1 00:00:00,720 --> 00:00:04,120 Speaker 1: So there was a Middle Eastern potentate who was a 2 00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:08,800 Speaker 1: bit crazy, and he had different palaces with underground bunkers 3 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:11,799 Speaker 1: and secret tunnels in and he would travel around in 4 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:15,240 Speaker 1: like different convoys of cars and like which one is 5 00:00:15,280 --> 00:00:18,159 Speaker 1: he in? But a human source told us that he 6 00:00:18,239 --> 00:00:21,599 Speaker 1: has a favorite milk camel and it was white. So 7 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:24,840 Speaker 1: if you could find in the satellite where the camel was, 8 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:29,120 Speaker 1: you knew the vance where he was. So this guy 9 00:00:29,200 --> 00:00:33,120 Speaker 1: spent billions of dollars building these multiple places where he 10 00:00:33,159 --> 00:00:36,640 Speaker 1: could hide in these different tunnel complexes. But as long 11 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:39,159 Speaker 1: as you knew that he had his white milk camel 12 00:00:39,240 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: with him, it didn't really matter. 13 00:00:41,840 --> 00:00:44,040 Speaker 2: Now I do believe that one, because I think we 14 00:00:44,080 --> 00:00:46,840 Speaker 2: all know once you find a milk camel that works 15 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:47,879 Speaker 2: like your. 16 00:00:49,440 --> 00:00:51,520 Speaker 1: I'm John Czeipher and I'm Jarry O'SHEF. 17 00:00:51,840 --> 00:00:55,080 Speaker 3: I served in the CIA's Clandestine Service for twenty eight years, 18 00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:56,959 Speaker 3: living undercover all around the. 19 00:00:56,880 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 1: World, and in my thirty three years with the CIA, 20 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:02,600 Speaker 1: I served in Africa, Asia, Europe, and the Middle East. 21 00:01:02,760 --> 00:01:05,040 Speaker 3: Although we don't usually look at it this way, we 22 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:07,280 Speaker 3: created conspiracies. 23 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:09,680 Speaker 1: In our operations. We got people to believe things that 24 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:10,440 Speaker 1: weren't true. 25 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 3: Now we're investigating the conspiracy theories we see in the 26 00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:14,680 Speaker 3: news almost every day. 27 00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:17,200 Speaker 1: We'll break them down for you to determine whether they 28 00:01:17,200 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 1: could be real or whether we're being manipulated. 29 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:22,120 Speaker 3: Welcome to Mission implausible. 30 00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:27,720 Speaker 1: So, as you and I both work all those years 31 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:32,280 Speaker 1: at CIA, long flights is just part of the deal, right, 32 00:01:32,360 --> 00:01:35,000 Speaker 1: And when you're called back, you need to be back 33 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,920 Speaker 1: tomorrow in Washington to talk, you know, in the Oval 34 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: Office or whatever it is, and you're sitting in Manila. 35 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:43,559 Speaker 1: It's a sixteen hour or twenty hour flight back. Sometimes. 36 00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:47,480 Speaker 1: I always liked it because in our busy lives it 37 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 1: was one of the few times, like you didn't hear 38 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:52,920 Speaker 1: any telephone ring, No one's coming after you. Yeah. 39 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:55,080 Speaker 3: I used to take long train rides through Europe and 40 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:56,200 Speaker 3: it was a chance to read. 41 00:01:56,400 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: So when I was in a rock and I would 42 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:00,920 Speaker 1: get home leave, which we would get twice in a 43 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:05,040 Speaker 1: tour to Kobek home to Hawaii, I would leave a 44 00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 1: rocket four in the morning and then it would go 45 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 1: from Bagdad to Istanbul to London to DC to LA 46 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:17,240 Speaker 1: to Honolulu, and it would take thirty five hours, and 47 00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 1: yet I would arrive at eleven thirty at night on 48 00:02:20,680 --> 00:02:21,919 Speaker 1: the same day I left. 49 00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:24,440 Speaker 3: Right, Well, today I think we're going to be talking 50 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:27,640 Speaker 3: a little bit about airline travel and airports and things, 51 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 3: and so this is about Denver International Airport of all places. 52 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:33,720 Speaker 3: And there's a number of conspiracy theories that have sort 53 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:35,919 Speaker 3: of built up around the airport. And then the one 54 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:38,120 Speaker 3: that seems to have sort of gone wider is this 55 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:41,240 Speaker 3: view that there's this big secret bunker underneath and it's 56 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 3: supposed to be designed to house billionaires in the global 57 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 3: political elite in the event of an apocalypse. 58 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:50,520 Speaker 1: I imagine there's a core of truth. Right, There's lots 59 00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:54,160 Speaker 1: of underground tunnels. It's an airport, You've got conveyor belts, 60 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:56,920 Speaker 1: losing your luggage in my luggage, all over the place. 61 00:02:57,639 --> 00:03:00,079 Speaker 1: So we both have had a lot of background with 62 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: with tunnels and our former existence, as we both know 63 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 1: back in the fifties when we were digging tunnels under 64 00:03:07,600 --> 00:03:10,240 Speaker 1: the Berlin Wall, one of the major problems was is 65 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:12,640 Speaker 1: where do we put the dirt and how do we 66 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 1: keep people quiet about it? Digging a tunnel generally means 67 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:19,680 Speaker 1: thousands of people or hundreds of people involved, and they 68 00:03:19,720 --> 00:03:22,400 Speaker 1: all sort of know, like where the tunnel is being 69 00:03:22,480 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 1: dug to So my first question would be the people 70 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:29,399 Speaker 1: who were all digging the tunnel, what keeps them quiet? 71 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:31,640 Speaker 1: Why aren't they any of them sort of spilling the 72 00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:32,320 Speaker 1: beans on it. 73 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:34,320 Speaker 3: Let me just step back to the Berlin tunnel, which 74 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:36,960 Speaker 3: is actually really interesting. So right, like in the early 75 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 3: fifties when the CIA was new, the President said, you 76 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:43,119 Speaker 3: know all I want from this new CIA, this Eisenhower 77 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 3: is twenty four hours notice when the Russians are coming 78 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 3: across the border. There was a great fear that they 79 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:50,920 Speaker 3: were coming, and essentially the US intelligence had no input 80 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:53,080 Speaker 3: into what Moscow was thinking and when the Red hordes 81 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:55,160 Speaker 3: were coming, and so came up with the idea at 82 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:58,640 Speaker 3: the Berlin CIA office there to dig this tunnel from 83 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:01,200 Speaker 3: West Berlin under the on into East Berlin so that 84 00:04:01,240 --> 00:04:04,520 Speaker 3: they could tap into the East German phone lines and 85 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:07,280 Speaker 3: get a hold of Soviet communications in that type of stuff. 86 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:09,360 Speaker 1: So you're telling me, John, this tunnel was so secret 87 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 1: that Russians didn't know about it. 88 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 3: Well, that's what makes this into a more interesting story 89 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:18,240 Speaker 3: is because the Russians had a spy who was a 90 00:04:18,279 --> 00:04:21,600 Speaker 3: British intelligence officer who was recruited by the Soviets when 91 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:23,600 Speaker 3: he was a prisoner of war in North Korea during 92 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:26,520 Speaker 3: the Korean War, right who spilled the beans on the tunnel, 93 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:30,159 Speaker 3: so that senior Soviet officials knew about the tunnel, but 94 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 3: in their effort to keep it secret, they allowed it 95 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:35,800 Speaker 3: to go forward. And so I don't think they realized 96 00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:38,120 Speaker 3: at the time just how much intelligence that the West 97 00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:40,160 Speaker 3: got out of the tunnel. But one of the things 98 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 3: they hadn't prepared for is when the first snow came 99 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 3: all of a sudden, when they looked at out of 100 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:47,159 Speaker 3: the windows from West Berlin where they were, they noticed 101 00:04:47,160 --> 00:04:49,000 Speaker 3: that the snow went everywhere, but there was this long 102 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:51,680 Speaker 3: stretch of grass where the heat from the tunnel had 103 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:53,800 Speaker 3: come up and melted the snow. They went out and 104 00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:56,080 Speaker 3: played football on the snow to try to mess it 105 00:04:56,120 --> 00:04:56,359 Speaker 3: all up. 106 00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 1: So the lesson from this just past being prologue is 107 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 1: that when the CIA dug a tunnel in the nineteen 108 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:07,839 Speaker 1: fifties that was incredibly important, super secret. Everything involved in 109 00:05:07,880 --> 00:05:10,600 Speaker 1: this was hush hush. The Russians knew about it before 110 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:11,320 Speaker 1: they even dug it. 111 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:13,920 Speaker 3: So you're suggesting that it's hard to keep something secret. 112 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:16,680 Speaker 1: I'm suggesting it's hard to keep something secret. Even when 113 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:18,120 Speaker 1: you're in the conspiracy business. 114 00:05:18,240 --> 00:05:19,960 Speaker 3: You're not going to get any arguments from me. But 115 00:05:20,040 --> 00:05:23,240 Speaker 3: there's two things I think that like, why would conspiracy 116 00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:25,599 Speaker 3: like this come along? And why do these things sort 117 00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:28,400 Speaker 3: of gain traction? I think there's two things that sort 118 00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:30,480 Speaker 3: of fit with what we learned from looking at these other. 119 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 4: Conspiracies too is one of them. 120 00:05:31,839 --> 00:05:34,440 Speaker 3: It deals with secrecy, right, so there's this secret place 121 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:37,599 Speaker 3: in there and when another secrecy, people fill that void 122 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:39,880 Speaker 3: of what they don't know with sometimes conspiracies. And the 123 00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:42,560 Speaker 3: other one is we're talking about the elite, that there's 124 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:45,039 Speaker 3: some band of people that are making big decisions that 125 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:48,279 Speaker 3: sort of control things. You know, the world looks chaotic 126 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 3: and it looks messy, but there must be somebody controlling it. 127 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 3: And these elite have this special knowledge and they need 128 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:56,159 Speaker 3: to hide, and they need to hide under the Denver Airport. 129 00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:57,880 Speaker 1: Why Denver one is. 130 00:05:57,800 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 3: Because it's just this massive, massive air was a massive 131 00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 3: construction effort, and then there was this supposedly revolutionary baggage 132 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:08,760 Speaker 3: system that was all this underground series of tunnels and 133 00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:12,119 Speaker 3: things that very quickly the public was told it didn't 134 00:06:12,120 --> 00:06:14,440 Speaker 3: work and was closed up. So maybe people thought that 135 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 3: was a cover up for something else that was going 136 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:19,520 Speaker 3: onto there. It couldn't be that screwed up. Of course, 137 00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:21,200 Speaker 3: we work in the government, so we know things actually 138 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:23,280 Speaker 3: can be screwed up. I think Denver makes sense in 139 00:06:23,320 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 3: the fact that it's sort of between the coasts. I mean, 140 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:28,159 Speaker 3: if you need to get somewhere quick, an airport is 141 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:28,880 Speaker 3: a good place. 142 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 4: To get to. 143 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 1: Right, all right, Joed, let's get onto our guest today, 144 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 1: Stacey Stegmant. So today we'd like to welcome Stacy Stegman, 145 00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:40,960 Speaker 1: who's senior vice president of Communication, Marketing and Customer Experience 146 00:06:41,320 --> 00:06:45,160 Speaker 1: at Denver International Airport. And from what we hear as well, 147 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:48,000 Speaker 1: you were a real who to talk with about conspiracy 148 00:06:48,040 --> 00:06:50,960 Speaker 1: theories having to do with Denver, something that you get 149 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:52,159 Speaker 1: a lot of. Huh. 150 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:52,320 Speaker 5: So. 151 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:55,240 Speaker 6: I started here in this position about ten years ago, 152 00:06:55,520 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 6: and when I started, the team that I worked with 153 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:02,600 Speaker 6: was very in to disputing every conspiracy that they have 154 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:05,200 Speaker 6: ever heard and pushing back when we got questions from 155 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:08,680 Speaker 6: the public or passengers, and I kind of thought, why 156 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:11,360 Speaker 6: are we doing that. Let's have some fun with it, 157 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:14,040 Speaker 6: and let's talk about it and make it part of 158 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:16,080 Speaker 6: who we are and part of our brand, and you'll 159 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:19,080 Speaker 6: see people coming through the terminal looking for where's the 160 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 6: time capsule or what does door for sixteen go to? 161 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 6: And you see those people and I was like, let's 162 00:07:26,240 --> 00:07:26,760 Speaker 6: embrace it. 163 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 1: Stacy, can you explain for us to the uninitiated, what 164 00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 1: are the conspiracy theories the main ones that fly around 165 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:34,560 Speaker 1: Dunray Airport. 166 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:37,400 Speaker 6: The one that seems to be most prevalent is that 167 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:41,240 Speaker 6: we are housing underground bunkers for the new World Order, 168 00:07:41,360 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 6: for the world's elite to come. When the end of 169 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 6: the world happens, those that have the Golden ticket get 170 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 6: to come here to the Denver Airport to be safe underground. 171 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:54,440 Speaker 6: Why everything is destroyed around us? There are a number 172 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:58,960 Speaker 6: of conspiracy theories about our public art that they depict 173 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:01,160 Speaker 6: to the end of the world, and it depicts the 174 00:08:01,240 --> 00:08:03,680 Speaker 6: end of society coming as sort of a preview of 175 00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 6: what's to come. 176 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:07,200 Speaker 7: I think it stems back to when this airport was built. 177 00:08:07,240 --> 00:08:10,960 Speaker 6: Remember this is the newest, larger airport in the US, 178 00:08:11,280 --> 00:08:14,120 Speaker 6: and so when it was put under construction, it was 179 00:08:14,280 --> 00:08:17,040 Speaker 6: moved miles out here to the eastern planes of the 180 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 6: state where nothing existed. There are a series of tunnels 181 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:23,760 Speaker 6: that run under the airport because of the baggage system 182 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:26,119 Speaker 6: that was built at the time and running baggage tugs 183 00:08:26,160 --> 00:08:28,920 Speaker 6: and things like that underground. And then just that we're 184 00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:32,440 Speaker 6: connected to every military base around here, that there's some 185 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:35,679 Speaker 6: underground system of tunnels that connect us to nora Ad 186 00:08:35,760 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 6: and the Air Force Academy and Buckley Air Force Base 187 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:41,120 Speaker 6: and all of them. But you can't help but to 188 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:44,280 Speaker 6: find interest in some of these. I mean the art itself, 189 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 6: when you just see it, there's some things that I 190 00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:49,960 Speaker 6: could understand why someone thinks they look odd. We have 191 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:52,920 Speaker 6: another piece of art by a Chicano artist that is 192 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:55,200 Speaker 6: the one that everybody comes and wants to take a 193 00:08:55,240 --> 00:08:58,240 Speaker 6: look at, and it's called Children of the World Dream 194 00:08:58,280 --> 00:08:58,680 Speaker 6: of Peace. 195 00:08:58,720 --> 00:08:59,560 Speaker 7: But it's all. 196 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:02,840 Speaker 6: About showing one when we're all living in peace and 197 00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 6: harmony and there's no war, how everyone gets a long 198 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:08,800 Speaker 6: life's beautiful, everyone's together. But then it also shows when 199 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:11,520 Speaker 6: you are in war, what's that death and destruction. And 200 00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:13,839 Speaker 6: there's some images in it that are disturbing. I mean, 201 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:16,160 Speaker 6: there's a man with a gas mask on and carrying 202 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:18,720 Speaker 6: a big machete. You can understand how people are a 203 00:09:18,720 --> 00:09:21,320 Speaker 6: little intimidated by that or question it. 204 00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:25,080 Speaker 1: So Sace, I have to ask about the horse. Everybody 205 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:28,520 Speaker 1: sees it coming in, this incredible blue horse with red eyes, 206 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 1: all sorts of legends around it. What can you tell 207 00:09:31,800 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 1: us you that. 208 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:36,760 Speaker 6: Is probably our crown jewel in the art program. It's 209 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:39,760 Speaker 6: a sculpture by Luis Jimenez. The horse is called Mustang. 210 00:09:39,840 --> 00:09:43,120 Speaker 6: He's a thirty two foot blue mustang sculpture with glowing 211 00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:45,560 Speaker 6: red eyes. We look at him as the sort of 212 00:09:45,600 --> 00:09:49,400 Speaker 6: fierce protector of the airport. But what did happen while 213 00:09:49,440 --> 00:09:52,839 Speaker 6: he was being built? It was overschedule. The airport was 214 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:55,680 Speaker 6: sort of pushing the artist to get this piece done. 215 00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:58,920 Speaker 6: The artist was working on the horse out of his 216 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:03,960 Speaker 6: studio in Hondo, New Mexico, and he had a piece 217 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:06,160 Speaker 6: of the horse that was on a strap and the 218 00:10:06,200 --> 00:10:10,960 Speaker 6: strap broke, the peace swung and it killed him. And 219 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:13,560 Speaker 6: so there's quite a few stories about that. 220 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:15,680 Speaker 1: So I think we need to rip the band aid 221 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:19,400 Speaker 1: off here and talk about Jesse Ventura. So is he 222 00:10:19,480 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 1: a lizard person? 223 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:23,200 Speaker 6: You know, that's just on my list of questions I 224 00:10:23,200 --> 00:10:25,560 Speaker 6: have about Jesse Ventura. 225 00:10:25,679 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 1: So why did you take us through the Jesse Venturer? 226 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:29,920 Speaker 1: I think he sort of turbo charged this way. 227 00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 7: I mean it was the same many many years ago. 228 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 6: He had heard the conspiracies, made a trip out here 229 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:37,600 Speaker 6: to Denver, I spent some time, ran a whole story 230 00:10:37,679 --> 00:10:40,560 Speaker 6: on his show about all of the ominous things going 231 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:43,400 Speaker 6: on here at the airport, and it just went from there. 232 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:47,599 Speaker 1: Not everybody may remember who Jesse Ventura is, but the 233 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 1: short version is he was a Worldwide Wrestling Federation superstar 234 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:57,680 Speaker 1: who later became a politician and became governor of the 235 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 1: Great State of Minnesota. He was also the Navy seal 236 00:11:01,240 --> 00:11:05,920 Speaker 1: during Vietnam. After his time as governor of Minnesota, Jesse 237 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:08,960 Speaker 1: went on to both work at Harvard and later become 238 00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:14,200 Speaker 1: a conspiracy theorist who has become particularly obsessed with Denver Airport. 239 00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:17,200 Speaker 1: Let's listen to a clip from Jesse Ventura's show in 240 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:18,200 Speaker 1: twenty eleven. 241 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:24,520 Speaker 8: Hidden power, secrets, cover ups, corruption, You think you know 242 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:29,160 Speaker 8: the whole story, Faint or gain a doomsday conspiracy. The 243 00:11:29,240 --> 00:11:33,040 Speaker 8: government want to save the elite, but not you do. 244 00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:35,640 Speaker 8: Our leaders think they can build bunkers for a select 245 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 8: few and leave the rest of us to fend for ourselves. 246 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:41,800 Speaker 1: So you deal a lot with conspiracy theories. Having to 247 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:45,120 Speaker 1: do with like tunnels that reach like one hundred miles, right, 248 00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:47,160 Speaker 1: don't you up to Nora d So what can you 249 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:49,520 Speaker 1: tell us about the tunnels at the airport and what 250 00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:51,920 Speaker 1: you know about sort of the tunneling conspiracies there. 251 00:11:52,040 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 6: It's probably the most requested tour I get from anyone 252 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:58,360 Speaker 6: that elected officials, anyone that lives here locally, or just 253 00:11:58,360 --> 00:12:00,520 Speaker 6: like can you take us down to the tunnel? And 254 00:12:00,559 --> 00:12:02,920 Speaker 6: when I take down, it's it's such a sense of 255 00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 6: disappointment from them because they keep thinking they're going to 256 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:09,560 Speaker 6: see something much more exciting. You know, our tunnels they're 257 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:13,120 Speaker 6: large and lengthy, but so it's our airport and there's 258 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:16,520 Speaker 6: just a system to run baggage tugs through. You see, 259 00:12:16,559 --> 00:12:19,400 Speaker 6: you know, everybody driving their tugs down there, and it's 260 00:12:19,480 --> 00:12:23,040 Speaker 6: populated and busy with everybody going everywhere. I mean, we, 261 00:12:23,240 --> 00:12:25,760 Speaker 6: you know, are an incredibly busy airport, serving close to 262 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:28,800 Speaker 6: seventy million people last year. And so that's what I 263 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 6: laugh about it, and like there's not a space really 264 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:34,240 Speaker 6: that it doesn't have some sort of activity going on. 265 00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 6: Another very disturbing one that we hear a lot is 266 00:12:37,559 --> 00:12:40,080 Speaker 6: that our runways are shaped like a swastika. We have 267 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:43,360 Speaker 6: six runways that you know, run every direction, and that's 268 00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:45,400 Speaker 6: because of the winds here on the eastern plane and 269 00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:47,640 Speaker 6: being able to be most efficient, to be able for 270 00:12:47,720 --> 00:12:50,079 Speaker 6: takeoff in landings and allows you know, the FAA to 271 00:12:50,120 --> 00:12:52,319 Speaker 6: pivot quickly based on weather conditions. 272 00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:54,520 Speaker 1: The thing about being a successful operation is no one 273 00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:57,720 Speaker 1: is supposed to know. So if you're running a SECRETCYI operation, 274 00:12:57,880 --> 00:13:01,200 Speaker 1: you don't put clues out for for people to see 275 00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 1: all the time, right, you don't want anybody to know. 276 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:05,760 Speaker 4: The clue is that there are no clues. 277 00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:10,160 Speaker 6: I mean, I guess anything's possible, but I will say 278 00:13:10,200 --> 00:13:13,680 Speaker 6: I've spent plenty of time underground looking at what's going 279 00:13:13,679 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 6: on because I'm nosy too. 280 00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:16,600 Speaker 7: I want to know what the heck's going on under there. 281 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:19,200 Speaker 6: You can imagine the size of what a facility would 282 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:23,160 Speaker 6: actually take. You know, there's gosh, almost forty thousand people 283 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:26,920 Speaker 6: that work here at the airport. Just for those people alone, 284 00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:29,959 Speaker 6: trying to hide it from the workers, that would be 285 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:30,959 Speaker 6: a pretty tricky thing. 286 00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:32,720 Speaker 7: There would be some indication of something. 287 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: Well. 288 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:35,800 Speaker 3: Stacy, thanks so much for taking the time to speak 289 00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:38,000 Speaker 3: with this. It sounds like you have a fun job 290 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:40,679 Speaker 3: there in a neat place, and we're glad that you 291 00:13:40,760 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 3: guys are taking it with a grain of salt, and 292 00:13:42,800 --> 00:13:45,319 Speaker 3: so thanks so much for being our guest. And now 293 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:46,320 Speaker 3: we're going to take a break. 294 00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 1: Let's talk to our producer, John Start. Thanks guys. So 295 00:13:57,280 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 1: there's a lot of people that know a lot. 296 00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:01,959 Speaker 9: About Denver International Airport, and one of the first people 297 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 9: I talked to is a reporter for The New York Times, saying, 298 00:14:05,160 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 9: Tiffany Shoe, she's been obsessed with the airport ever since 299 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:09,959 Speaker 9: she went to it for a bachelorette party. 300 00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:12,959 Speaker 1: The bachelorette party wasn't in the airport. She was traveling 301 00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:14,079 Speaker 1: through the airport. 302 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:16,600 Speaker 9: Clearly to a club or a bar, or who knows 303 00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:18,960 Speaker 9: a petting zoo. Petting zoo is what they call strip 304 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:19,880 Speaker 9: clubs since Denver. 305 00:14:20,680 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 5: I'm Tiffany Schue. I'm a reporter for the Tech team 306 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:26,120 Speaker 5: of the New York Times, and I focus on miss 307 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 5: and disinformation, which means I write frequently about fault narratives 308 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:32,760 Speaker 5: and rumors and conspiracy theories. 309 00:14:33,040 --> 00:14:35,840 Speaker 9: What's your impression of how prevalent this is and how 310 00:14:35,920 --> 00:14:36,840 Speaker 9: much people believe it? 311 00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:39,160 Speaker 10: You know, it's funny in my job when I talk 312 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:43,560 Speaker 10: to people and say I'm writing about these narratives and. 313 00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:45,080 Speaker 5: I focus on misinformation. 314 00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:48,760 Speaker 11: Usually people would be kind of hesitant about admitting that 315 00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:52,960 Speaker 11: they believe something, or they'll kind of slowly and delicately. 316 00:14:52,440 --> 00:14:52,920 Speaker 5: Work it in. 317 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:55,760 Speaker 10: At the Denver Airport, the number of people who are 318 00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:59,280 Speaker 10: off the bat like, oh yeah, that's totally true was 319 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 10: really striking. A lot of people think that there are 320 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:06,480 Speaker 10: hundreds of miles of tunnels underneath the airport that stretch 321 00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:11,320 Speaker 10: to places like Norrad and Colorado Springs. They say that 322 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:14,720 Speaker 10: they're full of things called dums, which are deep underground 323 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:18,480 Speaker 10: military bunkers that are used by the world elite as 324 00:15:18,520 --> 00:15:21,280 Speaker 10: a place to go in times of apocalypse or to 325 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 10: hold secret meetings that can't be traced. There is a 326 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:27,320 Speaker 10: plaque and I didn't see it myself, but apparently it 327 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:32,280 Speaker 10: says that the airport was funded by the New World 328 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 10: Airport Commission, which I guess doesn't exist, and a lot 329 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:40,560 Speaker 10: of people interpret that lack as being a reference to 330 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 10: the New World Order. 331 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:45,000 Speaker 5: You know, it's the elite cabal that runs the world 332 00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 5: behind the scenes. And you know, I did hear another 333 00:15:48,360 --> 00:15:53,160 Speaker 5: theory that suggested that the size of the airport is 334 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:56,560 Speaker 5: meant to allow it to double as a prison camp 335 00:15:56,760 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 5: for when the New World Order takes over. A suppose 336 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:02,560 Speaker 5: of all of the fencing around the perimeter of the 337 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:05,320 Speaker 5: airport has barbed war that faces inwards to keep people 338 00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:09,840 Speaker 5: from escaping. I was sitting in the office of the 339 00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:13,640 Speaker 5: head of Comms for the airport, Stacy Stegman, and I 340 00:16:13,680 --> 00:16:16,240 Speaker 5: looked out at a pretty long starch of fence with 341 00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:18,800 Speaker 5: barboarre on top, and it definitely does not face inward. 342 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:21,880 Speaker 9: So you've got a tour, Could you tell me what 343 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:23,160 Speaker 9: you saw when you had your tour? 344 00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:27,520 Speaker 11: You see like little parking areas for other golf cart 345 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:28,680 Speaker 11: type vehicles. 346 00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:31,080 Speaker 5: You see people like living around doing whatever. 347 00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:32,160 Speaker 10: You know, there are a. 348 00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:34,880 Speaker 5: Lot of like little doors set off to the side. 349 00:16:35,160 --> 00:16:39,720 Speaker 11: But you know, I can't see anything even remotely suspicious 350 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:43,440 Speaker 11: down there. I could never really understand with the Denver 351 00:16:43,520 --> 00:16:47,000 Speaker 11: Airport Tunnel theory specifically, like how how would you keep 352 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:48,240 Speaker 11: something like this quiet? 353 00:16:48,800 --> 00:16:51,760 Speaker 1: I guess they're all really reliable collaborators. 354 00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 5: Those nbas are ironclat. 355 00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 9: Now I want to talk to people who are real 356 00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:01,840 Speaker 9: experts on building survival bunkers, people that can explain all 357 00:17:01,880 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 9: that goes into it. Turns out that there isn't really 358 00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:08,800 Speaker 9: anyone building it at this scale, but it was interesting. 359 00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 12: Nonetheless, I am the executive director for Vivos. I'm also 360 00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:18,240 Speaker 12: the director of Operations at VIVOS Xpoint, which is the 361 00:17:18,320 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 12: world's largest survival community located in the Black Hills of 362 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:28,280 Speaker 12: South Dakota. So Vivos is the world's largest bunker company 363 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:36,160 Speaker 12: and that involves making bunkers, retrofitting and building communities around survivals. 364 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:41,000 Speaker 12: And Xpoint is a facility located in South Dakota in 365 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:44,560 Speaker 12: the Black Hills. It was originally designated the Black Hills 366 00:17:44,720 --> 00:17:48,720 Speaker 12: Ordnance Depot by the Army Corps of Engineers and built 367 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:52,439 Speaker 12: for the US's involvement in World War Two as a 368 00:17:52,520 --> 00:17:57,959 Speaker 12: major munitions factory. We are now converting that heavily heavily 369 00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:03,160 Speaker 12: fortified location from its original purpose to store bombs into 370 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:07,440 Speaker 12: protecting and sheltering people from whatever may come. We are 371 00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:11,600 Speaker 12: also involved other places around the country with all in 372 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:14,640 Speaker 12: one bunkers that typically were from the Cold War era, 373 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:19,200 Speaker 12: designing them to be completely self sufficient for a minimum 374 00:18:19,280 --> 00:18:23,800 Speaker 12: of one year of autonomous lockdown survivability. And we're also 375 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:27,359 Speaker 12: involved in different countries around the world because there is 376 00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:32,679 Speaker 12: worldwide demand for a solid and reliable, comfortable shelter solution 377 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:35,800 Speaker 12: for the masses. We just started going around the country 378 00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:40,280 Speaker 12: and around the world finding pre existing military spec bunkers 379 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,920 Speaker 12: that were getting auctioned or you know, had been decommissioned 380 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:46,400 Speaker 12: in one way or the other. We spect these bunkers 381 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:50,000 Speaker 12: to be survivable for a minimum of one year of 382 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 12: autonomous lockdown, right, right, So think about all you need 383 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:56,399 Speaker 12: for a year. There's a lot that goes into that. 384 00:18:56,800 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 12: It's no secret that Bill Gates, for example, and really 385 00:19:00,800 --> 00:19:02,680 Speaker 12: any one percent or I would imagine you know, the 386 00:19:02,720 --> 00:19:05,760 Speaker 12: elites of the world. You know, Bill Gates has bunkers 387 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:09,640 Speaker 12: in his mansions for him and his personnel, his family. 388 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:12,720 Speaker 12: The whole thing is probably you know, this triple a 389 00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:17,160 Speaker 12: level of just perfection, five star just luxury and also 390 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:18,440 Speaker 12: while being survivable. 391 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:22,280 Speaker 9: So something that big would be something probably only a 392 00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:23,920 Speaker 9: government could do exactly. 393 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:26,000 Speaker 12: Yeah, and they prove in time and again that they 394 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:27,119 Speaker 12: can and they will do it. 395 00:19:27,440 --> 00:19:29,639 Speaker 1: So you need a lot of space, sounds like you 396 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:30,600 Speaker 1: need a lot of labor. 397 00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:32,800 Speaker 12: There's so much that goes into stuff. 398 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:35,280 Speaker 9: Well, that kind of brings us into our big question 399 00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:38,119 Speaker 9: for this episode, which is, how would you do it. Now, 400 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,920 Speaker 9: if you needed to build a super large, several hundred 401 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 9: thousand square foot yeah bunker from scratch, where would you 402 00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:48,480 Speaker 9: do it, How would you do it, How long would 403 00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:50,160 Speaker 9: it take, what resources would it take? 404 00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:53,919 Speaker 12: You know, we would start with understanding who we're making 405 00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:56,760 Speaker 12: this for and how many people are going to be 406 00:19:56,840 --> 00:20:00,000 Speaker 12: using it. You would want to scope out your local 407 00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:03,040 Speaker 12: You would want to know that you have access to 408 00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:09,639 Speaker 12: fresh water, that you have soil that's acceptable for septic systems, 409 00:20:09,640 --> 00:20:12,960 Speaker 12: and things like that. Also, make sure that when your 410 00:20:12,960 --> 00:20:16,119 Speaker 12: construction trucks are driving in and you got trailers pulling 411 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:19,560 Speaker 12: excavators and that sort of stuff, that the neighbors don't 412 00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:21,960 Speaker 12: know what's going on. Make sure you don't have any 413 00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:25,480 Speaker 12: neighbors in that particular area, because the last thing you 414 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:29,280 Speaker 12: would want is people catching up to the fact that 415 00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:31,520 Speaker 12: you have this and here it is. 416 00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 9: Do you think there are secret megabunkers that we don't 417 00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:35,520 Speaker 9: know about? 418 00:20:35,680 --> 00:20:38,639 Speaker 12: Oh? Hell yeah, I don't even need to go grab 419 00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:42,320 Speaker 12: my tinfoil hat for that. Hell yeah there are. And 420 00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:45,360 Speaker 12: I'm sure they are already working on facilities that'll make 421 00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:47,760 Speaker 12: no rad look like a kindergartener built it out of 422 00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:48,639 Speaker 12: legos or something. 423 00:20:48,760 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 1: How do they keep it secret? 424 00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:50,200 Speaker 8: Yeah? 425 00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:50,760 Speaker 12: How do they? 426 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:51,000 Speaker 9: Right? 427 00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:53,480 Speaker 12: Yeah? I mean, well that's the thing too, is Hey, 428 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:57,320 Speaker 12: maybe you and I are talking about Denver Airport because 429 00:20:57,359 --> 00:20:59,280 Speaker 12: it's a smoke screen, you know what I mean. Maybe 430 00:20:59,320 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 12: there's something else. 431 00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:09,640 Speaker 9: So Vivos actually repurposes former military bases or other underground 432 00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 9: facilities rather than build them from scratch. And people who 433 00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:15,760 Speaker 9: are actually already living in some in South Dakota just 434 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 9: because they're why not, you're already paying for it. So 435 00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:22,480 Speaker 9: I talked to one other person whose company builds smaller 436 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:25,320 Speaker 9: bunkers and delivers them to you, and then you dig 437 00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:27,760 Speaker 9: a hole and you put them underground, probably in your backyard. 438 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:29,040 Speaker 3: I remember Malcolm in the Middle. 439 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:29,640 Speaker 4: They had one. 440 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:31,840 Speaker 3: Hell used to go down there to read Dirty magazine 441 00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:35,520 Speaker 3: so his wife didn't see him. 442 00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:38,680 Speaker 13: I'm Gary Lanch. I'm a general manager Rising S Company. 443 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:41,520 Speaker 13: The industry were known as Rising S bunkers. We build 444 00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:45,639 Speaker 13: a lot of Actually all we build are underground structures 445 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:48,840 Speaker 13: designed to save your life in a catastrophic event. Doesn't 446 00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:51,320 Speaker 13: matter if it's a nuclear war or a social underrest, 447 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:54,439 Speaker 13: a hurricane, a tornado, or what have you. You know, 448 00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:57,520 Speaker 13: they're designed to save your life. Being hidden away and 449 00:21:57,640 --> 00:21:59,200 Speaker 13: safely put underground. 450 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 9: To worry about the concept that is out there is 451 00:22:03,560 --> 00:22:07,240 Speaker 9: that the largest bunker in North America was built underneath 452 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:10,199 Speaker 9: the Denver International Airport. I guess my first question to 453 00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:11,680 Speaker 9: you is is that feasible? 454 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:11,960 Speaker 1: Oh? 455 00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:15,399 Speaker 13: Yeah, absolutely, you're talking are you asking without people really 456 00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 13: knowing about it? 457 00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:17,960 Speaker 1: Well, that's part two of the question. 458 00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:20,879 Speaker 13: Broad open daylight right in front of them, you know, 459 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:23,920 Speaker 13: especially at an airport where or none of us can 460 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:26,359 Speaker 13: just go drive and roam around. Even the employees that 461 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:28,080 Speaker 13: work there, they don't have free range to just go 462 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 13: roam around. So there's no better environment to do it 463 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:34,200 Speaker 13: right out in the open than an international airport. 464 00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:35,960 Speaker 1: I think it's very feasible. 465 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:37,200 Speaker 13: Do I know it exists? 466 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:37,320 Speaker 1: No? 467 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 13: I mean, you know, I saw the Jesse Ventura episode 468 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:42,240 Speaker 13: of some of the things that I saw in there 469 00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:43,640 Speaker 13: made sense to me in. 470 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:45,760 Speaker 9: Your opinion, Is there a good reason to build it 471 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:47,800 Speaker 9: under that airport instead of somewhere else? 472 00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 13: Thinking on a grand scale of things, the airport is 473 00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:55,480 Speaker 13: probably out going to guess twenty miles from the nearest 474 00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:59,720 Speaker 13: what would be foothill to the mountains. Typically government markers 475 00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:02,400 Speaker 13: are or deep inside of the earth, and one way 476 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:05,160 Speaker 13: to get deep inside the earth is into mountains. 477 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:07,760 Speaker 4: Maybe it's close enough that it's you. 478 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:10,679 Speaker 13: Know that everything under Denner Airport maybe could possibly just 479 00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:14,879 Speaker 13: be tunnels leading to other areas. Obviously, it's more costly 480 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 13: to go deep than it is horizontal. I mean, think 481 00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:20,959 Speaker 13: about that. You've got an airport, it's not too far 482 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:24,159 Speaker 13: from center from the United States, easily accessible from a 483 00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:27,879 Speaker 13: lot of major cities. You land right there and immediately 484 00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:30,640 Speaker 13: retreat underground to destination unknown. 485 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:33,560 Speaker 9: I guess the other part part of keeping it secret 486 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 9: is all the people that worked on the construction. But 487 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:40,080 Speaker 9: I suppose you don't necessarily know what you're digging down 488 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:41,120 Speaker 9: for what you're building. 489 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:44,040 Speaker 13: Well, I mean, let's just say that I've contracted you 490 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:47,320 Speaker 13: to dig a tunnel, and I'm going to tell you 491 00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 13: that this is for emergency response. It's going to sing 492 00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:52,520 Speaker 13: completely plausible to you, and you're going to do it, 493 00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:54,000 Speaker 13: and your guys are going to know what they're doing there, 494 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,360 Speaker 13: emergency response tunnels. Okay, Well, now here comes a guy 495 00:23:57,440 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 13: coming in for phase two. We're going to need you 496 00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:03,840 Speaker 13: to to do X, and it may not directly connect 497 00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:07,359 Speaker 13: to phase one. Then you bring in four, five, six, eight, ten. However, 498 00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:10,159 Speaker 13: many contractors. You's got maybe contractor three comes in and 499 00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:12,760 Speaker 13: ties these two points together, but because of his doors, 500 00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:15,120 Speaker 13: he doesn't know what he's tying together. I can tell him, 501 00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:17,680 Speaker 13: you know, that's this radio communication for the airport. This 502 00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:20,720 Speaker 13: is a emergency response tunnel. So you piece it together 503 00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:23,040 Speaker 13: and you piece it out, and not any one person 504 00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:25,800 Speaker 13: knows everything. 505 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:28,240 Speaker 3: So John, I know you've done some research on this. 506 00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:29,679 Speaker 3: Can you give us a little bit of an outline 507 00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:30,320 Speaker 3: of what you learned? 508 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:34,080 Speaker 9: Well, the government certainly is capable of doing this. They've 509 00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 9: done it before with NORAD in Cheyenne Mountain, which is 510 00:24:37,880 --> 00:24:41,359 Speaker 9: what only twenty miles from Denver Inton National Airport, that 511 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:45,080 Speaker 9: was built under two thousand feet of granite. It's five acres. 512 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:51,040 Speaker 9: There's fifteen three story buildings protected from earthquakes, nuclear weapons. 513 00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:54,480 Speaker 9: So compared to that in underground shelter ten feet below 514 00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:58,000 Speaker 9: an airport runway, that seems like pretty doable. There is 515 00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:01,200 Speaker 9: a place in the Czech Republic called the a Podium 516 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:03,840 Speaker 9: and from the air it looks just like an administration 517 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:07,240 Speaker 9: center and it was a secret facility in nineteen eighty four, 518 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:09,960 Speaker 9: at the height of the Cold War. It's carved deep 519 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:13,520 Speaker 9: in a Mountain and it's the largest residential doomsday shelter 520 00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:16,520 Speaker 9: in the world. How about the raven Rock Mountain Complex. 521 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:19,359 Speaker 9: Raven Rock is where Dick Cheney was taken on nine 522 00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:21,280 Speaker 9: to eleven when they needed to put them in a 523 00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:25,680 Speaker 9: secret facility. It's in Greenbrier, West Virginia. Apparently I went 524 00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:28,680 Speaker 9: to summer camp, probably spitting distance from there. No one 525 00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:31,639 Speaker 9: is aware of what it looks like what it is. 526 00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:35,440 Speaker 9: It's also only six miles away from Camp David. It's 527 00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:39,720 Speaker 9: basically a freestanding city in another hollowdown mountain location. 528 00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:42,800 Speaker 1: It can hold as many as five thousand people. Guys. 529 00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:44,320 Speaker 1: The irs also had to play. 530 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:48,200 Speaker 9: In the nineteen seventies in case there is a nuclear apocalypse. 531 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:50,000 Speaker 4: They still wanted to collect taxes. 532 00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 9: They figure they needed two billion dollars in cash to 533 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,479 Speaker 9: get them through eighteen months before they could start printing. 534 00:25:56,520 --> 00:25:59,720 Speaker 9: Presses up again to start printing new money, and oddly 535 00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:02,480 Speaker 9: was almost all two dollar bills because this was after 536 00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:06,200 Speaker 9: America reintroduced a two dollar bill and no one wanted them. 537 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:09,679 Speaker 9: The National Archives also had a plan for if there 538 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:10,760 Speaker 9: was a nuclear attack. 539 00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:12,520 Speaker 1: The attitude between saving. 540 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 9: The Declaration of Independence or the Constitution, which one. 541 00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:20,080 Speaker 1: Do you think they chose constitution. I would be the constitution. Nope, 542 00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:21,480 Speaker 1: declaration of independence. 543 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:24,399 Speaker 9: They could care less about the constitution, apparently like some 544 00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:26,359 Speaker 9: of our politicians today. 545 00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:32,760 Speaker 1: So John, in light of all this, what's your overall conclusion, Well, 546 00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:34,440 Speaker 1: it's certainly feasible. 547 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:37,840 Speaker 9: Obviously, the government can build anything, right if they put 548 00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:40,960 Speaker 9: their resources to it. Cut and cover is much cheaper 549 00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:43,840 Speaker 9: and easier than digging into the side of a mountain 550 00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:46,240 Speaker 9: or digging down. Cut and cover is how they built 551 00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:48,160 Speaker 9: most of the New York City subway, which is where 552 00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:51,640 Speaker 9: you just dig down from surface, go down, build your thing, 553 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:53,880 Speaker 9: put a roof on it, cover it with dirt, cover 554 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:56,119 Speaker 9: it with the road whatever. To me, it sounds like 555 00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:58,480 Speaker 9: a pretty economical way to do it. And if you're 556 00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:01,399 Speaker 9: building it near nor d and this airport is one 557 00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:04,000 Speaker 9: of the easiest places in the country for everyone to 558 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:07,320 Speaker 9: get to to fly into. It's an enormous airfield. If 559 00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:10,200 Speaker 9: you wanted to build this, this is certainly a pretty 560 00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:12,399 Speaker 9: good way to do it. So maybe the bigger question 561 00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:14,879 Speaker 9: is whether they would have built something at all, and 562 00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:16,360 Speaker 9: if they did, if we'd know about it. 563 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:17,240 Speaker 1: Good point. 564 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,240 Speaker 3: I remember I lived in Belgrade and Yugoslavia. I had 565 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:22,840 Speaker 3: this big, old, sort of odd looking house. But in 566 00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:25,239 Speaker 3: the basement there was a room whoever had built this 567 00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:27,400 Speaker 3: place that was already built there with this big, massive 568 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 3: bank vault door and this concrete room that had a 569 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:33,920 Speaker 3: tunnel that went out into the out back into the yards. 570 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:35,919 Speaker 3: You could come out in some great way on the 571 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:37,600 Speaker 3: other side of the yard. I never was able to 572 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:39,640 Speaker 3: use it, but the kids had a great fun plan, and. 573 00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:42,000 Speaker 1: I have to say I had one of those too, 574 00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:46,520 Speaker 1: doesn't everybody. When I lived in Berlin, we had housing 575 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:49,880 Speaker 1: that the US authorities had taken from the Nazis after 576 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:53,520 Speaker 1: World War Two. The Nazis had these houses because they 577 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:56,760 Speaker 1: had taken them from Jews and political prisoners and didn't 578 00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,720 Speaker 1: pay for them. And the house I lived in two 579 00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:02,199 Speaker 1: different two two different houses, both of them in the 580 00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:06,200 Speaker 1: basement hit these huge vault doors and rooms in there 581 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:09,080 Speaker 1: so when the Russians came through they could hide. I 582 00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:10,679 Speaker 1: wouldn't want to spend two weeks in there. 583 00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:13,400 Speaker 3: I'd say that, Well, thank you, John, that was interesting. 584 00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:15,080 Speaker 3: And we're going to take a break, and when we 585 00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:17,280 Speaker 3: come back, we're going to speak with our other producer, 586 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:18,440 Speaker 3: Adam Davidson. 587 00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:28,920 Speaker 1: Hey, and how's it going? 588 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:29,400 Speaker 4: Guys? 589 00:28:29,680 --> 00:28:31,840 Speaker 2: Whenever I try and make sense of these conspiracy theories, 590 00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 2: you know, one of my first questions is what's the 591 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:36,640 Speaker 2: problem they're trying to solve? And then we go into 592 00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:38,800 Speaker 2: the other questions, is this the best way to solve 593 00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:41,840 Speaker 2: the problem? I got to say, unlike most of the 594 00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:45,760 Speaker 2: conspiracy theories, there is a problem they're trying to solve. Right, 595 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:48,760 Speaker 2: we do have continuity of government plans. We do have 596 00:28:48,840 --> 00:28:51,360 Speaker 2: plans for what to do with the president, with Congress, 597 00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:56,640 Speaker 2: with senior bureaucratic, technocratic leaders in case of a nuclear war. 598 00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:58,680 Speaker 4: Or some other event. Right, that does exist. 599 00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 1: From what I understand, And a lot of these conspiracy 600 00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 1: theories come from people seeing things, mysterious things, odd things 601 00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:11,479 Speaker 1: at the airport and then extrapolating those into what the 602 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:16,000 Speaker 1: theories are. So, for example, there's the famous horse out 603 00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:18,360 Speaker 1: in front of it. People see this and they think 604 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:21,560 Speaker 1: it can't just be a blue horse with a red eye. 605 00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:25,600 Speaker 1: There needs to be a deeper explanation for this, And 606 00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:28,960 Speaker 1: it seems what happens is these are a set of 607 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:33,920 Speaker 1: a set of observations looking for a problem to solve. 608 00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 2: I see, so that whole idea, which does come up 609 00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,520 Speaker 2: in a bunch of these conspiracy theories that there is 610 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:44,480 Speaker 2: a huge effort, like a massive effort to keep it secret, 611 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:47,720 Speaker 2: and then a bunch of ways they decided to hint 612 00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:48,720 Speaker 2: that this is happening. 613 00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:53,480 Speaker 1: So if you go, if there is this huge secret program, 614 00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:56,880 Speaker 1: why would you give hints that there is this huge 615 00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 1: secret program if the whole point is to be secret. Now, 616 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,000 Speaker 1: speaking for the agency, we wouldn't do that, but we 617 00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:07,160 Speaker 1: do know that the Russians do do that. So the 618 00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:12,200 Speaker 1: fact that Russian oligarchs tend to fall off of balconies 619 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,840 Speaker 1: is sort of their death of choice. You know, while 620 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:19,040 Speaker 1: it can't be proven, that is a tell that that 621 00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:22,280 Speaker 1: it was an execution, or the fact that the Russians 622 00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:25,600 Speaker 1: tend to poison people with things like with exotic poisons 623 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:30,800 Speaker 1: like polonium, or that only a state would likely have that, right, Yeah, 624 00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:33,640 Speaker 1: and that is a tell. And yeah, there's a wink 625 00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:35,600 Speaker 1: at a nod at that. Right. 626 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:38,520 Speaker 2: That's interesting because they because you want to both you 627 00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:39,880 Speaker 2: want to do a bunch of things, right, you want 628 00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:42,840 Speaker 2: to kill somebody. I guess if you're assassinating, you kind 629 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,000 Speaker 2: of want them to know, and well, you want other 630 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:47,360 Speaker 2: people to know you did it, but you want to 631 00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:49,680 Speaker 2: be able to plausibly deny that you did it. So 632 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 2: it's a little bit of a dance, right, yeah, right, 633 00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:54,800 Speaker 2: Because if the whole point is you want a secret 634 00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:59,480 Speaker 2: place where you like, you could imagine a situation where 635 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:03,560 Speaker 2: the US got wanted China or Russia to think we 636 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:06,840 Speaker 2: have a place so that they bomb that place instead 637 00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:09,800 Speaker 2: of the real place. I remember someone telling me I 638 00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:12,400 Speaker 2: have no idea if this is true that Bruce Springsteen 639 00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 2: has two houses in the town he lives in. One 640 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:16,760 Speaker 2: is his actual house and the other is the house 641 00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:19,240 Speaker 2: everyone thinks is his house, so that he doesn't have 642 00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:20,040 Speaker 2: to deal with everybody. 643 00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:22,640 Speaker 3: It's like when the president flies in the helicopter into 644 00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:25,200 Speaker 3: the White House. There's always several helicopters, so you don't 645 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:25,720 Speaker 3: know which one. 646 00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:27,800 Speaker 2: So you don't know which one, all right. Another thing 647 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:32,040 Speaker 2: that pops in my head. This is from reading spy 648 00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:34,360 Speaker 2: novels and watching spy movies, most of which are. 649 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:36,600 Speaker 4: Completely accurate from what I understand. 650 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:40,720 Speaker 2: There is the whole thing of dead drops and using 651 00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:44,840 Speaker 2: chalk to mark a thing, or putting a flower pot 652 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:47,240 Speaker 2: in your window or whatever to say, hey, we're is 653 00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:48,000 Speaker 2: that a real thing? 654 00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:49,280 Speaker 4: Or is that just a movie thing. 655 00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:51,600 Speaker 3: That's a real thing. I spend a lot of time 656 00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:54,239 Speaker 3: doing that in places like Russia where under surveillance all 657 00:31:54,280 --> 00:31:56,760 Speaker 3: the time, and so if you're being followed and watched 658 00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,480 Speaker 3: by the other side, you have to have subtle signals 659 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:02,240 Speaker 3: to your sources that you're ready to meet, or that 660 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:04,160 Speaker 3: a package has been put down for them to pick 661 00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:07,160 Speaker 3: up at a prearrange location, and that kind of stuff. 662 00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:11,360 Speaker 3: So chalk mark, there's any variety of things that could 663 00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:13,960 Speaker 3: serve as a signal. It could be an electronic signal, 664 00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:15,760 Speaker 3: it could be it could even be a smell, or 665 00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:18,720 Speaker 3: it could be aquarium gravel dropped on the grounds, the 666 00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:21,360 Speaker 3: colored rocks, or it could be a mark of some side. 667 00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:23,120 Speaker 3: Or like you said that you can put out your 668 00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:25,480 Speaker 3: put out your laundry on a certain day. You know, 669 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:27,280 Speaker 3: certain colors could mean something. 670 00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:30,560 Speaker 1: Right, something that's seen but isn't discerned. Right, You don't 671 00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:33,680 Speaker 1: know what it, but there is, Adam, you touch on, 672 00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:36,840 Speaker 1: you touch on something else when you talked about when 673 00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:42,000 Speaker 1: we talk about underground caves and labyrinths, there's something basic 674 00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 1: inside of the human condition that caves and labyrinths and 675 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:52,320 Speaker 1: you know are are inherently mysterious, and we're always want 676 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:54,600 Speaker 1: to know. I think, you know, as a species, we've 677 00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:56,120 Speaker 1: always want to know what goes on in there. 678 00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 2: Now, did you when you were in Baghdad? Did either 679 00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:01,600 Speaker 2: of you ever go to the Saddam tunnels under the palace? 680 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,680 Speaker 4: I did. It was pretty crazy. This was right as 681 00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:07,120 Speaker 4: the US was occupying. 682 00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:12,400 Speaker 2: And the way I got soldiers to like me and 683 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:14,880 Speaker 2: tell me stuff and give me MRIs because it wasn't 684 00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:17,720 Speaker 2: easy to find food was I had a sad phone 685 00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:19,840 Speaker 2: and they didn't, so I would let them call their family, 686 00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:21,960 Speaker 2: and you know, and a lot of them hadn't talked 687 00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:24,480 Speaker 2: to the family since the war. And I was standing 688 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:26,960 Speaker 2: with a bunch of guys at one of the palaces 689 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:29,800 Speaker 2: and after I let them use the phone, and they 690 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:33,240 Speaker 2: were kind of having some nice like wow, we all 691 00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:34,240 Speaker 2: just survived a war. 692 00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:34,960 Speaker 4: Kind of conversation. 693 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:38,000 Speaker 2: They were like, all right, come on, I'll show you. 694 00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:41,240 Speaker 2: And they took me down and it was I don't 695 00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:43,040 Speaker 2: think this was the main entrance. I don't think this 696 00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:44,720 Speaker 2: was the entrance to doam would have used. It was 697 00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:49,200 Speaker 2: a ladder down and then I mean it looked more like, 698 00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:54,320 Speaker 2: I don't know, an institutional, like a school, or a 699 00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:58,880 Speaker 2: hospital like a very like long corridors with lots of 700 00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:02,000 Speaker 2: rooms on either side. I have no idea if it 701 00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:04,280 Speaker 2: was deep enough to some of nuclear war anything like that, 702 00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:07,360 Speaker 2: but it was pretty striking and it was pretty like 703 00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:12,040 Speaker 2: as I recall, it easily could have fit many hundreds 704 00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:15,520 Speaker 2: of people, maybe many thousands of people. And I as 705 00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 2: soon do most I mean most governments must have something 706 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:20,040 Speaker 2: like that, right well. 707 00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:22,319 Speaker 3: One of the reason over the US government would want 708 00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:26,040 Speaker 3: to build things like this, in addition to the reasons 709 00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:29,200 Speaker 3: that John said also is our military has had to 710 00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:32,640 Speaker 3: attack bunkers in places like Iraq, in Iran and North Korea, 711 00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:35,279 Speaker 3: or be ready to do that because a lot of 712 00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:39,000 Speaker 3: places have built deep, deep places to do nuclear research 713 00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:41,600 Speaker 3: or to hide their military or what have you. And 714 00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:44,160 Speaker 3: we have to test our weaponry, our bombs, and we 715 00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:46,839 Speaker 3: have bombs that supposedly dig underground or that can blow 716 00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:48,320 Speaker 3: up these kind of places. 717 00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:51,319 Speaker 1: So there was one particular story I think I can 718 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:55,200 Speaker 1: tell it is so there was a Middle Eastern potentate 719 00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:58,480 Speaker 1: who was a bit crazy, and he had different places. 720 00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:03,239 Speaker 1: That does differ it down different palaces with underground bunkers 721 00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:06,160 Speaker 1: and secret tunnels in and we could never be certain 722 00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:09,480 Speaker 1: because he would travel around in like different convoys of 723 00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:12,799 Speaker 1: cars and like which one is he in? But a 724 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,760 Speaker 1: human source told us that he has a favorite milk 725 00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:19,000 Speaker 1: camel and it was white. And so if you could 726 00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:22,880 Speaker 1: find in the satellite where the camel was, you knew 727 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 1: the dance where he was. So this guy spent billions 728 00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:31,000 Speaker 1: of dollars building these multiple places where he could hide 729 00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:34,200 Speaker 1: in these different tunnel complexes. But as long as you 730 00:35:34,239 --> 00:35:37,080 Speaker 1: knew that he had his white milk camel with him, 731 00:35:37,600 --> 00:35:39,480 Speaker 1: it didn't really matter, right, And so I. 732 00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,160 Speaker 2: Do believe that one because I think we all know 733 00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:45,600 Speaker 2: once you find a milk camel that works, like you're. 734 00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:48,840 Speaker 1: Well, that's pretty obvious. 735 00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:51,440 Speaker 2: Have I told you guys the story about my car 736 00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:54,920 Speaker 2: and Baghdad was it cursed? Well, so I was driving 737 00:35:55,040 --> 00:36:00,680 Speaker 2: up from Kuwait to Baghdad and my employers at marketplace 738 00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:02,160 Speaker 2: it's a show about money. 739 00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:03,600 Speaker 4: They were very concerned about money. 740 00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:07,319 Speaker 2: Right before I left Kuwait, a bunch of reporters for 741 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:11,279 Speaker 2: Newsweek had their car destroyed during a battle in the 742 00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:15,640 Speaker 2: Iraq War. And the main takeaway my editors got from 743 00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:17,760 Speaker 2: this was not, Wow, we got to keep at them safe. 744 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:21,080 Speaker 2: It's really dangerous The main takeaway they got is oh 745 00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:25,840 Speaker 2: insurance doesn't cover acts of war, so if Adam rents 746 00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:28,839 Speaker 2: a thirty thousand dollars car and it gets damaged, we're 747 00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:31,560 Speaker 2: out the whole thirty thousand. So they asked me to 748 00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:34,560 Speaker 2: buy a used car so that we kind of cap 749 00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,600 Speaker 2: our loss at whatever I pay for the used car. 750 00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:41,520 Speaker 2: So I bought a Jeep for ten grand in Kuwait 751 00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:43,360 Speaker 2: and then drove it up to Baghdad. 752 00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:46,560 Speaker 4: And then, did you drive in Baghdad at all? It's crazy, 753 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:47,400 Speaker 4: It's like the worst. 754 00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:49,919 Speaker 1: I didn't drive. I was driven, but yes, yes. 755 00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:53,440 Speaker 2: So I hired a driver, thomer who used to say 756 00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:56,520 Speaker 2: Iraqi drivers are the best drivers in the world because 757 00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:58,960 Speaker 2: they have to drive on the roads with Iraqi drivers 758 00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:00,840 Speaker 2: who are the worst in the world. 759 00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:02,320 Speaker 4: So I then. 760 00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:06,440 Speaker 2: Sold this Jeep, this white Jeep, to this fixer for 761 00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:10,120 Speaker 2: the New York Times named Abu Karar. And Abu Karar 762 00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:12,960 Speaker 2: had a bunch of misfortunes in this car. His cousin 763 00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:16,839 Speaker 2: was arrested driving the car. Then there was some other thing, 764 00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,200 Speaker 2: and then the third thing was the car was in 765 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:22,880 Speaker 2: a damaged in a suicide bombing while another relative was 766 00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:25,840 Speaker 2: sitting in it, and the relative didn't die, but was injured. 767 00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:28,839 Speaker 2: And so he came to the conclusion that I had 768 00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:31,560 Speaker 2: cursed the car, or I had done something that got 769 00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:34,759 Speaker 2: the car cursed. So the car was now cursed, and 770 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:39,319 Speaker 2: the only solution was either to kill me or for 771 00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:43,399 Speaker 2: us to have what in Iraq is called an exorcism, 772 00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:45,879 Speaker 2: just to have no a settlement. And so we went 773 00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,680 Speaker 2: to meet with Abu Karar sat down with him for 774 00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:50,600 Speaker 2: a long time, and after he talked to them, they 775 00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:52,160 Speaker 2: came to me and said, you have to pay him 776 00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:55,600 Speaker 2: money and you have to like pledge to remove the curse. 777 00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:58,080 Speaker 2: It was only five hundred bucks, so that's how much 778 00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:00,400 Speaker 2: my life is worth. And he wrote out on a 779 00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:03,239 Speaker 2: piece of paper a little contract saying he was formally 780 00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:08,239 Speaker 2: forgiving my guilt for putting a curse on him. And 781 00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:10,680 Speaker 2: then I sent the contract in and put in the 782 00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:15,760 Speaker 2: expense report for my life, and no one in marketplace 783 00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:16,280 Speaker 2: said anything. 784 00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:17,560 Speaker 4: They just paid the expense. 785 00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:20,400 Speaker 1: So, Adam, I do have to tell you that I 786 00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:25,239 Speaker 1: may be guilty of using US taxpayer dollars to pay 787 00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:29,480 Speaker 1: a witchcraft fee for an agent. Actually I may have 788 00:38:29,600 --> 00:38:32,920 Speaker 1: done that several times, and I got it through our 789 00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:36,879 Speaker 1: finance people. But if they believe it, it's true. It's 790 00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:38,080 Speaker 1: a real motivator to that. 791 00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:41,279 Speaker 3: I had trouble getting reimbursement for peanut butter I gave 792 00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:43,399 Speaker 3: as a gift to a source, and you were doing 793 00:38:43,440 --> 00:38:44,719 Speaker 3: witchcraft and getting it paid for. 794 00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:49,840 Speaker 1: And it had to do it had to do with 795 00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:54,440 Speaker 1: a dead chicken and peeing on a doorstep. And then 796 00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:57,160 Speaker 1: a guy lost his toe in a lawnmower and he 797 00:38:57,320 --> 00:39:00,359 Speaker 1: was certain it was witchcraft and we had to help. 798 00:39:00,760 --> 00:39:01,640 Speaker 4: But that makes sense. 799 00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:05,360 Speaker 2: Can you say what country this was in or you 800 00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:06,080 Speaker 2: know it. 801 00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:09,279 Speaker 1: Was it was? It was in an African country, And 802 00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:11,600 Speaker 1: this was one of the things that helped cement the 803 00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:16,200 Speaker 1: deal to have an individual assist the CIA. It depends 804 00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:18,839 Speaker 1: on how you write it up, how you present it. 805 00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:22,799 Speaker 1: So I may have paid for a green elephant to 806 00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:27,880 Speaker 1: appear at a party. I did. It's a long story. 807 00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:34,040 Speaker 1: But but the green elephant also was responsible for saying 808 00:39:34,520 --> 00:39:37,440 Speaker 1: Russians showing up at a particular event, right, you know, 809 00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:39,239 Speaker 1: you don't say it was a green elephant, but you 810 00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:43,120 Speaker 1: do say, like, what was there for? It was a 811 00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:46,360 Speaker 1: gray elephant, but they did painted green. It was we 812 00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:50,799 Speaker 1: figured out I would allowed to say it was I'm 813 00:39:50,920 --> 00:39:52,640 Speaker 1: just saying well listen. 814 00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:54,920 Speaker 3: If you want more of these fun stories, join us 815 00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:55,480 Speaker 3: next time. 816 00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:58,200 Speaker 1: Mission Mission. 817 00:40:03,160 --> 00:40:06,600 Speaker 9: The Mission Implausible is produced by Adam Davidson, Jerry O'Shea, 818 00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:10,480 Speaker 9: John Cipher, and Jonathan Stern. The associate producers are Rachel 819 00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:13,560 Speaker 9: Harner and David Sollinger. This has been a production of 820 00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:16,720 Speaker 9: honorable mention and abominable pictures for iHeartMedia.