1
00:00:05,680 --> 00:00:28,040
Speaker 1: M hm. The nineties. Uh, arguably arguably the greatest team

2
00:00:28,080 --> 00:00:31,920
Speaker 1: ever symboled in nineteen ninety two. Your coach is the coach.

3
00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:35,400
Speaker 1: And even at twelve years old, I knew the world

4
00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:39,159
Speaker 1: knew you were missing from that team. Yeah, talked to

5
00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:41,920
Speaker 1: us about that. Well, you know the last dance told

6
00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:43,879
Speaker 1: you that somebody who said they didn't want me on

7
00:00:43,920 --> 00:00:47,360
Speaker 1: the team. Do you really believe he was a secret meeting. Well,

8
00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:50,240
Speaker 1: a lot of people are saying there was no secret meeting, right,

9
00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:57,880
Speaker 1: So it just sound like it's just one guy said,

10
00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:01,480
Speaker 1: that's the way meeting of mine. That's the way it

11
00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:03,640
Speaker 1: sounding like. You know, and if and if that's how

12
00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:07,080
Speaker 1: you fell on it, right, don't don't. Don't you know,

13
00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:10,480
Speaker 1: I own it. That's how you felt, you know, own it.

14
00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:13,120
Speaker 1: If you didn't feel that way, didn't clean it up.

15
00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:15,920
Speaker 1: So I didn't make the team. That was the first

16
00:01:15,959 --> 00:01:18,199
Speaker 1: time that I didn't make a team in my life.

17
00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:21,840
Speaker 1: I never felt the sting of getting cut. Right, So

18
00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:24,640
Speaker 1: when we all tried for a team, you go and

19
00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:27,280
Speaker 1: they put the they put the names on the wall,

20
00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:29,520
Speaker 1: and you look and you see if you made it. Well,

21
00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:31,360
Speaker 1: I was always on the team. This is the first

22
00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:34,600
Speaker 1: time I didn't make a team, and did that sting?

23
00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:37,560
Speaker 1: Did that hurt? Absolutely? Did? I want to be on

24
00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:44,800
Speaker 1: the team right, But I didn't make it? Now? Was

25
00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:48,480
Speaker 1: I mad? Was I upset? Probably went through all of

26
00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:53,680
Speaker 1: those ranges of emotion. But then you know again, I'm

27
00:01:53,720 --> 00:01:58,280
Speaker 1: from the West side of Chicago, so it's like, hey,

28
00:01:58,320 --> 00:02:01,120
Speaker 1: you didn't make it. What you don't do? What's next?

29
00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:04,520
Speaker 1: You can cry about it or you can you know,

30
00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:08,120
Speaker 1: move on with your life. So I just kept moving on.

31
00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:12,239
Speaker 1: I watched every game, I rooted for the USA to win.

32
00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:15,800
Speaker 1: I had won the gold medal in seventy nine, I

33
00:02:15,919 --> 00:02:19,440
Speaker 1: made the Olympic team in eighty that was boycotted, and

34
00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:21,680
Speaker 1: was hoping that I would make this one. I didn't

35
00:02:21,720 --> 00:02:24,880
Speaker 1: make it. I didn't know why I didn't make it,

36
00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:28,040
Speaker 1: But did I do? I feel like I should have

37
00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:33,960
Speaker 1: been on it, absolutely, But let me say this, me

38
00:02:34,200 --> 00:02:41,480
Speaker 1: not making it has has given me more pub than

39
00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:46,560
Speaker 1: if I wouldn't have made it, you know, on the

40
00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:51,440
Speaker 1: good side. So there's always some good and some bad way,

41
00:02:51,639 --> 00:02:55,040
Speaker 1: you know. So I like the fact that you know

42
00:02:55,480 --> 00:03:00,519
Speaker 1: the people acknowledge, even though if the institutions didn't acknowledge,

43
00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:02,920
Speaker 1: we know the people acknowledge that I should have been

44
00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:05,920
Speaker 1: on the team, and you know, so I'm good with that.

45
00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:10,400
Speaker 1: Jordan rules. You went two titles. Mike is starting to catch,

46
00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:13,360
Speaker 1: you know, get some steam with his team. Explained to

47
00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:19,280
Speaker 1: the Jordan. Explain what the Jordan rules are and where

48
00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:22,280
Speaker 1: it came from. What that is? John Sally told us

49
00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:24,800
Speaker 1: his version of yeah, yeah, yeah, and it and it's

50
00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:27,760
Speaker 1: pretty simple. Now, we had rules for everybody. Okay, we

51
00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:34,160
Speaker 1: were we were a disciplined team. We had rules and

52
00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:39,000
Speaker 1: we followed rules, we followed orders. This is what we

53
00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:42,400
Speaker 1: at ten point plan. This is what we did. This

54
00:03:42,480 --> 00:03:44,160
Speaker 1: is how we act, this is how we walked. This

55
00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:47,120
Speaker 1: is what we do. So we had rules for magic,

56
00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:49,360
Speaker 1: we had rules for Kareem, we had rules for Bird.

57
00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:52,440
Speaker 1: Just like y'all go into a locker room. The rules

58
00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:58,160
Speaker 1: for everybody, right, So Jordan rules. Jordan was a reluctant passer.

59
00:03:59,200 --> 00:04:03,000
Speaker 1: He didn't liked the pass and he was the first

60
00:04:03,160 --> 00:04:09,160
Speaker 1: volume shooter. So he wasn't like a like now you

61
00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:11,160
Speaker 1: see kids that got great handles. In all that, he

62
00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:15,160
Speaker 1: didn't have great handles, couldn't go left right, and if

63
00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:16,920
Speaker 1: he went left more than two or three times, he

64
00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:20,560
Speaker 1: had to pick it up. So the rules are very simple.

65
00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:25,679
Speaker 1: Left side of the floor, sent him left, right side

66
00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:29,560
Speaker 1: of the floor, send him left. In the middle, sent

67
00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:33,480
Speaker 1: him left. Now when he's going left, we wanted the

68
00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:39,880
Speaker 1: trap to be visible. Right, So I'm going left and

69
00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:45,520
Speaker 1: the first person that he sees now is running at him,

70
00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:48,080
Speaker 1: and you, as a defender, your job is to take

71
00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:53,039
Speaker 1: away his right hand because now, as a passer, we

72
00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:55,760
Speaker 1: want that ball going in the air. And if that

73
00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:58,359
Speaker 1: ball goes in the air, we're quick enough to rotate

74
00:04:58,400 --> 00:05:01,160
Speaker 1: and get back and match up. So as that defender

75
00:05:01,279 --> 00:05:06,719
Speaker 1: leaves to come trap off the baseline or from the top.

76
00:05:07,360 --> 00:05:10,720
Speaker 1: Second defender, your job is to rotate to cover. Now

77
00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:13,039
Speaker 1: we want that pass scoring in the air cross court.

78
00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:16,120
Speaker 1: Jordan didn't want to pass, so what would he do.

79
00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:21,000
Speaker 1: He would shot and guess what he would do. He

80
00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:27,800
Speaker 1: would miss. Okay, now he would be you know, we

81
00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:32,039
Speaker 1: didn't mind if he was nine for twenty six. We

82
00:05:32,080 --> 00:05:35,640
Speaker 1: didn't mind if he was ten for thirty. Now the

83
00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:39,640
Speaker 1: newspaper were right, he scored twenty seven, but we would say, okay,

84
00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:43,480
Speaker 1: you know he was ten for thirty. Now, mind you,

85
00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:46,400
Speaker 1: there were a couple of games he was twenty for

86
00:05:46,520 --> 00:05:51,840
Speaker 1: twenty five. He wouldn't always ten for thirty. But here's

87
00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:54,400
Speaker 1: what this was the key though, by him being a

88
00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:57,760
Speaker 1: volume shooter. So this stuff they talk about analytics right

89
00:05:57,760 --> 00:06:00,200
Speaker 1: now and all this other stuff. Okay, that was the

90
00:06:00,200 --> 00:06:04,919
Speaker 1: Detroit Pistons. Okay, how many possessions you're gonna have in

91
00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:08,000
Speaker 1: the game. Okay, it's gonna be ninety five, is gonna

92
00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:09,800
Speaker 1: be one hundred, it's gonna be eighty, is gonna be

93
00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:14,520
Speaker 1: eighty five? Right, our job was to limit the possessions.

94
00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:18,839
Speaker 1: And if we can shut down the possessions, Okay, Jordan,

95
00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:22,160
Speaker 1: instead of you're taking thirty shots this game, right, you're

96
00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:25,680
Speaker 1: only gonna get twenty five. But here was the key,

97
00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:31,360
Speaker 1: Scotty who normally gets twelve or thirteen shots because he's

98
00:06:31,360 --> 00:06:34,400
Speaker 1: a reluctant passer. This game, Scotty, you're only gonna get

99
00:06:34,400 --> 00:06:40,560
Speaker 1: seven shots, and you know this one over here, horrors, Grant,

100
00:06:41,080 --> 00:06:44,720
Speaker 1: you might get three shots. And by the way, those

101
00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:47,920
Speaker 1: shots that you're taken and that you're getting, they're gonna

102
00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:50,400
Speaker 1: be at the end of the shot clock. It's gonna

103
00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:56,920
Speaker 1: be somebody running at you. And and now right your

104
00:06:57,080 --> 00:07:01,240
Speaker 1: field goal percentage. Right, So this is where we said

105
00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:03,920
Speaker 1: we were mentally, like you know, we we take your

106
00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:06,239
Speaker 1: little brain and just twist it and tell you fucking

107
00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:10,400
Speaker 1: fall off. Right. That's that's that's so. Now when you're

108
00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:15,200
Speaker 1: looking at that statuet and your field goal percentage, it's

109
00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:20,360
Speaker 1: thirty seven and it ain't forty five, right, you know

110
00:07:20,440 --> 00:07:22,800
Speaker 1: that mess with you. Right, So now you're looking at

111
00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:24,880
Speaker 1: your field goal percentage and your field goal percentage it's

112
00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:27,720
Speaker 1: thirty seven. And now we you know, you play games

113
00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:31,280
Speaker 1: with people out on the court. Eight I'm you know,

114
00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:35,120
Speaker 1: bj I'm gonna leave you open, right, he ain't gonna

115
00:07:35,120 --> 00:07:39,280
Speaker 1: even thirty you right, right, you go down there and

116
00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:42,920
Speaker 1: double he shoot right, and then you come back and say,

117
00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:45,920
Speaker 1: he ain't got to guard you. So those type of

118
00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:49,840
Speaker 1: mental games you play with the team and and if

119
00:07:49,880 --> 00:07:54,960
Speaker 1: I can break trust and one person you got him,

120
00:07:55,080 --> 00:07:59,520
Speaker 1: well I don'na beat you. So those were the Jordan rules.

121
00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:04,040
Speaker 1: Now Jordan goes to the basket. Let's say he beats

122
00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:07,920
Speaker 1: all the double teams. Right now, he gets to the basket.

123
00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,520
Speaker 1: The NBA at that time wanted to market the dunk,

124
00:08:12,680 --> 00:08:19,280
Speaker 1: right and understanding their marketing plan, the Lakers, the Celtics,

125
00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:22,600
Speaker 1: it was bird shooting, it was magic passing. It was

126
00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:25,680
Speaker 1: kareem hooking. Now they come with the marketing plan that

127
00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:28,200
Speaker 1: we want to market the dunk. Everybody got to fly

128
00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:30,520
Speaker 1: in the air. Remember when y'all were growing up. How

129
00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:32,720
Speaker 1: high can you dunk? How do you got a dunk?

130
00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:35,480
Speaker 1: You got dunk this way right now they market into

131
00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:37,800
Speaker 1: three point shot. Man. You can come down and do

132
00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:41,040
Speaker 1: a zach lavine dunk between your legs, float in the

133
00:08:41,080 --> 00:08:43,520
Speaker 1: air and all this other stuff. And they do that.

134
00:08:44,360 --> 00:08:52,040
Speaker 1: Somebody shooting three. So the marketing right, So understanding the

135
00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:56,360
Speaker 1: marketing plan, we ain't gonna let you dunk. Guess what

136
00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:58,840
Speaker 1: when you come to the hole and you've heard this

137
00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:03,840
Speaker 1: from all your coaches, don't give up the dunk. Were

138
00:09:03,920 --> 00:09:07,200
Speaker 1: gonna file you and put you on the file line.

139
00:09:07,679 --> 00:09:09,439
Speaker 1: So when we would file him and put him on

140
00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:13,120
Speaker 1: the fire line, he would cry real files too. Oh yeah,

141
00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:15,800
Speaker 1: what I was getting real files too? Yeah, wait a minute,

142
00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:18,280
Speaker 1: it one like one like he was the only one

143
00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:22,920
Speaker 1: getting real, getting real back then everybody was getting filed. Yeah,

144
00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:26,319
Speaker 1: Michael snatched rama side of the air. Bird was fine

145
00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:30,080
Speaker 1: on doctor Jay. I'm sorry Doctor Jay was flying on bird,

146
00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:32,320
Speaker 1: you know, I mean it was the big guy that

147
00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:34,520
Speaker 1: the talk got of elbow. You not call him alone.

148
00:09:34,520 --> 00:09:37,960
Speaker 1: It was another right car, right car, right, yes, ye,

149
00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:41,719
Speaker 1: all right, you still owe my lit or. I got

150
00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:49,559
Speaker 1: my lip m like I like to fight, So you

151
00:09:49,640 --> 00:09:52,040
Speaker 1: go back and you slow that down. You know, my

152
00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:54,760
Speaker 1: little left hand was up in there, and I went

153
00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:57,439
Speaker 1: to plant, and I'm glad I slipped because I went

154
00:09:57,480 --> 00:10:01,360
Speaker 1: to plant. And when I went to plant, he was

155
00:10:01,400 --> 00:10:05,360
Speaker 1: still rushing, and by him being big and coming in,

156
00:10:05,679 --> 00:10:08,920
Speaker 1: I'm right on that chin. Nah. Now, I was gonna

157
00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:11,040
Speaker 1: drive that nose bone right up to his brain. I

158
00:10:13,080 --> 00:10:16,440
Speaker 1: was coming, man, and I slipped. And when I slipped

159
00:10:16,880 --> 00:10:22,080
Speaker 1: right then you will see me just rush up into him, right,

160
00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:24,480
Speaker 1: So I just run up into his chest. So he

161
00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:26,560
Speaker 1: came like swinging hit me and then they break it up.

162
00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:31,560
Speaker 1: But but yeah, so so Oakley, right, he gets traded

163
00:10:33,040 --> 00:10:38,000
Speaker 1: because they say Chicago weren't tough enough, so they went

164
00:10:38,040 --> 00:10:41,400
Speaker 1: and got Cartwright. So they traded Oakley to New York.

165
00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:45,280
Speaker 1: Go get caught right, and you know cart Right, he

166
00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:48,960
Speaker 1: throw some bowls. He caught me. I ain't gonna lie. Yeah,

167
00:10:48,960 --> 00:10:51,600
Speaker 1: So I was getting hards. Grant hords. Grant was hitting

168
00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:53,640
Speaker 1: me pretty hard coming down the lane. So they was

169
00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:56,560
Speaker 1: laying wood. Man, I mean they was laying hard wood.

170
00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:59,679
Speaker 1: But but Jordan was. He was the only one to

171
00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:04,240
Speaker 1: steal crying today. They hit it. It was dirty. Look

172
00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:06,559
Speaker 1: look what they did. They show you all the clips, right,

173
00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:10,040
Speaker 1: they show you all a few video clips and tell

174
00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:12,560
Speaker 1: the world it's how they played. They don't never show

175
00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:16,240
Speaker 1: you the game. Have you seen the Chicago Bulls Detroit

176
00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:21,360
Speaker 1: Pistons basketball game? Any of y'all fans, they'll show you

177
00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:24,480
Speaker 1: the game. They'll show you the few video clips because

178
00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:28,360
Speaker 1: they got to keep this thing going, but show how

179
00:11:28,400 --> 00:11:33,000
Speaker 1: we really played. Everybody got filed. There's a guy during

180
00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:39,199
Speaker 1: that time got hit harder and more times than Isaiah

181
00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:42,760
Speaker 1: Thomas driving down the lane. I got the scars for it,

182
00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:45,400
Speaker 1: but I ain't never cry. I just got up, went

183
00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:47,960
Speaker 1: to the fire line. But you know he went to

184
00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:51,679
Speaker 1: the league office. You know they wrote newspaper articles about it.

185
00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:54,319
Speaker 1: You're sitting here talking about the Jordan rules. Hey man,

186
00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:57,840
Speaker 1: we had Kareem rules, we had Magic rules. Y'all played.

187
00:11:58,040 --> 00:12:03,200
Speaker 1: There was Tim Duncan rules, Bryan rued. So don't don't

188
00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:06,079
Speaker 1: make it sound like a rule. Don't get crossed. Yeah,

189
00:12:06,160 --> 00:12:08,559
Speaker 1: don't make it sound like it was yeah, yeah, it.

190
00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:12,000
Speaker 1: Don't make it sound like it was something really special

191
00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:15,840
Speaker 1: for him. Oh that we had a defensive philosophy for

192
00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:21,480
Speaker 1: everybody we played in and his was okay, send them

193
00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:25,439
Speaker 1: to the foul line, make him make free though he

194
00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:28,040
Speaker 1: was eighty five from the line, we had a better

195
00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:30,120
Speaker 1: chance to him missing the free through which he didn't

196
00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:34,800
Speaker 1: miss that many. But that dunk, that's a for sure too. Yeah.

197
00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:38,880
Speaker 1: So and momentum again, so you know possessions, you know,

198
00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:41,200
Speaker 1: shot clocks. I don't know, you keep trying to go

199
00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:43,800
Speaker 1: up with dunk four quarter. You tied them shot short,

200
00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:46,120
Speaker 1: tell me about it. And by the way, guess what

201
00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:52,080
Speaker 1: we said real screens. Yeah, yeah, we said screens on offense. Yeah. So,

202
00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:57,000
Speaker 1: you know, everybody getting picked, but then there's some people

203
00:12:57,000 --> 00:13:03,000
Speaker 1: who get picked harder. Right, So if you if your

204
00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:06,160
Speaker 1: head ain't on the swivel down there, that's part of

205
00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:11,200
Speaker 1: the game. Now, lockoff. So that so don't don't again,

206
00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:13,280
Speaker 1: don't make it like something that it really was. But

207
00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:15,760
Speaker 1: you know, as basketball players, we understand that because if

208
00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:18,280
Speaker 1: you've been in the playoffs, you have you you do

209
00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:20,839
Speaker 1: game players of different strategies for each team, and each

210
00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:23,200
Speaker 1: you have rules for star players. So but I also

211
00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:25,400
Speaker 1: like being able to explain it because this is the

212
00:13:25,480 --> 00:13:28,720
Speaker 1: narrative that has been out for thirty forty years. You

213
00:13:28,760 --> 00:13:29,959
Speaker 1: know what I mean for you to be able to

214
00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:32,240
Speaker 1: break it down like it wasn't just it was rules

215
00:13:32,240 --> 00:13:34,040
Speaker 1: for this, this and that, but they just chose to

216
00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:37,160
Speaker 1: focus on That's why y'all got the best show going

217
00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:40,520
Speaker 1: all that smoke. You got two true form of players

218
00:13:40,559 --> 00:13:45,719
Speaker 1: that now I can have in depth, real basketball conversations.

219
00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:49,240
Speaker 1: I ain't talking to two guys that ain't never played

220
00:13:49,240 --> 00:13:51,920
Speaker 1: in the NBA. Ain't talking to guys ain't even one championships,

221
00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:55,360
Speaker 1: ain't even play. I'm talking to the real guys now, right.

222
00:13:55,880 --> 00:13:57,520
Speaker 1: They ain't a whole lot of real guys you can

223
00:13:57,600 --> 00:14:01,520
Speaker 1: have this level of conversation with, right, So it always

224
00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:04,240
Speaker 1: had to get dumbed down, you know, and then they

225
00:14:04,280 --> 00:14:06,760
Speaker 1: take a few sentences of whatever, they chop it up

226
00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:09,240
Speaker 1: and they go to this is Detroit business. Yeah. But

227
00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:12,760
Speaker 1: like I said, it's definitely refreshing to here from your mom,

228
00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:15,280
Speaker 1: because we know that we know it's rules for every

229
00:14:15,280 --> 00:14:17,600
Speaker 1: different players, especially the star players. And if you don't

230
00:14:17,640 --> 00:14:20,040
Speaker 1: have no rules, they're gonna get your ass fifty points.

231
00:14:20,240 --> 00:14:22,200
Speaker 1: Then you're gonna look like you don't even belong God there,

232
00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:28,120
Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you. Early nineties. You're coming off three

233
00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:31,880
Speaker 1: straight finals appearance. You tell your achilles an injury. Back

234
00:14:31,920 --> 00:14:34,720
Speaker 1: then there was a career ender. Now they're coming back

235
00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:38,560
Speaker 1: off them. Um thoughts when that happens. So here was

236
00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:43,000
Speaker 1: the career ending that that I don't talk about and

237
00:14:43,120 --> 00:14:48,840
Speaker 1: didn't talk about. Right, So your wrists, yeah, see this

238
00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:50,440
Speaker 1: is as far as I can be my wrist and

239
00:14:50,520 --> 00:14:54,800
Speaker 1: that's your shooting hand to my shooting hand. Now, the

240
00:14:56,600 --> 00:15:01,560
Speaker 1: doctor Kirk Watson, it's called the Kirk Watson. He invented

241
00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:04,720
Speaker 1: the surgery. And when he did this surgery on my

242
00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:08,600
Speaker 1: wrist in ninety one, this is the year we lost.

243
00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:12,960
Speaker 1: I think I missed like fifty some games that year.

244
00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:19,680
Speaker 1: He said to me, you never played basketball again, and

245
00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:22,080
Speaker 1: I was like, no, well I'm gonna play. Go. No,

246
00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:26,760
Speaker 1: this is this is a career ending specifically for a

247
00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:30,200
Speaker 1: small guard. Now for big men who play around the basket.

248
00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:33,600
Speaker 1: If you was six to seven post up guy, you

249
00:15:33,640 --> 00:15:37,400
Speaker 1: know it worked. But you being a small guy having

250
00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:39,400
Speaker 1: to shoot from the perimeter. And you can go back

251
00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:42,520
Speaker 1: and look after we won in ninety and after this

252
00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:45,600
Speaker 1: risk surgery right. You can look at my stats from

253
00:15:45,680 --> 00:15:48,960
Speaker 1: ninety one to ninety four. I wasn't the same player

254
00:15:50,040 --> 00:15:54,840
Speaker 1: because I couldn't shoot. Now, why did I have to

255
00:15:54,880 --> 00:16:01,400
Speaker 1: hang on their contract? Right? You know you you got

256
00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:03,880
Speaker 1: three more years left on the contract. Ain't gonna get

257
00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:07,320
Speaker 1: you gotta get the money. Now, I can't retire. So

258
00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:09,720
Speaker 1: you stay and you do the best you can. But

259
00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:12,720
Speaker 1: you're not the same anymore. When did you realize you weren't?

260
00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:14,640
Speaker 1: Like as soon as you came back, you knew. I

261
00:16:14,680 --> 00:16:16,920
Speaker 1: was like, oh shit, I came down my wrist. I couldn't.

262
00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:22,280
Speaker 1: I couldn't. So nineteen ninety I think I still hold

263
00:16:22,360 --> 00:16:26,800
Speaker 1: there the three point shooting record in the NBA Finals,

264
00:16:27,160 --> 00:16:30,680
Speaker 1: the highest percentage. I think I shot sixty two sixty

265
00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:35,360
Speaker 1: three from the three point line. You got researcher here

266
00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:39,840
Speaker 1: right there, you're doing it right now. Nineteen ninety we're

267
00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:42,680
Speaker 1: playing the Portland Trail Blazers. We beat them for one.

268
00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:47,920
Speaker 1: What was my three point field goal percentage? Damn? Damn?

269
00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:52,640
Speaker 1: What you was? What you was shooting in ocean ship?

270
00:16:53,760 --> 00:16:59,360
Speaker 1: I was kind of good understand so that that still

271
00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:03,480
Speaker 1: is the highest percentage percentage, right, So now I come

272
00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:10,240
Speaker 1: back ninety one and shot too much. It was just

273
00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:13,320
Speaker 1: doctor say, hey, man, yeah, he said, you have so

274
00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:18,000
Speaker 1: many bins in the wrist. And I was, man, I

275
00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:23,800
Speaker 1: I practice. All I was doing was shooting and and

276
00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:26,240
Speaker 1: I had got so good from that three point line

277
00:17:26,800 --> 00:17:29,639
Speaker 1: and then my my penetration game was on. So again,

278
00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:33,040
Speaker 1: like when you talk about the Pistons week, we changed

279
00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:36,160
Speaker 1: the way the game's played. In that same series, where

280
00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:41,719
Speaker 1: did Bill Lambier shoot from the three point line thirty

281
00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:48,600
Speaker 1: six right in today's game? In today's game, that's the standard. Right,

282
00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:52,200
Speaker 1: So you know, that was all center and that's how

283
00:17:52,240 --> 00:17:56,919
Speaker 1: we played, right. Bill Lambier was heavily criticized because he

284
00:17:56,960 --> 00:17:59,880
Speaker 1: wasn't a post up center and he was standing out

285
00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:03,600
Speaker 1: I shooting three pointers and we was playing pick and roll.

286
00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:05,960
Speaker 1: But you know, when did I know it was over?

287
00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:11,400
Speaker 1: After that surgery? So I had to the first part

288
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:14,240
Speaker 1: of the surgery. I had to walk around like this

289
00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:19,679
Speaker 1: for for six weeks and then little sling and they

290
00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:22,960
Speaker 1: didn't want no blood running up in it, right, And

291
00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:28,280
Speaker 1: then they let me come down like this, right. And

292
00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:31,240
Speaker 1: then when they took the cast and everything, golf man,

293
00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:36,680
Speaker 1: my wrist was that big, smelling funky. The cast were stinking.

294
00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:42,720
Speaker 1: I remember them days. Yeah yeah, And so now we

295
00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:47,800
Speaker 1: I'm playing left handed in the playoffs because I can't

296
00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:50,520
Speaker 1: shoots it pain for you just can't bend it, oh

297
00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:52,400
Speaker 1: pain for you know, I wouldn't come out of castin

298
00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:57,320
Speaker 1: know muscles. And then they slapping, I mean they hit

299
00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:01,520
Speaker 1: Scottie Piper hit my arm one time in the Eastern

300
00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:05,000
Speaker 1: Converence Finals. Man, I swear to god, tears came to

301
00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:10,160
Speaker 1: my heart. I didn't do all that because you can't

302
00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:12,840
Speaker 1: let him know, right, yea, man, I swear to god,

303
00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:15,399
Speaker 1: I started crying. And if I wasn't sweating, right, you

304
00:19:15,440 --> 00:19:17,639
Speaker 1: would have seen it. People, people would have seen it.

305
00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:21,600
Speaker 1: I was, but I was was just playing off, like man,

306
00:19:21,640 --> 00:19:24,000
Speaker 1: that dude hit my arm so hard. Man, And speaking

307
00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:25,879
Speaker 1: to Scottie, I do want to clean something up and

308
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:33,159
Speaker 1: get Scotty his respect because as a defender, right, he

309
00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:37,640
Speaker 1: don't get enough credit. And when we talk about probably

310
00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:41,919
Speaker 1: the greatest and the best defender that's ever played in

311
00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:46,399
Speaker 1: the NBA, Chicago had two album Robbing and Scottie Pippen.

312
00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:53,520
Speaker 1: But but Scotty, Scotty was different, you know, as as

313
00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:57,960
Speaker 1: a defender at his best, I may have to say

314
00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:02,320
Speaker 1: that he and Rob in one and two best defenders

315
00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:06,720
Speaker 1: probably ever to play the game. And so I do

316
00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:10,200
Speaker 1: want to get him his respect in his props because

317
00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:16,600
Speaker 1: and then as a facilitator, you know, I mean Scotty Scotty,

318
00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:22,159
Speaker 1: you know he was, he was the real deal. Was great. Yeah. Um,

319
00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:26,200
Speaker 1: there's been recent debates about the physicality in today's game.

320
00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:29,359
Speaker 1: I don't even understand this because it's not physical. This

321
00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:34,080
Speaker 1: is the internet talk. So there's been some guys that

322
00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:36,600
Speaker 1: we played with, yeah, Gilbert Orinas JJ Ready in particularly

323
00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:39,439
Speaker 1: that says it's tougher to play in today's game than

324
00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:42,520
Speaker 1: it was to play in the eighties. M thoughts on that,

325
00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:45,120
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously the physicality. I don't think there's any

326
00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:48,640
Speaker 1: comparison to the physicality when you played to what today

327
00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:51,480
Speaker 1: is because you can't be physical. But just thoughts on

328
00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:54,880
Speaker 1: I guess remember, let me change my questions. Just the

329
00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:58,720
Speaker 1: errors of basketball in your mind, being an all time

330
00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:02,080
Speaker 1: great hard to compare. Can you compare eras or just

331
00:21:02,119 --> 00:21:04,160
Speaker 1: the game has continued to evolve so much that it's

332
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:08,240
Speaker 1: just because you leave them in their era. So I

333
00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:12,080
Speaker 1: do have to answer this question in a lot of ways.

334
00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:20,320
Speaker 1: So the errors are different. Some people say the eighties

335
00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:25,199
Speaker 1: was the best era of basketball ever. Some people have

336
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:32,600
Speaker 1: said the nineties, You know it's wasn't one of the

337
00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:42,080
Speaker 1: greatest basketball eras ever them two thousands. You know that

338
00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:52,400
Speaker 1: as the rules started changing and coaching schemes started changing.

339
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:58,600
Speaker 1: When you say the game has evolved, so I'm gonna

340
00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:01,720
Speaker 1: go back and I'm gonna go old air, And then

341
00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:03,880
Speaker 1: I want you to take me back to this question.

342
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:10,119
Speaker 1: So has the game really evolved? And what does that

343
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:15,840
Speaker 1: mean when you say it's evolved? Now, I grew up

344
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,679
Speaker 1: with watching a guy by the name of Billy Harris

345
00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:24,840
Speaker 1: shoot from half court. He wouldn't take a layup. He

346
00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:28,880
Speaker 1: come down one on nobody and he stopped and pull

347
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,360
Speaker 1: up at the top of the key, and everybody with holla,

348
00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:35,080
Speaker 1: lay up right. He was known for never shooting a

349
00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:38,200
Speaker 1: layup right. He was known for pulling up at half

350
00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:45,000
Speaker 1: court knocking it down. When y'all was playing in the

351
00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:46,440
Speaker 1: real games, it was a guy by the name of

352
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 1: Stefan Marberry Starberry who would stop at half court, pull up, boom,

353
00:22:54,280 --> 00:23:01,119
Speaker 1: knock it down. What has changed and the guy who

354
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:05,280
Speaker 1: doesn't get credit for changing the game in this so

355
00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:11,560
Speaker 1: called evolution of the game. His name would be coach

356
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:17,080
Speaker 1: Mark Jackson. Now let me tell you why Mark Jackson

357
00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:21,760
Speaker 1: changed the game. Because Mark Jackson saw a guy by

358
00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,600
Speaker 1: the name of Steph Curry and a guy by the

359
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:28,480
Speaker 1: name of Clay Thompson, and Mark Jackson as a coach

360
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:35,000
Speaker 1: made it acceptable. He made it acceptable for Steph Curry

361
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:40,600
Speaker 1: and Clay to shoot from that range. People always shot

362
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:45,320
Speaker 1: from that range, they just didn't do it as part

363
00:23:45,359 --> 00:23:55,240
Speaker 1: of their offensive schemes. Mark Jackson solely accepted Steph and

364
00:23:55,520 --> 00:24:00,760
Speaker 1: Clay shooting from that distance, from that range and crucial

365
00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:03,160
Speaker 1: powers of the game because before that it was lived

366
00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:04,960
Speaker 1: by the deer three dive by three because it hadn't

367
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:07,640
Speaker 1: been proven yet that you can win that way. Well,

368
00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:12,120
Speaker 1: we proved it well consistently at I'll take it back

369
00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:14,919
Speaker 1: because it was inside out. But also you know when

370
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,240
Speaker 1: you when you we talked about your three point percentage,

371
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:19,080
Speaker 1: you were eleven for sixteen in the finals. Like that's

372
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:21,320
Speaker 1: one game for guys, now, you know what I mean.

373
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:23,919
Speaker 1: So just the volume value, Yeah, that's that's what I'm

374
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:27,520
Speaker 1: getting there. So Mark, So the one who has power

375
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:35,760
Speaker 1: gives definition too, and the one who has power can

376
00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:41,200
Speaker 1: also allow things to happen. We came up and when

377
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:47,320
Speaker 1: we were playing, all coaches that wasn't acceptable to shoot

378
00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:52,120
Speaker 1: and from that distance or play that way. It just

379
00:24:52,240 --> 00:25:00,640
Speaker 1: wasn't acceptable. Mark Jackson alone accepted and when he accepted,

380
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:07,480
Speaker 1: that changed the game. That changed the game. Steph Curry,

381
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:13,080
Speaker 1: Clay Thompson would not be Steph Curry Clay Thompson getting

382
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 1: credit for evolutionary if there wasn't a teacher and the

383
00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:24,959
Speaker 1: master saying you can do that. And I never forget

384
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 1: watching Golden State player Okase and Clay Thompson pulled up,

385
00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:38,480
Speaker 1: dude in the pressure situation, the pressure situation from the

386
00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:43,600
Speaker 1: hash Mark Bam. Yeah. Now Mark Jackson wasn't coaching then,

387
00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:51,000
Speaker 1: but the thought the acceptability right that that we're watching

388
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:56,280
Speaker 1: Kevin Durant in Cleveland come down and Lebron James waiting

389
00:25:56,359 --> 00:26:01,479
Speaker 1: for him, and Kevin Durant stopped three feet behind Boom

390
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:04,840
Speaker 1: Sandwiches and they asked Lebron James what was the difference

391
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,960
Speaker 1: between last year and this year? He said, kadi ya

392
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:13,800
Speaker 1: for real? You know, but Mark, but Mark Jackson, in

393
00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:18,240
Speaker 1: my opinion, when you say the evolution of the game

394
00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:24,880
Speaker 1: and a three point shot his name, he's the one

395
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:28,919
Speaker 1: who changed the game. He's the one who made it

396
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:33,560
Speaker 1: acceptable from a coaching standpoint to not allow you to

397
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:39,199
Speaker 1: shoot there but allow you to miss from there. It

398
00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 1: wasn't the shooting, like he said, It was the missus.

399
00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:43,359
Speaker 1: The missus. No, he can't keep missing. That can't keep missing.

400
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:46,159
Speaker 1: Now we see, guys. I saw Steph come back his

401
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:48,360
Speaker 1: first game after being injured one time and he went

402
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:51,000
Speaker 1: three for sixteen in Portland from the three point line.

403
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:56,359
Speaker 1: It's acceptable now, it's acceptable now, right? You know you

404
00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:59,040
Speaker 1: can you can go one for ten and say I'm

405
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:06,320
Speaker 1: gonna get hot. Mark, Mark Jackson change the game. And

406
00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:08,800
Speaker 1: that's not even just credit Clay and Steff's talent. But

407
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 1: like you said, to understand what you're saying, it's just

408
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,120
Speaker 1: someone that will allowing and accept it and understand it.

409
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:17,240
Speaker 1: And you're definitely not wrong. I know you were obviously

410
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:21,119
Speaker 1: a team guy and and and you guys ran your

411
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 1: system and you thought. But with the freedom of today's

412
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 1: game because of Mark, what do you feel like if

413
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:30,919
Speaker 1: you were just an individual out there in today's game,

414
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 1: what do you feel like you can average with your

415
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:34,639
Speaker 1: ability to do people can't stay in front of you

416
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:38,159
Speaker 1: can shoot the ball, to high clip. If if I dominated,

417
00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 1: then I would dominate now. Yeah, I mean because the

418
00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:49,840
Speaker 1: rules now favor me. They favor the small guy. They

419
00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 1: they favor me now. Freedom of movement itself, space, No,

420
00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:58,000
Speaker 1: ain't nobody in the lane. No hand checking either. Yeah,

421
00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 1: but you know, a hand check in it bothered me some.

422
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:05,320
Speaker 1: But I was fast right, so and then I knew

423
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:07,919
Speaker 1: a little judo, So you put your hand there. I

424
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:09,439
Speaker 1: hit them. You know, I knew, I knew how to

425
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:11,960
Speaker 1: I knew how to move it and get back. But

426
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:17,160
Speaker 1: the nobody in the lane. See, every time I drove

427
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:21,159
Speaker 1: down the lane, six people in the lane. You know,

428
00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:24,800
Speaker 1: there's me and my defender and then there's you know,

429
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:28,680
Speaker 1: two big So you you got to be tricky around

430
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:33,560
Speaker 1: the basket. Now you're driving down the lane naked. Ain't

431
00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:37,720
Speaker 1: nobody there, so you you get to stretch out, lay

432
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,040
Speaker 1: up if you if you saw me coming down, I

433
00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 1: had to I had to ball up and then I

434
00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:47,360
Speaker 1: had to come out, you know. So But like I

435
00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:50,560
Speaker 1: said that, if if I dominated, then I would dominate

436
00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:53,760
Speaker 1: now and and make no mistake about it. In the

437
00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 1: game of basketball, some people may say you're arrogant. I

438
00:28:56,880 --> 00:29:03,520
Speaker 1: don't care. I am extremely confident in my skills and

439
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 1: my ability and what I was doing and what I

440
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 1: could do. I can't do it now, but you know,

441
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:13,440
Speaker 1: m I would be all right. I agree to say

442
00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 1: the least three players, you feel like that'll be the

443
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:29,120
Speaker 1: face of the NBA in the next ten years. I

444
00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 1: don't know if they'll be from America. H I'm just

445
00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 1: saying facts. That's crazy. I mean, that's crazy. That's true though,

446
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:46,320
Speaker 1: Jannis Luca, you know, joker. I mean when you look

447
00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:51,600
Speaker 1: at the last five, the young boy, I mean, when

448
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:56,400
Speaker 1: you look at the last the last four five m MVPs,

449
00:29:56,600 --> 00:30:02,480
Speaker 1: they all been international players. Now that's you know, that's

450
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 1: the conversation to have. Yeah, yeah, that's keep winning MVP

451
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 1: and can't get to the finals or at least the

452
00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:10,920
Speaker 1: conference finals or something. You can't you gotta win. Yeah,

453
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 1: it got to be a shut it down, like you

454
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 1: can win it back to back. Okay, cool, I understand that.

455
00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:17,480
Speaker 1: But one of them back to back years, you got

456
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:20,440
Speaker 1: at least get to your conference finals. Bro, you can't

457
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:22,520
Speaker 1: get there. You're not nv P one time, didn't they

458
00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:25,000
Speaker 1: Then they go to the Western finals once in the bubble,

459
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 1: right then that bubble shit, don't count. But this, this

460
00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:31,600
Speaker 1: is where the numbers, This is where the analytics hit

461
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:35,080
Speaker 1: don't count. This is where the analytics like you know,

462
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:41,600
Speaker 1: the the those remember I said, those who are in power,

463
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:46,760
Speaker 1: they give definition to so they get to define and

464
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 1: they get to make the rules and they get to

465
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:58,440
Speaker 1: say what's acceptable. So now winning is totally discounted. Yes,

466
00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:02,840
Speaker 1: that it's like anybody can win. And I'm here to say, no,

467
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 1: that ain't true. Those of us who have won will

468
00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:08,200
Speaker 1: let you know, like it ain't easy. That now it

469
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:10,760
Speaker 1: ain't easy, and that that guy who's a twelfth man,

470
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:14,360
Speaker 1: that dude count and why does he count? Because there

471
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:18,160
Speaker 1: is a such thing called chemistry that makes a whole

472
00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: team work, that makes it all together. And that guy

473
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,760
Speaker 1: who part of it is a big part of it.

474
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 1: His personality, his character, his showing up things that you

475
00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:33,520
Speaker 1: don't measure, right, those things are what we say. Those

476
00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 1: are the things that we value. Remember when we was

477
00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:39,960
Speaker 1: growing up, it was like, dude, you could have it

478
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 1: twenty points and tim rebounds, but if your character is nasty,

479
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:47,680
Speaker 1: you ain't on the team. I ain't picking you. You

480
00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 1: ain't on the team. You just ain't on the team.

481
00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:51,520
Speaker 1: Now you can have it twenty and ten have a

482
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:53,600
Speaker 1: bad attitude, and they'd be like, well, you know, he

483
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:56,480
Speaker 1: does get twenty points tim rebound, but they never speak

484
00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:59,720
Speaker 1: to your personality, your character, who you are, you're upstanding,

485
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:04,320
Speaker 1: none of that. Right, So since winning doesn't matter, now,

486
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,440
Speaker 1: we're just talking about numbers. And if we're only talking

487
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:15,880
Speaker 1: about numbers, analytics makes you selfish because you are only

488
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:21,040
Speaker 1: thinking about your numbers and you get paid on your numbers.

489
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:24,400
Speaker 1: And if I'm getting paid on my numbers, and all

490
00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 1: I gotta do is get numbers. And because that's all

491
00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:33,480
Speaker 1: general public understands, because we have to, we have to

492
00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 1: present the game in a way that the average fan

493
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:39,680
Speaker 1: will understand it so we can get more fans. So

494
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:41,719
Speaker 1: if I dumb it down and break it down so

495
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,760
Speaker 1: it's only about numbers, then it's a game for everybody.

496
00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:48,560
Speaker 1: It's not an exclusive club anymore. Anybody can do it.

497
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:50,880
Speaker 1: You got kids not thinking like they can play like

498
00:32:50,960 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 1: Steph Curry and shoot like Steph Curry because right now,

499
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:58,040
Speaker 1: you gotta do it. Be able to dribble, make a layup,

500
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:01,240
Speaker 1: make a free throw, and shoot a jump shot. You

501
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 1: don't have to understand no schemes. So when you look

502
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:07,040
Speaker 1: at a guy like you know, the joker, no disrespect,

503
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:11,800
Speaker 1: you know, I like him, But but I was I

504
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:19,400
Speaker 1: was saying the other year, like Devin Booker, his team

505
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:22,680
Speaker 1: at the best record, yeah, and he was having the

506
00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:27,080
Speaker 1: twenty six, twenty seven points and he in the MVP

507
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 1: right right, there used to be a time when record,

508
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:34,000
Speaker 1: when it matters. You have his twenty six, you have

509
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:36,480
Speaker 1: a twenty seven. You know, we we got to give

510
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 1: you that. But you can't be the MVP of the

511
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:45,920
Speaker 1: league one year and your team is in fifth place. Yeah, yeah,

512
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 1: that It's never worked that way. And you can't be

513
00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:50,120
Speaker 1: the best player in the league for the show when

514
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:53,880
Speaker 1: your team not even in the playoffs. Yeah, I don't

515
00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:55,160
Speaker 1: want a lot of people don't want to hear that

516
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:57,800
Speaker 1: those are those are well, that's how that's how we

517
00:33:57,840 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 1: look at it, right. It's like now, unfortunately we don't

518
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 1: have the loudest voice. You know that we're not the majority.

519
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:11,640
Speaker 1: The majority has the loudest voice because there's more of them, right,

520
00:34:11,840 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean that they're right. Absolutely not not

521
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 1: at all, not at all, not at all mean culture,

522
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 1: you haven't meme u that came out. I met the

523
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,160
Speaker 1: criteria to be selected but I wasn't thoughts on just

524
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:24,960
Speaker 1: where can you imagine have a social media back when

525
00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:26,879
Speaker 1: you guys played, We would have killed it, he said,

526
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:30,360
Speaker 1: we would have killed What's what's your name? Zake? You know,

527
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:37,680
Speaker 1: I met the criteria, but I wasn't selected. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah,

528
00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:43,520
Speaker 1: but I kind of like that now, speaking of that, mean, right,

529
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:45,960
Speaker 1: you see me dressed in a three piece suit. Yeah,

530
00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:48,600
Speaker 1: there's the other thing I got to say about Mike now,

531
00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:52,879
Speaker 1: his producer and Mike, they called me, Hey, we need

532
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:55,480
Speaker 1: you in the video. Can't tell my story without you.

533
00:34:55,480 --> 00:34:58,520
Speaker 1: He's so important. Now I'm thinking, we all cool, can't

534
00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:01,440
Speaker 1: tell my story without you, you know. Blah blah blah blah.

535
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:03,560
Speaker 1: So I dressed up. I'm sitting in a three piece suit.

536
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:07,600
Speaker 1: I bring one of my partners, Kevin Cotrell. You know,

537
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:10,360
Speaker 1: he was sitting in the interview. We actually did it

538
00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:15,840
Speaker 1: at NBA TV. I sat there for two hours. I

539
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:20,480
Speaker 1: said a lot of good stuff, right, last dance, come

540
00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 1: out and that's it. Now I'm dressed to the nine.

541
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 1: I didn't come here in the sweat suit today. Yeah. Yeah,

542
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:32,239
Speaker 1: I'm giving you respect. I'm gonna show up, you know,

543
00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:35,759
Speaker 1: the right way, because I got respect for you. I

544
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:37,440
Speaker 1: showed up the right way for that dude, and I

545
00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 1: sat there and I did the interview. And that's what

546
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 1: you do to me. Now, I like the mean, unreal,

547
00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:49,880
Speaker 1: I like the mean. I ain't gonna front on it,

548
00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:52,719
Speaker 1: but I like it. I'm just glad I was dressed nice.

549
00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:55,239
Speaker 1: Tell me if I'm going too far. Did you get

550
00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:59,239
Speaker 1: a check? No? Hell na? No? Wait wait a minute,

551
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:01,160
Speaker 1: I didn't ask for a chat. Now, I know you'd

552
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:03,399
Speaker 1: ask for you know what I'm saying, but like you know, damn.

553
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:06,320
Speaker 1: But but the way I was brought up right again,

554
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: we talked about that West side of Chicago that you know,

555
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:15,520
Speaker 1: we I came up in the era where where we

556
00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:19,479
Speaker 1: give each other knowledge. You know, the game is meant

557
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:23,600
Speaker 1: to be told, that sold right. This is a generation

558
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:26,120
Speaker 1: that has swip flipped it all around. So we don't

559
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:28,239
Speaker 1: work with each other, and we don't share with each other,

560
00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:31,520
Speaker 1: we don't pass on knowledge, we don't we don't uplift

561
00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:37,680
Speaker 1: each other, you know. And so I went there to uplift. Yeah, absolutely,

562
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:41,000
Speaker 1: I didn't go there to chair down. So do I

563
00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:43,200
Speaker 1: feel blindsided? Like I said, I got to sit here

564
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:47,120
Speaker 1: and asker these questions. Yeah. Now, if he real, he

565
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:49,680
Speaker 1: should come on your show. He should sit in this seat,

566
00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:53,719
Speaker 1: and and he should talk to y'all as brothers. He

567
00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:58,200
Speaker 1: should talk to y'all as former You know, I agree

568
00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:03,040
Speaker 1: straight to him. Yeah yeah, nah, no, I mean, I

569
00:37:03,080 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 1: mean I hear y'all praise him rightfully. So and he

570
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:09,399
Speaker 1: should be, you know, because his shoe game is tight,

571
00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:13,759
Speaker 1: what he's done in the shoe industry, and and and

572
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 1: we're happy for that, right, but it's some other stuff,

573
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:22,560
Speaker 1: you know, they come on, man, like, you know, be real.

574
00:37:22,440 --> 00:37:27,560
Speaker 1: Two thousand elected to the Hall of Fame. When you

575
00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:30,440
Speaker 1: think about your body of work starting in high school,

576
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:35,680
Speaker 1: through college, through the league, Uh what what rich? What

577
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:38,600
Speaker 1: stands out to you the most? Just a winner, proven winner.

578
00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:40,960
Speaker 1: Everybody can't say they one on every level. They played

579
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:44,360
Speaker 1: on and started the NBA franchise, in the in the

580
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:48,239
Speaker 1: in the foreign country, the Toronto Raptors. So when I

581
00:37:48,239 --> 00:37:53,600
Speaker 1: look at the Raptors and what I did there has

582
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:58,640
Speaker 1: stood the test of time. And you know that two

583
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:02,200
Speaker 1: thousand going into the Hall of Fame. So I retired

584
00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:07,200
Speaker 1: in ninety four in April and May I was part

585
00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 1: owner president of Basketball Operation. I was the first player

586
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 1: to ever walk off the floor straight into it and

587
00:38:15,640 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 1: go straight into ownership and run basketball operations. And by

588
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:24,160
Speaker 1: the way, all we had was a blank sheet of paper.

589
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:27,319
Speaker 1: There was no uniform. So there you go again. You

590
00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:29,239
Speaker 1: did that before, though you did that in Detroit. You

591
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:31,440
Speaker 1: built it up so the same thing. So when you

592
00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:34,040
Speaker 1: see when you see the raptor run out there with

593
00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:38,560
Speaker 1: that flag, and he planned his flag and he waved

594
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:41,000
Speaker 1: his flag, you can go back and you will see

595
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:46,480
Speaker 1: the bad boys right out with the flag waving. We

596
00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:52,719
Speaker 1: plan all flag right in all colors. What we stood for, right,

597
00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:57,759
Speaker 1: it's all around there. You know that dance pack, that

598
00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:02,960
Speaker 1: dance team started all of the right. So standing up

599
00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:07,160
Speaker 1: there in the Hall of Fame. In two thousand, I

600
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:12,719
Speaker 1: owned the league called the CBA, and the first man

601
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 1: to ever own a league and turned it into a

602
00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:23,880
Speaker 1: single entity which the NBA. Then started the w NBA

603
00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:27,839
Speaker 1: and copied a lot of our formulas what we were doing.

604
00:39:29,960 --> 00:39:32,680
Speaker 1: CBA had got to a point where it was so good.

605
00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:39,480
Speaker 1: David Stern said, I liked that. I want that. So

606
00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:43,080
Speaker 1: they started the G League and now everything that the

607
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:45,000
Speaker 1: G I didn't know you had something to do with

608
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:48,840
Speaker 1: the CBA. Z I owned the whole league. I didn't

609
00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:51,920
Speaker 1: know that. I played in this ship for about two weeks. Yeah,

610
00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:56,080
Speaker 1: the crossbodcast. Yeah, the worst place on Earth. I owned

611
00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:59,160
Speaker 1: the whole league. I bought every team, say word about

612
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 1: I bought every team. And I was I was the

613
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:06,600
Speaker 1: first individual. It's the first individual to ever own an

614
00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:10,360
Speaker 1: entire league. Not the way they the way it's been written.

615
00:40:11,480 --> 00:40:15,040
Speaker 1: Oh you you you bankrupted to CBA. Nah, time out

616
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 1: the NBA. David Stern and those owners bankrupted to CBA

617
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:27,120
Speaker 1: and started the league. Purpose Well, it was competition, you know,

618
00:40:27,239 --> 00:40:30,080
Speaker 1: And and I get it. That's that's business. You know.

619
00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:34,719
Speaker 1: They were they had more money, and I didn't have

620
00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 1: the money to compete with what they were getting ready

621
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:40,600
Speaker 1: to do. I thought wrongfully. So I thought that being

622
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:44,879
Speaker 1: a former player, that they would say, support you, let's

623
00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:51,160
Speaker 1: bring thought. But it's business. They're looking at his business

624
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:55,640
Speaker 1: like nine, it's good enough you competition, we want that

625
00:40:55,960 --> 00:41:00,080
Speaker 1: or either get out now the other thing that you

626
00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:03,960
Speaker 1: know less those are lessons learned, Those are those are

627
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:08,040
Speaker 1: hard business lessons. So when you talk about the first

628
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:13,520
Speaker 1: game that was ever broadcast live over the internet that

629
00:41:13,600 --> 00:41:18,480
Speaker 1: came out of the CBA, Isaiah Thomas did that CBA Hoops.

630
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:25,120
Speaker 1: There was a CBA hoops before NBA dot Com. Okay,

631
00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:30,440
Speaker 1: so that let's just real talk and that those now

632
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:33,920
Speaker 1: were they were they better at business? And did they

633
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:38,000
Speaker 1: have more money? Absolutely? When you look at the G League,

634
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:43,160
Speaker 1: you know a good portion of that is my business plan.

635
00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:48,440
Speaker 1: Just the blueprint. That's the blueprint, same thing, Yeah, just

636
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:50,799
Speaker 1: with more money. Now. The other thing that you can

637
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:53,080
Speaker 1: go back and look into history when you talk about

638
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:59,719
Speaker 1: the CBA, they said I couldn't own the league and

639
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:03,839
Speaker 1: coach in the NBA at the same time. So they

640
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:07,360
Speaker 1: said it was a conflict of interests. The only time

641
00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:11,040
Speaker 1: that there was a special vote in the NBA by

642
00:42:11,120 --> 00:42:16,440
Speaker 1: the owners that rule that Isaiah Thomas could not own

643
00:42:16,560 --> 00:42:20,880
Speaker 1: the league or a team because it was a conflict

644
00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:25,560
Speaker 1: of interest. The owners voted, so I had to sell

645
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:33,000
Speaker 1: or give up the CBA to coach the Indiana Pacers. Interesting,

646
00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:35,120
Speaker 1: so did you have a hand in putting the team

647
00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:41,960
Speaker 1: in Lacrosse, Wisconsin, Because I've still traumatized from that city.

648
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:44,480
Speaker 1: My first day I have to go to practice or

649
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:48,439
Speaker 1: go unpack and seem decides to go bowling as soon

650
00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:50,560
Speaker 1: as I get rid of the Rollman strike. Two dudes

651
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 1: coming in and lay the whole place down to rob everybody.

652
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:56,239
Speaker 1: I'm like, I want to make play basketball, but I

653
00:42:56,239 --> 00:43:00,200
Speaker 1: don't know if the risk is worth the reward. So U,

654
00:43:02,080 --> 00:43:05,560
Speaker 1: my brother and I had family in racing Wisconsin, and

655
00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:07,600
Speaker 1: I had a lot of bad A lot of people

656
00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:12,680
Speaker 1: from Chicago. A lot of people from Chicago, yeah, exactly,

657
00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 1: a lot of and racing was on touchables, yeah street. Yeah,

658
00:43:16,200 --> 00:43:21,160
Speaker 1: a lot of people from Chicago left and had to

659
00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:25,880
Speaker 1: go to Wisconsin. They went to two places, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Minnesota.

660
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:30,160
Speaker 1: And so actually the owners in Lacrosse they were good people.

661
00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:34,799
Speaker 1: So that the CBA owners, um, when I bought the

662
00:43:34,880 --> 00:43:38,120
Speaker 1: CBA from them, all of them were good people. They

663
00:43:38,120 --> 00:43:41,320
Speaker 1: were good operators. I left them all in the business

664
00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 1: and that the NBA became. You know, they wanted a

665
00:43:47,840 --> 00:43:53,279
Speaker 1: league for themselves. Uh is this urban legend? Is there

666
00:43:53,280 --> 00:43:57,120
Speaker 1: any truth to this that you wanted to draft Kevin

667
00:43:57,160 --> 00:44:02,640
Speaker 1: Garnett m and in Toronto, put him in the middle

668
00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:06,319
Speaker 1: and put four guards around him. Absolutely, So let me

669
00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:08,600
Speaker 1: let me tell you that down. Let me tell you

670
00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:11,200
Speaker 1: what ended up happened, and then I'll break it down.

671
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:14,040
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna remind you of a guy by name

672
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:18,080
Speaker 1: of Marcus Camby. That I had a brother that you love,

673
00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:21,840
Speaker 1: by the name of Doug Christy, one that I drafted

674
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:24,879
Speaker 1: by the name of Tracy McGrady. I love point guard

675
00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:27,239
Speaker 1: that was Wickie of the Year by name of Davis Stardomyer.

676
00:44:28,600 --> 00:44:35,279
Speaker 1: And then number fifteen Vince Carter. That's me. Them was

677
00:44:35,320 --> 00:44:40,800
Speaker 1: the guys. Okay, now, the idea that I had and

678
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:48,000
Speaker 1: Jim Kelly right now who's with the Dallas Mavericks, and

679
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:52,200
Speaker 1: and Bob Zeffalatto, whose son Scott Zeffalatto runs the Hall

680
00:44:52,239 --> 00:44:56,880
Speaker 1: of Fame. I brought those two gentlemen in and what

681
00:44:57,000 --> 00:44:59,000
Speaker 1: I want to do in Toronto. We called it the

682
00:44:59,080 --> 00:45:02,680
Speaker 1: Raptor two. And what was the Raptor two. The Raptor

683
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 1: two was going to be a six seven to six

684
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:19,040
Speaker 1: to nine power forward who had guard skills because if

685
00:45:19,080 --> 00:45:22,759
Speaker 1: you remember offense back then, the four always pinned down

686
00:45:22,760 --> 00:45:25,040
Speaker 1: on the two. So we wanted to be able to

687
00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:27,759
Speaker 1: switch to four in the two, but we wanted on

688
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:32,319
Speaker 1: the offensive end that guard that four, who would have

689
00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:35,760
Speaker 1: been McGrady or Carter or whatever. They would have guard

690
00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:39,640
Speaker 1: skills and now they can break it down, they can

691
00:45:39,640 --> 00:45:41,760
Speaker 1: shoot the three, they can get to the basket. Guys

692
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:45,959
Speaker 1: like Oakley couldn't guard them on a perimeter. Had Damon

693
00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:49,080
Speaker 1: Stodomeyer who could play high screening role with Marcus Camby,

694
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:53,879
Speaker 1: who could you know, pass shoot to them? Now, when

695
00:45:53,880 --> 00:45:58,120
Speaker 1: I saw Kevin Garnett, first time I saw him was

696
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:00,319
Speaker 1: in South Carolina at a playground. He didn't even though

697
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:04,759
Speaker 1: I was there. He was playing outside and they had

698
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:10,440
Speaker 1: this little playground tournament. So I snuck down there and

699
00:46:10,560 --> 00:46:17,000
Speaker 1: I'm watching this dude, yeah, yeah, yeah, tween the legs

700
00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:22,400
Speaker 1: behind the back, pulling up shooting, you know, passing diamond.

701
00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:28,240
Speaker 1: And I'm like, that's my Raptor two. That that's who.

702
00:46:28,320 --> 00:46:36,839
Speaker 1: I won't that's who. So Kevin Garnett, don't. I'm gonna

703
00:46:36,880 --> 00:46:41,719
Speaker 1: say this. Kevin Garnett also somehow ends up in Chicago

704
00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 1: and his coaches got my name of Anthony long Street,

705
00:46:50,320 --> 00:46:53,759
Speaker 1: who I played with inside job. I can hear it.

706
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:57,799
Speaker 1: I can hear the inside job. And he ends up

707
00:46:57,800 --> 00:47:00,319
Speaker 1: at Farragut on the West Side. And you know, aren't

708
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:06,279
Speaker 1: you from the West Side? You know, Mom and everybody,

709
00:47:06,320 --> 00:47:10,560
Speaker 1: they they end up, you know, in Chicago. Someone had

710
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:13,879
Speaker 1: to roll the red carpet out for him, and so

711
00:47:13,960 --> 00:47:18,719
Speaker 1: now you know, we're watching Garnett through his thing. And

712
00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:22,359
Speaker 1: by that time, you know, they you can draft high

713
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:26,000
Speaker 1: school players. The rules had changed. So I'm trying to

714
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:33,440
Speaker 1: figure out how can I get the players? So I

715
00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:35,719
Speaker 1: had a meeting with guys that I when I got

716
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:39,720
Speaker 1: the job. I had meeting with tech s ram Elgin Brailer,

717
00:47:41,239 --> 00:47:50,200
Speaker 1: Jerry West, and um Buddy Ryan, the football coaches, football coaches.

718
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:56,960
Speaker 1: Why did I go to football? Right? Because football draft

719
00:47:57,040 --> 00:48:05,080
Speaker 1: six rounds and Dallas was known for thinking outside the box.

720
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:07,680
Speaker 1: You may not remember a guy by the name of

721
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:11,359
Speaker 1: Bob Hayes, but Bob Hayes ran track. It's a long

722
00:48:11,400 --> 00:48:13,880
Speaker 1: time ago. Y'all weren't even born, but they was known for,

723
00:48:14,080 --> 00:48:18,720
Speaker 1: you know, drafting, you know, guys outside of their sport.

724
00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:21,319
Speaker 1: So I want to know how and why they thought

725
00:48:21,360 --> 00:48:26,160
Speaker 1: that way. Had to talk with him. Then I study

726
00:48:26,239 --> 00:48:31,080
Speaker 1: what the forty nine ers were doing, because what football

727
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:37,240
Speaker 1: does that basketball? Don't them? Guys in football? The amount

728
00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:43,160
Speaker 1: of information that they're able to consume on a weekly

729
00:48:43,280 --> 00:48:47,520
Speaker 1: basis is mind blowing. I mean when you look at

730
00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:52,560
Speaker 1: the information that they're able to absorb and then come out,

731
00:48:52,640 --> 00:48:56,759
Speaker 1: I mean they get volumes and volumes of books that

732
00:48:56,880 --> 00:49:00,600
Speaker 1: they have to know, tendencies, break down, everything else. So

733
00:49:01,600 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 1: when I looked at the coaching staffs, right at that time,

734
00:49:05,080 --> 00:49:08,000
Speaker 1: there was no such thing as an offensive coordinator defensive coordinator.

735
00:49:08,360 --> 00:49:12,600
Speaker 1: We brought that in in Toronto, copied it from football.

736
00:49:13,560 --> 00:49:19,160
Speaker 1: And why did we do that because again, football went

737
00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:26,040
Speaker 1: to specialization long before the NBA went to specialization, special teams,

738
00:49:26,040 --> 00:49:30,880
Speaker 1: special teams. And then they have you know, quarterback coach.

739
00:49:31,320 --> 00:49:34,120
Speaker 1: They have alignment's coach. You have a running back coach.

740
00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:38,280
Speaker 1: I mean their specialization, their breakdown and their information, their

741
00:49:38,360 --> 00:49:41,799
Speaker 1: their quality control and all that. So I put all

742
00:49:41,840 --> 00:49:45,680
Speaker 1: that together, now bring that to Toronto. I see Kevin

743
00:49:45,719 --> 00:49:48,920
Speaker 1: Garnett and I'm like, he the one. He got it

744
00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:54,520
Speaker 1: all he got, he got the understanding, he's smart, you know,

745
00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 1: he's got the personality, he's got the motor, he's got

746
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:01,239
Speaker 1: the engine. He's got he's got everything that you're looking for.

747
00:50:01,520 --> 00:50:04,799
Speaker 1: So I have this terminology that I call ICE. It's

748
00:50:04,840 --> 00:50:14,880
Speaker 1: hash him here, what's ice? Intensity, concentration and energy that

749
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:17,320
Speaker 1: That's that's what we and that's what you look for.

750
00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:20,920
Speaker 1: That's what separates the great player from the good player.

751
00:50:22,080 --> 00:50:24,680
Speaker 1: You can have skill and all that, but can you

752
00:50:24,680 --> 00:50:27,760
Speaker 1: put intensity, concentration and energy on top of that skill?

753
00:50:28,080 --> 00:50:31,640
Speaker 1: And if you can do that, dangerous cool got something

754
00:50:31,760 --> 00:50:36,279
Speaker 1: that was Kevin Garnett. And so now we're going through

755
00:50:36,320 --> 00:50:38,279
Speaker 1: the draft and I you know, while back, I told

756
00:50:38,320 --> 00:50:41,080
Speaker 1: you Kevin McKell and I are really good friends. So

757
00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:44,520
Speaker 1: if you remember, you know, around Garnett's draft, there's a

758
00:50:44,520 --> 00:50:49,719
Speaker 1: lot of bad talk around him. He's not there, he's dad,

759
00:50:49,880 --> 00:50:52,120
Speaker 1: you know, he's he's a great player, but can you

760
00:50:52,120 --> 00:50:54,920
Speaker 1: really trust him? You know character, you know all of

761
00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:58,200
Speaker 1: the cargo. So you didn't use worry about none of that. Well,

762
00:50:58,280 --> 00:51:02,920
Speaker 1: you know, I was kind of hell that because I

763
00:51:02,960 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 1: wanted to fall us. Right, So so I get a

764
00:51:08,200 --> 00:51:14,200
Speaker 1: car from kill Right, he goes, Ah, I need you

765
00:51:14,239 --> 00:51:19,760
Speaker 1: to be honest with me, He goes, tell me about

766
00:51:19,760 --> 00:51:22,759
Speaker 1: this kid, Garnett. I can't get a read on him.

767
00:51:23,239 --> 00:51:25,520
Speaker 1: I said, Kevin, I'm not gonna lie to you. I said,

768
00:51:25,520 --> 00:51:28,399
Speaker 1: if you don't draft him, I'm gonna draft him. Right,

769
00:51:29,000 --> 00:51:31,080
Speaker 1: he goes, you really would take him? I say absolutely?

770
00:51:31,239 --> 00:51:34,680
Speaker 1: And I say he would be great with you. I said,

771
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:38,280
Speaker 1: but you know, if you don't take him, I'm definitely

772
00:51:38,280 --> 00:51:41,240
Speaker 1: taking him. Everything else you're hearing around him is just

773
00:51:41,239 --> 00:51:45,480
Speaker 1: just straight noise. He goes all right, so he ends

774
00:51:45,560 --> 00:51:51,000
Speaker 1: up taking Kevin. Now, why did I draft Dame in

775
00:51:51,040 --> 00:51:56,719
Speaker 1: stotomy Here? Who did Dame in Stotomia played for? I

776
00:51:56,880 --> 00:52:00,400
Speaker 1: was only who was his head? That's a supposed to

777
00:52:00,440 --> 00:52:05,359
Speaker 1: go to zom. Did Rosborow recruit you Jesse Evans? Jesse

778
00:52:05,480 --> 00:52:11,800
Speaker 1: Evans or okay, okay, okay, okay, So yeah that so

779
00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:15,080
Speaker 1: so so I called Rosborough up. I'm like, tell me

780
00:52:15,080 --> 00:52:20,840
Speaker 1: about Damon? Right came miss Damon becomes a Rookie of

781
00:52:20,840 --> 00:52:25,759
Speaker 1: the Year. So that's how that's how Garnett, you know,

782
00:52:25,840 --> 00:52:30,040
Speaker 1: got started. Interesting all right, quick hitters. First thing to

783
00:52:30,080 --> 00:52:32,240
Speaker 1: come to mind. Let us know what you think top

784
00:52:32,360 --> 00:52:35,040
Speaker 1: five point guards of all time? This is gonna be

785
00:52:35,120 --> 00:52:40,160
Speaker 1: a good one. Well, I gotta go size in terms

786
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:43,520
Speaker 1: of category, because when you look at you know, Magic

787
00:52:43,560 --> 00:52:47,960
Speaker 1: and Oscar Robertson right there, that's a different there. It

788
00:52:48,080 --> 00:52:51,439
Speaker 1: was Oscar six six six five. He was six to five.

789
00:52:51,560 --> 00:52:56,360
Speaker 1: But but dude, like I mean strong, you know, have

790
00:52:56,480 --> 00:53:01,279
Speaker 1: a triple double all of that, and um, so you

791
00:53:01,320 --> 00:53:06,480
Speaker 1: know I put them in a different category. So we're

792
00:53:06,520 --> 00:53:09,640
Speaker 1: gonna say that the best And why are they the best?

793
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:14,080
Speaker 1: Because their size and their weight gives them an advantage

794
00:53:14,600 --> 00:53:18,560
Speaker 1: over all of us six one dudes, right, And when

795
00:53:18,560 --> 00:53:22,520
Speaker 1: you get to small people my size, I'm one two

796
00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:31,600
Speaker 1: three now and that's just you know, it's like, and

797
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:36,200
Speaker 1: why do I say that? Name me one gay my

798
00:53:36,280 --> 00:53:42,719
Speaker 1: size who's done what I've done? H, step boy, you

799
00:53:42,719 --> 00:53:48,000
Speaker 1: got anything for for for me? I can't see nobody.

800
00:53:48,080 --> 00:53:51,160
Speaker 1: And the reason why I separate you from a lot

801
00:53:51,160 --> 00:53:53,239
Speaker 1: of point guards the same reason I separate Kobe from

802
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:56,000
Speaker 1: a lot of people. Just that toughness, just being relentant,

803
00:53:56,000 --> 00:54:00,520
Speaker 1: a being a winner. Ah, I look at when different.

804
00:54:00,719 --> 00:54:03,000
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. I appreciate winning more than anything,

805
00:54:03,160 --> 00:54:05,400
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. So I respect that. So

806
00:54:05,440 --> 00:54:07,440
Speaker 1: that's why I separate you, because you had the toughness

807
00:54:07,520 --> 00:54:09,560
Speaker 1: and to win. Everybody don't have that. Can you humor

808
00:54:09,640 --> 00:54:12,719
Speaker 1: us real quick and give us you plus four more?

809
00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:14,880
Speaker 1: Just kind of see what you're thinking is on the

810
00:54:15,000 --> 00:54:19,480
Speaker 1: rear right. So so I'm gonna go if you listen

811
00:54:19,480 --> 00:54:21,960
Speaker 1: in Steph Curry as a point guard, H we are

812
00:54:22,120 --> 00:54:26,160
Speaker 1: we are okay? Then Steph? We are right? Then then

813
00:54:26,239 --> 00:54:30,279
Speaker 1: Steph because no one's done what he's done. Right from

814
00:54:30,280 --> 00:54:35,440
Speaker 1: a championship winning standpoint. Now we've done it differently, but

815
00:54:36,080 --> 00:54:41,920
Speaker 1: people all size right, you know, it's it's one and two, right,

816
00:54:42,640 --> 00:54:47,960
Speaker 1: and and if I was picking right, depending on what day,

817
00:54:48,040 --> 00:54:52,839
Speaker 1: he may be one because you know that, hey man,

818
00:54:52,880 --> 00:54:55,279
Speaker 1: it's intimidating when the guy step across half court and

819
00:54:55,280 --> 00:54:57,520
Speaker 1: he can just let it go you and you're standing

820
00:54:57,600 --> 00:55:00,680
Speaker 1: down in the layoup line doing your layoup, you're shooting him.

821
00:55:00,920 --> 00:55:04,440
Speaker 1: Of course that's intimidating. So it's a psychological effect that

822
00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:07,600
Speaker 1: he brings to the game. And then he's got that.

823
00:55:07,800 --> 00:55:10,680
Speaker 1: He's got the intellect, he's got the he's got the smartness,

824
00:55:10,680 --> 00:55:13,560
Speaker 1: he's got the toughness, he's got the he's got the character,

825
00:55:13,640 --> 00:55:16,359
Speaker 1: he's got the pedigree, he's got the leadership, he's got

826
00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:19,640
Speaker 1: he's got all of that. Right, there's there there there's

827
00:55:19,680 --> 00:55:23,799
Speaker 1: no flaws there. So you know what what I what

828
00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:28,560
Speaker 1: I banked on, right is again, I'm gonna outthank you,

829
00:55:28,640 --> 00:55:32,160
Speaker 1: I'm gonna out concentrate you. I'm gonna you're going to

830
00:55:32,200 --> 00:55:35,600
Speaker 1: make a mistake against me that allows me to beat you. Right.

831
00:55:36,040 --> 00:55:39,000
Speaker 1: So Steph and I are very similar in that way.

832
00:55:39,200 --> 00:55:42,960
Speaker 1: We do it differently, right, um, and then we win

833
00:55:43,719 --> 00:55:50,120
Speaker 1: like championships matter, Okay, um, and I'm just talking all side.

834
00:55:50,160 --> 00:55:54,160
Speaker 1: So magic Oscar. They that's how we put parking Biggie

835
00:55:54,200 --> 00:56:03,400
Speaker 1: somewhere else. Yeah, uh what nosdam, he's in the category. Yeah,

836
00:56:03,400 --> 00:56:07,640
Speaker 1: he's in there, just saying so speaking of nas, is

837
00:56:07,640 --> 00:56:11,880
Speaker 1: he still answering this? Yeah? So then and then I

838
00:56:12,200 --> 00:56:20,320
Speaker 1: gotta go Stockton, Chris paul Um. This is gonna be

839
00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:22,960
Speaker 1: tough one, but I got I gotta throw Jay Kidd

840
00:56:23,000 --> 00:56:25,160
Speaker 1: in there. You know, people, how can you not well

841
00:56:25,200 --> 00:56:27,680
Speaker 1: what people are gonna say, Nash one two MVPs and

842
00:56:27,719 --> 00:56:31,000
Speaker 1: not it. But but but Jason Kidd. You know he

843
00:56:31,040 --> 00:56:35,439
Speaker 1: was a motherfucker boy. Yeah yeah, yeah, Jake Kid. M Yeah,

844
00:56:36,920 --> 00:56:39,040
Speaker 1: I hate when people say that. Nash one too. He

845
00:56:39,120 --> 00:56:42,200
Speaker 1: did Man, but Shack and Kobe Man Man, Kobe should

846
00:56:42,200 --> 00:56:45,120
Speaker 1: have won that Man. But the rules the rules again,

847
00:56:45,200 --> 00:56:48,319
Speaker 1: that's the regular season award, But the rules changed. That's

848
00:56:48,360 --> 00:56:53,760
Speaker 1: when the rules started changing where small people can start playing.

849
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:55,800
Speaker 1: So I was in Actually I was actually in the

850
00:56:55,880 --> 00:56:58,520
Speaker 1: room with Mark Cuban the day he made that trade

851
00:56:59,040 --> 00:57:02,719
Speaker 1: or didn't resigned Nash We sitting in Dallas and it's

852
00:57:02,719 --> 00:57:07,560
Speaker 1: cub and I. We're in the room and he's debating

853
00:57:07,920 --> 00:57:12,720
Speaker 1: if if he should keep Nash and the rules hadn't

854
00:57:12,800 --> 00:57:16,200
Speaker 1: changed yet, and you know, he had all his material.

855
00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:18,600
Speaker 1: He was saying, you know, Nash snowing, slowing down a

856
00:57:18,600 --> 00:57:21,840
Speaker 1: little bit. Uh, deaf was on the line, deff he wanted,

857
00:57:21,920 --> 00:57:24,840
Speaker 1: you know, a little bit more money. Humans like, I'm

858
00:57:24,920 --> 00:57:27,680
Speaker 1: not sure, you know, And then he made the decision

859
00:57:27,800 --> 00:57:31,680
Speaker 1: he wasn't gonna he wasn't gonna resign Nash. And Nash

860
00:57:31,720 --> 00:57:34,160
Speaker 1: went on to win, you know, MVP, but then he

861
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:38,240
Speaker 1: ended up being Jason Kidd and winning the championship. So

862
00:57:40,120 --> 00:57:41,520
Speaker 1: do you want the MVP or do you want to

863
00:57:41,520 --> 00:57:45,360
Speaker 1: win the championship? You want so, you know, Q made

864
00:57:45,360 --> 00:57:49,120
Speaker 1: the decision smart. They end up you know, winning the championship.

865
00:57:49,600 --> 00:57:52,840
Speaker 1: But that's when the rules changed and the rules started

866
00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:59,920
Speaker 1: favoring the smaller people, guards and everything else. They eliminated

867
00:58:00,080 --> 00:58:03,680
Speaker 1: hand check in, you know, all that stuff. And you know,

868
00:58:03,840 --> 00:58:06,200
Speaker 1: Dan Tony gets credit for seven seconds or less. But

869
00:58:06,280 --> 00:58:09,600
Speaker 1: that's not that's not free movement. That's not free movement.

870
00:58:09,840 --> 00:58:12,360
Speaker 1: It's a gentleman by the name of John McClinton who

871
00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:15,680
Speaker 1: I took him to the Hall of Fame. John McClinton,

872
00:58:16,400 --> 00:58:20,440
Speaker 1: who invented fast break basketball, and he invented seven seconds

873
00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:23,560
Speaker 1: or less. I took John McClinton and his family into

874
00:58:23,600 --> 00:58:26,800
Speaker 1: the Hall of Fame. The first higher I made in Toronto,

875
00:58:26,920 --> 00:58:29,400
Speaker 1: it was John McClinton. And they still have the John

876
00:58:29,480 --> 00:58:32,400
Speaker 1: McClinton Award in Toronto. And the first player to win

877
00:58:32,480 --> 00:58:35,680
Speaker 1: it was Steve Nash out of Vancouver in Canada. But

878
00:58:35,800 --> 00:58:41,120
Speaker 1: John McClinton invented seven seconds of less basketball. Now they

879
00:58:41,120 --> 00:58:48,200
Speaker 1: give credit to Dantoni. Dan created Shah he one shit,

880
00:58:48,600 --> 00:58:51,800
Speaker 1: always get a job now, but they come from John McClinton.

881
00:58:52,120 --> 00:58:54,520
Speaker 1: You know, So let's let's let's be factual and get

882
00:58:54,520 --> 00:58:58,640
Speaker 1: a credit where credit goes. Mark Jackson changed the game.

883
00:59:00,080 --> 00:59:03,880
Speaker 1: John McClinton invented fast break basketball. Seven secon just never

884
00:59:03,920 --> 00:59:05,520
Speaker 1: thought about it. The way you broke me down with

885
00:59:05,640 --> 00:59:17,240
Speaker 1: a makes complete sense about the Mark Jackson thing. One

886
00:59:17,320 --> 00:59:21,200
Speaker 1: album you listen to on repeat, Earth Winning fire Man.

887
00:59:21,680 --> 00:59:23,640
Speaker 1: Don't do that to Earth Winning fire That's the way

888
00:59:23,640 --> 00:59:25,360
Speaker 1: of the world. They West Side boys. You know, I

889
00:59:25,440 --> 00:59:28,520
Speaker 1: went to Crane High School. Ok my rees White Birdine

890
00:59:28,640 --> 00:59:31,720
Speaker 1: that that's Chicago. I'm telling that Chicago is deep. And

891
00:59:31,800 --> 00:59:33,520
Speaker 1: when you look at the albums you look at that

892
00:59:33,640 --> 00:59:36,680
Speaker 1: air they you know, they they was talking to us.

893
00:59:37,240 --> 00:59:43,760
Speaker 1: They they was talking to us about nationality, birthright, citizenship, spirituality.

894
00:59:43,920 --> 00:59:46,120
Speaker 1: When you look at them pyramids and what they were

895
00:59:46,120 --> 00:59:48,440
Speaker 1: to Hey man, they were singing to you? Was it

896
00:59:48,600 --> 00:59:51,800
Speaker 1: Dad Earth winning fire? Funniest thing to happen to you recently.

897
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:58,200
Speaker 1: Funniest thing that happened to me recently. You might have

898
00:59:58,240 --> 00:59:59,720
Speaker 1: asked you for ya I d when you was trying

899
00:59:59,760 --> 01:00:07,680
Speaker 1: to get drink. Funniest thing that happened to me recently.

900
01:00:08,120 --> 01:00:12,520
Speaker 1: So I work on the NBA TV with Christian Letlow. Right,

901
01:00:13,240 --> 01:00:17,280
Speaker 1: So I'm going through the Detroit airport, going through the

902
01:00:17,320 --> 01:00:23,160
Speaker 1: Detroit Airport and and you know, I'm I'm playing golf

903
01:00:23,160 --> 01:00:26,120
Speaker 1: with with these dudes at Oakland and this dude goes

904
01:00:28,840 --> 01:00:31,160
Speaker 1: where this guy goes, hey, ain't you that dude that

905
01:00:31,280 --> 01:00:35,080
Speaker 1: work with Christian Letlow? I was in Detroit. I'm in

906
01:00:35,160 --> 01:00:40,760
Speaker 1: Detroit now, my picture on the wall everything airport. When

907
01:00:40,760 --> 01:00:44,040
Speaker 1: you go to that, you know say, ain't you that

908
01:00:44,120 --> 01:00:47,840
Speaker 1: dude that we're with Christian Letlow? I say yeah, yeah.

909
01:00:48,000 --> 01:00:50,600
Speaker 1: He goes, Oh, man, I love her like she she's

910
01:00:50,600 --> 01:00:54,120
Speaker 1: the best, She's great everything. So I'm like, you know,

911
01:00:54,280 --> 01:00:57,000
Speaker 1: he just going off. So, you know, Letlow and now

912
01:00:57,040 --> 01:00:59,760
Speaker 1: we're pretty tight. So I said, hey, you want to

913
01:00:59,760 --> 01:01:01,760
Speaker 1: talk to it. He's like, oh yeah, can so I

914
01:01:01,880 --> 01:01:05,240
Speaker 1: doll up Letlow right right, and so so I give

915
01:01:05,320 --> 01:01:08,640
Speaker 1: him the phone right. So he now he starts asking

916
01:01:08,680 --> 01:01:12,080
Speaker 1: her basketball questions like hey, you know, well, who you

917
01:01:12,080 --> 01:01:16,120
Speaker 1: think gonna win the championship this year? You know, and

918
01:01:16,120 --> 01:01:18,360
Speaker 1: and you know who you think the best players? And

919
01:01:18,640 --> 01:01:22,040
Speaker 1: so I'm I'm looking at this dude like, hey, man,

920
01:01:22,240 --> 01:01:27,040
Speaker 1: you know, you know what I mean. But you know,

921
01:01:27,080 --> 01:01:29,240
Speaker 1: I'm feeling some kind of way, but I'm playing it off,

922
01:01:29,360 --> 01:01:32,680
Speaker 1: right because I know when I get the phone back,

923
01:01:32,680 --> 01:01:35,480
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get an autograph or a picture something. Right. So,

924
01:01:37,280 --> 01:01:39,240
Speaker 1: now they get through talking. He had me the phone

925
01:01:39,280 --> 01:01:42,200
Speaker 1: back and he goes, oh man, you're so lucky you

926
01:01:42,240 --> 01:01:45,240
Speaker 1: get to work with Letlo. I just I just love

927
01:01:45,280 --> 01:01:46,960
Speaker 1: her and I just think she's the best, you know,

928
01:01:47,480 --> 01:01:50,960
Speaker 1: really really thank you, you know, and good luck to you.

929
01:01:51,160 --> 01:01:58,640
Speaker 1: And he walked away like like what the hell? Like

930
01:01:58,960 --> 01:02:02,440
Speaker 1: what so, so I would say, that's the funniest thing

931
01:02:02,520 --> 01:02:06,320
Speaker 1: that that that kind of happened. You know, I'm that

932
01:02:06,480 --> 01:02:09,000
Speaker 1: dude that work with Christian that love crazy and you

933
01:02:09,000 --> 01:02:11,640
Speaker 1: could be this next person, the other Isaiah Thomas talk

934
01:02:11,680 --> 01:02:16,080
Speaker 1: about just the confusion that this constantly goes between you two. Man,

935
01:02:17,520 --> 01:02:21,479
Speaker 1: I love it when he gets criticized because it ain't

936
01:02:21,520 --> 01:02:28,120
Speaker 1: you being named after you. But so I'm I'm scouting

937
01:02:28,640 --> 01:02:30,960
Speaker 1: and uh, I think I'm still in New York at

938
01:02:31,000 --> 01:02:35,720
Speaker 1: that time, and and I'm hearing about this this guard

939
01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:39,040
Speaker 1: in Seattle by the name of Isaiah Isaiah Thomas has

940
01:02:39,080 --> 01:02:43,000
Speaker 1: it and I'm like, this got this can't be right,

941
01:02:43,160 --> 01:02:47,480
Speaker 1: you know, like and are you thinking, like is he mine?

942
01:02:47,640 --> 01:02:53,440
Speaker 1: Or what You're thinking? What's a lot of stuff you

943
01:02:53,440 --> 01:02:55,720
Speaker 1: know on the rail on the rail, you know, it's

944
01:02:55,760 --> 01:02:58,600
Speaker 1: like not not not easy mind anything like that, but

945
01:02:58,720 --> 01:03:02,120
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, you know, no, but it's like

946
01:03:03,240 --> 01:03:06,040
Speaker 1: so so now you know, now I start, you know,

947
01:03:06,080 --> 01:03:10,960
Speaker 1: doing a little a little research, right, and so now

948
01:03:11,000 --> 01:03:13,920
Speaker 1: I get the film and I'm watching them play, and

949
01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:17,760
Speaker 1: I'm like this this joker kind of good, like really good.

950
01:03:18,040 --> 01:03:21,720
Speaker 1: So now they got the pacton tournament. You know, was

951
01:03:21,800 --> 01:03:25,120
Speaker 1: here in la you know, a while back when he

952
01:03:25,160 --> 01:03:29,920
Speaker 1: was coming out of school and they came in and

953
01:03:29,960 --> 01:03:36,920
Speaker 1: they was playing UCLA. So I'm like, okay, well, you know,

954
01:03:37,120 --> 01:03:40,880
Speaker 1: I want to meet this dude. So now his mom

955
01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:43,400
Speaker 1: was at the game, and so as mom and his

956
01:03:43,480 --> 01:03:45,480
Speaker 1: dad they come up, you know, they say hello and

957
01:03:45,720 --> 01:03:48,200
Speaker 1: you know, and then I finally get to meet him.

958
01:03:48,240 --> 01:03:52,000
Speaker 1: And when I got to meet him, it was like, damn,

959
01:03:52,160 --> 01:03:56,080
Speaker 1: like you, I feel like I really know you, Like

960
01:03:56,240 --> 01:03:59,080
Speaker 1: I feel like I do feel like there's some you know,

961
01:03:59,160 --> 01:04:02,880
Speaker 1: the universe to you, and there's some spirituality that you know.

962
01:04:02,920 --> 01:04:05,640
Speaker 1: And I'm and and so I'm really feeling this dude

963
01:04:05,680 --> 01:04:08,960
Speaker 1: like I I hadn't been in his presence, but in

964
01:04:09,040 --> 01:04:13,080
Speaker 1: his presence, I'm like, dude, like, you know, we we

965
01:04:13,280 --> 01:04:17,040
Speaker 1: vibeing on a totally different level. Right. And So now

966
01:04:19,480 --> 01:04:22,600
Speaker 1: he don't get drafted or he's the last pick in

967
01:04:22,600 --> 01:04:26,560
Speaker 1: the drafts at the draft, He's at the draft, and

968
01:04:26,560 --> 01:04:29,840
Speaker 1: and in my mind, I'm like, this dude can really play.

969
01:04:30,000 --> 01:04:32,440
Speaker 1: I don't know why. I don't know why they're tripping,

970
01:04:32,440 --> 01:04:34,440
Speaker 1: and I don't know why the scouts are tripping, but

971
01:04:34,560 --> 01:04:36,400
Speaker 1: this dude can really play and he should be in

972
01:04:36,440 --> 01:04:42,360
Speaker 1: the NBA. So he gets drafted by Sacramento. Michael Malone

973
01:04:42,960 --> 01:04:46,480
Speaker 1: is his coach. Now I've known Michael Malone since he

974
01:04:46,520 --> 01:04:51,280
Speaker 1: was this big Brendan Malone. His father, right, was my

975
01:04:51,320 --> 01:04:54,480
Speaker 1: assistant coach in Detroit, and he was also my first

976
01:04:54,560 --> 01:04:57,280
Speaker 1: hire as a coach in Toronto. So I've known the

977
01:04:57,360 --> 01:05:00,400
Speaker 1: Malone family forever, right, So that's why you don't never

978
01:05:00,440 --> 01:05:03,600
Speaker 1: hear me say nothing bad about Mike Malone and Malone family.

979
01:05:04,040 --> 01:05:09,840
Speaker 1: So so now he's got cousins in Isaiah. And if

980
01:05:09,840 --> 01:05:12,720
Speaker 1: you go back and you look, that's the best cousins

981
01:05:12,760 --> 01:05:15,720
Speaker 1: has ever played. That book. He said that was his

982
01:05:15,720 --> 01:05:19,360
Speaker 1: favorite coach you ever had, absolutely, and and so now

983
01:05:19,400 --> 01:05:24,840
Speaker 1: I'm following Isaiah and everything else. So and now he

984
01:05:24,920 --> 01:05:30,520
Speaker 1: goes to Boston. Now I'm all fucked up. I'm really

985
01:05:30,560 --> 01:05:35,560
Speaker 1: messed up now because Isaiah Thomas it's playing for Boston.

986
01:05:35,680 --> 01:05:40,080
Speaker 1: It's playing for the Boston Celtics. And they love Isaiah

987
01:05:40,160 --> 01:05:44,400
Speaker 1: in Boston love him. And I'm like, this don't go together,

988
01:05:44,600 --> 01:05:48,640
Speaker 1: This don't work. Has this working? And now he's breaking

989
01:05:48,720 --> 01:05:51,960
Speaker 1: all kinds of records in Boston and I'm hearing Tommy

990
01:05:52,040 --> 01:05:57,320
Speaker 1: Hyson talking about, Oh, Isaiah, he's the best, He's he's

991
01:05:57,360 --> 01:06:00,440
Speaker 1: the greatest, and oh you gotta love that Isaiah. I'm missing.

992
01:06:00,480 --> 01:06:03,400
Speaker 1: I'm like, you know, what's the little girl who does

993
01:06:03,560 --> 01:06:06,160
Speaker 1: the thing when she say, make it makes sense, make sense.

994
01:06:07,880 --> 01:06:09,400
Speaker 1: I didn't mean to call your little girl, I mean

995
01:06:09,440 --> 01:06:12,760
Speaker 1: the woman forgive me. I'm old, so you know, but

996
01:06:12,760 --> 01:06:18,000
Speaker 1: but anyway, it just it just what are the odds?

997
01:06:18,640 --> 01:06:22,880
Speaker 1: What are the odds that a young man is named

998
01:06:22,920 --> 01:06:26,000
Speaker 1: after you? And we know how hard it is to

999
01:06:26,040 --> 01:06:28,960
Speaker 1: make it to the NBA. Right then he gets to

1000
01:06:29,000 --> 01:06:35,040
Speaker 1: the NBA then plays for the Boston Celtics and y'all

1001
01:06:35,040 --> 01:06:38,360
Speaker 1: got the same name. I mean that that that is

1002
01:06:39,320 --> 01:06:41,480
Speaker 1: that is some spooky kind of stuff that's going up

1003
01:06:41,520 --> 01:06:43,760
Speaker 1: when your universe stuff. So we we're gonna make the

1004
01:06:43,800 --> 01:06:49,760
Speaker 1: Celtics love Isaiah work with me. Nice best Kobe story

1005
01:06:49,760 --> 01:06:51,920
Speaker 1: you can share with us, best Kobe story that I

1006
01:06:51,920 --> 01:06:55,280
Speaker 1: can share with you. So I'm I'm in New York

1007
01:06:56,320 --> 01:07:00,040
Speaker 1: and uh Polinka, who I known since he was in

1008
01:07:00,080 --> 01:07:05,440
Speaker 1: college and we used to all Detroit team used to

1009
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:07,320
Speaker 1: go up and play against you know the five five,

1010
01:07:07,600 --> 01:07:11,000
Speaker 1: you know, Chris and all them, and Polinka was was there.

1011
01:07:11,080 --> 01:07:18,439
Speaker 1: So now Polinka's representing Kobe and you know, Rob called

1012
01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:20,919
Speaker 1: me and he said, like, you know, Kobe really wants

1013
01:07:20,960 --> 01:07:24,200
Speaker 1: to talk to you, wants to you know, wants to

1014
01:07:24,400 --> 01:07:26,680
Speaker 1: you know, understand how you think. You know, I've told

1015
01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:29,560
Speaker 1: him a lot about you know, Detroit, the Bad Boys

1016
01:07:29,600 --> 01:07:31,880
Speaker 1: and everything else, and he wants to have a conversation

1017
01:07:31,920 --> 01:07:35,480
Speaker 1: with you. Now at that time, you know, Kobe is

1018
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:40,840
Speaker 1: thinking about leaving LA too, and and he keeps saying

1019
01:07:40,880 --> 01:07:44,120
Speaker 1: it's not about the money. And in New York, all

1020
01:07:44,160 --> 01:07:48,000
Speaker 1: we had was a mid level to offer him. Now

1021
01:07:48,000 --> 01:07:50,680
Speaker 1: he didn't visit I don't know if he visited any

1022
01:07:50,720 --> 01:07:54,919
Speaker 1: other teams, but he flew to New York to meet

1023
01:07:55,000 --> 01:08:00,200
Speaker 1: us to talk about signing with the Knicks, and all

1024
01:08:00,240 --> 01:08:02,720
Speaker 1: we had to offer was the mid level. But he

1025
01:08:02,840 --> 01:08:09,720
Speaker 1: was really like, I gotta get out of LA and

1026
01:08:09,720 --> 01:08:12,840
Speaker 1: and I'm and I'm like, but Shock there right, And

1027
01:08:12,880 --> 01:08:16,800
Speaker 1: he was like, I I want to win it on

1028
01:08:16,960 --> 01:08:24,800
Speaker 1: my own without Shack. O my god, that don't make

1029
01:08:24,840 --> 01:08:30,400
Speaker 1: no sense. He goes, if I win it with Shack,

1030
01:08:32,240 --> 01:08:35,800
Speaker 1: then I don't think I'm gonna be able to rise

1031
01:08:35,880 --> 01:08:39,720
Speaker 1: the way I want to rise. And he says, so

1032
01:08:40,040 --> 01:08:46,040
Speaker 1: if if i'm if Shack is gone, or if I

1033
01:08:46,080 --> 01:08:48,640
Speaker 1: win it someplace else, then I can get to that

1034
01:08:48,720 --> 01:08:51,320
Speaker 1: next level or whatever level he was trying to get to.

1035
01:08:53,120 --> 01:08:58,439
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, I've never heard anybody like think

1036
01:08:58,520 --> 01:09:02,040
Speaker 1: like that. You know, that's it's kind of different. And

1037
01:09:02,520 --> 01:09:04,840
Speaker 1: Rob was sitting there and he goes, I told you this,

1038
01:09:05,120 --> 01:09:08,439
Speaker 1: he's a little different, you know. He I say, so

1039
01:09:08,520 --> 01:09:12,559
Speaker 1: you want to shoulder that burden all by yourself? It

1040
01:09:12,640 --> 01:09:16,439
Speaker 1: goes yeah. And and so now you know, he starts

1041
01:09:16,479 --> 01:09:20,080
Speaker 1: talking to me about the pistons and thinking and being

1042
01:09:20,240 --> 01:09:22,679
Speaker 1: and at that time, I don't know if y'all remember,

1043
01:09:23,400 --> 01:09:28,400
Speaker 1: but Kobe wasn't well liked based teammates. And he wasn't

1044
01:09:28,400 --> 01:09:31,280
Speaker 1: a guy that you know, hung out or anything like that.

1045
01:09:31,400 --> 01:09:35,040
Speaker 1: You know, very disciplined, very regimented, work at think and

1046
01:09:35,040 --> 01:09:41,760
Speaker 1: everything else. And he's like, you know, I I want

1047
01:09:41,760 --> 01:09:44,800
Speaker 1: people to like me. But at the same time, I

1048
01:09:44,800 --> 01:09:48,200
Speaker 1: don't want to change. And so I was like, don't change.

1049
01:09:48,479 --> 01:09:51,280
Speaker 1: I say, you're doing it the right way. I said,

1050
01:09:51,280 --> 01:09:53,120
Speaker 1: I'm not sure if you can win without Shack though.

1051
01:09:54,080 --> 01:09:56,559
Speaker 1: That dude look me straight now eye and he goes,

1052
01:09:58,520 --> 01:10:01,360
Speaker 1: whether I'm which shack or not, He goes, I prefer

1053
01:10:01,479 --> 01:10:04,200
Speaker 1: to not be with him because I want to win

1054
01:10:04,240 --> 01:10:09,240
Speaker 1: it on my own. That's a good luck, young man.

1055
01:10:10,560 --> 01:10:14,439
Speaker 1: And and so that that's that's my Kobe story, right,

1056
01:10:14,560 --> 01:10:18,320
Speaker 1: and that that left an impression on me in terms

1057
01:10:18,320 --> 01:10:24,439
Speaker 1: of someone having a wheel and a determination, and when

1058
01:10:24,439 --> 01:10:27,679
Speaker 1: they lost to the Celtics in Boston that game seven,

1059
01:10:27,760 --> 01:10:31,080
Speaker 1: I think it was game six or seven, the first

1060
01:10:31,080 --> 01:10:34,840
Speaker 1: when the Celtics beat him, and if you remember, he

1061
01:10:34,920 --> 01:10:38,120
Speaker 1: was like six foot thirty or he had, he had

1062
01:10:38,160 --> 01:10:41,599
Speaker 1: like a really bad game, and in my mind, I'm like,

1063
01:10:43,520 --> 01:10:47,439
Speaker 1: it's gonna be hard to get up that hill. And

1064
01:10:47,479 --> 01:10:49,280
Speaker 1: then the next year he comes back in the Stamped

1065
01:10:49,320 --> 01:10:52,840
Speaker 1: with a back to back boom boom without without shot

1066
01:10:53,200 --> 01:10:57,920
Speaker 1: five and wig gasol and then he does this right,

1067
01:10:58,479 --> 01:11:00,320
Speaker 1: So I was like, yeah, I got three with shiit act,

1068
01:11:01,840 --> 01:11:04,519
Speaker 1: but I got it. I got stamped the back to back. Now,

1069
01:11:06,400 --> 01:11:10,760
Speaker 1: I understood that feeling the back to back still kay

1070
01:11:10,800 --> 01:11:14,599
Speaker 1: to win one, but when you can come back and

1071
01:11:14,640 --> 01:11:19,639
Speaker 1: dominate again and let all y'all know I'm that dude,

1072
01:11:20,520 --> 01:11:24,400
Speaker 1: or again again and ain't no bs, that's what he

1073
01:11:24,439 --> 01:11:27,320
Speaker 1: was able to do. So I understood that feeling Kobe

1074
01:11:27,320 --> 01:11:32,799
Speaker 1: to the Knicks. Next question, oh, we had no shots,

1075
01:11:33,320 --> 01:11:36,920
Speaker 1: but talk of the idea in the respect right right

1076
01:11:37,000 --> 01:11:39,639
Speaker 1: that he would even entertain it, and that never got out,

1077
01:11:39,640 --> 01:11:41,680
Speaker 1: So you had breaking news on all the smoke got

1078
01:11:41,800 --> 01:11:46,160
Speaker 1: damn appreciate you if you got the stories that ain't

1079
01:11:46,160 --> 01:11:49,760
Speaker 1: got out. We know that. Jack. You should tell him

1080
01:11:49,800 --> 01:11:53,240
Speaker 1: the one about when you when you almost got ran

1081
01:11:53,320 --> 01:11:56,559
Speaker 1: out of this league where we're in ended. And yeah,

1082
01:11:57,560 --> 01:12:00,599
Speaker 1: remember that call you made to me and I called

1083
01:12:00,640 --> 01:12:04,840
Speaker 1: him commission up man. I forgot about that. You was out.

1084
01:12:05,040 --> 01:12:08,439
Speaker 1: I was done. It was done. You was done. I

1085
01:12:08,560 --> 01:12:10,679
Speaker 1: was done so many times. But you'll remember that. And

1086
01:12:11,200 --> 01:12:15,960
Speaker 1: and you you said, I called you from AL. Yeah,

1087
01:12:16,040 --> 01:12:17,280
Speaker 1: that's how I got in touch with you. And I

1088
01:12:17,320 --> 01:12:19,880
Speaker 1: called David Stern. I said you can't do that to him.

1089
01:12:19,960 --> 01:12:22,080
Speaker 1: I was done, you was out. I remember that, it

1090
01:12:22,240 --> 01:12:26,840
Speaker 1: was gone. That's how you got back in the league.

1091
01:12:26,840 --> 01:12:29,880
Speaker 1: I was done. You remember that, like yesterday? You should

1092
01:12:29,880 --> 01:12:32,360
Speaker 1: tell lest I actually forgot about that, but I remember

1093
01:12:32,400 --> 01:12:34,800
Speaker 1: it vividly now. Yeah, I remember, cause I was shit.

1094
01:12:34,920 --> 01:12:36,960
Speaker 1: I was trying to call everybody that I figured would

1095
01:12:37,000 --> 01:12:39,880
Speaker 1: help me at that time. Yeah. And AL say me,

1096
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:44,800
Speaker 1: AL say, no, Isaiah saved I mean, I said I

1097
01:12:44,920 --> 01:12:47,360
Speaker 1: saved it, But AL say, you know what I mean.

1098
01:12:48,080 --> 01:12:51,760
Speaker 1: I said, I saved me, but AL connected me to you. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1099
01:12:51,840 --> 01:12:54,960
Speaker 1: And and you got back out of the court. How

1100
01:12:55,040 --> 01:13:00,360
Speaker 1: mean how many weeks after that? Three? Thank you? I

1101
01:13:00,439 --> 01:13:02,960
Speaker 1: was in the mistance. You already suspended. He was gone.

1102
01:13:03,040 --> 01:13:06,480
Speaker 1: I was done. I wasn't home already. He wasn't suspended. Yeah,

1103
01:13:06,680 --> 01:13:12,240
Speaker 1: the wheels were greased and he was out. Huh. I

1104
01:13:12,280 --> 01:13:16,559
Speaker 1: don't I think I called uh ghostbusters. No, I ain't

1105
01:13:16,600 --> 01:13:22,799
Speaker 1: called ghostbusters. I ain't called ghostbus. Donnie Wall I remember

1106
01:13:22,840 --> 01:13:31,040
Speaker 1: Donnie wah Zeke and uh Mike Brown. That's some people

1107
01:13:31,080 --> 01:13:33,120
Speaker 1: that went to wharf on me that I did, I

1108
01:13:33,200 --> 01:13:35,800
Speaker 1: remember vividly remember. But the only one that got to

1109
01:13:35,880 --> 01:13:38,880
Speaker 1: David Starns the ear. Yeah, I went to that man's office.

1110
01:13:39,439 --> 01:13:44,680
Speaker 1: M hmm. I can't do that to him. That's dope.

1111
01:13:44,760 --> 01:13:47,240
Speaker 1: That's not going to happen. See me in it, I

1112
01:13:47,400 --> 01:13:49,760
Speaker 1: see me in it. Our show was gone too. I'm

1113
01:13:49,760 --> 01:13:52,719
Speaker 1: too money. I was gone. I've seen it. Oh done.

1114
01:13:53,400 --> 01:13:55,439
Speaker 1: If you can see one guest on our show, og,

1115
01:13:55,600 --> 01:13:57,960
Speaker 1: who would it be? Michael Jordan put him in the seat,

1116
01:13:58,000 --> 01:14:02,080
Speaker 1: Tim to come sit here and answer the question, whoever

1117
01:14:02,120 --> 01:14:13,040
Speaker 1: the person is, help us get us. That's out the question.

1118
01:14:14,200 --> 01:14:17,679
Speaker 1: Now you love it, shoe you let it jingle? Yeah? Yeah, y'all, y'all, y'all,

1119
01:14:18,880 --> 01:14:23,080
Speaker 1: I'm still side. Y'all's number, you know, y'all somebody that

1120
01:14:23,120 --> 01:14:24,320
Speaker 1: you can help us get on the show that you

1121
01:14:24,320 --> 01:14:26,280
Speaker 1: would like to see on our show. Because I didn't

1122
01:14:26,360 --> 01:14:28,320
Speaker 1: hit him a million times and that ain't going to play.

1123
01:14:28,880 --> 01:14:31,280
Speaker 1: That's how as quick as we wanted to. So here's

1124
01:14:31,320 --> 01:14:38,080
Speaker 1: real talk, right, We in this brotherhood shouldn't have to

1125
01:14:38,160 --> 01:14:42,000
Speaker 1: go to walk the loop post. Our job and our

1126
01:14:42,120 --> 01:14:51,439
Speaker 1: responsibility is to come here and help you preach. That

1127
01:14:51,720 --> 01:14:59,720
Speaker 1: is our responsibility. That classified as black in the you

1128
01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:04,479
Speaker 1: I ain't in the States of America. Our job is

1129
01:15:04,600 --> 01:15:12,040
Speaker 1: to come and help each other. Now that being said,

1130
01:15:12,920 --> 01:15:16,719
Speaker 1: he needs to sit here. Now who else? Who else?

1131
01:15:17,479 --> 01:15:19,840
Speaker 1: Who else would I want you to see? We got

1132
01:15:19,920 --> 01:15:21,639
Speaker 1: a co run. You just stopped off a co run.

1133
01:15:21,680 --> 01:15:27,360
Speaker 1: We have Magic Chuck and then you Yeah, I got

1134
01:15:27,520 --> 01:15:30,240
Speaker 1: How about this? Y'all deserve it? Thank you, I think,

1135
01:15:30,320 --> 01:15:35,559
Speaker 1: I mean thank you very much. I got a request though,

1136
01:15:36,160 --> 01:15:39,759
Speaker 1: because it's different from me, Like I've been knowing about

1137
01:15:39,800 --> 01:15:42,880
Speaker 1: this guy when his teammates my whole life, and I've

1138
01:15:42,880 --> 01:15:45,360
Speaker 1: been I've been in the tournaments where he saved me

1139
01:15:45,400 --> 01:15:49,400
Speaker 1: as a youngster, Joe Dumas He's Joe didn't know me

1140
01:15:49,400 --> 01:15:52,000
Speaker 1: since I was a kid. I'm planning then the Lake

1141
01:15:52,080 --> 01:15:55,960
Speaker 1: Charles tournaments, basketball tournaments. Joe is a legend. Yes, I

1142
01:15:55,960 --> 01:15:57,680
Speaker 1: would love to get a chance to pick his brain

1143
01:15:57,720 --> 01:15:58,960
Speaker 1: and get to know him because I never had a

1144
01:15:58,960 --> 01:16:02,160
Speaker 1: conversation with him. Yeah, he's someone that you's having this

1145
01:16:02,280 --> 01:16:05,599
Speaker 1: chair and he can be official season. Yes, you know

1146
01:16:05,680 --> 01:16:09,280
Speaker 1: he was the Pistons, right, he's in the league office.

1147
01:16:09,360 --> 01:16:13,000
Speaker 1: The bad Boys. The Sportsmanship Trophy, we're so bad. It's

1148
01:16:13,080 --> 01:16:18,040
Speaker 1: named after Joe. So the influence that we've had on

1149
01:16:18,120 --> 01:16:21,479
Speaker 1: this NBA that they don't give us credit for talk about, right,

1150
01:16:21,960 --> 01:16:25,880
Speaker 1: Joe would be great. Let me ask you one more question.

1151
01:16:25,880 --> 01:16:27,599
Speaker 1: I mean we're done, but I mean you're just so

1152
01:16:27,680 --> 01:16:30,360
Speaker 1: open right now. We may never get this opportunity again.

1153
01:16:31,400 --> 01:16:35,080
Speaker 1: Why do you think And this sitting down has been

1154
01:16:35,120 --> 01:16:39,240
Speaker 1: so eye opening, mind opening, and I've learned so much.

1155
01:16:40,600 --> 01:16:43,880
Speaker 1: Where did the bad narrative about you come from? Because

1156
01:16:43,920 --> 01:16:48,599
Speaker 1: I had the audacity to come into this league and

1157
01:16:49,040 --> 01:16:57,160
Speaker 1: ask for diversity. And I said to the media, when

1158
01:16:57,200 --> 01:17:03,080
Speaker 1: I came into the NBA, it was ninety nine point

1159
01:17:03,240 --> 01:17:11,880
Speaker 1: nine percent white male coverage, were no females, and it

1160
01:17:12,000 --> 01:17:17,840
Speaker 1: may be a one brother point one point one right,

1161
01:17:18,760 --> 01:17:24,639
Speaker 1: And and I said, I do not want to be

1162
01:17:24,840 --> 01:17:33,759
Speaker 1: judged or perceived only through the gaze of the white male.

1163
01:17:36,040 --> 01:17:38,720
Speaker 1: This is the eighty that that that, that that, And

1164
01:17:38,840 --> 01:17:42,600
Speaker 1: I went to the commissioner's office, well Stern already and

1165
01:17:42,640 --> 01:17:45,880
Speaker 1: charged him not to cut you off for this this.

1166
01:17:46,200 --> 01:17:50,760
Speaker 1: So I came in under Larry O'Brien and then Larry left,

1167
01:17:51,120 --> 01:17:55,640
Speaker 1: David came in and to Stern's credit, this is what

1168
01:17:55,720 --> 01:18:01,160
Speaker 1: Stern did. Big respected David Stern because what David Stern

1169
01:18:01,280 --> 01:18:10,920
Speaker 1: did for NBA basketball in to America is David Stern said,

1170
01:18:12,520 --> 01:18:17,519
Speaker 1: black players classified as black in the United States. I'm

1171
01:18:17,560 --> 01:18:25,040
Speaker 1: gonna put them out front, your researcher Sports Illustrated. You

1172
01:18:25,080 --> 01:18:27,880
Speaker 1: can pull it up Sports Illustrated. On the cover of

1173
01:18:27,960 --> 01:18:37,519
Speaker 1: Sports Illustrated, We're white America except the NBA's black players. Wow.

1174
01:18:38,000 --> 01:18:42,120
Speaker 1: That was the article that was the cover. And David

1175
01:18:42,200 --> 01:18:49,400
Speaker 1: Stern said, boom, I'm putting it there now. Now I'm

1176
01:18:49,439 --> 01:18:54,320
Speaker 1: falling up, and I'm saying, we need some black coverage.

1177
01:18:54,680 --> 01:18:57,479
Speaker 1: You know, we need some some brothers. You know where

1178
01:18:57,520 --> 01:19:05,800
Speaker 1: they at Detroit and it still may be to this day.

1179
01:19:06,040 --> 01:19:11,040
Speaker 1: I was making so much noise. They gave us two

1180
01:19:11,080 --> 01:19:15,720
Speaker 1: black beat writers, and I think Detroit at that time

1181
01:19:15,880 --> 01:19:18,919
Speaker 1: was the only team traveling with two black beat writers,

1182
01:19:20,320 --> 01:19:24,320
Speaker 1: Terry Foster who's a columnist now, Drew Sharp who passed away,

1183
01:19:24,360 --> 01:19:29,200
Speaker 1: became a columnist, Clifton Brown became a columnist, Brian Burrow

1184
01:19:29,240 --> 01:19:41,680
Speaker 1: World became a columnist, Jeanette Howard became a columnist. That

1185
01:19:41,880 --> 01:19:49,760
Speaker 1: was Detroit, traveling around the NBA and Detroit today, I

1186
01:19:49,800 --> 01:19:53,080
Speaker 1: think they still have two black beat writers on the

1187
01:19:53,120 --> 01:20:00,080
Speaker 1: beat now, and I think Beard just got promoted to

1188
01:20:00,280 --> 01:20:05,160
Speaker 1: a columnist or he may even be an editor. So

1189
01:20:05,280 --> 01:20:08,360
Speaker 1: why do I get so much trouble Because a lot

1190
01:20:08,400 --> 01:20:11,240
Speaker 1: of the white males at that time who were writing

1191
01:20:13,080 --> 01:20:16,559
Speaker 1: didn't like what I was saying, and they thought that

1192
01:20:16,600 --> 01:20:20,000
Speaker 1: I was coming out to their jobs or what have you.

1193
01:20:20,120 --> 01:20:23,719
Speaker 1: And back then, they painted all the pictures. They painted

1194
01:20:23,720 --> 01:20:27,040
Speaker 1: all the pictures. And not only did they paint the pictures,

1195
01:20:28,240 --> 01:20:34,200
Speaker 1: but after they so you would get interviewed, they would

1196
01:20:34,240 --> 01:20:37,000
Speaker 1: write down what you say, and then they would take

1197
01:20:37,040 --> 01:20:40,920
Speaker 1: it to an editor, and one hundred percent of the

1198
01:20:41,040 --> 01:20:48,439
Speaker 1: editors were white males, and then the editor would fatigue

1199
01:20:48,479 --> 01:20:50,519
Speaker 1: what she said and then they would put it in

1200
01:20:50,520 --> 01:20:54,280
Speaker 1: the newspaper. And that's what you said. Don't look nothing

1201
01:20:54,360 --> 01:20:56,920
Speaker 1: like what came out of my mouth. Right, sometimes it

1202
01:20:57,000 --> 01:21:02,479
Speaker 1: was right, sometimes it was wrong. Whatever. So, and then

1203
01:21:02,520 --> 01:21:09,679
Speaker 1: the second thing is, y'all former players at that time

1204
01:21:10,200 --> 01:21:13,719
Speaker 1: when I became vice president and president of the union

1205
01:21:15,320 --> 01:21:24,280
Speaker 1: agents at that time, we're taking twenty percent off the top. Damn.

1206
01:21:24,280 --> 01:21:27,839
Speaker 1: It's crazy. As a player contracts, they were taking fifty

1207
01:21:27,880 --> 01:21:32,280
Speaker 1: percent on endorsements. So I put in this thing called

1208
01:21:32,320 --> 01:21:37,759
Speaker 1: agent certification, and I cut the fees from twenty percent

1209
01:21:37,880 --> 01:21:43,320
Speaker 1: to a negotiated four and then we slotted the salaries

1210
01:21:43,800 --> 01:21:48,720
Speaker 1: and we uniformed the contract in terms of language. I

1211
01:21:48,840 --> 01:21:52,040
Speaker 1: retired in ninety four, then locked y'all out in ninety five.

1212
01:21:52,600 --> 01:21:57,160
Speaker 1: He said, they locked it out, and he winked, damn

1213
01:21:57,560 --> 01:21:59,760
Speaker 1: one more time. I retired in ninety four. They locked

1214
01:21:59,760 --> 01:22:04,320
Speaker 1: you out ninety five, and then they started clawing back

1215
01:22:04,320 --> 01:22:09,000
Speaker 1: and taking everything that you once had. And then they

1216
01:22:09,000 --> 01:22:14,040
Speaker 1: start putting other people in place, start between the agent's

1217
01:22:14,120 --> 01:22:21,840
Speaker 1: narrative and some of the scriptwriters. And so I want

1218
01:22:21,840 --> 01:22:23,800
Speaker 1: I want you to go back and look up this word.

1219
01:22:23,840 --> 01:22:32,880
Speaker 1: It's called hegemony. H E G O O m N.

1220
01:22:33,040 --> 01:22:37,320
Speaker 1: Y y'all get that fun you know I'm gonna need it.

1221
01:22:38,640 --> 01:22:44,599
Speaker 1: Hegemony and the Hedgemond, right, the scriptwriters, those who create

1222
01:22:44,640 --> 01:22:52,320
Speaker 1: the narrative, those who influence, those who tell you not

1223
01:22:52,400 --> 01:22:57,920
Speaker 1: to like me, and like that one. You don't know

1224
01:22:57,960 --> 01:23:01,920
Speaker 1: why you don't like me. You just know why. It's

1225
01:23:01,960 --> 01:23:05,120
Speaker 1: just something I don't know. Didn't they look for any reason?

1226
01:23:05,640 --> 01:23:12,080
Speaker 1: You know, you know, you know, but it's always whatever

1227
01:23:12,120 --> 01:23:17,400
Speaker 1: it is, right. But you remember that word, and you

1228
01:23:17,439 --> 01:23:20,360
Speaker 1: go back and you look at a geminy and put

1229
01:23:20,400 --> 01:23:24,120
Speaker 1: that in your definitions and start talking to people about it.

1230
01:23:24,880 --> 01:23:32,519
Speaker 1: But bring that that we're back into play, because that's

1231
01:23:32,560 --> 01:23:36,400
Speaker 1: what's happening in the NBA and these narratives and these

1232
01:23:36,439 --> 01:23:40,440
Speaker 1: stories and everything else. You know, from an educational standpoint,

1233
01:23:41,760 --> 01:23:45,360
Speaker 1: we need to know what the scriptwriters are saying, how

1234
01:23:45,439 --> 01:23:49,439
Speaker 1: we being scripted, how we're being spoken to and spoken about.

1235
01:23:50,080 --> 01:23:52,160
Speaker 1: The last thing I'm leading with in terms of the

1236
01:23:52,160 --> 01:24:03,639
Speaker 1: thing that I attacked and still attacked today. Language carries

1237
01:24:03,680 --> 01:24:08,880
Speaker 1: outside of the playing field. So these ugly labels that

1238
01:24:08,960 --> 01:24:13,960
Speaker 1: they attached to the Detroit Pistons. Bior Lambier has never

1239
01:24:14,000 --> 01:24:19,800
Speaker 1: been called a thug in his life. Grew up in

1240
01:24:19,840 --> 01:24:22,679
Speaker 1: the suburbs, his father ran a fortune five hundred company.

1241
01:24:22,800 --> 01:24:27,000
Speaker 1: He gets to the Detroit Pistons and they called Bil

1242
01:24:27,080 --> 01:24:32,200
Speaker 1: Lambier a thug, and we know what thug means outside

1243
01:24:32,200 --> 01:24:35,320
Speaker 1: of the game of basketball. So these dirty labels that

1244
01:24:35,320 --> 01:24:40,120
Speaker 1: they attached to us right in all way of play,

1245
01:24:40,160 --> 01:24:42,320
Speaker 1: and then Detroit being the city that it is in

1246
01:24:42,439 --> 01:24:46,320
Speaker 1: all black city. So the language that they used around us,

1247
01:24:46,800 --> 01:24:51,000
Speaker 1: in the narrative that they painted around us, right, And

1248
01:24:51,080 --> 01:24:55,680
Speaker 1: when you try to refute those labels, bad person, you're

1249
01:24:55,680 --> 01:24:59,679
Speaker 1: a bad person. You got pushed down further and further, right,

1250
01:25:00,240 --> 01:25:07,720
Speaker 1: So you know the I had never been called a

1251
01:25:07,800 --> 01:25:12,240
Speaker 1: thug in my life, and I've said to several writers

1252
01:25:12,880 --> 01:25:20,400
Speaker 1: along the way, don't ever call me a beast, Don't

1253
01:25:20,400 --> 01:25:27,200
Speaker 1: ever call me an animal. Don't use dehumanizing words in

1254
01:25:27,360 --> 01:25:35,760
Speaker 1: terms to describe the way I play. That's not who

1255
01:25:35,800 --> 01:25:40,600
Speaker 1: I am, That's not what I represent. You're smart, you

1256
01:25:40,640 --> 01:25:44,040
Speaker 1: went to college, you're a journalist, you have a degree,

1257
01:25:45,280 --> 01:25:51,800
Speaker 1: you have a pretty vast vocabulary. You can find better

1258
01:25:51,840 --> 01:25:56,160
Speaker 1: words and language to use around the way I play.

1259
01:25:59,120 --> 01:26:09,880
Speaker 1: So I get drafted, I'm a restricted free agent. Then

1260
01:26:09,920 --> 01:26:14,240
Speaker 1: I become free. I'd let that sit with you for

1261
01:26:14,280 --> 01:26:28,040
Speaker 1: a minute. After I gained my freedom, now I can

1262
01:26:28,080 --> 01:26:36,920
Speaker 1: go anywhere. Okay, Now you can fantasize about owning me.

1263
01:26:40,960 --> 01:26:46,640
Speaker 1: You can trade me, you can bet on me, you

1264
01:26:46,680 --> 01:26:51,080
Speaker 1: can gamble on me, you can you can say words

1265
01:26:51,120 --> 01:26:54,759
Speaker 1: to me inside this place that no one would dare

1266
01:26:54,800 --> 01:27:00,280
Speaker 1: say outside of this place to me. So in a

1267
01:27:00,360 --> 01:27:09,240
Speaker 1: very slippery slope here, and the dehumanization of the NBA

1268
01:27:09,360 --> 01:27:15,479
Speaker 1: player needs to be uplifted. Now. I'm gonna give Adam

1269
01:27:15,560 --> 01:27:19,240
Speaker 1: Silver a big hand because what he said the other day,

1270
01:27:19,280 --> 01:27:23,960
Speaker 1: which he's getting heavily criticized for in terms of load management. Right,

1271
01:27:25,280 --> 01:27:27,840
Speaker 1: the first word that came out of Adam Silver's mouth

1272
01:27:28,040 --> 01:27:38,000
Speaker 1: was these guys are what human? These are human beings.

1273
01:27:39,439 --> 01:27:45,719
Speaker 1: That's what he said. Oh oh oh they these got

1274
01:27:45,920 --> 01:27:50,120
Speaker 1: these guys ain't human they player? No, no, no, that

1275
01:27:50,160 --> 01:27:55,679
Speaker 1: commissioner is right. He wants to treat them like human being.

1276
01:27:55,760 --> 01:28:00,519
Speaker 1: And he actually used the word human being. And you

1277
01:28:00,560 --> 01:28:06,040
Speaker 1: have one player right now who just left Brooklyn, and

1278
01:28:06,200 --> 01:28:20,120
Speaker 1: he keeps saying, don't dehumanize me. Words carry weight. Words

1279
01:28:20,400 --> 01:28:26,160
Speaker 1: carry weight. And it's important how you define rea talk

1280
01:28:26,880 --> 01:28:31,880
Speaker 1: about me. I don't accept it. I push back on

1281
01:28:32,000 --> 01:28:34,400
Speaker 1: a lot of them. No, you can't speak to me

1282
01:28:34,439 --> 01:28:39,080
Speaker 1: that way. You can't talk to me that way. You

1283
01:28:39,120 --> 01:28:44,360
Speaker 1: can't say this to me. No, I'm not that. Oh well,

1284
01:28:44,360 --> 01:28:47,840
Speaker 1: when you talk to Isaiah Man, you know that. Now, Yeah,

1285
01:28:47,880 --> 01:28:52,439
Speaker 1: you come correct. Yes, I'm not accepting you calling me

1286
01:28:52,560 --> 01:28:58,000
Speaker 1: the N word, y'all can say. Don't look in the dictionary.

1287
01:28:58,320 --> 01:29:02,400
Speaker 1: This is what it says. Right, don't call me that. Now.

1288
01:29:02,439 --> 01:29:03,760
Speaker 1: If you want to call your friend now, you want

1289
01:29:03,760 --> 01:29:06,559
Speaker 1: to call them back, but don't call me that. Because

1290
01:29:06,560 --> 01:29:08,040
Speaker 1: when I was growing up, if you call me that,

1291
01:29:08,080 --> 01:29:11,519
Speaker 1: we're fighting. I'm fighting you every day no matter how

1292
01:29:11,600 --> 01:29:13,880
Speaker 1: much melan you have in your skin or the lack

1293
01:29:13,920 --> 01:29:16,040
Speaker 1: of melan and you have in your skin. You call

1294
01:29:16,120 --> 01:29:19,719
Speaker 1: me that, it's on Don't call me that on the internet.

1295
01:29:19,760 --> 01:29:23,160
Speaker 1: Don't call me that on social media. Never ever ever

1296
01:29:24,880 --> 01:29:28,120
Speaker 1: call your mama that. Don't call me that, right, I'm

1297
01:29:28,160 --> 01:29:31,120
Speaker 1: not that. And how we speak to each other, how

1298
01:29:31,160 --> 01:29:33,400
Speaker 1: we treat each other, how we interact with each other,

1299
01:29:35,360 --> 01:29:38,880
Speaker 1: real talk. Taking it all the way back to the gangs.

1300
01:29:40,360 --> 01:29:46,080
Speaker 1: They weren't called gangs until they got labeled gangs. They

1301
01:29:46,080 --> 01:29:51,880
Speaker 1: were organizations in the community teaching us how to be

1302
01:29:52,120 --> 01:30:03,479
Speaker 1: upstanding citizens, live, act, treat each other. Then Big brother

1303
01:30:04,120 --> 01:30:07,599
Speaker 1: put some stuff in our neighborhood. Big Brothers started doing

1304
01:30:07,600 --> 01:30:10,320
Speaker 1: a lot of other stuff in our neighborhoods, and it's

1305
01:30:10,320 --> 01:30:16,120
Speaker 1: all documented. But you know the words that are being

1306
01:30:16,240 --> 01:30:23,080
Speaker 1: used right now. We can do better. Absolutely, man. We

1307
01:30:23,120 --> 01:30:27,120
Speaker 1: appreciate you, especially straight off a flight to come here

1308
01:30:27,160 --> 01:30:28,800
Speaker 1: and sit down and spend some time with us, and

1309
01:30:29,000 --> 01:30:30,960
Speaker 1: like I said, and just enlighten us. You know, I

1310
01:30:31,040 --> 01:30:33,599
Speaker 1: learned a lot today and I appreciate I got some

1311
01:30:33,600 --> 01:30:36,040
Speaker 1: free stuff. Oh yeah, you got some gear? Oh yeah, man,

1312
01:30:36,160 --> 01:30:39,200
Speaker 1: you know, but this is one thing that all of

1313
01:30:39,280 --> 01:30:43,000
Speaker 1: us won't right, don't get me no money, Okay, we

1314
01:30:43,000 --> 01:30:45,080
Speaker 1: won't gear. Do you want gear? You want the money.

1315
01:30:45,240 --> 01:30:48,120
Speaker 1: We take the gear over the money, right, gear. We

1316
01:30:48,240 --> 01:30:51,320
Speaker 1: got some man scared, We got your body buffer. You know,

1317
01:30:51,439 --> 01:30:54,840
Speaker 1: we got some all the smoke T shirt and sweatshirts,

1318
01:30:54,880 --> 01:30:57,280
Speaker 1: just some limited edition all the smoke gear for you.

1319
01:30:57,320 --> 01:30:59,840
Speaker 1: Will appreciate you showing up. Thanks you the plane, O G.

1320
01:31:00,360 --> 01:31:02,840
Speaker 1: Thank you. I appreciate so much. Man, We appreciate you.

1321
01:31:03,360 --> 01:31:07,960
Speaker 1: Thank I send y'all bottle of champagne. Yeah yeah, well

1322
01:31:07,960 --> 01:31:11,240
Speaker 1: that's a rap man. Isaiah Thomas, the one and only,

1323
01:31:11,320 --> 01:31:15,439
Speaker 1: the real Zeke uh All the Smoke, Showtime Basketball YouTube

1324
01:31:15,439 --> 01:31:18,080
Speaker 1: and the iHeart Platform Black Effects. We'll see y'all next

1325
01:31:18,120 --> 01:31:18,320
Speaker 1: week