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Speaker 1: I am Scott and I'm Ben and we're from car Stuff.

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Speaker 1: We're the podcast that covers everything that flutes, flies, swims,

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Speaker 1: or drives, adventures, thrills, chills literally, planes, trains and automobiles.

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Speaker 1: That's right. And you can find all of our episodes

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Speaker 1: on Google Play, Spotify, iTunes, and really anywhere else you

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Speaker 1: get your podcast. Welcome to Stuff, Mom Never told you.

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Speaker 1: From how stupp works dot com. Hello and welcome to

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Kristen and I'm Caroline. And today, as

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Speaker 1: we announced on social media, actually a while back, we're

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Speaker 1: talking about Hillary Clinton. Yeah, I'm I'm excited. I am

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Speaker 1: glad that we are taking this opportunity to apply our

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Speaker 1: sminty research. We're putting on our research caps two. Mine

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Speaker 1: has sequence on it. Um actually minds like a floppy

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Speaker 1: sun hat. Does it have a feather No, No feathers,

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Speaker 1: just like a straw hat. Like the kind of word

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Speaker 1: the beach, because I wish that I was at the

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Speaker 1: beach right now. Because your future so bright, you gotta

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Speaker 1: wear a floppy sun love it. Um. But we wanted

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Speaker 1: to put on our very sminty esque research caps today

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Speaker 1: to apply that um rigorous approach to Hillary Clinton, because

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Speaker 1: I know there was a little bit of trepidation that

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Speaker 1: we would maybe, like just deliver a puff piece. But

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Speaker 1: when have you known us besides maybe the Dad Bods

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Speaker 1: episode to deliver a puff piece. Oh, I think the

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Speaker 1: Dad Boss was not a puff piece. It was maybe

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Speaker 1: a puffy piece o puff pastry. And some people were,

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Speaker 1: you know, a little curious as to why we would

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Speaker 1: even talk about her. I mean, she's obviously you know,

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Speaker 1: she can be a polarizing figure. But the fact of

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Speaker 1: the matter is Hillary Clinton, hands down, is the most

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Speaker 1: successful woman in the history of American politics. I think

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Speaker 1: it would be really hard to argue that she's not.

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Speaker 1: And since she became the first Lady of Arkansas in

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Speaker 1: nineteen nine, people have both loved and loathed her, and

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Speaker 1: we want to emphasize that in this episode. We're not

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Speaker 1: trying to convince you to feel one way or the

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Speaker 1: other about her, because y'all is America, um. And also

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Speaker 1: it's just not our job, UM. And we also want

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Speaker 1: to let you know at the top of the podcast

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Speaker 1: that we cannot cover every single detail of her life

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Speaker 1: because there is a lot. I mean, she's done a lot,

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Speaker 1: but there's also been so much written about her, whether

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Speaker 1: it's books, academic articles with words in them, so many words,

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Speaker 1: so many words. UM. So for the purpose of this episode,

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Speaker 1: we are not going to be talking about her in

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Speaker 1: the current campaign. No, we're not going to talk about

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Speaker 1: her current platform, her going up against Bernie Sanders, how

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Speaker 1: she might fare against an opponent in the general election,

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Speaker 1: none of that. We're not even really going to talk

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Speaker 1: about two thousand and eight, her running against Obama. UM.

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Speaker 1: We are focusing on the Hillary Clinton and really the

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Speaker 1: Hillary Rodham. UM that I as you know, someone who

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Speaker 1: was very young when she was coming up in politics, UM,

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Speaker 1: the part of her that might not be as familiar

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Speaker 1: to listeners, younger listeners. UM. And yes, I do you

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Speaker 1: know count people our age as younger, um, because we

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Speaker 1: will always be young at heart. Well and especially and

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Speaker 1: I really do not mean this in a disparaging manner whatsoever,

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Speaker 1: trust me, especially going off of the response we got

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Speaker 1: to our Anita Hill episode where people our age and

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Speaker 1: younger were like, whoa, whoa, WHOA what? I didn't even

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Speaker 1: know the full ex Either I didn't know or I

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Speaker 1: didn't know the full extent. And so we sort of

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Speaker 1: hope to apply that treatment to to Hillary Rodham Clinton

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Speaker 1: as well and fill you in and on basically how

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Speaker 1: she got on the path that she has been on

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Speaker 1: essentially her entire life. Yeah, so we're going to focus

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Speaker 1: on her pre Lewinsky scandal biography, um, and also the

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Speaker 1: public perception around that, because we want to focus obviously

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Speaker 1: on the facts of her life, um, and how the

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Speaker 1: facts of her how her facts of life you take

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Speaker 1: the good, you take the bad, the facts machine, the

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Speaker 1: fact not like the fact that, yes that all of

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Speaker 1: her facts is um not her emails though. Uh. And

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Speaker 1: we want to talk about how um, her facts of

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Speaker 1: life now, I just want to hear that theme song

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Speaker 1: um uh have been kind of filtered through the press

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Speaker 1: machine and influence public perception. So in other words, we

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Speaker 1: we want to talk about how Hilary Diane Roddam became

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Speaker 1: Hillary Rodham Clinton and how the press has played the

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Speaker 1: so called gender card. Yeah. I'm going to get the

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Speaker 1: gender tarot card deck dred Our gender card future. Yeah, man,

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Speaker 1: I'm very nervous about my salary. Um. But the quote

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Speaker 1: unquote gender card is a huge factor in our conversation

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Speaker 1: because the very way that she has been covered as

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Speaker 1: just a person, a politician, a wife, a mother, a

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Speaker 1: lover of headbands. You know, for forty years now has

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Speaker 1: been so hyper gendered, and um, since this is stuff

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Speaker 1: I never told you, that is really what we're most

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Speaker 1: interested in because I think it says a lot to

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Speaker 1: all of us, regardless of where we stand politically or

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Speaker 1: um our station in life. Um, it says a lot

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Speaker 1: about our cultural climate as it relates to ambitious, career

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Speaker 1: driven women. Yeah, and ambitious career drive and women who

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Speaker 1: are even different from the rest. So for instance, Hillary

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Speaker 1: Clinton not necessarily conforming to the way that a woman

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Speaker 1: is supposed to work or be professional. Oh yeah, I mean.

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Speaker 1: And also, before we get further into our conversation, I

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Speaker 1: want to thank all of the stuff whenever told you

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Speaker 1: listeners who sent us voice memos sharing their thoughts on Hillary,

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Speaker 1: because this is a conversation that we wanted to to

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Speaker 1: invite you all into. We want your literal voices in

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Speaker 1: this because, um, you know, there are so many different

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Speaker 1: opinions about her out there. So with that, let's talk

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Speaker 1: about Hills. Let's talk about Hillary. Diane Rodham now Hillary

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Speaker 1: Rodham Clinton, Um, who, by the way, I thought I

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Speaker 1: thought this was notable, Caroline, that despite all of the

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Speaker 1: mixed opinions that are absolutely out there about her. She

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Speaker 1: has been gallop polls most of my tired Woman in

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Speaker 1: America for twenty years running. And the fact of the

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Speaker 1: matter is, folks, when we look at her bio, there

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Speaker 1: is a lot to genuinely admire. Yeah, listener ray and

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Speaker 1: certainly thinks so, and she wishes more people talked about it.

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Speaker 1: I love Hillary Clinton because she's one of the most

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Speaker 1: accomplished women in the world in many different areas. She's

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Speaker 1: had tons of different experiences and proven her commitment to

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Speaker 1: working her off. It's hard to love Hillary Clinton though,

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Speaker 1: because we never get to talk about her in that way,

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Speaker 1: because of all of the sexist bullshit that people don't

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Speaker 1: like women as much when they talk about their own accomplishments.

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Speaker 1: She's a fascinating figure, and it starts with the fact

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Speaker 1: that her name is inspired by explorer Edmund Hillary. I

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Speaker 1: love that. I didn't know that. This This episode is

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Speaker 1: honestly full of stuff I didn't know. Um. But she

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Speaker 1: was born October Cargo. She was the first of three

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Speaker 1: children to Hugh and Dorothy Rodham and her It was

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Speaker 1: pretty conservative family. Her dad owned a drapery fabric business,

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Speaker 1: and she grew up in the suburbs. Her mom was

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Speaker 1: a homemaker but very driven and very driven to see

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Speaker 1: her daughter be driven. Yeah. And her mom, as uh,

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Speaker 1: Hillary has talked about a lot, especially more recent years, UM,

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Speaker 1: was a huge influence in I mean really just shaping

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Speaker 1: her personality in her drive. UM. During the two thousand

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Speaker 1: and eight election, for instance, Hillary described her mother as

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Speaker 1: a woman who quote never got a chance to go

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Speaker 1: to college, who had a very difficult childhood, but who

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Speaker 1: gave me a belief that I could do whatever I

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Speaker 1: set my mind to. UM. And Dorothy was tough, I

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Speaker 1: mean this woman. She also grew up in really tough circumstances. Um.

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Speaker 1: She had to leave home I think because of abuse

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Speaker 1: when she was fifteen and essentially was supporting herself as nanny,

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Speaker 1: I want to say. Um. And when Hillary was but

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Speaker 1: four years old, she comes home after some neighborhood girls

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Speaker 1: had bullied her and she was really upset about it.

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Speaker 1: And um. Hillary writes in her autobiography Living History that

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Speaker 1: her mom said, you have to stand up for yourself

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Speaker 1: because there is no room in this house for cowards.

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Speaker 1: And I had read that quote somewhere in some article

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Speaker 1: that was talking about this very topic. And I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: that's say that's a good Um, that's a good sentiment.

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Speaker 1: I can appreciate that coming from a parent, not realizing

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Speaker 1: it was said to a four year old. He was

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Speaker 1: but then but then apparently so she you know, takes

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Speaker 1: Dorothy's advice and goes out, and um, I guess kind

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Speaker 1: of like stands up for herself. And the next time

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Speaker 1: she comes home she says, Mom, I can play with

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Speaker 1: the boys now. I know, I know. There are a

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Speaker 1: lot of moments when in her her upbringing that you're like,

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Speaker 1: she can play with the boys now, such as Dorothy's

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Speaker 1: big dreams for little Hillary. Um. This has been noted

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Speaker 1: in a number of her bios that her mom suggested,

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Speaker 1: I mean she kind of dreamed like this was her

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Speaker 1: vicarious dream for Hillary, that she become the first female

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Speaker 1: Supreme Court justice. I love that. No, it's no small potato, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I know, no pressure of pressure. Um. But we should

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Speaker 1: also note too that Dorothy and Hugh were decidedly Republican. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: yeah they weren't. I mean, she wasn't being raised as

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Speaker 1: a politically liberal, um little girl, which might be surprising

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Speaker 1: to some, But she Hillary not Dorothy Hillary did get

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Speaker 1: sort of an early splash of cold water when it

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Speaker 1: comes to sexism at just twelve years old, thanks to NASA. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: she writes in her book A Living History. How you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not any less capable than the dudes.

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Speaker 1: But when she was twelve and she was totally consumed

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Speaker 1: with space race fever, she writes to NASA volunteering to

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Speaker 1: become an astronaut, which I don't I don't want to

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Speaker 1: like be sound patronizing or anything, but that's like the

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Speaker 1: cutest that's like the cutest things I have volunteer a

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Speaker 1: volunteer as tribute to be an astronaut, but they rejected

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Speaker 1: her based on her gender. And she wrote that it

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Speaker 1: was the first time I hit an obstacle that I

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Speaker 1: couldn't overcome with hard work and determination. And I was outraged.

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Speaker 1: And that was something Caroline that jumped out to me.

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Speaker 1: This like just disbelief that there was something that her

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Speaker 1: hard work and determination, as she described it, like couldn't solve.

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Speaker 1: And it's going to be something too that she is

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Speaker 1: going to come you know, kind of uh run full

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Speaker 1: speed into once she becomes more involved in politics later

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Speaker 1: in life. Um, but in Living History she describes um

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Speaker 1: that kind of sex awakening to sexism as a quote

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Speaker 1: unquote click moment, like the light bulb went on of

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Speaker 1: oh it is. It's it's kind of a rare thing

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Speaker 1: that I'm being raised to um to be to consider

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Speaker 1: myself as capable as the boys, because the world at

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Speaker 1: large isn't necessarily like that. And I love that because that,

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Speaker 1: you know, you don't hear about a lot of families

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Speaker 1: of that air raising their girls necessarily. I'm not saying

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Speaker 1: all families obviously, not the families hashtag, not all families,

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Speaker 1: but I mean, I just that warms my little, cold

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Speaker 1: dead heart whenever I hear any family from any air

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Speaker 1: raising their little girl to be just as capable and

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Speaker 1: confident as their sons. Yeah. And she always expected to

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Speaker 1: go to college, you know she because in that era,

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Speaker 1: of course, it would have been perfectly acceptable for her

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Speaker 1: to graduate from high school and get her quote unquote

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Speaker 1: mrs degree. Um. But she was like, no, no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: I want to do things with my life like being

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Speaker 1: astronaut a weight I can't NASA. So we have her

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Speaker 1: awakening to the reality of sexism UM at fifteen. A

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Speaker 1: few years later, she has what she sided as her

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Speaker 1: awakening to injustice when she hears Martin Luther King Jr. Speak.

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Speaker 1: But this wasn't the first time she had basically been

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Speaker 1: around viewpoints of people from different backgrounds. UM. In interview

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Speaker 1: with Newsweek, Hillary attributed her sense of social responsibility to

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Speaker 1: her parents and a Methodist youth minister who took her

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Speaker 1: youth group to migrant farming communities where the kids would

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Speaker 1: babysit for the families when the parents had to go

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Speaker 1: work long hours and they would just talk with the

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Speaker 1: teen So as a teenager, Hillary was no stranger to

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Speaker 1: people who were of different backgrounds than herself, and she

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Speaker 1: cites that as really planning the seeds for UM, the

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Speaker 1: research and work that she would do around poverty and

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Speaker 1: children's issues. UM. In high school, no surprise, she was

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Speaker 1: a terrific student. I mean, Hillary was kind of a

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Speaker 1: Tracy flick without a UM, and she's still perceived in

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Speaker 1: a lot of ways as a Tracy flick UM for

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Speaker 1: any people out there who have seen Election, UM, the

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Speaker 1: movie Election, not like the election happening right now. But

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Speaker 1: she served on student council, she headed up her high

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Speaker 1: school's Republican club and debated the Democrat Club naturally, and

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Speaker 1: she was also the vice president of the National Honor Society,

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Speaker 1: in addition to a bunch of other extracurriculars that she

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Speaker 1: participated in. UM and BuzzFeed News dug up her senior yearbook,

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Speaker 1: and one of the things that they found in it

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Speaker 1: was a column that she wrote for the school newspaper,

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Speaker 1: pretending that she was interviewing her future self So Tracy

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Speaker 1: flick Um so Hill or in her like future Hillary

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Speaker 1: was already a successful lawyer. Um. And she said, though,

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Speaker 1: at the very end of this fake interview um, that

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Speaker 1: her post high school goal was to quote Mary's senator

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Speaker 1: and settled down in Georgetown. And half of me was like,

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Speaker 1: oh you old jokes, or the other half is like,

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Speaker 1: maybe he knows. She could have very well could have

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Speaker 1: been serious, because that's almost what happened. Yeah, almost, And

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Speaker 1: you wonder, I do wonder. Yeah, it was she downplaying

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Speaker 1: it her ambition or was this I don't know, Hillary,

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Speaker 1: you listening? What what was what was the fake you

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Speaker 1: Phillipson really thinking? Yeah, exactly. Um. So, no big surprise

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Speaker 1: that she snagged a scholarship to Wellesley, where she started

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Speaker 1: college in nine five and she majored again, no big

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Speaker 1: surprise in political science. Yeah, and she came to college

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Speaker 1: having been raised in a Republican household. She came to

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Speaker 1: college as a Republican who campaigned for Barry Goldwater. But

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Speaker 1: she evolved politically, which is not surprising. If you're a

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Speaker 1: human person, your views do tend to evolve as you

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Speaker 1: get older, especially in college. Oh. Man, I remember the

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Speaker 1: what was it two thousand four election when I was

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Speaker 1: in college and going home, and like, oh, I was

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Speaker 1: so fired up to talk to my parents about my

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Speaker 1: political awakening, shaking my my finger in the air. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I managed to convince my mother to change her vote

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Speaker 1: from who to who, from Bush to Carry. Very impressive, Caroline. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was in a UM. I was in a History

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Speaker 1: of Foreign Relations class, and I explained UM modernization theory

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Speaker 1: to her. Yeah, I was far less successful. My parents

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Speaker 1: just kind of laughed and said that I would change

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Speaker 1: my mind when I was older. Surprised it hasn't happened. Um.

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Speaker 1: But Yeah, when she gets to college, she is involved

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Speaker 1: in like Republican student organizations, but like you said, she

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Speaker 1: kind of has a political awakening UM and organizes the

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Speaker 1: school's first Vietnam War teaching, and Um ends up supporting

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Speaker 1: Eugene McCarthy, who was running on a very anti Vietnam

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Speaker 1: War platform. Yeah. And in nineteen sixty eight, after Martin

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Speaker 1: Luther King's assassination, she worked with fellow black students to

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Speaker 1: organize a two day strike to recruit more students and

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Speaker 1: tutors of color. So clearly that fifteen year old Hillary

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Speaker 1: who first saw MLK speak, clearly, fifteen year old Hillary

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Speaker 1: is still there. Um. And she wrote her senior thesis

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Speaker 1: on poverty and community development. And in nineteen six nine,

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Speaker 1: when she gradually waits, she was valedictorian of her class

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Speaker 1: and president of student government and became Wellesley's first student

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Speaker 1: commencement speaker. Um. And the students essentially got together and

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Speaker 1: we're like, Hillary, you should be the one to speak UM, which,

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Speaker 1: looking back, UM, it's like, well, who else would you pick?

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Speaker 1: And she was wearing her her big framed glasses were like, UM,

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Speaker 1: that would now be very uh Warby Parker esque, and

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Speaker 1: her hair up and this was something I had no

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Speaker 1: idea about her. Um. She delivers this speech, following up

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Speaker 1: Republican Senator Edward Brooke, who was the first African American

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Speaker 1: elected to the Senate, and Um, I guess he was

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Speaker 1: a little a little more um down with the war

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Speaker 1: and things that were going on, um than her and

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Speaker 1: the student body. So she gets up and makes this

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Speaker 1: speech that may the June nineteen sixty nine issue of

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Speaker 1: Life magazine, they did this whole pictorial of I want

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Speaker 1: to say, like five or six other students who were

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Speaker 1: graduating that year. It was simply titled the Class of

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Speaker 1: sixty nine. And um, you know, because this is the

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Speaker 1: time when all of these kids are being almost radicalized

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Speaker 1: in a way, because you have Vietnam and uh, the

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Speaker 1: sexual revolution and civil rights, all of these things happening. Um.

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Speaker 1: And that Life magazine spread was also the source of

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Speaker 1: the photo, the social media photo that we posted announcing

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Speaker 1: that we were going to do this episode where she

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Speaker 1: has the long hair and the big framed glasses and

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Speaker 1: those striped pants and sandals that I realized, um, look

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Speaker 1: like the ones I'm wearing right now. Uh. Um. And

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Speaker 1: when we posted that photo, Carolina, like half of the

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Speaker 1: comments were, UM, wonderful stuff I've ever told you fans saying,

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Speaker 1: I know I'm not supposed talk about her clothes, but

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Speaker 1: those pants are divide. That's totally fine. You can comment

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Speaker 1: on how much you like someone stripe pants. Um. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: She her speech was was fascinating to me, not only

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Speaker 1: for like the content, which was obviously interesting, but the

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Speaker 1: fact that she is so savvy that she was able

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Speaker 1: to dedicate the first part of her speech to addressing

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Speaker 1: things that Edward Brookes said. You know, She's not like

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Speaker 1: she was going after him, but she was like, I

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Speaker 1: can't delve into this topic that I've decided to pick

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Speaker 1: for today without first addressing some of the senator's comments.

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Speaker 1: And I'm just like, I was picturing myself in college,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, well, first of all, I was

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Speaker 1: drunk all the time, so I don't know how successful

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Speaker 1: I would have been. But h for her to be

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Speaker 1: able to just so calmly and coherently, which is where

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Speaker 1: the difference with me would come in, just address his

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Speaker 1: speech and what he said to her students in a

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Speaker 1: way that just like drove her point home before then

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Speaker 1: transitioning into the speech that she had prepared, I was

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Speaker 1: just like, you were so impressive. Yeah, I mean, like

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Speaker 1: it it takes a politician to be able, like a

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Speaker 1: natural born politician to be able to get up and

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Speaker 1: improvise like that. Yeah, that's exactly what I thought. Um,

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Speaker 1: but I do want to read from the last bit

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Speaker 1: of her speech, which is also um the inscription in

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Speaker 1: Rebecca Tracer's book Big Girls Don't Cry, which is all

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Speaker 1: about Hillary Clinton and the two thousand and eight campaign. Um,

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Speaker 1: so Hillary nine standing up there with her big frame,

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Speaker 1: glasses and up to and graduation. Roban said, one of

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Speaker 1: the most tragic things that happened yesterday, a beautiful day,

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Speaker 1: was that I was talking to a woman who said

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Speaker 1: that she wouldn't want to be me for anything in

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Speaker 1: the world. She wouldn't want to live today and look

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Speaker 1: ahead to what it is she sees because she's afraid.

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Speaker 1: Fear is always with us, but we just don't have

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Speaker 1: time for it. Not now. I mean talking about like

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Speaker 1: a passionate young woman who's like ready to go out

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Speaker 1: into the world. And like in part of that speech too,

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Speaker 1: she says like is echoing the sentiments of a lot

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Speaker 1: of young people at the time, which is just complete

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Speaker 1: and total dissatisfaction with the kind of establishment at large

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Speaker 1: and the way that you know, things were working out,

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Speaker 1: the people who were making all the decisions. Yeah, well,

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Speaker 1: I think that comment is particularly poignant today because you

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Speaker 1: don't hear too many politicians and I'm speaking about nine

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Speaker 1: Hillary like she's already a politician, but she kind of

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Speaker 1: was Um. But you don't hear too many politicians addressing

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Speaker 1: that that fear factor. And I think you have to

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Speaker 1: because fear is what leads to anti trans bathroom bills,

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Speaker 1: fear is what leads to quote unquote religious liberty bills

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Speaker 1: in places like Mississippi, and so I just think it's

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Speaker 1: really spectacular that as such a young woman she would

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Speaker 1: be addressing that. She was like, there's no room for fear.

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Speaker 1: We've got to plow ahead and change the world. Like

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Speaker 1: we can't just sit around and be afraid of this.

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Speaker 1: We've got to go out and do well. And something

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Speaker 1: that also echoes her um politician in training, whether she

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Speaker 1: was cognizant of it or not at the time, was

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Speaker 1: her reaction to the Life magazine piece and the and

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Speaker 1: the media coverage around her commencement speech because Um the photographer.

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Speaker 1: The Life magazine photographer noted Um on one of her

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Speaker 1: photos he was just like taking notes and said that

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Speaker 1: she was nervous about people kind of thinking that she

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Speaker 1: was attacking Brooks I mean she was kind of already

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Speaker 1: thinking about public perception and wanting to be more of

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Speaker 1: a centrist and not ruffle feathers too much. Um. So

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Speaker 1: that was kind of like another early hint of maybe

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Speaker 1: what was to come. But after Wellesley, she heads off

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Speaker 1: to Yale Law School, where she was one of thirty

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Speaker 1: six women in a class of two seven. And I

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Speaker 1: gotta say, like, at this point, so she's at Yale

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Speaker 1: Law School, I mean, Dorothy has to be pumped. She's like,

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Speaker 1: there's hills. She's on her way to the Supreme Court bench. Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 1: And then she meets a guy who's bragging about how

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Speaker 1: big watermelons are in Arkansas. It's all Bill Clinton. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I love that, say she she stalks up to

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Speaker 1: him in the library one day and it's like, listen,

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Speaker 1: if you're gonna keep looking at me and I'm going

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Speaker 1: to keep looking back, we at least ought to know

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Speaker 1: each other. And that's that's how they met. I mean,

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Speaker 1: very appropriate that she made the first move totally, um,

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Speaker 1: But we're not joking about the whole watermelon thing. She was.

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Speaker 1: I think that was also in the Newsweek interview. She

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Speaker 1: was like this, this guy, this returning Rhodes scholar who

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Speaker 1: was always talking about how big the watermelons were in Arkansas. UM,

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Speaker 1: and as has been emphasized many times, UM, they were

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Speaker 1: kind of inseparable from that point on. But law school

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Speaker 1: was not just about romance. Hillary kept busy. Aside from

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Speaker 1: bill Um, she was on the Yale Review of Law

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Speaker 1: and Social Action. She worked at the Yale Child Studies Center.

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Speaker 1: She took on cases of child abuse while volunteering at

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Speaker 1: the New Haven Legal Services Clinic. She also researched the

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Speaker 1: problems of migrant workers, going back to her teen experience

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Speaker 1: with her youth group. She researched the problem of migrant

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Speaker 1: workers as part of Walter Mondale's Subcommittee on Migrant Labor,

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Speaker 1: which echoes her UM experiences as a teenager with UM

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Speaker 1: her youth group. And in her postgrad year she continued

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Speaker 1: her work setting kids in medicine and served as the

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Speaker 1: staff attorney for the Children's Defense Fund in Cambridge. And

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Speaker 1: that chunk of info is coming courtesy of PBS, that's right,

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Speaker 1: and that's of course a child advocacy group, which I

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Speaker 1: think not only echoes her experience as a teen babysitting

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Speaker 1: for the children of migrant workers. But I think it

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Speaker 1: also echoes echoes her and mother's experience, her mother having

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Speaker 1: overcome abuse and um striking out on her own at

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Speaker 1: such a young age, and having to be a child

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Speaker 1: who has to sort of fend for herself. I think

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Speaker 1: that that also shaped a lot of what Hillary was

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Speaker 1: doing in terms of sticking up for kids and later

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Speaker 1: advocating for laws around child emancipation. Well, not to mention

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Speaker 1: that Bill clinton stepfather was abusive. That's him. Yeah. So

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Speaker 1: speaking of Bill Clinton, uh. In nineteen four, post graduation,

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Speaker 1: their long distance relationship commences because Bill heads back to

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Speaker 1: Arkansas to be with his massive watermelons. Um it sounds

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Speaker 1: like such a euphemism. Womp, Let me say that, No,

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Speaker 1: I don't think he should. Uh sad drumbone. Uh. And

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Speaker 1: Hillary meanwhile rolls out to d C to work on

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Speaker 1: the impeachment inquiry staff, advising the House Committee on the

429
00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:16,960
Speaker 1: Judiciary during Watergate, so she was essentially like digging through

430
00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:20,880
Speaker 1: all of Nixon's tapes and kind of helping put together

431
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:25,680
Speaker 1: the case against him. Um. And after Watergate went down,

432
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,679
Speaker 1: Hillary's job ended, so she had to make the choice

433
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:34,280
Speaker 1: of what to do next. Do you go settle down

434
00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:37,399
Speaker 1: in Georgetown, find that senator, or do you go chase

435
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 1: Bill Clinton's watermelons. Don't go chase, don't go chase watermelons.

436
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,320
Speaker 1: Please stick to the senator. You thought you would admit

437
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 1: every Yeah, I mean, not necessarily, please stick to the senator.

438
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:58,200
Speaker 1: But like, this is a major this is a major

439
00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:00,720
Speaker 1: point in her life. This is her crossroad like the

440
00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:05,840
Speaker 1: movie starring Britney Spears, like the movie Crossroads. Um So again,

441
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:09,560
Speaker 1: we're gonna keep referencing this Newsweek interview and just like

442
00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:14,199
Speaker 1: media coverage of her in because it's some of the

443
00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:17,760
Speaker 1: most um I would say unguarded Hillary Clinton that you

444
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,720
Speaker 1: could see. I mean, she would have these extensive interviews

445
00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:26,320
Speaker 1: that are I wouldn't say rare now but are less

446
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:30,400
Speaker 1: orchestrated well. And and you also get the sense from

447
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:34,240
Speaker 1: a lot of those early interviews that she's no nonsense.

448
00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:37,680
Speaker 1: And I don't mean that in like a sassy like

449
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:40,000
Speaker 1: I'm giving her a free path sort of way. I

450
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: just literally mean that when you look at some of

451
00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:44,120
Speaker 1: the questions that interviewers asked her back then, a lot

452
00:28:44,200 --> 00:28:49,120
Speaker 1: of them were like so idiotic and so baiting, and

453
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 1: her answers are very like no, what or yeah, of

454
00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 1: course she's very like you know, I almost sense and

455
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,400
Speaker 1: this is totally me projecting, but I almost sense like

456
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,280
Speaker 1: a yearning for someone to ask her us art question. Yeah,

457
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:04,080
Speaker 1: but I mean because she's brilliant, you know, and she's

458
00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 1: very matter of fact as well. Um, but I wanted

459
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 1: to to mention how she described to Newsweek, the decision

460
00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 1: that she made to go to Arkansas, the ways that

461
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:19,160
Speaker 1: she turned when she arrived at her Britney Spirits cross roads,

462
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,800
Speaker 1: because um, she wasn't a girl but maybe not yet

463
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:27,440
Speaker 1: a woman, let's say. Um but in nine four, you know,

464
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:33,120
Speaker 1: Bill proposes and Hillary Clinton says that he said, I know,

465
00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:35,800
Speaker 1: this is a really hard choice because I'm committed to

466
00:29:35,840 --> 00:29:39,360
Speaker 1: living in Arkansas. And I'd say, yeah, it's a really

467
00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:42,480
Speaker 1: hard choice. And I just finally decided, you know, this

468
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 1: is no way to make a decision when you love somebody.

469
00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 1: You just have to go and see what it's like.

470
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 1: So I moved to Arkansas and started teaching at the

471
00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:53,400
Speaker 1: law school. And I think I've had a more interesting

472
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 1: time of it than I would if I had chickened

473
00:29:55,560 --> 00:30:00,400
Speaker 1: out and not followed my heart. And thinking of Hillary

474
00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 1: Clinton talking about following her heart is also like was

475
00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 1: a standout moment for me reading about the stuff of

476
00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:10,480
Speaker 1: like whoa like It's it's just such a I don't know,

477
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:13,320
Speaker 1: It's not the type of phrasing that I would associate

478
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:15,640
Speaker 1: with her. No, I don't think a lot of people

479
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 1: because everyone you know, uh talks about how you know,

480
00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 1: she's very calculating and strategic, and you wouldn't think about,

481
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:30,040
Speaker 1: you know, following one's heart, especially not to Arkansas. Yeah,

482
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:31,920
Speaker 1: she does in that interview talk about how a lot.

483
00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:37,920
Speaker 1: She very diplomatically discusses how her East Coast and Midwest

484
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:41,000
Speaker 1: friends and family were like Arkansas, what are you even

485
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,040
Speaker 1: gonna do there? And she was. She said she was

486
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:47,280
Speaker 1: obviously very pleased to find that she could establish a

487
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:50,240
Speaker 1: place for herself there professionally well. And she said that

488
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:52,480
Speaker 1: she liked it too, the experience of living in a

489
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,880
Speaker 1: small town where everybody knows your name. We did not

490
00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:58,960
Speaker 1: know that this was going to be the musical episode

491
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:01,480
Speaker 1: of stuff one never tall years. I'm fine with it.

492
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,640
Speaker 1: But she really made small town Arkansas because they weren't

493
00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:07,080
Speaker 1: in little Rocket first. She made it sound like, um

494
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:10,040
Speaker 1: just kind of like a big cheers where you know,

495
00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:14,800
Speaker 1: people waves say hello, um, know your name, and that

496
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,280
Speaker 1: was the pivotal moment really in her life. I mean,

497
00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:25,320
Speaker 1: this sets the stage for Hillary Rodham to become Hillary Clinton,

498
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:27,560
Speaker 1: which is not going to happen when she gets married.

499
00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:29,840
Speaker 1: And we're going to talk about that when we come

500
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:35,479
Speaker 1: right back from a quick break. You know that feeling

501
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:37,560
Speaker 1: you get when you can get things done with just

502
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:40,040
Speaker 1: the click of a mouse. I mean, it can't get

503
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:43,160
Speaker 1: any more convenient than that, right, And now you can

504
00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:46,520
Speaker 1: even get your mailing and shipping done without leaving your

505
00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 1: desk thanks to stamps dot Com. Stamps dot com turns

506
00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:54,080
Speaker 1: your computer into your own personal post office that never closes.

507
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 1: With stamps dot com, you can buy and print official

508
00:31:56,920 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 1: US postage for any letter or package using your computer.

509
00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 1: And right now you can sign up for stamps dot

510
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:05,760
Speaker 1: com and use our promo codes stuff to get a

511
00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:09,400
Speaker 1: special offer. It's a four week trial plus one dollar

512
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:12,640
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513
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:15,239
Speaker 1: don't wait. Go to stamps dot com before you do

514
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:17,720
Speaker 1: anything else. Click on the microphone at the top of

515
00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 1: the homepage and type in stuff that's stamps dot com

516
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:32,440
Speaker 1: enter stuff. Well so in Hillary and Bill get married

517
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:36,240
Speaker 1: and fun fact which I didn't know that her mom

518
00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:38,280
Speaker 1: basically had to drag her to the store to buy

519
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:40,480
Speaker 1: address like a couple of days before they got married. Yeah,

520
00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:42,840
Speaker 1: it was a super low key wedding. Also, weddings in

521
00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,360
Speaker 1: ve we're way more low key in general than weddings

522
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:48,680
Speaker 1: these days. I am saying that a week before I'm

523
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:54,840
Speaker 1: getting married, So I'm a little biased right now, But yeah,

524
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:56,640
Speaker 1: I mean it was just like, um, I think it

525
00:32:56,720 --> 00:33:00,080
Speaker 1: was at their home, um, in their backyard, and she

526
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:01,280
Speaker 1: was like, yeah, I just like went and found a

527
00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,000
Speaker 1: dress and you know, no big deal. They get married.

528
00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 1: I want to say that, Um. Bill Clinton's mom was

529
00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:11,600
Speaker 1: not super into her new daughter in law. UM. But

530
00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:16,880
Speaker 1: no matter, Bill and Hills in it to win it. Um.

531
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:21,920
Speaker 1: She starts out teaching at the University of Arkansas's law school,

532
00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 1: where I think Bill was also teaching, and as you

533
00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:28,320
Speaker 1: would imagine, Hillary had the reputation for being a super

534
00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:32,080
Speaker 1: tough professor and um did not mind handing out sees,

535
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:38,880
Speaker 1: whereas Bill was like, oh, y'all, I'll give you all.

536
00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:43,320
Speaker 1: He gives all of them a watermelon. You'll just get

537
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:50,920
Speaker 1: try this watermelon. You see how big this is? So

538
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:59,280
Speaker 1: through nine, Hillary Clinton directs the University of Arkansas. I

539
00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 1: legally aig nick, but in the spring of backing up

540
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 1: a little bit, while helming that legal clinic, a judge

541
00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:11,520
Speaker 1: assigns her to defend a forty one year old indigent

542
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,200
Speaker 1: man accused of raping a twelve year old girl. So

543
00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:18,280
Speaker 1: you can imagine, with her background in advocating for children,

544
00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:21,000
Speaker 1: that this is a difficult spot. She asked to be

545
00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 1: removed from the case, but the court denied her request,

546
00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:28,360
Speaker 1: and in a move that has been brought up multiple

547
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:31,120
Speaker 1: times and criticized since then, she ended up submitting the

548
00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:35,600
Speaker 1: girl to a psychological test in order to challenge her credibility,

549
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:41,640
Speaker 1: which is admittedly not cool, but it was part of

550
00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:46,440
Speaker 1: the job. Yeah. So, I mean, because Hillary was a

551
00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:50,320
Speaker 1: really good lawyer. M her client still went to jail,

552
00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:56,360
Speaker 1: but on lesser charges. And soon after that, it's pretty

553
00:34:56,360 --> 00:35:00,440
Speaker 1: notable that Hillary and some friends got together and started

554
00:35:00,440 --> 00:35:03,600
Speaker 1: the area's first rape crisis center, which apparently was one

555
00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:06,680
Speaker 1: of the first rape crisis centers in the US. Yeah.

556
00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 1: I was reading a column by UH, an advocate for

557
00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:15,719
Speaker 1: rape survivors who had formerly worked with Hillary Clinton, and

558
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:18,560
Speaker 1: she talked about how she was trying to set up

559
00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:22,319
Speaker 1: a similar thing in Atlanta around the same time, and

560
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:25,120
Speaker 1: was told by numerous people like, well, Hillary Rodham is

561
00:35:25,120 --> 00:35:26,680
Speaker 1: the person that you got to talk to if you

562
00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:29,880
Speaker 1: want to do anything like this, because she just again

563
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:33,640
Speaker 1: like ploid ahead and and made it happen and was

564
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:36,040
Speaker 1: sort of a shining example of how to do it

565
00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:38,680
Speaker 1: if you wanted to set up a crisis center and

566
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:42,680
Speaker 1: quickly speaking to the time that all of this was

567
00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:46,560
Speaker 1: happening professionally for her. One of the reasons why the

568
00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:49,560
Speaker 1: judge turned down her request to not take the case

569
00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 1: was because they specifically wanted a woman representing this guy,

570
00:35:55,719 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 1: and Hillary was already the top of the legal field

571
00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:02,560
Speaker 1: in general. But they were also not that many lady

572
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:05,239
Speaker 1: lawyers at the time to choose from, so they were like, no,

573
00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:08,240
Speaker 1: you gotta, you gotta take this case. Um. So, while

574
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 1: it does, it does not excuse the shady legal practices

575
00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:15,359
Speaker 1: that went down. Um, some good came out of it,

576
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:20,160
Speaker 1: which I think is important to take into account. Um.

577
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:23,239
Speaker 1: The next year, in nineteen seventy six, Bill Clinton is

578
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:26,960
Speaker 1: elected to Attorney General of Arkansas, and this is when

579
00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 1: they moved to Little Rock. And this is also when

580
00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:36,360
Speaker 1: Hillary transitions out of Academia and into the Rose Law Firm,

581
00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:41,239
Speaker 1: where she would eventually become the firm's first female partner. Um,

582
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:44,480
Speaker 1: and she's just like working and she's super busy. She's

583
00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:47,080
Speaker 1: like on all of these boards. Um. She was also

584
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 1: the first woman on Walmart's board. Uh. And she's the breadwinner.

585
00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:54,000
Speaker 1: Hands down. Bill is not making that much money as

586
00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:57,160
Speaker 1: Attorney General. And she was like, well, you know, that's fine,

587
00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,399
Speaker 1: making plenty of money at Rose. It's fine. I'm bringing

588
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:04,200
Speaker 1: him the bacon and winning the bread. And in the

589
00:37:04,239 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 1: following year, she co founds Arkansas Advocates for Children and Families,

590
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:13,359
Speaker 1: which is the same year that President Carter appointed her

591
00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:17,320
Speaker 1: as the first woman to lead the Legal Services Corporation,

592
00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:22,000
Speaker 1: which was a federal program dedicated to expanding legal aid access.

593
00:37:22,120 --> 00:37:28,160
Speaker 1: And under her guidance, the the that Corporation, so to speak, exploded.

594
00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:30,440
Speaker 1: They got so much more in funding, and we're super

595
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:33,680
Speaker 1: successful under her under her watch. I wonder if she

596
00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:37,320
Speaker 1: and Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg have like similar

597
00:37:38,120 --> 00:37:41,800
Speaker 1: uh needs for no sleep? Yeah right, you know what

598
00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:44,839
Speaker 1: I mean, like this, and she doesn't have a kid

599
00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:47,719
Speaker 1: at this point, and I'm I still don't understand how

600
00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:51,239
Speaker 1: she would have any time to sleep. Um No, I

601
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,560
Speaker 1: mean because like just you know, you and I both

602
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:57,759
Speaker 1: have lawyer friends, and and and I you know, we

603
00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:00,640
Speaker 1: watched television. I've seen Matt Law, and so we know

604
00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:04,000
Speaker 1: kind of how much work it takes to make partner

605
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:06,080
Speaker 1: It takes a long time. I watched Better Call Saul.

606
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:09,759
Speaker 1: I've seen what it took for Mirandon sex and to

607
00:38:09,800 --> 00:38:15,040
Speaker 1: make partner braces. And um. So yeah, the fact that

608
00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 1: she was working those incredibly long hours and still was

609
00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:20,400
Speaker 1: on all these boards and fulfilling all these other obligations

610
00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:24,320
Speaker 1: and on all of these freaking committees and stuff. I mean, yeah,

611
00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:26,360
Speaker 1: I mean I like sleep too much. I mean I

612
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:28,799
Speaker 1: hate the sentiment of like, how does she do it? No?

613
00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:31,640
Speaker 1: But I mean if seriously, yeah, we could be talking

614
00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:33,600
Speaker 1: about anybody and I would be like, no, literally, when

615
00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:35,960
Speaker 1: do you sleep and eat the sandwiches? When when does

616
00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:42,319
Speaker 1: that happen? Um? And in Bill is elected Arkansas governor,

617
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 1: he would go on to serve five terms total. But

618
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 1: Arkansas residents weren't so sure about this Hillary Rodham character,

619
00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:58,120
Speaker 1: this professional lawyer lady who was the first first lady

620
00:38:58,160 --> 00:39:02,360
Speaker 1: to keep working and she did keep her name. Yeah,

621
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 1: I mean that was one thing we didn't mention when

622
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:07,160
Speaker 1: she got married. She was like, yeah, let's get married. Uh,

623
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 1: I'm not going to change my name. Um. And Bill

624
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:15,960
Speaker 1: would talk about that later because the whole name change thing.

625
00:39:16,360 --> 00:39:18,160
Speaker 1: And again I'm saying, this is a woman who's getting

626
00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:21,480
Speaker 1: married next week. Um, the whole name change thing is

627
00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:24,840
Speaker 1: something that has followed her throughout her political career. It

628
00:39:24,920 --> 00:39:28,600
Speaker 1: really has, it really has. Um. And in one interview

629
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:32,000
Speaker 1: with Bill I think in the early nineties, maybe with

630
00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:35,320
Speaker 1: his first presidential campaign, of course he was asked about

631
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:37,360
Speaker 1: it because it was just assumed that it was like

632
00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:40,959
Speaker 1: very masculating for him. Um. And he was like, no, no,

633
00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:44,680
Speaker 1: she she wanted to do that. So she was nine

634
00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:47,439
Speaker 1: years old. Okay, I'm sorry, I'll stop at Bill Clinton.

635
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:50,799
Speaker 1: It's just kind of fun. Um. But yeah, I mean,

636
00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:52,279
Speaker 1: of course he didn't care, you know, And it was

637
00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:59,560
Speaker 1: something that um, she always knew that she would do. Um.

638
00:39:59,600 --> 00:40:06,120
Speaker 1: But the Arkansans Arkanson's Arkansans, Arkansas. People in Arkansas has

639
00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:09,399
Speaker 1: know how how you are referred to properly because I'm

640
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:14,399
Speaker 1: sure in butchering it, um arks the Arkansans Is, We're

641
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:18,319
Speaker 1: not the only people side dyeing her because I mean

642
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:21,719
Speaker 1: she's professional. She and professional in sense of like she's

643
00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:25,239
Speaker 1: still working at this law firm. She is I mean

644
00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:30,719
Speaker 1: obviously very driven. She really does not care to play

645
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:34,359
Speaker 1: the part of a ceremonial first lady in terms of

646
00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:37,960
Speaker 1: the glitz and the glam um. And of course she's

647
00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:42,000
Speaker 1: Hillary Rodham and not Hillary Clinton. And the national press

648
00:40:42,040 --> 00:40:45,880
Speaker 1: followed suit. Uh. The New York Times reported that the

649
00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:51,040
Speaker 1: new governor was quote married to an ardent feminist, Hillary Rodham,

650
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:53,480
Speaker 1: who will certainly be the first lady of Arkansas to

651
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:57,560
Speaker 1: keep her married name. And the Associated Press, in reporting

652
00:40:57,800 --> 00:41:01,960
Speaker 1: on how the new first Lady of Arkansas was this

653
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:06,239
Speaker 1: this feminist who kept her own name when she got married, uh,

654
00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:09,920
Speaker 1: they made sure to mention that that Bill had said

655
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 1: that listen, you know, she's actually a lot more traditional

656
00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:17,440
Speaker 1: than than folks would would guess. And that's been another

657
00:41:17,560 --> 00:41:20,120
Speaker 1: narrative that's followed her throughout her political career too, of

658
00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:23,120
Speaker 1: like you don't have to be scared of her. She uh,

659
00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:25,799
Speaker 1: you know, she's actually she actually more conservative than you

660
00:41:25,880 --> 00:41:28,440
Speaker 1: might think, which is actually like kind of true in

661
00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:31,960
Speaker 1: a lot of ways. In a profile piece on her

662
00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:36,839
Speaker 1: in the Arkansas Democrat, here's plain speaking Hillary before she's

663
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:39,720
Speaker 1: kind of been put through the press wringer. She said, listen,

664
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 1: I need to maintain my interests in my commitments because

665
00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:46,400
Speaker 1: I need my own identity to which is not a

666
00:41:46,520 --> 00:41:49,480
Speaker 1: radical thought. I mean, I mean I would like everyone

667
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 1: to stop from him and close her eyes and just

668
00:41:51,239 --> 00:41:53,480
Speaker 1: think about that. Like, of course, you want your own identity.

669
00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:56,560
Speaker 1: You don't want to like absorb yourself into your spouse

670
00:41:56,640 --> 00:42:00,759
Speaker 1: or whoever h and become like a ghost of yourself.

671
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:05,759
Speaker 1: Speak for yourself. Is there? I can't wait for ghost Kristen. Yeah,

672
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:09,040
Speaker 1: recording is gonna get real weird. Um, Christen, are you there?

673
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:14,360
Speaker 1: I just see a floating Denham jacket? Ask my husband. Um.

674
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:19,280
Speaker 1: But it's funny when you filter that very non controversial,

675
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:23,360
Speaker 1: non radical statement through the press, it just becomes like

676
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:26,120
Speaker 1: a lightning rod. Oh yeah. Um. Well. And we should

677
00:42:26,120 --> 00:42:28,719
Speaker 1: also note too that it was a few months after

678
00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:31,960
Speaker 1: that profile came out when she was like, oh listen,

679
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:35,640
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do me y'all. Uh. That's when she made

680
00:42:35,680 --> 00:42:40,120
Speaker 1: partner at Rose Law firm UM, and she was also

681
00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:44,200
Speaker 1: serving as chair of the Rural Health Advisory Committee UM.

682
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:48,680
Speaker 1: That bill appointed her to UM, which provided healthcare to

683
00:42:48,880 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 1: rural areas. So we're already seeing the foundation laid for

684
00:42:53,560 --> 00:42:55,800
Speaker 1: a lot of the platforms that she would champion throughout

685
00:42:55,840 --> 00:43:01,080
Speaker 1: her political career in terms of poverty, children, and healthcare.

686
00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:05,240
Speaker 1: And listener Will called in with his thoughts about Hillary Clinton.

687
00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:07,840
Speaker 1: I think I can make a parent where I stand

688
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:11,320
Speaker 1: on this issue by recounting that when I met Kristen

689
00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:14,200
Speaker 1: and Caroline in l A. I spent a solid three

690
00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:19,880
Speaker 1: or four minutes waxing eloquent on my admiration for Hillary Clinton. Similarly,

691
00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:22,520
Speaker 1: it is apparent that there's little that can be said

692
00:43:22,760 --> 00:43:25,960
Speaker 1: that hasn't already been said about her public perception, and

693
00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:29,920
Speaker 1: that is precisely the point. She has been subject to

694
00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:34,480
Speaker 1: untold scrutiny beyond many other public figures, not just in

695
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:37,440
Speaker 1: the twenty five years since her husband campaign for president,

696
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:40,359
Speaker 1: but going all the way back to his time as

697
00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:43,319
Speaker 1: the governor of Arkansas, a time when one of his

698
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 1: Republican opponents made a central theme of his campaign the

699
00:43:47,200 --> 00:43:50,600
Speaker 1: fact that Hillary Clinton was at the time known as

700
00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:56,520
Speaker 1: Hillary Rodham. She was, in many ways the first woman

701
00:43:56,640 --> 00:44:00,480
Speaker 1: in her position, a position of such prominence and eventual power,

702
00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:05,880
Speaker 1: to take such a such an explicit stand on second

703
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:10,400
Speaker 1: wave feminist issues, and that first step made her a

704
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:14,880
Speaker 1: threat to so much, and as such was subject to

705
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:20,560
Speaker 1: that scrutiny, to that attack, and to a difficult time

706
00:44:20,719 --> 00:44:23,760
Speaker 1: in the public sphere to say the least for so long.

707
00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:28,719
Speaker 1: But I can say honestly that having survived for that

708
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:34,280
Speaker 1: long and to this day still championing many progressive causes

709
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:37,520
Speaker 1: despite the claims to the contrary that others may make,

710
00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:42,919
Speaker 1: that on its own is evidence that too. To say

711
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:47,120
Speaker 1: it shortly and bluntly, Hillary Clinton really does kick butt.

712
00:44:47,719 --> 00:44:49,880
Speaker 1: And in we've I mean, we've already told you she

713
00:44:49,960 --> 00:44:53,520
Speaker 1: makes partner, but in eighty Chelsea is born. So just

714
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:56,239
Speaker 1: think about that too. The same year that she's put

715
00:44:56,280 --> 00:44:58,920
Speaker 1: in all of that work to make partner, she also

716
00:44:59,080 --> 00:45:03,160
Speaker 1: has a child. And I think that's incredible for how

717
00:45:03,200 --> 00:45:05,880
Speaker 1: often you and I have talked about like mommy tracking

718
00:45:06,440 --> 00:45:09,920
Speaker 1: on this podcast, and how especially in male dominated fields,

719
00:45:09,920 --> 00:45:13,000
Speaker 1: women who are expected to you know, run off and

720
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:16,359
Speaker 1: have babies that they don't tend to get promoted as

721
00:45:16,400 --> 00:45:20,839
Speaker 1: often or as fast as men or lesbian women, which

722
00:45:20,880 --> 00:45:24,719
Speaker 1: is redundant of lesbians, um, because there's that expectation that

723
00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:27,000
Speaker 1: you're just gonna leave to go be a mother, and

724
00:45:27,080 --> 00:45:29,880
Speaker 1: here she is totally defying all of that well because

725
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:33,479
Speaker 1: some people were kind of waiting and saying, oh, well, okay,

726
00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:35,520
Speaker 1: the first ladies had a baby, So now is she

727
00:45:35,560 --> 00:45:41,040
Speaker 1: gonna quit her job finally? And she's like, na, not,

728
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:46,800
Speaker 1: y'all um. And years later, when Bill Clinton is running

729
00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:52,040
Speaker 1: for president, Newsweek asks her and she felt guilty about

730
00:45:52,080 --> 00:45:55,799
Speaker 1: that about being a working mother, and I like in

731
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:59,760
Speaker 1: our notes like circled guilty over and over again because

732
00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:02,480
Speaker 1: it's such a loaded question. Oh yeah, and she gives

733
00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:04,399
Speaker 1: a great answer. She's like, no, I mean I did

734
00:46:04,440 --> 00:46:06,360
Speaker 1: my best. And whether you're a mom who works or

735
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:08,640
Speaker 1: whether you're a mom who stays at home with your children,

736
00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:12,200
Speaker 1: like you're gonna feel guilty and like you could have

737
00:46:12,200 --> 00:46:14,400
Speaker 1: done better no matter what. And so I did the

738
00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:17,279
Speaker 1: best I could well, And she also framed it in

739
00:46:17,280 --> 00:46:20,880
Speaker 1: a way of role modeling for her daughter as well.

740
00:46:21,160 --> 00:46:23,879
Speaker 1: We heard from one mom who definitely appreciates the work

741
00:46:23,880 --> 00:46:27,040
Speaker 1: that Hillary has done as a working mother. I'm Serta.

742
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:30,440
Speaker 1: I'm a thirty five year old mother of three. I

743
00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:34,720
Speaker 1: live in Pennsylvania and as a matter of fact, today

744
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:38,359
Speaker 1: I am going to drive to Scranton, which is an

745
00:46:38,360 --> 00:46:43,239
Speaker 1: hour away to see Hillary speak. I'm really excited. I

746
00:46:43,239 --> 00:46:46,400
Speaker 1: guess I'm sort of a Hillary super fan. When I

747
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:48,760
Speaker 1: think of her, when I hear her name, the first

748
00:46:48,760 --> 00:46:51,480
Speaker 1: thing that comes to mind is seeing pictures of her

749
00:46:51,640 --> 00:46:54,719
Speaker 1: at a Gay Pride rally in the nineties, when she

750
00:46:54,760 --> 00:46:58,280
Speaker 1: was first Lady and I was just a child, and

751
00:46:59,239 --> 00:47:02,680
Speaker 1: in my family, the topic of gay rights was definitely

752
00:47:02,680 --> 00:47:06,520
Speaker 1: I don't ask, don't tell a situation, and I just

753
00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:09,680
Speaker 1: remember being very struck by what I considered at the

754
00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:14,720
Speaker 1: time courage. Now as an adult, I am grateful for

755
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:18,200
Speaker 1: the CHIP program, the children's health insurance program that she

756
00:47:18,280 --> 00:47:22,680
Speaker 1: helped create, or at least was a champion of UM,

757
00:47:22,719 --> 00:47:25,200
Speaker 1: because my three kids are insured that way. I'm a

758
00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:28,960
Speaker 1: fan of incremental change politically, but I have to admit

759
00:47:29,560 --> 00:47:33,959
Speaker 1: I really want a woman president. I intend to see

760
00:47:34,000 --> 00:47:39,040
Speaker 1: a woman president this time. I have to. I can't

761
00:47:39,080 --> 00:47:41,759
Speaker 1: go another year voting for an old white guy. I

762
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:45,640
Speaker 1: just can and uh. I think Hilary is a hero.

763
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:49,160
Speaker 1: I admire her so much. She is my all time

764
00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:52,040
Speaker 1: favorite politician. I feel close to her. I trust her

765
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:54,200
Speaker 1: because she's a working mother, and I feel like she

766
00:47:54,920 --> 00:47:57,840
Speaker 1: understands what I go through, even though she might be

767
00:47:57,960 --> 00:48:01,320
Speaker 1: rich and privileged beyond what I could ever imagine for myself.

768
00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:05,120
Speaker 1: I know that there is a commonality in being a

769
00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:10,120
Speaker 1: working mom, and I really want my two daughters to

770
00:48:10,239 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 1: see a woman president from so early on in their

771
00:48:13,560 --> 00:48:17,200
Speaker 1: lives that they never think that it's weird or you know,

772
00:48:17,239 --> 00:48:19,200
Speaker 1: even special. I want them to be able to take

773
00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:21,960
Speaker 1: it for granted that a woman can literally be anything.

774
00:48:22,600 --> 00:48:26,120
Speaker 1: I don't think electing a woman will change everything overnight

775
00:48:26,200 --> 00:48:28,719
Speaker 1: for women, but I do think it's just a symbolic

776
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:31,360
Speaker 1: step in the right direction. And if you're going to

777
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:34,000
Speaker 1: be voting for a symbolic step in the right direction,

778
00:48:34,440 --> 00:48:37,480
Speaker 1: you might as well be electing the most qualified person

779
00:48:37,719 --> 00:48:43,880
Speaker 1: ever to run for president. But in nine the Clintons

780
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:49,440
Speaker 1: suffer their their first major defeat because Bill is up

781
00:48:49,440 --> 00:48:54,120
Speaker 1: for reelection and loses. And this is also a really

782
00:48:54,160 --> 00:48:58,480
Speaker 1: pivotal moment. This is when we see Hillary's first kind

783
00:48:58,480 --> 00:49:04,799
Speaker 1: of political makeover, but with literally and figuratively, because the

784
00:49:04,880 --> 00:49:08,040
Speaker 1: kind of assessment from that was that Hillary was a

785
00:49:08,080 --> 00:49:12,520
Speaker 1: liability her career, and her being Hillary Rodham and not

786
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:18,560
Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton, and her not paying more attention to the

787
00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:20,600
Speaker 1: way that she did her hair and the way that

788
00:49:20,680 --> 00:49:23,000
Speaker 1: she dressed, and the fact that she always was still

789
00:49:23,080 --> 00:49:26,520
Speaker 1: wearing rocking those big framed glasses. You know, she just

790
00:49:26,960 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 1: wasn't really looking the part of a politician's wife, so

791
00:49:30,760 --> 00:49:33,319
Speaker 1: she might need to make she needed to make him

792
00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:36,560
Speaker 1: more electable hulk smash. But also this is when she

793
00:49:36,640 --> 00:49:39,800
Speaker 1: changed her name finally, and she said that it was

794
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:42,719
Speaker 1: more important to other people than it was to me,

795
00:49:43,000 --> 00:49:46,440
Speaker 1: So I just changed it. Yeah. Um, And she also

796
00:49:47,239 --> 00:49:51,960
Speaker 1: hired a fashion consultant and started dressing differently. She starts

797
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:56,000
Speaker 1: wearing contacts, she dyes her hair, she wears makeup more often.

798
00:49:56,239 --> 00:50:01,520
Speaker 1: I mean, she literally has a makeover. And in two

799
00:50:02,360 --> 00:50:05,760
Speaker 1: thanks in part to maybe two of her makeover, probably

800
00:50:05,800 --> 00:50:08,719
Speaker 1: two were makeover and also um changing her name to

801
00:50:08,800 --> 00:50:14,080
Speaker 1: Hillary Rodham Clinton, but also to her background strategizing. Bill

802
00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:18,560
Speaker 1: is re elected and then goes on to serve four

803
00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:24,279
Speaker 1: terms and she is an unusually active first lady, which

804
00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:27,319
Speaker 1: if she weren't that at this point would be strange. Yeah.

805
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:30,200
Speaker 1: During this time, so Bill had appointed her as chair

806
00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:34,640
Speaker 1: of the Arkansas Educational Standards Committee, and in her role

807
00:50:34,719 --> 00:50:38,960
Speaker 1: there she achieved super hard fought reforms in public education.

808
00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:43,320
Speaker 1: And this was a massive deal because this work paved

809
00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:46,319
Speaker 1: the way for Bill to be seen as the education

810
00:50:46,440 --> 00:50:51,200
Speaker 1: governor in Arkansas, and it helped then boost his national platform. Yeah.

811
00:50:51,239 --> 00:50:55,320
Speaker 1: I mean, this was paving the way toward Pennsylvania Avenue. UM.

812
00:50:55,400 --> 00:50:59,319
Speaker 1: And we should also mention that during this time, you know,

813
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:02,719
Speaker 1: during these were four terms that they are in the

814
00:51:02,760 --> 00:51:06,640
Speaker 1: governor's mansion. UM. The National Law Journal in both N

815
00:51:07,320 --> 00:51:11,920
Speaker 1: and N named her among the one hundred most influential

816
00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:16,719
Speaker 1: lawyers in America. I mean, she's killing it. Yeah, she's

817
00:51:16,840 --> 00:51:22,680
Speaker 1: she is killing it. And in UM, I mean there's

818
00:51:23,320 --> 00:51:28,640
Speaker 1: there's this deluge of media attention around her, specifically treating

819
00:51:28,680 --> 00:51:32,800
Speaker 1: her as if she is this like alien from outer space,

820
00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:36,239
Speaker 1: Like who is this ambitious woman who wants to have

821
00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:38,640
Speaker 1: her own career while her husband is making a go

822
00:51:38,800 --> 00:51:41,360
Speaker 1: for the White House. Yeah. So this is the first

823
00:51:41,360 --> 00:51:45,600
Speaker 1: presidential campaign, but in a way, at least at the beginning,

824
00:51:46,280 --> 00:51:49,479
Speaker 1: it was almost a co presidential campaign, which does sound

825
00:51:49,480 --> 00:51:52,440
Speaker 1: a little house of CARDSI with Frank and Claar Underwood.

826
00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:56,160
Speaker 1: But I mean, at the time it would make sense.

827
00:51:56,200 --> 00:52:00,000
Speaker 1: It's like, Okay, listen, y'all, I'm I'm the governor of Arkansas,

828
00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:02,360
Speaker 1: and I've done plenty of stuff, but listen, my wife

829
00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:05,720
Speaker 1: is brilliant. I've appointed her to all of these roles.

830
00:52:05,760 --> 00:52:10,000
Speaker 1: She's been wildly successful. And this is when during early

831
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:15,919
Speaker 1: in the campaign, when Bill famously says, when you vote

832
00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:18,359
Speaker 1: Bill Clinton, you get two for the price of one,

833
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:21,120
Speaker 1: and that sounds like a great deal. I'm a thrifty gal.

834
00:52:21,360 --> 00:52:27,000
Speaker 1: I love a good deal. But Americans were not interested

835
00:52:27,080 --> 00:52:29,000
Speaker 1: in a two for one deal. And I was at

836
00:52:29,320 --> 00:52:33,520
Speaker 1: something that the Republicans in particular latched onto, which is

837
00:52:33,640 --> 00:52:39,360
Speaker 1: crazy because Nancy Reagan was infamously like super in control

838
00:52:39,400 --> 00:52:42,040
Speaker 1: of her husband. Like Nancy Reagan was essentially a puppet

839
00:52:42,080 --> 00:52:47,200
Speaker 1: master over Ronald Reagan and totally influenced his decisions and

840
00:52:47,320 --> 00:52:49,960
Speaker 1: policy and his stance on so many things. I mean,

841
00:52:50,320 --> 00:52:52,680
Speaker 1: she's the one who freaking like framed how they even

842
00:52:52,719 --> 00:52:56,440
Speaker 1: looked at or talked about AIDS IF at all at first,

843
00:52:56,920 --> 00:52:59,520
Speaker 1: and so for Republicans to like come at Hillary and

844
00:52:59,560 --> 00:53:04,239
Speaker 1: Bill like but they were running as that, you know,

845
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:06,800
Speaker 1: I mean, and was I don't have my Nancy Reagan

846
00:53:06,840 --> 00:53:09,520
Speaker 1: bio in front of me. But there's no way she

847
00:53:09,640 --> 00:53:15,240
Speaker 1: was as successful at that point. Hillary was um and

848
00:53:16,080 --> 00:53:20,799
Speaker 1: all of this framing from the get go really like

849
00:53:21,200 --> 00:53:26,680
Speaker 1: posed her strength as an indication of his weakness, you know.

850
00:53:26,840 --> 00:53:29,200
Speaker 1: And and there was the whole kind of Lady macbeth

851
00:53:29,280 --> 00:53:32,160
Speaker 1: framing of like, Okay, if we elect this guy, he's

852
00:53:32,160 --> 00:53:36,160
Speaker 1: going to have this woman whispering in his ear, pulling

853
00:53:36,200 --> 00:53:39,520
Speaker 1: the strings. And there were rumors that he had promised

854
00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:42,840
Speaker 1: her a cabinet position um, which she would of course

855
00:53:43,440 --> 00:53:49,080
Speaker 1: later get um during the Obama administration. UM and Newsweek

856
00:53:49,600 --> 00:53:54,360
Speaker 1: cautiously hailed her as representing a new generation of political wives,

857
00:53:54,560 --> 00:53:57,560
Speaker 1: which is such a back handed compliment too, because it

858
00:53:57,640 --> 00:54:00,440
Speaker 1: reduces this woman, who was one of the one hundred

859
00:54:00,440 --> 00:54:03,520
Speaker 1: most influential lawyers in the United States, who has all

860
00:54:03,560 --> 00:54:07,080
Speaker 1: of these accomplishments and accoltes under her belt, as just

861
00:54:07,160 --> 00:54:11,800
Speaker 1: a wife, framing her only in relation to her husband. Yeah, exactly.

862
00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:15,400
Speaker 1: And you also have TV reporters asking her things like, hey,

863
00:54:15,480 --> 00:54:18,000
Speaker 1: some people think that you're an inspiring female attorney mother,

864
00:54:18,040 --> 00:54:19,959
Speaker 1: and other people think of you as the overbearing yuppy

865
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:22,359
Speaker 1: wife from hell. How would you describe yourself? And it's

866
00:54:22,400 --> 00:54:24,080
Speaker 1: like that just goes back to what I was saying

867
00:54:24,120 --> 00:54:27,400
Speaker 1: earlier about the ridiculous question she's getting as this brilliant,

868
00:54:27,400 --> 00:54:29,759
Speaker 1: accomplished woman in her own right, that she's having to

869
00:54:29,840 --> 00:54:32,480
Speaker 1: field stupid questions like this, well and that and that

870
00:54:32,680 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 1: is a direct quote, I mean, like a yuppy wife

871
00:54:37,080 --> 00:54:39,640
Speaker 1: from hell. By the way, her answer was that she

872
00:54:39,719 --> 00:54:43,760
Speaker 1: describes herself as a wife, mother, and activist. Um, which

873
00:54:43,800 --> 00:54:47,680
Speaker 1: I'm even surprised that she even entertained the question. Yeah,

874
00:54:47,719 --> 00:54:49,640
Speaker 1: I mean, but she had to. She gave a politically

875
00:54:49,640 --> 00:54:52,880
Speaker 1: correct response, and she also had to give politically correct

876
00:54:52,960 --> 00:54:58,600
Speaker 1: responses to the feminist label, kind of dancing around that hedging.

877
00:54:59,040 --> 00:55:04,560
Speaker 1: Oh well, you know, I don't necessarily identify with, you know,

878
00:55:04,600 --> 00:55:09,960
Speaker 1: the divisiveness that is associated with feminism today. But you know,

879
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:16,480
Speaker 1: of course, um, the idea that feminism equals man hating

880
00:55:16,600 --> 00:55:20,040
Speaker 1: is she called nonsense? Yeah, you know, so, I mean

881
00:55:20,640 --> 00:55:23,600
Speaker 1: she's just already on this tight rope, I would say,

882
00:55:23,640 --> 00:55:26,920
Speaker 1: even more so William, more so than her husband. I mean,

883
00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:30,600
Speaker 1: right down to her affection for headbands. She was always

884
00:55:30,600 --> 00:55:33,080
Speaker 1: wearing those headbands, which I'm like, well, that's just practical.

885
00:55:33,239 --> 00:55:35,279
Speaker 1: I was wearing headbands all the time too at the time.

886
00:55:35,320 --> 00:55:38,640
Speaker 1: I had the same blonde hair, you know, headband. But

887
00:55:38,760 --> 00:55:40,480
Speaker 1: people made fun of her for it. I mean, like,

888
00:55:40,520 --> 00:55:43,719
Speaker 1: and I remember being a kid and Um, I grew

889
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:46,319
Speaker 1: up in a very Republican household. I remember being a

890
00:55:46,400 --> 00:55:49,960
Speaker 1: kid and you know, hearing those kind of fashion snipes

891
00:55:50,360 --> 00:55:53,240
Speaker 1: at her too. Yeah, and that's just because humans are terrible.

892
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:55,080
Speaker 1: And I mean, that's not a comment against your parents,

893
00:55:55,080 --> 00:55:57,440
Speaker 1: because like my parents says the same thing, same kind

894
00:55:57,440 --> 00:56:01,239
Speaker 1: of stuff about Michelle Obama, and it's like that stuff

895
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:03,680
Speaker 1: is just the stuff you say when you don't have

896
00:56:03,840 --> 00:56:08,239
Speaker 1: something more substantial. Well, and it says a lot about

897
00:56:08,400 --> 00:56:11,359
Speaker 1: how we value women well, right, because yeah, again, it's

898
00:56:11,360 --> 00:56:13,920
Speaker 1: not just about first ladies or women in politics. I mean,

899
00:56:13,960 --> 00:56:17,879
Speaker 1: that's any woman. Anybody ever wants to discredit a woman.

900
00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:19,400
Speaker 1: It seems like the first thing they go for is

901
00:56:19,440 --> 00:56:21,520
Speaker 1: like she's ugly, or she's fat, or her look at

902
00:56:21,520 --> 00:56:24,520
Speaker 1: her stupid clothes or whatever that her headbands. H Yeah,

903
00:56:24,560 --> 00:56:27,920
Speaker 1: I just yeah, it does say a lot about other people,

904
00:56:28,000 --> 00:56:30,120
Speaker 1: way more than it says about whoever it is wearing

905
00:56:30,120 --> 00:56:35,400
Speaker 1: the headband. But then during that campaign there was legit

906
00:56:36,160 --> 00:56:40,520
Speaker 1: scandal that she and Bill had to immediately navigate, and

907
00:56:40,600 --> 00:56:46,000
Speaker 1: that was the whole Jennifer Flowers affair, and of course

908
00:56:46,080 --> 00:56:52,239
Speaker 1: rumors started spiraling, and they're trying to control the media narrative, UM,

909
00:56:52,239 --> 00:56:58,520
Speaker 1: while at the same time trying to protect their own privacy. UM.

910
00:56:58,560 --> 00:57:01,080
Speaker 1: And there's a sixty minutes in her view with the

911
00:57:01,120 --> 00:57:04,600
Speaker 1: both of them which some attribute like his ultimate victory

912
00:57:04,680 --> 00:57:08,640
Speaker 1: to um because she here, she is, you know, here's

913
00:57:08,680 --> 00:57:10,879
Speaker 1: the wife by his side. Can he really be all

914
00:57:10,920 --> 00:57:14,759
Speaker 1: that bad if um, she's still committed to him? And

915
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:20,480
Speaker 1: it's it's fascinating to watch because they're clearly such a

916
00:57:20,520 --> 00:57:24,160
Speaker 1: team and they are kind of on the same script.

917
00:57:24,320 --> 00:57:27,960
Speaker 1: Bill is dodging the direct question of did you have

918
00:57:27,960 --> 00:57:29,800
Speaker 1: an affair with this woman? Have you ever cheated on

919
00:57:29,840 --> 00:57:32,560
Speaker 1: your wife? And just like coming up with these very

920
00:57:32,600 --> 00:57:37,400
Speaker 1: roundabout answers of like, well, you know who says who

921
00:57:37,440 --> 00:57:40,000
Speaker 1: among us has been a perfect husband? Like all all

922
00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:45,200
Speaker 1: these really vague things, and also both of them coming

923
00:57:45,200 --> 00:57:49,400
Speaker 1: back and saying basically like this is no one's business.

924
00:57:49,720 --> 00:57:54,680
Speaker 1: This is really no one's business, UM, which I mean,

925
00:57:54,680 --> 00:57:57,760
Speaker 1: the tough thing is it's like kind of when you

926
00:57:57,800 --> 00:58:00,280
Speaker 1: put yourself in that position, it becomes everyone's. This is

927
00:58:00,280 --> 00:58:06,200
Speaker 1: It's not necessarily right or fair, but that's what happens. UM.

928
00:58:06,200 --> 00:58:09,560
Speaker 1: But it was also in that interview that she made

929
00:58:09,600 --> 00:58:13,640
Speaker 1: the famous Tammy Wynett quote, Yeah, she says, you know,

930
00:58:13,840 --> 00:58:16,440
Speaker 1: I'm not sitting here some little woman standing by my

931
00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:19,400
Speaker 1: man like Tammy Wynett. I'm sitting here because I love him,

932
00:58:19,400 --> 00:58:21,200
Speaker 1: and I respect him, and I honor what he's been

933
00:58:21,240 --> 00:58:23,680
Speaker 1: through and what we've been through together. And you know,

934
00:58:24,240 --> 00:58:26,680
Speaker 1: if that's not enough for people, then heck, don't vote

935
00:58:26,680 --> 00:58:29,600
Speaker 1: for him, then heck, then heck. I would also like

936
00:58:29,640 --> 00:58:31,480
Speaker 1: to note that during this time she did have a

937
00:58:31,520 --> 00:58:34,640
Speaker 1: little bit of an Arkansas twang, um, which is really

938
00:58:34,760 --> 00:58:38,760
Speaker 1: entertaining to go back and watch. Yeah, considering she's from Chicago. Yeah,

939
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:42,800
Speaker 1: although when she does campaign through the South, uh, currently

940
00:58:43,760 --> 00:58:48,640
Speaker 1: it comes back. You know. That's what's that called um

941
00:58:49,040 --> 00:58:55,760
Speaker 1: code switching. So partly due to restrategizing around Hillary's role

942
00:58:55,960 --> 00:58:59,520
Speaker 1: in the campaign, essentially kind of pulling her back a

943
00:58:59,560 --> 00:59:01,760
Speaker 1: little bit and being like, whoa, whoa, y'all don't need

944
00:59:01,800 --> 00:59:04,800
Speaker 1: to worry. Bill is gonna run the show. Hillary is

945
00:59:04,840 --> 00:59:07,440
Speaker 1: just I mean, she just happens to be smart and

946
00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:16,560
Speaker 1: accomplished um, and her publicly reiterating her devotion to him. Um.

947
00:59:16,600 --> 00:59:20,160
Speaker 1: Of course he wins. So they moved into the White House,

948
00:59:22,400 --> 00:59:29,120
Speaker 1: but immediately Hillary becomes an unusually active first Lady. Yeah,

949
00:59:29,280 --> 00:59:32,760
Speaker 1: so she becomes the first first lady to have a

950
00:59:32,760 --> 00:59:36,760
Speaker 1: post grad degree, her own professional career, and her own

951
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:39,040
Speaker 1: office in the West Wing of the White House. And

952
00:59:39,080 --> 00:59:42,800
Speaker 1: not only that, she had more political staffers dedicated to

953
00:59:42,800 --> 00:59:46,200
Speaker 1: her than Al Gore did as Vice President. She's also

954
00:59:46,240 --> 00:59:48,600
Speaker 1: the first first lady since Eleanor Roosevelt to take a

955
00:59:48,640 --> 00:59:54,560
Speaker 1: policy making tech and she advocated strongly for women's rights

956
00:59:54,640 --> 00:59:58,280
Speaker 1: throughout eighty countries and also advocated strongly for getting a

957
00:59:58,320 --> 01:00:01,960
Speaker 1: woman into her husband's abnet. That sounds so funny, like

958
01:00:01,960 --> 01:00:04,000
Speaker 1: I was gonna just put a lady in in a

959
01:00:04,120 --> 01:00:06,919
Speaker 1: in a big armoir. We don't know what their life

960
01:00:06,960 --> 01:00:12,560
Speaker 1: is like big watermelons. But here is the thing that

961
01:00:12,960 --> 01:00:16,720
Speaker 1: we all know. Because no perfect politician exists, Hillary Clinton

962
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:20,960
Speaker 1: was not perfect in her politics. Um, even when it

963
01:00:21,040 --> 01:00:26,040
Speaker 1: comes to issues of poverty and welfare that she was

964
01:00:26,120 --> 01:00:30,160
Speaker 1: extremely influential in. I mean, especially in this first term.

965
01:00:30,160 --> 01:00:34,720
Speaker 1: She was strategizing in both the foreground and also the

966
01:00:34,760 --> 01:00:41,240
Speaker 1: background on um these these policies that Bill would later enact,

967
01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:46,439
Speaker 1: and she had very progressive era ish ideas about poverty

968
01:00:46,760 --> 01:00:51,120
Speaker 1: kind of resulting from a failure of responsibility rather than

969
01:00:51,360 --> 01:00:55,440
Speaker 1: say systemic injustice, especially if we look at how people

970
01:00:55,480 --> 01:01:00,760
Speaker 1: of color are disproportionately UM part of the welfare system.

971
01:01:00,800 --> 01:01:04,760
Speaker 1: And I think it was around ninety three UM in

972
01:01:04,960 --> 01:01:07,720
Speaker 1: a Time magazine interview. It was actually yes, soon after

973
01:01:08,480 --> 01:01:11,200
Speaker 1: UM Bill had gotten into office. She was talking to

974
01:01:11,280 --> 01:01:17,600
Speaker 1: Joe Kleine from Time, and I mean her her explanation

975
01:01:17,720 --> 01:01:19,880
Speaker 1: of what she thought they should do with welfare is

976
01:01:19,920 --> 01:01:23,120
Speaker 1: a little a little eyebrow raising, for sure. I mean

977
01:01:23,160 --> 01:01:29,000
Speaker 1: she advocated stricter welfare regulations and tougher sanctions, essentially saying like,

978
01:01:29,480 --> 01:01:31,880
Speaker 1: we need to put more rules in place and punish

979
01:01:31,960 --> 01:01:35,480
Speaker 1: people if they don't get off the doll soon enough,

980
01:01:35,480 --> 01:01:37,560
Speaker 1: because the problem is that there are not there's not

981
01:01:37,720 --> 01:01:44,680
Speaker 1: enough structure in their environments. Yeah, she basically said that UM,

982
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:49,040
Speaker 1: in advocating for stricter welfare regulations and in advocating for

983
01:01:49,280 --> 01:01:54,720
Speaker 1: UM overhauls of inner city school systems, that when you

984
01:01:55,240 --> 01:02:00,520
Speaker 1: institute heavier structure, it improves people's lives, especially when there

985
01:02:00,680 --> 01:02:06,640
Speaker 1: is little structure at home. And so, I mean, I

986
01:02:06,640 --> 01:02:10,040
Speaker 1: think painting with that broad of a brush ruffled a

987
01:02:10,040 --> 01:02:12,200
Speaker 1: lot of feathers well, and it ruffles feathers today. I

988
01:02:12,200 --> 01:02:15,520
Speaker 1: mean that's one of the reasons why UH Black Lives Matter,

989
01:02:15,840 --> 01:02:19,720
Speaker 1: for instance, UM has not been a huge Hillary supporter.

990
01:02:20,120 --> 01:02:22,160
Speaker 1: UM also too, I mean, we're not going to get

991
01:02:22,200 --> 01:02:26,760
Speaker 1: into it, but also because of UM the criminal justice

992
01:02:26,960 --> 01:02:33,200
Speaker 1: policies that Bill Clinton enacted that were attached to these

993
01:02:33,240 --> 01:02:37,400
Speaker 1: concepts around welfare and poverty and how that also related

994
01:02:37,440 --> 01:02:40,160
Speaker 1: to crime. Yeah. But I mean, you know, she was

995
01:02:40,280 --> 01:02:44,920
Speaker 1: super involved in healthcare reform. That is one of her

996
01:02:44,920 --> 01:02:47,360
Speaker 1: biggest things. That is what I remember from being a

997
01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:49,720
Speaker 1: kid and watching the nightly news with my parents. I

998
01:02:49,760 --> 01:02:53,080
Speaker 1: remember her being involved in healthcare, and of course being

999
01:02:53,080 --> 01:02:55,640
Speaker 1: a child and having absolutely no context or explanation for

1000
01:02:55,680 --> 01:02:57,800
Speaker 1: what was going on, and just was like, yeah, there's

1001
01:02:57,840 --> 01:03:00,600
Speaker 1: this she's it's the president's wife, and she's talking about

1002
01:03:00,600 --> 01:03:02,680
Speaker 1: healthcare and people saying real upset about it. I really

1003
01:03:02,720 --> 01:03:05,360
Speaker 1: love the idea of of tiny Carol and sitting watching

1004
01:03:05,400 --> 01:03:08,440
Speaker 1: the nightly news like a little half half glasses on

1005
01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:11,560
Speaker 1: a little pipe, little bubble pipe. Yeah. The funny papers

1006
01:03:11,600 --> 01:03:15,960
Speaker 1: spread across my lab like, yeah, his healthcare and of

1007
01:03:16,000 --> 01:03:18,400
Speaker 1: course people called it hillary Care, just like they call

1008
01:03:18,480 --> 01:03:21,760
Speaker 1: it Obamacare today because we're so creative. Humans are not

1009
01:03:21,840 --> 01:03:26,320
Speaker 1: a creative bunch apparently, And uh, she was appointed head

1010
01:03:26,360 --> 01:03:30,000
Speaker 1: of that task Force on National Healthcare Reform bill's first

1011
01:03:30,040 --> 01:03:34,720
Speaker 1: week in office, but it went bust and the administration

1012
01:03:34,760 --> 01:03:38,240
Speaker 1: dropped it all together by September ninety and a lot

1013
01:03:38,280 --> 01:03:42,880
Speaker 1: of folks blamed it on not her being a poor leader. Actually,

1014
01:03:42,920 --> 01:03:45,680
Speaker 1: when she was first kind of making the rounds um

1015
01:03:45,720 --> 01:03:48,840
Speaker 1: after her appointment, a lot of politicians were really impressed

1016
01:03:48,840 --> 01:03:50,080
Speaker 1: with the way that she was just like walking a

1017
01:03:50,160 --> 01:03:52,040
Speaker 1: room and be like, all right, let's get down to business.

1018
01:03:52,280 --> 01:03:55,920
Speaker 1: I'm Hillary, don't mess with me. Um. But rather than

1019
01:03:56,040 --> 01:04:00,000
Speaker 1: making it a more open process, she in a very

1020
01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:04,200
Speaker 1: loyery kind of way, had her committee and was like, Okay,

1021
01:04:04,280 --> 01:04:06,560
Speaker 1: let's go into this room. We're going to keep things private,

1022
01:04:06,600 --> 01:04:08,800
Speaker 1: and then when we're done and ready to present everything,

1023
01:04:09,000 --> 01:04:14,080
Speaker 1: then we will. And Congress was like, oh no, lady, no, no, no, no,

1024
01:04:14,200 --> 01:04:17,360
Speaker 1: we're gonna shut that down. UM. So was a rough

1025
01:04:17,440 --> 01:04:19,960
Speaker 1: year for her. It was a terrible, no good year.

1026
01:04:20,480 --> 01:04:23,720
Speaker 1: UM And she was again dragged through the mud because

1027
01:04:23,760 --> 01:04:28,400
Speaker 1: of much like Claire Underwood's campaign. Oh my gosh, yeah,

1028
01:04:28,440 --> 01:04:30,360
Speaker 1: I mean there were reading up on this stuff. I

1029
01:04:30,400 --> 01:04:34,320
Speaker 1: was like, how much of this is Someone drew some yeah,

1030
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:39,400
Speaker 1: some heavy inspiration from this. Um. But wasn't a total bust.

1031
01:04:39,760 --> 01:04:42,760
Speaker 1: She did help launch the Department of Justice's Office on

1032
01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:47,760
Speaker 1: Violence against Women. Yeah, but still we see that the

1033
01:04:47,800 --> 01:04:51,600
Speaker 1: week midterm elections and the health care fail were a

1034
01:04:51,720 --> 01:04:55,160
Speaker 1: big setback for her. That was pretty demoralizing. And once

1035
01:04:55,200 --> 01:04:59,440
Speaker 1: again we see her ambition and her visibility in those

1036
01:04:59,600 --> 01:05:03,680
Speaker 1: very non traditionally feminine roles being seen and painted in

1037
01:05:03,720 --> 01:05:06,600
Speaker 1: the press as a liability. So yet again we see

1038
01:05:06,760 --> 01:05:11,360
Speaker 1: a uh sort of figurative and and also literal makeover

1039
01:05:11,520 --> 01:05:14,800
Speaker 1: of her where you know, by Christmas time after the

1040
01:05:14,840 --> 01:05:19,960
Speaker 1: midterm elections, she is in full on ceremonial first lady

1041
01:05:20,040 --> 01:05:24,320
Speaker 1: mode of showing off the White House Christmas tree and

1042
01:05:24,760 --> 01:05:27,640
Speaker 1: showing you know, the cookies, although man, we didn't even

1043
01:05:27,680 --> 01:05:32,600
Speaker 1: mention the tea and cookies quote from uh the campaign, right,

1044
01:05:32,920 --> 01:05:35,320
Speaker 1: one of the quotes that got her into big trouble

1045
01:05:35,360 --> 01:05:37,480
Speaker 1: with people was that you know, I'm not just gonna

1046
01:05:37,560 --> 01:05:40,440
Speaker 1: be the first lady who sits around making tea and

1047
01:05:40,480 --> 01:05:44,160
Speaker 1: cookies all day long. And of course, so you can

1048
01:05:44,240 --> 01:05:46,240
Speaker 1: imagine a lot of women found that to be very

1049
01:05:46,240 --> 01:05:48,320
Speaker 1: offensive and a lot of men were like, why not?

1050
01:05:49,480 --> 01:05:52,960
Speaker 1: And from what her friends have said, I mean and

1051
01:05:53,040 --> 01:05:56,960
Speaker 1: understandably it was extremely demoralizing for her. I mean some

1052
01:05:57,080 --> 01:05:59,880
Speaker 1: said that she went through a depression at the time

1053
01:06:00,120 --> 01:06:05,040
Speaker 1: because yet again she was essentially being reined in. Yeah,

1054
01:06:05,120 --> 01:06:07,080
Speaker 1: she was being reined in, and she was getting a

1055
01:06:07,120 --> 01:06:11,600
Speaker 1: smack on the hand for just again expressing the fact

1056
01:06:11,600 --> 01:06:15,800
Speaker 1: that she desired an identity beyond being at home and

1057
01:06:15,840 --> 01:06:18,520
Speaker 1: being built wife, that she wanted her own identity, and

1058
01:06:18,520 --> 01:06:21,080
Speaker 1: that she had worked so hard to establish it. But

1059
01:06:21,320 --> 01:06:24,200
Speaker 1: when you say that stuff and people know you, and

1060
01:06:24,240 --> 01:06:26,040
Speaker 1: you say it to your best friend, it's one thing.

1061
01:06:26,080 --> 01:06:28,880
Speaker 1: But when you are in such a high profile position

1062
01:06:28,880 --> 01:06:30,400
Speaker 1: and you say it to the press, which then of

1063
01:06:30,440 --> 01:06:33,880
Speaker 1: course goes out to everyone of all backgrounds, it tends

1064
01:06:33,920 --> 01:06:37,640
Speaker 1: to get filtered through different lenses. Well, and she also

1065
01:06:37,840 --> 01:06:41,080
Speaker 1: she wanted that co presidency, Yeah she did, and I

1066
01:06:41,080 --> 01:06:46,200
Speaker 1: think Bill wanted it to UM, but America did not UM.

1067
01:06:46,280 --> 01:06:50,440
Speaker 1: And we can sense her frustration with all of us

1068
01:06:50,920 --> 01:06:53,120
Speaker 1: loud and clear. It's not just a sense, it's obvious

1069
01:06:53,160 --> 01:06:57,360
Speaker 1: in when she famously said, if I want to knock

1070
01:06:57,400 --> 01:07:00,760
Speaker 1: a story off the front page, I just changed my hairstyle.

1071
01:07:01,160 --> 01:07:05,440
Speaker 1: But I mean also sees her making history. Yeah, she

1072
01:07:05,480 --> 01:07:08,000
Speaker 1: has a comeback. Yeah, she did in ninety five, we

1073
01:07:08,120 --> 01:07:11,640
Speaker 1: see the so called First Lady of the World traveling

1074
01:07:11,680 --> 01:07:17,360
Speaker 1: around the world, complete with daughter into Chelsea. She travels

1075
01:07:17,400 --> 01:07:21,240
Speaker 1: through all of these Southeast Asian countries, meetings specifically with

1076
01:07:21,720 --> 01:07:25,800
Speaker 1: women's groups and doing things like championing micro loans for

1077
01:07:25,840 --> 01:07:29,280
Speaker 1: women in these countries. But the highlight, the jewel and

1078
01:07:29,320 --> 01:07:31,800
Speaker 1: the crown. The thing that is still quoted today and

1079
01:07:31,840 --> 01:07:36,440
Speaker 1: should be quoted forever more is this electrifying speech that

1080
01:07:36,480 --> 01:07:39,480
Speaker 1: she delivers in Beijing at the u N Fourth World

1081
01:07:39,560 --> 01:07:43,000
Speaker 1: Conference on Women. Yeah, this was kind of an eleventh

1082
01:07:43,000 --> 01:07:49,040
Speaker 1: hour speech that she delivered that her her handlers essentially

1083
01:07:49,320 --> 01:07:52,360
Speaker 1: were really nervous about, because I mean, she was on

1084
01:07:52,400 --> 01:07:55,000
Speaker 1: the world stage, she was in China, um, and she

1085
01:07:55,120 --> 01:08:00,240
Speaker 1: wanted to deliver something really powerful, and this moment really

1086
01:08:00,240 --> 01:08:04,919
Speaker 1: seemed to re energize her from being effectively pushed aside.

1087
01:08:04,960 --> 01:08:07,600
Speaker 1: I mean, it really seems like she kind of gathered

1088
01:08:07,680 --> 01:08:11,760
Speaker 1: up all of you know, all the times that she

1089
01:08:11,800 --> 01:08:16,200
Speaker 1: had been told to kind of like temper her her smarts,

1090
01:08:16,240 --> 01:08:21,320
Speaker 1: her intelligence, um and put it into this speech where

1091
01:08:22,479 --> 01:08:26,160
Speaker 1: she famously said, if there's one message that echoes forth

1092
01:08:26,240 --> 01:08:29,760
Speaker 1: from this conference, let it be that human rights are

1093
01:08:29,800 --> 01:08:33,720
Speaker 1: women's rights and women's rights are human rights, once and

1094
01:08:33,800 --> 01:08:39,280
Speaker 1: for all, and this speech really cemented her as a

1095
01:08:39,360 --> 01:08:43,720
Speaker 1: global advocate for women. UM and in addition to just

1096
01:08:44,000 --> 01:08:47,559
Speaker 1: um essentially saying like, you know, women's rights should not

1097
01:08:47,560 --> 01:08:52,480
Speaker 1: be some niche interest, but they are also human rights.

1098
01:08:52,520 --> 01:08:59,280
Speaker 1: She decried sex, slavery, domestic violence, genital mutilation, coercive abortion, sterilization, wartime,

1099
01:08:59,360 --> 01:09:02,240
Speaker 1: rape burning. I mean, she essentially like went through the

1100
01:09:02,320 --> 01:09:06,080
Speaker 1: laundry list of all of the violence and discrimination that

1101
01:09:06,120 --> 01:09:09,360
Speaker 1: women around the world faced, and as a result, The

1102
01:09:09,400 --> 01:09:12,639
Speaker 1: New York Times, for instance, reported her speaking quote more

1103
01:09:12,720 --> 01:09:17,080
Speaker 1: forcefully on human rights than any American dignitary has on

1104
01:09:17,240 --> 01:09:22,400
Speaker 1: Chinese soil. Bill included, Yeah, when people asked Bill, you know, like, oh,

1105
01:09:22,479 --> 01:09:24,800
Speaker 1: what do you think about your lady going rogue over here?

1106
01:09:25,000 --> 01:09:27,920
Speaker 1: I mean, he fully he was very clear that she

1107
01:09:28,000 --> 01:09:31,439
Speaker 1: had his full support well, and she she had support

1108
01:09:31,439 --> 01:09:35,160
Speaker 1: across the aisle. I mean, there were I think it

1109
01:09:35,160 --> 01:09:39,040
Speaker 1: would be it would be such a liability to um

1110
01:09:39,400 --> 01:09:43,920
Speaker 1: argue against what she said. And it really seems like

1111
01:09:44,040 --> 01:09:47,639
Speaker 1: one of the only and certainly one of the last

1112
01:09:47,640 --> 01:09:52,560
Speaker 1: times she would enjoy that much unanimous praise from Democrats

1113
01:09:52,880 --> 01:09:58,200
Speaker 1: and Republicans alike. Yeah, and so coming off this victory,

1114
01:09:58,240 --> 01:10:03,759
Speaker 1: and despite her continued efforts to support healthcare reform, support

1115
01:10:03,840 --> 01:10:09,200
Speaker 1: children's health insurance, UH, fight for women's rights, the focus

1116
01:10:09,280 --> 01:10:12,760
Speaker 1: would then turn to their personal lives. Yeah, there is

1117
01:10:12,800 --> 01:10:17,120
Speaker 1: a grim horizon on the home front. UM. And we're

1118
01:10:17,120 --> 01:10:20,000
Speaker 1: not gonna get into all these details because we've already

1119
01:10:20,000 --> 01:10:21,600
Speaker 1: talked for a long time and we're only up to

1120
01:10:21,720 --> 01:10:26,280
Speaker 1: n UM. But what was to come, of course, would

1121
01:10:26,320 --> 01:10:31,639
Speaker 1: be Paula Jones, Kenneth Star, Linda Trip and Monica Lewinsky. UM.

1122
01:10:32,000 --> 01:10:34,559
Speaker 1: And she would also become the first lady to testify

1123
01:10:34,640 --> 01:10:40,400
Speaker 1: before a Senate committee regarding the White Water real estate project. UM.

1124
01:10:40,400 --> 01:10:44,080
Speaker 1: But she and Bill had started with another couple while

1125
01:10:44,080 --> 01:10:47,360
Speaker 1: they were living in Arkansas. I mean, and of course

1126
01:10:47,360 --> 01:10:50,600
Speaker 1: Bill was impeached and the whole time though it was

1127
01:10:50,840 --> 01:10:55,880
Speaker 1: kind of interesting about the Monica Lewinsky scandal UM where

1128
01:10:55,920 --> 01:10:58,000
Speaker 1: I mean, And and a lot of people, a lot

1129
01:10:58,000 --> 01:11:00,759
Speaker 1: of women and stuff I've never told you, fan UM

1130
01:11:00,800 --> 01:11:04,519
Speaker 1: are not pleased that she still stood by her man

1131
01:11:04,760 --> 01:11:08,439
Speaker 1: through all of that and the way that she helped

1132
01:11:08,520 --> 01:11:13,840
Speaker 1: to trash Monica Lewinsky's public image UM for the sake

1133
01:11:13,880 --> 01:11:17,880
Speaker 1: of politics. UM. Her approval ratings went up as his

1134
01:11:17,960 --> 01:11:23,240
Speaker 1: went down, because they're like, well, that poor woman. Listen

1135
01:11:23,320 --> 01:11:25,759
Speaker 1: or Maya wanted to chime in about the whole issue

1136
01:11:25,760 --> 01:11:30,080
Speaker 1: around Bill's affairs and Hillary's trustworthiness. In my opinion, the

1137
01:11:30,120 --> 01:11:34,439
Speaker 1: word distrust summarizes much of the public's opinion about Hillary Clinton.

1138
01:11:35,080 --> 01:11:38,240
Speaker 1: And it's not just because she's a career politician. It's

1139
01:11:38,320 --> 01:11:42,680
Speaker 1: so much more than that. Long before allegation surrounding her emails,

1140
01:11:42,760 --> 01:11:47,280
Speaker 1: America has been wondering and questioning what exactly is wrong

1141
01:11:47,320 --> 01:11:50,120
Speaker 1: with her? How can she be doing what she's doing

1142
01:11:50,240 --> 01:11:53,439
Speaker 1: to the degree of success that she's had, and it's

1143
01:11:53,479 --> 01:11:55,720
Speaker 1: done in a way that we don't do with male politicians.

1144
01:11:56,520 --> 01:11:58,920
Speaker 1: It runs so much deeper than the lack of trust

1145
01:11:59,000 --> 01:12:02,080
Speaker 1: we have for politicians overall. And when you get right

1146
01:12:02,120 --> 01:12:04,479
Speaker 1: down to it, so much of that is because she's

1147
01:12:04,479 --> 01:12:08,120
Speaker 1: a woman. There's a reason the name Rodham hasn't really

1148
01:12:08,160 --> 01:12:13,120
Speaker 1: been heard since the beginning of her presidential campaign. Whenever

1149
01:12:13,160 --> 01:12:16,439
Speaker 1: a woman's husband is unfaithful, we always look towards the

1150
01:12:16,479 --> 01:12:19,920
Speaker 1: wife asking why and what did you do? And why

1151
01:12:19,920 --> 01:12:23,000
Speaker 1: would he do this to you? And that stigma has

1152
01:12:23,040 --> 01:12:26,439
Speaker 1: stayed with her, And there's just something about a woman

1153
01:12:26,479 --> 01:12:29,320
Speaker 1: who doesn't know how to please her man that the

1154
01:12:29,360 --> 01:12:33,439
Speaker 1: American public has trouble standing behind, and this feeling is

1155
01:12:33,479 --> 01:12:38,360
Speaker 1: popular despite knowing how common infidelity is. That is not

1156
01:12:38,439 --> 01:12:41,280
Speaker 1: to say that the public doesn't respect Hillary. Young women

1157
01:12:41,320 --> 01:12:43,599
Speaker 1: all over the world have been writing essays about how

1158
01:12:43,640 --> 01:12:47,760
Speaker 1: strong and decisive and politically minded she is for decades.

1159
01:12:48,479 --> 01:12:51,080
Speaker 1: But in the back of America's mind, there's always that

1160
01:12:51,200 --> 01:12:54,719
Speaker 1: question of what is wrong? What is going on there?

1161
01:12:56,120 --> 01:12:59,160
Speaker 1: As a presidential candidate, Hillary Clinton is not inherently more

1162
01:12:59,280 --> 01:13:02,840
Speaker 1: or less trustworthy than any other candidate, and yet the

1163
01:13:02,880 --> 01:13:07,200
Speaker 1: word untrustworthy has been tossed in her direction disproportionately. But

1164
01:13:07,280 --> 01:13:10,160
Speaker 1: what I think is so interesting and I don't know,

1165
01:13:10,200 --> 01:13:12,600
Speaker 1: correct me if you think I'm wrong. But you know,

1166
01:13:12,760 --> 01:13:16,759
Speaker 1: as Bill's presidency is winding down and Hillary is winding

1167
01:13:16,960 --> 01:13:21,320
Speaker 1: up her career, I mean, she became the first first

1168
01:13:21,400 --> 01:13:23,600
Speaker 1: lady to run for national office while her spouse was

1169
01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:25,920
Speaker 1: still a sitting president, and in two thousand nine, she

1170
01:13:25,960 --> 01:13:28,800
Speaker 1: became the first first lady to subsequently serve as a

1171
01:13:28,840 --> 01:13:33,439
Speaker 1: cabinet member and as Secretary of State. To me, it

1172
01:13:33,640 --> 01:13:37,880
Speaker 1: feels like she just sort of hit the play button,

1173
01:13:38,439 --> 01:13:42,520
Speaker 1: you know, like not obviously not that she didn't accomplish

1174
01:13:42,560 --> 01:13:45,080
Speaker 1: things as first Lady of Arkansas and first Lady of

1175
01:13:45,120 --> 01:13:47,680
Speaker 1: the United States of America, because she obviously did. We've

1176
01:13:47,960 --> 01:13:50,080
Speaker 1: this is what this whole episode has been about, about

1177
01:13:50,080 --> 01:13:52,320
Speaker 1: all the amazing things she accomplished and how what a

1178
01:13:52,360 --> 01:13:55,800
Speaker 1: brilliant woman and lawyer she was is. But to me,

1179
01:13:55,920 --> 01:13:58,960
Speaker 1: it just feels like she kind of went, all right,

1180
01:13:59,040 --> 01:14:02,120
Speaker 1: I'm going to New York. I've got stuff to do.

1181
01:14:02,400 --> 01:14:05,720
Speaker 1: Let's buy the house in New York. Let's get to it. Um.

1182
01:14:05,800 --> 01:14:11,200
Speaker 1: And when you think about her qualities that were most reviled,

1183
01:14:11,560 --> 01:14:17,240
Speaker 1: really of being very tactical and strategic and calculating, if

1184
01:14:18,000 --> 01:14:21,240
Speaker 1: a male politician had all of those possessed all those

1185
01:14:21,280 --> 01:14:25,160
Speaker 1: same qualities and that same level of accomplishment and straight

1186
01:14:25,240 --> 01:14:27,720
Speaker 1: up intelligence, you cannot tell me Hillary Clinton is not

1187
01:14:27,760 --> 01:14:33,120
Speaker 1: straight up brilliant. Um, there would not have been an issue.

1188
01:14:33,360 --> 01:14:35,240
Speaker 1: You know, no one would have been like, yeah, but

1189
01:14:35,240 --> 01:14:38,000
Speaker 1: look at his hair, unless maybe he got like a

1190
01:14:38,000 --> 01:14:41,479
Speaker 1: four hundred dollar haircut, and unless it was Donald Trump. Yeah. Well,

1191
01:14:41,560 --> 01:14:45,000
Speaker 1: and Donald Trump of force hasn't done all those things. Um, well, yeah,

1192
01:14:45,000 --> 01:14:47,639
Speaker 1: of course, but you know what I mean. That's that's

1193
01:14:48,040 --> 01:14:51,320
Speaker 1: the takeaway from me. With all of this is like

1194
01:14:52,280 --> 01:14:55,360
Speaker 1: a why did you move to Arkansas? I mean, one

1195
01:14:55,360 --> 01:14:57,559
Speaker 1: of the big questions to Caroline that I'm left with

1196
01:14:57,680 --> 01:15:00,800
Speaker 1: after all of this was why did she move to

1197
01:15:00,880 --> 01:15:07,920
Speaker 1: Arkansas for such like for such a planner, you know

1198
01:15:07,960 --> 01:15:11,760
Speaker 1: what I mean, like following her heart like that. I

1199
01:15:11,800 --> 01:15:13,760
Speaker 1: don't know, I mean, but maybe she still had the plan.

1200
01:15:13,840 --> 01:15:17,320
Speaker 1: Maybe this was the plan all along, Yeah, I mean it.

1201
01:15:17,520 --> 01:15:19,160
Speaker 1: You know, it could be that they really are a

1202
01:15:19,200 --> 01:15:23,559
Speaker 1: Frank and a Claire Underwood, and that she maybe thought

1203
01:15:23,680 --> 01:15:28,720
Speaker 1: that by marrying following and marrying a man who had

1204
01:15:28,760 --> 01:15:32,960
Speaker 1: his eyes on a larger platform, a higher platform, that

1205
01:15:33,120 --> 01:15:36,960
Speaker 1: she herself could gain access to a higher platform as well.

1206
01:15:37,320 --> 01:15:39,920
Speaker 1: So maybe it was calculated, or maybe she really was

1207
01:15:39,960 --> 01:15:42,000
Speaker 1: just in love and you know, wanted to follow Bill.

1208
01:15:42,040 --> 01:15:46,320
Speaker 1: I mean, those two things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive, but um,

1209
01:15:46,360 --> 01:15:49,080
Speaker 1: you know, I it is interesting to think what would

1210
01:15:49,080 --> 01:15:53,080
Speaker 1: have happened would she you know, if she had not

1211
01:15:53,200 --> 01:15:55,280
Speaker 1: married Bill, if she had stayed in d C. Would

1212
01:15:55,280 --> 01:15:59,599
Speaker 1: she be and Elizabeth Warren like a really cool woman

1213
01:15:59,680 --> 01:16:03,880
Speaker 1: who is outspoken and accomplished and very admirable, but not

1214
01:16:05,520 --> 01:16:08,439
Speaker 1: the you know, the twenty years running gallop poles most

1215
01:16:08,479 --> 01:16:11,960
Speaker 1: admired American woman, but also scandal written in a lot

1216
01:16:12,000 --> 01:16:14,840
Speaker 1: of ways to I mean, that's the thing. I mean,

1217
01:16:14,920 --> 01:16:20,760
Speaker 1: she's they are a very imperfect political couple. Um. But

1218
01:16:20,800 --> 01:16:22,960
Speaker 1: it's like you have to take you got to take

1219
01:16:23,000 --> 01:16:25,439
Speaker 1: the good and the bad and you put it together

1220
01:16:25,479 --> 01:16:26,920
Speaker 1: and then you have the facts of life. And I

1221
01:16:26,960 --> 01:16:31,040
Speaker 1: know that I'm misquoted the theme song, um, but it was.

1222
01:16:31,160 --> 01:16:34,920
Speaker 1: It was really helpful for me to to to have

1223
01:16:35,080 --> 01:16:38,000
Speaker 1: the chance to look into her bio. I mean, I

1224
01:16:38,080 --> 01:16:42,160
Speaker 1: learned so much about this woman, you know who, regardless

1225
01:16:42,200 --> 01:16:46,200
Speaker 1: of the outcome of this election, and regardless of whether

1226
01:16:46,280 --> 01:16:48,680
Speaker 1: you love or loathe her, I mean, she will be

1227
01:16:48,720 --> 01:16:52,519
Speaker 1: in history books because I mean, there there's no one

1228
01:16:52,560 --> 01:16:55,160
Speaker 1: else like her has been and I think it will

1229
01:16:55,200 --> 01:16:57,240
Speaker 1: take a while for there to be someone. And I

1230
01:16:57,280 --> 01:17:01,559
Speaker 1: think it's interesting and you eeken unfortunate that with how

1231
01:17:01,640 --> 01:17:04,559
Speaker 1: much she did accomplish, the fact that it is all

1232
01:17:04,600 --> 01:17:08,679
Speaker 1: filtered through her husband and being a Clinton, so many

1233
01:17:08,720 --> 01:17:11,960
Speaker 1: of her accomplishments do get forgotten and left in the

1234
01:17:12,040 --> 01:17:15,000
Speaker 1: dust because of the scandal that's been attached to both

1235
01:17:15,040 --> 01:17:17,200
Speaker 1: of them. And Caroline, we didn't even we didn't even

1236
01:17:17,200 --> 01:17:20,439
Speaker 1: get up to the pants suits. She she did so much.

1237
01:17:20,600 --> 01:17:22,840
Speaker 1: We didn't we didn't even have time to get through

1238
01:17:22,880 --> 01:17:25,679
Speaker 1: that whole media phase. I mean, but that's the thing too,

1239
01:17:25,720 --> 01:17:29,479
Speaker 1: Like I hope that I hope that listeners have also

1240
01:17:30,800 --> 01:17:34,599
Speaker 1: gained some understanding as as I certainly have, of that

1241
01:17:34,840 --> 01:17:40,439
Speaker 1: extremely gendered lens that the media has persistently viewed her through.

1242
01:17:40,479 --> 01:17:43,639
Speaker 1: I mean, and it makes so much sense why she

1243
01:17:43,720 --> 01:17:47,439
Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily come across as all that open and likable

1244
01:17:47,640 --> 01:17:51,600
Speaker 1: because she doesn't like the press. I mean, they have

1245
01:17:51,760 --> 01:17:55,000
Speaker 1: never been kind to her in a lot of ways.

1246
01:17:55,040 --> 01:17:59,280
Speaker 1: So oh, people are gonna say we sound too sympathetic,

1247
01:18:00,320 --> 01:18:03,719
Speaker 1: But listeners, let us know what you think. Mom Stuff

1248
01:18:03,760 --> 01:18:06,679
Speaker 1: at how Stuff Works dot com is our email address,

1249
01:18:06,880 --> 01:18:09,000
Speaker 1: and you can also tweet us at mom Stuff podcast

1250
01:18:09,120 --> 01:18:11,439
Speaker 1: or messages on Facebook. And we've got a couple of

1251
01:18:11,479 --> 01:18:19,240
Speaker 1: messages this year with you right now. So I've had

1252
01:18:19,240 --> 01:18:22,040
Speaker 1: a letter here from uh, someone who would like to

1253
01:18:22,160 --> 01:18:26,720
Speaker 1: remain anonymous, who has a request anonymous rights. Would you

1254
01:18:26,720 --> 01:18:29,960
Speaker 1: guys consider doing a show on military women. I know

1255
01:18:30,080 --> 01:18:32,280
Speaker 1: you did one on Army wives and are about to

1256
01:18:32,280 --> 01:18:36,639
Speaker 1: release one on the military wars on women. Um And

1257
01:18:36,800 --> 01:18:41,519
Speaker 1: as this person says that she's stationed in Korea, UM,

1258
01:18:41,600 --> 01:18:44,400
Speaker 1: and that the she calls it, the Big Army is

1259
01:18:44,439 --> 01:18:49,360
Speaker 1: cracking down on problems of prostitution and trafficking. And she

1260
01:18:49,400 --> 01:18:51,720
Speaker 1: says that women have been present in all aspects of

1261
01:18:51,800 --> 01:18:55,040
Speaker 1: war through history, as victims, as those holding down the

1262
01:18:55,080 --> 01:18:58,640
Speaker 1: home front, but also as combatants and at times aggressors.

1263
01:18:59,160 --> 01:19:02,320
Speaker 1: Usually women in war are seen as freaks or are

1264
01:19:02,400 --> 01:19:05,920
Speaker 1: necessities due to personal shortages, but we are so much

1265
01:19:05,920 --> 01:19:08,920
Speaker 1: more than that. There's so much to unpack with military women.

1266
01:19:09,200 --> 01:19:12,840
Speaker 1: American military women still face open discrimination in certain units

1267
01:19:12,880 --> 01:19:16,479
Speaker 1: and are underrepresented at higher levels. I know I'm usually

1268
01:19:16,479 --> 01:19:18,679
Speaker 1: the only woman in the room when I go to meetings.

1269
01:19:19,160 --> 01:19:22,080
Speaker 1: Sexual assault is a very real threat, and the gender

1270
01:19:22,160 --> 01:19:24,400
Speaker 1: sexual double standard is probably worse in the U. S

1271
01:19:24,439 --> 01:19:27,840
Speaker 1: Military than in most other American workplaces. But in the

1272
01:19:27,920 --> 01:19:31,320
Speaker 1: last fifteen years, ladies are breaking down barriers, both for

1273
01:19:31,400 --> 01:19:35,719
Speaker 1: the good and ill. And she references uh Lynda England

1274
01:19:36,000 --> 01:19:40,559
Speaker 1: who was torturing prisoners just like the male soldiers, and

1275
01:19:40,640 --> 01:19:43,760
Speaker 1: she says, just something to consider looking forward to the

1276
01:19:43,800 --> 01:19:48,440
Speaker 1: next show. UM, So thank you for your request, Anonymous,

1277
01:19:48,520 --> 01:19:53,679
Speaker 1: and also I'm wishing you safety in your job and

1278
01:19:53,840 --> 01:19:55,960
Speaker 1: listeners wanting to know whether that's something that you would

1279
01:19:55,960 --> 01:19:58,720
Speaker 1: like us to explore more deeply as well. Okay, well,

1280
01:19:58,760 --> 01:20:00,600
Speaker 1: I have a letter here from Anne in response to

1281
01:20:00,600 --> 01:20:03,880
Speaker 1: our lesbian wage Bump episode. She says it got me

1282
01:20:03,920 --> 01:20:06,559
Speaker 1: thinking about my life a lot. I studied library and

1283
01:20:06,560 --> 01:20:09,320
Speaker 1: information studies and hoped to one day work at a library.

1284
01:20:09,720 --> 01:20:12,040
Speaker 1: During my studies, I got more interested in I T

1285
01:20:12,320 --> 01:20:16,000
Speaker 1: and libraries, integrated library systems, and other libraries software, et cetera,

1286
01:20:16,120 --> 01:20:17,640
Speaker 1: and was part of a team who worked at a

1287
01:20:17,640 --> 01:20:21,240
Speaker 1: project aimed at getting more open source software into libraries

1288
01:20:21,280 --> 01:20:23,760
Speaker 1: in my country. It got a bit famous in the

1289
01:20:23,800 --> 01:20:26,200
Speaker 1: librarian community, and I got offered a job in the

1290
01:20:26,240 --> 01:20:29,479
Speaker 1: second biggest library in the country. They were developing a

1291
01:20:29,479 --> 01:20:32,360
Speaker 1: library catalog and needed someone who was a librarian. But

1292
01:20:32,400 --> 01:20:34,800
Speaker 1: it's not afraid of software and more technical stuff than

1293
01:20:34,840 --> 01:20:36,920
Speaker 1: just books. By the way, you guys should play a

1294
01:20:36,960 --> 01:20:39,280
Speaker 1: drinking game to how many times I'm saying library. Actually

1295
01:20:39,280 --> 01:20:42,120
Speaker 1: I think it's pronounced library. Yeah. I keep like almost

1296
01:20:42,200 --> 01:20:46,080
Speaker 1: catching myself saying that because my mouth is lazy. Um. Okay,

1297
01:20:46,120 --> 01:20:49,040
Speaker 1: so and goes on to say at the interview, it

1298
01:20:49,080 --> 01:20:51,280
Speaker 1: became very clear to me that they are desperate and

1299
01:20:51,320 --> 01:20:53,559
Speaker 1: had been looking for someone like me. For a very

1300
01:20:53,560 --> 01:20:55,519
Speaker 1: long time, they interviewed a lot of people, but no

1301
01:20:55,560 --> 01:20:58,160
Speaker 1: one wanted the job. I couldn't understand that it was

1302
01:20:58,200 --> 01:21:01,040
Speaker 1: my dream job, incredibly interesting and also paid much better

1303
01:21:01,080 --> 01:21:03,880
Speaker 1: than almost anything else in the library. I realized what

1304
01:21:03,920 --> 01:21:06,760
Speaker 1: the issue was when they asked me the boss is

1305
01:21:06,800 --> 01:21:08,960
Speaker 1: a woman and the rest of the team is eleven men.

1306
01:21:09,120 --> 01:21:11,719
Speaker 1: Do you think that would be a problem. It wouldn't

1307
01:21:11,720 --> 01:21:13,880
Speaker 1: be for me, as a geek and a gamer and

1308
01:21:13,960 --> 01:21:17,200
Speaker 1: somewhat butch pan sexual woman. I'm used to being the

1309
01:21:17,240 --> 01:21:19,320
Speaker 1: only female in a group. But I could definitely see

1310
01:21:19,360 --> 01:21:22,120
Speaker 1: all the other candidates all women, because even if a

1311
01:21:22,160 --> 01:21:25,200
Speaker 1: man studies librarianship, they don't work at libraries. Having a

1312
01:21:25,280 --> 01:21:28,000
Speaker 1: huge issue with this, I got the job, and I'm

1313
01:21:28,040 --> 01:21:31,320
Speaker 1: happy to have it. I occasionally encounter sexism from my colleagues,

1314
01:21:31,800 --> 01:21:34,040
Speaker 1: and especially in the beginning, I had to set boundaries

1315
01:21:34,080 --> 01:21:36,400
Speaker 1: to show them that I'm not useless, as some of

1316
01:21:36,439 --> 01:21:39,519
Speaker 1: them thought. But it's pretty great otherwise. When I see

1317
01:21:39,560 --> 01:21:42,200
Speaker 1: what my classmates do now, I know I have significantly

1318
01:21:42,280 --> 01:21:45,120
Speaker 1: higher paychecks than them because anything I t is almost

1319
01:21:45,160 --> 01:21:48,200
Speaker 1: the best paid work in libraries, so I have a

1320
01:21:48,320 --> 01:21:51,920
Speaker 1: pan sexual wage bump. If it's a thing because they're

1321
01:21:51,960 --> 01:21:54,120
Speaker 1: good at communicating with people, they read a lot, and

1322
01:21:54,160 --> 01:21:57,920
Speaker 1: have other stereotypically female traits, whereas I'm an introverted geek

1323
01:21:58,080 --> 01:22:00,200
Speaker 1: is not afraid of computers. I'd say good for me,

1324
01:22:00,320 --> 01:22:01,840
Speaker 1: but I feel like it's bad for them, so it

1325
01:22:01,880 --> 01:22:06,160
Speaker 1: doesn't make me very happy. So thanks Anne, which reminds

1326
01:22:06,160 --> 01:22:10,080
Speaker 1: me we did an episode on librarians years and years

1327
01:22:10,080 --> 01:22:13,160
Speaker 1: and years ago, but um, I would love to visit

1328
01:22:13,200 --> 01:22:18,320
Speaker 1: the topic if we have any librarians in our audience

1329
01:22:18,360 --> 01:22:21,000
Speaker 1: who would also enjoy that. UM also shout out to

1330
01:22:21,400 --> 01:22:25,920
Speaker 1: to Bossy James. They're great and they're librarians. Alright, with that,

1331
01:22:26,360 --> 01:22:28,719
Speaker 1: send us your letters mom. Stuff at how stuff works

1332
01:22:28,720 --> 01:22:31,120
Speaker 1: dot com is our email address and for links all

1333
01:22:31,120 --> 01:22:33,759
Speaker 1: of our social media as well as all of our blogs, videos,

1334
01:22:33,760 --> 01:22:36,880
Speaker 1: and podcast with our sources. So you can fact check

1335
01:22:36,960 --> 01:22:39,920
Speaker 1: everything we just said about Hillary Clinton. Head on over

1336
01:22:39,960 --> 01:22:46,240
Speaker 1: to stuff bomb Never Told You dot com for more

1337
01:22:46,320 --> 01:22:48,559
Speaker 1: on this and thousands of other topics. Does it how

1338
01:22:48,640 --> 01:22:57,320
Speaker 1: stuff Works dot com