WEBVTT - Moderna CEO: 'Game-Changer' Vaccine Is Easier To Ship

0:00:01.400 --> 0:00:04.120
<v Speaker 1>Welcome to the Bloomberg Markets Podcast. I'm Paul Sweeney, along

0:00:04.120 --> 0:00:06.240
<v Speaker 1>with my co host of Bonnie Quinn. Every business day

0:00:06.240 --> 0:00:10.400
<v Speaker 1>we bring you interviews from CEOs, market pros, and Bloomberg experts,

0:00:10.400 --> 0:00:13.600
<v Speaker 1>along with essential market moving news kind the Bloomberg Markets

0:00:13.600 --> 0:00:17.000
<v Speaker 1>Podcast on Apple podcast or wherever you listen to podcasts,

0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:21.800
<v Speaker 1>and on Bloomberg dot com. Optimism in the market today,

0:00:21.840 --> 0:00:24.479
<v Speaker 1>though a little more temper than when the Fiser vaccine

0:00:24.480 --> 0:00:26.800
<v Speaker 1>news came out, I would say, Paul, Yeah, it's been

0:00:26.840 --> 0:00:28.680
<v Speaker 1>just an extraordinary hair so on the back of the

0:00:28.680 --> 0:00:31.720
<v Speaker 1>Fiser news, Um, it just gives people some hope that

0:00:31.760 --> 0:00:35.760
<v Speaker 1>there's some vaccines. Exactly what we're speaking of, of of course,

0:00:36.040 --> 0:00:39.320
<v Speaker 1>is this new Maderna news arriving as the US passes

0:00:39.360 --> 0:00:43.720
<v Speaker 1>eleven million coronavirus cases. We're going to be speaking with

0:00:43.760 --> 0:00:45.400
<v Speaker 1>Sam Fuselli in a little bit to give us the

0:00:45.400 --> 0:00:49.120
<v Speaker 1>context on exactly what this Maderna vaccine is. But first

0:00:49.200 --> 0:00:52.520
<v Speaker 1>we actually have the man responsible for the Maderna vaccine.

0:00:52.760 --> 0:00:55.720
<v Speaker 1>He is the chief executive officer of Modernist I found

0:00:55.720 --> 0:00:58.800
<v Speaker 1>at bon Sell and he is joining our television colleagues

0:00:58.800 --> 0:01:01.800
<v Speaker 1>Alex Steel and Guy Johnson. So let's toss it over

0:01:01.840 --> 0:01:05.360
<v Speaker 1>to Alex So now we welcome our TV viewers and

0:01:05.480 --> 0:01:10.040
<v Speaker 1>radio listeners to Stefan Vancell Maderna CEO. Stefan, it's been

0:01:10.040 --> 0:01:13.560
<v Speaker 1>a big morning. Congratulations. Were obviously all very excited at

0:01:13.600 --> 0:01:17.759
<v Speaker 1>any new prospect of a vaccine. The biggest question though,

0:01:17.840 --> 0:01:20.399
<v Speaker 1>that it seems like people have is why does your

0:01:20.480 --> 0:01:27.080
<v Speaker 1>vaccine require less cold storage than fives are key to distribution? Yes,

0:01:27.120 --> 0:01:29.800
<v Speaker 1>good morning, and thank you for me. I think it

0:01:29.800 --> 0:01:32.800
<v Speaker 1>goes back to the fact that we have been working

0:01:32.840 --> 0:01:36.640
<v Speaker 1>on Emmony vaccines for more than five years. This is

0:01:36.720 --> 0:01:40.200
<v Speaker 1>the tenth vaccine that we have been running a clinical

0:01:40.280 --> 0:01:43.120
<v Speaker 1>trial on the over vaccine that you mentioned. It's the

0:01:43.240 --> 0:01:47.280
<v Speaker 1>first time that they are doing need fictions is vaccine,

0:01:47.319 --> 0:01:50.640
<v Speaker 1>and so over years we've been invested heavily in science,

0:01:51.280 --> 0:01:54.520
<v Speaker 1>in process development that allows us now to have a

0:01:54.640 --> 0:01:57.960
<v Speaker 1>much better storage condition than what we used to have

0:01:58.320 --> 0:02:02.920
<v Speaker 1>five years ago. Stefan, this is really important because it's

0:02:02.960 --> 0:02:05.840
<v Speaker 1>going to have a huge impact on distribution. How much

0:02:05.840 --> 0:02:08.720
<v Speaker 1>of an effect will that stability at the higher temperature

0:02:08.840 --> 0:02:11.680
<v Speaker 1>have and everybody's ability to be able to get hold

0:02:11.680 --> 0:02:16.320
<v Speaker 1>of this vaccine. I think it's a huge impact. Were

0:02:16.320 --> 0:02:20.760
<v Speaker 1>gonna have a vaccine started minus twenty between our factory

0:02:20.800 --> 0:02:25.200
<v Speaker 1>and the big distribution centers, and those are able to

0:02:25.320 --> 0:02:29.160
<v Speaker 1>handle that type of product because they're already product approved

0:02:29.240 --> 0:02:31.880
<v Speaker 1>by the e M e A in Europe, amature in

0:02:31.919 --> 0:02:35.440
<v Speaker 1>the UK, or d in the US at minus twenty celsius.

0:02:35.960 --> 0:02:38.240
<v Speaker 1>But what is very important with today's news is we

0:02:38.280 --> 0:02:41.919
<v Speaker 1>can now for to thirty days have a vaccine stared

0:02:41.919 --> 0:02:44.520
<v Speaker 1>in the regular fridge at two to eight celsius like

0:02:44.600 --> 0:02:48.880
<v Speaker 1>you do insulin. And as you know, every pharmacy, uh

0:02:49.080 --> 0:02:53.120
<v Speaker 1>you know, doctor's office, hospital has that capability. So we

0:02:53.160 --> 0:02:55.640
<v Speaker 1>think it's a very important game changer. The VPS two.

0:02:56.200 --> 0:03:00.000
<v Speaker 1>To keep in mind this a vaccine does not require dilution,

0:03:00.040 --> 0:03:04.320
<v Speaker 1>and uh the over vaccine that you mentioned requires dilution

0:03:04.400 --> 0:03:06.760
<v Speaker 1>at the site. So you take the vaccine out, they

0:03:06.840 --> 0:03:09.480
<v Speaker 1>need to dialute it. It's an extra step. What we

0:03:09.560 --> 0:03:11.359
<v Speaker 1>have to do to get the world back to normal

0:03:11.480 --> 0:03:15.480
<v Speaker 1>is a massive vaccination campaign that never really happened before.

0:03:16.080 --> 0:03:19.080
<v Speaker 1>And so every time we're going to be wasting doing

0:03:19.080 --> 0:03:21.519
<v Speaker 1>this type of things for the product is going to

0:03:21.600 --> 0:03:23.880
<v Speaker 1>be an issue. And so we think that between the

0:03:23.919 --> 0:03:27.480
<v Speaker 1>fridge condition storage and the fact that we do not

0:03:27.600 --> 0:03:30.480
<v Speaker 1>require any dilution on site. That's gonna be a big

0:03:30.480 --> 0:03:34.760
<v Speaker 1>advantage for nurses and doctors to be able to provide

0:03:34.760 --> 0:03:37.680
<v Speaker 1>those vaccines quickly to the population. We wants it such

0:03:37.680 --> 0:03:40.120
<v Speaker 1>a good distinction. Um, have you had conversations with the

0:03:40.160 --> 0:03:43.640
<v Speaker 1>current administration or the incoming Biden administration about kind of distribution,

0:03:43.720 --> 0:03:49.480
<v Speaker 1>how to mobilize. Yes. So the operational web Speed has

0:03:49.520 --> 0:03:52.520
<v Speaker 1>been working in the US very closely with the CDC

0:03:52.760 --> 0:03:56.480
<v Speaker 1>for a long time and we're in daily discussions with them.

0:03:56.560 --> 0:04:00.200
<v Speaker 1>What we're gonna do as soon as we got prov

0:04:00.240 --> 0:04:03.400
<v Speaker 1>all or a new way by the us FD is

0:04:03.440 --> 0:04:07.920
<v Speaker 1>to ship the product via mckenson with the US government

0:04:07.920 --> 0:04:10.360
<v Speaker 1>as selected, because we are very active in the seasonal

0:04:10.400 --> 0:04:15.960
<v Speaker 1>flu process to get the vaccines out to hospital and pharmacies.

0:04:16.000 --> 0:04:19.640
<v Speaker 1>As I'm sure you read CVS Walgreen right and all

0:04:19.680 --> 0:04:22.560
<v Speaker 1>the big pharmacy changed in the US have signed up

0:04:22.600 --> 0:04:27.160
<v Speaker 1>to get the vaccine from mckinsson to provide administration in

0:04:27.200 --> 0:04:29.840
<v Speaker 1>the pharmacies. This is also going to be available you

0:04:29.880 --> 0:04:34.240
<v Speaker 1>know in hospitals in some rural area, in community hospitals

0:04:34.480 --> 0:04:38.320
<v Speaker 1>or GPS office. So there's a lot of work going

0:04:38.360 --> 0:04:41.240
<v Speaker 1>on and this is actually the government taking care of

0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:44.800
<v Speaker 1>that step, whereas you know, the military is being involved

0:04:44.800 --> 0:04:51.240
<v Speaker 1>to help with logistics stefan um. One of the key

0:04:51.320 --> 0:04:54.240
<v Speaker 1>questions as we all watch the case count climbing around

0:04:54.279 --> 0:04:58.240
<v Speaker 1>the world is what impact will these shots have on transmission?

0:04:58.760 --> 0:05:01.560
<v Speaker 1>So what affects if I have to say my arm,

0:05:01.920 --> 0:05:04.400
<v Speaker 1>will this have on my ability if I come into

0:05:04.400 --> 0:05:08.880
<v Speaker 1>contact to get the virus to transmit it to others? Yes,

0:05:09.000 --> 0:05:11.320
<v Speaker 1>and this we don't know yet. What we know from

0:05:11.360 --> 0:05:15.080
<v Speaker 1>today's data is that if you get on vaccine, you're

0:05:15.080 --> 0:05:17.880
<v Speaker 1>gonna have a ninety four percent chance to have no

0:05:18.160 --> 0:05:21.800
<v Speaker 1>COVID disease. That's obviously a big deal. But what is

0:05:21.800 --> 0:05:25.240
<v Speaker 1>even more important in my opinion, is of the nine

0:05:25.760 --> 0:05:29.920
<v Speaker 1>case of disease that were analyzed yesterday by the independent

0:05:30.760 --> 0:05:35.240
<v Speaker 1>n I actually lead safety board was severe cases, which

0:05:35.279 --> 0:05:39.640
<v Speaker 1>was the secondary endpoint of that phase free study. So

0:05:39.920 --> 0:05:43.280
<v Speaker 1>eleven of the ninety cases were severe. But what is

0:05:43.320 --> 0:05:48.440
<v Speaker 1>really remarkable is that of those eleven cases eleven where

0:05:48.480 --> 0:05:53.120
<v Speaker 1>with people who got placebo. There were no case reported

0:05:53.279 --> 0:05:55.320
<v Speaker 1>of people who get the model of vaccine. So when

0:05:55.360 --> 0:05:57.520
<v Speaker 1>you put those two data together, what does it tell

0:05:57.560 --> 0:06:00.279
<v Speaker 1>you with the data we have to there, it's seems

0:06:00.279 --> 0:06:02.240
<v Speaker 1>that are vaccine. If you get it, you're very high

0:06:02.320 --> 0:06:06.000
<v Speaker 1>chance of being with no disease, and if you get diseased,

0:06:06.360 --> 0:06:08.839
<v Speaker 1>most probably you will get mild disease. And if you

0:06:08.839 --> 0:06:12.120
<v Speaker 1>think about the impact on hospitalization, I see you, and

0:06:12.200 --> 0:06:15.200
<v Speaker 1>the impact on the economy where governments around the world

0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:19.359
<v Speaker 1>are trying to slow down contacts because they want to

0:06:19.400 --> 0:06:23.680
<v Speaker 1>manage the limited hospital and I see capacity. So if

0:06:23.720 --> 0:06:26.240
<v Speaker 1>that problem was to go away by having a vaccine

0:06:26.279 --> 0:06:30.320
<v Speaker 1>that prevents severe disease like ours seem to do, that's

0:06:30.320 --> 0:06:34.200
<v Speaker 1>a game changer. To your question about transmission. We will

0:06:34.240 --> 0:06:37.360
<v Speaker 1>know soon. As part of our study, we're also looking

0:06:37.480 --> 0:06:41.680
<v Speaker 1>at measuring antibodies that come from the virus but could

0:06:41.680 --> 0:06:44.719
<v Speaker 1>not come from the vaccine, and so when we have

0:06:44.800 --> 0:06:47.600
<v Speaker 1>that data will of course share it. It is possible

0:06:47.640 --> 0:06:50.440
<v Speaker 1>that the vaccine will prevent infection. We have shown that

0:06:50.760 --> 0:06:54.680
<v Speaker 1>in non human primates, in monkeys, but we need of

0:06:54.680 --> 0:06:57.040
<v Speaker 1>course to puttin human now just in a bit more time.

0:06:57.279 --> 0:07:00.200
<v Speaker 1>But the most important thing is to prevent disease. Is

0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:03.200
<v Speaker 1>if people vaccinated will not have disease, we will be

0:07:03.240 --> 0:07:06.440
<v Speaker 1>in a very different world. What's the breakdown for the

0:07:06.480 --> 0:07:10.160
<v Speaker 1>German population versus older people? Say those over sixty five,

0:07:10.280 --> 0:07:13.600
<v Speaker 1>you have fifteen in a trial, right, So what was

0:07:13.640 --> 0:07:18.400
<v Speaker 1>plasibo which were vaccinated? What was the effect? Yeah, we

0:07:18.440 --> 0:07:21.360
<v Speaker 1>don't know all the details yet because remember the company

0:07:21.480 --> 0:07:24.560
<v Speaker 1>is blind dead, the data is owned and run by

0:07:24.600 --> 0:07:28.040
<v Speaker 1>the independent Safety Bomb. But what we know is that

0:07:28.080 --> 0:07:31.280
<v Speaker 1>we had only five active cases on on the drug

0:07:32.000 --> 0:07:36.040
<v Speaker 1>and so we anticipate a good response in the elderly.

0:07:36.640 --> 0:07:38.920
<v Speaker 1>We will know more in a couple of weeks when

0:07:38.960 --> 0:07:41.440
<v Speaker 1>we have the study finalized and file to be f

0:07:41.560 --> 0:07:45.000
<v Speaker 1>D and in the MHI in the UK. But if

0:07:45.040 --> 0:07:47.280
<v Speaker 1>you look at the phase one data which were published

0:07:47.280 --> 0:07:50.480
<v Speaker 1>in the New England, were actually the vaccine of all

0:07:50.520 --> 0:07:53.480
<v Speaker 1>the vaccines in the clinic that was able to sustain

0:07:53.680 --> 0:07:56.280
<v Speaker 1>from the twenty five year old to a seventy year

0:07:56.280 --> 0:07:59.200
<v Speaker 1>old the same level of antibody for all of a

0:07:59.280 --> 0:08:02.760
<v Speaker 1>participants in the study. So we are costly optimistic that

0:08:02.840 --> 0:08:06.400
<v Speaker 1>in the elderly and other people with high commobility factor

0:08:06.880 --> 0:08:11.800
<v Speaker 1>we should have an effective vaccine. Stephan, I'm Christina guard

0:08:11.840 --> 0:08:13.760
<v Speaker 1>the president of the e CV. Was asked the other

0:08:13.840 --> 0:08:16.560
<v Speaker 1>day what the greatest fear was. One of them was war,

0:08:16.880 --> 0:08:20.440
<v Speaker 1>the other one was Mike, how big a fear? Do

0:08:20.600 --> 0:08:25.920
<v Speaker 1>you have about mutation And it's our messenger, robyn Ny

0:08:25.960 --> 0:08:30.440
<v Speaker 1>claic ascid the best way of dealing with any kind

0:08:30.480 --> 0:08:33.720
<v Speaker 1>of mutation that we say, So let me start with

0:08:33.760 --> 0:08:37.360
<v Speaker 1>your last question. Yes, MRY is the best technology to

0:08:37.520 --> 0:08:42.400
<v Speaker 1>deal with mutation. While because we've shown in January that

0:08:42.440 --> 0:08:45.120
<v Speaker 1>it took us forty two days to go from the

0:08:45.200 --> 0:08:48.360
<v Speaker 1>sequence published by the Chinese government of the Saskovie two

0:08:48.720 --> 0:08:53.319
<v Speaker 1>two shipping to be a ni H human grade quality product,

0:08:54.320 --> 0:08:56.680
<v Speaker 1>I think we can take this down to around thirty

0:08:56.760 --> 0:08:59.560
<v Speaker 1>days with the things we've learned and the investment we

0:08:59.559 --> 0:09:03.079
<v Speaker 1>have made. So if tomorrow there was a new mutation

0:09:03.360 --> 0:09:05.960
<v Speaker 1>like the one you mentioned that could have an impact

0:09:06.000 --> 0:09:08.880
<v Speaker 1>on the efficacy of vaccine, we could within a month

0:09:09.480 --> 0:09:12.120
<v Speaker 1>go back and have a new vaccine. We will not

0:09:12.280 --> 0:09:16.679
<v Speaker 1>need to do studies anymore because it's the same chemistry

0:09:16.760 --> 0:09:20.040
<v Speaker 1>for the molecular emoney. It's the same manufacturing process. So

0:09:20.080 --> 0:09:22.920
<v Speaker 1>if you change out of a message that is very long,

0:09:23.360 --> 0:09:26.960
<v Speaker 1>thousands of letters of genetic code of life, if you

0:09:27.040 --> 0:09:29.720
<v Speaker 1>change a couple of them for mutation, do not have

0:09:29.800 --> 0:09:33.400
<v Speaker 1>to redo clinical studies anymore. So MNEY is clearly the

0:09:33.400 --> 0:09:36.800
<v Speaker 1>best adapted for mutation on the one you mentioned. We

0:09:36.880 --> 0:09:40.800
<v Speaker 1>are tracking it. We're gonna run the experiment very quickly

0:09:41.240 --> 0:09:45.000
<v Speaker 1>to see those the blood that we have from the humans.

0:09:45.480 --> 0:09:47.840
<v Speaker 1>We went on phase one and of phase two. Does

0:09:47.880 --> 0:09:51.800
<v Speaker 1>it neutralize the new virus. If it does, we know

0:09:51.920 --> 0:09:55.080
<v Speaker 1>the vaccine works. Well. If it doesn't, we can quickly

0:09:55.160 --> 0:09:57.559
<v Speaker 1>change the sequence and have a new vaccine. Can you

0:09:57.600 --> 0:10:02.280
<v Speaker 1>give me some perspective on the side effects. Yes, the

0:10:02.320 --> 0:10:05.280
<v Speaker 1>side effects. We've reported the serious side effects in the

0:10:05.320 --> 0:10:08.680
<v Speaker 1>press release for Transparent Serison. They are very similar to

0:10:08.720 --> 0:10:11.960
<v Speaker 1>what you see with other vaccines. We did not even

0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:15.640
<v Speaker 1>report the fever because they were less than two percent

0:10:16.320 --> 0:10:18.960
<v Speaker 1>of cases at fever. And what you see is what

0:10:19.000 --> 0:10:22.040
<v Speaker 1>you see with commercial vaccine. A bit of pain at

0:10:22.040 --> 0:10:24.840
<v Speaker 1>the side of injection, a bit of rensse for their

0:10:24.920 --> 0:10:28.520
<v Speaker 1>two both go away with no medication, and that the

0:10:28.559 --> 0:10:32.280
<v Speaker 1>systemical values is some people having some fatigue, especially in

0:10:32.360 --> 0:10:36.080
<v Speaker 1>the elderly group. You see people having a bit of headache. Again,

0:10:36.160 --> 0:10:38.520
<v Speaker 1>those things go away usually within the day or so

0:10:39.000 --> 0:10:41.240
<v Speaker 1>with no medication. Of course, people can take a time

0:10:41.360 --> 0:10:47.520
<v Speaker 1>all or equivalent and actually not even feel those pains. Sevan,

0:10:47.559 --> 0:10:50.000
<v Speaker 1>you mentioned the moment to go about being able to reformulate,

0:10:50.320 --> 0:10:53.360
<v Speaker 1>How quickly do you think you'll get into kind of

0:10:53.360 --> 0:10:56.360
<v Speaker 1>two point zero three point zero? How quickly do you

0:10:56.360 --> 0:11:00.080
<v Speaker 1>think that cycle will happen um and what improved and

0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:02.120
<v Speaker 1>do you think you'll be looking for? You mentioned temperature

0:11:02.120 --> 0:11:04.480
<v Speaker 1>early on as paying more of the critical factors as

0:11:04.520 --> 0:11:07.480
<v Speaker 1>you look for reformulations. What work are you doing and

0:11:07.760 --> 0:11:11.880
<v Speaker 1>how improved will be the product and how quickly? Yes,

0:11:11.920 --> 0:11:14.040
<v Speaker 1>so that's a great question. I think we're of course

0:11:14.120 --> 0:11:18.240
<v Speaker 1>always working on temperature and stability the thirty days when

0:11:18.280 --> 0:11:21.160
<v Speaker 1>as today at French semperature is the first step forward.

0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:24.120
<v Speaker 1>Because we have that data, we continue to monitor a

0:11:24.160 --> 0:11:27.319
<v Speaker 1>product that is own stability in our abs and if

0:11:27.360 --> 0:11:29.960
<v Speaker 1>we're able to expand it will do so. The other

0:11:30.000 --> 0:11:33.920
<v Speaker 1>piece I think is single those usage. The current product,

0:11:34.480 --> 0:11:37.200
<v Speaker 1>like all the other products, is multi dose, so in

0:11:37.240 --> 0:11:40.800
<v Speaker 1>every vile you're gonna get ten dozes for ten people.

0:11:41.520 --> 0:11:44.600
<v Speaker 1>And the reason the entire industry did that is very

0:11:44.640 --> 0:11:48.040
<v Speaker 1>is not enough filling capacity in the world that was

0:11:48.080 --> 0:11:51.160
<v Speaker 1>sitting idle to wait for a pandemic, and so by

0:11:51.200 --> 0:11:53.920
<v Speaker 1>putting tenders in one vile, we can of course get

0:11:54.120 --> 0:11:58.200
<v Speaker 1>much quicker product in the marketplace to vaccinate people. But

0:11:58.240 --> 0:12:01.160
<v Speaker 1>if you think about the potential us from the meat

0:12:01.160 --> 0:12:04.440
<v Speaker 1>too long term. In term of boosting, it will be

0:12:04.520 --> 0:12:06.880
<v Speaker 1>much easier to have a single dose vaccination like you

0:12:06.920 --> 0:12:10.400
<v Speaker 1>have when you get a seasonal flu shot stuff. I

0:12:10.400 --> 0:12:12.000
<v Speaker 1>found a question from me. As you said at the

0:12:12.000 --> 0:12:14.800
<v Speaker 1>beginning of this conversation, you've been working on this for

0:12:14.840 --> 0:12:19.400
<v Speaker 1>a long time. You were looking to use messenger RNA

0:12:19.559 --> 0:12:22.080
<v Speaker 1>for other therapies. Can you talk to me about the

0:12:22.080 --> 0:12:26.280
<v Speaker 1>acceleration you've been through within your business as a result

0:12:26.320 --> 0:12:29.360
<v Speaker 1>of COVID nineteen and I'm looking for silver linings here?

0:12:29.800 --> 0:12:32.920
<v Speaker 1>Will this help in treatments elsewhere? Will it help with

0:12:32.960 --> 0:12:37.240
<v Speaker 1>cancer and other areas? Yes, I'm a place where it's

0:12:37.240 --> 0:12:40.920
<v Speaker 1>going to help the most is infectious disease vaccine. We

0:12:41.000 --> 0:12:44.000
<v Speaker 1>have six vaccines for over infectious disease that are all

0:12:44.120 --> 0:12:48.199
<v Speaker 1>first class, meaning no commercial vaccine available. A good example

0:12:48.280 --> 0:12:50.880
<v Speaker 1>is CMB Cito megat of virus. It's a virus that

0:12:51.000 --> 0:12:54.480
<v Speaker 1>drives the number one course of birth defect in Europe

0:12:54.559 --> 0:12:56.760
<v Speaker 1>or in the US ten thousand kids in the US

0:12:56.840 --> 0:12:59.520
<v Speaker 1>per year. No vaccine on the market. The WAD industry

0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:02.840
<v Speaker 1>a strike for twenty years to get a CMB vaccine

0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:05.600
<v Speaker 1>to work. They all failed well with the positive phase

0:13:05.640 --> 0:13:08.959
<v Speaker 1>to study in September, starting the Phase three next year.

0:13:09.360 --> 0:13:13.120
<v Speaker 1>That's a two to five billion annual pixel product that

0:13:13.240 --> 0:13:16.800
<v Speaker 1>we have not licensed, so meaning it's a product percent

0:13:17.240 --> 0:13:19.520
<v Speaker 1>for Moderna, and we have many more like this. We

0:13:19.640 --> 0:13:22.040
<v Speaker 1>just announced we're going to get into the flu business.

0:13:22.080 --> 0:13:25.240
<v Speaker 1>So what the COVID vaccine has done for Moderna is

0:13:25.320 --> 0:13:28.680
<v Speaker 1>one deal is king of a platform for vaccines, which

0:13:28.720 --> 0:13:31.320
<v Speaker 1>translated into a lot of value. And two is an

0:13:31.360 --> 0:13:35.000
<v Speaker 1>acceleration for us becoming a commercial company. We were supposed

0:13:35.000 --> 0:13:37.240
<v Speaker 1>to be commercial in the twenty three to twenty four

0:13:37.280 --> 0:13:40.719
<v Speaker 1>time frame, when now it's possible we were being commercial

0:13:40.880 --> 0:13:44.480
<v Speaker 1>before the end of the year. That's called an acceleration. Stephan,

0:13:44.559 --> 0:13:46.480
<v Speaker 1>thank you very much. In Day. We really appreciate your

0:13:46.520 --> 0:13:48.400
<v Speaker 1>time today. Thank you very much in Day sharing it

0:13:48.440 --> 0:13:54.280
<v Speaker 1>with us Stephanel the Moderna CEO. That was Stefan ban Cell,

0:13:54.400 --> 0:13:58.000
<v Speaker 1>the CEO of Moderna speaking with Bloomberg's Guy Johnson and

0:13:58.320 --> 0:14:01.080
<v Speaker 1>Alex Steel, talking about out the study that just came

0:14:01.080 --> 0:14:04.239
<v Speaker 1>out about their vaccine. Again, ninety four point five percent efficacy,

0:14:04.320 --> 0:14:07.160
<v Speaker 1>very high number, uh, you know, kind of in the

0:14:07.200 --> 0:14:10.360
<v Speaker 1>ballpark with what we saw from Fiser last week's We've

0:14:10.400 --> 0:14:14.040
<v Speaker 1>got two possible vaccines coming to markets. That's certainly very

0:14:14.080 --> 0:14:16.439
<v Speaker 1>positives if we think about this pandemic right now. Let's

0:14:16.480 --> 0:14:20.200
<v Speaker 1>get some more details on what this modern vaccine might

0:14:20.240 --> 0:14:23.680
<v Speaker 1>look like. We can do that with Bloomberg Intelligence senior

0:14:23.760 --> 0:14:28.080
<v Speaker 1>pharmac pharmaceutical analysts. That would be Sam Fizzelli. He joins

0:14:28.160 --> 0:14:32.160
<v Speaker 1>us from France. Sam, thanks so much for joining us here. Boy,

0:14:32.320 --> 0:14:35.080
<v Speaker 1>this number, the point five percent jumps out of it

0:14:35.200 --> 0:14:38.600
<v Speaker 1>just like the number did as well. How do you

0:14:38.640 --> 0:14:44.120
<v Speaker 1>compare and contrast um these two potential vaccines? Yeah, high

0:14:44.160 --> 0:14:47.440
<v Speaker 1>paul Um. So I think on the efficacy front, we

0:14:47.640 --> 0:14:52.480
<v Speaker 1>should currently assume that they're similarly effective, because these are

0:14:52.960 --> 0:14:56.360
<v Speaker 1>you know, nine seven percent versus nine point five on

0:14:56.800 --> 0:14:59.880
<v Speaker 1>a few cases can go either way as the case

0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:03.040
<v Speaker 1>as the crew. So I would call the two vaccines

0:15:03.040 --> 0:15:06.560
<v Speaker 1>equivalent in terms of efficacy, at least on the early data.

0:15:06.640 --> 0:15:10.040
<v Speaker 1>But then you have all the various other levels. So no,

0:15:10.200 --> 0:15:12.440
<v Speaker 1>Darn has done something that Fighter did not. They have

0:15:12.520 --> 0:15:14.640
<v Speaker 1>given us a bit more detailed They first they gave

0:15:14.720 --> 0:15:18.760
<v Speaker 1>us the statistical power, which is great, and then they

0:15:18.800 --> 0:15:22.920
<v Speaker 1>told us about the severe cases none in the vaccinated group.

0:15:23.040 --> 0:15:26.960
<v Speaker 1>That's fantastic to see. Um So that's like a protection.

0:15:27.000 --> 0:15:29.240
<v Speaker 1>But we're already dealing with the eleven cases, and then

0:15:29.280 --> 0:15:32.520
<v Speaker 1>you've got the elderly. And Steven Bontel did not go

0:15:32.560 --> 0:15:34.960
<v Speaker 1>into the detail, but if you assume that all the

0:15:35.040 --> 0:15:38.400
<v Speaker 1>cases on the vaccine are are older people, which is

0:15:38.800 --> 0:15:42.520
<v Speaker 1>very unlikely, then you still have at least a fifty

0:15:42.920 --> 0:15:46.120
<v Speaker 1>effective vaccine for older people. And I'm convinced that it

0:15:46.160 --> 0:15:49.240
<v Speaker 1>would be better than that. And they did have slightly

0:15:49.320 --> 0:15:52.600
<v Speaker 1>better data in elderly than others did, but that's early

0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:55.280
<v Speaker 1>phase one too, So everything looks pretty good for this

0:15:55.440 --> 0:15:58.240
<v Speaker 1>vaccine and also fights us based on the data that

0:15:58.280 --> 0:16:02.119
<v Speaker 1>we have to date. UM. So the m RNA technology

0:16:02.240 --> 0:16:07.080
<v Speaker 1>transforms the body's own cells into vaccine making factories. Apparently,

0:16:07.560 --> 0:16:09.600
<v Speaker 1>does that mean that when you come in contact with

0:16:09.680 --> 0:16:13.040
<v Speaker 1>the coronavirus, it doesn't get into your system and your

0:16:13.760 --> 0:16:16.640
<v Speaker 1>your your body doesn't go into sort of overdrive trying

0:16:16.680 --> 0:16:20.760
<v Speaker 1>to immunize your own body. So there's two things that

0:16:21.040 --> 0:16:23.320
<v Speaker 1>we want a vaccine to do, and we know that

0:16:23.360 --> 0:16:25.880
<v Speaker 1>these two vaccines do at least one of them. That is,

0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:29.880
<v Speaker 1>they prevent the infection from setting off a massive problem

0:16:29.920 --> 0:16:32.880
<v Speaker 1>within a disease within the body, so they limit the

0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:36.160
<v Speaker 1>infection and that's great. What we don't know is if

0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:39.440
<v Speaker 1>they eliminate the infection or stop the infection taking hold

0:16:39.560 --> 0:16:45.080
<v Speaker 1>at all. Therefore that so called sterilizing immunity. Do I do?

0:16:45.120 --> 0:16:47.680
<v Speaker 1>I am I still even though I'm vaccinated and don't

0:16:47.680 --> 0:16:52.080
<v Speaker 1>have a disease, still at risk of passing the virus

0:16:52.120 --> 0:16:55.160
<v Speaker 1>to somebody else or not. That is the thing that

0:16:55.440 --> 0:16:58.080
<v Speaker 1>they have to answer, and we still don't know. And

0:16:58.080 --> 0:17:01.880
<v Speaker 1>I'm not sure how um Mr bon Cell's answer to

0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:04.480
<v Speaker 1>that question actually gets to that point. They need to

0:17:04.480 --> 0:17:07.520
<v Speaker 1>look at the virus in the nose, and I don't

0:17:07.560 --> 0:17:09.800
<v Speaker 1>think any of the companies have really done that on

0:17:09.840 --> 0:17:14.359
<v Speaker 1>a routine weekly basis during their trial. So, Sam, So

0:17:14.400 --> 0:17:17.400
<v Speaker 1>we have two vaccines potentially out there. I know there

0:17:17.440 --> 0:17:20.440
<v Speaker 1>are more entities out there working at the end of

0:17:20.440 --> 0:17:23.160
<v Speaker 1>the day, how many do you think will be commercially

0:17:23.200 --> 0:17:27.320
<v Speaker 1>deployed to the market. Oh boy, I mean that's a

0:17:27.440 --> 0:17:29.639
<v Speaker 1>that's a tough one. So we look at the early

0:17:29.720 --> 0:17:31.800
<v Speaker 1>data for all these vaccines so far, and they all

0:17:31.960 --> 0:17:36.480
<v Speaker 1>seem pretty much the same. Maybe the AstraZeneca one is not,

0:17:37.320 --> 0:17:40.160
<v Speaker 1>or at least in the early trials didn't quite match

0:17:40.240 --> 0:17:43.160
<v Speaker 1>the data that we go for some of these other vaccines.

0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:45.520
<v Speaker 1>So time will tell you in the next few weeks

0:17:45.520 --> 0:17:48.440
<v Speaker 1>how that does in the UK trial. But I think

0:17:48.600 --> 0:17:50.840
<v Speaker 1>the majority of them will be in these sort of ranges.

0:17:51.000 --> 0:17:54.000
<v Speaker 1>So you've gotta you know that that creates a conundrum

0:17:54.040 --> 0:17:56.359
<v Speaker 1>for people or or a good problem to have. You

0:17:56.359 --> 0:18:00.040
<v Speaker 1>have to choose between them, and I don't envy we

0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:02.560
<v Speaker 1>ever has to do that. I suppose the reason I

0:18:02.600 --> 0:18:05.119
<v Speaker 1>was asking the previous questions samus because I was wondering

0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:09.240
<v Speaker 1>about longhoulers or people that you know, get over it,

0:18:09.600 --> 0:18:13.159
<v Speaker 1>you know, more quickly, but then develop longer term symptoms.

0:18:13.600 --> 0:18:17.080
<v Speaker 1>Do we know if this vaccine protects those kinds of people.

0:18:18.280 --> 0:18:21.520
<v Speaker 1>So that's a very interesting question. One is I think

0:18:21.560 --> 0:18:25.000
<v Speaker 1>the if the this issue with longhoulders is because they

0:18:25.040 --> 0:18:28.600
<v Speaker 1>have a little reservoir somewhere in the guard or systems

0:18:28.720 --> 0:18:32.359
<v Speaker 1>somewhere the virus continues to be alive and replicate and

0:18:33.000 --> 0:18:35.240
<v Speaker 1>keep couldn't have ac every now and then. If that's

0:18:35.240 --> 0:18:38.080
<v Speaker 1>the case, then with the vaccinated situation, you will have

0:18:38.200 --> 0:18:40.720
<v Speaker 1>much lower risk of that. But if the problem for

0:18:40.800 --> 0:18:44.840
<v Speaker 1>patients is that um, they've got the virus and then

0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:48.280
<v Speaker 1>there's other stuff that happens in the body, the immune

0:18:48.280 --> 0:18:51.560
<v Speaker 1>system have been going crazy, etcetera, that causes that long

0:18:51.640 --> 0:18:55.159
<v Speaker 1>haul issue with that long COVID. Then of course the

0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:58.480
<v Speaker 1>vaccine won't help that, except that if you never get

0:18:58.560 --> 0:18:59.680
<v Speaker 1>a proper disease from the