1
00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:14,040
Speaker 1: What'd you think of Jeremy when you.

2
00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:20,880
Speaker 2: When at first, man, I thought he was cute.

3
00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:25,360
Speaker 3: He was cute, he was dangerous, iad.

4
00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:32,040
Speaker 4: This is Jamie Nellams. She was Jeremy Scott's girlfriend in

5
00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:35,760
Speaker 4: nineteen eighty seven and nineteen eighty eight. They were both

6
00:00:35,840 --> 00:00:38,560
Speaker 4: seventeen years old when they met at a teen dance

7
00:00:38,600 --> 00:00:43,080
Speaker 4: club in Lakeland, Florida. This was right after Jeremy was

8
00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:46,159
Speaker 4: acquitted in the Jule Johnson murder, and then he and

9
00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:49,199
Speaker 4: Jamie stayed together until his arrest in the murder of

10
00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:55,040
Speaker 4: Donald Morehead. Sixteen years into Jeremy's murder sentence, a detective

11
00:00:55,080 --> 00:01:00,200
Speaker 4: from the Polk County Sheriff's Office contacted Jamie. Jeremy's finger

12
00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:02,800
Speaker 4: prints had been matched to the ones found in Michelle

13
00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:08,760
Speaker 4: Schofield's Mazda, but the investigation didn't last long. Assistant State

14
00:01:08,800 --> 00:01:12,680
Speaker 4: Attorney John Aguero, the same man who prosecuted and convicted

15
00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:16,880
Speaker 4: both Leo and Jeremy, quickly shuts down the investigation into

16
00:01:16,959 --> 00:01:22,600
Speaker 4: Jeremy Scott. Ten months after Jamie is first questioned, criminal

17
00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:26,160
Speaker 4: defense attorney Richard Bartman interviews her in late two thousand

18
00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:31,760
Speaker 4: and five. Bartman is representing Leo Schofield alongside his other attorney,

19
00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:36,360
Speaker 4: Scott Cupp. They're trying to finish the investigation into Jeremy

20
00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:38,920
Speaker 4: Scott that the state barely started.

21
00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:42,360
Speaker 1: So you remember speaking to this detective. What was the

22
00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:43,400
Speaker 1: reason he said he was there.

23
00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:46,880
Speaker 2: He that he needed to come talk with me regarding

24
00:01:46,959 --> 00:01:50,760
Speaker 2: Jeremy Scott, anything else that he told you that he

25
00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:54,000
Speaker 2: was there. He wanted me to take him to places

26
00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:58,360
Speaker 2: Jeremy now that I knew of. He had asked me

27
00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:00,919
Speaker 2: where we had never gone to be alone.

28
00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:02,040
Speaker 1: And I told him.

29
00:02:01,880 --> 00:02:04,680
Speaker 2: About this place over off off thirty three by I

30
00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:06,840
Speaker 2: tour if he wanted me to take him there, to

31
00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:08,280
Speaker 2: show him where that was at.

32
00:02:08,639 --> 00:02:09,399
Speaker 3: And I did that.

33
00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:14,400
Speaker 4: Jamie says that ten months earlier, she led the state's

34
00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:17,840
Speaker 4: detective to a place along State Road thirty three in

35
00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:22,040
Speaker 4: North Lakeland. Now she's telling Richard Bartman what it was

36
00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:26,120
Speaker 4: like when Jeremy first took her there. It was around

37
00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:30,360
Speaker 4: two am in the spring of nineteen eighty seven. Jamie

38
00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:34,639
Speaker 4: was driving and Jeremy was in the passenger seat directing her.

39
00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:39,520
Speaker 2: He told me where to drive. I had just started

40
00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:42,880
Speaker 2: driving and barely knew how to get around my hound,

41
00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:45,880
Speaker 2: let alone how to get anywhere else. So he told

42
00:02:45,919 --> 00:02:46,840
Speaker 2: me where to turn and.

43
00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:51,920
Speaker 1: Did he have any trouble finding.

44
00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:56,000
Speaker 2: Now he knew that you couldn't find us that you knew.

45
00:02:56,000 --> 00:02:56,480
Speaker 3: What's that?

46
00:02:58,560 --> 00:03:02,200
Speaker 4: Jeremy tells her when to slow down, to turn off

47
00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:06,880
Speaker 4: at the cut, to pull onto the dirt path back

48
00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:12,160
Speaker 4: behind the tree line. There's palmetto bushes and garbage on

49
00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:16,600
Speaker 4: the ground. No one else is back there. There's no

50
00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:20,480
Speaker 4: street lights, no houses in sight, and no cars on

51
00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:25,359
Speaker 4: the road either. Jeremy and Jamie are alone.

52
00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:29,320
Speaker 2: We had this saying about being outside.

53
00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:31,280
Speaker 5: He liked to be outside.

54
00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:34,000
Speaker 1: You liked to be outside.

55
00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:39,680
Speaker 4: When Jamie and Jeremy get out of the car and

56
00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:44,200
Speaker 4: walk further from the main road into the dark.

57
00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:46,480
Speaker 1: When you got there, what what was your impression?

58
00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:48,160
Speaker 3: Year in first time you went.

59
00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:52,160
Speaker 2: Then dirty and cold and you.

60
00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:54,240
Speaker 6: Know, dark.

61
00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:57,720
Speaker 2: I remember being nervous because there was nobody around.

62
00:03:58,720 --> 00:03:59,480
Speaker 1: I didn't like it.

63
00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:04,840
Speaker 4: Teenagers would come to the spot along State Road thirty

64
00:04:04,880 --> 00:04:09,800
Speaker 4: three to drink beer, smoke weed and make out, but

65
00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:13,880
Speaker 4: Jamie had been worn to stay away. After police began

66
00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:18,480
Speaker 4: discovering dead girls in the water behind the palmetto bushes.

67
00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:24,799
Speaker 4: One of those girls, Michelle Schofield, was found floating face

68
00:04:24,920 --> 00:04:29,320
Speaker 4: down just a few months earlier in this very same

69
00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:30,560
Speaker 4: drainage canal.

70
00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:39,479
Speaker 1: Do you.

71
00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:44,680
Speaker 7: My mans.

72
00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:48,280
Speaker 3: Have to have my field.

73
00:04:50,600 --> 00:05:14,480
Speaker 7: Soru steps siremists in this vast tea see relation abrege

74
00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:19,640
Speaker 7: dansish to.

75
00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:23,120
Speaker 3: The world, sounding stuff.

76
00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:35,719
Speaker 7: To the bone, sold things sum.

77
00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:54,679
Speaker 4: Things bone Valley, Chapter six.

78
00:05:55,760 --> 00:05:56,400
Speaker 5: Know that I know.

79
00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:05,600
Speaker 4: We talked to Leo's lawyer, Richard Bartman, more than fifteen

80
00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:09,080
Speaker 4: years after he interviewed Jamie Nellams, and I.

81
00:06:09,040 --> 00:06:12,240
Speaker 8: Remember a chilling up my spine which he described what

82
00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:14,760
Speaker 8: this guy had done to her and.

83
00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:17,800
Speaker 1: The level of fear in this woman when we've interviewed her.

84
00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:20,159
Speaker 1: I can't. I've never forgotten that.

85
00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:25,280
Speaker 4: Jamie tells Bartman that the violence began just weeks into

86
00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:30,960
Speaker 4: her relationship with Jeremy Scott. There's punching, choking, and worse.

87
00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:34,960
Speaker 4: She tells Bartman that Jeremy hit her pretty much every

88
00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:35,920
Speaker 4: time she saw him.

89
00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:39,840
Speaker 2: He Hitney, would crossed the pate with a belt before

90
00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:41,120
Speaker 2: he Hitney.

91
00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:43,320
Speaker 1: Was one of my babes before.

92
00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:48,360
Speaker 2: He and he was a baseball bat one.

93
00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:53,000
Speaker 4: Jamie had gone to Disney World with her sisters against

94
00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:58,880
Speaker 4: Jeremy's wishes. When she returned, he walked her outside picked

95
00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:02,880
Speaker 4: up a baseball bat and swung at her face, and

96
00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:09,240
Speaker 4: that was eddy. The blow from the baseball bat left

97
00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:14,160
Speaker 4: her jaw broken and her face disfigured. Her injuries and

98
00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:18,640
Speaker 4: her story left a big impression on Richard Bartman. He

99
00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:20,120
Speaker 4: still thinks about it today.

100
00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:24,160
Speaker 1: And you saw her face and what Scott did to it.

101
00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:25,920
Speaker 1: And this was years later.

102
00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:28,880
Speaker 8: Because she didn't have the money to get her injuries fixed,

103
00:07:29,480 --> 00:07:31,800
Speaker 8: so he had beaten her to such an extent that

104
00:07:31,840 --> 00:07:33,360
Speaker 8: her jaw was deformed.

105
00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:37,960
Speaker 4: Jamie was convinced that Jeremy was going to kill her,

106
00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:44,520
Speaker 4: but instead Jeremy directed his violence at someone else. On

107
00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:49,560
Speaker 4: Halloween Night in nineteen eighty eight, Jeremy murdered Donald moorehead.

108
00:07:50,640 --> 00:07:54,320
Speaker 4: He's arrested the following day and locked up without bail.

109
00:07:55,640 --> 00:07:58,080
Speaker 4: Jamie is finally free from Jeremy.

110
00:07:59,040 --> 00:08:00,800
Speaker 8: I think we talked to her for about two three

111
00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:05,800
Speaker 8: hours about his way of life, about how well he

112
00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:08,600
Speaker 8: knew Lakeland, about how well he knew this area where

113
00:08:08,640 --> 00:08:11,120
Speaker 8: the body was found, About his level of violence, About

114
00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:13,000
Speaker 8: the way he beat up gay people, about the way

115
00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:16,280
Speaker 8: he beat her if she would look at him wrong,

116
00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:19,560
Speaker 8: He beat the shit out of her. The slightest provocation

117
00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:23,280
Speaker 8: he would get violent, so I could easily picture him

118
00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:25,840
Speaker 8: killing Michelle over whatever.

119
00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:26,200
Speaker 1: I mean.

120
00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:28,960
Speaker 8: It didn't have to be rational. And of course I

121
00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:31,880
Speaker 8: remember driving home from that thinking Jesus Christ, this is

122
00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:36,600
Speaker 8: the guy. It matches in so many ways.

123
00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:46,440
Speaker 4: Richard Bartman and Scott Cupp keep gathering information about Jeremy's

124
00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:50,360
Speaker 4: connection to Michelle Schofield's murder. They're making the case that

125
00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:53,920
Speaker 4: Leo deserves a new trial. Not only do they have

126
00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:57,160
Speaker 4: fingerprints that linked Jeremy Scott to the vehicle Michelle was

127
00:08:57,240 --> 00:09:01,400
Speaker 4: driving the night she went missing, have testimony that Jeremy

128
00:09:01,480 --> 00:09:04,240
Speaker 4: used to take his girlfriend Jamie to the same place

129
00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:11,520
Speaker 4: where Michelle's body was found. Richard Bartman could hardly believe

130
00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:14,600
Speaker 4: what Jamie had told him. But when Kelsey and I

131
00:09:14,640 --> 00:09:17,440
Speaker 4: listened to this interview, almost fifteen years after it had

132
00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:20,360
Speaker 4: been recorded, something else caught our attention.

133
00:09:21,520 --> 00:09:24,040
Speaker 1: Did he ever did.

134
00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:27,640
Speaker 2: Okay, Yeah, I kind of thought about that.

135
00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:29,679
Speaker 1: In a long time, and I'm sorry to stir it up.

136
00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:33,720
Speaker 8: I really do apologize, but I don't mean anything personal,

137
00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:38,040
Speaker 8: but it's questions I got to ask, did he ever?

138
00:09:38,559 --> 00:09:39,720
Speaker 1: Did he ever tell you anything?

139
00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:42,880
Speaker 8: Jeremy, Now, during the course of your relationship about the

140
00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:45,720
Speaker 8: crimes he did to criminal ax or any sort of

141
00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:46,840
Speaker 8: criminal activity.

142
00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:52,640
Speaker 2: He told me he had killed a cab driver. He

143
00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,600
Speaker 2: was sixteen seventeen at time, and that he had gotten

144
00:09:55,640 --> 00:10:01,480
Speaker 2: away with it O and that was just a couple

145
00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:06,160
Speaker 2: months before he got arrested to his forehead thanks.

146
00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:06,679
Speaker 9: When he was telling me that.

147
00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:13,960
Speaker 4: Kelsey and I run down the list of murders that

148
00:10:14,080 --> 00:10:18,080
Speaker 4: Jeremy's linked to. We know that Jeremy bragged about killing

149
00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:22,160
Speaker 4: Juel Johnson after he was acquitted of her murder. Jewel

150
00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:24,920
Speaker 4: was found shot dead in a trailer behind her house.

151
00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:30,280
Speaker 4: Jeremy's fingerprints were lifted from her eyeglasses and coin wrappers

152
00:10:30,280 --> 00:10:36,120
Speaker 4: at the scene. Jewel Johnson is murder number one, and

153
00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:39,280
Speaker 4: Jeremy was convicted in the nineteen eighty eight murder of

154
00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:42,720
Speaker 4: Donald Moorehead. He smashed him over the head with a

155
00:10:42,760 --> 00:10:45,959
Speaker 4: grape juice bottle and strangled him with a telephone cord.

156
00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:51,000
Speaker 4: Jeremy was forensically tied to that crime scene and he

157
00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:55,439
Speaker 4: admitted to that killing as well. Donald Moorehead is murder

158
00:10:55,520 --> 00:11:01,800
Speaker 4: number two, and Jeremy's fingerprints were found inside Michelle Schofield's car.

159
00:11:02,840 --> 00:11:06,280
Speaker 4: Her body was discovered in the same Canal where Jeremy

160
00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:10,160
Speaker 4: used to take Jamie to have sex with her Michelle

161
00:11:10,160 --> 00:11:15,320
Speaker 4: Schofield is murder number three. But now Jamie mentions that

162
00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:20,080
Speaker 4: Jeremy had spontaneously confessed to another murder, the killing of

163
00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:29,160
Speaker 4: a taxicab driver. Is this murder number four. We don't

164
00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:31,880
Speaker 4: have a lot to go on, but we start digging.

165
00:11:33,320 --> 00:11:36,320
Speaker 4: We know that if Jeremy killed a taxicab driver, it

166
00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:38,840
Speaker 4: would most likely be in that two year period between

167
00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:42,400
Speaker 4: December nineteen eighty six, when he's released after his acquittal

168
00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:46,160
Speaker 4: of the Juwel Johnson murder, and Halloween of nineteen eighty eight,

169
00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:50,240
Speaker 4: when he's locked up for killing Donald Morehead. That matches

170
00:11:50,280 --> 00:11:54,200
Speaker 4: what Jamie told Bartman. Jeremy would have been sixteen or

171
00:11:54,240 --> 00:11:59,000
Speaker 4: seventeen at the time. We search through databases for unsolved

172
00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:04,000
Speaker 4: homicides and flo We combed through newspaper archives for stories

173
00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:07,600
Speaker 4: about cab drivers killed in central Florida between nineteen eighty

174
00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:12,520
Speaker 4: six and nineteen eighty eight, and then one murder catches

175
00:12:12,559 --> 00:12:17,760
Speaker 4: our attention. In the spring of nineteen eighty seven, right

176
00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:20,760
Speaker 4: near the Polk County line, a twenty five year old

177
00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:24,880
Speaker 4: taxi cab driver named Joseph Lavere was shot dead just

178
00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:31,480
Speaker 4: outside a little community called Intercession City. A suspect named

179
00:12:31,559 --> 00:12:35,720
Speaker 4: dan Odie was arrested and brought to trial twice, but

180
00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:40,120
Speaker 4: the second trial ended with the defendant's acquittal. No one

181
00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:44,079
Speaker 4: else is ever charged in the death of Joseph Lavere,

182
00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:51,160
Speaker 4: so this is an unsolved murder. From his records, we

183
00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:53,680
Speaker 4: know that Jeremy was not in jail at that time.

184
00:12:54,640 --> 00:12:58,000
Speaker 4: It happened just six weeks after Michelle Schofield was killed,

185
00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:02,640
Speaker 4: so we dig a little deeper. We start piecing together

186
00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:06,000
Speaker 4: the crime from newspaper coverage, and this is what we learn.

187
00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:11,959
Speaker 4: It's late at night April tenth, nineteen eighty seven. Lavere

188
00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:14,679
Speaker 4: is driving a taxi for the Yellow Cab Company and

189
00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:17,120
Speaker 4: he's close to finishing his shift when he gets a

190
00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:20,280
Speaker 4: call from his dispatcher directing him to pick up a

191
00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:24,880
Speaker 4: passenger at a kmart in Kassimi. Lavere picks up the

192
00:13:24,920 --> 00:13:29,360
Speaker 4: passenger around ten forty five pm, but about an hour later,

193
00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:32,840
Speaker 4: the cab driver's body is spotted just off the shoulder

194
00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:37,400
Speaker 4: of Old Tampa Highway. It seems that whoever killed Joseph

195
00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:41,680
Speaker 4: Lavere stole the taxi turned off the highway, crossed the

196
00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:46,040
Speaker 4: railroad tracks, and sped onto a quiet residential street in

197
00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:50,480
Speaker 4: Intercession City. He must have been driving fast, because he

198
00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:54,280
Speaker 4: quickly lost control of the vehicle, sideswiping a parked car

199
00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:57,480
Speaker 4: and crashing into a power pole that knocked out the

200
00:13:57,520 --> 00:14:02,320
Speaker 4: electricity in the neighborhood. Residents ran outside to see what

201
00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:05,000
Speaker 4: happened and caught a glimpse of the suspect as he

202
00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:09,000
Speaker 4: fled the scene. The witnesses told police they'd seen a

203
00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:12,760
Speaker 4: white man around five foot ten of a thin or

204
00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:17,400
Speaker 4: medium build running from the cab. He was wearing jeans

205
00:14:17,400 --> 00:14:20,960
Speaker 4: and a flannel shirt, had brown hair, and screamed it's

206
00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:26,760
Speaker 4: gonna blow before he disappeared into the woods. Inside the taxi,

207
00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:31,120
Speaker 4: deputies found a black baseball cap sitting in the back seat.

208
00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:33,720
Speaker 4: We were able to get our hands on a photo

209
00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:36,760
Speaker 4: of this cap. There's a design on the front of it,

210
00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:41,360
Speaker 4: a skull wearing a cowboy hat with a big Confederate

211
00:14:41,400 --> 00:14:46,080
Speaker 4: flag in the background. And then there's this other. Part

212
00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:50,120
Speaker 4: of Bartman's interview with Jamie, I replay it over and

213
00:14:50,200 --> 00:14:54,480
Speaker 4: over again. Jamie says that when she first met Jeremy,

214
00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:57,880
Speaker 4: there was something about his appearance that stood out to.

215
00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:02,880
Speaker 2: Her eyed a ham when I thought was weird. He

216
00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:04,440
Speaker 2: gnied he'd bleaching hair brown.

217
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:11,760
Speaker 4: Jamie thought this was odd because Jeremy never maintained that color. Naturally,

218
00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:15,160
Speaker 4: his hair was brown, and when the dark roots grew

219
00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:19,840
Speaker 4: back in, Jamie said, he never bleached it again. She

220
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:24,320
Speaker 4: and Jeremy met just before his eighteenth birthday, about a

221
00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:29,000
Speaker 4: week after Joseph Lavere was killed. It's a small thing,

222
00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:31,640
Speaker 4: but it could match up with what we know about

223
00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:35,840
Speaker 4: Lavere's murder. It would make sense that the suspect, knowing

224
00:15:35,880 --> 00:15:40,600
Speaker 4: he'd been seen, might try to change his appearance. And

225
00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:44,080
Speaker 4: there's another clue. In Richard Bartman's interview with Jamie, she

226
00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:47,920
Speaker 4: mentions that Jeremy wasn't particularly close with anyone at that time,

227
00:15:48,520 --> 00:15:52,320
Speaker 4: except maybe his younger brother. That brother has a pretty

228
00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:56,440
Speaker 4: distinct name. So we were able to track down Royal Dean.

229
00:15:56,320 --> 00:16:01,120
Speaker 9: Scott to accept this call and all future plus one

230
00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:06,040
Speaker 9: now so the phone calls our subject to monitoring and recording.

231
00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:12,760
Speaker 9: You have thirty eight dollars twenty four cents, Hi, Royal.

232
00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:17,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, he was locked up in the Russell County Jail

233
00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:22,320
Speaker 4: in Alabama, awaiting transfer to state prison. On an obstruction

234
00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:26,800
Speaker 4: of justice charge. I sent Royal Dean a letter, told

235
00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:29,360
Speaker 4: him I opened a phone account with the jail and

236
00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:30,320
Speaker 4: gave him my number.

237
00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:33,120
Speaker 10: I got no problem with answering this, buddy that you

238
00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:36,040
Speaker 10: gotta asked somebody in allted to don't incriminate Jeremy on

239
00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:38,680
Speaker 10: something that's gonna hurt him. I got a problem with that.

240
00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:42,560
Speaker 4: I start chatting with Royal Dean pretty frequently over a

241
00:16:42,560 --> 00:16:45,480
Speaker 4: period of a few weeks. He calls when he can

242
00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:49,880
Speaker 4: and sometimes leaves voicemail messages. We talk about what Jeremy

243
00:16:49,960 --> 00:16:53,120
Speaker 4: was like as a kid in their family life. But

244
00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:56,120
Speaker 4: I'm also trying to find out more about Jeremy's possible

245
00:16:56,160 --> 00:16:58,000
Speaker 4: links to the murder of Joseph Lavere.

246
00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:01,920
Speaker 6: Did you guys believe it? Intercession City at some point?

247
00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:02,640
Speaker 1: Oh?

248
00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:07,960
Speaker 10: Yeah, that's where me and my wife met, okay in

249
00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:11,760
Speaker 10: a session. City is where well man, Jeremy pretty much

250
00:17:11,840 --> 00:17:12,199
Speaker 10: grow up.

251
00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,760
Speaker 6: Really, I mean, did you ever hear anything, Because one

252
00:17:15,840 --> 00:17:18,880
Speaker 6: of the other things that Jeremy confessed to Jamie about

253
00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:24,600
Speaker 6: was robbing a cab driver on the way home from

254
00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:28,359
Speaker 6: Kasimmi towards Intercession City. Did you ever hear anything about that?

255
00:17:29,359 --> 00:17:29,560
Speaker 11: Yes?

256
00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:31,880
Speaker 10: I heard about what is that?

257
00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:33,520
Speaker 6: What happened?

258
00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:34,000
Speaker 11: Uh?

259
00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:42,240
Speaker 10: Wow? I'd heard about the cab driver, man Robb, but

260
00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:45,800
Speaker 10: I didn't I couldn't tell you. I guess about Jeremy.

261
00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:50,800
Speaker 4: He doesn't seem to want to go into this with me. Still,

262
00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:55,480
Speaker 4: Royal Dean keeps calling. We talk about his legal troubles,

263
00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:59,160
Speaker 4: and I keep asking about Jeremy, hoping he shares more

264
00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:04,120
Speaker 4: about their time an Intercession city. And finally he lets

265
00:18:04,160 --> 00:18:04,919
Speaker 4: something slip.

266
00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:09,520
Speaker 10: I remember him saying something about robbing the cans I

267
00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:12,120
Speaker 10: remember my brother telling me about jumping out of a car,

268
00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:14,119
Speaker 10: I mean about taking that out of the money, and

269
00:18:14,160 --> 00:18:16,480
Speaker 10: that something about a gun.

270
00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:22,360
Speaker 6: Do you remember him with blonde hair, Yeah, that would

271
00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:25,119
Speaker 6: be about right soon. Is he trying to change his

272
00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:26,119
Speaker 6: identity or something?

273
00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:30,159
Speaker 10: I think so. I remember the blonde hair, and I

274
00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:32,879
Speaker 10: remember the canserver being robbed, and I remember him saying

275
00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:34,960
Speaker 10: something about it, and then he had to leave for

276
00:18:35,040 --> 00:18:37,320
Speaker 10: the while. And see, I never got any details. I

277
00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:39,760
Speaker 10: just know that my brother disappeared after that. For a while.

278
00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:48,880
Speaker 4: After this conversation, Royal Dean disappeared too. The phone call

279
00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:51,399
Speaker 4: stopped coming when he was transferred to a state prison

280
00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:57,520
Speaker 4: outside of Montgomery.

281
00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:02,679
Speaker 12: I am Jason Flamm, CEO and founder of Lava for

282
00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:06,160
Speaker 12: Good podcasts, home to Bone Valley, Wrongful Conviction, The War

283
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:09,680
Speaker 12: on Drugs, and many other great podcasts. Today we're asking you,

284
00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:12,840
Speaker 12: our listeners, to take part in a survey. Your feedback

285
00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:15,720
Speaker 12: is going to help inform how we make podcasts in

286
00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:18,679
Speaker 12: the future. Your complete and candid answers will help us

287
00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:22,399
Speaker 12: continue to bring you more insightful and inspiring stories about

288
00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:25,560
Speaker 12: important topics that impact us all. So please go to

289
00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:29,159
Speaker 12: Lava for goood dot com slash survey and participate today.

290
00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:30,840
Speaker 12: Thank you for your support.

291
00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:37,920
Speaker 13: Bone Valley is sponsored by Stand Together. Stand Together is

292
00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:41,760
Speaker 13: a philanthropic community that partners with America's boldest change makers

293
00:19:41,840 --> 00:19:44,879
Speaker 13: to tackle the root causes of our country's biggest problems,

294
00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:49,639
Speaker 13: including the broken criminal justice system. Christina Dent is one

295
00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:53,320
Speaker 13: of many entrepreneurs partnering with Stand Together to end the

296
00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:57,080
Speaker 13: War on drugs, the underlying cause of many problems such

297
00:19:57,119 --> 00:20:01,920
Speaker 13: as overincarceration and the criminalization of a in communities across

298
00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:06,240
Speaker 13: the country. As a foster mom, Christina came into contact

299
00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:08,359
Speaker 13: with the War on drugs when she saw how it

300
00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,840
Speaker 13: was ripping apart the family she worked with. She witnessed

301
00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:15,200
Speaker 13: how kids were affected and how mothers wanted something better

302
00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:18,000
Speaker 13: for their families but didn't have the tools to get

303
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:23,320
Speaker 13: there themselves. Christina Dent started a nonprofit called End It

304
00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:26,160
Speaker 13: for Good because she knew there was a better solution

305
00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:30,040
Speaker 13: to help these families. She's working to end the war

306
00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:33,679
Speaker 13: on drugs in Mississippi and build consensus around the state

307
00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:37,520
Speaker 13: to help families struggling with substance abuse problems find a

308
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:41,479
Speaker 13: different path forward than the one they've been given. Stand

309
00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:44,439
Speaker 13: Together has many more stories like this one, as it

310
00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:47,960
Speaker 13: partners with thousands of change makers who were driving solutions

311
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:53,159
Speaker 13: in education, health care, poverty, and the criminal justice system.

312
00:20:53,520 --> 00:20:56,159
Speaker 13: To learn more about the War on drugs, listen to

313
00:20:56,200 --> 00:20:59,639
Speaker 13: the War on Drugs podcast on Apple Podcasts or wherever

314
00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:10,679
Speaker 13: you get your podcasts. Kelsey and I go down to

315
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:13,639
Speaker 13: the Osceola County Clerk's office to look at the case

316
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:18,480
Speaker 13: files and trial transcripts from the murder of Joseph Lavere.

317
00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:20,919
Speaker 13: I wanted to find out what was collected from the

318
00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:24,040
Speaker 13: cab to see if there was any DNA evidence or

319
00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:27,400
Speaker 13: fingerprints that could be run. One of the great things

320
00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:30,560
Speaker 13: about doing research in Florida is the state Sunshine Law

321
00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:34,600
Speaker 13: that requires that all state, county, and municipal records be

322
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:36,000
Speaker 13: made available to the public.

323
00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:39,040
Speaker 4: But we don't get off to a very promising start.

324
00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:42,760
Speaker 4: After asking for the file, we wait for about an

325
00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:47,120
Speaker 4: hour and then they send down not one, not two,

326
00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:49,560
Speaker 4: but three clerks to talk to us.

327
00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:55,400
Speaker 3: Hello. Hi, I'm Gilbert, I'm good.

328
00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:57,840
Speaker 14: How are you? You're welcome?

329
00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:00,120
Speaker 3: I am saying it, Suzy.

330
00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:07,960
Speaker 14: Kelsey, nice to meet you. Yes, so you're interested in

331
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:09,240
Speaker 14: the Daniel aunt file.

332
00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:15,000
Speaker 4: Donna is mispronouncing his name. But Daniel Odie was the

333
00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:18,240
Speaker 4: man who was tried twice and was eventually acquitted of

334
00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:20,600
Speaker 4: killing the cab driver Joseph Laverare.

335
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:26,240
Speaker 14: It doesn't have the arrest affidavit. It's a partial file.

336
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:33,240
Speaker 14: So what's in here you are entitled to view? I

337
00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:33,600
Speaker 14: don't know.

338
00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,760
Speaker 4: If Donna shows me a slim file, it can't have

339
00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:40,440
Speaker 4: more than one hundred pages in it. Usually the clerk's

340
00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:44,160
Speaker 4: office will turn over boxes of files with transcripts, police reports,

341
00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:49,600
Speaker 4: and depositions, thousands of pages. Again, this is all supposed

342
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:52,560
Speaker 4: to be public record, and I'm entitled to view all

343
00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:56,000
Speaker 4: of it, or preferable, I just want to look at

344
00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:58,080
Speaker 4: it first and see what's in there because we're looking

345
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:01,800
Speaker 4: these were two trials too. Homicide trials usually there's like

346
00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:05,520
Speaker 4: transcripts notation about where physical evidence might be.

347
00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 14: Since he was found not guilty, the physical evidence would

348
00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 14: no longer be available, and.

349
00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:14,440
Speaker 4: Is it disposed or is it just not available to

350
00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:18,080
Speaker 4: the public. This is infuriating me and I'm trying not

351
00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:22,080
Speaker 4: to show it. If dan Odie really didn't kill Joseph Laverair,

352
00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 4: that means the murderer might still be out there. I

353
00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,080
Speaker 4: can't understand why this isn't available, and why the clerk

354
00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:31,720
Speaker 4: won't tell me where I can find the information I'm

355
00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:35,120
Speaker 4: looking for. He can't be tried again, right, But I'm saying,

356
00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:37,520
Speaker 4: we think we know who did the crime. Oh, okay,

357
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:39,640
Speaker 4: So it would be lovely to just have some records

358
00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:43,720
Speaker 4: to look at trial transcripts, see what physical evidence did exist.

359
00:23:43,880 --> 00:23:45,359
Speaker 3: Maybe there was a hat we know of in the

360
00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:46,240
Speaker 3: newspaper accounts.

361
00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:46,760
Speaker 5: That's all we know.

362
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:49,399
Speaker 4: But maybe there's some DNA or some hair fibers that

363
00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:50,400
Speaker 4: might match the guy.

364
00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:50,840
Speaker 3: We think did it.

365
00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,359
Speaker 4: But we'll go through all this and look through it

366
00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:55,120
Speaker 4: and just see if we can find any clues as

367
00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:56,280
Speaker 4: to where this stuff might be.

368
00:23:57,800 --> 00:23:59,720
Speaker 14: So that goes back to you, guys, somebody has to

369
00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:00,360
Speaker 14: sit with him.

370
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:02,520
Speaker 10: Yes, so the two options that you have.

371
00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:05,200
Speaker 4: We're told someone will need to observe us if we're

372
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:08,320
Speaker 4: gonna view the files in the courthouse. This has never

373
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:11,760
Speaker 4: happened to me at a clerk's office before. We decide

374
00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:13,800
Speaker 4: to get copies made so we can go through them

375
00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:18,040
Speaker 4: without someone looking over our shoulder. But something's really bothering

376
00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:21,639
Speaker 4: me about this case. It feels like it's been flagged.

377
00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:24,919
Speaker 4: Why do they send down three clerks to tell us

378
00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:28,399
Speaker 4: we're only entitled to view a partial file. They're not

379
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:31,520
Speaker 4: showing me these files because dan Odie was found not guilty.

380
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:35,560
Speaker 4: It doesn't make any sense to me. Kelsey and I

381
00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:38,800
Speaker 4: sit and wait for the copies to be made.

382
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:40,080
Speaker 3: It's such a.

383
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:46,320
Speaker 4: Mysterious right now, I'm a fucking war path. Right We're

384
00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:47,040
Speaker 4: gonna we're gonna go.

385
00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:47,720
Speaker 5: We're gonna go.

386
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,879
Speaker 4: Into the Sheriff's department, and then we're gonna go the

387
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,679
Speaker 4: Stadt Joorney's office. You never heard of fucking something like

388
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:56,600
Speaker 4: this in Florida that did the trial transform funders every

389
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:57,640
Speaker 4: fucking single trial.

390
00:24:57,680 --> 00:24:59,280
Speaker 15: I never looked into the transfer stas.

391
00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:06,359
Speaker 4: Later that same day, we drive to the Osceola County

392
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,399
Speaker 4: Sheriff's office. We tell them that we might have some

393
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:13,159
Speaker 4: important information on an old cold case in their jurisdiction.

394
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:17,199
Speaker 4: They send two young detectives down to us, but they

395
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:21,080
Speaker 4: won't let us record our meeting. The detectives are friendly

396
00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:23,720
Speaker 4: and they listen to what we have to say, but

397
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:27,719
Speaker 4: they don't seem to know anything about this case. Okay,

398
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:31,160
Speaker 4: we just left the Osceola County Sheriff's office. It's raining

399
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:34,760
Speaker 4: out now, and the two detectives in there told us

400
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:37,639
Speaker 4: that who are very interested. They told us that they

401
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:38,919
Speaker 4: were going to look through the file to see if

402
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:40,320
Speaker 4: they can find some physical evidence.

403
00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:44,199
Speaker 5: I think that's good to.

404
00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:52,760
Speaker 1: Reach a detective. Press one to schedule an appointment to regiter.

405
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:57,399
Speaker 4: The detectives say they'll get back to us, but never do.

406
00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 4: I keep calling for updates with no luck. After the tone,

407
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:06,159
Speaker 4: Please record your message.

408
00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:08,360
Speaker 1: When you finish recording, hang up or.

409
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:09,400
Speaker 13: Press the pound key.

410
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:10,639
Speaker 11: For more options.

411
00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 3: Oh, good morning, Detective Miller.

412
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:14,800
Speaker 4: This is Gilbert King. We met with you a couple

413
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,480
Speaker 4: of weeks ago about that cab driver killing back in

414
00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:20,640
Speaker 4: nineteen eighty seven, and Detective Cortes and I just wanted

415
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:22,240
Speaker 4: to follow up with you because I had a file

416
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:24,760
Speaker 4: of information on that particular case. I know we didn't

417
00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:27,160
Speaker 4: really leave you with anything, but I love we're happy.

418
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:31,200
Speaker 4: Since we're having no luck accessing the files or getting

419
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:34,760
Speaker 4: any info from law enforcement, Kelsey and I try to

420
00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:38,280
Speaker 4: find the defendant in the case, the nineteen year old

421
00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:43,960
Speaker 4: kid who stood trial twice for this murder, dan Odie.

422
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:46,879
Speaker 16: So we did find an address for dan Odie that

423
00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,919
Speaker 16: looked pretty solid. It looked like he'd been at that

424
00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:53,960
Speaker 16: address for quite some time. It was all the way

425
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:57,840
Speaker 16: out in East Polk County, which we talk about parts

426
00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 16: of Lakeland being ruled, but it doesn't it doesn't compare

427
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:03,119
Speaker 16: to East Polk County.

428
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:03,359
Speaker 1: You know.

429
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 16: We got out there, but it was just this long,

430
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 16: straight road and I know we were there for miles,

431
00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:12,399
Speaker 16: driving on this road for miles, and we didn't pass

432
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 16: another car. There's no houses, no structures, you know. Our

433
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:22,240
Speaker 16: cell service was in and out. We got to the

434
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 16: street dan Odie lives on and we saw it was

435
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:30,680
Speaker 16: a dirt road. It wasn't like a very well maintained

436
00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:34,040
Speaker 16: dirt road. So we drove down the road. We found

437
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:37,960
Speaker 16: his address and we saw that there were dogs in

438
00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:41,840
Speaker 16: the yard. Big dogs, and there was a flagpole with

439
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:45,280
Speaker 16: a Confederate flag on it. So it just it seemed

440
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 16: a little like, hey, maybe we should give this guy

441
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 16: a heads up before we like go through his gate

442
00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:55,960
Speaker 16: and like have to approach these dogs and like knock

443
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 16: on his door. It just it didn't didn't feel super safe.

444
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 16: So we when and we like found a place to

445
00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:05,840
Speaker 16: sit in the car. We started calling the phone numbers.

446
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:12,920
Speaker 11: You have reached the voicemail box of eight six three.

447
00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:18,880
Speaker 7: Alright, which one was that?

448
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:19,520
Speaker 3: That's the first one.

449
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:24,000
Speaker 1: Let's say hello, Please leave the message after the cane.

450
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:32,920
Speaker 4: Nobody answers their phone anymore. I know, Hello, Hello, is

451
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 4: this mister dan Ott? Mister Ott, my name is Gilbert King,

452
00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:40,600
Speaker 4: and I am working on a criminal justice report. I

453
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 4: was also pronouncing his name wrong. It's Odie Dan Odie first.

454
00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 4: So I don't know if you're around, but we would

455
00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 4: just love to talk to you for a few minutes

456
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:49,160
Speaker 4: if you're available.

457
00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:52,840
Speaker 5: I'm available, all right.

458
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,000
Speaker 4: Could I stop by and just see you in about

459
00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 4: ten minutes or so.

460
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:01,720
Speaker 5: At the car when you hear again, I got an

461
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 5: automatic gate.

462
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:03,440
Speaker 1: I hadn't lift you yet.

463
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:05,760
Speaker 4: Oh okay, all right, I'll call you right when I

464
00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 4: get in front of the gate, then sir, thank you

465
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:09,120
Speaker 4: very much.

466
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:14,240
Speaker 5: Fucking believe this.

467
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 4: All right, we're gonna get out in the fucking porn rain,

468
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:21,240
Speaker 4: but we're gonna have a fucking interview.

469
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:25,200
Speaker 5: All right, let's just go over some questions here quick.

470
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 16: I want you so much.

471
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 4: We tried, we found your address and we had like down.

472
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:41,960
Speaker 3: But I actually when I started reading about your case,

473
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 3: I couldn't believe what you went through.

474
00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, twice, they tried you twice.

475
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 16: Yeah, I know, Like my first impression when we first

476
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 16: saw Dan was I was just a little scared. I

477
00:29:56,080 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 16: was like, did we do we have the right idea

478
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:02,480
Speaker 16: about this? Are we sure this guy didn't do it?

479
00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 16: Because he's a big guy. He's six', four pretty like

480
00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 16: built to, like you, know, hefty like football player type of.

481
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 16: Build and then on top of, that he was wearing

482
00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:20,680
Speaker 16: a baseball cap with A confederate flag on. It you,

483
00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 16: know of, course The confederate flag hat was a key

484
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:28,520
Speaker 16: piece of evidence in this. CASE i, mean obviously not

485
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:31,840
Speaker 16: the hat That ten was, wearing but there was a

486
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 16: baseball cap left in the taxi cab that they think

487
00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:40,680
Speaker 16: belonged to the you, know the murderer who fled the.

488
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 16: Scene so there was definitely a moment WHERE i Think

489
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:50,120
Speaker 16: gilbert AND i were probably thinking the same, thing, Like, oh,

490
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:53,440
Speaker 16: geez did this guy actually do? It do we have this?

491
00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:57,520
Speaker 4: Wrong he invites us in and we all take a

492
00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:01,520
Speaker 4: seat on his couch facing A. Tv there's also a

493
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 4: big aquarium next to. Us you can hear its water

494
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 4: pump in the. Background we Asked dan about what happened

495
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 4: when he was arrested for killing the cab Driver Joseph.

496
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:21,600
Speaker 17: Lavere, well when when they arrested, ME i was in

497
00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:24,520
Speaker 17: the truck, and LIKE i told him in, Court i'm

498
00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:26,920
Speaker 17: down there bying WE i was honest with.

499
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 5: HIM i had nothing to.

500
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:32,400
Speaker 4: Hide dan tells us that after he's pulled over in his,

501
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:36,280
Speaker 4: truck police officers tell him to get. Down there's a

502
00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:40,600
Speaker 4: picture of him in The Orlando, sentinel, handcuffed shirtless and

503
00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:43,840
Speaker 4: splayed out on the ground with a rifle toting deputy

504
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:44,560
Speaker 4: standing over.

505
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:47,160
Speaker 17: Him and when they arrested, me that's WHAT i thought

506
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:50,520
Speaker 17: they was throwing down on me for is. Weed and

507
00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:52,400
Speaker 17: when they had me on the ground AND i, said,

508
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 17: well what are you arresting me for?

509
00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:56,880
Speaker 5: It he, said first or great. MURDER i like to pass.

510
00:31:56,960 --> 00:32:01,479
Speaker 5: Out what are you kidding? ME i JUST i couldn't

511
00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 5: get my. BREATH i was like.

512
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 4: What dan didn't understand why police had been looking for.

513
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:10,640
Speaker 4: Him he wasn't really a, troublemaker and at the time

514
00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:13,320
Speaker 4: of his, arrest all we could find on his record

515
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:18,080
Speaker 4: were minor traffic. Infractions after he was booked into, jail

516
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:22,000
Speaker 4: they fingerprinted, him drew his, blood and plucked hairs from his,

517
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:26,320
Speaker 4: scalp all for comparison with the physical evidence recovered from

518
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:31,640
Speaker 4: the taxi, cab and none of it Matched. Dan on

519
00:32:31,720 --> 00:32:34,040
Speaker 4: the night of the, Murder dan was at a party

520
00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:37,680
Speaker 4: with about a dozen other. People they all vouched For

521
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:41,000
Speaker 4: dan that he was with them all. Night no way

522
00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 4: he left and killed. Someone with his, alibi, witnesses and

523
00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:48,040
Speaker 4: all the physical evidence that did not connect him to

524
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:51,200
Speaker 4: the murder Of Joseph. Lavere guards at the jail were

525
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:54,160
Speaker 4: Telling dan that he had nothing to worry. About he'd

526
00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:54,840
Speaker 4: be going home.

527
00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:59,480
Speaker 17: Soon BUT i was nineteen scared to deaths you, Know

528
00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 17: i'll fix fry for SOMETHING i didn't.

529
00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:03,160
Speaker 5: DO i was. SCARED i ain't GONNA i was.

530
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:08,959
Speaker 4: Scared dan's father didn't want his son to be represented

531
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:09,560
Speaker 4: by a public.

532
00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:15,320
Speaker 17: Defender, yes my daddy had a junkyard and he sold

533
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 17: had a crusher to come out, there and so all

534
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 17: the cars he had jumped him just to get me a.

535
00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:26,240
Speaker 17: Lawyer because my daddy, says, son don't. Worry he, SAID

536
00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:29,880
Speaker 17: i KNOW i didn't raise you this. Way he said

537
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:32,040
Speaker 17: this is, bullshit and he Said i'll spend every DOLLAR i.

538
00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:33,760
Speaker 5: Got he, says you're not going down for.

539
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:37,440
Speaker 4: This dan's dad was able to raise enough money to

540
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 4: hire a private. Attorney you'll never guess who they.

541
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:44,800
Speaker 17: Hired Jack evans said this is one of the most

542
00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:47,520
Speaker 17: framed jobs he'd ever seen in his.

543
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 4: Life Jack edmund the same lawyer who later Represented Leo

544
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 4: schofield at, trial the guy in the western cut suit

545
00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:58,720
Speaker 4: with the tiny waist and the life.

546
00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:02,400
Speaker 17: Savers BUT i never thought much Of jack BECAUSE i always

547
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:04,560
Speaker 17: tried to call him in. JAIL i was, scared and

548
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:06,920
Speaker 17: he'd tell everything's all, right, signed don't worry about and hang.

549
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:09,120
Speaker 17: Up SO i called my. MOM i, Said, mom you

550
00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:12,240
Speaker 17: got fire this. Lawyer i'm gonna. Die you don't.

551
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 4: Seems Like edmund had a habit of dodging his clients

552
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:22,360
Speaker 4: until just before. Trial but the prosecution was certainly investigating their, case.

553
00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:27,880
Speaker 11: But it still puzzles me as to Why. DAN i

554
00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:31,200
Speaker 11: don't understand. IT i don't Even dan didn't even live

555
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:33,319
Speaker 11: In Intercession.

556
00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:37,399
Speaker 4: City While dan sat in, jail people close to him

557
00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:41,160
Speaker 4: started getting knocks on their. Doors one of them Was Tanya,

558
00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:45,839
Speaker 4: dean who was Dating dan's. Cousin she remembers the night

559
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:46,880
Speaker 4: the cab driver was.

560
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:52,520
Speaker 11: MURDERED i remember the power going, out AND i THINK

561
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:55,720
Speaker 11: i was near the, area BUT i didn't see. ANYTHING

562
00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:58,040
Speaker 11: i just heard about it after the, fact and then

563
00:34:58,040 --> 00:34:59,120
Speaker 11: the detective came to the.

564
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:03,799
Speaker 4: House when detectives knock on her, door she's fifteen and

565
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:04,960
Speaker 4: pregnant with her second.

566
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 11: BABY i can one hundred percent recall walking out with

567
00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:16,440
Speaker 11: my child on my hip and the detective, saying we

568
00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:20,719
Speaker 11: know you've seen, him and it, says see Who what

569
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:24,720
Speaker 11: do you? MEAN i didn't see. Anything you Seen Daniel?

570
00:35:24,760 --> 00:35:25,720
Speaker 11: Odie you Seen?

571
00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:26,080
Speaker 2: Dan?

572
00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:26,480
Speaker 11: Doit?

573
00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:28,080
Speaker 8: NO i.

574
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 11: Didn't you're gonna tell us that you've Seen Daniel odie

575
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:38,040
Speaker 11: or that baby on your hip and in the one

576
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:41,360
Speaker 11: in your stomach is going to be. Gone you remember

577
00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:44,360
Speaker 11: that this one hundred. PERCENT i will never forget that.

578
00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:49,200
Speaker 11: Day his name Was Buddy. SHEPHERD i will NEVER i

579
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:51,200
Speaker 11: just got. Chills i'll never forget.

580
00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:55,480
Speaker 4: That Deputy Buddy shepherd was a detective with The Osceola

581
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:58,799
Speaker 4: County Sheriff's office and he was the lead investigator on

582
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:02,800
Speaker 4: The lavere. MURDER i Asked tanya if she's sure That

583
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 4: Buddy shepherd wasn't just warning her that she was under

584
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:10,200
Speaker 4: oath and if she committed perjury there could be consequences

585
00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:11,000
Speaker 4: that would affect her.

586
00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:17,120
Speaker 11: Children absolutely, Not that is not the, no absolutely. Not

587
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:21,520
Speaker 11: it was a direct, threat AND i was told to

588
00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:26,120
Speaker 11: say THAT i seen. HIM i, remember BECAUSE i was a.

589
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:29,440
Speaker 11: MINER i had to have a parent present BECAUSE i

590
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:33,680
Speaker 11: had to go down and make a recorded. Statement AND

591
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 11: i remember telling my, Dad, dad they're making me. Lie

592
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:40,520
Speaker 11: they're telling me WHAT i have to, say or they're

593
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:45,279
Speaker 11: going to take my. Babies he, Said, sissy they can't do.

594
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:51,440
Speaker 11: That they can't take your children because you tell the.

595
00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:55,040
Speaker 11: Truth all you have to do is What i've taught

596
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:59,239
Speaker 11: you is tell the. Truth SO i went down to

597
00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:05,719
Speaker 11: give a statement and the detective kept on, saying so tell,

598
00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 11: us tell us it Was, dan wasn't. It remember it Was?

599
00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:14,720
Speaker 11: Dan and he would point to my stomach AND i, said,

600
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:18,360
Speaker 11: no it. WASN'T i didn't see. ANYTHING i didn't see.

601
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:23,120
Speaker 11: Nothing and he turned off the recorder and he slammed

602
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:25,200
Speaker 11: his fist down and he, says you're gonna tell us

603
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:28,520
Speaker 11: it Was. Dan do you remember WHAT i told. You

604
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:30,600
Speaker 11: you're gonna tell us it Was, dan.

605
00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:32,839
Speaker 4: And this Was Buddy shepherd, Again yes it.

606
00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:34,880
Speaker 1: WAS i was.

607
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:36,800
Speaker 11: TERRIFIED i was.

608
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:42,200
Speaker 4: Terrified tanya says she doesn't give in To Buddy shepherd's.

609
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:45,960
Speaker 4: Threats but it turns out there were other young mothers

610
00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:48,759
Speaker 4: in town who claimed That shepherd tried to get them to.

611
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:51,640
Speaker 4: Lie one of them Was Debbie.

612
00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:55,520
Speaker 17: Murphy, Well Debbie murphy was their main. Witness that's the

613
00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:59,080
Speaker 17: only thing they had against, me and she was pointing me.

614
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:02,200
Speaker 17: Out she said she's seen me over six hundred yards

615
00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:06,200
Speaker 17: away at two o'clock in the, morning run on the

616
00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 17: cross the railroad.

617
00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:12,240
Speaker 4: Tracks at, trial the state's witnesses point To Dan odie

618
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 4: as the man they saw get out of the taxi.

619
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 4: Cab but what's odd is that in the witness's initial

620
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:22,239
Speaker 4: statements to, police they had described the suspect as being

621
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:26,239
Speaker 4: somewhere between five foot eight and six feet tall and

622
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:30,759
Speaker 4: weighing around one hundred and sixty. Pounds that is not Dan.

623
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:35,200
Speaker 4: Odie at the, Time dan was six foot four and

624
00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 4: weighed two hundred and thirty five, pounds which is the

625
00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:41,240
Speaker 4: average size of a tight end in The National Football.

626
00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 4: League he's kind of hard to. Miss Dan odie's friends

627
00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:53,640
Speaker 4: are all testifying under oath That dan was with them all.

628
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,960
Speaker 4: Night the jury has to decide which witnesses are, lying

629
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:01,480
Speaker 4: and they can't do. It failed to reach a verdict

630
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:05,600
Speaker 4: and a mistrial is. Declared but just two months, later

631
00:39:06,200 --> 00:39:09,200
Speaker 4: the state tries Dan odie, again.

632
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:13,760
Speaker 17: And everybody kind of didn't want to pursue, it except

633
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:16,920
Speaker 17: For Buddy. Shepherd Old Buddy. Shepherd he wouldn't letting it.

634
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:19,919
Speaker 17: Go he was just he was bound and determined to frame.

635
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:21,040
Speaker 17: Me he wasn't gonna let it.

636
00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:24,560
Speaker 4: Go Debbie murphy takes the stand again in the second,

637
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:28,280
Speaker 4: trial but in the middle of her, testimony the trial

638
00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:29,080
Speaker 4: grinds to a.

639
00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:32,000
Speaker 5: Halt she came clean on the second.

640
00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:35,719
Speaker 17: Trial she broke, down started, crying and they stopped and

641
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:37,799
Speaker 17: said what's. Wrong she, SAID i can't do this no.

642
00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:41,080
Speaker 17: More she, Said dan Those i've never seen him that.

643
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:44,920
Speaker 17: NIGHT i Know dan from. SCHOOL i never Seen dan

644
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:47,439
Speaker 17: on the railroad tracks that. Night she, SAID i haven't

645
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:50,160
Speaker 17: Seen dan since we got out of, school and she told,

646
00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:52,719
Speaker 17: him you, know, LOOK i was paid to say. THIS

647
00:39:53,360 --> 00:39:55,399
Speaker 17: i was threatening with my kids IF i didn't say

648
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:59,480
Speaker 17: this Against Daniel. Rody AND i was, like oh, wow

649
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:04,120
Speaker 17: finally come. True you know at, Lease oh, MAN i tell,

650
00:40:04,120 --> 00:40:05,919
Speaker 17: You i'll tell.

651
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 4: You after the, Trial dan Says debbie apologized for lying

652
00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:16,840
Speaker 4: about seeing him on the railroad tracks that, night.

653
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:20,200
Speaker 17: AND i told, HER i, understand you, Know i'm just

654
00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:23,520
Speaker 17: glad you finally came forward BECAUSE i was fixing got

655
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 17: electric chair for SOMETHING i know THAT i didn't. Do

656
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:29,000
Speaker 17: but she finally came forward told the.

657
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:33,360
Speaker 4: Truth there was a quick investigation into the claims That

658
00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:38,799
Speaker 4: Buddy shepherd was threatening young mothers In Intercession. City despite the,

659
00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:44,760
Speaker 4: allegations he was. Cleared On october, twentieth nineteen eighty. Seven

660
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:48,600
Speaker 4: Dan is acquitted of the murder of cab Driver Joseph.

661
00:40:48,719 --> 00:40:52,920
Speaker 17: Lavere it was a great feeling because my mom had

662
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:54,520
Speaker 17: three stroke fries in, there.

663
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:57,080
Speaker 5: And when.

664
00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:02,960
Speaker 17: WHEN i was choosing not of it no, more she

665
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:06,280
Speaker 17: broke down and cried and felt you could just see

666
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:09,520
Speaker 17: wake lifts it off over BECAUSE i was her, baby you,

667
00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:11,480
Speaker 17: know of all my, BROTHERS i was her, baby and

668
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:13,879
Speaker 17: she she KNOWED i didn't do, it but she just

669
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:16,400
Speaker 17: she really thought she had never Seen nick again like.

670
00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:20,280
Speaker 17: This and when they said not, guilty just everybody jumped.

671
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:24,280
Speaker 4: Up But Dan odie had spent six months in, jail

672
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:27,760
Speaker 4: and he sat through two trials facing the death, penalty

673
00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:32,319
Speaker 4: and despite being found not, guilty he still doesn't feel

674
00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:33,120
Speaker 4: like his name has been.

675
00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:39,759
Speaker 17: Cleared but it's just it's still to this. DAY i,

676
00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:43,279
Speaker 17: MEAN i don't think about. IT i know what's right

677
00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:45,080
Speaker 17: and what's, wrong AND i KNOW i didn't do it

678
00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:48,520
Speaker 17: and all, This but when you meet people from back

679
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 17: then that you see him somewhere on the street today

680
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:54,759
Speaker 17: and they kind of look at you, like oh, yeah,

681
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:57,719
Speaker 17: hey and you know they're, thinking did you do it

682
00:41:57,800 --> 00:41:58,200
Speaker 17: or did you?

683
00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:01,120
Speaker 5: Not BUT i just stare is a, way.

684
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:06,799
Speaker 17: Without a shadow of doubt THAT i could show everybody

685
00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:08,040
Speaker 17: THAT i did not do.

686
00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:12,719
Speaker 16: THIS i want to see that physical evidence.

687
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:14,440
Speaker 5: Too oh my.

688
00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:17,320
Speaker 17: GOD i would love for y'all to do THE dna

689
00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:19,239
Speaker 17: and find out who really did.

690
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:23,040
Speaker 5: IT i would just really like to know who did.

691
00:42:23,080 --> 00:42:31,319
Speaker 4: It when we first walked in to talk To, dan

692
00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,839
Speaker 4: we weren't sure what to, expect but listening To dan

693
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:38,479
Speaker 4: tell his story and talk about his, innocence it's hard

694
00:42:38,560 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 4: not to think About. Leo they both want us to

695
00:42:42,080 --> 00:42:46,359
Speaker 4: keep investigating their cases from thirty five years. Ago they

696
00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:49,600
Speaker 4: want so badly to get to the, truth to have

697
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:51,759
Speaker 4: their names cleared so they can get on with their.

698
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 4: Lives the state insists that they had the right man

699
00:42:56,280 --> 00:42:58,560
Speaker 4: And Dan, odie but that the jury just saw it,

700
00:42:58,600 --> 00:43:03,320
Speaker 4: differently so after his acquittal they don't investigate any. Further

701
00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:07,279
Speaker 4: but if the state is, wrong that means that the

702
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 4: murderer Of Joseph lavere may still be out there. SOMEWHERE

703
00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:30,839
Speaker 4: i just can't stop thinking this has to Be. Jeremy

704
00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:36,400
Speaker 4: it's twenty, ten twenty three years After Michelle schofield was.

705
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:41,160
Speaker 4: Killed more than five years have passed since the unidentified

706
00:43:41,200 --> 00:43:45,960
Speaker 4: fingerprints in The mazda were matched To Jeremy, scott and

707
00:43:46,120 --> 00:43:50,560
Speaker 4: Finally leo's granted an Evident sherry, hearing which he hopes

708
00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:54,600
Speaker 4: will lead to a new. Trial his lawyers prepare to

709
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:59,360
Speaker 4: present the new, evidence the fingerprints And Jamie nillam's testimony

710
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:02,440
Speaker 4: about Ja jeremy's violence and how he brought her to

711
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:05,360
Speaker 4: the same spot Where michelle's body was.

712
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:10,960
Speaker 8: Found all of the things we found out about him.

713
00:44:09,840 --> 00:44:10,319
Speaker 1: Made him the.

714
00:44:10,400 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 4: Killer this Is Richard, Bartman leo's, attorney and.

715
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:20,920
Speaker 8: It certainly in discerated any any possibility That leo did.

716
00:44:20,920 --> 00:44:22,799
Speaker 8: This if this case went to travel with all that,

717
00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:27,280
Speaker 8: evidence it would have been mountains a doubt About leo

718
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:30,720
Speaker 8: being the, killer and it would have created all sorts

719
00:44:30,719 --> 00:44:34,799
Speaker 8: of very clear pictures in my mind that not only

720
00:44:34,920 --> 00:44:36,520
Speaker 8: wasn't It, leo but we knew who did.

721
00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:37,400
Speaker 1: This it Was Jeremy.

722
00:44:37,400 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 4: Scott Both jeremy And leo are brought from their respective

723
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,400
Speaker 4: prisons to the Pol County jail to attend the. Hearing

724
00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:51,359
Speaker 4: this is the first time That jeremy And leo will

725
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:55,440
Speaker 4: be in the same room. Together leo's, Wife, chrissy has

726
00:44:55,480 --> 00:44:58,160
Speaker 4: been waiting for this day in court for a long.

727
00:44:58,200 --> 00:45:02,080
Speaker 18: Time in our, mine in my, mind there was absolutely

728
00:45:02,120 --> 00:45:02,839
Speaker 18: no way to lose.

729
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:04,799
Speaker 5: This it's a no.

730
00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:08,960
Speaker 18: Brainer you've got physical evidence now that was not in

731
00:45:09,040 --> 00:45:14,480
Speaker 18: the case. Before so in anticipation of the, HEARING i

732
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:19,160
Speaker 18: bought him two, suits had them, tailored they were. Packed

733
00:45:20,320 --> 00:45:21,000
Speaker 18: we were ready to.

734
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:27,280
Speaker 4: Go the hearing begins On may, fifth twenty, Ten Jeremy

735
00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:30,520
Speaker 4: scott is called to, testify and he's questioned BY. C. J,

736
00:45:30,719 --> 00:45:32,399
Speaker 4: benefield an assistant state.

737
00:45:32,440 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 5: Attorney Jeremy Lenny.

738
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:40,040
Speaker 19: Scott, WELL i asked, you did you ever know a

739
00:45:40,080 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 19: PERSON i Named Michelle? Schofield, no, Sir i'm going to ask.

740
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:53,239
Speaker 19: You did you Kill Michelle? Schofield, no, sir. Didn't are

741
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:56,960
Speaker 19: you aware that a fingerprint of yours was found in her?

742
00:45:57,320 --> 00:45:58,680
Speaker 3: Vehicle, yes, SIR i.

743
00:45:58,719 --> 00:46:04,360
Speaker 4: Am When Jeremy scott is called to, testify he denies Killing,

744
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:08,800
Speaker 4: michelle but the assistant state attorney doesn't really seem committed

745
00:46:08,840 --> 00:46:10,560
Speaker 4: to getting a consistent story out of.

746
00:46:10,600 --> 00:46:16,839
Speaker 3: Him tell me about your activities back. Then my activities

747
00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:20,520
Speaker 3: WAS i. WOULDN'T i wasn't even stealing cars or.

748
00:46:20,680 --> 00:46:24,600
Speaker 20: Tires my thinging was breaking, cars, steer stereo, systems.

749
00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:26,560
Speaker 5: Speakers that was my.

750
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:30,480
Speaker 3: Thing how did you get transportation to do these? Activities

751
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:39,000
Speaker 3: jamie's Carr jamie was not aware of. It do you

752
00:46:39,040 --> 00:46:39,920
Speaker 3: know about when you Met?

753
00:46:40,040 --> 00:46:44,160
Speaker 21: Jamie april was, seventeen nineteen eighty.

754
00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:51,440
Speaker 3: Seven how do you remember that? Date, okay my birthday

755
00:46:51,480 --> 00:46:52,320
Speaker 3: is on a twenty ninth Of.

756
00:46:52,440 --> 00:46:57,280
Speaker 4: April he's saying that he used his Girlfriend jamie's car

757
00:46:57,600 --> 00:47:03,120
Speaker 4: to steal stereo equipment from abandoned. Vehicles But jamie And

758
00:47:03,200 --> 00:47:06,800
Speaker 4: jeremy didn't even meet until about six weeks After Michelle

759
00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:12,600
Speaker 4: schofield was. Killed the state lets these inconsistencies go. Unchallenged

760
00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:16,759
Speaker 4: the state says they Trust jeremy's story about why his

761
00:47:16,800 --> 00:47:20,239
Speaker 4: fingerprints were found in the car Because State Attorney John

762
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:26,160
Speaker 4: aguero believes. Him John, aguero the prosecutor with the electric

763
00:47:26,239 --> 00:47:29,399
Speaker 4: chair tigh, clip is called as a witness to talk

764
00:47:29,440 --> 00:47:30,319
Speaker 4: about his meeting With.

765
00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:36,200
Speaker 20: Jeremy SO i had Mister scott brought back from whatever

766
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:38,120
Speaker 20: correctional institute he was in.

767
00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:39,840
Speaker 1: To my.

768
00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:44,120
Speaker 4: Office jeremy was brought To aguero's office in two thousand

769
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:47,640
Speaker 4: and five to talk about The. Prince the two men

770
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:51,920
Speaker 4: spoke behind closed. Doors there were no other witnesses and

771
00:47:51,960 --> 00:47:56,359
Speaker 4: no tape. Recordings all we have to go on Is aguero's.

772
00:47:56,400 --> 00:48:00,839
Speaker 20: WORD i told him that his fingerprint was found in a,

773
00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:05,759
Speaker 20: car THAT i had put Mister schofield in prison for

774
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:07,719
Speaker 20: the rest of his life for killing his, wife and

775
00:48:07,760 --> 00:48:12,319
Speaker 20: if he didn't do, IT i had to know. It

776
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:18,359
Speaker 20: THEREFORE i would give him. Immunity that it was more

777
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:20,959
Speaker 20: important for me to know the, truth than it, was.

778
00:48:22,840 --> 00:48:23,400
Speaker 5: Than anything.

779
00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:27,640
Speaker 4: Else John aguero is saying that in this one on one,

780
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:32,160
Speaker 4: meeting when he Questioned jeremy about his, fingerprints he Offered

781
00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:38,480
Speaker 4: jeremy immunity essentially confess to Killing Michelle schofield and you

782
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:39,799
Speaker 4: won't be charged with the.

783
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:47,239
Speaker 20: Crime Mister, scott AS i, said was. COOPERATIVE i think

784
00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:53,560
Speaker 20: he fully understood, immunity fully understood that it was important

785
00:48:53,560 --> 00:48:57,719
Speaker 20: to me that if he did this, murder it would

786
00:48:57,880 --> 00:49:01,040
Speaker 20: BE i couldn't prosecute, him BUT i could let Leosco

787
00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:01,640
Speaker 20: field out of.

788
00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:06,120
Speaker 4: Jail i've asked lawyers and legal experts about the kind

789
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:09,560
Speaker 4: of full Immunity aguero claims he Offered jeremy in this

790
00:49:09,680 --> 00:49:13,160
Speaker 4: closed door, meeting And i've been told it just doesn't

791
00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:17,000
Speaker 4: happen like, this or it isn't supposed. To and it

792
00:49:17,080 --> 00:49:19,640
Speaker 4: makes no sense to me Why aguero would do, that

793
00:49:20,560 --> 00:49:24,200
Speaker 4: because If jeremy admitted under full immunity that he Killed,

794
00:49:24,200 --> 00:49:27,839
Speaker 4: Michelle leo would be released from prison and no one

795
00:49:27,840 --> 00:49:32,200
Speaker 4: would ever be charged With michelle's. Murder and on top

796
00:49:32,239 --> 00:49:35,120
Speaker 4: of how little sense it, MAKES i can't find any

797
00:49:35,200 --> 00:49:40,120
Speaker 4: documentation of this alleged immunity Offer leo's lawyers say they

798
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:43,920
Speaker 4: made repeated requests for proof of it, too and the

799
00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:48,279
Speaker 4: state's response is. Telling they don't turn over any. Documentation

800
00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:52,480
Speaker 4: they just argue about the number of Requests leo's lawyers,

801
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,759
Speaker 4: made so no proof of immunity is ever.

802
00:49:55,840 --> 00:50:00,719
Speaker 3: Produced what was his explanations to the thing in that?

803
00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:04,640
Speaker 20: Vehicle Mister scott indicated that at the time he was a.

804
00:50:04,719 --> 00:50:09,200
Speaker 4: Thief aguero says he Looked jeremy in the eye and

805
00:50:09,360 --> 00:50:13,480
Speaker 4: asked him if he Killed Michelle. Schofield jeremy said he,

806
00:50:13,520 --> 00:50:18,920
Speaker 4: didn't that he's just a car stereo, thief And aguero believes.

807
00:50:19,000 --> 00:50:23,200
Speaker 4: Him this is the same prosecutor who tried to Send

808
00:50:23,239 --> 00:50:27,040
Speaker 4: Jeremy scott to the electric chair for Killing Donald, morehead

809
00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:30,920
Speaker 4: arguing to the court That jeremy was a cold blooded

810
00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:32,400
Speaker 4: criminal who couldn't be.

811
00:50:32,480 --> 00:50:37,320
Speaker 19: Trusted after getting this information and the investigation was, complete

812
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:38,239
Speaker 19: did you do anything with?

813
00:50:38,320 --> 00:50:43,040
Speaker 5: It, WELL i did not go any.

814
00:50:43,080 --> 00:50:47,439
Speaker 20: FURTHER i made notes in my file concerning my, investigation

815
00:50:47,560 --> 00:50:50,080
Speaker 20: AND i closed the investigation.

816
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:51,920
Speaker 3: At any time that you notify.

817
00:50:52,040 --> 00:50:56,600
Speaker 21: Them they Believed jeremy his reasons for being in the

818
00:50:56,680 --> 00:51:02,120
Speaker 21: car was. Credible believed that it's.

819
00:51:02,080 --> 00:51:08,359
Speaker 4: Credible now everyone is left waiting and wondering if The

820
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:13,120
Speaker 4: Polk county judge presiding over this hearing will also Believe Jeremy.

821
00:51:13,120 --> 00:51:24,760
Speaker 4: Scott Judge Keith spoto's ruling is released just six weeks

822
00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:30,400
Speaker 4: after the. Hearing spoto, writes given Mister scott's past history

823
00:51:30,600 --> 00:51:34,680
Speaker 4: and modus, operandi there is every reason to believe that

824
00:51:34,760 --> 00:51:38,640
Speaker 4: he simply stumbled upon the car after her murder and

825
00:51:38,800 --> 00:51:42,600
Speaker 4: after her body had been, hidden stole stereo equipment from her,

826
00:51:42,640 --> 00:51:47,799
Speaker 4: car thereby leaving his fingerprints in the. Vehicle in other,

827
00:51:47,840 --> 00:51:53,359
Speaker 4: Words Judge spoto Considers jeremy's past history and rules That

828
00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:57,839
Speaker 4: Jeremy scott is simply a car stereo, thief that he's

829
00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:03,280
Speaker 4: telling the. Truth as far as the. Concerned it's almost

830
00:52:03,360 --> 00:52:06,799
Speaker 4: as if it was inconceivable To Judge spoto that a

831
00:52:06,920 --> 00:52:10,360
Speaker 4: known murderer who was tried twice for homicide by this

832
00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:16,160
Speaker 4: same office might also steal from his victim, afterwards just

833
00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:20,160
Speaker 4: Like jeremy did after killing Jul johnson when he stole her,

834
00:52:20,160 --> 00:52:24,719
Speaker 4: coins and just Like jeremy did after Killing Donald morehead

835
00:52:25,080 --> 00:52:34,080
Speaker 4: when he stole his. Car Judge spoto Denies leo's motion

836
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:38,239
Speaker 4: for a new Trial i'm stunned AS i read this,

837
00:52:38,320 --> 00:52:41,959
Speaker 4: opinion but MAYBE i shouldn't, be given that so many

838
00:52:42,040 --> 00:52:44,960
Speaker 4: of the judges In Polk county come from The State attorney's.

839
00:52:45,000 --> 00:52:50,240
Speaker 4: Office for, Example Judge, spoto who presided Over leo's, hearing

840
00:52:50,719 --> 00:52:54,560
Speaker 4: worked as a prosecutor in The Tenth circuit Alongside John

841
00:52:54,600 --> 00:52:56,239
Speaker 4: aguero for nearly a.

842
00:52:56,280 --> 00:53:00,880
Speaker 15: Decade My, God i've BEEN i have been long about

843
00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:04,239
Speaker 15: virtually everything with from the, beginning WHICH i thought was

844
00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:11,480
Speaker 15: going to. Happen SO i feel bad about that personally misread.

845
00:53:11,520 --> 00:53:17,799
Speaker 4: Everything Scott cupp thought at one point that the discovery

846
00:53:17,840 --> 00:53:21,600
Speaker 4: Of jeremy's fingerprints In michelle's car would Spring leo out

847
00:53:21,600 --> 00:53:26,200
Speaker 4: of prison in just ninety. Days but once again his

848
00:53:26,360 --> 00:53:29,359
Speaker 4: intuition That leo would be given a new trial is.

849
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:33,600
Speaker 8: Wrong it's the greatest personal and professional regret of my

850
00:53:33,680 --> 00:53:35,839
Speaker 8: life That Leo scholfield is still in.

851
00:53:35,840 --> 00:53:38,960
Speaker 4: Prison Richard, Bartman leo's other.

852
00:53:39,040 --> 00:53:42,239
Speaker 1: Lawyer no one really wanted to admit they were.

853
00:53:42,239 --> 00:53:44,719
Speaker 8: Wrong no one really took the kind of close look

854
00:53:44,719 --> 00:53:48,200
Speaker 8: we were urging them to. Take people got cooked on

855
00:53:48,320 --> 00:53:52,480
Speaker 8: these mythological remembrances of evidence that didn't.

856
00:53:52,480 --> 00:53:59,280
Speaker 4: Exist mythological remembrances of. Evidence that's. Right Judge spoto couldn't

857
00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:03,440
Speaker 4: resist writing About Leo senior's. Premonition it's included in his

858
00:54:03,520 --> 00:54:06,960
Speaker 4: summary of the state's, evidence Which spoto says is quote

859
00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:10,359
Speaker 4: strong and sufficient for a jury to Convict Leo.

860
00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:13,719
Speaker 22: Schofield how is that evidence of?

861
00:54:13,760 --> 00:54:14,480
Speaker 15: Guilt it's.

862
00:54:14,600 --> 00:54:16,799
Speaker 5: Not it's just some.

863
00:54:18,120 --> 00:54:22,600
Speaker 22: Anomaly it's just something that comes. Up doesn't mean any

864
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:26,600
Speaker 22: can mean a million. Things guy's historyonic guys are. Nut

865
00:54:28,280 --> 00:54:31,280
Speaker 22: he's not evidence of. Guilt it's not evidence of. Anything

866
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:37,480
Speaker 22: that's the urban legend. Stuff it just has its own you,

867
00:54:37,520 --> 00:54:39,680
Speaker 22: know the snowball going. Down how many can't stop.

868
00:54:39,719 --> 00:54:46,880
Speaker 4: It, meanwhile the physical evidence That kup And bartman do

869
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:51,560
Speaker 4: present About jeremy's connection To michelle's, murder it's dismissed by

870
00:54:51,560 --> 00:54:55,319
Speaker 4: the judge as a happy, coincidence as if it was

871
00:54:55,440 --> 00:54:58,759
Speaker 4: just bad luck For jeremy that his fingerprints turned up

872
00:54:58,760 --> 00:55:01,160
Speaker 4: in the car of a young woman who'd been found

873
00:55:01,239 --> 00:55:04,120
Speaker 4: dead in a dark place where he was known to hang.

874
00:55:04,160 --> 00:55:07,839
Speaker 8: OUT i so the likely don't understand how a trial

875
00:55:07,920 --> 00:55:09,560
Speaker 8: judge or appellate court could have looked.

876
00:55:09,360 --> 00:55:12,359
Speaker 1: At what we came up with and said nothing to see.

877
00:55:12,360 --> 00:55:18,000
Speaker 4: Here this disappointment hits no one harder Than, leo and

878
00:55:18,040 --> 00:55:21,000
Speaker 4: by the time he learned of the judge's, decision he

879
00:55:21,200 --> 00:55:25,000
Speaker 4: was still reeling from an encounter that happened right before

880
00:55:25,040 --> 00:55:25,640
Speaker 4: he entered the.

881
00:55:25,680 --> 00:55:33,360
Speaker 21: Courtroom i'm gonna tell you, this, MAN i should probably filter.

882
00:55:33,480 --> 00:55:35,239
Speaker 21: It i'm not gonna filter. It i'm gonna let you

883
00:55:35,239 --> 00:55:36,000
Speaker 21: filter what you want to.

884
00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:36,520
Speaker 3: Filter this.

885
00:55:36,600 --> 00:55:38,440
Speaker 21: Is and If i'm wrong for this and you tell

886
00:55:38,480 --> 00:55:41,560
Speaker 21: Me i'm wrong And Soviet i've been wronged for a long.

887
00:55:41,640 --> 00:55:45,520
Speaker 21: Time i've been, WRONGED i would have been justified in

888
00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:46,440
Speaker 21: my mind to be.

889
00:55:46,560 --> 00:55:54,080
Speaker 4: Wrong it's the morning before the first day of the evidentiary.

890
00:55:54,120 --> 00:55:58,000
Speaker 4: Hearing leo And jeremy are both brought to the jail

891
00:55:58,160 --> 00:56:01,719
Speaker 4: across from the courthouse for the. Hearing they're supposed to

892
00:56:01,800 --> 00:56:04,960
Speaker 4: be separated from each other since they're now involved in

893
00:56:05,000 --> 00:56:08,920
Speaker 4: the same. Case So leo was grouped with other defendants

894
00:56:08,960 --> 00:56:10,200
Speaker 4: who are doing court.

895
00:56:09,960 --> 00:56:15,040
Speaker 21: That, day and so they had all the guys handcuffed

896
00:56:15,040 --> 00:56:19,160
Speaker 21: two by. Two there's thirty three of, us So i'm

897
00:56:19,200 --> 00:56:22,400
Speaker 21: the odd man, out So i'm not handcuffed to. Anybody

898
00:56:23,040 --> 00:56:26,600
Speaker 21: and so there's a tunnel that goes under the road

899
00:56:26,840 --> 00:56:29,880
Speaker 21: between the jail and the courthouse that they bring the inmates.

900
00:56:29,920 --> 00:56:30,640
Speaker 5: To it's a long.

901
00:56:30,719 --> 00:56:33,160
Speaker 21: Tunnel there's only one door, in one door on the

902
00:56:33,160 --> 00:56:36,960
Speaker 21: other side, out and there's no doors on the. Inside

903
00:56:37,160 --> 00:56:41,160
Speaker 21: it's it's a, concrete unfinished concrete tunnel on the.

904
00:56:41,239 --> 00:56:46,040
Speaker 4: Road they're led through the door and start walking through the.

905
00:56:46,080 --> 00:56:49,759
Speaker 4: Tunnel they march down and stop in front of the

906
00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:53,920
Speaker 4: door that leads to the. Courthouse there's an officer there

907
00:56:54,440 --> 00:56:57,600
Speaker 4: and he starts banging on the door waiting for someone

908
00:56:57,680 --> 00:56:59,239
Speaker 4: on the other side to let them.

909
00:56:59,280 --> 00:57:02,440
Speaker 21: In, meanwhile all the way back at the end of the,

910
00:57:02,440 --> 00:57:07,799
Speaker 21: tunnel here Comes. Jeremy come, on another. Man he was by.

911
00:57:07,880 --> 00:57:13,280
Speaker 4: Himself leo has Seen jeremy's mugshots. Before it's a face

912
00:57:13,360 --> 00:57:14,640
Speaker 4: that's seared Into leo's.

913
00:57:14,680 --> 00:57:18,920
Speaker 21: MIND i can see him way back, there walking, up

914
00:57:18,920 --> 00:57:21,040
Speaker 21: AND i can see him walking, up AND i had

915
00:57:21,160 --> 00:57:24,000
Speaker 21: enough time to stand there thinking my heart stots, racing

916
00:57:24,680 --> 00:57:26,800
Speaker 21: AND i, SAID i know these people are not gonna

917
00:57:26,840 --> 00:57:29,800
Speaker 21: just walk the murder of my wife right up in

918
00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:31,840
Speaker 21: front of me in this, tunnel right. Here after all

919
00:57:31,880 --> 00:57:34,480
Speaker 21: That i'm gone, through AND i just made a decision

920
00:57:34,560 --> 00:57:37,480
Speaker 21: in my. Mind if they march him up and put

921
00:57:37,560 --> 00:57:40,560
Speaker 21: him alongside of. Me That's god's. Will i'm gonna end

922
00:57:40,560 --> 00:57:44,680
Speaker 21: it right here in this. Hallway and So i'm my

923
00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:47,120
Speaker 21: drone is, pumping it's, pumping it's, pumping and march him

924
00:57:47,200 --> 00:57:49,640
Speaker 21: up And i'm getting ready and all. Round i'm just

925
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:51,840
Speaker 21: gonna wrap his handcuffs around his neck And i'm gonna

926
00:57:51,840 --> 00:57:54,480
Speaker 21: take him. Down and they're not gonna be beat me

927
00:57:54,520 --> 00:57:58,080
Speaker 21: off of him until twenty something years of frustration and

928
00:57:58,400 --> 00:58:01,200
Speaker 21: comes out AND i get you From, michelle and it's.

929
00:58:01,240 --> 00:58:02,600
Speaker 21: Done now you can go ahead and put me in.

930
00:58:02,640 --> 00:58:05,320
Speaker 21: Prison NOW i belong, there you know WHAT i. Mean

931
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:06,919
Speaker 21: And i'm not.

932
00:58:06,840 --> 00:58:09,080
Speaker 3: A, murderer that's who they made.

933
00:58:09,120 --> 00:58:13,600
Speaker 21: ME i, Mean i've had to fight for my life

934
00:58:13,800 --> 00:58:16,560
Speaker 21: in here WHEN i first came in twenty two years,

935
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:19,600
Speaker 21: old young and white in the prison. System no dad's,

936
00:58:19,640 --> 00:58:22,920
Speaker 21: coming no police, Coming nobody cares. You you have to

937
00:58:22,960 --> 00:58:26,440
Speaker 21: do this or be raped or something stupid like. That

938
00:58:26,560 --> 00:58:29,480
Speaker 21: so you know where your lines. ARE i know where

939
00:58:29,680 --> 00:58:32,600
Speaker 21: my lines, are and you cannot cross that line without

940
00:58:32,800 --> 00:58:36,000
Speaker 21: certain things. Happening if you're gonna watch the murder of

941
00:58:36,040 --> 00:58:39,400
Speaker 21: my life and put him, upside that's a line you cannot.

942
00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:41,160
Speaker 3: Cross just so.

943
00:58:41,360 --> 00:58:44,680
Speaker 21: Happened they got him maybe ten feet away from, me

944
00:58:44,720 --> 00:58:47,600
Speaker 21: and this guy up the top stairs turns around and sees,

945
00:58:47,720 --> 00:58:53,320
Speaker 21: him and he knows and he yells, stop, stop back him,

946
00:58:53,400 --> 00:58:54,400
Speaker 21: up back, him.

947
00:58:54,320 --> 00:58:56,320
Speaker 3: Then yank him, back AND i, WENT.

948
00:59:00,400 --> 00:59:05,439
Speaker 21: I just have this massive release of you, know because

949
00:59:05,520 --> 00:59:06,640
Speaker 21: that was that was pretty.

950
00:59:06,640 --> 00:59:11,240
Speaker 4: Scary in the basement of the, Courthouse leo says he

951
00:59:11,280 --> 00:59:15,080
Speaker 4: waits in a holding cell with the other. Defendants because

952
00:59:15,120 --> 00:59:19,160
Speaker 4: Of jeremy's violent, Behavior he's kept in an isolation cell

953
00:59:19,240 --> 00:59:23,360
Speaker 4: right by the. Elevator the jail is short, staffed there

954
00:59:23,400 --> 00:59:27,680
Speaker 4: aren't any correction officers down, there And leo's name is

955
00:59:27,720 --> 00:59:28,320
Speaker 4: called over the.

956
00:59:28,360 --> 00:59:33,400
Speaker 21: Loudspeaker scholfield approached the, elevator and So i'm, thinking, WELL

957
00:59:33,720 --> 00:59:36,080
Speaker 21: i got to walk right by a. Cell now he

958
00:59:36,120 --> 00:59:39,320
Speaker 21: doesn't know me From, adam but he knows WHO i

959
00:59:39,360 --> 00:59:42,600
Speaker 21: am by. Name and this is WHEN i, knew BECAUSE

960
00:59:42,640 --> 00:59:45,520
Speaker 21: i really wasn't. SURE i, MEAN i don't, know you,

961
00:59:45,560 --> 00:59:49,600
Speaker 21: know what's the what's the percentage on it being a

962
00:59:49,640 --> 00:59:53,480
Speaker 21: coincidence that this no murderer is forensically linked to my

963
00:59:53,480 --> 00:59:55,600
Speaker 21: wife's car and he didn't have anything to do with,

964
00:59:55,640 --> 00:59:59,160
Speaker 21: it and after everything we know about, him and my

965
00:59:59,240 --> 01:00:02,640
Speaker 21: thought is if you are accusing me of doing something

966
01:00:02,640 --> 01:00:05,920
Speaker 21: THAT i KNOW i did not. Do i'm gonna be

967
01:00:05,960 --> 01:00:09,040
Speaker 21: at them bars WHEN i see you walk. BY i

968
01:00:09,120 --> 01:00:11,680
Speaker 21: might not do anything, stupid But i'm gonna have something to.

969
01:00:11,720 --> 01:00:13,440
Speaker 3: Say i'm gonna say. Something you got the.

970
01:00:13,400 --> 01:00:16,200
Speaker 21: Wrong guy or something or. Anything i'm Gonna i'm gonna say.

971
01:00:16,200 --> 01:00:21,000
Speaker 21: Something here's your. Opportunity SO i walk up there AND

972
01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:23,040
Speaker 21: i go to the bars to the cell AND i

973
01:00:23,120 --> 01:00:24,720
Speaker 21: stand there AND i look at him and he's sitting,

974
01:00:24,720 --> 01:00:27,240
Speaker 21: there profile to the front of the cell and he

975
01:00:27,280 --> 01:00:29,800
Speaker 21: won't look at. Me And i'm standing there waiting for

976
01:00:29,880 --> 01:00:31,760
Speaker 21: him to look. OUT i need him to look at,

977
01:00:31,840 --> 01:00:35,120
Speaker 21: me and he couldn't look at. Me he couldn't even face.

978
01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:38,960
Speaker 21: Me AND i told, him know THAT i. Know, jeremy

979
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:44,120
Speaker 21: know THAT i. Know and he never says anything to.

980
01:00:44,160 --> 01:00:47,720
Speaker 21: ME i knew in that, MOMENT i was looking at

981
01:00:47,720 --> 01:00:48,400
Speaker 21: the murderer of my.

982
01:00:48,440 --> 01:00:49,360
Speaker 5: WIFE i knew.

983
01:00:49,360 --> 01:01:09,040
Speaker 4: It Bone valley is a production Of lava For Good

984
01:01:09,120 --> 01:01:13,960
Speaker 4: podcasts in association With Signal Company Number. One our executive

985
01:01:13,960 --> 01:01:19,200
Speaker 4: producers Are Jason blohm And Kevin. Wordiskak kornhaber is our senior.

986
01:01:19,240 --> 01:01:24,320
Speaker 4: Producer Brit spangler is our sound. Designer Roxandra guidy is our,

987
01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:30,040
Speaker 4: editor fact checking By Maximo. Anderson our producer and researcher

988
01:01:30,160 --> 01:01:34,560
Speaker 4: Is Kelsey. Decker our theme, Song The One Who's holding The,

989
01:01:34,600 --> 01:01:37,840
Speaker 4: stars is performed By Lee bob And The. Truth it

990
01:01:37,920 --> 01:01:40,960
Speaker 4: was written By Leo schofield And Kevin herrick In Florida's

991
01:01:41,000 --> 01:01:45,680
Speaker 4: Hardy Correctional. Institution Bone valley is written and produced by

992
01:01:45,720 --> 01:01:50,120
Speaker 4: Me Gilbert. King you can follow the show On, Instagram,

993
01:01:50,360 --> 01:01:54,440
Speaker 4: facebook And twitter At lava For. Good to see photos

994
01:01:54,440 --> 01:01:57,680
Speaker 4: and documents from our investigation and exclusive behind the scenes,

995
01:01:57,760 --> 01:02:01,440
Speaker 4: content Visit lava For good dot. Com Tom Slash Bone Valley,

996
01:02:07,880 --> 01:02:08,080
Speaker 4: yeah