Speaker 1: When you block emotion out, what you can end up
Speaker 1: doing is blocking them all out. So I'll often have
Speaker 1: people who get to therapy after years of doing that
Speaker 1: and they feel numb, and they not only have they
Speaker 1: managed to block out all these negative emotions, so life
Speaker 1: is less painful in that way, it's almost become more
Speaker 1: painful because they've also blocked out their ability to feel
Speaker 1: joy or pleasure or love, and they start to question, gosh,
Speaker 1: do I love my partner? Hey, everyone, welcome back to
Speaker 1: On Purpose, the number one health podcast in the world.
Speaker 1: Thanks to each and every single one of you that
Speaker 1: come back every week to listen, learn, and grow, and
Speaker 1: I am so excited to be talking to you today.
Speaker 1: I can't believe it. My new book, Eight Rules of
Speaker 1: Love is out and I cannot wait to share it
Speaker 1: with you. I am so so excited for you to
Speaker 1: read this book, for you to listen to this book.
Speaker 1: I read the audio book. If you haven't got it already,
Speaker 1: make sure you go to eight Rules of Love dot com.
Speaker 1: It's dedicated to anyone who's trying to find, keep, or
Speaker 1: let go of love. So if you've got friends that
Speaker 1: are dating, broken up, or struggling with love, make sure
Speaker 1: you grab this book and I'd love to invite you
Speaker 1: to come and see me for my global tour Love Rules.
Speaker 1: Go to Jay shedytour dot com to learn more information
Speaker 1: about tickets, VIP experiences and more. I can't wait to
Speaker 1: see you this year now. Today's guest is someone that
Speaker 1: I've been following on social media for nearly the past
Speaker 1: couple of years now, and I have loved her content
Speaker 1: the way she presents ideas that are hard to understand
Speaker 1: in simple ways through incredible props and demonstrations. I'm blown
Speaker 1: away by her ability to communicate difficult ideas with ease, simplicity,
Speaker 1: and practicality. I'm talking about the one and only doctor
Speaker 1: Julie Smith, who's a clinical psychologist with over a decade
Speaker 1: of professional experience, having previously worked in the NHS with
Speaker 1: veterans and the mod in addiction and crisis centers, and
Speaker 1: now in private practice. She's also an online educator and
Speaker 1: social media star, sharing bite sized mental health and motivational
Speaker 1: videos online with a combined following of more than three
Speaker 1: and a half million. In November twenty nineteen, Julie launched
Speaker 1: her TikTok account to make her services and education about
Speaker 1: mental health more accessible during the COVID nineteen pandemic. Doctor
Speaker 1: Julie's audience on TikTok grew astronomically as young people related
Speaker 1: to the video she was making about mental health and
Speaker 1: her advice to use. Now. I am so excited because
Speaker 1: in front of me, I have her first amazing book
Speaker 1: that's out called Why Has Nobody told Me this before?
Speaker 1: Everyday Tools for Life's Ups and Downs? I want you
Speaker 1: to go out and grab a copy. It's already a
Speaker 1: number one Sundaytimes bestseller, a best selling book. Please, please,
Speaker 1: please go out and grab a copy of this, Doctor
Speaker 1: Julie Smith, Welcome to the show. Thank you for being here, Oh,
Speaker 1: thank you for having me. It's absolute pleasure up and
Speaker 1: really looking forward to it. I know we've been trying
Speaker 1: to make this happen for some time. Let's dive straight in.
Speaker 1: I want to understand what you saw as the greatest
Speaker 1: challenge of people that you were working with. When you
Speaker 1: looked at the root challenges of patients you worked with,
Speaker 1: clients you worked with, people, you saw, people you spoke to.
Speaker 1: What are some of the biggest challenges that you think
Speaker 1: people are dealing with right now? When you look at
Speaker 1: the root, not the symptoms, not the leaves, but the
Speaker 1: root of the problem, the root of the tree. You know,
Speaker 1: that root of the problem can be different for everybody,
Speaker 1: But certainly what motivated me to begin all of this
Speaker 1: kind of stuff and step out of the therapy room
Speaker 1: a little bit was this sort of common theme of
Speaker 1: people coming along to therapy and expecting me to do
Speaker 1: something to them, so that so therapy was some sort
Speaker 1: of treatment that would be done to them because they
Speaker 1: felt at the mercy of how they felt, and a
Speaker 1: lot of people didn't have the education about how their
Speaker 1: own mind works and how their own body works. To
Speaker 1: feel empowered by the idea that you can influence how
Speaker 1: you feel, that you don't have to be completely at
Speaker 1: the mercy of it. There are things you can do
Speaker 1: to help yourself. And often once people had that information,
Speaker 1: that was a real game changer, because suddenly, hang on
Speaker 1: a minute, there are some tools I can learn that
Speaker 1: could help. And it doesn't have to be rocket science.
Speaker 1: It doesn't have to all be out of my hands.
Speaker 1: It's not something the doctor's going to do to me.
Speaker 1: It's not this kind of spooky, you know, sort of
Speaker 1: magical thing that I can't do myself. So I think
Speaker 1: that really sort of fired me up. That there was
Speaker 1: a lot of information and education that is often provided
Speaker 1: within certain therapies. Anyway, that just is a life changing
Speaker 1: for people because it enabled to take their health into
Speaker 1: their own hands a bit more and not feel that
Speaker 1: there are the mercy of it. Yeah, absolutely, I love that.
Speaker 1: I mean that was such a great piece of insight
Speaker 1: because I think we all secretly hope that there's going
Speaker 1: to be someone out there who comes and solves all
Speaker 1: our problems, right, whether it's a therapist, or whether it's
Speaker 1: a partner, or whether it's a friend, or whether it's
Speaker 1: a mentor or a coach or whoever it may be.
Speaker 1: I think we all secretly hope that there's someone out
Speaker 1: there who's just going to magically turn up and be
Speaker 1: our fairy godmother and sprinkle their magic dust and all
Speaker 1: of a sudden our lives going to look different. And
Speaker 1: what you're kind of saying, which is the inconvenient, painful truth,
Speaker 1: is that well, actually, or actually it's a fortunate thing,
Speaker 1: it's a beautiful thing, is that actually it's all within
Speaker 1: your own control. You have the ability to make choices
Speaker 1: and habits and practices that can define that. Why do
Speaker 1: you think it is that we are looking to outsource
Speaker 1: our well being or outsource our journey? Why is it
Speaker 1: that we're trying to say fix me or solve me?
Speaker 1: Where does that come from? I think it comes from
Speaker 1: sometimes not knowing, not knowing that there are things you
Speaker 1: can do that help, and that I think there's a
Speaker 1: sort of culture around needing to buy something that is
Speaker 1: going to fit. You know, it's good marketing. I think
Speaker 1: you know that lots of companies are based on making
Speaker 1: you feel like there's something wrong with you and they
Speaker 1: can fix it if you buy this product off there.
Speaker 1: And but also mixed in with the fact that there
Speaker 1: isn't enough education around how your mind works and how
Speaker 1: you can manage your own health. We get a little
Speaker 1: bit of that around physical health, but nothing really in
Speaker 1: terms of mental health. And I kind of felt like,
Speaker 1: you know, all these people want to say we're having
Speaker 1: some of these little bits of education that we're really
Speaker 1: making this difference. Day today, I was kind of thinking,
Speaker 1: why why do people have to pay to come and
Speaker 1: see someone like me to find that out, because you
Speaker 1: know that's not obviously some people come for full therapy,
Speaker 1: which you know is brilliant and helps lots of people.
Speaker 1: But there were a lot of people that were coming
Speaker 1: along and once they had the education, they were raring
Speaker 1: to go. They that was enough, and so I kind
Speaker 1: of wanted to make that more available. Absolutely so for
Speaker 1: those of you who don't have the book in front
Speaker 1: of you yet, I know you will after this podcast,
Speaker 1: doctor Julius talks about everything from moods to motivation, to
Speaker 1: emotional pain, to grief, to self doubt, to fear, to
Speaker 1: stress to meaning all beautiful themes and topics, and we're
Speaker 1: going to dive into a few of my favorites from
Speaker 1: when I've received her book over the holidays, I really
Speaker 1: wanted to talk about mood and I want to dive
Speaker 1: in with you now. I think mood and a low
Speaker 1: mood have become such common experiences now, and the idea
Speaker 1: that we have certain days where we feel good, and
Speaker 1: there are certain days where we just feel bad and
Speaker 1: unmotivated and we don't want to get out of bed
Speaker 1: and we don't feel like doing anything. How do we
Speaker 1: how should we be approaching those days or those weeks
Speaker 1: that start to feel like we're stuck, We're not moving,
Speaker 1: nothing's happening. In our life. How should we approach that
Speaker 1: feeling and emotion. Well, I think it starts with understanding
Speaker 1: that it's a normal part of being a human being.
Speaker 1: And I think that's often something that holds us all
Speaker 1: back is you know, there's this sort of I don't
Speaker 1: know if it was something that's been sort of pushed
Speaker 1: by you social media or anything like that, but it's
Speaker 1: definitely online. Is this idea that that somehow our default
Speaker 1: is one of happiness and contentment and anything outside of
Speaker 1: that means you're getting something wrong and which is just
Speaker 1: absolute rubbish. You know that human beings are built to
Speaker 1: fluctuate and emotions come and go, The pleasant ones come
Speaker 1: and go, and the unpleasant ones come and go as
Speaker 1: a part of that experiences and that's so normal. And
Speaker 1: you know, if you if you wake up and your
Speaker 1: mood isn't as you want it to be, that can
Speaker 1: be caused by so many different things. You know, you
Speaker 1: might have not slept well, you might be dehydrated, you
Speaker 1: might be dealing with something normal like grief, or there
Speaker 1: could be anything. But if you wake up in that
Speaker 1: mood and then respond to that mood by telling yourself
Speaker 1: that you're failing at life because you're not as happy
Speaker 1: as everybody else, or you know, look at that woman
Speaker 1: down the road who's always energetic and always enthusiastic, and
Speaker 1: she must never get a terrible mood like this, And
Speaker 1: what am I getting wrong? And we get into that
Speaker 1: narrative that pulls us further down that spiral, rather than
Speaker 1: allowing us to kind of acknowledge this feeling is here,
Speaker 1: allow it to be present, and allow yourself to also
Speaker 1: then question what could be causing this? So what are
Speaker 1: my needs? Are there any needs that are unmet? And
Speaker 1: can I meet those that could help? And sometimes it
Speaker 1: is just a matter of doing what you can to
Speaker 1: meet those needs if you can identify any, and then
Speaker 1: allowing that to calm naturally. Yeah. No, I like the
Speaker 1: idea of meeting your needs because I think what's really
Speaker 1: interesting about what you just said is that so many
Speaker 1: of us are almost judging ourselves or critiquing ourselves for
Speaker 1: running out of energy. And it's almost like looking at
Speaker 1: your phone on three percent and hating your phone for
Speaker 1: being on three percent battery life, and it's like, well, no,
Speaker 1: a phone is either going to be a hundred or
Speaker 1: ninety or eighty or seventeen it's going to get to
Speaker 1: three or it's going to get to one if you
Speaker 1: don't recharge it. And it's the same thing with us,
Speaker 1: Like you're saying that as humans, our emotions fluctuate, our
Speaker 1: moods fluctuate. We're either at one hundred percent or we're
Speaker 1: at three percent. But we can't start hating ourselves at
Speaker 1: three percent. We can't start judging. We have to go, Okay,
Speaker 1: I need to stop and recharge. I need to stop
Speaker 1: and take a moment. And that's where your question of okay,
Speaker 1: what are my unmet needs? It's almost like, okay, well,
Speaker 1: what do I need to do to charge me? That
Speaker 1: feels like the right way to think about that. I
Speaker 1: think one of the biggest challenges doctortunity you've probably seen
Speaker 1: is that people trying to avoid loan moods. We're trying
Speaker 1: to avoid feeling bad, we're trying to avoid feelings. What
Speaker 1: happens when you try to avoid an emotion or when
Speaker 1: you trying to avoid feeling what actually happens to us? Yeah,
Speaker 1: well it can get quite extreme, you know, if we
Speaker 1: have these kind of blocking behaviors. So if a feeling
Speaker 1: is aversive in some way, whatever it might be if
Speaker 1: we as soon as we start to feel it or
Speaker 1: even see signs of it that they might be approaching,
Speaker 1: we put in those blocking behaviors, and so I don't know,
Speaker 1: you might find yourself with your head in the fridge
Speaker 1: looking for something to eat, or you might find yourself,
Speaker 1: you know, on Netflix, just watching program after program, or
Speaker 1: or drinking or whatever. That blocking behavior is for that person,
Speaker 1: maybe staying really busy at work and trying to convince
Speaker 1: yourself you know that you've got all this energy or whatever.
Speaker 1: But when you do that, when you when you block
Speaker 1: emotion out, what you can end up doing is blocking
Speaker 1: them all out. So I'll often have people who get
Speaker 1: to therapy after years of doing that and they feel numb,
Speaker 1: and they not only have they managed to block out
Speaker 1: all these negative emotions so life is less painful in
Speaker 1: that way, it's almost become more painful because they've also
Speaker 1: blocked out their ability to feel joy or pleasure or love,
Speaker 1: and they start to question, gosh, do I love my partner?
Speaker 1: You know, I'm not interested in all the things that
Speaker 1: I used to find pleasurable. And there's this kind of numbness,
Speaker 1: and people imagine that there's this sort of you know,
Speaker 1: emotions have this bad rap, don't they, where they're apparently
Speaker 1: this kind of irrational mess that you need to stay
Speaker 1: away from in order to be a highly functioning individual,
Speaker 1: rather than it being a part of how we work.
Speaker 1: And so, you know, by by pushing all of those
Speaker 1: away and trying to stay away from them with the
Speaker 1: idea that will somehow be kind of logical beings, actually
Speaker 1: being devoid of emotion strips away your life in terms
Speaker 1: of your sense of meaning or your enjoyment from life.
Speaker 1: And so that idea that you know, if you block
Speaker 1: one emotion well enough, you'll also block a lot of
Speaker 1: others and then and then you can really start to struggle.
Speaker 1: So a lot of what we do in therapy is,
Speaker 1: you know, changing our relationship with emotion is looking at
Speaker 1: how can we allow emotional experience to come and go
Speaker 1: and not only accept it but also welcome it. You know,
Speaker 1: how could you allow fear or low mood or sadness
Speaker 1: to be there and let it be welcome in the
Speaker 1: present moment. I mean, that's just a bizarre kind of
Speaker 1: state of affairs, right how. You know, we've never been
Speaker 1: taught to do that. You're taught to kind of brush
Speaker 1: it off and pretend it's not happening and make it
Speaker 1: go away. And so it's a kind of new experience
Speaker 1: and honestly, you'll know a lot about this yourself, with
Speaker 1: you know, using sort of mindfulness to be able to
Speaker 1: practice sitting there and allowing experiences to come and go. Yeah. No,
Speaker 1: I think the biggest thing I took away from what
Speaker 1: you shared just there's this idea of blocking behaviors that
Speaker 1: seem like very normal behaviors, and they seem very easy
Speaker 1: and accessible, and they feel like they make sense. They
Speaker 1: look normal because a lot of people do them, and
Speaker 1: then when you really break it down and you go, oh, yeah, wow,
Speaker 1: that's a blocking behavior. I'm actually trying to just numb
Speaker 1: myself from feeling things. And I love what you said
Speaker 1: where you were like, well, actually, if you number yourself
Speaker 1: from feeling something, you potentially can number yourself from feeling
Speaker 1: anything like everything, a lot of other positive emotions as well.
Speaker 1: And so by weakening your ability to feel pain, you
Speaker 1: actually weaken your ability to feel joy. And that idea
Speaker 1: is really fascinating because that as a block is a
Speaker 1: block that we all know we don't want in our life.
Speaker 1: That's you know, I've loved that you've given me that
Speaker 1: reflection today because I didn't necessarily connect the two in
Speaker 1: that way when you talk a lot about motivation in
Speaker 1: the second chapter. And I'm glad that you touched on
Speaker 1: motivation because I know and I'm sure you get this too.
Speaker 1: I get so many dms on a daily basis or
Speaker 1: messages saying like, I'm not motivated? What do I do?
Speaker 1: How do I find motivation? I don't feel any motivation today.
Speaker 1: And one of the sections in your book that I
Speaker 1: loved is called how do you make yourself do something
Speaker 1: when you don't feel like it? And it's really funny
Speaker 1: because someone asked me recently. They said, Jay, what do
Speaker 1: you think is the greatest skill you can have as
Speaker 1: a human? And I really thought about that, is like,
Speaker 1: what is the greatest skill that you could have as
Speaker 1: a human. And the idea that came to my head
Speaker 1: was the greatest skill you can have as a human
Speaker 1: is being able to do something that's good for you
Speaker 1: even when you don't feel like it, because that is
Speaker 1: the crux of life. Like the amount of days that
Speaker 1: I wake up and actually want to go to the
Speaker 1: gym are very very few, But do I feel amazing
Speaker 1: after going to the gym. Yes, I have. Meditation has
Speaker 1: been a part of my life for a long time,
Speaker 1: so it's changed. I have a healthy relationship with meditation,
Speaker 1: but there are still days when I don't want to meditate,
Speaker 1: or I'm too tired or exhausted, or I'm too bored
Speaker 1: to go to sleep early, and so I'd rather think
Speaker 1: that maybe if I stay up a bit late, I'll
Speaker 1: be more entertained. And so I find that things that
Speaker 1: are good for me feel hard in the beginning but
Speaker 1: feel great afterwards, and things that are bad for me
Speaker 1: feel easy in them beginning, but they're really bad for
Speaker 1: me afterwards. Talk to us a bit about how do
Speaker 1: we get good at doing things when we don't feel
Speaker 1: like it. Because I am completely with you, I think
Speaker 1: that's like an undefeatable skilled that we all need. Yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 1: And I agree with what you were saying there. You know,
Speaker 1: it's that that sort of motivation feeling, that sort of
Speaker 1: elevated energy inspired feeling that you get is the feeling
Speaker 1: you get as you walk out the gym, not as
Speaker 1: you walk in generally, and and it's it's after action
Speaker 1: and effort you then think, you know, I never sort
Speaker 1: of feel like going to the gym eitherough like, but
Speaker 1: when I when I come back from the gym, I
Speaker 1: think I should do this every day. This is great,
Speaker 1: And I think it starts with recognizing that pattern, doesn't
Speaker 1: it recognizing I know I'm not going to always feel
Speaker 1: like it because not because I'm Again, it's not about failure,
Speaker 1: It's not about you know, I think a lot of
Speaker 1: stuff online teachers people. You know, you've just got to
Speaker 1: be motivated every day, and if you're not, then what
Speaker 1: are you doing? And actually humans don't work that way. Motivation.
Speaker 1: You have to treat it like any other emotion. Some
Speaker 1: days it will be there, some days it won't, So
Speaker 1: you can't rely on it to be there to help
Speaker 1: you reach your goals. So, you know, if you've got
Speaker 1: goals that you've set around your own values and what's
Speaker 1: really important to you, you have to then find a
Speaker 1: way of being able to keep that consistent even when
Speaker 1: you don't feel like it. So you can't make the
Speaker 1: decision to act only based on do I feel like
Speaker 1: a bit like cleaning your teeth? Right, So you clean
Speaker 1: your teeth every day, You never consider whether you really
Speaker 1: want to or not. It's just something that you do
Speaker 1: because you consider yourself for someone who looks after their
Speaker 1: dental hygiene, right, and it's you know, it's so it's
Speaker 1: just part of your day. It's non negotiable, and you
Speaker 1: can kind of work with it a little bit like that.
Speaker 1: But when you see emotion as something that can come
Speaker 1: and go, you can then acknowledge that you can tap
Speaker 1: into other reasons for doing the thing that you want
Speaker 1: to do. So I don't feel like going to the
Speaker 1: gym today, but I have set myself a goal to
Speaker 1: in my fitness because it's important to me that I
Speaker 1: am fit and healthy for my children as they grow up.
Speaker 1: I want to be able to play with them and
Speaker 1: live a long life to be with them for as
Speaker 1: long as possible, and those sorts of things, So you're
Speaker 1: tapping into your value system and being absolutely clear on
Speaker 1: why you're doing that thing. And even if it's you know,
Speaker 1: if it's I have to go to this job that
Speaker 1: I hate, it might be because you're going to put
Speaker 1: food on the table at the end of the week
Speaker 1: for your children, or you're going to keep a roof
Speaker 1: over your family's head, And you know, you can tap
Speaker 1: into those sorts of values even if it's something that
Speaker 1: isn't you know, something that you would benefit from sort
Speaker 1: of personally or in terms of your kind of health
Speaker 1: or well being. You know, life can be really tough
Speaker 1: in that way, but you can tap into well, why
Speaker 1: is it that I'm doing this really really hard thing
Speaker 1: that I'm hating. Oh, it's because actually, yeah, I'm the
Speaker 1: breadwinner and it's important to me to look after my
Speaker 1: family and stuff like that. You can kind of tap
Speaker 1: into the values and but also something that's taught in
Speaker 1: a therapy called dialectical behavior therapy dbt UM. It's often
Speaker 1: taught to people who feel overwhelmed with emotion and then
Speaker 1: respond to that emotion in a sort of high risk
Speaker 1: or unhealthy way. And so what you're what you teach
Speaker 1: people is a skill that they call sort of opposite action.
Speaker 1: So and you use mindfulness to help people recognize that
Speaker 1: difference between having an urge to do something and then
Speaker 1: acting on it. So you know your your The trouble is,
Speaker 1: you know your different aspects of your experience are all
Speaker 1: experienced at once. So it's like, I think it's like
Speaker 1: weaves in a basket. You have you have your thoughts,
Speaker 1: and you have your emotions. You have your physical state,
Speaker 1: you have your urges to do or not do something,
Speaker 1: but you don't experience them as separate. You know, you
Speaker 1: don't describe it in your head. You you experience this
Speaker 1: whole thing in one and so you're often acting based
Speaker 1: on urges and there's no gap in between. And so
Speaker 1: you kind of use, you know, a mindfulness practice to
Speaker 1: help just widen that gap so that you can experience
Speaker 1: an urge. And in the book, I talk about just
Speaker 1: silly game that I used to play with my sisters
Speaker 1: growing up, where we would hold polo mints in our
Speaker 1: mouths and it was a competition. See, you could not
Speaker 1: crunch the mint because it's just you just can't do it.
Speaker 1: It's it's impossible, right, And and I didn't realize it
Speaker 1: at the time, but what we were doing there was
Speaker 1: practicing acting opposite to an urge. Um, you know, you
Speaker 1: have this urge to crunch down on the mint, but
Speaker 1: you learn that actually, I can experience that urge and
Speaker 1: not act and I can even do the opposite to that.
Speaker 1: You know you can, and so you get this moment
Speaker 1: to choose, and you know you'll be an expert on
Speaker 1: this yourself. But that, you know, mindfulness helps to open
Speaker 1: up that that gap that allows you to then choose
Speaker 1: whether you're going to go with an urge or go
Speaker 1: opposite to it. You know, so if you wake up
Speaker 1: and the urge to pull the duvet over and switch
Speaker 1: a phone off and shut the world out for the day,
Speaker 1: you get this choice, Okay, do I go with this
Speaker 1: and or do I act opposite to it? And often
Speaker 1: you have to make that decision pretty quick to kind
Speaker 1: of you know, really kind of make the most of
Speaker 1: the moment. But it's it's a great thing. You know.
Speaker 1: You can use things like the sort of the mint
Speaker 1: crunching competitions to just kind of practice being aware of
Speaker 1: that and in kind of lighthearted ways so that you're
Speaker 1: more skilled at doing it when you most need it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: thank you for showing those two massive insights. The first
Speaker 1: one was you talking about how we shouldn't rely on motivation.
Speaker 1: I thought that was such a great way of phrasing it.
Speaker 1: That we're reliant on motivation and we can't be reliant
Speaker 1: on any feeling because we're going to feel different every day.
Speaker 1: And the problem is we're trying to create the same
Speaker 1: feelings every day, and you're spot on that when I
Speaker 1: think about my life, I don't feel the same today
Speaker 1: recording this episode with you as I felt the same
Speaker 1: recording my last episode with the other guests. I feel different,
Speaker 1: And so I can't rely on how I feel. I
Speaker 1: have to rely on why I'm here and why I'm
Speaker 1: doing this, and why I'm trying to serve my community
Speaker 1: and why on purpose listeners want me to show up
Speaker 1: at my best, and I want to show up for them,
Speaker 1: and that's what's driving me, not not how I'm feeling
Speaker 1: right now, and so almost being driven by something else.
Speaker 1: And then coming to what you just said, is that
Speaker 1: difference between the urge and the ability to take that
Speaker 1: space and time to respond. And in the spiritual texts
Speaker 1: when we studied that about the mind, the three words
Speaker 1: were thinking, feeling, and willing, So it being like the
Speaker 1: different the gap between thinking and willing, like from having
Speaker 1: the thought to actually doing it. You you have that
Speaker 1: gap that can that you can adjust and edit and change.
Speaker 1: And you're so right that we almost need to create
Speaker 1: that gap in areas of our life where we're not
Speaker 1: trying to practice, if that makes sense. So what I'm
Speaker 1: trying to say there, and I'd love to hear your
Speaker 1: thoughts on this, Doctor Julius that if you're trying to
Speaker 1: wake up early in the morning, don't practice trying to
Speaker 1: create this gap between the urgent pulling the duvet over
Speaker 1: in that moment. Practice it outside of the moment so
Speaker 1: that then you can bring it into that area, Whereas
Speaker 1: if you practice in that area, chances are your default
Speaker 1: action is going to come across. Does that make sense
Speaker 1: and how could you build that conditioning in another area
Speaker 1: of your life? Yeah? Absolutely, I would say practice with
Speaker 1: things that feel easy and manageable, just to just create
Speaker 1: some repetition in doing that. And actually, you know, nobody
Speaker 1: will be starting from scratch either. You know there will
Speaker 1: be times when you use that skill, but you just
Speaker 1: haven't recognized that you've used it. And sometimes I think
Speaker 1: becoming aware of when you use it and it's successful
Speaker 1: helps you to feel more positive about the fact that
Speaker 1: you can do it. So, um, I don't know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've got young children, so you know sleep deprivation is
Speaker 1: you know torture, and that you know your baby will
Speaker 1: wake up for the sixth time and a night and
Speaker 1: you've got to be up at six for work and
Speaker 1: you hear them cry and you think, I just cannot
Speaker 1: get out of bed one more time, and so your
Speaker 1: body is telling you know that I can't do this
Speaker 1: in a very powerful way, but you do it, and
Speaker 1: you do it because you have a set of values
Speaker 1: about the kind of parent you want to be and
Speaker 1: you know, and so you know in those instances, for example,
Speaker 1: you will be doing things. Or it doesn't even have
Speaker 1: to be at night. It could be anything. You know,
Speaker 1: you might not feel like making another sandwich or you know,
Speaker 1: buying another load of ice creams or whatever it is
Speaker 1: of your family, but you you do things because you
Speaker 1: maybe have a set of values around that or something's
Speaker 1: important to you about that. And so it's really useful
Speaker 1: I think to kind of sit and think about the
Speaker 1: times when you already do that to success, so that
Speaker 1: you can really tap into that and recognize that therefore
Speaker 1: is possible to translate it and like you say, practice
Speaker 1: in a in a way that is enjoyable and manageable.
Speaker 1: And you know, even with the polo thing or you know,
Speaker 1: kind of mindful eating and stuff like that, you know
Speaker 1: where you kind of pause and experience food before you
Speaker 1: allow yourself to then before neat it, for example, or
Speaker 1: just kind of lighthearted things that feel easy because, like
Speaker 1: you say, the first time you do it, it probably
Speaker 1: won't go well, and then you think, oh, this doesn't work,
Speaker 1: move on, and then you're stuck in the same cycle. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I love that. Have you actually done them video? Have
Speaker 1: you done a video on the mints experiment? I think
Speaker 1: it's actually a great one. No, yeah, I haven't. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it would be. It would be good to see you
Speaker 1: do it with your sisters again, that would be. That
Speaker 1: would be amazing. Yeah, I love that one. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: think it's well, maybe you can come and collaborate when
Speaker 1: you come to them. That's what we'll do. That's what
Speaker 1: we'll do. Yeah, you can, we can do the testing it.
Speaker 1: I love that. One of the other things doctor Julie, Actually,
Speaker 1: this just came to mind while you were talking that
Speaker 1: you spoke about, was that we just feel this rush
Speaker 1: of everything at the same time. Can you help my
Speaker 1: community today, an audience today, to understand the difference between thoughts, feelings,
Speaker 1: and emotions because we feel them all, or we experience
Speaker 1: them all, as a better word, we experience them all
Speaker 1: at the same time, and like you said, we don't
Speaker 1: label them effectively. We don't even know the difference, and
Speaker 1: we use the words interchangeably today, and that's probably not
Speaker 1: healthy either, because then when we artic I think language
Speaker 1: is just so important, and the way we articulate how
Speaker 1: we feel or an emotion, if it's incorrect in the
Speaker 1: sense of how it works as a system, we're already
Speaker 1: setting ourselves up for more difficulty. So could you just
Speaker 1: break down for us the three and how to know
Speaker 1: the difference when we your incident? Sure so, certainly, I
Speaker 1: would say some people can tap into more easily one
Speaker 1: over the other. So some people will always be able
Speaker 1: to identify what they think but can't sort of label
Speaker 1: feelings or something like that. Some people will be really
Speaker 1: tapped into how they feel physically in their physical state,
Speaker 1: but won't necessarily recognize thoughts. And that's normal and that's okay.
Speaker 1: In terms of thoughts, I often talk to people about
Speaker 1: it's that you know, the description, the narrative that's going
Speaker 1: on in your head, the way you talk to yourself
Speaker 1: in your head, or the different sort of words that
Speaker 1: pop into your head or images. Even so, it's that
Speaker 1: kind of you know, how you talk to yourself in
Speaker 1: your head. Whereas emotions are of feelings and sensations that
Speaker 1: you have, and then you kind of we often separate
Speaker 1: that from sort of physical sensation and therapy, so we'll
Speaker 1: talk about your physical state, so you know where you
Speaker 1: feel things in your body and how your body feels
Speaker 1: at certain times, and then behavior being I often split
Speaker 1: behavior into urgent action for reasons that we've been just
Speaker 1: talking about to get people to recognize that you might
Speaker 1: have an urge to do something, but you might not
Speaker 1: do it, and so you know, you know, actions are
Speaker 1: what we do or don't do at any given point,
Speaker 1: but you might be able to elaborate on those yourself. Actually,
Speaker 1: I mean, how would you kind of describe emotions? Yeah? No,
Speaker 1: The difference that I've at least understood, and by the way,
Speaker 1: I love what you said, the way I've heard it
Speaker 1: being explained is that feelings are our experiences of emotions.
Speaker 1: So emotions are something that is chemically, biologically, physically happening,
Speaker 1: and then how we feel about what is happening is
Speaker 1: our feeling. So for example, if my body is feeling exhausted,
Speaker 1: if my body is tired, and the emotional experience would
Speaker 1: be you know, low energy, the emotion, the emotional experience
Speaker 1: would be fatigue, etc. We know what's happening with the
Speaker 1: chemicals in that space. Then my feeling is, oh my god,
Speaker 1: I'm so exhausted, I'm shattered, I'm destroyed. And that's a feeling.
Speaker 1: That's a story that I'm adding to that. And now,
Speaker 1: as you said, the thought is the narrative, which I
Speaker 1: love that way of describing thoughts. My narrative is, now, Oh,
Speaker 1: I should have taken better care of myself. I should
Speaker 1: have slept earlier, I should have done this, I could
Speaker 1: have done that. I'm such an idiot because I'd right.
Speaker 1: That's that thought narrative. So that's how it actually connects
Speaker 1: from from how I've understood it, and it's made sense
Speaker 1: to me because I think a lot of stuff is
Speaker 1: happening biologically and chemically that we're then adding an emotional
Speaker 1: feeling and layer two that isn't helping because we get
Speaker 1: stuck in our head with something that's actually quite physical.
Speaker 1: If that makes sense, Yeah, absolutely, And often I get
Speaker 1: that when a really question I get is you know,
Speaker 1: what's the difference between stress and anxiety? And often the
Speaker 1: answer that I give for that is often around they're
Speaker 1: actually part of the same physical reaction. You know, you
Speaker 1: have this one threat response, and you only have that
Speaker 1: one threat response, so that what your body is doing
Speaker 1: is essentially the same, but we can septualize it differently.
Speaker 1: So you know, you and I often talk about this
Speaker 1: idea of stress being Let's say you you allocate yourself,
Speaker 1: you know, ten minutes to go off and go to
Speaker 1: the post office and post a parcel and you get
Speaker 1: there and there's this huge queue and you'll stood there,
Speaker 1: you know, tapping your foot thinking, oh no, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: relate for my meeting. I an allocated ten minutes for this,
Speaker 1: and that kind of pounding heart and you know, the
Speaker 1: sweaty palms, and that increase in the level of your
Speaker 1: alertness is your stress response. That's enabling you to sort
Speaker 1: of increase your alertness so you can reprioritize if you
Speaker 1: need to, so that your brain can start problem solving
Speaker 1: and working out do we ditch this and get to
Speaker 1: the meeting? Is that more important? Or would do we
Speaker 1: do this? And or how can we you know, skip
Speaker 1: the key or something, and so you kind of that
Speaker 1: would be stress. We would conceptualize that threat response or stress,
Speaker 1: but if it was anxiety, then it's more likely to
Speaker 1: be based around sort of something like fear, so some
Speaker 1: sort of threat, physical threat to your safety for example,
Speaker 1: or a psychological threat. Let's say it might turn into
Speaker 1: anxiety if you were really worried about this, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe it's not a meeting, maybe it's a big conference,
Speaker 1: and walking in late would mean you have felt humiliated
Speaker 1: or and that would be a psychological threat, right, and
Speaker 1: so you might feel anxious. And so it's still that
Speaker 1: same threat response kicking off, but you're conceptualizing it slightly differently.
Speaker 1: And when I was researching for the book, actually I've
Speaker 1: found some great research around sort of motion, vocabulary and granularity,
Speaker 1: so the ability to feel something and give it a label,
Speaker 1: and it really doesn't matter what that label is. It
Speaker 1: doesn't matter if it matches everybody else. It helps if
Speaker 1: it matches up everybody else's, but it doesn't have to.
Speaker 1: The more labels you have for different feelings that you have,
Speaker 1: the better your outcomes in terms of how you're then
Speaker 1: able to deal with it, because you're just giving your
Speaker 1: brain a little label that says, Okay, I recognize this,
Speaker 1: I know what to expect from this exactly. I love
Speaker 1: that and I'm so glad that you brought that up
Speaker 1: because I think that diagnosing something is what makes it
Speaker 1: easier to deal with. If you don't give something a label,
Speaker 1: you're now dealing with uncertainty again. And I think with
Speaker 1: a lot of anxiety and stress, we have repetitive thoughts
Speaker 1: and repetitive feelings. It's not necessarily a new thing. A
Speaker 1: lot of the time it's the same thing being triggered
Speaker 1: by a particular event, a particular person, a particular place,
Speaker 1: and therefore being able to label it, as you said,
Speaker 1: allows you to feel a bit of comfort with it.
Speaker 1: Like I know that anytime I go on stage, I
Speaker 1: will always feel a sense of nervousness, Like I will
Speaker 1: always feel nerves no matter how many times I've spoken
Speaker 1: on stages to tens of thousands of people, whatever it is,
Speaker 1: I always do. And as I got more used to that,
Speaker 1: I just started to realize, that's what happens when I care.
Speaker 1: And I was like, that's what happens when I care.
Speaker 1: That's what happens when I really am genuinely present with
Speaker 1: that feeling of this is important, this is meaningful. And
Speaker 1: when I sit into that and I breathe that way,
Speaker 1: and I have my breathing practice that I do with
Speaker 1: my mindfulness practice. It happens every time, but I already
Speaker 1: know it's going to happen, and so now I'm not surprised.
Speaker 1: Then it's not something new, Whereas, like you said, if
Speaker 1: you don't label that, I label it as care. If
Speaker 1: you don't label that with a word, now it's like,
Speaker 1: oh no, this is happening all over again, and I
Speaker 1: don't know what to do with it, and I don't
Speaker 1: know why it's happening. So I think that's a really
Speaker 1: great insight. One of the things you go into this book,
Speaker 1: which I thought was really beautiful and really important, is
Speaker 1: grief and loss. And of course so many people have
Speaker 1: lost so many people. In the last couple of years.
Speaker 1: I lost two really deep people in my life, and
Speaker 1: not to COVID nineteen, but I couldn't see them because
Speaker 1: I couldn't travel back. So I lost one of my
Speaker 1: spiritual mentors who have spoken about on the podcast before,
Speaker 1: to stage four brain cancer and he passed away after
Speaker 1: many years of suffering with that. And then I lost
Speaker 1: one of my closest friends who I lived as a
Speaker 1: monk with he was still a monk and he passed
Speaker 1: away to cancer. As well, and I couldn't go back
Speaker 1: and see him because I can travel back to the
Speaker 1: UK where where they were in a hospital. And so
Speaker 1: grief is something that I think is one of the
Speaker 1: hardest things to talk about. I even often get messages
Speaker 1: from people saying, well, what do you say to your
Speaker 1: friend when they've just lost someone? You know? What do
Speaker 1: you say? Like? What do you text? Like? Okay, you
Speaker 1: can text your condolences and your love, but what do
Speaker 1: you say what? As a therapy beast, what is the
Speaker 1: healthiest thing to do when your friend has lost someone? How?
Speaker 1: How should you talk to them? What is something that
Speaker 1: is useful, comforting and helpful at that time? I think
Speaker 1: a lot of people struggle with that. Yeah, and I've
Speaker 1: done some videos on this actually because it's a really
Speaker 1: common question. And I feel like, you know, for everybody
Speaker 1: who's struggling with grief or something else, there are this
Speaker 1: circle of people around them who really care and are
Speaker 1: then struggling with the idea of getting it wrong and
Speaker 1: saying the wrong thing. And I think a lot of
Speaker 1: people worry so much about saying the wrong thing that
Speaker 1: they don't say anything at all. And certainly I've done
Speaker 1: that before myself. And you know that I think we
Speaker 1: have to maybe get away from the idea of having
Speaker 1: specific things that we must say or must not say,
Speaker 1: and instead expressing being okay with expressing how we feel.
Speaker 1: So you know, if something feels like a shock, you know,
Speaker 1: say that, label it. And and if you're worried about
Speaker 1: what to say or what not to say, say that too.
Speaker 1: You know, wow, I you know, I feel so sad
Speaker 1: for you, this is awful. How I really want to
Speaker 1: be there for you, but I have no idea how
Speaker 1: or what to say. And then you know, if you
Speaker 1: go with how you feel in terms of you probably
Speaker 1: want to know how they're doing, and so ask those
Speaker 1: questions and maybe make those you know, if you want
Speaker 1: that person to feel able to open up, maybe ask
Speaker 1: open questions you know that aren't going to open questions
Speaker 1: are questions that invite an answer that's longer than a
Speaker 1: yes or no answer. So you know, if you ask
Speaker 1: it are you okay? Someone will go yeah, fine. But
Speaker 1: if you ask how are you doing, then someone is
Speaker 1: invited to kind of talk at length and things like that.
Speaker 1: So if you're wanting to start a conversation about that
Speaker 1: sort of thing, then those are great ways to do that,
Speaker 1: but really I would You know, you can kind of
Speaker 1: turn yourself up with what's the right thing to say,
Speaker 1: what's what's meaningful or profound and or going to change
Speaker 1: how they feel? And essentially you're not going to change
Speaker 1: how they feel. What you can add to the mix
Speaker 1: is letting them know you care for them and that
Speaker 1: their distress matters to you and that you want to
Speaker 1: get it right. So you know, it's okay to ask
Speaker 1: someone how can I support you through this? What do
Speaker 1: you need? Because often those people will have an idea
Speaker 1: about what they need, and often it's just checking in,
Speaker 1: isn't it, and knowing someone's there to support you. I mean,
Speaker 1: what helpful things that people have said to you? You
Speaker 1: know what's really interesting is that I don't think I
Speaker 1: don't think a lot of people did say anything to me,
Speaker 1: and not that I needed them too. I'm a I'm
Speaker 1: an interesting person with certain things, Like I find when
Speaker 1: I go through pain or stress or anxiety, I like
Speaker 1: sorting it out myself. So I'm not much of a
Speaker 1: I'm not much of a talk or when it comes
Speaker 1: to certain things, apart from if I'm working with a
Speaker 1: coach or a therapist or someone who I trust is
Speaker 1: helping me make sense of something. And so but I agree,
Speaker 1: I mean, I agree with everything you just said. I
Speaker 1: think that the biggest thing that I think you said
Speaker 1: is the problem is when we speak to someone in pain,
Speaker 1: whether they're in grief, whether they've just broken up, whether
Speaker 1: they've been through a divorce, or whether they're experiencing anxiety,
Speaker 1: the biggest problem is we're trying to say something that
Speaker 1: we hope will change how they feel, which is not
Speaker 1: going to happen. It's too much pressure on you, it's
Speaker 1: too much pressure on them. It's just not going to happen.
Speaker 1: And I remember when I first started coaching, and I'm
Speaker 1: sure you feel the same way as a therapist. And
Speaker 1: I don't want to speak for you, but I know
Speaker 1: that I used to carry that pressure around that I
Speaker 1: had to say something profound in every meeting, and that
Speaker 1: every connection you have with someone you have to drop
Speaker 1: these pearls of wisdom that are going to solve their
Speaker 1: life and be like this opening, magical doorway. And you
Speaker 1: just realize that now you're not even listening to them
Speaker 1: because you're working so hard to come up with this
Speaker 1: false piece of insight that's going to help someone and
Speaker 1: that actually, if you just sat and listened and like
Speaker 1: you said, asked open questions and we're just present, that's
Speaker 1: what that person needed more than ever. And I think
Speaker 1: I'm segueing a little bit, but even in our romantic
Speaker 1: relationship and our friendships, the problem is we're always trying
Speaker 1: to say things that we hope will change how people feel,
Speaker 1: and the truth is we don't have that power. And
Speaker 1: trying to have that power creates so much pressure and
Speaker 1: burden on you that you feel so weighed down by
Speaker 1: it that, like you said, you don't say anything, or
Speaker 1: you try and say something, and then you're upset that
Speaker 1: it didn't change how they feel. So that to me
Speaker 1: has been the biggest takeaway from what you just said,
Speaker 1: And hopefully I've just illuminated some of my thoughts on that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think, and it's interesting actually how things work in therapy.
Speaker 1: You know, someone might go to therapy for the first
Speaker 1: time and imagine that they're going to take this feeling
Speaker 1: in and the therapist will say something that will make
Speaker 1: it go away, and actually what you do as a
Speaker 1: therapist is sit with them in it, and yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: you kind of if someone's let's say someone's in a hole.
Speaker 1: I think renee Brand did this example really well when
Speaker 1: she did a sort of example of the difference between
Speaker 1: sympathy and empathy. And you know, instead of kind of
Speaker 1: standing looking down in the hole and saying, wow, that
Speaker 1: looks terrible. In therapy, particularly, what we do is get
Speaker 1: down in the hole with them and say, yes, this
Speaker 1: is this is really tough. How are we going to
Speaker 1: work on this together? And you know what's next, and
Speaker 1: so you know that there's this real I think when
Speaker 1: someone is grieving, it's okay to just be with them
Speaker 1: through your pain, like through their pain. So there is
Speaker 1: no way that you can remove that pain. There's no
Speaker 1: way that you can bring the person back or make
Speaker 1: it disappear or exit. But you underestimate the power of
Speaker 1: simply walking alongside someone through it and allowing them to
Speaker 1: just feel heard and cared for. Nobody really wants to
Speaker 1: be told what to do. They want to feel heard.
Speaker 1: They want to feel that they matter and how they
Speaker 1: feel matters, and that in itself has such a profound
Speaker 1: impact over time. But you know, building that kind of
Speaker 1: trusting relationship with someone is huge. So yeah, take away
Speaker 1: those expectations to be some kind of you know, healer
Speaker 1: or you know, fix her upper and just work on
Speaker 1: being a really good friend to someone. I want to
Speaker 1: segue a little bit, Doctor Julie, with what we were
Speaker 1: talking about the idea of relationships and romantic relationships and
Speaker 1: love and breakups, because a lot of the emotions we feel,
Speaker 1: a lot of the feelings we experience are based on
Speaker 1: our relationships around love and so whether it's the feeling
Speaker 1: of losing love, never getting love, never find love, not
Speaker 1: being lovable, not being enough, not knowing how to love like,
Speaker 1: there is a lot of anxiety and stress around that,
Speaker 1: as you're well aware, and as you know in our work,
Speaker 1: we come across a lot when you look at that,
Speaker 1: when you look at the feeling of I am trying
Speaker 1: to find someone to solve the void I have within myself,
Speaker 1: or the idea that if I find someone then I'll
Speaker 1: be complete, if I find someone then I'll be whole.
Speaker 1: How do you work with someone And I know that
Speaker 1: it's case by case, and of course I'm giving a
Speaker 1: broad question, but with that, how do you work with
Speaker 1: someone who you notice that that is a trait that
Speaker 1: they have, Like, how do you work with that kind
Speaker 1: of an individual who has that kind of a trait, Well,
Speaker 1: I guess you work with someone based on the idea
Speaker 1: that if they haven't met that person yet, that you
Speaker 1: can't guarantee they're going to come along. So you have
Speaker 1: to start taking responsibility for your happiness. And while actually
Speaker 1: you know getting in relationships can be really helpful for
Speaker 1: people's well being, and you know that the changes and
Speaker 1: the development that you go through by being in a
Speaker 1: relationship can be wonderful and really healing in many ways,
Speaker 1: but you don't ever want to put the responsibility for
Speaker 1: your own healing or your own happiness in that other
Speaker 1: person's hands. So I would say, you know, in working
Speaker 1: with someone who was maybe kind of dealing with that
Speaker 1: idea that they were sort of waiting for someone to
Speaker 1: come along in order for them to then be happy,
Speaker 1: it would really be about looking at growing your life
Speaker 1: as it is now and making that more meaningful for you,
Speaker 1: more purposeful based on your own values, and really looking
Speaker 1: at that relationship with this self, So looking at how
Speaker 1: you know, if someone sort of feels unloved, for example,
Speaker 1: how are they treating themselves? You know, what are they
Speaker 1: are they not being caring and loving to themselves or
Speaker 1: treating themselves well, and so a lot of therapy would
Speaker 1: be looking reflecting on that relationship. I mean, there's a
Speaker 1: lovely therapy called cognitive analytic therapy. It's SAT for short,
Speaker 1: and that looks at how the relationship. The early relationships
Speaker 1: you have in life, so with parents and siblings, can
Speaker 1: then be reflected in our relationships that we have as adults.
Speaker 1: So you might have been in a slight. You know,
Speaker 1: no family situation is perfect, so there will have been
Speaker 1: situations that weren't ideal at some point, and as a child,
Speaker 1: you would have worked out how to get through those
Speaker 1: and how to survive them psychologically with certain safety behaviors.
Speaker 1: For example, let's say a parent was sort of inconsistent
Speaker 1: with love. You might have learnt to be a real
Speaker 1: people pleaser to make sure that you made sure they
Speaker 1: felt okay so that you could feel acceptable. And then
Speaker 1: you get into relationships as an adult, and that habit
Speaker 1: of being that people pleaser continues, perhaps but then causes
Speaker 1: you to do that to your own detriment. So maybe
Speaker 1: you're working so hard on being astute to everybody else's
Speaker 1: feelings and making sure that everybody else is happy, that
Speaker 1: actually it's making you ill because you're not looking after yourself,
Speaker 1: for example, And those therapies can be really helpful in
Speaker 1: looking at where did this cycle come from, you know,
Speaker 1: and if it's something around looking for somebody out there
Speaker 1: so that you can finally be happy, then you can
Speaker 1: really break that down to where's that coming from, and
Speaker 1: how can I fix that cycle in a different way
Speaker 1: so that I'm not dependent on this this person coming
Speaker 1: along and fixing it. Yeah, that's so great. So often
Speaker 1: we're fixing the wrong end of the cycle, right We're
Speaker 1: just trying to solve the current feeling, the emotion, the
Speaker 1: situational problem right now. And you're like, well, actually, let's
Speaker 1: look at where the cycle started and how that mindset
Speaker 1: got formed and how that behavior got formed, and how
Speaker 1: that desire for validation got formed. And actually, if we
Speaker 1: solve that, then we can we can see this completely differently.
Speaker 1: And that I mean to me, that's that's really where
Speaker 1: it all has to go. I've seen so many bad
Speaker 1: habits in myself that I picked up years ago in
Speaker 1: my childhood and beliefs and bad habits, and that now
Speaker 1: you're like living them through as an adult, and you
Speaker 1: look at yourself and you go, oh, wow, like I
Speaker 1: just thought this was normal, but it's it's not and
Speaker 1: it's not healthy, and so how can I work on
Speaker 1: that now? And and actually tracing it back gives you
Speaker 1: a sense of separation from it as well, because you've got, oh,
Speaker 1: this isn't me, this isn't mine, this isn't this isn't
Speaker 1: who I am, this is something I picked up along
Speaker 1: the way, And that distance is really helpful to say
Speaker 1: this isn't me, this is this is not all about me.
Speaker 1: Doesn't mean you're blaming it on someone else, but you
Speaker 1: are saying that, let me distance from this so I
Speaker 1: can act, so I can actually deal with it and
Speaker 1: work through it. When you wrote this book and you
Speaker 1: titled it beautifully, why has nobody told me this before?
Speaker 1: Where do you think mental health and well being going
Speaker 1: over the next few years? You know, when I think
Speaker 1: about things like web three, the metaverse, when I think
Speaker 1: about obviously social media is continuing to grow. When I
Speaker 1: look at even people like yourself, who've you know, obviously
Speaker 1: been able to communicate these ideas so phenomenally well through TikTok,
Speaker 1: you know, we both know that social media can be
Speaker 1: an amazing tool to reach out to people, to connect
Speaker 1: with people, to serve people, to help with people. But
Speaker 1: when you see people navigating their mental health and well
Speaker 1: being moving forward, what do you think are sustainable daily
Speaker 1: practices that we need to implement in order to live
Speaker 1: in a world that is technologically accelerated and advanced and
Speaker 1: isn't turning around. It's going to sound really boring, but
Speaker 1: a bit of self awareness, of which can come through
Speaker 1: things like journaling, something quite simple, like journaling experience that
Speaker 1: allows you to stop and reflect on experience. And you know,
Speaker 1: that's a smaller scale of a little bit of what
Speaker 1: happens in therapy. And you know, we're talking about those
Speaker 1: cycles then, and the way you become able to tackle
Speaker 1: a cycle that you're stuck in in is by first
Speaker 1: becoming aware of it. You know, if you if you're
Speaker 1: not aware of what the problem is, how do you
Speaker 1: even begin to think about solutions. And so, you know,
Speaker 1: even with this kind of fast paced world and everything's
Speaker 1: online and our attention as being kind of stolen from
Speaker 1: us left, right, and center, the ability to step back
Speaker 1: and focus on you and your life for a moment
Speaker 1: is really a victory. And and so I'm I'm a
Speaker 1: sort of big advocate for sort of journaling and things
Speaker 1: like that. And even before I sort of did any
Speaker 1: clinical training, I look back and when I was sort
Speaker 1: of growing up, any time that I was struggling with
Speaker 1: different emotions that I couldn't make sense of, or a
Speaker 1: situation that was kind of troubling me, I'm like you,
Speaker 1: I'm not a big kind of talker, or I'm very introvert,
Speaker 1: and I spend time alone. My thing would be write
Speaker 1: it down, and if you write for long enough, you
Speaker 1: can begin to sort of make more sense of a situation.
Speaker 1: And that's really what we do in therapy when we're
Speaker 1: talking about those cycles. We literally map them out, So
Speaker 1: we write out what happens then, what happens next, what
Speaker 1: happens next, and then it comes background. So you literally
Speaker 1: get yourself a map in front of you, and by
Speaker 1: doing that, you get this separation. So you know, in
Speaker 1: the age of kind of social media growing or all
Speaker 1: the problems that might come with that, you're only able
Speaker 1: to tackle that and make conscious choices about what you
Speaker 1: want for your life if you are able to step
Speaker 1: back and consider the problem first. Yeah, I'm totally with
Speaker 1: you on that, and that that feels and resonates so
Speaker 1: deeply for everyone who's been listening or watching today. We've
Speaker 1: just dived into some of my favorite chapters. But as
Speaker 1: I said before, there's chapters on motivation, emotional pain, grief,
Speaker 1: self doubt, fear, stress, and a meaningful life. And what
Speaker 1: I love about the book is that every section has
Speaker 1: a beautiful summary with things to think about, things to
Speaker 1: reflect on. There's, you know, like this whole section here
Speaker 1: which breaks down certain introspection and reflection questions. So, doctor Julie,
Speaker 1: I'm so grateful we got to spend this time together.
Speaker 1: Highly recommend everyone goes out and gets a copy of
Speaker 1: Why has Nobody told me this before? Everyday Tools for
Speaker 1: life's ups and downs. I can't wait to meet you
Speaker 1: and connect with you in person, and we're going to
Speaker 1: do our Mint challenge or something similar. But thank you
Speaker 1: for sharing this with us. We end every episode of
Speaker 1: On Purpose with a final five. These are the fast
Speaker 1: five where you have to answer every question in one
Speaker 1: word or one sentence maximum. So, doctor Julie Smith, are
Speaker 1: you ready? Okay? Okay? Question number one is what is
Speaker 1: the best advice you've ever received to enjoy myself alongside anxiety?
Speaker 1: What is the worst advice you've ever received to calm down.
Speaker 1: How would you describe your current purpose touching people's lives
Speaker 1: in a positive way with the skills that I have, beautiful?
Speaker 1: Question number four, what's something you used to value that
Speaker 1: you don't anymore? Probably say material things. I'm not sure
Speaker 1: I ever really valued material things, but we'll go with
Speaker 1: that one. Okay, great and fifth and final question. If
Speaker 1: you could create one habit that everyone in the world
Speaker 1: had to follow and do every day, what would that
Speaker 1: habit be? Journaling? Nice? Beautiful everyone, Doctor Julie Smith. If
Speaker 1: you're listening or watching this episode, make sure that you
Speaker 1: tag us both on Instagram, on TikTok, on Twitter, or
Speaker 1: on Facebook so that we can see the nuggets of
Speaker 1: wisdom and all of that which you learned from this episode.
Speaker 1: I want to see all the takeaways. I want to
Speaker 1: see what you've what's resonated with you, what stuck with you,
Speaker 1: what you're applying, what you're practicing. Dr Judie Smith. I'm
Speaker 1: so grateful for your time and energy. Thank you for
Speaker 1: doing this at a seven pm on a Friday night
Speaker 1: in England, and I am so happy that we got
Speaker 1: to connect finally, all the best with everything. Congrats on everything,
Speaker 1: and I really do look forward to meeting you. Thank
Speaker 1: you so much, and likewise, I'm really grateful for the
Speaker 1: chance to chat with you. It's been really really lovely.