WEBVTT - Bloomberg Businessweek Weekend - February 4th, 2022 0:00:01.040 --> 0:00:05.400 This is Bloomberg Business Week Inside from the reporters and 0:00:05.600 --> 0:00:09.200 editors who bring you America's most trusted business magazine, plus 0:00:09.240 --> 0:00:13.200 global business, finance and tech news as it happened. Bloomberg 0:00:13.240 --> 0:00:16.759 Business Week with Carol Messier and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim 0:00:16.800 --> 0:00:21.320 Stinevin on Bloomberg Radio. Hi, everyone, Welcome to the weekend 0:00:21.440 --> 0:00:24.639 edition of Bloomberg Business Week. Big tech earnings dominating the 0:00:24.680 --> 0:00:28.200 headlines this past week, as did the latest government jobs report, 0:00:28.440 --> 0:00:30.160 and we'll get a macro look at the state of 0:00:30.200 --> 0:00:33.080 the American worker with the chief operating officer of LinkedIn, 0:00:33.240 --> 0:00:36.000 Dan Shapiro. Also ahead, we'll hear about the small group 0:00:36.040 --> 0:00:38.640 of billionaires who are devouring the world while touting a 0:00:38.720 --> 0:00:42.000 more socially conscious form of capitalism. We get that from 0:00:42.080 --> 0:00:44.960 journalist Peter S. Goodman. He's global economics correspondent at The 0:00:44.960 --> 0:00:47.199 New York Times, also the author of the new book Davos. 0:00:47.240 --> 0:00:49.400 Man casts a harsh light on some of the most 0:00:49.400 --> 0:00:53.360 powerful people in the corporate world. Also speaking of journalists, 0:00:53.400 --> 0:00:56.640 an assault on Hong Kong's independent press, the fall of 0:00:56.680 --> 0:00:59.160 Apple Daily is the subject of our cover story. All 0:00:59.200 --> 0:01:00.880 of that to come first, It's welcome the editor of 0:01:00.880 --> 0:01:04.120 Bloomberg Business Week magazine, Joel Webber and Joel We're gonna 0:01:04.120 --> 0:01:05.920 go in depth on the cover story a bit later on, 0:01:05.959 --> 0:01:08.320 but first of all, tell us why Apple Daily was 0:01:08.400 --> 0:01:09.840 the big story for you this week had to be 0:01:09.880 --> 0:01:13.640 the cover. Well, it was a big event last year 0:01:13.640 --> 0:01:18.160 in Hong Kong, Um and Beijing. Basically, how to how 0:01:18.240 --> 0:01:23.880 to takedown effectively of this pro democy democracy newspaper that 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:29.360 is for years really been UM, a newspaper that was 0:01:29.440 --> 0:01:32.200 like the part of the fabric of Hong Kong, Um 0:01:32.319 --> 0:01:36.000 and Beijing. Basically went after the money, turned off the 0:01:36.360 --> 0:01:41.760 faucet and successfully basically silenced the newspaper that has had 0:01:42.200 --> 0:01:46.679 significant implications for Hong Kong. Already, the pro democracy movement 0:01:46.800 --> 0:01:50.640 had been a target once it lost UM, the newspaper 0:01:50.960 --> 0:01:55.400 Um Apple Daily, UM and Jimmy Lay. Obviously the tycoon 0:01:55.960 --> 0:01:59.560 Um behind the newspaper had already been jailed. It was 0:01:59.640 --> 0:02:03.480 It's become sort of this downward spiral for one of 0:02:03.520 --> 0:02:08.120 the world's financial capitals, So significant implications. Obviously, this all 0:02:08.200 --> 0:02:11.360 happened already UM. But the number of voices that Ian 0:02:11.400 --> 0:02:13.720 Marlowe the writer was able to bring into the story 0:02:14.080 --> 0:02:16.760 just made it feel like one of these definitive stories 0:02:16.840 --> 0:02:19.040 that we had to do it, and doing it basically 0:02:19.080 --> 0:02:21.480 here on the on the brink of the Winter Olympics. 0:02:21.520 --> 0:02:23.160 I thought it was another way of kind of talking 0:02:23.200 --> 0:02:26.320 about um China in a big way. We're gonna have 0:02:26.480 --> 0:02:28.639 much more a little later in the program when Ian 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:32.160 Marlow joins us Joel. Meanwhile, it's been a big week 0:02:32.240 --> 0:02:36.360 for tech earnings. Facebook just getting crushed after reporting. We 0:02:36.400 --> 0:02:39.800 also heard from Google parent Alphabet making out quite well 0:02:39.880 --> 0:02:42.640 once again, and yet in this week's Tech section, Nico 0:02:42.720 --> 0:02:44.880 Grant writes that the company has struggled to gain market 0:02:44.919 --> 0:02:47.480 share and one area of growing importance. We are, of 0:02:47.480 --> 0:02:51.840 course talking cloud computing services uh really controlled by Amazon 0:02:51.840 --> 0:02:55.120 and Microsoft at this point. So what's Alphabet doing about it? 0:02:55.360 --> 0:03:02.520 So I think the meta scene here had earnings in 0:03:02.560 --> 0:03:05.560 this uh it's future earnings could look like. I think 0:03:05.560 --> 0:03:08.360 there's this and we're gonna be talking about this a 0:03:08.480 --> 0:03:11.880 lot this year. Is growth versus value and and big 0:03:11.919 --> 0:03:15.240 tech obviously has always been in that growth game. And 0:03:15.639 --> 0:03:17.800 there's a big question that I think Wall Street is 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:21.040 opening up to, which is, you know, what are these 0:03:21.080 --> 0:03:24.320 big tech stocks? Are all of them still growth um 0:03:24.440 --> 0:03:29.480 and value. I think everyone's beginning to realize it could 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:33.000 be having a moment here, but yet there's still companies 0:03:33.040 --> 0:03:36.400 like the alphabets that are still potentially in a growth mode. 0:03:36.400 --> 0:03:39.400 And one of those things that I think Google Google's 0:03:39.400 --> 0:03:43.320 cloud operation is attempting to do here is actually recognized 0:03:43.360 --> 0:03:47.760 that they are a distant UH force actually in cloud 0:03:47.800 --> 0:03:53.240 computing AWS, Amazon is number one, followed by Microsoft, Ali 0:03:53.320 --> 0:03:56.000 Baba is actually bigger than Google, and part of that 0:03:56.080 --> 0:03:58.920 is just because of the way that Google has for 0:03:59.200 --> 0:04:03.640 years actually UH organized its infrastructure. It was always the 0:04:03.720 --> 0:04:08.120 servers were always intended to support Google's products, so things 0:04:08.160 --> 0:04:12.400 like Gmail, Google Photos, YouTube that it was the whole 0:04:12.400 --> 0:04:17.039 system was optimized to be first and form of servicing 0:04:17.080 --> 0:04:21.080 those products and not clients necessarily. So Google is actually 0:04:21.160 --> 0:04:24.480 quietly spent um the past two years to try and 0:04:24.600 --> 0:04:29.400 overhaul its infrastructure in an attempt to actually become more 0:04:29.400 --> 0:04:32.880 reliable for its clients. And as you'll probably recall, there 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:37.360 were some lot of reliability questions US in December, and 0:04:37.600 --> 0:04:40.279 Google hopes that it can make up some of that ground. 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:42.520 And now keep in mind, it has a lot of 0:04:42.600 --> 0:04:45.360 ground to make up. So the I think that it 0:04:45.400 --> 0:04:47.680 will be something that the street continues to watch. But 0:04:48.040 --> 0:04:51.520 Google or alphabet UM clearly was a company that the 0:04:51.600 --> 0:04:55.320 streets like UM compared to Meta. Yeah, and that's what's 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:58.839 fascinating because it talks about them putting out their strategies, 0:04:58.880 --> 0:05:02.320 as you said, Joel, becoming the most reliable cloud. It's 0:05:02.320 --> 0:05:04.440 hard to do that when you have problems, right, but 0:05:04.760 --> 0:05:07.760 everybody has problems, even the leaders. There are problems in 0:05:07.760 --> 0:05:09.240 the system. It's just kind of the nature of the 0:05:09.279 --> 0:05:11.839 business to some extent, that's right. And but you know, 0:05:11.880 --> 0:05:14.200 the question is can you attempt to control some of 0:05:14.200 --> 0:05:17.360 those variables UM, and they're you know, even Google has 0:05:17.360 --> 0:05:20.479 had problems with that in the past. UM. So it's 0:05:20.520 --> 0:05:23.560 the question though, is like this reliability message is not 0:05:23.760 --> 0:05:28.040 enough to make someone leave Aws or Microsoft in favor 0:05:28.120 --> 0:05:31.560 of of Google. And we'll have to watch UM. But 0:05:31.680 --> 0:05:33.919 you know, going from the seven or so percent of 0:05:33.960 --> 0:05:36.800 market shore they currently have, they have essentially a lot 0:05:36.800 --> 0:05:38.920 of upsets now when it comes to big tech, Joel. 0:05:38.960 --> 0:05:41.520 One person we watched closely is of course Cathy would 0:05:41.520 --> 0:05:44.360 have our investment management. She's been the subject of a 0:05:44.400 --> 0:05:47.479 Business Week cover story, one of the Bloomberg fifty because 0:05:47.480 --> 0:05:51.560 of her uber out performance in We should note more recently, though, 0:05:51.600 --> 0:05:54.480 a major struggle for her flagship our Innovation et F 0:05:54.720 --> 0:05:57.480 over the last year. So one was not a good year. 0:05:57.480 --> 0:05:59.680 It's not off to a good start in two. In 0:05:59.680 --> 0:06:01.840 the any in section this week, we learned that her 0:06:01.880 --> 0:06:05.640 investors they're actually holding firm for the most part. In 0:06:05.680 --> 0:06:08.520 this piece, Uh, it really talks about how there's never 0:06:08.560 --> 0:06:12.200 been somebody who's has the performance or under performance that 0:06:12.240 --> 0:06:16.760 Kathy would had in but investors have really stuck with her. Yeah, 0:06:17.000 --> 0:06:20.560 so there, this is a real curiosity. M Obviously she 0:06:20.880 --> 0:06:26.760 had an amazing m as the pandemic took hold those 0:06:26.800 --> 0:06:31.120 growth stocks that it is a hyper concentrated portfolio in 0:06:31.120 --> 0:06:35.520 in her flagship A r k K that et f UM. 0:06:35.760 --> 0:06:38.320 What happened since then is, you know what, what we're 0:06:38.360 --> 0:06:42.080 just talking about, those major growth stocks have begun to 0:06:42.640 --> 0:06:45.760 under port reform. That's Bloomberg Business Week editor Joe Webber 0:06:45.800 --> 0:06:48.000 with an overview of our issue well. Coming up next, 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:50.560 the CEO of Lincoln tells us why many of us 0:06:50.560 --> 0:06:52.560 will never look at work the same way again and 0:06:52.600 --> 0:06:54.920 why that could spell bad news for employers in one 0:06:54.960 --> 0:06:58.760 particular area. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week. This is Bloomberg. 0:07:08.200 --> 0:07:12.160 This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg 0:07:12.280 --> 0:07:17.160 Quick Takes. Tim Spinovik from Bloomberg Radio. I love this 0:07:17.200 --> 0:07:19.200 first line of a recent essay that was written by 0:07:19.200 --> 0:07:22.560 our next guest, and here's what he said. Is the 0:07:22.640 --> 0:07:26.440 year relationship with work change forever. Those words from our 0:07:26.480 --> 0:07:29.040 next guest. We're talking about Dan Shapiro. He's the chief 0:07:29.080 --> 0:07:32.880 operating officer over at LinkedIn, the world's largest professional networking platform, 0:07:32.960 --> 0:07:35.960 is seeing millions of users changing jobs and also an 0:07:35.960 --> 0:07:39.680 increasing number looking for new career paths entirely, and Lincoln 0:07:39.760 --> 0:07:42.400 expects that to continue. It's part of the trend that 0:07:42.520 --> 0:07:46.560 Dan calls the Great reshuffle. Right now, more people are 0:07:46.640 --> 0:07:48.880 reconsidering what they want to do in their jobs than 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:50.400 what they want to do with their careers at any 0:07:50.400 --> 0:07:52.600 time in recent memory. We run a survey at LinkedIn 0:07:53.080 --> 0:07:59.360 that suggested that of professionals in America in are going 0:07:59.400 --> 0:08:02.400 to rethink what they want to do. And what's interesting 0:08:02.560 --> 0:08:05.480 is that that is happening at a time when there's 0:08:05.560 --> 0:08:08.960 hasn't been a tighter labor market for professionals in recent memory. 0:08:09.200 --> 0:08:12.800 The economy is growing again. There's a massive imbalance in 0:08:12.880 --> 0:08:16.480 supply and demand for digital skills. And what that means 0:08:16.560 --> 0:08:19.240 is that as we come out of this pandemic period, 0:08:19.320 --> 0:08:23.440 as the world becomes more endemic and companies reconsider their 0:08:23.480 --> 0:08:26.320 policies for how they're going to work in this new world, 0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:29.440 that employees have a much stronger voice than they used 0:08:29.440 --> 0:08:31.880 to in this resetting the expectation. So it's gonna be 0:08:31.880 --> 0:08:34.320 a really interesting year. So I do wonder too, though, 0:08:34.360 --> 0:08:36.760 Damn Like, I feel like the pendulum can swing big 0:08:36.800 --> 0:08:39.720 time and workers do. It does feel like they are 0:08:39.720 --> 0:08:42.479 in the driver's seat right now, as so many employees 0:08:42.520 --> 0:08:46.719 pick your employee. They're all scrambling for workers, so employees 0:08:46.720 --> 0:08:49.880 in many ways can set their terms. Does that stick 0:08:50.480 --> 0:08:53.760 when the labor market corrects itself and a more normal 0:08:53.920 --> 0:08:57.640 labor market is back with us to do workers continue 0:08:57.679 --> 0:09:00.760 to have that leverage and that power. Only time will tell, 0:09:00.800 --> 0:09:03.800 But I think there's reason to believe that digital skills 0:09:03.840 --> 0:09:07.120 in particular are going to remain very tight for the 0:09:07.160 --> 0:09:09.640 foreseeable future. If you look at what's happened over the 0:09:09.679 --> 0:09:13.040 last few years, we were already on this journey around 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:16.479 companies going through this idea of digital transformation, really digitizing 0:09:16.520 --> 0:09:19.480 their businesses, and the pandemic only accelerated that. If you 0:09:19.520 --> 0:09:22.680 think about the expectations consumers have now about what they 0:09:22.720 --> 0:09:25.800 expect when they interact with a restaurant or a retailer, 0:09:26.040 --> 0:09:29.240 it is a much more digital experience, and that's placing 0:09:29.240 --> 0:09:32.080 more and more burdens operationally on the companies that need 0:09:32.160 --> 0:09:36.080 digital talent to make those things real. So that is 0:09:36.200 --> 0:09:39.960 likely to continue for quite some time, and that will 0:09:40.040 --> 0:09:43.400 likely drive some of the policies and practices that many 0:09:43.400 --> 0:09:45.480 companies adopt. So I think that there's some real staying 0:09:45.520 --> 0:09:48.480 power here. What about for elements of this that that 0:09:48.600 --> 0:09:52.079 don't stay do we? You know, we're already seeing companies 0:09:52.440 --> 0:09:54.880 call their workers back to work right now. But we're 0:09:54.880 --> 0:09:56.840 seeing some shifts. You know, Carol and I talked about 0:09:56.840 --> 0:10:00.400 Apollo for for for private equity employees offering that one 0:10:00.440 --> 0:10:02.760 month of remote work. That's something that Carol, I mean, 0:10:02.800 --> 0:10:05.160 you've covered this stuff forever. That's that was unthinkable a 0:10:05.160 --> 0:10:08.040 few years ago, right, Yeah, exactly. It's really fascinating to see, 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:11.120 like even the financial firms have been pushing back saying, okay, 0:10:11.200 --> 0:10:13.160 you can work from home, So Dan, where where are 0:10:13.200 --> 0:10:15.480 the things that go back to what they were where 0:10:15.520 --> 0:10:17.520 they were before? What are the changes that don't stick? 0:10:18.559 --> 0:10:20.960 I wish I had a crystal ball. I think that 0:10:21.040 --> 0:10:24.360 the thing that is most resonant with employees right now 0:10:24.440 --> 0:10:28.040 is this concept of flexibility. UH. People are happier, They 0:10:28.040 --> 0:10:31.079 report being happier when their jobs are more flexible. You 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:35.040 see that looking at remote jobs, UH is something that 0:10:35.120 --> 0:10:36.640 if you look at all the jobs on LinkedIn and 0:10:36.679 --> 0:10:39.400 how many people were viewing different kinds of jobs. Just 0:10:39.440 --> 0:10:41.120 a few years ago, less than ten percent of the 0:10:41.240 --> 0:10:44.160 jobs were remote eligible that people looked at. That number 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:48.920 is now all the job viewing is people curious about 0:10:48.920 --> 0:10:51.520 remote roles. And so I think that the idea of 0:10:51.520 --> 0:10:55.800 flexibility is something that has staying power. Exactly where the 0:10:55.800 --> 0:10:58.560 lines are drawn about what kind of flexibility works such 0:10:58.640 --> 0:11:01.400 that businesses can need their needs and the teams can 0:11:01.400 --> 0:11:03.680 be functioning. I think that's going to be some where 0:11:03.679 --> 0:11:06.240 everyone's watching everyone in time will tell you know. I 0:11:06.320 --> 0:11:09.320 recently UM caught up at the CEO of Cisco and 0:11:09.400 --> 0:11:13.080 Chuck Robbins and even he conceded and a company like Cisco, 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:16.160 they have been doing hybrid work, you know for years 0:11:16.200 --> 0:11:18.640 pre pandemic. That's just the way many of the tech 0:11:18.679 --> 0:11:23.040 industry have been working. But even he acknowledged um being 0:11:23.320 --> 0:11:27.400 a little surprised at how innovative everybody really could be 0:11:27.480 --> 0:11:30.760 during the pandemic. Technology has made that much more possible. 0:11:30.760 --> 0:11:32.640 Like I think about, you know, as much as we 0:11:32.760 --> 0:11:34.720 make fun of all the zoom calls and things, you 0:11:34.800 --> 0:11:37.640 really can almost feel like you're with people. Yeah, I 0:11:37.679 --> 0:11:40.400 think we're going to see a tremendous amount of technological 0:11:40.440 --> 0:11:43.800 innovation in this space. Every leader has likely gone through 0:11:43.840 --> 0:11:46.800 a journey of being skeptical about how teams would operate 0:11:46.840 --> 0:11:49.599 when they were from home or in a hybrid capacity, 0:11:49.640 --> 0:11:51.600 and things have worked in a lot of ways better 0:11:51.600 --> 0:11:54.319 than expected. And that is coming at a time when 0:11:54.320 --> 0:11:57.440 there's more investment from software companies and trying to make 0:11:57.520 --> 0:12:01.000 this better for people. So those things come together. I think. 0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:03.439 I think there's a lot of optimism. Least I hold 0:12:03.520 --> 0:12:06.400 that these working styles will be effective, But exactly where 0:12:06.400 --> 0:12:08.200 we land, I think it's going to be something we'll 0:12:08.240 --> 0:12:11.240 have to see. Do you think, Dan, honestly, anything is 0:12:11.280 --> 0:12:14.360 lost without being in person with one another, because I 0:12:14.400 --> 0:12:17.440 do what I can. What I can say is that 0:12:17.920 --> 0:12:21.160 we have on occasion at LinkedIn had opportunities in a 0:12:21.240 --> 0:12:24.960 way that was safe and in compliance with health guidelines. 0:12:25.040 --> 0:12:27.480 We've had opportunities for some teams to spend time together 0:12:27.520 --> 0:12:31.040 in person, and it is like a spark of energy. 0:12:31.160 --> 0:12:34.760 It is a breath of share. People love having those moments. Now, 0:12:35.240 --> 0:12:38.199 whether that becomes people something people do more periodically as 0:12:38.200 --> 0:12:41.440 opposed to every day, it's interesting, Um, but I think 0:12:41.480 --> 0:12:44.960 you will continue to see the power of being together 0:12:45.160 --> 0:12:47.800 and creating connection as being really fundamental to how great 0:12:47.800 --> 0:12:50.480 teams work. Dan eager to talk to you about this 0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:53.079 story that we highlighted a little earlier in our broadcast 0:12:53.080 --> 0:12:56.320 about New York City requiring employers to list the minimum 0:12:56.400 --> 0:12:59.720 and maximum salaries on job postings. That's going to start 0:12:59.720 --> 0:13:02.400 this bring. According to the Wall Street Journal, it's getting 0:13:02.400 --> 0:13:04.680 some opposition from business groups. Can you talk a little 0:13:04.679 --> 0:13:09.600 bit about the way that being transparent with these positions 0:13:09.600 --> 0:13:13.040 when it comes to salary can empower workers? Absolutely well, 0:13:13.040 --> 0:13:16.040 it's a broad trend. Um. The trend towards salary transparency 0:13:16.080 --> 0:13:18.000 has been happening for years, and I think one of 0:13:18.040 --> 0:13:21.280 the guiding principles behind it is that there's evidence to 0:13:21.360 --> 0:13:24.800 suggest that it helps remove bias in the process um. 0:13:24.920 --> 0:13:30.760 Some people of different backgrounds negotiate differently, and oftentimes the 0:13:30.800 --> 0:13:34.000 transparency that you can bring to the conversation yields outcomes 0:13:34.120 --> 0:13:37.040 where there is less bias in terms of pay um. 0:13:37.040 --> 0:13:38.319 And so I think that's one of these is driving it, 0:13:38.360 --> 0:13:40.959 and it's it's something that we think it's a positive. 0:13:41.200 --> 0:13:44.600 Are you seeing more companies post on linked in those 0:13:44.600 --> 0:13:47.000 salary ranges for jobs that are being offered, Like, do 0:13:47.040 --> 0:13:48.599 you have any data that that that shows that the 0:13:48.600 --> 0:13:50.760 trend is happening on LinkedIn too? I don't have any 0:13:50.800 --> 0:13:52.680 data myself right now, but I know it's a broad 0:13:52.679 --> 0:13:54.560 trend that's going on in the industry. Was the other 0:13:54.559 --> 0:13:56.960 thing that's going on is obviously we're an increasingly inflationary 0:13:57.040 --> 0:14:00.199 environment and companies are trying to figure out how that's 0:14:00.240 --> 0:14:03.880 going to play out in their in their compensation packages, 0:14:03.920 --> 0:14:07.040 and particularly as it's a tight labor market, workers are 0:14:07.080 --> 0:14:10.040 asking questions around how does that what does that mean 0:14:10.040 --> 0:14:14.240 for my pay? And similarly, companies are grappling with as 0:14:14.240 --> 0:14:17.640 employees are working in different locations in the same job, 0:14:18.200 --> 0:14:20.640 how do they reconcile whether they pay different amounts in 0:14:20.680 --> 0:14:23.520 different cities for similar work. So what we're going to 0:14:23.600 --> 0:14:26.600 find as we enter in the two is a world 0:14:26.640 --> 0:14:29.640 where executive teams are gonna have to think through pay 0:14:29.720 --> 0:14:32.280 policies um as one of the core questions that they 0:14:32.320 --> 0:14:36.040 asked themselves. That was Dan Shapiro, chief operating officer at LinkedIn. 0:14:36.280 --> 0:14:38.960 Still ahead on Bloomberg Business Week. It's been an uphill 0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:42.160 climb for the cannabis industry. Is regulatory easing has been 0:14:42.640 --> 0:14:45.120 really slow to him to materialize? Why the head of 0:14:45.200 --> 0:14:48.360 publicly traded truly is optimistic that better days are ahead. 0:14:48.560 --> 0:14:51.040 We'll speak with the CEO, Kim Rivers on the other side. 0:14:51.320 --> 0:15:00.720 This is Bloomberg Broadcasting from the Financial cap Love the World, 0:15:00.800 --> 0:15:04.000 Bloomberg He Love the Frio in New York to Washington, 0:15:04.080 --> 0:15:08.160 d C. Bloomberg to Boston, Bloomberg one oh six one 0:15:08.280 --> 0:15:11.720 to San Francisco, Bloomberg nine sixty to the country Sirius 0:15:11.880 --> 0:15:14.480 XM Chado one nine team, and around the globe the 0:15:14.520 --> 0:15:18.800 Bloomberg Business app and Bloomberg Radio dot Com. This is 0:15:18.880 --> 0:15:22.960 Bloomberg Business Week. So this past week you might have 0:15:23.000 --> 0:15:25.840 noticed our Bloomberg team put out a story. It was 0:15:25.960 --> 0:15:28.240 about how last year was a rough one for the 0:15:28.240 --> 0:15:33.360 cannabis industry. It definitely had high hopes initially pinned I 0:15:33.480 --> 0:15:36.800 hope so initially pinned on the incoming Biden administration to 0:15:36.800 --> 0:15:39.640 start one right, that was really kind of the mood. 0:15:40.040 --> 0:15:44.680 But then tim it moved to an atmosphere where we 0:15:44.760 --> 0:15:48.520 had a lot of gridlock. And then those cannabis companies, 0:15:48.560 --> 0:15:51.200 certainly the publicly held ones, we saw an extended decline 0:15:51.240 --> 0:15:54.360 in their stock prices. Progress on the regulatory front it's 0:15:54.440 --> 0:15:56.880 essential for the industry's fortunes to shift. That's according to 0:15:56.880 --> 0:15:59.920 our colleagues at Bloomberg Intelligence, and Kim Rivers thinks that's 0:16:00.000 --> 0:16:02.360 still on the horizon. Kim you've heard of before on 0:16:02.360 --> 0:16:04.720 our air. She's the chairman and CEO of Quincy, Florida 0:16:04.760 --> 0:16:07.280 bas True Leave Cannabis. The public company is more than 0:16:07.320 --> 0:16:10.280 a hundred and sixties stores nationwide, a market value of 0:16:10.320 --> 0:16:13.640 about three point nine billion dollars. Truly have acquired Harvest 0:16:13.680 --> 0:16:15.520 for two point one billion dollars. That was a few 0:16:15.560 --> 0:16:17.960 months ago, back in October. That made it the largest 0:16:18.000 --> 0:16:21.520 cannabis operator in the space. Here's the question, though, what 0:16:21.600 --> 0:16:23.800 will it take for the pot company to fully realize 0:16:23.800 --> 0:16:26.480 the benefits of that distinction? What I would say is 0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:29.600 that there are lots of reasons for continued optimism across 0:16:29.640 --> 0:16:33.120 the cannabis landscape. UM. Certainly, as we've talked about previously, 0:16:33.200 --> 0:16:36.320 there was a lot of high hopes for federal change 0:16:36.840 --> 0:16:40.280 much earlier with a Democratic control of Congress. However, we 0:16:40.400 --> 0:16:43.760 do have a continued champion in Congressman prol Letter, and 0:16:43.800 --> 0:16:47.160 it was recently announced that he was successful and getting 0:16:47.200 --> 0:16:51.320 safe banking attached to the compete facts. And so we're 0:16:51.360 --> 0:16:54.520 not we're not giving up hope yet, UM with respect 0:16:54.560 --> 0:16:56.520 to safe thanking, which we think makes a ton of 0:16:56.560 --> 0:16:59.160 sense and has been championed not only by the cannabis 0:16:59.200 --> 0:17:03.040 industry but also by banking UH folks on the hill 0:17:03.080 --> 0:17:05.800 as well, UM and and again seems to be continued 0:17:05.880 --> 0:17:08.680 to garner significant support and would certainly make a lot 0:17:08.720 --> 0:17:11.600 of sense UM for this Congress to go ahead and 0:17:11.600 --> 0:17:14.080 pass prior to the terms. That being said, though, as 0:17:14.119 --> 0:17:17.880 we've also talked about before, business still remains strong. We 0:17:17.960 --> 0:17:21.560 actually just truly just closed a second round of debt 0:17:21.760 --> 0:17:25.359 um seventy five million last week, bringing our most recent 0:17:25.440 --> 0:17:29.520 race total to four million. It was oversubscribed and at 0:17:29.560 --> 0:17:32.719 industry leading rates, we're seeing debt rates continue to come 0:17:32.760 --> 0:17:34.960 down for the industry. And so you know what we 0:17:35.000 --> 0:17:37.120 what we see in the stock market is a continued 0:17:37.160 --> 0:17:41.200 separation between fundamentals and where the market is UM and 0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:43.040 and we think that that's going to close here over 0:17:43.080 --> 0:17:45.679 the next little while. And and again fundamentals are strong 0:17:45.800 --> 0:17:49.680 and UM folks are are continuing to uh to show 0:17:49.840 --> 0:17:53.240 strong demand across the US. All right, so can we 0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:56.359 be as bold or so bold to say in terms 0:17:56.359 --> 0:17:58.919 of regulatory Um, what you guys have all been waiting 0:17:58.960 --> 0:18:01.240 for for some kind of co usion on a federal level, 0:18:01.480 --> 0:18:04.480 are we likely to get it? Can this year? And 0:18:04.520 --> 0:18:06.000 if we don't get it, and if we don't get 0:18:06.040 --> 0:18:08.240 it this year, and if we don't get it this year, 0:18:08.359 --> 0:18:11.600 is it tricky because then we're dealing with a whole 0:18:11.600 --> 0:18:15.640 other election cycle, are counting down to another big election cycle. Yeah, 0:18:15.720 --> 0:18:18.080 you know what's what's interesting about that? And so you know, 0:18:18.119 --> 0:18:20.199 I can't have a prediction. UM. I do think that 0:18:20.359 --> 0:18:22.560 incremental change is the more likely path. And I do 0:18:22.600 --> 0:18:24.320 think that safe thinking this is a very logical and 0:18:24.400 --> 0:18:27.240 rational first step. Uh. So that's why you hear me, 0:18:27.400 --> 0:18:29.880 you know, continue to talk about safe banking. I'm very 0:18:30.200 --> 0:18:32.639 hopeful that we potentially it could be SAE bankings plus 0:18:32.720 --> 0:18:35.960 meaning spate banking plus some sort of criminal justice UM, 0:18:36.000 --> 0:18:39.920 and or other social equity reforms to go along with it. UM. 0:18:39.960 --> 0:18:41.879 I do think that obviously, if it doesn't happen by 0:18:41.880 --> 0:18:45.000 the mid terms, we may see a shift, and UM, 0:18:45.040 --> 0:18:47.560 you know, obviously there's always a reset after that. However, 0:18:47.640 --> 0:18:50.920 what I can say is that with Congresswoman maces Uh 0:18:50.960 --> 0:18:53.919 comprehensive reform bill dealing with cannabis, and as you know, 0:18:54.000 --> 0:18:56.440 she's a Republican out of South Carolina, UM, this is 0:18:56.520 --> 0:18:59.560 becoming over time less and less partisan. As of course 0:18:59.560 --> 0:19:02.159 we've seen or more states come on board. UM. We 0:19:02.240 --> 0:19:04.960 have a number of Southern states, UM, that are actually 0:19:05.000 --> 0:19:08.600 implementing medical programs here for the next six to twenty 0:19:08.600 --> 0:19:11.119 four months, and so it becomes, you know, less and 0:19:11.240 --> 0:19:13.000 less a partisan issue. I think would become more and 0:19:13.040 --> 0:19:15.240 more likely that kind of regardless of which party is 0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:18.520 in control on the hill. UM, it sort of becomes 0:19:18.520 --> 0:19:21.600 again not only an if, but just to win. Well, 0:19:21.640 --> 0:19:23.080 I want to talk more about that. And I think 0:19:23.080 --> 0:19:25.159 I've shared this story before, Carol, but when I was 0:19:25.200 --> 0:19:29.520 in graduate school just two thousand and sixteen, a friend 0:19:29.520 --> 0:19:32.600 of mine wanted to start a cannabis entrepreneurship club and 0:19:32.640 --> 0:19:35.400 this was business school and he couldn't do it. It 0:19:35.440 --> 0:19:38.000 was he was facing pushback from the administration. He had 0:19:38.040 --> 0:19:40.640 to go around and get signatures. And I'm wondering, Kim, 0:19:40.760 --> 0:19:43.040 how much has changed in just a few short years. 0:19:43.040 --> 0:19:45.960 If we're thinking that's just five years ago, six years ago. Um, 0:19:46.000 --> 0:19:49.360 how is the perception a public perception around cannabis changed. Oh, 0:19:49.440 --> 0:19:51.520 it's it's changing daily. I was just forward in an 0:19:51.600 --> 0:19:53.919 article this morning that the NFL has just announced a 0:19:53.920 --> 0:19:57.280 million dollar donation for research at that was resparked to 0:19:57.280 --> 0:20:01.119 cannabis for as alternate therapy stree mentum having to do 0:20:01.160 --> 0:20:04.280 primarily with concussions um in the NFL. So I mean 0:20:04.320 --> 0:20:07.280 think back to, you know again that same time period 0:20:07.280 --> 0:20:10.760 you just mentioned, we're literally players, um, you know, significant 0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:13.600 players were being banned from the NFL because of failed 0:20:13.640 --> 0:20:16.879 drug casts involving cannabis. That's Kim Rivers. She's chairman and 0:20:16.920 --> 0:20:19.800 CEO of True Leaf Cannabis. Yeah, I guess the expectations 0:20:19.840 --> 0:20:23.680 certainly shifted in the Biden administration obviously has its hands 0:20:23.680 --> 0:20:27.840 full and had its hands full, but clear regulatory framework 0:20:27.880 --> 0:20:30.280 is really important, especially on a federal level, for these companies, 0:20:30.320 --> 0:20:32.840 because it's really difficult for them to do business. I mean, 0:20:32.840 --> 0:20:34.560 look at what banks. Banks don't want to touch this 0:20:34.600 --> 0:20:37.800 stuff exactly, and this has been the main issue, I 0:20:37.800 --> 0:20:39.800 feel like Tim from the get go, when we started 0:20:39.800 --> 0:20:42.440 really focusing on this whole sector. You're listening to Bloomberg 0:20:42.440 --> 0:20:45.600 Business Week. Coming up next, The Rise of davos Man. 0:20:45.920 --> 0:20:48.560 It's a thing apparently, how a small group of billionaire 0:20:48.560 --> 0:20:52.119 executives came to reap untold power and use the pandemic 0:20:52.160 --> 0:20:55.880 to further perpetuate economic inequality across the globe. At least, 0:20:55.920 --> 0:21:08.320 so says our next guest. This is Bloomberg. You're listening 0:21:08.359 --> 0:21:12.120 to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick 0:21:12.160 --> 0:21:16.840 takes Tim Stinovik from Bloomberg Radio. In his new book, 0:21:16.880 --> 0:21:20.240 journalist Peter S. Goodman writes about davos Man. It's a 0:21:20.359 --> 0:21:23.720 term coined by the late political scientist Samuel Huntington's. It 0:21:23.800 --> 0:21:26.040 refers to a group of very well known individuals in 0:21:26.040 --> 0:21:28.600 the business and broader world. We talk about him a lot. Yeah, 0:21:28.640 --> 0:21:31.080 They're known to attend the World Economic Forums annual meeting 0:21:31.080 --> 0:21:34.480