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Speaker 1: Hey, welcome into the All Ball Podcast. Boy Doug Gottlieb

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Speaker 1: here and Man, We're gonna have a two part pop

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Speaker 1: and I'll talk a little bit about my recruitment UMU.

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Speaker 1: During the pod, we'll talk a little bit about the

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Speaker 1: I gotta do an NBA preview. Like man, we just

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Speaker 1: get these great interviews and have these great talks, So

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Speaker 1: I want to do all of that. But first I

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Speaker 1: wanted to catch up with Dan dick out. Dan obviously

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Speaker 1: was was college basketball play of the year play in

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Speaker 1: the NBA. But in this pod, we're gonna talk about

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Speaker 1: him as a kid growing up in Portland and then

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Speaker 1: in Vancouver, Washington, Vancouver just Overwhell. Let's let you tell

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Speaker 1: him where exactly it is, what what motivated him? Who

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Speaker 1: did he idolize? How did he make himself in to

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Speaker 1: the player he became in. Why did you choose the

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Speaker 1: University of Washington. I know there's actually a lot of

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Speaker 1: people that are probably listening to podcast, like, no, Dan

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Speaker 1: dick I went to Gonzaga, and he transferred to Gonzaga

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Speaker 1: after playing a year and a half at Washington like

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Speaker 1: he yes, but Washington and Gonzaga was not It was

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Speaker 1: not his dream schools. There's an interesting tie that binds

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Speaker 1: the two of us that I will get to. I'll

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Speaker 1: get to, um, including guys I was recruited by his

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Speaker 1: dream school nearly went there. It was like, tell him

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Speaker 1: I didn't, He'll tell me why he didn't go to

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Speaker 1: that same school and then and then he went to what. Well,

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Speaker 1: there's a bunch to get to. So you're really going

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Speaker 1: to enjoy this without further ado, my guy, Dann dick out. So, UM,

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Speaker 1: it's fascinating, fascinating to catch up with you on this level,

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Speaker 1: because yeah, I would love to talk about current ZAG

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Speaker 1: hoops right and Zag's Iowa this weekend and we'll try

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Speaker 1: and get to that. But like, I feel like you

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Speaker 1: were Tebow before Tebow. And and I don't mean that

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Speaker 1: from a religious background. I mean it in terms of

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Speaker 1: like a a cult following where like every white kid

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Speaker 1: was like every white dad and there was like, man,

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Speaker 1: you can dick out. That's the dude, Like if he

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Speaker 1: can be National Player of the Year, you can too.

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Speaker 1: You're you started playing basketball where you know that's uh,

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Speaker 1: that's a funny comment. And and actually I appreciate that

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Speaker 1: I've heard that from a number of coaches you know,

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Speaker 1: about five six years after I was done at Gonzaga

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Speaker 1: that every kid they recruited or an AU coach thought

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Speaker 1: they had a kid to recruit had the long floppy hair,

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Speaker 1: and my name was thrown out there. So it brings

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Speaker 1: back some interesting and unique and fun memories, that's for sure.

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Speaker 1: But I started playing basketball. I was born in Portland.

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Speaker 1: I moved to Vancouver when I was in second grade

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Speaker 1: with my family, but I remember in Portland's um. I

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Speaker 1: actually had three hoops at my house as a little kid.

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Speaker 1: In our basement, I had a hoop that was probably

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Speaker 1: you know, like it wasn't one of those plastic little

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Speaker 1: type coops, but it was. It was a hoop that

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Speaker 1: went up on the wall, you know, probably no higher

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Speaker 1: than than six ft in. My parents used to say

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Speaker 1: I would be down there for hours on end, even

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Speaker 1: when I was four or five years old. And then

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Speaker 1: we also had a hoop on our driveway that was

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Speaker 1: ten ft um in Portland. And then in our backyard

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Speaker 1: we had a tree and we had a backboard with

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Speaker 1: a rim on the tree. So as as a kid

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Speaker 1: in Portland, I had three different hoops to choose from.

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Speaker 1: But I didn't play on an organized basketball team until

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Speaker 1: we moved to Vancouver in the second grade. But back then,

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Speaker 1: the y m c A only started teams in third grade.

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Speaker 1: So third grade was the first time I was on

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Speaker 1: a on an organized team. And I think that's something

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Speaker 1: that's so important. I see AU team starting at like

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Speaker 1: fifth sixth grade now, and they're traveling across the country.

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Speaker 1: It's like, you don't even know how to jump stop,

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Speaker 1: you don't know how to screen, you don't know how

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Speaker 1: you don't know how to pass. It's uh, it's become

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Speaker 1: a completely different, uh set up. But that's a that's

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Speaker 1: a whole another conversation for that that could honestly, like

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Speaker 1: just so you know, so it's it's fascinating because so

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Speaker 1: I'm coaching my son in an AU program and and

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Speaker 1: you know, my dad did it, you know, for us.

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Speaker 1: And he came when he got fired in college, he

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Speaker 1: went up to Oregon State for a year. He came back,

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Speaker 1: he was doing some scouting, he was coaching some minor

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Speaker 1: league stuff, and he started at a necessity for my brother,

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Speaker 1: and then he would coach like high level high school

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Speaker 1: like back then was travel ball teams, right and anyway,

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Speaker 1: So when I moved back and my son was, you know,

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Speaker 1: third grade. I took him to a fourth and fifth

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Speaker 1: grade workout and I had the exact same thought where

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Speaker 1: I'm watching and I thought that the workouts were good.

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Speaker 1: I just thought that way we we for you like

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Speaker 1: skip things like, hey, they don't know how to jump stop. Hey,

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Speaker 1: you know, they don't actually know all the rules of basketball,

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Speaker 1: Like there's a lot of things they don't know that.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know if it's because, you know, basketball

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Speaker 1: camps back then were more teaching warrented. I don't know

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Speaker 1: if it's as we watched games more on TV, Like

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Speaker 1: do kids watch TV? Yes, but they watched a lot

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Speaker 1: of YouTube, and they watched a lot of you know,

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Speaker 1: highlight reels on I G right and snap and these

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Speaker 1: other things where there are no jump stop videos on

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Speaker 1: YouTube that have a million downloads. Right, but but but

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Speaker 1: last I checked, you can't make all these plays if

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Speaker 1: you travel every time we get the ball. So it's

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Speaker 1: a fascinating experience. And then what I've found is that

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Speaker 1: the right parents that get it, they end up gravitating more,

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Speaker 1: at least in the current moment. I may have another

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Speaker 1: pod with you. They're like, wow, wait, you actually coach them. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you actually make them running offense, like, yeah, we're playing

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Speaker 1: We're not playing zone, dude, We're not We're not doing that.

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Speaker 1: We got to teach you how to guard guard your

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Speaker 1: man and how to help and how to position your

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Speaker 1: feet properly and all these things. And it might get

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Speaker 1: us beat because you're not as athletic as another duo.

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Speaker 1: But that's okay. It's a it's a marathon, not not

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Speaker 1: a sprint. I want to go to Okay. So, Vancouver, Washington,

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Speaker 1: right is right on the border of Oregon. Yeah. So

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Speaker 1: if you've you've flown into Portland many times, I'm sure, right, Doug.

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Speaker 1: So the Columbia rivers right there. The bridge that you

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Speaker 1: see when you land at the airport that takes you

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Speaker 1: to Vancouver. So, uh, you go north from the airport,

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Speaker 1: you're in Vancouver, Washington, and you go south you get

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Speaker 1: into the heart of Portland. And so, you know, I

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Speaker 1: grew up. When we moved to Vancouver, we were fifteen

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Speaker 1: minutes away from from the Rose Garden. They call it

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Speaker 1: the Motor Center. Now I never will call it that.

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Speaker 1: It's it's the Rose Garden, sure, so um, but it's

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Speaker 1: it's it's fashionating because that's been like a little well

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Speaker 1: spring of especially Gonzaga players. But it's a good little best.

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Speaker 1: But was your dad a hooper? Like what was you

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Speaker 1: had three hoops up that he just loved it or

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Speaker 1: what was it? No, my dad was actually uh a

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Speaker 1: golf teaching professional, um before he got into pharmaceutical sales

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Speaker 1: when when I was, right before I was born. Um,

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Speaker 1: so there there was some athleticism there. He hand eye

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Speaker 1: coordinates and he liked basketball, but he didn't play at

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Speaker 1: any high level. Um. But you know, I think, as

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Speaker 1: with any kid that ends up having some success in

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Speaker 1: in any sport or even any endeavor, if whether it's

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Speaker 1: you know, another hobby, you gotta you have to love

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Speaker 1: it on your own and you have to be passionate

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Speaker 1: enough and driven enough to just spend countless hours on

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Speaker 1: your own doing it until you perfect different things. Um.

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Speaker 1: And that's something that I was always willing to do.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I I never had video games system growing up.

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Speaker 1: I think the first time I actually had a video

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Speaker 1: game system was an Xbox when I was at college

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Speaker 1: at the University of Washington. Um that it wasn't even mine,

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Speaker 1: it was my roommates. And I thought It was the

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Speaker 1: coolest thing because that was back when college players they

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Speaker 1: had the college Game, but they couldn't use your name,

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Speaker 1: but you had the number and it looked exactly like you.

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Speaker 1: And I thought that was the coolest thing that I

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Speaker 1: was on the game. Yeah, I was black, actually couldn't shoot,

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Speaker 1: which was accurate, right, I was black, super fast, really past,

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Speaker 1: but I could, but I was I was they changed

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Speaker 1: by race, which I'm actually actually really kind of good with, right,

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Speaker 1: Like that's that that that I don't take that as

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Speaker 1: a negative in in any way. Um, it's fat So okay.

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Speaker 1: I grew up shooting hoops at Garrett Phipps's house, So

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Speaker 1: I grew up in its. Six years old, we moved

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Speaker 1: to Orange, California, and our driveway was slanted, and so

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Speaker 1: back then you didn't have the portable goals, right, you couldn't.

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Speaker 1: By the time I was in high school, we had

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Speaker 1: one on the sidewalk that you could shoot in the street.

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Speaker 1: But as a kid, they didn't have those. So I

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Speaker 1: actually never had a hoop in my driveway. Ever. I

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Speaker 1: had to go like six doors down and here the kid,

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Speaker 1: Garrett was my brother's age, and he had a flat

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Speaker 1: driveway and so I go and I just asked his

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Speaker 1: parents for my somebody asked his parents when I was

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Speaker 1: really little, like he likes to come shoot. It's the

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Speaker 1: exact same thing. And I used to play imaginary games

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Speaker 1: just all afternoon. I would do I would be the

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Speaker 1: announcer and the player. I would announce the game as

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Speaker 1: I play, or I I had introduced myself and I

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Speaker 1: do high fives with all the plants on the way

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Speaker 1: down to Garrett's house and I go and shoot. And

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Speaker 1: then my my brother, who of course has been an

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Speaker 1: assistant coach for twenty five years, he that wasn't his thing,

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Speaker 1: like he wasn't a self motivated guy at that point

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Speaker 1: in terms of hoop. So they used to kind of

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Speaker 1: camp out in Garrett's parents garage because they had these

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Speaker 1: takaate posters and the kakati posters were basically topless women

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Speaker 1: beer or maybe skimpy bikinis or whatever, and they would

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Speaker 1: and they would make fun of me, and I'd be

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Speaker 1: out there shooting. So it was always your driveway or

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Speaker 1: was there a local park that you are that you

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Speaker 1: went and you you kind of honed your game. So

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Speaker 1: when we moved to Vancouver, that was second grade. And

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Speaker 1: luckily a couple of years after that, I was my

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Speaker 1: parents we joined an athletic club called Club Green Meadows

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Speaker 1: and it was about seven or eight minutes from where

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Speaker 1: we lived. UM, and my parents would take me there

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Speaker 1: as as often as as they could get me there. UM.

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Speaker 1: I became old enough where they just dropped me off

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Speaker 1: for a few hours and I'd be able to shoot um.

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Speaker 1: You know. But the unique thing about that place was,

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Speaker 1: starting from a young age, they had three courts and

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Speaker 1: so there were six hoops. You could always find a

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Speaker 1: hoop to shoot on regardless of the time. UM. And

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Speaker 1: the other cool thing was this was before NBA teams

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Speaker 1: had practice facilities um where they would open it up

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Speaker 1: for the other two road team to come practice at

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Speaker 1: the day before the game, or a lot of colleges

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Speaker 1: would host teams for practice. So the Club Green Medals

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Speaker 1: was such a good facility that NBA teams would come

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Speaker 1: to Green Meadows in Vancouver in practice the day before

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Speaker 1: they played the Blazers. So as a young kid, I

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Speaker 1: was able to watch NBA practices. I remember watching the Spurs,

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Speaker 1: I remember watching it was the Bullets at the time,

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Speaker 1: the Hornets. I watched a number of different teams at

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Speaker 1: the NBA level practice as a young kid, and I

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Speaker 1: just sit there watching and start kind of picking and

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Speaker 1: choosing different things to watch in different guys. I remember

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Speaker 1: I got to to meet west An so years later

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Speaker 1: I met him again during the NBA draft process and stuff.

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Speaker 1: But I remember meeting west On so because he was

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Speaker 1: a coach at the time with the Bullets. I remember

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Speaker 1: Liddell Echoes if you remember that name. I played one

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Speaker 1: on one as a as a like a sixth like

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Speaker 1: a seventh eighth grade against Joe Wolf when he was

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Speaker 1: with the the Hornets, And so I was able to

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Speaker 1: kind of really um see the NBA game, pick and

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Speaker 1: choose different things that different guys were doing in the

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Speaker 1: practices and then go out and work on that once

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Speaker 1: they left. And it was a really unique experience for

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Speaker 1: a young kid, because what what kid gets to do that.

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Speaker 1: So fast forward a few more years being at Club

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Speaker 1: Green Meadows UM every Tuesday and Thursday afternoons, they would

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Speaker 1: have open open runs and it was with the old guys.

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Speaker 1: And you know how it is, Doug, as a young guy,

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Speaker 1: you gotta kind of earn your stripes. You gotta earn

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Speaker 1: the ability to be on the court. And so when

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Speaker 1: you're an eighth grader or ninth grader and you're playing

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Speaker 1: against you know, whether it's a twenty five year old

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Speaker 1: guy who was playing in college two years ago, which

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Speaker 1: there were plenty of there, or there was a forty

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Speaker 1: five year old guy that's a city league legend. If

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Speaker 1: you're the young guy wanted to get on the court,

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Speaker 1: you gotta figure out, Okay, well you win, you stay,

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Speaker 1: you lose, you gotta sit for forty five minutes. Nobody's

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Speaker 1: want to do that. And then if you are the

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Speaker 1: young guy who screwed it up for everybody, you're not

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Speaker 1: getting back on or you're not gonna be inspired to play,

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Speaker 1: You're gonna you're gonna be told to go, hey kid,

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Speaker 1: go shoot over there. So I figured it out from

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Speaker 1: a pretty early age how to compete and what it

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Speaker 1: would take to win in a team concept. And then

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Speaker 1: as my skills grew throughout high school, you know, I

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Speaker 1: was the guy that all the old guys wanted on

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Speaker 1: their team, whether they were a fresh out of college

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Speaker 1: or where there they were an old guy because they

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Speaker 1: knew we were probably what we're gonna win. Because my

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Speaker 1: skills kept getting better, and better. Um. So I credit

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Speaker 1: Green Medals for a lot of my my basketball career.

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Speaker 1: So I was I was two places racquetball World. Um.

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Speaker 1: And what's fascinating. So my best friend in basketball, my

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Speaker 1: best friends in life is Miles Simon. Um. I know

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Speaker 1: you know, well, Miles and I started playing together in

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Speaker 1: fourth grade. But what's what's interesting about Miles is he

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Speaker 1: grew up in a town called Placentia, which is really

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Speaker 1: really so close to Fullerton, and he played at racquetball World.

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Speaker 1: There's only two racketball world, I believe in Fullerton. I

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Speaker 1: grew up playing at Rackball World in Santa Anna. Like

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Speaker 1: we lived parallel lives where our dads would take us

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Speaker 1: to rackeball where my dad was a racketball player and

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Speaker 1: we would play like all day, but we didn't actually

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Speaker 1: play with each other for the most part until like

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Speaker 1: high school. Were like, you play rackball World and we're

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Speaker 1: best friends. We occasionally go to each other's rackball World

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Speaker 1: and we'd have sleepovers, but but that was that was it?

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Speaker 1: Who is your idol? Growing up? Like, there was there

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Speaker 1: a guy that you tried to embulate? Yeah, I had

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Speaker 1: a couple of him. You know, every kid that was

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Speaker 1: our age, Doug and I would imagine you would say

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Speaker 1: the same would be Michael Jordan and that's the easy one.

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Speaker 1: He he was greatest player of all time. He was

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Speaker 1: unbelievable to watch. Um. But for me growing up in Portland,

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Speaker 1: I love Jerome Kersey and Clyde Drexler, But bigger picture

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Speaker 1: in the NBA, I love John Stockton um. And oddly enough,

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Speaker 1: all these years later, John and I are good friends

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Speaker 1: and I get two friends all the time. I mean,

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Speaker 1: the craziest ship ever was I knew that. I mean

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Speaker 1: I had to feel like. First of all, Jerone Kirsty

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Speaker 1: was one of those guys, why didn't he shave his head?

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Speaker 1: He was like perfessionally going bald, Like, why didn't he

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Speaker 1: shave his head? He used to watch him the NBA finals.

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Speaker 1: And then you know, Clyde was Clyde was like you

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Speaker 1: know the Pacific Northwest Jordans like, well we got we

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Speaker 1: got right, um, but but it is we obviously we

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Speaker 1: can skip steps or whatever, but that is fascinating, right.

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Speaker 1: You grew up, I had lighting this guy and all

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Speaker 1: of a sudden, like now you're in his morning workouts

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Speaker 1: and you're playing at his school and in many ways,

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Speaker 1: surpassing everything he did at his school and now years

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Speaker 1: later your close friends, like you're a mentor to his son,

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Speaker 1: Like all of that stuff has to be just fascinating. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it blows my mind sometimes, you know. And it's because

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Speaker 1: like I'll make a comment at at home to my

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Speaker 1: wife that hey, stocks has got open gym this day

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Speaker 1: or whatever. He She'll just look at me Stocks like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: John Stockton. Everybody up here that that knows him well

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Speaker 1: just calls him stocks Um. But you know the reason

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Speaker 1: why is I was a understized white kid from suburban Portland, Vancouver,

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Speaker 1: and you know, you tend to gravitate towards and look

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Speaker 1: to the dream about, Hey, if that person did it,

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Speaker 1: maybe I can do it if I work hard and

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Speaker 1: things work out. And so I kind of always looked

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Speaker 1: at it as, hey, when I'm big, I'm probably gonna

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Speaker 1: be no bigger than John Stockton when I'm fully grown.

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Speaker 1: Uh he's good at this, this and this. Well I

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Speaker 1: need to try to be good at those same things.

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Speaker 1: And you're right, I mean, it's uh, it has come

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Speaker 1: full circle when I get a chance to go down

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Speaker 1: and and play in his his open gym's Uh, it's

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Speaker 1: a lot of fun. I mean he still plays it.

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Speaker 1: I mean, shoot, I'm forty two now, he must be

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Speaker 1: fifty five fifty six and he still plays. You know,

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Speaker 1: he's got a mix of guys, whether they're high school kids, uh,

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Speaker 1: fresh out of college kids, guys playing from overseas, or

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Speaker 1: some older guys. He's got a nice mix of guys

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Speaker 1: that play in his open gyms. That's amazing. Okay, why

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Speaker 1: you dub and it's amazing because like there's a I

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Speaker 1: want to have a part of my boy, Chris Johnson. Um.

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Speaker 1: I grew up as a u c l A fan.

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Speaker 1: We moved out here and my dad kind of befriended

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Speaker 1: Sam Gilbert, who's like the legendary booster at U c

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Speaker 1: l A. When Walt Hazard was the coach, his two sons,

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Speaker 1: Jalil and Rashid were teammates in mind. We we had

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Speaker 1: him on our travel teams. Whatever, stay the night at

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Speaker 1: the house, I'd be ball boys. Sometimes we had season tickets.

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Speaker 1: When Jim Herrick took over, like he would help. He

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Speaker 1: tried to help coach Herrick and I was offered a

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Speaker 1: scholarship there and did not go there. And you know,

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Speaker 1: all the kinds of myriad reasons. Why was was you

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Speaker 1: dub like always your place with like why you dubb

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Speaker 1: out of high school? No? I actually I wanted to

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Speaker 1: go to University of Oregon UM. I went to one

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Speaker 1: game at MATC Court. I believe it was my freshman

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Speaker 1: year of high school. Jason care would have been a freshman,

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Speaker 1: so it would have been Jason King was a freshman,

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Speaker 1: so the only year in college I believe it was.

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Speaker 1: And I was blown away by Matt Court, like just

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Speaker 1: the energy in the building, how cool it was on

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Speaker 1: the outside, how amazing it was on the inside. And

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Speaker 1: you know, at that time, I wasn't being recruited by anybody.

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Speaker 1: I was a freshman in high school. Yeah, I was

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Speaker 1: playing varsity, but I still at the time, I was

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Speaker 1: five nine forty pounds, and nobody, nobody myself included, knew

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Speaker 1: what to expect my career. And so fast forward a

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Speaker 1: couple of years, and I'm good enough to now be

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Speaker 1: recruited in the start of my junior year by uh,

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Speaker 1: pretty much everybody in the West Coast Conference, some of

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Speaker 1: them in the Mountain West, I would say, Washington, Washington State, USC,

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Speaker 1: Stanford were recruiting me. But Oregon was the school that

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Speaker 1: I wanted, like I wanted to go to Oregon. And

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Speaker 1: my high school coach, um he called them probably monthly.

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Speaker 1: Hey I got a point guard here. These others it

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Speaker 1: would have been so somewhere in there. But Jerry Green, Yes,

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Speaker 1: unbelievable staff by the way, and and and you you'll

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Speaker 1: be amazed at how are There's a bigger connection than

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Speaker 1: you think. But the staff for people don't know mark

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Speaker 1: Ersian right, Yep, yeah, he was there. Darren Kaylish, I

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Speaker 1: don't remember. Okay, So Darren was. He's from southern California

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Speaker 1: and he coached team he was a coach with Team

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Speaker 1: of Villa. Team of Villa's claim to fame was among

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Speaker 1: other people they had, they had Keith and Horn and

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Speaker 1: Darren went from Oregon to um uh to working for

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Speaker 1: Adidas a long time. And then I think he's I

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Speaker 1: think he manages people's money in the in the NBA

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Speaker 1: now whatever. Darren's great dude. And then Tad Boyle was

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Speaker 1: the other assistant when I I know because I visited

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Speaker 1: there in nineties seven spring of and I and and

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Speaker 1: my background in mac Court was my dad was an

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Speaker 1: assistant for one year at Oregon State, a C. Green's

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Speaker 1: last year. I'll never forget. And we stayed down here

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Speaker 1: and I'll never forget that he called me. He's like,

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Speaker 1: who's the most unbelievable atmosphere I've ever seen? When we

377
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Speaker 1: played at Oregon there gym is like made of would

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Speaker 1: and so the whole thing shakes. So we're at the

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Speaker 1: pretro line and they had to stop the game because

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Speaker 1: the students kept making the goals sway and I was like,

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Speaker 1: it's like your dad telling you're like no, right, And

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Speaker 1: sure enough I go and visit. And in the spring

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Speaker 1: of ninety seven they play Arizona, who like a month

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Speaker 1: later win a national championship. Jerry Green's the coach. Kenya

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Speaker 1: Wilkins was their point guard. He was amazing. He was

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Speaker 1: an l A guy I think Dorsey High School and

387
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Speaker 1: he was one of those guys that just junkyard dogs,

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Speaker 1: scoring one, tough as hell, right, And it was the

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Speaker 1: best atmosphere I had ever seen in my entire life.

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00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:44,960
Speaker 1: But here's the downside to it. Okay, and I want

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Speaker 1: to hear why why they were so late and recruiting.

392
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Speaker 1: I go and I had just been to Oklahoma State

393
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Speaker 1: on a visit where I played my freshman year of

394
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Speaker 1: Notre Dame. I left, I sat at a junior college

395
00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:58,480
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. So they're like, you'll sit, you know,

396
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Speaker 1: normally you sit in a section. They have like, you know,

397
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Speaker 1: a girl who's a host whatever, you know, even on

398
00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:08,119
Speaker 1: visits whatever, and they have people come and introduced themselves.

399
00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:12,040
Speaker 1: Back then at matt court Um, the players sat on

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Speaker 1: bleachers with like little pads in the front row of

401
00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:19,240
Speaker 1: the bleachers. And then as a recruit, my knees were

402
00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:22,720
Speaker 1: literally right behind the bench. So I'm sitting behind these guys.

403
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Speaker 1: And Jerry Green came from he was like a North

404
00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:28,720
Speaker 1: Carolina guy right where he I'm not not in terms

405
00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:30,800
Speaker 1: of where he was, but he was in that North

406
00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:35,119
Speaker 1: Carolina basketball background where they were constantly subbing guys in

407
00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:39,239
Speaker 1: and out. Point guard called the defenses whatever, but they

408
00:21:39,359 --> 00:21:41,639
Speaker 1: he it was like a turnstile with the guys subbing.

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Speaker 1: And now, and you know what happens when you take

410
00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:45,920
Speaker 1: dudes out in college, they come out and they all

411
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Speaker 1: they did was motherfuck's right. They won the game. They

412
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Speaker 1: beat Arizona, who was a more talented, unbelievable team. But

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Speaker 1: they come out of the game and every bit and

414
00:21:57,080 --> 00:22:02,840
Speaker 1: gripe about everything they're doing. And I was like, oh, oh, anyway, okay,

415
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:06,520
Speaker 1: so why did they offer you? What what happened? So,

416
00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:08,919
Speaker 1: like I said, my high school coach called them probably

417
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,760
Speaker 1: once a month and hey, I got this kid. He's

418
00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:16,639
Speaker 1: being recruited by such and such schools. His dream school

419
00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:19,520
Speaker 1: is Oregon, and they showed no interest none. I don't

420
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Speaker 1: even think I got a single. You know, they they

421
00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:24,360
Speaker 1: sent the questionnaire letters. I don't even think I got

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Speaker 1: one of those. So then after my junior year, I've

423
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,040
Speaker 1: got to have a good spring and then uh, in

424
00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:33,520
Speaker 1: the summer, I go to to Nike All American Camp

425
00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:36,199
Speaker 1: and I make one of those three All Star Games.

426
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Speaker 1: And as soon as that camp was over, they all

427
00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:43,479
Speaker 1: they do they want you, they want they want me.

428
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,680
Speaker 1: But but a month prior to that, they're like, no,

429
00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:48,520
Speaker 1: we've got the point guard of the future in the

430
00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:51,600
Speaker 1: PAC twelve Mike McShane, and I had known Mike for

431
00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:56,000
Speaker 1: years and it was like, hmm, okay, that's that's interesting.

432
00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:58,800
Speaker 1: So you know, I mean, you're a seventeen year old

433
00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:01,160
Speaker 1: kid making a decision. I might have been rash and

434
00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:04,679
Speaker 1: kind of marking them off the list. Once the interisted.

435
00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:06,640
Speaker 1: But at the same time, it's like, you know what

436
00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:09,119
Speaker 1: that that was my dream school. You never even wanted

437
00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:11,680
Speaker 1: me until I went and played at a high level.

438
00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:14,520
Speaker 1: You didn't You didn't trust my eval of myself, my

439
00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:17,960
Speaker 1: high school coaches, eval my AU coach because after Nike

440
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:21,399
Speaker 1: Camp here, before Nike Camp, my main schools are Washington,

441
00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,560
Speaker 1: Washington State, Portland's because it was so close to home,

442
00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:28,280
Speaker 1: Pepper nine because Lorenzo Romar in Stanford, and those were

443
00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 1: pretty much stayed my final choices. UM. But I did

444
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:34,480
Speaker 1: have a phone caller too with Kansas. I did uh

445
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:38,600
Speaker 1: kind of get interested in Penn State in UM and

446
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:40,560
Speaker 1: there was a couple other schools in the Midwest, Tulsa

447
00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:42,080
Speaker 1: because they were just coming off a couple of Sweet

448
00:23:42,119 --> 00:23:45,040
Speaker 1: six teams with Chasse Seals UM. But really, at the

449
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:46,720
Speaker 1: end of the day, I went to the Pac ten

450
00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:49,680
Speaker 1: and you dubbed because and you know this as well

451
00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:53,280
Speaker 1: as anybody, all the good players at that time, especially

452
00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 1: if you were a guard, you wanted to go to

453
00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:58,879
Speaker 1: the Pac twelve Pac ten. You had it was guard

454
00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:04,160
Speaker 1: crazy Terrell Bis, Davis Dotomar, My Mike Bibby, Jason Terry,

455
00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:11,760
Speaker 1: I mean was a bad boy, so many good players.

456
00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:14,520
Speaker 1: Art Artley, who was also a team of Villa by

457
00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:17,879
Speaker 1: the way, Art Lee. Uh and you mentioned brevn then

458
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:20,800
Speaker 1: it was art Ly. Then it was a quick story. Uh.

459
00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:23,560
Speaker 1: So Stanford was one of my final schools as well.

460
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:26,000
Speaker 1: And anybody knows, you go to Stanford if it doesn't

461
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:27,760
Speaker 1: work out on the basketball, and you're gonna have a

462
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:30,480
Speaker 1: pretty good degree and it's gonna open quite a few

463
00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:34,560
Speaker 1: doors for you. So, uh, they were recruiting Mike McDonald

464
00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:38,520
Speaker 1: and myself. That was their final my dad, by the way. Okay,

465
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,320
Speaker 1: so Mike McDonald and myself were the final two guys

466
00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,840
Speaker 1: that Mike Montgomery had pinpointed in that years because they

467
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:48,680
Speaker 1: needed a point guard. So I had a home visit

468
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 1: set for Mike Montgomery and one of the assistants I

469
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:54,440
Speaker 1: think on a on a Wednesday, and if everything went well,

470
00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 1: I was gonna go down the following weekend for a

471
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,399
Speaker 1: campus visit. Well, they called me on I think it

472
00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:01,800
Speaker 1: was a Monday night or a Tuesday morning. Hey, camp,

473
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:05,920
Speaker 1: our home visits off. Mike McDonald just committed committed. So

474
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:08,639
Speaker 1: and that's how it is with recruiting unless year know,

475
00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:11,280
Speaker 1: you know, ump, here's my here's here's my here's my

476
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:15,119
Speaker 1: Standford one. Okay, here's my Standford one. So I'll never forget.

477
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:17,680
Speaker 1: I was my my high school coach, the guy named

478
00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:21,119
Speaker 1: Andy Ground and he just retired from saddleback as like

479
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:24,800
Speaker 1: the best junior college coach in California. And he had

480
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 1: an office right next to the basketball gym, and I'd

481
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:29,399
Speaker 1: hang out there. You know, you get downe with class,

482
00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:31,240
Speaker 1: you got to practice, you hang out there. We just

483
00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:34,200
Speaker 1: hang out there all day and I gotta he gotta

484
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:38,920
Speaker 1: call Mike. Mike Montgomery called him, um, and he puts

485
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:41,359
Speaker 1: me on the phone and he's like, yeah, listen, we

486
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:45,000
Speaker 1: went off your scholarship. Um. You know, it's kind of

487
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:47,560
Speaker 1: the you and Art Lee thing. You know, they had

488
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:50,119
Speaker 1: me slotted ahead of Art or whatever. Art was a

489
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,840
Speaker 1: tremendous player. We'd go at it in in in a

490
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,159
Speaker 1: U ball and he's like, look, here's the deal. You know,

491
00:25:56,560 --> 00:26:00,600
Speaker 1: will sign you. You'll be Reven Knight's back for two years.

492
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 1: You'll play something with him, and then in two years

493
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:04,119
Speaker 1: you'll be the starter. And I was like, Coach, I'm

494
00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:06,720
Speaker 1: just I'm not really interested and I want to go somewhere.

495
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 1: I got a chance to start as a freshman, you know,

496
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 1: and not definitely as a sophomore, like I ain't laiting

497
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:12,720
Speaker 1: two years. I just don't know myself. I can't do

498
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:15,800
Speaker 1: it anyway. He was just kind of very, very matter

499
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 1: of fact. And then they took art and you know,

500
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:20,280
Speaker 1: the one thing about money and my brother worked for

501
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:23,120
Speaker 1: Monny is he actually is a guy of his word.

502
00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:25,760
Speaker 1: Like his problem was always he's just too honest, right,

503
00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:31,520
Speaker 1: whereas other coaches, like whole thing was like a five guys, Doug,

504
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:34,000
Speaker 1: we played the best five guys. You were like, okay,

505
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:36,400
Speaker 1: but you took a commitment from a junior and I'm

506
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:41,040
Speaker 1: a senior, like you know, um okay, so you go

507
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 1: to you dub and to be fair like at the time, okay,

508
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:47,600
Speaker 1: so I I knew, like I'm I'm with you. Arizona

509
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:51,240
Speaker 1: was all the guards. Arizona State was still kind of

510
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:54,040
Speaker 1: a little bit in the rogue. You know. They always

511
00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:57,280
Speaker 1: had dudes that were like like Eddie House, like no

512
00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:03,040
Speaker 1: real position, but just ballersh right, just ballers. Um. My

513
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:05,320
Speaker 1: problem with USC was this is before they built the

514
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:10,200
Speaker 1: Galen Center, and they had really good players, but nobody cared,

515
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:12,760
Speaker 1: Like nobody went to their games and the sports arena

516
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:15,200
Speaker 1: had such a bad rap that it was hard to

517
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,440
Speaker 1: get guys go there. U c l A won a

518
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:20,960
Speaker 1: national championship my senior year in high school. Right, Cal

519
00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:24,199
Speaker 1: had Jason Kidd and then Randy Duck. Randy Duck was good.

520
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:25,719
Speaker 1: I played with him in the USB L I got

521
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:28,360
Speaker 1: was good. But then they had Gianni. He took Gillanni

522
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:30,720
Speaker 1: Gardner the year before me, and they had they had

523
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:32,880
Speaker 1: they had a team those over the salary cap. Right,

524
00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:38,840
Speaker 1: Stanford Wazoo you dub now you went to you dub with?

525
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:42,280
Speaker 1: Was Donald wattson freshman? You're a freshman's a sophomore year.

526
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:48,400
Speaker 1: Donald would have been a junior my freshman year. Sophomore. Well,

527
00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:51,920
Speaker 1: he was one year older than me um and so

528
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:55,440
Speaker 1: Donald you could kind of see things building at University

529
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 1: of Washington when coach Benner took over Um gradually getting

530
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 1: better year by year. Donald Watts, Dion Luton, who I

531
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:04,080
Speaker 1: think you played with at Oklahoma State, was a year

532
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,840
Speaker 1: older than me Um. So no, Donald was two years older.

533
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,200
Speaker 1: Sorry he didn't. Dion was from Oklahoma City, but he

534
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:12,800
Speaker 1: didn't go to Oklahoma State. That's that's why you guys

535
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 1: played us, because you brought him home. That's what it was. Yeah,

536
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,280
Speaker 1: So Deon Luton was a tremendous shooter, and then we

537
00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 1: had two really good seven footers, Patrick Femerlen from Germany

538
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:24,639
Speaker 1: UM and then Todd McCulloch, who obviously played in the

539
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:27,840
Speaker 1: NBA for about six years. So you saw the kind

540
00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:32,399
Speaker 1: of trajectory of of what you thought the program could be. Yea,

541
00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:34,879
Speaker 1: granted you never you knew, at least I knew we

542
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:37,520
Speaker 1: were never gonna be u C. L A or Arizona.

543
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:39,360
Speaker 1: But you know, as a kid, you always want to

544
00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:42,280
Speaker 1: have a chance to to you know, play right off

545
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 1: the bat, like you mentioned, and you want to go

546
00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:45,840
Speaker 1: to an n c A tournament. I thought both of

547
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 1: those things were possible for me. Um. And you know,

548
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 1: looking back, Um, you know, the way recruitment went versus

549
00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:59,040
Speaker 1: the way your first year on campus went really wasn't

550
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:02,160
Speaker 1: what I was expecting. And I think that's that's indicative

551
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 1: of a lot of kids. You know, they get told something,

552
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 1: they get their their their hopes and their thoughts in

553
00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:09,600
Speaker 1: one ways and it doesn't quite work out. And not

554
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 1: that I was guaranteed to be a starter, but you know,

555
00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 1: if you looked at the two seniors that's that that

556
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:17,600
Speaker 1: played ahead of me in the rotation. Um, neither one

557
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:19,680
Speaker 1: were better than me, and and and you know me

558
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:23,840
Speaker 1: well enough. I'm not gonna be talking bad about another player,

559
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:26,160
Speaker 1: but I mean it was pretty obvious to me that,

560
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 1: you know, I was going to have to earn my minutes,

561
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 1: and I earned them, you know, as a freshman, I

562
00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:33,840
Speaker 1: still played fourteen minutes a game, and and I had

563
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,600
Speaker 1: some big moments, uh in some big games down the

564
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:39,920
Speaker 1: stretch of the season. But um, you know, freshman year

565
00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:42,480
Speaker 1: didn't pan out quite as well minutes wise as I

566
00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:45,479
Speaker 1: had thought or hoped. Um, but we made this sweet

567
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 1: six team, which you dubbed hadn't done and who knows

568
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:51,040
Speaker 1: how long. So they ended up being a really good

569
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:54,000
Speaker 1: freshman year. And then some different things happened injury wise,

570
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:56,240
Speaker 1: and then leading into my sophomore year that that made

571
00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,400
Speaker 1: me know that was not the place for me. Okay,

572
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:04,480
Speaker 1: So so you skip some steps there, Okay, So no,

573
00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:07,480
Speaker 1: it's okay, okay, it's okay. I'm I'm my mans scatter

574
00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:11,720
Speaker 1: as well. So here's what I remember. Okay, we played

575
00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:15,680
Speaker 1: you your freshman year and I was hyped because I was.

576
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 1: It was like, you like, are one of our first

577
00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 1: we were I go to Oaklhoma State and the two

578
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:23,560
Speaker 1: years before I get there there seventeen and fifteen, and

579
00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:25,160
Speaker 1: they just they kind of sold me on, hey, we

580
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:29,120
Speaker 1: need a point guard, and you know it, actually it's

581
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:31,920
Speaker 1: kind of crazy. Oakland State was a place where everything

582
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 1: they said actually kind of came to fruition, right, like,

583
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 1: we're gonna move these guys were points to the two

584
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:40,880
Speaker 1: and everybody's gonna move down a position or whatever. We'll

585
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:44,040
Speaker 1: play a little small and it it kind of worked out. Um,

586
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:48,440
Speaker 1: but I remember coming in all the guys and this

587
00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:50,600
Speaker 1: is this is again how A is a little different

588
00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:52,880
Speaker 1: now than it was then. They all knew all the

589
00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:54,520
Speaker 1: guys from that part of the country. So like they

590
00:30:54,560 --> 00:30:57,560
Speaker 1: all knew Dion Luton. I mean, I mean, yes, they're

591
00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:00,239
Speaker 1: like they kept calling keep on shooting Dan Luton, right,

592
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:03,680
Speaker 1: They're like and they were hyped because Joe Atkins and

593
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 1: Still Laster, who were the two sophomore guards that were

594
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,600
Speaker 1: trying to be points it became twos. They were hyped

595
00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:12,360
Speaker 1: about playing a guy who they grew up playing with

596
00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:15,400
Speaker 1: or against or whatever. And you know, we had a

597
00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 1: big guy, Brett Roebish who was the transfer of Illinois.

598
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:20,960
Speaker 1: He was fired up about playing Mount McColo and I

599
00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:23,040
Speaker 1: was like, we get to play against Dan Dick. I

600
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:25,560
Speaker 1: like I heard, but I was older, you know, I

601
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:28,400
Speaker 1: had sat out, but I had like I knew the

602
00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:31,440
Speaker 1: A U circuit whatever, and so I was. And then

603
00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:34,440
Speaker 1: we get ready for the game and he's playing these

604
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:38,080
Speaker 1: two other guys and I remember, like Seawn Sutton tell me,

605
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:41,640
Speaker 1: like playing the wrong guys playing that he's like playing

606
00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:44,080
Speaker 1: the wrong Like we're watching tape. They're like they're playing

607
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 1: the wrong guys because you have to. It's one of

608
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:50,080
Speaker 1: the things that I actually really admire about Frank McCaffrey

609
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,960
Speaker 1: and I were talking about Iowa Gonzaga is that he

610
00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:55,840
Speaker 1: told me when he signed me at Notre Dame. He

611
00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:58,320
Speaker 1: was the reason I went there, and he told me

612
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:00,560
Speaker 1: it's like, look, you have to rust me on this

613
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:03,880
Speaker 1: when we get the real games, like you're going to

614
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 1: be the guy because I was terrible in practice. You know,

615
00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 1: you know is when you get to college, like all

616
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:10,480
Speaker 1: these guys are grown men, you don't know what you're doing.

617
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:14,680
Speaker 1: And uh, he had the vision of what it would

618
00:32:14,680 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 1: look like eventually, but I what, so take me through

619
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:21,959
Speaker 1: what it was like to play for Coach Bender because they,

620
00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:25,680
Speaker 1: as you point out right, they were building something and

621
00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 1: but at that point in time the season, it didn't

622
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:30,400
Speaker 1: feel like he gave you the team. Well, you know

623
00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:33,080
Speaker 1: that's that's a really good point that you make in

624
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:37,000
Speaker 1: trusting the coach that recruited you, Fran McCaffrey. So the

625
00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,040
Speaker 1: coach who did most of the recruiting for me when

626
00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 1: when he was at University of Washington was Ray jack Letty.

627
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:46,880
Speaker 1: He ended up being a head coach at Eastern Washington,

628
00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:50,200
Speaker 1: Utah and that Drake and now he's an assistant at St. Louis.

629
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 1: But he was the main guy who recruited me. He's

630
00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:55,680
Speaker 1: the guy who I ended up developing the relationship and

631
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:58,360
Speaker 1: trust in and and knew he was gonna have my

632
00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:02,960
Speaker 1: back at camp on empis. The other two assistants, to

633
00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:04,800
Speaker 1: be honest, take it or leave it. I didn't think

634
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:07,520
Speaker 1: they that they trusted me or they wanted me there

635
00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:10,480
Speaker 1: like Coach jack Letty did, and Coach Jack had Coach

636
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 1: Bender's ear. Well, Coach jack Letti got his first head

637
00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:20,200
Speaker 1: coaching opportunity in August of the summer, right before I

638
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:23,120
Speaker 1: was gonna be a freshman at at you, dub. So

639
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 1: imagine that your assistant coach, the guy that's gonna be

640
00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:30,800
Speaker 1: in your corner, vouching for you, breaking down film with you,

641
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:34,640
Speaker 1: talking to you, he's no longer there because he left.

642
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:38,040
Speaker 1: And so I kind of navigating everything, kind of blind.

643
00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:41,040
Speaker 1: Um as a freshman when't and nobody, you don't even

644
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 1: don't know what to expect, You don't know who to

645
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,400
Speaker 1: lean on. Right away, I realized, well, one of the assistants,

646
00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:48,520
Speaker 1: Byron Borgereau, he's not a fan of mine at all. Okay,

647
00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:51,920
Speaker 1: that's fine. Another Eric hughs he take it or leave it.

648
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:54,600
Speaker 1: He's he's not really in my corner. Jason Hamilton's who

649
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:58,440
Speaker 1: replaced Um, who was on the staff as well. Um,

650
00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:01,400
Speaker 1: he he was in my core, but he was a

651
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:04,040
Speaker 1: younger coach and he was who I don't and he

652
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:06,440
Speaker 1: was news, so I don't think he necessarily you know,

653
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:09,920
Speaker 1: I had coach Bender's ear. And it's difficult, I'm sure,

654
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:12,359
Speaker 1: And I've never been in a position, but I'm sure

655
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:16,359
Speaker 1: it's difficult to take a freshman point guard and give

656
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:19,120
Speaker 1: him the ball over to seniors. I mean, you might

657
00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:22,400
Speaker 1: you might lose those two guys mentally, you know, just

658
00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:26,200
Speaker 1: as you know, what's this kid doing coming here? Because

659
00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:28,400
Speaker 1: neither one of those guys and I've always felt this,

660
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:31,160
Speaker 1: if neither of the guys that are ahead of you

661
00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:34,919
Speaker 1: and are that much older, if they're not heading shoulders better,

662
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:38,480
Speaker 1: why not play the freshman, especially early in the season,

663
00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:41,400
Speaker 1: go through some ups and downs, bumps and bruises, and

664
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:44,200
Speaker 1: your team and that individual who's younger is going to

665
00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:46,080
Speaker 1: be better off for it down the down the stretch

666
00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:50,120
Speaker 1: of the season. The the well I called the rabbi

667
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:52,280
Speaker 1: in the room. You gotta have somebody who's your rabbi,

668
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:55,080
Speaker 1: who blessedes you, who watches out for you, right, And

669
00:34:55,160 --> 00:35:00,440
Speaker 1: it's really interesting, Like I mean, I remember Paul Graham

670
00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:02,160
Speaker 1: was an assistant coach. He became the head coach at

671
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 1: Washington State, and he didn't really recruit me. So like

672
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,000
Speaker 1: I I he gave me one compliment in three years

673
00:35:10,040 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 1: at Oklahoma State and here was a compliment. Okay, So

674
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 1: Paul Graham's called the Judge. He used to always do this,

675
00:35:16,120 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 1: you know, and like get it out, get it out, Judge,

676
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:24,640
Speaker 1: get it out. Anyway we play I think it was

677
00:35:24,760 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 1: my sophomore maybe my junior year. We play Texas Tech

678
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:30,479
Speaker 1: on the road in their old place seems a dump.

679
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:32,160
Speaker 1: And it was my Sophoma year and they had a

680
00:35:32,200 --> 00:35:34,080
Speaker 1: good team. It was there. They were coming off of

681
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:39,760
Speaker 1: sweet sixteen as well, um and they had lost Battite

682
00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:42,480
Speaker 1: to the NBA, but they still had Corey Carr did

683
00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 1: a really good combo guard named Stan Bonowitz point guard

684
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:49,080
Speaker 1: names Stan Bonowitz. Ray Young was their point guard. He

685
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 1: was a scoring point guard. That's Trays Dad. That's how

686
00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 1: crazy how old we are getting right where guys who'd

687
00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:56,480
Speaker 1: be like sons are in the n B A say,

688
00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:59,880
Speaker 1: a really good team and um Cliff owners are sent

689
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 1: or he was built like a Greek god and we

690
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 1: we beat him and I played really well down the

691
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:07,440
Speaker 1: stretch and he like called me in and maybe as

692
00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:10,839
Speaker 1: my junior, and he was like, hey man, they're really good.

693
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:14,400
Speaker 1: You're not doing that stupid ship. Good job, right. That

694
00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:18,360
Speaker 1: was it? Like literally never coached me, Like, like what

695
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:20,040
Speaker 1: was it like to play for? Like, I don't know.

696
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 1: He recruited all the time, right, And the guys that

697
00:36:23,560 --> 00:36:25,520
Speaker 1: he recruited, those are the guys that he kind of

698
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:29,920
Speaker 1: gravitated towards. Whereas like Sean Sutton and Fran McCaffrey, like

699
00:36:30,640 --> 00:36:32,920
Speaker 1: I literally would talk to them on the phone or

700
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:36,239
Speaker 1: in person every single day of my existence. So I

701
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:38,960
Speaker 1: totally get when you lose Ray Jackaletti and he goes

702
00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 1: becomes a head coach, You're like, dude, who's my guy here? Right?

703
00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:44,800
Speaker 1: You know who's my guy? And as much as you

704
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:46,400
Speaker 1: wanted to be the head coach, the head coach is

705
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:49,200
Speaker 1: doing head coaching things you know you you need. I mean,

706
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:53,359
Speaker 1: it's just okay, So let's let's get to how how

707
00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:59,839
Speaker 1: the transfer and why Gunzaga. Yeah, that's uh So after

708
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:03,200
Speaker 1: my freshman year, I injured my foot in the summer.

709
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:06,960
Speaker 1: Um we thought it was broken and kind of did

710
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,279
Speaker 1: the whole put it in a cast for a short bit,

711
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,440
Speaker 1: go to a walking boot, to the rehab thing. Are

712
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:16,200
Speaker 1: you definitely coming back? Definitely definitely coming back. So I

713
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:19,080
Speaker 1: get to to you dub In in the fall, and

714
00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:22,399
Speaker 1: I'm back healthy again at that point, but we're doing

715
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:27,120
Speaker 1: conditioning and and my mental capacity or my mental approach

716
00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:31,719
Speaker 1: has always been if you're if you're dinged up, go ahead,

717
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:33,960
Speaker 1: play through it. If you're hurt, okay, go talk to

718
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:36,000
Speaker 1: a trainer. Well, I at the time, I still I

719
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:37,840
Speaker 1: didn't know what the difference between the two. So I

720
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:40,320
Speaker 1: knew there was something wrong with my foot still, but

721
00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:42,960
Speaker 1: I just kept gutting it out through conditioning, through fall

722
00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:46,800
Speaker 1: open gyms and workouts and then practice, and you know,

723
00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 1: start the season off and I'm starting, you know, I

724
00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:51,960
Speaker 1: think I started the first eleven games of the year

725
00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:56,400
Speaker 1: before I broke my foot um and we got an

726
00:37:56,760 --> 00:37:58,640
Speaker 1: X ray and an m R I and realized, hey,

727
00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:02,080
Speaker 1: it's it's it's done. You need surgery. So in leading

728
00:38:02,160 --> 00:38:06,400
Speaker 1: up to that, you know, it was kind of one

729
00:38:06,440 --> 00:38:08,879
Speaker 1: of those things where I was playing, but I wasn't

730
00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:11,719
Speaker 1: myself because I wasn't healthy, and I couldn't do the

731
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:13,920
Speaker 1: things on the court that I knew that I could do,

732
00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:15,640
Speaker 1: just because I couldn't do it. And so then we

733
00:38:15,719 --> 00:38:18,200
Speaker 1: had a freshman sank You Carry at the time, who

734
00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:20,839
Speaker 1: is now an assistant coach at Long Beach State under

735
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:24,520
Speaker 1: Dan Monson. And this will kind of be funny how

736
00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:26,920
Speaker 1: it comes for a full circle. Well, he's thank you

737
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:29,600
Speaker 1: Carry as a freshman who starts playing really well. And

738
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:32,880
Speaker 1: I can't do the things that are making me or

739
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:34,720
Speaker 1: would give me the chance to be a good player.

740
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:38,160
Speaker 1: I can't change speeds, I can't change directions because I

741
00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:40,120
Speaker 1: can't do that. I can't create space to make the

742
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:41,759
Speaker 1: right play and a pick and roll. I can't do

743
00:38:42,280 --> 00:38:44,440
Speaker 1: those things. So I can't create space to get off

744
00:38:44,520 --> 00:38:50,040
Speaker 1: my jump shot. I'm just playing on one leg game

745
00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 1: as a Husky. I'm playing in Arizona. I have to

746
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:56,239
Speaker 1: guard Jason Terry, the fastest player in the country at

747
00:38:56,280 --> 00:38:57,560
Speaker 1: the time. I have to play him on one leg.

748
00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:02,799
Speaker 1: I mean, give me a breakfast committed to you, dub dub,

749
00:39:03,239 --> 00:39:08,320
Speaker 1: and then midnight Luke came in. It's true. So finally

750
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:10,279
Speaker 1: after that Arizona game, talk with the trainers, like, look,

751
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:12,080
Speaker 1: we gotta figure this out. I can't go through an

752
00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:14,880
Speaker 1: hour of rehab before practice, after practice, and then it

753
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:17,160
Speaker 1: still hurts this way. So we get back to Seattle.

754
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:19,839
Speaker 1: We'll get m r I. We got a cat scan. Yep,

755
00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:23,880
Speaker 1: foot's broken. Uh, going to have surgery the doctor. I

756
00:39:23,920 --> 00:39:25,600
Speaker 1: come out of the surgery and the doctor was like, well,

757
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:27,480
Speaker 1: we fixed it, but I don't think you broke your

758
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:30,840
Speaker 1: foot this summer. I think it was a misdiagnosis. Awesome,

759
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:34,680
Speaker 1: So I had a misdiagnosis leading into a bigger surgery

760
00:39:34,760 --> 00:39:38,640
Speaker 1: than what we thought was gonna be. Well, Lo and behold.

761
00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:42,960
Speaker 1: During that time frame, Gonzaga starts making a run. As

762
00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:45,000
Speaker 1: far as you know, I'm watching them on TV and

763
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:46,880
Speaker 1: they're having a really good season in w c C.

764
00:39:47,520 --> 00:39:49,280
Speaker 1: And guys on that team are friends of mine, Richie

765
00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:51,719
Speaker 1: from who was the sixth grade teammate, We were high

766
00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:55,399
Speaker 1: school rivals. Casey Calvary was an AU team mate of mind.

767
00:39:55,960 --> 00:39:59,279
Speaker 1: And I'm seeing these guys on TV getting better and

768
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:01,800
Speaker 1: watching the progression of the team throughout the course of

769
00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:03,600
Speaker 1: the year, and then they give me a call on

770
00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:06,960
Speaker 1: you know, and like, hey, when are you transferred? I'm like,

771
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:11,040
Speaker 1: what are you talking about? So kind of gradually a

772
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,200
Speaker 1: couple of the guys keep past through me, like hey, Gonzaga, Gonzaga.

773
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:16,680
Speaker 1: So that Gonzaga ends up going to the Elite eight

774
00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:19,560
Speaker 1: that year, they get to a tournament, make their huge run,

775
00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:24,279
Speaker 1: And before before that happened, I knew in my mind,

776
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:26,920
Speaker 1: before the n c A tournament started, I was transferred

777
00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:29,440
Speaker 1: and I liked Gonzaga. I wanted to be there, And

778
00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:33,040
Speaker 1: then that Gonzaga run to the Elite eight just sold

779
00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:35,399
Speaker 1: me as like that's where I want to be. Those

780
00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:38,279
Speaker 1: are my buddies. They're getting better, They're playing in a

781
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:41,240
Speaker 1: system that obviously is working. There in the NCAA tournament

782
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:43,800
Speaker 1: and the Elite eight, they're winning, they're having fun. I

783
00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:46,680
Speaker 1: want to be a part of that. So I decided

784
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:54,520
Speaker 1: to transfer. Um, Jason Hamilton so no, So I decided

785
00:40:54,520 --> 00:40:57,759
Speaker 1: to transfer. Coach Benner honestly couldn't care less if I

786
00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:01,239
Speaker 1: was transferring or not. It was really weird phone call versation. UM,

787
00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 1: Jason Hamilton's at home. You didn't go, You didn't go

788
00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:07,160
Speaker 1: and see him. I went into the office at you

789
00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:11,719
Speaker 1: dubbed Jason Hamilton's was there. Um. He was the only

790
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:13,920
Speaker 1: assistant coach that tried to talk me out of transfer.

791
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:16,920
Speaker 1: He wanted me to stay. The other two weren't in

792
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:20,000
Speaker 1: the office, but they could care less. Bob Bender, I

793
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,799
Speaker 1: believe was at the Final four or hadn't gotten back

794
00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:26,520
Speaker 1: yet from the Final four. Um, and we had a conversation,

795
00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:30,000
Speaker 1: and it just, you know, I didn't get the sense

796
00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:35,239
Speaker 1: that he was particularly wanting me to stay or not

797
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:38,359
Speaker 1: wanting to stay. And I decided, you know, it's best

798
00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:40,680
Speaker 1: for me to transfer. So I decided to. I sent

799
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:45,439
Speaker 1: my release to two places, Gonzaga and St. Louis. And St.

800
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:49,360
Speaker 1: Louis was because Lorenzo Romar Pepperdine. So I talked to

801
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:53,520
Speaker 1: both schools. Lorenzo at St. Louis said, look, Gonzaga is

802
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:57,719
Speaker 1: perfect for you perfect take your visit there. If you

803
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:01,680
Speaker 1: don't like it, and if it doesn't, if you don't commit,

804
00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:04,040
Speaker 1: which I think you will do on your visit, call

805
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:05,719
Speaker 1: me on Monday and we'll set you up for a

806
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,960
Speaker 1: visit out at St. Louis. Well lo and behold, I

807
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:13,600
Speaker 1: go to Gonzaga the visit, I I realized within ten

808
00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:16,400
Speaker 1: hours that that's where I need to be, and I

809
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:20,440
Speaker 1: committed on to coach Dan Monson, who I mentioned came

810
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:23,280
Speaker 1: full circle, who is now the heck and he carries

811
00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:27,359
Speaker 1: the assistant. Yeah, so I commit to Dan Monson. Um.

812
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:31,120
Speaker 1: And then right before actually about two months later, he

813
00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:33,800
Speaker 1: takes the Minnesota job. But I knew that that was

814
00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:35,879
Speaker 1: a possibility, and I knew and talking to the guys

815
00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:38,120
Speaker 1: at the program that you know, the program would be

816
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:40,640
Speaker 1: in good hands with coach Few and coach Greer being

817
00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:43,479
Speaker 1: his assistant, and it wasn't gonna miss a beat because

818
00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:45,520
Speaker 1: of the guys that were there. Um. So that's kind

819
00:42:45,560 --> 00:42:48,920
Speaker 1: of full circle how that transfer came about. And it

820
00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:52,799
Speaker 1: was Honestly, it was the the best decision I had

821
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:55,719
Speaker 1: ever made basketball wise. It's it's amazing. I know you

822
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:57,400
Speaker 1: have to go. Okay, so we're gonna do just you know,

823
00:42:57,480 --> 00:42:59,640
Speaker 1: you're you're I'm getting you to commit to Part two.

824
00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:06,440
Speaker 1: Um from I'm always down to talk. Okay, so but

825
00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:08,680
Speaker 1: but but okay, so but here here's here's what I

826
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 1: need before we conclude part one. Give me your visit

827
00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:15,400
Speaker 1: because I was told by few that would. And now

828
00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:18,320
Speaker 1: maybe it's just with specific guys. You know, when you

829
00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:20,080
Speaker 1: get there, you go to dinner with everybody and they

830
00:43:20,160 --> 00:43:24,480
Speaker 1: make you tell one funny story from your previous spot. Okay,

831
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:26,880
Speaker 1: so here's here, Like I'll give you an example. And

832
00:43:30,040 --> 00:43:34,560
Speaker 1: uh I so Jackson what was his last name? He

833
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:38,839
Speaker 1: actually transferred to Oregon from Utah. But he's from count

834
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:42,440
Speaker 1: of your area? God, what is his name? Shoot order

835
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:51,080
Speaker 1: to Utah? He was at David Jackson. Okay, so Jackson Okay,

836
00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:54,800
Speaker 1: So but he visited Glenzaga So and maybe it was

837
00:43:54,840 --> 00:43:57,759
Speaker 1: just because it was Mgara's. But the story that I

838
00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:00,319
Speaker 1: got was like, Hey, what we do is you coming home?

839
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:02,600
Speaker 1: You gotta tell a story about like your previous spot. Right,

840
00:44:03,360 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 1: and his story about about uh about Utah was about

841
00:44:12,320 --> 00:44:14,600
Speaker 1: Rick Majeri's right, and every no one you weren't allowed

842
00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:16,920
Speaker 1: to call Rick coach. You had to call him Rick. Right.

843
00:44:17,520 --> 00:44:20,360
Speaker 1: So he goes, we needed, we needed we need a

844
00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:23,880
Speaker 1: Rick story. He's like and non, no, I I can't know,

845
00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:25,680
Speaker 1: we need a Rick story. We're not ordering any food

846
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:28,040
Speaker 1: till we get a Rick story. Like all right, well

847
00:44:28,120 --> 00:44:30,200
Speaker 1: just the other day, like just the other day, Like yeah,

848
00:44:30,280 --> 00:44:34,120
Speaker 1: So here's how he told him he was transferred. Rick

849
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:36,640
Speaker 1: lived in the penthouse of the Marriott in Salt Lake

850
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:39,319
Speaker 1: City and if you and any time you go up

851
00:44:39,320 --> 00:44:42,080
Speaker 1: and you go see him, but he was always like

852
00:44:42,239 --> 00:44:45,080
Speaker 1: in a towel. He was almost always naked. I don't know.

853
00:44:45,920 --> 00:44:49,120
Speaker 1: And so they had talked about him transferring. You know,

854
00:44:49,200 --> 00:44:51,759
Speaker 1: it is like going into Christmas break, everybody kind of

855
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:54,319
Speaker 1: oh my, do you want it? He's staying. So they're

856
00:44:54,360 --> 00:44:56,719
Speaker 1: getting coming at the end of Christmas break and like

857
00:44:56,760 --> 00:44:59,040
Speaker 1: knocks on his door, and you know, you gotta get

858
00:44:59,120 --> 00:45:01,800
Speaker 1: to call your coach, like I'm sure just a caller

859
00:45:01,880 --> 00:45:04,440
Speaker 1: going to the office and tell somebody you're leaving him out.

860
00:45:05,000 --> 00:45:08,480
Speaker 1: Like that's a hard thing for nine, right, Like you

861
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 1: invested in me, you believed to me on some level,

862
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:14,200
Speaker 1: and I'm out. That's a hard thing to do. So

863
00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:18,479
Speaker 1: he's like, uh, oh, come in, come in, David, come in. Sorry,

864
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:19,839
Speaker 1: is just getting out of the shower, you know, he's

865
00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:24,560
Speaker 1: in a towel, and so David tells the story. He's

866
00:45:24,600 --> 00:45:26,520
Speaker 1: like looking down at his feet, shuffle to you know, Rick,

867
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:29,719
Speaker 1: we talked about like if I wasn't happy and I'm

868
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:32,120
Speaker 1: just not feeling it, I'm not getting the minutes and

869
00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:39,120
Speaker 1: I don't know. And he looks up and Majaris's out cold.

870
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:43,600
Speaker 1: Now you're like poorn at. You're like pouring out your heart, right,

871
00:45:43,719 --> 00:45:48,040
Speaker 1: pour out your heart to a guy. And he's so

872
00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:55,440
Speaker 1: he's like, do I leave, like nudges him, nudges him again, Oh, David,

873
00:45:55,640 --> 00:45:58,520
Speaker 1: or oh I'm sorry, I'm sorry. Sorry. He's like, Oh,

874
00:45:58,600 --> 00:46:01,319
Speaker 1: this medication that I'm on, it just knocks me out.

875
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:05,080
Speaker 1: And look what it does to my ball. He's got

876
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:08,279
Speaker 1: some like swollen testicle. He shows David Jackson. This is

877
00:46:08,320 --> 00:46:11,080
Speaker 1: the David goes like, hey, Rick, I just came to

878
00:46:11,200 --> 00:46:14,200
Speaker 1: I want to transfer. I'm out. You signed the release

879
00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:16,759
Speaker 1: and like literally walked out never talked to him ever again.

880
00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:20,759
Speaker 1: So you did that, your experience was not perfect right

881
00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:24,080
Speaker 1: where Bob Bender didn't we love you, we want you

882
00:46:24,160 --> 00:46:27,120
Speaker 1: to stay. You became the national player the year. But

883
00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:30,400
Speaker 1: it wasn't that your visit to Gonzaga, did they? I

884
00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:33,080
Speaker 1: went to Marquette, we did a case race. We just

885
00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:36,000
Speaker 1: drank beers all weekend. We went to the Brewers game

886
00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:40,239
Speaker 1: and uh, Chris Crawford wouldy we we just all we

887
00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:42,680
Speaker 1: did was I remember was drinking that that weekend. Your

888
00:46:42,760 --> 00:46:47,680
Speaker 1: visit to Gonzaga was what happened? It was I think

889
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:51,359
Speaker 1: I committed on the first night of the visit at

890
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:55,520
Speaker 1: at the restaurant. UH pulled coach Monson aside and say, hey,

891
00:46:55,600 --> 00:46:58,080
Speaker 1: you know what, um, this is where I want to be.

892
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:00,880
Speaker 1: And so they scrapped the us to the weekend as

893
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:03,520
Speaker 1: far as having to go to uh, you know, your

894
00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:07,759
Speaker 1: academic counselor meeting, meeting this professor, that a professor, and

895
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:10,640
Speaker 1: I just I went to the gym and hooped. That's

896
00:47:10,640 --> 00:47:13,560
Speaker 1: what I did. I mean. Richie From was a childhood

897
00:47:13,600 --> 00:47:17,720
Speaker 1: friend and a a you buddy, and Casey Calvary Richie

898
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:20,200
Speaker 1: From were the same, So it was really just a

899
00:47:20,680 --> 00:47:24,359
Speaker 1: hangout weekend. Um. Once I knew I was gonna gonna

900
00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:27,760
Speaker 1: be at Gonzaga. So there was nothing crazy or special

901
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:30,960
Speaker 1: to any of my recruiting trips. I was. I was

902
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:33,359
Speaker 1: pretty boring. I was wanted to be in the gym.

903
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:37,839
Speaker 1: What what did you do to improve during your Red

904
00:47:37,920 --> 00:47:43,000
Speaker 1: Tree year? Never take a day off? I was. I

905
00:47:43,160 --> 00:47:46,480
Speaker 1: was lucky because Tommy Lloyd was a student assistant at

906
00:47:46,520 --> 00:47:49,839
Speaker 1: the time and we became he's associated head coach now

907
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:53,279
Speaker 1: and we became like best friends for for for that

908
00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:56,200
Speaker 1: stretch of my life, my career. I mean, he was

909
00:47:56,239 --> 00:47:57,960
Speaker 1: in the gym every time I wanted to be there,

910
00:47:58,640 --> 00:48:02,720
Speaker 1: working on just random stuff like jab shots off legged

911
00:48:02,760 --> 00:48:06,640
Speaker 1: pivot foot jab shots, jab goes, jab crossovers, uh, pick

912
00:48:06,719 --> 00:48:11,560
Speaker 1: and roll reads where you know, instead of you you

913
00:48:11,680 --> 00:48:13,920
Speaker 1: make a delivery with one hand, you're making it with

914
00:48:14,040 --> 00:48:16,320
Speaker 1: both hands. You're making it off a reverse pivot on

915
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:20,000
Speaker 1: hook pass, you're throwing you know, Uh, every different kind

916
00:48:20,040 --> 00:48:22,160
Speaker 1: of scenario drill you could think of. Tommy and I

917
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:24,480
Speaker 1: worked on that year, and he was he was still

918
00:48:24,560 --> 00:48:26,520
Speaker 1: young enough where we played a lot of one on

919
00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:29,520
Speaker 1: one as well, So UM team would go out on

920
00:48:29,600 --> 00:48:31,399
Speaker 1: the road, we would be in the gym every day

921
00:48:31,840 --> 00:48:36,480
Speaker 1: UM practices. I became the guy that was the focal

922
00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:39,000
Speaker 1: point um of the other team, whether it was a

923
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:42,920
Speaker 1: point guard who could pass it, okay, well today in practice,

924
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:45,839
Speaker 1: I gotta just make every single read. I gotta make

925
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:47,759
Speaker 1: place for others all practice long. If it was a

926
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:50,120
Speaker 1: scoring point guard, you know, I had the freedom to

927
00:48:50,160 --> 00:48:52,120
Speaker 1: pull up from thirty ft on the break. If I

928
00:48:52,239 --> 00:48:55,719
Speaker 1: was a two, I was coming off pin downs, floppy actions,

929
00:48:56,120 --> 00:48:58,840
Speaker 1: whatever it was. If I was a three in practice

930
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:01,400
Speaker 1: that day, you know, I was filling the lane and

931
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:03,640
Speaker 1: transition and I was trying to slash. I mean, it

932
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:06,920
Speaker 1: was a year where Coach Few challenged me in practice

933
00:49:07,000 --> 00:49:08,839
Speaker 1: to to bring it every day to help the guys

934
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:11,680
Speaker 1: get ready. But in turn it helped me because I

935
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:14,239
Speaker 1: had to kind of fill all these different roles for

936
00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:17,239
Speaker 1: what they would face as an opponent in the coming days.

937
00:49:17,920 --> 00:49:19,640
Speaker 1: And it got me out of my comfort zone and

938
00:49:19,719 --> 00:49:22,960
Speaker 1: really helped improve all these different little facets of the

939
00:49:23,080 --> 00:49:26,720
Speaker 1: game while I learned how to be competitive and coached

940
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:31,759
Speaker 1: us system. We'll break there because you gotta go. But

941
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:38,319
Speaker 1: that was a great look into a into what into

942
00:49:38,360 --> 00:49:40,879
Speaker 1: what led you to becoming a Zag and now you're

943
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:44,759
Speaker 1: you're a Zag legend. But it's just Uh, it's it's Uh,

944
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:47,200
Speaker 1: it's pretty awesome. Dan, Thanks so much for joining me.

945
00:49:47,640 --> 00:49:49,800
Speaker 1: Absolutely without a doubt we will have to do it

946
00:49:49,880 --> 00:49:53,320
Speaker 1: again sometimes because Uh, like I said, I always like

947
00:49:53,920 --> 00:49:56,440
Speaker 1: catching up talking hoops with you, Doug. So just let

948
00:49:56,520 --> 00:50:02,239
Speaker 1: me know when I that's part one and there's there's

949
00:50:02,440 --> 00:50:04,960
Speaker 1: there's more. Now we got now he's he's at Gonzaga.

950
00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:10,320
Speaker 1: We still haven't gotten into the first meeting with John Stockton.

951
00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:12,759
Speaker 1: Right now he's telling us he's called him stocks But

952
00:50:13,239 --> 00:50:15,600
Speaker 1: the first meeting, Like, was it like to play for

953
00:50:15,640 --> 00:50:18,839
Speaker 1: the Zags? What what was that heartache? Like? How much

954
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:22,000
Speaker 1: pride does he take in what they've done his NBA journey?

955
00:50:22,280 --> 00:50:23,959
Speaker 1: And oh yeah, by the way, for a guy that's

956
00:50:24,239 --> 00:50:27,000
Speaker 1: was known for the hair when he was in college,

957
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:29,520
Speaker 1: the floppy hair when he's a kid. Now he owns

958
00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:32,480
Speaker 1: barbershops too, So and we'll talk about the Zag thing

959
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:34,799
Speaker 1: and how this could be the year we getting ready

960
00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:37,440
Speaker 1: for the Iowa Glenzag game. In the meantime, really appreciate

961
00:50:37,480 --> 00:50:40,200
Speaker 1: you listening. My radio show is daily three to six Eastern,

962
00:50:40,239 --> 00:50:43,799
Speaker 1: twelve to three Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, Fox Sport

963
00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:47,040
Speaker 1: Tradio dot Com, the I Heart Radio Network in the meantime,

964
00:50:47,640 --> 00:50:50,600
Speaker 1: download subscribe rate, write one of those reviews. I was

965
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:52,879
Speaker 1: told it helps me do it. You can write Doug

966
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:56,120
Speaker 1: Gotlieb is amazing. That's awesome. Doug Gotlieb is the greatest.

967
00:50:56,239 --> 00:51:00,080
Speaker 1: That's also good. UM. I love Doug gotlie but these

968
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:03,560
Speaker 1: are all good reviews to write, and I appreciate that. UM.

969
00:51:03,800 --> 00:51:07,480
Speaker 1: Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukah, Happy New Year, Thanks for downloading

970
00:51:07,520 --> 00:51:11,480
Speaker 1: and listening. Waity here Part two. I'm Doug gotlie This

971
00:51:11,719 --> 00:51:12,160
Speaker 1: is all ball