1 00:00:04,795 --> 00:00:21,155 Speaker 1: Countdown with Keith Olderman is a production of iHeartRadio. Donald 2 00:00:21,275 --> 00:00:25,795 Speaker 1: Trump is going to be convicted of violating the Espionage 3 00:00:25,875 --> 00:00:30,435 Speaker 1: Act because there are smoking guns, and then there are 4 00:00:30,475 --> 00:00:34,515 Speaker 1: the kinds of smoking guns so profound and so productive 5 00:00:35,195 --> 00:00:40,675 Speaker 1: that they turn the entire Eastern seaboard sky orange. And 6 00:00:40,875 --> 00:00:46,235 Speaker 1: this one is the second kind. CNN got the clip 7 00:00:46,355 --> 00:00:50,835 Speaker 1: of the actual recording of Trump showing off classified Joint 8 00:00:50,915 --> 00:00:54,555 Speaker 1: chiefs of Staff military plans for attacking Iran, and then 9 00:00:54,595 --> 00:00:57,195 Speaker 1: the Washington Post got the recording, and then the New 10 00:00:57,275 --> 00:00:59,955 Speaker 1: York Times got the recording. I have not yet checked 11 00:00:59,955 --> 00:01:05,355 Speaker 1: my high school paper, the Hackley Dial. First, this fulfills 12 00:01:05,875 --> 00:01:10,595 Speaker 1: the primary rule of Trump. Everything is worse than you 13 00:01:10,635 --> 00:01:14,915 Speaker 1: could have possibly imagined. He is laughing as he commits 14 00:01:14,955 --> 00:01:19,075 Speaker 1: crimes prohibited by the Espionage Act. His flunky is making 15 00:01:19,155 --> 00:01:27,635 Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton jokes. He's making Anthony Wiener jokes. He's ordering cokes. Second, 16 00:01:28,395 --> 00:01:30,955 Speaker 1: this has to have come from Mark Meadows. It has 17 00:01:31,035 --> 00:01:36,075 Speaker 1: to have. Third, this fulfills the prophecy of Ryan Goodman 18 00:01:36,115 --> 00:01:40,155 Speaker 1: from Just Security. It is not just Trump committing a crime, 19 00:01:40,755 --> 00:01:47,995 Speaker 1: It is Trump narrating his own crime as he commits it. Fourth, 20 00:01:48,515 --> 00:01:52,795 Speaker 1: the recording has a PostScript something that was, for whatever reason, 21 00:01:52,955 --> 00:01:56,555 Speaker 1: not included in the transcript of the tape that was 22 00:01:56,595 --> 00:02:00,195 Speaker 1: included in the charging document as filed by Special Counsel 23 00:02:00,315 --> 00:02:07,115 Speaker 1: Jack Smith. There's bonus content here. Just before the recording begins, 24 00:02:07,275 --> 00:02:10,315 Speaker 1: the name of the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Mark Milly, 25 00:02:10,395 --> 00:02:16,395 Speaker 1: has been invoked Donald Trump, convicting himself of violating eighteen 26 00:02:16,595 --> 00:02:21,235 Speaker 1: US Code seventy nine to three transmitting defense information a 27 00:02:21,355 --> 00:02:26,275 Speaker 1: fine or up to ten years in prison. We joined 28 00:02:26,275 --> 00:02:28,795 Speaker 1: Donald Trump already in progress. 29 00:02:29,155 --> 00:02:30,955 Speaker 2: He's a bad sick people. 30 00:02:31,475 --> 00:02:35,955 Speaker 1: That was your cue, you know, against you What started 31 00:02:36,035 --> 00:02:38,515 Speaker 1: right at time when Millie's talking about, oh you were 32 00:02:38,595 --> 00:02:40,355 Speaker 1: going to try to do now that they were. 33 00:02:40,195 --> 00:02:42,435 Speaker 2: Trying to do that before you even were sworn in. 34 00:02:42,835 --> 00:02:46,795 Speaker 2: That's right, Maria, overthrow your life. Well with Milly, let 35 00:02:46,835 --> 00:02:48,955 Speaker 2: me see that. I'll go show you an example. He 36 00:02:49,075 --> 00:02:53,995 Speaker 2: said that I wanted to attack an. 37 00:02:55,235 --> 00:02:57,475 Speaker 3: Isn't it amazing to have a big pile of Diapersie 38 00:02:57,675 --> 00:02:58,555 Speaker 3: just came in a fluter. 39 00:03:00,515 --> 00:03:04,315 Speaker 2: This was him. They presented me. This is off the record, 40 00:03:04,315 --> 00:03:07,355 Speaker 2: but they presented me this. This was him. 41 00:03:08,155 --> 00:03:11,315 Speaker 3: This was the Defense Department in him. 42 00:03:11,355 --> 00:03:13,475 Speaker 2: We looked at him. This was him. This wasn't done 43 00:03:13,515 --> 00:03:17,515 Speaker 2: by me. This was him, all sorts of stuff pages long, 44 00:03:19,275 --> 00:03:25,755 Speaker 2: and let's see yere I just found. 45 00:03:25,795 --> 00:03:28,915 Speaker 3: Isn't that amazing? This totally wins my case, you know, 46 00:03:29,875 --> 00:03:34,995 Speaker 3: except it is like highly cond this secretive for it. 47 00:03:35,555 --> 00:03:37,755 Speaker 3: Look look at this you attack. 48 00:03:38,075 --> 00:03:40,715 Speaker 2: And Hillary would put that out all the time. You know, 49 00:03:42,555 --> 00:03:49,755 Speaker 2: she sent it to Anthony. By the way, isn't that incredible? 50 00:03:50,555 --> 00:03:53,235 Speaker 3: I was just because we're talking about it and either 51 00:03:53,315 --> 00:03:55,955 Speaker 3: he said he wanted to attack ran and what. 52 00:03:59,195 --> 00:04:03,315 Speaker 2: This was done by the military given to me. I 53 00:04:03,355 --> 00:04:07,355 Speaker 2: think we can trouble linked I to see. 54 00:04:07,475 --> 00:04:10,035 Speaker 3: Yeah, also died lesser. 55 00:04:10,795 --> 00:04:13,195 Speaker 2: Yes, his president. I could have did less now I 56 00:04:13,235 --> 00:04:17,795 Speaker 2: can't you know, but this is is that interesting? It's 57 00:04:17,875 --> 00:04:21,875 Speaker 2: so cool. So I'm look, we hear ivan and you 58 00:04:21,955 --> 00:04:24,395 Speaker 2: probably almost didn't believe me, but now you believe me. 59 00:04:24,995 --> 00:04:29,355 Speaker 3: It's incredible, right, it brings some brings, some coats in place. 60 00:04:30,515 --> 00:04:33,835 Speaker 1: That as CNN and later The Post and The Times 61 00:04:33,955 --> 00:04:37,075 Speaker 1: aired and posted it last night from the meeting Trump 62 00:04:37,115 --> 00:04:41,715 Speaker 1: held with two writers working on well ghostwriting Mark Meadows autobiography, 63 00:04:42,195 --> 00:04:45,995 Speaker 1: recorded at Trump's club at Bedminster, New Jersey in July 64 00:04:46,115 --> 00:04:51,075 Speaker 1: twenty twenty one. The most fawning references, and the loudest 65 00:04:51,115 --> 00:04:55,115 Speaker 1: sycophantic laughter appears to be from the Trump aide Margot Martin, 66 00:04:56,075 --> 00:04:59,635 Speaker 1: and the new part. At the end, Trump continues to 67 00:04:59,715 --> 00:05:02,995 Speaker 1: marvel that Millie's name has been invoked and went out 68 00:05:03,035 --> 00:05:06,075 Speaker 1: of his big pile of papers. Millie's secret plan to 69 00:05:06,115 --> 00:05:09,755 Speaker 1: attack Iran. Quote just came up. The new quote we 70 00:05:09,795 --> 00:05:13,795 Speaker 1: had not heard or read before. It's so cool. I mean, 71 00:05:13,915 --> 00:05:17,075 Speaker 1: it's so look her and I and you probably almost 72 00:05:17,115 --> 00:05:21,315 Speaker 1: didn't believe me, but now you believe me. Trump has 73 00:05:21,395 --> 00:05:25,395 Speaker 1: violated national security to boast how cool it is that 74 00:05:25,475 --> 00:05:30,675 Speaker 1: he has this document. It's like me and a baseball card, 75 00:05:31,115 --> 00:05:36,195 Speaker 1: except there are very few goddamn classified baseball cards. And 76 00:05:36,235 --> 00:05:41,235 Speaker 1: the recording not only disproves but defies his latest lie 77 00:05:41,275 --> 00:05:43,955 Speaker 1: about this meeting that he might have been talking about 78 00:05:43,955 --> 00:05:47,075 Speaker 1: Iran and General Milly, but there were no classified or 79 00:05:47,115 --> 00:05:52,835 Speaker 1: defense documents being shown to unauthorize people. Just quote newspaper stories, 80 00:05:53,155 --> 00:05:58,275 Speaker 1: magazine stories, and articles. On tape, Trump is heard saying, see, 81 00:05:58,315 --> 00:06:02,435 Speaker 1: as President, I could have declassified it. On tape, Trump 82 00:06:02,555 --> 00:06:05,715 Speaker 1: is heard saying these are the paper. On tape, Trump 83 00:06:05,835 --> 00:06:08,595 Speaker 1: is heard saying this was done by the military and 84 00:06:08,675 --> 00:06:12,435 Speaker 1: given to me. On tape, Trump is heard saying, let 85 00:06:12,435 --> 00:06:16,115 Speaker 1: me see that. I'll show you an example. On tape, 86 00:06:16,155 --> 00:06:19,915 Speaker 1: Trump is heard saying it's pages long. You hear him 87 00:06:19,955 --> 00:06:23,355 Speaker 1: flipping through the pages, showing it off. Let's see here. 88 00:06:24,235 --> 00:06:29,355 Speaker 1: On tape, Trump is heard saying, except its highly confidential 89 00:06:29,435 --> 00:06:34,195 Speaker 1: secret information. He not only breaks the law by showing 90 00:06:34,235 --> 00:06:37,835 Speaker 1: two aids and two people working for Mark Meadow's defense information, 91 00:06:38,115 --> 00:06:42,635 Speaker 1: maybe classified defense information, but he repeatedly confirms he is 92 00:06:42,795 --> 00:06:46,275 Speaker 1: holding the document as he does so, and he confirms 93 00:06:46,275 --> 00:06:48,675 Speaker 1: who wrote it and why, and how long it is, 94 00:06:48,795 --> 00:06:52,075 Speaker 1: and he's showing it off, presumably with that same idiotic 95 00:06:52,195 --> 00:06:54,755 Speaker 1: smirk on his face that he'd show when he signed 96 00:06:54,795 --> 00:06:57,475 Speaker 1: some nefarious act in the Oval office, and he would 97 00:06:57,515 --> 00:06:59,595 Speaker 1: hold it up for cameras so you could see his 98 00:06:59,755 --> 00:07:05,995 Speaker 1: gigantic madman's electro cardiogram signature. It could be worse for 99 00:07:06,075 --> 00:07:11,595 Speaker 1: him in one way, only if there was video. That 100 00:07:11,675 --> 00:07:18,035 Speaker 1: assumes there isn't video. Ten days ago, Ryan Goodman from 101 00:07:18,235 --> 00:07:21,555 Speaker 1: Just Security went on the Bill Crystal podcast. I quoted 102 00:07:21,635 --> 00:07:25,155 Speaker 1: him here, and he asked, rhetorically, what would happen if 103 00:07:25,195 --> 00:07:29,515 Speaker 1: the recording itself of the conversation about the milli Iran 104 00:07:29,675 --> 00:07:33,955 Speaker 1: document were to turn up, it would be something visceral, 105 00:07:34,435 --> 00:07:38,875 Speaker 1: something undeniable, Trump in essence, doing play by play of 106 00:07:38,875 --> 00:07:43,315 Speaker 1: his own crimes as he committed them. What would happen, 107 00:07:43,555 --> 00:07:46,395 Speaker 1: Goodman wondered, to the dynamic of this case, to the 108 00:07:46,435 --> 00:07:50,835 Speaker 1: public's understanding of it, to even the unblinking belief by 109 00:07:50,875 --> 00:07:54,875 Speaker 1: some in Trump's cult that he's not lying. If a 110 00:07:55,035 --> 00:07:57,395 Speaker 1: major news organization were to get a copy of the 111 00:07:57,435 --> 00:08:00,795 Speaker 1: recording and put it on television or on YouTube, as 112 00:08:00,795 --> 00:08:03,275 Speaker 1: I phrased it on the nineteenth, not a transcript, but 113 00:08:03,275 --> 00:08:07,635 Speaker 1: Trump's actual crime. I am in Trump's actual voice, as 114 00:08:07,715 --> 00:08:13,115 Speaker 1: Trump actually commits it, playing on CNN dot com, New 115 00:08:13,195 --> 00:08:17,315 Speaker 1: York Times dot com, Washingtonpost dot com. Let me go 116 00:08:17,435 --> 00:08:21,555 Speaker 1: check the hackleydial dot com now available without a subpoena 117 00:08:22,115 --> 00:08:26,875 Speaker 1: or a search warrant or a prescription. And I am 118 00:08:26,875 --> 00:08:29,995 Speaker 1: not kidding myself, and you should not kid yourself. It 119 00:08:30,035 --> 00:08:32,955 Speaker 1: will not sway a majority of his cultists. These are 120 00:08:33,035 --> 00:08:35,555 Speaker 1: the twenty first century versions of the people who literally 121 00:08:35,635 --> 00:08:38,235 Speaker 1: drank the kool aid at Jonestown. They will not be 122 00:08:38,355 --> 00:08:43,635 Speaker 1: converted to reality, but it will sway some of them. Hell, 123 00:08:44,475 --> 00:08:47,475 Speaker 1: I expect Donald Trump to die of old agent prisoner me. 124 00:08:47,595 --> 00:08:49,555 Speaker 1: But I think he's guiltier than I thought he was 125 00:08:49,595 --> 00:08:55,555 Speaker 1: before I heard that recording. That recording does raise a 126 00:08:55,755 --> 00:08:59,715 Speaker 1: procedural question, again brought up by the estimable mister Goodman. 127 00:09:00,355 --> 00:09:02,795 Speaker 1: Why has Trump not yet been charged with a crime 128 00:09:02,955 --> 00:09:07,075 Speaker 1: in New Jersey where that recording was made, and those 129 00:09:07,075 --> 00:09:11,315 Speaker 1: events took place, retaining the Milli document took place in Florida, 130 00:09:11,355 --> 00:09:14,275 Speaker 1: He's been charged for it there. Remember, they still don't 131 00:09:14,315 --> 00:09:17,355 Speaker 1: know where the Milli document is. But if Trump could 132 00:09:17,435 --> 00:09:21,075 Speaker 1: somehow convince a jury that he had declassified it, even 133 00:09:21,075 --> 00:09:23,595 Speaker 1: though he clearly implies on tape that he had not 134 00:09:23,675 --> 00:09:27,515 Speaker 1: declassified it and wistfully regrets that he had not declassified it. 135 00:09:28,035 --> 00:09:30,355 Speaker 1: If he does that, or he just fuzzes the issue 136 00:09:30,395 --> 00:09:33,435 Speaker 1: up sufficiently, the fallback would be to charge him under 137 00:09:33,475 --> 00:09:37,875 Speaker 1: the transmitting clause of the Espionage Act. That only has 138 00:09:37,915 --> 00:09:41,475 Speaker 1: to be defense information. It does not have to be classified, 139 00:09:43,195 --> 00:09:49,515 Speaker 1: and it's on a recording, that recording. Where did CNN 140 00:09:49,555 --> 00:09:54,835 Speaker 1: and the Post of the Times get that recording? Mark Meadows, 141 00:09:55,595 --> 00:09:59,595 Speaker 1: I don't literally mean from him, I don't know, but 142 00:09:59,715 --> 00:10:02,395 Speaker 1: from him and or his legal team. Who else has 143 00:10:02,435 --> 00:10:05,955 Speaker 1: a motive? There's no real debt damage to Jack Smith's 144 00:10:05,995 --> 00:10:09,475 Speaker 1: prosecution of Trump if the Millie Iran document is revealed, 145 00:10:09,515 --> 00:10:11,875 Speaker 1: I mean, if the plan is to introduce clips at 146 00:10:11,915 --> 00:10:16,275 Speaker 1: the trial of Trump during the twenty sixteen campaign talking 147 00:10:16,315 --> 00:10:21,515 Speaker 1: about Hillary Clinton mishandling secret information tapes that have been 148 00:10:21,555 --> 00:10:24,915 Speaker 1: out there now for seven years. Having this tape out 149 00:10:24,915 --> 00:10:28,115 Speaker 1: there is not going to spoil the jury pool. But 150 00:10:28,195 --> 00:10:31,835 Speaker 1: I do think the Special Council's Office releasing it themselves 151 00:10:32,435 --> 00:10:35,595 Speaker 1: would presumably violate at least some of the seventy five 152 00:10:35,795 --> 00:10:40,715 Speaker 1: thousand pages of Department of Justice boy scout rules. I 153 00:10:40,715 --> 00:10:43,235 Speaker 1: mean in Jack Smith. After all, we have a special 154 00:10:43,235 --> 00:10:46,995 Speaker 1: counsel who, until he confirmed the indictments, none of us 155 00:10:47,115 --> 00:10:52,475 Speaker 1: knew what his voice sounded like. In theory, this could 156 00:10:52,515 --> 00:10:55,355 Speaker 1: be the copy recorded by the Trump side. Presumably that 157 00:10:55,515 --> 00:10:58,155 Speaker 1: Margot Martin, the one who was at the Miami hearing 158 00:10:58,955 --> 00:11:03,275 Speaker 1: when Fox misidentified her as Milania. But she was at 159 00:11:03,275 --> 00:11:06,955 Speaker 1: the Miami hearing at Trump side. She has not abandoned 160 00:11:07,035 --> 00:11:13,595 Speaker 1: him yet unless she's wearing a wire. You think the 161 00:11:13,635 --> 00:11:17,595 Speaker 1: two unidentified writers working for Meadows released this tape. It's 162 00:11:17,675 --> 00:11:20,035 Speaker 1: always seemed unlikely to me that they were involved with 163 00:11:20,075 --> 00:11:22,675 Speaker 1: the tape getting first to Jack Smith and now to 164 00:11:22,795 --> 00:11:26,675 Speaker 1: Anderson Cooper, largely because if Meadows was paying them to 165 00:11:26,795 --> 00:11:31,155 Speaker 1: interview Trump for his quote autobiography, the recording legally belongs 166 00:11:31,195 --> 00:11:36,075 Speaker 1: to Meadows, not them. I mean, prosecutors could subpoena whoever 167 00:11:36,155 --> 00:11:38,755 Speaker 1: hit the record button on the phone, but this fits 168 00:11:38,755 --> 00:11:42,355 Speaker 1: in much much more correctly as a piece inside the 169 00:11:42,435 --> 00:11:48,835 Speaker 1: mark Meadows has flipped on Trump jigsaw puzzle, just amazing 170 00:11:49,515 --> 00:11:53,315 Speaker 1: and clear as a bell, fine recording. Whoever did that one? 171 00:11:54,395 --> 00:11:59,755 Speaker 1: There is, though one other gigantic surprise on that recording, 172 00:12:00,675 --> 00:12:04,155 Speaker 1: and in fact it's after the other surprise at the tail, 173 00:12:04,755 --> 00:12:09,075 Speaker 1: the one that I had already mentioned. Oh, Donald, bring 174 00:12:09,195 --> 00:12:16,755 Speaker 1: some bring some coachs in ples, just some cokes, no cheeseburgers, 175 00:12:16,795 --> 00:12:22,395 Speaker 1: Donald and forty four large fries, McNuggets, two forty piece sets, 176 00:12:22,675 --> 00:12:24,795 Speaker 1: two dozen shakes, a lot of ketchup on the side, 177 00:12:24,915 --> 00:12:27,475 Speaker 1: and get a Grimace's Birthday meal. No, no, no two 178 00:12:27,675 --> 00:12:28,875 Speaker 1: Grimace's Birthday meal. 179 00:12:28,995 --> 00:12:29,195 Speaker 3: Ah. 180 00:12:29,275 --> 00:12:38,755 Speaker 1: Hell, let's have a party, make it four one for everybody. Also, 181 00:12:39,075 --> 00:12:42,875 Speaker 1: last night, Jack Smith's investigation of the fake Electors scam 182 00:12:42,955 --> 00:12:46,515 Speaker 1: moved forward a little bit further. The Washington Post reports 183 00:12:46,515 --> 00:12:49,435 Speaker 1: that the Special Council is trying to ascertain if that 184 00:12:49,635 --> 00:12:54,275 Speaker 1: same crowd of cheesy lawyers I mentioned yesterday, Kenneth Cheesebro, 185 00:12:55,395 --> 00:13:01,035 Speaker 1: Jeffrey Clark, John Eastman, Jenna Ellis, Rudy Giuliani, and Kurt Olson, 186 00:13:01,755 --> 00:13:05,875 Speaker 1: we're following specific instructions from Trump or from others about 187 00:13:05,915 --> 00:13:09,355 Speaker 1: the fake slates of electors, and if so, what those 188 00:13:09,395 --> 00:13:13,315 Speaker 1: instructions were. But the Post also reported a new missive 189 00:13:13,355 --> 00:13:16,995 Speaker 1: from Trump's all purpose schlub Jason Miller, written to an 190 00:13:16,995 --> 00:13:20,035 Speaker 1: executive and an ad agency producing campaign ads for Trump. 191 00:13:20,115 --> 00:13:24,555 Speaker 1: And this goes to fraud charges, probably wire fraud, against 192 00:13:24,635 --> 00:13:27,635 Speaker 1: Trump for raising money from the public to roll back 193 00:13:27,675 --> 00:13:32,515 Speaker 1: a stolen election that Trump definitively knew had not been stolen. 194 00:13:33,235 --> 00:13:37,155 Speaker 1: Quoting the Miller message, the campaign's own legal team and 195 00:13:37,315 --> 00:13:42,715 Speaker 1: data experts cannot verify the bullshit being beamed down from 196 00:13:42,715 --> 00:13:47,355 Speaker 1: the mother ship, unquote, wrote Miller. Miller goes on to 197 00:13:47,355 --> 00:13:50,795 Speaker 1: tell the ad exact that that was why Giuliani and 198 00:13:50,835 --> 00:13:56,035 Speaker 1: the lawyers were quote and thirty two and tying into 199 00:13:56,075 --> 00:13:59,555 Speaker 1: both of those sets of possible future indictments fake electors 200 00:13:59,635 --> 00:14:03,835 Speaker 1: and financial fraud, and mixing in yet a third possible 201 00:14:03,875 --> 00:14:07,355 Speaker 1: set for total four the Post also reports that Smith's 202 00:14:07,355 --> 00:14:12,075 Speaker 1: investigators will tomorrow interview the Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensberger, 203 00:14:12,235 --> 00:14:14,395 Speaker 1: who was on the end of the I just want 204 00:14:14,395 --> 00:14:17,195 Speaker 1: to find eleven seven hundred and eighty votes phone call, 205 00:14:17,595 --> 00:14:21,555 Speaker 1: which could be its own electoral interference crime federally and 206 00:14:21,635 --> 00:14:25,195 Speaker 1: not just in Georgia, and which, bringing us back full circle, 207 00:14:25,555 --> 00:14:30,035 Speaker 1: is on tape. There is also a new development in 208 00:14:30,075 --> 00:14:34,235 Speaker 1: a fourth prong of the Smith investigation. NBC reported that 209 00:14:34,315 --> 00:14:38,715 Speaker 1: approximately half a dozen Secret Service agents have testified to 210 00:14:38,755 --> 00:14:43,195 Speaker 1: the Smith grand jury about Trump on January sixth, and 211 00:14:43,275 --> 00:14:46,355 Speaker 1: nobody knows which ones they are, or what they saw 212 00:14:46,515 --> 00:14:49,395 Speaker 1: or how close they were. But they are not testifying 213 00:14:49,395 --> 00:14:53,035 Speaker 1: about classified documents or fake electors or wirefraud. They are 214 00:14:53,075 --> 00:14:57,035 Speaker 1: talking about Trump and the violent coup attempt on January sixth. 215 00:14:58,835 --> 00:15:01,995 Speaker 1: And then there's a little chaser here for America's bum 216 00:15:02,555 --> 00:15:07,715 Speaker 1: Rudy Giuliani. Al Old pal Lev Parnas tweeted out of 217 00:15:07,715 --> 00:15:11,235 Speaker 1: the Blue yesterday, quoting sources are telling me that Rudy 218 00:15:11,275 --> 00:15:18,675 Speaker 1: Giuliani is having a meltdown and drinking heavily. Okay, your points, sir, 219 00:15:19,315 --> 00:15:22,155 Speaker 1: I mean that sounds like any Giuliani days since roughly 220 00:15:22,275 --> 00:15:27,195 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty five. Quoting Parnas again, after being sanctioned, he 221 00:15:27,235 --> 00:15:30,155 Speaker 1: fears that he is about to get indicted and doesn't 222 00:15:30,195 --> 00:15:33,635 Speaker 1: know who to turn to for help. It's time to 223 00:15:33,715 --> 00:15:41,675 Speaker 1: pay the piper. Rudy hashtag hashtag Lev remembers, hey, bring 224 00:15:41,755 --> 00:15:46,155 Speaker 1: some cokes in please, and a tanker truck full of 225 00:15:46,235 --> 00:15:53,395 Speaker 1: vodka for Rudy. And just to wrap this up, a 226 00:15:53,475 --> 00:15:57,395 Speaker 1: reminder of the story behind all of these other stories. 227 00:15:57,435 --> 00:16:00,915 Speaker 1: Fascinating as they are, ultimately they are not the point. 228 00:16:01,555 --> 00:16:05,715 Speaker 1: When I hear Trump's defenders and apologists say that the 229 00:16:05,755 --> 00:16:08,115 Speaker 1: rest of us will do anything to keep him from 230 00:16:08,155 --> 00:16:13,555 Speaker 1: being president, my instinctive reaction is always the same, and 231 00:16:15,075 --> 00:16:20,115 Speaker 1: a reminder of just what subhuman scum Trump and the 232 00:16:20,155 --> 00:16:22,915 Speaker 1: slime he brought into the White House, our White House 233 00:16:23,835 --> 00:16:29,635 Speaker 1: really are. Miles Taylor, once the anonymous staffer, has been 234 00:16:29,715 --> 00:16:33,315 Speaker 1: letting loose nuggets from his upcoming book Blowback. This appeared 235 00:16:33,395 --> 00:16:37,275 Speaker 1: last night in Rolling Stone. Taylor quotes a conversation between 236 00:16:37,315 --> 00:16:42,235 Speaker 1: the disgusting nosparatu of the Trump cult, Stephen Miller, and 237 00:16:42,275 --> 00:16:46,675 Speaker 1: the then commandant of the US Coast Guard, Admiral Paul Zakunft, 238 00:16:46,875 --> 00:16:52,835 Speaker 1: who is now retired. Miller, Admiral the military has aerial drones, correct, 239 00:16:53,555 --> 00:16:58,075 Speaker 1: Admiral Zakunft, Yes, Miller, and some of those drones are 240 00:16:58,075 --> 00:17:04,195 Speaker 1: equipped with missiles, correct, za Kunft, Sure, Miller. And when 241 00:17:04,235 --> 00:17:07,875 Speaker 1: a boat of migrants is in international waters, they aren't 242 00:17:07,875 --> 00:17:13,635 Speaker 1: protected by the US constitution, right, za Kundt. Technically no, 243 00:17:13,875 --> 00:17:17,675 Speaker 1: but I'm not sure what you're getting at Miller. Tell me, 244 00:17:17,795 --> 00:17:21,635 Speaker 1: why then, can't we use a predator drone to obliterate 245 00:17:21,715 --> 00:17:26,475 Speaker 1: that boat, zi Kunft, Because Stephen, it would be against 246 00:17:26,515 --> 00:17:33,195 Speaker 1: international law. Miller, the United States launches airstrikes on terrorists 247 00:17:33,315 --> 00:17:41,715 Speaker 1: in disputed areas all the time, unquote. Miller and the 248 00:17:41,755 --> 00:17:47,915 Speaker 1: admiral deny. That was their conversation. Taylor adds that Miller 249 00:17:48,035 --> 00:17:52,835 Speaker 1: quote wasn't interested in the moral conflict of drone bombing migrants. 250 00:17:53,355 --> 00:17:57,595 Speaker 1: He wanted to know whether anyone could stop America from 251 00:17:57,675 --> 00:17:58,035 Speaker 1: doing it. 252 00:17:58,795 --> 00:18:00,835 Speaker 2: Unquote. 253 00:18:01,115 --> 00:18:07,475 Speaker 1: I am, for some reason on convinced by Stephen Miller's denial. 254 00:18:13,035 --> 00:18:15,915 Speaker 1: Also of interest here. Did you watch them play the 255 00:18:15,955 --> 00:18:19,115 Speaker 1: Trump recording on CNN last night or did you watch 256 00:18:19,155 --> 00:18:25,875 Speaker 1: anything on MSNBC, NBC, CBSABC News. If so, you watched 257 00:18:25,875 --> 00:18:28,755 Speaker 1: the work and the innovation of a man named David Borman, 258 00:18:29,595 --> 00:18:33,155 Speaker 1: also twice my boss and once in the middle of 259 00:18:33,195 --> 00:18:37,315 Speaker 1: a couple of my lawsuits involving a total of roughly 260 00:18:37,435 --> 00:18:41,715 Speaker 1: more or less one hundred million dollars. David Borman died Sunday. 261 00:18:41,995 --> 00:18:43,795 Speaker 1: I want to talk about him. He was a very 262 00:18:43,835 --> 00:18:46,875 Speaker 1: special man. That's next. This is countdown. 263 00:18:48,635 --> 00:18:50,875 Speaker 2: This is countdown with Keith Olberman. 264 00:18:59,195 --> 00:19:02,435 Speaker 1: Post strips to the news, some headlines, some updates, some snarks, 265 00:19:02,475 --> 00:19:08,395 Speaker 1: some predictions. Dateline z Alto, California. Imagine being the president 266 00:19:08,475 --> 00:19:10,995 Speaker 1: of and key witness for a television channel in the 267 00:19:10,995 --> 00:19:14,955 Speaker 1: deposition stage as it is suing its star newsman, and 268 00:19:15,035 --> 00:19:18,155 Speaker 1: its star newsman is suing it with a total of 269 00:19:18,195 --> 00:19:22,315 Speaker 1: around one hundred million dollars on the table, and the 270 00:19:22,395 --> 00:19:25,195 Speaker 1: lawsuit ends, and the network does not win the lawsuit, 271 00:19:25,315 --> 00:19:29,395 Speaker 1: and you stay in friendly touch with that newsman for 272 00:19:29,475 --> 00:19:35,115 Speaker 1: the rest of your life. David Borman died Sunday complications 273 00:19:35,155 --> 00:19:38,675 Speaker 1: after hip surgery. His family reports he was sixty nine 274 00:19:38,755 --> 00:19:44,075 Speaker 1: years old. He and I had nearly identical personalities and 275 00:19:44,275 --> 00:19:47,995 Speaker 1: were essentially equally larger than life in an office setting, 276 00:19:47,995 --> 00:19:50,235 Speaker 1: and therefore it was almost inevitable that I do not 277 00:19:50,315 --> 00:19:56,475 Speaker 1: remember us agreeing on anything, and yet we never had 278 00:19:56,475 --> 00:20:00,835 Speaker 1: a fight. We did not have crosswords, not even when 279 00:20:00,915 --> 00:20:03,395 Speaker 1: we were on opposite sides of a lawsuit with one 280 00:20:03,475 --> 00:20:07,075 Speaker 1: hundred million dollars on the table. I had last heard 281 00:20:07,075 --> 00:20:11,155 Speaker 1: from him barely four months ago. It was about this podcast, 282 00:20:11,195 --> 00:20:14,355 Speaker 1: which he listened to every day. It was always friendly 283 00:20:14,435 --> 00:20:17,435 Speaker 1: on my end. It was always friendly and supportive on 284 00:20:17,515 --> 00:20:19,515 Speaker 1: his end, and frankly, when it came time for him 285 00:20:19,515 --> 00:20:23,035 Speaker 1: to be deposed in my lawsuit against Current TV and 286 00:20:23,195 --> 00:20:28,595 Speaker 1: it's against mine a decade ago, that friendliness probably guaranteed 287 00:20:28,595 --> 00:20:32,075 Speaker 1: that Current was not going to win the lawsuits. Without 288 00:20:32,075 --> 00:20:34,475 Speaker 1: getting too deep in the weeds. The bottom line was 289 00:20:34,515 --> 00:20:38,755 Speaker 1: this Current needed to prove I was not talking to management, 290 00:20:39,395 --> 00:20:42,835 Speaker 1: and they were sure the network president, David Borman would 291 00:20:42,875 --> 00:20:45,075 Speaker 1: back them up. And for eight hours or so in 292 00:20:45,115 --> 00:20:47,635 Speaker 1: a tape deposition, he kept saying that no, I was 293 00:20:47,675 --> 00:20:50,635 Speaker 1: actually above average cooperative, and he always looked forward to 294 00:20:50,675 --> 00:20:53,275 Speaker 1: talking to me, never had a problem finding me. And 295 00:20:53,315 --> 00:20:55,995 Speaker 1: I was the least anchory type person he'd ever worked with, 296 00:20:56,035 --> 00:20:58,315 Speaker 1: and he knew what that meant, since his father was 297 00:20:58,355 --> 00:21:02,155 Speaker 1: a news anchor. The more I have thought over the 298 00:21:02,275 --> 00:21:04,635 Speaker 1: years about what I know of what he said on 299 00:21:04,715 --> 00:21:06,675 Speaker 1: under Oath, the more I begin to wonder if he 300 00:21:06,715 --> 00:21:09,915 Speaker 1: didn't say all that deliberately so the case would swing 301 00:21:10,035 --> 00:21:13,115 Speaker 1: my way. Not that he wanted me to have the money, 302 00:21:13,195 --> 00:21:16,475 Speaker 1: or he had something against Current TV, But David Borman 303 00:21:16,715 --> 00:21:20,195 Speaker 1: was for all the innovations and the insight and the leadership. 304 00:21:20,275 --> 00:21:23,555 Speaker 1: David Borman was about the people who worked with him. 305 00:21:23,995 --> 00:21:26,755 Speaker 1: He was about the anchors and the reporters, and the writers, 306 00:21:26,795 --> 00:21:29,555 Speaker 1: and the producers and the associate producers, and the interns 307 00:21:29,755 --> 00:21:33,195 Speaker 1: and the guys who cleaned the studio. Ultimately, they were 308 00:21:33,235 --> 00:21:36,835 Speaker 1: what mattered to him. He showed that affection for them 309 00:21:36,875 --> 00:21:42,435 Speaker 1: in many different and sometimes indecipherable ways. But his business 310 00:21:42,475 --> 00:21:46,435 Speaker 1: was about people, Borman, and that's what everybody called him. 311 00:21:46,875 --> 00:21:53,115 Speaker 1: Borman had fifty ideas a day, fifty original ideas a day. 312 00:21:54,155 --> 00:21:58,995 Speaker 1: Fifty were original, ten were genius, thirty had promised, and 313 00:21:59,155 --> 00:22:02,675 Speaker 1: ten had the potential to destroy your show, your career, 314 00:22:02,835 --> 00:22:06,475 Speaker 1: and or his network. They brought him in as president 315 00:22:06,515 --> 00:22:09,955 Speaker 1: of Current TV during my fiasco there, and not long 316 00:22:09,995 --> 00:22:11,715 Speaker 1: after he came into my office and he said he 317 00:22:11,755 --> 00:22:14,395 Speaker 1: had an utterly new idea for how to cover the 318 00:22:14,515 --> 00:22:20,475 Speaker 1: upcoming twenty twelve presidential election. Now, mind you an utterly 319 00:22:20,555 --> 00:22:23,475 Speaker 1: new idea for how to cover a presidential election. Basically, 320 00:22:23,555 --> 00:22:26,875 Speaker 1: everything you see on television on election night to this 321 00:22:27,115 --> 00:22:32,755 Speaker 1: day is something David Borman thought up or improved. Big screens, 322 00:22:32,875 --> 00:22:38,275 Speaker 1: touch screens, disappearing screens, anchor standing reporters appearing by a hologram, 323 00:22:38,315 --> 00:22:41,195 Speaker 1: the data boards, the graphics, the graphics that move in, 324 00:22:41,275 --> 00:22:44,875 Speaker 1: the graphics that move out, everything, to say nothing of 325 00:22:44,915 --> 00:22:48,075 Speaker 1: the content. And now he had an utterly new idea. 326 00:22:48,875 --> 00:22:53,755 Speaker 1: We were current TV, we were no longer paying our bills. Okay, 327 00:22:53,955 --> 00:22:56,715 Speaker 1: they won't let me spend any money. I mean, maybe 328 00:22:56,755 --> 00:22:58,835 Speaker 1: I can get you a sidekick on debate night and 329 00:22:58,875 --> 00:23:01,915 Speaker 1: election night, but that's it. So here's my idea. Let's 330 00:23:01,995 --> 00:23:06,915 Speaker 1: carry the debates live. Anyway. I just looked at him, 331 00:23:06,955 --> 00:23:09,875 Speaker 1: thinking that this was the day he finally went round 332 00:23:09,955 --> 00:23:13,155 Speaker 1: the bend, and I started to smile. I'm serious. We 333 00:23:13,275 --> 00:23:15,915 Speaker 1: put you and whoever the hell else works here in 334 00:23:15,955 --> 00:23:19,595 Speaker 1: a room on couches, and you're all watching a big monitor, 335 00:23:19,595 --> 00:23:22,475 Speaker 1: and we have like four cameras positioned behind the monitor 336 00:23:22,475 --> 00:23:25,115 Speaker 1: at different depths, so we only see the back of 337 00:23:25,155 --> 00:23:28,435 Speaker 1: the monitor, or maybe we see blurry reflections of what's 338 00:23:28,475 --> 00:23:31,555 Speaker 1: on the monitor in other glass behind you, or something 339 00:23:31,595 --> 00:23:34,555 Speaker 1: like that. But the cameras are all trained on you. Guys. 340 00:23:35,235 --> 00:23:39,675 Speaker 1: Our coverage of the debates is you Olderman watching the debate. 341 00:23:40,275 --> 00:23:43,915 Speaker 1: We never show the debate. We never use clean sound 342 00:23:43,955 --> 00:23:47,315 Speaker 1: from their debate. It's just a TV that's on in 343 00:23:47,355 --> 00:23:49,835 Speaker 1: the studio that happens to be tuned to the debate 344 00:23:50,155 --> 00:23:54,275 Speaker 1: ambient sound. You hear what's going on, and you describe 345 00:23:54,315 --> 00:23:59,355 Speaker 1: it to our audience, and you react to it. I 346 00:23:59,475 --> 00:24:02,995 Speaker 1: just stared at him, and then I said, we'll get sued, 347 00:24:03,675 --> 00:24:06,355 Speaker 1: and he stroked his beard. I don't think so. They'd 348 00:24:06,355 --> 00:24:08,715 Speaker 1: have to be able to prove that's what the viewer 349 00:24:08,755 --> 00:24:10,195 Speaker 1: is hearing at home. And I think we can make 350 00:24:10,275 --> 00:24:12,275 Speaker 1: sure that all the viewer here is at home is 351 00:24:12,315 --> 00:24:15,155 Speaker 1: an indistinct mumble that sounds like the debate. I mean, 352 00:24:15,275 --> 00:24:17,755 Speaker 1: maybe we could even sweeten the audio with a loop 353 00:24:18,155 --> 00:24:22,195 Speaker 1: of generic sound or other sound bites from Obama and 354 00:24:22,675 --> 00:24:24,795 Speaker 1: Mitt Romney. I assume it's going to be Romney, so 355 00:24:24,795 --> 00:24:28,875 Speaker 1: they really couldn't hear the Fox audio or the NBC audio, 356 00:24:29,075 --> 00:24:34,075 Speaker 1: or whichever network's carrying the debate. I sighed, and I 357 00:24:34,155 --> 00:24:37,155 Speaker 1: said Borman, this is not one of your genius ideas, 358 00:24:37,915 --> 00:24:41,795 Speaker 1: and he laughed and he said maybe not, then why 359 00:24:41,795 --> 00:24:45,275 Speaker 1: don't you make it better? And I had to confess 360 00:24:46,075 --> 00:24:52,555 Speaker 1: I could not. He had a sased our resources, which 361 00:24:52,595 --> 00:24:56,155 Speaker 1: were nothing. My employers had recently decided to stop paying 362 00:24:56,195 --> 00:24:59,115 Speaker 1: their debts, which they would do with me shortly, which 363 00:24:59,155 --> 00:25:01,315 Speaker 1: was why I would sue them, which is why they 364 00:25:01,315 --> 00:25:04,115 Speaker 1: would sue me, which is why we had no reporters, 365 00:25:04,795 --> 00:25:07,595 Speaker 1: which is why he would testify inadvertently on my behalf. 366 00:25:08,155 --> 00:25:10,595 Speaker 1: We also had no feed from the debate sites because 367 00:25:10,595 --> 00:25:13,075 Speaker 1: they'd stop paying the bills for the satellite time and 368 00:25:13,115 --> 00:25:16,235 Speaker 1: the remote studio links. We might be able to get 369 00:25:16,235 --> 00:25:19,315 Speaker 1: a guest or two to come in and be on 370 00:25:19,395 --> 00:25:23,675 Speaker 1: our Debate night coverage for free, chosen from among his 371 00:25:23,795 --> 00:25:26,195 Speaker 1: friends or my friends, but they would have to pay 372 00:25:26,235 --> 00:25:28,995 Speaker 1: their own way in in a cab or subway because 373 00:25:29,075 --> 00:25:32,315 Speaker 1: Current had stopped paying the car service fees, and we 374 00:25:32,315 --> 00:25:35,355 Speaker 1: were now on our eighth or ninth car service company 375 00:25:35,395 --> 00:25:37,635 Speaker 1: in as many weeks. And this one was a guy 376 00:25:37,675 --> 00:25:39,995 Speaker 1: with a beat up Cadillac who liked to smoke as 377 00:25:39,995 --> 00:25:44,715 Speaker 1: he drove you around, And all that went through my head, 378 00:25:44,755 --> 00:25:46,315 Speaker 1: and finally I said, Boraman, and I take it back. 379 00:25:46,355 --> 00:25:49,195 Speaker 1: This is one of your genius ideas. We have no 380 00:25:49,435 --> 00:25:53,955 Speaker 1: chance at doing anything as good as this. I mean, 381 00:25:53,995 --> 00:25:55,955 Speaker 1: it could be the Mystery Science Theater three thousand of 382 00:25:55,995 --> 00:25:58,635 Speaker 1: debate coverage. And I still think we shouldn't do it. 383 00:25:59,355 --> 00:26:01,275 Speaker 1: And now he stared at me and shook his head, 384 00:26:01,315 --> 00:26:03,435 Speaker 1: and why is that? And I said, well, the very 385 00:26:03,475 --> 00:26:05,555 Speaker 1: reasons you had to figure out how we could do 386 00:26:05,715 --> 00:26:09,035 Speaker 1: live TV news from a presidential debate when it's just 387 00:26:09,195 --> 00:26:13,435 Speaker 1: me and some guys watching another network carrying the debate 388 00:26:13,675 --> 00:26:17,075 Speaker 1: with the sound up but not up full. I said, 389 00:26:17,115 --> 00:26:18,995 Speaker 1: those are the reasons that this network is not going 390 00:26:19,035 --> 00:26:22,155 Speaker 1: to still be on the air by election night. I mean, 391 00:26:22,195 --> 00:26:24,835 Speaker 1: we might get away with doing this. People might even 392 00:26:24,835 --> 00:26:28,035 Speaker 1: find it's better than watching the actual debate, depends on 393 00:26:28,075 --> 00:26:30,875 Speaker 1: whether or not I'm funny that night. But you know, 394 00:26:30,995 --> 00:26:32,235 Speaker 1: you and I are going to have to work in 395 00:26:32,315 --> 00:26:36,115 Speaker 1: this business again soon, somewhere else. And no matter how 396 00:26:36,155 --> 00:26:39,835 Speaker 1: clever this is, we are still pirrating the defeat Debate's feed. 397 00:26:40,835 --> 00:26:45,475 Speaker 1: We're pirrating it from NBC, ABCCBS, Fox. They will remember that. 398 00:26:46,115 --> 00:26:47,955 Speaker 1: And you know what, if it works and the viewers 399 00:26:47,955 --> 00:26:50,315 Speaker 1: do like it, the other networks will remember it even 400 00:26:50,355 --> 00:26:56,955 Speaker 1: more Forman paused and swore. If you are worried about 401 00:26:56,955 --> 00:27:00,875 Speaker 1: what this will do to your reputation or my reputation, 402 00:27:01,675 --> 00:27:06,755 Speaker 1: I need to rethink it. You're probably right, all right, Well, 403 00:27:06,955 --> 00:27:09,315 Speaker 1: if you come up with something that won't end our careers, 404 00:27:09,395 --> 00:27:12,955 Speaker 1: let me know. I kind of liked this. It's too bad. 405 00:27:14,115 --> 00:27:16,955 Speaker 1: He rose, and he rose like a very large bird 406 00:27:17,075 --> 00:27:20,035 Speaker 1: might rise, a lot of noise, a lot of wingspan, 407 00:27:20,435 --> 00:27:25,275 Speaker 1: often blotting out the sun. And he left my office. 408 00:27:25,435 --> 00:27:29,515 Speaker 1: I don't think I saw him again. Take a moment 409 00:27:29,595 --> 00:27:33,315 Speaker 1: and picture David Borman for me. There was an actor 410 00:27:33,435 --> 00:27:37,995 Speaker 1: named Severn Darden, founder of the Second City Improv Group 411 00:27:37,995 --> 00:27:43,315 Speaker 1: in Chicago. Huge man, astonishing presence. He was the evil 412 00:27:43,435 --> 00:27:46,835 Speaker 1: human doctor Culp Culp in a couple of the Planet 413 00:27:46,835 --> 00:27:49,795 Speaker 1: of the Apes movies. He was in a Walter Mathow 414 00:27:49,875 --> 00:27:53,115 Speaker 1: picture called Hopscotch, and he was in the Rodney Dangerfield 415 00:27:53,315 --> 00:27:55,355 Speaker 1: movie Back to School, And he was in a thousand 416 00:27:55,435 --> 00:27:58,635 Speaker 1: other films. Always very briefly and brilliantly. It could have 417 00:27:58,635 --> 00:28:03,555 Speaker 1: been Borman's brother, Huge ate up the whole screen same 418 00:28:03,595 --> 00:28:07,235 Speaker 1: as Borman. And then there was Borman's real life father. 419 00:28:07,515 --> 00:28:10,755 Speaker 1: You ever seen the Jane Fonda nuclear accident movie The 420 00:28:10,875 --> 00:28:16,395 Speaker 1: China Syndrome with Michael Douglas. David Borman's father, Stan was 421 00:28:16,435 --> 00:28:18,795 Speaker 1: the news anchor in that film, and he's in it 422 00:28:18,835 --> 00:28:22,755 Speaker 1: a lot, and primarily because Stan Borman was a news 423 00:28:22,755 --> 00:28:25,515 Speaker 1: anchor in LA Radio and TV and in Philly and 424 00:28:25,555 --> 00:28:28,115 Speaker 1: in San Francisco. He and his son did not look 425 00:28:28,235 --> 00:28:33,995 Speaker 1: exactly alike, but they had that same aura. Obviously. That's 426 00:28:33,995 --> 00:28:36,155 Speaker 1: how David Borman got into news. I mean, he had 427 00:28:36,155 --> 00:28:39,395 Speaker 1: a degree in French but his father was in the industry, 428 00:28:39,435 --> 00:28:42,275 Speaker 1: and he had this unique ability from the beginning to 429 00:28:42,435 --> 00:28:45,395 Speaker 1: look at the news and say, this looks boring, let's 430 00:28:45,395 --> 00:28:49,195 Speaker 1: fix that. Nineteen eighty eight, he was tired of anchors 431 00:28:49,235 --> 00:28:53,475 Speaker 1: reading details off index cards on election night, handed them 432 00:28:53,475 --> 00:28:55,475 Speaker 1: to guys who were sitting at their feet out of 433 00:28:55,515 --> 00:28:59,355 Speaker 1: camera range. So instead everything that might come up he 434 00:28:59,475 --> 00:29:04,355 Speaker 1: thought of beforehand, every possible factoid, and he put each 435 00:29:04,395 --> 00:29:07,475 Speaker 1: one of the them onto a full screen graphic. For 436 00:29:07,635 --> 00:29:12,995 Speaker 1: ABC that year, he had ten thousand full screen graphics 437 00:29:13,115 --> 00:29:16,195 Speaker 1: ready for election night and could call them up on 438 00:29:16,235 --> 00:29:21,275 Speaker 1: a computer at a moment's notice. Two thousand and four, 439 00:29:21,315 --> 00:29:24,515 Speaker 1: he's running the conventions for CNN, he eliminated the anchor booth. 440 00:29:24,795 --> 00:29:27,795 Speaker 1: They'd been having anchor booths since radio in the nineteen 441 00:29:27,875 --> 00:29:30,915 Speaker 1: thirties began to cover the conventions. He had the anchors 442 00:29:30,995 --> 00:29:34,995 Speaker 1: for CNN join the reporters for CNN on the convention floor. 443 00:29:35,435 --> 00:29:40,235 Speaker 1: No anchor booth, less boring, he said. Election Night two 444 00:29:40,275 --> 00:29:42,395 Speaker 1: thousand and four, he got rid of the studio altogether. 445 00:29:42,675 --> 00:29:44,355 Speaker 1: By two thousand and eight, he was tired of all 446 00:29:44,355 --> 00:29:47,275 Speaker 1: those graphics he had created in the computers. So instead 447 00:29:47,315 --> 00:29:49,635 Speaker 1: of having all the graphics on just one screen that 448 00:29:49,675 --> 00:29:52,755 Speaker 1: would change from graphic to graphic, he built a new 449 00:29:52,875 --> 00:29:56,955 Speaker 1: set with like a dozen screens standing up all through 450 00:29:56,955 --> 00:30:00,675 Speaker 1: the set. He had the anchors change screens and walk around, 451 00:30:01,195 --> 00:30:04,395 Speaker 1: rather than the screens changing graphics and all those big 452 00:30:04,435 --> 00:30:07,075 Speaker 1: screen it means that you associate with Wolf Blitzer or 453 00:30:07,155 --> 00:30:11,155 Speaker 1: John King or that Kornaky guy or whoever that's Borman 454 00:30:12,035 --> 00:30:15,875 Speaker 1: all Borman. By the time I got to MSNBC in 455 00:30:15,955 --> 00:30:18,995 Speaker 1: nineteen ninety seven, he had already left his first show 456 00:30:19,035 --> 00:30:21,795 Speaker 1: there was called The Site, And while everybody else at 457 00:30:21,875 --> 00:30:25,075 Speaker 1: MSNBC was just going through the motions about computers and 458 00:30:25,115 --> 00:30:29,115 Speaker 1: the Internet tying them together with TV. So that NBC 459 00:30:29,235 --> 00:30:32,595 Speaker 1: could get hold of some of Microsoft's money. Borman put 460 00:30:32,635 --> 00:30:36,635 Speaker 1: together a tech show, a daily tech show whose hosts 461 00:30:36,635 --> 00:30:44,115 Speaker 1: were Solidad O'Brien and dev Null. Dev Null was a 462 00:30:44,275 --> 00:30:49,715 Speaker 1: live action animated guy who looked vaguely like side show Bob, 463 00:30:52,555 --> 00:30:58,075 Speaker 1: a live action animated guy guy in the back with 464 00:30:58,235 --> 00:31:03,635 Speaker 1: a motion capture suit, talking ad libbing in real time 465 00:31:03,675 --> 00:31:10,235 Speaker 1: and appearing as dev Null nineteen ninety seven. Before that, 466 00:31:10,595 --> 00:31:13,915 Speaker 1: Borman had done more conventional things. He'd redesigned World News 467 00:31:13,955 --> 00:31:17,195 Speaker 1: Tonight in Nightline for ABC, and the CNN Financial shows 468 00:31:17,355 --> 00:31:20,195 Speaker 1: and most of the NBC News studio shows. And basically, 469 00:31:20,275 --> 00:31:23,315 Speaker 1: if you see it on TV today or tomorrow or 470 00:31:23,315 --> 00:31:25,955 Speaker 1: hell for the next twenty five years, it's Borman's idea 471 00:31:26,475 --> 00:31:31,515 Speaker 1: or something somebody took from one of Borman's ideas. I 472 00:31:31,555 --> 00:31:33,355 Speaker 1: don't want to leave the wrong impression here, because it 473 00:31:33,355 --> 00:31:34,955 Speaker 1: would be one thing, of course, if he was just 474 00:31:34,995 --> 00:31:38,435 Speaker 1: this fire hose of innovation production ideas. But Borman was 475 00:31:38,475 --> 00:31:41,035 Speaker 1: not just a pictures guy. He was a pictures guy because, 476 00:31:41,075 --> 00:31:42,995 Speaker 1: as he often said, you need to make a good 477 00:31:43,035 --> 00:31:46,835 Speaker 1: television show first so people will watch it so you 478 00:31:46,875 --> 00:31:49,635 Speaker 1: can tell them what happened, which is called journalism, and 479 00:31:49,675 --> 00:31:51,995 Speaker 1: you can make it a good television show and never 480 00:31:52,195 --> 00:31:56,715 Speaker 1: tamper for one second with the journalism. Borman also ran 481 00:31:56,795 --> 00:32:00,035 Speaker 1: the news. I met him first when I went back 482 00:32:00,075 --> 00:32:02,915 Speaker 1: to CNN after nine to eleven, the New York coverage, 483 00:32:02,915 --> 00:32:06,875 Speaker 1: of which he line produced. I was a utility anchorman 484 00:32:06,955 --> 00:32:08,955 Speaker 1: for CNN at that time. I filled in for everybody, 485 00:32:08,995 --> 00:32:12,795 Speaker 1: from the morning hosts to Greta Van Sustron to Jeff Greenfield. 486 00:32:13,235 --> 00:32:16,235 Speaker 1: But Borman asked me to be his essayist and long 487 00:32:16,355 --> 00:32:19,235 Speaker 1: form reporter for what his bosses tried like hell to 488 00:32:19,315 --> 00:32:24,355 Speaker 1: make the centerpiece of CNN Newsnight with Aaron Brown. But 489 00:32:24,435 --> 00:32:27,035 Speaker 1: though I was the filling anchor for basically everybody else, 490 00:32:27,035 --> 00:32:29,555 Speaker 1: I was not the filling anchor for Aaron Brown. How 491 00:32:29,555 --> 00:32:31,275 Speaker 1: long do you think it would be before they noticed 492 00:32:31,275 --> 00:32:34,075 Speaker 1: you're better than he is. We can't do that, That's 493 00:32:34,075 --> 00:32:37,475 Speaker 1: what Borman told me. Instead, Borman pushed them to put 494 00:32:37,475 --> 00:32:40,395 Speaker 1: me on every night at eight pm. Aaron Brown was 495 00:32:40,395 --> 00:32:43,795 Speaker 1: on at ten, Larry King at nine. He actually got 496 00:32:43,795 --> 00:32:46,275 Speaker 1: CNN to sign me to a contract to anchor their 497 00:32:46,275 --> 00:32:49,755 Speaker 1: eight PM show two thousand and two. If they decided 498 00:32:49,755 --> 00:32:51,355 Speaker 1: to have me anchor the show, we would have the 499 00:32:51,355 --> 00:32:54,395 Speaker 1: contract already, but they also signed somebody else to exactly 500 00:32:54,435 --> 00:32:59,675 Speaker 1: the same contract, Connie Chung. They chose Connie Chung. You'll 501 00:32:59,675 --> 00:33:02,035 Speaker 1: be on at eight pm somewhere Soon enough, he said, 502 00:33:02,595 --> 00:33:05,755 Speaker 1: like six months later, I returned to MSNBC at eight pm, 503 00:33:06,235 --> 00:33:09,115 Speaker 1: and they stuck him with Connie Chung, and they eventually 504 00:33:09,435 --> 00:33:16,195 Speaker 1: canceled Connie's eight pm show on CNN. If my recollections 505 00:33:16,195 --> 00:33:18,315 Speaker 1: here on the passing of David Borman are a little 506 00:33:18,355 --> 00:33:20,555 Speaker 1: all over the place, I guess it is a combination 507 00:33:20,635 --> 00:33:24,675 Speaker 1: of two things. First shock, I knew him twenty years, 508 00:33:24,715 --> 00:33:26,955 Speaker 1: and I never knew him in good health, but he 509 00:33:27,035 --> 00:33:30,515 Speaker 1: still seemed eternal. I mean, three years ago, with the 510 00:33:30,555 --> 00:33:33,355 Speaker 1: election coming up, CBS News looked at itself in the 511 00:33:33,395 --> 00:33:36,075 Speaker 1: mirror and said, crap, we don't have anybody who can 512 00:33:36,155 --> 00:33:38,435 Speaker 1: do this. Do you think Borman could come in for 513 00:33:38,475 --> 00:33:42,435 Speaker 1: six months and produce the elections? And he did four 514 00:33:42,515 --> 00:33:44,875 Speaker 1: years earlier, he done the same thing at MSNBC. In 515 00:33:44,915 --> 00:33:46,555 Speaker 1: the next year. He was so close to being brought 516 00:33:46,595 --> 00:33:49,675 Speaker 1: back to knock that whole network and NBC News into 517 00:33:49,675 --> 00:33:51,995 Speaker 1: shape that he not only went looking for an apartment 518 00:33:52,035 --> 00:33:54,395 Speaker 1: here in New York, he looked in my damned building. 519 00:33:55,715 --> 00:33:58,315 Speaker 1: Within the last year he had peppered me with ideas 520 00:33:58,315 --> 00:34:01,315 Speaker 1: for turning this podcast into a television news show or 521 00:34:01,355 --> 00:34:03,835 Speaker 1: a television network or something new. He hadn't figured out 522 00:34:03,915 --> 00:34:07,595 Speaker 1: what yet. I had no doubt that either I'd be 523 00:34:07,635 --> 00:34:10,755 Speaker 1: hearing from him about what, or I'd be reading of 524 00:34:10,875 --> 00:34:13,595 Speaker 1: somebody convincing him to try to staunch the viewer hemorrhage 525 00:34:13,595 --> 00:34:18,515 Speaker 1: and cable news or broadcast news. I thought he was eternal. Frankly, 526 00:34:18,595 --> 00:34:21,115 Speaker 1: I thought at some point somebody at CNN would go, 527 00:34:21,395 --> 00:34:24,035 Speaker 1: what do we do now after we've screwed this all up? 528 00:34:24,675 --> 00:34:30,875 Speaker 1: Borman too late. The other part of this scattershot version 529 00:34:30,915 --> 00:34:33,515 Speaker 1: of the life and death of David Borman is if 530 00:34:33,595 --> 00:34:36,435 Speaker 1: there was anybody in the last forty years of television 531 00:34:36,475 --> 00:34:39,955 Speaker 1: history who had more different things on his resume than 532 00:34:40,035 --> 00:34:44,995 Speaker 1: I do, it was him. CBS in LA, ABC News, 533 00:34:45,115 --> 00:34:49,715 Speaker 1: NBC News, MSNBC, his own company, CNN Financial News, than 534 00:34:49,755 --> 00:34:52,595 Speaker 1: CNN New York, then running CNN Washington, then running c 535 00:34:52,675 --> 00:34:56,075 Speaker 1: IN in elections, than the CNN Chief Innovation Officer, then the 536 00:34:56,115 --> 00:34:58,955 Speaker 1: presidency of Current TV, then his own company again, then 537 00:34:59,035 --> 00:35:03,835 Speaker 1: the MSNBC and CNN renewal gigs, and the CBS reducts, 538 00:35:04,835 --> 00:35:09,115 Speaker 1: eighteen National Emmy nominations and six wins, and two Peabodies, 539 00:35:09,115 --> 00:35:12,875 Speaker 1: and a Polk Award and a DuPont As. I said 540 00:35:12,875 --> 00:35:15,915 Speaker 1: to him, almost as many awards as jobs, and he 541 00:35:16,075 --> 00:35:18,915 Speaker 1: just shot me a sour look and said, at least 542 00:35:18,955 --> 00:35:23,195 Speaker 1: I have the awards. I want to close with what 543 00:35:23,355 --> 00:35:29,595 Speaker 1: somebody else said about David Borman. Solidad O'Brien, aforementioned former 544 00:35:29,635 --> 00:35:35,995 Speaker 1: co host of a animated character show. On that show 545 00:35:36,475 --> 00:35:39,475 Speaker 1: where her co anchor was a virtual reality guy with 546 00:35:39,555 --> 00:35:43,515 Speaker 1: purple dreadlocks, she wrote, when the site which was the 547 00:35:43,555 --> 00:35:45,675 Speaker 1: name of the show was about to debut on MSNBC 548 00:35:45,795 --> 00:35:49,475 Speaker 1: in ninety six, we were behind schedule and had no 549 00:35:49,755 --> 00:35:54,155 Speaker 1: control room forty eight hours before launch. At some point 550 00:35:54,235 --> 00:35:56,995 Speaker 1: David Borman just got on the floor and started connecting 551 00:35:57,035 --> 00:36:00,635 Speaker 1: all the gear. Literally, he built the show control room 552 00:36:00,875 --> 00:36:07,475 Speaker 1: with about three hours to spare. It was in solid Ad, 553 00:36:07,515 --> 00:36:09,555 Speaker 1: You think that was insane? Did I mention his idea 554 00:36:09,595 --> 00:36:11,555 Speaker 1: for how we could cover the presidential debates when they 555 00:36:11,555 --> 00:36:14,035 Speaker 1: weren't on our network and they wouldn't give us the 556 00:36:14,075 --> 00:36:19,195 Speaker 1: money to send anybody there. Yeah, I did. I'm waiting 557 00:36:19,235 --> 00:36:22,515 Speaker 1: for a good TV oh bit of David Borman, whatever 558 00:36:22,555 --> 00:36:25,555 Speaker 1: the network, whoever read it, whoever produced it, if it 559 00:36:25,555 --> 00:36:28,195 Speaker 1: were really good, it would have to acknowledge that all 560 00:36:28,275 --> 00:36:31,355 Speaker 1: the tech being used in his oh bit was dreamt 561 00:36:31,435 --> 00:36:35,395 Speaker 1: up by him, and that at least one person in 562 00:36:35,435 --> 00:36:39,515 Speaker 1: the control room as it aired was taught by him 563 00:36:40,875 --> 00:36:51,155 Speaker 1: or mentored by him. Or we'll miss him always. Finally 564 00:36:51,195 --> 00:36:53,315 Speaker 1: to the number one story on the Countdown and things 565 00:36:53,315 --> 00:36:55,115 Speaker 1: I promised not to tell, and I was just putting 566 00:36:55,155 --> 00:36:57,435 Speaker 1: the finishing touches on what I wanted to say about 567 00:36:57,435 --> 00:37:01,355 Speaker 1: the late David Borman when bang there was freaking Bill 568 00:37:01,515 --> 00:37:06,035 Speaker 1: Maher in the news again, sitting there with JFK. Junior, 569 00:37:06,795 --> 00:37:13,475 Speaker 1: whining about vaccines, absolutely putting bullet holes in whatever was 570 00:37:13,595 --> 00:37:20,995 Speaker 1: left of his own career by mistaking Kennedy's madness for courage. 571 00:37:21,275 --> 00:37:25,195 Speaker 1: Sometimes your first impression of someone is wildly mistaken, and 572 00:37:25,235 --> 00:37:28,395 Speaker 1: you go years or even decades thinking, you know, I 573 00:37:28,595 --> 00:37:30,635 Speaker 1: was wrong about them, They're not as bad as I 574 00:37:30,715 --> 00:37:34,555 Speaker 1: first thought, And then it turns out, and it can 575 00:37:34,595 --> 00:37:39,355 Speaker 1: turn out literally forty five years later, yeah they were 576 00:37:39,395 --> 00:37:42,795 Speaker 1: that bad, and your first impression was right, and your 577 00:37:42,835 --> 00:37:45,515 Speaker 1: revised impression was not right, and the guy was just 578 00:37:45,555 --> 00:37:50,915 Speaker 1: a reactionary clown in the twentieth century and again here 579 00:37:50,915 --> 00:37:55,475 Speaker 1: in the twenty first. Sometime in nineteen eighty five or 580 00:37:55,595 --> 00:37:58,355 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty six, I saw a movie on cable TV 581 00:37:58,515 --> 00:38:02,595 Speaker 1: called DC Cab. There was a character in it, and 582 00:38:02,675 --> 00:38:05,595 Speaker 1: clearly the actor portraying the character was talented and funny. 583 00:38:05,595 --> 00:38:07,635 Speaker 1: But for some reason I felt like I knew him 584 00:38:07,675 --> 00:38:11,955 Speaker 1: from somewhere, and I really really disliked him. I remember 585 00:38:11,955 --> 00:38:14,195 Speaker 1: the feeling was so strong that I stuck around to 586 00:38:14,275 --> 00:38:16,795 Speaker 1: watch the credits to find out who he was. I 587 00:38:16,835 --> 00:38:19,315 Speaker 1: tried to figure out why I didn't like him. His 588 00:38:19,435 --> 00:38:27,435 Speaker 1: name was Bill Mayher Mher. I had a high school 589 00:38:27,435 --> 00:38:30,635 Speaker 1: teacher named Bill Mayer, but his name didn't have a 590 00:38:30,835 --> 00:38:33,635 Speaker 1: y in it, so no, it wasn't him. But I 591 00:38:33,715 --> 00:38:36,515 Speaker 1: knew three things. He was talented, I didn't like him, 592 00:38:36,715 --> 00:38:40,035 Speaker 1: and I knew him from somewhere. This is pre Internet, 593 00:38:40,075 --> 00:38:42,515 Speaker 1: of course, it's no way to find out where I 594 00:38:42,595 --> 00:38:47,515 Speaker 1: knew him from. Hallowell's annual Film Guide would be my 595 00:38:47,595 --> 00:38:49,835 Speaker 1: best bet. Maybe he'd be in the new one coming out. 596 00:38:50,795 --> 00:38:54,035 Speaker 1: I checked my calendar just eight or nine months from now. 597 00:38:55,875 --> 00:38:58,075 Speaker 1: Eventually I found out Bill Maher was in the year 598 00:38:58,115 --> 00:39:01,275 Speaker 1: ahead of mine at Cornell University. He was not at 599 00:39:01,315 --> 00:39:04,315 Speaker 1: my radio station. I would have recognized him immediately. He 600 00:39:04,395 --> 00:39:06,955 Speaker 1: was not in my college in the university. Maybe I 601 00:39:07,035 --> 00:39:10,715 Speaker 1: knew him from a class somewhere. I could never nail 602 00:39:10,715 --> 00:39:14,875 Speaker 1: it down. And what's troublesome about that is I like 603 00:39:14,915 --> 00:39:17,715 Speaker 1: to say I have a photographic memory, but it's polaroids, 604 00:39:18,595 --> 00:39:22,555 Speaker 1: which I do not always bother to label. Almost everything 605 00:39:22,595 --> 00:39:24,675 Speaker 1: that has ever happened to me is stuck inside this 606 00:39:24,795 --> 00:39:28,915 Speaker 1: big empty head of mind. But often key details like who, what, when, 607 00:39:28,955 --> 00:39:32,995 Speaker 1: and where they're just missing. I'm sorry I forgot to 608 00:39:33,195 --> 00:39:36,715 Speaker 1: write the year down or the name on the polaroid, 609 00:39:37,195 --> 00:39:39,435 Speaker 1: and honestly, in this case, it was not worth the effort. 610 00:39:40,195 --> 00:39:43,315 Speaker 1: I knew, though that I was, what was the right word, 611 00:39:43,515 --> 00:39:48,755 Speaker 1: aware of this guy when we were both at Cornell. Occasionally, 612 00:39:49,275 --> 00:39:52,315 Speaker 1: especially after I went from ESPN to MSNBC in nineteen 613 00:39:52,355 --> 00:39:54,555 Speaker 1: ninety seven, a writer would note the coincidence of the 614 00:39:54,675 --> 00:39:57,235 Speaker 1: university and the years and ask me about it. I 615 00:39:57,235 --> 00:39:59,835 Speaker 1: would say just that, use that same word. I don't 616 00:39:59,875 --> 00:40:02,115 Speaker 1: remember if he was in a class with me or something, 617 00:40:02,195 --> 00:40:05,235 Speaker 1: but I knew him somehow. I was aware of him 618 00:40:05,275 --> 00:40:09,155 Speaker 1: at Cornell. On November twenty third, two thousand, I went 619 00:40:09,195 --> 00:40:11,715 Speaker 1: on his old show, Politically Incorrect, used to be the 620 00:40:11,795 --> 00:40:14,875 Speaker 1: late night show on ABC. This was an all sports episode. 621 00:40:14,955 --> 00:40:18,275 Speaker 1: Lennox Lewis, the boxer, the owner of the Dallas Mavericks, 622 00:40:18,315 --> 00:40:21,235 Speaker 1: Mark Cuban, Todd zeal who at that point was the 623 00:40:21,235 --> 00:40:23,195 Speaker 1: first basement of the New York Mets, and then from 624 00:40:23,235 --> 00:40:26,955 Speaker 1: Fox Sports Me. When I met Mar, I asked him 625 00:40:26,955 --> 00:40:31,035 Speaker 1: about Cornell. I didn't know anybody there. I didn't see anybody. 626 00:40:31,315 --> 00:40:33,475 Speaker 1: I didn't do comedy anywhere. I didn't talk to anybody. 627 00:40:33,515 --> 00:40:37,995 Speaker 1: I didn't meet you. Well, that settled it, except during 628 00:40:38,035 --> 00:40:40,875 Speaker 1: the recording of the show when Mar contradicted me on 629 00:40:40,955 --> 00:40:44,515 Speaker 1: some point. I got angry and there was no reason 630 00:40:44,555 --> 00:40:47,955 Speaker 1: to get angry, and I dismissed the anger, and I 631 00:40:47,995 --> 00:40:50,555 Speaker 1: dismissed the moment. Except on the way home, I kept thinking, 632 00:40:50,875 --> 00:40:55,915 Speaker 1: I know him from school somehow, no matter what he says, 633 00:40:56,595 --> 00:41:05,155 Speaker 1: and I know I didn't like him. In the course 634 00:41:05,155 --> 00:41:08,355 Speaker 1: of the next decade, Bill Maher got his weekly HBO 635 00:41:08,435 --> 00:41:11,955 Speaker 1: political show, and I went back and turned MSNBC into 636 00:41:11,955 --> 00:41:14,635 Speaker 1: a political network, and the Internet happened, so that Cornell 637 00:41:14,755 --> 00:41:19,035 Speaker 1: juxtaposition became easier for reporters to stumble over, so they 638 00:41:19,075 --> 00:41:21,155 Speaker 1: would ask a lot more often, and I would tell 639 00:41:21,155 --> 00:41:23,435 Speaker 1: them the same thing. I can't remember the details, but 640 00:41:23,515 --> 00:41:26,115 Speaker 1: for twenty years now I have been convinced I was 641 00:41:26,155 --> 00:41:30,915 Speaker 1: aware of Bill Maher at Cornell. Finally came the day 642 00:41:31,395 --> 00:41:34,475 Speaker 1: March twentieth, two thousand and nine, when they first asked 643 00:41:34,475 --> 00:41:38,235 Speaker 1: me to go on Real Time and Bill Maher Cornell 644 00:41:38,315 --> 00:41:41,475 Speaker 1: seventy eight asked me Cornell seventy nine, something about colleges, 645 00:41:41,515 --> 00:41:43,755 Speaker 1: and I said, well, as you know, we overlapped at Cornell, 646 00:41:43,795 --> 00:41:45,635 Speaker 1: and I don't know if we met or whatever it was, 647 00:41:45,675 --> 00:41:49,515 Speaker 1: but I was aware of you there. And he interrupted 648 00:41:49,555 --> 00:41:52,875 Speaker 1: me and said, no, you weren't, and I just went 649 00:41:52,955 --> 00:41:56,875 Speaker 1: back and answered his question. Now, after every episode of 650 00:41:56,915 --> 00:42:00,035 Speaker 1: his program, mar has or at least had a little 651 00:42:00,115 --> 00:42:04,675 Speaker 1: party backstage, I mean catered with booze and with more gas. 652 00:42:04,795 --> 00:42:07,395 Speaker 1: Then there are people in the studio audience, and usually 653 00:42:07,435 --> 00:42:10,995 Speaker 1: a bunch of models having done that show four times, 654 00:42:11,315 --> 00:42:13,315 Speaker 1: where they will fly you in first class and put 655 00:42:13,355 --> 00:42:15,115 Speaker 1: you up for the weekend in LA just to do 656 00:42:15,235 --> 00:42:20,155 Speaker 1: their show, and there's a party. I began to suspect that, 657 00:42:20,315 --> 00:42:23,035 Speaker 1: like many of the guests, Bill Maher does the show 658 00:42:23,635 --> 00:42:28,395 Speaker 1: just so he can have the party anyway. Not long 659 00:42:28,435 --> 00:42:30,915 Speaker 1: after it started, it overcomes mar and he's mad at me. 660 00:42:31,355 --> 00:42:34,355 Speaker 1: And mind you, even if his allegation that he is 661 00:42:34,435 --> 00:42:37,715 Speaker 1: five feet eight is correct, I'm just under six ' four, 662 00:42:37,795 --> 00:42:40,315 Speaker 1: So he's giving up a lot of height during an argument, 663 00:42:40,475 --> 00:42:42,635 Speaker 1: and he starts yapping about how I should stop saying 664 00:42:42,635 --> 00:42:44,475 Speaker 1: I was a way here of him at Cornell and 665 00:42:44,555 --> 00:42:46,835 Speaker 1: I'm just trying to get publicity off something that never happened. 666 00:42:46,875 --> 00:42:50,235 Speaker 1: And who could remember that kind of crap anyway? And 667 00:42:50,275 --> 00:42:52,235 Speaker 1: he never talked to anybody in four years in college 668 00:42:52,315 --> 00:42:54,715 Speaker 1: because quote except for the Ethica High school students I 669 00:42:54,755 --> 00:43:00,395 Speaker 1: sold drugs to unquote. And I notice he's getting heated, 670 00:43:00,875 --> 00:43:04,395 Speaker 1: and this is just triggering that core belief of mine 671 00:43:04,955 --> 00:43:08,595 Speaker 1: thought I was aware of him in college and I 672 00:43:08,675 --> 00:43:11,235 Speaker 1: didn't like him, And now it becomes clear to me 673 00:43:12,235 --> 00:43:16,795 Speaker 1: he didn't like me either. He's getting loud enough and 674 00:43:16,875 --> 00:43:19,955 Speaker 1: he's swinging his arms around now and it looks kind 675 00:43:19,955 --> 00:43:22,675 Speaker 1: of funny, but apparently it happens in the office sometimes. 676 00:43:22,875 --> 00:43:26,435 Speaker 1: And this is when Scott Carter, who was the executive producer, 677 00:43:26,475 --> 00:43:29,275 Speaker 1: whom I definitely did know since like nineteen ninety two 678 00:43:29,435 --> 00:43:32,275 Speaker 1: when he worked at Comedy Central with my friend Alan Havy. 679 00:43:32,475 --> 00:43:37,195 Speaker 1: Scott Carter comes over to defuse the situation. Scott was 680 00:43:37,235 --> 00:43:39,475 Speaker 1: a three piece suit kind of guy with a thumbs 681 00:43:39,515 --> 00:43:42,995 Speaker 1: tucking the vest, who would call a group of men fellows, 682 00:43:43,435 --> 00:43:47,555 Speaker 1: as in say fellows. So Scott comes over and says, 683 00:43:47,875 --> 00:43:52,355 Speaker 1: say fellows with your Carnell alumni reunion here, And of 684 00:43:52,395 --> 00:43:55,275 Speaker 1: course this makes Bill Maher even angrier. Let me ask 685 00:43:55,315 --> 00:43:58,075 Speaker 1: you something. I used to drive down from Hobart to 686 00:43:58,155 --> 00:44:01,035 Speaker 1: see concerts at Cornell to say, I think Cornell was 687 00:44:01,035 --> 00:44:04,795 Speaker 1: the leading concert school in the nation back in our day. 688 00:44:05,515 --> 00:44:07,755 Speaker 1: And now Scott starts the list who he saw in 689 00:44:07,835 --> 00:44:11,355 Speaker 1: concert at Cornell, Robert Palmer and the famous Grateful Dead 690 00:44:11,435 --> 00:44:14,915 Speaker 1: concert at Cornell at Barton Hall. He was there, and 691 00:44:14,955 --> 00:44:17,595 Speaker 1: I say I went to Springsteen, and mar mumbles something 692 00:44:17,635 --> 00:44:20,355 Speaker 1: about Loggins and Messina, and I know what Carter is 693 00:44:20,395 --> 00:44:23,035 Speaker 1: doing here. He's diffusing, and we do a couple of 694 00:44:23,155 --> 00:44:26,395 Speaker 1: rounds of who saw which Cornell concert? And finally I say, 695 00:44:26,475 --> 00:44:30,155 Speaker 1: I can top both of you, comic geniuses. I saw 696 00:44:30,555 --> 00:44:35,835 Speaker 1: Robert Kleine in concert at Cornell. Now it is criminal, 697 00:44:36,595 --> 00:44:39,235 Speaker 1: but there's an excellent chance You may not know who 698 00:44:39,315 --> 00:44:44,715 Speaker 1: Robert Kline is, suffice to say as prominent a comedian 699 00:44:44,755 --> 00:44:47,835 Speaker 1: in the sixties, seventies eighties as George Carlin or Richard 700 00:44:47,835 --> 00:44:53,115 Speaker 1: pryor HBO. Itself was built on annual George Carlin concerts 701 00:44:53,115 --> 00:44:57,795 Speaker 1: and annual Robert Klin concerts and everybody else. And Robert 702 00:44:57,835 --> 00:45:00,955 Speaker 1: Kline wasn't quite as deep or eternal as George Carlin, 703 00:45:01,035 --> 00:45:04,115 Speaker 1: but he was really on the money during Watergate and 704 00:45:04,195 --> 00:45:07,475 Speaker 1: during ra So I say, I saw Robert Klein in 705 00:45:07,555 --> 00:45:11,515 Speaker 1: concert at Cornell, and Mar looks at me, funny and 706 00:45:11,635 --> 00:45:16,115 Speaker 1: not angrily, and says quietly, I was at that too. 707 00:45:17,075 --> 00:45:20,275 Speaker 1: I saw Robert Klein too, And I don't really register 708 00:45:20,355 --> 00:45:23,835 Speaker 1: that Mar's mood has now utterly changed. He's not angry, 709 00:45:24,235 --> 00:45:27,555 Speaker 1: he's confused. Well, I say, I can still top you, 710 00:45:27,635 --> 00:45:32,075 Speaker 1: because after that concert I interviewed Robert Klein. Now Bill 711 00:45:32,155 --> 00:45:35,515 Speaker 1: Maher starts to squint, and he looks at me, and 712 00:45:35,555 --> 00:45:37,835 Speaker 1: he looks at Scott Carter, and he looks back at 713 00:45:37,835 --> 00:45:46,195 Speaker 1: me and he says, wait, I interviewed Kleine after that concert, too, 714 00:45:46,275 --> 00:45:48,795 Speaker 1: And I'm smiling through all this and smiling and smiling 715 00:45:48,835 --> 00:45:52,435 Speaker 1: and smiling. And then suddenly simultaneously, it hits Bill Maher 716 00:45:52,475 --> 00:45:54,595 Speaker 1: and me at the same moment, in the same fullness 717 00:45:54,635 --> 00:45:57,355 Speaker 1: of detail, and I stop smiling and I shout at 718 00:45:57,395 --> 00:46:01,755 Speaker 1: Bill Maher, you and he pulls his arms in towards 719 00:46:01,755 --> 00:46:04,315 Speaker 1: his stomach and kind of bends forward at the waist 720 00:46:04,395 --> 00:46:07,075 Speaker 1: and his face with his hands, and he says, oh God, 721 00:46:07,115 --> 00:46:09,995 Speaker 1: I'm so sorry, Jesus, it can't be. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. 722 00:46:11,235 --> 00:46:14,795 Speaker 1: And while the anger wells up inside me so powerfully, 723 00:46:14,795 --> 00:46:18,155 Speaker 1: I can almost see it in my own eyeballs. Bill 724 00:46:18,235 --> 00:46:23,315 Speaker 1: Maher's concert going producer Scott Carter is really confused. Say Fellows, 725 00:46:23,715 --> 00:46:26,195 Speaker 1: did I miss something or did I have a brief 726 00:46:26,315 --> 00:46:31,275 Speaker 1: stroke or episode? And I say Bill, and I just 727 00:46:31,355 --> 00:46:35,875 Speaker 1: remembered how I happen to be aware of him in school, 728 00:46:37,075 --> 00:46:39,555 Speaker 1: and Mar still has got his hands over his face 729 00:46:39,835 --> 00:46:43,355 Speaker 1: and people are looking at us, and Bill is shouting apologies, 730 00:46:43,355 --> 00:46:46,275 Speaker 1: and I say you want to tell him or should I? 731 00:46:47,315 --> 00:46:50,315 Speaker 1: And Mar just shakes his body no and mumbles, oh God, 732 00:46:50,475 --> 00:46:52,955 Speaker 1: you do it. I can't, I can't, I can't, And 733 00:46:53,075 --> 00:46:56,955 Speaker 1: it all came back to me. For years, I would 734 00:46:56,995 --> 00:47:00,235 Speaker 1: tell people the story of the Robert Klein concert at 735 00:47:00,235 --> 00:47:04,555 Speaker 1: Cornell University in nineteen seventy eight, our radio station co 736 00:47:04,795 --> 00:47:07,955 Speaker 1: sponsored his appearance along with the Corneill Concert Commission, and 737 00:47:08,115 --> 00:47:11,635 Speaker 1: in the contract we specified that a couple of us 738 00:47:11,675 --> 00:47:14,035 Speaker 1: real comedy nerds at the radio station would get to 739 00:47:14,075 --> 00:47:17,675 Speaker 1: go backstage afterwards and tape a brief ten or fifteen 740 00:47:17,675 --> 00:47:21,875 Speaker 1: minute interview with Robert Klin. Basically, we paid him not much, 741 00:47:21,915 --> 00:47:25,355 Speaker 1: but we paid him to do an interview. And when 742 00:47:25,395 --> 00:47:28,555 Speaker 1: my pal Andy Grossman and I get backstage to talk 743 00:47:28,555 --> 00:47:30,715 Speaker 1: to Robert Klein, and we have our two microphones and 744 00:47:30,755 --> 00:47:33,595 Speaker 1: two mike stands and three tape recorders, there is this guy, 745 00:47:34,355 --> 00:47:38,475 Speaker 1: this short guy, and he's yelling at the chief of 746 00:47:38,515 --> 00:47:42,155 Speaker 1: the Cornail Concert Commission, and he's yelling at Robert Clein's manager, 747 00:47:42,235 --> 00:47:44,195 Speaker 1: and he's demanding that he should get to interview Robert 748 00:47:44,195 --> 00:47:46,515 Speaker 1: Clin because, like Klein, this kid says he is a 749 00:47:46,555 --> 00:47:49,715 Speaker 1: stand up comedian and he publishes the Corneill Humor magazine. 750 00:47:49,755 --> 00:47:51,755 Speaker 1: And he points at me and he says he should 751 00:47:51,795 --> 00:47:57,075 Speaker 1: get priority over these quote corporate sellouts from the Corneill 752 00:47:57,195 --> 00:48:05,275 Speaker 1: Radio station. I hated him on site. Oh wait, I 753 00:48:05,355 --> 00:48:07,755 Speaker 1: say to him in nineteen seventy eight, and he's small, 754 00:48:07,795 --> 00:48:10,755 Speaker 1: and he's got dirty, stringy hair and he's loud, and 755 00:48:10,795 --> 00:48:14,635 Speaker 1: I say, you are the publisher of the Cornell humor magazine, 756 00:48:14,635 --> 00:48:17,715 Speaker 1: the Cornell Widow. And he snorts and says I would 757 00:48:17,835 --> 00:48:22,035 Speaker 1: get caught dead publishing that corporate sellout, Cornell Widow. And 758 00:48:22,075 --> 00:48:24,515 Speaker 1: so I say, oh, so, then that means you're the 759 00:48:24,515 --> 00:48:28,435 Speaker 1: publisher of the Cornell Alternative humor magazine, the Not So 760 00:48:28,635 --> 00:48:31,115 Speaker 1: Big Red or whatever it is they call it. He says, 761 00:48:31,315 --> 00:48:35,275 Speaker 1: no way, they are corporate sellouts. I publish this and 762 00:48:35,315 --> 00:48:38,835 Speaker 1: he pulls out a stack of mimeographed pages stapled together 763 00:48:39,395 --> 00:48:41,555 Speaker 1: and there's like a drawing on the front of a 764 00:48:41,755 --> 00:48:47,555 Speaker 1: naked girl and handwritten it says it's his comedy magazine. 765 00:48:48,195 --> 00:48:51,755 Speaker 1: And I look at Robert Klein's manager and I say, so, 766 00:48:51,915 --> 00:48:54,915 Speaker 1: it's ten o'clock and if you leave now while while 767 00:48:54,915 --> 00:48:57,355 Speaker 1: this idiot is screwing this up, the limo can still 768 00:48:57,395 --> 00:49:01,355 Speaker 1: get mister Klein to Elaine's in the city before it closes, right, 769 00:49:01,755 --> 00:49:05,275 Speaker 1: And the manager is wildly impressed. You know of Lanes? 770 00:49:05,755 --> 00:49:08,715 Speaker 1: And I said yes, and I felt like an adult. 771 00:49:09,315 --> 00:49:11,595 Speaker 1: And I also said, if we give this guy five 772 00:49:11,635 --> 00:49:13,675 Speaker 1: minutes of our time right now while we're setting up 773 00:49:13,675 --> 00:49:15,515 Speaker 1: our tape recorders. Can we still have ten minutes with 774 00:49:15,595 --> 00:49:18,715 Speaker 1: mister Klein And the manager says, good plan. I like 775 00:49:18,755 --> 00:49:20,595 Speaker 1: the way you think, and he points to the kid 776 00:49:20,635 --> 00:49:24,035 Speaker 1: and gestures for him to come along. Now the kid shouts, 777 00:49:24,115 --> 00:49:27,195 Speaker 1: I want half an hour. These corporate sellouts deserve nothing. 778 00:49:28,795 --> 00:49:33,275 Speaker 1: And now I'm getting angry. I say, buddy, so far 779 00:49:33,515 --> 00:49:37,155 Speaker 1: all the corporations in the world have paid me about 780 00:49:37,195 --> 00:49:40,995 Speaker 1: one hundred bucks. So I threaten him. Now, mind you, 781 00:49:41,075 --> 00:49:43,675 Speaker 1: I believe this is literally true. Since nineteen sixty seven, 782 00:49:43,715 --> 00:49:46,115 Speaker 1: when I was eight years old, I have started two fistfights, 783 00:49:46,795 --> 00:49:50,795 Speaker 1: two in fifty five years. I am a man of peace. 784 00:49:51,475 --> 00:49:54,555 Speaker 1: I am loud, but I am a man of peace. 785 00:49:56,075 --> 00:50:01,475 Speaker 1: But I say to this guy, you now have two choices. Kid, 786 00:50:01,995 --> 00:50:04,875 Speaker 1: five minutes with Robert Klein or I hit you you 787 00:50:04,875 --> 00:50:08,915 Speaker 1: in the face. And he runs to where client's manager 788 00:50:08,955 --> 00:50:12,195 Speaker 1: is still gesturing towards him, and he screams, carpred sell out, 789 00:50:12,875 --> 00:50:15,515 Speaker 1: and he disappears to do his interview, and behind him 790 00:50:15,515 --> 00:50:19,875 Speaker 1: he leaves his little homemade mimeograph ten or twelve page 791 00:50:19,955 --> 00:50:22,435 Speaker 1: humor publication. And I pick it up, and I read 792 00:50:22,475 --> 00:50:26,875 Speaker 1: it and register it and dismiss it. Before I leave 793 00:50:26,915 --> 00:50:29,875 Speaker 1: the building. And if I had only remembered what it 794 00:50:29,995 --> 00:50:32,555 Speaker 1: said on the cover, all the years of mystery and 795 00:50:32,595 --> 00:50:34,435 Speaker 1: I was aware of him, and all that would never 796 00:50:34,475 --> 00:50:38,475 Speaker 1: have happened because the cover of the magazine read Bill 797 00:50:38,755 --> 00:50:45,235 Speaker 1: Mahr's Comedy Magazine by Bill MAHERR. And now back in 798 00:50:46,515 --> 00:50:49,875 Speaker 1: well technically this is correct, back in real time. At 799 00:50:49,875 --> 00:50:52,195 Speaker 1: the party in the Hollywood studio in two thousand and nine, 800 00:50:52,235 --> 00:50:55,195 Speaker 1: the producer Scott Carter says nothing, and Bill Maher is 801 00:50:55,235 --> 00:50:58,955 Speaker 1: still doubled over in shame, and I say, are you 802 00:50:59,275 --> 00:51:02,995 Speaker 1: satisfied that I was aware of you? And he mumbles yes. 803 00:51:03,915 --> 00:51:07,715 Speaker 1: And I say, will you ever question my memory again? 804 00:51:08,475 --> 00:51:11,955 Speaker 1: And he mumbles no. And he says if I need 805 00:51:12,035 --> 00:51:15,035 Speaker 1: him to do my show or a charity benefit or something, 806 00:51:15,115 --> 00:51:18,115 Speaker 1: just call. And he says he's ashamed, and he offers 807 00:51:18,155 --> 00:51:20,115 Speaker 1: me his hand to shake, and we shake, and finally 808 00:51:20,115 --> 00:51:22,595 Speaker 1: I say, and by the way, Bill Maher, if Bill 809 00:51:22,635 --> 00:51:26,475 Speaker 1: Maher's Comedy Magazine by Bill Maher are you a corporate sellout? 810 00:51:27,195 --> 00:51:32,795 Speaker 1: And he says kind And that's how I was aware 811 00:51:32,955 --> 00:51:49,435 Speaker 1: of Bill Maher in college. I've done all the damage 812 00:51:49,435 --> 00:51:51,355 Speaker 1: I can do here. Thank you for listening. Here are 813 00:51:51,395 --> 00:51:54,275 Speaker 1: the credits. Most of the music arranged, produced and performed 814 00:51:54,315 --> 00:51:56,875 Speaker 1: by Brian Ray and John Phillips Chanel, who are the 815 00:51:56,915 --> 00:52:00,355 Speaker 1: Countdown musical directors. Guitarist, bass and drums by Brian Ray, 816 00:52:00,755 --> 00:52:04,475 Speaker 1: All orchestration and keyboards by John Phillip Shaneale, produced by TKO. 817 00:52:05,395 --> 00:52:08,115 Speaker 1: Other Beethoven selections have been arranged and performed by the 818 00:52:08,115 --> 00:52:11,235 Speaker 1: group No Horns Allowed. The sports music is the Olderman 819 00:52:11,315 --> 00:52:13,515 Speaker 1: theme from ESPN two and it was written by Mitch 820 00:52:13,555 --> 00:52:18,355 Speaker 1: Warren Davis courtesy of ESPN, Inc. Musical comments by Nancy Faust. 821 00:52:18,435 --> 00:52:21,475 Speaker 1: The best baseball stadium organist ever. Our announcer today was 822 00:52:21,475 --> 00:52:24,835 Speaker 1: my friend Tony Kornheiser. Everything else is pretty much my fault. 823 00:52:25,355 --> 00:52:27,355 Speaker 1: So that's countdown for this the nine hundred and third 824 00:52:27,475 --> 00:52:30,915 Speaker 1: day since Donald Trump's first attempted coup against the democratically 825 00:52:30,915 --> 00:52:34,595 Speaker 1: elected government of the United States. Arrest him again while 826 00:52:34,635 --> 00:52:38,395 Speaker 1: we still can. The next scheduled countdown is tomorrow. Until then, 827 00:52:38,435 --> 00:52:41,955 Speaker 1: I'm Keith Olberman. Good Morning, good afternoon, goodnight, and good luck. 828 00:52:52,395 --> 00:52:56,355 Speaker 1: Countdown with Keith Olderman is a production of iHeartRadio. For 829 00:52:56,555 --> 00:53:01,475 Speaker 1: more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app Apple podcasts, 830 00:53:01,715 --> 00:53:03,675 Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts