WEBVTT - Episode 6: “Spawn of Hell” 0:00:14.640 --> 0:00:17.440 I figure out what we're gonna talk about here, it's 0:00:17.480 --> 0:00:20.480 gonna take the interview. You've been County Sheriff's office times 0:00:20.520 --> 0:00:25.720 approximately nineteen minutes till twelve. President Ernest interviews myself, Detective 0:00:25.760 --> 0:00:28.680 Blankenship at the County Sheriff's office and Detective Arnorming with 0:00:28.720 --> 0:00:30.960 the television branch of the Sheriff's office. 0:00:31.560 --> 0:00:34.680 And we're talking to he's a white male. 0:00:35.000 --> 0:00:39.640 We served you what is called the prosecutor subpoena, and 0:00:40.440 --> 0:00:43.159 at that time you had agreed to come to the 0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:47.519 Sheriff's office and answer some questions and ask some if 0:00:47.520 --> 0:00:50.199 you want to. During that time, you also give us 0:00:50.200 --> 0:00:52.120 consent to search on your big Is that correct? 0:00:52.520 --> 0:00:54.480 You don't pick up a nunn? Is okay. 0:00:56.080 --> 0:00:58.560 During the summer of twenty twenty three, I spoke with 0:00:58.640 --> 0:01:02.640 a source about a b CSO suspect and Danas Didam's murder. 0:01:03.200 --> 0:01:06.360 The man I am calling Jack Lenny, who in my 0:01:06.480 --> 0:01:10.520 mind was the only suspect anyone needed to focus on 0:01:10.720 --> 0:01:14.640 and either eliminate or go after with everything I had. 0:01:15.640 --> 0:01:20.040 My source mentioned a recorded interview with BCSO detectives conducted 0:01:20.040 --> 0:01:23.360 with Lenny in the early nineteen nineties that I needed 0:01:23.400 --> 0:01:24.679 to hear and. 0:01:24.680 --> 0:01:27.400 Also your advised your rights. Did you understand your right? Yes? 0:01:28.720 --> 0:01:31.360 Was there any questions that you want to ask us me? 0:01:31.440 --> 0:01:33.160 Did you? Did you understand your rights? 0:01:34.240 --> 0:01:36.840 The more I had found out about Lenny, the more 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:40.919 he fit into being the prime suspect in danist Didam's murder, 0:01:41.800 --> 0:01:44.800 and as I spoke to investigators who worked on SHAWNA. 0:01:44.959 --> 0:01:48.760 Grayte Garber's murder, Lenny's name was very much at the 0:01:48.800 --> 0:01:54.720 forefront of that investigation as well. And Jack Lenny, well, 0:01:55.440 --> 0:01:56.160 he knew it. 0:01:57.160 --> 0:01:58.279 Did you understand your rights? 0:01:58.680 --> 0:02:04.520 I'm well, I need the lawyer is now I wonder 0:02:04.680 --> 0:02:05.640 what that stop? 0:02:05.760 --> 0:02:05.920 Right? 0:02:05.960 --> 0:02:06.000 Know? 0:02:06.840 --> 0:02:07.920 And that's for the lawyer. 0:02:08.720 --> 0:02:12.400 That's something you'll have to consider. What I want to 0:02:12.400 --> 0:02:14.960 go through is that you understood your rights? Why you're 0:02:14.960 --> 0:02:15.720 saying that now? 0:02:16.280 --> 0:02:19.440 Yes? If you don't want to answer any questions, you don't, 0:02:19.760 --> 0:02:24.520 that's totally. It's very baffled because other than know why 0:02:24.560 --> 0:02:25.560 I'm here. 0:02:26.040 --> 0:02:30.480 Proof, it's going to that oh see, okay, And if 0:02:30.560 --> 0:02:32.880 anytime you want to stop this interview and do what 0:02:32.919 --> 0:02:35.320 you think is right, like I said, you're not under 0:02:35.360 --> 0:02:38.240 wrist but anytime you want to stop, just say stop. 0:02:38.400 --> 0:02:42.480 You know, you're you're a free man, you're not under wrist, 0:02:42.600 --> 0:02:44.400 and you can go and come as you please. You 0:02:44.440 --> 0:02:46.760 want a glass of water, go get a coat, go 0:02:46.800 --> 0:02:53.919 to lunch. Okay, operate with Yes, I don't know why 0:02:53.919 --> 0:02:55.960 I'm here. Well, that's that's why we're going to get 0:02:56.000 --> 0:03:00.120 into it as we go on. And look, Well, I 0:03:00.240 --> 0:03:03.519 want to do is is ask you some background questions, 0:03:04.040 --> 0:03:08.120 and I want to go back, you know, say, four 0:03:09.080 --> 0:03:12.600 five years something like that, find out where all you've 0:03:12.639 --> 0:03:15.920 lived and what all you've done, and to remember that 0:03:16.000 --> 0:03:16.520 far back. 0:03:17.440 --> 0:03:21.000 The one consistent observation about this guy I had heard, 0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:25.440 beyond him being a serial sexual harasser or even worse, 0:03:26.240 --> 0:03:29.320 is that he's one cold son of a bitch who 0:03:29.440 --> 0:03:33.440 knows how to play the system. Facts that became increasingly 0:03:33.919 --> 0:03:37.000 more implicit throughout this old interview. 0:03:38.720 --> 0:03:41.600 You got a company car back in or company trailer? 0:03:43.720 --> 0:03:48.720 What was that? Hell, y'all? Pick up? What come? Was? 0:03:49.880 --> 0:03:50.000 All? 0:03:50.080 --> 0:03:51.720 Right? I think I remember it? 0:03:53.720 --> 0:03:54.800 You topper on it? 0:03:57.560 --> 0:04:00.280 If that was hard to hear on this time warrant ape, 0:04:00.560 --> 0:04:05.720 he says yes to the camper question. In fact, photos 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:10.560 I obtained of this vehicle matched the exact description of 0:04:10.600 --> 0:04:14.400 the vehicle. Parked behind Dana's car on the morning after 0:04:14.800 --> 0:04:16.040 she was reported missing. 0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:20.000 Want's you tell me about the cars you've own him 0:04:20.000 --> 0:04:23.560 since this Ranger you've got right now? 0:04:23.880 --> 0:04:30.040 How long he had it now? After? I told that, yeah, 0:04:30.320 --> 0:04:31.280 not too much after. 0:04:32.920 --> 0:04:37.120 It's hard to understand his answer because he mumbles, is that. 0:04:37.160 --> 0:04:41.400 Back in nineteen ninety when you wreck the torioder? How 0:04:41.520 --> 0:04:43.800 very couldn't David? That sounds about right. 0:04:44.560 --> 0:04:48.279 All this discussion about his vehicles was small talk for 0:04:48.520 --> 0:04:52.600 detectives who were just looking to gauge his level of 0:04:52.640 --> 0:04:59.080 participation and transparency. They had already pulled the history from 0:04:59.120 --> 0:05:03.040 the Motor Vehicle Department to see which makes and models 0:05:03.040 --> 0:05:05.159 of vehicles he owned and when? 0:05:06.080 --> 0:05:07.719 How long do you have that one with Toyota? 0:05:08.839 --> 0:05:13.479 I was thinking about, it's a lot of time would 0:05:13.520 --> 0:05:15.640 you have before that one? 0:05:16.760 --> 0:05:17.719 Soon? Truck? 0:05:18.560 --> 0:05:20.040 And uh so? 0:05:20.279 --> 0:05:25.479 Science Cameron on cameras on the shell or. 0:05:26.200 --> 0:05:28.480 The amount of time he took to answer what are 0:05:28.880 --> 0:05:33.839 essentially basic questions, spoke to how carefully he was thinking 0:05:34.200 --> 0:05:38.760 about what to say. At one point, he mentions an 0:05:38.839 --> 0:05:41.839 accident he was in back in the early eighties, which 0:05:41.880 --> 0:05:46.680 he claimed had caused a traumatic brain injury. Danny Varner, 0:05:47.200 --> 0:05:51.440 the detective you here most prominently in the recordings, pushed 0:05:51.520 --> 0:05:54.800 him on it, but he refused to give any specifics. 0:05:56.960 --> 0:06:00.560 They moved on to his employment history during the time 0:06:00.680 --> 0:06:04.880 of Dana's abduction and murder. He not only worked within 0:06:04.920 --> 0:06:08.359 a mile of where Dana's body was found, but witness 0:06:08.440 --> 0:06:13.760 statements support how he had been sexually harassing women at 0:06:13.800 --> 0:06:18.000 the nearby Ozark Beverage company, which, if you recall from 0:06:18.000 --> 0:06:21.560 an earlier episode, was just up the road from the 0:06:21.680 --> 0:06:23.039 Stidham crime scene. 0:06:24.080 --> 0:06:29.440 Yours nineties. Yes, y'all still married? Yes, bit separated? No, 0:06:30.200 --> 0:06:30.960 still lived together. 0:06:31.120 --> 0:06:36.160 Sometimes you can explain that to him, he said. 0:06:36.200 --> 0:06:39.520 They split their time between two different states, where he 0:06:39.680 --> 0:06:42.720 lived in Arkansas and the state where she lived. 0:06:43.400 --> 0:06:47.960 Get married previously to her first marriage? Right, I went 0:06:48.040 --> 0:06:50.680 to her married beforeios. 0:06:52.120 --> 0:06:54.800 They pressed him for his wife's first name and address, 0:06:55.520 --> 0:07:00.760 simple things. What does he do? He plays the stupid card, 0:07:00.920 --> 0:07:05.920 of course, then recalled that she likely lived somewhere in 0:07:06.000 --> 0:07:09.800 the Southwest. He had one daughter with her, he says, 0:07:10.520 --> 0:07:15.080 but hadn't seen her in many, many years. Guess why 0:07:17.440 --> 0:07:20.400 exactly he was getting weird with her too? 0:07:20.880 --> 0:07:23.840 Does she give him around here an hour? No? Appreciate. 0:07:26.000 --> 0:07:31.200 Then they casually snuck in additional questions about his vehicle 0:07:31.640 --> 0:07:35.000 and a timeline associated with Dana's murder. 0:07:36.040 --> 0:07:39.120 You lived over here at these harvests, Wright Camber. 0:07:39.760 --> 0:07:45.200 He nodded yes to the question. The point of this 0:07:45.640 --> 0:07:49.240 short interview was to rattle Lenny and lock down a 0:07:49.320 --> 0:07:53.320 few specifics. Beyond that, they wanted to get a feel 0:07:53.720 --> 0:07:57.200 for his overall demeanor. See how cocky he was. In 0:07:57.320 --> 0:08:01.520 other words, as an investigator conducted an initial interview like this, 0:08:02.000 --> 0:08:05.440 you allow the suspect to think he is in control. 0:08:07.520 --> 0:08:11.560 The BCSO walked away from that short interview with two 0:08:11.960 --> 0:08:16.080 major tasks ahead to find and speak to Lenny's ex 0:08:16.200 --> 0:08:21.200 wife and daughter and begin to draft, secure and execute 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:25.880 two search warrants, one for his house and of course 0:08:26.640 --> 0:08:35.760 a second for his vehicles. Previously on paper ghosts. 0:08:35.920 --> 0:08:38.920 If you've got a child and you send him and 0:08:39.040 --> 0:08:41.760 take care of the keys and all this, and send 0:08:41.840 --> 0:08:43.800 him to school and everything, you. 0:08:43.920 --> 0:08:47.840 Keep crack from your child. And the part that bothered 0:08:47.920 --> 0:08:52.160 me for years was so if somebody didn't report or missing, 0:08:53.360 --> 0:08:53.760 I want. 0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:54.360 You to talk to this man. 0:08:54.720 --> 0:08:54.920 Okay. 0:08:55.160 --> 0:08:57.080 I had no idea that he has something to offer, 0:08:57.160 --> 0:08:59.800 but he was here the night that he heard this. 0:09:00.679 --> 0:09:02.920 But I'm looking at my emails and it says Laurie 0:09:03.000 --> 0:09:07.320 me Grace, and she was nice. I didn't know her 0:09:07.440 --> 0:09:10.079 by Anna knew her, and she looked exactly like what 0:09:10.160 --> 0:09:12.360 I thought she would look like. And I just knew 0:09:12.400 --> 0:09:13.040 that this is funny. 0:09:13.160 --> 0:09:13.679 Who she is? 0:09:14.880 --> 0:09:17.960 My name is em William Phelps. I'm an investigative journalist 0:09:18.040 --> 0:09:21.199 and author of more than forty true crime books. This 0:09:21.480 --> 0:09:37.600 is season four of Paper Ghosts the Ozarks. It had 0:09:37.640 --> 0:09:41.400 taken thirty years to identify Grace Dowe and learn her 0:09:41.520 --> 0:09:49.560 name Shauna Garber, three decades. In that sense, technology had 0:09:49.640 --> 0:09:52.079 caught up to Shawna's case, the same as it had 0:09:52.200 --> 0:09:56.480 in so many cold cases we see today. But if 0:09:56.520 --> 0:10:02.040 Detective Laurie Howard, Sheriff Rob Evenson, and Detective Ronda Wise 0:10:02.480 --> 0:10:07.240 thought identifying Shawna was caused for celebration, the reality of 0:10:07.320 --> 0:10:13.520 the road ahead became abundantly clear right away, because as 0:10:13.600 --> 0:10:17.360 they began searching for information about her, it seemed as 0:10:17.480 --> 0:10:22.520 if well SHAWNA. Garber had never existed to begin with. 0:10:26.120 --> 0:10:28.800 Okay, so who is Shauna Garber? 0:10:29.720 --> 0:10:33.439 That's a good question, because she had a tough go 0:10:33.600 --> 0:10:36.520 as a little girl. She her mother had some issues 0:10:36.559 --> 0:10:39.360 and she was burned as a child to her mother's 0:10:40.120 --> 0:10:43.240 or her mother willfully earned her. So she went into 0:10:43.280 --> 0:10:45.600 foster care. But I think that she might have been 0:10:45.679 --> 0:10:47.800 bounced around for a little bit and even in the 0:10:47.880 --> 0:10:50.280 foster care system, and then of course eventually she aged out. 0:10:50.480 --> 0:10:54.599 So she lost her relationships with her bio family and 0:10:54.679 --> 0:10:57.880 also with her step family, and then she ultimately lost 0:10:57.920 --> 0:11:01.600 the relationships with her foster family. And so she goes 0:11:01.640 --> 0:11:02.320 out on the street. 0:11:02.559 --> 0:11:03.000 She does. 0:11:03.160 --> 0:11:06.719 Yeah, and she's eighteen at that time. Yeah, she's on 0:11:07.080 --> 0:11:10.040 her own now, I say, on her own. I think 0:11:10.120 --> 0:11:12.959 she had a boyfriend at the time. I don't know 0:11:13.120 --> 0:11:16.599 the nature of that relationship. I'm told it's difficult to 0:11:16.640 --> 0:11:18.880 find any type of information on him at this point. 0:11:19.240 --> 0:11:22.080 How does she end up in McDonald County. 0:11:22.960 --> 0:11:26.040 I can surmise how that happened. I can't tell you factually. 0:11:26.440 --> 0:11:28.360 But she was actually working in Joplin, Missouri, but she 0:11:28.440 --> 0:11:30.319 was living in Coffeevill, Kansas, and she was making that 0:11:30.400 --> 0:11:33.560 commute from Coffeevill, Kansas to Joplin, Missouri and back. 0:11:34.280 --> 0:11:37.079 And what kind of job was it that she was working, 0:11:38.200 --> 0:11:39.040 I don't know. 0:11:40.040 --> 0:11:45.160 I contacted Shawna's brother, Robert Ringwald, and started by asking 0:11:45.240 --> 0:11:46.280 him where they grew up. 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:50.160 We lived in several different places, that is mostly in 0:11:50.480 --> 0:11:55.880 eastern Kansas between Tapeka and Iole, Okay. 0:11:56.400 --> 0:11:59.000 And what was the house like the family like at 0:11:59.080 --> 0:12:00.439 the time as kids? 0:12:01.160 --> 0:12:05.800 At that time, it was our biological mother and my 0:12:06.160 --> 0:12:08.440 older brother, myself and Shauna. 0:12:09.120 --> 0:12:10.400 What was Shauna like then? 0:12:11.040 --> 0:12:13.800 She was singing happy quite a bit. 0:12:14.040 --> 0:12:15.920 You know what did she like to do? 0:12:17.000 --> 0:12:17.240 Play? 0:12:18.600 --> 0:12:23.360 I don't don't remember. You know, an awful lot. We 0:12:23.600 --> 0:12:26.560 used to play in the yard together and stuff. 0:12:27.000 --> 0:12:33.960 So you and Shauna were taken away from your mom. Yes, 0:12:34.960 --> 0:12:37.000 tell me a little bit about that. So how old 0:12:37.040 --> 0:12:37.280 were you? 0:12:38.360 --> 0:12:38.520 Uh? 0:12:38.960 --> 0:12:39.240 Six? 0:12:40.320 --> 0:12:42.280 And she would have been four. 0:12:43.480 --> 0:12:46.000 This was about the same time as you heard in 0:12:46.080 --> 0:12:50.640 the last episode that Shawna's mother horribly disfigured her own 0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:55.000 little girl. It's hard to talk about this sort of abuse, 0:12:55.640 --> 0:12:59.800 but it's what Shauna and her family went through. Her 0:13:00.080 --> 0:13:03.599 mother poured lighter fluid on her, lit a match and 0:13:03.720 --> 0:13:07.120 set the girl on fire. While she would never be 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:11.760 the same, she was removed from the situation. It was 0:13:11.800 --> 0:13:15.120 also the moment in Shauna's life when she became part 0:13:15.160 --> 0:13:19.040 of the revolving door of the foster care system. So 0:13:19.200 --> 0:13:21.000 did you stay in contact with her? 0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:25.839 No, we weren't allowed to. I wasn't allowed to. She 0:13:26.200 --> 0:13:32.120 was removed from several foster homes because our mother would 0:13:32.200 --> 0:13:36.440 interfere with everything. I mean to the point she even 0:13:36.600 --> 0:13:39.839 threatened to kill one foster family's kids. 0:13:40.640 --> 0:13:40.880 Wow. 0:13:41.880 --> 0:13:42.800 Yeah, she was evil. 0:13:43.600 --> 0:13:46.240 And so as time goes on, do you ever see 0:13:46.320 --> 0:13:47.120 Shauna again? 0:13:48.280 --> 0:13:54.320 I saw our birthday after we were taken. We were 0:13:54.400 --> 0:13:59.160 taken to a SRS office or something like that and 0:13:59.559 --> 0:14:05.440 celebrate our birthdays. And then saw her one time after 0:14:05.600 --> 0:14:11.120 that in court when they severed our mother's parental rights. 0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:13.240 And I never saw her again. 0:14:13.880 --> 0:14:16.280 And how come they severed the parental rights. 0:14:17.120 --> 0:14:22.320 Because our mother was an evil, vindictive spawn of health. 0:14:23.400 --> 0:14:25.280 And then what did you hear about her as the 0:14:25.400 --> 0:14:26.040 years go on? 0:14:27.800 --> 0:14:28.560 Not very much. 0:14:29.640 --> 0:14:35.000 We were trying to keep everything about her a secret 0:14:35.160 --> 0:14:39.520 from everybody so that our biological mother wouldn't find her. 0:14:40.520 --> 0:14:40.920 I see. 0:14:41.840 --> 0:14:44.920 And so time moves on. You grow into an adult, 0:14:45.360 --> 0:14:48.560 and I guess you sent some letters to Shanna. Can 0:14:48.600 --> 0:14:49.400 you tell me about that? 0:14:50.480 --> 0:14:54.360 Yeah? I wrote two letters and I gave them to 0:14:54.520 --> 0:14:59.680 the social worker. One was for them to give to her. 0:14:59.680 --> 0:15:03.200 Writ way couldn't get anything but my first name in 0:15:03.360 --> 0:15:07.840 it and nothing other than that, you know, just tell 0:15:07.880 --> 0:15:11.720 her that you know, I was out here and I was, 0:15:12.560 --> 0:15:16.240 you know, looking forward to meeting her. And then the 0:15:16.880 --> 0:15:19.320 second one was formed to give to her after she 0:15:19.440 --> 0:15:23.760 turned eighteen and had my name, you know, my full name, 0:15:23.840 --> 0:15:27.360 my contact information, you know, how she could get a 0:15:27.400 --> 0:15:30.000 hold of me, you know, letting her know that if 0:15:30.040 --> 0:15:33.160 she wanted to meet me, that I was here and 0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:34.160 wanted to see her. 0:15:34.920 --> 0:15:39.440 And you were confident that the social worker would forward 0:15:39.520 --> 0:15:44.200 those letters to Shawna. Right, so I was. And then 0:15:44.280 --> 0:15:44.920 what happened? 0:15:45.280 --> 0:15:48.200 They were put in a drawer somewhere and left, never 0:15:48.320 --> 0:15:48.880 given to her. 0:15:49.720 --> 0:15:52.600 It was as if a series of tragic events beginning 0:15:52.680 --> 0:15:56.720 almost on the day she was born, culminated in Shawna's murder. 0:15:57.840 --> 0:16:02.720 Imagine the frustration, horror, and emotional trauma Rob felt when 0:16:02.760 --> 0:16:06.560 he discovered that those letters never made it to Shawna, 0:16:07.040 --> 0:16:13.280 all because some incompetent, lazy social worker forgot or just 0:16:13.560 --> 0:16:18.680 chose not to forward them. Which leads me to wonder 0:16:19.240 --> 0:16:22.560 if Shauna had gotten those letters, if she had known 0:16:22.680 --> 0:16:26.240 there was someone out there who cared for her, loved her, 0:16:26.560 --> 0:16:30.720 and wanted a relationship with her. Would I be talking 0:16:30.800 --> 0:16:48.880 about her now as a murder victim. I've heard it 0:16:49.000 --> 0:16:53.080 said that tragedy and life are inseparable. I think maybe 0:16:53.360 --> 0:16:59.200 inevitable is a better word. We can't avoid pain, yet 0:16:59.760 --> 0:17:03.160 we do put policies and programs in place and the 0:17:03.280 --> 0:17:07.760 hope that preventable tragedies stemming from the ugliest side of 0:17:07.840 --> 0:17:12.560 our humanity are avoided. But even those policies and programs 0:17:12.840 --> 0:17:18.280 can sometimes fail us. As I continued talking to Detective 0:17:18.320 --> 0:17:22.399 Lorie Howard, the idea that Shanna Garber got swallowed up 0:17:22.640 --> 0:17:26.840 by the system, the same system that contributed in some 0:17:27.080 --> 0:17:32.760 ways to her death, hovered over our conversation, which makes 0:17:32.840 --> 0:17:37.000 investigating her murder that much more difficult from both an 0:17:37.040 --> 0:17:40.159 emotional and practical standpoint. 0:17:40.800 --> 0:17:43.520 It's hard to do victimology. It's hard to find people 0:17:43.560 --> 0:17:45.480 who knew her right correct. 0:17:45.359 --> 0:17:48.359 And even more so if you are a child, which 0:17:48.400 --> 0:17:50.720 I now have hindsight, but if you're a childhood's growing 0:17:50.760 --> 0:17:54.560 up in the foster care system because she's not reported missing, 0:17:54.840 --> 0:17:57.280 so you can't go through a database of missing people 0:17:57.359 --> 0:18:01.960 in your area, or even missing people in a four 0:18:02.080 --> 0:18:06.359 state area because she's not there now. Later I learned 0:18:06.720 --> 0:18:11.359 that supposedly she had been reported missing by the boyfriend 0:18:11.600 --> 0:18:13.240 in Joblin, Missouri, but there's no. 0:18:13.320 --> 0:18:16.959 Record of it. I wondered if that elusive boyfriend had 0:18:17.000 --> 0:18:19.600 ever been considered a suspect in her murder. 0:18:20.720 --> 0:18:23.800 I think you have to always you kind of work 0:18:23.880 --> 0:18:25.960 from the victim out and the people that are closest 0:18:25.960 --> 0:18:29.160 to them, And certainly the boyfriend is where a paramour 0:18:29.320 --> 0:18:31.040 of any sort it would be where you would start. 0:18:31.760 --> 0:18:35.879 But I don't know that that could really easily or 0:18:35.960 --> 0:18:40.200 readily be developed because the boyfriend, again is we took off, 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:42.359 he took off, and he's not there, and we're not 0:18:42.480 --> 0:18:44.119 sure where he is or even if he's alive. 0:18:45.080 --> 0:18:49.680 So as an unsolved murder, this is a very difficult case, 0:18:49.840 --> 0:18:50.720 right it is. 0:18:50.960 --> 0:18:54.840 It's extremely difficult, but it's not impossible. None of them 0:18:54.880 --> 0:18:57.840 were impossible. It was impossible, we'd probably stop trying. But 0:18:58.880 --> 0:19:01.440 this can be solved, and it will be. It's just 0:19:01.520 --> 0:19:02.960 a matter of keep plugging away. 0:19:03.040 --> 0:19:06.960 I mean, we started with nothing, and now we know 0:19:07.200 --> 0:19:12.040 who she is, so that's probably ninety percent of it is. 0:19:12.160 --> 0:19:12.879 Knowing who she is. 0:19:14.200 --> 0:19:17.560 We will continue to put things back to the lab 0:19:18.040 --> 0:19:21.639 and retest and as new technology comes along. 0:19:22.200 --> 0:19:25.399 Now, was this case looked at as possibly tied to 0:19:25.560 --> 0:19:26.960 data Stidham's case. 0:19:27.200 --> 0:19:32.959 Absolutely, And the reason for that is because they are 0:19:33.160 --> 0:19:38.840 similar in appearance, but they are also similar geographically, and 0:19:39.520 --> 0:19:43.840 the timeline is really close. You're looking at that eighty 0:19:43.960 --> 0:19:47.320 nine to ninety in years. So when you begin to 0:19:47.400 --> 0:19:51.400 put people together, you look, okay, geographically, how do they look? 0:19:51.440 --> 0:19:54.199 Are they similar in nature? Do they have anything in common? 0:19:54.920 --> 0:19:59.359 And then your timeline and the way they're found and 0:19:59.400 --> 0:20:04.760 the way they're fan Absolutely, now Dana, and again Dana 0:20:04.920 --> 0:20:07.000 was tied, not not to this degree, but she was 0:20:07.040 --> 0:20:10.080 certainly bound. She had the same colored hair, which is 0:20:10.160 --> 0:20:14.040 kind of a dark auburn hair. There's a group of 0:20:14.119 --> 0:20:18.600 women in this area that are that have been found 0:20:19.840 --> 0:20:21.520 that are similar in their appearance. 0:20:22.440 --> 0:20:25.800 How do you even begin to solve a murder? Better yet, too, 0:20:26.160 --> 0:20:28.639 if one is connected to the other when you know 0:20:28.840 --> 0:20:33.840 so very little about your victim. This was a problem 0:20:34.000 --> 0:20:38.600 for the McDonald County Sheriff's Office and its ability to 0:20:38.680 --> 0:20:42.960 begin building a profile of Shawna's killer if they have 0:20:43.080 --> 0:20:45.920 no idea about Shawna's movements near the time of her death, 0:20:46.280 --> 0:20:50.400 it becomes almost impossible to nail down not only those 0:20:50.440 --> 0:20:53.479 who might have known her, but the events leading up 0:20:53.600 --> 0:20:57.760 to her death. Hair Sheriff Rob Evenson. 0:20:58.119 --> 0:21:01.840 Remember, you're going back to nineteen eighty nine, nineteen ninety 0:21:02.160 --> 0:21:06.280 and there's not We have not been able to find 0:21:06.600 --> 0:21:11.119 those electronic those records of that. So when after she 0:21:11.320 --> 0:21:16.000 ages out of the foster system at age eighteen, there's 0:21:16.359 --> 0:21:18.480 not a whole lot that we've been able to find. 0:21:18.680 --> 0:21:20.880 She didn't have a lot of presence that left any 0:21:20.960 --> 0:21:23.480 kind of tangible record that we've been able to find. 0:21:23.680 --> 0:21:28.400 Like friends, correct, yes, friends, We were able to identify 0:21:29.320 --> 0:21:32.320 a former boyfriend, but the best information we have is 0:21:32.400 --> 0:21:36.000 that those two had broken up quite some time before 0:21:36.160 --> 0:21:38.879 she would have ended up here in McDonald County. 0:21:39.240 --> 0:21:42.320 Was there any indication that she was into drugs or 0:21:42.560 --> 0:21:43.840 that scene or anything like that. 0:21:43.880 --> 0:21:46.720 We believe so, But if you ask us how certain 0:21:46.800 --> 0:21:48.840 we are, I couldn't tell you that we were one 0:21:48.920 --> 0:21:51.000 hundred percent, But yes, the likelihood is there. 0:21:51.080 --> 0:21:55.400 Yet, did you begin to maybe think that her case 0:21:55.560 --> 0:21:57.720 was connected to some of the other cases in the 0:21:57.880 --> 0:21:59.159 area at all, because. 0:21:58.920 --> 0:22:01.760 There certainly was a lot of cases during that time. 0:22:03.640 --> 0:22:07.000 Yes, I mean, anytime you have an unsolved homiside, you 0:22:07.040 --> 0:22:10.639 always look for other connections to other similar cases. So 0:22:10.880 --> 0:22:13.000 of course that was one of the things. There were 0:22:13.160 --> 0:22:17.760 so many leads that were run down and followed. So yes, 0:22:17.960 --> 0:22:23.480 I mean, there are other unsolved cases in this area, 0:22:23.680 --> 0:22:26.600 so that is something that we always would look into. 0:22:26.760 --> 0:22:29.440 But I don't know that we had any direct evidence 0:22:29.480 --> 0:22:33.760 that would connect her to anybody else or any other case. 0:22:34.880 --> 0:22:37.800 I asked Detective Lorie Howard about a cause of death 0:22:38.480 --> 0:22:42.760 if they were ever able to find out. The speculation 0:22:42.960 --> 0:22:46.359 is strangulation based on all the bindings and cords and 0:22:46.520 --> 0:22:50.600 ropes found. Now you may wonder how law enforcement could 0:22:50.720 --> 0:22:55.240 possibly prove a skeletonized murder victim was strangled to death. 0:22:55.680 --> 0:23:00.320 After all, a pathologist cannot inspect bruising around the neck area, 0:23:00.640 --> 0:23:04.560 other soft tissue, or look for signs of particual hemorrhage, 0:23:04.800 --> 0:23:08.840 burst blood vessels in the eyes. But there's a delicate 0:23:08.960 --> 0:23:13.040 bone called the hyoid in our throats that, when compressed 0:23:13.400 --> 0:23:22.000 during strangulation, usually snaps. So was Shawna's hyoid bone actually broken? 0:23:23.119 --> 0:23:23.159 No? 0:23:23.800 --> 0:23:27.240 The answer to that is no, we believe very strongly 0:23:27.280 --> 0:23:30.960 that she was strangled, just because she was badly decomposed. 0:23:31.320 --> 0:23:33.879 Her body was strewn across the lawn from animals and 0:23:34.040 --> 0:23:40.000 the natural process of decomposition. But we believe that she 0:23:40.200 --> 0:23:43.359 wasn't stabbed because normally and that type of thing, if 0:23:43.400 --> 0:23:44.960 you hit a bone, you might have a chip, and 0:23:45.080 --> 0:23:49.440 that wasn't necessarily there. The skeleton was intact, so you're 0:23:49.480 --> 0:23:52.240 not looking at blunt force trauma. We didn't see anything 0:23:52.359 --> 0:23:56.280 like that. Really, there was nothing to tell us that 0:23:56.359 --> 0:24:00.919 there was any sort of trauma to person eletal remains. 0:24:01.240 --> 0:24:03.200 So we believe she was more than likely strangled, and 0:24:03.320 --> 0:24:05.119 I think that the bindings would support that. 0:24:06.080 --> 0:24:09.639 So the how she's found is very important. 0:24:09.320 --> 0:24:11.920 Right, it is, absolutely It tells you a great deal. 0:24:12.240 --> 0:24:13.000 Tell me about that. 0:24:13.640 --> 0:24:19.160 The crime scene essentially is your first picture of what happened, 0:24:19.480 --> 0:24:22.440 and so you can determine a lot obviously from that. 0:24:22.720 --> 0:24:26.399 Was there, what first trauma, how was she left, was 0:24:26.520 --> 0:24:30.440 she clothed, what clothing was missing? How long has she 0:24:30.640 --> 0:24:35.200 been there? And because she was bound in the manner 0:24:35.240 --> 0:24:38.159 that she was bound and how was she bound, she 0:24:38.359 --> 0:24:41.920 was essentially what we call hoptide, which is your hands, 0:24:42.040 --> 0:24:45.239 your wrists are bound behind your back and that then 0:24:45.440 --> 0:24:48.879 is bound to your feet, and in her case it 0:24:49.000 --> 0:24:52.560 was bound to a shoelace and only one shoelace, so 0:24:52.720 --> 0:24:54.440 she had massive amounts of bindings. 0:24:56.720 --> 0:25:00.600 What about the towel wrapped around Shawna's head with kowak cable, 0:25:01.280 --> 0:25:02.000 what did it mean? 0:25:03.200 --> 0:25:06.600 Normally that would tell you that he wants to cover 0:25:07.440 --> 0:25:09.200 He either one didn't want to see the look on 0:25:09.320 --> 0:25:12.920