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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio Welcome back to the show.

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Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Nol. They call

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Speaker 1: me Ben. We are joined as always with our super

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Speaker 1: producer Paul Mission controlled decond. Most importantly, you are you.

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Speaker 1: You are here, and that makes this stuff they don't

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Speaker 1: want you to know. Let's begin today's episode, which gets

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Speaker 1: very strange, with a question, fellow listeners, what's the most

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Speaker 1: vivid dream you've ever experienced? You know, for many people,

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Speaker 1: this answer will come to your mind immediately in a

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Speaker 1: flash of images, sensations, or emotion that are often almost

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Speaker 1: indistinguishable from experiences in the waking world. Before the dawn

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Speaker 1: of recorded history, these things called dreams haunted us, They inspired, terrified,

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Speaker 1: and guided our ancestors. And dreams, you know, everyone knows

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Speaker 1: they're often central plot points and ancient myths. And who hasn't,

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Speaker 1: of course, heard the more modern tales of the visionary

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Speaker 1: scientists and inventor and artist, a writer or someone receiving

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Speaker 1: inspiration and suddenly solving a problem in a dream and

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Speaker 1: having a real solution to a problem when they wake up.

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Speaker 1: Long story short, dreams have been pivotal throughout the span

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Speaker 1: of human existence, and we still don't understand them. We

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Speaker 1: still don't completely get what's happening with dreams. We know

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Speaker 1: they tell us about the past, we know they re

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Speaker 1: contextualize the present, but could they also tell us about

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Speaker 1: the future? Here are the facts, you know. I don't

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Speaker 1: want to lose any time here, but I have a

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Speaker 1: reoccurring dream when I'm very stressed out where I am

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Speaker 1: physically jumping across asteroids that are flowing at me, or

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Speaker 1: like moving towards me. Do you guys have any like

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Speaker 1: stressed dreams that you've ever had like that? Or maybe

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Speaker 1: asitive dude, I have this recurring dream where I'm like

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Speaker 1: I've made it, my band has made it, and we're

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Speaker 1: like playing before you know, the biggest crowd I've ever

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Speaker 1: seen in the entire history of playing music, and I

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Speaker 1: don't know any of the songs. I'm like dreadfully underprepared,

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Speaker 1: or maybe like I'm in the arcade fire cool and

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Speaker 1: I just just freeze. I don't know any of the songs.

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Speaker 1: I have that dream a lot. What does it mean, guys?

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Speaker 1: What does it mean? Well, hopefully today we're gonna find out,

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Speaker 1: because we do know what dreams are. At least we

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Speaker 1: have a pretty good understanding of what they are. A

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Speaker 1: fancy way to phrase it would be something like, dreams

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Speaker 1: are patterns of information, specifically something that we have taken

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Speaker 1: in as sensory information, and the dream occurs when the

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Speaker 1: brain is in a resting state and somehow using this

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Speaker 1: information and making essentially a story or at least patterns

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Speaker 1: from it. And if we want to be a little

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Speaker 1: more blunt about it, dreams are hallucinations. They take every

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Speaker 1: box for everything that's ever been described as a hallucination.

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Speaker 1: And we've talked about it in previous episodes, But if

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Speaker 1: you describe the process of dreaming or even just sleeping

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Speaker 1: to some life form that had never encountered it, it

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Speaker 1: sounds so bizarre. We've just all sort of accepted that

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Speaker 1: anywhere from four to eight hours out of every twenty

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Speaker 1: four hours, we will uh, we will pass out, our

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Speaker 1: bodies will be useless, will go into some weird other world,

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Speaker 1: and then we gain control of our body again, and

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Speaker 1: everybody acts like nothing happened. It's odd right, And every

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Speaker 1: once in a while we encounter shadow people that want

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Speaker 1: to thwart our plans of living. Those pesky shadow people

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Speaker 1: always trying to suffocate us in our sleep. That's no fun. Um.

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Speaker 1: But we're talking specifically today. But I don't know, Ben,

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Speaker 1: you have this really great uh analogy for dreams is

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Speaker 1: the idea of like your brain kind of as a

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Speaker 1: hard drives, sort of like sorting out the bits or

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Speaker 1: like defragging, like kind of cleaning out the cobwebs. I

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Speaker 1: guess of the day, and subconsciously maybe doing some internal

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Speaker 1: problem solving. Even if it's not like you wake up

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Speaker 1: with some kind of ah ha moment, it is somehow

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Speaker 1: doing some good for you, like in terms of you know,

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Speaker 1: maybe uncluttering your subconscious Let's say, is that about the

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Speaker 1: span of it, Ben? Yeah? Yeah. Before we jump to

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Speaker 1: you know, the kind of theories that we have about

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Speaker 1: dreams because we don't know what they are, let's bust

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Speaker 1: one myth really quick. We've all heard that dreams only

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Speaker 1: occurred arenas specific phase of sleep r e M. Great

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Speaker 1: band Uh. The phrase r e M stands for rapid

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Speaker 1: eye movement. It's like the fifth stage of sleep. That's

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Speaker 1: where the dreams are supposed to happen. However, we know

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Speaker 1: that multiple studies have shown maybe we dream mainly in

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Speaker 1: the r M phase, but we also dream in other phases.

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Speaker 1: We can't be the dream process cannot be quite as

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Speaker 1: easily categorized as we would like, and that's where the

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Speaker 1: theories come in. So one of those leading theories their

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Speaker 1: loads and loads of great research pieces on dreams. One

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Speaker 1: of those theories is just what you described, that dreams

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Speaker 1: are a part of memory processing, meaning that it helps

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Speaker 1: us consolidate things we've learned while also transferring our short

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Speaker 1: term memory to our long term memory storage. So yes,

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Speaker 1: I think the analogy holds that to me, it seems

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Speaker 1: like a good description is the brains defragging the hard drive.

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Speaker 1: But then again, is the brain the hard drive? What

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Speaker 1: what's doing the defragging? Is that the software? Is that

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Speaker 1: the consciousness? This this gets very strange, very quickly, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: it in that concept. It says, though, all of those

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Speaker 1: connections that your neurons have made, it's solidifying that right

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Speaker 1: if they're necessary, And it's almost like the brain itself

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Speaker 1: is trying to decide what's important. It's really weird. It's

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Speaker 1: weird to think about your brain uh in the in

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Speaker 1: its unconscious state doing one of the most important things

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Speaker 1: that you can imagine, figuring out what you actually learned

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Speaker 1: and what you should remember, or or how you actually

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Speaker 1: feel about things. Sometimes I mean, like, perhaps my recurring

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Speaker 1: dream about being unprepared is a signal or a symptom

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Speaker 1: of me feeling overwhelmed at certain times. I don't have

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Speaker 1: this dream all the time, but when I do have

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Speaker 1: the dream, I think it's a product of me maybe

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Speaker 1: feeling a little under water with work or a little

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Speaker 1: bit like I'm out of my depth or something, or

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Speaker 1: like I kind of am a little bit of drift

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Speaker 1: and maybe need a little bit of a course correction.

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Speaker 1: So they can be interesting when you have these over

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Speaker 1: and over, you're like, oh, maybe this is a signal

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Speaker 1: pointing towards something that's really a great observation, because another

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Speaker 1: thing it could be is really just a problem solving

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Speaker 1: activity that your brain goes through a way to go

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Speaker 1: through it is difficult, complicated things that you know are

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Speaker 1: more deeply psychological. Then then perhaps you appreciated in the

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Speaker 1: moment um and to get balanced back in a way

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Speaker 1: or two to maybe put things in the right perspective

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Speaker 1: for you. But at the end of the day, it's

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Speaker 1: all just chemicals, right Like, it's all just firing neurons

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Speaker 1: and you know, electrical impulses bouncing around. Yeah, but that's

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Speaker 1: like saying that music is only math, you know what

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Speaker 1: I mean. It's a massive perspective. I I think I

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Speaker 1: think that's an important theory to bring up as well. Uh.

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Speaker 1: The bit more, I wouldn't say reductionists, but the theory

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Speaker 1: that wants to remove the concept of consciousness from the

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Speaker 1: equation and says that dreams are simply the brain responding

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Speaker 1: to uh, an array of biochemical changes and electrical pulses

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Speaker 1: that impulses that fire as you are asleep, whatever you

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Speaker 1: might be. The dream then is seen as nothing more

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Speaker 1: than a side effect, right like Uh, like sunsets look pretty,

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Speaker 1: but that wasn't part of some grand plan. This argument says,

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Speaker 1: it's just a a a very small side effect of

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Speaker 1: gravity and orbit. So we have these theories and they

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Speaker 1: all The thing is that none of them, on the

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Speaker 1: outset seem just straight wrong, none of them seem demonstrably incorrect.

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Speaker 1: They just seem like the old adage of the mice

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Speaker 1: describing an elephant, right, you know, different micey, different parts

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Speaker 1: of the elephant. They think it's a bunch of different

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Speaker 1: objects instead of one large thing. We do, luckily know

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Speaker 1: on numerous levels what happens when we dream. Every dream

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Speaker 1: you have has some of the same guide post. We

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Speaker 1: tend to be the main characters of our own lives

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Speaker 1: and our dreams. Just as in the aching world, you

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Speaker 1: are in your dreams. Even when you feel like you're

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Speaker 1: watching something happen, You're in it. Things are happening, You're

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Speaker 1: taking actions. The environment, the reality of the dream is

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Speaker 1: responding to your actions, and in the universe of the dream,

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Speaker 1: those responses and those actions they make sense. This is

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Speaker 1: not really the case once you wake up and you think, wow,

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Speaker 1: my um. You know, like my great aunt has been

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Speaker 1: dead for years, she never played the oboe, and I

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Speaker 1: have never been to Portugal. But they're like, how come

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Speaker 1: when I eat a chocolate covered pretzel in the real world,

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Speaker 1: it's delicious treat, But in a dream, all my teeth

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Speaker 1: fall out and I'm naked in front of a high

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Speaker 1: school gym of my peers and they're all laughing at me.

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Speaker 1: Why are they laughing at me? Or like in the

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Speaker 1: far side. One of the one of the greatest modern

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Speaker 1: American comic strips, uh, the the recurrent fear of showing

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Speaker 1: up to a lecture without one's duck. That's a that's

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Speaker 1: a deep cut for folks. But but yeah, that it

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Speaker 1: is true. These things have an internal logic. And if

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Speaker 1: you practice dream journaling, which can be a tremendously useful

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Speaker 1: psychological tool, then what you'll notice when you try to

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Speaker 1: write out the plot points of your dreams is that

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Speaker 1: things change, especially scenery. I didn't I didn't talk about

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Speaker 1: any of my recurrent dreams because they're weird. They kind

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Speaker 1: of all occur in the same universe, and things that

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Speaker 1: happen in one affect things in the other. Um, it's

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Speaker 1: like cinematic dream universe. It's not as cool as it sounds. Man,

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Speaker 1: that's pretty cool. I don't know, it's not as cool

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Speaker 1: as it sounds. But but we all But the thing is,

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Speaker 1: it makes sense when you're in the moment, right, Like

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Speaker 1: of course, my teeth falling out, That is a tremendously

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Speaker 1: common uh dream trope, especially in the West. Maybe it's

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Speaker 1: maybe has something to do with dentists, maybe has something

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Speaker 1: to do with the write of passage we experience when

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Speaker 1: our baby teeth fall out. But yeah, yeah, so it's

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Speaker 1: kind of programmed into us. But when we think about it,

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Speaker 1: when we're awake, all of our thoughts have a kind

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Speaker 1: of familiar logic to them. Right, I did A because

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Speaker 1: I want B or I did see because someone is

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Speaker 1: going to do D later. And our brain, which is

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Speaker 1: hugely underrated in the in the sort of avengers of

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Speaker 1: our body. Our brain is always working through all this

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Speaker 1: internal external stimuli. And your brain, like your heart, uh,

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Speaker 1: once it starts going, it doesn't get a break. It's

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Speaker 1: not supposed to get a break until you die. If

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Speaker 1: your brain or your heart stop doing what they do,

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Speaker 1: getting down how they get down, then you are very

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Speaker 1: much in trouble. So when you're when you're asleep, your

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Speaker 1: brain is still active. The brain is like the great

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Speaker 1: white shark of the body. You know, if it stops

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Speaker 1: then it dies. Um. And that's because of a couple

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Speaker 1: of things. So that the brain is divided into segments.

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Speaker 1: As we know, we've got the limbic system in the

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Speaker 1: mid brain, which deals with emotion in both waking and

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Speaker 1: dreaming states. It's interesting there these these parts kind of

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Speaker 1: have shared responsibilities, and they do similar functions when you're

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Speaker 1: awake and when you're asleep, and that includes the amygdala,

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Speaker 1: which is particularly active when you're in a dream state. Right,

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Speaker 1: and then we've got the cortex. The cortex is what

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Speaker 1: if the cortex had a job, If your dreams were

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Speaker 1: of soulless corporation, and the cortex was an employee of

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Speaker 1: your dreams, then it would have the title content creator,

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Speaker 1: which is not not a not a favorite title of mine.

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Speaker 1: So the reason that's important is everything that your cortex does,

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Speaker 1: your cortex rights and directs uh your dreams right comes

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Speaker 1: up with the plotlines. Everything you feel, from floating in

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Speaker 1: a vast, unnowable ocean to flying to jumping from one

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Speaker 1: impossible across one impossible chasm to another. All the people

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Speaker 1: you meet, all the monsters that chase you, they all

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Speaker 1: come from your cortex. And the visual cortex right there

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Speaker 1: the back of your brain, if you're human, when you're

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Speaker 1: listening to this is especially active because we are such,

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Speaker 1: you know, visual creatures, kind of the way that dogs

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Speaker 1: that dogs are olfactory creatures. This made me wonder. I

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Speaker 1: don't have the science on it yet, but I wonder

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Speaker 1: if dogs mainly dream and smell. Well. It's interesting too

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Speaker 1: because I never really recall sounds from dreams, and and

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Speaker 1: I know that's that's a thing that happens. There's even

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Speaker 1: a story Paul McCartney says that he came up with

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Speaker 1: the melody to I Believe yesterday in a dream and

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Speaker 1: he woke up and he had this melody, and he said,

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Speaker 1: and being a musical dude, I don't think I've ever

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Speaker 1: dreamt of a melody. I think of it as a

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Speaker 1: very specifically in the realm of visual hallucinatory kind of state,

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Speaker 1: you know. So I think that's pretty special for Paul

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Speaker 1: to come out of a dream date with that melody.

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Speaker 1: Have you guys ever dreamt sounds or remembered sounds from

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Speaker 1: a dreamy happen at all? I have several highly talkative

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Speaker 1: monsters that inhabit my dreamscape. UM, very talkative and then

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Speaker 1: fascinating uh vocalizations. I highly recommend checking out one of

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Speaker 1: these if you get a chance, one of these mad brains.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, just hot back there and my, oh my

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Speaker 1: under lit Jim Bay look at that. Uh so, you

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Speaker 1: know it's fascinating that you're talking about that. The Cordex been.

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Speaker 1: I think it's You're absolutely right. The cortex is the

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Speaker 1: reason why we're almost It feels a lot of times

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Speaker 1: for me and maybe a lot of others that you're

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Speaker 1: kind of just a passenger in your dreams. Like you're moving,

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Speaker 1: you're going places, you're seeing things, things are changing, but

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Speaker 1: you just kind of accept it. You just kind of

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Speaker 1: go with it. You're just heading in that direction, unless,

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Speaker 1: of course, you've unlocked. You know, the ability to is

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Speaker 1: a dream, which is a whole other thing. But one

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Speaker 1: of the reasons that it's the dreams are like that

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Speaker 1: is because these parts of our brain, the lobes that

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Speaker 1: are talked about so frequently, kind of the logic systems. Uh,

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Speaker 1: those are the least active parts of your brain when

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Speaker 1: you are dreaming, which it really explains why you know,

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Speaker 1: things don't feel so strange until you wake up. And

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Speaker 1: maybe it's also one of the main reasons you don't

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Speaker 1: remember too much. She never played the obo. I've never

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Speaker 1: been to Portugal. Uh, and you know, and if I

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Speaker 1: don't write it down in twenty three minutes, I'll forget dude.

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Speaker 1: But that, yeah, that's it. That's right. That's another thing,

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Speaker 1: Like I've never been a dream journalier, and there's it

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Speaker 1: has to be my dream has to pack such a

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Speaker 1: wallet for me to remember it at all. Um. But

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Speaker 1: when it does, I do, and they stick with me.

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Speaker 1: I remember them for many years. But typically unless you

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Speaker 1: write it down super quick, you're still in that kind

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Speaker 1: of like waking dreaming between state and then you kind

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Speaker 1: of lose it. Right, Are you guys good at remembering dreams?

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Speaker 1: What would you say your odds are or like in

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Speaker 1: terms of like waking up and being able to recall

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Speaker 1: specifics from a dream. I keep a note on my

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Speaker 1: phone and it's always right by my bed, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: constantly doing that. What about you? Ben? Uh? I I

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Speaker 1: don't necessarily think it's a good thing, but yes, yeah,

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Speaker 1: pretty um I I do. Um. Well, it's no secret

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Speaker 1: longtime listeners. I don't like sleep. I resent it. I

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Speaker 1: think that science should already be at the point like where,

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Speaker 1: you know, if I can call someone in freaking Bhutan

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Speaker 1: and talk to them in real time with something you know,

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Speaker 1: the size of an open hand, then I shouldn't have

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Speaker 1: to I shouldn't have to sleep. We should have figured

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Speaker 1: some some way around it. Someone to space, we said,

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Speaker 1: people to space. But then Ben, if if you do

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Speaker 1: have to sleep because unfortunately our analog bodies require it

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Speaker 1: for some dang reason. Uh, why not at least record

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Speaker 1: as much as you possibly can. One day we're gonna

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Speaker 1: be able to plug in somehow and just get that

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Speaker 1: stuff like roll on quick time while I'm dreaming, and uh,

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Speaker 1: I can't wait for that, dude, right man, There's there's

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Speaker 1: one thing that to add with that. Um. You know,

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Speaker 1: I I spent a lot of time researching kind of

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Speaker 1: what we talked about with lucid dreams, which is probably

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Speaker 1: a story for another day. But I I end up

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Speaker 1: getting a lot of work done in dreams. It feels

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Speaker 1: like I'm doing a lot of work. And then I

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Speaker 1: wake up and I think, oh, I gotta write this

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Speaker 1: amazing story down. And then I write it down, go

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Speaker 1: get some coffee or something. I come back and I'm like, Wow,

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Speaker 1: the most amazing part of this story is that I

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Speaker 1: thought it was good and because my frontal lobes were

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Speaker 1: turned off, right, um, And I think we I think

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Speaker 1: we do that a lot to your point, and all

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Speaker 1: about how how we process in dreams. Um, it's unless

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Speaker 1: people have you know, PTSD or some sort of um

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Speaker 1: condition that gives them violent, nightmarish, recurrent horrific visions every

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Speaker 1: time they sleep. Most people would prefer dreams to a

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Speaker 1: dreamless sleep, you know. Otherwise it's really disconcerting to have

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Speaker 1: everything go dark at say four fifty three a m.

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Speaker 1: And then wake up at um, I don't know to

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Speaker 1: thirty seven PM. I just sort of hope nothing important happened. So,

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Speaker 1: I mean, we we probably won't really truly be able

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Speaker 1: to answer definitively like why do we dream? We've got

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Speaker 1: some good theories, but there are experts in mental health

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Speaker 1: that that do believe that it's an important part of

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Speaker 1: maintaining some semblance of sanity or like self awareness or

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Speaker 1: understanding of ourselves. Um. But there's you know, not like

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Speaker 1: a definitive like this is what dreams are for, um,

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Speaker 1: but for of from people. There for a lot of things.

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Speaker 1: And like like I said, if you're Paul McCartney, it

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Speaker 1: makes you write a song that's been covered by over

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Speaker 1: three thousand artists and probably one of the most recognizable

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Speaker 1: songs in the history of recorded music. That's just my

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Speaker 1: hot take on on yesterday. But it's a thing that

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Speaker 1: came from a dream. Um. So they certainly have value.

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Speaker 1: I mean, so many artists recreate images from their dreams.

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Speaker 1: And to your point, then, whether I think you're selling

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Speaker 1: yourself short with the quality of your dream stories. But

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Speaker 1: they are things that you've pulled from a dream state

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Speaker 1: that you can then translate into the real world and

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Speaker 1: do something with their functional in that way. Yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 1: evolution is a brutal editor. So we know that uh,

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Speaker 1: dreams exist for some purpose, right, and it's probably not

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Speaker 1: a vestigil leaving of our earlier arboreal ancestors. But we

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Speaker 1: do know to your point, even if we can't fully

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Speaker 1: answer the question why when it comes to dreams, we

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Speaker 1: know they do inform the waking world. I mean we

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Speaker 1: have examples, Like just to rattle off a few examples. Um,

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Speaker 1: one of my favorites, there's a guy named Dmitri men

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Speaker 1: to leave, the guy who made the periodic table. He's

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Speaker 1: got an element named after him. He's legit his story.

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Speaker 1: His claim, which is very difficult to prove about how

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Speaker 1: he figured out the periodic table is that he was

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Speaker 1: going mad looking at all these mismatched cards that kind

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Speaker 1: of picture his version of index cards where he wrote

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Speaker 1: down everything he knew about an element. And he's like

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Speaker 1: having his Charlie Day conspiracy theory thing. He's trying to

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Speaker 1: have his beautiful mind moment, it doesn't make sense. The

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Speaker 1: guy passes out on top of these cards, and then

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Speaker 1: in a dream he watches them sort of get up

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Speaker 1: and dance around, and then they put themselves in order

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Speaker 1: of their atomic weight, and he wakes up and he goes, Eureka,

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Speaker 1: what a satisfying feeling. That must have been, just just

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Speaker 1: the idea of of of making order out of chaos

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Speaker 1: and then waking up and having an actual concrete idea

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Speaker 1: from that. That's that's awesome. There's a I don't have

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Speaker 1: the exact story here, but you can look it up.

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Speaker 1: This will be an adventure for everyone watching. There's a

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Speaker 1: dream about a scientist who was attempting to work on dogs,

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Speaker 1: performing surgery on dogs. Um. I don't know exactly what

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Speaker 1: what his end goal was, but he had this dream

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Speaker 1: about a specific surgery that he wasn't planning on doing,

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Speaker 1: and then he wrote down all of the information from

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Speaker 1: his dream, attempted these surgery and he ended up discovering

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Speaker 1: insulin is pretty insane. Thank goodness that he did so,

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Speaker 1: and that he had a wonderful dream. Yeah, that's amazing, right,

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Speaker 1: this is um this leads us to this is a tangent.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if we we should delve into it,

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Speaker 1: but it leads to one of the questions that I

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Speaker 1: know a lot of us will have listening to this today,

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Speaker 1: which is, is it possible to oh spoilers, Okay, no,

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Speaker 1: let's save it for the end. We have to practice

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Speaker 1: linear time for this. So I have I have questions

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00:22:06,520 --> 00:22:09,919
Speaker 1: for you guys that I've cat to be Yeah, So

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Speaker 1: so we'll get our questions in. At the end, we

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Speaker 1: know we we've painted a pretty good picture here, right.

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Speaker 1: Evolutionary theory suggests that basically dreams function as a safe

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Speaker 1: way to learn maybe right, so I can I can

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Speaker 1: figure out things without physically harming myself the way that

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Speaker 1: I could be in danger in the real world. So,

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00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:34,800
Speaker 1: if you think about it, we all kind of have

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Speaker 1: this hollow deck in our head and we just run

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Speaker 1: scenarios until we wake up physically harm yourself or maybe

385
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:45,399
Speaker 1: burn bridge, you know, with a colleague. Maybe you have

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Speaker 1: a dream where you get to yell at somebody that

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Speaker 1: you're dealing with some resentment towards, and then you wake

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Speaker 1: up and you feel like you've worked that out sort

389
00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:55,040
Speaker 1: of like a simulation where you've you know, gotten to

390
00:22:55,119 --> 00:22:57,600
Speaker 1: beat the crap out of you know, like a doll

391
00:22:57,680 --> 00:22:59,800
Speaker 1: with this person's face on, and then you feel better

392
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Speaker 1: so that you don't actually do it in real life.

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Speaker 1: Is that a thing people do? Do you know? It's

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Speaker 1: I just came up with it. It should be Why

395
00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:10,000
Speaker 1: why shouldn't it be? I guess it is better than

396
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Speaker 1: hitting hitting in person? You get a do you get

397
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Speaker 1: a different doll every time, or you just switch the face.

398
00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:19,000
Speaker 1: It's just gotta sleeve like a face shaped sleeve, or

399
00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:22,000
Speaker 1: you to slide in a new picture, you know, uh,

400
00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:23,679
Speaker 1: and you can dress it up in the types of

401
00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:26,440
Speaker 1: clothes that person might wear. You know. It's a commitment,

402
00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:32,560
Speaker 1: but it's you know, yeah, yeah, I think so, yeah,

403
00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:37,320
Speaker 1: except in places where really swell gels, like Norway. But

404
00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:42,119
Speaker 1: Norway is um, I'll clean up this background here, but

405
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:45,199
Speaker 1: I'm I'm in the process of fixing some stuff up,

406
00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:48,639
Speaker 1: and I realized that currently the place I record is

407
00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:51,160
Speaker 1: not as nice as a Norwegian prison, but a lot

408
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:53,239
Speaker 1: of places where people live in the US or not

409
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Speaker 1: to your point, noll uh, that's I'm gonna think about

410
00:23:57,520 --> 00:23:59,800
Speaker 1: that I'm going to think about, like, what kind of

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Speaker 1: all is it less creepy if you catch someone with

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Speaker 1: the real doll and they say, no, this is not

413
00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:09,360
Speaker 1: for sexual purposes. I put other people's faces on it

414
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,399
Speaker 1: because I dislike other people and I just want to

415
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Speaker 1: beat something that feels like I'm realistically beating something right now.

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00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 1: It's not a sex thing. I think the safe way

417
00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:19,320
Speaker 1: to get around that is just to use those we

418
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:23,480
Speaker 1: were those wwf uh slam dolls that were like, you know,

419
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:26,240
Speaker 1: the Ultimate Warrior and whole COVID and they were a

420
00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:29,879
Speaker 1: little small kind of body pillow things and slam them

421
00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:31,720
Speaker 1: around or whatever. There's a name for him. But maybe

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00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:35,160
Speaker 1: keep them like not life size. That would probably keep

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00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:37,200
Speaker 1: people from looking at skance at you. We're not talking

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Speaker 1: about stuff that happened in the we are a little

425
00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:41,920
Speaker 1: bit the real world. We're talking about um working things

426
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Speaker 1: out in in your in your brain while you're not

427
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:47,800
Speaker 1: fully awake, and that could involve working things out that

428
00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:51,520
Speaker 1: are like either too painful or just too like weird

429
00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:54,399
Speaker 1: to get into when you're awake. Maybe you have a

430
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:56,440
Speaker 1: hard time wrapping your brain around it. But you need

431
00:24:56,480 --> 00:24:58,959
Speaker 1: to process these things, whatever they might be and so

432
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:01,520
Speaker 1: this is your brain's way like forcing you to address

433
00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 1: some of these things that maybe you're not equipped to

434
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:07,359
Speaker 1: do so mentally when you're when you're awake. Yeah, and

435
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:10,680
Speaker 1: this is strange because we can also see that dreams

436
00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:14,879
Speaker 1: do have the capability to warn us of things, and

437
00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:18,159
Speaker 1: maybe not in the way that we might initially suspect.

438
00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:22,560
Speaker 1: There was a two thousand ten study in the journal

439
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:27,639
Speaker 1: Neurology which shows that some violent dreams may actually be

440
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:32,840
Speaker 1: very very early warning signs of growing brain disorders, the

441
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:36,760
Speaker 1: very dangerous ones like dementia or Parkinson's. And when we

442
00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:40,359
Speaker 1: say early warning signs here the study, uh, the study

443
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:46,880
Speaker 1: appears to indicate that certain frequencies of violent dreams maybe

444
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 1: predicting a brain disorder malfunction up to a decade out,

445
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:54,800
Speaker 1: which is which is nuts. And also I think that's

446
00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:57,320
Speaker 1: kind of dangerous. That's the kind of thing that you

447
00:25:57,320 --> 00:26:00,320
Speaker 1: you know, you look up on web MD if you've

448
00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:02,680
Speaker 1: had a nightmare and you think, oh, I'm gonna die.

449
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:05,199
Speaker 1: At least this time it wasn't cancer, because as we

450
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:10,439
Speaker 1: know web MD, it's cancer. Cancer. Yeah. Yeah, No, I mean,

451
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:13,520
Speaker 1: like I I have violent dreams occasionally, but I also

452
00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:15,960
Speaker 1: watched a lot of horror movies and occasionally eat spicy

453
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:19,440
Speaker 1: food before bad So I do think when I saw

454
00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:23,040
Speaker 1: that stat bend Um, it did give me pause. But

455
00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 1: is this specifically violence? You doing violence or just any

456
00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:32,200
Speaker 1: form of violent imagery in your dreams. We'll think about

457
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 1: threat like physically thrashing for instance, where you know your

458
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:42,040
Speaker 1: brain body connection hasn't completely switched off, which is also

459
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:45,520
Speaker 1: you know something that happens with sleep paralysis. Yeah, but

460
00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,159
Speaker 1: I I would say also that is in That is

461
00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:53,240
Speaker 1: a fascinating study, but it's not. It's not hard proof.

462
00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:56,200
Speaker 1: So just because you're having nightmares does not mean that

463
00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:59,919
Speaker 1: you have cognitive woes in the future. No more so

464
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:06,840
Speaker 1: than the average person. But everybody, everybody knows that may

465
00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:09,640
Speaker 1: have felt a bit like a beta switch on our part,

466
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:12,679
Speaker 1: because when we say dreams might warn you of things,

467
00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:16,000
Speaker 1: what are we really talking about? What is the elephant

468
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:18,480
Speaker 1: in the room that so many mice are confusing for

469
00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:22,160
Speaker 1: five different forms of life? It is this. You or

470
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:25,960
Speaker 1: someone you know, regardless of whether they consider themselves a

471
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:28,879
Speaker 1: skeptic or a quote unquote true believer, has at some

472
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:31,800
Speaker 1: point in their life had a dream that they could

473
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:35,679
Speaker 1: not explain, A vision that, for instance, inspired someone to

474
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:38,240
Speaker 1: take a different route to work on the morning of

475
00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:42,040
Speaker 1: a horrific traffic accident, or a simple compulsion to react

476
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:46,560
Speaker 1: to a trigger, something as elementary as I go inside

477
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: immediately when I see the woman with the red hat,

478
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 1: and then boom, you go inside. And just as you

479
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,879
Speaker 1: go inside, I don't know, we're making stuff up, so

480
00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:58,760
Speaker 1: wishes or horses here, just as you go inside, a

481
00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:04,440
Speaker 1: gigantic piano slams down from the second floor of that building,

482
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:06,600
Speaker 1: and you would have been standing in the spot where

483
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:09,879
Speaker 1: it hits fascinating slippery slope. Are these warnings from the

484
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:14,920
Speaker 1: mental process we don't fully understand? Uh? Is it just coincidence?

485
00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:18,840
Speaker 1: Is there something more to the story? Can dreams predict

486
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:24,159
Speaker 1: the future? Will? We'll do our best to look at this.

487
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:35,520
Speaker 1: After a word from our sponsor, here's where it gets crazy. Yeah. So,

488
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 1: I mean, for for most of modern history that there's

489
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:43,280
Speaker 1: been this kind of notion of psychic abilities, precognition, being

490
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:47,680
Speaker 1: able to see the future, tell people's fortunes, all of that,

491
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:51,920
Speaker 1: you know, from that explainable kind of huckster side of things.

492
00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:55,080
Speaker 1: There's fiction, the realm of ghost stories and sci fi. Uh.

493
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:58,719
Speaker 1: And then there's, of course the religious, or even separate

494
00:28:58,760 --> 00:29:02,040
Speaker 1: from religious, spiritual side of it all that. Yeah, And

495
00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:07,000
Speaker 1: you know, science essentially looks at things like this where

496
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:10,400
Speaker 1: we don't fully understand yet. They look at it as

497
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 1: there is a mundane reason for this to occur. Just

498
00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:17,360
Speaker 1: because we don't know what it is. Doesn't mean that

499
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 1: it's supernatural, doesn't mean that our brains are connecting into

500
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:25,240
Speaker 1: a time slip somewhere or a stream of whatever. It

501
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:28,320
Speaker 1: just means that we don't know what's happening yet. And

502
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 1: that's all. That's all that it means and us. Science,

503
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:37,480
Speaker 1: when it is done well, is able to admit when

504
00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:40,360
Speaker 1: it's wrong. Science is able to learn from itself, like

505
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:44,280
Speaker 1: the best of human beings are able to do as individuals. Science,

506
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:48,680
Speaker 1: like history, is one long ongoing conversation. It refers back

507
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:53,200
Speaker 1: to earlier points. Do we orbit the sun? Does the

508
00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 1: Sun orbit us? It challenges these points, and often it

509
00:29:57,400 --> 00:30:02,479
Speaker 1: disproves itself unapologetically at a future date. How could this

510
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:07,200
Speaker 1: rock possibly injure me from way over, way over I'm

511
00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 1: way I'm standing way over here and this rock as

512
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 1: we over here? How is that thing causing me cancer? Yes?

513
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 1: I thought you just meant like, you know, how does

514
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:21,479
Speaker 1: it injure you when someone like throws it at your head? Oh?

515
00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:24,240
Speaker 1: That too? Propulsion. It's just a rock with like a

516
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:27,920
Speaker 1: bad vibe. It's a downer rock, you know what I mean.

517
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 1: It's like emotionally an abusive rock to see. Well, speaking

518
00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:36,720
Speaker 1: of speaking of downers, we we should probably get the

519
00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:41,840
Speaker 1: downer version of this explanation kind of out of the way, right, Yeah, yeah,

520
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:44,720
Speaker 1: you're right, Noel, Let's let's go to the ones that

521
00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:48,760
Speaker 1: the uh probably the first two that people think of

522
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 1: and should think of. The first is the C word

523
00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:58,720
Speaker 1: for today's show, coincidence. There are a ton of people

524
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:02,760
Speaker 1: living on earth right now. It's a long time tradition.

525
00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:06,000
Speaker 1: On this show, we're pulling up the current world population,

526
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 1: which is seven billion, eight hundred and six million, uh

527
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:17,520
Speaker 1: seventy one thousand, nine hundred and fifty eight nine sixty one. Like, look,

528
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:19,320
Speaker 1: there are a lot of people, that's what we're saying.

529
00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:23,040
Speaker 1: And the vast majority of those people they all dream,

530
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:26,320
Speaker 1: most of them in one way or another. Most people, also,

531
00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 1: by the way, do not dream in black and white.

532
00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:31,240
Speaker 1: That is another myth to bust. There are also tons

533
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 1: and tons of people who lived and died before we

534
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:38,760
Speaker 1: ever recorded this podcast, before podcast we're a thing, before

535
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:42,600
Speaker 1: I don't know, before hula hoops were a thing. There

536
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:45,680
Speaker 1: are a ton of yes there, there's so many dead

537
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:49,040
Speaker 1: people that precede our stories in the world in which

538
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:51,800
Speaker 1: we live today. And all of those people, or at

539
00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:56,280
Speaker 1: least the vast majority, experienced a dream, right, experienced multiple

540
00:31:56,320 --> 00:32:00,280
Speaker 1: dreams every night, every single night. So think, well, yeah,

541
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:01,960
Speaker 1: I mean, but like, you know, I was watching a

542
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 1: YouTube video of I forget the guy's name, but he's

543
00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:06,560
Speaker 1: a lucid dreaming guy, and he had this is sort

544
00:32:06,600 --> 00:32:09,240
Speaker 1: of his whole point. He had the world population taking

545
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:11,960
Speaker 1: away on on the screen and was just talking about

546
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:15,120
Speaker 1: how he's like, let's do a more conservative estimate. Let's

547
00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:17,960
Speaker 1: count out everyone that has insomnia, you know, or like

548
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:21,320
Speaker 1: kids that maybe aren't interpreting their dreams correctly or whatever.

549
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 1: And you know, you could maybe lower that number, it

550
00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:26,959
Speaker 1: was still you know, a massive, massive number. And so

551
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:29,880
Speaker 1: it starts to become like dice rolls, right, Like every

552
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:33,000
Speaker 1: time someone's dreaming, it's the roll of the dice. And

553
00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:35,080
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff happens, a lot of news, a

554
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:37,720
Speaker 1: lot of bad news, a lot of things that we

555
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:41,440
Speaker 1: are worried about that, We think about that, we um

556
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:45,920
Speaker 1: commiserate over what will happen? Will there be a tanker accident?

557
00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:48,520
Speaker 1: Will there be a horrible plane crash? And sometimes those

558
00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:53,640
Speaker 1: things align right, Yeah, And you know, I think the

559
00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:57,440
Speaker 1: focus can can get pretty sharp here when you talk about,

560
00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:01,440
Speaker 1: let's see an important factory to the town where you live, right,

561
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,360
Speaker 1: you know, maybe you're thinking about a lot. Maybe your

562
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:06,240
Speaker 1: family has worked at that factory for a long time,

563
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:09,400
Speaker 1: maybe you work there, um, and then something bad occurs

564
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 1: at that factory because there's a ton of mechanical equipment

565
00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:17,480
Speaker 1: and something goes wrong. Um, it may make you feel

566
00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:20,800
Speaker 1: as though you had a precognitive vision of something, even

567
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:24,440
Speaker 1: if it even if your dream occurred months ago before

568
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:27,600
Speaker 1: the accident, you still might remember it. But you know

569
00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,040
Speaker 1: that that's that's at least the way science would would

570
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 1: put a wet blanket, and you prize the details, right,

571
00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:36,480
Speaker 1: The things that are relevant are the things you remember.

572
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,880
Speaker 1: The things that are irrelevant are cast aside, and then

573
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 1: you you every time you remember this, Just like in

574
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 1: our episodes on Deceptive Bread, the narrative, the story, the

575
00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 1: details of your memory alter ever so slightly to fall

576
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:54,080
Speaker 1: increasingly in line with what you think happened, and time

577
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:57,760
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter, right, there's no there's no methodology, of course,

578
00:33:57,840 --> 00:34:00,400
Speaker 1: it's like a form of confirmation bias, right. You You

579
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:04,200
Speaker 1: just highlight the bits that support your thesis. You know,

580
00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:07,120
Speaker 1: you need to explain something, and you have this little

581
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:09,479
Speaker 1: inkling of a dream, of a piece of a dream,

582
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:11,520
Speaker 1: of a fragment of a dream. God knows how much

583
00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:13,719
Speaker 1: of it you're actually even remembering. It just happens to

584
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:16,239
Speaker 1: line up with that detail, and you're like, ah, yes,

585
00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:20,040
Speaker 1: I predicted this, this was meant to be, This was

586
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:23,080
Speaker 1: destined or something, you know. And and that means that

587
00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:25,600
Speaker 1: what we see is precognition is just sort of a

588
00:34:25,600 --> 00:34:29,040
Speaker 1: magic trick we're playing on ourselves. If you're watching the video,

589
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:31,840
Speaker 1: you're doing something like this, but you think it really

590
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:34,680
Speaker 1: is your finger and how are you doing that? I

591
00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:37,080
Speaker 1: don't I don't understand what I'm looking at. How you

592
00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:42,520
Speaker 1: can you do the one where it's like, yeah, that's

593
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 1: like it. I like it, Witchcraft. I showed my son

594
00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,840
Speaker 1: that after you did it for me. It's one of

595
00:34:50,840 --> 00:34:53,440
Speaker 1: his favorite things. It's a cool move. It's a super

596
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:55,400
Speaker 1: cool move. Can I can I really quickly ask you

597
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,960
Speaker 1: guys opinion about something like this that that did happen

598
00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:01,680
Speaker 1: to me really quickly. It's very strang range, nothing significant,

599
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:04,920
Speaker 1: nothing like a factory explosion or a plane crash or anything.

600
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:09,280
Speaker 1: But I used to intern at this recording studio in Athens, Georgia,

601
00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 1: and there was this um woman, a young woman who

602
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 1: also worked there. And I never actually met her, but

603
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:16,960
Speaker 1: I always heard her name because it was a really

604
00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 1: cool name. Her name was Bennett Moon, and I just

605
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:21,919
Speaker 1: love that name, and I thought it was just really

606
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,239
Speaker 1: memorable to me. And I hadn't thought about Bennett Moon

607
00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:28,680
Speaker 1: in a long long time, uh, for whatever reason. And

608
00:35:28,719 --> 00:35:31,960
Speaker 1: I had this very specific dream where I met Bennett

609
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:33,879
Speaker 1: Moon was a person that I had never actually met,

610
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:36,480
Speaker 1: but I was aware, like the periphery of this person.

611
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:40,279
Speaker 1: And literally the next day, I'm listening to wait Waite,

612
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:42,759
Speaker 1: don't tell Me on NPR and they have the call

613
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:45,600
Speaker 1: in thing at the end, and who's the call in person?

614
00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:49,239
Speaker 1: But Bennett Moon from Athens, Georgia, And it's it's the

615
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:52,200
Speaker 1: same person. It is this person, no question about it.

616
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:55,480
Speaker 1: Never heard her voice in my life, never actually met her,

617
00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:57,640
Speaker 1: just knew of her that she kind of she had

618
00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:00,239
Speaker 1: a shared experience that was we never actually crossed paths.

619
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:03,800
Speaker 1: It isn't that weird, Yeah, But I mean, at the

620
00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:05,920
Speaker 1: end of the day, I can chuck that up to coincidence.

621
00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 1: It's not like it was predicting anything exactly. But it's

622
00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:11,920
Speaker 1: a pretty interesting game of odds there, you know, and

623
00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:13,600
Speaker 1: if if, if this is our brain just kind of

624
00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:16,200
Speaker 1: playing a trick on ourselves and the party, Meaning that

625
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:18,839
Speaker 1: was a pretty pretty big one. It wasn't like I

626
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:20,640
Speaker 1: was like blown away or felt like I was seeing

627
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:22,920
Speaker 1: the hand of God or anything, but I did feel

628
00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 1: like I was experiencing something, you know what I mean,

629
00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, there's a there's another it's still

630
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:31,879
Speaker 1: kind of a downer, but it's a little bit less

631
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:35,320
Speaker 1: of a downer that that may help explain that. Let's

632
00:36:35,320 --> 00:36:39,680
Speaker 1: call it playing the probability game. So we're all familiar, Yeah,

633
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:43,440
Speaker 1: we're all familiar with Carl Young. Uh, we're all familiar

634
00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:48,160
Speaker 1: with archetypes, these ideas of the super consciousness and so on.

635
00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:51,880
Speaker 1: But we don't really need that yet to talk about

636
00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:56,800
Speaker 1: dreams in this way. So if coincidence is a lottery,

637
00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:01,480
Speaker 1: then the probability game is kind of uh, kind of

638
00:37:01,520 --> 00:37:04,920
Speaker 1: your your brain playing clue in a couple of ways.

639
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:08,239
Speaker 1: So this may apply to your anecdote. They are an

640
00:37:08,239 --> 00:37:11,600
Speaker 1: old because Carl Young makes a great point about the

641
00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:17,839
Speaker 1: perceived precognitive capacity of some dreams. Uh, we didn't want

642
00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:20,480
Speaker 1: to paraphrase demand, so we we just pulled the quote.

643
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:24,839
Speaker 1: It's smart. It sounds smart because he wrote it. That's right. Yeah, Uh,

644
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:28,640
Speaker 1: you wanna give it to us? Oh? Yes, the occurrence

645
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:33,040
Speaker 1: of prospective dreams cannot be denied. It would be wrong

646
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:36,319
Speaker 1: to call them prophetic because at bottom, they are no

647
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:40,480
Speaker 1: more prophetic than a medical diagnosis or a weather forecast.

648
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:44,719
Speaker 1: They are merely an anticipatory combination of probabilities which may

649
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:48,360
Speaker 1: coincide with the actual behavior of things, but need not

650
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:54,839
Speaker 1: necessarily agree in every detail confirmation. So what's so can

651
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:58,560
Speaker 1: we unpack like the difference or the distinction between prospective

652
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:05,759
Speaker 1: and prophetic. Sure? Yeah, the perspective dream would be the

653
00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:11,319
Speaker 1: the sum of your sensory information, your memory, often short term,

654
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:18,000
Speaker 1: sometimes long term. Uh, you're fleeting ephemeral impressions all mashed together,

655
00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:21,920
Speaker 1: like that horrible stuff called neutral loaf that they used

656
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 1: to feed prisoners in the US. And maybe still do

657
00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:27,800
Speaker 1: you know if you want like a slightly more pleasant

658
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:31,520
Speaker 1: sure or salad if you want something healthier as well.

659
00:38:32,360 --> 00:38:34,879
Speaker 1: So so this is all this is all mixed up.

660
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 1: And from this our subconscious, which doesn't function with some

661
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:44,759
Speaker 1: of the same uh socially imposed constraints or ego imposed

662
00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:49,879
Speaker 1: constraints that our consciousness uh functions with our our subconscious

663
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:54,960
Speaker 1: is able to aggregate these things and make a an

664
00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:59,160
Speaker 1: analysis a gues estimate. So a prospective dream is the

665
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:07,480
Speaker 1: subconscious is saying this, this, this, and this are crazy connected. Therefore,

666
00:39:07,560 --> 00:39:12,120
Speaker 1: I think here's the room that this road leads us to.

667
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:15,080
Speaker 1: So that's the idea. The idea there is that for

668
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:20,120
Speaker 1: young a dream may only be prophetic if every detail

669
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:26,520
Speaker 1: of the dream matches every detail of the bit, the scene,

670
00:39:26,520 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 1: the event in the waking world. Wait, so is he

671
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,680
Speaker 1: acknowledging that this is possible or is he just setting

672
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:34,719
Speaker 1: up a standard that's like impossible to meet. That's a

673
00:39:34,719 --> 00:39:38,799
Speaker 1: good question. He is primarily implying, at least the way

674
00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:42,879
Speaker 1: that I interpret it, that we are underestimating the intelligence

675
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:47,160
Speaker 1: of our subconsciousness, because you know, we are very unappreciative

676
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:49,799
Speaker 1: of our brains. I had to cut a line out

677
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:52,280
Speaker 1: here at some point. But it's like the brain works

678
00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:56,520
Speaker 1: so hard you're asleep and you're still breathing. That's amazing

679
00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:59,600
Speaker 1: and the brain is doing that. But but that's what

680
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:02,160
Speaker 1: he's saying. He's saying that we're kind of short changing

681
00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:07,759
Speaker 1: our own mental abilities, our own pattern recognition, really, uh,

682
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:11,920
Speaker 1: and that we only notice this amazing ability when we

683
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:17,320
Speaker 1: get something super weirdly specifically correct, and then we're like, WHOA,

684
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 1: maybe I I have superpowers. I have superpowers, and they

685
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:24,640
Speaker 1: are entirely related to my ability to know which song

686
00:40:24,719 --> 00:40:26,799
Speaker 1: I'm gonna hear on the radio two days from now,

687
00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:30,920
Speaker 1: which is a tremendously common thing, especially with music, or

688
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:34,759
Speaker 1: your ability to all of a sudden recognize Benett Moon. Yeah,

689
00:40:34,840 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 1: I been itt by the way, seriously, I hope I

690
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:38,960
Speaker 1: hope she listens to the show. I gotta say that

691
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 1: that was That was one of those moments that that

692
00:40:41,239 --> 00:40:44,759
Speaker 1: I was like, is this real? Like I really had

693
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:46,719
Speaker 1: to kind of do a double take, like a spit take,

694
00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:48,920
Speaker 1: where I was like, how how don't understand what I'm

695
00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:54,919
Speaker 1: experiencing right now? Um? And uh. There are some other

696
00:40:55,080 --> 00:40:58,960
Speaker 1: examples of this throughout history that I think would cause

697
00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:01,760
Speaker 1: even the most skeptical person to ask that very same question.

698
00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:04,799
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you, I mean you could go on other

699
00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:10,160
Speaker 1: channels on YouTube and find lists of these kinds of things.

700
00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:14,160
Speaker 1: Shout out to Matthew Santauro, So I see you, man.

701
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 1: He gave a great example of Abraham Lincoln that I

702
00:41:17,239 --> 00:41:19,920
Speaker 1: had never heard about before. So I headed over to

703
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:23,440
Speaker 1: history dot com just to learn a little more about it. Allegedly,

704
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 1: this is the way the story goes. Just a couple

705
00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:30,560
Speaker 1: of days before Abraham Lincoln was assassinated, he told his

706
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:34,800
Speaker 1: wife Mary Todd and his friend Ward hill Lamon about

707
00:41:34,920 --> 00:41:38,000
Speaker 1: this dream that he had just had. And in this dream,

708
00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:40,200
Speaker 1: he's I believe he's there at the White House and

709
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:44,560
Speaker 1: the Oval Office are near there, and he is he

710
00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:47,680
Speaker 1: sees all of these mourners. He sees a casket. He

711
00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:52,719
Speaker 1: sees like important members of his like inner circle, and

712
00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:56,160
Speaker 1: they're all mourning the death of the president. But he says,

713
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,360
Speaker 1: according to the story, he didn't recognize himself in the

714
00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:02,399
Speaker 1: casticket in the casket. It wasn't him, so he wasn't

715
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:04,640
Speaker 1: worried about it. He didn't believe that he was having

716
00:42:04,680 --> 00:42:08,080
Speaker 1: some kind of prophetic dream or precognitive dream that was

717
00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:12,600
Speaker 1: going to foretell his death. But uh, he did get assassinated,

718
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:15,160
Speaker 1: if you I think it was very soon after. I

719
00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:17,160
Speaker 1: heard another version of the story where like he was

720
00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:21,000
Speaker 1: telling this to his bodyguard and and like saying, um

721
00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:24,279
Speaker 1: that Lamon is his was his part time bodyguard, his friend, right,

722
00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:27,360
Speaker 1: But but he would say like usually he would say

723
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:31,520
Speaker 1: good night Laman or whatever, but this time he said goodbye.

724
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:34,319
Speaker 1: And he told him like, I had this dream and

725
00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:36,400
Speaker 1: I'm worriou something's going to happen in the theater tonight.

726
00:42:36,640 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 1: And he and he was like, well, he shouldn't go,

727
00:42:38,640 --> 00:42:41,080
Speaker 1: Mr President, he said, but I'm meeting my wife there.

728
00:42:41,120 --> 00:42:43,000
Speaker 1: I don't want to disappoint her, so I must go.

729
00:42:43,320 --> 00:42:45,759
Speaker 1: And then like he he said goodbye for the first

730
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:48,520
Speaker 1: time ever instead of you know, goodnight, which whatever. It's

731
00:42:48,560 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 1: it's an interesting detail. Here's why it's a little weird

732
00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:55,120
Speaker 1: because Lamon is the guy who told this story. So

733
00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:59,640
Speaker 1: Lincoln was assassinated April four, eight sixty five. And this

734
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 1: concept that there was a dream that was told to

735
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:04,600
Speaker 1: Mary Todd and Laman didn't come out for at least

736
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:11,160
Speaker 1: fifteen years, if if not longer, And it was allegedly

737
00:43:11,239 --> 00:43:14,440
Speaker 1: told by Laman based on notes that he took in

738
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 1: eighteen sixty, so who who knows if it's real or not. UM.

739
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:25,759
Speaker 1: But there's another interesting fact. The cabinet that worked with

740
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:29,680
Speaker 1: Abraham Lincoln were aware that he did seem to put

741
00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:34,160
Speaker 1: a lot of importance on his dreams, that that he

742
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:37,640
Speaker 1: would have you tell him about it. Will pause for

743
00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:41,799
Speaker 1: a word from our sponsor, but please stay away. We'll

744
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:52,680
Speaker 1: be back soon. And we're back with more on precognitive dreams.

745
00:43:53,360 --> 00:43:55,800
Speaker 1: Like a lot of us, I grew up reading these

746
00:43:55,840 --> 00:43:59,440
Speaker 1: sorts of stories, often in time life books. Uh. This

747
00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:03,719
Speaker 1: point was just make him a sponsor. But these stories

748
00:44:03,960 --> 00:44:07,480
Speaker 1: have grains of truth, which I think you've done a

749
00:44:07,520 --> 00:44:12,160
Speaker 1: fantastic job of outlining. And then they also get carried

750
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:16,799
Speaker 1: over and embellished, you know, and in in UM television

751
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:20,480
Speaker 1: series like Unsolved Mysteries or anything on the History Channel

752
00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:23,560
Speaker 1: after about ten PM back in the day. Uh. And

753
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:27,279
Speaker 1: and this the thing that's interesting about that is it's

754
00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:32,040
Speaker 1: often used that tendency is often used by skeptics as

755
00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 1: a way to entirely discredit the anecdote, right, or keep

756
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:40,120
Speaker 1: raising the bar of proof until proof is something that

757
00:44:40,160 --> 00:44:44,240
Speaker 1: can never be attained. But it's it's almost enough for

758
00:44:44,280 --> 00:44:49,120
Speaker 1: an entire episode on its own, The other worldly quote

759
00:44:49,160 --> 00:44:55,120
Speaker 1: unquote psychic experiences of world leaders. Churchill said that he

760
00:44:55,239 --> 00:44:58,680
Speaker 1: heard a golden voice since he was a child, and

761
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:05,280
Speaker 1: said later that it's saved his life until actually until um,

762
00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:07,879
Speaker 1: even around World War two or so, until the World

763
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:12,080
Speaker 1: War two years, it was incredibly common for Western leaders

764
00:45:12,160 --> 00:45:14,400
Speaker 1: to be pretty open about what they saw as a

765
00:45:14,440 --> 00:45:18,000
Speaker 1: connection with some sort of other side. Uh, and it

766
00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:21,440
Speaker 1: faded now or it's it's uh, it's a bit in

767
00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:25,640
Speaker 1: the dull drums now, because I imagine that a lot

768
00:45:25,640 --> 00:45:29,040
Speaker 1: of people feel they would not be taken seriously if

769
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:32,200
Speaker 1: they said, hey, I am from a family that has

770
00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:36,960
Speaker 1: precognitive dreams. I have precognitive dreams. Also I should be

771
00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:40,000
Speaker 1: in charge of nuclear weapons. It doesn't track right. It's

772
00:45:40,080 --> 00:45:42,960
Speaker 1: it's seen as a blow to credibility rather than just

773
00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:46,000
Speaker 1: a part of someone's individual human experience. But we know

774
00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:50,239
Speaker 1: it's not. These people who are recounting these things are

775
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:53,719
Speaker 1: not chumps, they're not unintelligent people. I think you had

776
00:45:53,719 --> 00:45:57,479
Speaker 1: a you had another example, Matt also an American and

777
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:01,239
Speaker 1: also a pretty smart guy. You love him or hate him? Yeah,

778
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:06,120
Speaker 1: I found a story about Samuel Clemons just right rifling

779
00:46:06,120 --> 00:46:09,400
Speaker 1: through the internet, and it comes from Life on the Mississippi,

780
00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:14,960
Speaker 1: which is Samuel Clemons or Mark Twain's autobiography. It's fascinating.

781
00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:21,719
Speaker 1: So he was, uh, Sam, Sam, I don't I don't

782
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:25,000
Speaker 1: like calling that. Mark Twain was working on a steamboat

783
00:46:25,640 --> 00:46:30,160
Speaker 1: called the Pennsylvania and he had arranged for his younger brother,

784
00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:33,080
Speaker 1: guy named Henry, to also get a job there. He

785
00:46:33,120 --> 00:46:36,240
Speaker 1: was going to I think what did they call it.

786
00:46:36,239 --> 00:46:41,160
Speaker 1: It's a really interesting job, a mud clerk on the Pennsylvania,

787
00:46:41,239 --> 00:46:46,400
Speaker 1: which is the steamboat. And um, there's this whole situation

788
00:46:46,520 --> 00:46:51,839
Speaker 1: where the captain insulted Henry for some reason and Mark

789
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:55,400
Speaker 1: Twain heard about it. There was a whole fight that

790
00:46:56,040 --> 00:47:00,359
Speaker 1: resulted in Mark Twain just being banned from the boat

791
00:47:00,400 --> 00:47:03,839
Speaker 1: where his brother was working. Right, So, out of just

792
00:47:03,920 --> 00:47:06,920
Speaker 1: the set of circumstances, Mark Twain got kicked off of

793
00:47:06,920 --> 00:47:09,560
Speaker 1: this boat that he was on and his brother is

794
00:47:09,600 --> 00:47:15,439
Speaker 1: still there. So then at some point Mark Twain lays down,

795
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:19,040
Speaker 1: he has a dream, and inside this dream he sees

796
00:47:19,120 --> 00:47:22,160
Speaker 1: his brother Henry in a coffin and there are a

797
00:47:22,200 --> 00:47:25,960
Speaker 1: lot of specifics about it. Um, I've heard that he

798
00:47:26,360 --> 00:47:29,520
Speaker 1: was wearing one of Mark Twain's own suits. But one

799
00:47:29,520 --> 00:47:32,520
Speaker 1: of the most important things about this dream was that

800
00:47:32,560 --> 00:47:36,040
Speaker 1: there was a specific set of white flowers laid down

801
00:47:36,239 --> 00:47:39,359
Speaker 1: on to Henry's coffin where he was laying, and with

802
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:43,840
Speaker 1: a single red flower in the middle. Right. That's exactly

803
00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:47,840
Speaker 1: what it is. So what very very strong image that

804
00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:51,560
Speaker 1: was left on Mark Twain even after he awoke. And

805
00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:54,120
Speaker 1: obviously you know that kind of dream you dream about

806
00:47:54,160 --> 00:47:56,800
Speaker 1: a loved one who dies that's going to be affecting

807
00:47:57,480 --> 00:48:00,759
Speaker 1: in some way or another. And so there were there

808
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:04,759
Speaker 1: were different details here which would be of interest to

809
00:48:04,800 --> 00:48:09,239
Speaker 1: anyone agreeing with the beliefs of Carl Young or the

810
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:14,600
Speaker 1: beliefs as laid out in in today's episode. Uh. He

811
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:18,479
Speaker 1: had some specific details that appeared to be correct, things

812
00:48:18,520 --> 00:48:22,120
Speaker 1: that were unusual, like a metallic often. This is also

813
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:30,640
Speaker 1: for anyone else who who read the incredibly unedited autobiography

814
00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:33,200
Speaker 1: of Mark Twain, where some of this is pulled from.

815
00:48:33,239 --> 00:48:35,000
Speaker 1: I just want to I just want to let you

816
00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:38,840
Speaker 1: know I'm right there with you in solidarity. Even great

817
00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:43,239
Speaker 1: writers need editors, even just good editors. It's a very

818
00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:46,680
Speaker 1: very long book. He's dictating it on his deathbed. And

819
00:48:46,719 --> 00:48:49,719
Speaker 1: the reason I'm bringing that up is because he may

820
00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:54,680
Speaker 1: have fallen victim to something known as retrospective conviction, which

821
00:48:54,719 --> 00:48:58,080
Speaker 1: is what we're talking about earlier, when we alter our

822
00:48:58,120 --> 00:49:03,799
Speaker 1: own memories by remembering those memories. However, like you said, Matt,

823
00:49:04,280 --> 00:49:08,840
Speaker 1: he he says he had never had any doubts since

824
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:12,239
Speaker 1: he had had that dream, that it was predictive. He

825
00:49:12,280 --> 00:49:16,719
Speaker 1: can remember everything very, very vividly. So Mark Twain has

826
00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:19,160
Speaker 1: to leave the boat. His brother is still on it,

827
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:23,160
Speaker 1: and later on he gets word that a boiler has

828
00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:27,080
Speaker 1: in fact exploded on this steamboat and his brother in

829
00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:30,239
Speaker 1: inhaled a bunch of steam and it actually burned his

830
00:49:30,360 --> 00:49:33,960
Speaker 1: lungs and he's in he's in the hospital. So Mark Twain,

831
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:37,960
Speaker 1: you know, obviously makes his he stops what he's doing.

832
00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:40,239
Speaker 1: He makes his way to the hospital where his brother is.

833
00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:44,480
Speaker 1: It's in Memphis, Tennessee. And when Sam gets there, the

834
00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:49,040
Speaker 1: doctors um tell him that his brother is in absolutely

835
00:49:49,200 --> 00:49:52,239
Speaker 1: terrible pain, but he's going to be fine. He just

836
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:54,760
Speaker 1: scalded his lungs a little bit. He's going to recover.

837
00:49:54,840 --> 00:49:57,879
Speaker 1: Don't worry about it, uh Sam. They wouldn't have called

838
00:49:57,920 --> 00:49:59,920
Speaker 1: him Mark Twain. They didn't know that name. Listen, here,

839
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:06,120
Speaker 1: Mark Twain, brother's gonna be just fine. Yeah. Um, but Sam,

840
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:09,960
Speaker 1: you know, uh, a caring brother says, well, there must

841
00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:11,520
Speaker 1: be something you can do to make him feel a

842
00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:14,439
Speaker 1: little better, Like, look at him. He's obviously in pain.

843
00:50:14,560 --> 00:50:16,480
Speaker 1: You know, he's in pain. Let's do something about it.

844
00:50:17,120 --> 00:50:21,680
Speaker 1: And according to Sam himself, he convinces the doctor to

845
00:50:21,719 --> 00:50:25,480
Speaker 1: give his brother a shot of morphine. And the doctor

846
00:50:25,600 --> 00:50:31,440
Speaker 1: is supposedly inexperienced with this type of drug and overdoses

847
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:38,960
Speaker 1: Henry and and Henry unfortunately passes away. I thought he

848
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:41,239
Speaker 1: died from the blast and I didn't realize that. That's

849
00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:46,120
Speaker 1: that's extra tragic and unexpected. Wow. Yeah, and you know again,

850
00:50:46,160 --> 00:50:49,040
Speaker 1: according to Sammy never forgave himself for this fact. But

851
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:52,120
Speaker 1: the strangest part is that at the actual funeral of

852
00:50:52,200 --> 00:50:56,040
Speaker 1: his brother Henry, he noticed some things that reminded him

853
00:50:56,080 --> 00:51:00,160
Speaker 1: of the dream he had had where what the what

854
00:51:00,239 --> 00:51:04,640
Speaker 1: the coffin looked like, the suit that his brother was wearing,

855
00:51:05,160 --> 00:51:09,160
Speaker 1: and the most important fact, the most important similarity perhaps

856
00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:13,040
Speaker 1: were a a bouquet of white flowers with a single

857
00:51:13,120 --> 00:51:15,520
Speaker 1: red rose in the center that was laid down on

858
00:51:15,719 --> 00:51:18,200
Speaker 1: to his brother Henry. That's like the end of a

859
00:51:18,200 --> 00:51:21,439
Speaker 1: ghost store. It's like a twist ending dude. And then

860
00:51:21,680 --> 00:51:24,160
Speaker 1: it took the ribbon off and her head fell off

861
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:28,160
Speaker 1: like that, and there was a single red rose. Burr

862
00:51:28,800 --> 00:51:32,640
Speaker 1: don't like that. He also told this story around seventy

863
00:51:32,760 --> 00:51:36,959
Speaker 1: or eighty times, by his own admission, and when he

864
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:41,239
Speaker 1: was performing this story at the Monday Evening Club, as

865
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:49,880
Speaker 1: was called in four UH, the the incident, I believe

866
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:52,680
Speaker 1: if I'm thinking of the right one without without pulling

867
00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:55,880
Speaker 1: out that brick of a book, I believe it. He

868
00:51:55,960 --> 00:51:59,000
Speaker 1: was telling this story several years later, and someone called

869
00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:04,880
Speaker 1: Reverend Burton, Reverend Dr Burton, just for extra accolades, asked

870
00:52:05,120 --> 00:52:08,839
Speaker 1: Twain if he had told it multiple times. He said, yes,

871
00:52:08,880 --> 00:52:14,240
Speaker 1: seventy or eighty, and Burton pointed out that is likely,

872
00:52:14,719 --> 00:52:17,120
Speaker 1: or it's very possible for someone with the best of

873
00:52:17,160 --> 00:52:22,480
Speaker 1: intentions to embellish a story over the years. Twain stuck

874
00:52:22,520 --> 00:52:25,759
Speaker 1: to his guns. I don't think any of it is embroidery,

875
00:52:25,880 --> 00:52:28,279
Speaker 1: he had replied. I think it is all just as

876
00:52:28,320 --> 00:52:33,040
Speaker 1: I've stated it, detail by detail. Yes, the man wrote fiction,

877
00:52:33,200 --> 00:52:36,600
Speaker 1: and wrote uh an enormous amount of fiction, so he's

878
00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:40,080
Speaker 1: no stranger to spinning a tale. However, In the case

879
00:52:40,200 --> 00:52:43,920
Speaker 1: of Mark Twain, I would point out that he appears

880
00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:49,280
Speaker 1: to have predicted his own death without taking his own hand.

881
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:54,920
Speaker 1: He was born on November five, two weeks after Hayley's

882
00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:58,480
Speaker 1: comments Reach the Brillion where it's the point nearest the sun.

883
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:02,440
Speaker 1: This is apply point in an awesome claymation filled with

884
00:53:02,520 --> 00:53:05,520
Speaker 1: some very disturbing depictions of the devil. I recommend checking

885
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:09,799
Speaker 1: it out on YouTube. In his autobiography in nineteen o nine,

886
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:12,720
Speaker 1: he said, I came in with Haley's comment at eighteen

887
00:53:12,760 --> 00:53:15,640
Speaker 1: thirty five. It's coming again next year. I expect to

888
00:53:15,640 --> 00:53:18,359
Speaker 1: go out with it. It will be the greatest disappointment

889
00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:20,800
Speaker 1: of my life if I don't go out with Haley's comment.

890
00:53:21,760 --> 00:53:25,560
Speaker 1: So he went on about it. Um so that's a

891
00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:28,640
Speaker 1: little different, because is that precognition or is that just

892
00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:31,279
Speaker 1: him being very stubborn and saying I want to go

893
00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:36,080
Speaker 1: out with a power move. But to your point, Matt, yes,

894
00:53:36,160 --> 00:53:39,560
Speaker 1: it is tremendously I think it's I think it would

895
00:53:39,560 --> 00:53:45,400
Speaker 1: surprise people to learn how common it is for people

896
00:53:45,480 --> 00:53:47,759
Speaker 1: that you would associate with great success, people that you

897
00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:53,239
Speaker 1: would associate with great power UH to to believe in

898
00:53:53,560 --> 00:54:00,000
Speaker 1: predictive UH precognitive or even prophetic dreams. Maybe they don't

899
00:54:00,280 --> 00:54:03,719
Speaker 1: talk about it as much now, you know, maybe they

900
00:54:03,800 --> 00:54:08,319
Speaker 1: are not recounting strange stories of their family or their

901
00:54:08,360 --> 00:54:12,439
Speaker 1: personal experience. And if so, there's probably a reason. It's

902
00:54:12,520 --> 00:54:15,160
Speaker 1: because they feel like they will be resigned to the

903
00:54:15,239 --> 00:54:18,160
Speaker 1: rubbish heap of the current day. And that's a real

904
00:54:18,480 --> 00:54:22,040
Speaker 1: valid concern. But I would imagine, you know, world leaders

905
00:54:22,200 --> 00:54:26,439
Speaker 1: listening in the audience today that, yeah, that you two

906
00:54:26,440 --> 00:54:30,880
Speaker 1: have had a dream or four or Baker's dozen or

907
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:35,440
Speaker 1: nineteen that you yourself cannot explain to this day. It

908
00:54:35,560 --> 00:54:40,239
Speaker 1: is a very common thing. It is a very common thing. Yeah, yeah, no,

909
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:43,480
Speaker 1: it's true. Uh. And I mean I don't know up

910
00:54:43,480 --> 00:54:45,560
Speaker 1: to this point in the in the show, I hope

911
00:54:45,560 --> 00:54:48,240
Speaker 1: it doesn't sound like we're poo pooing any of these things.

912
00:54:48,320 --> 00:54:50,080
Speaker 1: I think we've all acknowledged the whole way that the

913
00:54:50,120 --> 00:54:54,560
Speaker 1: brain is a very under understood that's a redundant. But

914
00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:57,600
Speaker 1: I'm still gonna go with the thing. Um, I have

915
00:54:57,840 --> 00:55:00,520
Speaker 1: I have not proofrood this. I've just said out. I'm

916
00:55:00,520 --> 00:55:05,840
Speaker 1: building a case that unfortunately we're not getting trying to

917
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:08,799
Speaker 1: get to in in a very ham fisted way. Um,

918
00:55:08,840 --> 00:55:10,640
Speaker 1: This is one of those ones where we like just

919
00:55:10,640 --> 00:55:12,319
Speaker 1: look at the clock and we're like, man, we've got

920
00:55:12,360 --> 00:55:14,960
Speaker 1: so much more left to go and some really good, amazing,

921
00:55:15,320 --> 00:55:18,719
Speaker 1: juicy science based stuff. Um, but I think we're gonna

922
00:55:18,719 --> 00:55:20,759
Speaker 1: save that for a part two because there's really enough

923
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:25,320
Speaker 1: there to to give you another really um substantial episode

924
00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:28,560
Speaker 1: out of this topic. Yes, so you will have to

925
00:55:28,600 --> 00:55:32,560
Speaker 1: stay tuned, But for now, why don't you write to us?

926
00:55:32,719 --> 00:55:36,680
Speaker 1: Tell us about your dreams, tell us about something maybe

927
00:55:36,719 --> 00:55:40,640
Speaker 1: you've predicted, or a strange thing that's happened within your

928
00:55:40,680 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 1: family or a friend or a loved one. You can

929
00:55:43,600 --> 00:55:46,400
Speaker 1: find us on Facebook and on Twitter, where we are

930
00:55:46,400 --> 00:55:50,359
Speaker 1: a conspiracy stuff show. You can also uh find us

931
00:55:50,360 --> 00:55:53,040
Speaker 1: on social media and the usual spots or Facebook where

932
00:55:53,080 --> 00:55:56,520
Speaker 1: Instagram we're we're not pinterious. We fought back and we

933
00:55:56,520 --> 00:55:58,680
Speaker 1: we we we fought the law and the law did

934
00:55:58,719 --> 00:56:01,720
Speaker 1: not win. We won that one, but who knows anything

935
00:56:01,719 --> 00:56:04,480
Speaker 1: could happen. Um, we are conspiracy or conspiracy Stuff show

936
00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:07,520
Speaker 1: and most of the usual spots Twitter as well. Uh.

937
00:56:07,560 --> 00:56:09,520
Speaker 1: If you don't want to do that, you can go

938
00:56:09,560 --> 00:56:12,040
Speaker 1: to Facebook where we have a really dope Facebook group

939
00:56:12,080 --> 00:56:14,200
Speaker 1: called Here's where it Gets Crazy. It's super easy to

940
00:56:14,200 --> 00:56:17,120
Speaker 1: get in. Just name you know anybody involved in the show,

941
00:56:17,360 --> 00:56:19,759
Speaker 1: or a topic or whatever you want, just so we

942
00:56:19,800 --> 00:56:22,680
Speaker 1: know that you're actually real, um and and you're in

943
00:56:22,760 --> 00:56:25,200
Speaker 1: a lot of cool conversations there and meme exchanges and

944
00:56:25,320 --> 00:56:28,360
Speaker 1: a good group of folks on Here's where it gets crazy.

945
00:56:28,400 --> 00:56:30,759
Speaker 1: What else can they do? You can give us a call.

946
00:56:31,280 --> 00:56:35,080
Speaker 1: Our number is one eight three three s T d

947
00:56:35,280 --> 00:56:38,360
Speaker 1: W y t K. If you don't like social media,

948
00:56:38,480 --> 00:56:41,320
Speaker 1: if you don't like uh, if you don't cotton to

949
00:56:41,680 --> 00:56:44,520
Speaker 1: calling on the phone, but you have a story to

950
00:56:44,560 --> 00:56:46,279
Speaker 1: tell us, and I expect many of us in the

951
00:56:46,280 --> 00:56:49,880
Speaker 1: audience do have a story to share today. Please, please, please,

952
00:56:50,400 --> 00:56:53,080
Speaker 1: always remember that there is one last way you can

953
00:56:53,080 --> 00:56:56,400
Speaker 1: contact us any old time and day or night, the

954
00:56:56,440 --> 00:56:59,160
Speaker 1: waking world or the world of dreams. You can send

955
00:56:59,239 --> 00:57:03,399
Speaker 1: us a good old ash and email caveat asterix. If

956
00:57:03,440 --> 00:57:06,399
Speaker 1: you dream about sending us an email, just to make

957
00:57:06,440 --> 00:57:09,280
Speaker 1: sure it does go through, send one while you're awake

958
00:57:09,320 --> 00:57:32,040
Speaker 1: as well. Where we are conspiracy at iHeart radio dot com.

959
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:34,280
Speaker 1: Stuff they Don't Want You to Know is a production

960
00:57:34,320 --> 00:57:37,400
Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio,

961
00:57:37,560 --> 00:57:40,400
Speaker 1: visit the i Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever

962
00:57:40,480 --> 00:57:41,800
Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.