Speaker 1: This episode was recorded prior to the SAG After Strike.
Speaker 2: Unpacking the Toolbox is a production of Shondaland Audio in
Speaker 2: partnership with Iheartradiots.
Speaker 3: And Katie Tho.
Speaker 4: I'm watching the episode that we're talking about today, and
Speaker 4: I'm like, do you remember conversation Shonda would have where
Speaker 4: it's like they would give such shit about sexual stuff
Speaker 4: on the show, but like violence or death was like
Speaker 4: fair game?
Speaker 3: Did it matter? Yeah?
Speaker 4: And I'm just like refreshing myself on the end of
Speaker 4: season two, which is where we're currently at. There's just
Speaker 4: guns held at people's heads.
Speaker 3: All the time, ye constantly.
Speaker 5: Yeah, motherfuckers are eating donuts right before they were about
Speaker 5: to get shot.
Speaker 3: Abby's holding a gun.
Speaker 4: I'm holding a gun, and Charlie's holding a gun at
Speaker 4: David Rosen, and then Jake Ballard has a gun because
Speaker 4: he's about to take down Charlie. It's just like Rice,
Speaker 4: why don't we And Adam Adam just did like the
Speaker 4: top gun thing. He just did John Wick prequel series,
Speaker 4: which is literally gun porn. It's like, how many fucking
Speaker 4: things can we fucking light up?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 6: What is that?
Speaker 5: I haven't seen any of the John Wicks, but I
Speaker 5: hear there's somebody just went to see it a friend
Speaker 5: of mine and said it was super violent. And it's
Speaker 5: like one of the most popular franchises. Right, there's like
Speaker 5: what five part five now or four?
Speaker 3: I don't even know.
Speaker 4: Fast and the Furious. I have no idea what's going on.
Speaker 4: I've never seen You're right, it's like porn yea. And
Speaker 4: my son is like obsessed. He is, but yeah, he
Speaker 4: just is like, you know, I want swords, I.
Speaker 3: Want I want shields.
Speaker 4: Everything is good guy, bad guy. Did you play like
Speaker 4: that when you were a little kid or no?
Speaker 5: No, I played with like a Donald Duck doll that
Speaker 5: you would press his hands and he would walk, his
Speaker 5: legs would move. You would press his right hand and
Speaker 5: his left leg would move. Typical fucking gay shit. Like
Speaker 5: I loved all the dolls. I loved all the superhero
Speaker 5: dolls and Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck all that stuff.
Speaker 6: Have you been in real fights in your life?
Speaker 3: Just like two? But I don't like it, and I'm
Speaker 3: not good at it at all.
Speaker 5: I'm not I get very scared, like I'll defend myself,
Speaker 5: but I'm still super I don't like it.
Speaker 4: I don't like it like did you get ever get
Speaker 4: hit or hit someone in the face, like when you
Speaker 4: were a kid growing up.
Speaker 6: I've never done that.
Speaker 5: I did once I did. I hit someone in the face,
Speaker 5: and I've been hitting the face.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 6: Was it terrible.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it was almost like I blacked out. Like afterwards,
Speaker 5: I was like, I don't even remember doing that. It
Speaker 5: was just like a reflex to Yeah, you know, I
Speaker 5: was just being.
Speaker 4: Protect yourself with fight or flight, like you went into
Speaker 4: like animalistic mode.
Speaker 3: But then it stopped. It didn't. It was like a
Speaker 3: continued fight.
Speaker 5: I would have friends that would be fighting on the
Speaker 5: street for like fifteen minutes, like taking their shirts off,
Speaker 5: like let's go, like taking you know, their shoes off.
Speaker 3: I was like, what are you people doing?
Speaker 6: Like, oh my god.
Speaker 4: I remember in high school the girls fighting like way
Speaker 4: worse than the guys. The girls like fucking ripping their
Speaker 4: out and fucking dreads and shit out of their hair.
Speaker 5: Bad bad like black girls. I mean, I said, I
Speaker 5: blacked out, but girls black the fuck out.
Speaker 3: They don't care. You can't pull them apart O.
Speaker 6: Can this like not happen to my kids?
Speaker 7: No?
Speaker 3: Fighting, fighting is bad, Yeah.
Speaker 6: But they're still fucking doing it. I think they are.
Speaker 5: Well, and then you know, we're brought up, especially boys,
Speaker 5: being like, fuck, you gotta fight, defend yourself, you gotta
Speaker 5: learn how to fight, learn a fight, fight. You know,
Speaker 5: it becomes like this thing that you feel you need
Speaker 5: to be good at, or that it's a good thing
Speaker 5: that you could beat somebody up.
Speaker 3: Like that's not good. It's fucking you, it's not good.
Speaker 4: But also like why even let it get to that?
Speaker 4: And I was kind of lucky to I was sort
Speaker 4: of friends with everyone. I don't know how, but I
Speaker 4: was like a theater girl and I was on the
Speaker 4: dance team and a few things. But I think being an adult
Speaker 4: is so much harder because my anxiety. I didn't have
Speaker 4: that as a kid, and now it's worse than it's
Speaker 4: ever been, Like my real life worries everyone, kitty.
Speaker 5: Do you ever think I think back on the times
Speaker 5: when I first started acting and doing plays and everything
Speaker 5: and having no anxiety whatsoever. I was fearless, And I
Speaker 5: think back on those times and I'm like, wow, like
Speaker 5: I wish I could feel that again, you know what
Speaker 5: I mean. And of course there's fleeting moments when you
Speaker 5: feel that way, but you're right, there's so much crap
Speaker 5: that we're dealing with.
Speaker 4: There's just real life worries, like I didn't worry, like
Speaker 4: and look, that is such a fucking privilege, Like obviously
Speaker 4: I wasn't worried about food or like rent or like
Speaker 4: you know, because there are kids that have those fucking
Speaker 4: worries of course.
Speaker 6: Which is awful.
Speaker 3: And did you say food? You know?
Speaker 6: We have to talk to Betsy about that. She we
Speaker 6: used to host the Scandal podcast.
Speaker 3: Yes, I was thinking about that earlier.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I want to ask her all about like
Speaker 4: how did she first hear that that the meeting went
Speaker 4: great and like come on board?
Speaker 6: And was she into it from the start?
Speaker 4: And then we had to talk to her all about
Speaker 4: reading stage directions scared.
Speaker 5: Yes, I thought about that too, yes, yes, yes, and
Speaker 5: she was.
Speaker 6: A comedian and an actress yes in New York.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, start Betsy Beers. Yeah, I feel like always
Speaker 3: say that I love it so much.
Speaker 5: I do not as much as I love your last
Speaker 5: name Beers, because I would love four right now?
Speaker 8: Who wouldn't And it's totally what eleven o'clock here, Where
Speaker 8: are you? Garma? Are you? I'm in La so morning drinking,
Speaker 8: which is the.
Speaker 4: Best, right right, because we're coming out at the time
Speaker 4: of this recording of a three day weekend.
Speaker 6: He we just are feeling very like, whoa, we really.
Speaker 4: Had a Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday situation and our brain's
Speaker 4: not firing, probably a level that Betsy Beers.
Speaker 8: Is no minus minus a big sleepy pile of poo.
Speaker 8: What's fun about this episode two is it's the episode
Speaker 8: before the last episode, which, like I remembered really well
Speaker 8: because we did that table.
Speaker 3: Read yes in front of a live audience, Yeah, in.
Speaker 8: Front of a live audience, and when we gave the
Speaker 8: last line, which I'm not going to give away for
Speaker 8: anybody who hasn't seen the show, which probably makes no
Speaker 8: sense because everybody listens to this like, gosh, I hope
Speaker 8: you've you've seen the show, but that there's that last line.
Speaker 8: And I remember, because I was doing stage directions.
Speaker 6: We were in were we at the Doldie.
Speaker 8: It was some scary, weird situation, big theater. It was
Speaker 8: a big theater, right, and I remember we all had
Speaker 8: to stop because the screaming. Just for anybody who doesn't
Speaker 8: know what the hell I'm talking about, I don't blame you.
Speaker 8: So we did a season finale table read. I think
Speaker 8: it was for charity.
Speaker 6: I think it was for charity too.
Speaker 8: Yeah, we did this table read and they were about, oh,
Speaker 8: I don't know, four or five hundred people there, and
Speaker 8: obviously the actors had already shot it, so we all
Speaker 8: knew it was yeah, yeah, yeah, which often, by the way,
Speaker 8: we didn't we don't.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 8: But it was one of the most amazing experiences I've
Speaker 8: ever had because I got to the last line, which,
Speaker 8: as we all know, is Dad. None of these people
Speaker 8: had seen the episode. We literally did it right as
Speaker 8: the episode was airing. I remember we just we all
Speaker 8: just sat there and look at each other. Yeah, while
Speaker 8: people were sweating and screaming and running up and down
Speaker 8: the aisles, and it was pretty great.
Speaker 6: It was insane.
Speaker 5: I remember Debbie Allen jumping out of her seat like
Speaker 5: a mad woman and cheering, and I'm like, and she's
Speaker 5: in Shondaland, and even she was like, oh my.
Speaker 4: God, yeah, she must not have known. It was so crazy.
Speaker 4: But Betsy, tell our listeners two things. One, you used
Speaker 4: to host the Scandal podcast.
Speaker 8: It was called Scandaled Revealed, and I forced every single
Speaker 8: one of these poor actors to be on it, like
Speaker 8: eight hundred times over the course of the period of
Speaker 8: the show.
Speaker 4: You knew before like podcasts are obviously such a thing now,
Speaker 4: But my god, Betsy, you were hosting correct if I'm wrong,
Speaker 4: was a grace.
Speaker 8: Then we did Scandal, then we did Shondaland Revealed, and
Speaker 8: then people became tired and had to lie down, so
Speaker 8: I got out of it, and then of course it
Speaker 8: got really popular so I can do my FM.
Speaker 4: It just means that Betsy is always at the beginning
Speaker 4: of the bell curve. She knows what's hot before everyone
Speaker 4: else knows what's hot.
Speaker 8: For timing's so good that she gets out just when
Speaker 8: it gets hot.
Speaker 6: Oh that is not.
Speaker 4: The case now wait listen, but I remember everyone talking
Speaker 4: about going on the Scandal Revealed podcast, And look, Betsy
Speaker 4: is you're so famous in life and in in Shondaland for.
Speaker 6: Just well you were an actor.
Speaker 4: Tell us, like, yes, you're the greatest, one of the
Speaker 4: most prolific producers in all of television history.
Speaker 6: And you were an.
Speaker 4: Actor in a comedian, which makes you amazing at hosting
Speaker 4: pot and the best stage direction reader at a table
Speaker 4: reader that's ever existed. So tell us what you did
Speaker 4: on the podcast. Originally start there.
Speaker 8: Okay, so on the podcast. Originally, the first podcast we
Speaker 8: did was Gray's Anatomy. I think I don't remember if
Speaker 8: it had a catchy name, except it was Shonda and
Speaker 8: me and it was like, I don't know if it
Speaker 8: was season two or season three. But we started doing
Speaker 8: this because in those days, not that many people were
Speaker 8: doing podcasts, and everybody was really excited with hers anatomy,
Speaker 8: and Shanda, believe it or not, at that period of time,
Speaker 8: didn't talk as much. She was not that vocal. All
Speaker 8: she was doing was kind of working, and everybody sort
Speaker 8: of wanted to know was in her brain. And so
Speaker 8: we started doing this thing where we would start every
Speaker 8: podcast night she'd go, I'm Shanda, and I go I'm Betsy,
Speaker 8: and we'd go, and this is Gray's Anatomy. And then
Speaker 8: we would I would just ask a bunch of questions
Speaker 8: or I'd say, oh, man, this week was really hard.
Speaker 8: You know, can you believe this week? This week just
Speaker 8: was so hard, and you go, I know, we were
Speaker 8: in so late doing X, Y and Z. And then
Speaker 8: we'd ask questions about the story. And that's sort of
Speaker 8: where I learned how to ask questions because it's not
Speaker 8: like we had a script or anything like, Yeah, I
Speaker 8: just asked her shit and then we talk about stuff,
Speaker 8: and then I give my opinions as to what I
Speaker 8: felt about things. And the only thing I remember about
Speaker 8: that podcast was, for some reason, for some reason, it
Speaker 8: was around the holidays, and we got obsessed talking about
Speaker 8: wrapping paper.
Speaker 6: Oh my god, she's obsessed with wrapping paper.
Speaker 8: It was, you know, the holiday cliffhanger. And all we did,
Speaker 8: I think was talked about wrapping paper, which is.
Speaker 6: Just probably why it's podcast banter.
Speaker 8: And then moved from the Gray's Anatomy one to the
Speaker 8: Scandal one. That was just like a big excuse to
Speaker 8: hang out with the actors and the crew and stuff
Speaker 8: or anybody who's listening, because this is like in the call
Speaker 8: of television fame, the most incredibly great cast in the world.
Speaker 8: Like just we've been really lucky with her cast. So
Speaker 8: it's not to disparage any for other phenomenal casts, but
Speaker 8: you all were really close and also just you were
Speaker 8: game for anything, you poor things.
Speaker 6: So yeah, oh my gosh, we were so gay.
Speaker 8: I'd go like, Hi, here's the opening of envelope, and
Speaker 8: you'd be like, it's cool.
Speaker 3: We'll go it's do it. It's good.
Speaker 8: It's just it's an envelope. Envelopes are good.
Speaker 5: I remember going into your office to do the podcast
Speaker 5: to be a guest. It was always so exciting to
Speaker 5: go into the Shondaland offices and your office and Hozo
Speaker 5: is just like, oh, this is so fun and exciting, and.
Speaker 6: You had a cool office.
Speaker 4: I tell the listeners, what was the history behind that
Speaker 4: Sunset Gower office?
Speaker 8: Deal was? We were at Sunset Gower and I got
Speaker 8: Harry Cohne's all office. And none of you will know
Speaker 8: who Harry Cone was, but Harry Cone pretty much started
Speaker 8: Columbia Pictures. I think it was Columbia Oh wow. And
Speaker 8: this was during the period of time in which there
Speaker 8: were like big moguls, like the gold Winds were sort
Speaker 8: of a mogal family. That was a whole funny thing
Speaker 8: when Tony came in that office. But this office was
Speaker 8: so intense. It was like all wood paneled. It looked
Speaker 8: like a really scary, gigantic study. It had a bathroom
Speaker 8: off of it that used to have like a barber
Speaker 8: shop or like a beauty shop or whatever. And then
Speaker 8: it had a secret door. So Harry Cohne who was
Speaker 8: a dirty dude could get the girls in and out
Speaker 8: without anybody knowing.
Speaker 4: No.
Speaker 6: Oh, I remember said that. I mean you told me that.
Speaker 4: When I was in there, I was like, oh, I
Speaker 4: mean it's classic Hollywood, classic old Hollywood.
Speaker 8: And then later I started realizing it was used in
Speaker 8: all these movies. So like my husband and I were
Speaker 8: watching the way, we were randomly oh yeah, I love it,
Speaker 8: and the studio had is like sitting in my office
Speaker 8: and I'm like what.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 8: The other thing that was really cool was like every
Speaker 8: time we'd get really short on budget money for any
Speaker 8: show like How to Get with Murder, we used it
Speaker 8: like three times as different things because they'd be like
Speaker 8: a bud just really stress this episode, I go, what
Speaker 8: can you use the office for? And we go Gentlemen's Club,
Speaker 8: perfect college President. So it was also good.
Speaker 4: I want to hear about when you first found out
Speaker 4: like that Judy and Shonda had met, and were you like, okay.
Speaker 8: I arranged I arranged that, you arranged.
Speaker 6: Oh okay, so take us through that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, how did you meet Judy?
Speaker 7: So?
Speaker 8: I met Judy through my agent, whose name is Larry Salz,
Speaker 8: who's great at UTA, and he had called me and said,
Speaker 8: we're wrapping this woman that I think you, I just
Speaker 8: think you would really respond to and sent me all
Speaker 8: this information and material and I took one look at
Speaker 8: it and I was like, this is such an interesting
Speaker 8: idea of what this woman does for a living in
Speaker 8: that and we were both Shonda and I've always been
Speaker 8: obsessed with politics, We've always been obsessed with journalism. I
Speaker 8: was like, I think she's really going to respond to
Speaker 8: this guy. I think she would be a really good
Speaker 8: basis for a show. And at that point we were
Speaker 8: like buried under Gray's anatomy in private practice, and we
Speaker 8: were starting to produce for other people, and she was
Speaker 8: sort of like, I don't want to don't give me anything.
Speaker 8: So we arranged this meeting and Judy Smith walked in
Speaker 8: and she was wearing this white suit. Come on, and
Speaker 8: she was I mean, Judy, as you all have probably
Speaker 8: seen her, she's like beautiful, she's glamorous, she had this
Speaker 8: long brown hair.
Speaker 4: She's tall, she's thin, she's very statuesque and graceful.
Speaker 8: She still like gets to the point right away. Stuff. Yes,
Speaker 8: five minutes in she's talking and Shonda looks at me
Speaker 8: and she MAVs, fuck you, oh, because she knew she
Speaker 8: wanted to.
Speaker 3: She was like, I'm doing this.
Speaker 8: Wow, I'm doing this.
Speaker 6: Yeah, like I don't want anybody else to do it.
Speaker 8: I want, I don't want, I want to do it.
Speaker 8: And then it kind of got put on the back
Speaker 8: burner for a while because she was so busy. And
Speaker 8: then little by little by little, we have these conversations
Speaker 8: and she was sort of playing with these different pieces
Speaker 8: and eventually came up with a totally fictionalized and only
Speaker 8: inspired by version of Judy Smith, which of course was
Speaker 8: Olivia Pope.
Speaker 6: Wow.
Speaker 5: I know, I wonder what was going through Judy's Smith's
Speaker 5: brain while she was meeting with Seawanda.
Speaker 3: Was she like was she in on it? Like? Did
Speaker 3: you she think, okay, they might do a show about
Speaker 3: my life?
Speaker 8: Oh? I think she was pitching herself as a show
Speaker 8: about a life, Like she was sort of like life
Speaker 8: rights type situation. Yeah, but she really liked us too.
Speaker 8: I then became closer to Judy for a while, so
Speaker 8: as the process was sort of going on. But yeah,
Speaker 8: she I think was she was into it? And then
Speaker 8: there were some other people who were interested, but we
Speaker 8: strong armed our way in.
Speaker 4: Nice crazy beers. I know, do you remember like the
Speaker 4: casting process.
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, you were. You were in my auditions.
Speaker 3: Thank yeah, you were there for me too. You were in.
Speaker 8: Everyone I love me those rooms.
Speaker 4: Is it your produce storial brain that loves it or
Speaker 4: is it like your I mean, you have to tell
Speaker 4: us about your acting stand up comedy situation and you
Speaker 4: even came out here.
Speaker 8: It's a brief story. Basically, I studied acting from when
Speaker 8: I was a kid. My dad was an agent and
Speaker 8: he died when I was little. They were always like,
Speaker 8: she should be an actress, she should be an actress.
Speaker 8: And it was one of those things where everybody tells
Speaker 8: you and you're like okay. And I could memorize lines
Speaker 8: really easily, which I guess was all I thought was necessary,
Speaker 8: which is really depressing. But I acted all the way
Speaker 8: through elementary school, high school, college, I did summer theater,
Speaker 8: and I remember in college they were sort of like
Speaker 8: you shouldn't act, you should direct, and I was like,
Speaker 8: I know, I know, it was really corol.
Speaker 1: My mouth is on the ground. I'm like, how dam
Speaker 1: they and all they did in those days? Because this
Speaker 1: was like in eighteen forty two when I was in
Speaker 1: college and all they did was like wrecked, but they
Speaker 1: do it like as a Western.
Speaker 6: Oh, nobody wants that.
Speaker 8: It was like this period of time where nobody was
Speaker 8: having any fun. Everybody was just doing like really really
Speaker 8: serious plays. And I found out that I was like
Speaker 8: funny because we did one or two things that weren't
Speaker 8: and they were sort of like, yeah, if you did anything,
Speaker 8: the only you could kind of do is like musical
Speaker 8: comedy and stuff. I was okay, fine, So I ended
Speaker 8: up doing some summer theater and then I went to
Speaker 8: New York and I joined this improv group and.
Speaker 1: That was really, to me really easy, right, well, because
Speaker 1: you're so smart and so instinctual.
Speaker 8: God. It was also I liked. I liked sort of
Speaker 8: the producing aspect of it, I discovered. And I also
Speaker 8: was taking acting classes, and like the acting teachers would
Speaker 8: pull me aside and go, you're not making a very
Speaker 8: good argument for your character. You're letting the other person
Speaker 8: in this conversation just and I'd be like, well, I
Speaker 8: get their point, Like I understand what point of view,
Speaker 8: Like I think they're right.
Speaker 6: I think I'm too smart.
Speaker 8: I think I'm being a dick.
Speaker 6: That's why.
Speaker 8: No, it was because I can see all the points
Speaker 8: of view, which make me a better.
Speaker 3: Producer producer, Yes, and an actor.
Speaker 5: Yes, Betsy, did you ever do a guest spot on
Speaker 5: any of the shows?
Speaker 3: Did you ever, like, were you ever in front of
Speaker 3: the camera? Would you ever want to be?
Speaker 8: No? And I honestly this, I don't know how you
Speaker 8: all do.
Speaker 3: It Honestly, I don't know how we do it either.
Speaker 8: Really Like, I was watching this episode last night and
Speaker 8: I'm like, I said to Bruce, my husband, who is also,
Speaker 8: of course, the legal consultant on the show, what was like?
Speaker 8: I remember intellectually, but I forgot emotionally was how much
Speaker 8: freaking story is in there?
Speaker 3: I mean, oh my god.
Speaker 8: I was like, Okay, so hold on, hold on hold.
Speaker 8: So they are having an affair and then she.
Speaker 6: Likes, I'm like, who is the fucking mole?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 6: What is happening?
Speaker 8: And Jake shows up with the mole? And then I
Speaker 8: was like, the mole is with the the Chiron card
Speaker 8: or whatever the hell's help draw card in that I
Speaker 8: remember Abby stole the card and put it in the safe,
Speaker 8: but I totally forgot that David was the guy who
Speaker 8: actually was the guy who stole it. Yes, the introduction
Speaker 8: to Charlie and I remember casting Charlie, like all this
Speaker 8: stuff came back. Shanda couldn't be there, and we kept
Speaker 8: seeing these people and she was looking at auditions and stuff,
Speaker 8: but we had this conversation. She was like, Okay, I
Speaker 8: want somebody unexpected. And we kept seeing these people are
Speaker 8: like really like killers and serial kidders, and I kind
Speaker 8: of go this guy like no, no, no, no, no no,
Speaker 8: it's like a guy, like a normal guy. And Linda Loewie,
Speaker 8: the brilliant casting director, totally pivoted and we brought Georgian
Speaker 8: and we're all like, this is such a nasty idea, really,
Speaker 8: because he seems so nice, but also he needed somebody
Speaker 8: who really contrasted with you, huck.
Speaker 4: So yeah, this middle aged middle age like what's his
Speaker 4: big movie father that loves.
Speaker 8: And he looks like he's dropping his kids off at
Speaker 8: soccer practice, you.
Speaker 3: Know, totally makes him frightening.
Speaker 8: Which makes him so frightened when they made him a
Speaker 8: sugar freak, and the whole sort of opening thing about
Speaker 8: he's like he's having sex with this woman for the laptop.
Speaker 6: I mean, oh my god, bird work.
Speaker 3: Yes, we'll be right back, guys, before.
Speaker 6: We talk about this episode, really quick.
Speaker 4: One last question, how did you become this the Shonda
Speaker 4: and special sauce that you read the stage directions for
Speaker 4: graising down to me, Private Practice, Scandal, how to get Away?
Speaker 4: I'm sure Bridgerton inventing Anna.
Speaker 5: Betsy was like a character in the show doing the
Speaker 5: stage directions. And for people that don't understand what the
Speaker 5: stage directions are, there's sort of the description of what's happening,
Speaker 5: you know, in between all the scenes. Sometimes it'll describe what,
Speaker 5: you know, the feeling that a person is is feeling
Speaker 5: and and it's usually super boring, right, but Betsy would
Speaker 5: come in and just make it so freaking exciting and
Speaker 5: you're but you matched our pace too, your pace point
Speaker 5: you have to yeah, because people will fall asleep.
Speaker 8: People fall asleep. And the thing that I realized, because
Speaker 8: having actually been an actor, I'll be it a bad
Speaker 8: one how difficult it is if you are actually reading
Speaker 8: with people, which I found when I would read with actors,
Speaker 8: is if you suck or you're really dep it, it's
Speaker 8: really hard for the actor to do the best job.
Speaker 3: Right. Of course, to lift the bottom of lifting.
Speaker 8: Number two, I learned how to do it to some degree.
Speaker 8: Pilots because I was selling the pilot to the studio network.
Speaker 8: Of it was how do I help sell this pilot?
Speaker 8: And I was like the stealth seller, and I just
Speaker 8: I feel like what started to happen was when everybody
Speaker 8: started realizing that somebody was reading stage directions and they
Speaker 8: were paying attention. That started on Scandal. All the writers
Speaker 8: started writing more stage directions and then to hear you say,
Speaker 8: just to humiliate me, and then Shanda, all the sex
Speaker 8: scenes normally would have just been sort of sex scene,
Speaker 8: they started putting in every detail and it was the best,
Speaker 8: just to force me to read it. Then they started
Speaker 8: putting in songs that they wanted me to sing that
Speaker 8: I then refused to sing, so then they would put
Speaker 8: other stuff that it turned into a thing that was
Speaker 8: actually really fun.
Speaker 6: It's the best.
Speaker 4: And these Scandal table reads were famous. Like, yeah, sometimes
Speaker 4: you go into a table read and it's really like
Speaker 4: respectful and kind of quiet, and everyone's sort of on
Speaker 4: edge and scared, and like Scandal was like a fucking raucous.
Speaker 8: That was like a revival meeting yea.
Speaker 4: And what's great about Betsy is like sometimes you would
Speaker 4: be at these table reads and you'd be watching some
Speaker 4: of the best actors. We have the best stage actors
Speaker 4: in our country, right, So you're watching someone who would
Speaker 4: you would pay a three hundred and fifty dollars Broadway
Speaker 4: ticket to see Jeff Perry and Kate Burton going head
Speaker 4: to head or whatever, trained actors, and Betsy's like right
Speaker 4: in there in the scenes doing crazy descriptions at their pace,
Speaker 4: matching their energy, resetting us.
Speaker 6: And then everyone who's listening it was like a show.
Speaker 4: Everyone was like oh no, or like oh shit, or
Speaker 4: like you know, oh yeh, or like there's sexy.
Speaker 6: It was crazy.
Speaker 8: Do you also just remember too, like we had to
Speaker 8: limit the number of executives who would show up.
Speaker 3: Oh, because everybody wanted to come to the table reads.
Speaker 8: You may not have known this, but there are periods
Speaker 8: of time where there was limited access to the table
Speaker 8: reads because either a plot point, but mainly because it
Speaker 8: was like we were just always overrun. And I have
Speaker 8: to tell you small brag. I was doing the table
Speaker 8: read for How to Get Away with Murder and it
Speaker 8: was this pivotal episode and Denzel Washington randomly came I
Speaker 8: guess guess he was doing fences with Viola. Oh, Denzel Washington.
Speaker 4: My dabhood God and I'm.
Speaker 3: Good, I could die now.
Speaker 5: And the thing is you would you would get those
Speaker 5: scripts when we got him, like you didn't get him
Speaker 5: ahead of time and sort of go over this the
Speaker 5: stage directions.
Speaker 8: I don't know how much everybody's talked about this, but
Speaker 8: basically it was like this crazy django where they'd start
Speaker 8: the season and they'd dig a hole. The writers in
Speaker 8: Shonda would just like, dig hole, get in the hole,
Speaker 8: dump dirt on themselves, and then figure out the rest
Speaker 8: of the way to get out of the season. And
Speaker 8: they had an idea as to what was going to happen,
Speaker 8: but it was such an incredibly complex puzzle that without
Speaker 8: a doubt, like nobody would see scripts until do you
Speaker 8: remember they were hot.
Speaker 3: Hot Oh yeah, literally hot off the press.
Speaker 4: Yep, we need the ticking clock like it really helped Scandal,
Speaker 4: I think for this show exactly, the vibe was everyone
Speaker 4: is stretch. It's like we're all freaking because it's all
Speaker 4: so high stage.
Speaker 8: And you're all finding out information in real time with
Speaker 8: the audience anyway for the most part.
Speaker 4: So yes, yeah, okay, let's talk about episode two twenty one,
Speaker 4: because Betsy Beers is one of the most, Like I said,
Speaker 4: prolific producers in Hollywood.
Speaker 6: She's busy.
Speaker 8: I know this is way more fun.
Speaker 4: We're talking about episode two twenty one, which was called
Speaker 4: Any Questions, which aired on May ninth, twenty thirteen.
Speaker 6: It was written by Matt.
Speaker 8: Byrne, who earned Matty Byrne, longtime member of the family
Speaker 8: and has written prodigiously, even on the recent Inventing Anna
Speaker 8: starring Katie Lows.
Speaker 6: Of course, love him.
Speaker 8: He worked on Queen Charlotte. He's phenomenal, and he wrote
Speaker 8: this in a very Maddy Byrne way. And I think
Speaker 8: it was directed by Mark Tinker.
Speaker 3: Yes, directed by Mark Tinker.
Speaker 7: Yes.
Speaker 8: Mark Tinker longtime member of the Shondaland family. He was
Speaker 8: the producing director on Private Practice and has worked on
Speaker 8: many shows and was a big factor in an old
Speaker 8: medical show called Saint Elsewhere, which we believe I swear
Speaker 8: love him, love him, but Mark's hysterical and great.
Speaker 3: But Mark directed a few episodes of Scandal right, and.
Speaker 4: He directed my one guest star episode of Private Practice
Speaker 4: where I just left my baby in the backseat.
Speaker 8: You did you killed your child?
Speaker 3: Geez okice.
Speaker 4: This episode is guest starring, guest starring Scott Foley is
Speaker 4: Jake Ballard, Joe Morton is Mysterious Man. Dan but Gatinsky
Speaker 4: is James Novak. George Newburn is Charlie. Kate Burton is
Speaker 4: Vice President, Sally Langston.
Speaker 5: Matt Lesher is Billy Chambers. Brian Lesher is Tom Larson,
Speaker 5: Samantha Sloyan is Janine, Alexander Griers Patrick the White House staffer,
Speaker 5: Christy Myers is Perky counter Girl be six thirteen Operative,
Speaker 5: and also John Barrowman as the Fixer.
Speaker 8: I was just about to say John Berriman, who I
Speaker 8: think the same year we had in a pilot called
Speaker 8: The Gilded Lilies where he played hey brother and Katie.
Speaker 3: He's a huge like Broadway.
Speaker 8: Guy's also Doctor Who, right.
Speaker 3: Yes, he's in Doctor Who. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 5: He was in a show called Central Park West years ago,
Speaker 5: which is the first time I saw him on anything,
Speaker 5: and he's he's wonderful and he's hot as fuck and
Speaker 5: he's hot.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 8: The other thing I thought was very funny, which is
Speaker 8: the actress who plays Janine actually looks like jen Saki,
Speaker 8: the former White House correspondent, looks.
Speaker 4: So much like Jensaki, it's yeah, okay, to remind our listeners.
Speaker 4: What happens in this We're gonna read the synopsis. There
Speaker 4: is so much, listeners, just so much that scandalpace.
Speaker 6: Are you ready?
Speaker 3: G yes?
Speaker 6: Okay?
Speaker 4: As Cyrus dodges questions about Fitz's affair, the opay team
Speaker 4: tries to track down the mole once and for all.
Speaker 4: Fitz tells Olivia and Cyrus that he's not planning of
Speaker 4: running again, which Olivia is okay with as long as
Speaker 4: it means they can be together Oh yeah, kissy kissing.
Speaker 5: But when Cyrus learns it Fits might not have planned
Speaker 5: to run regardless, Olivia convinces him not to throw away
Speaker 5: his presidency.
Speaker 4: Yus Charlie shows up seeking Olivia's protection, but instead almost
Speaker 4: gets killed by Huck. Luckily, after Huck gets the name
Speaker 4: of the mole, Quinn convinces Huck to let Charlie live,
Speaker 4: which turns out to be.
Speaker 6: A bad plan. When the Citron card goes missing.
Speaker 5: Everyone thinks they know what happened to it. Bun David
Speaker 5: Rosen has revealed to be the one who stolen what.
Speaker 4: And that, Folks is our episode, Betsy, go watch your
Speaker 4: favorite scenes from this.
Speaker 6: Epp Oh, I think mine? Okay?
Speaker 4: The Cyrus ripping James a new asshole.
Speaker 8: That is so painful, that's so good.
Speaker 4: He had a lip quiver at the end that I
Speaker 4: was like, this motherfucker got the Emmy.
Speaker 6: He got that the stars this role.
Speaker 8: But don't you think that he There's two scenes in it.
Speaker 8: The two scenes that go together are the sy will
Speaker 8: you let me be a reporter?
Speaker 2: Sy?
Speaker 8: Will you let me be a reporter? Si? Will you
Speaker 8: let me be a reporter? And Size totally distracted, is
Speaker 8: paying any attention to him, and they're gonna be on air.
Speaker 8: They're gonna let me be on air. Yeah, yeah, And
Speaker 8: I'm going like sure, sure, shirt. And then the flip
Speaker 8: side of it, which is you see sweaty James with Mellie.
Speaker 8: It's the pet of like three scene beat.
Speaker 6: It's like a play. Their their story is a play.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I came to the realization watching this episode and watching
Speaker 5: those scenes with Jeff Perry flipping out, blowing his top
Speaker 5: like he does, and I thought that is the reason
Speaker 5: that why Jeff Perry the actor is always so chill.
Speaker 5: He has that I just had an amazing orgasm vibe.
Speaker 8: Well put you know what I mean.
Speaker 5: He's so chill and relaxed and I'm like, it's because
Speaker 5: he got that shit all out doing these scenes and
Speaker 5: scandal like for seven seasons, right, oh.
Speaker 8: Without a doubt. And like jeff Perry marches down a
Speaker 8: hallway pissed better than anybody I've ever seen in my life.
Speaker 3: Do you know that?
Speaker 8: On that shot when he's walking down the tunnel.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, doesn't he take his jacket off?
Speaker 8: He's amazing. I'm also obsessed with Jeffrey's hair, but that's
Speaker 8: a different issue. Oh my god, he's got this great
Speaker 8: sort of like puffy hair in this which.
Speaker 6: He just just totally totally does. I love that scene.
Speaker 5: I love the scene with Olivia and Cyrus outside in
Speaker 5: the park that used to be a graveyard, remember, And
Speaker 5: then at the end Olivia says it also used to
Speaker 5: be a zoo, which I think.
Speaker 6: That what does that mean?
Speaker 8: Well, I think I mean there's still animals there, exactly. Yeah,
Speaker 8: it used to be a zoo, so we fit right in.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh it's such a great scene.
Speaker 8: I also loved, weirdly all the voyeuristic stuff, which was
Speaker 8: fully Sorry, Jake, I know I love it, but Jake,
Speaker 8: the constant scenes have been watching himself having sex with Olivia,
Speaker 8: which is just you.
Speaker 4: I want to make fun of him so bad. I
Speaker 4: text him that all the times. I'm like, yep, I'm
Speaker 4: on the episode where you're watching yourself throw Olivia on
Speaker 4: the counter.
Speaker 6: Jeez, weirdo.
Speaker 3: Sometimes we have to look down.
Speaker 5: Katie and I have have said this that sometimes we're
Speaker 5: watching an episode where fits in Olivia or or you know,
Speaker 5: Scott and Olivia and olivia're having sex, and I can't
Speaker 5: look at the screen because I'm like, we know them,
Speaker 5: they are friends.
Speaker 3: It's like, what are you doing?
Speaker 8: I have to say it is it's weirder now that
Speaker 8: we've all known each other for so long.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, yes, I was.
Speaker 8: Watching this stuff and I would have flashes of like,
Speaker 8: can I remember going to the Democratic National Convention with
Speaker 8: Tony what twenty sixteen or whatever it was, and Tony
Speaker 8: and his wife and all anybody.
Speaker 6: Could see was that, Oh yeah, women were as.
Speaker 8: Swissed with him. They got it.
Speaker 3: They still are.
Speaker 4: It's really wild. Wait another one, the freaking Harrison Dean
Speaker 4: oh in Olivia, Yes, where he's like end game, what is.
Speaker 3: You're my client? Yeah?
Speaker 8: And also this weird thing where she's passing the torch.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, I love that.
Speaker 8: Scene because it's the first time she tries to patch
Speaker 8: the torch. A couple of times over the course of
Speaker 8: the series, but this, I think is the first time
Speaker 8: you see her say I'm out. And I just kept
Speaker 8: thinking how emotionally incredibly disappointing it is, how she always
Speaker 8: has to do the right thing. And they did one
Speaker 8: thing wrong, yeah, which was a big thing.
Speaker 6: Oh, they just read a little election.
Speaker 8: Hey, ye know, they did one thing wrong. But that
Speaker 8: over and over and over again, she has to to
Speaker 8: sacrifice that thing. You know where in the episode before
Speaker 8: where they sit and they watch the clock and the album.
Speaker 6: Leaf time have run out.
Speaker 8: The album leaf stuff comes in, which is just like,
Speaker 8: oh my god, and you know, Mellie's talking and she
Speaker 8: realizes that it's actually really going to happen. And then
Speaker 8: she starts this episode and she's she's like lighter. And
Speaker 8: I keep watching the costumes too, in terms of what
Speaker 8: people are wearing, like she's in a slightly sort of
Speaker 8: like it feels slightly air and then little by little
Speaker 8: by little, you see it dawn on her. And it's
Speaker 8: a genius of Carrie, like you see it dawn on her.
Speaker 8: Over the course of the episode that they can't do this,
Speaker 8: that Cyrus is right.
Speaker 4: That he needs to get a second term and he's
Speaker 4: got to win. I know you're right. Her acting at
Speaker 4: the beginning of this episode, there's so much about her like,
Speaker 4: oh my god, I'm going to get what I want.
Speaker 4: I'm gonna not live this life. I'm going to be
Speaker 4: with the man that I love. I can have normal
Speaker 4: or whatever. Yeah, whatever that means to her. And then
Speaker 4: you watch it slowly, act by act break down. She's
Speaker 4: holding onto it and she's passing over Opa. She's done
Speaker 4: being a fixer.
Speaker 6: She can do it. She can do it.
Speaker 4: And in that scene you guys were talking about the zoo,
Speaker 4: she's still holding onto it. And then she starts. There's
Speaker 4: that part where Cyrus is like, don't do this to me,
Speaker 4: don't do this to us. Then she finds out about
Speaker 4: the paper that he never submitted.
Speaker 6: That's the paper what's it called, what's it called?
Speaker 5: The thing saying that he wants to again, Yeah.
Speaker 4: Never submitted it because he didn't think he deserved it,
Speaker 4: and so she ends their relationship again. It's just like,
Speaker 4: they keep us on this line, man, for seven seasons.
Speaker 6: They keep us on this They.
Speaker 8: Super super do. But then I also am like, I
Speaker 8: was so delighted about the fact that Charlie makes an
Speaker 8: entrance and now there's a Charlie in the world as well.
Speaker 8: But also I just have to say for the record,
Speaker 8: and I will prove myself to be the idiot I am.
Speaker 8: I totally had forgotten that Billy Chambers comes back.
Speaker 3: Oh, I forgot too. I watched it. I was like, oh, Billy,
Speaker 3: Billy Chambers, you're not alone.
Speaker 8: I the last time I saw Billy Chambers was he
Speaker 8: was stabbing somebody with scissors.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Like.
Speaker 8: To totally forgot that Billy Chambers is in the car, which, by.
Speaker 4: The way, speaking of table reads, sometimes y'all would do
Speaker 4: that to us too, which is we wouldn't know what
Speaker 4: the storyline of what was happening, and then all of
Speaker 4: a sudden, Billy Chambers would come back, or Greg Henry
Speaker 4: or somebody had been around in two years or something,
Speaker 4: and then they'd come back and we're.
Speaker 3: Like, what are you doing?
Speaker 6: Like we've learned that way that they're going to be
Speaker 6: a part of it.
Speaker 8: Oh, and how long did it take me to understand
Speaker 8: that Billy and Tom are brothers?
Speaker 3: Matt and Brian Lesher.
Speaker 6: Yeah, Matt and Brian Lesher great actors.
Speaker 8: It took me like. It wasn't until somebody said, you
Speaker 8: know their brothers.
Speaker 4: I was like, really, wait, So we learned that Charlie
Speaker 4: took the cidetron hard but it's okay.
Speaker 3: No, well we think he did, but it was really
Speaker 3: it was really Rosen.
Speaker 4: It was David Rosen, yes, and he gave it to
Speaker 4: Billy Chamber because.
Speaker 8: David Rosen is not happy with the election fraud and
Speaker 8: he keeps making it clearer. No, it's listening to him.
Speaker 8: All he wants to know is like, who's fits having
Speaker 8: sex with? And you all did this really funny thing
Speaker 8: where you keep going on that part. They take their
Speaker 8: heads and they look around a lot, or they dip
Speaker 8: their heads down.
Speaker 4: Look down, look at each other, and he's like, oh,
Speaker 4: I wonder who's banging the president and we all know
Speaker 4: it's Olivia's that We're like, dude.
Speaker 8: It was also this great moment where Quinn obviously knows
Speaker 8: how to dismember a body. At this point, you look
Speaker 8: at Huck and you're so pleased with yourself.
Speaker 3: And Abby says, ooh baby, oh.
Speaker 4: Baby, I say some shit about hacking We're like trying
Speaker 4: to send a trojan horse to Sally Langston's daughter.
Speaker 6: That was it.
Speaker 8: I love this Sally Langston thing. And then it's David
Speaker 8: Rosen who comes up with the thing.
Speaker 6: Yeah, who's like, you got to get the meanest mean girl.
Speaker 3: Which is so true. That's true.
Speaker 6: Oh my god.
Speaker 8: And then there's that really funny picture of this girl
Speaker 8: with this nose before a nose job that was so vicious.
Speaker 4: They must have built that, Like it looked so terrible
Speaker 4: glue did you use like that?
Speaker 3: It was like nozola on her face.
Speaker 8: Wow, she was like the wicked witch in the Wizard
Speaker 8: of Oz. Like.
Speaker 4: I was like, is that like Shylock from Merchant to
Speaker 4: Venice likes Shakespeare?
Speaker 8: Katie Way to bring the level of the podcast up,
Speaker 8: it looked really ridiculous.
Speaker 4: I was like, this is so insane. Wait, some fun
Speaker 4: facts about this episode. Sally says, the name of the
Speaker 4: previous episode a woman scorn.
Speaker 6: She's doing a walk and.
Speaker 4: Talk down the White House hallways with Jeff and.
Speaker 8: She's like trying to find out information.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Mellie's gonna come out tonight, She's gonna say it,
Speaker 4: and well, you know, like the Bible says, hell, haf
Speaker 4: no fury, like a woman scorned, and Jeff says something
Speaker 4: like not everything's in the bally. Yeah, we should do
Speaker 4: the whole series again and Guillermo should play in Cyrus. Okay,
Speaker 4: since it wasn't said last time, it has been said
Speaker 4: in almost every episode so far. According to the timeline
Speaker 4: within the Scandal universe, Billy has been missing for a
Speaker 4: year and six months.
Speaker 8: This is when I'm saying till like, this is what
Speaker 8: I'm saying, What the hell? What's the deal?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 6: I mean, where'd he go? What's he been doing?
Speaker 3: But how exciting when he pops back up right and like,
Speaker 3: what the fuck?
Speaker 8: It's amazing, yo.
Speaker 5: One thing that I loved is one of the opening
Speaker 5: scenes when Jeff Perry when Cyrus goes to Olivia's apartment
Speaker 5: and is trying to get into the apartment and he's
Speaker 5: yelling at Tom and the other guy, the other security
Speaker 5: guy blowing his top again I know.
Speaker 8: And then don't you love it when he tries to
Speaker 8: go back again and he has the assistant lie to
Speaker 8: get him in. Oh yes, he gets there, and the
Speaker 8: same thing happens this time it's Jake. It's just like
Speaker 8: that man cannot get in that woman's apartment no matter
Speaker 8: what he does.
Speaker 4: Also, my god, how how much sex to fits in
Speaker 4: Olivia I have to have in this series.
Speaker 8: It's like unbelievable. As I would say, I think most
Speaker 8: of us. It either makes you feel like that's incredible
Speaker 8: or I just feel bad about my life.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I just me.
Speaker 4: I always think, like, God, did they have to shoot
Speaker 4: that at five am on like a one day?
Speaker 3: You know what I mean?
Speaker 4: I alwaysistically, was it like at worked that day?
Speaker 7: Oh?
Speaker 8: Oh oh, teacher, teacher, teacher.
Speaker 3: Also Beetsy Beer, thank you?
Speaker 8: Did Josh Melina have a cold or the flu when
Speaker 8: we were filming that episode?
Speaker 3: Oh my god, Betsy, I thought the same thing.
Speaker 8: I remember that there was a couple of episodes where
Speaker 8: he was like really sick. When he was describing the nose.
Speaker 8: I turned to Bruce and I said, I remember this
Speaker 8: because I remember we didn't know if we could shoot
Speaker 8: with Josh because I think Josh had the flu or something.
Speaker 3: You could hear.
Speaker 6: This and I was like, Oh, no, someone's got a cold.
Speaker 6: And you know what's so funny in this post COVID.
Speaker 3: World, like that would have never happened.
Speaker 6: Things have changed so much.
Speaker 4: Were like if you're really sick like that, Like you
Speaker 4: can't go on a set and expose all of your castmates.
Speaker 6: But the seven years of Scandal, we used to work,
Speaker 6: oh full on fucking slugs. Oh you like, just get
Speaker 6: it done.
Speaker 4: If you can stand and you can walk, you can act,
Speaker 4: get it together.
Speaker 8: The only rule was you couldn't do love scenes if
Speaker 8: you like had a fever or lots and lots of
Speaker 8: snot right. So that was the only kind of waterloo.
Speaker 8: But everybody would show up like hacking. Oh yeah, just
Speaker 8: feeling sea dumbiting, he doesn't like a little diarrhea.
Speaker 6: Gee, did you ever have to not come because you
Speaker 6: were so sick?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 5: I remember the one time I almost didn't come. They
Speaker 5: sent a doctor to my.
Speaker 8: House to make sure you could.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and she gave me like a shot and like
Speaker 5: a Z pack, and I was fine the next day.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean fine enough.
Speaker 4: How about when you came to work and you'd been
Speaker 4: in the emergency room the whole night before because you,
Speaker 4: by accident, were at a restaurant and had nuts and
Speaker 4: you're definitely allergic, and your whole body blew up.
Speaker 5: Yes, And then I got a cold sore on my lip,
Speaker 5: and we had to do that sex scene in the
Speaker 5: conference room and Tom was like, Okay, it's gonna be
Speaker 5: from behind, so we weren't facing each other.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we had to adjust.
Speaker 8: That would be Tom Verica, our producer. Yes, of course
Speaker 8: it's an actor, and not only was like the show
Speaker 8: must go on, but figured out a way to film it.
Speaker 4: Yep, on top of g on the conference wooden table.
Speaker 4: We were supposed to make out and have sex, and
Speaker 4: then he walked in and he was like, I'm so sorry,
Speaker 4: I'm a cold sore. So I remembered Tom being like, oh,
Speaker 4: it's okay.
Speaker 6: He could just flip you around and the whole thing
Speaker 6: just happens from behind. I was like, okay, and we
Speaker 6: did it.
Speaker 3: What season was that?
Speaker 2: Was that?
Speaker 3: Like? Season three? I don't know your I think it's four.
Speaker 6: Idea, we'll get there. We will be back with more
Speaker 6: after the break.
Speaker 5: We also forgot to talk about the scene with you,
Speaker 5: me and George Newburn Katie. I love that when I
Speaker 5: have him taped up and I'm about to shoot him
Speaker 5: after he gives us gives me the name of the mole,
Speaker 5: and then Katie walks in with this beautifully like dun
Speaker 5: hair and like hot lipstick. Did you notice that you
Speaker 5: were like all made up?
Speaker 8: Well, that was the thing. One of the things that
Speaker 8: you do really notice is how shiny it is, Like
Speaker 8: the whole show is super shiny. Everybody's up. It's a
Speaker 8: really clean and pressed and you always look neat and
Speaker 8: even after sex like fits. His shirts are crisp and
Speaker 8: they come and Katie looked like, oh, just come off
Speaker 8: like guest hosting Good Morning America.
Speaker 6: My hair was just had come out of a set
Speaker 6: of rollers.
Speaker 8: You literally look like you're a guest hosting with Ryan Seacrest.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it was too much. I look better on this
Speaker 6: show than.
Speaker 4: That, honestly, Like I was like, also, I mean somebody,
Speaker 4: I think I've gotten better at acting since then. My god,
Speaker 4: it is hard for me to sometimes watch these scenes.
Speaker 6: I'm like, what am I too doing? Like why, yeah.
Speaker 8: I'm so good, You're so high on stupidity.
Speaker 3: That's all in your head. We all need ourselves.
Speaker 4: Nobody's thinking that how much chapstick lip gloss could I
Speaker 4: possibly have on b Why am I talking like that?
Speaker 4: Like why can't I just talk normal? Like what is happening?
Speaker 4: I just am over the top acting and thank god,
Speaker 4: Shanda and Betsy didn't kill Quinn off because I was like,
Speaker 4: I am a failure, Like this.
Speaker 8: Is hysterical, you're such a weirdo, Like you're so good.
Speaker 8: And the whole point is Quinn was from the moment
Speaker 8: you meet her, she's over eager, she's performative, she's she
Speaker 8: puts that out there. That's the whole point. The same
Speaker 8: way Huck is, you know, a semi vegetable half the
Speaker 8: time until he comes.
Speaker 6: Alive murdering people.
Speaker 8: I mean, what's great is you get to know Huck
Speaker 8: is you go It's almost like there's a trigger that
Speaker 8: was built into him that at a particular point he
Speaker 8: has to kill, like this is all he was good for.
Speaker 8: Oh and that characters. What's great to me is as
Speaker 8: you watch the show progress over the seasons, everybody really
Speaker 8: knows how to write for the characters as they are.
Speaker 8: You all pivoted as your characters would change. That's the
Speaker 8: most incredible thing. So no shit talking about one's performance.
Speaker 6: I say that to people all the time.
Speaker 4: I feel really lucky, Like I think a lot of
Speaker 4: times if you're if you're an actor and you're lucky
Speaker 4: enough to land lightning in a bottle.
Speaker 6: When you do, or if you do.
Speaker 4: Most of the times the character you book is how
Speaker 4: they stay for seven years, like especially on a sitcom
Speaker 4: or especially like it is very rare for your character
Speaker 4: to change. And that's what I thought was so awesome
Speaker 4: about Scandal was like I got to do.
Speaker 6: The craziest shit in the whole world.
Speaker 4: And if you had showed me Quen season five, six
Speaker 4: seven compared to one, two, three and all the I
Speaker 4: mean the characters.
Speaker 7: Melilly, Smelly, Melly, Yeah season two, like Mellie is she's
Speaker 7: very self righteous and she's doing that low ballomy voice,
Speaker 7: and she's wearing her suit and she's.
Speaker 8: Very angry about everything. And then you think about where
Speaker 8: we got to where you have, and so much of
Speaker 8: it to me, in terms of the writing, is about
Speaker 8: I've always said about this company, about what Shonda creates
Speaker 8: and the writers. Everybody's three dimensional. As you start to
Speaker 8: get to know a character, you think you know them,
Speaker 8: and then something comes out, either in flashback or backstory
Speaker 8: or their Achilles heel, and everything changes about how you
Speaker 8: feel about those characters. And to the point where you know,
Speaker 8: Olivia Pope brains the vice president with a chair.
Speaker 3: That's right, and you're kind of like.
Speaker 5: You had it coming well and also even fits killing Verna,
Speaker 5: like all that shit was like.
Speaker 4: What, yeah, how about the season where Fitz was just
Speaker 4: a drunk, like just a mean, fucking drunk.
Speaker 6: Sure, he's like awful to Melly.
Speaker 3: He's after he got shot.
Speaker 8: It's also like you meet us dad and you understand
Speaker 8: the whole thing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Barry boss Wick like.
Speaker 8: Oh, the poor Barry Poster. I mean he was like
Speaker 8: the Robert bridegrim on Broadway and there he was just
Speaker 8: being terrible. But yeah, No, it's those layers and depth
Speaker 8: and the fact that very often the plot, which is
Speaker 8: so incredibly engaging and involving, reveals not only another plot
Speaker 8: point that either traumatizes or changes the way that you
Speaker 8: operate as characters, but reveals something deeper that you didn't
Speaker 8: know existed, which then allows the character to keep growing.
Speaker 8: It's really cool and incredibly layered.
Speaker 6: We felt very, very very lucky to do that.
Speaker 4: Wait, fortunately, before we let you go, and we're going
Speaker 4: to read some tweets at the time, was there any
Speaker 4: of your favorite memories that come to mind.
Speaker 5: Like meeting me and Katie for the first time, Well,
Speaker 5: i'd met you.
Speaker 8: Before, Gamo, so I was so excited to see you
Speaker 8: because it was like a creepy reunion where I, like
Speaker 8: you first meet. He was in two hundred Cigarettes, which
Speaker 8: was the first movie I produced, and Ghirmo was hysterical
Speaker 8: and really really good in the movie.
Speaker 3: It's like a cult underground, like people love them. It's
Speaker 3: such a great movie.
Speaker 8: So I loved Gharma like and Ghirmou did me the
Speaker 8: ultimate solid, which we talked about in the podcast, which
Speaker 8: is yes, it's a long story, but he ended up
Speaker 8: playing Angie Featherstone in the back of a cap so
Speaker 8: I wouldn't have to dye my hair carrot orange and
Speaker 8: do a double for her because she wasn't with us anymore.
Speaker 8: She hadn't die, she just had to go on to
Speaker 8: another job. But I remember distinctly like being really excited
Speaker 8: to see Gheramo, and I'd met you a couple of times, Katie,
Speaker 8: because we came really close to casting you twice before,
Speaker 8: and we also had You've been You were in Gray's
Speaker 8: Anatomy too, weren't you.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm private practice.
Speaker 8: Yeah, And I remember Seanda said, you get to call
Speaker 8: Ghirrimo and tell me about the part because you know
Speaker 8: him and you love him. So I got to call Ghirrimo.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, yes, I remember that.
Speaker 8: Yes I got to call Gaermeau. But you know what,
Speaker 8: there's so much the casting process was really fun. I
Speaker 8: don't know if they're all of these weird because we
Speaker 8: all we all would hang out together too. Sometimes I would,
Speaker 8: I would see you all.
Speaker 6: Yeah, we went upfronts together. We went two things together.
Speaker 8: I remember, do you remember these sacks fit the avenue
Speaker 8: window things?
Speaker 3: Yes, Oh my god, we were Mannikins.
Speaker 8: We took over Sacksmith Avenue and they had sacks with
Speaker 8: avenue hosted. I think was Lynn pallow Is, the costume
Speaker 8: our brilliant costume designer who worked with a lot since
Speaker 8: and we sort of took over sacks We had this
Speaker 8: big party and there were all of these scandal mannequins
Speaker 8: with clothes on in the sax window, and all the
Speaker 8: actors climbed into the windows and stood next to their mannequins.
Speaker 8: And we couldn't get out of like a hotel without
Speaker 8: bringing you guys through the kitchen.
Speaker 3: It was Inese. Yes, we walked through so many kids.
Speaker 8: We went through so many kitchens in those days. So
Speaker 8: I remember, like all of those times the table reads.
Speaker 8: I remarily really well, and I remember realizing when the
Speaker 8: show was going to hit and sitting everyone down because
Speaker 8: we've been through with Grays and as I mean, I
Speaker 8: remember sitting down with you all and basically saying, Okay,
Speaker 8: so your lives are going to change and you have
Speaker 8: to be prepared for the fact that it's going to
Speaker 8: get really weird. And Katie was like, what do you mean.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, I was like, why what are you talking about?
Speaker 4: This is what I remember, though, you guys being so
Speaker 4: giving and saying like, if you need anything, if something happens,
Speaker 4: like you get a fender bender, all the shit, you
Speaker 4: call me, call me. I don't want to find out
Speaker 4: Monday morning and the trade like you know, you guys
Speaker 4: had already been through a hit happening on Grays and
Speaker 4: it's skyrocketing so quickly. I think the greatest thing that
Speaker 4: happened to Scandal with it was a little bit more
Speaker 4: of a slower burn that people got turned onto the
Speaker 4: show like it was like it builds it was season two.
Speaker 8: Yeah, it was like a bad season one under your belt.
Speaker 8: But the weirdest thing about it was because it didn't
Speaker 8: shoot out like a cannon when we started The weirdest
Speaker 8: thing was you were already used to it being fine
Speaker 8: to do whatever you wanted to do. You were going
Speaker 8: into like Loman's dressing room. So what everybody needs to
Speaker 8: know is like their Lomans was the store where you
Speaker 8: went in. There were communal dressing rooms. They had them
Speaker 8: in New York and different stores, And if you're from
Speaker 8: the East Coast, you're really used to this. And we
Speaker 8: found out as the show was becoming gigantic that Katie
Speaker 8: was still going into Lomans in the public dressing room
Speaker 8: and change your clothes. And I remember specifically saying, Katie,
Speaker 8: you can't go in the public dressing rooms anymore. Nope,
Speaker 8: because you're going to end up in your bronz panting.
Speaker 6: People are going to take photos of me and your
Speaker 6: underwear on the intranet.
Speaker 4: Yeah no, thank God said something to me. I was like,
Speaker 4: I think things are starting to get weird.
Speaker 8: The sales, you missed, the.
Speaker 6: Sales, sales all the time.
Speaker 4: Listen to some tweets at a time, y'all is the
Speaker 4: best improv.
Speaker 3: Artists and Whistler apparently.
Speaker 6: Wait, Betsy, did you join the Twitter for this show?
Speaker 6: Like we all did? I'm not on it. Much anymore.
Speaker 8: But I joined the tweets kate for this show specifically,
Speaker 8: and now I'm not.
Speaker 3: Yeah wait should I be off Twitter? Yes? Do I
Speaker 3: need to get off Twitter? Yeah?
Speaker 8: Right, I'm not off. I just don't check it or
Speaker 8: go on it for age.
Speaker 3: It's so sad and angry.
Speaker 4: Now, I know what I like about these is that
Speaker 4: it was a real time capsule for what was going on.
Speaker 4: Like at official JP Peace and Power Planet is coming.
Speaker 4: Me and my brother just had the ill convo trying
Speaker 4: to figure out who the mole is on hashtag scandal.
Speaker 6: This fool thinks it's fits. Lol, Guys the.
Speaker 5: Mole, that damn mole and then do better, y'all. At
Speaker 5: Miss Lynn ninety three tweeted, wait, what if how is
Speaker 5: the mole? I knew he blinked too much hashtag scandal.
Speaker 6: This is a good one.
Speaker 4: At sunny Chaie tweeted, So I just told a friend
Speaker 4: that I think Harrison is the mole on Scandal.
Speaker 6: I think she just about passed out. Lol. We both
Speaker 6: hope and I'm wrong. Here's the thing.
Speaker 5: People were invested, man, They really were trying to figure
Speaker 5: out who the male was.
Speaker 4: We're so invested. And my favorite line of the episode
Speaker 4: might be. Quinn was like, if I say the word
Speaker 4: mole one more.
Speaker 3: One more time? Yes, that was so good and you were.
Speaker 8: Right, Betsy, Thank you so thank so much, so much fun.
Speaker 8: Anytime you just want me on to talk randomly about
Speaker 8: shit that has nothing to do with anything.
Speaker 5: We definitely want to have you back on. We should
Speaker 5: switch the roles and have her host and you and
Speaker 5: I be the guests on on this podcast.
Speaker 6: Yeah, because she's such a better host than.
Speaker 8: Guys are so full of shit. Your eyes are brown.
Speaker 6: I've never heard that before.
Speaker 8: Thank you so much for having me. This was so
Speaker 8: much fun. I didn't have to work for like an hour.
Speaker 4: This was so great And now you have so much
Speaker 4: to do. And next up we've got the finale of
Speaker 4: season two, episode two two, which is so good. White
Speaker 4: hats back on people, and I think we have a
Speaker 4: very very very another very special guest in our back
Speaker 4: pocket coming. So make sure you tune into all your
Speaker 4: friends like subscribe Unpacking the tool Yes at Girmo, how
Speaker 4: do we say it en Espano.
Speaker 3: De Ramientas Unpacking the Toolbox and.
Speaker 6: Espanol Adeos Gladiators.
Speaker 5: Thank you everybody, by Betsy, thank you guys for joining
Speaker 5: us on Unpacking the Toolbox. If you enjoyed the show,
Speaker 5: please subscribe, share with your friends, rate, or leave us
Speaker 5: a review.
Speaker 4: Scandal is executive produced by Sandy Bailey, Alex Alce, Lauren Homan,
Speaker 4: Tyler Klang, and Gabrielle Collins. Our producer and editor is
Speaker 4: Vince De Johnny, with music by Chad Fisher. Unpacking the
Speaker 4: Toolbox is a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with iHeartRadio.
Speaker 4: For more podcasts from Shondaland Audio, visit the iHeartRadio app
Speaker 4: or anywhere you subscribe to your favorite shows.