Speaker 1: Good morning, Peepsen. Welcome to wok F Daily with Meet
Speaker 1: Your Girl Daniel Moody, recording from the Home Bunker. Folks,
Speaker 1: I'm excited about today's conversation and interview with Gina Ortiz Jones,
Speaker 1: who is the founder of the find Out Pack. The
Speaker 1: find Out Pack is exactly what you think it is,
Speaker 1: fuck around and find out. This pack is dedicated to
Speaker 1: going after the three Texas Supreme Court Justices Jimmy, John,
Speaker 1: and Jane who have come for the reproductive rights of
Speaker 1: women and people with uteruses inside of the state of Texas.
Speaker 1: And you know, I think that what strikes me so
Speaker 1: much in the conversation with Gina is that in order
Speaker 1: for us to win, we really truly need to understand
Speaker 1: where the power actually lies, right and so for far
Speaker 1: too long we have believed as Democrats that the power
Speaker 1: lied in the executive branch, in the presidency, and so
Speaker 1: we pay attention every four years, and in between that
Speaker 1: time we go back to business as usual. Well, what
Speaker 1: we've been able to truly grasp over the last eight
Speaker 1: or so years under trumpsm is that that is not
Speaker 1: where power lies actually, and that power lies in the courts,
Speaker 1: power lies in the election of attorney generals and district
Speaker 1: attorneys and ultimately the appointment of judges. Right because what
Speaker 1: we know about Congress, for instance, is that their wheels
Speaker 1: turn incredibly fucking slow, and that most of our rights
Speaker 1: that we are still hanging onto were one in court battles.
Speaker 1: So then why wouldn't our attention be directed at the
Speaker 1: very courts that decide our fates. So I love this
Speaker 1: conversation with Gina because the find Out Pack is very
Speaker 1: clear about who they are targeting, how they are targeting,
Speaker 1: and are going full throttle. And that is what I
Speaker 1: want people to be doing, state by state, right, district
Speaker 1: by district, or Steve Bannon said, village by village, flood
Speaker 1: the zone right, going after these seats of power that
Speaker 1: have long been held by Republicans without objection. And now
Speaker 1: that we know that they are not to be trusted.
Speaker 1: Right now that we know and they make no you know,
Speaker 1: mix up of their intentions for this country, it's time
Speaker 1: that we understand how power works. So coming up next,
Speaker 1: my conversation with Gina Ortiz Jones, Folks, I am very
Speaker 1: excited to welcome to wok F Daily Gina Ortiz Jones,
Speaker 1: who is the founder of the find Out Political Action Committee,
Speaker 1: and served during the Biden administration as Undersecretary of the
Speaker 1: Air Force from July twenty twenty one to March twenty
Speaker 1: twenty three. Gina, I want to start with the fact
Speaker 1: that a couple of weeks ago we saw a horrific
Speaker 1: report GRAB headlines that since the overturning of Roe v. Wade,
Speaker 1: there has been sixty thousand plus rape based pregnancies in
Speaker 1: the fourteen states that have denied abortion, even in the
Speaker 1: case of rape, in the case of incest, in the
Speaker 1: case of fetal abnormalities and non viability. I wanted to
Speaker 1: get your thoughts on that astounding number and the ramifications
Speaker 1: thereof that we've seen in such a short time of
Speaker 1: the overturning of Roe v. Wade.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, and thanks again for having me on. I
Speaker 2: think you know that number in and of itself is
Speaker 2: astounding when you think of the fourteen states, and as
Speaker 2: you mentioned, the sixty thousand rape related pregnancies. But let's
Speaker 2: be very clear, twenty six thousand of those, just over
Speaker 2: twenty six thousand of those are in Texas alone, right,
Speaker 2: and so we are disproportionately impacted by this, just given
Speaker 2: the sheer size of our state. One in ten kids
Speaker 2: in this country calls Texas home. And you know, the
Speaker 2: reason I really wanted to, you know, start this pack
Speaker 2: is in part based on what the Texas Supreme Court
Speaker 2: just decided, but also understanding that, look, you know, ascoes Texas,
Speaker 2: so goes this country. Right. Texas traditionally been kind of
Speaker 2: training ground, a greeting ground, if you will, for some
Speaker 2: of the more extremest policies that are exten exported to
Speaker 2: other parts of the country. And so I think it's
Speaker 2: always really important to aggregate the data and truly understand.
Speaker 2: I mean that just one of the states is responsible
Speaker 2: for almost half of these in light of as you mentioned,
Speaker 2: you know, they're not not being any exceptions in the state,
Speaker 2: for with exception of the metal, which now is even
Speaker 2: in debate given the Texas Supreme Court's decision in December,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: And it's wild because you know, Governor Greg Abbott, he
Speaker 1: told us that he was going to eliminate all rapes.
Speaker 1: So I'm surprised that it hasn't happened, and that these
Speaker 1: numbers are just off the charts. I think what gets
Speaker 1: me about, in particular, the state of Texas is not
Speaker 1: even how draconian the policies are, but that, like you said,
Speaker 1: it is a petri dish for how they want to
Speaker 1: nationalize these types of laws. And when you look at
Speaker 1: the case of and I want to of Kate Cox,
Speaker 1: and Kate Cox, you know, making national headlines when she
Speaker 1: went to go seek an abortion because she had a
Speaker 1: non viable pregnancy, this fetus not going to make it,
Speaker 1: and a panel of judges told her no, right, And
Speaker 1: I just want to get your reactions to some of
Speaker 1: the stories. We've heard women testify before Congress, we've heard
Speaker 1: them in press conferences, and yet for these you know,
Speaker 1: largely white male bodies, whether it is the Missouri you know, Senate,
Speaker 1: whether it is the Texas governor, nothing seems to penetrate.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think. So let me just back up a
Speaker 2: little bit and how this how this started for me? So, yes,
Speaker 2: it was December of last year, and I remember reading
Speaker 2: as the country was about the about Kate Cox's case
Speaker 2: and I and I obviously also was astounded by the
Speaker 2: decision to deny deny her access to this abortion for
Speaker 2: the medical exception. So I took the time to actually
Speaker 2: read the seven page Texas Supreme Court ruling, and essentially
Speaker 2: what they said is that this woman was not close
Speaker 2: enough to losing either her life or losing her fertility
Speaker 2: to qualify for the exception. So obviously I had a
Speaker 2: very visceral reaction to that because it just it raises
Speaker 2: some very basic questions, right, which is one, Okay, well,
Speaker 2: how close is close enough? We talk in hours, we
Speaker 2: talk in minutes. But also, who are y'all you know
Speaker 2: these partisan judges? And we are one of the few
Speaker 2: states where we actually elect our judges and justices to
Speaker 2: include the Texas Supreme Court, through partisan elections, And so
Speaker 2: who are you, these partisan justices to say that you
Speaker 2: know better than her doctor, much less anyone else's doctor.
Speaker 2: And then for me, the last question was, all right, well,
Speaker 2: how do we get this better? Because this is not right?
Speaker 2: And in looking at the the nine justices, they are
Speaker 2: all Republican. They run as statewide folks, statewide candidates. These
Speaker 2: folks are elected, which means they can be unelected, Danielle,
Speaker 2: And that is what we are, that is what we're
Speaker 2: working to do. I think, you know, we're very encouraged.
Speaker 2: This is the first time ever, this is the first
Speaker 2: time ever that we have tried to change the makeup
Speaker 2: of the Texas Supreme Court. These folks that have never
Speaker 2: had kind of this type of focus and attention that
Speaker 2: they will come twenty twenty four due to find out.
Speaker 2: Pack Secondly, we are encouraged also by what we are
Speaker 2: seeing in states like Kansas and Kentucky, you know, states
Speaker 2: that have very similar political compositions, if you will, to
Speaker 2: our own state. And even in those states, when the
Speaker 2: issue was put before voters, voters overwhelmingly voted to protect
Speaker 2: reproductive freedoms. And so our ballot initiative is a little
Speaker 2: bit different in that we are going to hold Jimmy,
Speaker 2: John and Jane accountable. That's actually their names, just Jimmy Blacklock,
Speaker 2: John Devine, and Jane Bland accountable for the ways in
Speaker 2: which they have made it more dangerous to be a
Speaker 2: woman in Texas and by the reproductive freedoms of so
Speaker 2: many women. And then lastly, let me just say, I know,
Speaker 2: you know, I know folks are like they hear these
Speaker 2: stories coming out of Texas, but let's be very clear,
Speaker 2: there is a difference between where these partisan justices are
Speaker 2: on this issue and where Texans are on this issue.
Speaker 2: So in February of twenty twenty three, there was a
Speaker 2: survey that was published by Survey Results Rather that was
Speaker 2: published by the University of Houston, the Hobby School of
Speaker 2: Public Affairs, and in that the results eighty two percent
Speaker 2: of Texans survey support medical exceptions. I mean, it's not
Speaker 2: even close, right, And so I think when we put
Speaker 2: this and talk about this as a valid initiative, this is,
Speaker 2: you know, for folks that are pissed off or how
Speaker 2: these women have been treated, this is their opportunity to
Speaker 2: have their voice heard. And it starts with flipping those
Speaker 2: seats Jimmy John and Jane and you know, if i'm
Speaker 2: I also, I think it's really important. So it's the
Speaker 2: issue itself. But as I was also looking into the
Speaker 2: backgrounds of these folks, Danielle, Yeah, they're just not fit.
Speaker 2: They're just not fit for the Texas Supreme Court. I think,
Speaker 2: you know, you and I grew up probably with the
Speaker 2: same visual of justice, which is a woman in a
Speaker 2: rowe blindfolded, holding the scale right, impartial, and it's about
Speaker 2: the facts, and that's just not what we have on
Speaker 2: the Texas Supreme Court, let alone in Jimmy John and
Speaker 2: Jane and I say their names just to be clear
Speaker 2: for folks that they say their names, because these are
Speaker 2: the three that are on the ballot in November twenty
Speaker 2: twenty four. So let me give you a snippet of
Speaker 2: these folks. In twenty eighteen, at a Texas rally for Life,
Speaker 2: Governor Abbott said about John Divine, quote, I don't have
Speaker 2: to guests or wonder how just Blacklock is going to
Speaker 2: decide cases because of his proven record of fighting for
Speaker 2: pro life causes. Right, that's one John Divine. This guy's
Speaker 2: real special. This guy has campaigned, campaigned on his own
Speaker 2: wife's tyris pregnancy. He's campaigned on being arrested dozens of
Speaker 2: times for protesting in front of abortion clinics. And then
Speaker 2: Jane Bland, she wrote an opinion in a separate case
Speaker 2: where the Texas Supreme Court ruled that anti abortion groups
Speaker 2: could not be held liable for defamation for equating abortion
Speaker 2: to murder. So can you, I mean, just like you,
Speaker 2: try to put yourself in the shoes of these women
Speaker 2: that are going through the justice system and in good
Speaker 2: faith trying to seek justice through by the way, on
Speaker 2: top of this very traumatic experience that they have already
Speaker 2: personally experienced, they are their family members, and then they
Speaker 2: go through the court system, and then they find out
Speaker 2: that these three among the others are the ones that
Speaker 2: are going to hear their case. Like that doesn't instill
Speaker 2: any level of confidence in terms of impartiality or them
Speaker 2: even having a fair share a justice here. Right, So
Speaker 2: I think we've got a real opportunity. These folks run
Speaker 2: statewide and again encouraged by one where Texans are on
Speaker 2: the issue, but also what we've seen in other states.
Speaker 1: Let me ask you this, Cina, and I appreciate you
Speaker 1: providing the background, because I think that it is really
Speaker 1: important for people to understand who these justices are, right,
Speaker 1: and the fact that you could bring any case before them,
Speaker 1: but given that they've already decided that's right. Right, So
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter what facts you present, it doesn't matter
Speaker 1: what precedent you present. They've already decided how the case
Speaker 1: is going to be ruled, given their own backgrounds and
Speaker 1: given their own prejudices. Right. This is what it means
Speaker 1: to have activist judges. They use that term on those
Speaker 1: that are progressive, but this is what it means to
Speaker 1: be an activist judge. That you don't listen to cases
Speaker 1: that you decide them based on whatever the Bible right
Speaker 1: tells you to decide on. And I wonder, you know,
Speaker 1: for eu GENA, Texas in a lot of ways, I
Speaker 1: think has not received the kind of investment that it
Speaker 1: needs from the Democratic Party, and that we have seeded
Speaker 1: these red states and said well, there's nothing we can
Speaker 1: do here, right, And because of our lack of investment,
Speaker 1: they have become a breeding ground and fertile ground to
Speaker 1: forward these draconian style policies. And so I wonder where
Speaker 1: you think that the Democratic Party as a whole as
Speaker 1: we head into the twenty twenty four presidential election, as
Speaker 1: these people are going to be on the ballot, what
Speaker 1: responsibility the party has in creating the apparatus that needed
Speaker 1: and necessary and well funded in order in order to
Speaker 1: turn a state like Texas around.
Speaker 2: I think, well, so there's a lot there. Let me
Speaker 2: start off with a couple of points. One and let
Speaker 2: me also just I should have said this at the
Speaker 2: very beginning, but for folks that are listening and are
Speaker 2: trying to figure out where find out pac comes from,
Speaker 2: it does come from the very scientific concept of f
Speaker 2: around and find out right. And that's I said earlier.
Speaker 2: I had a visual reaction to reading that seven page opinion,
Speaker 2: and that was honestly my very first reaction, which is
Speaker 2: this is this is ridiculous. So that's where the name
Speaker 2: comes from. But I think to your point, you know
Speaker 2: this is this is not a partisan issue, and I know,
Speaker 2: I know we're kind of couching it that way as
Speaker 2: we head into twenty twenty four. But like being able
Speaker 2: to listen to your doctor and being able to make
Speaker 2: decisions about your your own fertility, being able to make
Speaker 2: decisions about about your own about the ability to save
Speaker 2: your own life, none of that stuff is partisan. Even
Speaker 2: though the two parties are are in very different camps
Speaker 2: on this doesn't make it inherently a partisan issue, right.
Speaker 2: I mean that probably speaks more to the values of
Speaker 2: the parties themselves. And you know, we have deliberately talked
Speaker 2: about this issue, frankly on the merits of the issue,
Speaker 2: because it is the way I think in which we
Speaker 2: reach the most people. Again, eighty two percent of folks,
Speaker 2: eighty two percent of Texans support medical exceptions. I mean
Speaker 2: that's a I don't think there's a lot of things
Speaker 2: that eighty two percent of Texans agree on, but talking
Speaker 2: about the issue. I think is also the way in
Speaker 2: which we are able to one show the contrast and
Speaker 2: and when we are talking about engaging kind of young
Speaker 2: folks in particular, I think we see that, you know,
Speaker 2: data shows that they're more motivated by the issue than
Speaker 2: they are by political party or ideology. And so you know,
Speaker 2: let's be very clear. And that's why you know, for
Speaker 2: folks that haven't seen the video yet our launch chat,
Speaker 2: please going to find out pack dot com. And we
Speaker 2: are very clear about what is at stake here and
Speaker 2: why this is so important, right and would welcome folks
Speaker 2: to support. I think the more we can talk about
Speaker 2: what is at stake here and less about party and
Speaker 2: less about ideology, I think will be more will be
Speaker 2: more successful should we And I think what we are
Speaker 2: also encouraged by, you know, there's some potential for some
Speaker 2: reverse coattails here to your point. You know, I think
Speaker 2: we're all uh, you know, kind of reading reading articles
Speaker 2: about kind of black enthusiasm at the at the top
Speaker 2: of the ticket. So look, it's all hands on deck,
Speaker 2: right to make sure that we've got leaders up and down,
Speaker 2: up and down the ballot they're going to fight for
Speaker 2: reproductive freedoms and frankly not be a threat to democracy.
Speaker 2: So I think you're but you're absolutely right. All that
Speaker 2: takes investment, and so I think by being creative, thinking
Speaker 2: outside of the box, you know, hope to attract that
Speaker 2: investment here in Texas, because again, one intent kid, like
Speaker 2: one intent kids in this country, calls Texas home. You
Speaker 2: cannot write off ten percent of our ten percent of
Speaker 2: our future.
Speaker 1: I wonder too, you know. You you mentioned the lack
Speaker 1: of enthusiasm right that we are hearing about, right, and
Speaker 1: a part of me knows that it is one exasperated
Speaker 1: by media in order to gain clicks and audience and
Speaker 1: all of these things, and to turn this election, upcoming
Speaker 1: election into a horse race, devoid of the seriousness of
Speaker 1: what is at stake. But two, you know President Biden,
Speaker 1: while he has made abortion a campaign issue, right and
Speaker 1: an important one, he said recently that I'm a Catholic
Speaker 1: and don't think that abortion should be used, you know,
Speaker 1: it should be used, you know, regularly. But I think
Speaker 1: that the reversal of Rob Wade was wrong. I'm paraphrasing,
Speaker 1: but he said that, and you know, abortion rights activists
Speaker 1: are completely dismayed by it, and I wanted to get
Speaker 1: your reactions from that statement and how it land.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think look, I think keeping this
Speaker 2: focused on what this is ultimately about, right, which is
Speaker 2: can you truly be, you know, a free person in
Speaker 2: this country if you cannot make decisions about your own body.
Speaker 2: Let's let's keep it super simple, right, And I think
Speaker 2: the more simple that we keep it and show the
Speaker 2: contrast between where leaders are on this issue. I think
Speaker 2: that is how we are most successful. Again, most of
Speaker 2: us are are united on again medical exceptions, the ability
Speaker 2: to listen to your doctor. I mean not only just
Speaker 2: listen to your doctor, Danielle, but even you know, there's
Speaker 2: stories in Texas anecdotally of you know, doctors even being
Speaker 2: fearful of providing information to the person so that they
Speaker 2: can make the decision. Right. So that is that's really
Speaker 2: what is happening. And we are seeing unfortunately, kind of
Speaker 2: where this where this takes, where these policies take you
Speaker 2: what they look like. And obviously that's not where that's
Speaker 2: not where Texans are. I'm sure that's not where most
Speaker 2: Americans are either, But it just strikes me, as you know,
Speaker 2: as an Air Force veteran Iraq War veteran that you
Speaker 2: know in the land of the Home, the land of
Speaker 2: the free, the home of the brave, that this is
Speaker 2: something that we are even discussing right women having to
Speaker 2: flee their states, living in fear right as they go
Speaker 2: seek reproductive care that is not available in their state
Speaker 2: to save their life and takes to save their their
Speaker 2: their fertility. So I think, look, let's keep the main thing,
Speaker 2: the main thing, which is women should be able to
Speaker 2: make decisions about their own bodies. And there's one person
Speaker 2: for there's one person running for president that believes that.
Speaker 2: So I mean, this is a it's a we can
Speaker 2: we can make it a ten second discussion or it
Speaker 2: can be a ten hour discussion. But at the end
Speaker 2: of the day, there's one person running for president that
Speaker 2: believes that.
Speaker 1: There are still right now a handful of states right
Speaker 1: where abortion is legal. We have a patch of protections.
Speaker 1: And there are some that say, well, if you can't
Speaker 1: have an abortion in Texas, then just go someplace else.
Speaker 1: And I think that people who live inside of blue states,
Speaker 1: like I do, believe that a national abortion ban is
Speaker 1: an impossibility. What do you say to.
Speaker 2: That, Well, I don't think we should take anything for granted, right,
Speaker 2: I mean, look, I'm a I'm a I'm a lesbian
Speaker 2: woman of color. Like I I don't take anything for granted,
Speaker 2: given what we have, what we have seen happen just
Speaker 2: in the last just under the last administration, right, certainly
Speaker 2: from a from a national security standpoint, but also from
Speaker 2: a from a just a reproductive freedom standpoint, I don't.
Speaker 2: I don't take anything for granted, and we shouldn't do that.
Speaker 2: That's that's my my short answer to that. I just complacency,
Speaker 2: I think is very dangerous, certainly heading into twenty twenty four,
Speaker 2: and to think about what could be possible under a
Speaker 2: second term of Donald Trump. I mean now that he's
Speaker 2: you know, figured out, you know who's on his side
Speaker 2: is not, has a better understanding of the rules, I
Speaker 2: think he and he's been very clear right about the
Speaker 2: type of people he'd bring in and the things he
Speaker 2: would focus on, and even his rhetoric now is much
Speaker 2: more dangerous a kin obviously to Nazi speak. So we
Speaker 2: should take nothing for granted, and certainly that applies to
Speaker 2: the reproductive freedom space.
Speaker 1: Do you tell people as we close out how they
Speaker 1: can support find out how they can get involved with
Speaker 1: the work that you all are doing on the ground
Speaker 1: and so that people feel like they are doing something
Speaker 1: that they're just not, you know, waiting for the worst
Speaker 1: to happen.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, thanks so much again for having me on
Speaker 2: and thanks folks for listening. But the website is Www.
Speaker 2: Find outpack dot com. Got our launch video there. Please
Speaker 2: share that. I think you know, increasingly folks are understanding
Speaker 2: just how important that bench is right and so we'll
Speaker 2: continue to hit that home as well as as these
Speaker 2: as these justices make decisions on this issue on others
Speaker 2: that are affecting the everyday lives of Texan. So www.
Speaker 2: Dot FindOut pack dot com is where folks can go
Speaker 2: and make a donation in any amount that they would like.
Speaker 2: And really appreciate the support. And again we're not hopeless
Speaker 2: or hopeless in Texas and this is our ballot initiative,
Speaker 2: so really appreciates folks with support to help us out.
Speaker 1: We really appreciate the work that you're doing. Really appreciate
Speaker 1: the focus that you have on changing your Supreme Court
Speaker 1: and I hope that it is mimicked across the country
Speaker 1: in red states that we have in many ways turned
Speaker 1: our backs on. Really appreciate you Gena, thanks for joining,
Speaker 1: Thanks Didille. That is it for me today. Dear friends
Speaker 1: on Woke a f as always, Power to the people
Speaker 1: and to all the people. Power, get woke and stay
Speaker 1: woke as fuck.