WEBVTT - Pfizer Fights to Keep Their Vaccine Recipe Secret

0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:04.280
<v Speaker 1>It's Monday, November. I'm Oscar Ramirez from the Daily Dive

0:00:04.360 --> 0:00:08.719
<v Speaker 1>podcast in Los Angeles, and this is Reopening America. Fiser

0:00:08.800 --> 0:00:11.520
<v Speaker 1>recently struck a licensing deal with the Medical Patents Pool,

0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:14.360
<v Speaker 1>which in turn construct deals with other manufacturers to make

0:00:14.400 --> 0:00:17.760
<v Speaker 1>generic versions of its COVID anti viral pill for poorer countries.

0:00:18.160 --> 0:00:20.160
<v Speaker 1>But when it comes to its m R and A vaccine,

0:00:20.239 --> 0:00:22.520
<v Speaker 1>Fiser has not been so willing to share the recipe.

0:00:22.920 --> 0:00:25.360
<v Speaker 1>They stand to make thirty six billion dollars in revenue

0:00:25.400 --> 0:00:27.440
<v Speaker 1>this year and have said that they will increase their

0:00:27.440 --> 0:00:31.960
<v Speaker 1>shipments to poor countries at adjusted prices. Stephanie Baker, senior

0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:34.800
<v Speaker 1>writer at Bloomberg News, joins us for the fight over

0:00:34.880 --> 0:00:38.040
<v Speaker 1>profits and the lopsided global supply of vaccines. Thanks for

0:00:38.120 --> 0:00:41.400
<v Speaker 1>joining us, Stephanie. Thank you. There's been a lot of

0:00:41.479 --> 0:00:44.800
<v Speaker 1>interesting news with Fiser very recently. One of the things

0:00:44.800 --> 0:00:47.840
<v Speaker 1>that popped out was that they just signed a deal

0:00:47.920 --> 0:00:50.720
<v Speaker 1>with a u N back group to allow other manufacturers

0:00:50.720 --> 0:00:53.840
<v Speaker 1>to make its experimental COVID nineteen pill. There's a lot

0:00:53.840 --> 0:00:56.600
<v Speaker 1>of hope behind this that it would bring access to

0:00:56.640 --> 0:01:00.160
<v Speaker 1>this medicine to a large part of the world. They're

0:01:00.160 --> 0:01:02.760
<v Speaker 1>gonna be working with the medicine's patent pool, which would

0:01:02.800 --> 0:01:05.440
<v Speaker 1>let generic drug companies produce this pill for use in

0:01:05.480 --> 0:01:08.840
<v Speaker 1>a bunch of different countries. Great news. On the other

0:01:08.880 --> 0:01:11.440
<v Speaker 1>side of things, when we talk about the actual vaccine,

0:01:11.520 --> 0:01:14.200
<v Speaker 1>the Fiser vaccine, the with beyond tech that they have,

0:01:14.680 --> 0:01:16.959
<v Speaker 1>that is a little trickier. They are holding that a

0:01:16.959 --> 0:01:19.960
<v Speaker 1>little closer to the chest and don't really want to

0:01:20.319 --> 0:01:23.760
<v Speaker 1>let others know that secret recipe and allow others to

0:01:23.840 --> 0:01:27.760
<v Speaker 1>manufacture the vaccine um Their stand to make thirty six

0:01:27.880 --> 0:01:31.200
<v Speaker 1>billion dollars off of that this year. So Stephanie tell

0:01:31.280 --> 0:01:33.800
<v Speaker 1>us a little bit about what we're seeing with this. Yeah,

0:01:33.840 --> 0:01:37.280
<v Speaker 1>it's really interesting that Fiser has decided to take this

0:01:37.440 --> 0:01:41.000
<v Speaker 1>different approach with its COVID pill than it's taken with

0:01:41.120 --> 0:01:44.240
<v Speaker 1>the vaccine. You know, we've seen from the past year.

0:01:44.360 --> 0:01:47.160
<v Speaker 1>Ever since they read out their results from their COVID

0:01:47.280 --> 0:01:50.960
<v Speaker 1>vaccine trial, they have kept a tight grip on the

0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:55.520
<v Speaker 1>vaccine manufacturing process, keeping most of it in house through

0:01:55.600 --> 0:01:58.800
<v Speaker 1>facilities and their factories in uh the United States as

0:01:58.800 --> 0:02:02.400
<v Speaker 1>well as in Belgium, and they really resisted calls to

0:02:03.120 --> 0:02:09.000
<v Speaker 1>either do licensed manufacturing deals with other vaccine manufacturers around

0:02:09.040 --> 0:02:13.760
<v Speaker 1>the world. Particularly in low income countries like Africa or Asia,

0:02:14.120 --> 0:02:19.040
<v Speaker 1>and they have opposed this proposal at the World Trade

0:02:19.120 --> 0:02:24.920
<v Speaker 1>Organization to waive intellectual property protections on COVID vaccines and therapeutics,

0:02:25.400 --> 0:02:28.480
<v Speaker 1>and you know, they really just sort of resisted all

0:02:28.600 --> 0:02:33.000
<v Speaker 1>the calls to either share the technology or just do

0:02:33.120 --> 0:02:37.480
<v Speaker 1>more license manufacturing deals with a wider array of producers.

0:02:37.720 --> 0:02:41.560
<v Speaker 1>So I think you might conclude by that that they

0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:44.600
<v Speaker 1>perhaps have learned their lesson from the past year that

0:02:44.680 --> 0:02:48.280
<v Speaker 1>they need to be more inclusive and perhaps have decided

0:02:48.320 --> 0:02:51.320
<v Speaker 1>to take a different approach with the covid pill. Now,

0:02:51.360 --> 0:02:54.720
<v Speaker 1>it could be that the covid pill is potentially easier

0:02:54.760 --> 0:02:58.760
<v Speaker 1>to produce. Vaccines are very complicated. There's something like two

0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:01.919
<v Speaker 1>d and eighty six compos oonents from nineteen countries that

0:03:02.000 --> 0:03:04.639
<v Speaker 1>go into the covid vaccine that Fiser and its German

0:03:04.639 --> 0:03:07.160
<v Speaker 1>partner by in Tech make. I think the covid pill

0:03:07.280 --> 0:03:10.800
<v Speaker 1>is probably a simpler product to outsourced two generic producers.

0:03:10.880 --> 0:03:13.840
<v Speaker 1>That may be one factor at play. Yeah, and until now,

0:03:14.000 --> 0:03:15.800
<v Speaker 1>you know, we we always knew was going to be

0:03:15.880 --> 0:03:19.280
<v Speaker 1>that race to buy up as many doses as you can,

0:03:19.400 --> 0:03:21.560
<v Speaker 1>and we saw that with very much with all the

0:03:21.639 --> 0:03:24.839
<v Speaker 1>higher income countries, and that's exactly how it played out

0:03:24.840 --> 0:03:28.240
<v Speaker 1>for pretty much every vaccine they FISER, for their part,

0:03:28.320 --> 0:03:32.239
<v Speaker 1>has started to make more shipments supporter countries, but they're

0:03:32.280 --> 0:03:34.800
<v Speaker 1>really in dire need of more doses that I think

0:03:35.560 --> 0:03:38.360
<v Speaker 1>from the article. You know, Africa only six percent of

0:03:38.360 --> 0:03:41.360
<v Speaker 1>the people that are fully inoculated as of early November.

0:03:41.640 --> 0:03:44.280
<v Speaker 1>I mean, that's almost nothing right there. So I know

0:03:44.320 --> 0:03:47.400
<v Speaker 1>FISER is starting to increase those shipments, but that's why

0:03:47.400 --> 0:03:49.760
<v Speaker 1>people are asking for, you know, the a waiver of

0:03:49.800 --> 0:03:53.400
<v Speaker 1>the intellectual property. Maybe they can start manufacturing in different places.

0:03:53.440 --> 0:03:55.240
<v Speaker 1>I know they were trying to set up a hub

0:03:55.600 --> 0:03:57.640
<v Speaker 1>in Africa as well, just to help with all of this,

0:03:58.520 --> 0:04:01.720
<v Speaker 1>right the medicine's patent. The group, the u N back

0:04:01.880 --> 0:04:05.160
<v Speaker 1>group that that FISER says it will cooperate with on

0:04:05.200 --> 0:04:09.720
<v Speaker 1>the COVID pill. They're sponsoring this m rn A vaccine

0:04:09.760 --> 0:04:13.800
<v Speaker 1>manufacturing hub in South Africa, but haven't gotten much feedback

0:04:13.800 --> 0:04:17.280
<v Speaker 1>from any of the m RNA producers on that. So yeah,

0:04:17.320 --> 0:04:19.920
<v Speaker 1>there's this huge push to try to get more vaccines out.

0:04:19.960 --> 0:04:22.479
<v Speaker 1>I mean, FISER did this big deal with the US

0:04:22.560 --> 0:04:25.560
<v Speaker 1>government after a huge amount of pressure on them to

0:04:25.640 --> 0:04:29.839
<v Speaker 1>do more, including the US backing this i P waiver

0:04:30.000 --> 0:04:32.520
<v Speaker 1>proposal at the w t O, which really shocked the

0:04:32.560 --> 0:04:37.680
<v Speaker 1>world that the US, a staunch supporter of intellectual property protections,

0:04:37.680 --> 0:04:39.960
<v Speaker 1>would back something like that. It was a real gut

0:04:40.000 --> 0:04:44.120
<v Speaker 1>punch to the pharmaceutical industry. So after that, Fiser did

0:04:44.160 --> 0:04:47.480
<v Speaker 1>this big deal for a billion doses, selling those at

0:04:47.560 --> 0:04:49.359
<v Speaker 1>cost to the U S Government, and the U S

0:04:49.400 --> 0:04:52.599
<v Speaker 1>Government would in turn turn around and donate those two

0:04:52.760 --> 0:04:56.360
<v Speaker 1>low and middle income countries. But however, only about two

0:04:56.720 --> 0:04:59.800
<v Speaker 1>million of those donated doses will ship by the end

0:04:59.839 --> 0:05:02.760
<v Speaker 1>of this year, so the vast majority of that supply

0:05:03.240 --> 0:05:07.920
<v Speaker 1>will only arrive the middle of next year, possibly towards

0:05:07.960 --> 0:05:11.599
<v Speaker 1>the end. You know, the production is very much prioritized

0:05:11.680 --> 0:05:15.119
<v Speaker 1>to paying customers, mostly in wealthy countries who are rolling

0:05:15.120 --> 0:05:17.880
<v Speaker 1>out these booster campaigns. And that's an interesting part of

0:05:17.880 --> 0:05:21.360
<v Speaker 1>it too, because their CEO basically was talking about how

0:05:21.400 --> 0:05:23.320
<v Speaker 1>they sell this, and they say that they do sell

0:05:23.360 --> 0:05:26.599
<v Speaker 1>it on a sliding scale, right, so higher income countries

0:05:26.640 --> 0:05:29.640
<v Speaker 1>get it at one price, they slash that price a

0:05:29.640 --> 0:05:32.760
<v Speaker 1>little bit more for middle income countries, and for poorer countries,

0:05:32.800 --> 0:05:35.839
<v Speaker 1>they're basically selling it at cost. And part of their

0:05:35.960 --> 0:05:39.080
<v Speaker 1>argument for fiser. They say, well, let's say we do

0:05:39.160 --> 0:05:41.040
<v Speaker 1>give up the I P. What let's say we do

0:05:41.120 --> 0:05:44.760
<v Speaker 1>let other people manufactured. For them to ramp up any

0:05:44.800 --> 0:05:47.159
<v Speaker 1>type of production is going to take them a year

0:05:47.240 --> 0:05:49.880
<v Speaker 1>to eighteen months to do all of that. In the meantime,

0:05:49.880 --> 0:05:53.280
<v Speaker 1>they're saying, we're manufacturing this at a at a fast pace,

0:05:53.520 --> 0:05:56.200
<v Speaker 1>We're going to meet all those numbers by that time. Anyways,

0:05:56.960 --> 0:05:59.000
<v Speaker 1>part of me does agree with that, and I see

0:05:59.000 --> 0:06:01.240
<v Speaker 1>the point that it's it's we're pretty late in the

0:06:01.279 --> 0:06:03.320
<v Speaker 1>game at this point to be trying to start up

0:06:03.360 --> 0:06:07.440
<v Speaker 1>new manufacturing sites that will make a dent in the pandemic.

0:06:07.560 --> 0:06:11.120
<v Speaker 1>As it stands now, it will take maybe not eighteen months. Look,

0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:14.280
<v Speaker 1>Fighter stood up its own manufacturing capacity much more quickly,

0:06:14.480 --> 0:06:18.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, within nine months, um. It possibly even shorter.

0:06:18.760 --> 0:06:21.159
<v Speaker 1>And they know a lot more about the manufacturing process

0:06:21.160 --> 0:06:23.880
<v Speaker 1>now than they did a year ago. So we're in

0:06:23.920 --> 0:06:27.160
<v Speaker 1>a different world now. And the real question is we

0:06:27.200 --> 0:06:28.960
<v Speaker 1>don't know if we're going to the world is going

0:06:29.040 --> 0:06:31.960
<v Speaker 1>to need an annual booster shot. We just don't know

0:06:32.040 --> 0:06:34.919
<v Speaker 1>at this point, So we could be constantly playing catch

0:06:35.000 --> 0:06:40.240
<v Speaker 1>up of needing seven billion doses potentially a year to

0:06:40.320 --> 0:06:43.159
<v Speaker 1>try to get the vast majority of the population with

0:06:43.240 --> 0:06:46.320
<v Speaker 1>immunity to keep the pandemic at bay, and and and

0:06:46.440 --> 0:06:49.840
<v Speaker 1>push it towards an endemic virus that is still there

0:06:49.880 --> 0:06:53.359
<v Speaker 1>but not shutting down economies. Yeah, and that's an interesting

0:06:53.400 --> 0:06:55.280
<v Speaker 1>what you're right, We don't know right now, but it

0:06:55.400 --> 0:06:58.160
<v Speaker 1>seems like it's heading that way. We've seen studies saying

0:06:58.200 --> 0:07:00.560
<v Speaker 1>that the effectiveness of the vaccine of all of them,

0:07:00.600 --> 0:07:03.920
<v Speaker 1>really start waning after a period of time, so you know,

0:07:03.960 --> 0:07:06.839
<v Speaker 1>the need for boosters might be a more commonplace thing.

0:07:07.240 --> 0:07:09.320
<v Speaker 1>One of the interesting things too, that you wrote about

0:07:09.920 --> 0:07:14.920
<v Speaker 1>is just making contracts with other countries and Fightser asking

0:07:14.960 --> 0:07:18.240
<v Speaker 1>for you know, the waving of certain liabilities and all that.

0:07:18.280 --> 0:07:20.400
<v Speaker 1>Can you talk to the speak to that a little bit,

0:07:20.400 --> 0:07:23.880
<v Speaker 1>because that was really interesting. It said that in some

0:07:23.920 --> 0:07:27.560
<v Speaker 1>cases deals are starting to fall apart because of that. Yeah.

0:07:27.600 --> 0:07:31.440
<v Speaker 1>This was really fascinating and incredibly difficult to report out.

0:07:31.520 --> 0:07:37.440
<v Speaker 1>It was so secretive. Fighter asked for nondisclosure agreements confidentiality

0:07:37.480 --> 0:07:41.080
<v Speaker 1>agreements with all the countries that it was doing manufacturing

0:07:41.120 --> 0:07:44.720
<v Speaker 1>deals with, so some of the contracts leaked out. We

0:07:44.800 --> 0:07:47.480
<v Speaker 1>got reports from some of the countries that were upset

0:07:47.680 --> 0:07:52.560
<v Speaker 1>with viser's demands for complete indemnity. You know, they wanted

0:07:52.600 --> 0:07:57.680
<v Speaker 1>protection against all liabilities associated with the vaccine, including negligence,

0:07:58.160 --> 0:08:01.280
<v Speaker 1>which some for some countries that felt like a step

0:08:01.280 --> 0:08:04.040
<v Speaker 1>too far. Now you're dealing with legal systems in different

0:08:04.080 --> 0:08:07.280
<v Speaker 1>countries that vary widely, so how do you interpret what

0:08:07.480 --> 0:08:10.680
<v Speaker 1>quote unquote negligence means. But you know, they did not

0:08:10.800 --> 0:08:14.320
<v Speaker 1>want to be held liable for mistakes made in the

0:08:14.320 --> 0:08:19.160
<v Speaker 1>manufacturing process or doses that perhaps spoiled along the way.

0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:21.920
<v Speaker 1>And to some extent, you can understand that they're rushing.

0:08:22.320 --> 0:08:24.960
<v Speaker 1>We're in the middle of a pandemic. It's a it's

0:08:24.960 --> 0:08:29.200
<v Speaker 1>an emergency. You don't want to necessarily have pharmaceutical companies

0:08:29.320 --> 0:08:31.520
<v Speaker 1>not step up to the plate because they're worried that

0:08:31.560 --> 0:08:34.360
<v Speaker 1>they might be held liable because they're rushing, and you know,

0:08:34.640 --> 0:08:38.880
<v Speaker 1>mistakes do happen. But this did hold up negotiations in

0:08:38.920 --> 0:08:44.040
<v Speaker 1>a number of countries South Africa, Argentina, Brazil, you know

0:08:44.080 --> 0:08:46.480
<v Speaker 1>who pushed back on the kind of demands that fires

0:08:46.520 --> 0:08:49.800
<v Speaker 1>are made, including in some cases they were asking to

0:08:49.840 --> 0:08:52.000
<v Speaker 1>put up collateral. How are you going to pay for

0:08:52.080 --> 0:08:55.280
<v Speaker 1>us and pay for any claims related to the vaccine

0:08:55.280 --> 0:08:58.080
<v Speaker 1>if something should go wrong. That includes you know, adverse

0:08:58.120 --> 0:09:01.080
<v Speaker 1>events from you know, individuals who we know the vaccines

0:09:01.080 --> 0:09:04.560
<v Speaker 1>are very safe, but there are occasionally in cases where

0:09:04.720 --> 0:09:07.560
<v Speaker 1>you know, if someone reacts badly, and there there's compensation

0:09:07.640 --> 0:09:10.080
<v Speaker 1>programs set up in the United States to deal with that.

0:09:10.440 --> 0:09:13.880
<v Speaker 1>They wanted to replicate those kind of protections worldwide, and

0:09:13.960 --> 0:09:16.319
<v Speaker 1>most countries didn't have a system set up for that,

0:09:16.880 --> 0:09:19.400
<v Speaker 1>a sort of vaccine compensation scheme, and that's what they

0:09:19.400 --> 0:09:22.000
<v Speaker 1>were trying to replicate. So they had huge sway over

0:09:22.360 --> 0:09:25.400
<v Speaker 1>you know, new laws being written in these countries to

0:09:25.480 --> 0:09:28.240
<v Speaker 1>set up these sort of schemes, and you know that

0:09:28.240 --> 0:09:31.880
<v Speaker 1>that caused delays. We're talking about Fiser and you know

0:09:31.920 --> 0:09:34.199
<v Speaker 1>they've had nothing but first and a lot of this.

0:09:34.480 --> 0:09:37.480
<v Speaker 1>You can call them probably the the global front and

0:09:37.520 --> 0:09:41.800
<v Speaker 1>runner in this COVID vaccine race. How have other vaccine

0:09:42.000 --> 0:09:44.920
<v Speaker 1>makers fared in all this and sharing this and you

0:09:44.920 --> 0:09:47.440
<v Speaker 1>know what we're talking about getting as many people across

0:09:47.440 --> 0:09:50.880
<v Speaker 1>the world now access to these vaccines. Maderna Johnson and Johnson,

0:09:51.160 --> 0:09:53.680
<v Speaker 1>astros Eneka some other big players in this. How have

0:09:53.720 --> 0:09:56.280
<v Speaker 1>they fared with all this and trying to share their

0:09:56.320 --> 0:10:00.840
<v Speaker 1>recipes for this? Right? So, Maderna, for On, a small

0:10:00.880 --> 0:10:04.440
<v Speaker 1>biotech company that had never produced a license drug before

0:10:04.920 --> 0:10:08.880
<v Speaker 1>and you know, produced this fantastic mRNA vaccine. But they

0:10:08.880 --> 0:10:13.760
<v Speaker 1>employed about a thousand people. There are tiny company that is. Um.

0:10:13.800 --> 0:10:15.559
<v Speaker 1>It was kind of incredible that they stood up the

0:10:15.600 --> 0:10:18.760
<v Speaker 1>amount of manufacturing that they did given how small they are.

0:10:19.400 --> 0:10:21.440
<v Speaker 1>They were aiming for a billion doses by the end

0:10:21.480 --> 0:10:24.040
<v Speaker 1>of this year. So far they supplied a little over

0:10:24.559 --> 0:10:27.160
<v Speaker 1>fifty million. I believe off the top of my head,

0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:29.800
<v Speaker 1>I think they may fall slightly short of their target

0:10:30.160 --> 0:10:31.920
<v Speaker 1>of a billion doses by the end of the year.

0:10:31.960 --> 0:10:34.280
<v Speaker 1>And you know, they when this w t O proposal

0:10:34.320 --> 0:10:36.920
<v Speaker 1>to wave IP rights came up, they said, look, we're

0:10:36.920 --> 0:10:40.240
<v Speaker 1>not going to enforce our our patents. UM. During the pandemic,

0:10:40.360 --> 0:10:42.560
<v Speaker 1>they were sort of a bit hands off. It was,

0:10:42.880 --> 0:10:45.679
<v Speaker 1>you know, it's hard to replicate these vaccines, so that

0:10:45.760 --> 0:10:48.840
<v Speaker 1>was an easy thing to say. But um, you know,

0:10:49.080 --> 0:10:53.040
<v Speaker 1>and they were charging quite high prices. On the flip side,

0:10:53.040 --> 0:10:56.480
<v Speaker 1>you have astras Enka, which promised their vaccine would be

0:10:56.559 --> 0:11:00.360
<v Speaker 1>not for profit for the world and did these licence

0:11:00.440 --> 0:11:04.520
<v Speaker 1>manufacturing deals, including with the world's largest vaccine manufacturer in India.

0:11:04.600 --> 0:11:08.200
<v Speaker 1>The ceremon Institute, and the vast majority of their doses

0:11:08.280 --> 0:11:11.360
<v Speaker 1>they've produced about the same amount as fies are two billions,

0:11:11.360 --> 0:11:13.760
<v Speaker 1>just over two billion. Vast majority of their doses have

0:11:13.880 --> 0:11:16.200
<v Speaker 1>gone to low and middle income countries. A lot of

0:11:16.240 --> 0:11:19.319
<v Speaker 1>big chunk of that is because of India, which threw

0:11:19.400 --> 0:11:23.120
<v Speaker 1>up it's the gates and refused to allow the vaccines

0:11:23.480 --> 0:11:26.559
<v Speaker 1>produced in India to leave the country, as you were called.

0:11:26.600 --> 0:11:30.200
<v Speaker 1>They had a terrible time with the pandemic with a

0:11:30.240 --> 0:11:33.720
<v Speaker 1>wave of COVID deaths, and then they've recently said that

0:11:33.800 --> 0:11:38.439
<v Speaker 1>they will start charging a bit more to high income countries.

0:11:38.640 --> 0:11:41.720
<v Speaker 1>They've abandoned that that not for profit pledge, which was

0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:46.280
<v Speaker 1>a sad but probably inevitable move given that they had

0:11:46.400 --> 0:11:49.240
<v Speaker 1>given had so many problems with the vaccine rollout and

0:11:49.280 --> 0:11:53.160
<v Speaker 1>gotten such bad press on for a number of different reasons. Yeah,

0:11:53.160 --> 0:11:55.760
<v Speaker 1>and as they mentioned, you know, as the pandemic does

0:11:55.840 --> 0:11:58.920
<v Speaker 1>turn endemic, you know this, we're going to probably see

0:11:58.920 --> 0:12:01.080
<v Speaker 1>a lot of this and we'll see how fiser affairs

0:12:01.080 --> 0:12:02.680
<v Speaker 1>and all of this. They're gonna hold it pretty close.

0:12:02.679 --> 0:12:05.360
<v Speaker 1>There's obviously stands to a lot of money to be made,

0:12:05.400 --> 0:12:08.400
<v Speaker 1>but it's very very complex. As we've been talking about,

0:12:08.440 --> 0:12:10.640
<v Speaker 1>so we'll see how Fiser fares with all of that.

0:12:11.120 --> 0:12:14.560
<v Speaker 1>Stephanie Baker, Senior writer at Bloomberg News, thank you very

0:12:14.600 --> 0:12:20.080
<v Speaker 1>much for joining us. Thank you. I'm Oscar Ramirez and

0:12:20.120 --> 0:12:23.600
<v Speaker 1>this has been reopening America. Don't forget effort today's big

0:12:23.600 --> 0:12:25.160
<v Speaker 1>news stories. You can check me out on the Daily

0:12:25.200 --> 0:12:28.160
<v Speaker 1>Dive podcast every money through Friday. So follow us in

0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:30.640
<v Speaker 1>I Heart radio or wherever you get your podcast