WEBVTT - Does your dog really love you? 0:00:03.800 --> 0:00:06.680 Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff 0:00:06.680 --> 0:00:13.920 Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. 0:00:13.960 --> 0:00:16.759 My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Julie Douglas. And 0:00:17.079 --> 0:00:21.160 you know, Julie, the title of today's podcast is does 0:00:21.239 --> 0:00:25.560 my dog really Love Me? Or something to that effects. Yeah, 0:00:25.600 --> 0:00:27.520 we just nailed it down, but over forgot it. But 0:00:27.520 --> 0:00:30.480 but the original title that I had pitched was your 0:00:30.520 --> 0:00:32.280 dog doesn't love you? And we decided not to go 0:00:32.320 --> 0:00:35.520 with that because, uh, it's it's a little anti dog 0:00:35.560 --> 0:00:37.000 and I didn't want to come up with this dog 0:00:37.040 --> 0:00:39.440 hating cat person. Well, and the jury is a little 0:00:39.479 --> 0:00:42.240 bit out on that, right. Yeah, we can't definitively say 0:00:42.280 --> 0:00:45.160 your dog doesn't love you, because there's some interesting data. 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:46.680 So I just want to point out that if you're 0:00:46.720 --> 0:00:49.839 Josh Clark, you can apparently definitively say that dogs are 0:00:49.920 --> 0:00:52.800 man's best friend and quote, even if you're strictly a 0:00:52.840 --> 0:00:55.600 bona fied cat lover, it's nearly impossible not to be 0:00:55.680 --> 0:00:58.600 moved by the brand of loyalty unique to dogs. That's 0:00:58.640 --> 0:01:02.760 from Josh's How to Work's article um is Our Dogs 0:01:02.800 --> 0:01:06.000 trully Man's Best Friends, which is worth reading but but, 0:01:06.000 --> 0:01:08.080 but Josh has a bit of a thing and for cats. 0:01:08.080 --> 0:01:09.520 I think he was licked by them as a child 0:01:09.600 --> 0:01:11.920 or something. I think so too, he was afraid they 0:01:11.920 --> 0:01:14.039 were going to steal his breath. Yeah, but but I 0:01:14.080 --> 0:01:16.560 admit I I tend to side more with the with 0:01:16.600 --> 0:01:20.160 the cat uh on the on the cat's side of 0:01:20.160 --> 0:01:22.480 of the old dogs versus cat's argument. And I'm not 0:01:22.480 --> 0:01:24.200 trying to stir up a big debate because I think 0:01:24.200 --> 0:01:27.000 there's a lot of crossover between the affinity we have 0:01:27.480 --> 0:01:33.040 for our animals and the the the the often ridiculous 0:01:33.120 --> 0:01:35.120 ideas we get in our head about what they are 0:01:35.200 --> 0:01:38.119 and what our relationship with him consists of. Oh, you're 0:01:38.120 --> 0:01:41.880 talking about anthropomorphosizing, where we project all of our feelings 0:01:41.959 --> 0:01:46.280 onto cat, dogs, sometimes a robot you name it. Yeah, 0:01:46.360 --> 0:01:48.400 And there's but the interesting things, there's been a lot 0:01:48.400 --> 0:01:51.520 of studies and exactly what's going on beyond beyond the 0:01:51.560 --> 0:01:56.280 whole This dog is my child, this dog is my friend, um, 0:01:56.320 --> 0:01:58.560 you know that they're There's been some actual studies into 0:01:58.560 --> 0:02:00.200 what's going on in the brain when we inter act 0:02:00.240 --> 0:02:02.800 with dogs. What's what's going on in the dog's brain 0:02:02.840 --> 0:02:06.200 when it's interacting with us, and uh and and and 0:02:06.520 --> 0:02:08.920 you know, there's no denying that these are amazing creatures. 0:02:08.960 --> 0:02:11.120 And in the relationship they have with us is is 0:02:11.160 --> 0:02:16.400 pretty bizarre. Uh and and and pretty incredible. They've You 0:02:16.480 --> 0:02:19.680 have you have a a a species that just lives 0:02:19.720 --> 0:02:24.200 throughout the world, often in luxurious environment. Well sometimes they're 0:02:24.200 --> 0:02:26.960 not so luxurious environments. But but you have some dogs 0:02:26.960 --> 0:02:30.200 that are really living well and and really benefiting from 0:02:30.240 --> 0:02:33.280 from all the fruits of human culture without actually having 0:02:33.360 --> 0:02:35.680 to do any work. Yeah, well, let me just spring 0:02:35.680 --> 0:02:38.280 this little stat on you. According to the Nova documentary 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:41.280 Dogs Decoded, there are more pet dogs than babies in 0:02:41.280 --> 0:02:46.200 the world, nearly half a billion. So yeah, of course 0:02:46.240 --> 0:02:49.880 they've got their own clothes and furniture, and you know, 0:02:50.000 --> 0:02:53.080 they've got their own little dinner plates. And according to 0:02:53.360 --> 0:02:58.079 um Um The World Without Us author Alan Wiseman, if 0:02:58.240 --> 0:03:01.160 humans civilization were to stop, tom most of these dogs 0:03:01.160 --> 0:03:04.760 would just vanish, because it's it's we'll not vanished, you know, 0:03:04.880 --> 0:03:06.920 like it's not like not like the you know, the 0:03:06.960 --> 0:03:09.280 Second Coming and the Rapture and all that. But but 0:03:09.320 --> 0:03:11.480 they would they would die out pretty because pretty steadily 0:03:11.560 --> 0:03:14.160 in most cases, because they wouldn't be able to support themselves. 0:03:14.200 --> 0:03:16.359 They wouldn't be able to feed themselves in the environment 0:03:16.680 --> 0:03:19.160 like that depend on Yeah, they depended on us. I 0:03:19.160 --> 0:03:21.720 mean likewise with the cats, most a lot of the 0:03:21.720 --> 0:03:24.200 cats would die and others would just become feral because 0:03:24.240 --> 0:03:27.040 we've created these these artificial environments and we've propped up 0:03:27.080 --> 0:03:30.000 these these species and allow them to just run wild, 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:32.560 you know, around the world, even if running wild is 0:03:32.560 --> 0:03:34.840 only in your living room, in your backyard, right right, 0:03:35.120 --> 0:03:37.000 I mean we can't help it because we look at 0:03:37.040 --> 0:03:39.920 these dogs, we look at puppies, and we instantly feel 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:44.440 a connection. Right. We already know that this is scientifically proven. Yes, 0:03:44.760 --> 0:03:48.400 we've in fact, we've we've seen the release of oxytocin 0:03:48.480 --> 0:03:52.440 in the brain when well in two cases. One when 0:03:52.440 --> 0:03:54.400 we're just interacting with their dogs and we're making a 0:03:55.920 --> 0:04:01.360 long gaze um eye interaction, which is like we lock eyes. Yeah. 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:04.320 There's a two thousand and nine um Japanese study and 0:04:04.360 --> 0:04:06.680 they took fifty five dog owners, all right, they brought 0:04:06.720 --> 0:04:09.080 them in and they had all the dog owners peanut 0:04:09.120 --> 0:04:11.920 up and then they tested that sounds nice, tested the 0:04:12.040 --> 0:04:15.920 urine for oxytocin levels, and then they put them in 0:04:15.960 --> 0:04:18.080 the playroom, let them play with their dogs all right, 0:04:18.080 --> 0:04:20.400 and then they observed how they're interacting with their pets. 0:04:20.839 --> 0:04:22.640 Then the dog owners came back in and they took 0:04:22.640 --> 0:04:25.400 another yearine sample um which I guess they had to 0:04:25.440 --> 0:04:27.359 have a drink while they're in there playing with their dogs. 0:04:27.960 --> 0:04:30.080 I don't think i'd be able to go twice like that. 0:04:30.560 --> 0:04:33.719 And and and they were able. And they also had 0:04:33.760 --> 0:04:36.360 a control group where some owners sat in a room 0:04:36.400 --> 0:04:38.480 with their dog and we're told to completely avoid looking 0:04:38.520 --> 0:04:41.760 at their animal. So uh so that that they found 0:04:41.760 --> 0:04:46.160 that that there was a increase in oxytocin levels. And 0:04:46.160 --> 0:04:49.240 the people who made long gaze eye contact with their dog, 0:04:49.320 --> 0:04:52.200 that's where they're looking on average, you know, two and 0:04:52.200 --> 0:04:56.040 a half minutes of eye contact during play. And uh 0:04:56.240 --> 0:04:59.080 and and so the people were benefiting from this, from 0:04:59.080 --> 0:05:02.040 this this relation ship. They're feeling really good about it. 0:05:02.040 --> 0:05:04.760 It's mutually beneficial to them. And then also we should 0:05:04.760 --> 0:05:06.960 talk a little bit about oxytocin. This is that feel 0:05:06.960 --> 0:05:10.320 good hormone that is released and a lot of people 0:05:10.560 --> 0:05:13.000 think about it more in the example of an infant 0:05:13.160 --> 0:05:15.880 and its mother during the breastfeeding process, because that's when 0:05:15.880 --> 0:05:19.640 oxytocin is released for for both um for both the 0:05:20.040 --> 0:05:22.880 mom and the baby, and they're both feeling all lovey 0:05:22.960 --> 0:05:26.320 dovey and content. And oxytocin is great because it's an 0:05:26.360 --> 0:05:29.840 incredible stress reducer. And they have actually found that people 0:05:29.960 --> 0:05:33.479 who are dog owners are less likely to have heart attacks. 0:05:33.480 --> 0:05:35.840 And if they do have a heart attack and they 0:05:35.839 --> 0:05:38.440 are a dog owner, they're three to four times more 0:05:38.560 --> 0:05:42.200 likely to actually survive that heart attack. That's how powerful 0:05:42.960 --> 0:05:46.760 oxytocin is and a possible reason why we feel such 0:05:46.800 --> 0:05:51.440 a bond to our animals, in particular dogs. Now, of 0:05:51.480 --> 0:05:53.880 course it's worth knowing that if you don't survive that 0:05:53.920 --> 0:05:57.480 heart attack, dogs are cats will probably eat your feet. 0:05:57.800 --> 0:06:00.400 But that's that just goes with the territory. Yeah, yeah, 0:06:00.400 --> 0:06:02.599 a very at least lick them. Yeah, well it starts 0:06:02.600 --> 0:06:04.480 with licking and then it becomes eating because they can't 0:06:04.520 --> 0:06:07.880 help themselves. This is the situation where they just then 0:06:07.920 --> 0:06:10.520 I'll go ferrell and yeah, and then then they go 0:06:10.680 --> 0:06:13.880 they go ferrell in the living room. Yeah, they run around. 0:06:14.120 --> 0:06:17.400 So you know, we know that the oxytocin and and 0:06:17.520 --> 0:06:19.760 this sort of connection makes us want to cuddle and 0:06:19.800 --> 0:06:24.040 care for them. And again and Nova's dogs decoded. There 0:06:24.120 --> 0:06:28.080 was a section um in which they featured psychologists Morton Kringelbach, 0:06:28.279 --> 0:06:30.320 and he put adults in a make scanner, which is 0:06:30.320 --> 0:06:34.599 like a supercharged neuroimager, and then he showed them photos 0:06:34.640 --> 0:06:38.680 of adult faces, infant faces, and puppy faces, nothing else, 0:06:38.760 --> 0:06:41.360 just like the big face looming in the background or 0:06:41.400 --> 0:06:44.760 without dark background. And what he found is that within 0:06:45.120 --> 0:06:48.800 one seventh of a second, their orbital frontal cortex, which 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:52.480 is involved in emotional responses, started to light up. And 0:06:52.720 --> 0:06:56.480 it showed activation only when people looked at infants and puppies, 0:06:56.680 --> 0:07:01.200 not other adults. And he called this that the parent instinct. Yeah, 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:03.480 or it's I mean, it's basically the cute factor. It's 0:07:03.480 --> 0:07:07.159 why people love like cute overload. It's why if you're 0:07:07.640 --> 0:07:09.640 if you like Peter or somebody, you're gonna put a 0:07:09.680 --> 0:07:12.920 baby seal on the cover of your your promotional material, 0:07:13.760 --> 0:07:16.200 or a half naked woman. But but but in many 0:07:16.200 --> 0:07:19.720 cases Green Piece or various organizations, you'll see that like 0:07:19.760 --> 0:07:22.200 the white baby seal is the one to put on 0:07:22.240 --> 0:07:24.280 because its face looks so much like an infant. You 0:07:24.280 --> 0:07:26.640 look at cute cartoon characters and you can see like 0:07:26.680 --> 0:07:29.920 the big eyes and the you know, in the small 0:07:30.000 --> 0:07:34.239 head and in the various uh um, some measurements that 0:07:34.280 --> 0:07:37.120 didn map up with a with a baby's face. Yeah. 0:07:37.160 --> 0:07:39.160 And you've actually even mentioned this when we've talked about 0:07:39.200 --> 0:07:43.200 robots and and having robots in the service industry, that 0:07:43.480 --> 0:07:46.640 they're in Japan, that they've got the really super cute 0:07:46.640 --> 0:07:49.800 looking robots that actually to us, look, you know us 0:07:49.840 --> 0:07:51.640 here in the West look kind of creepy because it 0:07:51.640 --> 0:07:55.560 does look like cartoon character giant robots. Um. But so yeah, 0:07:55.560 --> 0:07:59.200 there's there's definitely something to that. Um. So, I mean, 0:07:59.240 --> 0:08:02.120 there you go that the basis a very good scientific 0:08:02.160 --> 0:08:06.360 basis for why we feel the way we do about dogs. 0:08:06.400 --> 0:08:10.200 So Okay, we've got the bond with them, right, Um, 0:08:10.240 --> 0:08:12.520 and we know from fossil records that we have a 0:08:12.560 --> 0:08:16.480 really long history with dogs, right this, This didn't just 0:08:16.480 --> 0:08:18.400 start up in the last hundred years. Yeah, yeah, no, 0:08:18.480 --> 0:08:20.120 this is like a hundred thousand years ago. We can 0:08:20.200 --> 0:08:22.040 we know that we started to hang out with them, 0:08:22.200 --> 0:08:25.880 But why would we hook up with canine familiars anyway? Well, 0:08:25.920 --> 0:08:28.840 the most immediate um answer that comes to mind is 0:08:28.880 --> 0:08:31.280 that we're we're probably in a situation where we were 0:08:31.360 --> 0:08:34.720 either competing with the wolves for food, or the wolf 0:08:34.880 --> 0:08:38.360 or the wolves were food or both. And uh, and 0:08:38.400 --> 0:08:40.720 after you've killed a whole bunch of the adult wolves, 0:08:40.720 --> 0:08:43.560 you might find all these little baby, cuddly wolves, all right, 0:08:44.040 --> 0:08:46.520 and you go there and your first instinct, well, you 0:08:46.600 --> 0:08:49.800 probably have two competing instincts. One is, hey, let's fry 0:08:49.840 --> 0:08:54.520 these puppies up because there because because the tribe is hungry, 0:08:54.600 --> 0:08:56.520 and these look delicious. But then on the other hand, 0:08:56.800 --> 0:08:58.800 they look kind of like human babies. So it's your 0:08:58.840 --> 0:09:00.840 belly is full and your bellies full, and they're harmed. 0:09:00.840 --> 0:09:04.040 They're unlike the adult wolves you just strangled to death 0:09:04.080 --> 0:09:08.160 on the primeval plane, you know, or you know, are 0:09:08.200 --> 0:09:10.720 beat to death with a stone. Um. These things aren't 0:09:10.720 --> 0:09:13.320 attacking you. There may be licking your hand, and that 0:09:13.440 --> 0:09:15.160 they look cute. So you've been like, all right, let's 0:09:15.160 --> 0:09:16.679 take these back to the camp and play with them 0:09:16.679 --> 0:09:20.120 for a little bit. Yeah, and so this and then 0:09:20.520 --> 0:09:23.760 this sort of bond could have developed. And then all obviously, 0:09:24.000 --> 0:09:27.920 wolves we know are the closest relative to dogs, right, 0:09:28.120 --> 0:09:32.440 so at some point dogs separated from wolves. Um, so 0:09:32.480 --> 0:09:35.880 it's very likely that we began to see the wharf 0:09:35.920 --> 0:09:39.840 and having these little pups around that then became really 0:09:39.840 --> 0:09:42.760 good hunters along with us. And if you look at 0:09:42.800 --> 0:09:45.960 dog domestication, which happened around fift years ago, that's about 0:09:45.960 --> 0:09:49.600 the same time that we quit doing the whole nomadic 0:09:49.679 --> 0:09:52.800 hunter gatherer thing and switched over to being a grarian's 0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:56.200 so you know, then we're much more localized and it 0:09:56.320 --> 0:09:58.400 makes sense to have a dog around that can help 0:09:58.440 --> 0:10:02.600 you hunt. That's really fat us inefficient with with their 0:10:02.640 --> 0:10:05.679 own food consumption and how they use it as fuel, right, 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:07.640 so they don't have to eat a whole lot themselves 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:10.720 and they can guard right, right, and that in turn 0:10:10.880 --> 0:10:14.360 makes us much more successful as a species, right and 0:10:14.400 --> 0:10:17.520 you can and uh, it's also worth noting that there's 0:10:17.520 --> 0:10:20.600 a show on Discovery and BBC called Human Planet, and 0:10:20.640 --> 0:10:23.839 it's a great example of this whole um hunting and 0:10:24.200 --> 0:10:28.439 then raising the young kind of situation with the Owa 0:10:28.440 --> 0:10:33.120 Guagi Guaga people of the eastern Amazon, and they hunt 0:10:33.160 --> 0:10:36.040 and kill monkeys, which they eat and they make them 0:10:36.080 --> 0:10:40.760 do a delicious looking stewins. Well that's I don't know 0:10:40.760 --> 0:10:43.400 about eating brains, but they're definitely stewing up some monkeys. 0:10:43.920 --> 0:10:45.880 But then they'll bring the baby monkeys back to camp 0:10:45.920 --> 0:10:47.920 and they'll they'll not only raise them as pets, but 0:10:47.960 --> 0:10:50.880 in some cases they'll actually breastfeed the really young baby 0:10:50.920 --> 0:10:54.520 monkeys um, which is you know, even more than more 0:10:54.600 --> 0:10:58.880 oxy uh toastin released into the system through that. But 0:10:58.880 --> 0:11:01.800 but it's an interesting it's such an interesting glimpse into 0:11:02.080 --> 0:11:04.280 how humans work. Just the idea that you could on 0:11:04.280 --> 0:11:07.760 one hand kill and eat this particular species, but then 0:11:07.800 --> 0:11:09.560 also raise it up as a pet. And then they 0:11:09.720 --> 0:11:13.160 in this case, they don't actually eat um eat the 0:11:13.200 --> 0:11:16.120 monkeys that they raise pets, so there's a difference there. 0:11:16.120 --> 0:11:18.520 But but then you have situations, I mean, clearly you 0:11:18.559 --> 0:11:20.960 have people who are really attached to baby goats that 0:11:21.160 --> 0:11:23.880 may grow up to be become a food source. So 0:11:23.960 --> 0:11:26.040 that you see plenty of examples in human culture where 0:11:26.160 --> 0:11:29.079 where there's even this divide between the baby and the 0:11:29.440 --> 0:11:32.480 edible adult, it will become right. Yeah, And just to 0:11:32.480 --> 0:11:35.120 go back to oxytocin again, and I have read this 0:11:35.160 --> 0:11:40.080 before that it's it's actually pretty addictive um apparently for 0:11:40.080 --> 0:11:42.040 for new moms, and then it does give you a 0:11:42.040 --> 0:11:44.800 big rush. So it's sort of interesting that you know, 0:11:45.240 --> 0:11:50.319 you see those instances of surrogate um breastfeeding happening like 0:11:50.320 --> 0:11:53.280 like a wet nurse is could be an oxytocin addict. 0:11:53.280 --> 0:11:55.520 Really yeah, yeah, I mean you think it is an 0:11:55.559 --> 0:11:58.600 altruistic doct but you have to wonder, you know, if 0:11:58.640 --> 0:12:01.480 they're just doing it for the rush. So maybe you know, 0:12:01.600 --> 0:12:04.600 this is completely unproven, but but maybe the situation was 0:12:04.640 --> 0:12:08.559 we domesticated um dogs and are working on monkeys because 0:12:08.559 --> 0:12:11.720 you have, like you have these these oxytocin addicted nurse 0:12:11.720 --> 0:12:13.800 maids who are running wild through the woods and give 0:12:13.840 --> 0:12:16.280 me some puppies. Let me breastfeed some puppies, you know, 0:12:16.280 --> 0:12:18.680 because I gotta get that rush. Wow, I'm saying, like 0:12:18.720 --> 0:12:22.720 this pulp fiction movie like set fift years ago, I'm yeah, 0:12:22.920 --> 0:12:27.120 thinking about Darryl Hannah now as as a crazy wit nurse. 0:12:27.240 --> 0:12:29.360 This is not good. Yeah, and we gotta get back. Yeah, 0:12:29.400 --> 0:12:31.400 that's totally unproven. Do not use that as an answer. 0:12:31.600 --> 0:12:35.600 We gotta get back your students. Yeah. But but then 0:12:35.640 --> 0:12:38.600 another reason that we would hang out with canines and 0:12:38.640 --> 0:12:41.120 domesticate them is their sense of smell, which again would 0:12:41.120 --> 0:12:45.040 help with hunting um and in fact, cancers apparently have 0:12:45.320 --> 0:12:48.440 a smell that dogs can be trained to detect according 0:12:48.480 --> 0:12:53.000 to a growing body of research. Um and actually they've 0:12:53.080 --> 0:12:55.600 had some small trials which have shown canines capable of 0:12:55.640 --> 0:12:58.480 detecting melanoma in a person's skin and lung and breast 0:12:58.520 --> 0:13:02.160 cancers by chemical que was in the person's breath. The trick, 0:13:02.240 --> 0:13:06.480 according to Auburn University veterinarian Larry Myers, is the ability 0:13:06.520 --> 0:13:09.640 of dogs to smell the multiple layers of chemicals. So 0:13:09.720 --> 0:13:12.880 it's so much more nuanced and sophisticated rather than the 0:13:12.880 --> 0:13:15.480 way that we detect smells. They've they've got a lot 0:13:15.480 --> 0:13:19.360 more parts to their system, so to speak. So all 0:13:19.400 --> 0:13:21.120 of this adds up to the fact that we that 0:13:21.120 --> 0:13:23.960 that dogs have definitely helped us to become successful and 0:13:24.000 --> 0:13:27.640 our survival and and certainly dogs themselves have become very 0:13:27.679 --> 0:13:31.000 successful in their survival right. And it's it's interesting to 0:13:31.000 --> 0:13:33.920 to look at, Okay, just on the surface things. Dogs 0:13:33.960 --> 0:13:38.199 definitely have emotion, whether whether or not they can there's 0:13:38.240 --> 0:13:40.640 this thing called love, and they can feel it. That's 0:13:40.720 --> 0:13:44.439 that's a different issue. But but definitely emotion is it 0:13:44.559 --> 0:13:47.840 has evolved as an adaptation and numerous species. Uh. It 0:13:47.920 --> 0:13:52.280 bonds animals to one another. It catalyzes and regulates a 0:13:52.320 --> 0:13:55.920 wide variety of social encounters among both friends and competitors, 0:13:56.040 --> 0:14:00.079 and it permits animals to protect themselves adaptively. And with 0:14:00.120 --> 0:14:03.200 the dogs that the curious thing is that dogs have 0:14:03.360 --> 0:14:06.760 are much more social and say cats because I mean, 0:14:07.120 --> 0:14:09.400 like my cat doesn't want any part of another cat 0:14:10.120 --> 0:14:12.880 except to chase them off and uh, and they're just 0:14:12.920 --> 0:14:15.240 not social for some reason. It may want to live 0:14:15.280 --> 0:14:17.520 with she man want to live with humans. But the 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.000 heck with all the cats, dogs however, much more social. 0:14:20.120 --> 0:14:22.840 They have a much more social mind and uh. And 0:14:22.880 --> 0:14:26.880 therefore there's this they have this whole alpha uh situation 0:14:26.920 --> 0:14:29.120 where one alpha can dominate the others and there's this 0:14:29.200 --> 0:14:31.360 dominant and passive thing in there. And then the way 0:14:31.360 --> 0:14:35.080 they behave so we've been able to interject ourselves into 0:14:35.120 --> 0:14:39.160 their into this this uh, this this system where we 0:14:39.200 --> 0:14:41.880 can eat where we either become the dominant master of 0:14:41.920 --> 0:14:44.520 the dogs or we become this thing that the dog 0:14:44.640 --> 0:14:49.480 is possessive of. Um, which is generally not the ideal situation, 0:14:49.520 --> 0:14:51.960 but you see it all the time. Yeah, and that's 0:14:51.960 --> 0:14:54.720 interesting again to draw those parallels and see how we 0:14:54.800 --> 0:14:57.680 are more alike than different than dogs in the sense 0:14:57.680 --> 0:15:01.240 that we are really social creatures, and certainly fifteen years 0:15:01.240 --> 0:15:04.240 ago we were you know, carnivorous. Um, not all of 0:15:04.320 --> 0:15:08.920 us are now, but and we really relied on hunting. Yeah. 0:15:09.040 --> 0:15:11.280 So same thing with dogs, right, Yeah, you had this 0:15:11.440 --> 0:15:14.080 suddenly this dogs like growing up among people, and there's 0:15:14.120 --> 0:15:15.960 this this guy and he's like saying, hey, I'm the 0:15:16.000 --> 0:15:18.200 pack leader. Let's go catch ourselves some food, and the 0:15:18.240 --> 0:15:20.120 dogs like, yeah, I'm game for that. That's totally what 0:15:20.160 --> 0:15:22.280 I've evolved to do. So let's yeah, let's let's make 0:15:22.280 --> 0:15:24.600 it happen. And by the wather like thirty of you guys, 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:27.840 five of us. Yeah, you guys have the clubs, you 0:15:27.880 --> 0:15:30.760 can be the pack master. Fine, you know so part 0:15:30.760 --> 0:15:32.160 of it is like you kind of wonder how much 0:15:32.160 --> 0:15:34.960 the dogs are going along in their own survival. Yeah, 0:15:35.240 --> 0:15:37.440 and then you you get into all this uh, this, 0:15:37.440 --> 0:15:39.440 this these other weird areas who were like you take 0:15:39.480 --> 0:15:42.720 a dog's natural hunting instinct and then you you you 0:15:42.800 --> 0:15:45.880 kind of perverted over the over the ages to to 0:15:45.960 --> 0:15:48.240 create say a hurting animal where you're like saying, hey, 0:15:48.240 --> 0:15:50.720 you guys are really good at catching these animals, but 0:15:51.080 --> 0:15:54.920 let's work on you not killing them, but just moving 0:15:54.920 --> 0:15:57.720 them around, uh, in exactly the place I want them 0:15:57.760 --> 0:16:01.160 to be, right, yeah, when you're talking you gent x right, 0:16:01.240 --> 0:16:04.160 yeah yeah, so yeah, I mean actually eugenics became pretty 0:16:04.200 --> 0:16:07.520 popular in nineteenth century Europe, right, So there's this drive 0:16:07.600 --> 0:16:11.920 to perfect and design our environments, including pets, and of 0:16:11.920 --> 0:16:15.920 course you have this sort of newish technology too, and eugenics, um, 0:16:15.960 --> 0:16:19.120 so they applied that to dogs through selective breeding. So 0:16:19.320 --> 0:16:21.640 you're like, in the scenario you were talking about, that's 0:16:21.640 --> 0:16:26.160 like a border collie, right, um. And so this allowed 0:16:26.240 --> 0:16:29.480 us to to basically breed out traits and breeding traits 0:16:29.520 --> 0:16:32.760 as you said, and and and you know, of course 0:16:32.800 --> 0:16:36.200 now we have our little tiny um toy poodles and 0:16:36.280 --> 0:16:38.520 every from that to like a mastiff, right, and you 0:16:38.560 --> 0:16:40.600 can take everything in between and sort of mush it 0:16:40.680 --> 0:16:42.800 up and see which you can get. So it is 0:16:42.840 --> 0:16:47.400 amazing to think that right now, um, of dog breeds 0:16:47.400 --> 0:16:50.840 are modern breeds that we created. So that's four hundred 0:16:50.920 --> 0:16:59.280 genetically distinct dog breeds. This presentation is brought to you 0:16:59.320 --> 0:17:07.120 by Intel Sponsors of Tomorrow. So in many of these cases, 0:17:07.160 --> 0:17:11.719 we are breeding, selectively breeding animals to encourage particular traits 0:17:12.359 --> 0:17:15.760 that that allow them to perform a task, and as 0:17:15.800 --> 0:17:20.280 those tasks disappear, we end up then in breeding them 0:17:20.320 --> 0:17:25.159 selectively to encourage physical traits that we identify with that 0:17:25.240 --> 0:17:28.840 particular breed. Right, so you have like situations like with boxers, 0:17:28.840 --> 0:17:31.560 where you no longer actually need boxers to perform the 0:17:31.760 --> 0:17:34.080 task they were bred for, and instead you just breathe 0:17:34.119 --> 0:17:36.680 them to look even more and more like a cartoon 0:17:36.840 --> 0:17:40.640 character of themselves in the ring. Yeah, and then there's 0:17:40.680 --> 0:17:43.960 the there's the whole the longer the ring. Um. I 0:17:43.960 --> 0:17:48.280 believe they were used to control cattle and like, I 0:17:48.280 --> 0:17:51.560 think it's like slaughterhouse situation. Um, so we have robots 0:17:51.600 --> 0:17:53.160 for that now, So instead you're just like, hey, let's 0:17:53.160 --> 0:17:54.560 breed them, make them look funny and stand on the 0:17:54.560 --> 0:17:58.360 side of a football field. Likewise, even with with with 0:17:58.400 --> 0:18:02.880 the with with sheep herding dog, like my my family 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:05.719 has a as a herding dog and they don't have 0:18:05.920 --> 0:18:08.360 sheep or anything. So the dog just loves to run 0:18:08.359 --> 0:18:10.760 around and barket trees and attempt to herd things like 0:18:10.800 --> 0:18:16.080 tractors or or branches in a tree or hawks flying overhead, 0:18:16.520 --> 0:18:18.879 and and you just think, wow, we've really screwed this 0:18:18.880 --> 0:18:21.479 one up. We we we've we've we've taken this animal's 0:18:21.520 --> 0:18:24.720 natural hunting instinct turned it into something that benefits us 0:18:24.800 --> 0:18:27.840 and then say all right, we're eliminating that job. But 0:18:27.960 --> 0:18:31.800 you guys stick around and uh and just go crazy. Yeah, 0:18:31.880 --> 0:18:34.040 And that's actually where the problem comes in, right, because 0:18:34.400 --> 0:18:35.959 I mean, you know, it sounds like in this scenario, 0:18:36.040 --> 0:18:38.479 at least your dog can go out and hang out 0:18:38.520 --> 0:18:40.800 in the yard, but some of those types of dogs 0:18:40.800 --> 0:18:42.800 are you know, confined to apartments and they just go 0:18:42.920 --> 0:18:46.000 run and running circles and basically then the next thing 0:18:46.040 --> 0:18:49.000 you know, they're on zoloft. So um. But what allows 0:18:49.040 --> 0:18:51.119 us to do this to to breed these traits is 0:18:51.160 --> 0:18:54.959 that they have such a great plasticity of jeans, and 0:18:55.080 --> 0:18:58.040 it takes just twenty five years to create some sort 0:18:58.040 --> 0:19:01.480 of breed that you want, which, if you've get evolutionary terms, 0:19:01.560 --> 0:19:06.280 is like supercharged evolution in a sense, right. Um. And 0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:08.960 there's actually a good example of this is a dog 0:19:09.000 --> 0:19:12.959 called the dogo Argentino and it has something like, you know, 0:19:13.160 --> 0:19:16.600 twelve different breeds that they tinkered with over two and 0:19:16.680 --> 0:19:20.160 a half decades to create the perfect dog that could 0:19:20.160 --> 0:19:23.560 take down wild boars. Without killing the boars, but could 0:19:23.560 --> 0:19:27.440 also hang out with kids, you know, and be all cuddly. Wow, 0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:29.800 that was an interesting checklist when they were putting that 0:19:29.800 --> 0:19:31.800 one together. It's like, I needed to be able to 0:19:31.840 --> 0:19:34.120 take down a boar, but I wanted to hang out 0:19:34.119 --> 0:19:36.400 with my kid too. Yeah, And in twenty five years 0:19:36.440 --> 0:19:39.040 and and and and taking everything from like a mastiff too. 0:19:39.560 --> 0:19:42.520 I think there was actually, um, maybe a bull terrier 0:19:42.520 --> 0:19:45.159 in there somewhere in the mix, and just tinkering around 0:19:45.200 --> 0:19:47.879 with it, and then finally they had something that Again, 0:19:48.240 --> 0:19:50.880 this was helping them at the time because they really 0:19:50.920 --> 0:19:53.320 didn't have this wild boar problem that was eating all 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:55.160 the crops, and so they wanted to take them down 0:19:55.160 --> 0:19:58.040 without killing them. And this was a good solution. But 0:19:58.080 --> 0:20:00.480 it's also a little bit frightening to that we could 0:20:00.720 --> 0:20:03.880 do this to such a degree, right, hence the eugenics part, 0:20:03.920 --> 0:20:07.760 which you know, that's a whole other two sides to 0:20:07.800 --> 0:20:10.399 the eugenics coin for sure. Yeah. Yeah. And then of 0:20:10.400 --> 0:20:13.040 course the other problem with this, or you know, a 0:20:13.040 --> 0:20:17.280 problem in the sense when it's not used, um perhaps 0:20:17.280 --> 0:20:20.880 with the best of ethical intentions, is when you have 0:20:20.960 --> 0:20:24.680 someone who's a disreputable breeder who is continuing to breed 0:20:25.040 --> 0:20:28.439 so aggressively that there are a lot of defects that 0:20:29.040 --> 0:20:31.560 the dog might be born with. Right do you end 0:20:31.640 --> 0:20:37.480 up with in some cases a genetic neurological problems? Um, Like, 0:20:37.560 --> 0:20:40.080 for instance, there's the whole feigning goat thing. Um if 0:20:40.080 --> 0:20:42.439 you're anyone familiar with the feigning goat, these are goats 0:20:42.480 --> 0:20:45.800 that they just happened to uh through breathing. They have 0:20:45.880 --> 0:20:49.040 this neurological condition where they'll you'll frighten them and they'll 0:20:49.040 --> 0:20:53.359 fall over. And for a number of reasons, people decided 0:20:53.359 --> 0:20:55.560 that the breeders decided, hey, let's keep let's keep this. 0:20:55.560 --> 0:20:57.440 This is a good trait to having a dog, even 0:20:57.440 --> 0:20:59.399 though it's it's not really i mean, in a goat, 0:20:59.440 --> 0:21:01.480