1: is it? Oh, it's the one. It's the one. Um, yeah,
Speaker 1: the new one that they're opening where is it Hong
Speaker 1: Kong or Japan? And so uh, I had to do
Speaker 1: it in Chinese. I don't speak and I don't speak Chinese,
Speaker 1: so I had to cram Chinese, and then of course
Speaker 1: they dubbed me and the onsets. I will say the
Speaker 1: onset experience for that was very upsetting because I wanted
Speaker 1: to do a good job and I was all of
Speaker 1: my Asian American kind of shame about speaking the language
Speaker 1: and all of that started like coming up, and I
Speaker 1: wanted to do as good a job as possible, but
Speaker 1: they weren't giving me the t is that I needed.
Speaker 1: They wanted to go really fast, and I had explained
Speaker 1: to the months ago, this is what I need, but
Speaker 1: I couldn't. I didn't have it, so so it that
Speaker 1: was disappointing to me. But and that was a perfect
Speaker 1: example of me saying, Okay, you gotta let it go
Speaker 1: because it is what it is. They don't care about
Speaker 1: what you care about, they don't care about any of
Speaker 1: that stuff, so just let it go. But um, but
Speaker 1: that was so by the time I got to the
Speaker 1: third one, I thought, oh wow, I really but again,
Speaker 1: another completely different ride with a completely different script and
Speaker 1: a completely different shooting thing. It's all all independent. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but this is a character Henry Wu who has has
Speaker 1: lived on for twenty plus years, and you wear a
Speaker 1: black turtleneck like, no, no other man and thanks, don't
Speaker 1: you know Sean Connery, But no, no, no. I think
Speaker 1: I think you've remarked on this that after is done
Speaker 1: a little dirty at first, and maybe there is a
Speaker 1: chance for him to occupy this very impactful and I
Speaker 1: think by the time you get to Fall in Kingdom,
Speaker 1: he whatever he's he's basically I mean, doesn't he get
Speaker 1: like whatever, He gets like sterilized and ship he gets
Speaker 1: castrated professionally, Yes, you know, he's like taking his lost
Speaker 1: his license and and so he's been humbold because he's
Speaker 1: really arrogant. In the first of the three of the
Speaker 1: of the Jurassic World movies, he's very that's the black
Speaker 1: that's the black turtleneck thing. Yeah. Yes, he was really
Speaker 1: the cock of the walk. You know, he he knew
Speaker 1: he was the hottest man in the world. Yeah, it was,
Speaker 1: you know, Yes, he was basically Steve Jobs. Basically when
Speaker 1: when you guys were just saying he was sterilized, I
Speaker 1: was like, Okay, how high was I when I watched
Speaker 1: that movie, because like, I don't I don't remember him
Speaker 1: being sterilized, but I remember a lot of crazy should happened,
Speaker 1: like the Little girl let the doc let Disgnus was
Speaker 1: free at and because she was like them too. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I was like, this movie is camp. I love it.
Speaker 1: In the original, in the original novel and the book
Speaker 1: the Michael Criton like like Henry wu is like like
Speaker 1: just to him part of Yeah, they need to beef
Speaker 1: up the role. How is the how is the how
Speaker 1: is it in dominion? What can you say? He can't
Speaker 1: say anything. I won't say a lot, but I can
Speaker 1: say fun things. Well, first of all, just attract the
Speaker 1: whole thing. I think this is one of the more
Speaker 1: interesting things that's ever happened to me, actually, because when
Speaker 1: I was asked to come an audition for the part,
Speaker 1: I was, um, I had I read the book and
Speaker 1: I was I got really excited, and then they had
Speaker 1: to read scenes from the book to audition. I forgot
Speaker 1: how it was very strange, it was very it was
Speaker 1: not a real script. And then um, I got the
Speaker 1: part and I was really excited. And then I got
Speaker 1: booked for one day and I thought oh no, that
Speaker 1: about what could could they do all that? And one day?
Speaker 1: And I thought no? And so then because I hadn't
Speaker 1: read the script, and then I find that it was
Speaker 1: one of those things we had to go to the
Speaker 1: somebody's Steve Spielberg's office, sit in the lobby in the
Speaker 1: waiting room, read it and give it back. And and um,
Speaker 1: I've read it and discovered it was a one day part.
Speaker 1: It became that part that's in the movie, that that's it,
Speaker 1: without even an ending, like everyone's fleeing the island and
Speaker 1: all that stuff. That person made no impact was had,
Speaker 1: there was no consequence to them. And I was very
Speaker 1: disappointed personally. And I also had enough of a spine
Speaker 1: at that time to think, is this an Asian American thing?
Speaker 1: Is this because there's no Asian American movie stars and
Speaker 1: I'm not one of them. And and I really believed
Speaker 1: that they had to make this cuts and changes and
Speaker 1: you know, the people are all still alive again to
Speaker 1: last them. But but um, I think they didn't care
Speaker 1: about this character because he didn't appeal to the audience
Speaker 1: at that time in our cultural history. And so that
Speaker 1: was great, and then it was over and and then
Speaker 1: years later it came back around in this very weird
Speaker 1: way because they re in read whatever you call it,
Speaker 1: Reese rebooted the whole thing. And I had a close
Speaker 1: friend Nathan who told me this would happen because he's
Speaker 1: a big friend of the fan fan of the franchise.
Speaker 1: And he says, it it's got to come back to you.
Speaker 1: It has to come back to you. And I said,
Speaker 1: I don't see why it would or how it would,
Speaker 1: but okay, and then it did and he was right,
Speaker 1: And um, the first one happened. And the first one
Speaker 1: was a complete one, a d from the character that
Speaker 1: was in the original movie. And then the second movie
Speaker 1: he's you know, kind of been brought down from that.
Speaker 1: It's like a little bit of a roller coaster. The third.
Speaker 1: All I can say is that I'm okay, and I'll
Speaker 1: let me just give you the landscape of why. I
Speaker 1: mean what I might have thought. I thought one of
Speaker 1: the great things about the original book was that he
Speaker 1: had this incredibly operatic death is kind of like wooly,
Speaker 1: wonderful kind of coming around, you know. It was a
Speaker 1: really three dimensional park. Yeah, like yes, And I thought, wow,
Speaker 1: that would be great. And then of course that never happened,
Speaker 1: and I thought, well, that happened in will it happen
Speaker 1: in the first one? Will that happening the second one?
Speaker 1: And and so I'm not saying that does or doesn't happen.
Speaker 1: I'm just saying I thought that would be really one
Speaker 1: of the great things. But there are other great things
Speaker 1: too that could happen. You can imagine what they are,
Speaker 1: like Bryce Dallas running in a heel again. We want
Speaker 1: to see Bryce Dallas running in the heels again. That's
Speaker 1: that's our big thing in I can't tell you. I'm
Speaker 1: not going to comment about that, but yes, I totally
Speaker 1: understand that is Lawa is Laura during in a ponytail
Speaker 1: salmon buttoned down? Maybe it is samon a hat. No, well, okay,
Speaker 1: they're they're's sucking up. No, I can't even hardly remember.
Speaker 1: This is what the gaze one raptors are chasing you,
Speaker 1: Laura and Bryce Dallas, and we're all of heels, and
Speaker 1: everyone's in heels, and everyone's wearing all salmon like salmon
Speaker 1: button down but also salmon like sort of cool lots
Speaker 1: really because cool like salmon crispy, And maybe Laura's is
Speaker 1: tied at the way at crop midriff, Yes, exactly exactly,
Speaker 1: and we go back to Bryce Dallas' original Jurassic World hair,
Speaker 1: which is what we call the chop. So we need
Speaker 1: to go back to the chop, and they all, you
Speaker 1: all need to be in heels. You get absolutely I'm
Speaker 1: not sure what the death is in the book, but
Speaker 1: you get ripped apart, and it's it's it's iconography. It's
Speaker 1: iconography the way that you die. Yeah. Well, because this
Speaker 1: interior salmon matches the exterior sound Yeah, yes, exactly exactly ripped. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it's it's it's gorgeous, it's art. It transcends. And
Speaker 1: then at the end, Bryce Dallas and Laura have to
Speaker 1: fight the raptors. That's what I think I want to
Speaker 1: happen with this with this. Yes, they because they look
Speaker 1: at each other and they say, they look at each other,
Speaker 1: and this is what the script writers wrote. Bryce Dallas
Speaker 1: looks at Laura and she says girl power. And then
Speaker 1: they fight and they went exactly and they went. Of course,
Speaker 1: they knock them out, and the t Rex comes in
Speaker 1: and then looks at them and he turns the other
Speaker 1: way and runs the other way. He says, I'm not
Speaker 1: messing with that with those ladies, and for for for
Speaker 1: Henry to die after six movies six I'm miscounting her
Speaker 1: technically four, but I know it's technically six. But actually
Speaker 1: I don't count for two the ones that I'm not
Speaker 1: in Lost World. No, that is that is like, that
Speaker 1: is a big deal for this man to survive the
Speaker 1: course of this story and to be ripped apart in
Speaker 1: Salmon at the end, acting as the bridge between the
Speaker 1: generations of you have Bryce who is Who's new? Laura
Speaker 1: who's from the He's from the old school, and then
Speaker 1: you have you have b d who is who? Who?
Speaker 1: Who is a connective tissue? Remember the dinosaurs wouldn't even
Speaker 1: be there without him, that we would not be there
Speaker 1: without him. Yes, and well the thing is what I
Speaker 1: will My response to that is, if you can imagine
Speaker 1: the rollercoaster of it. I mean, he's headed towards some
Speaker 1: thing and this first at this arrogance in the first
Speaker 1: this kind of like I create or energy, and then
Speaker 1: this whole kind of being brought down. A little something
Speaker 1: needs to happen in the third thing. I'm not going
Speaker 1: to tell you what it is, but it could be
Speaker 1: related to the connection back to the original material, which
Speaker 1: is why you know, yeah, I mean, you know, his
Speaker 1: attitude of his attitude about you guys are so funny.
Speaker 1: We are getting it out where he's coming from this
Speaker 1: as this person. But I'm not gonna say anything because
Speaker 1: I don't want to miss lead or you know they say,
Speaker 1: is gold bloom in this last one? Yes, Oh my god.
Speaker 1: Three of them are hilarious. They're they're they're they're great together.
Speaker 1: Who you're talking about, Laura, Sam and Jeff. One of
Speaker 1: the icons of Lost Coach is Bryce Dallas. What is
Speaker 1: Bryce Dallas? Like? Incredible? Like we love Bryce Dallas. Yes,
Speaker 1: he has an incredible sense of humor. She's she's totally
Speaker 1: um nothing but you know, like that kind of real,
Speaker 1: there's no pretense or anything. She's extremely smart. She was
Speaker 1: the spearhead and the UM took a huge leadership role
Speaker 1: in the um. What's the word going into production in
Speaker 1: this movie, it's the early part of the pandemic really,
Speaker 1: So she's the one that got us all together and said, Okay,
Speaker 1: this is what I've found out so far about what's possible,
Speaker 1: and this is what I'm saying to production about what
Speaker 1: we want because we can't do this without absolute absolute
Speaker 1: precautions and protocols that have to be in place, and
Speaker 1: so that, you know, because they wanted they were proposing
Speaker 1: that we would go into production, back into profit because
Speaker 1: the movie was shooting in January and February and then
Speaker 1: shut down like everything else. And then they came to
Speaker 1: us like in May or something and wanted us to
Speaker 1: shoot in June. And she said, I I said, I
Speaker 1: can't picture that at all. I mean I was I
Speaker 1: wasn't even leaving getting out of bed, and and and
Speaker 1: so she was the one that got We eventually went
Speaker 1: back in the end of July, I think it was,
Speaker 1: and which was which seemed really fast, but it was
Speaker 1: because all of this stuff had been put into place.
Speaker 1: They really bend over backwards to get this movie finished.
Speaker 1: They wanted it done by a certain date. That was
Speaker 1: their first motivation. But then there what quickly overtook that
Speaker 1: was this desire for it to be done properly because
Speaker 1: it was the first movie to go back into production. Yeah,
Speaker 1: y'all were back really early. I remember seeing like Laura
Speaker 1: Durn's Instagram because it was like a huge deal when
Speaker 1: she posted that she was on set. Of course her
Speaker 1: Laura Durn, and it being Durassic Park. I remember it
Speaker 1: felt early. I was like, wow, it feels like in America,
Speaker 1: this could not happen. That's right, that's right. And so
Speaker 1: but that's on topic. That is the answer to the
Speaker 1: question about what's Bryce like. I mean, she has this
Speaker 1: real energy and super intelligence when it comes to laying
Speaker 1: out all the facts and compiling it, and then she
Speaker 1: has people skills to bring people together and get them
Speaker 1: to want to um, yeah, to do it and to
Speaker 1: be you know, she was a really great team leader.
Speaker 1: That's skilled. That's that's wonderful. That's wonderful to hear it.
Speaker 1: We love hearing it. I Oh, that was it was this.
Speaker 1: This was of course the uh third, really the fourth
Speaker 1: time that I worked with her, because I did three
Speaker 1: of these movies with her, But then I went in
Speaker 1: nineteen and twenty three, I did Our Town with her
Speaker 1: at the theater in sag Harbor, and I played her father.
Speaker 1: You were Bryce's dad, Yes, I was Bryce's dad in
Speaker 1: that production of Our Time. So that was when I
Speaker 1: first kind of really fell for her because she was
Speaker 1: so she was she was also just like out of school,
Speaker 1: you know, she was really young and fresh and yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: she was in E two, W this photos of her
Speaker 1: in the hallway not playing the family card at all,
Speaker 1: and well not she never does that. But but um,
Speaker 1: you know then when you think some kids might she
Speaker 1: she certainly didn't do that. I love to hear it.
Speaker 1: I have a quest been I mean, we're on the
Speaker 1: topic of theater. I have a specific question to ask
Speaker 1: about Pacific Overtures. I because I think it's really fascinating
Speaker 1: that it is this. It's a Sondheim show that is like,
Speaker 1: probably is this fair to say b d like the
Speaker 1: least produced Sondheims share because because because because of so
Speaker 1: many reasons, there's a lot of production demands. Um. And
Speaker 1: in terms of the casting, it demands a big full
Speaker 1: cast of Asian dancers, singers, actors, what have you to
Speaker 1: recreate some like kabuki presentation. Um. And it's just it's
Speaker 1: just a very it's a very layered show. And so
Speaker 1: I feel like it both like is inspiring and it's
Speaker 1: a little bit sad that it is a show that
Speaker 1: like no one really that no one really gets, even
Speaker 1: even the most like even the biggest time free Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like the one that people don't really like. They
Speaker 1: don't really engage with. And it's got some of the
Speaker 1: most beautiful music in it and some of the most
Speaker 1: intelligent material and some of the most spectacular everything. It's
Speaker 1: it's a great it's a really interesting and it's certainly
Speaker 1: interesting to study. But it is so this is such
Speaker 1: a rich conversation to have, Like it's got so many
Speaker 1: layers to it. I mean, it is, let's call it
Speaker 1: what it is, a show written by two brilliant white
Speaker 1: guys about this very Japanese you know, it was it
Speaker 1: was a it was a bit of a folly for them,
Speaker 1: or kind of an experience. The way I look at
Speaker 1: it now looking back, I used to be absolutely just
Speaker 1: in love with it from top to about, you know,
Speaker 1: like it could do no wrong. But as I've gotten
Speaker 1: older and it kind of evaluated, well, what is it?
Speaker 1: What is appropriation? And what does it mean to me?
Speaker 1: And when is it really you know, if if I'm
Speaker 1: applying all my rules of appropriation, Pacific Overtures is in
Speaker 1: many ways like the Rogers and Eberstein shows of the
Speaker 1: of the of the fifties and sixties appropriation and and
Speaker 1: it just so happens that all of these shows, I'd say,
Speaker 1: I'd say the King and I and and and Flower
Speaker 1: Drum Song and and and this show, Pacific Overtures have
Speaker 1: an integrity to them that allows their appropriation to be
Speaker 1: acceptable to us for the most part. And and and
Speaker 1: so this was that and and Pacific Overtures is a
Speaker 1: show which has such kind of ambitious, intelligent um um
Speaker 1: aspirations that um, the idea of it being appropriation is
Speaker 1: really never discussed because um, it's such an interesting and
Speaker 1: wonderful and beautiful show, and because it gave us a
Speaker 1: lot of jobs, and because it put us you know,
Speaker 1: we did the show. We h. But this is what
Speaker 1: I want to ask, is that, like, what was it
Speaker 1: like working on that show? And to be because I
Speaker 1: I am like naively have until literally we did this
Speaker 1: thing over the summer. Matt and I were both involved
Speaker 1: and Beats project songs from I made bed song cycle
Speaker 1: that he put out in that that was really fun, fun,
Speaker 1: so fun. Um. But we were on a zoom call
Speaker 1: Beauty with like all these all these other actors and
Speaker 1: I and I had the terrible, terrible thought, Wow, it's
Speaker 1: so incredible that there are so many Asian like Broadway
Speaker 1: performance I was definitely like I had I had no
Speaker 1: business being there, but I was like, there's so many
Speaker 1: fantastic Asian and can happen to be gay men, gay
Speaker 1: men who were who were who were just these huge talents.
Speaker 1: And and when I when I think about Pacific Overtures,
Speaker 1: I go, man, like, it must have been a trip
Speaker 1: to like be part be a part of that orders
Speaker 1: to have any awareness of it, and think wow, like
Speaker 1: you were led to believe that there's a dearth of
Speaker 1: this kind of performer, of these kinds of people who
Speaker 1: are capable of putting on this kind of show, a
Speaker 1: show that demands so much from its performers. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: it really fucking I don't know. It bumps me out
Speaker 1: when I think, I mean, now, it's like we we
Speaker 1: we know this to be true, but like I mean,
Speaker 1: I really and this, I think this is like this,
Speaker 1: this moves beyond like any like cursory discussion about representation.
Speaker 1: I'm just thinking, like even even like even now and go, wow,
Speaker 1: I didn't realize we're all out here, do you know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying? Well, yeah, you were, you yourself had
Speaker 1: that experience being an Asian American person was separate from
Speaker 1: I mean, you actually had that AHA moment which surprised
Speaker 1: you and disappointed you at the same time. And for Nora,
Speaker 1: no no, just while you you were you were having
Speaker 1: an AHA moment that was was kind of great but
Speaker 1: also kind of sad at the same time. And and
Speaker 1: and and it hadn't occurred to you in the same way. Right,
Speaker 1: it's snuck up on you. I guess that's what I mean.
Speaker 1: And and and to me, it's there's all these different
Speaker 1: perspectives about representation and appropriation and all that. And one
Speaker 1: of them is the observance of history as it's playing
Speaker 1: out or or or the situation in the world as
Speaker 1: it's playing out. And then another thing which can be
Speaker 1: very different is how you feel about it or what
Speaker 1: your involvement or what you're overlapping with it is. Pacific
Speaker 1: Overtures was two thousand four four. Oh yeah, I guess
Speaker 1: it was two. That's episode was after I met Bryce,
Speaker 1: and it was um that those are your time. By
Speaker 1: the way, for me, there's for me, there's before Bryce
Speaker 1: and after Bryce as well. When I first saw the Help,
Speaker 1: but it was it was it was two thousand four
Speaker 1: and the original production was in nineteen seventy nineteen seventies
Speaker 1: six and UM. Then UM between that in nine two
Speaker 1: or so was Miss Saigon, and Miss Saigon plays this
Speaker 1: huge role in our timeline for going on UM kind
Speaker 1: of creating a conversation about the casting of Asian people
Speaker 1: in general, and after that say what you will about
Speaker 1: that conversation. There was a change in the way that
Speaker 1: we were taken seriously as musical theater performers, broadway performers,
Speaker 1: and a lot of jobs came from the many years
Speaker 1: that Miss Saigon ran and allowed us in many ways,
Speaker 1: not the only reason, but allowed us to establish UM
Speaker 1: a community of actors in New York who were a
Speaker 1: musical theater performers that continues to grow and be nurtured
Speaker 1: and to um strength in itself. And you realize throughout
Speaker 1: the course of this how much the experience of doing
Speaker 1: what you're doing has to do with the building of
Speaker 1: that community. You yourself are you know, in a in
Speaker 1: a situation where people say, well, how how come this
Speaker 1: has taken so a long? How come this is taken
Speaker 1: so long that there isn't another There hasn't been a
Speaker 1: person Asian person on SNL for ever ever there has been,
Speaker 1: and the default was always well, they just aren't any
Speaker 1: I mean, we just don't do that. We're not funny.
Speaker 1: And and the actually, the actual real answer is because
Speaker 1: we don't have a building block process or developmental process,
Speaker 1: or an educational process or an experiential process that leads
Speaker 1: us there and and safely gets delivers us there, so
Speaker 1: that the ultimate inevitability of it, it happens naturally. And
Speaker 1: and that's very like, that's a lot of things that
Speaker 1: need to be fixed in order for the world to
Speaker 1: be a better place. You know, it's like a lot
Speaker 1: of stuff that happens in and creates a situation that
Speaker 1: is easily written off as a talent issue or a
Speaker 1: or whatever. I mean. There's also the issue, Yes, there's
Speaker 1: an issue of of our relationship to our parents and
Speaker 1: what what happens to our relationships with them when we
Speaker 1: either come out or decide that we're going to tell
Speaker 1: them that we're going to be actors. Yeah, and then
Speaker 1: and then you and I have done both, yes, and
Speaker 1: it's it's they're similar reactions. They're similar reactions, and they're
Speaker 1: similar yeah, similar fears and and all of that, and
Speaker 1: it's there is not to be super general, but there's
Speaker 1: a cultural aspect to why certain generation of Asian American
Speaker 1: UH parents are are a little more controlling with their
Speaker 1: kids about what their future is sure, And so that's
Speaker 1: all part of swirling around in this whole thing. And
Speaker 1: then you have a show like Pacific Overtures, which creates opportunities.
Speaker 1: UM Missigan also creates opportunities, and there's a gratefulness to
Speaker 1: them that you sometimes have to kind of remind yourself,
Speaker 1: is is not the only you know that, that's not
Speaker 1: the only answers on the start to everything? Is someone
Speaker 1: else creating enough to the indebtedness? Yes, the indebtedness is
Speaker 1: not something that UM is. It should be a fixture
Speaker 1: and and and ore. And then the way that we
Speaker 1: think about things like I this is the whole chapter
Speaker 1: in Cathy Parker. It's the last chapter in essay in
Speaker 1: Kathy Park's book, which is like this feeling of indebtedness
Speaker 1: that it's like, well, I I should be grateful to
Speaker 1: be here is kind of it's a weird mental trap.
Speaker 1: But I I love what you're saying about this community
Speaker 1: building because I feel like I'm about to make a
Speaker 1: statement about you, about about about your beginnings, which I know,
Speaker 1: which which what which is? I mean you you have
Speaker 1: built this, You've built community your entire career. But also
Speaker 1: I feel like that has been informed by the fact
Speaker 1: that you started I mean, you started out doing in Butterfly,
Speaker 1: which was written by an ancient person like this, this
Speaker 1: is it. I don't know, like that is the perfect
Speaker 1: example of it being a self contained thing. That's right,
Speaker 1: that's the that's one of the more graceful ways to
Speaker 1: achieve what we are, what we what one can achieve
Speaker 1: is through self generation. You know. This is why songs
Speaker 1: from an On bade bead. That thing that you guys
Speaker 1: did with me that last summer, it was important to
Speaker 1: me because it was self generated, and it because it
Speaker 1: allowed me to express my point of view from mice
Speaker 1: but without any filter of anyone else's input. And and
Speaker 1: that is important for us to have a kind of
Speaker 1: purity to um the journey of getting where we are
Speaker 1: trying to get um. And yes that I don't know.
Speaker 1: I didn't even to interrupt, but that is what it was.
Speaker 1: It was an experience with an Asian American writer. I
Speaker 1: had never had such an experience before. It was a
Speaker 1: very rare thing and also was a It was a
Speaker 1: play that went to Broadway written by an Asian person.
Speaker 1: I don't think there are very many other examples of
Speaker 1: such a thing, which is amazing when you think about
Speaker 1: how well Broadway is doing. Now, Oh, I guess what's
Speaker 1: her name? You wrote? Um? Straight right men? Yeah, young
Speaker 1: jean Lee, Young jan Lee. And there are, um, surely others,
Speaker 1: but the fact that it's it's not that easy to
Speaker 1: kind of list them, and they're an example of what
Speaker 1: we're talking about. And my question is like, were you
Speaker 1: out your entire career or did that was that something
Speaker 1: that was later? And I also wanted to know if
Speaker 1: you being gay influenced your character on Lauren Order also
Speaker 1: being gay, or was that just like happenstance. It was
Speaker 1: kind of it was you know, I still don't know.
Speaker 1: I think it for me, to be quite honest, I
Speaker 1: felt that was really convenient and kind of like almost
Speaker 1: like not like I wouldn't call it jumping the shark,
Speaker 1: but I would say I had been on the show
Speaker 1: for eleven years, and it's goes to show you how
Speaker 1: thinn the writing was for the character that I was playing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this was never discussed until this moment, and that they
Speaker 1: felt comfortable just lobbing it out there to serve a
Speaker 1: plot point or a argument that was happening in the Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it was your character being offended at the insinua.
Speaker 1: Like it was like a thing of like there were
Speaker 1: there was like some sort of insinuation that like there
Speaker 1: was like a pedophile on the show they were dealing with,
Speaker 1: and it was it was really it was weird. It
Speaker 1: was it felt a little jammed in there, but but
Speaker 1: I remember it being an example of representation. Like I
Speaker 1: remember at that time everyone was talking about like what
Speaker 1: what like when it was it was like, I guess
Speaker 1: what would you call it turn of the century, like
Speaker 1: around two thousand ish where we started to see well,
Speaker 1: I'm just saying in general, we started to see more
Speaker 1: gay characters. And so I remember watching something on TV
Speaker 1: that was about representation and they were flashing through like
Speaker 1: the I don't know seven or eight gay characters on TV,
Speaker 1: and yours was one of them. And I was like, Oh,
Speaker 1: that's so funny that they include that, because that's a
Speaker 1: that's like a very very tertiary character on that show,
Speaker 1: and yet they're ticking it off as a way to
Speaker 1: pat themselves on the back in terms of representation, And
Speaker 1: I just thought that was so um that that is
Speaker 1: how I felt about it, And I also I did
Speaker 1: feel that that was it was fine for me. I
Speaker 1: just didn't think it was something to brag about. Absolutely
Speaker 1: did not think it was something to brag. But I
Speaker 1: didn't think it was unhealthy. But I did not think
Speaker 1: it was the cure to anything or or you know,
Speaker 1: like any great example of any kind of wonderfully generous
Speaker 1: thing um at that point. And but I was also
Speaker 1: uh really almost bitter or or sensitive about the fact
Speaker 1: that I, you know, that's to be super honest why
Speaker 1: I left the show and to begin with, because the
Speaker 1: part just didn't ever um sing to me at all.
Speaker 1: It was just always kind of um. Something that the
Speaker 1: people really liked about the character was that he never
Speaker 1: changed and he always gave you exactly what you wanted.
Speaker 1: But for me, it was not particularly interesting. And so
Speaker 1: for them to have thrown that and try to right
Speaker 1: at the end and to go, yeah, that's great, right right,
Speaker 1: like it was kind of like, oh, yeah, no, that's
Speaker 1: not what I meant. Really, that's not acting. That's me
Speaker 1: saying a line you wrote for you and your show.
Speaker 1: That's not a that's that's not a way to explore
Speaker 1: the character serving some ulterior some ulterior purpose. I think, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: but again I was thinking, like, not only you want
Speaker 1: to are you on a loop on like in Universal
Speaker 1: Studios Hollywood, but like probably somewhere at all times there
Speaker 1: is a Lauren utter Spu playing. So I'm sure the
Speaker 1: checks don't hurt. Yeah, they don't they And I was
Speaker 1: I was lucky that I got on the residual um
Speaker 1: heart before it changed. It changed drastically in the beginning
Speaker 1: of early two thousand's and um uh so that has
Speaker 1: been good. I mean it does. It doesn't get bigger,
Speaker 1: it gets smaller as it goes along. But it has
Speaker 1: been really helpful to me. I think it's time to
Speaker 1: ask the question. Yes, it's been sustaining, it's it's time
Speaker 1: to ask the question. And that question is um sort
Speaker 1: of the central question beauty of lost culture is this,
Speaker 1: which is what was the culture that made you? Say?
Speaker 1: Culture was for you? This is defining pop culture that
Speaker 1: you feel, in looking back on your life made you
Speaker 1: the person that you are in some way. And when
Speaker 1: you say the culture, you mean the object of culture
Speaker 1: or the event of culture, or just it can be
Speaker 1: as it can be as broad or as specific as
Speaker 1: you want. It can be like the town you lived,
Speaker 1: It can be like growing up in San Francisco, or
Speaker 1: it can be like you know this this thing that
Speaker 1: I experienced once, This is what part this is what
Speaker 1: makes the question beautiful nature of whatever you're gonna say.
Speaker 1: I'm just I think, you know, as if this was therapy,
Speaker 1: which it is not. Unlike um, I want to go
Speaker 1: with the first thing that pops into my mind and
Speaker 1: just follow it where it should go. Right, that's the
Speaker 1: actor's impulse. Yes, that for the first thing that comes
Speaker 1: to mind is that time period when Pacific Overtures came out.
Speaker 1: It was also the same year that A chorus line
Speaker 1: came out. The chorus line came out when I was
Speaker 1: fifteen or sixteen years old. I had been in one
Speaker 1: or two musicals, and I was hooked on the experience
Speaker 1: of being in the musical theater and began this weird,
Speaker 1: long process of thinking about doing it or you know,
Speaker 1: is this is I mean, it was a long process
Speaker 1: because I didn't dream of it for quite a long time.
Speaker 1: I just liked doing it. But at some point I think,
Speaker 1: and I think to this day, even there are not
Speaker 1: a rent a chorus line, a very few national Hamilton's
Speaker 1: certainly national news Broadway musicals, Broadway musicals that became national
Speaker 1: news or that became things that people knew, And then
Speaker 1: there was a lot more touring than of Course. Line
Speaker 1: certainly toured for many many decades after that, so there
Speaker 1: was an understanding of it. But the one thing that
Speaker 1: was a real UM moment was the star of UM,
Speaker 1: or arguably the star of of of Course Line, Donoma Chickne,
Speaker 1: was on the cover of Newsweek magazine. And I remember
Speaker 1: seeing that woman on the cover of Newsweek magazine and thinking, Wow,
Speaker 1: this is this isn't just like some play off in
Speaker 1: the you know, off way far I lived and I
Speaker 1: grew up in San Francisco, and I had an awareness
Speaker 1: of the impact of the particular show on to be
Speaker 1: dramatic the world UM, and that there was a shifting
Speaker 1: in the medium that I was not sophisticated enough to
Speaker 1: yet to understand or appreciate or uh uh grasp, which
Speaker 1: is that Michael Bennett, the kind of legendary UM director
Speaker 1: of that production, UM was changing the form and kind
Speaker 1: of turning it in and it and it and it
Speaker 1: reached people in a different way, and there was they
Speaker 1: were contemporary issues in the play you know, of course
Speaker 1: now least very quaint, but but at the time there
Speaker 1: were people coming out on stage and people you know,
Speaker 1: touching their tips and stuff, and and you went, oh, wow,
Speaker 1: this is like real life kind of theater that's also
Speaker 1: a musical, that um uh, it's also still kind of
Speaker 1: oddly family entertainment, and that um, I wanted to be
Speaker 1: in that business. I mean, I just I knew somehow
Speaker 1: at a very early age that I wanted to create
Speaker 1: theater or that I wanted to be a theater actor.
Speaker 1: Um And I wasn't sure how or what manifestation and
Speaker 1: were it would take me. I was lucky enough and
Speaker 1: when I was in high school to have a really
Speaker 1: great relationship with a high school drama teacher who really
Speaker 1: just opened the doors for me and in my own mind,
Speaker 1: you know, and kind of showed me that there were
Speaker 1: these tremendous possibilities. So at that time and I and
Speaker 1: then subsequently course line played a huge role in my
Speaker 1: in my recurring theme in my life. Um. I certainly
Speaker 1: saw it every time it came to town, and it
Speaker 1: came to town many times. And then I got a
Speaker 1: job after high school as a um An Usher at
Speaker 1: the theater where it also came, and I saw it
Speaker 1: maybe a hundred times. I watched it every night. I
Speaker 1: memorized it. I mean, it was, it plays, It's a
Speaker 1: show that play. And now I look back on it
Speaker 1: and I think, wow, gee, it's not as good as
Speaker 1: I remember it to be. You know. I actually have
Speaker 1: a kind of a come to you know moment where
Speaker 1: I think, let me evaluate it now as a growing
Speaker 1: up and a and a writer and whatever. And it's
Speaker 1: still wonder fall and I still have these wonderful, fond
Speaker 1: memories of it, but I have a different critical eye
Speaker 1: towards it. And and were you ever in it? Was
Speaker 1: in it? Yes? Do you know about this? No? No, no, no,
Speaker 1: this is all new to I was in it, but
Speaker 1: I was in it in a really powerful way. I
Speaker 1: was in the only production of it at East West
Speaker 1: Players in l A. The It was an all Asian cast,
Speaker 1: of course long and it's all people. That are many
Speaker 1: people that I still know now and and and and
Speaker 1: are and and there was that same kind of experience later,
Speaker 1: many years later, that I had with the cast of
Speaker 1: Pacific Overtures, which is and glowing. You might not ever
Speaker 1: have we may not not yet have had this experience,
Speaker 1: which is well, the zoom was the experience of being
Speaker 1: in a show with a bunch of other Asian people
Speaker 1: and without even effortlessly there's this kind of shorthand and
Speaker 1: this this sense of of closeness to one another because
Speaker 1: we all have a very similar kind of pain, really,
Speaker 1: and and that that is just a layer of the
Speaker 1: working experience. That's really really I wish this on anybody.
Speaker 1: Just between the breaking of bread and the rehearsal process
Speaker 1: and and the kind of looking out for each other
Speaker 1: and everything, there's a real sense of of understanding each other.
Speaker 1: That was the first time I had it when I
Speaker 1: was in chorus line at East West, and then I
Speaker 1: had it again in Pacific Overtures in two four, like
Speaker 1: you said, and and that's a really oh memorable color
Speaker 1: of experience. I want to put a pin in chorus line.
Speaker 1: But yeah, just just the only fassimile of that that
Speaker 1: I have ever had was I've told you this right
Speaker 1: right beat like that, the shooting that scene. I was
Speaker 1: in one scene of the pilot for Nora, but shooting
Speaker 1: that scene, I remember leaving that leaving that day and
Speaker 1: being like, wow, we talked about wood ears. In between takes,
Speaker 1: we talked about we talked about like I was like,
Speaker 1: what are your mustionoms. I was like, that's never happened
Speaker 1: to me before. You mentioned that when you came from
Speaker 1: shooting it, that it was that it had an impact
Speaker 1: on you. I remember that day and I was like,
Speaker 1: and I said, and I like said out loud, and
Speaker 1: this this sounds this sounds weird. But I was like,
Speaker 1: this is what white people must feel all the time.
Speaker 1: I'm like, this is I was like, I've never and
Speaker 1: then I looked at the call I was like, oh, look,
Speaker 1: and like the top four people on the call sheet.
Speaker 1: I was like, I've never played someone's family member, um,
Speaker 1: the lead person, the lead the leads family member. I'm like,
Speaker 1: this is all wild. And granted I only I had
Speaker 1: only been like a day player and the stuff that
Speaker 1: I had done in the past and prior to that,
Speaker 1: but like, and even now it's something that like is
Speaker 1: incredibly rare. Yes, I mean even now for me it's
Speaker 1: it's there's still I mean, I've never had a relationship
Speaker 1: with anyone and that you said that nor was your
Speaker 1: first time dating someone in and then you're you're dating
Speaker 1: Jennifer Usito. I love from you know, zero loser to
Speaker 1: like the you know, the luckiest person in the world. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're too. Hotties getting together on Jesus. Wait, do you
Speaker 1: see the crazyness that ensues in season two? It's really
Speaker 1: Can we say that I'm having a lot of fun
Speaker 1: already this season too? Can we say that? Okay, the
Speaker 1: vibe is so good. It is it is people say
Speaker 1: this all the time and it gets boring. That is
Speaker 1: a really very good crew, it is. Yes, their energy
Speaker 1: is very good and it's very conducive to comedy because
Speaker 1: you know how comedy can be just like a wet
Speaker 1: you know, you can get like closed down by some
Speaker 1: moment that happens off, you know, between takes, and then
Speaker 1: you're dry or you can't can't do what you're supposed
Speaker 1: to do. But this is very upbeat, it's very very professional,
Speaker 1: and it just works for me. I really like these people. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Nora was making me laugh. There's if there's if there's
Speaker 1: a gag ril, it's gonna be a good one. Yeah,
Speaker 1: just just because of me and Nora. Just there's always
Speaker 1: got to be a gag ril. It's a real culture.
Speaker 1: It's really Culdron number ninety one. There's always always people
Speaker 1: want to see the gags. People want to see laughing.
Speaker 1: They want to see him laugh, you know, like I
Speaker 1: feel that the people want to see Bowen laugh. Can
Speaker 1: I ask you, what do you like working with Bowen?
Speaker 1: Because he can become challenging. You're putting me on the spot.
Speaker 1: We haven't really done it that, No, we haven't. We
Speaker 1: had that one scene, the Woodrior scene that was really
Speaker 1: are one like moment where we had went back and
Speaker 1: forth a few times. Really, you know, we haven't had
Speaker 1: that much. We had to be sat at the table
Speaker 1: for that other scene, which that that other scene. I
Speaker 1: was so I was so out of it that and
Speaker 1: I remember not I was remember going home that day
Speaker 1: shooting that kitchen scene and being like, I really fucked.
Speaker 1: I funked up in front of Laura, you know. I
Speaker 1: was like, he's always like that. No, no, no, but
Speaker 1: like it was a mood you were in, though, it
Speaker 1: was a mood I was in, and I really felt
Speaker 1: because at that point, at that point, we were just
Speaker 1: beginning to like get to know each other. And I
Speaker 1: was and I still had and this is still probably
Speaker 1: a little present, but I'm like man, there's something about
Speaker 1: there's something about me like acting opposite b D that
Speaker 1: like is really tripping me up just because it's him,
Speaker 1: you know, just because this is someone who means all
Speaker 1: of these things. Um, but anyway, yes, no need for that.
Speaker 1: I mean, look, it's really and it was really I
Speaker 1: mean we were still getting to know each other and
Speaker 1: all of that stuff. So I understand that it's a
Speaker 1: nerve wracking whenever you start any project, let alone something
Speaker 1: where like and and I mean it is true like
Speaker 1: Bowen is sent expressing like he he you are BD one.
Speaker 1: I mean like it's and also like you know, Aquafina
Speaker 1: is like she was such a huge is such a
Speaker 1: huge deal. Like so I get like feeling like, oh God,
Speaker 1: like I just just shot up out and I left
Speaker 1: a couple of days like being like, well, I hope
Speaker 1: that was good. Because especially we come from we come
Speaker 1: from live comedy and become and as you know, coming
Speaker 1: from theater, you're used to a reaction and that reaction
Speaker 1: sustaining you going forward. And so when you act for
Speaker 1: the camera, um, it's obviously different because you have to
Speaker 1: move on. And I did a little tiny guest thing
Speaker 1: on the first season of Nora, And that was something
Speaker 1: I remembered about. It was like it felt like it
Speaker 1: was professional and moving, but also that it was loose
Speaker 1: enough where the comedy could happen and it but like
Speaker 1: you were given a take for you you know what
Speaker 1: I mean? You know what I mean, like and that's important,
Speaker 1: Like what you're saying with comedy, it's it's it's rare
Speaker 1: to get that on the first take because often the
Speaker 1: people that are performing in the comedy on camera are
Speaker 1: people that you know, maybe they're maybe they do come
Speaker 1: from live performance, maybe their cast because they are a
Speaker 1: big old fucking ham and it's gonna take a take
Speaker 1: or two to get it. Man improvised a line, um
Speaker 1: and Nora. Uh. The most famous person in my phone
Speaker 1: is a tie between Hillary Clinton and Billie Island. It
Speaker 1: did they get in? They kept they keep that, they
Speaker 1: did keep that at And then that's that's Matt Rodgers outleb. Well,
Speaker 1: before we were before, because before we were talking about Nora,
Speaker 1: I just want to say, you're you're directing an episode.
Speaker 1: He's directing an episode, which is mind blowing to me
Speaker 1: and also like a dream come true for me, and
Speaker 1: it's everything that I ever wanted and it's really great
Speaker 1: and it's just started today. Is all the kind of
Speaker 1: pre production and stuff. Um, and you know, it's a
Speaker 1: little crazy because I'm in this episode that's being shot
Speaker 1: while I'm doing the pre production, and then when we
Speaker 1: get into actually shooting the episode i'm directing, I'm also
Speaker 1: in that. So I'm having that that what I would
Speaker 1: call the John Camera Mitchell experience. And who is he's
Speaker 1: you know, well that might be something different experience depend
Speaker 1: you're talking about, but yeah, so I'm really into it
Speaker 1: and I'm great, you know, really really just so happy
Speaker 1: that I was asked and I was. It's a lot
Speaker 1: of fun and and these episodes, I think all of them,
Speaker 1: but this particular one, I really really like it. So
Speaker 1: it's it's going to be easy to direct it. So
Speaker 1: that will be nice, except that Bones not in it,
Speaker 1: which is not good for me. Can I tell you
Speaker 1: my I think I explicitly said to the to the EPs,
Speaker 1: They're like, what do you what do you want Damn
Speaker 1: to do season two? I was like, I just want
Speaker 1: Edmund and Wally interaction. I was like, I want scenes
Speaker 1: with Bradley Darryl Wong. And that shows how much they
Speaker 1: listened to you. I guess they did listen to no nobody.
Speaker 1: He's a nobody on set whatever said the same thing.
Speaker 1: I want the same thing. I think that would be fun.
Speaker 1: But let's just hope that it's not over yet, you know.
Speaker 1: I think I think the good things are in store. Yes,
Speaker 1: not God, Jesus, little Jesus. Um. Okay, should we close
Speaker 1: the loop on this chorus line? Yeah? I want to hear.
Speaker 1: I want to hear your question. Sorry, I just had to.
Speaker 1: I had to bring up the directing thing because I
Speaker 1: was so excited. Of course, oh my gosh, of course,
Speaker 1: favorite song, like is it like what I did for
Speaker 1: a lot like like that? I feel like I gotta
Speaker 1: admit I don't know know mine, My mine is Mine
Speaker 1: is Music in the Mirror and the check. I mean,
Speaker 1: have you ever seen Jane Karkowski's version of that on
Speaker 1: Ally mcbeel. A lot of gays out there don't know
Speaker 1: that Jane Karkowski sang Music in the Mirror on Alan.
Speaker 1: She did, and you can YouTube it, and she's stunning
Speaker 1: in and she gives you the whole dance number and
Speaker 1: she fucking belts the end and it's great. But I
Speaker 1: think that's my favorite number, What I Did for Love
Speaker 1: Us a close second. Yeah, she does the whole number. Wow. No,
Speaker 1: I don't, I mean, I'm not really I don't know
Speaker 1: if they're maybe is there any particular song that really is,
Speaker 1: you know, exemplifies my affection for sure. It was a
Speaker 1: whole kind of experience. I just I mean, I mean
Speaker 1: being just kind of like, I don't know what how
Speaker 1: to call it, like impressed or or my breath was
Speaker 1: slightly taken away by the fact that there was no
Speaker 1: set and there was just this black stage with numbers
Speaker 1: on it, and it just was like so bold at
Speaker 1: that time to just not have a set and and
Speaker 1: and and all of that stuff. And I also had
Speaker 1: what appeared to be at the time a really great
Speaker 1: um quick change at the very end of the show,
Speaker 1: where everybody goes from dance close to these like fancy
Speaker 1: costumes and there, you know, little things like that. And
Speaker 1: then there was there is a song about teenage angst
Speaker 1: and growing puberty, which is a really great song, which
Speaker 1: is a huge number, and I liked that, but and
Speaker 1: also was really into the lighting. The lighting was very geometric.
Speaker 1: If you sat in the balcony, you could see all
Speaker 1: of the shapes and hard angles and and colors that
Speaker 1: the fair and must have. The lighting designer used which
Speaker 1: was very not like a regular musical. It was very angular.
Speaker 1: It was suited the choreography. It created shapes and spaces
Speaker 1: and different times and all the kinds of different kinds
Speaker 1: of There was a kind of lots of different usages
Speaker 1: for it. That was really great. There was no set
Speaker 1: and so that the lightning became a huge part of
Speaker 1: the transformative quality of of the um. That element Wow,
Speaker 1: you gotta you also bow and you also have to
Speaker 1: listen to on Barbara streisand she did like a recent
Speaker 1: album which was like um she got like movie starts
Speaker 1: to come in and sing with her, and her and
Speaker 1: Hathaway and Daisy Ridley did Now at the Bell at
Speaker 1: It was really good. It was really good. And the
Speaker 1: feature at which is Barbara streisand talking about it is
Speaker 1: also really good because Barbara streisand talking about anything. Have
Speaker 1: you ever met Barbara? I don't think I've ever met Barbara. Well,
Speaker 1: we got I met a lot of people in passing
Speaker 1: or whatever, and but she's not one of them. That's
Speaker 1: what I felt like. I could ask you that and
Speaker 1: maybe I'd get a, Yes, you might, and out of
Speaker 1: anyone who's ever been on this show, you are the
Speaker 1: person that's most likely to have met Barbara, although Will
Speaker 1: Ferrell might have met Barbara. No, you know, I was
Speaker 1: at I know this is gonna sound supertentious, but I
Speaker 1: was at the same White How state dinner that Barbera. Wow,
Speaker 1: whose state dinner was that? Jugent Tao? And yeah it
Speaker 1: was the It was Jugent Tao at Obama's dinner from
Speaker 1: Fujin Town and I sat at Obama's table. Wow, did
Speaker 1: you have anything good to say? No? No, I'm joking.
Speaker 1: I was completely tongue tied. I mean, I never have
Speaker 1: that experience where I don't know, you know, where I
Speaker 1: usually sit down next to a stranger or whatever. This
Speaker 1: was the strangest experience. I brought my mother, she was
Speaker 1: my plus one date, and I said my mom to
Speaker 1: my mom, would going to the White House. And then
Speaker 1: we we got there and we were given our little
Speaker 1: fancy engraved thing with the table number twenty three, and
Speaker 1: we were like, great, we're walking to good number. And
Speaker 1: the people there it was like, you know, like um
Speaker 1: miss um, who was there? Michelle? Michelle and and and
Speaker 1: I'm one of who I meant was Michelle Kwan and
Speaker 1: oh that's fancy the architect, my uh Lynn and um,
Speaker 1: just people like that, you know. And and and so
Speaker 1: we're walking looking for the room and we're going with
Speaker 1: twenties three. I guess that's the room on the end,
Speaker 1: and we're going in there in twenties. I think it's
Speaker 1: that long table underneath the painting of Lincoln. And then
Speaker 1: we get there and like and we're looking at the
Speaker 1: names and the people at our table. It was my mother,
Speaker 1: me Michelle Barack built the Clintons, the Carters, what John Kerry,
Speaker 1: it was mayor Daily from Chicago. It was, um, it was.
Speaker 1: It was the strangest thing ever. I mean, I think
Speaker 1: they were trying to figure out who could kind of
Speaker 1: like bridge the gap or something. And my mother, who
Speaker 1: you know, might have been a part of it too.
Speaker 1: It just all was. It was the craziest thing, was wonderful.
Speaker 1: I mean, we were just to say we were sitting
Speaker 1: at the table with the with the Obama's, but Barbara
Speaker 1: Streisand was in another room. That's what I'm saying. It's
Speaker 1: so weird, like she was often the bleachers they said
Speaker 1: at Barbara tonight, we have right, So, so what is
Speaker 1: is conversation very casual? They're like, are they all like,
Speaker 1: hey girl, do you see this and the news? Like
Speaker 1: what do you think of Dancing with the stars? Are
Speaker 1: they kind of saying that kind of chatter? It is
Speaker 1: like that, But then it isn't It isn't you know.
Speaker 1: I mean I sat directly across from Michelle Obama and
Speaker 1: I I could not I couldn't think of anything that
Speaker 1: seemed worthy to discuss with her. And now I think
Speaker 1: of plenty of things that I could or would have said,
Speaker 1: but I was really like sitting there eating just kind
Speaker 1: of I sat next to Rosalind Carter. I was like
Speaker 1: talking to Rosaln Carter about their foundation and stuff like that,
Speaker 1: and oh, what is it that you're doing? And they've
Speaker 1: gone to Syria and you know, you know, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: what am I doing? You know, I'm on a TV show? Great,
Speaker 1: you know, like it's like they're going to Syria and
Speaker 1: he's building habitat for humanity houses and you know, running
Speaker 1: all that stuff. So I felt I felt decidedly unworthy.
Speaker 1: I was thrilled. My mother was there. My mother was
Speaker 1: chatting it up with John Kerry and mayor Daily. They
Speaker 1: got along great. She was sitting between John Kerry American.
Speaker 1: She was at that table because you're the closest thing
Speaker 1: we have to an Asian American president, and that is
Speaker 1: why you were there exactly. You hear that, Andrew Yang,
Speaker 1: and know your place there we go, stop grabbing bananas.
Speaker 1: You can't keep your hands to yourself and those bodegas,
Speaker 1: Andrew Yang, those bananas don't want nothing to do with you.
Speaker 1: Then when we left alone, before we move on to
Speaker 1: I don't think so, honey. I think I have a
Speaker 1: very important question to ask Bet Wong. Do you think
Speaker 1: Captain LEEH Shang was attracted to paying? I would like
Speaker 1: to think that he was. But I think this is
Speaker 1: a to you. This is up to you to say,
Speaker 1: you know. And I don't want to disappoint anyone, and
Speaker 1: I don't want to be a coward or anything like that.
Speaker 1: Oh but you know what, Okay, No, Fluidity is a
Speaker 1: big It's a very important thing to acknowledge. Fluit. He
Speaker 1: is is something. When we made the movie, fluidity was
Speaker 1: not a word. We didn't talk about liquidity. Now we
Speaker 1: have fluidity. Now we can watch Chang and his choices
Speaker 1: and his actions and see it through the lens of fluidity,
Speaker 1: and this whole idea that there's a there's a needle
Speaker 1: and it goes from one zero to a hundred and
Speaker 1: it's always. It doesn't have to be in one place
Speaker 1: or another. It can move. You can change your pronouns
Speaker 1: next the day one day and change the next day
Speaker 1: if you want, and and and and and that's that's
Speaker 1: good and should be the way it is. So in
Speaker 1: that case, I'm really I'm recalibrating my answer. Of course
Speaker 1: he was. Otherwise he wouldn't been doing all that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: why why would he Why what other reason would there be? Right?
Speaker 1: I mean, he's not, he's he's it's it's not. It's
Speaker 1: it's very binary to think that he was. But I
Speaker 1: did used to say, oh, no, come on, you guys,
Speaker 1: that's that's that. Don't go there. That's right, that's best.
Speaker 1: But but but you know, it does remind me of
Speaker 1: the music video that Bone was in. We we we
Speaker 1: texted a little bit about this that you and they
Speaker 1: got the Boner Bros. Video and that the whole, the
Speaker 1: whole notion of of that kind of thing that is
Speaker 1: really fluidity. I think it's like, can you do you
Speaker 1: have to say it's one thing or another. Can't you
Speaker 1: just say, well, there's this kind of inclination, but it
Speaker 1: doesn't mean I'm gay. Whatever, it doesn't. Why why can't
Speaker 1: people do that? They're they're really afraid to do that.
Speaker 1: They can't do it, so they have to write a
Speaker 1: song about it to kind of pat all. They're just
Speaker 1: comfort about it. And that's hilarious in its own right.
Speaker 1: To me. I'm still entertained by the song. But at
Speaker 1: the same time, I'm going, come on, you guys, come on.
Speaker 1: So so so we're talking about this sketch that was
Speaker 1: a pre tape sketch on us and l Um written
Speaker 1: by Back and Kyle and Frank Gillespie, and we'll spend
Speaker 1: We'll Stephen. It's a bachelor party in the woods and
Speaker 1: then um the strippers come, and then all the boys
Speaker 1: break out into a song about um, this is the
Speaker 1: highlight of their lives. That they're getting hard next to
Speaker 1: their friends, that they're getting boners, that they're getting boners
Speaker 1: next to their friends, and so funny when you just
Speaker 1: steal it, that's what it is. It's what it is.
Speaker 1: Together and b D and b D text me the
Speaker 1: first of all, I just can I just out b
Speaker 1: D is like you watch every week, you watch every week,
Speaker 1: and I watched a lot because of you. Oh come on,
Speaker 1: I do. I want to know what you're doing, and
Speaker 1: I want to be able to discuss it with you. Um.
Speaker 1: You know we're not that close. Let's just call you know,
Speaker 1: just pull the wool over. Not everyone in Hollywood is
Speaker 1: very close. Yeah, that's right, and and and but I
Speaker 1: do UM and I love it. I think it's a
Speaker 1: golden age for the show. I think you're in on
Speaker 1: it at a really good time as the wild age
Speaker 1: can by it. I certainly depended on it and in
Speaker 1: bad In and my family depended on the show in
Speaker 1: bad in hard times in this past year, um in
Speaker 1: a huge way. And during the whole Trumpet, the whole
Speaker 1: Trump administration, and and so there was a there is
Speaker 1: a huge um allegiance. I have to it. Actually, m M,
Speaker 1: that's nice. That's really nice to hear. So anyway, so,
Speaker 1: so so Bed text me the next day being like,
Speaker 1: I I talked to you about this boner video and
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, like, what do you want to talk about?
Speaker 1: He was like, He's like were you were you basically saying,
Speaker 1: should I just pull up the we basically that the
Speaker 1: people who wrote it are repressing something or no, that's
Speaker 1: not what you mean. Well, what I was, I was
Speaker 1: kind of saying what I just said a minute or
Speaker 1: two ago, which is they see it in a very
Speaker 1: binary way, like I'm not gay, and so here's the
Speaker 1: irony of me getting a boner next to my Sure,
Speaker 1: the fact that he is there may or may not
Speaker 1: play a part in your boner. I mean your your friend, Yeah,
Speaker 1: your friend, the friend of the person singing whatever verse
Speaker 1: of the song. And and and it's okay, it's okay
Speaker 1: to see it that way, but it's very no pun
Speaker 1: intended hard for people to see it that way. They
Speaker 1: they need to know they're not gay. They need they
Speaker 1: absolutely need to know they're not gay so that they
Speaker 1: can tell whoever that it's and and and even if
Speaker 1: they had a kind of a fluid moment where they well,
Speaker 1: let's say they always you know, you hear about it
Speaker 1: this all the time, blame alcohol or something on their
Speaker 1: actions or choices. Even if they did that, it's still
Speaker 1: something that happened. And why did it happen? And what
Speaker 1: what did the out what role did the alcohol play.
Speaker 1: I think it's fascinating. I love I love thinking about it.
Speaker 1: And I think the proof in the putting of all
Speaker 1: of this is the way women regard this whole same issue.
Speaker 1: There are much completely different about it in many cases,
Speaker 1: if not to speak generally, but that you can have
Speaker 1: someone actually identify one way and then not identify that
Speaker 1: way anymore, and then identify that way again or have
Speaker 1: a moment of of fluidity. I just think there's there's
Speaker 1: blockage happening that does not need to happen. I'm not
Speaker 1: saying anything about any pretty particular on SNLT no no no, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: no no. But but the fact that they are so
Speaker 1: easily slip into that role of adopting that um posture
Speaker 1: is interesting to that the joke is so easily delivered
Speaker 1: through that like filter lens, while you know, through the
Speaker 1: filter of masculinity, where masculinity is basically like self harm.
Speaker 1: At this point, I feel like, I feel like, yes,
Speaker 1: and you want to think about women getting together like women.
Speaker 1: Women sinking up through periods is not like an ironic thing.
Speaker 1: It's just this thing that's like it's like, oh, isn't
Speaker 1: that beautiful? Yes, exactly exactly. That's exactly. That's a good example,
Speaker 1: I think, got it. I mean, I think that straight
Speaker 1: men should just do what gay men do, and once
Speaker 1: they get boners, they should just do what we do
Speaker 1: and just like fuck each other. Especially fabulous. It's fabulous.
Speaker 1: It's fabulous. I think it's fabulous. They should. I welcome
Speaker 1: any straight man that's around me and gets a boner.
Speaker 1: Don't be scared of it. I have it. I have
Speaker 1: yet to check off on my list hooking up with
Speaker 1: a straight guy, and I just got to do it
Speaker 1: before I die. Somebody. I think it will be. I
Speaker 1: don't think it'll be fantastic. I just think it will
Speaker 1: be something yes, and and something to remember or to
Speaker 1: talk about or too yeah, and then I write my
Speaker 1: sketch about it. This this all goes back to Lee
Speaker 1: shang Um who who felt must have felt something he did.
Speaker 1: He did paying is the only other male character to
Speaker 1: whom Lee shang shows affection. Well. Also, remember it was
Speaker 1: Mulan the whole time, but it was Mulan the whole time,
Speaker 1: so it didn't matter. There was obviously an attraction there
Speaker 1: and it didn't actually matter the matter the person. And
Speaker 1: I feel that in the new movie, the live action movie.
Speaker 1: It wasn't Lee Shang. It was like a different character
Speaker 1: that the US is a stand in, but he gay,
Speaker 1: and we'll leave it at that. They went there, Did
Speaker 1: they go there? No, they didn't go there, But they
Speaker 1: didn't need to because the longing looks in live action
Speaker 1: you can't get away with the sort of trickery of
Speaker 1: animation where it's just like, oh, he slides down the
Speaker 1: begin he's a little too close and it's like whoo whoo, whoop.
Speaker 1: I'm falling off the chair because I'm a little nervous
Speaker 1: to be close to you know. It's like, not gonna
Speaker 1: be like that on live action. It's this guy goes
Speaker 1: into the barracks, looks at Mail presenting Mulan, and I
Speaker 1: fux the ship out of him. And you can't tell
Speaker 1: me that there wasn't something there. And I almost feel
Speaker 1: like if they released Mulan now in the way that
Speaker 1: they did, with all the panic about gender and gender
Speaker 1: expression and like what is and isn't, it would be
Speaker 1: such a controversy now, like you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: Like I feel like it would be a harder selling now. Yes,
Speaker 1: I really do I think that that people conservative parents
Speaker 1: would be like fucking up the wall about it, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean? But I also think that that
Speaker 1: is what you just said, there's a perspective shift. I mean,
Speaker 1: you could see it that way. Is he seeing a
Speaker 1: man or a woman when he's sucking her, jim her
Speaker 1: slash him? What is he seeing? And what why? He
Speaker 1: doesn't even know himself? We can we know what we
Speaker 1: know from our experience. But that's what's so beautiful about
Speaker 1: it is it doesn't matter. It's it's it's the fact
Speaker 1: is it's it's in some ways neither here nor there.
Speaker 1: He she is neither one nor the other, and that's okay,
Speaker 1: And then it's okay for him to have whatever response
Speaker 1: that comes with that. Yeah, making a percentage, you know,
Speaker 1: deciding what percentage of desire he has for one or
Speaker 1: the other is not useful anymore. Really, I don't think
Speaker 1: how did you feel when they flew in Osmond to
Speaker 1: sing your part? Because I feel like that are you
Speaker 1: allowed to talk about that? Are okay? What's the relationship
Speaker 1: with Donnie? Yeah? I don't have any relationship with Donnie.
Speaker 1: I was told first of all, when I was kind
Speaker 1: of fired. You know, they didn't they didn't um they
Speaker 1: brought him in, and and any when one could just
Speaker 1: say any number of reasons why they brought him in,
Speaker 1: whether it was because they thought liked him better, or
Speaker 1: they thought they wanted somebody who who had you know,
Speaker 1: he has said, but the perfect Disney name. But I
Speaker 1: can't say that's the only reason I think they were.
Speaker 1: One of the things that they said, just sell it
Speaker 1: to me, to let me down easy, was well, you know,
Speaker 1: his singing voice sounds more like your singing voice than
Speaker 1: your singing voice. What does that mean. It means trickery, foolishness, betrayal,
Speaker 1: it means, it means it was I just thought. I
Speaker 1: just nodded and said, okay, I don't believe that for
Speaker 1: a damn second. I'm glad I was a part of
Speaker 1: any part of it. I really was, and stupid enough
Speaker 1: to say that that you believe it, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, like I can see you're receiving that at
Speaker 1: the time, and being like, okay, that has to make sense.
Speaker 1: It's so dumb, and being like, wait a second, let's
Speaker 1: get down to business about this. About that? How about that?
Speaker 1: That is interesting? That is so funny. They said, your
Speaker 1: singing voice doesn't sound as much like you as Donniahsman. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think I think there's some emotion to this recounting
Speaker 1: that I'm I'm I respect you sort of withholding and
Speaker 1: because I feel like you must have felt a certain way,
Speaker 1: but I don't, you don't. You don't have to tell us.
Speaker 1: He obviously felt a certain way. What what do you
Speaker 1: mean about about being about being fired from the song?
Speaker 1: Well as the singer, he still famously is the human voice,
Speaker 1: of course, but like, yeah, yeah, and I and I
Speaker 1: I didn't This was probably the first time in a
Speaker 1: big way where well, you know, not that it's not
Speaker 1: that not that interesting, but where I was forced to
Speaker 1: deal with something that was out of my control, okay,
Speaker 1: and and over my as a as a famously controlling
Speaker 1: person or a person who was always looking for control
Speaker 1: or gravitates towards want feeling like they needed it was
Speaker 1: real adjustment for me, like to go, oh, I don't
Speaker 1: really get it's nothing. I can't beg them. They're not
Speaker 1: going to change the shore, So okay, I guess I
Speaker 1: got to really like, uh just kind of like try
Speaker 1: to accept this, you know. And they did it to
Speaker 1: Mingna to right, they because Leah so Longa sang it,
Speaker 1: but it's ming not a singer. Maybe she maybe that
Speaker 1: was the thing where she's not I don't think she is,
Speaker 1: so she was probably not laboring. This is always the
Speaker 1: thing that is bumped me. I mean, I thought about
Speaker 1: this for decades at this point. You know, why didn't
Speaker 1: they let b D sing the Damn Song? Because, like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think they I think maybe they didn't like the
Speaker 1: way I sang yet I don't know for sure, though. No,
Speaker 1: it's because they're scared of the Church of Latter day
Speaker 1: Saints and the Church of Latter day Saints was going
Speaker 1: to storm the ball if they didn't have their boy
Speaker 1: in it. Okay, that's really what it is. And that's
Speaker 1: that's that's all. That's how we're gonna They couldn't wait
Speaker 1: for them. They couldn't wait for their own princess. They
Speaker 1: couldn't wait for the Mormon princess. We're gonna get some, yeah,
Speaker 1: they for yeah, whatever that's going to be like Genie
Speaker 1: in the Lake or whatever. I don't know what it's
Speaker 1: going to be more Genie in the Lake. I don't
Speaker 1: know a bit, all right, I don't know Mormon culture,
Speaker 1: Like what are the things that they do, like casinos.
Speaker 1: What is it gonna be like a casinos a casino
Speaker 1: owner's daughter that wants to be an ice skater? Like,
Speaker 1: was that going to be the Mormon Disney princess? Yeah? Sure,
Speaker 1: Hans says. I think we'll get hate mail for not
Speaker 1: talking about sv We talked about SVU. We talked about SPU, Hans,
Speaker 1: So maybe you need to listen, okay, straight, is there
Speaker 1: more to say about it? You know? I know, okay,
Speaker 1: all right, unless you want to say to cut you out.
Speaker 1: I mean, it was very good to me and I
Speaker 1: was really thankful to be on it and it and
Speaker 1: it was perfect the way, exactly the way it was.
Speaker 1: People always want me to go back to it, and
Speaker 1: I'm not. I don't think that's gonna happen. Don't go back.
Speaker 1: Can you say three words to describe Marisca your reverend
Speaker 1: dedicated moral. We love our moral queen, We love an irreverend,
Speaker 1: We love an irreverent moral queen, dedicated as well. We
Speaker 1: can't forget you can ever get dedicated. Okay, So Bowen,
Speaker 1: is it time? It's time? This is I don't think so, honey,
Speaker 1: this is our one minute segment. I don't think that's right.
Speaker 1: After reads his text. No, I'm trying, you know. I know,
Speaker 1: I'm trying to pull up my stopwatch because I want
Speaker 1: to see my sixty seconds going by. Oh no, no, no,
Speaker 1: we'll hold a timer up. Don't worry. Matt and I
Speaker 1: are gonna go first. This is a true control king,
Speaker 1: and it's actually a frontrunner for the title of app
Speaker 1: control king because he wants control over the over the timer,
Speaker 1: but he know he doesn't know we got I don't
Speaker 1: want control over it. I want to make sure that
Speaker 1: I see it, so that I know, hope you're going
Speaker 1: to see it. Be DENA are similar in this way
Speaker 1: where we are self sufficient and not gets mistranslated for
Speaker 1: I didn't say domineering. All right, I think you both
Speaker 1: should dominate me. That's how I feel. Oh, this is
Speaker 1: I don't think Sony. This is our one minute segment.
Speaker 1: We take wo minute to rail against something in culture
Speaker 1: that's really getting under our skins, as it were. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'll go first. I have something I've been thinking about
Speaker 1: this and it's something actually it's actually been lifelong. Okay,
Speaker 1: I love it. Wow, Oh god, I wish I could
Speaker 1: do like twenty of these. But oh one, on your
Speaker 1: twentieth time back, you'll have done money. This is Matt Rodgers.
Speaker 1: I don't think so, honey. His time starts now. I
Speaker 1: don't think so, honey. Wheel of Fortune this is stupid game.
Speaker 1: First of all, there's no skill involved. And even if
Speaker 1: there were, no one that they cast has an ounce
Speaker 1: of it. They spend the goddamn wheel. It lands on
Speaker 1: bankrupt eight out of ten times. It's so fucking boring.
Speaker 1: And then they look up at the wheel it says
Speaker 1: it's like g blank a T. The word is goat
Speaker 1: and they go I'd like to solve glass. It's like, so,
Speaker 1: what are you fucking talking about? Also, stop buying val idiots.
Speaker 1: You're losing money. Guess see see us in every word
Speaker 1: guess T. If you have a tea up there, mama,
Speaker 1: guess h if there's a cue, that's when you buy
Speaker 1: a You these idiots guessing are when it says p
Speaker 1: blank s s what is priss? Stop? They are fools.
Speaker 1: You don't need any skill involved. Jeopardy is the real game.
Speaker 1: They need to give a bigger wall roll. Pat say
Speaker 1: Jack sucks and I'd like to solve the puzzle. I
Speaker 1: don't think so. Money oh no, and that's one minute
Speaker 1: and you didn't solve it, right, that's not correct. Wow,
Speaker 1: that is brave and one of your best. I'm in trouble.
Speaker 1: I constantly watch a Wheel of Fortune and I'm like,
Speaker 1: after Jeopardy, you're gonna put on This is fucking It's
Speaker 1: like it's like watching a New York Times crossword puzzle
Speaker 1: and then watching kids play hop scotch. It's like, get
Speaker 1: the hell out of here. That that's those are the
Speaker 1: those are the those are the poles. After you loop up,
Speaker 1: you don't go play checkers, and Jeopardy is getting you
Speaker 1: looped up, and then you want to get fucked and
Speaker 1: then they give you Wheel of Fortune. That is a
Speaker 1: very interesting way to look at it. Listen, after Jeopardy,
Speaker 1: I'm loose and I'm thinking let's go, and then then
Speaker 1: they put no, never never, um never. That was brave, right,
Speaker 1: And I love this world in which the answers are
Speaker 1: four letter words when you would be blown away in fact, no,
Speaker 1: of course, no, I know where. I know exactly what
Speaker 1: you're talking about. It's a funny thing to YouTube, like
Speaker 1: Wheel of Fortune fails and see when when they really
Speaker 1: need to, it's really impossible to get it wrong, and
Speaker 1: they're like, I'd like to solve the puzzle Chicken Ran,
Speaker 1: and it's like, no, it was Chicken Run. And whenever
Speaker 1: Pat say, Jack is like, oh that sucks. You are
Speaker 1: really dumb. Yeah, So it is funny for that reason,
Speaker 1: but I think the game is stupid. The prizes are
Speaker 1: so small. They're winning no money. It's like they live
Speaker 1: with like twelve thousand dollars and they're like cool. And
Speaker 1: it's like the longest running show in the world. Vana White,
Speaker 1: the poor woman, she like does she like her life?
Speaker 1: Will never know? But one time we did. We did
Speaker 1: one time on the show explore what the inner life
Speaker 1: of we think Vana is, and we act actually quite dramatic.
Speaker 1: It actually lends itself well to a play b D.
Speaker 1: If you want to produce, I'm looking for rich material. Yeah,
Speaker 1: feeling for rich material. We've actually basically already scripted the
Speaker 1: whole Vana White play, so we'll be in wait. Honestly,
Speaker 1: but really quickly. This is this isn't even a pitt.
Speaker 1: I just want to get beaties thoughts. I think it's
Speaker 1: a play that is game show, uh, set in the
Speaker 1: game show, or a game set in a game show,
Speaker 1: and that you're seeing the game show play out, but
Speaker 1: then there's like the staging of it is such that
Speaker 1: like there's like a backstage area in which like the
Speaker 1: politics between these two hopes, but like the dynamic between
Speaker 1: these two hosts is a little toxic and combative. Oh yes,
Speaker 1: So then you see the backstage antics and then then
Speaker 1: you see them on screen and see them covering up
Speaker 1: or being um kind of left like what they present
Speaker 1: to everyone else on stage back. But meanwhile, her life
Speaker 1: is crumbling, yes, yes, and he's toxic and he's toxic,
Speaker 1: and she's been she's been at this job for decades
Speaker 1: at this point, and her only job is to be silent,
Speaker 1: look pretty, and and if you think about it, the
Speaker 1: spinning of the wheel is actually really a good metaphor,
Speaker 1: because what what are they doing if noting the wheels
Speaker 1: every day? And that's what's so beautiful. And they never
Speaker 1: get anywhere, they're just nope, just because that's not what
Speaker 1: happened in a circle. It's actually really culture number thirteen.
Speaker 1: You never get anywhere, that's not what happens in a circle. No,
Speaker 1: all right, okay, I think it's time for me. I
Speaker 1: think it's time for Bo and Yang and look at Harry.
Speaker 1: Look at how hot he is. I mean, who could
Speaker 1: get away with that outfit? When we were watching that,
Speaker 1: I was going, Okay, that is success, man, Yeah, that
Speaker 1: is I don't know anybody that could wear that the way,
Speaker 1: the way genius look. And then he was covering up
Speaker 1: with these boas and I almost came in here and
Speaker 1: did I don't think so, honey, Harry's BoA's because I
Speaker 1: feel the boas or a hat on a hat, and
Speaker 1: you didn't feel No, I didn't feel that strong. I mean,
Speaker 1: he can really wear whatever he wants or or as
Speaker 1: little as he wants. Um but I did. I do
Speaker 1: love the opportunity to see his torso um So the
Speaker 1: boa was was in the way for me personally well,
Speaker 1: but there reveal exactly and we love that. Then the
Speaker 1: reveal was satisfying exactly, and that's theater. The road comes
Speaker 1: back to theater and so bowing, this is gonna be
Speaker 1: your time to do. I don't think so, honey. Can
Speaker 1: I say, you're backlit in a very like sort of
Speaker 1: like glamorous way right now like I'm front No, but
Speaker 1: you're you have backlighting too, and it's the aesthetic is
Speaker 1: very good so it's a little fairs, a little flare
Speaker 1: on the lens, on the lens, like a goddamn J. J.
Speaker 1: Abrams movie in the Zoom Star Trek. Oh my god,
Speaker 1: Oh my god, if if we're so lucky. All right,
Speaker 1: So this is Bowen Young's I don't think so, honey,
Speaker 1: and his time starts now, I don't think so honey. Construction,
Speaker 1: what are you doing. We have the buildings we need
Speaker 1: for the rest of humanity. And this is this is
Speaker 1: actually true. There is enough space for every person in
Speaker 1: this world to be housed to live in. And I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna make it about um, you know, a houseless situation.
Speaker 1: I'm saying, stop building things because it's actually ruining people's lives,
Speaker 1: mine included. Pay to have noise. And I know this
Speaker 1: is such a hackney New York complaint, but it's this,
Speaker 1: it's this enduring one for a reason because they think
Speaker 1: they can get away with it, because they think this
Speaker 1: is part of your life. Is that you have to
Speaker 1: put up with construction? Actually we don't. New York is
Speaker 1: fine the way it is building wise. We don't need
Speaker 1: any new developments. We don't need any new crazy, crazy buildings.
Speaker 1: I don't want to. I don't want all of these
Speaker 1: dorms for adults and finance bros specifically built around the
Speaker 1: city anymore dorms for adults. I don't think so, Honey.
Speaker 1: That was Bowen Yang's one minute. It's how, it's how,
Speaker 1: it's how they're marketing. It's how they're marketing these buildings
Speaker 1: to people. Now it's like, well, there's a pool table
Speaker 1: in the in the common area. It's like amenities, but
Speaker 1: it's not even amenities to me, are like washer and
Speaker 1: dryer and unit dish washer. It's like movie there's more. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's right, Peloton Peloton room. There's a gym and a
Speaker 1: Peloton room. Now that's how it is. I'm afraid of
Speaker 1: doing this. I'm so afraid of doing this. You're why
Speaker 1: would you be afraid? Because you've done it many times
Speaker 1: and because I don't know, But can you can you
Speaker 1: handle this? This? This happens all the time, right, What
Speaker 1: happens all the time is that Matt and I do
Speaker 1: it and are all I don't think somebody is at
Speaker 1: this point are like c plus is throughout, Like the
Speaker 1: people who are novel at it are actually the ones
Speaker 1: who like are able to bring some electric active thing
Speaker 1: to and they come in and they hem and home. Meanwhile,
Speaker 1: I just did one on a forty year old game show.
Speaker 1: Bowen did it on construction. Neither of us are going
Speaker 1: to get anything done with this. Will a fortune is
Speaker 1: can not going anywhere. Cuomo has got his hands full.
Speaker 1: So it's like, what the hell would you have an
Speaker 1: opportunity to enact change right now? You really do? I
Speaker 1: don't think I'm going to enact change. I'm just going
Speaker 1: to be you know. I mean I have to. I
Speaker 1: have to be as honest as I can about a situation.
Speaker 1: You know. I try not to be angry about things.
Speaker 1: So here when I'm angry about something, I'm going to
Speaker 1: just talk about what I'm angry about. You know. Okay? Good?
Speaker 1: And this is this is your Here we go, Irks
Speaker 1: is a great way to put it perfect. This is
Speaker 1: beauty Wongs. I don't think so, honey. His time starts now.
Speaker 1: I don't think so, honey. I mean, I know that
Speaker 1: I'm late to this party, but crime scene vanishing at
Speaker 1: the Cecil Hotel is something that not abide. This is
Speaker 1: four hours or more of time that I will never
Speaker 1: ever ever get back in my life. I first should
Speaker 1: say watched as part of my presentation that the the
Speaker 1: the soul of Elisa Lamb must be spinning in her grave,
Speaker 1: and we must take a moment to say that this
Speaker 1: is all based on um, you know, this kind of commercialized,
Speaker 1: over hyped and um poorly produced production was her expense,
Speaker 1: and I find absolutely terrible there was to get even
Speaker 1: into the whole terrible other aspect of it, which is
Speaker 1: the problem of taking paying attention to too much people
Speaker 1: on the internet. That should stop right now. I don't think, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're actually very topical, very topical, because we've discussed on
Speaker 1: this very podcast that Bowen does not think so, honey,
Speaker 1: this that the only thing that the show unintentionally does
Speaker 1: well is to talk about the culture around crime now
Speaker 1: around intentionally unintentionally because it was such drivel, the way
Speaker 1: it was made garbage. I was so I'm really mad
Speaker 1: about it. I think it's you've already talked about this,
Speaker 1: I know, after people have already heard about it. No,
Speaker 1: we want to hear what you said. Well, well, I
Speaker 1: mean it was absolutely irresponsible and it was um manipulated,
Speaker 1: like kind of like taking facts and just trying to
Speaker 1: make a narrative out of them that didn't exist. You
Speaker 1: could see it. It was also stretched beyond Oh just
Speaker 1: be just stretched hopelessly stretched. Yes, And I was, I'm
Speaker 1: I'm I'm critical of things like this or things that
Speaker 1: are you know, if if something I feel like I
Speaker 1: get ahead of something or something like that. But I
Speaker 1: really felt this was intelligence insulting for most people. Do
Speaker 1: you feel do you feel that we have hit the
Speaker 1: breaking point with true crime where maybe it's just like
Speaker 1: we need we all need a break, because I feel
Speaker 1: like the reason why it was bad is because they
Speaker 1: were like, oh, we have an opportunity to do a
Speaker 1: true crime thing, like, let's do it without really thinking
Speaker 1: about the case, whether or not it was appropriate or
Speaker 1: like would fit. Yeah, I mean they yes, of course, yes,
Speaker 1: I think that. I mean I was. It was now
Speaker 1: on my you know, the algorithm on my my, my Netflix,
Speaker 1: all this true crime is coming up and it's all
Speaker 1: Netflix produced, and I'm over it. I'm like, well, I'm
Speaker 1: not watching any more of those because you you blew
Speaker 1: your credibility on that one. Um, you know there are
Speaker 1: other ones like if it wasn't you know, certain other
Speaker 1: shows that I've seen in other places when they produced them, Well,
Speaker 1: you wanted to see that content and and and that,
Speaker 1: but this really damaged me. I felt really abused. And
Speaker 1: this is very this is specific, but were you not
Speaker 1: heartbroken when they cut to the parents anytime they like
Speaker 1: showed the parents. I was just like, God, these two
Speaker 1: the Canadian Asian people who like immigrants, like who like
Speaker 1: have no idea about any of that, got on a
Speaker 1: plane or where whatever, however they got here and just
Speaker 1: got thrown into this horrible, horrible and and the show
Speaker 1: doesn't clearly they didn't want to be involved. They didn't
Speaker 1: attach themselves to it. There they've extricated themselves from it,
Speaker 1: and there's a reason for it, because it's it's not
Speaker 1: good and it wasn't going to serve them well or
Speaker 1: her their daughter. She was not served well. She was
Speaker 1: manipulated and turned into some kind of bizarre character, when
Speaker 1: in fact she had real challenges in her life, apparently
Speaker 1: if you were to believe everything you saw on the show.
Speaker 1: But and that's terrible too, that's like what are we doing?
Speaker 1: How who did that? And didn't think twice about it?
Speaker 1: You know, Like it takes a lot of people to
Speaker 1: make a show like this, and somebody didn't raise their
Speaker 1: hand and say, hey, what do you what are we
Speaker 1: actually trying to do here? Yeah, we've talked about it
Speaker 1: so much that I'm like, I hadn't I need to
Speaker 1: watch it, but everything we've said has been negative, So
Speaker 1: I guess I'm not going to watch them. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I could not recommend it less is that. Yeah? Yeah.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't say watching just for the research or like,
Speaker 1: oh so that we can talk about it. I would
Speaker 1: say it's a waste of time. Did you watch the vow?
Speaker 1: I did watch the vow and I watched the other
Speaker 1: one on see and I want I want to say,
Speaker 1: ever something to the readers. If you like me and
Speaker 1: Bowen got exhausted by the Vow, you gotta watch Seduced.
Speaker 1: Seduced is better. And you know who brought Seduced to
Speaker 1: my attention. Molly Shannon in the makeup trailer was like,
Speaker 1: you have to watch Seduce. Molly loves like all reality shows,
Speaker 1: like all all this stuff, and she was like, no,
Speaker 1: don't watch the vow, don't watch the vow. Watched Seduced,
Speaker 1: and I watched Seduced, and she was right. And I'm
Speaker 1: telling you every bead knows Seduced was better, would you agree?
Speaker 1: I think that there was something really um not right
Speaker 1: about the vow. I kind of got into it for
Speaker 1: the first part. I was really and I did like
Speaker 1: the way they the way they positioned the vow where
Speaker 1: they where. They led us into this whole thing by
Speaker 1: showing us what was great or what apparently it seemed
Speaker 1: like it was great about the program. And then you
Speaker 1: got pulled into it just the way everyone else did. Yes,
Speaker 1: and then this otherd Seduced is like a one eighty
Speaker 1: kind of weird. It's a fascinating, uh different perspective to have.
Speaker 1: The only thing that kind of bugs me about Seduced
Speaker 1: is that itself produced by the person who's trying to
Speaker 1: make their Proba Oxenberg. And that is like, there's long
Speaker 1: I said, there's all these long kind of her talking
Speaker 1: to the camera, right yeah, And I said to my husband,
Speaker 1: I said, there's nobody there in the room in here.
Speaker 1: She's just talking. She's sitting there her story. I did
Speaker 1: feel like the way that she was saying the lines,
Speaker 1: I was like, is she being directed badly or she
Speaker 1: just like she definitely isn't natural on screen presence. But
Speaker 1: it was really interesting, like Seduced was just four episodes.
Speaker 1: It was just like the facts, they have Keith Ranieri
Speaker 1: on camera saying things like, you know, kids actually want
Speaker 1: to be raping. He's literally saying things like this. Meanwhile,
Speaker 1: the vow only kind of alludes to that maybe or
Speaker 1: maybe it gets to it later. And I feel like
Speaker 1: there was an ego pump in the vow because it
Speaker 1: was people that were involved in it, that were part
Speaker 1: of that thing administratively, that felt like they really needed
Speaker 1: to dig themselves out of it with more and more
Speaker 1: and more and more and more. Meanwhile, Seduced, it's four episodes.
Speaker 1: They literally show him on camera being a monster, and
Speaker 1: you get a direct perspective from someone who was like
Speaker 1: truly victimized by it. So it's just I I preferred Seduced,
Speaker 1: And I say that to the readers as an audience member,
Speaker 1: and also at the end of the day, neither one's
Speaker 1: some great documentary film. No, if you're looking at for that,
Speaker 1: then don't watch either of them. To compare INDIAA Valerie
Speaker 1: Cherished inspired though, that that's that's the perfect intersection of
Speaker 1: culture that we talked about here on this Culture and
Speaker 1: a brilliant way to cap off an episode that has
Speaker 1: been our true joy. We thank you so much for
Speaker 1: coming on. You are I mean to quote Wendy Williams,
Speaker 1: he's got a point. He's got a point in icon
Speaker 1: and icon. He's all a legend and he is the moment.
Speaker 1: Now come on, come on now, it's beauty wong um
Speaker 1: some I love you so much. Someone who I don't
Speaker 1: know is and the girls say this now in in
Speaker 1: a facetious way, like that person is the blueprint. This
Speaker 1: is someone who is the blueprint knows that it's about
Speaker 1: community building, because they say before you don't think about
Speaker 1: building a career, thinking about building a community. This is this.
Speaker 1: Everything that Beaty does is about that at its at
Speaker 1: it's root, and it's so so so it's I hate
Speaker 1: saying this word, but it's so inspiring. But we do
Speaker 1: love to end every episode with a song. Who's we
Speaker 1: life is a willow in it bent? Right now? You
Speaker 1: did the next one? I don't well, he's gonna see
Speaker 1: he's gonna take a week to get off for good evermore,
Speaker 1: but for now, bye bye mhm