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Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways. I don't interest you've never known stories of

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Speaker 1: things we simply don't know the answer too. Hey, guys,

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Speaker 1: welcome to uh ann episode of Steve makes a Weird

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Speaker 1: Face the podcast. I don't think that's the name of

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Speaker 1: the show. We should rename it though, probably Steve make

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Speaker 1: the weird face. Yeah, constantly, I can't help literally constantly. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we'll have to build up our listenership again, that's gonna

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Speaker 1: take a long time. Just kidding. This is Thinking Sideways

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Devin, joined most weeks by and Steve

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Speaker 1: Steve makes a funny face. This week, we're going to

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Speaker 1: talk about a mystery that is a little bit associated

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Speaker 1: with the mystery we've already talked about. That would be

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Speaker 1: the Mothman. Scarier. This one's better, No, I mean I

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Speaker 1: think the stories are better true. I'll give you that.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for giving that. Yeah, uh. This week you

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Speaker 1: probably know we're going to talk about the Grinning Man, who,

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Speaker 1: it turns out a surprising number of people don't know about.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know about Earning Man ahead of time. I

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Speaker 1: didn't either. Every time I'm like, oh yeah, the Grinning Man,

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Speaker 1: people are like, I don't know what you're talking about.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, that's my story's at end of episode, Okay,

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Speaker 1: all the credits. No, he also had a name, he

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Speaker 1: did um. He may have been called Indurd Cold. He

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Speaker 1: could have also maybe been called Ingrid Cold. I saw

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Speaker 1: it as injured of the places, but I did see

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Speaker 1: Ingrid every once in a while, so I thought i'd

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Speaker 1: throw it in there, just in cases auto correct. I hope,

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Speaker 1: I hope so. But he only told told his name

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Speaker 1: to one person, only in person, and it was in

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Speaker 1: Injured in that one, which makes me think that I

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Speaker 1: would assume so. But you know how these things go.

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Speaker 1: It's all. We got to throw it all in, we

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Speaker 1: do so. The Grinning Man is described as quote well

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Speaker 1: over six ft tall, totally bald, with black, beady eyes

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Speaker 1: that are set a little too far apart. He most

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Speaker 1: often is said to wear a shiny green or metallic

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Speaker 1: suit or overalls, and is staring in your window right now,

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Speaker 1: looking now, now, now, just kidding, probably maybe my hand,

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Speaker 1: don't look. I hope it's not nighttime where you are.

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Speaker 1: People who have met or seen the Grinning Man are

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Speaker 1: often so taken aback that they can't say for certain

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Speaker 1: if he has ears or a nose, because what they notice,

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Speaker 1: as you might guess from his name, is the smile. Huge. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like very uncomfortably large, just like a jack d Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And I don't necessarily get the sense that it's like,

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Speaker 1: you know, an extra large mouth or anything. It's not

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Speaker 1: an actual ear to ear. But did you guys watch

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Speaker 1: Buffy ever? Yeah? Yeah, do you remember the absolute best

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Speaker 1: episode of all Buffy canon, which is called Hush, which

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Speaker 1: I actually did see. That's the one where it's completely silent,

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Speaker 1: all of the voices get taken away by those creepy,

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Speaker 1: terrifying guys who float around and smile constantly. I don't

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Speaker 1: remember that one. It's a really really good it's by

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Speaker 1: far the best episode of Buffy to ever exist. Go

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Speaker 1: out check it out. I was really impressed with the

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Speaker 1: musical episode. Yeah, that was a good one. This one's better. No,

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Speaker 1: I think that that's the way I kind of picture

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Speaker 1: the smiles of being not inhuman, but uncomfortably large and fixed, fixed, constant. Yeah. Okay,

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Speaker 1: the Grinning Man may have his skin maybe kind of grayish,

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Speaker 1: maybe tannish, maybe greenish, certainly not a supernatural healthy color,

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Speaker 1: not supernatural, but very natural. They only ever saw him

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Speaker 1: at night at night, Yeah, so it's harder to tell.

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Speaker 1: I think it's like a pallid tone. Whatever it is

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Speaker 1: would be the way I would describe it. Apparently, sometimes

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Speaker 1: he maybe wore a black belt, right, well, so when

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Speaker 1: he wore overalls or coveralls, he was maybe wearing a

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Speaker 1: black belt. Probably not wearing black belt with the suit

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Speaker 1: that you would notice necessarily true jacket would the way, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it would. He apparently sometimes communicates telepathically with the people

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Speaker 1: he encounters. I think I only heard about that happening once.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if you guys encountered it anywhere else.

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Speaker 1: Which is where we get the name Indrid Cold. And

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Speaker 1: he was seen at Point Pleasant, West Virginia. Yeah, West Virginia,

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Speaker 1: And if you'll remember correctly, that's uh where Mothman was

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Speaker 1: seen made his debut. Was he seeing that point Pleasant

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Speaker 1: or near like not too far, very close to yeh.

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Speaker 1: So he's a Mothman sidekick or just the Mothman. Maybe

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Speaker 1: the Mothman's ball, the boss supervisor. Maybe Mothman is his pet.

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Speaker 1: He was just taking him out for a walk and

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Speaker 1: he got off leash somehow. What what if he's like

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Speaker 1: you know, the mothman collector the catcher like the dog catcher.

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Speaker 1: So he's always he's always there because he's always chasing him. Well, actually,

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Speaker 1: we'll touch on that a little bit in a minute,

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Speaker 1: because one of the theories kind of plays into that.

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Speaker 1: So we're gonna in this episode it's going to be

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Speaker 1: one of those ones where we kind of tell stories.

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Speaker 1: It's less theory based, more story based, and start contrast

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Speaker 1: to like last week, where it was like almost entirely

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Speaker 1: theory Yeah, almost entirely theory based. Sorry about that. It's

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Speaker 1: not your fault, it's mine. It's Steve's fault. He made

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Speaker 1: us watch that horrible movie again again and again again.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a pretty good movie myself. We disagree

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Speaker 1: on that. He didn't think I could make that voice.

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Speaker 1: Did you know that was legitinely terrified? Sorry, but you're ready,

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Speaker 1: we'll get back on track. Yeah, that's that's We've got

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Speaker 1: an important mystery to self here. Okay, now that we've

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Speaker 1: taken a pause to recover, the editing might be a

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Speaker 1: little weird there because we were cracking up. Sorry, guys,

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Speaker 1: let's tell this story. I'm gonna start by telling the

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Speaker 1: story of the first maybe documented sighting of the Grinning Man.

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Speaker 1: And would you say this is the standard version or

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Speaker 1: is this the official version? Standard version? A version, like,

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Speaker 1: how would you cluse? It's a version, It's the thinking

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Speaker 1: sideways version. It's the kind of thing that we all

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Speaker 1: kind of do, where we search out the most authentic

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Speaker 1: documents but also mixing accepted lore. I just because sometimes

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Speaker 1: we do it. This is exactly what we're told. You

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Speaker 1: just want to clarify that. Yeah, this is kind of

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Speaker 1: the general telling of this story perfect. I'm so we're

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Speaker 1: going to tell this story. And then I want to

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Speaker 1: tell you about the story that made me interested in

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Speaker 1: the Grinning Man years and years ago. That was my

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Speaker 1: first point of contact for even hearing about the Grinning Man.

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Speaker 1: It was at least three years ago. And uh, well,

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Speaker 1: we'll talk about that in a second. Two kids in October.

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Speaker 1: Two kids, two boys, James and Marvin. And she's not

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Speaker 1: telling you their last names because they're unpronounceable, but they

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Speaker 1: have like five names. It's it's fine, Uh no, James

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Speaker 1: and Marvin because this is the Sties. And somebody named

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Speaker 1: their child Marvin like a jerk. I'm sorry, that was

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Speaker 1: an okay name back in those days. It was a

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Speaker 1: pretty good name. It's an old dude name now, but

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Speaker 1: because yeah, that's true. Any idea how old these kids were?

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Speaker 1: They were teenagers, they weren't. I thought they were like

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Speaker 1: early teenagers though it's not like sev but barely teenagers,

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Speaker 1: young teen, tweens and teens. They lived in Elizabeth, New Jersey,

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Speaker 1: and they were walking home from if I recall correctly,

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Speaker 1: some kind of mischief. Then the first reading of the

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Speaker 1: stories that I did years and years ago, I distinctly

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Speaker 1: remember being included in in the stories that like, they

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Speaker 1: were out creating mischief and they were walking home from

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Speaker 1: the toilet paper. I wasn't Maybe I wasn't able to

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Speaker 1: find that again though, so it could be my misremembering.

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Speaker 1: They were walking home along Fourth Street, which Joe may

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Speaker 1: or may not have Google street viewed, actually didn't. He

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Speaker 1: didn't go. I was busy. The road runs near the turnpike,

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Speaker 1: and um as they arrived at a fairly treacherous part

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Speaker 1: of the journey along a fence that kind of went

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Speaker 1: past the turnpike. So there was the fence and then

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Speaker 1: there was this huge hill and then the turnpike. Uh As,

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Speaker 1: they were walking over a turn at this place. Is

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Speaker 1: it below the ground level? Yeah, and so there was.

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Speaker 1: It was a very very steep incline, so steep in fact,

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Speaker 1: that almost everybody agrees that it's unclimbable from the turnpike,

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Speaker 1: that it would be impossible for whatever whoever these boys

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Speaker 1: saw to have climbed up from the turnpike. Apparently nobody

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Speaker 1: had really ever been seen on the other side of

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Speaker 1: that fence. Well, it would make sense because it was

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Speaker 1: like impassable, and who would be dumb enough to climb

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Speaker 1: the fence just to like be on a impassable incline

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Speaker 1: basically right, or to climb up that grade? Yeah? Yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 1: So the boys were, you know, the story is always

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Speaker 1: really dramatically told. They're like passing in between pools of light.

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Speaker 1: They were walking along a fence, you guys, and they

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Speaker 1: paused to catch their breath. I don't know if they

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Speaker 1: were like ridiculously out of shape. They weren't. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: would guess one had to pee, and I believe it

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Speaker 1: was James looked at Marvin, who was peeing apparently totally

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Speaker 1: facing him back was to the fence, and said, who's

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Speaker 1: that behind you? And they turned around and there's a

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Speaker 1: man standing on the other side of the fence. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: of course. And now they were already a little on

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Speaker 1: edge because somehow, I don't know how, they had heard

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Speaker 1: rumors of that night one of the women in the

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Speaker 1: neighborhood being chased by a quote, tall green man. I

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Speaker 1: don't know how they heard that, but Okay, I guess

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Speaker 1: the grape vine moved way more quickly than I anticipate

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Speaker 1: in the sixties, I guess apparently. But but at this

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Speaker 1: time they saw this guy was about a quarter to ten.

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Speaker 1: It was about quarter to ten around really fast, So

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Speaker 1: I guess. Yeah. Um, they described this guy that they

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Speaker 1: saw as quote, the strangest guy we've ever seen. He

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Speaker 1: was the biggest man I ever saw. At about three

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Speaker 1: days later, this guyist afologists. Yes, my favorite upologist, John Kiel, Yes,

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Speaker 1: he somehow heard that they had seen this guy and

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Speaker 1: showed up and interviewed them in three days and three

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Speaker 1: days later. Yeah, yeah, And here's what Kiel wrote about

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Speaker 1: the interview. I don't think he actually quotes them or anything,

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Speaker 1: So this is a quote from him talking about his

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Speaker 1: interview with them. Quote. The man was over six ft tall,

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Speaker 1: day agreed, and was dressed in a sparkling green coverall

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Speaker 1: costume that shimmered and seemed to reflect the street lights.

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Speaker 1: There was a wide black belt around his waist. He

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Speaker 1: was very dark complexion, with little round eyes, real beaty

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Speaker 1: set far apart. They could not remember seeing any hair,

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Speaker 1: ears nose on this figure. Yeah, that's they don't remember

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Speaker 1: that because as soon as they saw him, they ran

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Speaker 1: like a little girl. They saw the grin and then

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Speaker 1: they were like, maybe just we're getting out of here. Bye. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: was like twenty days away. Yeah, it was pretty close.

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Speaker 1: Apparently there were reports of UFOs sightings at quote exactly

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Speaker 1: the same time, forty miles away. Okay, so this is

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Speaker 1: we're going to hit like a little interesting spot. So

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Speaker 1: we'll just talk about this real quick. Steve's already super annoyed.

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Speaker 1: He hates it when we talk about UFOs at all.

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Speaker 1: Um small diversions. You guys know about the Men in Black? Yes,

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Speaker 1: the Men in Black. These are different than the movie,

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Speaker 1: different than the movies. Yeah, so no, Will Smith, no,

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Speaker 1: Will Smith Jones, No, sorry, what about the pug? The dog?

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Speaker 1: Definitely not the pug. So the you know, I mean,

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Speaker 1: and they you are aware that, like some descriptions have

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Speaker 1: these quote unquote men not being men, alien humanoid aliens.

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Speaker 1: I s yeah, maybe the bibs, Yeah, they're bibs. They're

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Speaker 1: most often described as unusually pale, most often with no eyebrows,

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Speaker 1: no hair, no facial hair. Once I I did see

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Speaker 1: describe them as at once being pale, complexioned and swarthy.

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Speaker 1: So I'm not totally sure how that that doesn't make

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Speaker 1: any It doesn't make any sense. Maybe they were spotted, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: maybe that's it. Some reports say that the Men in

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Speaker 1: Black speak with weird accents. Some say they communicate in

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Speaker 1: weird giggling noises, like butthead, Yeah, exactly like that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we're in the spot. It's you know that part of

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Speaker 1: the episode again already where Steve makes weird faces. He

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Speaker 1: doesn't like this appearance. Yeah, it's Keel Keel Drives sightings.

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Speaker 1: But the Men in Black were also seen in well

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Speaker 1: so yeah, and anyway, in October of nineteen sixty six,

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Speaker 1: there was a rash of sightings of um UFOs Men

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Speaker 1: in Black and then also um the Grinning Man in Elizabeth,

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Speaker 1: New Jersey, and the surrounding areas. But in New Jersey

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Speaker 1: they are even some alleged pictures of the sightings of

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Speaker 1: men in black, but nobody actually has a copy. Well no,

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Speaker 1: actually I looked at them online and it's it's just

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Speaker 1: hard to tell because it's nineteen sixty six, so it's

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Speaker 1: not like it's the highest definition picture. And then dudes

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Speaker 1: wore black suits a lot in those days and the fedoras,

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Speaker 1: So you know, you catch a picture of a dude

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Speaker 1: lurking in you know, from a slightly far distance, he's

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Speaker 1: kind of standing in a doorway. You take a picture

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Speaker 1: of it. What are you going to get at night? Well, no,

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Speaker 1: it was during the day. During the day men in black?

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Speaker 1: Do you go out in the day? And I wasn't

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Speaker 1: able to find any actual reports of the actual UFO

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Speaker 1: sightings that happened in October of nineteenth sixty six in

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Speaker 1: New Jersey. So do you check the papers. I did

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Speaker 1: not check the papers, but I checked a lot of

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Speaker 1: different websites, but more than one site did refer to

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixty six as the year of UFO sightings. So

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Speaker 1: it's not nothing. You're gonna talk about this now or

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Speaker 1: in the series section. You can talk about it now.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about it now the Black Book. No, here's

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Speaker 1: my problem with this whole thing for this story of

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Speaker 1: the grading. Man, I know we have more story to go,

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Speaker 1: but in this original one, and I'm using air quotes

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Speaker 1: when I say original, Kiel's the only one. He's the

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Speaker 1: only source, and he's he's the one who says that

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Speaker 1: there were all these UFO sightings. And one of the

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Speaker 1: places that he loves to talk about is the n

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Speaker 1: i c a P, which is the National Investigations Committee

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Speaker 1: on Aerial Phenomena. They're the ones who tracked UFOs. That

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Speaker 1: was their big thing at there that nearly is active

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Speaker 1: with their archives are online, and he's there was UFO

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Speaker 1: sightings in the area every day. So I went through

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Speaker 1: the prior month and then the month after in nineteen

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Speaker 1: sixty six, and there's like three a month, and most

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Speaker 1: of the sightings are all over the maps. So like,

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Speaker 1: I really I questioned this just because this one thing

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Speaker 1: that he's making such a big deal of turns out

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Speaker 1: to be absolutely completely wrong by an organization that tracks that.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, So in other words, there were three in

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Speaker 1: that whole time period, and none of them were in

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Speaker 1: New Jersey. No, No, in New Jersey there was three.

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Speaker 1: Like there's tons and tons and tons in the month

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Speaker 1: of night and each month in nineteen sixty six. But

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Speaker 1: they're all over the world, you know, They're everywhere, So

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Speaker 1: it's not as if it was New Jersey the month

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Speaker 1: of October nineteen sixty six, bang bang bang bang bang

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Speaker 1: bang bang. It was a couple of them, but they

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Speaker 1: were in New Jersey in general, not necessarily this one

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Speaker 1: small town. So that that really really I have a

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Speaker 1: problem with him being the only source and then him

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Speaker 1: making claims that are provably I agree. Yeah. I also,

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Speaker 1: I don't think we mentioned if you aren't familiar, if

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Speaker 1: you didn't listen to the Mothman episode, or you just

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Speaker 1: don't know. John Keel, who we're talking about right now,

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Speaker 1: is the author of The Mothman Prophecies. That's his most

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Speaker 1: famous work. He's an author. On top of that, he

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Speaker 1: also was a fictional screenwriter for horror movies for really

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Speaker 1: long time. So that's uh interest that. Yeah, Well, when

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Speaker 1: he wrote I can't remember the name of his book

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Speaker 1: before the Mothman Prophecies, he's a lot of first showed

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Speaker 1: up in a book of strange stories. That's not the name,

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Speaker 1: but that might as well be the name, and the

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Speaker 1: Mothman got I think it was all of chapter fourteen

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Speaker 1: and several chapters before he briefly mentions the Grinning Man

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Speaker 1: and what we read in what you just read and

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Speaker 1: you see all the internet is directly taken from that.

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Speaker 1: There is no other source for the story of Marvin

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Speaker 1: and James. Yeah, there's there's nowhere else. Yeah kind of,

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Speaker 1: that's usually what those things were a little bit, yeah, often, Yeah, Okay,

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Speaker 1: it's great. I love that, and it's going to make

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Speaker 1: the theory section go even faster. Yeah, but this is

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Speaker 1: the story. We're going to read this. When are you

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Speaker 1: going to read it to us? I mean, we're about

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Speaker 1: we're there right now. Actually, yeah sweet. There's this story

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Speaker 1: on reddit, that one that's a creepy one story. It

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Speaker 1: first appeared on our the subreddit Let's Not Meet. Sorry,

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Speaker 1: I wrote it and read it lingo, you really did?

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Speaker 1: Started to read it um, and then again the subreddit

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Speaker 1: No Sleep Let's Not Meet is um. It's meant to

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Speaker 1: be all true stories, true horror stories, true experiences that

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Speaker 1: people have actually experienced, whereas No Sleep can be true

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Speaker 1: or fictional, no matter what, it's just horror stories. The

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Speaker 1: author of this story claims that it's true. He's continued

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Speaker 1: to claim it's true. If that's the case, then I

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00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:11,919
Speaker 1: don't ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever ever want to

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Speaker 1: be outside alone when it's dark, and you'll be fine.

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Speaker 1: Maybe this story is called The Smiling Man, and I'm

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Speaker 1: not going to tell the whole thing. It's really easy

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Speaker 1: to find. You can just google the Smiling Man and

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Speaker 1: it is literally the first thing to come up. But

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Speaker 1: we're gonna do some mixture of direct quotes and then

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00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:34,760
Speaker 1: summarize what happens in between. The story is written by

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Speaker 1: a user named Blue Title. I did get permission to

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Speaker 1: use this story from the author, Just so everybody knows,

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Speaker 1: I also spoke to him. I keep saying him. I'm

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Speaker 1: just assuming him. I didn't actually ask, because it's read

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00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:52,679
Speaker 1: it and that's rude. But we'll talk a little bit

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Speaker 1: about the discussion I had with him after the fact.

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Speaker 1: So Blue Title starts the story out by talking about

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Speaker 1: how he likes to walk at night. I think we

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Speaker 1: all do things like this sometimes, you know, walk or

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Speaker 1: drive or something at night to clear your head, or

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Speaker 1: if you can't sleep, or a drink and drive. Not

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Speaker 1: a thing to admit, not a thing to do, definitely not.

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Speaker 1: I don't even know what that means. So around two

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Speaker 1: am he turns down a side street heading home off

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Speaker 1: of kind of a more main thoroughfare, when he sees

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Speaker 1: the silhouette of a man dancing. That was a strange dance,

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Speaker 1: similar to a waltz, but he finished each box with

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Speaker 1: an odd forward stride. I guess you could say he

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Speaker 1: was dance walking, heading straight for me. Deciding he was

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Speaker 1: probably drunk, I stepped as close as I could to

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Speaker 1: the road to give him the majority of the sidewalk

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Speaker 1: to pass by. I mean, the closer he got, the

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Speaker 1: more I realized how gracefully he was moving. He was

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00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:51,600
Speaker 1: very tall and lanky and wearing an old suit. He

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00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:54,440
Speaker 1: danced closer still until I could make out his face.

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Speaker 1: His eyes were wide open and wild head tilted back slightly,

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Speaker 1: looking off at the sky. His mouth was formed in

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00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:06,200
Speaker 1: a painfully wide cartoon of a smile. At this point,

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00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:11,359
Speaker 1: the author wisely crosses the street. Uh, and terrifyingly, the

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Speaker 1: man quote unquote man the figure follows him, kind of

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Speaker 1: it won't he won't move until blue title looks away

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Speaker 1: from him. So like an angel and doctor who kind

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Speaker 1: of weeping angel like the weeping angels. So he you know,

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Speaker 1: he decides this guy is drunk. He like is creeped

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Speaker 1: out by him, so he looks at him, he turns,

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00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:37,960
Speaker 1: he walks across the street. He turns back and is paused,

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Speaker 1: just frozen, like he's about to cross the street, exactly

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Speaker 1: parallel from blue title. So Blue title desides, but I'm

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Speaker 1: just I'll just keep walking. That's weird, it's creepy, but

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna keep walking. So he turns around and

353
00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:55,800
Speaker 1: walks for a minute or two, and then turns around again.

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Speaker 1: He had crossed the street and was now slightly crouched down.

355
00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:03,480
Speaker 1: I couldn't tell for sure due to the distance in shadows,

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Speaker 1: but I was certain he was facing me. It was

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00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:08,280
Speaker 1: clear that he had moved fast. I was so shocked

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00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:11,280
Speaker 1: that I stood there for some time staring at him.

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00:22:11,359 --> 00:22:14,119
Speaker 1: And then he started moving towards me again. He took giant,

360
00:22:14,280 --> 00:22:17,800
Speaker 1: exaggerated tiptoe steps, as if he were a cartoon character

361
00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:21,479
Speaker 1: sneaking up on somebody, except he was moving very very quickly.

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00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:24,080
Speaker 1: I'd like to sit at this point I ran away

363
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,440
Speaker 1: or pulled out my pepper spray or my cell phone

364
00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:29,400
Speaker 1: or anything at all, but I didn't. I just stood there,

365
00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:32,919
Speaker 1: completely frozen as a smiling man crept towards me, and

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00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:35,280
Speaker 1: then he stopped again, about a car length away from me,

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Speaker 1: still smiling, his smile, still looking to the sky. When

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Speaker 1: I finally found my voice, I blurted out the first

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Speaker 1: thing that came to mind. What I meant to ask

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00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:50,800
Speaker 1: was what the do you want? Yeah? In an angry,

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Speaker 1: commanding tone. What came out was a whimper, what the fun?

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00:22:56,920 --> 00:22:59,399
Speaker 1: Regardless of whether or not humans can smell fear, the

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Speaker 1: concertainly hear it. I heard it in my own voice,

374
00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:04,520
Speaker 1: and that only made me more afraid. But he didn't

375
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Speaker 1: react at all. He just stood there, smiling, and then,

376
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Speaker 1: after what felt like forever, he turned around very slowly

377
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:15,440
Speaker 1: and started dance, walking away just like that. Not wanted

378
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Speaker 1: to turn my back on him again, I just watched

379
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Speaker 1: him go until he was far enough away to almost

380
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:22,960
Speaker 1: be out of sight, and then I realized something. He

381
00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:26,679
Speaker 1: wasn't moving away anymore, nor was he dancing. I watched

382
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 1: in horror as a distant shape of him grew larger

383
00:23:29,119 --> 00:23:32,480
Speaker 1: and larger. He was coming back my way, and this

384
00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:36,840
Speaker 1: time he was running blue. Title decided to run to Yeah,

385
00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:40,119
Speaker 1: I would smartly, so right, Yeah. He ran to a

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Speaker 1: busier street, at which point he turned around and the

387
00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 1: smiling Man was gone. Didn't follow him onto the busy street,

388
00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:51,840
Speaker 1: which also makes sense for a weird creepy dude. Yeah,

389
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:54,960
Speaker 1: he would like to stick to the shadows. Yeah, as

390
00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:58,679
Speaker 1: I said, I did exchange a few messages with the

391
00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:02,840
Speaker 1: poster off their blue title. He said the suit didn't

392
00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:06,360
Speaker 1: match the description of the smiling man. It wasn't metallic,

393
00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:08,679
Speaker 1: it wasn't greenish, he said, it was probably black or

394
00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:12,479
Speaker 1: I'm sorry of the grinning man. Got it, okay, smiling man. Well,

395
00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:16,560
Speaker 1: we've just been doing the story of the Yeah. He

396
00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:20,600
Speaker 1: also said that the the guy had a headful of

397
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,640
Speaker 1: hair and that he was over six ft tall, certainly,

398
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:27,080
Speaker 1: but still within a normal range for a human. That

399
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:29,359
Speaker 1: really he thought this guy was more of a psychopath

400
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:31,320
Speaker 1: than he was, like an alien or something like that.

401
00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:37,760
Speaker 1: Maybe drunken ballerina, drunk ballerina. You know, it's hard. Did

402
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,120
Speaker 1: they say he never went up? He never stopped doing

403
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 1: his nighttime walks after that he did for a while.

404
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:47,320
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, he was like maybe no, so low

405
00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:50,359
Speaker 1: in the comments on the original one. So it was

406
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:53,840
Speaker 1: the let's not meet. Somebody said, oh, hey, you met

407
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:57,320
Speaker 1: the Grinning Man, which was my first point of contact

408
00:24:57,359 --> 00:24:59,439
Speaker 1: for the concept of the Grinning Man. So this is

409
00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:01,760
Speaker 1: where you this is where I first came across it.

410
00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:05,560
Speaker 1: And you know, people seem to not really know about

411
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:08,400
Speaker 1: the Grinning Man. You know, it wasn't highly voted up.

412
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:12,040
Speaker 1: And then there's a subreddit called the Smiling Man dedicated

413
00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 1: to maybe not just this story, um, dedicated to the

414
00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:21,520
Speaker 1: idea of the Smiling Man character character himself. And it

415
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:25,240
Speaker 1: does bring up some points about the difference between the

416
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:28,119
Speaker 1: Smiling Man and the Grinning Man, most of which I

417
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:32,920
Speaker 1: would say, are you know it's like, well, the Smiling

418
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,479
Speaker 1: Man likes to toy with his victims, whereas the Grinning

419
00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:39,960
Speaker 1: Man likes to play with his victim. I mean, you know,

420
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:43,399
Speaker 1: it's it's that I don't know what the vote is,

421
00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:47,119
Speaker 1: but it's that close a difference, got it. Yeah, I

422
00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:49,000
Speaker 1: don't know. The Grinning Man really doesn't seem to do

423
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 1: anything other than the communicating telepathically with that one guy.

424
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:56,120
Speaker 1: That's yeah, that's been my sense to So I don't

425
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:58,840
Speaker 1: know why any you know, how anybody was like, he

426
00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:00,760
Speaker 1: tries to do this, he tries do that. I don't know.

427
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:02,480
Speaker 1: Of course, on the other hand, you don't. You don't

428
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:04,640
Speaker 1: really know what he does with everybody, because it might

429
00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:07,480
Speaker 1: be that the people wind up getting killed by him yea,

430
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:11,600
Speaker 1: and they can't report it. Yeah, so who knows For

431
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,160
Speaker 1: some random reason, some people get let off the hook. Yeah,

432
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:16,680
Speaker 1: you might want to stop at this point look out

433
00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:24,840
Speaker 1: your window. Just kidding. There have been other reports of

434
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:30,920
Speaker 1: seeing the Smiling Man. I would dismiss of them. Oh

435
00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:34,320
Speaker 1: and also for for our local listeners or like Pacific

436
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,480
Speaker 1: Northwest listeners, that original story of the Smiling Man took

437
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:42,280
Speaker 1: place in Seattle, So sleep tie, what the way did

438
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,400
Speaker 1: did blue title? Did he get a good enough look

439
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 1: at this guy? Or if he ran into him and

440
00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:50,360
Speaker 1: get on the street in the daylight, what do you recognize?

441
00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:53,160
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, absolutely, But he hasn't seen him anything,

442
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:55,840
Speaker 1: hasn't seen him, sense No, hasn't seen him. But Seattle

443
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:59,240
Speaker 1: is not a small place. Okay, But back to canon,

444
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:03,359
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, or the Grinning Man. Since I don't know,

445
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:06,159
Speaker 1: I think there's a reasonable chance that if both parties exist,

446
00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 1: they may be one and the same the Grinning Man.

447
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,480
Speaker 1: The Smiling Man and the Grinning Man both exists, that

448
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:14,639
Speaker 1: they could be the same thing. Well, but there's there's

449
00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:20,359
Speaker 1: differences between the two reported differences. That's true, which makes

450
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:22,959
Speaker 1: me think they couldn't be the same entity, that they

451
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:25,720
Speaker 1: could be the same, the same thing, the same kind

452
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 1: of thing. Yeah, you know, Joe's not We're both weird

453
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:36,400
Speaker 1: looking dudes. I would mistake one for the other. Sorry, Joe. Sure,

454
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:43,000
Speaker 1: One more question about Blue Titles story. Uh did he

455
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,639
Speaker 1: say I it doesn't really come across in the story

456
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:49,439
Speaker 1: for sure, But did he say that he felt like

457
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:53,920
Speaker 1: the Smiling man's movements were I mean, obviously they were unnatural,

458
00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:56,320
Speaker 1: they were strange. But did you say that he felt

459
00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:58,480
Speaker 1: like they didn't see the story, they thought that they

460
00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:02,159
Speaker 1: were like physically impossible for human being, right, No, The

461
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:05,400
Speaker 1: sense that I have from everything, you know, from exchanging

462
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:07,760
Speaker 1: messages from him and reading the comments and things like that,

463
00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 1: the sense that I have is that Blue Title does

464
00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:15,679
Speaker 1: believe that the Smiling Man is human or very close

465
00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 1: to human physiologically the same. Yeah, it wasn't. It was

466
00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:21,879
Speaker 1: heard stuff, but it was more I mean, like, you

467
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:24,000
Speaker 1: know the kind of stuff that like Jim Kurt carry

468
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:28,040
Speaker 1: might do. You know, physicality wise, it's not impossible for

469
00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:30,960
Speaker 1: human although times like the cartoons from the thirties and

470
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 1: forties where the guy's got his arms out and they're

471
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,960
Speaker 1: just doing the seesaw motion back and forth, waves crossed. No,

472
00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:39,360
Speaker 1: not that kind of liquid bone motion. No, that wasn't

473
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:40,840
Speaker 1: the sense that I okay, so you could have been

474
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:44,600
Speaker 1: a human being. Okay, So to this other sighting in

475
00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 1: November of nineteen sixty six. This is where we get

476
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 1: in indurd cold from the name sorry, the name, oh,

477
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:56,960
Speaker 1: the sewing machine salesman by the name of a woodrow

478
00:28:57,240 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 1: Darren Burger, Darren Berger. Yes, that's how he pronounced it. Yeah,

479
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 1: sure it was. So he was driving home after a

480
00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:10,600
Speaker 1: long year of work, which some of us know about. Yeah,

481
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:18,480
Speaker 1: apparently he saw this really weird vehicle quote unquote drop

482
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 1: out of this guy and land on the road in

483
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 1: front of him with a really loud noise that will happen. Yeah.

484
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 1: He described it as an old fashioned kerosene lamp chimney

485
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:34,520
Speaker 1: flaring at both ends, but I assume a lot bigger. Yeah, sorry, yeah,

486
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:38,240
Speaker 1: looking like that, And for anybody who doesn't know, I

487
00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:39,840
Speaker 1: knew what it was, but I still looked it up

488
00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:41,400
Speaker 1: to make sure. If you don't know what a kerosene

489
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:46,240
Speaker 1: lamp chimney is it's a cylinder with a bulge in

490
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 1: the center. That's really the simplest description of what it is. Yes, yeah, yeah,

491
00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:54,640
Speaker 1: but I was like, what what part of it? And

492
00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 1: so I had to look it up. So I realized

493
00:29:56,400 --> 00:29:59,160
Speaker 1: not everybody is familiar with us. Yeah, apparently it had

494
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,239
Speaker 1: was it flared at both ends a little bit, so

495
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:05,920
Speaker 1: I think it was like wider and then slim, and

496
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:07,920
Speaker 1: then there was a bulge and then it was slim

497
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 1: and then flared again. Yeah, that's how he described it.

498
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 1: So when good old Woodrow slammed on the brakes of

499
00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 1: his truck, this like hatch, I guess, split open in

500
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,480
Speaker 1: the side of the weird vehicle that had just crashed

501
00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:25,520
Speaker 1: in front of him. I didn't have a good sense.

502
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:27,600
Speaker 1: I don't know if you guys did. If it was

503
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 1: like crashed, oops, this thing is ruined or crashed. It

504
00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:35,440
Speaker 1: sounds like I just sat down, just set down hard,

505
00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:38,440
Speaker 1: really hard. Yeah, but it didn't destroy it or damage it.

506
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:42,000
Speaker 1: I I don't know. I don't know if it's I

507
00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:44,320
Speaker 1: don't have a sense. I don't. You don't either, neither

508
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 1: of you do. Steve's mad already. He has something. I'm

509
00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 1: sure it sounds like the guy. The guy popped out

510
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:52,360
Speaker 1: and then got back in and flew off again. Right,

511
00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 1: So I couldn't. I could not have damaged it that much. Right. Anyways,

512
00:30:55,600 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 1: the tall, dark skinned man climbed out. Woodrow said that

513
00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:06,200
Speaker 1: he had slightly elongated eyes, but the most notable attribute

514
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 1: was a wide, creepy grin. Yeah, and he could see

515
00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:15,960
Speaker 1: glinting in the lights of his truck. Okay, the smile,

516
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:19,880
Speaker 1: not the man. Woodrow said that he was wearing reflective clothing,

517
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 1: reflective kind of it was. This is one of the

518
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:27,560
Speaker 1: big disparities between the two stories. The suit that the

519
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:31,280
Speaker 1: man was wearing wasn't green. It was just kind of

520
00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:35,120
Speaker 1: more metallic. So it's just shiny metallic, not green. No,

521
00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:37,440
Speaker 1: that was you know. I mean the grinning man maybe

522
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:39,680
Speaker 1: wants to change his outfits once in a while, right,

523
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:42,760
Speaker 1: Like what, he's not allowed to change his clothes. Come on, guys,

524
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 1: just the belt as an accessory is not enough. You

525
00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:48,520
Speaker 1: got to have a full outfit, Jake, I think I

526
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:50,440
Speaker 1: think that's fair. You gotta send your clothes with the

527
00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:55,400
Speaker 1: laundry at some point. Yeah. Anyway, So, Woodrow said that

528
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 1: the grinning Man telepathically communicated with him and asked him

529
00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:03,000
Speaker 1: a seriar is of odd questions. Did he remember any

530
00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:05,880
Speaker 1: of these questions? I don't think so. But he did

531
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: say that his name was Cold and that he would

532
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:12,920
Speaker 1: come back and visit Woodrow sometime. So, just to point out,

533
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 1: this conversation was not had entirely verbally, and I think

534
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:27,000
Speaker 1: at all, Uh, thank you, Woodrow was speaking. The grinning

535
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:30,400
Speaker 1: man was speaking telepathically because they would ruin his grant

536
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:33,720
Speaker 1: if he would. Yeah, you can't grin, and well you can,

537
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:36,480
Speaker 1: but it's not easily. It's it's really strange when I

538
00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:39,680
Speaker 1: do it right now, So he doesn't work. This episode

539
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:43,160
Speaker 1: of Steve makes weird faces grinning and talking at the

540
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 1: same time. Um, so, I don't know. Apparently Cold then

541
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 1: got back to his vehicle again. I don't know, like

542
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,840
Speaker 1: necessarily where the like indurid Cold came from. I assume

543
00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:57,200
Speaker 1: it's from a different telling the first name. It's not

544
00:32:57,280 --> 00:33:00,400
Speaker 1: the first the last time that he saw him, Yeah,

545
00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:04,480
Speaker 1: that's how it came about. Came back again many times, Yeah,

546
00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:08,920
Speaker 1: many times. So the Cold gets back in his little

547
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:12,600
Speaker 1: craft thing and zooms away, and then I guess visits

548
00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:14,760
Speaker 1: Woodrow a bunch of other times and they talk about

549
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:22,240
Speaker 1: posies and sunflowers and how hot to bake bread? Right now?

550
00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:25,880
Speaker 1: Is that not what they talked about? And Andred never

551
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: tried to be violent or have sex with Woodrow or

552
00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:32,480
Speaker 1: anything like that. No probing, no probing. But other other

553
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,680
Speaker 1: people who lived in Point Pleasant, which is where this

554
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:41,640
Speaker 1: interaction happened, yeah, claimed to have seen Indred cold and

555
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:46,720
Speaker 1: spoken with him too. Steve has that little black book again,

556
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:49,680
Speaker 1: I do, because well, actually, and there's not much on

557
00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:53,680
Speaker 1: this particular bit in the book. But here's the deal.

558
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:58,040
Speaker 1: Woodrow went to the news the next day and they

559
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 1: interviewed him for like a half an hour, and then

560
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,080
Speaker 1: he went and talked to a bunch of other people,

561
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:09,239
Speaker 1: and all of that audio is available to listen to it.

562
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:15,000
Speaker 1: I did. I didn't even research Woodrow, Darren Burger, because

563
00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:18,319
Speaker 1: I know, just assumed that you never existed. Yeah, No,

564
00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 1: he's a says this whole The ship crashed to the

565
00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 1: ground in front of him. He described it as a

566
00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:30,160
Speaker 1: vehicle approached him from behind, past him on the left.

567
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:33,359
Speaker 1: He looked over at it, saw it, and then it

568
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:38,000
Speaker 1: went in front of him and slowed down and got

569
00:34:38,040 --> 00:34:42,120
Speaker 1: blocked him. Once Indrid got out of the vehicle, the

570
00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:45,719
Speaker 1: vehicle went in the sky and hovered, waited for him

571
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:49,200
Speaker 1: to return, then landed, picked him up and took off again.

572
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 1: He was in a dark suit like as in a

573
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,120
Speaker 1: suit and trousers. Is the impression I got from the

574
00:34:56,160 --> 00:35:01,319
Speaker 1: way he described the suit. Uh, had hair, had you know,

575
00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:05,960
Speaker 1: a nose, normal features. And the only mentioned in the

576
00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:10,680
Speaker 1: entire thing about the grin is he had a smile

577
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:15,359
Speaker 1: on his face, a pleasant friendly look. That was it.

578
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:18,719
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe Injurd Cole is the smiling man not the

579
00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,520
Speaker 1: grinning man. You know, we're accidentally doing an episode on

580
00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:25,560
Speaker 1: the smiling Well, I think you're trying to so. But

581
00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 1: he did. But but Indurd's cold actually did speak to

582
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:32,399
Speaker 1: him telepathically, Yes, he said, he spoke to him telepathically.

583
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:35,319
Speaker 1: And was his description of the ship or craft the same,

584
00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:41,240
Speaker 1: very similar. I mean the chimney, the kerosene lantern chimney

585
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:45,320
Speaker 1: part parts still holds true. Uh, that still all happens.

586
00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:49,160
Speaker 1: The crashing to the ground part doesn't happen. He asked

587
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:52,000
Speaker 1: him about what the town is and stuff like that,

588
00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:54,640
Speaker 1: and then he says, yeah, we're gonna speak again. And

589
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:57,840
Speaker 1: Woodrow goes on, with the help of another author to

590
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:02,279
Speaker 1: write about his other encow outers with Indrid, where he

591
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:06,840
Speaker 1: meets two of Cold's companions whose names I don't recall,

592
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:12,960
Speaker 1: and things don't go good for him because nobody believes him.

593
00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:15,640
Speaker 1: He writes these crazy books, his wife leaves him, he

594
00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:18,080
Speaker 1: turns into a wreck louse because he's sure that people

595
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 1: are after him. Like I have a feeling he was

596
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:24,880
Speaker 1: a little unhinged from the beginning. But if nothing else,

597
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:27,600
Speaker 1: I really believe that this whole thing was in his

598
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:31,359
Speaker 1: head simply because he'd been working hours and hours and hours,

599
00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:33,640
Speaker 1: and now he's got this long drive home. And have

600
00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:37,040
Speaker 1: you ever been driving and you're just spacing out and

601
00:36:37,080 --> 00:36:39,680
Speaker 1: you're having this whole thing go through your head, and

602
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:41,920
Speaker 1: then you realize fifteen minutes has gone by and you

603
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:47,080
Speaker 1: don't remember driving. He could have freaked himself out to

604
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:48,719
Speaker 1: the point and said that's got to be really told

605
00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:51,400
Speaker 1: everybody about It could very well have been in yeah,

606
00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:54,000
Speaker 1: or he was nuts, or he made it up. But

607
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:57,400
Speaker 1: that did he say how many? How many more times

608
00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:01,680
Speaker 1: he talked to Indured. I know that he has quote

609
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:04,920
Speaker 1: unquote documented how many times he spoke to him. I

610
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,799
Speaker 1: don't know that number myself. I didn't I didn't go

611
00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:11,160
Speaker 1: any deeper after that, I I gleaned, I got the

612
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:14,520
Speaker 1: information I needed at that point, and I just left

613
00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:16,879
Speaker 1: it be. He didn't say anything about what they talked

614
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:20,240
Speaker 1: about on these various occasions or not again, Joe, I

615
00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:23,640
Speaker 1: I went through the initial encounter, and I read stuff

616
00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:26,840
Speaker 1: about the later encounters, but I didn't read any of

617
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:32,880
Speaker 1: the later encounter text. Alright, Wood, Yeah, maybe the best

618
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:37,480
Speaker 1: witness Also, maybe thirteen year old boys not the best

619
00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:42,960
Speaker 1: witnesses fourteen or John Keel or John Keel. How about

620
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 1: this one. Let's try this one on for size. Another

621
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:49,920
Speaker 1: one a twenty six year old night watchman named Pierre

622
00:37:49,960 --> 00:37:57,320
Speaker 1: zan Fretta. He was on patrol in the village of Triglia,

623
00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:02,600
Speaker 1: Italy um in December of nineteen seventy eight, and he

624
00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:05,239
Speaker 1: claims he was abducted by a trio. I'm sorry I

625
00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:09,080
Speaker 1: shouldn't say this laughing, but he was abducted by a

626
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:17,240
Speaker 1: trio of gigantic, yellow eyed semi reptilian aliens, but also

627
00:38:17,400 --> 00:38:20,080
Speaker 1: apparently the Grinning Man was there with them. He says

628
00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:23,680
Speaker 1: he was abducted like times or something like that. There

629
00:38:23,719 --> 00:38:27,719
Speaker 1: were semi reptilian yellow line Yeah, but that like overseeing

630
00:38:27,760 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 1: the whole operation was this grinning man. What is semi reptilian?

631
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:37,600
Speaker 1: I'd see like a mixed between reptilian and humans. Think

632
00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:40,440
Speaker 1: about that old Star Trek episode, the original from the

633
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:43,160
Speaker 1: original show, and it was Grock or whatever his name was,

634
00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:46,759
Speaker 1: I don't remember if it was the one Kirk fought. Yeah,

635
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:49,960
Speaker 1: that that the alien center of the planet. Exactly who

636
00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:54,839
Speaker 1: you're talking rex head and he's not semi reptil guy

637
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:58,600
Speaker 1: was full on its dr who wit again? Then okay,

638
00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:03,239
Speaker 1: you know the let's see the woman who um has

639
00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:06,480
Speaker 1: the girlfriend and they Yeah, and they're in London. Yes,

640
00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:10,880
Speaker 1: I know exactly what race their semi reptilian. They're reptilian. No,

641
00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 1: they are humannid. They're like humans, right, their bodies are humans,

642
00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:19,919
Speaker 1: but they stand upright on two legs and the two

643
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:24,600
Speaker 1: arms and they speak. That doesn't make them humanoid. They're

644
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:28,000
Speaker 1: still a reptile. They're reptilian. Actually, this is the whole

645
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:31,719
Speaker 1: reptilian without even being a reptile. Okay, well, yeah, let's

646
00:39:31,719 --> 00:39:35,000
Speaker 1: just leave this alone because this is an argument that

647
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:37,880
Speaker 1: will take a long time and go gowhere. Agreed, and

648
00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 1: we'll do a whole episode on it. Please know, anyway,

649
00:39:40,719 --> 00:39:43,000
Speaker 1: I don't think this guy is a very credible. Witnesses

650
00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:45,560
Speaker 1: want to talk anyone. Now, you don't think the overseers

651
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 1: the grinning men? Notice I said men, man, They say,

652
00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:52,200
Speaker 1: so they abducted in. What did they do with probe?

653
00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:57,319
Speaker 1: Lots of experiments and probing like a lot of probing questions.

654
00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:00,120
Speaker 1: So what were you doing last Thursday at seven p

655
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:03,880
Speaker 1: m at the what's the average air speed of European swallow?

656
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:09,120
Speaker 1: How many drugs have you taken tonight? Sir? And we're

657
00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:12,800
Speaker 1: any of the mushroom shape? Really it's in little white

658
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:15,640
Speaker 1: and green mushrooms. Well, does anybody have any theories? I

659
00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:19,919
Speaker 1: actually do, were there? There's not a lot of them,

660
00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:24,600
Speaker 1: and there's not a lot left at left. Sorry. Yeah,

661
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: So the theories are as per Debon usual in bullet

662
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:32,880
Speaker 1: point form. One is that he could be an alien

663
00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:38,239
Speaker 1: or an alien species. Right. I guess the proof of

664
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:41,680
Speaker 1: this or the theory would go that they're the Grinning Man.

665
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:45,800
Speaker 1: Sightings are by and large in conjunction with UFO sightings,

666
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:49,760
Speaker 1: except not all the time, and not really not really.

667
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:55,120
Speaker 1: There's a huge difference. They're distance, not difference, but the distances,

668
00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:58,920
Speaker 1: but also difference, not always. I wonder if you. I

669
00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:02,640
Speaker 1: wonder if perhaps the grinning Man is actually a number

670
00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:06,240
Speaker 1: of different human beings from far far in in our future.

671
00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:08,759
Speaker 1: We were traveling back in time and don't know how

672
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 1: to be like normal human beings by our standard. Exactly,

673
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:16,719
Speaker 1: have you watched Fringe? No, have you watched Fringe? Okay,

674
00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:23,120
Speaker 1: they have the observers who was already over like years ago.

675
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:25,080
Speaker 1: I'm planning out watching them. Okay, Well, I'm not going

676
00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:28,920
Speaker 1: to spoil anything. There's these guys who always walk around

677
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:31,640
Speaker 1: in a black suit with a white shirt and a

678
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 1: black tie and wear a fedora, and they're they're white,

679
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,760
Speaker 1: and they have absolutely no hair on their entire bodies

680
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 1: and they know what's coming. Yeah, they're meant to be

681
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:44,359
Speaker 1: men in black, so that is you know, it could

682
00:41:44,360 --> 00:41:48,240
Speaker 1: be like that. But they're from the future, so could

683
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 1: be that. But Joe's suggesting is right, they're just ding

684
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:54,160
Speaker 1: dongs from the future. Just I think it's fair. Right,

685
00:41:54,160 --> 00:41:56,840
Speaker 1: if we were to travel back, what even a thousand

686
00:41:56,880 --> 00:42:00,000
Speaker 1: years in human history, right, our social conventions would seem

687
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:03,360
Speaker 1: super weird to anybody, and we would seem super tall

688
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:05,440
Speaker 1: to everybody. It would seem well I wouldn't, but you

689
00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:09,440
Speaker 1: guys would actually would a thousand years ago. A thousand

690
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:15,080
Speaker 1: years ago years ago, i'd be totally almal Yeah, but no,

691
00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:17,080
Speaker 1: I mean I guess that's true. I didn't have that,

692
00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:20,520
Speaker 1: but I guess we'll add it right now. Time Traveler, Well,

693
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:22,319
Speaker 1: it kind of falls into the next theory. It's that

694
00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:25,960
Speaker 1: he's a men in black, right, He's a man in black.

695
00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:30,440
Speaker 1: He's part of the Men in Black black. Well, because

696
00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:33,759
Speaker 1: the theory could I mean, some proponents of the men

697
00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:37,480
Speaker 1: in Black theory think it's just like normal human men

698
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:42,040
Speaker 1: for aliens or and well know, I mean the part

699
00:42:42,080 --> 00:42:44,759
Speaker 1: of it is that kind of the what the movie

700
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:49,040
Speaker 1: is about. That they're right, But then the other part

701
00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 1: of that is that maybe actually the men in Black

702
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:54,919
Speaker 1: are aliens or people from the future or whatever. So yeah,

703
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:56,920
Speaker 1: that that's my thing is that, you know, there's the

704
00:42:56,960 --> 00:43:02,040
Speaker 1: whole the movie genre is there hiding the aliens. But

705
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:06,200
Speaker 1: if they're aliens, what are they hiding? You know what

706
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:09,359
Speaker 1: I mean? Is that necessarily? Yeah, it's like, well, maybe

707
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 1: it's just that that their fashion sense is antiquated and

708
00:43:12,239 --> 00:43:14,320
Speaker 1: we don't know what they're up to. I'm just I'm curious.

709
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:17,680
Speaker 1: I never understood it. Well, like, what's the deal with

710
00:43:17,719 --> 00:43:19,960
Speaker 1: the Men in Black. If what was in the movie

711
00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:23,000
Speaker 1: wasn't right, and I know what the movie wasn't real fiction,

712
00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:25,840
Speaker 1: it wasn't Well, if they were aliens, it would be

713
00:43:25,840 --> 00:43:28,680
Speaker 1: that they were working in collusion with the government to

714
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:33,359
Speaker 1: hide the more drastic aliens from the world or maybe

715
00:43:33,440 --> 00:43:35,759
Speaker 1: hunt down and hutown and capture or kill these more

716
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:38,520
Speaker 1: drastic aliens. Yeah, because they could pass as human. Kind

717
00:43:38,520 --> 00:43:41,279
Speaker 1: of imagine that would be kind of an interesting thing

718
00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:43,000
Speaker 1: if it never came out that that's true, that you know,

719
00:43:43,040 --> 00:43:45,200
Speaker 1: there's a bunch of aliens. They're here on Earth just

720
00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 1: tracking down the criminals who have escaped to Earth. That's

721
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:51,880
Speaker 1: a very long episode in and of itself. Well, well,

722
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:54,279
Speaker 1: you know the easy answer those either of you ever

723
00:43:54,360 --> 00:43:59,839
Speaker 1: watched that movie Critters. No, it's an old eighties horror movie.

724
00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:03,239
Speaker 1: It's their little hairy round guys. They were like, you know,

725
00:44:03,320 --> 00:44:06,480
Speaker 1: medicine ball sized and hairy, but they had nothing but

726
00:44:06,560 --> 00:44:09,080
Speaker 1: teeth and they ate constantly. Well, the bounty hunters who

727
00:44:09,200 --> 00:44:12,680
Speaker 1: chased them were shape changers, and so they would find

728
00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:15,719
Speaker 1: a local and you know, quote unquote scan and then

729
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,719
Speaker 1: change themselves to look like that interesting, So it could

730
00:44:18,760 --> 00:44:22,200
Speaker 1: be that kind of situation is the one scan they

731
00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:25,760
Speaker 1: have in their system that's considered passable on this planet

732
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:31,719
Speaker 1: happens to have a stupidly huge grin and a black suit. Yeah, exactly.

733
00:44:31,880 --> 00:44:35,320
Speaker 1: Or they're trying to, you know, pass this friendly and normal,

734
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:38,080
Speaker 1: and they're like, oh, people smile when they're friendly normal,

735
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:40,959
Speaker 1: So it's just we're just gonna smile. People are so dumb,

736
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:43,239
Speaker 1: we totally blended. Don't say anything. They just look at

737
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:50,680
Speaker 1: you and keep going quickly. That's absolutely, absolutely true, absolutely true. Yeah. Yeah.

738
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:55,000
Speaker 1: Next theory is that he's the moth Man, could be

739
00:44:55,360 --> 00:44:59,040
Speaker 1: just wearing a different kick I go with that, or

740
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:05,160
Speaker 1: Wrangler yeah right, wrangler. Yeah, they're like released the moth

741
00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:11,399
Speaker 1: Man and he's like, man, I just definitely to right.

742
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:14,799
Speaker 1: I just got that kid down to sleep. Now you

743
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:18,960
Speaker 1: want me to wake him up again? Yeah? No, you

744
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 1: don't think, um, I don't, I know, I I lump,

745
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:28,520
Speaker 1: I lump. If that's where we're going in with Mothman,

746
00:45:28,920 --> 00:45:32,120
Speaker 1: might as well just be mass hysteria. Yeah, because that's

747
00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:36,839
Speaker 1: the last theory. Mothman had had wings and stuff, didn't he. Yeah, well,

748
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:40,399
Speaker 1: the last theory is that he's just made up. That's

749
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:43,240
Speaker 1: a possibility. I want to throw in another theory, which

750
00:45:43,280 --> 00:45:48,680
Speaker 1: is that people sometimes put on costumes. Yeah, they get

751
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:50,440
Speaker 1: they get a mask, you know, and they get out

752
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:54,640
Speaker 1: outrageous cal could be you know. I added to the

753
00:45:54,680 --> 00:45:59,160
Speaker 1: list of like made up subheading like sleep deprivation mass

754
00:45:59,239 --> 00:46:01,879
Speaker 1: hysteria sort of thing, because they think it's true. Every

755
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:05,480
Speaker 1: single sighting that you've heard has either been like kids

756
00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:08,080
Speaker 1: who are already freaked out about something scary and they

757
00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:10,319
Speaker 1: saw a tall guy who was smiling at them and

758
00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:13,839
Speaker 1: they were like, no, talking about that. One family who

759
00:46:14,080 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 1: supposedly also encountered the grinning man is everyone was talking

760
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:22,520
Speaker 1: about Jimmy and or James and Marvin because there's because

761
00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:24,520
Speaker 1: there's the other story about the family who has all

762
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:27,359
Speaker 1: the weird extraterrestrial stuff in their house. Yeah that was

763
00:46:28,600 --> 00:46:30,600
Speaker 1: I don't know it was. But the only thing that

764
00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:33,319
Speaker 1: was like grinning Man kind of specific to that story

765
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:35,279
Speaker 1: was the daughter woke up one night and it was

766
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:38,279
Speaker 1: a huge man towering over her bed. And she's like

767
00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:41,520
Speaker 1: four or five, so all adults are towering, and some

768
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: weirdos that are. She didn't necessarily say that he was

769
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:46,520
Speaker 1: wearing a green or it doesn't sued or had a

770
00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:50,239
Speaker 1: un naturally wark. Yeah, yeah, I know that one I

771
00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:52,359
Speaker 1: didn't even include because I found it to be so weak.

772
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:54,719
Speaker 1: Well yeah, but if you look at the website to

773
00:46:54,760 --> 00:46:57,240
Speaker 1: talk about the Grinning Man, that one is almost always included.

774
00:46:57,640 --> 00:46:59,680
Speaker 1: Well that's because there's not very much good stuff. But

775
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:03,200
Speaker 1: were trying to make a four page article. You have

776
00:47:03,360 --> 00:47:08,760
Speaker 1: enough ads on your website, you will pull it'll pull it. Yeah,

777
00:47:07,800 --> 00:47:15,160
Speaker 1: the Woodrow sleep deprived. The night Watchman probably sleep deprived,

778
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:20,040
Speaker 1: and and honestly not to like cast dispersions, but Blue

779
00:47:20,040 --> 00:47:24,120
Speaker 1: title sleep deprived. You know, in his by his own admission,

780
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:28,439
Speaker 1: he walked because he couldn't sleep well. Insomnia. Yeah, well,

781
00:47:28,600 --> 00:47:32,520
Speaker 1: little freak out. Somebody probably drunk in your brain interpreting

782
00:47:32,600 --> 00:47:35,719
Speaker 1: it as like being malicious. On the other hand, it

783
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:39,200
Speaker 1: could just be a jerk. It could have been somebody

784
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:40,799
Speaker 1: had a little fun with him with I mean, in

785
00:47:40,840 --> 00:47:42,480
Speaker 1: all of these cases too, right, it could have just

786
00:47:42,520 --> 00:47:47,319
Speaker 1: been somebody having fun. My personal theory is that this

787
00:47:47,400 --> 00:47:51,400
Speaker 1: whole thing is John Keel's fault, and he started a trend,

788
00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:54,600
Speaker 1: which these things always happen, is one guy publishes something

789
00:47:54,640 --> 00:47:57,319
Speaker 1: and suddenly everybody sees it. It's you know, when you

790
00:47:57,360 --> 00:47:59,960
Speaker 1: buy that one car and suddenly you see that car

791
00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:03,080
Speaker 1: everywhere on the road. That problem. But yeah, no, I

792
00:48:03,120 --> 00:48:06,759
Speaker 1: don't like the One of the interesting things about the

793
00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:11,040
Speaker 1: UFO phenomenon is that nobody ever saw UFOs until the

794
00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:17,240
Speaker 1: plane was invented. That's true. Yeah, there's reports of UFOs

795
00:48:17,280 --> 00:48:20,400
Speaker 1: in like ancient Egypt and the Greeks and stuff like

796
00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:23,399
Speaker 1: ancient Aliens. Man, do you not watch that show? Yeah,

797
00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:25,239
Speaker 1: but it never I mean, it was never as as

798
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:28,120
Speaker 1: big a thing as it is nowadays. Though. Well, we

799
00:48:28,120 --> 00:48:31,319
Speaker 1: weren't that interesting, or we weren't looking at up. We

800
00:48:31,320 --> 00:48:33,440
Speaker 1: were busy doing others. We were looking at the ground.

801
00:48:33,680 --> 00:48:35,759
Speaker 1: We're like, oh man, this pyramid is not going to build.

802
00:48:35,800 --> 00:48:40,960
Speaker 1: Its cracked that with a little harder. Yeah, no, I

803
00:48:41,520 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 1: think I think it's made up. I'm sorry, guys, No, really,

804
00:48:46,200 --> 00:48:50,200
Speaker 1: I wholeheartedly agree. I think some people saw what they

805
00:48:50,280 --> 00:48:54,520
Speaker 1: believe to be the same character. I'm not saying that

806
00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:58,320
Speaker 1: what they saw and what they believed they saw is wrong,

807
00:48:58,760 --> 00:49:01,839
Speaker 1: but I'm saying the ord into the story completely made up,

808
00:49:01,920 --> 00:49:08,080
Speaker 1: and therefore they're operating off of skewed information. Yeah. Absolutely, yea,

809
00:49:08,200 --> 00:49:10,200
Speaker 1: some of these people probably don't even exist. I mean,

810
00:49:10,239 --> 00:49:13,800
Speaker 1: Woodrow did I don't know about the Frankie not Frankie,

811
00:49:13,880 --> 00:49:18,960
Speaker 1: James and Marvin. Yeah, they're they're they're gone. They don't

812
00:49:19,080 --> 00:49:22,239
Speaker 1: exist anymore. They're not. That's the one thing. Kiel never

813
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:25,680
Speaker 1: cites his sources. He's awful at it. So they're gone

814
00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:30,399
Speaker 1: for all intents and purposes. Gone. Yeah. Yeah, Well they're

815
00:49:30,400 --> 00:49:33,600
Speaker 1: probably still alive if they actually ever existed. That's my problem.

816
00:49:33,680 --> 00:49:37,160
Speaker 1: I don't think they actually ever existed. Probably not. Well,

817
00:49:37,239 --> 00:49:38,839
Speaker 1: we should wrap this up before it gets too dark,

818
00:49:38,840 --> 00:49:40,279
Speaker 1: because I don't really want to have to go home

819
00:49:40,280 --> 00:49:42,680
Speaker 1: in the dark. Well, I mean, you can wrap this

820
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:44,359
Speaker 1: up as fast as you want, Devon, but you gotta

821
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:50,320
Speaker 1: put all this equipment away, so you're kind of hosed here. Okay,

822
00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:54,000
Speaker 1: so you probably know where you're listening to us, But

823
00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:55,920
Speaker 1: if you want to read any of the links to

824
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:59,920
Speaker 1: the researcher, you can also leave a comment on our website.

825
00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 1: The website is Thinking Sideways podcast dot com. Also on

826
00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:10,080
Speaker 1: the website there's links to our Patreon and uh donate

827
00:50:10,120 --> 00:50:13,800
Speaker 1: button for PayPal, and then also a link to buy swag,

828
00:50:14,080 --> 00:50:18,799
Speaker 1: which is pretty awesome. Sorry merch not swag. Swag is free. Yeah,

829
00:50:19,120 --> 00:50:21,120
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. We can we don't give we give away

830
00:50:21,160 --> 00:50:25,839
Speaker 1: the podcast. The podcast podcast is slag Um. You can

831
00:50:26,000 --> 00:50:30,080
Speaker 1: also find us on iTunes, which you probably know by now.

832
00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:32,520
Speaker 1: If you're listening to us on iTunes, please do give

833
00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:34,960
Speaker 1: us a comment and a rating if you would like

834
00:50:35,160 --> 00:50:37,839
Speaker 1: the probably a five star rating. Yeah, I don't really care.

835
00:50:38,200 --> 00:50:39,879
Speaker 1: Kind of like those. I just ignore the one star,

836
00:50:40,000 --> 00:50:42,920
Speaker 1: so it's fine. I don't even read them anymore. Um.

837
00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:45,360
Speaker 1: You can find us on Facebook. We've got the group

838
00:50:45,360 --> 00:50:48,040
Speaker 1: in the page find us, friend us, like us. You

839
00:50:48,080 --> 00:50:52,000
Speaker 1: can find us on Twitter. We're thinking Sideways. We're okay

840
00:50:52,000 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 1: at Twitter, I guess sometimes everyone we're in the RPG world.

841
00:50:58,120 --> 00:51:01,080
Speaker 1: We're like a level two yeah at your handle maybe

842
00:51:01,719 --> 00:51:08,680
Speaker 1: out of like possible. We're gonna level up soon, or

843
00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:11,400
Speaker 1: you can. If you want to talk about any of

844
00:51:11,400 --> 00:51:13,960
Speaker 1: this with us, you have suggestions, anything like that, send

845
00:51:14,040 --> 00:51:19,320
Speaker 1: us an email Thinking Sideways podcast at gmail dot com. Um.

846
00:51:19,360 --> 00:51:21,359
Speaker 1: I think with that we're going to get out of here.

847
00:51:21,360 --> 00:51:25,359
Speaker 1: So it's not dark. Alright, Well, so long for this week, folks.

848
00:51:25,440 --> 00:51:27,840
Speaker 1: And you can't tell, but I've got a huge unnatural

849
00:51:27,880 --> 00:51:33,319
Speaker 1: granum and I'm standing outside your window. Okay, we'll talk

850
00:51:33,320 --> 00:51:34,919
Speaker 1: to you next week. Is I have a really weird

851
00:51:34,920 --> 00:51:37,880
Speaker 1: look on my face. That's true. Okay, talk to you

852
00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:48,920
Speaker 1: guys later by