1 00:00:01,080 --> 00:00:04,040 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class from how 2 00:00:04,080 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 1: Stuff Works dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 1: I'm Holly fro and I'm Tracy Vie Wilson, and kind 4 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 1: of we're doing this topic today because we've gotten several 5 00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:24,000 Speaker 1: requests to do some South American history and so many 6 00:00:24,079 --> 00:00:25,759 Speaker 1: and can we can we talk for a second about 7 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:27,880 Speaker 1: why we have not had a ton of them? Yeah, 8 00:00:28,160 --> 00:00:30,680 Speaker 1: much of the information is in languages that neither of 9 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:34,360 Speaker 1: us read fluently. Yeah, and it makes me really sad 10 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:37,680 Speaker 1: because I'll find some awesome, awesome historical figure from South 11 00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:39,600 Speaker 1: American history, and I'll be able to find like a 12 00:00:39,640 --> 00:00:43,480 Speaker 1: short Encyclopedia article in English, and then anything more substantive 13 00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:47,199 Speaker 1: is in Spanish or Portuguese or another language that I 14 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:50,320 Speaker 1: sadly do not read well enough to use as a 15 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:54,800 Speaker 1: history source on this podcast. Yeah, that's a general trickiness 16 00:00:54,800 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: in multiple areas. I mean, there are a lot of 17 00:00:57,080 --> 00:00:58,720 Speaker 1: there's a lot of African history I would love to 18 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 1: cover that it's a bit hard to find source material, 19 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:04,680 Speaker 1: or if we do find source material, it's deeply biased 20 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:08,360 Speaker 1: in the favor of whoever was colonizing. Yeah, so that's 21 00:01:08,400 --> 00:01:10,760 Speaker 1: sort of why sometimes these don't get as much play 22 00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:13,960 Speaker 1: as we would like. But luckily today's topic has been 23 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:18,200 Speaker 1: studied by so many people that there's loads of information 24 00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:23,280 Speaker 1: out there. Uh. And that is the Nasca lines. So 25 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:26,720 Speaker 1: to give it some contexts, about two hundred miles southeast 26 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:30,200 Speaker 1: of Lima, Peru, nestled right between the Andes Mountains and 27 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:33,959 Speaker 1: the Pacific Ocean, there are these huge lines etched into 28 00:01:33,959 --> 00:01:36,800 Speaker 1: the desert. When I see lines, that's not really entirely 29 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:40,760 Speaker 1: accurate in terms of characterization. You've probably seen photos of 30 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:44,160 Speaker 1: these before, but if you haven't, they're really really astonishing. 31 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:49,240 Speaker 1: We're talking about large scale designs. Uh. And some of 32 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: them are things you would recognize, like a monkey or 33 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:56,160 Speaker 1: a spider or a condor. There's a hummingbird. Others are geometric. 34 00:01:56,400 --> 00:02:00,120 Speaker 1: And because they're etched into rock and have survived thousands 35 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:02,760 Speaker 1: of years, this was clearly like a serious amount of 36 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 1: work that went into the creation of these. The environment 37 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:09,280 Speaker 1: in this part of the world has really helped preserve 38 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:12,600 Speaker 1: the work of the Nasca. It's a really arid climate 39 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:15,360 Speaker 1: and there's not a lot of erosion, which means that 40 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:18,040 Speaker 1: even tracks from chariots that were left in the sixteenth 41 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 1: century by warring Conquestador factions are all still visible in 42 00:02:21,720 --> 00:02:25,480 Speaker 1: some places. Yeah, there are like, uh, tire tracks from 43 00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:28,360 Speaker 1: the nineteen twenties in that area that you can still 44 00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 1: clearly see footprints last for hundreds of years. It's unusual 45 00:02:33,040 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 1: because it is close to the ocean, yet it is very, 46 00:02:35,080 --> 00:02:38,720 Speaker 1: very dry. Uh. And for decades, these designs caused a 47 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:42,760 Speaker 1: lot of head scratching because we didn't understand why a 48 00:02:42,840 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 1: culture would devote so much energy to creating art that 49 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:48,639 Speaker 1: we thought they couldn't really see themselves because these are 50 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:51,320 Speaker 1: so expansive, and we'll talk a little bit about their 51 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:54,840 Speaker 1: size in a moment that you know, it seems you'd 52 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 1: only see them from the air, right. A lot of 53 00:02:57,040 --> 00:03:01,639 Speaker 1: the photos of them that exists are taken from from aircraft. Yeah, 54 00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:03,960 Speaker 1: I mean they've been featured in like coffee table books 55 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:08,280 Speaker 1: of like aerial archaeology. Uh. And it is hard to 56 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 1: imagine how they would ever look like anything from ground level. 57 00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: But UH, scientists and researchers are continuing to uncover new 58 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 1: information about these pieces of landscape art. We're learning more 59 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:22,760 Speaker 1: all the time. The picture keeps getting fuller, and there's 60 00:03:22,760 --> 00:03:24,880 Speaker 1: still a good bit of theory in the mix. Though 61 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 1: we think we've figured out what these lines might be about, 62 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:30,400 Speaker 1: or some researchers who think they've figured it out. There 63 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:35,640 Speaker 1: have been worrying opinions on this UH, but there's no 64 00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 1: you know, final Oh, it's all been made clear by 65 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:42,640 Speaker 1: this discovery. And as a note, there is a modern 66 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:45,600 Speaker 1: day town of Nasco, which has a population of about 67 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 1: thirty thou people. But for this discussion, when we use 68 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:51,800 Speaker 1: the word Nasco, we're referring to the ancient culture or 69 00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:55,720 Speaker 1: the location of the glyphs. Right. So, as I said before, 70 00:03:56,200 --> 00:03:58,880 Speaker 1: the Nascar region one of the driest places on Earth. 71 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:02,280 Speaker 1: It often goes more in a year without rain uh. 72 00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:06,480 Speaker 1: And the Pampa, the Nasca desert sometimes it will get 73 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 1: like a rainfall of twelve minutes a year, so very 74 00:04:09,880 --> 00:04:14,240 Speaker 1: very little moisture going on. The Nasca culture, which predates 75 00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:17,600 Speaker 1: the Incans, was in its flourished phase between two hundred 76 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 1: and six hundred, and there are to these lines, more 77 00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:23,440 Speaker 1: than eight hundred straight lines. There are more than three 78 00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:29,320 Speaker 1: hundred geometric figures UH and roughly seventy animal or plant designs. 79 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:33,680 Speaker 1: The whole collection of drawing spans a huge area. Some 80 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,840 Speaker 1: of the geometric shapes are more than six miles across, 81 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:39,359 Speaker 1: and some of the straight lines are thirty miles long. 82 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 1: All together, the area that the shapes span is nearly 83 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:47,120 Speaker 1: five hundred square kilometers or a hundred nineties square miles. 84 00:04:47,160 --> 00:04:49,960 Speaker 1: And just as a note on the thirty miles long one, 85 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:54,080 Speaker 1: I have heard differing or red differing statements about the 86 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 1: longest line. Some listed as low as nine, some go 87 00:04:56,640 --> 00:05:00,159 Speaker 1: as high as thirty. I think there are probably some 88 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 1: that maybe have petered out, and it's hard to discern 89 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:06,920 Speaker 1: for certain, So some are attributing length that may or 90 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:09,480 Speaker 1: may not be attributed by other people, depending on if 91 00:05:09,480 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 1: it's faded, if it's uh, you know, maybe it was 92 00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:15,080 Speaker 1: one of the lines, maybe it was part of the 93 00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:18,599 Speaker 1: natural landscape, So just know that going in UH and 94 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: researchers believe that all of the designs were created using 95 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:25,880 Speaker 1: the same methodology, so basically using wooden spades to kind 96 00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:27,919 Speaker 1: of shave or carve off the top layer of the 97 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 1: rock and expose the lighter sediment beneath. Some of the 98 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 1: drawings are actually carved on top of older ones, so 99 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: there was clearly a long term tradition of making these 100 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:42,400 Speaker 1: glyphs um and that tradition might have evolved over time. 101 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 1: The age of the drawings and even the age of 102 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:48,880 Speaker 1: the culture have been debated and the dates revised as 103 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:53,279 Speaker 1: people keep analyzing all the evidence. It'll probably be even 104 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,240 Speaker 1: further revised as time goes on. But a number that 105 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 1: you'll see pretty often in the research is that the 106 00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:02,440 Speaker 1: lines date back to only five hundred years, although some 107 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:05,440 Speaker 1: newer data suggested that at least some of them are 108 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:09,239 Speaker 1: even older than that. The UNESCO listing for the site 109 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:12,000 Speaker 1: gives the date range of between five d b C 110 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:16,280 Speaker 1: to five hundred C, and the designs are grouped into 111 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 1: two types. There um geoglyphs and biomorphs, and the geoglyphs 112 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:23,919 Speaker 1: are geometric shapes and the biomorphs says you may have 113 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:27,640 Speaker 1: guests feature animal or human shapes. Uh. In addition to 114 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,160 Speaker 1: the ones that I mentioned earlier, there's also a hummingbird, 115 00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:35,080 Speaker 1: there's a fish, a flamingo, and iguana, a fox, a whale, 116 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:39,040 Speaker 1: and even others. But just to keep it confusing, often 117 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 1: when you're looking at research, the whole group is often 118 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:47,040 Speaker 1: lumped under the geoglyph name, rather than separating out into 119 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:51,040 Speaker 1: those two separate geoglyph and biomorphs. Though there was some 120 00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:54,080 Speaker 1: archaeological work being done in Nasca in the late nineteen 121 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:57,359 Speaker 1: twenties by a proving archaeologists who spotted some of the 122 00:06:57,400 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 1: designs while hiking in the nearby foothills. The lines weren't 123 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:04,320 Speaker 1: really known of outside the area until a commercial pilot 124 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:07,640 Speaker 1: spotted them in the thirties and sometimes UH that date 125 00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:11,720 Speaker 1: is another one that UH is a little fuzzy. In 126 00:07:12,680 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 1: resources that you'll read, some will listen as late twenties, 127 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:20,680 Speaker 1: other in the early thirties. But once the impressive geoglyphs 128 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:23,920 Speaker 1: were known to the outside world, almost immediately, of course, 129 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:26,040 Speaker 1: people were trying to figure out what they were about. 130 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:30,920 Speaker 1: Some positive that they were inking roads, some suggested that 131 00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:35,080 Speaker 1: they were irrigation lines. UH. The nearby Sarah Blanco Mountain, 132 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 1: which is technically actually a sand dune, but it's like 133 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:40,280 Speaker 1: the largest standing in the world, I think, or ranks 134 00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 1: up there. UH is the primary water source for the 135 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,160 Speaker 1: area because of an underground reservoir, and at least one 136 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 1: of the triangular geoglyphs runs along the water veins that 137 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:54,679 Speaker 1: are in that mountain. Another favorite, as is always a favorite, 138 00:07:55,080 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 1: everything cool. It comes up in every piece of sort 139 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:02,000 Speaker 1: of difficult to explain or we have done the research 140 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 1: that finds the key Yet aliens aliens their alien landing 141 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:11,440 Speaker 1: strips mostly popular in the nineteen sixties, also not particularly surprising. 142 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:15,280 Speaker 1: It was perpetuated mostly by Eric von Danikin, who has 143 00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 1: made a career as an author specializing in writing about 144 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:23,400 Speaker 1: alien interaction with humans, especially in early cultures. Uh. Yeah, 145 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: Dannikin actually really angered one of the people who really 146 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:31,400 Speaker 1: dedicated their lives to studying this with his theories. Uh. 147 00:08:31,440 --> 00:08:33,880 Speaker 1: And then others have applied the concept that they have 148 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 1: religious meaning, and there are variations on this one that 149 00:08:37,320 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 1: the lines are paths to rituals, or that their messages 150 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 1: to the gods, ETCETERA. American Paul Kazak, who was a 151 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:47,679 Speaker 1: professor of history at Long Island University, is often credited 152 00:08:47,720 --> 00:08:50,720 Speaker 1: with being the first person to seriously study these lines. 153 00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:54,840 Speaker 1: His interest was really irrigation, and it was the theory 154 00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 1: that the lines could have been complex water routing ditches 155 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 1: that led him to Peru. He almost immediately realized that 156 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:05,440 Speaker 1: the lines were just too shallow to carry water. On 157 00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:08,640 Speaker 1: June twenty ninety one, he saw that the straight line 158 00:09:08,679 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 1: he was standing near pointed directly at the setting sun, 159 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:14,200 Speaker 1: and he believed that it was a marker for the 160 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:19,040 Speaker 1: winter solstice. In the meantime, a young woman named Maria Reicha, 161 00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:23,400 Speaker 1: who was a mathematician from Dresden, Germany and spoke five languages, 162 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:28,200 Speaker 1: also started analyzing and mapping the drawings in Uh. And 163 00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:31,400 Speaker 1: she came to that because she had actually gone to 164 00:09:31,440 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 1: South America initially to tutor a diplomat's children, but then 165 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:38,400 Speaker 1: started working as a translator in Lima. And it was 166 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:41,600 Speaker 1: through her translation work that she actually met Paul kazak 167 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:45,000 Speaker 1: Uh in Lima, and the professor really became a mentor 168 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:48,640 Speaker 1: to Reicha, and once she learned the lines, it was 169 00:09:48,720 --> 00:09:51,319 Speaker 1: kind of I don't I don't want to over romanticize 170 00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 1: it and say it was a love at first sight thing, 171 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:58,440 Speaker 1: but she pretty quickly just decided that was her life's work. Uh. 172 00:09:58,840 --> 00:10:01,720 Speaker 1: She really devote the rest of her life to them, 173 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:04,560 Speaker 1: and she even lived in a small desert house near 174 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:08,679 Speaker 1: the Nasca lines to serve as their protector. So, even 175 00:10:08,679 --> 00:10:12,240 Speaker 1: though it's this huge expanse, this one woman kind of 176 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,679 Speaker 1: out there in the desert living by herself really felt 177 00:10:14,679 --> 00:10:17,360 Speaker 1: like she had to keep a watch on everything. And 178 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:20,080 Speaker 1: she became known as the lady of the lines, and 179 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:22,240 Speaker 1: she actually um as I said, she lived out her 180 00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:25,680 Speaker 1: life there. She became a Peruvian citizen in at the 181 00:10:25,679 --> 00:10:29,439 Speaker 1: age of ninety one. Uh. And it was very highly regarded, 182 00:10:29,920 --> 00:10:33,840 Speaker 1: I think by the Peruvian people and by the government. Uh. 183 00:10:34,520 --> 00:10:38,559 Speaker 1: But her work with Kazak really in that early stage 184 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:42,040 Speaker 1: really formed the basis for the rest of her analysis. 185 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 1: Right while working with him, six months after this winter 186 00:10:45,559 --> 00:10:49,320 Speaker 1: Celsist revelation, she discovered a line that pointed to the 187 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:53,080 Speaker 1: sun during the summer solstice. This led Kassack to believe 188 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:57,040 Speaker 1: that they had uncovered a celestial calendar, and he characterized 189 00:10:57,040 --> 00:11:00,280 Speaker 1: the Nasca Lines as the world's largest astronomy book. This 190 00:11:00,440 --> 00:11:03,920 Speaker 1: really reminds me of Stonehenge, and how if you stand 191 00:11:03,960 --> 00:11:07,560 Speaker 1: in certain places in Stonehenge you see specific they line 192 00:11:07,600 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: up with specific astronomical events. Yeah. It's much bigger. It's much, much, 193 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 1: much bigger than Stonehenge, but similarly mysterious. Yeah. Uh. And 194 00:11:17,400 --> 00:11:20,480 Speaker 1: in Cossack left Peru. It was not his life's work, 195 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 1: even though he loved it. Uh. But Maria stayed and 196 00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 1: she continued working, and she was really attempting to find 197 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 1: a pattern or a system to all of the drawings, 198 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:32,520 Speaker 1: and she spent more than forty years mapping the area, 199 00:11:32,679 --> 00:11:35,520 Speaker 1: and as part of her work, she even painstakingly restored 200 00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:38,800 Speaker 1: portions of the glyphs that had been obscured over time. 201 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:44,960 Speaker 1: Some of them had accumulated duster debris, or the the 202 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:49,439 Speaker 1: layers that had been exposed had darkened from sunlight exposure 203 00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:52,640 Speaker 1: or other elemental exposure, and she would pull those away, 204 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 1: never altering the glyphs, but just you know, a little 205 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:59,960 Speaker 1: tidying and restoration. She believed that these drawings were trying 206 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 1: the sun's path and position in the sky, and that 207 00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:07,040 Speaker 1: the Nascar were using their knowledge of equinoxes to schedule 208 00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:10,400 Speaker 1: when they should plant and harvest their crops. She also 209 00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 1: theorized that some of the glyphs were symbols correlated to 210 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:18,640 Speaker 1: the constellations and raik working you know, as a woman 211 00:12:18,880 --> 00:12:23,800 Speaker 1: so low analyzing these phenomena. Uh, she was not taken seriously, 212 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:27,920 Speaker 1: and she initially published her findings in the late forties, 213 00:12:27,920 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 1: shortly after Kazak left Um, and she her writings were 214 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:38,000 Speaker 1: pretty much met with ridicule. Yeah. Competing theorists all pointed 215 00:12:38,040 --> 00:12:40,800 Speaker 1: out that the vast majority of the lines in the 216 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:44,439 Speaker 1: glyphs did not point to any celestial bodies. Yeah, there 217 00:12:44,520 --> 00:12:47,120 Speaker 1: was a lot of criticism that she had, you know, 218 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:50,000 Speaker 1: found she had kind of cherry picked a few things 219 00:12:50,400 --> 00:12:53,840 Speaker 1: that lined up with her idea and then the things 220 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:58,080 Speaker 1: that didn't line up with She wasn't really um worried 221 00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:02,680 Speaker 1: about or working into the bigger theory. But just before 222 00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 1: Rick had died, in one of her proteges, who was 223 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:09,959 Speaker 1: a senior astronomer at the Adler Planetarium in Chicago at 224 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:13,960 Speaker 1: the time, named Phillis B. Petluga, she actually came to 225 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:16,960 Speaker 1: the conclusion that the bioglyphs were referring to the heavens. 226 00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:23,240 Speaker 1: She uh concluded that they aren't representing constellations but counter constellations, 227 00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:26,880 Speaker 1: so sort of the irregular shaped dark patches within the 228 00:13:26,920 --> 00:13:29,880 Speaker 1: milky way that you can see at night, like the 229 00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:34,120 Speaker 1: the negative space between the stars that I do too. 230 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:36,880 Speaker 1: I looked around for a little more research on it 231 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:38,599 Speaker 1: and didn't find a whole lot. But that's one that 232 00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:40,600 Speaker 1: I would like to delve further into because it's kind 233 00:13:40,640 --> 00:13:43,440 Speaker 1: of cool and fascinating. But that's one of those things 234 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:48,239 Speaker 1: that I worry, uh, and I'm certainly not an astronomer. 235 00:13:49,920 --> 00:13:52,680 Speaker 1: I worry that that might be again one of those 236 00:13:52,679 --> 00:13:55,440 Speaker 1: things that it's easy to make work, you know what 237 00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:57,920 Speaker 1: I mean. Uh, there are so many stars in the 238 00:13:58,040 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 1: night sky that it would be easy to like if 239 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:03,439 Speaker 1: you rotated a little, everything kind of fits. Or again, 240 00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:06,320 Speaker 1: I'm just postulating and I haven't looked at her research well. 241 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:11,280 Speaker 1: And because the North Pole gradually moves over time, the 242 00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 1: constellations are all in a slightly different place over time, 243 00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 1: which also makes it challenge. But that's a really neat concept. 244 00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:22,680 Speaker 1: Now that we have all kinds of fancy computers that 245 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 1: can adjust for those kinds of things, it's a little easier, 246 00:14:26,280 --> 00:14:30,480 Speaker 1: but still it can be tricky that way. In there 247 00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:33,920 Speaker 1: was a big Peruvian German research collaboration that started near 248 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:36,920 Speaker 1: the town of Palpa, and it has continued to study 249 00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:40,960 Speaker 1: all the lines through the years since. Archaeologist Dr Marcus 250 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:46,119 Speaker 1: Randell of the German Archaeological Institute UH still leads a team, 251 00:14:46,400 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 1: but he started in the late nineteen nineties and early 252 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:51,440 Speaker 1: two thousand's with the intent to take an in depth 253 00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:55,800 Speaker 1: look at the Peruvian Nasca lines, and their approach to 254 00:14:55,920 --> 00:14:59,280 Speaker 1: the lines was not so much starting with the lines 255 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:02,520 Speaker 1: and trying to just staring their meaning, but instead they 256 00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:05,360 Speaker 1: really wanted to dig into the culture of the ancient 257 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 1: Nasca to try to contextualize the Nasca lines and give 258 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:13,080 Speaker 1: a better basis for understanding their purpose. Uh. So it 259 00:15:13,200 --> 00:15:18,120 Speaker 1: definitely took a deeper archaeological uh investigation at that point. 260 00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:20,520 Speaker 1: I love that too, I do too. Oh, they did 261 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:24,120 Speaker 1: some really cool stuff. Because of grave robbers, the whole 262 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:27,120 Speaker 1: desert around this area is littered with all kinds of 263 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:31,400 Speaker 1: broken pottery and skeletons, basically a big mess as people 264 00:15:31,480 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 1: have plundered Nasca burial grounds. But eighty years ago a 265 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 1: number of intact mummies from the Nasca land were rescued 266 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:41,880 Speaker 1: and preserved. Yeah, they had been just sitting in a museum, 267 00:15:42,680 --> 00:15:46,000 Speaker 1: but Ryan Dell's research team decided that they wanted to 268 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:49,040 Speaker 1: use modern technology to try to analyze those mummies as 269 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: part of their kind of mission to do more of 270 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:54,440 Speaker 1: a cultural analysis. Uh. And one of the things that 271 00:15:54,520 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 1: was interesting is that this uh their analyzes revealed dietary 272 00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:01,680 Speaker 1: differences between some of them. These some were getting more 273 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:05,520 Speaker 1: animal protein and varied diets. Uh. And around the same 274 00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 1: time that these were going on, another part of the 275 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:12,240 Speaker 1: team found a burial shaft for a person who obviously 276 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:16,240 Speaker 1: had kind of a higher social standing who was adorned 277 00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:20,840 Speaker 1: with a personal shrine. And these two pieces together, the 278 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:23,160 Speaker 1: variation in diets and the fact that they had found 279 00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:27,360 Speaker 1: this shrine that clearly was different from previous burial sites, 280 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:31,320 Speaker 1: kind of locked together to lead researchers to believe that 281 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,000 Speaker 1: there was in fact a social class system at play 282 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:38,200 Speaker 1: in the Nasca culture. This is actually a pretty significant finding. 283 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:40,760 Speaker 1: It may seem like, well, duh, every culture has a 284 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:44,080 Speaker 1: class system and a social hierarchy, But for a long time, 285 00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:46,960 Speaker 1: people had believed that the ancient Nasca were a peaceful 286 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:50,320 Speaker 1: tribe that didn't have that kind of structure. So there's 287 00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:55,000 Speaker 1: a famous ceramic tableau called the Teo Plaque, which features 288 00:16:55,080 --> 00:16:58,720 Speaker 1: multiple Nasca playing pan pipes, walking with dogs, and it 289 00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 1: was long held this iconic representation of a relaxed tribal 290 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:07,199 Speaker 1: life without much of a class system. Yeah. We uh, 291 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:11,640 Speaker 1: you know, I think, to put it in casual terms, 292 00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:13,440 Speaker 1: I think people sort of thought of them as more 293 00:17:13,520 --> 00:17:16,439 Speaker 1: like a the hippies of history, and they were just 294 00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:19,480 Speaker 1: all cool with each other, chilling out, being groovy, enjoying 295 00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:23,480 Speaker 1: the land. So there were then some theories now that 296 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:25,439 Speaker 1: they had established that there did appear to be a 297 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:29,439 Speaker 1: class system that the Nasca lines might have been commanded 298 00:17:30,040 --> 00:17:32,719 Speaker 1: to be made by high ranking Naskins to mark their 299 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:38,639 Speaker 1: territory or show their prestige. Geoelectric tomography, which measures the 300 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:42,200 Speaker 1: electrical conductivity in the earth, was then used to try 301 00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:46,120 Speaker 1: to find any undiscovered buildings or other structures that might 302 00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:50,240 Speaker 1: inform this whole idea of a more socially stratified culture. 303 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:54,720 Speaker 1: The researchers did find other structures, and they pieced together 304 00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:58,680 Speaker 1: that with other discoveries and eventually assembled a pretty compelling 305 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:02,119 Speaker 1: model of how the Nasca we're actually running a pretty 306 00:18:02,119 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 1: successful trade empire, linking settlements and trade spots like beads 307 00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 1: on a necklace. Yeah. At the time, Uh, and I 308 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:13,639 Speaker 1: should say that the findings here were really expansive and 309 00:18:13,640 --> 00:18:16,560 Speaker 1: they could easily be their own episode. But they sort 310 00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:18,960 Speaker 1: of discovered that they could have traveled along what is 311 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 1: now a dry portion of the river that was leading 312 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:23,159 Speaker 1: out to the ocean, and that they had all of 313 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:25,760 Speaker 1: these small settlements, you know, dotting along the way so 314 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:27,639 Speaker 1: that they could go a little trade rest, go a 315 00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:32,800 Speaker 1: little trade rest. Uh. And uh, there were again in 316 00:18:32,800 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 1: those findings that we're not going to dig deep into you, 317 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:38,399 Speaker 1: but I at least want to acknowledge them. They found 318 00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:41,160 Speaker 1: some evidence that some of the glyphs and the structures 319 00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 1: that we've historically attributed to the Nasca were actually pre Nasca, 320 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:47,080 Speaker 1: and they trace it all the way back to like 321 00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:50,359 Speaker 1: the migration down into South America. But for the scope 322 00:18:50,400 --> 00:18:52,200 Speaker 1: of this one, we're gonna keep it simple with regard 323 00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:56,200 Speaker 1: to the trade culture and that sort of uh other 324 00:18:56,720 --> 00:19:00,240 Speaker 1: branch of the plot line of the Nasca and forcus 325 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 1: back on the lines. So perhaps in the future we 326 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:05,040 Speaker 1: will do another one entirely on that, because there's some 327 00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:09,040 Speaker 1: cool stuff involving links to the Neolithic Age that had 328 00:19:09,080 --> 00:19:14,240 Speaker 1: not ever happened before. It's really really fascinating research. As 329 00:19:14,280 --> 00:19:17,080 Speaker 1: we've said already, we're talking about one of the driest 330 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:21,120 Speaker 1: places on the planet. But in one small basin, which 331 00:19:21,119 --> 00:19:23,399 Speaker 1: is the area where the Nasca culture is said to 332 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:26,400 Speaker 1: have flourished, there were at one point at least ten 333 00:19:26,520 --> 00:19:30,240 Speaker 1: rivers which descended from the Andies. Steven S Hall, writing 334 00:19:30,280 --> 00:19:36,200 Speaker 1: for National Geographic, described them pretty poetically as fragile ribbons 335 00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:40,280 Speaker 1: of green surrounded by a thousand shades of brown. So 336 00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:43,119 Speaker 1: most of these rivers would have each been dry for 337 00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 1: at least part of the year. This nextus point offered 338 00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:49,959 Speaker 1: up this perfect fertile ground to support a settlement. It 339 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:53,080 Speaker 1: also came with a really high risk because the microclimate 340 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:56,239 Speaker 1: in that particular spot is really unstable. Any kind of 341 00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:59,720 Speaker 1: small change, like a high pressure system moving through can 342 00:19:59,720 --> 00:20:03,560 Speaker 1: comp com lately dry out the Nasca Valley. Yeah, because 343 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:07,399 Speaker 1: of the way the Andes rings the area, it's easy 344 00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:11,639 Speaker 1: for um, some weather to get cut off my system 345 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 1: moving over at etcetera. But at one point it really 346 00:20:15,320 --> 00:20:19,800 Speaker 1: would have been an oasis. Uh, similar to other famous 347 00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 1: spots in terms of like civilization developments, which are often 348 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:28,200 Speaker 1: an oasis, you know, kind of up against the desert. Uh. 349 00:20:28,359 --> 00:20:31,280 Speaker 1: And in this oasis, we know that the Nasca grew citrus, 350 00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:33,880 Speaker 1: they grew grain, they grew maze. They had a really 351 00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:37,280 Speaker 1: impressive well structure to bring water to all these crops, 352 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:40,040 Speaker 1: and a business built around trading some of the crops 353 00:20:40,080 --> 00:20:44,159 Speaker 1: because they were so abundant. So in two thousand seven, 354 00:20:44,320 --> 00:20:48,800 Speaker 1: German geographers took samples from the Andean Highlands where there's 355 00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:53,240 Speaker 1: a climate archive basically the core drill that that we 356 00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:55,880 Speaker 1: see a lot of times when we're studying long ago 357 00:20:56,040 --> 00:20:59,080 Speaker 1: facets of the earth. So the drill core revealed to 358 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:02,359 Speaker 1: the researchers loam and even a snail, so there's proof 359 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:05,280 Speaker 1: that there was once a lot more moisture in the area. Yeah, 360 00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:08,400 Speaker 1: the permafrost there had really preserved things for quite some times. 361 00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:11,359 Speaker 1: They were able to get a really deep sample. So 362 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:14,560 Speaker 1: between then and now, when it's known for its dry climate, 363 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:16,880 Speaker 1: we know that the water had to have left the region, 364 00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:19,879 Speaker 1: and this, in the minds of many researchers, is really 365 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:23,600 Speaker 1: the key to understanding the Nasca lines. As more and 366 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:27,040 Speaker 1: more excavations have been done, there's been the same imagery 367 00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:30,800 Speaker 1: that's popped up over and over on everything from everyday 368 00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:35,040 Speaker 1: tools to sacred objects, some of which have been identified 369 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:38,960 Speaker 1: as likely weather deities. They look just like the earliest 370 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:42,679 Speaker 1: rock carvings, which are mostly on the hills surrounding the area, 371 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:47,800 Speaker 1: sort of like protectors. So as these researchers theorized more 372 00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:50,680 Speaker 1: and more droughts were happening in the desert was advancing 373 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 1: progressively into the Nasca plateau and really spelled out this 374 00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:58,119 Speaker 1: the beginning of the end for the Nasca, and the 375 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:01,840 Speaker 1: Nasca believing that they had somehow yield the gods really 376 00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:07,520 Speaker 1: stepped up their religious rituals, including their glyphmaking. Many of 377 00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:10,720 Speaker 1: the animals that are featured in the biomorphs don't really 378 00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:15,119 Speaker 1: live near the Navska. They are found more in rainforests 379 00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:17,800 Speaker 1: on the other side of the Andes. So the current 380 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:21,639 Speaker 1: theory is that these figures are fertility prayers of a sort, 381 00:22:22,160 --> 00:22:26,600 Speaker 1: asking the gods for the plenty of their neighbors, including water. Yeah, 382 00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:29,399 Speaker 1: there aren't monkeys there, but there is a monkey glyph. 383 00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:32,560 Speaker 1: There aren't certainly aren't whales there, but there is a 384 00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 1: whale glyph. Uh. Some of the birds and other animals 385 00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:39,640 Speaker 1: that they feature do not exist there, but again, right 386 00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:44,000 Speaker 1: over the Andes and the rainforest they're plentiful, so it 387 00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:46,399 Speaker 1: does make some sense certainly that they would be like, 388 00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:49,520 Speaker 1: we would like what the neighbors have please. But the 389 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:55,160 Speaker 1: geometric sites researchers think are likely actually ritual sites. And 390 00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:58,800 Speaker 1: there is a very cool project that was done where 391 00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:02,000 Speaker 1: they put together a comp puter graphics model of the 392 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,840 Speaker 1: entire area and they developed it with information that the 393 00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:10,240 Speaker 1: researchers had provided regarding ruins and settlement structures of the time. 394 00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:13,840 Speaker 1: So it's a pretty comprehensive model of what would have 395 00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:19,719 Speaker 1: been there. And in this uh uh CG version of 396 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 1: the Nasca area, it shows that in fact, people could 397 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:25,199 Speaker 1: have seen the glyphs from many of the buildings in 398 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:27,880 Speaker 1: the region. Like they weren't necessarily tall, but they still 399 00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:30,800 Speaker 1: would have had a better line of sight. Uh And 400 00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:33,879 Speaker 1: this is a pretty significant break from the previous thinking 401 00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:36,080 Speaker 1: that we talked about earlier that they were only visible 402 00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:40,720 Speaker 1: from the sky. So that is, you know, a mistaken 403 00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:44,040 Speaker 1: belief that has probably led many researchers down the wrong path, 404 00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 1: like um process of thought that oh, nobody could see these, 405 00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:52,000 Speaker 1: why were they making them, and how they probably could 406 00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:55,600 Speaker 1: actually see some of them. What's interesting about the geometric 407 00:23:55,640 --> 00:24:00,120 Speaker 1: designs is that they're all lockable, they're mostly on the plateau, 408 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:02,919 Speaker 1: and this plus the revelation that you could see the 409 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:06,480 Speaker 1: glyphs from around the area, have led researchers to theorize 410 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:09,720 Speaker 1: that there were huge ritual spectacles that could be performed. 411 00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 1: There would be sort of like putting on a show 412 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:15,480 Speaker 1: for everyone to see, including the gods. Yeah, so kind 413 00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 1: of um religious theatricality. And it could very well be 414 00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:25,200 Speaker 1: that the glyphs went from being pectoral to taking on 415 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:29,160 Speaker 1: this geometric approach because at that point the Nasca were hurrying. 416 00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:32,639 Speaker 1: They knew that they were struggling and that they didn't 417 00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:36,080 Speaker 1: really have time for a lot of artistic flourish. So 418 00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:41,440 Speaker 1: they started focusing more on straighter lines, circles that could 419 00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:44,000 Speaker 1: be drawn inside straight lines. They didn't have to really 420 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:48,000 Speaker 1: worry as much about mirroring images. It was more like, Okay, 421 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:50,480 Speaker 1: we've been doing this, we're not getting the God's attention, 422 00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 1: we're not gaining their favor. We have to do more 423 00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:54,600 Speaker 1: and more and more, and we don't have time for 424 00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:58,440 Speaker 1: all of the squiggles. Let's hurry, so which is kind 425 00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:02,240 Speaker 1: of sad to think about. Also an interesting approach to 426 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:05,600 Speaker 1: this question of what these things are and why they're there. 427 00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:10,720 Speaker 1: In two thousand, Rhyndale and his team made an interesting discovery. 428 00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:14,880 Speaker 1: While archaeologists had noticed large man made mounds of stones 429 00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:17,879 Speaker 1: that they suspected were ceremonial altars at the end of 430 00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:22,199 Speaker 1: the trapezoidal glyphs before an excavation of one of them 431 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:27,879 Speaker 1: revealed fragments of a spondylist muscle seashell. This particular muscle 432 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,879 Speaker 1: is only found off the coast of Peru during El 433 00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:34,080 Speaker 1: Nino events. This would have tied it to rainfall in 434 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:36,480 Speaker 1: the minds of the Nascar, So the shells found at 435 00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:39,480 Speaker 1: some of these alt sites might have been offerings to 436 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:43,119 Speaker 1: the gods from the sea to encourage water. And this 437 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:46,399 Speaker 1: theory of water warship and request of the gods is 438 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:50,040 Speaker 1: also supported by the growing size of the geoglyphs in 439 00:25:50,080 --> 00:25:52,919 Speaker 1: the later period of the ancient Nasca culture as they 440 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:55,639 Speaker 1: grew more desperate as I was talking about before, they 441 00:25:55,640 --> 00:26:00,159 Speaker 1: would have wanted everyone in their villages and settlements to 442 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:04,760 Speaker 1: participate in the water rituals. So even uh, the spiral 443 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 1: lines and some of the geometric glyphs, if they were 444 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,960 Speaker 1: walking them the way these researchers are suggesting as part 445 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,600 Speaker 1: of their ritual, it would have forced the worshippers to 446 00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:17,439 Speaker 1: face one another over and over, kind of like if 447 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:19,199 Speaker 1: you've ever been through like a long queue in an 448 00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:21,440 Speaker 1: amusement park and you keep seeing the same people back 449 00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 1: and forth. Uh, and it it would have as they 450 00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:27,199 Speaker 1: moved through their steps kind of reinforce their sense of 451 00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:31,359 Speaker 1: community and potentially strengthened their resolve to plead for the gods, 452 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:34,120 Speaker 1: for their favorite for the good of everyone like they were. 453 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:38,840 Speaker 1: Potentially this is one theory of course kind of reinforcing 454 00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:40,919 Speaker 1: that idea that we all need to survive together, so 455 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:44,080 Speaker 1: we all need to be doing this. By five hundred 456 00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:46,320 Speaker 1: to six hundred, the end of the Nasca was near. 457 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:50,520 Speaker 1: The water issue would have really been insurmountable at this point, 458 00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:53,200 Speaker 1: And we know that by six fifty the Nasca had 459 00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:56,600 Speaker 1: been replaced by the Way Empire, which had its roots 460 00:26:56,640 --> 00:27:00,000 Speaker 1: in the Central Highlands. Yes, so since they weren't exclusive 461 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:03,000 Speaker 1: of Lee in this super dry area, they kind of 462 00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:08,600 Speaker 1: had a stronger um cultural presence that they could branch out, 463 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:11,680 Speaker 1: but they always had that kind of more hospitable environment 464 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,560 Speaker 1: to return to you. And so, while there isn't enough 465 00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:18,720 Speaker 1: evidence to definitively prove any of these theories, the celestial 466 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:23,000 Speaker 1: theory or certainly not the alien landing strip theory or 467 00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:26,600 Speaker 1: even these sort of pretty well thought out water and 468 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:32,160 Speaker 1: God related theories, uh, the current frontrunner among researchers, given 469 00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:34,080 Speaker 1: what we've been able to uncover, does seem to be 470 00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:37,080 Speaker 1: the religious ritual usage as a means to try to 471 00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:41,160 Speaker 1: save the culture. So to sort of wrap it up, 472 00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:46,000 Speaker 1: the United Nations Educational Scientific and Cultural Organization better known 473 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:49,080 Speaker 1: as UNESCO put the NASCAR GIOG lifts on the World 474 00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 1: Heritage List in and as I mentioned earlier, Maria Rika 475 00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:58,120 Speaker 1: died in June at the age of four years after 476 00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:01,080 Speaker 1: the lines were added to UNESCO's list, and there was 477 00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:02,960 Speaker 1: talk at the time of her death that the lines 478 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,600 Speaker 1: should be named the Reicha Lines, but it appears that 479 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:08,280 Speaker 1: idea never really gained any traction. I would like to 480 00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:10,800 Speaker 1: vote against that, please. I think it would be too 481 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,720 Speaker 1: problematic for the historical record at this point. Yeah. Well, 482 00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:17,480 Speaker 1: and I also think I sort of feel like the 483 00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:20,560 Speaker 1: name of the culture that made them should be preserved 484 00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:23,760 Speaker 1: there and not replaced with some other person. They have 485 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:27,440 Speaker 1: also been new figures discovered through the years, so even 486 00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:30,919 Speaker 1: though Maria Reiko was very thorough and dedicated to the lines, 487 00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:33,920 Speaker 1: there have been advances in photography that have revealed some 488 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:37,200 Speaker 1: glyphs that were previously really hard to make out. Yeah, 489 00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:40,520 Speaker 1: she mapped the vast majority of them, but they still 490 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:44,120 Speaker 1: do sometimes discover them. And while the Nasca Lines are 491 00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 1: not the only such g glyphs on Earth, they are 492 00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,920 Speaker 1: perhaps the most famous. UH And even now there's a 493 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:53,040 Speaker 1: significant tourism trade built around carrying people out to the 494 00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: desert UH for aerial tours to see these massive landscape 495 00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,480 Speaker 1: carvings from the past. It just kind of neat. I 496 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 1: would like to go stuff in Peru. Yeah, delicious food 497 00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:11,440 Speaker 1: even beyond the food. How my tourism is based entirely 498 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:14,880 Speaker 1: around what I can eat in different places. Uh. But yeah, 499 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:23,480 Speaker 1: they's amazing amazing archaeology and amazing amazing ancient culture. Yeah, preserved. Yeah, 500 00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:25,480 Speaker 1: and it is one of those things where, like I 501 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:27,680 Speaker 1: said at the top, I think most people have probably 502 00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:29,960 Speaker 1: seen pictures of these and maybe even heard a little 503 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:34,320 Speaker 1: bit about them, But when you realize how much research 504 00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:37,600 Speaker 1: has been dedicated to them. I mean, even in doing this, 505 00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,600 Speaker 1: there are so many archaeologists that we can't sort of 506 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:43,720 Speaker 1: step aside and talk about their individual work, so we 507 00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:46,280 Speaker 1: focused on kind of the big ones. But there's just 508 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:50,520 Speaker 1: people are really enthralled by them. And Maria Reiche is 509 00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:55,000 Speaker 1: not the only person who pretty much dedicated her entire ah, 510 00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:58,240 Speaker 1: she dedicated her entire life. Other people, many people dedicate 511 00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:03,440 Speaker 1: their careers to them. So it's they're engaging. I like them. 512 00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:05,520 Speaker 1: I would love to walk them all well. And the 513 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,120 Speaker 1: fact that so many people have dedicated their lives to 514 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 1: trying to puzzle out the mysteries of what these ancient 515 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:16,200 Speaker 1: sites were all about. Um makes it seem really silly 516 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,360 Speaker 1: that occasionally, like governments will come up with this cookie 517 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:21,560 Speaker 1: plan about what to do with nuclear waste and say, 518 00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:25,120 Speaker 1: well if we market with these things, that will deter people. 519 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:29,920 Speaker 1: Like Okay, Now, in a thousand years, people are probably 520 00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:32,560 Speaker 1: not going to be deterred. They're going to be walking 521 00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:35,120 Speaker 1: around and trying to figure out what that was about. Yeah, well, 522 00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:37,440 Speaker 1: and there is even am I thought about that a 523 00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 1: little bit while doing research. The big lizard glyph actually 524 00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:45,080 Speaker 1: had its bisected by a highway that was built. I 525 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:48,840 Speaker 1: think it was that the that highway was worked on 526 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:53,040 Speaker 1: in Peru. And I wonder if you know, years and 527 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 1: years and years from now, someone will look and be like, 528 00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:57,560 Speaker 1: why was the lizard cutting ham And it's like, oh, 529 00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:00,880 Speaker 1: I was really not part of the origin old plan. 530 00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,480 Speaker 1: But they won't know that Nope, or maybe they'll figure 531 00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:10,360 Speaker 1: it out archaeology. It's so cool. Guess what. I also 532 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:12,480 Speaker 1: have listener mail. Please tell me what it says this 533 00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:15,440 Speaker 1: time I now made us both smiles so big. Uh. 534 00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:18,120 Speaker 1: It is from our listener Angela, and she says, I 535 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:19,880 Speaker 1: wanted to tell you first how much I enjoy your 536 00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:22,440 Speaker 1: podcasts I listened on my drive to and from work 537 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:25,560 Speaker 1: each day at the public library. Uh and I love 538 00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:27,680 Speaker 1: that you cover topics that have had a significant impact 539 00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:29,320 Speaker 1: on our lives, but are just too narrow to be 540 00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:31,880 Speaker 1: taught in a normal high school or college level history course. 541 00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 1: I am an amateur culinary historian. This is where I 542 00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:38,720 Speaker 1: leaned forward a little bit while I was reading. We 543 00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:42,600 Speaker 1: got really excited. So your recent episode on ice cream 544 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:45,600 Speaker 1: was a real treat for me, she quoted treats. After 545 00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:48,280 Speaker 1: listening to it, I decided to cook three vintage ice 546 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:52,360 Speaker 1: cream recipes, vanilla, strawberry, and corn flake from books in 547 00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:54,880 Speaker 1: my collection. You can see the results of my blog 548 00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:56,680 Speaker 1: and maybe try the recipes at home if you like. 549 00:31:57,040 --> 00:31:59,200 Speaker 1: The vanilla and strawberry were out of this world, and 550 00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:02,720 Speaker 1: the corn flake is interesting. Okay, I will go on 551 00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:05,200 Speaker 1: record the corn flake sounded the best to me. Yeah, 552 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:08,760 Speaker 1: well and we um we we being me. I put 553 00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:10,720 Speaker 1: a link to that on our Facebook and Twitter, to 554 00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:13,400 Speaker 1: the cornflake one in particular, just because I feel like 555 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:16,520 Speaker 1: John Harvey Kellogg is rolling over in his grave that 556 00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:20,360 Speaker 1: someone made ice cream out of corn flate is healthy, 557 00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:22,320 Speaker 1: I know, out of his thing. That was all about 558 00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:24,720 Speaker 1: not having dairy or sugar, meat or any of this 559 00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:27,200 Speaker 1: other delicious stuff, and it was all about eating like fairy, 560 00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:30,720 Speaker 1: bland things. But yeah, it makes me super happy that 561 00:32:30,880 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 1: there's corn flake ice cream. I for sure want to 562 00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:34,920 Speaker 1: try the corn flake ice cream recipe because it does 563 00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:38,160 Speaker 1: sound really yell me to me. Yeah. Well, and I 564 00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:40,240 Speaker 1: think she said later and Anna follow up that it 565 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:44,200 Speaker 1: tastes sort of like frozen corn flakes. Yeah. I reading 566 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:46,520 Speaker 1: her blog about it. I think she said I don't 567 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:48,320 Speaker 1: have it in front of me, that it tasted more 568 00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:51,120 Speaker 1: interesting before it froze, but when it froze, it lost 569 00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:55,480 Speaker 1: some of its kind of spices and um, more individual flavors, 570 00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:57,160 Speaker 1: and that's when it started to just taste like frozen 571 00:32:57,240 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 1: corn flakes. I'm fascinated. I'm in and one to make it. 572 00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,240 Speaker 1: When you find me passed out diabetic shock from eating 573 00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:06,280 Speaker 1: all the corpl like ice cream, you'll know what happened. 574 00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:08,200 Speaker 1: I'll probably have to smile on my face. I've been 575 00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:10,360 Speaker 1: really sad when that happened. I hope that doesn't happen. 576 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:12,160 Speaker 1: We try to eat well most of the time so 577 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:17,160 Speaker 1: that we can indulge in the CORNFLA. So thank you 578 00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:19,719 Speaker 1: Angela because you have inspired me in the kitchen. I 579 00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:23,120 Speaker 1: love the idea of being a culinary historian. Yes. Well, 580 00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:26,200 Speaker 1: and we occasionally get all kinds of people who are 581 00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:29,760 Speaker 1: doing blogs of historical recipes and things, and occasionally when 582 00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:31,920 Speaker 1: we talk about what kind of video series we can do, 583 00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:35,640 Speaker 1: we talk about some kind of historical cooking show. Yeah. 584 00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:38,160 Speaker 1: All the food stuff makes us really happy, of course, 585 00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:42,080 Speaker 1: because this food is great. We we've already been talking 586 00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:44,560 Speaker 1: today about what's for lunch and we still have more 587 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:48,240 Speaker 1: episodes to record. Yeah, it's really all about food here. 588 00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:50,200 Speaker 1: Uh So, if you would like to write to us 589 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:52,280 Speaker 1: and share risk, fees are thoughts, you can do so 590 00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:55,560 Speaker 1: at History Podcast at Discovery dot com. You can also 591 00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:58,480 Speaker 1: touch base with us on Twitter atmost in history, on 592 00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:02,120 Speaker 1: Facebook dot com slash history class stuff, or on Tumbler 593 00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:04,800 Speaker 1: at mist in history dot tumbler dot com. We also 594 00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:07,280 Speaker 1: have a board on pictests, which includes I pinned at 595 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:11,000 Speaker 1: one point Thomas Jefferson's vanilla ice cream recipe, although I 596 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,440 Speaker 1: think it's hard to make out the details to actually 597 00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:16,160 Speaker 1: use it because it's handwritten and it's quite an elderly piece. 598 00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:19,239 Speaker 1: It's a photograph of the original document. Uh if you 599 00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:22,120 Speaker 1: would like to learn a little bit about something we 600 00:34:22,200 --> 00:34:24,440 Speaker 1: touched on in today's podcast, if you can go to 601 00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:27,480 Speaker 1: our website and search the word UNESCO and it will 602 00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:29,560 Speaker 1: turn up what is a World Heritage site, so you'll 603 00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:31,759 Speaker 1: get more of a sense of how those are selected 604 00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:35,680 Speaker 1: uh and made into official sites. If you would like 605 00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:37,839 Speaker 1: to research almost anything else in your mind you can 606 00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:40,080 Speaker 1: think of, you can do so at our website. And 607 00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:46,839 Speaker 1: that website is how Stop works dot com for more 608 00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:49,239 Speaker 1: on this and thousands of other topics. 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