1 00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 1: Welcome to Securing America with me, Frank Affne, the program 2 00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:30,280 Speaker 1: that's a kind of owner's manual for protecting the country 3 00:00:30,320 --> 00:00:33,360 Speaker 1: we love against all enemies foreign and domestic, to the 4 00:00:33,400 --> 00:00:36,600 Speaker 1: glory of God and his Kingdom. Well, we're going to 5 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:40,560 Speaker 1: talk a bit about protecting the country we love against 6 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:45,239 Speaker 1: enemies foreign and some now who are domestic, with one 7 00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:49,239 Speaker 1: of the men who I admire most for his absolutely 8 00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:55,160 Speaker 1: relentless efforts to assure that the rest of us understand 9 00:00:55,280 --> 00:01:01,000 Speaker 1: the importance of immigration policy and practice the mistakes that 10 00:01:01,040 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 1: have been made, particularly in recent years with respect to both. 11 00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:08,880 Speaker 1: His name is Mark Krekorian. He is the president of 12 00:01:08,959 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 1: a stupendously important organization, the Center for Immigration Studies. He 13 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:18,479 Speaker 1: has been the watchman on the wall for as long 14 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: as I've known him, which is a couple of decades 15 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:25,160 Speaker 1: I think at this point, and absolutely a go to resource, 16 00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:27,959 Speaker 1: and I'm sorry we haven't gone to him more regularly 17 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:30,200 Speaker 1: of late. It's been a while, Mark, but we're delighted 18 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:32,040 Speaker 1: to have you back. Welcome once again, my friend. 19 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:33,640 Speaker 2: Glad to be here anytime. 20 00:01:34,560 --> 00:01:37,360 Speaker 1: So I wanted to sort of level set a little bit. 21 00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:37,760 Speaker 3: Mark. 22 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:41,360 Speaker 1: The very good news as I understand it, is in 23 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 1: the wake of the new second Trump presidency, what we 24 00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 1: were told was an insuperably hard problem of securing, particularly 25 00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 1: the southern border, got solved in Well, it wasn't a 26 00:01:57,320 --> 00:01:58,720 Speaker 1: couple of days. I guess it was a couple of 27 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:01,440 Speaker 1: weeks at most. Is that in fact the case, do 28 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 1: we now have a secure southern border? 29 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 2: Would you say, sir, Yeah, we do. And it doesn't 30 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:10,120 Speaker 2: mean that nothing's ever gonna happen there. I mean, you 31 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:12,200 Speaker 2: can lock your car and it could still get stolen. 32 00:02:12,320 --> 00:02:17,520 Speaker 2: But the number of apprehensions there is the lowest, really 33 00:02:17,520 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 2: the lowest ever recorded because even in earlier generations, and 34 00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:27,320 Speaker 2: we're talking about a long time ago, numbers were lower sometimes, 35 00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:29,920 Speaker 2: but we also didn't know what was going on at 36 00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:33,720 Speaker 2: the border. We now have eyes on the whole border 37 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 2: day and night in a way that never exists before. 38 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 2: So we really do know what's happening at the border. 39 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:43,640 Speaker 2: The numbers are way down doesn't mean that the challenge 40 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:46,360 Speaker 2: isn't there. People now are trying to smuggle on boats 41 00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 2: come up you know, past San Diego or Visa overstairs, 42 00:02:50,919 --> 00:02:53,800 Speaker 2: which is always a real challenge, or the Canadian border. 43 00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:56,639 Speaker 2: So the point is this never goes away. It's a 44 00:02:56,680 --> 00:03:01,920 Speaker 2: permanent feature of national security. But we're actually doing the 45 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:05,080 Speaker 2: national security now at the southern border in a way 46 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:08,239 Speaker 2: that not only do we not see under Biden, but 47 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:12,000 Speaker 2: really under all previous administrations, we just didn't have this 48 00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:15,480 Speaker 2: level of security. So absolutely, So, Mark, let me just 49 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:15,920 Speaker 2: be clear. 50 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 1: The border has greater surveillance on it than previously. Does 51 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:29,519 Speaker 1: it still have holes in the wall there? And when 52 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:34,720 Speaker 1: you say the apprehensions are minimal at this point, does 53 00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:37,000 Speaker 1: that mean that we're no longer having the phenomenon of 54 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:41,920 Speaker 1: getaways that previously weren't apprehended but were nonetheless getting into 55 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 1: the country. 56 00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:44,760 Speaker 2: There's always going to be some god aways, but the 57 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:49,200 Speaker 2: numbers are much lower and we have much more certainty 58 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 2: about the estimates of god aways because of that surveillance. 59 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:57,440 Speaker 2: I mean, we have remote cameras, there are underground sensors. 60 00:03:57,840 --> 00:04:01,880 Speaker 2: We have these stationary blimps sometimes that are used in 61 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 2: order to get a higher view. So yeah, absolutely we 62 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 2: are there holes. The wall is never going to be 63 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 2: two thousand miles long, because there's no real reason in 64 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:15,560 Speaker 2: some places to even have a wall. They are filling 65 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:19,800 Speaker 2: in holes. But the wall itself isn't some magic thing 66 00:04:19,880 --> 00:04:21,880 Speaker 2: that you seal it up and then you can you know, 67 00:04:21,960 --> 00:04:24,360 Speaker 2: set it and forget it. It's a tool, and they 68 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 2: have to have roads and sensors and lights and all 69 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:29,360 Speaker 2: the rest of that stuff. And you know there there's 70 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 2: still room for improvement, and they're working on it. They're 71 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:37,120 Speaker 2: building some more wall sections, but you know, it's it's 72 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:39,200 Speaker 2: sort of a work in progress, but it's a work 73 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:43,360 Speaker 2: that's actually progressing very well. Now. Yeah. 74 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:47,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, And so Mark, when when we talk about this, 75 00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:50,359 Speaker 1: and I alluded to it in my opening question to you, 76 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 1: how is it that all of this seemingly was done 77 00:04:56,480 --> 00:05:00,840 Speaker 1: so quickly when we were so assiduously told and not 78 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 1: just by Democrats by the way. I mean, there was 79 00:05:03,839 --> 00:05:06,480 Speaker 1: James Langford and you know, Mitch McConnell and others who 80 00:05:06,560 --> 00:05:10,520 Speaker 1: were insisting that no, no, no, we needed comprehensive legislation 81 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:14,840 Speaker 1: or some version thereof to get the tools that we're 82 00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:18,880 Speaker 1: going to be required to keep this keep this problem 83 00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:23,080 Speaker 1: for persisting. Why was that not so, sir? 84 00:05:23,240 --> 00:05:26,160 Speaker 2: We didn't really need new laws, We needed a new president. 85 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:30,720 Speaker 2: And you know that's that's what Trump had said, and 86 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:35,920 Speaker 2: there's actually a lot of truth to that, because prospective 87 00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 2: illegal immigrants and they're smugglers. Aren't some kind of I 88 00:05:40,200 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 2: don't know, irresistible force or you know, superheroes or something. 89 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:49,760 Speaker 2: The regular people making rational calculations, And probably the most 90 00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:53,159 Speaker 2: important thing other than just Trump's rhetoric, it's like, oh 91 00:05:53,240 --> 00:05:55,120 Speaker 2: my god, the bad Orange man is here. We better 92 00:05:55,160 --> 00:05:58,520 Speaker 2: stop a policy change that. The fundamental one is that 93 00:05:58,520 --> 00:06:02,159 Speaker 2: they stopped letting everybody go with the border. If you're 94 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:04,360 Speaker 2: not going to spend all that money and take all 95 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:07,280 Speaker 2: that risk, if you're just going to end up in 96 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:10,120 Speaker 2: detention and they're going to send you home anyway. Biden 97 00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:14,039 Speaker 2: was just letting everybody go. Once you stop that, the 98 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:16,200 Speaker 2: only people who are going to keep trying are the 99 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:19,960 Speaker 2: real hard cases, and you know you need to stop them. 100 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:22,479 Speaker 2: And it's labor intensive, but you don't have the kind 101 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:26,000 Speaker 2: of flood that we did for four years under Biden. 102 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:31,920 Speaker 1: And on the point about enforcement of the laws, we're 103 00:06:31,960 --> 00:06:36,040 Speaker 1: hearing a lot about the efforts by ICE, Customs and 104 00:06:36,080 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 1: Border Patrol, other law enforcement agencies, national Guard, even in 105 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:46,640 Speaker 1: some cases working the problem of trying to remove people 106 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:51,240 Speaker 1: here illegally. Talk to us about the state of that 107 00:06:51,320 --> 00:06:52,599 Speaker 1: effort as you see it, sir. 108 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, See, that's the other side of the coin, if 109 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 2: you will. In other words, the administration has done a 110 00:06:58,480 --> 00:07:01,880 Speaker 2: very good job of basically turning off the faucet, but 111 00:07:01,960 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 2: they now have to mop up the you know, flow 112 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:06,800 Speaker 2: from the overflow of the bathtub to use the continue 113 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:11,000 Speaker 2: the metaphor, and they're you know, making significant progress there. 114 00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:14,440 Speaker 2: Most of it, from our research is people leaving on 115 00:07:14,480 --> 00:07:17,400 Speaker 2: their own, illegal immigrants who were kind of concluding that 116 00:07:17,440 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 2: the party's over and they bear to get out quick. 117 00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:26,440 Speaker 2: Our research through July, from January through July suggests, using 118 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:30,880 Speaker 2: Census Bureau data, that two point the number of foreign 119 00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:34,040 Speaker 2: born people legal or illegal has declined by two point 120 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:38,400 Speaker 2: two million, and that of that one point six million 121 00:07:38,440 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 2: were illegal immigrants. So the number's gone up since obviously. 122 00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 2: But our research director has looked at that question from 123 00:07:44,280 --> 00:07:46,840 Speaker 2: a bunch of different angles, and it does seem to 124 00:07:46,920 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 2: be a real thing, not just illegal immigrants not answering 125 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:52,840 Speaker 2: the surveys or something they do that actually believe it 126 00:07:52,920 --> 00:07:53,120 Speaker 2: or not. 127 00:07:53,240 --> 00:07:55,080 Speaker 1: So who are self deporting? 128 00:07:55,360 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 2: Self deporting? Say, some of those are actual ice deportations, 129 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:02,720 Speaker 2: but the large majority our self deportations. That's what the 130 00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:06,200 Speaker 2: administration is counting on. And one of the reasons they 131 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 2: have such publicity about this is to try to send 132 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 2: the message to get people to leave on their own. 133 00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:13,840 Speaker 2: The one thing that they need to now ramp up 134 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 2: is employer based employment based enforcement too. They need to 135 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:22,640 Speaker 2: purp walk some employers that are knowingly hiring illegal immigrants, 136 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 2: send the message that it's not just murderers and rapists 137 00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 2: that we're looking for. Those are the first priority, but 138 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 2: that regular, ordinary illegal aliens need to put their affairs 139 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:34,839 Speaker 2: in order and go home as well. 140 00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:43,520 Speaker 1: And by shaming essentially people who are giving them employment, the. 141 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:45,600 Speaker 2: Theory punishing hopefully more than shaming. 142 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:49,280 Speaker 1: Well yeah, it starts with I guess shaming as part 143 00:08:49,280 --> 00:08:53,640 Speaker 1: of the punishment. But yes, and this would hopefully cause 144 00:08:53,679 --> 00:08:57,280 Speaker 1: others to cease and desist in that practice as well, 145 00:08:57,640 --> 00:09:00,640 Speaker 1: creating a new impetus for people to self deport I 146 00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:01,400 Speaker 1: take it exactly. 147 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:05,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean, because look, most employers aren't crooks. 148 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:08,319 Speaker 2: I mean, I'm an employer, you know, I come from 149 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:10,880 Speaker 2: a line of small business men people or you know, 150 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:13,240 Speaker 2: most employers they want to just know what the rules 151 00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:16,400 Speaker 2: are and be able to follow the rules. It needs 152 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 2: to become clear that the rules are now what the 153 00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:22,840 Speaker 2: law says rather than the kind of wink and nod, 154 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:25,320 Speaker 2: nudge nudge, you know know what I mean, kind of 155 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:28,959 Speaker 2: non enforcement that prevailed in the past. When we do that, 156 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:34,319 Speaker 2: you're going to see real self deportation increase. 157 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:38,040 Speaker 1: This is this is a tremendously important point. Mark. We 158 00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 1: have to take a short break. When we come back, 159 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:41,200 Speaker 1: I want to talk to you about one of the 160 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:45,280 Speaker 1: other things that is compounding the problem, and that is 161 00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:48,560 Speaker 1: sanctuary cities and whether we're about to see New York 162 00:09:48,640 --> 00:09:52,800 Speaker 1: City become one of a whole new class. Stay two. 163 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:54,959 Speaker 1: We'll be right back with more with Mark Gordan of 164 00:09:55,040 --> 00:10:18,680 Speaker 1: the Center for Immigration Studies. Right after this welcome back, 165 00:10:18,960 --> 00:10:23,280 Speaker 1: we are visiting with Mark Krekorian, a man whose insights 166 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:28,040 Speaker 1: and expertise and dogged tenacity when it comes to matters 167 00:10:28,080 --> 00:10:31,959 Speaker 1: involving immigration, I have admired greatly for many years, as 168 00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:35,960 Speaker 1: I have his organization, the Center for Immigration Studies. You 169 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:40,240 Speaker 1: can find it at CIS dot org. You can find 170 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:44,000 Speaker 1: his books on Amazon. He's got a number of them, 171 00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:50,240 Speaker 1: The New Case Against Immigration being one, How Obama transformed 172 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:55,040 Speaker 1: America through immigration being another. There are many others, and Mark, 173 00:10:55,120 --> 00:10:58,720 Speaker 1: I wanted to talk to you about transforming America through 174 00:10:59,760 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 1: saint sanctuary cities. What the historic impact has been of 175 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 1: I think in every case democratic mayors, some cases democratic 176 00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:14,120 Speaker 1: governors have done this with states, I believe, but certainly 177 00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:18,200 Speaker 1: mayors have. And now we have this fellow Zoron Mamdani, 178 00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:24,960 Speaker 1: a communist as well as jihadist, making no bones about 179 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:29,160 Speaker 1: what he intends to do to be welcoming of immigrants, 180 00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:33,400 Speaker 1: he being one of them after all, talk a little 181 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 1: bit about this particular aspect of the immigration security problem. 182 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:44,000 Speaker 2: A sanctuary city. People misunderstand this sanctuary city or state 183 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:48,000 Speaker 2: as you suggested, or county isn't a place that says, okay, 184 00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:52,680 Speaker 2: our police will not go around checking people's papers. Ice 185 00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:55,920 Speaker 2: doesn't want the police to be going around and saying, hey, Paco, 186 00:11:55,960 --> 00:12:00,520 Speaker 2: where's your green card. What they want is the jurisdictions 187 00:12:00,920 --> 00:12:05,560 Speaker 2: to let ICE know when they're done whatever they're going 188 00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:09,880 Speaker 2: to do with people they arrest for normal reasons. They're 189 00:12:10,160 --> 00:12:14,120 Speaker 2: driving drunk, beating their wives, you know, uh, dealing drugs. 190 00:12:14,120 --> 00:12:19,079 Speaker 2: They're arrested for that. Their fingerprints all go to DHS 191 00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:21,040 Speaker 2: now as well as the FBI, so they know if 192 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:24,200 Speaker 2: this guy's an illegal. A sanctuary city says, no, we 193 00:12:24,240 --> 00:12:26,760 Speaker 2: are not we are going to release these people back 194 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 2: into American communities. It's specifically designed to protect criminals, and 195 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:36,480 Speaker 2: it's outrageous. And the thing is that we've our estimate 196 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:38,720 Speaker 2: is at a slight majority of all the illegal immigrants 197 00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:42,839 Speaker 2: live in sanctuary jurisdictions. So how is ICE supposed to, 198 00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 2: you know, do his job if the main way that 199 00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:50,360 Speaker 2: illegal immigrants come in contact with the authorities is foreclose 200 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:54,080 Speaker 2: to them. And so this is a serious problem. Governor, 201 00:12:54,280 --> 00:12:57,080 Speaker 2: I mean, the new or elected mayor of New York 202 00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:03,760 Speaker 2: has said he's gonna type and even further their sanctuary policies. Interestingly, 203 00:13:04,280 --> 00:13:06,880 Speaker 2: the current governor, Eric Adams actually kind of loosened up 204 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 2: a little bit and has been cooperating to a limited 205 00:13:10,200 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 2: degree with Ice. Again with regard to people they've arrested 206 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:17,560 Speaker 2: for murder and what have you to hand them over 207 00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:19,760 Speaker 2: when they're finished with them, whatever they're going to do 208 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 2: with them. The interesting thing is, will mom Donnie try 209 00:13:23,960 --> 00:13:28,000 Speaker 2: to presume to try to arrest ICE agents doing their jobs. 210 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:32,160 Speaker 2: That'll be interesting and that would force a constitutional crisis, 211 00:13:32,200 --> 00:13:34,120 Speaker 2: I think in the same way that his pledged to 212 00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:37,560 Speaker 2: arrest Prime Minister and Yahoo if he comes to the 213 00:13:37,679 --> 00:13:40,640 Speaker 2: un it's the same kind of thing. It's not going 214 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:43,080 Speaker 2: to happen. Frankly, that's the way a mayor ends up 215 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:47,600 Speaker 2: getting arrested himself. But it does send a message to 216 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 2: illegal immigrants that this is a place you should stay. 217 00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 1: And mark among those I fear will be well, Gie Hoddies, 218 00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:02,240 Speaker 1: I mean, this is a mayor, actually a Sharia's supremacist 219 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:05,440 Speaker 1: convert to Islam convert actually, as you know, I'm sure, 220 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 1: to the Shia death cult known as Twelverism, which thinks 221 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:14,040 Speaker 1: that we ought to have the apocalypse to bring back 222 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:18,440 Speaker 1: the Mahdi, the twelfth Imam, the golden age of Islam. 223 00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:22,560 Speaker 1: And so I mean it's terrifying to think about the 224 00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:26,360 Speaker 1: kind of people who he might provide safe haven to, 225 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: who seek such you know, diabolical you know, missions and 226 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:39,760 Speaker 1: states to the extent that there are, in fact, in 227 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:43,360 Speaker 1: part as a result of Joe Biden's open border policy, 228 00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:53,360 Speaker 1: not only possibly millions of immigrants who embrace this doctrine 229 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:56,800 Speaker 1: of Sharia and seek to impose it upon our country, 230 00:14:57,480 --> 00:14:59,680 Speaker 1: but there is also by some estimates, and I'd be 231 00:14:59,840 --> 00:15:03,640 Speaker 1: very appreciative of your best guess. I've heard numbers as 232 00:15:03,680 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 1: low as ten thousand as high as two hundred thousand 233 00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:15,400 Speaker 1: individuals who are believed to be Chinese soldiers who've gotten 234 00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:18,200 Speaker 1: into this country through those open borders as well. What 235 00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:20,560 Speaker 1: are your thoughts about those threats, sir? And why don't 236 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 1: we hear more about trying to remove such people find 237 00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:26,840 Speaker 1: the first of all, I guess and remove them as well. 238 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:30,320 Speaker 2: See the thing with these kind of threats, whether they're 239 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 2: you know, Chinese spies, jihattis, or any other kind of malefactors, 240 00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:38,200 Speaker 2: if we knew which ones they were, in other words, 241 00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:39,800 Speaker 2: if they had some kind of patch on their head 242 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:43,040 Speaker 2: saying I'm a member of the People's Liberation Army, even 243 00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:46,440 Speaker 2: Biden wouldn't have let them in. I mean, but we 244 00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:49,640 Speaker 2: have no idea. And so this is the point I 245 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:52,960 Speaker 2: try to make to people who talk about sanctuary and 246 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:55,160 Speaker 2: the rest of it, is that we don't know who 247 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:59,600 Speaker 2: the ordinary illegal aliens are versus the you know, malign, 248 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:03,400 Speaker 2: dangerous illegal aliens, or even just criminals and gang members, 249 00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:07,400 Speaker 2: let alone Chinese spies or jihatis. You have to have 250 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:12,640 Speaker 2: enforcement across the board if you're going to weed out 251 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:16,120 Speaker 2: those people. This idea that we're going to focus on 252 00:16:16,560 --> 00:16:22,960 Speaker 2: just the Chinese agents. It's a recipe for non enforcement, inaction, 253 00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:26,800 Speaker 2: and failure. You have to enforce the rules across the 254 00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:31,920 Speaker 2: board so that you also get the gang members, the spies, 255 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:36,680 Speaker 2: the terrorists. Otherwise, what are you doing that you're not 256 00:16:36,880 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 2: providing security? It's you know, national security is indivisible, I 257 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:43,440 Speaker 2: guess is one way to put it. You have to 258 00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:49,960 Speaker 2: go after everybody in order to uproot and remove the 259 00:16:50,040 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 2: malignant actors as well as the dishwashers and the drywall hangers. 260 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:56,280 Speaker 2: We don't know which one is which. 261 00:16:57,360 --> 00:17:00,120 Speaker 1: No, I take the point, but I think if you're 262 00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:08,080 Speaker 1: looking for mostly Hispanic dishwashers and you know one people, 263 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 1: for example, and you are not making the point to 264 00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:18,200 Speaker 1: the American people that we're also worrying about large numbers 265 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:26,200 Speaker 1: of military age, unaccompanied men of apparent China Chinese extraction 266 00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:34,080 Speaker 1: who are perhaps as well, you know, in groups, and 267 00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:37,840 Speaker 1: that that's a problem, then this whole idea of see something, 268 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:41,480 Speaker 1: say something seems to me to be somewhat doomed to failure, 269 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:44,080 Speaker 1: and more to the point, the possibility of sort of 270 00:17:44,080 --> 00:17:49,720 Speaker 1: crowdsourcing the situational awareness that we need to enforce the 271 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,479 Speaker 1: laws and protect the country as being missed. 272 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I don't disagree, and the administration does 273 00:17:57,400 --> 00:18:01,320 Speaker 2: need to highlight that they've highlighted the game issue, maybe 274 00:18:01,320 --> 00:18:04,480 Speaker 2: not as much the terrorist issue, although they did just 275 00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:08,560 Speaker 2: I think recently arrest an illegal alien truck driver. This is, 276 00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:10,880 Speaker 2: you know, part of this crackdown on the truck drivers. 277 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,480 Speaker 2: Guy turns out to be an Uzbek wanted terrorist back 278 00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:17,919 Speaker 2: in his home country. But that's my point. Regular enforcement 279 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:23,080 Speaker 2: is the way you end up nabbing these people, especially 280 00:18:23,680 --> 00:18:26,159 Speaker 2: we're employment enforcement all of it. So you got to 281 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:29,320 Speaker 2: enforce it across the board, not just pick and choose. 282 00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:33,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's absolutely right, Mark, and you know 283 00:18:33,240 --> 00:18:37,800 Speaker 1: you've been very clear about that, and we were facing, unfortunately, 284 00:18:37,880 --> 00:18:40,880 Speaker 1: I guess, the harsh reality that you've got limited resources, 285 00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:45,160 Speaker 1: and especially when you find them running into interference at 286 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:49,720 Speaker 1: every turn, you've got an even greater challenge than otherwise. 287 00:18:51,000 --> 00:19:00,480 Speaker 1: Leslie drug trafficking, how instrumental are the cartels to what 288 00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:05,240 Speaker 1: is continuing to come across that border? Human trafficking, child 289 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 1: trafficking and the like that has that also come to 290 00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:12,720 Speaker 1: a pretty much a holt. 291 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:18,000 Speaker 2: From what I've seen. Fentanyl trafficking is down, but meth 292 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:21,679 Speaker 2: and heroin and other things. Is the cartels are seeking 293 00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:25,760 Speaker 2: to replace it with that because in a sense, fentanyl 294 00:19:25,840 --> 00:19:29,360 Speaker 2: became the you know, the the drug of the day, 295 00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:32,280 Speaker 2: and that everybody was focusing attention on it. And so 296 00:19:32,320 --> 00:19:35,240 Speaker 2: these guys are businessmen and they're saying, Okay, well, let's 297 00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 2: move something else. But clearly, if it's harder to get 298 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:44,520 Speaker 2: across the border, it's going to be harder to move 299 00:19:44,920 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 2: dope and other things, because regular people storming across the 300 00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:52,679 Speaker 2: border are also cover for all kinds of bad things. 301 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:55,280 Speaker 1: Mark, we have to leave it at that, Thank you 302 00:19:55,320 --> 00:19:58,960 Speaker 1: so much for your efforts. Cs cis dot org is 303 00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:01,439 Speaker 1: the website for Marc Korean. Check it out please and 304 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:02,480 Speaker 1: support his great work. 305 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:03,760 Speaker 2: Stay tuned. 306 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:26,880 Speaker 1: We'll be right back, folks. We're back, and I am 307 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:31,160 Speaker 1: delighted to say always. Rod Martin is back as well. 308 00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:35,479 Speaker 1: Rod Martin is, of course the founder and the chairman 309 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,880 Speaker 1: of the board of our Institute for the American Future. 310 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:40,800 Speaker 4: Which I'm very proud to be the president. 311 00:20:41,119 --> 00:20:48,359 Speaker 1: He is an incredibly free range minded individual who now 312 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:51,760 Speaker 1: is the proprietor in addition to all of that of 313 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:57,000 Speaker 1: the Rod Martin Report, which you can find Atmartin dot org. 314 00:20:58,040 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: He is an entrepreneur and businessmen as well, who cut 315 00:21:03,320 --> 00:21:08,000 Speaker 1: his teeth with Peter Teel and the PayPal mafia. But 316 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:12,040 Speaker 1: he before that worked as a policy advisor to then 317 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:16,040 Speaker 1: Governor of Arkansas, Mike Huckabee, the man in short of 318 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:21,160 Speaker 1: many parts, including a longtime leader of the Southern Baptist Convention. 319 00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:24,040 Speaker 1: We're always delighted to have a chance to pick his brains, 320 00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:27,439 Speaker 1: considerable brains at that. Welcome back, Rod, Good to have you, 321 00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:32,280 Speaker 1: my friend would be here. So I wanted to start 322 00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:34,520 Speaker 1: with some thoughts of my own on the subject that 323 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:36,679 Speaker 1: I want to turn to with you first. It was 324 00:21:36,720 --> 00:21:42,160 Speaker 1: something you discussed with Eric Metexas recently and very impressively. 325 00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:49,080 Speaker 1: It concerns what's been happening to our conservative movement for 326 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:54,520 Speaker 1: one of a better term maga the base, the right, 327 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 1: however you describe it. What has been taking place, I 328 00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:04,680 Speaker 1: think is nothing short of a sort of fratricide at 329 00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:09,840 Speaker 1: a very unfortunate time. We've got conservatives who agree on 330 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:16,480 Speaker 1: some things and disagree on other things now increasingly finding 331 00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: that they don't seem to agree on much at all, 332 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:25,199 Speaker 1: and that in their disagreements there is a kind of 333 00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:31,520 Speaker 1: bitterness that is poisonous I'm afraid, certainly for a movement 334 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:34,600 Speaker 1: more needed now arguably than ever. 335 00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:37,919 Speaker 4: Some of the. 336 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:42,720 Speaker 1: Disagreements revolve around Israel, its importance to our country, its 337 00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:47,120 Speaker 1: importance of course to the Jewish people, but also its 338 00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:51,400 Speaker 1: importance to Western civilization, and I'd want to be absolutely 339 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:55,320 Speaker 1: clear about this. I don't think we can overstate the 340 00:22:55,359 --> 00:23:01,120 Speaker 1: importance of Israel to Western civilization as well to our 341 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:06,880 Speaker 1: own interests, particularly in the Middle East. And I find 342 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:15,679 Speaker 1: it difficult to state with sufficient conviction that I pray 343 00:23:16,359 --> 00:23:20,359 Speaker 1: that those who were seeing things otherwise will think better 344 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,560 Speaker 1: of their position as it becomes more and more untenable 345 00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:28,520 Speaker 1: by the day. Rod Martin, you talked a bit about 346 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 1: this with Eric Metaxas and your clarity on the kinds 347 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 1: of well, at best, willful blindness and at worst, I 348 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:50,840 Speaker 1: think a kind of dishonesty is characterizing the positions of 349 00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:54,560 Speaker 1: those who are finding fault with Israel and disregarding its 350 00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:57,359 Speaker 1: importance to us. Walk us through your thinking on this. 351 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:02,080 Speaker 3: Well, we have a lot of friends who are theologically 352 00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:05,399 Speaker 3: committed to Israel for one reason or another. We have 353 00:24:06,200 --> 00:24:10,560 Speaker 3: a growing number of friends and in some cases not friends, 354 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:15,639 Speaker 3: who have a theological argument with the first group, and 355 00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:19,880 Speaker 3: therefore Israel is evil and you just look at that, 356 00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:23,240 Speaker 3: and honestly, I just shake my head. Israel is like 357 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:28,919 Speaker 3: every other country that we have any business with. We 358 00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:33,639 Speaker 3: don't agree religiously with Japan if we're Christians. We don't 359 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:40,439 Speaker 3: agree religiously with France, honestly, if we're Christians. So you know, 360 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,760 Speaker 3: but we get along. We can be friends, we can 361 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:47,840 Speaker 3: love our neighbors as ourselves, we can make meaningful alliances, 362 00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:51,560 Speaker 3: we can have meaningful trade deals. There's nothing wrong with 363 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:55,240 Speaker 3: any of that. And you know, for some of our 364 00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 3: pastors on one side to take this vament andy Israel 365 00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:04,960 Speaker 3: position because they don't agree with Mike Huckabe's eschatology, just 366 00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,959 Speaker 3: boggles my mind. I mean, I don't agree with lots 367 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,879 Speaker 3: of countries for lots of reasons, some of them theological 368 00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:15,879 Speaker 3: that those people seem to want to give a pass. So, 369 00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:20,679 Speaker 3: for example, we're constantly told that somehow the tail is 370 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:23,240 Speaker 3: wagging the dog. This country of nine and a half 371 00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:28,240 Speaker 3: million people controls the whole world, and certainly Donald Trump. 372 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:31,320 Speaker 3: I haven't noticed that Donald Trump is capable of being 373 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:34,960 Speaker 3: controlled by anybody. I think the last four years showed 374 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:39,639 Speaker 3: us anything. It's that literally nobody can control Donald Trump. 375 00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:43,359 Speaker 3: And Donald Trump has spent a lifetime telling us he's 376 00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:46,720 Speaker 3: pro Israel. So why are these folks all of a 377 00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:51,160 Speaker 3: sudden in an uproar about Donald Trump doing exactly what 378 00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:55,520 Speaker 3: Donald Trump promised he would do. And more to the point, Look, 379 00:25:55,880 --> 00:26:02,760 Speaker 3: Israel is a capitalist, free enclave in a sea of tyrants. 380 00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:09,960 Speaker 3: Everyone around them has fewer rights than Arabs do. In Israel, 381 00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:14,240 Speaker 3: There's no question about this. They have become a technology powerhouse. 382 00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 3: This idea that somehow they're dependent on USAID is honestly, 383 00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 3: at best forty years out of date, and second, just absurd. 384 00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:27,800 Speaker 3: The money that does go to Israel almost entirely never 385 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:31,440 Speaker 3: gets to Israel. It goes to General Dynamics and Boeing 386 00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:36,399 Speaker 3: as grants to help them buy things, largely in exchange 387 00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:40,200 Speaker 3: for things they're doing for us, like the joint development 388 00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:44,280 Speaker 3: work on iron beam and so forth, but also all 389 00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:47,720 Speaker 3: our dirty work in the Middle East. The idea that 390 00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:51,800 Speaker 3: Donald Trump got dragged into the war against Iran? Are 391 00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:55,840 Speaker 3: you kidding? Donald Trump set it up where the Israelis 392 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:58,320 Speaker 3: do all the hard stuff and then we show up 393 00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:01,760 Speaker 3: for a grand finale, and again and again and again 394 00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:07,080 Speaker 3: you see this it reflects just a level of nonsense 395 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:12,439 Speaker 3: that is hard to grasp apart from, of course, natari money. 396 00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:15,200 Speaker 1: Well, that's the point I wanted to get to Roder. 397 00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:22,320 Speaker 1: It seems as though nonsense doesn't begin to describe the 398 00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:25,879 Speaker 1: impetus behind this. I'm sure there's some of it, obviously, 399 00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:32,680 Speaker 1: but to the extent that we are witnessing an aggressive 400 00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:38,320 Speaker 1: influence operation by this nation of Cutter, which has more 401 00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:40,879 Speaker 1: money than it knows what to do with. But what 402 00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:43,800 Speaker 1: it seems to be principally interested in doing with it 403 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:49,520 Speaker 1: is trying to advance the jihad and take down those 404 00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:53,680 Speaker 1: opposed to its success. And one of the ways in 405 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,760 Speaker 1: which that is playing out, as best I can tell, 406 00:27:56,960 --> 00:28:00,880 Speaker 1: is well buying off, for want of a better on 407 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:06,639 Speaker 1: some prominent conservative influencers to a point where it does 408 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:10,080 Speaker 1: it does get into that space where it seems rather 409 00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:15,560 Speaker 1: virulently anti Israel, not just you know, sort of an 410 00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:20,320 Speaker 1: argument about our priorities domestic and otherwise your thoughts. 411 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:24,600 Speaker 3: Well, the thing is, if Cutter weren't doing it, George 412 00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:27,840 Speaker 3: Soros or Reid Hoffman would be you know, this is 413 00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:31,919 Speaker 3: the thing constantly treated to this idea that there's this 414 00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:36,200 Speaker 3: sea of Israeli money in American politics, but the numbers 415 00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:40,760 Speaker 3: are pretty clear. In a ranking of numbers one through 416 00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:48,800 Speaker 3: ten countries by expenditures to influence American politicians and citizens 417 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:54,840 Speaker 3: in America, Open Secrets has Israel in tenth place. The 418 00:28:55,000 --> 00:29:00,240 Speaker 3: Chinese are ahead, Cutter is ahead, Saudi Arabia is ahead. 419 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:05,800 Speaker 3: Get this, the Bahamas are ahead. Everybody is ahead of Israel. 420 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:08,960 Speaker 3: And why wouldn't they lobby in the United States. It's 421 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 3: not illegal to lobby in the United States. We have 422 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,640 Speaker 3: this crazy new fangled thing called the First Amendment. So yeah, 423 00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:18,960 Speaker 3: they have interests here against people who are out spending 424 00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:22,920 Speaker 3: them dramatically to try to turn American opinion against them. 425 00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:26,280 Speaker 3: They're spending money to try to keep people in support 426 00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,000 Speaker 3: of them. Okay, that's all fine. That's called a marketplace 427 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:32,440 Speaker 3: of ideas. Now, if you could show they were bribing 428 00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:35,960 Speaker 3: politicians or something, that'd be fine. You know, we should 429 00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:38,640 Speaker 3: put those people in jail. But wouldn't you have to 430 00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 3: start with Eric Swolwell, wouldn't you have to start with 431 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:46,320 Speaker 3: all these democrats who are in bed with the Chinese 432 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:50,640 Speaker 3: Communist Party And I don't hear people attack in China. 433 00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:55,560 Speaker 3: None of these people are questioning the DNA of the 434 00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:59,720 Speaker 3: Han Chinese in the way that they suddenly are about you. 435 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:04,120 Speaker 3: And I just keep coming back to, First of all, 436 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:08,680 Speaker 3: that's been completely debunked. The science claiming that Jews in 437 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 3: Israel aren't the same as Jews two thousand years ago 438 00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 3: is just obscene anti Semitism. There's no science to it. 439 00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:19,280 Speaker 3: But it's more than that. A Jew is anybody who 440 00:30:19,320 --> 00:30:21,840 Speaker 3: wants to be a Jew, just like a Baptist is 441 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:24,320 Speaker 3: anybody who wants to be a Baptist. We don't do 442 00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:29,080 Speaker 3: a DNA check on Baptists. That's just silly. So you know, 443 00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:32,440 Speaker 3: the kinds of arguments being marshaled sound like they come 444 00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:36,960 Speaker 3: straight out of Gebels, and it's just horrifying to watch. 445 00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:39,840 Speaker 3: And it really you know, I'm not saying we should 446 00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:43,080 Speaker 3: cancel anybody. That's not true. I want to give them 447 00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:47,200 Speaker 3: enough exposure that we can hear how obscene their arguments 448 00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:49,320 Speaker 3: actually are and reject them. 449 00:30:49,800 --> 00:30:53,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I guess the question that occurs, rod is 450 00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:59,000 Speaker 1: are the folks that such individuals seem to be particularly 451 00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:10,160 Speaker 1: appealing to, namely the younger cohort of Americans able to 452 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:17,080 Speaker 1: discern determine from that exposure that these folks are acting 453 00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:19,640 Speaker 1: in this scene way that what they're saying and what 454 00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:23,200 Speaker 1: they're recommending, what they're what they're calling for visa the 455 00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 1: Israel and for that matter, visa be the United States 456 00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:36,160 Speaker 1: is beyond the appalling. It's it's totally unacceptable. I want 457 00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:37,600 Speaker 1: to explore this with you on the other side of 458 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:40,000 Speaker 1: the break because I think this is really a critical 459 00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:43,200 Speaker 1: issue for our time. Have we lost the youth of 460 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:51,080 Speaker 1: our country or are they susceptible to making sensible, responsible 461 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:55,880 Speaker 1: decisions once they understand actually what people are trying to 462 00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:59,880 Speaker 1: do here Gerbalesque especially. We'll be talking about all of 463 00:31:59,880 --> 00:32:01,920 Speaker 1: that and much more with Rod Martin on the other 464 00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:02,680 Speaker 1: side of the short break. 465 00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:03,680 Speaker 4: Please stay tuned. 466 00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:27,320 Speaker 1: We're back, and so is Rod Martin. Praise the Lord, 467 00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:32,040 Speaker 1: follow his great work at Rodmartin dot org, and support 468 00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:34,960 Speaker 1: the work of the organization that he founded, the Institute 469 00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:39,800 Speaker 1: for the American Future at Usfuture dot org as one 470 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:44,240 Speaker 1: of its employees. I will be very appreciative Rod. Let 471 00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:48,960 Speaker 1: me just drill down a little bit. Tucker Carlson is 472 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:54,360 Speaker 1: an individual who has been doing some I think very 473 00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:59,520 Speaker 1: troubling platforming of another individual, notably well several of them 474 00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:03,000 Speaker 1: we have the Qatari Prime minister I believe, and the 475 00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:07,400 Speaker 1: Iranian president I think it was, and then more recently 476 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:13,480 Speaker 1: some historians of some disrepute. But Nick Fuentes is a 477 00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:17,560 Speaker 1: name that I had not heard, frankly until fairly recently, 478 00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:21,920 Speaker 1: and for two and a half hours, Tucker showcased him 479 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:24,800 Speaker 1: and some of his ideas. I'm not sure that they 480 00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 1: were fully on display in that performance. It seemed as 481 00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:29,800 Speaker 1: though he was tempering his. 482 00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:32,000 Speaker 4: Rhetoric a bit. 483 00:33:32,120 --> 00:33:35,680 Speaker 1: But the more you're exposed to it, and I find 484 00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:39,480 Speaker 1: it a kind of soiling experience, honestly, the more it's 485 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:43,560 Speaker 1: evident he really falls into that category of reprehensible people 486 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:48,680 Speaker 1: that you're talking about. What are your thoughts about the 487 00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:53,720 Speaker 1: seeming affinity of an awful lot of young Americans to 488 00:33:55,080 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 1: the kind of well worldview, shall we say, the kind 489 00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:04,800 Speaker 1: of at a Semitic, the kind of pro Nazi even 490 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:08,720 Speaker 1: attitudes that Flint seems to embrace. 491 00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:11,719 Speaker 3: Well, I just want to start by saying I don't 492 00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:16,360 Speaker 3: have any problem with Tucker platforming Nick Flint. Is I 493 00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:21,000 Speaker 3: just wish Tucker had actually interviewed him with the vigor 494 00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:25,120 Speaker 3: shall we say, that he did Ted Cruz and all 495 00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 3: he did was throw softballs at Flint as and when 496 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:33,760 Speaker 3: Flint has outright says I think Stalin is cool, Tucker 497 00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:36,480 Speaker 3: just let it go, never came back to it, never 498 00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:40,800 Speaker 3: asked to follow up at all. I'm sorry, Stalin wasn't cool. 499 00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:45,520 Speaker 3: Stalin murdered twenty million of his own people and proceeded 500 00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:48,600 Speaker 3: to take over every country he was in reach of, 501 00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:54,480 Speaker 3: where further millions died, including China, where sixty five million 502 00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:58,320 Speaker 3: were killed by their communist government. There is nothing cool 503 00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:02,759 Speaker 3: about that. But Nick Flints will tell you Hitler was 504 00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:06,240 Speaker 3: also cool, and you know all these people are cool. Okay, 505 00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:08,839 Speaker 3: that's a problem for me. I don't need to know 506 00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:12,239 Speaker 3: what he thinks about Israel, you can guess. But I 507 00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:14,759 Speaker 3: don't even need to know. I just need to know 508 00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:18,200 Speaker 3: that he's a communist. He is a communist who dresses 509 00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:23,200 Speaker 3: himself up in just enough free market and pro American 510 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:27,439 Speaker 3: trappings to be able to pretend he's on the right. 511 00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:31,120 Speaker 3: But he's not. He's a communist. And not only is 512 00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:34,799 Speaker 3: he a communist, he's a pretty reprehensible person. I mean, 513 00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:38,480 Speaker 3: just look at the other things he's pushing. This is 514 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:43,160 Speaker 3: a guy who you know, there is honestly just no 515 00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:46,920 Speaker 3: limit to how bad it is now? Is he is 516 00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:52,560 Speaker 3: he pro masculinity, Yes, but he's also misogynistic, you know. 517 00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:58,640 Speaker 3: Is he is he pro Trump? Well, yes, after the election, 518 00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:03,120 Speaker 3: but before the election he was posting over and over 519 00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:06,440 Speaker 3: again about how how we have to do whatever we 520 00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:09,680 Speaker 3: can to stop Trump. So he spends with four Katungu. 521 00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:12,600 Speaker 3: He just wants to tell you enough like the devil 522 00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:16,080 Speaker 3: to get you to listen, and then he slips in 523 00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:19,960 Speaker 3: the poison. And I don't understand why Tucker Carlson didn't 524 00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:24,040 Speaker 3: interview him properly. I think a retarded fifth grader could 525 00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:27,520 Speaker 3: have interviewed him better than Tucker did well. 526 00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 1: And again it's fitting a pattern. The same kind of 527 00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:33,360 Speaker 1: softball approach was taken with the Iranian and with the 528 00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:35,959 Speaker 1: Katari and with some of these other characters as well, 529 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,759 Speaker 1: which gives again a certain legitimization to the moment. 530 00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:42,880 Speaker 3: Again, is fine, as you know, to the degree that 531 00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,480 Speaker 3: it's letting them get their side out. I don't have 532 00:36:45,520 --> 00:36:48,400 Speaker 3: a problem with someone interviewing the Ayatola. I want to 533 00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:50,719 Speaker 3: hear what the Ayatola thinks. I want to hear what 534 00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:55,720 Speaker 3: Saddam Hussein thought or Adolf Hitler thought. Those are reasonable things. 535 00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:58,839 Speaker 3: When I hear Vladimir Putin, I know more about what's 536 00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:01,680 Speaker 3: going on in Russia. Of course his spin is on it, 537 00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:04,759 Speaker 3: but if we're sitting here, we're giving it our spin too. 538 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,120 Speaker 3: I don't have a problem with that. I believe in 539 00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:10,279 Speaker 3: the marketplace of ideas. But I know that if I 540 00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:13,040 Speaker 3: were the one being interviewed, I would be getting hit 541 00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:18,360 Speaker 3: harder than Nick Flint has got, or than Vladimir Putin got. 542 00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:21,480 Speaker 3: And I think there's a real fundamental problem with that, 543 00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:24,680 Speaker 3: not with the interview, but what the interview were. 544 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:26,400 Speaker 2: Amen. 545 00:37:27,400 --> 00:37:30,239 Speaker 1: Let me turn to something you've written about at Rodmartin 546 00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:36,239 Speaker 1: dot org, and that is that President Trump's hemispheric strategy 547 00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:43,120 Speaker 1: is actually part of a two front approach to containing 548 00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:46,400 Speaker 1: communist China. You're a member of our Committee on the 549 00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:49,560 Speaker 1: President Danger China, as you know, we're rather big on 550 00:37:49,680 --> 00:37:52,759 Speaker 1: rolling back China, not just containing it. But took us 551 00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:56,720 Speaker 1: through the theory of these pieces that you're talking about, 552 00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:59,640 Speaker 1: the two front aspects of this conflict. 553 00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:04,839 Speaker 3: Well, Donald Trump grasps that if you can't handle your 554 00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:08,359 Speaker 3: own backyard, you can't handle anything else. And we used 555 00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:11,319 Speaker 3: to understand that, we actually understood that for most of 556 00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:15,120 Speaker 3: American history, we have gotten very slack in the last 557 00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:19,120 Speaker 3: not just years, but several decades, and we have let 558 00:38:20,080 --> 00:38:26,440 Speaker 3: China and Russia and Iran in particular have meaningful dangerous 559 00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:31,520 Speaker 3: presences in places like Venezuela and Cuba, which is just unconscionable. 560 00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:35,000 Speaker 3: And we've let China own the ports at both ends 561 00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:39,040 Speaker 3: of the Panama Canal, which is just unconscionable. And we've 562 00:38:39,120 --> 00:38:42,080 Speaker 3: let China move into a position where it could end 563 00:38:42,160 --> 00:38:46,760 Speaker 3: up exploiting the mining rights in Greenland, which is just unconscionable. 564 00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:50,000 Speaker 3: So Donald Trump has addressed all of those things quite 565 00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:55,600 Speaker 3: aggressively since even before he took office again, and that's essential, 566 00:38:55,680 --> 00:38:59,080 Speaker 3: that's foundational to American grand strategy globally. 567 00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:09,320 Speaker 1: This is I think at the core of the question 568 00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:12,160 Speaker 1: that I want to explore with you a bit further. 569 00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:18,200 Speaker 1: If the President is in fact intent on containing China 570 00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:24,000 Speaker 1: rod or better yet, rolling it back, and that certainly 571 00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:29,480 Speaker 1: is the clear implication of what we've learned, for example, 572 00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:35,759 Speaker 1: from Lee Smith's new book The China Matrix, that chronicles 573 00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:41,920 Speaker 1: Trump's attitude towards China over decades. Really, I want to 574 00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:45,520 Speaker 1: explore with you the other piece of his strategy, which 575 00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:53,480 Speaker 1: is seemingly maintaining the Chinese Communist Party in business and 576 00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:57,600 Speaker 1: you know, doing deals with them on well, rare earths 577 00:39:57,640 --> 00:40:01,600 Speaker 1: among other things. We in fact do really have a 578 00:40:01,640 --> 00:40:04,120 Speaker 1: deal with him on that. Talk about it with Rod Martin. 579 00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:27,160 Speaker 4: Please stay too, We're back. 580 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:31,520 Speaker 1: We're talking with our free range minded friend and colleague 581 00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:38,000 Speaker 1: Rod Martin about the Trump strategy towards China. Is the 582 00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:41,960 Speaker 1: hemispheric security piece of it part of a larger strategy 583 00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:46,000 Speaker 1: to contain or I would prefer to see roll back 584 00:40:46,120 --> 00:40:48,839 Speaker 1: the Chinese Communist Party put it as Ronald Reagan did 585 00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:52,319 Speaker 1: the Soviet Party on the ash heap of history. But 586 00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:56,279 Speaker 1: there's also this other dimension Rod, that I wanted you 587 00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:58,400 Speaker 1: to address, if you would, and that is what the 588 00:40:58,440 --> 00:41:03,799 Speaker 1: President is doing with respect to trade with the Chinese, 589 00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:11,600 Speaker 1: including trade that seemingly is now being once again restricted 590 00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:16,480 Speaker 1: by the Chinese. They've said that they are going to 591 00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:20,520 Speaker 1: deny the use of their rare earth minerals, their processed 592 00:41:20,600 --> 00:41:23,440 Speaker 1: rare earth minerals by companies in the United States that 593 00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:28,920 Speaker 1: are doing business, at least in part with our military. 594 00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:33,040 Speaker 1: How does all this come together as a grand strategy, sir? 595 00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:37,440 Speaker 3: And to what end I think Trump learned most of 596 00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:40,640 Speaker 3: his lessons on these things from Reagan, which has been 597 00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:46,120 Speaker 3: really remarkable to watch. Actually, obviously the details differ and 598 00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:51,080 Speaker 3: the circumstances in the world are very very different from 599 00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:54,839 Speaker 3: the eighties, and in most ways that's a good thing. 600 00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:57,359 Speaker 3: You know, we're not in danger of being conquered by 601 00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:01,480 Speaker 3: the Soviet Union tomorrow, and that's definitely and that positive 602 00:42:01,520 --> 00:42:04,160 Speaker 3: in the world. But what Reagan did, as you know, 603 00:42:04,640 --> 00:42:08,280 Speaker 3: was not eliminate the Soviet Union by bombing the radar 604 00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:13,359 Speaker 3: at Krasnoiarsk or you know, going after SS twenties, you know, 605 00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:17,920 Speaker 3: with with FB one eleven's, that wasn't the plan. The 606 00:42:17,960 --> 00:42:21,600 Speaker 3: plan was to bankrupt them, which he did, and that 607 00:42:21,880 --> 00:42:26,759 Speaker 3: involved continuing to do business with them, but also constraining 608 00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:30,120 Speaker 3: their ability to do that business. So you get the 609 00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:33,440 Speaker 3: deal with the Saudi's in eighty five that starts collapsing 610 00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:36,160 Speaker 3: the price of oil, which then as now was the 611 00:42:36,160 --> 00:42:39,040 Speaker 3: source of Soviet hard currency, and all of a sudden 612 00:42:39,040 --> 00:42:41,440 Speaker 3: they can't keep up in the arms race. They certainly 613 00:42:41,520 --> 00:42:46,240 Speaker 3: can't compete with SDI and you know, Gorbachev is trying 614 00:42:46,239 --> 00:42:48,719 Speaker 3: to get the economy to do right, and in the 615 00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:52,759 Speaker 3: process he just absolutely broke the entire system. So I 616 00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:56,239 Speaker 3: think that's what you're seeing here. I think Trump is 617 00:42:56,360 --> 00:42:59,200 Speaker 3: aware that there are certain things that we have allowed 618 00:42:59,239 --> 00:43:02,239 Speaker 3: ourselves to be dependent on China for that we're not 619 00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:05,640 Speaker 3: going to be able to decouple from overnight, and so 620 00:43:06,239 --> 00:43:10,440 Speaker 3: the continued dialogue makes sense at least until that point 621 00:43:10,520 --> 00:43:14,040 Speaker 3: at which we can, and that's in progress. As you 622 00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:17,760 Speaker 3: saw during the Asian trip, we had a new deal 623 00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:20,200 Speaker 3: we actually this was at the White House the week before. 624 00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:24,360 Speaker 3: We had a new deal with Albanizi in Australia, not 625 00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:28,520 Speaker 3: just for rare earths mining but processing. So we're taking 626 00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:32,560 Speaker 3: back some of that refining which China currently dominates. Ninety 627 00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:36,320 Speaker 3: two percent of the Ukraine deal is about rare earths. 628 00:43:36,520 --> 00:43:39,600 Speaker 3: The Greenland deal is in part about rare earths. But 629 00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:44,440 Speaker 3: we're also opening significant facilities in the United States, old 630 00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:49,240 Speaker 3: mines and new mines that are capable of producing these things. 631 00:43:49,520 --> 00:43:53,640 Speaker 3: And we're building refining capacity, including a giant new plant 632 00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:57,600 Speaker 3: in Fort Worth that will take over production of about 633 00:43:57,600 --> 00:44:00,600 Speaker 3: a third of the rare earth's magnets we need, so, 634 00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:03,400 Speaker 3: you know, and that's just one facility. A lot of 635 00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:06,759 Speaker 3: this eighteen trillion in new investment coming in will go 636 00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:10,960 Speaker 3: to that. And you just saw just not that I 637 00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:14,920 Speaker 3: can't talk. You just saw half a billion dollars go 638 00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:18,520 Speaker 3: from the Pentagon into RP Materials, which is which is 639 00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:21,640 Speaker 3: the main producer in the United States, and another half 640 00:44:21,719 --> 00:44:25,239 Speaker 3: billion dollars come in in an investment from Apple. So 641 00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:28,759 Speaker 3: we're moving aggressively on this. They're not going to be 642 00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:31,680 Speaker 3: able to hold this over our heads much longer. And 643 00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:34,359 Speaker 3: at the same time, the other big pain point, of 644 00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:39,400 Speaker 3: course is their dominance of pharmaceuticals, and Trump is moving 645 00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:44,399 Speaker 3: aggressively on getting pharmaceutical plants built here. So I think 646 00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:47,319 Speaker 3: over a four year period you see their ability to 647 00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:49,920 Speaker 3: control events dropped significantly. 648 00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:57,919 Speaker 1: So for the interim period though, rod General Motors and 649 00:44:58,520 --> 00:45:02,279 Speaker 1: Tesla have both said that they're going to respond to 650 00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:06,560 Speaker 1: this threat from the Chinese to restrict companies that do 651 00:45:06,640 --> 00:45:11,080 Speaker 1: business with the Pentagon by saying, you know, they're ending 652 00:45:11,080 --> 00:45:15,080 Speaker 1: their supply chain dependency on China. Is that something they 653 00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:18,000 Speaker 1: can do at this point in time? I mean, I 654 00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:20,880 Speaker 1: take your point that there's a lot of other things 655 00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:23,480 Speaker 1: in the works that will give them options in the future, 656 00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:28,399 Speaker 1: But can we essentially decouple even selectively by such companies now, 657 00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:29,120 Speaker 1: do you think. 658 00:45:29,320 --> 00:45:32,200 Speaker 3: There's stock piles here and there, there are long term 659 00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:35,040 Speaker 3: contracts here and there. They're not going to make a 660 00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:39,359 Speaker 3: pronouncement like that without thinking at least that they have 661 00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:44,080 Speaker 3: it covered, and I don't doubt that they do. If 662 00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:48,400 Speaker 3: we have a two year production hit on f thirty fives, 663 00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:50,799 Speaker 3: we've got a bunch of them, the world won't end. 664 00:45:50,880 --> 00:45:53,360 Speaker 3: And at the other side of that, we're just going 665 00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:57,359 Speaker 3: to double production. So even if you have that kind 666 00:45:57,440 --> 00:46:00,880 Speaker 3: of thing, I don't think it material affects us. But 667 00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:03,640 Speaker 3: here's what I do know. Scott Bessant was on TV 668 00:46:03,800 --> 00:46:07,080 Speaker 3: again yesterday saying, if they do mess with us on this, 669 00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:10,680 Speaker 3: we have a lot of levers on them, and he's 670 00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:14,200 Speaker 3: not kidding, and we can prove that they actually are 671 00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:18,360 Speaker 3: susceptible to some of those by virtue of two factoids 672 00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:21,640 Speaker 3: that your audience will appreciate, you know. The first one 673 00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:27,840 Speaker 3: being that we are still charging China almost four times 674 00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:32,120 Speaker 3: the tariff they're charging us, and Chi chen Ping agreed 675 00:46:32,200 --> 00:46:35,920 Speaker 3: to that. That's remarkable to me. The other thing is 676 00:46:36,280 --> 00:46:41,520 Speaker 3: Trump really pressed him on Russian oil imports. Obviously they 677 00:46:41,560 --> 00:46:45,520 Speaker 3: can't wean off immediately, and obviously there's only so much 678 00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:48,839 Speaker 3: face they can lose in one shot. But two of 679 00:46:48,880 --> 00:46:53,239 Speaker 3: the largest Chinese oil companies immediately announced that they aren't 680 00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:56,560 Speaker 3: buying Russian oil anymore. Will they keep their word? Don't know. 681 00:46:57,000 --> 00:47:00,600 Speaker 3: But that's actually a really big diplomatic ship, even if 682 00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:03,160 Speaker 3: it doesn't change a lot on the ground, and Putin 683 00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:07,600 Speaker 3: has to plan for that and deal with that whether 684 00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:12,320 Speaker 3: it happens or not. So that materially impacts Putin's ability 685 00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:16,680 Speaker 3: to continue the war in Ukraine. He is completely energy 686 00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:21,000 Speaker 3: dependent for funding that war and frankly funding his government. 687 00:47:21,239 --> 00:47:24,680 Speaker 3: And at some point that starts putting enough hurt on 688 00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:28,560 Speaker 3: the oligarchs that they start demanding some kind of change 689 00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:31,160 Speaker 3: either in his policy or in. 690 00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:36,239 Speaker 1: His position, meaning that his days may be numbered. In 691 00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:41,120 Speaker 1: all of this a fascinating perspective. As usual, you have 692 00:47:41,480 --> 00:47:46,239 Speaker 1: stretched the envelope of the possible here, and our appreciation 693 00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:50,960 Speaker 1: to you is likewise greatly expanded as well. Rod Martin, 694 00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:53,680 Speaker 1: thank you for all that you're doing at Rodmartin dot org. 695 00:47:53,840 --> 00:47:57,120 Speaker 1: Thank you for featuring this program in our conversations with 696 00:47:57,160 --> 00:48:00,479 Speaker 1: you on that platform as well. As You're right Broad 697 00:48:00,560 --> 00:48:04,839 Speaker 1: Martin Reports, subscribe folks to them come back to us soon. 698 00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:06,480 Speaker 1: I hope the rest of you'll do the same next time. 699 00:48:06,560 --> 00:48:08,160 Speaker 1: Until then you'll go forth and multiply. 700 00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:19,160 Speaker 3: H m hmm.