1 00:00:01,880 --> 00:00:05,240 Speaker 1: Hello, I'm Scott Suck, I'm Evan Novie Williams and Michael 2 00:00:05,280 --> 00:00:08,680 Speaker 1: Barr and this is the Bloomberg Business of Sports podcast 3 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:15,040 Speaker 1: where we with no Eben again he did it when 4 00:00:15,080 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 1: it was just we'll take that personally. We're gonna discuss 5 00:00:21,440 --> 00:00:25,760 Speaker 1: some of the big topics in sports. Forbes magazine says, 6 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:30,320 Speaker 1: now every team is worth at least a billion dollars 7 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:33,519 Speaker 1: in three of the four major food groups, in the NFL, 8 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:38,080 Speaker 1: in the Major League Baseball, and in the NBA. Yes, 9 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:40,560 Speaker 1: you're not surprised that hockey might have a few teams 10 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:43,919 Speaker 1: that are not worth a billion, simply based on the 11 00:00:43,960 --> 00:00:46,080 Speaker 1: media deal in the United States, which could change, by 12 00:00:46,080 --> 00:00:48,240 Speaker 1: the way, And then I would predict the next media deal, 13 00:00:48,880 --> 00:00:50,879 Speaker 1: they're gonna get very close. Every team will be very 14 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: close to a billion dollars based on the numbers in 15 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:56,279 Speaker 1: the new deal. But though I went, I went right 16 00:00:56,280 --> 00:01:02,279 Speaker 1: away to Major League Baseball, I went right to the bottom, 17 00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:07,040 Speaker 1: and there they were the Miami Marlins. Average attendants seven, 18 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:16,080 Speaker 1: um worth one billion dollars. Derek Jita number two. Um, yeah, 19 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:18,280 Speaker 1: I mean, once the Marlins hit a billion, it's no 20 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:22,040 Speaker 1: surprise that everybody else is there. You just wonder again 21 00:01:22,360 --> 00:01:25,760 Speaker 1: what is driving the valuations, and of course that's the 22 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:32,280 Speaker 1: media deals, and with the scalability of digital, it's gonna 23 00:01:32,319 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 1: be interesting to see how high these go and what 24 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:38,320 Speaker 1: the trickle down effect is in terms of how many 25 00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:40,720 Speaker 1: people can afford to buy them. Does the NFL need 26 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:42,800 Speaker 1: to change the rule because there aren't enough billionaires like 27 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 1: David Tepper willing to pay for the Panthers? So ramifications, 28 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:51,440 Speaker 1: But bar we're there three of the four majors, every 29 00:01:51,440 --> 00:01:55,240 Speaker 1: single team. It's two things. I mean, certainly the media 30 00:01:55,320 --> 00:01:58,880 Speaker 1: rights is one piece, and the scarcity value of them 31 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 1: is also a massive one right there. There's not occasionally 32 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:04,640 Speaker 1: these leagues expand, but for the most part, you know, 33 00:02:04,640 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 1: we're stuck at a finite number of these things. Yeah, 34 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:09,880 Speaker 1: I still wonder whether we're going to get to a 35 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: point when when the tire kickers. If something, let's say, 36 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:17,320 Speaker 1: what most people would consider a less than ideal franchise 37 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:20,760 Speaker 1: comes up for sale, do we get folks jumping at 38 00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:25,320 Speaker 1: it at this time now that the valuations are so high, 39 00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:30,520 Speaker 1: or do they say, you know, maybe I don't need 40 00:02:30,600 --> 00:02:32,800 Speaker 1: to be in so badly. I'm going to wait for 41 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:35,320 Speaker 1: a better situation. And if it doesn't happen for me, 42 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 1: it doesn't happen. Well, we recently. I mean, the the 43 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:41,000 Speaker 1: NFL is a behemoth as a league in this world 44 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:43,000 Speaker 1: as well. But you know, the Panthers were up for 45 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:45,200 Speaker 1: sale a year and a half ago or so, and 46 00:02:45,200 --> 00:02:48,799 Speaker 1: and there were a number of multiple different sets of 47 00:02:48,800 --> 00:02:51,840 Speaker 1: of pretty you know, depocketed bidders who were interested in 48 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 1: that sale. And the Panthers are probably a middle to 49 00:02:55,080 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 1: bottom middle franchise and the but it's the NFL. Sure, yeah, 50 00:03:00,400 --> 00:03:02,520 Speaker 1: that makes that's the big deal. But it's the NFL. 51 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: And you and I think agree that Roger Goodell's eyeing 52 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:10,960 Speaker 1: the billion is not that far fetched. So valuations will 53 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:13,000 Speaker 1: continue to ride. Yeah, just to make it clear for 54 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:16,840 Speaker 1: for readers and informs magazines, fifty most valuable franchises. Twenty 55 00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 1: six of them are NFL teams, uh, Seven of them 56 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:21,680 Speaker 1: are Major League Baseball teams, nine of them are NBA teams, 57 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 1: and eight of them are soccer teams. Uh. The NBA 58 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:26,080 Speaker 1: has made it a we talked about a lot on 59 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:27,560 Speaker 1: the show. It has made an amazing jump here. In 60 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 1: two thousand twelve, the most valuable NBA NBA team was 61 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:34,120 Speaker 1: thirty five on the list internationally. Now it's the Knicks 62 00:03:34,160 --> 00:03:36,240 Speaker 1: in their fifth one well left Jimmy Dolan if you must. 63 00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:40,200 Speaker 1: But well, but let me take it on a lower level. 64 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 1: And just a recent story about ten Cent about how 65 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:47,839 Speaker 1: they are getting into with the NBA two K and 66 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:51,720 Speaker 1: they're doing the streaming of the e sports and more 67 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:56,320 Speaker 1: importantly they also stream some of the live NBA games. 68 00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:01,600 Speaker 1: When is this going to expand to the NFL or 69 00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: in terms of the sports. And also, I mean like Madden. Yeah, 70 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:08,640 Speaker 1: what I'm saying, I mean, but no, I get that, 71 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 1: But I mean, are they you know, are you going 72 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: to see more like remember when you saw the NFL 73 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:20,280 Speaker 1: skins in Fortnite? Yes, and amazingly that was a case 74 00:04:20,320 --> 00:04:23,599 Speaker 1: of the NFL needing Fortnite more than Fortnite needing the NFL. 75 00:04:24,040 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 1: So yes, they are looking for opportunities to broaden the 76 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 1: fan base to the tykes who hang out on the 77 00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 1: video game platforms, who are looking at their phones all day, 78 00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:39,279 Speaker 1: who are looking at the hypepads all day, who have 79 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:42,720 Speaker 1: never ever ever had cable. Yeah, they're they're they're looking 80 00:04:42,720 --> 00:04:44,280 Speaker 1: at that direct. To be clear, I don't think much 81 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:46,560 Speaker 1: of any of these NBA teams value is driven by 82 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:50,040 Speaker 1: the fact that they have sports franchises. But I do 83 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 1: also think that you know, at some point in the 84 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:55,400 Speaker 1: near future, we may see any sports team, maybe not 85 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 1: on the top fifty list, but you know, there are 86 00:04:57,680 --> 00:04:59,440 Speaker 1: the sports teams out there that are that are trying 87 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 1: to raise money, evaluations higher than so many HL teams. Right. So, 88 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 1: so we're already at the point where the sports, the 89 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:10,200 Speaker 1: big franchises are in the hundreds of millions of dollars um. 90 00:05:10,240 --> 00:05:12,400 Speaker 1: So you know we'll see them start to creep up. 91 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 1: Are we're excited for Fortnite World Cup? Yes? I was, 92 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 1: and and my son was excited for it. Believe it 93 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:22,080 Speaker 1: or not, it hasn't happened. Well, no, he's excited for 94 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:27,400 Speaker 1: it because he's been practicing. You're taking him because that 95 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: requires me getting yeah, and it requires me getting off 96 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:35,920 Speaker 1: the couch. So he's excited about it. You know, it's something. 97 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:38,280 Speaker 1: But I will say this about Fortnite, and he said 98 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:40,440 Speaker 1: this too. And now keep in mind, my son is 99 00:05:40,440 --> 00:05:44,400 Speaker 1: fourteen years old. He's saying that some of the luster 100 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:48,679 Speaker 1: a Fortnight is starting to Yeah, my son said yesterday 101 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:50,560 Speaker 1: he said, I'm not playing so much Fortnit anymore. I'm 102 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:52,880 Speaker 1: playing roadblocks and some other stuff. Yeah, that's where my 103 00:05:52,920 --> 00:05:56,800 Speaker 1: son played Roadblock. My goodness. It's always the always, the 104 00:05:56,839 --> 00:05:59,480 Speaker 1: concern for for people who are investing within games in 105 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:01,400 Speaker 1: the sports is that you know, you can hit a 106 00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:04,000 Speaker 1: stretch where a game is super popular and then you know, 107 00:06:04,279 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: flash forward three months and no one's playing it again, 108 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:08,520 Speaker 1: and and and a lot of your investment has been 109 00:06:08,560 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 1: for not one other quick question actually on the on 110 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:15,040 Speaker 1: the valuations. The most valuable team in the world the 111 00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboys five billion dollars. They have the third largest 112 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:22,360 Speaker 1: NFC title drought in football. The Knicks are the most 113 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:28,000 Speaker 1: valuable NBA team four billion dollars. Doesn't when not only 114 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 1: does winning not matter, I'm wondering if for a lot 115 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:33,599 Speaker 1: of these teams, if franchise valuation was essentially baked into 116 00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 1: the cake two decades ago, right, Like, these were teams 117 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:40,080 Speaker 1: that we're successful at one point in the nineties and 118 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:43,680 Speaker 1: grew exponentially at that time. Yeah, but you gotta you 119 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:46,719 Speaker 1: also have to know it's impossible for for them to 120 00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 1: not stay up here. Yeah, but you gotta give credit 121 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:51,880 Speaker 1: to folks like Jerry Jones. You can't just say, well, 122 00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:55,120 Speaker 1: it's a byproduct of him being in Texas and he 123 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:57,400 Speaker 1: owns an NFL team, and he gets all that shared 124 00:06:57,440 --> 00:07:00,040 Speaker 1: money because the difference maker for the Dallas Cowboy is 125 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:04,360 Speaker 1: actually the local revenue. And Jerry almost went bankrupt buying 126 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:07,679 Speaker 1: that team, and he fought the NFL, he sued the NFL, 127 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:12,360 Speaker 1: and Jerry, more than anybody else, keeps a bucket of 128 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 1: the suites and the local revenue. He doesn't have to 129 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:18,440 Speaker 1: share that with the others. So kudos to Jerry for 130 00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:21,360 Speaker 1: actually building the better mouse trap and being able to 131 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 1: capitalize on what he saw was sort of this this 132 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:28,800 Speaker 1: feverish passion for football in his area. Would you say 133 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:33,280 Speaker 1: the same of Dolan? I would say Jim is lucky 134 00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 1: in a sense that he's in a market where there's 135 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 1: so much corporate, wealthy, corporate support that I don't believe 136 00:07:41,760 --> 00:07:45,160 Speaker 1: his His sales team has to work all that hard 137 00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:48,640 Speaker 1: to renew the suites and the front row seats, and 138 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 1: Madison Madison Square Garden, for better or worse, in terms 139 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 1: of Nick performance, is still a place to be seen 140 00:07:55,680 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 1: on even a Tuesday night against pick a team, cause 141 00:08:01,240 --> 00:08:05,680 Speaker 1: the NBA, being that star driven league, you always want 142 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:08,840 Speaker 1: to be there. When Colby came to town. You want 143 00:08:08,880 --> 00:08:13,120 Speaker 1: to be there when Durant Westbrook hardened on and on 144 00:08:13,200 --> 00:08:15,760 Speaker 1: and on. You want to see them the New Jersey nets. 145 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 1: And I'm saying New Jersey because I'm not. I don't 146 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:20,160 Speaker 1: mean the Brooklyn nets. When they were in New Jersey. 147 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:22,960 Speaker 1: The billboards along the Turnpike used to market the visiting teams. 148 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 1: They used to give away Jersey to the visiting team 149 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:27,120 Speaker 1: was like, come see Shack in the Orlando Magic because 150 00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:30,680 Speaker 1: they knew they were so bad at Madison Square Garden. 151 00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:33,440 Speaker 1: That's still the only opportunity. But no, I mean, I 152 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:36,240 Speaker 1: know Brooklyn isn't possibility as well, but there is such 153 00:08:36,320 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 1: big corporate support for that arena that is still the 154 00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:43,079 Speaker 1: place to be seen when James Harden comes in and 155 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 1: maybe drops fifty. And I assume you'd say the same 156 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 1: thing about the Lakers and another team that is tremendously 157 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:53,160 Speaker 1: valuable and has been bad competitively, at least recently. Yeah, 158 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:55,520 Speaker 1: well this is the thing again. And I don't mind 159 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 1: talking about this even longer than we intended. It's pat 160 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:01,400 Speaker 1: It's not it's not a surprise that pat Riley, of 161 00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:04,600 Speaker 1: course came up with the Lakers and then went to 162 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:08,400 Speaker 1: Miami Heat. It's it's similar in that to draw in 163 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 1: those two locales, you have got to be an attraction. 164 00:09:12,040 --> 00:09:15,160 Speaker 1: There's so much to do in South Beach and in 165 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:19,200 Speaker 1: Miami that you are competing against so many things. Why 166 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:21,000 Speaker 1: do you think it wasn't just to win. It wasn't 167 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:24,120 Speaker 1: enough for the Miami Heat to win. He had to 168 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:27,800 Speaker 1: go get Shaquille O'Neill. He had to go get Lebron 169 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:32,600 Speaker 1: James and Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh because it needs 170 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:36,320 Speaker 1: to be the sizzle. That's what people want. It's the 171 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:38,640 Speaker 1: event to go be there. They figure like you're missing 172 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 1: out if you're not there. It's the place to be. 173 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:44,040 Speaker 1: It's the same in l A. There was showtime and 174 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 1: I said, all the time, there's showtime. And then they 175 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 1: went through slow time and that place was not full. 176 00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:52,679 Speaker 1: And it is not immune to a downturn simply because 177 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:55,160 Speaker 1: it's the l A Lakers. They better put a product 178 00:09:55,160 --> 00:09:57,959 Speaker 1: on the floor. Not only that, but they better put 179 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:01,199 Speaker 1: some star power in it. And what do you got now? 180 00:10:01,240 --> 00:10:04,040 Speaker 1: Slow time was a little ephemal thing there. Now you've 181 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:07,439 Speaker 1: got Lebron and a d Yeah, darn right. People want 182 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: to go and be seen there. So it's not just 183 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:12,080 Speaker 1: a matter of rolling the ball out in some of 184 00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:14,840 Speaker 1: these places. You've got to give people a reason to come. 185 00:10:15,760 --> 00:10:21,280 Speaker 1: Let's talk about shifting gears Zion Williamson. And probably one 186 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:23,720 Speaker 1: of the best things that ever happened to this young 187 00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:27,120 Speaker 1: man was when he blew out a sneaker during the 188 00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 1: Duke game and uh University of North Carolina, I believe 189 00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 1: and uh now he assigned a deal with Nike because 190 00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:41,000 Speaker 1: he had a lot of leverage. Involved seventy five million 191 00:10:41,080 --> 00:10:43,400 Speaker 1: dollars in a sneakers But this is your your thing. 192 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 1: But let me jump in here. That's the popular narrative. 193 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:49,840 Speaker 1: But if it's true that the Chinese sneaker makers, we're 194 00:10:49,880 --> 00:10:54,480 Speaker 1: offering more money, then didn't matter that he stepped out 195 00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:57,120 Speaker 1: of his shoe in an Ashley televised game against North Carolina. 196 00:10:57,320 --> 00:10:59,439 Speaker 1: They need they wanted him, they needed the money was 197 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,160 Speaker 1: going to be there, and clearly Nike didn't blow him 198 00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:04,480 Speaker 1: out of the water. Didn't say we we have to 199 00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:07,600 Speaker 1: top all offers to get them. So is the popular 200 00:11:07,679 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 1: narrative accurate? Well, those both can be accurate. I mean, 201 00:11:10,760 --> 00:11:13,640 Speaker 1: Nike could have increased what it was willing to offer 202 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:16,640 Speaker 1: him and still not have been. It seems like if 203 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:21,080 Speaker 1: you look at their lineage of deals, this is sub Lebron. 204 00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:23,240 Speaker 1: I mean, if you're looking at their lineage of deals, 205 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:27,440 Speaker 1: this seems to fall within the range you would have expected. Yeah, 206 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 1: I think roughly ten million dollars a year. It was 207 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:32,000 Speaker 1: kind of what people were expecting. I mean, I think 208 00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:35,400 Speaker 1: it is clear that Nike bent over backwards for him 209 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:37,680 Speaker 1: after his shoe exploded. Right, They sent a team to Durham. 210 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:39,800 Speaker 1: They sent that same team to China. You know, they 211 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 1: built a shoe that they thought was you know, bulletproof 212 00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 1: and could not explode no matter who was wearing that. 213 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:49,120 Speaker 1: He just wanted to He loved Michael Jordan's so much 214 00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 1: that he wanted to wear the jump Man. Nike has 215 00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:55,160 Speaker 1: that power over over some players, right, Like they are 216 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:57,760 Speaker 1: still the dominant brand in this world. I mean, he 217 00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:00,320 Speaker 1: grew up loving Michael Jordan's. I'm sure he grew up 218 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:03,160 Speaker 1: wearing the next Zion. I don't think it is going 219 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:06,360 Speaker 1: to care about Michael Jordan's. It's true. And that's why 220 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:11,840 Speaker 1: Lebron James and why z I on this potentially right 221 00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:15,040 Speaker 1: and Nike. He has a lot more competition in basketball 222 00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:17,560 Speaker 1: than they had probably four five years ago, or even 223 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:19,199 Speaker 1: back in two thousand three when they were trying to 224 00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 1: sign Lebron Right, it's not just under Armour with Steph Curry. 225 00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:25,520 Speaker 1: It's not just Adidas and James Harden. It's New Balance 226 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 1: now right, which which signed Darius Basley and Kawhi Leonard 227 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:30,559 Speaker 1: right last year, and the New Balance has had a 228 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:34,040 Speaker 1: very good basketball year. Fila is back with with Grant Hill, 229 00:12:34,120 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 1: believe it or not. Puma signed a number of brands 230 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:40,280 Speaker 1: and they just launched their new basketball shoe last year. 231 00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 1: And one that the nineties Street brand is back in 232 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 1: the basketball game. That there's a lot of companies and 233 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 1: and and it's because over the past decade and maybe 234 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: less so right now, but over the past decade, basketball 235 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:54,760 Speaker 1: shoes have been such a big business that a lot 236 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:56,240 Speaker 1: of brands have thought, you know what, we need to 237 00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:59,000 Speaker 1: get back into this. So there's more competition for Nike 238 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:02,280 Speaker 1: and if Zion ends up being the next Lebron James, 239 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:04,360 Speaker 1: I mean, this is a this is a massive thing. 240 00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:06,960 Speaker 1: Give me, give me your retail knowledge how our basketball 241 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:08,920 Speaker 1: shoes selling. Yeah, it's been a bad it's been a 242 00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:11,719 Speaker 1: bad eighteen months right now for basketball shoes, right, So 243 00:13:11,720 --> 00:13:13,840 Speaker 1: so you can argue that, you know, Puma New Balance 244 00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 1: and and and one kind of came back in maybe 245 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:18,840 Speaker 1: at the at the wrong time. Um. Kind of this 246 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:23,520 Speaker 1: this push into you know, the casual sneaker, the popularity 247 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:26,080 Speaker 1: of that has pushed basketball shoes, which used to be 248 00:13:26,080 --> 00:13:28,600 Speaker 1: the casual sneaker, kind of out of the way a 249 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:31,079 Speaker 1: little bit. I see bar hanging in Puma Clydes. There 250 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:35,640 Speaker 1: you go. I see that, you know, Pumaclede, I see, 251 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:37,520 Speaker 1: I see you back in then. Now see now, I 252 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 1: got to go back to something that you were saying. 253 00:13:39,120 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 1: I mean, granted when when we started it earlier, Yes, 254 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:45,360 Speaker 1: when he blew the shoe out. That's the popular narrative, 255 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 1: and I believe it's popular because simply, the last thing 256 00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:51,520 Speaker 1: you want when you're trying to sell a product is 257 00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 1: for the thing to go hey wire, which is what 258 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:56,880 Speaker 1: it did. You don't want to be here, I go, 259 00:13:56,920 --> 00:13:58,640 Speaker 1: I want to bring in racing. You don't want to 260 00:13:58,679 --> 00:14:02,560 Speaker 1: be on a race track. And you're you're promoting let's 261 00:14:02,600 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 1: say Ford, and all of a sudden your engine blows 262 00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:09,240 Speaker 1: apart and you're trying to sell. But the narrative at 263 00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:11,880 Speaker 1: that back then was now Nike is going to have 264 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:14,079 Speaker 1: to overpay. They have to have them, They're going to 265 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 1: have to pay more than they would have to get Zion. 266 00:14:18,120 --> 00:14:20,840 Speaker 1: And it doesn't seem like it played out that way. 267 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:24,800 Speaker 1: I mean, but again they could have. Maybe Nike with 268 00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:27,080 Speaker 1: with no shoe exploding, was only going to offer him 269 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 1: seven years. Perhaps the numbers inflated because perhaps it just 270 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 1: seems that it fell in arrange to be expected it. 271 00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:38,400 Speaker 1: There's no outlier here with the number. Totally no. I 272 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:41,520 Speaker 1: think that's fair. And and and if if this again Nike, 273 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:43,640 Speaker 1: he was always the favorite to sign him. If if 274 00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:45,920 Speaker 1: this had been a deal with Puma or with a 275 00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:47,960 Speaker 1: New Balance, I think a lot of the conversation would 276 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:51,320 Speaker 1: have been Wow. I wonder if Nike screwed themselves out 277 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:54,600 Speaker 1: of this deal because they had a shoe and we 278 00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:56,800 Speaker 1: noticed member in the digital billboards they used around the 279 00:14:56,800 --> 00:14:59,240 Speaker 1: country to announce this, including what at Madison Square Garden 280 00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:01,840 Speaker 1: it had. Is the jump Man logo? Yes, but nowhere 281 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:05,480 Speaker 1: do you see Pelicans exactly. It's so if you ever, 282 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:08,160 Speaker 1: if you ever wondered what the brand was that mattered here, 283 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 1: it ain't Pelicon. Yeah, imagine what the New Orleans front 284 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:14,120 Speaker 1: office felt when they saw they saw all those billboards. 285 00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 1: Let's move I don't think they're happy good with it? Yeah, 286 00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:23,560 Speaker 1: let's move on the volleyball volleyball media venture and Scott, 287 00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:27,400 Speaker 1: this is your story. The richest female venture capitalist is 288 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:31,040 Speaker 1: backing the volleyball media venture. Yeah. I mean I think 289 00:15:31,040 --> 00:15:32,960 Speaker 1: in the world of volleyball, most people would know the 290 00:15:33,040 --> 00:15:36,640 Speaker 1: name Kerry Walsh Jennings, a five time Olympian, three time 291 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:40,360 Speaker 1: gold medalist. I covered her in Beijing and some other 292 00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:43,960 Speaker 1: things around volleyball. She has a media platform like many 293 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:46,960 Speaker 1: you seemingly athletes do these days. I had not known 294 00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:50,040 Speaker 1: about P fourteen forty. And by the way, bar interested 295 00:15:50,040 --> 00:15:52,040 Speaker 1: in this. The P fourteen forty what it stands for. 296 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 1: The fourteen forty stands for the number of minutes in 297 00:15:55,960 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 1: a day and how she wants you to live those minutes. 298 00:15:59,640 --> 00:16:02,280 Speaker 1: So it carries all about live it to the fullest. 299 00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:07,040 Speaker 1: That's a question the Yeah. But Teresa Gal she's co 300 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:11,720 Speaker 1: founded Aspect Ventures. UH. She is the first outside investor 301 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:16,840 Speaker 1: in P four So if she is to be believed, 302 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 1: and if Carrie Walsh Jennings vision UH comes to fruition, 303 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 1: this will be the global go to spot and it's 304 00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: an appen and it's a website. Of course, an app 305 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 1: will be most important. This will be the go to 306 00:16:30,480 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: spot for what Teresa said, with nine million volleyball fans 307 00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:39,560 Speaker 1: around the world, so you know I always talk about 308 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:42,560 Speaker 1: scale here. This is what the app is going to 309 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:46,000 Speaker 1: allow Carry to do. Get that message. It's not just 310 00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:49,200 Speaker 1: about by the way volleyball playing, and it is. It's 311 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:53,600 Speaker 1: about beach volleyball. It's about culture, it's about health and wellness. 312 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:55,680 Speaker 1: It's about they will have live rights, they will be 313 00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:58,320 Speaker 1: paying for live rights to events they already do. It's 314 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:02,680 Speaker 1: about coaching. So it's sort of embodies everything in the 315 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:06,359 Speaker 1: lifestyle of beach volleyball. So is this like an iron 316 00:17:06,359 --> 00:17:09,680 Speaker 1: man for for for volleyball and then it's a it's 317 00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:14,359 Speaker 1: a lifestyle brand. Yes, yes, that's part of the money 318 00:17:14,359 --> 00:17:15,920 Speaker 1: being used here. And we don't know how much Teresa 319 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:17,439 Speaker 1: put in, but she has a net worth of five 320 00:17:18,080 --> 00:17:20,320 Speaker 1: million dollars, so you can rub a few nickels together, 321 00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:23,720 Speaker 1: but let's not discount Also, one of the things that 322 00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: attracted Teresa to this, yes, it was Carry and that 323 00:17:27,080 --> 00:17:29,600 Speaker 1: she's a powerhouse to face the volleyball I think she 324 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 1: really has the right idea here and the passion for it. 325 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:35,320 Speaker 1: But it was the fact that the company was founded 326 00:17:35,440 --> 00:17:39,679 Speaker 1: by a woman aspect and I didn't know this of 327 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:44,320 Speaker 1: the companies in the Aspect Ventures portfolio founded by women. 328 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:48,359 Speaker 1: Teresa is pushing this sheet and one of her investors, 329 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:49,679 Speaker 1: by the way, one of the people who put some 330 00:17:49,720 --> 00:17:52,720 Speaker 1: money in one of Aspects funds, Okay, can we guess 331 00:17:52,720 --> 00:17:59,200 Speaker 1: who who might be? Yeah? So, And she has been 332 00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:01,920 Speaker 1: very vocal in in in sort of the the gap 333 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:04,840 Speaker 1: in venture capital, the gender gap in venture capital. So 334 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:08,479 Speaker 1: this is a recurring narrative. And Kerry told me that 335 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:12,680 Speaker 1: she also wants to invite other athletes. So let's let's 336 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:16,200 Speaker 1: get um. Let's say Alex Morgan, who by the way, 337 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: told Evan last week that she is starting a female 338 00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:23,120 Speaker 1: focused media platform, also wants to open. Paul Rabel, who 339 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 1: she has met a number of times, who has clearly 340 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:29,120 Speaker 1: shown a proficiency for developing a brand and using digital 341 00:18:29,160 --> 00:18:32,320 Speaker 1: and social to promote that brand of the premier lacrosse 342 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:35,200 Speaker 1: I would like to see and and because I'm a 343 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:38,919 Speaker 1: Johnny come lately as usual that you know, volleyball to 344 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:44,359 Speaker 1: me didn't come on my radar until I saw Kerry 345 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:48,320 Speaker 1: and Misty May trainer, her teammate when they were playing 346 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:51,439 Speaker 1: in the Olympics, and I'm like, this is you know 347 00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:53,960 Speaker 1: what column I wrote it I wrote, and I mean, 348 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:55,720 Speaker 1: we're going back to the Beijing Olympics. But one of 349 00:18:55,720 --> 00:18:57,200 Speaker 1: the columns I wrote, I think I was writing two 350 00:18:57,200 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 1: a day. So the lack of sleep too, was something 351 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:03,560 Speaker 1: ab out how they were almost like a marriage, that 352 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:05,959 Speaker 1: the partners were like a marriage, and yeah, that that 353 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:10,000 Speaker 1: was some team. But my first volleyball name that sticks 354 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:13,600 Speaker 1: in my head is cart Kurai. That's so, I mean, 355 00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:16,600 Speaker 1: that's that's the one that sticks in my head. That's 356 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:18,479 Speaker 1: an Olympian as well. Yeah, he was an Olympian as well, 357 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:20,720 Speaker 1: beach volleyball player. Yeah. So this is the problem that 358 00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:23,000 Speaker 1: this is the issue that she's going to have to overcome, right. 359 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 1: It is the fact that volleyball captures the attention for 360 00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:28,960 Speaker 1: for two weeks, every every something, your boom, you hit 361 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:30,680 Speaker 1: it right on the head. And something she addressed. She said, 362 00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:33,160 Speaker 1: what we need to do is be top of mind 363 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:36,560 Speaker 1: and in the consciousness for more than just the quadrennial 364 00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:39,160 Speaker 1: Olympics cycle. She's like, we go dark every three point 365 00:19:39,160 --> 00:19:44,240 Speaker 1: of years, which is true of sports right, exactly right? 366 00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:45,640 Speaker 1: And is she do you do you get the sense 367 00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:47,600 Speaker 1: that this is a I mean, this is a competitor 368 00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:50,800 Speaker 1: essentially to Flow sports right, which is track dominant, Yeah, 369 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:53,639 Speaker 1: streamer and a lot of the different Olympic sports. Um, 370 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:56,439 Speaker 1: is there an exit strategy here? Is she? Does she 371 00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,720 Speaker 1: want to sell this thing at some point? Didn't say, 372 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 1: But just tone of the conversation that I got from 373 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:05,800 Speaker 1: Carrie and her passion play is that this strikes me 374 00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 1: as a build what happens at some point? I mean, 375 00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:11,520 Speaker 1: if it is successful, the money will be there as investment. 376 00:20:12,119 --> 00:20:15,080 Speaker 1: Whether she sells, who knows. But it strikes me as 377 00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:19,399 Speaker 1: she has a builder's mentality. You have been listening to 378 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:22,720 Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Business of Sports podcast. We're here for you 379 00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:26,840 Speaker 1: every Monday, Wednesdays and Thursdays bringing you some of the 380 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:31,080 Speaker 1: biggest news stories in sports. Guess what. You can catch 381 00:20:31,119 --> 00:20:34,200 Speaker 1: me on Twitter at Big Bar Sports. You can follow 382 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:37,240 Speaker 1: me at no VI Underscore Williams, and you can follow 383 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:40,640 Speaker 1: me at Sashnik. You know what, I know, we gotta 384 00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:43,479 Speaker 1: wrap this up. I didn't realize this. Carrie Walsh Jennings 385 00:20:43,600 --> 00:20:47,359 Speaker 1: is six ft three inches tall. Yeah, I've been around 386 00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:50,560 Speaker 1: her in different events, yet I did. I did not 387 00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:52,840 Speaker 1: know that. I mean because I've never seen her in person, 388 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:54,800 Speaker 1: so I would see her on TV, but I didn't 389 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:58,479 Speaker 1: know that she was six three, okay, and you are 390 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:02,800 Speaker 1: not want six one. I think that's a I think 391 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,159 Speaker 1: that's an NBA exaggeration. Right. Oh man, here we go. 392 00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:08,080 Speaker 1: Oh we gotta go down six Everyone fet me how 393 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:09,879 Speaker 1: much he weighed and he was so far off. I 394 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:12,680 Speaker 1: won that one. You're telling me you're six ft one. 395 00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:15,080 Speaker 1: We're going down to the office, the nurse's office downstairs 396 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:17,000 Speaker 1: and put you on that machine. You are not six one? 397 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:21,080 Speaker 1: What do you think I am? Maybe six? Can we 398 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: get a wager here? You want you want to put 399 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 1: some coin on it. Let's put some coin on it. 400 00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:28,840 Speaker 1: Will be learning on it lunch, alright, and we don't 401 00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:31,840 Speaker 1: want the Seinfeld problem. Soup in a sandwich is luch lunch, Philip. 402 00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:37,840 Speaker 1: It's just the bloomberg business of sports. And we're here 403 00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:43,240 Speaker 1: for you are coming up later in the week, and 404 00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:45,520 Speaker 1: then will you tell me who's gonna we have the 405 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,480 Speaker 1: CEO of Liverpool that Peter Moore, former high ranking executive 406 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:51,600 Speaker 1: at e A Sports as well. We're gonna talk some 407 00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:54,440 Speaker 1: soccer gonna talk to some FIFA, make your conversation. Catch 408 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:56,280 Speaker 1: our podcasts where available.