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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class from how

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Speaker 1: Stuff Works dot com. Hello, we welcome to the podcast.

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Speaker 1: I'm editor Kandice King are joined by staff writer Jane McGrath.

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Speaker 1: Hey the Kandice High. Jane. Today, we have a topic

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Speaker 1: that doesn't come from too far back and the annals

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Speaker 1: of American history, and it's a pretty important topic to

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Speaker 1: discuss because it's a mystery that's been unsolved for decades

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Speaker 1: now and a pretty controversial one of that too, definitely.

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Speaker 1: And what's so interesting about this is that there's new

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Speaker 1: evidence that even emerged a couple of years ago that

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Speaker 1: threatens to change the course of how we conceive of

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Speaker 1: this event. And what I'm referring to rather mysteriously is

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Speaker 1: what really happened at Kent State. Kent State is actually

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Speaker 1: a university in Ohio, um the town of Kent. You

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Speaker 1: probably have heard it or rings a bell because of

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Speaker 1: this tragedy that happened in nineteen seventy and that happened

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Speaker 1: on May fourth, and it had to do with an

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Speaker 1: anti war protest. And as you probably know, the Vietnam

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Speaker 1: War was going on at this time and the Americans

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Speaker 1: were involved in it, and it was very very controversial. Uh.

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Speaker 1: It was an incredibly unpopular war. And one of the

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Speaker 1: reasons that Richard Nixon had been elected to the president, say,

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Speaker 1: was because he had made the promise to get the

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Speaker 1: American troops out of the war. Right. He promised Vietnamization,

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Speaker 1: which was basically the idea that he was going to

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Speaker 1: transfer the battle duty, the combat duty, from American soldiers

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Speaker 1: to the Vietnamese themselves. And so that was one of

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Speaker 1: the reasons why he was elected president. He was campaigning

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Speaker 1: for this, but he sort of seemed to stab people

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Speaker 1: in the back or or or go back on this

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Speaker 1: promise when he announced on April thirtieth, nineteen seventy, that

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Speaker 1: he was sending U. S. Troops into Cambodia, and this

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Speaker 1: really chucked people by surprise. They didn't understand the motive

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Speaker 1: behind it. And the official motive that nixt gay when

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Speaker 1: he made the announcement on national television and radio was

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Speaker 1: that there were Viet Cong headquarters and Cambodia, and by

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Speaker 1: infiltrating the headquarters that eventually be able to take down

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Speaker 1: the Viet Cong. So, by I guess that a military

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Speaker 1: and governmental perspective, the man you ever made sense. But

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Speaker 1: to the American people who felt they'd been duped. It

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Speaker 1: was a real slap in the face, right. It seemed

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Speaker 1: like he was escalating the war rather than um pulling

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Speaker 1: out of it, which people wanted to see, especially college

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Speaker 1: kids around the country. And they were one of the

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Speaker 1: most active anti war protesters at this time. And so

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Speaker 1: the next day, which would have been Friday, May one,

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Speaker 1: students in campuses all around the country, not just Kent,

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Speaker 1: were staging anti war protests. Very standard thing and very

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Speaker 1: understandable because it's happened. This is the day after the announcement,

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Speaker 1: and in Kent, the students staged at protests in which

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Speaker 1: they buried they symbolically buried the U. S. Constitution, and

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Speaker 1: it was it was very standard, you know, Kent was

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Speaker 1: not unlike many other campuses. And another thing they did

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Speaker 1: was planned to convene again on Monday, May fourth at

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Speaker 1: noon for another rally and Friday night, as you can

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Speaker 1: imagine this semester sort of winding down, it's getting close

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Speaker 1: to summer, students go out as usual to the bars

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Speaker 1: and they're intermingling with townspeople from Kent, and the scene

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Speaker 1: just escalates because anti war sentiment is running high and

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Speaker 1: things get a little bit out of control. Yeah, these

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Speaker 1: crowds start building bonfires in the streets, and the bottles

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Speaker 1: are thrown at cop cars and it just just sort

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Speaker 1: of increasingly gets more and more tense in rawity, and

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Speaker 1: coming from I went to University of Maryland and this

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Speaker 1: doesn't seem completely out of the ordinary. I mean, we

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Speaker 1: have a we win a championship and the kids build bonfires,

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Speaker 1: you know, but it really um made the officials of

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Speaker 1: the town of Kent very nervous, definitely, and the protesters

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Speaker 1: were having verbal conflicts and physical conflicts without the police,

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Speaker 1: and so all the Kent police were out that night,

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Speaker 1: police were called in from surrounding towns and cities, and

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Speaker 1: all the counties officials came out to just to you know,

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Speaker 1: show their faces and help all the crowds and even

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Speaker 1: eventually helped disperse the crowds. And things really got out

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Speaker 1: of control, and mayhem really broke loose when the mayor

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Speaker 1: of Kent closed all the bars, and what what a

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Speaker 1: bad move in retrospect, because people are being rowdy, but

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Speaker 1: you can imagine that there's still a good number of

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Speaker 1: people inside the bars and having their beers and carrying

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Speaker 1: on as usual. But you close all the bars, you

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Speaker 1: move all of those people into the streets. They've all

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Speaker 1: been drinking. Mayhem, What were you thinking? I think he

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Speaker 1: had good intentions, because you can understand how the presence

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Speaker 1: of the bars made made the crowds were rowdy after

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Speaker 1: they were drinking, but to close them during the night

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Speaker 1: just made things worse, it really did. And so and

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Speaker 1: a bit of desperation, he called Governor James Rhodes, and

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Speaker 1: those two wouldn't conspire quite yet, but then next day

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Speaker 1: they reached a decision that ultimately culminated in the tragic

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Speaker 1: shootings at Kent State. But that night the crowd was

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Speaker 1: dispersed with tear gas and things were calm. It was

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Speaker 1: the calm before the storm. Yeah, you know. The next day, Saturday,

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Speaker 1: May two, we're talking about now, Satram, the mayor was

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Speaker 1: still nervous about what happened the night before, but also

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Speaker 1: he was hearing rumors and supposedly threats against local businessmen.

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Speaker 1: This made him even more nervous, and so he called

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Speaker 1: the governor James Rhodes, as you mentioned, and at about

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Speaker 1: five that evening Saturday, he he asked the governor to

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Speaker 1: send the National Guard to Kent, and at ten pm

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Speaker 1: the Ohio National Guard arrived, and they came into a

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Speaker 1: rather dramatic scene on the Kent State campus. Someone we

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Speaker 1: to this day don't know who was burning down the

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Speaker 1: r OTC building there. Yeah, well there there was a

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Speaker 1: big crowd around the r r OTC building and and

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Speaker 1: the crowd was sort of cheering on the blaze. But

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Speaker 1: you know, we still haven't found out who exactly lit it.

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Speaker 1: Some some students were wrongly accused of of starting the fire,

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Speaker 1: and so yeah, we still don't know, but we do

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Speaker 1: know that many protesters actually cut fire hoses, which effectively

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Speaker 1: prevented firemen from from putting out the blaze when they

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Speaker 1: did arrive on the scene. And so that night there

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Speaker 1: were arrests made and more tear gas and just pandemonium

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Speaker 1: for for a good while. Yeah, the guards were able

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Speaker 1: to disperse them when they arrived, but the blaze had

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Speaker 1: already been said, the damage had already been done exactly

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Speaker 1: so by Sunday, May three, UM, according to your reports,

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Speaker 1: it was a pretty nice day in Kent, Ohio. The

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Speaker 1: sun was out, it was springtime, and even though the

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Speaker 1: guardsmen were there, you know, they didn't really damp in

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Speaker 1: spirits that much. Students were actually having conversations with them.

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Speaker 1: They were talking, they were conversing, and things were going

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Speaker 1: okay until Governor Rhodes showed up in Kent, and the

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Speaker 1: things he said just added fuel to a fire that

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Speaker 1: had been, you know, burning out. He essentially threatened to

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Speaker 1: get a court order putting the state in a state

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Speaker 1: of emergency, and no one actually said the words, but

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Speaker 1: it was assumed that martial law had been declared, and

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Speaker 1: understanding falsely that martial law was in a fact, all

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Speaker 1: rallies were banned, including the one that had been planned

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Speaker 1: for noon the next day, and they may fourth and

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Speaker 1: tensions spiked again. And one important thing also that Rhodes

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Speaker 1: did on Sunday was during a press conference he actually

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Speaker 1: called these violent protesters the worst type of people that

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Speaker 1: we harbor in America, which very uncharitable remark and not

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Speaker 1: very diplomatic for the time. I'm sure it just added

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Speaker 1: fuel to the fire exactly. So university officials tried to

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Speaker 1: get the word out to all the Kent State students,

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Speaker 1: don't conduct the rally, please don't meet on the commons.

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Speaker 1: Let's just scrap this whole idea. They went so far

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Speaker 1: as to print about I think a couple of thousand

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Speaker 1: and twelve thousand sot fires telling us, you don't hold

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Speaker 1: this rally. And the students felt on the whole that

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Speaker 1: it was their their right, you know, constitutionally, to have

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Speaker 1: this rally and to speak what was on their minds.

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Speaker 1: And so by eleven am, a couple thousand had already

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Speaker 1: started congregating, and then by noon there were three thousand.

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Speaker 1: And there's a report that was put together by UM

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Speaker 1: two men affiliated with Kent State University, and that is

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Speaker 1: Jerry Lewis and Thomas are Hensley, and they attempt to

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Speaker 1: break down the numbers to give us a better idea

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Speaker 1: of how many people in the crowd were actually protesters, demonstrators, agitators,

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Speaker 1: and spectators. And they estimate that of the three thousand,

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Speaker 1: five hundred were active demonstrators, about one thousand were on

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Speaker 1: the sidelines cheering them on, and then around the periphery

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Speaker 1: you had about more who were speculating. And I would

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Speaker 1: presume also that that number includes people who were passing

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Speaker 1: by on their way to different sides around campus US.

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Speaker 1: As we'll see, one of the the victims of the

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Speaker 1: shootings was just a passer by. Right, So you have

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Speaker 1: the situation where, um, you have about a thousand guardsmen

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Speaker 1: and its three thousand students who are gathered around, some

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Speaker 1: actively protesting. So I'm just watching. So you have one

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Speaker 1: of the generals in the National Guardenal Robert Canterbury, and

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Speaker 1: he tried to disperse the crowd. He tried with a

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Speaker 1: bullhorns andying like go home, h rallies are banned, and

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Speaker 1: he finally got around. He was driven around in a

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Speaker 1: jeep around the commons trying to get people to leave.

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Speaker 1: Finally he ordered his men to load their weapons and

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Speaker 1: start dispersing tear gas. And we should mention that their

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Speaker 1: weapons were and one rifles. And it's pretty intimidating just

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Speaker 1: from all accounts. Imagine you're a bystander. You're one of

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Speaker 1: the crowd of three thousand civilians looking on to see

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Speaker 1: men holding these weapons and you know that they're loaded,

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Speaker 1: even if they're locked. What a scary thought. But conversely,

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Speaker 1: for the guardsman's point of view, they were outnumbered by

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Speaker 1: about what two to one seems like, And so that's

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Speaker 1: why there's so much controversy today. As we'll see later

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Speaker 1: in the debate, who was more frightened. Yeah, well, I

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Speaker 1: think it's interesting to know. It was a good point.

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Speaker 1: But on the other hand, you if I were a

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Speaker 1: spectator or a protester, I really wouldn't expect the guard

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Speaker 1: to even think about shooting into the crowd, you know,

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Speaker 1: And I think that's what gave them a lot of

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Speaker 1: the I don't know what the word is, but courage

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Speaker 1: or just sort of you know, the goal to to

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Speaker 1: challenge the National Guard. And by challenge we should be

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Speaker 1: explicit and say that they were hurling insults, they were

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Speaker 1: throwing rocks, they were not being complacent people in a crowd.

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Speaker 1: And please don't mistake what I'm saying. I'm not trying

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Speaker 1: to defend either side here. I'm presenting the facts. But

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Speaker 1: you should know that people weren't standing by. They were

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Speaker 1: actively engaging with the guards. You know, the guards how

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Speaker 1: their weapons loaded. They were dispersing the tear gas, and

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Speaker 1: the crowd was fighting back eight and so when the

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Speaker 1: tear gas was dispersed, this pushed protesters passed the Commons

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Speaker 1: area and up and over a hill. Um And on

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Speaker 1: the other side you had this practice football field in

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Speaker 1: a in a parking lot, and so the crowd was

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Speaker 1: pushed back to that that area, and when the guardsmen

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Speaker 1: got there, they sort of realized that they were kind

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Speaker 1: of trapped because the field was was um enclosed by

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Speaker 1: a fence, right, And at that point the guard started

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Speaker 1: trapesing back up Blanket Hill, and when they got to

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Speaker 1: the top of the hill, they turned around and out

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Speaker 1: of the seventy plus guards present fired. Yeah, and we

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Speaker 1: should also note that not all of these twenty eight

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Speaker 1: who fired fired into the crowd. Some or most of them,

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Speaker 1: i should say, actually just shut up in the air

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Speaker 1: or shot down the ground. Seems like they were trying

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Speaker 1: to not harm anyone but just warned the protesters. But

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Speaker 1: that wasn't the case for all of the guards. So

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Speaker 1: for about thirteen seconds, they were between sixty one and

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Speaker 1: sixty seven shots fired, and as a result there were

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Speaker 1: four deaths. We have Jeffrey Miller, who was shot from

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Speaker 1: two hundred seventy ft away and he was hit in

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Speaker 1: the mouth. Alison Krauss was three thirty ft away and

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Speaker 1: she was shot in the left side. William Schroeder three

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Speaker 1: hundred ninety feet away was shot in the back, and

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Speaker 1: Sandy Showyer, who was a student just passing by on

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Speaker 1: her way to class was shot at three d nine

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Speaker 1: ft away as well, and she was shot in the neck.

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Speaker 1: And that's what makes it more tragic. I mean, it

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Speaker 1: would have been tragic anyway, but the fact that some

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Speaker 1: of the kids who were shot or wounded were not

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Speaker 1: even involved, they didn't even want to engage in the protests,

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Speaker 1: and they were they became a victim of it. And

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Speaker 1: nine wounded um included Dean Kaylor who was permanently paralyzed

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Speaker 1: from the shot. Donald Mackenzie was the farthest away of

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Speaker 1: any of the victims of the shootings at seven hundred

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Speaker 1: fifty feet and another one of the students, Joseph Lewis,

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Speaker 1: who was hit. He was actually hit while he was

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Speaker 1: flipping off the guard with his middle finger. So I

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Speaker 1: remember reading about the so panic basically ensued, you know,

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Speaker 1: like I can't imagine how it would feel in the seconds,

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Speaker 1: the moments after these shots were fired. But people believe,

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Speaker 1: like you mentioned Lewis and Hensley right about this, and

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Speaker 1: they were a great source from for my research on this.

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Speaker 1: They they believe that things would have gotten worse most

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Speaker 1: definitely well and if you listen to I witness accounts

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Speaker 1: from Kent state that day, they say that everyone just

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Speaker 1: hit the ground. You know, shots are fired, you hit

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Speaker 1: the ground, and then people paused and stood back up,

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Speaker 1: and you don't realize at first who's been shot. And

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Speaker 1: then they start seeing people who aren't getting up, people

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Speaker 1: who are covered in blood, and especially in the parking lot,

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Speaker 1: it became very obvious you have blood pulling out of

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Speaker 1: victims lying on the asphalt. Um, Jeffrey Miller went in particular,

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Speaker 1: and so at least after this there was thought about

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Speaker 1: even uh provoking the guards further, and um, if it

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Speaker 1: weren't for Glenn Frank, who was a professor there and

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Speaker 1: he happened to be acting as a facult and marshal

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Speaker 1: to keep the peace during the protest, he started uh

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Speaker 1: pleading with the crowd just to just you know, disperse

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Speaker 1: and and let it go and don't provoke the guards

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Speaker 1: any anymore. And then you can actually hear clips of

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Speaker 1: what he said or people recounting his words. And this

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Speaker 1: is circtly paraphrasing, but he was very impassionately saying things like,

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Speaker 1: if you've never listened to any directions in your life

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Speaker 1: at all, you know, for Heaven's sake, listen to this

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Speaker 1: now heart wrenching, and thank goodness he was there to

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Speaker 1: say that, because a lot of people credit him for

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Speaker 1: saving some lives. That day, this news hit the national

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Speaker 1: scene and everyone was basically in shock. UM. A lot

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Speaker 1: of people were disappointed with the response they got from

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Speaker 1: the Nixon administration. Uh. Nixon himself said that it's merely

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Speaker 1: when dissent turned to violence, it invites tragedy. It struck

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Speaker 1: a lot of people as cold when he said that,

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Speaker 1: and he later remarked that there's a few days after

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Speaker 1: Kent among the darkest of my presidency. And I can

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Speaker 1: guess so if you're showing such a lakewarm sentiments is

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Speaker 1: what you come into say. Yeah, it's interesting. Actually, I

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Speaker 1: remember reading um an account of how one of the

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Speaker 1: most bizarre things of Nixon's presidencies in the days following Kent,

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Speaker 1: he actually left the White House very early in the

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Speaker 1: wee hours of the morning, UH, with I think no

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Speaker 1: security or maybe just very little security, and he um

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Speaker 1: engaged in conversation with some protesters who were sitting on

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Speaker 1: the steps of a monument or some such and he

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Speaker 1: told them, like, I know you probably hate me. You

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Speaker 1: think I'm a jerk. He used a little more vulgar

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Speaker 1: language than I did, but he tried to sort of

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Speaker 1: engage within the generation. But you can see the disconnect

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Speaker 1: between the younger college generation at this time and in

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Speaker 1: Nixon's generations. Sort of they didn't know how to connect

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Speaker 1: with each other. Definitely not and I can imagine that

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Speaker 1: that sort of generational gap would have made it incredibly

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Speaker 1: difficult to understand the sentiments of the crowd and reconcile

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Speaker 1: those with the duty of the National Guard, and that

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Speaker 1: became a huge debate, and trying to settle this case

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Speaker 1: in court was a nightmare, and it wasn't settled really

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Speaker 1: until January ninety nine, and eventually the courts settled with

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Speaker 1: six seventy five thousand dollars to the wounded and the

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Speaker 1: families of the killed students. And the National Guard never

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Speaker 1: even issued an apology. They only made a statement of regret. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: they wanted to clarify I think that that it was

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Speaker 1: not an apology because they didn't because that would make

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Speaker 1: it look like they were to blame, which they didn't

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Speaker 1: want to make it. They they testified in these trials

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Speaker 1: that they shot because they felt that their lives were

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Speaker 1: in danger and a lot of people disagree with that.

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Speaker 1: They think that they made up this excuse and that

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Speaker 1: you know, there are some even conspiracy theories that the

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Speaker 1: troops when they originally uh came down past the hill

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Speaker 1: into the football field, that they that these these troops

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Speaker 1: who fired had um conspired to when they play to

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Speaker 1: head sort of a premeditated murder situation where they said, Hey,

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Speaker 1: when we get back up to that hill, we're going

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Speaker 1: to turn around in fire, which would indicate that they

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Speaker 1: weren't um. They didn't feel like their loves were in

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Speaker 1: danger so much as they just wanted to shoot, you know,

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Speaker 1: they wanted to end this this rally, right, and other

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Speaker 1: I witness accounts say that they were very angry. I mean,

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Speaker 1: they were obviously caught in the middle of a student

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Speaker 1: protest that arguably they weren't prepared to handle. I mean,

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Speaker 1: the National Guard is obviously prepared for certain types of situations,

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Speaker 1: but a student protests may have been one that they

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Speaker 1: weren't trained to handle, or at least efficiently or properly. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And what's what I find most interesting about the guards

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Speaker 1: themselves is that a lot of sources bring up the

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Speaker 1: fact that these guards were most of them not much

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Speaker 1: older than the college, because that they were they were

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Speaker 1: shooting into, you know, the and that would explain the

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Speaker 1: camaraderie on Sunday. That's true. That's true. And also the

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Speaker 1: fact that many of these many of these kids in

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Speaker 1: the guard, they had to the guard because they wanted

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Speaker 1: to dodge the draft themselves. So you can see that

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Speaker 1: maybe they had similar sentiment as the protesters as as

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Speaker 1: draft dodgers. Well after after the shootings, essentially life stopped

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Speaker 1: on the university and it was closed. Like many universities

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Speaker 1: around the country, Kent State was closed for six weeks

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Speaker 1: and I didn't reopen until the summer. But in order

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Speaker 1: to endure normalcy and the proper closure of the semester,

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Speaker 1: professors and students completed their coursework through mail and they

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Speaker 1: would have meetings in town and UM. I believe in

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Speaker 1: the and the Jerry Lewis and Thomas Henley report, they

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Speaker 1: described one student who was in the sciences who helped

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Speaker 1: make videos at different experiments and laboratories and mailed them

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Speaker 1: out to his his UM fellow students. So people were

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Speaker 1: obviously trying to make this work and in other campuses

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Speaker 1: were closed around the country too. It partly had to

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Speaker 1: do with the student strikes which worce on the close,

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Speaker 1: and also just they had to close or they felt

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Speaker 1: it was it was the right thing to do. And

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Speaker 1: I was talking to my dad about it, and he

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Speaker 1: was actually attending Georgetown at this time, and he remembers

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Speaker 1: when Georgetown campus shut down for the rest of the year.

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Speaker 1: But I mean, there wasn't a whole lot left of

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Speaker 1: the semester, like you mentioned, six weeks or so. I mean,

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Speaker 1: we're thinking May, it's pretty late in the semester. But

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Speaker 1: it did disrupt the entire country in that way. It

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Speaker 1: really did. And what's interesting I alluded earlier in the

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Speaker 1: podcast to the fact that there's evidence now that threatens

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Speaker 1: to shake up the verdict of the cases. We know it.

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Speaker 1: And I'm not quite sure what became of this, but

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Speaker 1: back in May of two thousand seven, story broke on

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Speaker 1: NPR that one of the wounded victims, Alan Canfora, had

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Speaker 1: new evidence that he wanted to see investigated. And the

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Speaker 1: day of the rally, there was a student who had

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Speaker 1: a microphone perched on the window sill of his dorm

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Speaker 1: room and he recorded everything that happened on a real

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Speaker 1: to real tape. And not until recently, with improved technology

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Speaker 1: standards and audio, was any and able to convert that

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Speaker 1: into a better sounding club And it had been stored

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Speaker 1: in the archives at Yale for many many years since then.

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Speaker 1: And can Flora gave an eyewitness account that he heard

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Speaker 1: someone command the shots, which obviously would have you know,

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Speaker 1: made this case very different because people say we don't

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Speaker 1: know why the guard shot. Well, if someone told them

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Speaker 1: to shoot, well, there's you know, the evidence right there.

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Speaker 1: And if you listen very carefully to the tape, and

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Speaker 1: you can, if you do search for it online, you

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Speaker 1: can hear it. You can sort of make out the

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Speaker 1: words right here gets set point and fire, but it's

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Speaker 1: very faint. So I'm not quite sure if this is

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Speaker 1: maybe a matter of wanting to hear something that's not

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Speaker 1: really there. Maybe maybe do they know that it would

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Speaker 1: have been an official who said that, or maybe it

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Speaker 1: was just because Canterbury was the officer of highest rank

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Speaker 1: among the National Guard. But is there evidence to point

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Speaker 1: to where the fact that he would have said that

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Speaker 1: he would have given the order. And I remember reading

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Speaker 1: that one of the official was after the shootings, one

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Speaker 1: of the officials came running across saying stop firing, stop firing, right,

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Speaker 1: And it could be that maybe an order got handed

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Speaker 1: down incorrectly to a small portion of the number of guards,

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Speaker 1: and that would have explained why only twenty something out

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Speaker 1: of seventy something even shot. That's true. So it's something

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Speaker 1: that I don't really know a lot about except for

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Speaker 1: this story, and I'm not sure if the case has

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Speaker 1: been reopened for investigation. But one thing that struck me

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Speaker 1: when I began doing research on Kent State was the

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Speaker 1: fact that it sounded really similar to another historical situation

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Speaker 1: that happened centuries beforehand, having to do with the Boston massacre.

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Speaker 1: And it really struck a chord with me that there

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Speaker 1: was the situation where you have armed troops and angry citizens, uh,

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Speaker 1: confronting each other and there's sort of panic and confusion

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Speaker 1: going on and somehow a fire a shot was fired,

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Speaker 1: and it just escalated after that. And I actually found

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Speaker 1: a scholarly article about it that describes the similarities and

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Speaker 1: the differences, and it's really fascinating. So it's interesting to

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Speaker 1: think about these situations and how there are so much

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Speaker 1: better ways to handle them, and how you know, we

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Speaker 1: need to avoid repeat of such episodes exactly. And it

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Speaker 1: really is our right as citizens to speak out against things.

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Speaker 1: You know, we we have that granted to us by

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Speaker 1: the Constitution. We have freedom of speech. We can protest,

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Speaker 1: and obviously there are peaceful ways to do it, more

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Speaker 1: radical ways to do it, and yet it's complicated by

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Speaker 1: the fact that it needs to be peaceful protests. And

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Speaker 1: were the protesters being peaceful? Well, you know, you could argue, well,

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Speaker 1: what the burning now of the RTC building? Maybe not?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. That's a question that in the report

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Speaker 1: from Lewis and Hensley they raised. They sort of leave

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Speaker 1: their summary of of the Kent State shootings with a

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Speaker 1: whole list of questions and some of the ones that

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Speaker 1: really stood out to me where how much of this

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Speaker 1: action was sort of brought on by outside agitators, non

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Speaker 1: Kent State students, what were the townspeople doing to get

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Speaker 1: the crowds around? And the confusion of the martial law

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Speaker 1: as well. Exactly. Marshal Law declared, was it not who

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Speaker 1: actually banned the rally? Didn't anyone have a right to

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Speaker 1: ban the rally? And in respect to the outside agitators

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Speaker 1: coming in um one of the most famous images from

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Speaker 1: Kent State shooting is a photograph taken by photography student

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Speaker 1: John Filo that day of um young Mary Vechio leaning

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Speaker 1: over the body of Jeffrey Miller. Her hands are, you know,

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Speaker 1: at her sides, and her face is just contorted in anguish.

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Speaker 1: Mary Vecchio wasn't a Kent State student. She was a

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Speaker 1: fourteen year old runaway who just happened to be there.

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Speaker 1: And this image is so iconic, and it's really I think,

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Speaker 1: how many of us remember Kent State and just a

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Speaker 1: pan ammonium and the exactly and if you haven't seen

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Speaker 1: it again, do a search for it. But Mary Vecchio

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Speaker 1: later said that she'd suffered because of the photo, and

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Speaker 1: that's a direct quote. She said that she had suffered

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Speaker 1: because of it. And I'm not quite sure what that means. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't know what to be maybe would indicate that

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Speaker 1: she got a lot of attention because of it, and

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00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:07,720
Speaker 1: you know, she was always attached with the with this tragedy.

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Speaker 1: I guess that's a good point, the idea of if

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00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:12,480
Speaker 1: you witness an event like that, of course it's always

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00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:13,800
Speaker 1: going to be with you, it's always going to be

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00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:17,760
Speaker 1: something you remember, but eventually you overcome tragedy by coping

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00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:19,879
Speaker 1: with it in certain ways. And if if your face

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00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:23,359
Speaker 1: is so strongly attached to this moment, you can't really

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00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:26,800
Speaker 1: ever get over it can't be hard. And that's why

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Speaker 1: it's so important to remember Kent State and remember it

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00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:34,919
Speaker 1: not just from the perspective of of the actual events

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00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:38,560
Speaker 1: that occurred, but from the perspective of history, as you mentioned, Jane,

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Speaker 1: bringing it into context with other events where where mob

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Speaker 1: behavior resulted and culminated in tragedy when you have someone

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00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 1: who's armed against a protester who's not in proper ways

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Speaker 1: to speak out against what you deem injustices in the world.

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Speaker 1: And as you mentioned, you know news is still sort

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Speaker 1: of mulling and coming out about this, this tragedy with

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00:24:59,359 --> 00:25:01,399
Speaker 1: the with the real use of that audio. So if

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00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:03,639
Speaker 1: there's any um anything the news about can't say, you

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00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:05,880
Speaker 1: can bet that we'll be talking about it on our

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00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:08,720
Speaker 1: blog Stuff you Miss in History Class on the website

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Speaker 1: how how Stuff Works dot com, and Candice and I

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00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,359
Speaker 1: write on this blog every day and keep you up

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00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:15,760
Speaker 1: to date on things that are happening, things that interest us,

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00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:18,520
Speaker 1: and we we can go interest you too, And as always,

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Speaker 1: if you have any comments, or feedback for us. You

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Speaker 1: can email us at History Podcast at how stuff works

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Speaker 1: dot com. And if you want to read more about

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Speaker 1: Kent stay to be sure to check out this article

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00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:32,080
Speaker 1: on how stuff works dot com for more on this

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Speaker 1: and thousands of other topics. Because at how stuff works

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Speaker 1: dot com, let us know what you think. Send an

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Speaker 1: email to podcast at how stuff works dot com