1 00:00:05,280 --> 00:00:10,400 Speaker 1: It's Wednesday, July thirtieth, So happy Trade Deadline Eve. Welcome 2 00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:13,399 Speaker 1: back to Cardinal Territory, Katie and Bernie here to cover 3 00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:17,759 Speaker 1: the final twenty four ish hours before MLB's trade deadline 4 00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:22,280 Speaker 1: officially hits that scheduled four Thursday. That's tomorrow, July thirty, first, 5 00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:26,120 Speaker 1: at five pm Central Time. A couple of trades taking 6 00:00:26,160 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 1: place today. I saw Austin Slater went to the New 7 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:32,440 Speaker 1: York Yankees. All was quiet here on the Cardinals front, 8 00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:35,360 Speaker 1: and I expect it to remain that way up until tomorrow. 9 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:38,680 Speaker 1: Then things will pick up. Ryan Helsley, film Aton and 10 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:41,199 Speaker 1: Stephen Matz are still the most likely players to go 11 00:00:41,280 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 1: at this deadline. But John Mozelac has always kind of 12 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:49,680 Speaker 1: been He's been okay with waiting until the deadline final 13 00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:53,200 Speaker 1: buzzer beater to make a movie. Think about his significant 14 00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:55,840 Speaker 1: trades as of late. He swapped Tommy Edmund for Eric 15 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:59,040 Speaker 1: Betty and Tommy fam the afternoon of the deadline. Last 16 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:02,600 Speaker 1: year three, he sent Jack Flaherty an hour before the deadline, 17 00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:05,600 Speaker 1: and then he traded Harrison Bader for Jordan Montgomery minutes 18 00:01:05,640 --> 00:01:08,360 Speaker 1: before the twenty twenty two deadline. Same with his deal 19 00:01:08,400 --> 00:01:12,040 Speaker 1: for John Lester. This all happened maybe three or four 20 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:14,600 Speaker 1: minutes before the deadline officially hit its cut off. So 21 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:18,119 Speaker 1: sit in wait patiently as much as you can, Cardinals fans. 22 00:01:18,400 --> 00:01:20,240 Speaker 1: Things should start to pick up in the next twenty 23 00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:22,440 Speaker 1: four hours. They kind of have to, otherwise we're having 24 00:01:22,440 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 1: a much bigger problem. Bernie, how do you hear the 25 00:01:25,080 --> 00:01:25,920 Speaker 1: trade deadline? 26 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:29,760 Speaker 2: Well, I'm just like everyone else. I'm just waiting to 27 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 2: see if you know, John Mozleak will make the boast 28 00:01:32,440 --> 00:01:38,120 Speaker 2: of it, or whether you know I'm not. I'm trying. 29 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:41,600 Speaker 2: I'm not trying to be a jackass, Okay, but you 30 00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 2: know I have to admit, you know, part of me 31 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:47,319 Speaker 2: is like wondering, you know, is it even possible for 32 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 2: him to screw this up? And let me just say, 33 00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:53,040 Speaker 2: I guess everything is possible. I mean, I think skepticism 34 00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 2: is understandable. So I'm just I'm not there's no need 35 00:01:56,040 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 2: to pass any judgment yet. But they do have assets, 36 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:04,920 Speaker 2: they do have expiring contracts, they have three relievers, plus 37 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 2: Jojo Romero has got a year left in a market 38 00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:09,919 Speaker 2: where I read the Athletic all the time and all 39 00:02:09,919 --> 00:02:14,880 Speaker 2: the national writers, yourself, you know, keep talking understandably so 40 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:18,399 Speaker 2: about how there is this dire need for relief help 41 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 2: and the Cardinals have like basically four guys to pedal. 42 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 2: And you know, I do think sometimes, I mean, we 43 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:31,480 Speaker 2: expect that they will get like a lot for these guys. 44 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:35,080 Speaker 2: And I'm never sure whether that's a safe prediction because 45 00:02:35,080 --> 00:02:38,240 Speaker 2: I've seen it where yeah, teams will go nuts and 46 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:40,079 Speaker 2: give you a lot for your relievers, but I've also 47 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:41,960 Speaker 2: seen deadlines where it doesn't happen. So I don't know 48 00:02:41,960 --> 00:02:45,520 Speaker 2: what to expect. But when you have four relievers, three 49 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:50,120 Speaker 2: on expiring contracts, in a market where contenders are scrambling 50 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:52,800 Speaker 2: for relief help, you got to make the most of it. 51 00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:56,240 Speaker 2: You just have to. There's no justification for not doing that. 52 00:02:57,000 --> 00:02:59,359 Speaker 1: Absolutely, you have to capitalize on these returns. And that's 53 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,799 Speaker 1: why I'm okay with John mozaylock taking his time here. 54 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:05,240 Speaker 1: There's no need to rush into anything. The Cardinals have 55 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:08,000 Speaker 1: all of the leverage here, so you might as well 56 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:09,760 Speaker 1: use it to your advantage. And I will say this 57 00:03:09,840 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 1: about mo he might not hit on every single return, 58 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:15,960 Speaker 1: but he's one of the best negotiators in the league 59 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:18,880 Speaker 1: because he gets what he wants. He wanted Tommy fam 60 00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 1: and that Eric Fetty deal that had come to Fruition 61 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:24,440 Speaker 1: a night before. But he wasn't settled with just Betty. 62 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:26,200 Speaker 1: He wanted Tommy Fam. So who gets out and he 63 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 1: gets it, he is okay. I've actually used some of 64 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:32,760 Speaker 1: his negotiation tactics to when I was negotiating my own contract. 65 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:35,680 Speaker 1: So they do work. He knows how to negotiate. We 66 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 1: can have a different conversation about the returns and if 67 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:40,560 Speaker 1: they've panned out, because most of them have not. And 68 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:43,080 Speaker 1: I won't fight you there. But this is a time 69 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 1: where the Cardinals have again all the leverage, at a 70 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:48,360 Speaker 1: time where relief market, the relief pitching market is at 71 00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:50,760 Speaker 1: its highest. There are not a lot of bona fide 72 00:03:50,760 --> 00:03:54,120 Speaker 1: closers out there. There is David Bednan from the Pirates, 73 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 1: maybe Pete Fairbanks from the Rays if they kind of 74 00:03:57,280 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 1: if they sell, but they're walking this tightrope and they 75 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:02,280 Speaker 1: really don't want to let him go. In Manuel Class 76 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: is on the I can't remember the official term. It's 77 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:10,240 Speaker 1: like the not the pay to leave investigation. He's not 78 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,360 Speaker 1: able to play until August thirty first. Maybe Joanne Duran 79 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:16,000 Speaker 1: breaks into that list as well, But there are just 80 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:17,800 Speaker 1: not a lot of out there for a while. 81 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm sorry, I'm just I have such terrible manners. 82 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:24,640 Speaker 2: Just cut my microphone off when I'm doing that. I 83 00:04:24,680 --> 00:04:28,799 Speaker 2: apologize to you. Yeah, but I'm with you because listen, 84 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:30,600 Speaker 2: I've been really, really, really tough on MO and I 85 00:04:30,640 --> 00:04:32,960 Speaker 2: think it's most of that is warranted. Maybe sometimes I 86 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 2: go a little overboard, but whatever. But the one thing 87 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:37,800 Speaker 2: I do is I try to be fair and I 88 00:04:37,839 --> 00:04:40,280 Speaker 2: will defend him. And there's a lot of people, you know, 89 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:43,839 Speaker 2: you know, fans or whomever, that even when he's made 90 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 2: some really good trades at the deadline, they'll try to 91 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:49,320 Speaker 2: tell you they weren't really good trades. The hell they weren't. 92 00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:52,560 Speaker 2: I mean, in twenty twenty two, in addition to Montgomery, 93 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:55,039 Speaker 2: he got Jose Cantana, and both of those guys were terrific. 94 00:04:55,080 --> 00:04:57,839 Speaker 2: You know, the Cardinals after they got those two guys, 95 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 2: and their rotation was bleeding at that down the stretch, 96 00:05:02,279 --> 00:05:05,640 Speaker 2: those two starters combined, the Cardinals were seventeen and six 97 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:09,480 Speaker 2: in their starts. I mean, you cannot come up any 98 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:12,160 Speaker 2: better bigger than that at the trade deadline when you 99 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 2: need starting pitching, they were excellent, and Cantana basically had 100 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:18,360 Speaker 2: the Phillies beat in Game one of the playoffs that year. 101 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:22,279 Speaker 2: So and then in twenty one you mentioned Lester, and 102 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 2: then there's also Jay Happy got them on the same day. 103 00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:27,640 Speaker 2: He gave up nothing. Well, Lane Thomas was okay. But 104 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 2: the point is the Cardinals people, you have to remember, 105 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:34,280 Speaker 2: they were desperate. They were utterly desperate for starting pitching, 106 00:05:34,839 --> 00:05:38,440 Speaker 2: and Hap and Lester did really really well for what 107 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 2: they needed. No one's saying, you know, they're Thomas Ever 108 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:44,240 Speaker 2: and Don Drysdale or whatever, but they did really really 109 00:05:44,279 --> 00:05:47,040 Speaker 2: well for a team that was desperate for starting pitching. 110 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:53,360 Speaker 2: Most reasons for making the Fetti trade were logical and 111 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:57,200 Speaker 2: fit sound, and I approved of the trade. I thought 112 00:05:57,200 --> 00:06:00,240 Speaker 2: it was good. Keith Law The Athletic and many others wrote, hey, 113 00:06:00,400 --> 00:06:04,680 Speaker 2: Mo got the top available starter on the market, and 114 00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:07,720 Speaker 2: he gave up an infielder that was hurt and they 115 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:10,400 Speaker 2: weren't going to re sign when his contract expired, So 116 00:06:10,880 --> 00:06:12,560 Speaker 2: this was a heck of a trade. It didn't, bottom line, 117 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:14,599 Speaker 2: didn't work out. But that doesn't like. 118 00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 1: It was a good trade. 119 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's In other words, both things can be true, 120 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:25,719 Speaker 2: meaning the thinking behind the trade was absolutely right. But 121 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:28,440 Speaker 2: then you have the final result. Nope, it didn't work out. 122 00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:32,120 Speaker 2: Both things can be true, And you know, I think 123 00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:36,400 Speaker 2: twenty twenty three, you know where he traded offloaded Flaarty 124 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:39,760 Speaker 2: and Montgomery and some others. I think I don't think 125 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:41,680 Speaker 2: there's a full verdict in yet. I think a lot 126 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:43,919 Speaker 2: of that will depend on what Tako Robi becomes and 127 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:45,600 Speaker 2: we're not going to find that out for quite a 128 00:06:45,640 --> 00:06:48,159 Speaker 2: while now. And same with s JC. And you know, 129 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:51,919 Speaker 2: they also got Matt Spahnson in that, and there's a 130 00:06:51,960 --> 00:06:54,280 Speaker 2: couple other guys that could surface. I'm not gonna I'm 131 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:56,640 Speaker 2: not going to give up on those guys yet. But Mo, 132 00:06:57,120 --> 00:06:59,039 Speaker 2: I'll never forget Katie and I'll shut up because this 133 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:01,040 Speaker 2: is like, well, let's let me give you a history 134 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:01,600 Speaker 2: lesson here. 135 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:02,000 Speaker 3: No. 136 00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:07,040 Speaker 2: In twenty thirteen, the Cardinals really really needed relief help 137 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:11,200 Speaker 2: and Cardinals fans were clamoring for Jonathan Broxton who was 138 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:14,520 Speaker 2: having a good year, and all these leavers were coming 139 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:17,120 Speaker 2: off the shelves and Mo got a guy from the 140 00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:21,280 Speaker 2: Marlins name Edward Mohica and at the time I was 141 00:07:21,320 --> 00:07:23,000 Speaker 2: osen the show one on one ESPN, And when he 142 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:25,480 Speaker 2: traded for Edwin Mehica, when all these big name relievers 143 00:07:25,480 --> 00:07:28,120 Speaker 2: were going off the shelves. People were losing their minds. 144 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:32,760 Speaker 2: People were losing their minds. Right oh mo oh, thanks boy, 145 00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:35,080 Speaker 2: big help there. I don't even know who this guy is. 146 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:38,080 Speaker 2: Mohika saved their season. They wouldn't say their season. They 147 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:39,960 Speaker 2: were really good. We're talking about a National League pennant 148 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 2: winner and he was outstanding. That trade might have been 149 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:48,560 Speaker 2: twenty twelve and twenty thirteen. Mohika was an all star. 150 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:51,240 Speaker 2: He was outstanding. He said he had thirty seven saves 151 00:07:51,240 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 2: one year. So Mo has made some goofs that he 152 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:58,240 Speaker 2: doesn't get enough credit for. But but again, because I 153 00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:02,360 Speaker 2: am guilty of this, I am so we'll see. I've 154 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 2: lost some trust in him, to say the least. 155 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 1: And that's totally fair, and I think a lot of 156 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 1: fans share that sentiment. We'll get into that, we'll get 157 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:10,600 Speaker 1: into the market for what the Cardinals believers look like. 158 00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 1: We'll get into how the dynamic is working with Mohenheim 159 00:08:13,080 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 1: and Bloom quickly after we hear a message from our 160 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:19,520 Speaker 1: sponsors at Superpower krats. 161 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:21,800 Speaker 4: At some point we're going to laugh about how healthcare 162 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:26,040 Speaker 4: was so reactive and not proactive, and we're starting to 163 00:08:26,160 --> 00:08:28,880 Speaker 4: change that with Superpower. They believe every human has one 164 00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:32,040 Speaker 4: hundred plus year potential and they're here to help you 165 00:08:32,080 --> 00:08:33,760 Speaker 4: get there. I'm a big believer in this. I just 166 00:08:33,800 --> 00:08:35,959 Speaker 4: started the journey, so I'm excited about it. 167 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:36,920 Speaker 2: And what do you think? 168 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:40,480 Speaker 3: As a player, You're always looking ways to improve yourself, 169 00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:43,800 Speaker 3: improve your health, and this is an easy, easy way. 170 00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:47,600 Speaker 3: Superpowers made it way easier than when I was playing. 171 00:08:47,640 --> 00:08:49,760 Speaker 3: You had to go get all these lab panels and 172 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:52,959 Speaker 3: it was a long, drawn out, expensive process. But now 173 00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:55,280 Speaker 3: with Superpower, so this is awesome for me. I'm excited 174 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:55,679 Speaker 3: about it. 175 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 4: They'll send a licensed professional to your home, or you 176 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:01,560 Speaker 4: can visit a nearby lab at time. The FT fam 177 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:04,560 Speaker 4: can get fifty dollars off an annual Superpower membership by 178 00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:07,520 Speaker 4: using code foul at checkout. Just head to superpower dot 179 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:10,880 Speaker 4: com and use code foul to get our exclusive discount, 180 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:15,320 Speaker 4: your biology decoded, your blueprint activated with Superpower. After your purchase, 181 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:17,280 Speaker 4: they'll ask you where you heard about them and please 182 00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:19,280 Speaker 4: support FT and tell them we sent you. 183 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:22,720 Speaker 1: I want to know what my biological age is. It's 184 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:24,800 Speaker 1: probably like fifty. After this deadline? 185 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:27,400 Speaker 2: Can we split it? Can we share a membership to 186 00:09:27,520 --> 00:09:30,160 Speaker 2: superpower that I swear to you. I was writing that 187 00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:32,680 Speaker 2: down when they were talking about it. I might have 188 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:33,440 Speaker 2: to look into that. 189 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:35,520 Speaker 1: So I want to know what I need. 190 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:38,320 Speaker 2: I think I need superpower help. It might be the 191 00:09:38,360 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 2: only thing that can keep me going anyway to. 192 00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:42,240 Speaker 1: Get through the next twenty four hours on all the 193 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 1: help I can get just caffeine alive. Oh, that's the same, 194 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 1: that's the same banner. We just did that segment. Next, 195 00:09:49,960 --> 00:09:51,959 Speaker 1: what's the market for the Cardinals relievers? I had a 196 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 1: story up on the Athletic yesterday. I thought it was hilarious. Uh, 197 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:59,640 Speaker 1: Steven Mattz pitched an inning and relief on Monday, so 198 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:02,280 Speaker 1: he my expectation was coming into Tuesday he would pitch 199 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:05,920 Speaker 1: an inning and relief and I understand why. Chip and 200 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:10,520 Speaker 1: Brat on the Cardinals broadcast pointed out that when the 201 00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:12,680 Speaker 1: top of this hour at the bottom of the seven started, 202 00:10:13,320 --> 00:10:15,400 Speaker 1: how weird of a situation it was because nobody was 203 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:20,880 Speaker 1: on the mound and Matt Spohnson comes running into the game. Unfortunately, 204 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:23,240 Speaker 1: one of the umpires had some heat exhaustion. But that 205 00:10:23,280 --> 00:10:24,920 Speaker 1: turned out to be a favorable break for the Cardinals 206 00:10:24,920 --> 00:10:27,240 Speaker 1: because it gave Sponson some time to warm up. They 207 00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:30,079 Speaker 1: had nobody up, nobody on the mound, so of course 208 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:33,839 Speaker 1: this time of year, the speculation was Steven Matches got traded. 209 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:36,800 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. No, there was a miscommunication between the 210 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:39,480 Speaker 1: phone lines and the dugout and the bullpen and sponson 211 00:10:39,559 --> 00:10:43,280 Speaker 1: never was never got up. So that was all. But 212 00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:45,760 Speaker 1: I was thankfully everything all worked out. Matt's and I 213 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:48,440 Speaker 1: laughed about it after the game. I was just thinking, like, 214 00:10:48,640 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 1: what a crazy next forty eight hours. At the time 215 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:54,319 Speaker 1: this is going to be, because we know the market 216 00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:58,079 Speaker 1: for the Cardinals believers is going to be so so extensive. 217 00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:00,160 Speaker 1: So no, Stephen mass did not get traded last night. 218 00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:03,320 Speaker 1: There's just a miscommunication, bad timing all around. I do 219 00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:05,199 Speaker 1: expect there to be a market for Steven Matts, will 220 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 1: start with him potentially as a swingman. As we know, 221 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:11,160 Speaker 1: the Cardinals have used Matts mostly as a late inning, 222 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:14,960 Speaker 1: multi inning leverage reliever. Uh and he's thrived there, especially 223 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:17,320 Speaker 1: against lefty hitters. I mean, left handed hitters are hitting 224 00:11:17,400 --> 00:11:20,040 Speaker 1: less than two hundred against him this year. Uh and 225 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:22,120 Speaker 1: he's had had a couple spot starts. He's up to 226 00:11:22,160 --> 00:11:25,360 Speaker 1: forty pitches right now. He could be used as a swingman, 227 00:11:25,480 --> 00:11:27,160 Speaker 1: and there are plenty of teams that are looking for 228 00:11:27,200 --> 00:11:29,679 Speaker 1: that role. Matts wants to start, but he's open to 229 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:32,400 Speaker 1: anything really at this point, and I wonder if a 230 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 1: team like Toronto, where he has pass past experience with 231 00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:37,560 Speaker 1: really enjoyed his time, would be a good fit there. 232 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:41,400 Speaker 1: I do know that he's out about four point eight 233 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:43,560 Speaker 1: million dollars left on that contract, so it's kind of 234 00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:45,680 Speaker 1: a lot of money for a two month rental. But 235 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:47,559 Speaker 1: to your point, Bertie, the market for relievers is in 236 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:51,200 Speaker 1: such high demand that I could see Matt's going before 237 00:11:51,240 --> 00:11:53,439 Speaker 1: this deadline. May Ton, you know what you're gonna get 238 00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:56,439 Speaker 1: with him, veteran guy ample Post. He's an experience owed 239 00:11:56,520 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 1: seven hundred thousand dollars remaining on his contract. He's gonna go, 240 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:02,680 Speaker 1: and he's gonna go quick. Ryan Helsley has several teams 241 00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:04,960 Speaker 1: in the mix, and we know they are at least 242 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:08,440 Speaker 1: the Tigers, the Dodgers, the Mets, the Blue Jays, and 243 00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:10,880 Speaker 1: the Phillies. The Phillies' interest in Hellsley dates back to 244 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:15,199 Speaker 1: the off season. Similar to many people around the organization 245 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 1: and the industry as a whole, I believe all three 246 00:12:17,120 --> 00:12:21,240 Speaker 1: believers will be out of here come tomorrow afternoon. But 247 00:12:21,440 --> 00:12:24,840 Speaker 1: to your point, Bernie, I understand why fans might be 248 00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:28,719 Speaker 1: skeptical that these deals either have a hang up in 249 00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:33,319 Speaker 1: the return or don't get done. Regardless, it is objectively 250 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:38,000 Speaker 1: weird to have two president Baseball Operations essentially running the show. 251 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 1: John Mozailok will ultimately have the final say. And while 252 00:12:41,360 --> 00:12:43,440 Speaker 1: we're still working through figuring out the extent of heinm 253 00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:46,440 Speaker 1: Bloom's involvement, he is involved. And I find it very, 254 00:12:46,559 --> 00:12:50,360 Speaker 1: very hard to imagine an organization signing off on a 255 00:12:50,400 --> 00:12:54,640 Speaker 1: prospect package for the future without including the man responsible 256 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:57,640 Speaker 1: for building up the minor leagues. So Bernie, what are 257 00:12:57,640 --> 00:12:58,400 Speaker 1: your thoughts on all of this? 258 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:00,400 Speaker 2: Well, first of all, you know, if you go back 259 00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:01,839 Speaker 2: to which at the beginning, I'll be honest with you, 260 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:05,120 Speaker 2: I'll be chicken little here. I like the last night's 261 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:07,640 Speaker 2: already gone. But I was thinking, no, no, no, no, 262 00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:09,600 Speaker 2: do not put Matts out there for a second inning. 263 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:12,600 Speaker 2: Just don't do it. He's got a history of injuries. 264 00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:15,760 Speaker 2: Just don't do it. Okay, what's the point? No offense 265 00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:18,200 Speaker 2: to everyone down there sweating and working hard in the 266 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:20,079 Speaker 2: Cardinals uniform. I don't care if they want to lose 267 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:25,360 Speaker 2: a game, the trade deadline, overrules are overrules all. I 268 00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:27,440 Speaker 2: would say the same thing about Hellzy tonight. If it's 269 00:13:27,440 --> 00:13:29,719 Speaker 2: a safe situation, keep him in the bullpen. I don't 270 00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:32,320 Speaker 2: want to see him because it would be the cardinal's luck. 271 00:13:33,240 --> 00:13:36,000 Speaker 2: He comes out and something happens, and you know the rest. 272 00:13:36,120 --> 00:13:41,240 Speaker 2: So no, just bubble wrap off limits, have security guards 273 00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:43,760 Speaker 2: out there. Won't let them actually walk through the gate 274 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:45,880 Speaker 2: to come into a game. You got to have security 275 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:49,320 Speaker 2: out there to prevent it anyway. I guess you could 276 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:51,360 Speaker 2: say the same for Maton too, And I'm not trying 277 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 2: to be so clever here, but no, it's a very 278 00:13:56,679 --> 00:13:58,920 Speaker 2: weird situation. I wrote a column about it last week, 279 00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 2: I think it was Friday on stal Sports Central. I 280 00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:05,319 Speaker 2: don't recall a situation like this ever in Saint Louis, 281 00:14:05,320 --> 00:14:07,880 Speaker 2: and I've been covering the pro sports in this market 282 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:11,800 Speaker 2: since nineteen eighty five full time continuously since summer of 283 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 2: eighty nine. Never recall anything like this where you have 284 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:17,520 Speaker 2: the guy running the team has already said well, I'm leaving, 285 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:20,480 Speaker 2: and he said it a long time ago, relatively speaking, 286 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:23,520 Speaker 2: and so he's got the authority he is going to 287 00:14:23,520 --> 00:14:25,760 Speaker 2: have the final say, he has got the power to control, 288 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:29,400 Speaker 2: to make all of the decisions as he is basically 289 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:32,280 Speaker 2: moves closer to the door, and he won't be around 290 00:14:32,760 --> 00:14:35,480 Speaker 2: to see or have to deal with good or bad 291 00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:39,160 Speaker 2: those trades, the trades that he's going to make, the 292 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:41,360 Speaker 2: ones that go If some of them go bad or 293 00:14:41,400 --> 00:14:44,760 Speaker 2: some of them aren't even completed, well that impacts the 294 00:14:44,760 --> 00:14:48,200 Speaker 2: next guy. That impacts heim Bloom. Like, whatever MO does, 295 00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:50,560 Speaker 2: and I hope he does well for his sake and 296 00:14:50,640 --> 00:14:53,240 Speaker 2: for the Cardinal's sake and him Bloom's sake, but what 297 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:58,280 Speaker 2: would But if MO screws this up somehow, well MO 298 00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:01,280 Speaker 2: doesn't have to worry about it. He's gone. It's like 299 00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:04,160 Speaker 2: not his problem anymore. But the guy who the guys, 300 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:07,400 Speaker 2: the guy who would have be left dealing with that 301 00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:10,560 Speaker 2: problem and the consequences is heim Bloom. And I think, 302 00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 2: just I just think that's ridiculous, because here's the deal, Katie, 303 00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:16,160 Speaker 2: because I was thinking about this a lot. Listen, if 304 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:19,800 Speaker 2: they had just hired heim Bloom this season, Like let's 305 00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:22,640 Speaker 2: just say he showed up down in Jupiter in March 306 00:15:22,680 --> 00:15:24,320 Speaker 2: and you're like, oh, what is he doing here? Well, 307 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:28,240 Speaker 2: they brought him in as a consultant, Okay, but he's 308 00:15:28,240 --> 00:15:31,200 Speaker 2: had two years to study everything about the Cardinals. And 309 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 2: I know his project obviously was an important one, which 310 00:15:34,680 --> 00:15:38,600 Speaker 2: is to you know, re re restore the minor league system, 311 00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:42,280 Speaker 2: player development and all all things related to that. But 312 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:45,680 Speaker 2: heim Bloom, who is an incredibly smart man, he has 313 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:50,160 Speaker 2: had basically two years to study the Cardinals. I think 314 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:53,280 Speaker 2: he can make decisions about trades. I think he knows 315 00:15:53,320 --> 00:15:56,960 Speaker 2: the Cardinals personnel. And with heim Bloom and all of 316 00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:00,800 Speaker 2: his lieutenants out there, including some in the minor leagues 317 00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:03,920 Speaker 2: right now, you know, like rob'sortfolio, Larry Day, some other ones, 318 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:09,200 Speaker 2: Matt Pierpont and him, has a great network. I'm pretty 319 00:16:09,200 --> 00:16:11,880 Speaker 2: sure they have a great handle on prospects out there. 320 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:17,960 Speaker 2: So since the guy whatever comes out of this trade deadline, 321 00:16:18,400 --> 00:16:20,360 Speaker 2: heim Bloom is going to have to deal with it. 322 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:23,680 Speaker 2: So why not just let him make the call. Because 323 00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:27,359 Speaker 2: let me tell you something, if after studying the Cardinals 324 00:16:27,200 --> 00:16:31,320 Speaker 2: for nearly two years and he's not he doesn't have 325 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,760 Speaker 2: the capability to make a trade, well why are you 326 00:16:34,760 --> 00:16:37,640 Speaker 2: putting him in charge for your foreseeable future? It doesn't 327 00:16:37,640 --> 00:16:39,960 Speaker 2: make any sense. But of course he does have the 328 00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:42,880 Speaker 2: capability of making the trades, and I would prefer him 329 00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:44,880 Speaker 2: to do it because he has to live with whatever 330 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:46,640 Speaker 2: comes out of it. Johamazelek doesn't. 331 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:48,920 Speaker 1: That's a fair point. And I know you are not 332 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:51,480 Speaker 1: suggesting that John Azelac doesn't care about the return. Okay, 333 00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 1: he obviously cares about getting in it. 334 00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:53,760 Speaker 2: Sure he does. 335 00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:56,840 Speaker 1: Why I do think heim Bloom is in consultation and 336 00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,760 Speaker 1: working with MO to make sure they get a prospect 337 00:16:59,800 --> 00:17:02,400 Speaker 1: package that matters for the future. MO has set it 338 00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:04,639 Speaker 1: on the record, we're looking towards the future. And if 339 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:09,080 Speaker 1: there's one thing heim Bloom knows, it's player development and evaluation. 340 00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:11,320 Speaker 1: He is one of the best in the game at 341 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:13,800 Speaker 1: doing so, whether you're looking at his work in Tampa Bay, 342 00:17:13,800 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 1: whether you're working looking at his work in Boston. I mean, 343 00:17:16,119 --> 00:17:17,600 Speaker 1: you look at the Red Sox now on some of 344 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:20,399 Speaker 1: those players that have popped up from the minor league system. 345 00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 1: That's why he's here, because the Cardinals desperately needed some 346 00:17:24,080 --> 00:17:27,719 Speaker 1: outside perspective in their player development and evaluation model. So 347 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: he's going to do it. And I would hope that 348 00:17:31,560 --> 00:17:34,000 Speaker 1: these two are working to make sure they can capitalize 349 00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:36,520 Speaker 1: on a return, because you are right Bernie. It's him 350 00:17:36,560 --> 00:17:38,520 Speaker 1: who's going to have to manage these assets when they 351 00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 1: come back. And I hate talking about players like that 352 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:42,600 Speaker 1: in that way where they're just like pieces. But at 353 00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:45,960 Speaker 1: this during this week especially, everything is a business. So 354 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:49,760 Speaker 1: that's just kind of the harsh reality of where we're at. 355 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:53,520 Speaker 1: I understand why fans again are skeptical about Mo calling 356 00:17:53,520 --> 00:17:55,080 Speaker 1: the shots, and maybe this is on me for not 357 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 1: prophrasing it in the way. When I say Mo is 358 00:17:57,320 --> 00:17:59,359 Speaker 1: calling the shots, I mean he is ultimately the president 359 00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:02,280 Speaker 1: of baseball opera. He is the decision maker for the 360 00:18:02,280 --> 00:18:06,280 Speaker 1: forty man roster, for the entire baseball operations. He is 361 00:18:06,359 --> 00:18:09,480 Speaker 1: the final say. That doesn't mean he's not listening to 362 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 1: the input of the new player development system. That doesn't 363 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:15,480 Speaker 1: mean that he is just you know, outed Bloom. I 364 00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:18,720 Speaker 1: think that him is going to have a significant say 365 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:22,320 Speaker 1: in this prospect return because this deadline is not about 366 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:25,560 Speaker 1: acquiring major league ready talent. It's about acquiring talent for 367 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:28,000 Speaker 1: the future. And if it comes out that he doesn't, 368 00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:30,520 Speaker 1: then we're going to have a much, much bigger problem. 369 00:18:30,680 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 1: But for right now, I would I want to trust 370 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:36,920 Speaker 1: that these two are working together. It's what I've heard 371 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 1: within the organization that it's kind of just a big cloud. 372 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:41,760 Speaker 1: The Cardinals are very secretive and how they operate at 373 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:45,080 Speaker 1: this deadline we will find out eventually, But right now 374 00:18:45,119 --> 00:18:47,080 Speaker 1: I think Bernie and I both we cannot overstate how 375 00:18:47,119 --> 00:18:50,160 Speaker 1: important it is that the Cardinals nail their returns for Hellsley, 376 00:18:50,320 --> 00:18:53,040 Speaker 1: Mayton and Matts. And you know what a quick side 377 00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:54,760 Speaker 1: thing on Mayton before we get to some of the 378 00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 1: news over the Smartlin series. He doesn't want to go anywhere. 379 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 1: I sat down with him on Monday and he said, 380 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:03,480 Speaker 1: you know, I signed my contract for the summer to 381 00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:05,200 Speaker 1: be here. I would like to stay. But he's also 382 00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:07,840 Speaker 1: been traded in July three times in his nine year career, 383 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 1: including last year. He knows how this is going to 384 00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:14,280 Speaker 1: go down. I think the Cardinals should consider bringing him 385 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:17,440 Speaker 1: back next year on another free agent deal. He has 386 00:19:17,480 --> 00:19:20,440 Speaker 1: been instrumental in that bullpen. Ollie Marmal said it best. 387 00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:22,320 Speaker 1: He said, you think about where we are without Phil. 388 00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:25,240 Speaker 1: It gets ugly real quick that it does. 389 00:19:25,480 --> 00:19:25,640 Speaker 2: So. 390 00:19:25,760 --> 00:19:27,600 Speaker 1: While it's going to hurt to see all three of 391 00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:31,159 Speaker 1: these guys go, all three have been very good Cardinals. 392 00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 1: I hope the Cardinals are open to bringing Mayton back 393 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:35,040 Speaker 1: next year. I thought he did a lot of good 394 00:19:35,040 --> 00:19:35,679 Speaker 1: things for them. 395 00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:39,160 Speaker 2: No doubt about it. And listen, I look forward to where, 396 00:19:39,359 --> 00:19:43,399 Speaker 2: for for for the fans, for Katie Wu and Derek 397 00:19:43,440 --> 00:19:45,680 Speaker 2: Gould and John Denton and everyone who covers the team 398 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:49,720 Speaker 2: in a daily basis. Look, I look forward to the 399 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:52,320 Speaker 2: day which is coming soon where And this is not 400 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:54,920 Speaker 2: a cheap shot at MO. It's just the reality where 401 00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:58,720 Speaker 2: there will be clarity about who's running everything will be you. 402 00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:01,560 Speaker 1: Know, make sense that they're being secretive. I got it. 403 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:03,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, and that cloud's not there. I will 404 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:07,359 Speaker 2: say this, I'll be curious to see, you know, is 405 00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 2: Moe going to play hard to get? Is he going 406 00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:10,960 Speaker 2: to overplay his hand? That's one question I have And 407 00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:12,639 Speaker 2: I'm not saying he will. I just wonder about that. 408 00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:16,160 Speaker 2: The other thing is, I've been talking to some people 409 00:20:16,200 --> 00:20:18,120 Speaker 2: that know heym Bloom very very well, and they say 410 00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:20,959 Speaker 2: that other gms are President Baseball Operations, whatever you want 411 00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:23,040 Speaker 2: to call them, the people that run these departments, that 412 00:20:23,119 --> 00:20:25,479 Speaker 2: they like him a lot because he's great to deal with. 413 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 2: He's a really straightforward guy, but he's not he doesn't 414 00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:31,200 Speaker 2: try to be a con man. He doesn't try to bs. 415 00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:33,520 Speaker 2: I mean, he gets down to it. You know, this 416 00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:35,800 Speaker 2: is what we have, this is what we're looking for. 417 00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:38,399 Speaker 2: Let's talk about your prospects. What are you willing to do. 418 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:41,840 Speaker 2: It's a straightforward conversation, and they know that. You know, 419 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:45,159 Speaker 2: when you deal with heim Bloom, you can count on 420 00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:47,879 Speaker 2: his integrity. You can count on the fact that he 421 00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:50,119 Speaker 2: plays it straight. He's not going to be playing all 422 00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:52,960 Speaker 2: these games to slow it down and gum it up. 423 00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:57,960 Speaker 2: And he's a dama free guy, right And I think 424 00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:00,199 Speaker 2: in the future that will serve the Cardinals very well, 425 00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:03,439 Speaker 2: because listen, I know this from my extensive experience covering 426 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 2: Moe as the leader of the baseball races. One of 427 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:08,600 Speaker 2: the things I've heard from other teams along the way. 428 00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:10,760 Speaker 2: I don't know if it's true now, but along the 429 00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:13,359 Speaker 2: way it's like, you know, the problem is, you know, 430 00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:16,440 Speaker 2: he wants to win every deal. Now, of course he does. 431 00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:19,880 Speaker 2: That's a shock, But other executives have told me it's 432 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:22,080 Speaker 2: like he wants to win every deal, but he doesn't 433 00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:24,240 Speaker 2: just want to win the deal. He wants to like 434 00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:26,760 Speaker 2: slaughter the other side, like he wants to win it, 435 00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:29,679 Speaker 2: as if he's like rolling the tanks over over the 436 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:33,960 Speaker 2: other side, and they they kind of find him unreasonable 437 00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:36,760 Speaker 2: because a lot of guys straight shooters. It's like, Okay, 438 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:38,600 Speaker 2: this is what I need. Let's get down to it. 439 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:41,280 Speaker 2: This is what I need. Maybe we can compromise on 440 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:45,080 Speaker 2: this prospect or that prospect, but you know, let's make 441 00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:46,639 Speaker 2: a trade that's going to help both of this and 442 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:49,280 Speaker 2: that'll be easy. And I think MO, I think MO, 443 00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:51,960 Speaker 2: when things started to go bad here, got into this mindset. 444 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:54,760 Speaker 2: It's like, I must conquer everyone. You know, you're not. 445 00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:56,880 Speaker 2: It's gonna be hard to make It's harder to make 446 00:21:56,920 --> 00:21:59,119 Speaker 2: trades when you have that kind of thing. So, and 447 00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:01,320 Speaker 2: that's been his rep in the past. I have no 448 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:02,240 Speaker 2: idea about now. 449 00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:06,440 Speaker 1: As someone who can often come across as overly aggressive, 450 00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:09,719 Speaker 1: I do respect that mentality, but we have Actually, this 451 00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:11,879 Speaker 1: is a really cool series that we're doing at the 452 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:16,359 Speaker 1: Athletic where our national writers canvassed executives throughout the league 453 00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:18,720 Speaker 1: and talked about it's I think a four part series. 454 00:22:18,760 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 1: Part three drop today how execs negotiate with each other. 455 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:27,159 Speaker 1: And I think series two talked about the importance of 456 00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:30,360 Speaker 1: the dues and the don'ts and being straight up and 457 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:33,720 Speaker 1: being honest and transparent goes a long way than playing 458 00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:35,440 Speaker 1: any kind of games. And I'm not in the room, 459 00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:37,439 Speaker 1: I'm not on the phone calls. I don't know how 460 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 1: John Mozaelock negotiates with the other executives. I don't know 461 00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:42,359 Speaker 1: how I'm Bloom negotiates with other executives. But I thought 462 00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:45,240 Speaker 1: this story in particular was really illuminating on how that 463 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:48,679 Speaker 1: all works. Again, I think four part series out on 464 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 1: the Athletic. Check it out. Also, if on the Athletic, 465 00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 1: you can stay up to date with all the things 466 00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:56,719 Speaker 1: we got going on. Yeah, this has been last night. 467 00:22:56,760 --> 00:22:58,640 Speaker 1: What I'm hearing about the Cardinals trade deadline with less 468 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,119 Speaker 1: than forty hours, forty eight hours to go. Some info 469 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:05,520 Speaker 1: on Hellsley, Matt's and Nolan Arnotto no substantial attraction picking 470 00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:09,439 Speaker 1: up on his trade front there. We also, if I 471 00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:13,480 Speaker 1: can figure out how to do this correctly, have a 472 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:17,199 Speaker 1: live blog at the Athletic where you can stay up 473 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:19,320 Speaker 1: to date on all of the trades. Here. I'll pull 474 00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 1: it up for you, guys. 475 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:22,320 Speaker 2: I was looking at it just before we started. 476 00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:26,520 Speaker 1: It's great, It's really helpful. I use it an I 477 00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:29,920 Speaker 1: never closed the tab on my computer. This is open 478 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:33,960 Speaker 1: all the time, updated literally by the minute, with any 479 00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:37,840 Speaker 1: kind of news, rumors, analysis, and it's from all thirty teams. 480 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:40,760 Speaker 1: It's not just Cardinals specific. It's a really handy tool. 481 00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:43,399 Speaker 1: While we were going in on our segment, however, the 482 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,840 Speaker 1: relief market did start to pick up the athletics, Ken 483 00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:53,480 Speaker 1: Rosenthal reporting that Andrew Chaffin and excuse me, Luis Garcia 484 00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:56,480 Speaker 1: from the Nationals are heading to the Angels. I do 485 00:23:56,520 --> 00:23:58,879 Speaker 1: not know what the Angels are doing. Apparently they're not selling. 486 00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,919 Speaker 1: But you know, okay, so the. 487 00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:05,720 Speaker 2: Relief Okay, I would have sworn you were gonna tell me, 488 00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:10,280 Speaker 2: like the Blue Jays or you know, you know, the 489 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:15,680 Speaker 2: Reds or you know, somebody like that. Maybe even yeah, 490 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:18,400 Speaker 2: maybe even I'm like even like a team that's still 491 00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,400 Speaker 2: in it that needs both on help, like the Rangers 492 00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:21,680 Speaker 2: the Angels. 493 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:26,560 Speaker 1: Okay, so Marcus hitting out, Andrew Chafin and Luis Garcia 494 00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:29,480 Speaker 1: are headed to Anaheim. When we're headed to a quick break, 495 00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:32,120 Speaker 1: a message from DraftKings and we'll get into some non 496 00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 1: trade in the trade deadline, news about the roster, about 497 00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:39,159 Speaker 1: triple A, all that good stuff. Be right back. Nothing 498 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,200 Speaker 1: beats relaxing on a hot summer day and watching baseball, 499 00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:44,720 Speaker 1: and the simplest way to get in on the action 500 00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 1: is to download the Pick six app from DraftKings. It's crazy, 501 00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:51,480 Speaker 1: simpol Just pick more or less on the stats for 502 00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 1: two or more of your favorite players, and boom, you're 503 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:56,480 Speaker 1: in the mix for big cash prizes. Pick six is 504 00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 1: available right here in Missouri. 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Agent eligibility restrictions vary by jurisdiction. Void work prohibited, 515 00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:32,919 Speaker 5: New customers only, minimum five dollars deposit. Bonus picks expire 516 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,000 Speaker 5: one hundred and sixty eight hours after issue. In four 517 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:38,160 Speaker 5: additional terms and responsible gaming resources see Pick six dot 518 00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:40,040 Speaker 5: DraftKings dot com slash promos. 519 00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:44,359 Speaker 1: All right, some unfortunate news to start the week on 520 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:48,359 Speaker 1: Monday to coh Roobia, I'm sorry on Friday. The news 521 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:50,960 Speaker 1: was announced on Monday to co Roby under when Tommy 522 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,560 Speaker 1: John surgery, he'll miss the twenty twenty six season, most 523 00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:56,040 Speaker 1: likely won't be ready for twenty twenty seven. That's a 524 00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:58,040 Speaker 1: significant blow in no matter how you look at it. He 525 00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:02,119 Speaker 1: entered the season as the Athletics or as the Cardinals' 526 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:05,800 Speaker 1: number six overall prospects according to the Athletics Keith Law. 527 00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:08,000 Speaker 1: But no matter where you get your prospect frankings, whether 528 00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 1: it's from Baseball America and WELLB pipeline, the overwhelming consensus 529 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:13,440 Speaker 1: was that co Roby was a top ten pick in 530 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: the organization and he was having a really strong year 531 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:18,879 Speaker 1: promoted to Triple A in June, was building up some 532 00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:22,639 Speaker 1: consideration to be you know, under consideration for a rotation spot. 533 00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:26,000 Speaker 1: Comes spring training instead, it's another devastating hit. This is 534 00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 1: what happens when you have guys that throw hard with 535 00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:31,119 Speaker 1: a ton of spin. These kinds of injuries, unfortunately are 536 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:33,520 Speaker 1: not you know, their League spread. This is not just 537 00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:37,000 Speaker 1: a Cardinals exclusive problem. So real bummer for the organization. 538 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:39,360 Speaker 1: I was really excited for Roby next year, and as 539 00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:42,040 Speaker 1: we know Bernie triple A depth continues to be a 540 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 1: big problem for this organization. I wonder if that's something 541 00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:48,280 Speaker 1: the organization is looking to address at the deadline with 542 00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:49,120 Speaker 1: some of their returns. 543 00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:53,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, because isn't just Roby, you know, Cooper Europe needed, 544 00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,400 Speaker 2: Tommy John and simmer Robasaw needed. I believe Tommy John. 545 00:26:56,440 --> 00:27:00,080 Speaker 2: But they're they're they're non factors for twenty six and 546 00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:03,200 Speaker 2: those are tough glows for an organization that is really 547 00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:06,520 Speaker 2: thin on starting pitching, which will be a priority. Can 548 00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:11,080 Speaker 2: I just point out one silver lining? And there's nothing 549 00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:14,439 Speaker 2: good about a good prospect like Roby having surgery, Okay, 550 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:16,719 Speaker 2: but there is a silver lining when the car as 551 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:19,120 Speaker 2: you know, when the Cardinals got him from the Rangers, 552 00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:21,520 Speaker 2: everything you read about it is like, look, he's got 553 00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:24,680 Speaker 2: really good stuff, but he's you know, he's got recurring 554 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,119 Speaker 2: elbow problems. And then he came here it was the 555 00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,080 Speaker 2: same thing. They had to shut him down a couple times, 556 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:32,920 Speaker 2: these recurring elbow problems because he never had surgery. He'd 557 00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:34,600 Speaker 2: put it off, put it off, put it off. We 558 00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:38,760 Speaker 2: think he'll be okay. Well, clearly that wasn't going to 559 00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:42,080 Speaker 2: go away, and it was inevitable that he would have 560 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:45,480 Speaker 2: Tommy John surgery. And I'm looking at this way, he's 561 00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:48,560 Speaker 2: had it, and he's going to put that stuff behind him. 562 00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:51,800 Speaker 2: All these delays, stops and starts, elbow sores, shut it down, 563 00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:55,720 Speaker 2: elbow shres. You know, you get the thing done and 564 00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:57,679 Speaker 2: then you can move on with your career. And I 565 00:27:57,680 --> 00:27:59,920 Speaker 2: think that that could be a positive because the cardinal 566 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,119 Speaker 2: will still have him at full eligibility, you know, like 567 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:06,720 Speaker 2: for six seasons basically, and so that's okay. I know 568 00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:09,040 Speaker 2: that it doesn't sound okay to him because he won't 569 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:11,119 Speaker 2: be able to pitch it till twenty twenty seven. But 570 00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 2: there can be some value in this given his long 571 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:14,880 Speaker 2: history of elbow issues. 572 00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:18,000 Speaker 1: And he's only twenty three years old, so there's time. 573 00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:20,960 Speaker 1: I think Roby is a really exciting talent. It just 574 00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:23,639 Speaker 1: stings because it looks like he was figuring things out. 575 00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:25,680 Speaker 1: I mean, he was nasty and double a some really 576 00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:28,080 Speaker 1: high strakeout numbers and triple as he adjusted that level 577 00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:31,040 Speaker 1: of talent, and it's just an unfortunate break for an 578 00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:34,679 Speaker 1: organization that really needs depth in a lot of areas, 579 00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:37,919 Speaker 1: which apparently now includes the outfield. Because Von Herrera, new 580 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:40,640 Speaker 1: left fielder for the Saint Louis Cardinals, made his first 581 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:43,680 Speaker 1: career start in left field on Monday, it has a 582 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:47,280 Speaker 1: perfect one thousand percent career fielding percentage in left field 583 00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:50,560 Speaker 1: because he successfully successfully recorded his one and only put 584 00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 1: out that night. This is a move that we talked 585 00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:54,960 Speaker 1: about on the podcast. We've talked about with Alie Marmel 586 00:28:55,320 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 1: about the Cardinals maybe entertaining Herrera in the outfield in 587 00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:02,120 Speaker 1: the off season. I didn't think this is going to 588 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:05,120 Speaker 1: occur in the last week of July, but the Cardinals 589 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:06,720 Speaker 1: are doing it for a reason that makes sense. We 590 00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:08,520 Speaker 1: know that Herrera is not going to catch for the 591 00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:11,240 Speaker 1: rest of the season, but keeping him at just DH 592 00:29:11,680 --> 00:29:15,000 Speaker 1: really claws up the roster for so many other guys, 593 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:18,640 Speaker 1: and it also limits Herrera's positional flexibility. So they think 594 00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,360 Speaker 1: Herrera is athletic enough to go out there and try 595 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,440 Speaker 1: out the corner outfield, and I would agree Herrera is very, 596 00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:27,920 Speaker 1: very athletic, but they can't have him be the DH 597 00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 1: every day because you're going to take away a bast 598 00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:33,080 Speaker 1: from Nolan Gorman. Alec Gurlissen needs a half day every 599 00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:35,280 Speaker 1: now and then, and you can't Nolan Gorman. He needs 600 00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:37,680 Speaker 1: a half day every now and then. You can't just 601 00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,719 Speaker 1: have Herrera as your everyday DH because it complicates the 602 00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:44,440 Speaker 1: rest of the lineup. At this point, with the Cardinals 603 00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:47,760 Speaker 1: projecting to sell and the next two months maybe looking 604 00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:51,360 Speaker 1: not as optimistic, I'm okay with the Cardinals experimenting the 605 00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:53,280 Speaker 1: next two months. It's kind of what the season is for. 606 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:54,479 Speaker 1: And Bernie, I know you have a lot of good 607 00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:56,200 Speaker 1: points about this, and I want to hear it. But 608 00:29:56,280 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 1: my main takeaway is is it weird? Yeah, a little bit, 609 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:01,680 Speaker 1: But are are we going to maybe going to see 610 00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:06,200 Speaker 1: some ugly plays? We might, But the Cardinals went into 611 00:30:06,200 --> 00:30:09,640 Speaker 1: the season hoping to find out answers about their players. 612 00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:12,160 Speaker 1: They seem to have found out that von Herrera is 613 00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:14,480 Speaker 1: not their catcher of the future, but now they have 614 00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:16,840 Speaker 1: the opportunity they also found out that he is the bat. 615 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:18,960 Speaker 1: He is a bat of the future for sure. Now 616 00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:21,240 Speaker 1: they have the opportunity to find out if outfield is 617 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:24,600 Speaker 1: a reasonable position for him and if the Cardinals finished 618 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:27,600 Speaker 1: twenty twenty five season and they have definitively answered that 619 00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:30,040 Speaker 1: Yvon Herrera is not their catcher of the future, but 620 00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:32,720 Speaker 1: he can hit. That's still a win for me in 621 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:36,120 Speaker 1: evaluating the organization because you answer something definitively and that 622 00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:37,200 Speaker 1: was the goal of the season. 623 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:40,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, there's so much here. First of all, I love 624 00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:42,960 Speaker 2: this move, and I love this move because it also 625 00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:47,280 Speaker 2: represents that the Cardinals are fully connected to reality. Here. 626 00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:49,640 Speaker 2: This is a chance to get a head start on 627 00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:52,400 Speaker 2: what you want to happen going forward. You would love 628 00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:54,080 Speaker 2: for him to be able to be your left fielder 629 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:57,200 Speaker 2: because it makes all the sense in the world. Because 630 00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:00,600 Speaker 2: let me tell you something. I did some research on 631 00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:02,520 Speaker 2: this yesterday. A couple of things. One thing, I'll be 632 00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:05,320 Speaker 2: really really really quick. I'm talking about homegrown players. I'm 633 00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:08,600 Speaker 2: talking about people signed or developed by the Cardinals. In 634 00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:10,680 Speaker 2: terms of what he's done so far in his career, 635 00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:14,520 Speaker 2: and granted it's a relatively small sample, this is the 636 00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:19,360 Speaker 2: most successful right handed hitter developed by the Cardinals in 637 00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:22,040 Speaker 2: terms of where his weighted runs created. Plus is so 638 00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:25,440 Speaker 2: far the most successful or at least so far the 639 00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:29,760 Speaker 2: best right handed hitter they have developed since a guy 640 00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:32,360 Speaker 2: named pool Holes. I'm not saying he is pool Hooles. 641 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:36,480 Speaker 2: I'm saying he's the best right handed bet that they selected, 642 00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:40,760 Speaker 2: signed and developed Since Poolholes that has been a real, real, 643 00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:43,400 Speaker 2: real big problem within the organization. They've had to go 644 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:46,400 Speaker 2: trade for right handed hitters who can play the outfield, 645 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:49,000 Speaker 2: and this is one of their own. So why not 646 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:51,760 Speaker 2: get started on this, Like why sit there and be 647 00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:54,400 Speaker 2: stupid and say, well, we can still catch these other things? No, 648 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,480 Speaker 2: you can't. Not with that starting pitching some games. 649 00:31:57,200 --> 00:31:58,880 Speaker 1: Back in the division and the rotation has like a 650 00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:00,000 Speaker 1: five hundred ra right now. 651 00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:02,320 Speaker 2: So I mean, I was sort of I was sort of, 652 00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,760 Speaker 2: you know, debating with fans on X and I don't 653 00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:10,800 Speaker 2: understand why they're so they're so upset about this. Avon 654 00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:13,360 Speaker 2: Herrera may be your best hitter, right It's either him 655 00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:16,040 Speaker 2: or Contraras. But but Avon Herrera is growing into it. 656 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:19,640 Speaker 2: He's going to be a great hitter. He already is. Okay, Okay, 657 00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:22,400 Speaker 2: let me see something your outfield in terms of like 658 00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:27,880 Speaker 2: counting plate appearances taken by guys who were playing outfield 659 00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:31,080 Speaker 2: in that game, not playing another position. Since the start 660 00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:35,040 Speaker 2: of last season, the Cardinals outfield offensively has had the 661 00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:38,480 Speaker 2: worst production in the National League, and if you even 662 00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:42,480 Speaker 2: sort of take it down to another level, we all 663 00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:44,480 Speaker 2: know they have a lot of left handed hitters in 664 00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:45,200 Speaker 2: their outfield. 665 00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:45,960 Speaker 1: YEP. 666 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:51,680 Speaker 2: Over the last two years, right handed hitting outfielders, and 667 00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:53,800 Speaker 2: a lot of that's shord Walker, but right handed hitting 668 00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:58,640 Speaker 2: outfielders in the Cardinals have hit two oh six with 669 00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:01,880 Speaker 2: the three twenty four slugging percentage, and they're according to 670 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:04,720 Speaker 2: Way to Runs Creative plus they're thirty one percent below 671 00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:08,040 Speaker 2: average offensively. Huh, well, we have a guy we think 672 00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 2: we can play outfield. Oh, he's a right handed bat. 673 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,760 Speaker 2: Oh we have no offense from their outfield or outfle 674 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:14,800 Speaker 2: I think someone bur Liston's out there. Well, here's a 675 00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:20,560 Speaker 2: chance to a boost our outfield capability offensively. A. Okay, 676 00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:23,400 Speaker 2: that's a good reason. B. We have time to work 677 00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:25,720 Speaker 2: on this. It's like we're not saying, well, he's our 678 00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:28,560 Speaker 2: left fielder for the next ten years. No, no, no, 679 00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:32,120 Speaker 2: they're getting the process started and see if you can 680 00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:34,360 Speaker 2: get him to be a good bat in left field 681 00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:36,959 Speaker 2: and really upgrade your offense out there and give you 682 00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:40,800 Speaker 2: more right handed presidents out there. It also opens up 683 00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:43,040 Speaker 2: the d H spot for another good bat who might 684 00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:46,920 Speaker 2: otherwise be blocked. So I know, I say, you know, 685 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,760 Speaker 2: I'm exascerated, Like, so, what is the problem here is 686 00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:54,440 Speaker 2: this is the upside and the ceiling on this is outstanding. 687 00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:57,760 Speaker 2: And you know, another thing I don't understand is people 688 00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:00,440 Speaker 2: who never learned from history. The Cardinals under Tony Larusa, 689 00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:03,840 Speaker 2: over and over and over again, always said left field 690 00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:05,960 Speaker 2: is a back first position. I don't really give a 691 00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:08,520 Speaker 2: damn about the guys playing defense because it's the easiest 692 00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:12,080 Speaker 2: position to play. Some people say, no, first base is 693 00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:15,160 Speaker 2: go ask Lance Berkman about that. He's, oh my god, 694 00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:17,759 Speaker 2: I hated playing first base. I hated it. I was 695 00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:19,719 Speaker 2: like Tony, no, no, no, put me in right field now. 696 00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:21,520 Speaker 2: I don't want to play first one. That is tough. 697 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:23,880 Speaker 2: I don't know why people assume that's the easiest mission 698 00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:28,279 Speaker 2: to play anyway. LaRussa always sacrificed defense for offense. And 699 00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:31,080 Speaker 2: some of the guys he put out there were awkward looking. Okay, 700 00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:33,640 Speaker 2: Chris Duncan was awkward looking, But the year they won 701 00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:36,680 Speaker 2: the World Series in two thousand and six, the dude 702 00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:40,160 Speaker 2: slug five ninety. Okay, I don't care that he wasn't 703 00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:43,680 Speaker 2: graceful in left field. He could hit. You got his 704 00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,600 Speaker 2: bat in the lineup. You could live with some defensive 705 00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:51,399 Speaker 2: defensive flaws. They didn't cost you games. His slugging won 706 00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:56,440 Speaker 2: you games. Matt Holliday a guy that you know, I 707 00:34:56,480 --> 00:34:58,600 Speaker 2: looked at every year. He was below average defensively in 708 00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:04,880 Speaker 2: left field, but he in terms of wins above replacement. 709 00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:07,960 Speaker 2: From two thousand and nine through twenty fifteen, he was 710 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:12,080 Speaker 2: the top outfielder in the National League six All Star 711 00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:16,000 Speaker 2: teams MVP votes in four seasons. He anchored teams that 712 00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 2: were going to the playoffs. Every year. He had great 713 00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:21,040 Speaker 2: numbers and runners of scoring position, he had great numbers. 714 00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:24,320 Speaker 2: He was like top five offense among all outfielders. Okay, 715 00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 2: did he look clumsy playing left field? Yeah? And people 716 00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:29,560 Speaker 2: send me emails going nuts, just going nuts. Oh, this 717 00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:34,320 Speaker 2: is the disgrace. You know. It is a back first position. 718 00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:37,280 Speaker 2: If you get a good defender out there, okay, that's great. 719 00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:41,239 Speaker 2: But if I remember as you do, there was a 720 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:44,319 Speaker 2: thought around town, you know, Alec Burlson in the early days, 721 00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:46,799 Speaker 2: trying to play corner outfield. It's like, oh my gosh, 722 00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:48,840 Speaker 2: oh my gosh. He looks like a big, you know, 723 00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:51,799 Speaker 2: water buffalo out there just running running wild. You know 724 00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:56,280 Speaker 2: he'll never be able to play outfield. Not he'll be awful. Okay. 725 00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 2: Oli Marmel gave him an ultimate He said, look, you're 726 00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:02,319 Speaker 2: gonna have to get better defensively, that's all there is 727 00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:04,440 Speaker 2: to it, or you're not gonna We can't play you. Okay, 728 00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:08,200 Speaker 2: Burt listened to his credit, worked really really hard. Alec Burlison, 729 00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:11,400 Speaker 2: Yeah he did. And I'll shut up after this. Alec Burlison, 730 00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:15,640 Speaker 2: as of yesterday, he was a plus one in defensive 731 00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:17,720 Speaker 2: run saved in left field, and he was a plus 732 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:20,080 Speaker 2: one and out's above average in left field. He is 733 00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:24,759 Speaker 2: now a slightly above average outfielder, So don't tell me. 734 00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:27,759 Speaker 2: And who's a better athlete? Who runs better? Is it Herrera? Burlson? 735 00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:32,400 Speaker 2: Horeras an athlete on the team. So you got all 736 00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:36,399 Speaker 2: these people out there condemning the move before they let 737 00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:39,800 Speaker 2: the process begin, and they forget already that Alec Berlison, 738 00:36:39,840 --> 00:36:43,040 Speaker 2: who is not the athlete that Herrara was, has has 739 00:36:43,080 --> 00:36:49,400 Speaker 2: become a perfectly serviceable average corner outfielder. Do we not 740 00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:53,560 Speaker 2: learn anything from what we've just watched? Anyway? You can 741 00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,520 Speaker 2: tell I'm annoyed by this, anyway, I like you. 742 00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:58,600 Speaker 1: I agree with you. The upside is high, and I 743 00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:03,719 Speaker 1: understand the like, oh on a position change, but especially 744 00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:07,560 Speaker 1: now as we pitot towards a true development season and 745 00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:10,400 Speaker 1: not this halfway you know, balancing runway results thing that 746 00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:12,200 Speaker 1: we did in the first half. As we finished the 747 00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:14,120 Speaker 1: final two months of the season, and the Cardinals are 748 00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:17,799 Speaker 1: focusing on truly twenty twenty six and beyond, why not 749 00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:19,799 Speaker 1: give some of these players a head start. Why not 750 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:22,440 Speaker 1: see what Yvon Herrera can do. That was the point 751 00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:24,680 Speaker 1: of this season. So I'm with you, Bernie. I'm with 752 00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:26,760 Speaker 1: you there, and I know we'll continue to talk about Herrera. 753 00:37:27,040 --> 00:37:28,799 Speaker 1: He's not going to play there every day. It's going 754 00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:32,040 Speaker 1: to be when the matchup best suggests that they're certainly 755 00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:33,279 Speaker 1: not going to put him out there when there's a 756 00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:35,880 Speaker 1: heavy fly ball hit or pull side or pitcher excuse me, 757 00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:38,960 Speaker 1: pull side Polante. The Cardinals felt like it was a 758 00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:42,240 Speaker 1: good time to start Herrera on a Polante start, because Polante, 759 00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:44,080 Speaker 1: as you know, is usually on the ground and very 760 00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:47,480 Speaker 1: rarely pull side in the air. So we'll continue to 761 00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:50,640 Speaker 1: see him sporadically. But I have throw issue with this move. 762 00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:54,719 Speaker 2: You yeah, and he's got John Jay By side every day. Right, 763 00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:56,719 Speaker 2: Is he gonna have John Jay by side every day 764 00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:59,360 Speaker 2: in the offseason. No, let the process begin. And you 765 00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:01,640 Speaker 2: know what, I expect there were to be some pratfalls. 766 00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:05,480 Speaker 2: I expect them to be some stumbles, awkward moments. I 767 00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:07,640 Speaker 2: expect them to mess up. I don't care. This is 768 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:09,960 Speaker 2: about the future. It's not about the remaining weeks of 769 00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:13,440 Speaker 2: twenty twenty five. Get that in our skulls. If we 770 00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:15,760 Speaker 2: get that in our skulls, don't understand. 771 00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:18,399 Speaker 1: We got to do it so that the whole point 772 00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:21,440 Speaker 1: of the next two months is about next year. Some 773 00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:25,160 Speaker 1: quick housekeeping before we go. Nolan Gorman started a rehaba 774 00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:28,400 Speaker 1: assignment with Double A Springfield yesterday. That's Tuesday. Lars Newbar 775 00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:31,759 Speaker 1: will start his today, this is Wednesday. The hope is 776 00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:34,400 Speaker 1: that both players could be back by the Dodgers series. 777 00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:36,600 Speaker 1: The Cardinals will wrap up their series against the Marlins 778 00:38:36,600 --> 00:38:39,400 Speaker 1: tonight with Miles Michaelis on the mound off day in 779 00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:41,839 Speaker 1: San Diego Slash deadline Day tomorrow, and then a three 780 00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:44,360 Speaker 1: game set with the Padres, hopefully everyone calms down, no 781 00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:47,560 Speaker 1: more drama, and then LA on Monday. So again, the 782 00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:49,680 Speaker 1: hope is if the Cardinals will have both of those 783 00:38:49,719 --> 00:38:52,960 Speaker 1: guys back if not sooner, And in case you missed it, 784 00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:56,359 Speaker 1: you can visit the Cardinal Territory Shop for all our 785 00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:59,240 Speaker 1: new merch. If you're watching this on YouTube, there's actually 786 00:38:59,239 --> 00:39:01,279 Speaker 1: a link to the or right under the screen. Just 787 00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:03,160 Speaker 1: scroll down like half an inch and then all these 788 00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:06,520 Speaker 1: things will pop up. We have shirts, we have mugs, 789 00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:10,560 Speaker 1: we have backpacks, purses, notebooks. We're gonna get hat soon. 790 00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:13,640 Speaker 1: We have quarter zips, sweatshirts, a ton of stuff. A 791 00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:16,040 Speaker 1: big thank you already to some who have already purchased 792 00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:17,840 Speaker 1: their gear. I can't wait to see it out and 793 00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:21,400 Speaker 1: about in Saint Louis. All right, Bernie, I have about 794 00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:26,000 Speaker 1: thirty seconds to wrap this one up because stuff is near, 795 00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:28,680 Speaker 1: the game is near. I have a flight to San 796 00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:31,759 Speaker 1: Diego tonight, and things are about to get crazy. So 797 00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:34,600 Speaker 1: we'll have a trade deadline recap episode for you as 798 00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:36,719 Speaker 1: soon as we can get to it after the deadline 799 00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:40,560 Speaker 1: tomorrow and then off in the second half where all 800 00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:42,600 Speaker 1: of a sudden, our message changes, as we just talked about, 801 00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:45,600 Speaker 1: from competing to the future. Can't wait to stick with 802 00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:47,320 Speaker 1: that or stick with you guys throughout the rest of 803 00:39:47,360 --> 00:39:50,239 Speaker 1: the season, talking about that Bernie. Thanks. As always, we'll 804 00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:52,480 Speaker 1: be back with you soon. You guys have a great 805 00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:54,600 Speaker 1: day and we'll be back with more deadline news when available. 806 00:39:54,640 --> 00:40:10,080 Speaker 1: Thanks for watching.