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Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, are you ready's about to hit the fan?

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Speaker 2: Welcome to on sanctioned Thursdays, a wrestling with Ready.

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Speaker 3: What's up everybody?

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Speaker 1: Good day to you, and welcome the unsanctioned Thursdays, the

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Speaker 1: show that you guys demanded because our other show's too

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Speaker 1: short and has too many commercials.

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Speaker 3: So here you go. You get a little extra talk

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Speaker 3: wrestling talk this week.

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Speaker 1: And we have a guest that I haven't spoken to

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Speaker 1: in I don't know how many years, but it's been

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Speaker 1: over a decade. And the last time we spoke, we

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Speaker 1: were in a car driving in between cities at like

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Speaker 1: two am, and there was another writer in the car

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Speaker 1: as well, a really good dude, and I haven't seen

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Speaker 1: him in forever, but he has worked in WWE Creative,

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Speaker 1: started as a writer's assistant, moved all the way up

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Speaker 1: to senior writer. That's like how sushi chefs have to

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Speaker 1: do it, man, They start in the kitchen before and

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Speaker 1: they work all the way up from busser to waiter

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Speaker 1: to sue chef to chef.

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Speaker 3: That's how he did it.

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Speaker 1: And because of that, here in a lot of respect

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Speaker 1: from guys like Bray fucking Wyatt he's known him ever since.

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Speaker 3: He was husky.

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Speaker 1: Harris worked with him, helped create the Firefly Funhouse and

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Speaker 1: the Fiend character with Wyndham. Wyndham was an amazing human being.

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Speaker 1: We both knew him very well. You knew him much

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Speaker 1: better than I did. And with us is Nick Manfredini.

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Speaker 1: And how are you, sir. It's great to see you again.

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Speaker 1: You're looking good.

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Speaker 2: I look my age. I feel like I aged twenty

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Speaker 2: years working at WWE, but I.

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Speaker 1: Still we both have we both have some gray in

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Speaker 1: our beard, but that's okay.

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Speaker 2: A little bit, a little bit.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I got a little more than you.

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Speaker 2: Twenty eleven last last time we spoke. Wow.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, he's been for it. Yeah, that's been forever. It was. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I think we were on a Pacific Northwest trip. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I think we're going from like Portland to Seattle or

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Speaker 1: something like that. Yeah, something like that, something like that.

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Speaker 1: And we had a lovely gentleman in the car with

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Speaker 1: his name Angelo Fazio, who was another writer there that

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Speaker 1: I liked very much, Lofa as we called him. He

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Speaker 1: joined the same day I did and stayed much much longer,

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Speaker 1: and he was the one who introduced.

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Speaker 3: Me to you.

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Speaker 1: So let's just get started on one of my favorite topics,

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Speaker 1: which is Wyndham and Bray and the magic that you

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Speaker 1: guys got to create, and then from there we'll just

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Speaker 1: kind of see where the conversation goes. And then I

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Speaker 1: want to talk to you about a little bit of

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Speaker 1: wrestling news that happened in the last week and get

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Speaker 1: your take on that too. But Wyndom to me, was

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Speaker 1: the last attraction in wrestling as far as people that

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Speaker 1: were like almost a circus attraction that you had to

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Speaker 1: see because there was a little bit of mystique in

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Speaker 1: magic to it. Guys like the Undertaker, guys like Caine,

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Speaker 1: all these like mystical characters, and Bray was sort of

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Speaker 1: the modern day version of that. You guys got to

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Speaker 1: take big time swings in working to get this character

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Speaker 1: over things that hadn't been done really in wrestling, or

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Speaker 1: at least not to that level and not executed at

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Speaker 1: that level. What was it like just trying to get

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Speaker 1: this character through past the past.

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Speaker 3: The heads of the company and on the television.

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Speaker 2: Well, he just kind of touched on it like we

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Speaker 2: always wanted to do something that's never been done before,

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Speaker 2: and you know, in wrestling everything's been done right, you know,

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Speaker 2: some form of fashion. So we were trying really hard

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Speaker 2: to just come up with a character that's unique, that's different,

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Speaker 2: you know that and who them would always say, he

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Speaker 2: wants to do something to elevate wrestling, so more than

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Speaker 2: just you know, a promo a match. He wanted to

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Speaker 2: be this larger than life character. So we met when

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Speaker 2: he was Husky Harris an XT. We just became friends.

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Speaker 2: You know, he had horror movie t shirts on talking

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Speaker 2: to him.

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Speaker 3: MVP was his senior was MVP was his mentor for

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Speaker 3: Husky Harris. I remember that. Go ahead, so sorry for

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Speaker 3: interrupting you.

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Speaker 2: So he's you know, he wears horror movie t shirts.

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Speaker 2: I'm a big horror movie guy. We started talking, became friends.

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Speaker 2: Remember I burned him a copy of Lords a Salem,

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Speaker 2: a rob zombie movie.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: We would always talk about House of a Thousand Corpses,

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Speaker 2: that terrible movie that we both hated. So we became friends.

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Speaker 2: You know, he went back down to n XT, kept

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Speaker 2: in contact, you know, texted back and forth. You know,

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Speaker 2: he's like, I'm working on this new thing. This is

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Speaker 2: the wife early Wyatt family. And he sent me one

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Speaker 2: of the promos and I was just like blown away.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't believe what he had done. How he was

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Speaker 2: able to channel all these different inspirations from horror movies,

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Speaker 2: from different characters that he liked growing up, and all

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Speaker 2: these different things put this into Bray Wyat and he

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Speaker 2: just kind of became that character.

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Speaker 3: It was.

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Speaker 2: It was crazy. And then once, you know, I kind

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Speaker 2: of I really wanted to work with him, so I

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Speaker 2: was like, let me get ahead of this, let me

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Speaker 2: start writing stuff for him, coming up with some ideas.

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Speaker 2: So I ended up writing the original like Wyatt Family

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Speaker 2: vignettes right before they debuted, and we kind of we

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Speaker 2: worked together ever since that was basically outstarted.

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Speaker 1: Did you meet any resistance when you were trying to

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Speaker 1: get these guys on TV? And how did you sort

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Speaker 1: of circumnavigate that if you did?

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Speaker 3: Uh?

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Speaker 2: For the Why Family, not really, they were receptive that

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Speaker 2: everybody kind of saw the act. They liked it. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I think everybody was, you know, they knew, you know,

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Speaker 2: how could you not realize this guy was special? It

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Speaker 2: was so obvious. But just watching anything he did, anytime

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Speaker 2: he opened his mouth, so it wasn't like there was

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Speaker 2: any you know, resistance to get him on TV back then.

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Speaker 2: You know, once he got on TV, once he became successful,

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Speaker 2: that's when everybody started getting involved, you know, changing things up.

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Speaker 2: So certain things went ways we didn't plan mm hmmm.

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Speaker 2: From a character standpoint, it got a little supernatural, a

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Speaker 2: little too much supernatural, too supernatural.

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Speaker 1: Well go a little deeper on that if you if

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Speaker 1: you could what what what would you describe as as

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Speaker 1: the Wya stuff that you preferred and the Wye stuff

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Speaker 1: that you didn't prefer.

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Speaker 2: So he was very Charles Manson inspired, right, So we

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Speaker 2: would always watch my YouTube Seurchurchory back then was just

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Speaker 2: Charles Manson and cult for anybody you know, looked it up.

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Speaker 2: So I've probably seen every Charles Manson quote, every video,

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Speaker 2: every promo have you ever cut? You know, we were

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Speaker 2: trying to take little pieces from each one, and that

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Speaker 2: was the style we wanted to go for. To get

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Speaker 2: off topic, Charles Manson, I don't know if this story

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Speaker 2: has ever been told. Wyndham's teammate, former teammate in college football,

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Speaker 2: became a prison guard at Charles Manson's prison. Allegedly, this

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Speaker 2: guy showed Manson the Bray Wyatt promos and he wanted

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Speaker 2: to meet him man, and.

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Speaker 3: This was the whole thing.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, it is one hundred per cent true. And

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Speaker 2: uh so Mike Rotunda knew about it, and I think

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Speaker 2: he brought it up to somebody maybe I don't know

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Speaker 2: if it was Hunter or Vince or someone, and they immediately,

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Speaker 2: you know, squashed it obviously because they were like, who

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Speaker 2: shoot a network special?

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Speaker 3: Oh my god, Manson Bray meets Charles miss.

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Speaker 2: It was immediately squashed. And then afterwards I was like, Dad,

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Speaker 2: let's let's just go, like next time we're in northern California,

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Speaker 2: me and you, you know, just put on a hat

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Speaker 2: or something. Nobody will uh will know it to you.

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Speaker 2: Let's just go meet him, you know.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I thought more about it, and obviously it was

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Speaker 2: a terrible, terrible idea. Would have been a good story,

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Speaker 2: but a bad idea.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. He Uh.

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Speaker 1: Sean Penn had an it, had an experience with him.

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Speaker 1: He went to jail for something and was in jail

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Speaker 1: in the same prison as Charles Manson, and Manson was like, yo,

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Speaker 1: I'm a big fan. Wrote him a letter. It was like,

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Speaker 1: I'm a big fan. I'd love to talk to you.

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Speaker 1: And Shohn Penn was like, yo, fuck that I'm not

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Speaker 1: trying to talk to you.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, man, it's a yeah, I think. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: It was like, woah, man, this would be so fun,

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Speaker 2: you know, weird to do. But yeah, you know, obviously

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Speaker 2: bray Wyatt proably would have never seen TV again if

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Speaker 2: we did that.

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Speaker 1: He was willing to take huge chances and big time swings.

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Speaker 1: And you know, I always compare it to like this

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Speaker 1: will sound weird because the opposite of horror, but like

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Speaker 1: Jim Carrey, right, like Jim Carrey's level of commitment to

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Speaker 1: his comedy, to that character.

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Speaker 3: And let's say Liar Liar.

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Speaker 1: Where he can't tell a lie and he can only

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Speaker 1: tell the truth and he's trying to say that the

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Speaker 1: pen is red even though the pen's blue and he

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Speaker 1: can't and his body goes crazy and it's all this stuff.

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Speaker 1: If he doesn't commit one hundred percent to that, it's

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Speaker 1: corny and goofy and shitty and we're going, oh god,

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Speaker 1: when is this scene over? But his level of commitment

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Speaker 1: is such that you're like, yeah, man, like the pen

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Speaker 1: is blue. When he goes crazy, the crowd goes nuts.

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Speaker 1: Bray was able to do things with puppet shows, bro

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Speaker 1: that shouldn't have worked, and he somehow made it work.

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Speaker 1: I mean I remember watching that and going like, this

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Speaker 1: is like watching the fucking Muppets on acid right now,

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Speaker 1: and it shouldn't. I shouldn't be responding to any of this.

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Speaker 1: And because it's Bray and his level of commitment was

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Speaker 1: so high.

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Speaker 3: That I'm I'm like, yeah, dude, the fucking pen is blue. Like,

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Speaker 3: somehow it just worked. Dude?

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Speaker 1: Did you Was that more when the company got a

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Speaker 1: hold of it, or was that something that you guys

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Speaker 1: the Funhouse? Was that something that you guys created as well?

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Speaker 1: And if so, how the fuck did you make it work?

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Speaker 2: So I will say this, the Ray White character, the

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Speaker 2: original one, the Firefly, Funhouse Fiend, that was not a

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Speaker 2: WWE product. That was me and Wyndham and then Jason Baker,

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Speaker 2: you know, the brilliant artists we worked with for the

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Speaker 2: Funhouse stuff. He created the mask and the puppets and

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Speaker 2: all that stuff.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so.

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Speaker 2: It was not a hey, do this, this came from creative,

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Speaker 2: This came from whatever. For the Fiend and Funhouse. I

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Speaker 2: tried to keep everything as secret as possible. I didn't

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Speaker 2: want anybody getting involved tweaking it. We just kind of

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Speaker 2: did it on our own, came up with this idea,

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Speaker 2: pitched it, you know, getting it past Vince was a

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Speaker 2: little tricky. Uh So that was a fun experience having

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Speaker 2: to go over the original vignettes with him and having him,

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Speaker 2: you know, read through it and what the sociopath you know,

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Speaker 2: he's going through the vignettes. Yeah, he loved the puppets though.

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Speaker 2: He loved the idea of the puppets. I remember the

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Speaker 2: first time you read them, he just goes, well, why

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Speaker 2: is he not wearing the mask the entire time? I

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Speaker 2: was like, fuck, Like that's the whole the whole point

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Speaker 2: is like that, you know, the dark side and the

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Speaker 2: light side of these two of his character, So that

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Speaker 2: that would have obviously squashed the whole thing.

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Speaker 3: Yeah right, I.

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Speaker 2: Forget what happened, you know, uh what I had to

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Speaker 2: you know, how I explained it to him, But it

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Speaker 2: might have just been he wanted me out of the office,

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Speaker 2: and he's like he was just confused and just get

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Speaker 2: out because there there's you know, if you push back

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Speaker 2: too hard with him, he's just gonna double down and

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Speaker 2: you know, make it his. So you have to be

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Speaker 2: very careful how it was pitched. And I think I

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Speaker 2: handled it well and we were able. He was just like,

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Speaker 2: just go do it, and we got it. That's all

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Speaker 2: I needed. I didn't need anything else. I was like,

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Speaker 2: just go do it. So that's how we got the

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Speaker 2: the go ahead to shoot the vignettes. As far as

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Speaker 2: the character itself, the true story behind Funhouse was so

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Speaker 2: we had the fiend idea or not. We had an

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Speaker 2: idea that he had the idea that he wanted to

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Speaker 2: wear a mask, right, he wanted to be a monster,

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Speaker 2: become a monster, and that was kind of it. That

240
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Speaker 2: was all we had. It was just he wants to

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Speaker 2: be wear a mask, become a monster. But monsters don't

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Speaker 2: cut promos, and we obviously can't lose promos from Bray Wyatt.

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Speaker 2: That's as you know, bread and butter. So we had

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Speaker 2: to come up with away a unique way for him

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Speaker 2: to call promos. And it was always what's never been

246
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Speaker 2: done before, what's never been done before. That was always,

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Speaker 2: you know, in the back of both of our heads,

248
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Speaker 2: and you know, and you were right, there's in wrestling again,

249
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Speaker 2: everything's been done, you know in some way. So it's tricky.

250
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Speaker 2: It took us a little while, but the truth thing,

251
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Speaker 2: the true story behind the Funhouse was. I was drunk

252
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Speaker 2: watching the Mister Rogers documentary Won't Where's It Going? Won't

253
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Speaker 2: You Be My Number? The documentary that came out. So

254
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Speaker 2: I'm watching that and I'm like, shit, like what if.

255
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Speaker 2: I don't know what came into my head, but I

256
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Speaker 2: was just like, what if you did this? What if

257
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Speaker 2: Bray worked with puppets? Because there was it There was

258
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Speaker 2: in a gift or not. It was a scene in

259
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Speaker 2: the movie, but I remember seeing the gift of it

260
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Speaker 2: of mister Rogers putting on this clown mask. Right, you

261
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Speaker 2: could probably it's very easy to find mister Rogers clown mask.

262
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Speaker 2: I'm like, I think that was it. I was like, shit,

263
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Speaker 2: that's Ray wearing the mask mister Rogers. And it was

264
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Speaker 2: just maybe it was the red one talking or in

265
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Speaker 2: my brain, but I was just like, let's try and

266
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Speaker 2: do this. Let's I sent them a text. I was like,

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Speaker 2: we got I got a crazy idea. He responds with

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Speaker 2: the Jack Nicholson departed gift, like uh, And then you know,

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Speaker 2: I'm watching the documentary, I'm drinking more. Mister Rogers is

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Speaker 2: you know, singing to the kid in the wheelchair. I'm

271
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Speaker 2: getting all like emotional you know, I'm not in any

272
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Speaker 2: shape to talk creative at all. So you know, later

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Speaker 2: on that night we talked. He calls me like we

274
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Speaker 2: would talk like not every day, but pretty much almost

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Speaker 2: every day during the week about creative. This was like

276
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Speaker 2: a Friday or Saturday night, and uh, you know, I

277
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Speaker 2: pitched it to him. I don't remember exactly what I said,

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Speaker 2: but he was just kind of like, eh, you no,

279
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Speaker 2: it's gonna it might make me look stupid. And he

280
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Speaker 2: was work you know, after what happened with the other

281
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Speaker 2: pray Wyatt and kind of how that went awry, he

282
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Speaker 2: was very like careful, you know, he wanted to be

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Speaker 2: make sure that this was gonna work. So he was

284
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Speaker 2: a little he wasn't like against the idea, but he

285
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Speaker 2: wasn't like gung ho yet.

286
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Speaker 1: Uh.

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Speaker 2: I think it was the next morning or the day.

288
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Speaker 2: A couple of days afterwards, Uh, the song Lithium came

289
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Speaker 2: on Nirvana song. You know, it's like a today I

290
00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:16,680
Speaker 2: found my friends there in my head and that was

291
00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:18,400
Speaker 2: that was like, oh, show, okay, this is another thing

292
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Speaker 2: we can take kind of applied to this that. So

293
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Speaker 2: I knew he was a huge Nirvana fan. Kerko Bang guy,

294
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Speaker 2: So I used that as an example. I was like,

295
00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:29,040
Speaker 2: this is kind of it. And then in the movie It,

296
00:14:29,640 --> 00:14:33,400
Speaker 2: the New remake, there's a scene with Pennywise where he's

297
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Speaker 2: in the crowd of a kid show and he's chanting

298
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Speaker 2: kill them all, and it's this crazy scene. It just

299
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Speaker 2: stuck with me and I was like, that's it. I

300
00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:42,480
Speaker 2: sent that to win them. He saw that. I think

301
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:44,200
Speaker 2: it just clicked in his head and he's like, all

302
00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:47,760
Speaker 2: right now now he's coming up with ideas. We're puppets.

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Speaker 2: We're both going back and forth. Like the ball was

304
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Speaker 2: rolling after that. So it took like a few days

305
00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:54,480
Speaker 2: to kind of I don't want to say convince him

306
00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:57,560
Speaker 2: because he wasn't like totally against it, but uh yeah,

307
00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:00,280
Speaker 2: it took a little little convincing and then once he

308
00:15:00,360 --> 00:15:03,800
Speaker 2: was on board, he was, you know, one hundred miles

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00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:04,760
Speaker 2: an hour, let's go.

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Speaker 3: You guys were able to make magic with that character as.

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Speaker 2: He was with everything. You know, he didn't do anything

312
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Speaker 2: half assed.

313
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Speaker 3: Nah, he did. He committed one hundred percent.

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Speaker 2: Thank you. I I it was so much fun and

315
00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:17,880
Speaker 2: uh you know, we had such a blast and there

316
00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:22,040
Speaker 2: was so much work that went into it. M hm,

317
00:15:22,080 --> 00:15:24,800
Speaker 2: you know, it wasn't just show up to TV do

318
00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:26,720
Speaker 2: it like. This was a week long process trying to

319
00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:30,120
Speaker 2: come up with different things, trying to tell, you know,

320
00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:32,640
Speaker 2: the same story when he's working a match, maybe he's not,

321
00:15:32,920 --> 00:15:36,000
Speaker 2: you know, having having matches at that time, telling the

322
00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:39,160
Speaker 2: same story in different ways. So we were constantly trying

323
00:15:39,160 --> 00:15:42,120
Speaker 2: to come up with you know, unique segments, unique like

324
00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:44,480
Speaker 2: lessons in the Funhouse and different things like that, so

325
00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:46,440
Speaker 2: that it was it was hard, but it was also

326
00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:49,280
Speaker 2: like just a shit ton of fun, uh, to be

327
00:15:49,320 --> 00:15:52,600
Speaker 2: able to do that with him. It was never meant

328
00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:57,600
Speaker 2: to be supernatural. It kind of once that became successful,

329
00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:00,240
Speaker 2: it was like, oh, you know, everybody's involved, everybody, He's

330
00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:03,160
Speaker 2: changing things, everybody's getting their hands on it. When it

331
00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:05,560
Speaker 2: was just a very small group at first, then it

332
00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:10,120
Speaker 2: became a big thing. So it kind of spiraled a

333
00:16:10,120 --> 00:16:12,960
Speaker 2: little out of control at the beginning because it was

334
00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,400
Speaker 2: never supposed to be. He was supposed to be in control,

335
00:16:16,560 --> 00:16:18,840
Speaker 2: right right, Wyatt of the Fiend. That was the whole point.

336
00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:21,360
Speaker 2: And like the fourth vignette, he tells the story about

337
00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:24,000
Speaker 2: how now I can control it, he's doing the paper

338
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:27,040
Speaker 2: plate mask. Vince saw it another way to where it

339
00:16:27,160 --> 00:16:31,320
Speaker 2: was something he couldn't control and he had to. It

340
00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:33,560
Speaker 2: just kind of came out. He wouldn't even mention the

341
00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:36,440
Speaker 2: fiend by name. It was always like alluding to this guy.

342
00:16:37,160 --> 00:16:38,680
Speaker 2: So that kind of changed it a little bit and

343
00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:41,520
Speaker 2: made it a little you know, we have to It

344
00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:47,320
Speaker 2: wasn't the original vision, but you know, he was very

345
00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:51,120
Speaker 2: frustrated with stuff like that when somebody was trying to

346
00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:55,480
Speaker 2: change what he wanted to do. But you know, and

347
00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:57,200
Speaker 2: I was too. I mean, I'm not gonna lie, but

348
00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:01,040
Speaker 2: you know, we're employees, right, we don't own this character.

349
00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:03,440
Speaker 2: As much as we created this. We have to look

350
00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:05,800
Speaker 2: at it like we don't own it. We're employees. We

351
00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:08,160
Speaker 2: have to do what's told. What you know, Let's make

352
00:17:08,160 --> 00:17:11,720
Speaker 2: the best of it. Let's not complain and just kind

353
00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:14,600
Speaker 2: of go ahead. And that's that's the way I like

354
00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:18,320
Speaker 2: to approach it. And he, you know, he did too,

355
00:17:18,359 --> 00:17:20,480
Speaker 2: after some you know, complaining and threatening to quit.

356
00:17:20,800 --> 00:17:23,399
Speaker 3: But uh, yeah, it was.

357
00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:27,080
Speaker 2: It was a lot of compromise, right, like a marriage,

358
00:17:27,080 --> 00:17:30,600
Speaker 2: a lot of compromise. I hate how it ended up

359
00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:34,080
Speaker 2: turning out in the end. It just got you know,

360
00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:39,720
Speaker 2: so goofy and just not what it was supposed to be.

361
00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:42,560
Speaker 2: But again, you know, we'd really proud of some of

362
00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:46,360
Speaker 2: the stuff we did, you know, the Funhouse match with Sina. Yeah,

363
00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:50,840
Speaker 2: able to pull that off, you know, and that was

364
00:17:50,840 --> 00:17:54,360
Speaker 2: put together in two days, I think maybe three days

365
00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:59,520
Speaker 2: at the most. That was like, that's what the Funhouse

366
00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:00,480
Speaker 2: was meant to be.

367
00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:00,719
Speaker 3: Like.

368
00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:03,760
Speaker 2: Just to see that come to life, it was you know,

369
00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:06,080
Speaker 2: it's pretty awesome to see, especially WrestleMania with all that

370
00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:10,199
Speaker 2: COVID and everything going on, it was crazy time. But

371
00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:12,560
Speaker 2: to be able to get that off the ground and

372
00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:16,040
Speaker 2: have people like it, it was. I'm really proud of that.

373
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Speaker 2: M M.

374
00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:44,199
Speaker 1: If you could have people remember one specific moment of

375
00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:47,399
Speaker 1: Brave's legacy, what would that moment be?

376
00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:51,400
Speaker 2: You know, I think as much work as he put

377
00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:55,159
Speaker 2: into characters, and you know how much he wanted to

378
00:18:55,760 --> 00:19:00,639
Speaker 2: please the fans, I think you know, his family was

379
00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:04,679
Speaker 2: most important, Yeah to him. So I think, you know,

380
00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:07,679
Speaker 2: being remembered as a good father, I think he'd want

381
00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:08,720
Speaker 2: to be remembered by that.

382
00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:10,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think you're probably dead on man, I didn't

383
00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:11,520
Speaker 3: know him as well as.

384
00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:12,960
Speaker 2: Sorry, he's probably laughing at me now.

385
00:19:13,240 --> 00:19:16,000
Speaker 3: No, Well, as long as he's laughing, it's good man.

386
00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:17,199
Speaker 3: I didn't mean to break you up.

387
00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:21,520
Speaker 2: We you know, we had so many phone calls. He's

388
00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:24,200
Speaker 2: calling me from like his kids, like I don't know,

389
00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:27,600
Speaker 2: recital or the kids at the doctor crying in the background,

390
00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:30,880
Speaker 2: and he's talking to me about you know, Charles Manson

391
00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:35,359
Speaker 2: and whatever, you know, whatever else. So it was his

392
00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:37,879
Speaker 2: his family came first. So I want him, you know,

393
00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:41,600
Speaker 2: wanted to be remembered for that more than anything.

394
00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:45,280
Speaker 1: Well, Nick, let me take you out of that that

395
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:47,960
Speaker 1: train of thought and get because you worked for w

396
00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:50,120
Speaker 1: W Creative with more than just bray.

397
00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:51,240
Speaker 3: And there was some news this.

398
00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:57,320
Speaker 1: Week about AI and and writing wrestling, and you know,

399
00:19:57,440 --> 00:20:01,119
Speaker 1: I'm very I think it's hysterical that Hunter would say

400
00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:03,479
Speaker 1: something like it's inevitable when he's the head of Creative

401
00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:05,439
Speaker 1: and it's like, it's not inevitable, just say no, you

402
00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:08,480
Speaker 1: don't need it. I'm not a believer in AI and art.

403
00:20:08,840 --> 00:20:11,760
Speaker 1: I don't think the two really mix. I don't think

404
00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:14,760
Speaker 1: analytics and art particularly mixed that well. I think it's

405
00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:17,760
Speaker 1: why people complain about the way movies are today. A

406
00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:20,200
Speaker 1: lot of that has to do with the choices executives make.

407
00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:23,720
Speaker 1: But they're saying it's inevitable and they're bringing it in now.

408
00:20:24,359 --> 00:20:26,760
Speaker 1: I have my own conspiracy theories as to why. I

409
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,400
Speaker 1: won't bore you with them. But do you think there's

410
00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:34,040
Speaker 1: a place for AI in wrestling writing creative?

411
00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:37,680
Speaker 2: First of all, I think that I don't know how

412
00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:40,879
Speaker 2: accurate that report is. I mean to say that.

413
00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:42,960
Speaker 3: I hope it's not. By the way, Yeah, I hope

414
00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:43,679
Speaker 3: it's wrong.

415
00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:46,119
Speaker 2: That they're coming up with storylines and wrinning promos like,

416
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:48,560
Speaker 2: I don't buy that. I don't think that's true, because again,

417
00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:51,040
Speaker 2: you need writers at TV to produce all this stuff,

418
00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:52,800
Speaker 2: so you're not going to replace them. You're not gonna

419
00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:55,720
Speaker 2: have a fucking robot, you know, at least not yet

420
00:20:56,119 --> 00:20:58,880
Speaker 2: produce a walk or shoot a promote, you know, do

421
00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:03,439
Speaker 2: a promote somebody. So I don't like, you have this

422
00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,879
Speaker 2: giant creative team. You don't need chat GBT to come

423
00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:09,400
Speaker 2: up with ideas for you. So I don't think that's

424
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:11,639
Speaker 2: what they're using it for, at least I hope not.

425
00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:14,080
Speaker 1: What if I told you companies like Netflix were thinking

426
00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:14,880
Speaker 1: about doing.

427
00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:17,919
Speaker 2: It, isn't that the whole big plima going on right

428
00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:21,000
Speaker 2: now with I don't you know, I'm again I don't.

429
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:24,840
Speaker 3: AI is just weird Nick, It's like it's not an

430
00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:26,120
Speaker 3: artistic tool.

431
00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:28,199
Speaker 1: Like I don't want to watch a robot paint a picture,

432
00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:30,480
Speaker 1: so I don't want to read what a robot has

433
00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:33,400
Speaker 1: to write, Like I just that's never that's never been

434
00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:36,280
Speaker 1: my thing. So I'm like, I hope you're right, and

435
00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:39,320
Speaker 1: I hope that it's a bullshit story and there's zero

436
00:21:39,440 --> 00:21:42,120
Speaker 1: truth to it. But I know that studios are seriously

437
00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:44,320
Speaker 1: starting to consider this kind of stuff to get rid

438
00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:47,000
Speaker 1: of writers, So I wouldn't put it past another corporation

439
00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:47,920
Speaker 1: to do the same thing.

440
00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:49,720
Speaker 3: That's more where I'm coming from.

441
00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:52,639
Speaker 2: I guess, cause it's a lot, it's a live show.

442
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:54,840
Speaker 2: I mean, you've been back you've been backstage, you know how.

443
00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:58,320
Speaker 2: Or it's like you need people to shoot a backstage

444
00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:01,119
Speaker 2: to a promo and headset, so you can't replace that.

445
00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:05,040
Speaker 2: I mean maybe they can shrink the team a little bit.

446
00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:07,520
Speaker 2: I don't know, but I mean you definitely can't replace everybody.

447
00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:08,440
Speaker 2: There's no way.

448
00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:11,080
Speaker 3: Better not be able to it.

449
00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:13,320
Speaker 2: Just when I saw the report, I was like, there's

450
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:15,879
Speaker 2: no way this is true, Like they're not coming up

451
00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:16,920
Speaker 2: with storylines.

452
00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:18,960
Speaker 1: You said earlier that you and Bray had this sort

453
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:21,200
Speaker 1: of shared love for horror. I almost made a horror

454
00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:25,600
Speaker 1: movie with him. You've sort of transitioned from wrestling to

455
00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:29,000
Speaker 1: this space and kind of joined the horror world. What's

456
00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:29,720
Speaker 1: new for you, man?

457
00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:34,400
Speaker 2: So, yeah, he had mentioned working with you on something

458
00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:37,119
Speaker 2: a while back. I didn't know all the details behind it,

459
00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:40,680
Speaker 2: but he definitely mentioned it to me once. But yeah,

460
00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:42,680
Speaker 2: that was always his thing, you know, even back when

461
00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:45,320
Speaker 2: I first met him. He wants to do a movie.

462
00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:47,399
Speaker 2: He wants to be like Rob Zombie, you know, that

463
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:49,480
Speaker 2: was you know, he wants to do a House of

464
00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:52,240
Speaker 2: a thousand corpses, that type of stuff. So that was

465
00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:55,800
Speaker 2: always the you know, we always both kind of looked

466
00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:58,600
Speaker 2: at it like this is a springboard to that, right,

467
00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:02,159
Speaker 2: so let's stick together at WW and then you know,

468
00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:04,920
Speaker 2: move on to something else, because that's always what he wanted,

469
00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:08,720
Speaker 2: always what he wanted to do. Right the summer twenty

470
00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:12,320
Speaker 2: twenty three, we were he called me and this was

471
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:14,159
Speaker 2: the last time I think it was the last time

472
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:15,560
Speaker 2: I spoke to him on the phone, and he said

473
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:18,439
Speaker 2: he was having these you know, meetings with people about

474
00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:21,679
Speaker 2: you know, developing stuff for TV. So he's you know,

475
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,320
Speaker 2: his mind goes one hundred miles an hour and he's like,

476
00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:26,360
Speaker 2: we got to do this, do this. So we we

477
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:30,159
Speaker 2: we started putting together now idea for a TV series.

478
00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:35,960
Speaker 2: This was like June twenty twenty three. So I started

479
00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:41,120
Speaker 2: putting together stuff, doing research, and obviously nothing came of it,

480
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:45,560
Speaker 2: you know, but I do want to you know, he

481
00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:48,280
Speaker 2: had all these ideas that were not used. We had

482
00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:52,560
Speaker 2: a lot of ww stuff that wasn't used. Take that.

483
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:54,080
Speaker 2: I don't want to see it go to waste. So

484
00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:57,560
Speaker 2: got to figure out a way to take some of

485
00:23:57,600 --> 00:24:00,520
Speaker 2: that do something with him, you know, get with this

486
00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:03,120
Speaker 2: obviously with his family, not not doing it on my own,

487
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:07,080
Speaker 2: and figure out a way to kind of bring bring

488
00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:09,320
Speaker 2: this stuff to life and make his you know, dream

489
00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:12,480
Speaker 2: come true in a way. So hopefully we can do

490
00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 2: that at some point. It was a little hard to

491
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:16,960
Speaker 2: get back to it, but I want to start, you know,

492
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:20,879
Speaker 2: relooking at that stuff again and finishing it, seeing if

493
00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:24,080
Speaker 2: we can do something with it. So but yeah, that

494
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:27,760
Speaker 2: was always his dream. It was always movies, TV horror.

495
00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:30,320
Speaker 2: You know, he wanted to do some some really cool stuff.

496
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:34,359
Speaker 2: He had some great ideas and uh yeah, get I

497
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,560
Speaker 2: mean talking to him, you you know, it's like me,

498
00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:39,840
Speaker 2: it's like get pouring water in an envelope like, it's

499
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 2: just overwhelming. It's just the tidal wave of ideas at once.

500
00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:47,439
Speaker 2: So the hard part was channeling it and focusing it

501
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,720
Speaker 2: and getting it something, getting it to someplace where it

502
00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:54,000
Speaker 2: makes sense. That was always the trick. But yeah, he

503
00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 2: was really focused. He always wanted to to do it

504
00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:03,080
Speaker 2: at Just timing wasn't wasn't right obviously, Yeah, just bad,

505
00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:03,919
Speaker 2: just bad timing.

506
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:07,480
Speaker 1: Pouring water in an envelope is uh is a really

507
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:08,080
Speaker 1: beautiful way.

508
00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:09,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I used to tell him.

509
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,000
Speaker 3: I really, I really.

510
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:15,560
Speaker 1: Appreciate you coming on here and and sharing these stories

511
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:19,280
Speaker 1: with with me and with my listeners. And I appreciate

512
00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:23,280
Speaker 1: you being open and honest about it. And and I

513
00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:25,400
Speaker 1: hope I didn't take you to any bad places, man,

514
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:28,240
Speaker 1: But I just I'm so grateful to you for coming

515
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 1: on here and speaking about somebody that touched so many

516
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:33,399
Speaker 1: people's lives and giving them sort of a chance to

517
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,760
Speaker 1: see inside that character that he created and the legacy

518
00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:39,200
Speaker 1: that he left of being such a wonderful family man.

519
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:42,840
Speaker 3: So thank you, Nick. I appreciate you, Oh.

520
00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:45,120
Speaker 2: Thank you man. And and again there's so many untold

521
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:47,400
Speaker 2: stories with him. I could go on for five hours.

522
00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:49,720
Speaker 1: We'll have you on another one, man, We'll have you

523
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:51,119
Speaker 1: on another one, and we'll get deeper.

524
00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:54,760
Speaker 2: I'll come on again. Yeah, I I uh, it took

525
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:56,240
Speaker 2: me a while to really be able to talk about

526
00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 2: this stuff. I didn't really want to do interviews, do

527
00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:01,800
Speaker 2: anything like that. Yeah, but you know, there's a lot

528
00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 2: of untold stories with him, a lot of really good

529
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:07,120
Speaker 2: stories put him, paint him in a really great light.

530
00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 2: He was a genius.

531
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 3: You know.

532
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:11,320
Speaker 2: He deserves it, He deserves to be he deserves all

533
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 2: the praise he's getting, and even more so, if I

534
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:18,000
Speaker 2: can do anything to help that, yeah, I'm on board.

535
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:22,200
Speaker 1: So you guys, that's Nick mann Perdini. He's the man.

536
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 1: Thank you guys for listening. Tune in to this episode,

537
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:29,080
Speaker 1: this this week, next week, every single week. We're here

538
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,240
Speaker 1: almost fifty two weeks a year, so enjoy the show.

539
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:41,800
Speaker 1: I'll see everybody next week on Wrestling with Pretty