1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:04,400 Speaker 1: Oh, fellow ridiculous historians, keep your pants on. We have 2 00:00:04,480 --> 00:00:07,240 Speaker 1: a great classic episode for you, we do. Ben. 3 00:00:07,280 --> 00:00:10,080 Speaker 2: Are you familiar with the practice known as pheasants underglass? 4 00:00:10,680 --> 00:00:13,119 Speaker 1: I'm familiar with the dish. I didn't know it was 5 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:13,640 Speaker 1: a move. 6 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:16,239 Speaker 3: Well, it's when you take your bare butt cheeks and 7 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:17,680 Speaker 3: press them against a window. 8 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:20,760 Speaker 1: Oh, like any window or window. 9 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:23,239 Speaker 2: I think, as long as it's glass, I think it's okay. 10 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:25,080 Speaker 2: It could be like a sliding door or whatever. 11 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 1: But so like, if I carry a pane of glass 12 00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:30,120 Speaker 1: with me before I moon people. 13 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:32,080 Speaker 3: I would argue that would be even more akin to 14 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:35,040 Speaker 3: the actual pheasant underglass, because it's, you know, a portable 15 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 3: thing that you can just pull right off, revealing the 16 00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:37,560 Speaker 3: bear butt. 17 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:44,280 Speaker 2: The mooning practice of mooning is a historical I guess, 18 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 2: dis referring to the act of bearing ones behind to 19 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:51,240 Speaker 2: someone as an insult, sort of a biting of the thumb. 20 00:00:52,440 --> 00:00:54,040 Speaker 1: Have you ever mooned anyone? 21 00:00:54,200 --> 00:00:54,280 Speaker 2: Know? 22 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:55,080 Speaker 3: I don't think. 23 00:00:55,160 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 2: Maybe cheekily, you know, someone out in a relationship with 24 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 2: you know, a little cheeky sneak peek at the old 25 00:01:02,880 --> 00:01:06,240 Speaker 2: bum maroony, but no, never in anger. Honestly, I just 26 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:08,320 Speaker 2: don't understand the act of doing it in anger. It's 27 00:01:08,319 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 2: so goofy and silly. Although maybe has not aged super well. 28 00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:17,400 Speaker 2: The idea of exposing oneself to somebody not great. They 29 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 2: have laws against that stuff, so maybe definitely don't do that. 30 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:21,960 Speaker 2: There's got to be a better way. 31 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:27,400 Speaker 1: As Liam Gallagher once famously said, don't moon back in anger. 32 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 1: He did say that it's true thousands of people could die. 33 00:01:31,080 --> 00:01:33,960 Speaker 1: This is our classic episode. You know what Liam Gallagher 34 00:01:33,959 --> 00:01:38,559 Speaker 1: also said? What did he also say? You fancy some lasagna? 35 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:45,039 Speaker 1: And with that here is our champagne supernova of a 36 00:01:45,120 --> 00:02:17,160 Speaker 1: classic app. Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Well, well, well, 37 00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:21,680 Speaker 1: thanks for tuning in Ridiculous Historians. Today we have a 38 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:23,760 Speaker 1: rather cheeky episode for you. 39 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:26,320 Speaker 3: Huh Ben, you cheeky bastard. 40 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:30,080 Speaker 1: Well, I want to be I want to be bear 41 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:32,640 Speaker 1: faced about what we're getting into here today. 42 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:35,119 Speaker 3: Noel Hermann punster over here, right. 43 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:38,920 Speaker 1: We do want to say that we hope you enjoy 44 00:02:39,040 --> 00:02:41,840 Speaker 1: the occasional dad joke and pun that happens here on 45 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:44,919 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History, but we do want to warn you these 46 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:49,919 Speaker 1: puns have not been approved by our super producer, Casey Pegram. Yeah. 47 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:53,560 Speaker 3: In fact, sometimes he'll make a face, yes, but sometimes 48 00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:54,320 Speaker 3: it's a good face. 49 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:58,360 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, you know. We spend a lot of time 50 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:03,040 Speaker 1: during recording saying stuff to make each other laugh and 51 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:06,519 Speaker 1: then hopefully you can see it one day friend's neighbors, 52 00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:08,640 Speaker 1: Nola and I will make a joke trying to crack 53 00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:10,800 Speaker 1: the other one up, and then we'll both turn. 54 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 3: Well, you can probably hear the sounds of our next 55 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 3: whipping around over to Casey. 56 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 1: Approve of us, Casey for. 57 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:20,880 Speaker 3: A nod, just any kind of errant glance, you know. 58 00:03:21,200 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, we we hinge on it, and we do so 59 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:30,760 Speaker 1: in the spirit of decorum conversations between gentlemen. This episode 60 00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:34,760 Speaker 1: is about something that is very under chorous, and I 61 00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:39,440 Speaker 1: wanted to open with a question. Don't have to answer, 62 00:03:39,480 --> 00:03:41,240 Speaker 1: don't feel obligated. I was hoping it was going to 63 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 1: be a song. No question in the form of a song. 64 00:03:44,560 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 1: Give it to me. Have you ever mooned someone? No, 65 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:54,360 Speaker 1: you haven't, not that I recall that. 66 00:03:54,520 --> 00:03:57,120 Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, that's that's incriminating. I mean no, I don't 67 00:03:57,400 --> 00:04:02,400 Speaker 3: have a distinct memory of I mean yeah, okay, yeah, 68 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 3: I mean you know, a girlfriend. Now I'm getting too personal. 69 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 3: That sounds weird, you know, a little cheeky flash, you know, 70 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 3: a little flash of the cheek, but not as an insult, right, 71 00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:16,600 Speaker 3: not as not to degrade someone. 72 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 1: No, sir, I will tell you a true story that 73 00:04:19,360 --> 00:04:25,080 Speaker 1: stays just between you, Casey, me and everyone listening to 74 00:04:25,120 --> 00:04:27,920 Speaker 1: this show. Hey, we're all friends here. I did I 75 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 1: did moon someone once as an insult. In high school. Yeah, 76 00:04:32,600 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 1: it was my junior year. There was a villain, a 77 00:04:37,279 --> 00:04:41,000 Speaker 1: bully in my high school. He was the year above me. 78 00:04:41,240 --> 00:04:45,919 Speaker 1: And the kid was a sack of bricks from the 79 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:49,080 Speaker 1: neck up. The not the brightest crayon in the box. 80 00:04:49,120 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 3: Oh, I thought you meant like he was built like 81 00:04:50,800 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 3: a brick ship house. He was also a big dude. 82 00:04:53,160 --> 00:04:58,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, and he made life miserable for my friends and I. 83 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:00,680 Speaker 1: And there was a gas station and that people would 84 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:05,320 Speaker 1: go to every day after school to hang, to pick 85 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 1: up sodas, to try to mac on each other and whatnot. 86 00:05:09,120 --> 00:05:13,520 Speaker 1: And this guy was advertising one day near the end 87 00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:16,320 Speaker 1: of the school year. He was advertising a house party 88 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:19,640 Speaker 1: at his place, and he drove a jeep he thought, 89 00:05:19,839 --> 00:05:22,200 Speaker 1: of course he did, Yeah, an open air jeep. And 90 00:05:22,240 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: he thought it would be a great idea for him 91 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 1: to strip down to his skivies, put on a sandwich 92 00:05:29,440 --> 00:05:33,159 Speaker 1: board sign advertising his house party, and walk up and 93 00:05:33,160 --> 00:05:35,880 Speaker 1: down the street between the school and the gas stations 94 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:39,719 Speaker 1: like a punishment. We really didn't like this guy, me 95 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:42,440 Speaker 1: and my posse, and so while we were at the 96 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:45,240 Speaker 1: gas station, spur the moment, terrible impulse. Don't try this 97 00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:48,560 Speaker 1: at home, kids. We took his clothes out of his 98 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:53,360 Speaker 1: jeep and then we drove by in my car and 99 00:05:53,560 --> 00:06:00,159 Speaker 1: stopped and then mooned him and drove away waving his clothes. 100 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:05,800 Speaker 1: He ran in his underwear to his jeep, reared off, 101 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:09,040 Speaker 1: chasing after us. And it was also the first day 102 00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:11,039 Speaker 1: I mooned someone as an insult. Was also the first 103 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:12,560 Speaker 1: day I got involved in a car chase. 104 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:15,800 Speaker 3: Okay, the bully didn't murder anybody. He chased you a 105 00:06:15,839 --> 00:06:17,680 Speaker 3: little high speed card chase, a little bit of a 106 00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 3: fist shaking. But you know, no lives were lost in 107 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:22,560 Speaker 3: this particular mooning incident. 108 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 1: Right, Well, we don't have to go to the rest 109 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:28,520 Speaker 1: of the story too, but but yeah, it's just just 110 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:32,479 Speaker 1: the mooning part is pertinent for today's episode because you 111 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 1: are right, Mooning, for some reason, is universally acknowledged as 112 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:44,200 Speaker 1: an insult to someone right, it's not like another form 113 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 1: of a wave. Right. And in today's episode, you and 114 00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 1: I discovered a story about just how far back the 115 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:58,120 Speaker 1: practice known as mooning goes. And maybe this is over 116 00:06:58,160 --> 00:06:59,800 Speaker 1: explaining it, but what do you think do you think 117 00:06:59,839 --> 00:07:02,400 Speaker 1: we should tell people, just in case they're hearing this, 118 00:07:02,480 --> 00:07:04,159 Speaker 1: tell people what mooning actually is. 119 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:08,039 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean if they haven't figured it out by 120 00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:11,360 Speaker 3: now or didn't already know, I'm worried about them. 121 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:13,080 Speaker 1: But why don't we do it? Mooning? 122 00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:18,000 Speaker 3: The act of mooning bearing your moon, be hind quarters, 123 00:07:18,040 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 3: your backside, dropping trout dropping, or lifting a kilter or 124 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:25,640 Speaker 3: skirts and lifting the kilter the skirt like in Brave Heart. 125 00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 1: Remember that. 126 00:07:26,760 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, apparently some historical truth to that, but it was 127 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:32,160 Speaker 3: actually flipped around the other way. It was it was 128 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:36,360 Speaker 3: the English mooning the Scots. 129 00:07:35,920 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 1: Because I believe in the film the Scottish forces show 130 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:44,080 Speaker 1: their backside but then also show their front size. 131 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 3: That's right, don't they doing about face? Or that was 132 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:48,760 Speaker 3: the double the moon and the sun. 133 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:53,000 Speaker 1: It was very choreographed as well, so that's interesting. I 134 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 1: didn't know that that was the English. 135 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:57,440 Speaker 3: That's what Yeah, apparently in real real life skis but 136 00:07:57,520 --> 00:08:02,960 Speaker 3: we're going back to what some have dubbed the original moon, Yes. 137 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:08,360 Speaker 1: The earliest recorded mooning. According to many sources, it goes 138 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 1: all the way back to the first century AD, the 139 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 1: very first one, the very first one. And to tell 140 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:20,880 Speaker 1: the story, we're relying on an author named Josephus Boyd 141 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:24,680 Speaker 1: Josephus man Young Fesus himself. 142 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:26,880 Speaker 3: Hey, I know, I mean, he's got an interesting story 143 00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 3: all his own, But let's let's start with the initial 144 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:34,440 Speaker 3: story that Josephus has to tell us about this historical 145 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:36,400 Speaker 3: display of ours. 146 00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:41,880 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, okay. So Josephus wrote a book called the 147 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:47,360 Speaker 1: Jewish War, and in this book he tells a story 148 00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:53,920 Speaker 1: of a very strange event that occurred between the Jewish 149 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:58,440 Speaker 1: people and the occupying Roman soldiers. 150 00:08:58,679 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 3: So Roman force is during what's dubbed the Pax Romana, 151 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 3: which is kind of interesting considering that means piece of Rome. 152 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:10,360 Speaker 3: But it wasn't so peaceful. There were outright rebels, and 153 00:09:10,600 --> 00:09:15,640 Speaker 3: there were revolts brewing in this land against these occupying forces. 154 00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:17,679 Speaker 3: And there were a lot of factors at play, because 155 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:21,880 Speaker 3: there were religious zealots who wanted to purify the Jewish faith, 156 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:24,439 Speaker 3: and then there were ones that were a little more 157 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:28,959 Speaker 3: amenable to their invaders, you know, and we're kind of 158 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:32,560 Speaker 3: okay with continuing with this way of life as long 159 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:35,840 Speaker 3: as they were able to maintain some of the tenets 160 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 3: of their Jewish faith. So we're seeing here in Josevis's 161 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:44,480 Speaker 3: story is a clash involving some of those more zealous forces. 162 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, because whenever there is an occupying force, there 163 00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 1: is inevitably going to be some sort of tension, and 164 00:09:53,320 --> 00:10:00,440 Speaker 1: this situation was no different. Imagine if you can living 165 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: in a city where in you and your entire community 166 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:08,959 Speaker 1: are under the thumb, whether benevolent or whether brutal. You're 167 00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:14,800 Speaker 1: under the thumb of foreign forces, an alien culture that 168 00:10:15,080 --> 00:10:18,360 Speaker 1: doesn't hold the values you hold, that doesn't believe in 169 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:24,400 Speaker 1: the traditions that you have practiced since time immemorial. Obviously 170 00:10:24,440 --> 00:10:26,240 Speaker 1: there's going to be some tension. Noel, I think you 171 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 1: did a fantastic job laying out the differences between these groups. 172 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:33,560 Speaker 3: And we're not going to go all the way into 173 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:35,920 Speaker 3: every nuance of this, but there is a lot of 174 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 3: back and forth in this conflict between Rome and the 175 00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:45,680 Speaker 3: people of Israel, ultimately resulting in the Romans being expelled 176 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:49,560 Speaker 3: and largely massacred. But that's almost a whole episode unto 177 00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:53,880 Speaker 3: itself that is pretty heavy and full of bloodshed. We're 178 00:10:53,880 --> 00:10:55,920 Speaker 3: talking about moonings today. 179 00:10:55,840 --> 00:11:00,640 Speaker 1: That's right, that's right. So the situation becomes incredible tense 180 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:05,000 Speaker 1: during the passover season because crowds and crowds of people 181 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:11,080 Speaker 1: are flocking to Jerusalem, and this is a powder keg. 182 00:11:11,559 --> 00:11:16,200 Speaker 1: Any small excuse could become the feather that breaks the 183 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:20,760 Speaker 1: Camels back in terms of war. And there's an excellent 184 00:11:20,840 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: recount of this in a book called the Jewish Revolts 185 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 1: against Rome ad Sixty six to one thirty five, a 186 00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:34,559 Speaker 1: military analysis by James J. Bloom. So here's the situation. 187 00:11:35,120 --> 00:11:39,640 Speaker 1: The Roman prefect, who is in charge of these occupying forces, 188 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:44,680 Speaker 1: would routinely post soldiers atop battlements so that they could 189 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:48,920 Speaker 1: have an unparalleled or superior view of the proceedings of 190 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:53,400 Speaker 1: the pilgrimages, the visitors the passover. 191 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:57,360 Speaker 3: Make sure no one was stern any stern any mess. 192 00:11:57,240 --> 00:12:01,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, no domestic unrest, right, And he was in charge 193 00:12:01,320 --> 00:12:03,920 Speaker 1: at this point. Do you remember Cestius Gallus, Yes, sir, 194 00:12:04,040 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 1: that's the one. Yes. So he he had these soldiers 195 00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:13,600 Speaker 1: looking for any sign of agitation because at least from 196 00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 1: the prefect's perspective, no one wanted to quote Michael Jackson. 197 00:12:19,480 --> 00:12:22,800 Speaker 1: No one wanted to be starting something. But unfortunately those 198 00:12:22,840 --> 00:12:27,640 Speaker 1: plans went awry because of a single Roman soldier. 199 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, this unnamed soldier thought it'd be real cute if 200 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 3: he did the thing in question here, pulled down as 201 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:39,280 Speaker 3: his what did he have, like a skirt? Yeah, he uh, 202 00:12:39,400 --> 00:12:42,600 Speaker 3: like one of those battleskirts. He had something covering his 203 00:12:42,679 --> 00:12:45,080 Speaker 3: took as he removed it. And I'm guessing no, he 204 00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 3: was commando because you know, he was kind of a soldier. 205 00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:52,680 Speaker 3: I guess where's the term coming from. Man, going commando? 206 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:55,360 Speaker 3: Do you really think commandos didn't wear underpants? That that 207 00:12:55,480 --> 00:12:58,199 Speaker 3: seems to be a bad idea. Seems like you'd get 208 00:12:58,200 --> 00:12:58,839 Speaker 3: swamp ass. 209 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, it seems like, especially if you're on a commando mission, 210 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 1: you would want all the protection you can have. So 211 00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:12,840 Speaker 1: I think going commando dates back to the Vietnam War 212 00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:15,640 Speaker 1: at least that's when it got popular because people would 213 00:13:15,679 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 1: say that these folks, these commandos went without underwear to 214 00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 1: increase ventilation and reduce moisture. Oh so they dried out 215 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 1: the other way. Yeah, it still doesn't make sense. No, 216 00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:27,960 Speaker 1: it's fine. 217 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:31,920 Speaker 3: Anyway, we digress. This particular fellow. Sure seems like he 218 00:13:32,040 --> 00:13:34,280 Speaker 3: had easy access to his bits. 219 00:13:34,559 --> 00:13:36,200 Speaker 1: Yeah right, because he didn't. 220 00:13:36,280 --> 00:13:38,520 Speaker 3: You know, you don't see it written that he you know, 221 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,040 Speaker 3: gingerly removed his breeches. 222 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:45,880 Speaker 1: No, it's he like pulled up something and. 223 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:48,559 Speaker 3: Let it fly. And to quote the account, you want 224 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:50,400 Speaker 3: to do this, Ben, I think this. I think if 225 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 3: you care to this is are you sure, yeah, I'll 226 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:56,439 Speaker 3: do it. I'll do it Joe cephas, and I realized why. 227 00:13:56,440 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 3: I think that's funny. I think of bo Cephis, which 228 00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:02,439 Speaker 3: is the nickname for leave Hank Williams Ocephis. 229 00:14:02,559 --> 00:14:04,320 Speaker 1: So that's I can never separate this too. 230 00:14:04,520 --> 00:14:09,760 Speaker 3: But yeah, Joe Cephis describes the historical mooning as such, 231 00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:14,600 Speaker 3: one of the soldiers raising his robe, stooped in an 232 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:19,320 Speaker 3: indecent attitude so as to turn his backside to the Jews, 233 00:14:19,840 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 3: and made a noise in keeping with his posture. Does 234 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:26,200 Speaker 3: that mean a he let fly at a toot? 235 00:14:26,600 --> 00:14:30,680 Speaker 1: That means he either either he actually flatulated, or the 236 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 1: version that I think is for some reason much funnier 237 00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:36,120 Speaker 1: is he leaned over and made the noise with his mouth. 238 00:14:36,280 --> 00:14:41,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, Oh, yours is better there's there's different No, but 239 00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:42,320 Speaker 3: I put my hands on my face. 240 00:14:42,560 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 1: He couldn't have done that. 241 00:14:43,440 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 3: He definitely couldn't because he was holding his skirts, robe, rope, skirt, whatever. Yeah, 242 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:52,480 Speaker 3: and this, this did not go over well, my friend, 243 00:14:52,560 --> 00:14:57,440 Speaker 3: because these were pilgrims on a during a very high 244 00:14:57,480 --> 00:14:58,200 Speaker 3: holy time. 245 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:03,400 Speaker 1: Right, yeah, it's a holy it's a very serious, somber, 246 00:15:04,120 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 1: thankful time. 247 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:08,600 Speaker 3: And they're already beefed up with these Roman jerks, you know, 248 00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 3: who are just hanging around when they're. 249 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:18,040 Speaker 1: Skirts Boston people around spears. Well, yeah, honestly, it's tremendously 250 00:15:18,080 --> 00:15:22,800 Speaker 1: offensive to deride somebody's religion at any point, but especially 251 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:26,320 Speaker 1: when they're in the middle of one of the most 252 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:27,520 Speaker 1: important celebrations they have. 253 00:15:27,680 --> 00:15:30,160 Speaker 3: I'm trying to picture this too. Can you picture this scene? 254 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 1: Like? 255 00:15:30,920 --> 00:15:33,160 Speaker 3: What, how is this guy able to make himself such 256 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:35,000 Speaker 3: a display? 257 00:15:35,320 --> 00:15:37,640 Speaker 1: You know, because he was on that battle man, he's 258 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:40,600 Speaker 1: on raised ground. But the other thing that's weird about 259 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:45,720 Speaker 1: this is that we know very little about his motivation 260 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:50,400 Speaker 1: other than that he was, as Josepha says, contemptuous. You know, so, 261 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:54,320 Speaker 1: was it something where he had had some strong wine 262 00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:56,760 Speaker 1: and had one of those hold my beer moments? 263 00:15:56,800 --> 00:15:59,880 Speaker 3: Yes, he had drained his wine skin. Yes, yeah, you know, 264 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 3: up on the up on the battlements in the hot sun. 265 00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:08,200 Speaker 1: Or was he really just a sober, bad tempered person. 266 00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:11,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, because ben, I mean, it's pretty clear from the 267 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:15,120 Speaker 3: history here that neither side cared much for the other. 268 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:19,440 Speaker 1: Right, well, why would you if you were if you 269 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 1: were a Jerusalem native, Yeah, why would you be buddy 270 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:23,520 Speaker 1: buddy with these people? 271 00:16:23,520 --> 00:16:27,080 Speaker 3: There was some weird side switching though, and our boy 272 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:34,080 Speaker 3: Josephus was one of these defectors. He initially was actually 273 00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:38,680 Speaker 3: put in command of a force of rebels on the 274 00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:43,440 Speaker 3: Jewish side, and then hopped sides over to the Roman side, 275 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:46,760 Speaker 3: and he ended up becoming the historian that told these accounts. 276 00:16:46,800 --> 00:16:50,280 Speaker 3: And he is considered by many historians to be particularly 277 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:55,080 Speaker 3: manipulative and untrustworthy. So he's kind of an unreliable narrator here, 278 00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:58,600 Speaker 3: But it's all we've got, and it's, you know, a 279 00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:01,080 Speaker 3: primary source because he was there. But he also may 280 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:04,720 Speaker 3: well have been a bit of a self aggrandizing liar. 281 00:17:05,280 --> 00:17:10,000 Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, that's that's the thing. So his his lifetime, 282 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 1: he was born in thirty seven CE or thirty seven 283 00:17:13,600 --> 00:17:17,040 Speaker 1: ad C for common era ad for after the death 284 00:17:17,119 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 1: of Jesus Christ and no dominie yes, nail on the head. No. 285 00:17:22,560 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: And he died around one hundred CE. And so when 286 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:30,760 Speaker 1: we go to this record of this earliest recorded mooning, 287 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:35,840 Speaker 1: it's him writing about this event far after the fact. 288 00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:41,040 Speaker 1: But he was definitely involved in the political and military 289 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:43,520 Speaker 1: conflicts of the time. He was, you know, as as 290 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:46,680 Speaker 1: you said, the head of Jewish forces in Galilee until 291 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:52,160 Speaker 1: he surrendered in sixty seven to Roman forces, right, and 292 00:17:52,200 --> 00:17:54,959 Speaker 1: then he decided to stay on. He had been a slave, 293 00:17:55,119 --> 00:18:02,280 Speaker 1: he had been an interpreter, very fascinating life. Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely, 294 00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:09,000 Speaker 1: we have to take it with a grain of salt 295 00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:14,720 Speaker 1: when we hear the stories as told primarily by Josephus, 296 00:18:14,760 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: is he writing to sort of polish his own image. 297 00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:22,400 Speaker 1: Is he factually reporting, and if so, to what degree 298 00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:24,880 Speaker 1: he is held up in the Jewish community. 299 00:18:24,880 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 3: It seems as being at least an important chronicler of 300 00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:30,400 Speaker 3: some of these battles because he was there. But even 301 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:33,480 Speaker 3: in this article I found from a beautifully named website 302 00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:37,679 Speaker 3: called the jew Niverse, they describe him as a famously 303 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:42,120 Speaker 3: self aggrandizing ancient historian. But he wrote such works as 304 00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:44,560 Speaker 3: The Jewish War which is where this account is from 305 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:47,360 Speaker 3: Jewish antiquities and against apion. 306 00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:52,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a two volume defense of Judaism as classical 307 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:55,800 Speaker 1: religion and philosophy. Is very well written, prolific man. 308 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,399 Speaker 3: Yes, and speaking of that, and actually found a translation 309 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:02,320 Speaker 3: of the incident, call it that. I much prefer this 310 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:05,200 Speaker 3: is just the wording is which one is this? It's 311 00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:07,280 Speaker 3: just it's in this article in the universe, and it's 312 00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 3: just it's the same. It's obviously the same text as 313 00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:10,879 Speaker 3: what we read a minute ago. I just think this 314 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:14,960 Speaker 3: particular translation is way more fun. This one describes the 315 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:19,400 Speaker 3: soldier as that he pulled back his garment and cowering 316 00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 3: down after an indecent manner, turned his breach to the 317 00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 3: Jews and spake such words as you might expect upon 318 00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:27,600 Speaker 3: such a posture. 319 00:19:27,840 --> 00:19:30,400 Speaker 1: I love the idea of that he spake. Yes, Now 320 00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:33,680 Speaker 1: this makes us think whether there is a difference in translation. 321 00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:36,800 Speaker 1: Was he making a farting noise with his mouth? Was 322 00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:42,560 Speaker 1: he saying something offensive like, you know, uh, snarf my 323 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: butt people? I don't know, Ben, what ever? 324 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:47,640 Speaker 3: Did I think those words would let fly from those 325 00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:49,840 Speaker 3: luxurious lips of yours? 326 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:51,960 Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you. It's called a cupid's bow in 327 00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:55,880 Speaker 1: the top one. So, uh, I don't we don't think 328 00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 1: they said snarf. We're speculating there. But despite the fact 329 00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:06,439 Speaker 1: that many people nowadays love a good bit of crass, 330 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 1: butt oriented humor, there's a time and a place for it. 331 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:14,280 Speaker 1: And that was true in this instance, because the crowd 332 00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:17,800 Speaker 1: did not react well to this. No one was like, 333 00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:18,679 Speaker 1: look at that. 334 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:22,680 Speaker 3: But yeah, I started going down that path earlier. I 335 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:26,720 Speaker 3: think we got distracted with more butt related lore. But yeah, no, 336 00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:29,440 Speaker 3: this did not go well. This did not go well. 337 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:32,919 Speaker 3: And also that commander we were talking about, Gallas, Yeah, 338 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:37,040 Speaker 3: he was kind of considered a bit of a dunderhead 339 00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:40,560 Speaker 3: or like a bit of kind of an overreacting adult 340 00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:44,080 Speaker 3: when it came to being a military superior. And there 341 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:46,040 Speaker 3: have been a lot of incidents leading up to this 342 00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 3: that were already causing a lot of divisive feelings between 343 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:54,560 Speaker 3: the Jews and their occupiers. I believe there was some 344 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:59,160 Speaker 3: destruction of some sacred scrolls and just just in general 345 00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:02,440 Speaker 3: bad behavior here on the part of these occupying forces 346 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:05,440 Speaker 3: toward the religion of the natives. 347 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:08,719 Speaker 1: Yes, so you can read an excellent article about this 348 00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:13,680 Speaker 1: from history Net. The Great Siege of Jerusalem by Ralph Peters, 349 00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 1: which details some of the context leading up to this. 350 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:22,679 Speaker 1: And we have to establish that because it's easy to 351 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:29,000 Speaker 1: look at this single incident in a vacuum and say, sure, 352 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 1: mooning someone may be impolite, but it's not a cause 353 00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:41,040 Speaker 1: for citywide pandemonium. So this was something that was happening 354 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:47,120 Speaker 1: in addition to many profoundly offensive and disrespectful things burning 355 00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:50,560 Speaker 1: sacred scrolls, that's a huge one. But also there were 356 00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:53,800 Speaker 1: recent crises that had occurred in Afghanistan at the time, 357 00:21:54,119 --> 00:21:59,520 Speaker 1: and they also strong armed the temple priest into making 358 00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:02,080 Speaker 1: a mass of payment to Rome, so they were stealing 359 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:03,640 Speaker 1: from the people as well. That's right. 360 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,120 Speaker 3: Was that the Pharisees, they were all these different classes, 361 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:10,080 Speaker 3: and I believe that Josephus was initially part of the Pharisees, 362 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:15,160 Speaker 3: and they were a sect of priests that get sort 363 00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:18,760 Speaker 3: of a bad rap because of their place in the 364 00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:21,639 Speaker 3: Bible and their interactions with Jesus and the idea of 365 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:23,840 Speaker 3: the Pharisees and the money changers and all that of 366 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:28,040 Speaker 3: being the sign of greed and hypocrisy. But they were 367 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:33,359 Speaker 3: largely responsible for preserving some of the important religious texts 368 00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:36,080 Speaker 3: of this faith. So there's a lot of interesting stuff 369 00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 3: in the history of the Jewish people, really really fascinating stuff. 370 00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:41,920 Speaker 3: I mean, they were a kingdom, you know, yeah, the 371 00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:45,080 Speaker 3: Kingdom of Judea, and like the Maccabees, and you know, 372 00:22:45,119 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 3: they were always able to fight off their occupiers and 373 00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:49,600 Speaker 3: they were constantly be inject with right. 374 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:52,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, Rome was one in a series. 375 00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:54,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean initially there was the Persian conquest, and 376 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:57,840 Speaker 3: there was the Hellenistic period with Alexander the Great, and 377 00:22:57,880 --> 00:22:59,679 Speaker 3: there was even this sense of a lot of the 378 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:02,840 Speaker 3: a lot of Jews, parts of sects of the society, 379 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:07,080 Speaker 3: wanted to become Hellenized. They wanted to become more Greek 380 00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:09,399 Speaker 3: and kind of abandon the old ways. So there's always 381 00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:13,720 Speaker 3: the struggle between religious zealous people that want to like 382 00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 3: keep the faith pure and you know, more fair weather 383 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:20,520 Speaker 3: Jews that I think want to be more assimilated into 384 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 3: their invading culture. 385 00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:26,400 Speaker 1: Right, Assimilation is the word, and the threat of assimilation 386 00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:31,199 Speaker 1: looms large, right, and not just in this situation, but 387 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:34,880 Speaker 1: in situations throughout history. And so it is within this 388 00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:41,400 Speaker 1: rich and dangerous cultural soil that this seed of discord, 389 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:45,240 Speaker 1: this act of mooning by an unidentified Roman soldier of Moony. Yeah, 390 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 1: sprouts and spreads because not only do the people not 391 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:53,920 Speaker 1: like it, not only does no one go but stuff, No, 392 00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:55,800 Speaker 1: the people riot. 393 00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, no they ass out. 394 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:02,080 Speaker 1: Ok. I think that's fine, I think it's appropriate. 395 00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:05,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, but no, I mean they're you know, this assembled 396 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:09,800 Speaker 3: crowd of thousands, I mean upwards of over thirty thousand, 397 00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:12,960 Speaker 3: because that is the number reported. 398 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,960 Speaker 1: That were killed by Josephus. Yeah. Yeah, he says that 399 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 1: the riot occurs, and all told, when the dust settles, 400 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:26,439 Speaker 1: thirty thousand people Jewish and Roman lost their lives. And 401 00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:30,200 Speaker 1: part of this, this is a little bit maybe outside 402 00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:34,000 Speaker 1: of the documented facts here, but part of this we 403 00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:38,840 Speaker 1: can assume would be due to Gallas's incredibly belligerent and 404 00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:40,240 Speaker 1: bellicost nature. 405 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:44,680 Speaker 3: And just utter skittishness, right because he called in the 406 00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:50,600 Speaker 3: troops big time, over corrected, and then gave the order 407 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:55,400 Speaker 3: to you know, fire adam boys sticking with spears. 408 00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:59,920 Speaker 1: Right right, an over response. He's sent in Roman soul 409 00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:05,119 Speaker 1: not just to quell the riot or calm the people, 410 00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:10,359 Speaker 1: but to punish and injure them, and that is what 411 00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 1: sprouted the seat. Now we don't have any information of 412 00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:17,480 Speaker 1: what that unknown Roman soldier was doing as he was 413 00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:20,719 Speaker 1: on the battlement watching this riot occur. Did he go 414 00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:25,080 Speaker 1: down to attack some of these innocent men, women and children? 415 00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:29,119 Speaker 1: Did he just stay up there thinking that he had 416 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:34,280 Speaker 1: discovered one of the world's most amazing and dangerous insults, 417 00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:39,679 Speaker 1: The Adam Bam of rude physical gestures, Adam Bum, the 418 00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:42,560 Speaker 1: Adam Bum. There we go. So we don't know what 419 00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,560 Speaker 1: happened to him, but we do know that this is 420 00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:51,080 Speaker 1: the earliest recorded mooning. So if you have ever been mooned, 421 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:54,800 Speaker 1: or if you like you're bullying, probably broke his mind. 422 00:25:55,840 --> 00:26:00,160 Speaker 1: He probably drove him, mad man, you know, Okay, okay, 423 00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:02,800 Speaker 1: last thing I'll say about that doll. It was a 424 00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,879 Speaker 1: car of us. Were you doing, Peasant under glass? What's that? 425 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:09,360 Speaker 3: Are you pressing your bare butts against the window? 426 00:26:09,520 --> 00:26:11,400 Speaker 1: I mean one guy definitely was one of the guys 427 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:14,000 Speaker 1: in the back Pheasant under Glass. I had no idea 428 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:18,640 Speaker 1: that is such a classy moment, such a crass So 429 00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:21,640 Speaker 1: I guess, So I guess so Pheasant underglass. 430 00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:25,320 Speaker 3: Well, that's an advanced moon that's like some next level mooning. 431 00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:30,600 Speaker 1: So whether you have mooned someone have been mooned before. 432 00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:34,440 Speaker 1: We hope that this episode helps you be aware that 433 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:37,679 Speaker 1: you are either the victim of or the practitioner of 434 00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:41,080 Speaker 1: an ancient form of derision. 435 00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:44,680 Speaker 3: But Ben, I want to talk about more historical mooning, So. 436 00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 1: Glad you do know. Off air we were looking into 437 00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:52,320 Speaker 1: some really unusual and fascinating ones. What do you got? 438 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:53,119 Speaker 1: What do you got? Ben? 439 00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:55,399 Speaker 3: I really appreciate you letting me go first. You know 440 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:58,960 Speaker 3: how much how much I love this topic. We both 441 00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:03,119 Speaker 3: found and have been really enjoying a fantastic article on 442 00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:08,280 Speaker 3: slate dot com the very classy name mooning, a History 443 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:13,200 Speaker 3: by Forrest Wickman mentioned briefly earlier, the whole brave heart 444 00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:16,600 Speaker 3: sun and moon gesture thing was actually flipped the other 445 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:20,320 Speaker 3: way around. It was the English taunting the Scottish with 446 00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:24,280 Speaker 3: their butts. I think this article was think a good 447 00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:25,920 Speaker 3: way to start here is just let's talk about let's 448 00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:31,760 Speaker 3: get back to the coinage of the term mooning, because 449 00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 3: you see, Ben, while this act was ancient, it didn't 450 00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:39,760 Speaker 3: really get a proper name until the nineteen sixties, when 451 00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:43,720 Speaker 3: the Oxford English Dictionary got an entry for the word 452 00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:48,800 Speaker 3: that attributed it to student slang of the sixties. Because 453 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:51,960 Speaker 3: it became a really popular thing to do in university 454 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:57,399 Speaker 3: in America specific exactly. And that's important because I believe 455 00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:02,080 Speaker 3: that the description the use of the word moon as 456 00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 3: a euphemism for butt or buttocks dates back to the 457 00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:10,320 Speaker 3: seventeen hundreds or the eighteenth century. But the reason I 458 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:14,879 Speaker 3: think it's interesting that it's traced to American or US 459 00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:20,359 Speaker 3: student slang is because American English is notorious for the 460 00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:24,399 Speaker 3: practice of turning every single word into a verb. You 461 00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:27,160 Speaker 3: and I have done it on multiple shows. Yeah, like Squatching, 462 00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 3: Yeah exactly, from the Sasquatch episode. 463 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:31,960 Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. So it's it's nice to know that that 464 00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:37,879 Speaker 1: linguistic tradition precedes us. But I'm so fascinated by the 465 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:43,760 Speaker 1: fact that this act has been described multiple times in literature, 466 00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:47,160 Speaker 1: in fiction and nonfiction, and they didn't come up with 467 00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 1: a convenient term for it for centuries, for heck, for millennia. 468 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:56,880 Speaker 1: We know that we know that during the Fourth Crusade 469 00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 1: and twelve three Western Europeans were to take Constantinople, but 470 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:06,240 Speaker 1: they failed and they sailed away in defeat. And as 471 00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:10,200 Speaker 1: they were sailing away, the Byzantine forces who did at 472 00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:14,760 Speaker 1: them hollered at them and quote showed their bare buttocks 473 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:17,400 Speaker 1: in derision to the fleeing foe derision. 474 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:22,760 Speaker 3: You say, yeah, because this act you're essentially like sexually 475 00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:25,400 Speaker 3: harassing someone from afar that is. 476 00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:29,920 Speaker 1: And then I guess, I guess it is somewhat counterintuitive 477 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:34,800 Speaker 1: because in the animal world often when other mammals show 478 00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 1: their posterior to a creature, it's an active submission. 479 00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:41,680 Speaker 3: Right, It's like, hey, come, come, get you some of this, right. 480 00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:50,920 Speaker 1: But yeah, so now it's clearly it is. So, of course, 481 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:53,600 Speaker 1: where would we be if we did not mention one 482 00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:58,040 Speaker 1: of the most well known retellings or depictions of mooning 483 00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:01,080 Speaker 1: in the English language, And that is, of course, the 484 00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:04,800 Speaker 1: Miller's tale from Chaucer's The Canterbury. 485 00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:08,320 Speaker 3: Tales Old Saucy Chassi And there's baldy body Canterbury. 486 00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:12,200 Speaker 1: Tales Chos the sauce. That's him. There you go. So 487 00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:16,040 Speaker 1: in the frame story of the Canterbury Tales, a group 488 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:20,120 Speaker 1: of people who are traveling decide to travel together and 489 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:24,000 Speaker 1: to pass the time in their travels, they tell each 490 00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 1: other's stories. These people are described often by their occupations. 491 00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:31,640 Speaker 1: So there's a partner, for instance, who carries relics and 492 00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:36,239 Speaker 1: charges people to get close to these religious artifacts. And 493 00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: then there is the Miller, who is in a wild 494 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:42,360 Speaker 1: plot twist the miller, But we have a very saucy 495 00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:44,440 Speaker 1: tale from the Miller himself. We're not going to read 496 00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:47,720 Speaker 1: the whole thing, but there are some parts that we 497 00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:49,880 Speaker 1: think you will find choice. 498 00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:51,920 Speaker 3: Oh, Ben, can we do the back and forth where 499 00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:53,880 Speaker 3: one of us is the old Englishman and the other 500 00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:55,000 Speaker 3: is the translator? 501 00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:56,480 Speaker 1: For sure? Which one do you want to do? 502 00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:58,760 Speaker 3: Can I be the translator? I feel like you have 503 00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:00,400 Speaker 3: a little more expertise when it comes to this work. 504 00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:01,360 Speaker 3: I believe he studied in. 505 00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:05,520 Speaker 1: The school I did, but my pronunciation is going to 506 00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:06,160 Speaker 1: be terrible. 507 00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:08,880 Speaker 3: I wish Jonathan Strickland, the quizzer, was here in his 508 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:13,280 Speaker 3: Renaissance fair regalia. He would lean into this hard. He'll 509 00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:14,800 Speaker 3: tell you what he might be here. 510 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:17,880 Speaker 1: We never know. Let's launch a channel. Yeah, let's go this. 511 00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:19,440 Speaker 3: So, just so we don't have to read the whole thing, 512 00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:21,880 Speaker 3: can you give us a little quick and dirty of 513 00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:24,040 Speaker 3: how we get to the part that we're about to start? 514 00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:27,520 Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, yeah. So the Miller's tale is this story 515 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:31,400 Speaker 1: about a carpenter and his wife and these two students 516 00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:35,600 Speaker 1: or clerks that are trying to get her into bed. 517 00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:39,040 Speaker 1: The Carpenter's a guy named John, and he lives knocked 518 00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:42,320 Speaker 1: for his wife is a lot younger than him, and 519 00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:46,960 Speaker 1: she is known as the local hobby. Right. 520 00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:49,480 Speaker 3: Isn't this like a cuckolding story kind of, isn't there? 521 00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:54,920 Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, And what we'll do, without going into the 522 00:31:56,120 --> 00:32:00,440 Speaker 1: without going into the entire setup to the story, will 523 00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,920 Speaker 1: read you the juicy bit where in a character named 524 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:09,640 Speaker 1: Absalom attempts to pursue this wife romantically. 525 00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:13,560 Speaker 3: And there's some climbing up a ladder into a window 526 00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:15,120 Speaker 3: kind of action going on here. 527 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:19,120 Speaker 1: So let us begin, lemon, thy grace and sweet bird. 528 00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:23,640 Speaker 3: Then, oh, sweetheart, your favor, and sweet bird, your kindness. 529 00:32:24,040 --> 00:32:27,880 Speaker 1: The window she undooth, and that in haste she unlatched 530 00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:31,760 Speaker 1: the window. Quickly, have do quote, she come on, then 531 00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:35,040 Speaker 1: speed thee fast, go ahead, she said, come on, and 532 00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:39,080 Speaker 1: do it quickly, lest that our neighbors thee a spy. Yeah, 533 00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:42,920 Speaker 1: in case our neighbors see us, this Absalom gon wipe 534 00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:47,400 Speaker 1: his mouth full dry. This Absalom began to wipe his 535 00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:51,240 Speaker 1: mouth dry. Dirk, was the night as pitch or as 536 00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:51,800 Speaker 1: the cool. 537 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:54,760 Speaker 3: The night was dark, yeah, like pitch or coal. 538 00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:58,040 Speaker 1: And at the window out she puts here whole. 539 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:01,840 Speaker 3: And to help the window, she put her whole. 540 00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:07,680 Speaker 1: We're a family show. Okay, okay, okay, and absalom him 541 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:12,760 Speaker 1: feel no better, newares this confuses me. And as for Absalom, 542 00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:17,080 Speaker 1: it happened no better nor worse. But with his mouth 543 00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:19,000 Speaker 1: he kissed her naked URRs. 544 00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:25,240 Speaker 3: So body, they teach this in school, man. 545 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:27,400 Speaker 1: This is a We're still a family show. 546 00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:32,360 Speaker 3: A translation if he couldn't use your imagination there but 547 00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:37,280 Speaker 3: with his mouth, But with his mouth he kissed her 548 00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:41,360 Speaker 3: naked arse full savorly are He was war of this 549 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:46,040 Speaker 3: most enjoyable. Before he realized what he was kissing. 550 00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:48,600 Speaker 1: A back He's start and thought it was a mess. 551 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:52,160 Speaker 3: Back he started and thought something was wrong. 552 00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:57,600 Speaker 1: Here we go for well, he wished a woman hath. 553 00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:03,000 Speaker 3: No bird, for he well knew women have no beards. 554 00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:08,120 Speaker 1: Like we have a slow im. 555 00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:11,920 Speaker 3: I'm applauding for Chaucer and also for Ben Bowleen and 556 00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:13,720 Speaker 3: your fantastic old English. 557 00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:19,800 Speaker 1: Uh brugue, what do you call that? Elish whatever? Whatever? 558 00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:23,520 Speaker 3: Old brown ladies and gentlemen, you're too kind. Let's hear 559 00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:27,000 Speaker 3: it for super producer Casey Pagrie. Yeah, we're making this alive. 560 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,399 Speaker 3: Can we also hear it for a regular contributor, Lori 561 00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:35,440 Speaker 3: l Dove. She didn't really contribute anything to this episode, 562 00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:38,840 Speaker 3: but I just don't want to hear it's delight. 563 00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:42,440 Speaker 1: And while we're thanking everyone, let's give it up friends 564 00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:48,080 Speaker 1: and neighbors, for Alex Williams, who composed our track, and 565 00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:53,040 Speaker 1: for our research associate Christopher Hasiotis, who spoiler alert this 566 00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:57,960 Speaker 1: show and who spoiler alert needs a sound effect. Yeah, yeah, Casey, 567 00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:00,520 Speaker 1: we defer to you, NI give me later. We'll just 568 00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:02,600 Speaker 1: you know, put it on the back burner. We'll work 569 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:04,719 Speaker 1: you know what right to us and let us know 570 00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:06,960 Speaker 1: what you think is what do you think when you 571 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:08,040 Speaker 1: hear Hasiotis? 572 00:35:08,360 --> 00:35:13,120 Speaker 3: I think about the infamous club, the Hacienda owned by 573 00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:16,839 Speaker 3: the guy that you know discovered Joy Division and New 574 00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:18,360 Speaker 3: Order and all that stuff. Remember have you seen the 575 00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:19,640 Speaker 3: movie twenty four Hour Party people? 576 00:35:19,920 --> 00:35:23,160 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's great, Wow, great movie that come out. 577 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,359 Speaker 1: It was like the early two thousand Yeah yeah yeah. 578 00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:25,680 Speaker 2: Oh. 579 00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:29,280 Speaker 1: And most importantly, give it up for yourself. 580 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:30,640 Speaker 3: Cann If you want to pat yourself on the back, 581 00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:32,280 Speaker 3: give yourself a handshake. 582 00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:35,600 Speaker 1: Don't be weirded out if people are looking at you, 583 00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:36,920 Speaker 1: you are your self affirming. 584 00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:39,880 Speaker 3: Play Rock paper scissors with yourself, see what happens. 585 00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:43,359 Speaker 1: Tell us who wins. Please. In the meantime, we hope 586 00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:46,680 Speaker 1: that you enjoyed our exploration of the history of Moony 587 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:50,120 Speaker 1: at least a fraction as much as we have clearly 588 00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:51,759 Speaker 1: enjoyed diving into it. 589 00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:55,279 Speaker 3: I'm just tipsy with delight and sour. 590 00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:59,000 Speaker 1: Our journey ends for today. That's the end of our episode, 591 00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:03,080 Speaker 1: but not our show. Tune in again very soon for 592 00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:08,800 Speaker 1: more ridiculous history and last, but certainly not least, and 593 00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:13,680 Speaker 1: we promise not bare butt related. We're going on tour. 594 00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:17,000 Speaker 1: If you happen to be in Philadelphia and would like 595 00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:20,800 Speaker 1: a little bit of historical what would you call it, 596 00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:23,640 Speaker 1: no historical entertainment, Shenanigan. 597 00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:27,600 Speaker 3: Sure, Yeah, we bring the pain, historical pain. That sounds 598 00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:30,000 Speaker 3: not fun, you know what I mean? Yeah, I bring 599 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:32,520 Speaker 3: the fun, the fun pain, And we're going to bring 600 00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:37,839 Speaker 3: our butts, yes, which will remain squarely covered with our pentaions. 601 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:42,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, that is the ridiculous history guarantee of quality. We 602 00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:45,520 Speaker 1: will have our pants on the whole time. But yes, 603 00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:47,719 Speaker 1: the rumors are true. You can find us on tour 604 00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:52,920 Speaker 1: July first in Philadelphia, along with our longtime pals and 605 00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:57,200 Speaker 1: founders of Mental, Flossy Mango, and will It's True. They 606 00:36:57,239 --> 00:37:00,640 Speaker 1: are the host of part Time Genius Won't You? If 607 00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:01,560 Speaker 1: you happen to be in town. 608 00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:06,080 Speaker 3: You can find ticket information at phillypodfast dot com. They 609 00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:08,880 Speaker 3: are on sale right now and it's at four o'clock 610 00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:12,799 Speaker 3: on Sunday, July first, at the Trocadero Theater. So come 611 00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:20,520 Speaker 3: get ridiculous with us in a live setting. For more 612 00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:24,120 Speaker 3: podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or 613 00:37:24,160 --> 00:37:26,160 Speaker 3: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.