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Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray.

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Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you Should Know

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Speaker 1: from House Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. Chuck Bryant's with me as usual.

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Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, I don't know what I

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Speaker 1: do If Chuck Bryant wasn't with me, I'd probably curl

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Speaker 1: up in the fetal position in the corner and cry

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Speaker 1: myself to sleep. I think you'd be just fine. I

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Speaker 1: don't know, Chuck. I don't ever want to find out. Chuck. Well, thanks,

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Speaker 1: almost didn't make it today. Why what's going on with you?

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Speaker 1: I was out last night. I went out and saw

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Speaker 1: Matt's band. As you know, Matt Frederick are handsome young

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Speaker 1: stand in producer. Yeah, Matt Frederick of Stuff of Genius

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Speaker 1: fame and awesome new video podcasts. We should mention, Chuck.

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Speaker 1: It's really good. You guys should check that out, Stuff

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Speaker 1: of Genius. It's it's a video podcast video and it's

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Speaker 1: cool and it has a little like Monty Python esque animation.

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Speaker 1: I like it. Yeah, And we don't want to hear

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Speaker 1: any of this. I don't have time to watch that

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Speaker 1: crap because it's like a minute forty two tops. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's quick. Yeah. But went and saw his band last night,

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Speaker 1: Lions and Scissors. Yeah, good stuff, And I wanted to

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Speaker 1: say that they have a MySpace page and it's good

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Speaker 1: music if you're into its very shoegaze, yeah, mag wise

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Speaker 1: good is sort of a radio heady component at times.

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Speaker 1: Explosions in the sky you ever heard of them? I

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Speaker 1: have a big wall of sound, loud, my ears are ringing,

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Speaker 1: and I'm slightly tired and imbibed a bit too much.

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Speaker 1: But that was my night. That's Chuck's Thursday, everybody, So

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Speaker 1: keep rocking, Matt. We love it. Yeah, way to go, Matt.

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Speaker 1: So can we get back to our podcast now? Maybe? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: But I just wanted to give give you a hard time.

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Speaker 1: I think you're a good guy for doing that. Talented drummer,

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Speaker 1: great drummer. Okay, So, Chuck, you grew up in the

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Speaker 1: Cold War, right, it's pretty funny, jerk you did. You're

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Speaker 1: a Cold War baby like me. I'm a Cold War kid.

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Speaker 1: Isn't it weird to think we actually work with people who,

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Speaker 1: like weren't cognizant that, you know, the Soviets had nukes

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Speaker 1: pointed at us at all times and vice versa. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that is weird to me. Yeah, but um yeah, I

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Speaker 1: remember being particularly unnerved from time to time that like, dude,

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Speaker 1: eventually they're going to come over and or our missile

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Speaker 1: is going to be sent over, and that's that, you know.

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Speaker 1: I think I can't help but think that we were

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Speaker 1: definitely shaped, our personalities were shaped by that underlying, constant

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Speaker 1: level of paranoia that we grew up with. You well

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Speaker 1: in the movies, uh, a lot, a lot of great

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Speaker 1: Cold war movies of that era, but the Roosky is

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Speaker 1: out to get us? Yeah, well, do you remember the

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Speaker 1: movie Rooskis? Was there one called? It was actually a

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Speaker 1: counter propaganda movie where a bunch of kids that were

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Speaker 1: probably my age you would have been, like, you know,

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Speaker 1: twenty by then. Um, where I think they found a

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Speaker 1: Russian sailor who washed ashore and they had to hide

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Speaker 1: them because of course, you know, the government would shoot

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Speaker 1: him in the head if they found him. And they

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Speaker 1: came to learn that the Soviets have hearts too, they

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Speaker 1: know how to love. Was it a real movie? Like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it wasn't very good, but it was somebody actually put

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Speaker 1: out the effort to say, you know, hey, we're all

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Speaker 1: just people here, you know. Um, And what they were

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Speaker 1: doing actually was counter propaganda, right, Like all the that

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Speaker 1: was right off the cuff, two pounds um, all of

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Speaker 1: the all the stuff we were told, I would say,

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Speaker 1: at least the vast majority of it was lopsided at best.

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Speaker 1: Like do you remember what did you think of the

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Speaker 1: Russians when you were growing up? That they were like

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Speaker 1: they cut your throat just as soon as look at you,

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Speaker 1: And they were always standing in these horrible breadlines, and

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Speaker 1: like every single one of them wanted to escape, but

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Speaker 1: the Russian government wouldn't let her. They wanted up toilet papers.

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Speaker 1: They heard stories about they don't have blue jeans and

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Speaker 1: they don't have toilets. Yeah, like you could get you know,

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Speaker 1: five wives with the single pair of jeans if you

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Speaker 1: wouldn't ever the kind of thing. Yeah, well, I remember

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Speaker 1: when the Iron curtain fell and like actual news started

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Speaker 1: coming out of the the former USSR states that I

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Speaker 1: remember thinking, oh, yeah, what a surprise. All of that

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Speaker 1: was lies And they're actually kind of nice folks by

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Speaker 1: and large. I'm not saying that they weren't trying to

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Speaker 1: do bad things. When we were trying to do bad things. Well, no,

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Speaker 1: I think that that was the Russian people were good

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Speaker 1: people that came that. That's what I figured out when

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Speaker 1: the propaganda ended, the Cold War propaganda ended so abruptly,

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Speaker 1: is that we're all people like the average Russian is

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Speaker 1: like the average American at heart, with the same dreams, goals, aspirations,

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Speaker 1: same things that Kim or her. You know, it's the

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Speaker 1: same thing. And we didn't want our stockpiles of weapons

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Speaker 1: pointed in their direction either. You know, you're average American

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Speaker 1: probably didn't know, certainly not I didn't either. Let's just

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Speaker 1: get along, all right, So, Chuck, what we're talking about

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Speaker 1: clearly is propaganda, right, which in just that word, A

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Speaker 1: very smart person once said, um that propaganda is not

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Speaker 1: a dirty word, and it didn't end with the Cold War,

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Speaker 1: and that's actually true. But propaganda still has horrible connotations

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Speaker 1: just the word itself, right, I mean, it elicits images

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Speaker 1: of like brainwashed mass and that's it's definitely the case

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Speaker 1: in most cases when it comes to propaganda. But there's

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Speaker 1: a classical, more classical definition of propaganda, and essentially, Um,

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Speaker 1: it's that it's simply a tool for persuasive arguments, Um,

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Speaker 1: that use facts and beliefs, but omit facts and beliefs

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Speaker 1: that that would persuade people to the other side of

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Speaker 1: the argument, right. It's it's accentuating the positive in a way,

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Speaker 1: and you never talked about the negative side of the things. Right,

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Speaker 1: So it's sort of like Facebook, it is. It's very

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Speaker 1: much like Facebook. Um. I figured out that, um through

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Speaker 1: reading this article how propaganda works. That technically the truth campaign,

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Speaker 1: you know, to to get people to quit smoking comcials,

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Speaker 1: that's propaganda because they omit the fact that cigarettes make

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Speaker 1: you alive with pleasure and flavor country. Right, So it's

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Speaker 1: that's a little bit of both. I'm not sure we

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Speaker 1: should say the brands because I'm pretty sure Big Tobacco

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Speaker 1: would sue our parents. And you're right, you've come a

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Speaker 1: long way, nice chuck, Um. So yes, But the the

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Speaker 1: main hallmark of propaganda is that it includes omissions of facts, right. Um.

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Speaker 1: And actually, the where where did the whole word come from?

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Speaker 1: You got any you got any info on that? Dude? Uh? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: started with religion way back, and it started, you know,

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Speaker 1: hundreds of years before it was officially coined. But in

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Speaker 1: sixteen twenty two, Pope Gregory was I need to work

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Speaker 1: in my room in new Pope Gregory fifteen established the

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Speaker 1: Congregation of Propaganda in sixty two, and that was basically

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Speaker 1: trying to win back Catholics who had taken up the

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Speaker 1: Protestant faith. Yeah, Martin Luther made a real damp in

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Speaker 1: the number of seats in the pews every Sunday. So

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Speaker 1: Pope Gregory formed the what was it, the Congregation of Propaganda. Um,

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Speaker 1: and they, oh you did say that, Holy cow man,

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Speaker 1: I gotta pay more attention. Basically, this Congregation of Propaganda,

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Speaker 1: you know, one Catholics back by pointing out that anyone

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Speaker 1: who doesn't take communion every week as a loser. And

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Speaker 1: it worked, it did, sure, I'm sure numbers increased. So

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Speaker 1: since then, you know, from that point until I don't know,

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Speaker 1: the nineteen forties, there was absolutely no propaganda whatsoever. That's

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Speaker 1: probably not true. No, you don't think that's okay. I

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Speaker 1: need to read a little more clearly World War One?

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Speaker 1: Are we talking? Are we're gonna go with the history now?

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Speaker 1: I don't think we should get to that party. I

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Speaker 1: think we should talk more about propaganda's implications. Right in

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Speaker 1: the article, you you read that there was an interview

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Speaker 1: with a guy named em Laine Bruner. Yeah, he's a

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Speaker 1: professor of what rhetoric at Georgia State. Yeah, I didn't

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Speaker 1: know that was such a thing. I didn't either, but

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Speaker 1: it's interesting for him. Um. But Brunner said that the

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Speaker 1: the distinction for him between good and bad propaganda was

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Speaker 1: whether or not, um, the the people perpetrating the propaganda

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Speaker 1: have the best interests of their audience at heart. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but that's subjective. I agree wholeheartedly. I take issue with

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Speaker 1: that because I think that it's up to the individual

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Speaker 1: to decide what his or her best interests, all right,

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Speaker 1: and to make the decision, you have to be fully informed. Well,

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Speaker 1: propaganda is based on an a mission of facts. You're

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Speaker 1: never fully informed when you're when you're being propagandized. Right,

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Speaker 1: So therefore there's no such thing as good propaganda. Sure,

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Speaker 1: you never see two both sides of the argument with propaganda, right, right,

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Speaker 1: So that's I don't think there is such a good

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Speaker 1: thing as I take issue. And he's a Georgia State.

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Speaker 1: He's not too far. Maybe we should hop on the

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Speaker 1: subway and go down him take issue with him. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I want to take issue with this, professor, I got

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Speaker 1: some propaganda for you. Yeah. Uh, so, Chuck, how do

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Speaker 1: you how do you get propaganda? Cross, Well, there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of techniques actually, and these are pretty cool. And

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Speaker 1: I know that when people hear these are going to

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Speaker 1: be very familiar, maybe not with the name, but with

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Speaker 1: the result. Yeah. Um, name calling is a big one. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I I found a poster I showed you. Um, it's

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Speaker 1: a takeoff on that Shepherd Ferry right Obama political poster,

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Speaker 1: but this one it's a slightly different picture. He has

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Speaker 1: his nose in the air and it says snob under.

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Speaker 1: It's actually pretty funny. Yeah, especially since you want it's

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Speaker 1: a lot funnier because he won, right Yeah uh yeah, true.

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Speaker 1: I guess that was done before he won. Yeah uh.

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Speaker 1: And you know, name calling is that's just typical playground stuff.

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Speaker 1: But they do it on large you know, on a

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Speaker 1: large scale. Grown men and women in the political spectrum

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Speaker 1: call people out. They'll they'll use names to uh, they'll

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Speaker 1: use names like terrorists and trader and like evil doers.

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Speaker 1: Stuff that nobody wants to be right. Not to pick

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Speaker 1: too much on George Bush, but when you throw down

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Speaker 1: words like access of evil and evil doers. That's propaganda

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Speaker 1: definitely form Yeah, it is, it is, and it makes

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Speaker 1: you wonder like what exactly is going on in Iran

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Speaker 1: right now? How much propaganda we're experiencing from that? Sure,

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Speaker 1: so that's one technique. Sure, you want to talk about

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Speaker 1: the bandwagon, Well, bandwagon is pretty simple. It's like get

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Speaker 1: on the winning side, dummy, you know, which is actually

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Speaker 1: that example mixed name calling and bandwagon. Nobody wants to

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Speaker 1: feel left out, and again this is pretty much a

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Speaker 1: playground technique, which is still come with us, then you're

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Speaker 1: and your other group, right, or you're gonna be left behind.

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Speaker 1: All your friends and neighbors are gonna be cooler than you,

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Speaker 1: smarter than you, richer than you, whatever, um. And you know,

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Speaker 1: everybody wants to be a part of something good, you know.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, basically with with the bandwagon technique, you're made

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Speaker 1: to feel like you can be a part of something

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Speaker 1: good if you join in, or be left behind if

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Speaker 1: you don't. You got it. Thanks. I like this one

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Speaker 1: a lot. The glittering generalities. Yeah, it's a great name. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is really common in political propaganda, and that's when

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Speaker 1: you combine words that have positive connotations the concept that

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Speaker 1: is beloved. So basically, no one's gonna come out and

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Speaker 1: denounce something that you call And I have another example,

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Speaker 1: and again not to put on pick on Bush, but

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Speaker 1: he was in office for eight years. There's a lot

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Speaker 1: of years. You know, there's a lot of recent things

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Speaker 1: you can point to, like the Patriot Act. Like anyone

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Speaker 1: who would come out and say, oh, the Patriot Act

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Speaker 1: is bad, then what you're not a patriot not supporting? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: But and the worst part is is it worked. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: although do you remember one of the original provisions was

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Speaker 1: basically to turn postal workers into spies, and the post

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Speaker 1: Office said, no, we're not going to do that, right,

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Speaker 1: and it got left out. But they wanted postal workers

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Speaker 1: to keep an eye on what was going on, to

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Speaker 1: report on communities and individual people, right, Yeah, So other

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Speaker 1: words you can use in the glittering general generalities or

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Speaker 1: words like liberty and dreams and family and you you

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Speaker 1: throw these words in there, and you know, God forbid

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Speaker 1: you step up and say something that's anti family just

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Speaker 1: because they tagged that name to it, right exactly, And

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Speaker 1: all all politicians do this. We're not we're not gonna

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Speaker 1: single things out. It happens all over the place on

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Speaker 1: both sides of the spectrum. Yeah, it's just that Bush

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Speaker 1: was in office for eight years, which I just said

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Speaker 1: you should listen. Cards stacking. Card stacking is exactly what

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Speaker 1: it sounds like. It's stacking. Uh, it's stacking the argument

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Speaker 1: in the favor of one side over another. Right. Um,

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Speaker 1: and again this is the is the one that where

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Speaker 1: fact emission really comes into play, you know. Um And

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Speaker 1: and it's most often seen in political campaigns where you know,

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Speaker 1: one candidate is like Broadwater. Have you ever seen Ali

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Speaker 1: g Yeah, did you ever see the barat where he

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Speaker 1: follows around that candidate, Jim Broadwater. It's hilarious. At one point,

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Speaker 1: he tells a voter that Broadwater is talking to that

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Speaker 1: if you do not vote for Broadwater, Broadwater will take power.

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Speaker 1: It's hilarious. And he compares him to Stalin. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: this is is poor you know Republican guys running for

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Speaker 1: city councilmen. But yeah, have Betty last you didn't? He

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Speaker 1: I don't know, I'd like to find that out. But yeah.

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Speaker 1: Card stacking is basically just um saying, here's our candidates great,

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Speaker 1: great attributes, leaving out any bad stuff. Well, details and

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Speaker 1: statistics too, Like they'll throw out legitimate studies, but studies

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Speaker 1: that don't mention the other study that can point out

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Speaker 1: the exact opposite. Nice point, Chuck, card stacking like Facebook, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's exactly. And then it is my favorite fear. That's

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Speaker 1: a big one. So, Chuck, say we were to point

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Speaker 1: out that the guys who host tech stuff uh steal

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Speaker 1: babies in America and then sell them to human traffickers

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Speaker 1: in the Balkans. You're saying that Jonathan Strickland and Chris

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Speaker 1: Puette would do that. I'm just saying I've heard things,

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Speaker 1: So I mean, don't you think would be a good

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Speaker 1: idea to not listen to their podcast and all the

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Speaker 1: people who are tech stuff fans maybe come over and

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Speaker 1: listen to us instead, because we certainly don't steal babies

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Speaker 1: and we would never sell any to human traffickers if

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Speaker 1: we did. That's spaganda. Great example, Josh, thanks, of course,

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Speaker 1: we have to do them on the tech Stuff podcast

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Speaker 1: so they'd hear it. Yeah, good point. Uh, subliminal subliminal messaging.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry I should say it. Subliminally subliminal messaging. Huh.

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Speaker 1: I feel like doing your bidding all of a sudden exactly,

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Speaker 1: and that is, uh, that's one of the oldest tricks

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Speaker 1: in the book. And that's basically images and whip. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's oldest drick in the book. Now it's you know

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Speaker 1: how it is. It's images and words that are so

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Speaker 1: quick and abstract that you don't consciously recognize it. Again,

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Speaker 1: we keep going back to politics because it's just so

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Speaker 1: obvious with politics. But at any campaign poster for anyone,

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Speaker 1: from it somebody running for school board to somebody running

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Speaker 1: for president, they always have red, white and blue in them.

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Speaker 1: They'll often have a star or the the there there'll

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Speaker 1: be a wavy graphic that's kind of reminiscent of a flag.

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Speaker 1: And none of these things are concrete like that that

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Speaker 1: you never see the candidate dress as a statue of liberty.

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Speaker 1: They're actually wrapped in a flag. It's a little more

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Speaker 1: subtle than that, but it has the same effect. Obama

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Speaker 1: symbol was exactly like that. The one that they designed.

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Speaker 1: It was kind of looked like the wavy flag in

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Speaker 1: the circle. It makes the Owen snob, It doesn't it does.

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Speaker 1: I'll show you more closely. But yeah, so, and actually

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Speaker 1: a really good way to kind of pick out this

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Speaker 1: kind of propaganda. What it's called transfer, right, um, is

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Speaker 1: to pretend you're from another country. Right, so all of

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Speaker 1: a sudden that wave, what's that wave for? Or what's

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Speaker 1: that star for? Like stuff we just take for granted

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Speaker 1: that immediately because in our neurons are like patriot, patriot,

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Speaker 1: you know, Um, if you imagine you're from another country,

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Speaker 1: suddenly you deconstruct these abstract images and it seems a

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Speaker 1: little clunky, clumsy, doesn't have the same effect. What these

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Speaker 1: way they star exactly in Soviet Russia, wavy star doesn't

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Speaker 1: understand you. That's good, thank you that what do? What

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Speaker 1: happened to that guy? And then lastly there's plain folks propaganda,

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Speaker 1: which is kind of weak. Actually, yeah, that didn't. That

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Speaker 1: didn't strike me as propaganda when I read it, like

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Speaker 1: kind of the politician trying to seem like your average ordinary,

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Speaker 1: you know, next door neighbor American. Um, I guess it's

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Speaker 1: propaganda if the article says so, But it never struck

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Speaker 1: me as that. Well, technically it is, because it's an

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Speaker 1: omission of fact. So you know, if they sure the

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Speaker 1: candidate loves fishing, but is he really fishing in some

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Speaker 1: rinky dink rowboat that he rented from like a local fisherman.

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Speaker 1: Or is he on like an eight foot yacht, you know,

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Speaker 1: using babies that he bought off the tech stuff guys

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Speaker 1: bait or or what did they set up some you

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Speaker 1: know TV commercial where they did take him to that

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Speaker 1: farm in the rinky dink rowboat and said, hey, excellent

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Speaker 1: points with you for five most decidedly propaganda. Yeah, so yeah, plane, folks,

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Speaker 1: is propaganda to and Chuck. The more you start looking

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Speaker 1: or thinking about propaganda, the more you realize it is

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Speaker 1: everywhere it is, Chuck, how well it's it's it's where

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Speaker 1: you would expect it to be, which is in print,

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Speaker 1: on the internet, TV, radio, movies, you name it. Like

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Speaker 1: I was talking about with the with the eighties movies

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Speaker 1: and the Cold War, I mean every every action movie

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Speaker 1: that came out, the Russians were the enemy pretty much,

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Speaker 1: and then kind of later on it became Middle Easterners

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Speaker 1: were the enemy. Like look who Rambo fought and who

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Speaker 1: Rocky thought. Those were prime examples the Russian. But he

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Speaker 1: helped the mujah hadein a k a. The Taliban. He

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Speaker 1: did what in uh one of the Rambo movies the

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Speaker 1: third Rambo movie. He and at the very end it's

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Speaker 1: they said that they dedicated the movie to the muja

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Speaker 1: Hadean freedom fighters and the mujah Hadein who we were

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Speaker 1: funding to help fight the Russians in Afghanistan turned into

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Speaker 1: the Taliban won. What Chuck Norris is not happy about

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Speaker 1: that at all. He's been after still long since in

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Speaker 1: right and show a thing or two? Yeah, so apparently, Um,

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Speaker 1: according to one of the uh the the professor's interviewed

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Speaker 1: in this article, UM, broadcast media like radio or TV

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Speaker 1: is the most dangerous propaganda medium because people tend to

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Speaker 1: believe it. Well, not just that there's no discourse, it's

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Speaker 1: all one sided. It's all here you ingest this. And

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Speaker 1: also it's it's much it's very entertaining. You know, your

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Speaker 1: average TV shows usually more entertain aiming then your average

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Speaker 1: AP news article. Yeah that's true, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 1: But ironically it's the AP news articles that are generally

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Speaker 1: the least propagandic. Yeah, you're right, because you think about

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Speaker 1: it's like fact fact fact, fact fact quote fact quack. Yes,

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Speaker 1: that's that's actually a quote in a fact quack. Um,

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Speaker 1: and then um, that's it, right, there's not. It's pretty

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Speaker 1: bare bones. I like those political commercials. Those are great.

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Speaker 1: Which one, you know, the big time propaganda where they're

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Speaker 1: where they're you know, this candidate, your family, stuff like that.

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Speaker 1: Do you remember the phone ringing one? I think it

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Speaker 1: was a Clinton add against Obama. It was one of

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Speaker 1: the last ones she ran during the primary, and it

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Speaker 1: was just a phone ringing. Is that when the phone,

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Speaker 1: when the phone rings in the middle of the night,

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Speaker 1: who do you want as president to answer it? Something

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Speaker 1: like that? Right, Yeah, that's that's definitely fear propagandia. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Those crack me up, though, I mean the people that

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Speaker 1: buy into those, that's what scares me. The commerce themselves.

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Speaker 1: I get a kick out of it. I think it's hysterical.

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Speaker 1: Yeah that anyone wouldn't say this is so one sided.

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Speaker 1: It's what's mind bogglingly frightening is that it actually works

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Speaker 1: on some people, so um chuck. Propagana also sometimes is

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Speaker 1: not necessarily contrived. It just kind of comes out. Like

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Speaker 1: I spent a few years as a journalist, right and

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Speaker 1: I realized that it is really easy for your beliefs

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Speaker 1: to creep into a story. It doesn't matter whether it's

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Speaker 1: a story about somebody who just turned a hundred or um,

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Speaker 1: you know about the war in a rock is as

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Speaker 1: unbiased as you try to be, it's impossible to be

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Speaker 1: totally objective. Right in this very podcast. We get taken

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Speaker 1: to task occasionally by people that think we're communist, communists,

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Speaker 1: anti religious, sexist, Bommy worshippers, that kind of thing. But

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Speaker 1: we're not any of those things. No, not really, And

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Speaker 1: if we are, we're sure not aware of it anyway.

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Speaker 1: But you know, your belief system informs your outlook, right,

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Speaker 1: so you know, just the very position you're taking, just

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Speaker 1: the very approach to an article, there's eighty hundred countless

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Speaker 1: different ways to approach an article. The one you choose,

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Speaker 1: even if you're trying to be objective, that's a choice

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Speaker 1: that's a bias right out of the gate. And you're

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Speaker 1: gonna choose the one that you identify with that you

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Speaker 1: understand more. Yeah, so again, I mean, I guess what

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to say is, if you're getting news, only

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Speaker 1: get it from a p not a bad idea. Thank you, Chuck.

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Speaker 1: You want to move along, uh different types of propaganda, Well,

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Speaker 1: let let's talk about the internet real quick, because I

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Speaker 1: find this interesting. The Internet actually has the potential to

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Speaker 1: totally undermine traditional propaganda, right, So well, think about it, like,

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Speaker 1: if broadcast programming is the most dangerous form propaganda because

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Speaker 1: there's no feedback, then the Internet would be the least

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Speaker 1: dangerous form because there's nothing but feedback. Social media has

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Speaker 1: just opened the Internet up to everybody in any crack

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Speaker 1: pot normal person saint can put this stuff on the

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Speaker 1: Internet and and get opposing viewpoints out there, so you

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Speaker 1: can conceivably just be a fully informed person to make

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Speaker 1: your own decisions, which completely undermines um propaganda, right right.

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Speaker 1: The problem is, you know, facts spreading lightning fast just

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Speaker 1: as much as that undermines propaganda. Um, uninformed ideas or

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Speaker 1: facts that aren't really facts can spread just as quickly,

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Speaker 1: and that helps propaganda. So yeah, and the Internet is

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Speaker 1: just rife with that kind of time. What my solution,

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Speaker 1: Snopes dot com. Yeah, they're pretty good. So let's talk

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Speaker 1: about the different types of propaganda and wrap this puppy

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Speaker 1: up like a Christmas president. Religious propaganda was kind of

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Speaker 1: where it all began, like we said earlier, and uh,

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Speaker 1: missionaries yeah, for centuries have been uh even and they've

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Speaker 1: been traveling to other countries trying to recruit others to

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Speaker 1: their to their faith. And this is a form of

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Speaker 1: propaganda pamphlets and the posters that they hand out, and

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Speaker 1: and we're not saying that they're bad people and that

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Speaker 1: they're spreading lies. What we're saying is that's a form

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Speaker 1: of propaganda when you only evangelize the one side of

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Speaker 1: the coin, and they do when you go to these

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Speaker 1: countries tell people that this is the answer right here. Well,

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Speaker 1: you can also make the case that another kind of

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Speaker 1: propaganda the article points out, but doesn't join to religion,

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Speaker 1: thought reform. There's actually a form of religious propaganda as well.

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Speaker 1: You know, if you're running around worshiping like a d

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Speaker 1: deities and the Christians come along and say, no, no,

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Speaker 1: there's just one, we're monotheistic. Now, that's thought reform, right right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: although you know generally they don't give up kool aid

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Speaker 1: that's laced with sinide. Now that that's a very cult

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Speaker 1: But you know, all those those types of political religious,

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Speaker 1: well especially political and religious propaganda, they kind of um

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Speaker 1: underscore our divisive nature, right like us versus them. And

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Speaker 1: actually took an anthropology us once in college and the

420
00:23:01,280 --> 00:23:04,960
Speaker 1: professor challenged us to go a day, just one day,

421
00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:08,440
Speaker 1: without using the words us or them or any variation

422
00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:13,440
Speaker 1: on that theme. And I defy you to do it successfully.

423
00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:15,359
Speaker 1: You can't start now the day's half over. You have

424
00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:18,240
Speaker 1: to start tomorrow. Just those two words. You can say,

425
00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:20,960
Speaker 1: we know no variation on the theme of us in

426
00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:25,000
Speaker 1: us or them. Try it. It's tough. I'm gonna forget

427
00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:28,639
Speaker 1: about that as soon as I leave this, yes studio check.

428
00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:32,439
Speaker 1: The big one, though, of all of them, is government propaganda,

429
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:35,960
Speaker 1: right right, which is illegal since nightficially, and if you

430
00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:40,600
Speaker 1: think about it, that government propaganda is taxpayers paying to

431
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:45,200
Speaker 1: be brainwashed, which is why it should be illegal, right yeah,

432
00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:49,639
Speaker 1: And it has been since technically, but w Mr Bush

433
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:54,080
Speaker 1: in two thousand five actually signed the Stop Government Propaganda

434
00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:58,440
Speaker 1: Now Bill to UH to keep some like blatant outright

435
00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:02,080
Speaker 1: acts of propaganda commit by government agencies, like when you

436
00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:05,280
Speaker 1: pay television reporters to skew a message like planting stories,

437
00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:10,840
Speaker 1: planting stories exactly. Yeah. And it also established some that

438
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:15,280
Speaker 1: audio in printed press communication state who the agency is

439
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:18,000
Speaker 1: that funded it, like paid for by blah blah blah

440
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:20,280
Speaker 1: blah blah, that kind of thing, And we we see

441
00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:25,040
Speaker 1: government propaganda, most prominently during times of war, right like

442
00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:28,800
Speaker 1: Hitler and the Nazis were masters of propaganda. He was

443
00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:32,680
Speaker 1: the king of propaganda in world history, I think. Yeah,

444
00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:37,719
Speaker 1: he cut Germany off from the outside world. He sold

445
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:41,080
Speaker 1: radios for next to nothing. I think he was driving

446
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:43,080
Speaker 1: around in the back of a truck selling him. He

447
00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:45,600
Speaker 1: made sure the prices were loft so every German could

448
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:48,160
Speaker 1: afford one, so they could tune into his radio addresses

449
00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:50,200
Speaker 1: and and hear how great they were and how awful

450
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:53,000
Speaker 1: the Jews and everybody else was. Uh, and and the

451
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:58,359
Speaker 1: portrayal of what was going on, like Germans living in

452
00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:00,639
Speaker 1: the in other parts of the world were being abused

453
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 1: at the hands of their host countries and things like that. Um,

454
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:06,520
Speaker 1: And it was effective. Yeah. And they also made movies,

455
00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:09,840
Speaker 1: the famous Nazi propaganda movies where they, you know, made

456
00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 1: out Jews to be rats and Hitler to be godlike

457
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:16,000
Speaker 1: and it was And they didn't like the Gypsies much either,

458
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:20,280
Speaker 1: or Gays or Catholics. Yeah. Yeah, you forget sometimes you

459
00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:22,800
Speaker 1: know that it wasn't just the Jews that were persecuted

460
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:25,840
Speaker 1: in the Holocaust. There's a lot of other groups. Yeah.

461
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,280
Speaker 1: And here in the US here state side we had

462
00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:32,400
Speaker 1: our own propaganda as well. And also we should say

463
00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 1: um on our very enjoyable sister podcast stuf you missed

464
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:39,919
Speaker 1: in history class, They actually did an entire podcast on

465
00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:43,440
Speaker 1: the Nazi propaganda machinery. Yeah, yeah they should. People should

466
00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:45,560
Speaker 1: check that out. You can get that on iTunes too.

467
00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:48,439
Speaker 1: But again, state side, we had our own propaganda, and

468
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:51,679
Speaker 1: that's something that have become pop icons, right. Yes, and

469
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:53,720
Speaker 1: World War two was when it really kicked up. Like

470
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:56,680
Speaker 1: if you think of the famous Uncle Sam I want

471
00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,960
Speaker 1: you posters with Uncle Sam pointing trying to get young

472
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:02,359
Speaker 1: American men to enlist in the army. Yeah, that was

473
00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:04,320
Speaker 1: new in the forties. Yeah, and that was a big,

474
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,199
Speaker 1: big time propaganda posters were very effective back then. My

475
00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 1: favorite I had two favorites. One of them is what

476
00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:14,120
Speaker 1: what which? One Rosie? Probably Rosie is pretty cool, um.

477
00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:16,400
Speaker 1: But there was one that had somebody riding in a

478
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 1: car by by by by himself and it said, um

479
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 1: when you it was for car pooling, right, ration gas

480
00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:26,639
Speaker 1: and stuff. When you ride alone, you ride with Hitler.

481
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:29,639
Speaker 1: How great would it be to have one of those posters? Now,

482
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:32,359
Speaker 1: I'm sure you can find at least a replica Yeah,

483
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 1: that's true. I mean that. That's the other thing about

484
00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:38,920
Speaker 1: him is they're like great art. Oh yeah, propaganda posters

485
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:41,720
Speaker 1: have the best art. Yeah, I like that that that era.

486
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:45,399
Speaker 1: The The other one I like is just I just

487
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:47,679
Speaker 1: can't believe it, like that. These were up in in

488
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:51,479
Speaker 1: on public display. Um during World War Two. There's a

489
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 1: Japanese soldier using the butt of his rifle to smack

490
00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:59,720
Speaker 1: an American pow in the chin, and it says, what

491
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:03,199
Speaker 1: are you going to do about it? And below is

492
00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 1: the answer. And the answer, according to this propaganda poster

493
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:09,439
Speaker 1: is stay on the job until every murdering Jap is

494
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,760
Speaker 1: wiped out. You're kidding. It even has a little Government

495
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:16,680
Speaker 1: Office of Propaganda logo at the bottom. Look, I kid

496
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:19,680
Speaker 1: you not. That's something else. Yeah, it's a little nuts.

497
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:22,720
Speaker 1: So yeah, well you go a little overboard during times

498
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 1: of war. I liked Rosie the Riveter. That's who I

499
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:26,920
Speaker 1: thought you were going to mention. Have you seen my

500
00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:31,160
Speaker 1: favorite mechanic as a woman over indicatory riff on that? Yeah?

501
00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:35,240
Speaker 1: Successfully too. Um Yeah, Rosie the Riveter was famous obviously

502
00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:38,600
Speaker 1: because women at the time during World War Two were

503
00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:43,000
Speaker 1: encouraged to help the war at home. On the home

504
00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:45,840
Speaker 1: front by working in the taking these factory jobs that

505
00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:48,280
Speaker 1: the men had to leave. And as she became like

506
00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:52,119
Speaker 1: an iconic character, and one of the posters read longing

507
00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 1: won't bring him back sooner, get a war job. Yeah,

508
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:57,000
Speaker 1: I love that. Yeah, it is. It's pretty cool that

509
00:27:57,119 --> 00:27:58,679
Speaker 1: I saw another one who was a woman holding a

510
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:01,760
Speaker 1: giant key and it's a food ration ng is the

511
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:04,480
Speaker 1: key to the war effort. And and actually that was

512
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 1: one of the things that I don't think you could

513
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:12,400
Speaker 1: predict that came out of propaganda was um, women suddenly

514
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:17,440
Speaker 1: were uh put into their proper position of power. They

515
00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 1: were elevated to that that kind of power. They were

516
00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:23,199
Speaker 1: no longer the mirror little houndsewives. They were empowered to

517
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 1: like actually help with the war effort, get a war job,

518
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:30,359
Speaker 1: or to um food ration food or do whatever. They

519
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 1: suddenly had a role. And not just women but blacks

520
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 1: as well. There was a propaganda poster that said like

521
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:36,960
Speaker 1: united we win and it was a black guy and

522
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 1: a white guy working side by side, decades before the

523
00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:43,560
Speaker 1: Civil rights movement. Yeah, so sometimes it's um it's foreshadowing

524
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,280
Speaker 1: of social change and possibly even a mechanism of social

525
00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:49,960
Speaker 1: change that follows. Whatever the the the issue is it's

526
00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 1: being propagandized. I think definitely in the case of women,

527
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 1: I think World two probably had a lot of good

528
00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:57,760
Speaker 1: benefits for women, kind of having a voice for the

529
00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:00,920
Speaker 1: first time, or not the first time, but probably a

530
00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:03,880
Speaker 1: really big, curly on voice for the first time. Yeah yeah,

531
00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:08,160
Speaker 1: um and Chuck, that's propaganda, baby. Yeah. You know. I

532
00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 1: had a movie idea, script idea when I was during

533
00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 1: my screenwriting days about a film student that gets um,

534
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:17,560
Speaker 1: like he wins the big student film award and then

535
00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:18,960
Speaker 1: all of a sudden he gets whisked away by the

536
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 1: government to the secret Layer and they recruit young filmmakers

537
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 1: to the Ministry of Propaganda and like the moon landing

538
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:28,800
Speaker 1: was fake and all these things have been faked or what.

539
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 1: We talked about that in another podcast. But this, yeah,

540
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:33,880
Speaker 1: this kid gets caught up into making these movies that

541
00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 1: are all faults and have the dog. Yeah. It's a

542
00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 1: great one too. Yeah, sort of a riff on that

543
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:39,760
Speaker 1: And I never wrote it, and I don't I'm not

544
00:29:39,800 --> 00:29:41,560
Speaker 1: going to. So if anyone out there's a screenwriter a

545
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:44,320
Speaker 1: longs that idea, feel free, Yeah, just give a shout

546
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:47,280
Speaker 1: out to Chuck at the premiere, right right, Yeah, so

547
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:52,360
Speaker 1: again that's propaganda, that is right. So are we plugging

548
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:55,280
Speaker 1: anything to We haven't add nothing, Holy cow. That means

549
00:29:55,280 --> 00:30:03,320
Speaker 1: we get to go right to listener mail Josh today.

550
00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 1: I think we uh, since it would be appropriate to

551
00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:10,640
Speaker 1: talk about Molly Orshansky. Yeah, are less subject matter there.

552
00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 1: We were talking about the women in World War Two.

553
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:16,120
Speaker 1: We were uh, and also we mentioned that we have

554
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 1: been called sexists and mommy worshipers. You want to read

555
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:22,520
Speaker 1: the letter in question. Yes, we actually got a couple

556
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:26,000
Speaker 1: of letters, um, one which we're going to read now,

557
00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:29,200
Speaker 1: and one that was kind of nasty and mean, and

558
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:30,760
Speaker 1: we're not going to read that or we're not gonna

559
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 1: say that uh, nasty, mean person's name. But this one

560
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,280
Speaker 1: was much more above board. Uh. This says you probably

561
00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:39,840
Speaker 1: have received a bunch of emails about this, but I

562
00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:41,720
Speaker 1: wanted to let you know that Molly or Shansky is

563
00:30:41,760 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 1: a woman. If you recall, she is a woman who

564
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 1: developed the poverty line. But in your podcast how much

565
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:49,000
Speaker 1: money do I Really Need to live? You referenced ms.

566
00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:52,200
Speaker 1: Orshansky as a heat as a female graduate student of

567
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:55,680
Speaker 1: public policy with a specialization in poverty. I was so

568
00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 1: excited to hear you mentioned a woman who was so

569
00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 1: influential to the field. But then I was stremely disappointed

570
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:03,280
Speaker 1: when you got the gender wrong. Obviously she had a

571
00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 1: right to be and I hope you make this correction

572
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:08,760
Speaker 1: on your podcast. And that comes from Cheryl Master in

573
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:11,240
Speaker 1: public policy candidate at the John F. Kennedy School of

574
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 1: Government at Harvard University. And I wrote Cheryl back and

575
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:16,600
Speaker 1: thanked her for being kind since we had gotten the

576
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:21,000
Speaker 1: nasty letter calling its misogynistic freaks and it was a

577
00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:25,520
Speaker 1: big mistake. We were wrong, and the research that we

578
00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:28,959
Speaker 1: got actually referenced uh, Molly rus Chancey as a key

579
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:32,080
Speaker 1: and so it wasn't some big assumption on our part

580
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:34,800
Speaker 1: that it had to be a man. Great wait, Chuck, Chuck,

581
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:36,600
Speaker 1: I've been thinking about this. I think at this point

582
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:41,520
Speaker 1: we should make up a research team and lay this

583
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 1: hot in their feet. I don't think we should take

584
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:47,800
Speaker 1: any responsibility to what spear you right? Right, So, Chuck Um,

585
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:51,080
Speaker 1: it was our research team that really uh dropped the

586
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 1: ball on this one. It wasn't you or I We

587
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,160
Speaker 1: were misinformed. We did We did not assume like a

588
00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 1: couple of readers or listeners have thought that we didn't

589
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:01,080
Speaker 1: assume that it is a man just because it was

590
00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:02,960
Speaker 1: some big college. It wasn't us at all that we

591
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:04,640
Speaker 1: don't do that cut. But to make up for the

592
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:07,800
Speaker 1: failings of our crack research team, who have been chastised,

593
00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 1: um since we got this pointed out to us, well fired,

594
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 1: We fired them both. It's a different way of putting it.

595
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:15,600
Speaker 1: In this economy, you want to stay chastised. We didn't

596
00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:18,120
Speaker 1: fire anyone. I'm just kidding. UM. So we did a

597
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 1: little research into Maali or Shansky. We found out that

598
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:24,240
Speaker 1: she is dead. She died in April two thousand seven.

599
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:28,160
Speaker 1: And she actually was quite a pioneer UM in her field.

600
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 1: She worked for the Social Security Administration from nineteen fifty

601
00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 1: eight to nineteen eighty two, and uh, as historian Alice

602
00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:38,400
Speaker 1: O'Connor wrote in Poverty Knowledge, she was one of a

603
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:43,480
Speaker 1: respected but mostly invisible cardro of women research professor professionals

604
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:47,280
Speaker 1: based at Social Security Administration and other government agencies during

605
00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:50,200
Speaker 1: the postwar years. And I think that's part of the

606
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:54,640
Speaker 1: part of the problem. I think, um, we as you

607
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:57,520
Speaker 1: know thirty early thirty somethings, well, one of us is

608
00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,680
Speaker 1: in early thirty somethings in two thousand nine kind of

609
00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:05,800
Speaker 1: Um underestimated what women were allowed to do, I think

610
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:10,120
Speaker 1: in the sixties. Right, that's fair enough. Sure so, because

611
00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,080
Speaker 1: you don't hear much about it. No, they were, no,

612
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 1: I know, and that is that is the travesty. And

613
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:17,920
Speaker 1: I even thought, like when we were doing that podcast,

614
00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:19,880
Speaker 1: like Molly is a weird name for a guy. But

615
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,520
Speaker 1: I did too. Still, I thought it was an Irish thing,

616
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: and I thought Mally Orshansky. I could see a guy

617
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:27,360
Speaker 1: being named Molly or Chansky, right, So it was. It

618
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 1: was a mistake, I would say, much more notable or

619
00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:34,719
Speaker 1: noteworthy than being invisible, you know. But successful was that

620
00:33:34,760 --> 00:33:40,040
Speaker 1: she actually um has helped countless uh, impoverished people in

621
00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:43,480
Speaker 1: the United States absolutely by creating this poverty line, which

622
00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:46,400
Speaker 1: basically forces the government's hand into saying, Okay, if you're

623
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 1: below this, we're gonna help you, right uh. And this

624
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 1: is largely due to her work as a mathematician and statisticians.

625
00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:56,360
Speaker 1: True trailblazer. He was a great man. He was hats

626
00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:59,240
Speaker 1: off to you, Mr George Shansky. So if you want

627
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 1: to say, and checking emails, taking us to task, or

628
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:06,720
Speaker 1: pointing out an error or just say hi. Whatever, gender confusion.

629
00:34:06,760 --> 00:34:09,480
Speaker 1: If you want to call us sexist mommy worshipers, whatever,

630
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:13,440
Speaker 1: We accept all comers. You can send that to stuff

631
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 1: podcast at how stuff works dot com. For more on

632
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:22,279
Speaker 1: this and thousands of other topics, visit how stuff works

633
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:24,800
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