WEBVTT - Episode 82: Watchmen 0:00:09.480 --> 0:00:13.440 Hello, everyone, Welcome to another edition of Nerdificence. I am 0:00:13.520 --> 0:00:15.880 one half of your host, Danny Fernandez, sitting across from 0:00:15.880 --> 0:00:21.280 me as always. How's everybody doing? He looks, we look shnazzy, 0:00:21.920 --> 0:00:24.920 very snazzy. We like match too, I know. And then 0:00:24.960 --> 0:00:27.800 I have this excuse to break out. I can't raise 0:00:27.880 --> 0:00:31.240 this too high. Not that you haven't like, I don't care. 0:00:31.240 --> 0:00:34.640 I've I've bared all at all times, especially my friends. 0:00:34.840 --> 0:00:36.880 That sounds bad. You know what we have that giggle 0:00:37.040 --> 0:00:39.840 on here is you know where you love her. She's 0:00:39.840 --> 0:00:43.920 a pop pop culture critic, amazing, very thoughtful writer. It 0:00:44.040 --> 0:00:48.440 is our friend Joel Monique. Hey, I'm so excited. Hey, 0:00:48.520 --> 0:00:51.640 how's it gone? I see you came prepared. You you 0:00:51.720 --> 0:00:55.680 have readings, dramatic readings for you guys, especially as we 0:00:55.680 --> 0:00:58.680 start to talk about the differences and similarities between the 0:00:58.720 --> 0:01:02.400 show and comic book. Well, speaking of the show, we 0:01:02.520 --> 0:01:04.960 normally talk about what we're geeking out about, but this 0:01:05.000 --> 0:01:10.959 week we're geeking out about the Watchman show. Yes, Regina King, 0:01:11.440 --> 0:01:13.920 and yeah, yeah, it's a lot. There's a lot happening 0:01:13.920 --> 0:01:17.959 to show. Our good friend Cheyenne took me she was 0:01:18.040 --> 0:01:21.280 working for HBO at New York Comic Con and so 0:01:21.319 --> 0:01:26.200 they had the Watchman premier party there and Regina King. Listen, 0:01:26.319 --> 0:01:30.240 famous people in public, they just stand out in a 0:01:30.319 --> 0:01:35.040 way that we don't understand. Like she like, even when 0:01:35.080 --> 0:01:39.759 I'm done up, like she was just glowing, Like they're 0:01:39.800 --> 0:01:42.400 just on a different level than the rest of us. 0:01:44.280 --> 0:01:46.800 That's that's true. That's true. But it's just like she 0:01:46.880 --> 0:01:49.320 was wearing regular clothes. I feel like, but she Oh 0:01:49.360 --> 0:01:52.960 my gosh, it was just radiant. Um, I feel that way. Yeah, 0:01:53.000 --> 0:01:55.440 when I run into I don't know, like Chris Hemsworth 0:01:55.560 --> 0:01:59.840 or something. Yeah, yeah, it's Regina. I feel like, specifically 0:01:59.840 --> 0:02:02.560 as a post Oscar glow, like the women have babies 0:02:02.600 --> 0:02:04.520 and they're glowing. She had an Oscar and she was like, 0:02:04.920 --> 0:02:07.840 I have arrived finally, Holly would like, notice isn't recognizes. 0:02:08.080 --> 0:02:09.920 She also talked about how she feels like she's really 0:02:09.919 --> 0:02:12.080 coming to her own now. I mean, she's obviously been 0:02:12.120 --> 0:02:15.839 around for a while. One of my earliest memories of her, 0:02:16.160 --> 0:02:18.360 and this just goes for when I was growing up, 0:02:18.480 --> 0:02:21.239 is um, she was in a Cinderella story. Do you 0:02:21.240 --> 0:02:25.560 remember that? That was so long ago? Um, that was 0:02:25.600 --> 0:02:29.920 like my Lizzie McGuire days. Um, but yeah, she she's 0:02:29.919 --> 0:02:32.080 been a phenomenal actress for so long. But she said, 0:02:32.120 --> 0:02:34.600 like having kids like that, really being a mother like 0:02:34.800 --> 0:02:39.760 changed her acting style. Testing. I cannot speak to um 0:02:39.960 --> 0:02:43.360 post children, pre children or Gina King performances, but I 0:02:43.400 --> 0:02:46.720 do think that there's a level of comfort in this performance, 0:02:47.360 --> 0:02:51.000 level of like inherent talent and badass three and sort 0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:52.600 of like how did it take us this long to 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:56.440 realize she should be a superhero. She's just so false, 0:02:56.880 --> 0:03:00.560 being like dark and brooding but also like really on 0:03:00.600 --> 0:03:05.760 her detective stuff. Um, it's it's incredible. She had better 0:03:05.760 --> 0:03:08.040 go all the nominations. That would be very upset about it. 0:03:09.480 --> 0:03:15.040 We'll see, we've been we've been uh burned before. Alright, 0:03:15.160 --> 0:03:17.320 let's just jump into the nitty gritty and start with 0:03:17.360 --> 0:03:20.200 the comics. So Watchman is a comic book MAXI series 0:03:20.240 --> 0:03:23.160 by the British creative team of that of writer Alan 0:03:23.240 --> 0:03:27.280 Moore and artist David Gibbons, and colors John Higgins. It 0:03:27.360 --> 0:03:30.280 was published by d C Comics in nine eighty six 0:03:30.320 --> 0:03:34.400 in seven, and collected in a single volume edition in 0:03:34.560 --> 0:03:38.000 nineteen eight seven. Watchman originated from a story proposal More 0:03:38.040 --> 0:03:42.200 submitted to d C featuring superhero characters uh that the 0:03:42.240 --> 0:03:46.000 company had acquired from Charlton Comics. As Moore's proposed story 0:03:46.080 --> 0:03:49.160 would have left many of the characters unusable for future stories, 0:03:49.560 --> 0:03:54.320 Managing editor Dick Giordano convinced Moore to create original characters instead. 0:03:54.840 --> 0:03:57.600 See why he kind of blows out the world at 0:03:57.640 --> 0:04:01.640 the end of Yeah, he actually originally so More wanted 0:04:02.080 --> 0:04:05.520 comics from MLJ and he couldn't use those, So then 0:04:05.520 --> 0:04:09.440 they recommended Charlton Comics would had which had just been 0:04:09.480 --> 0:04:12.120 acquired by d C, but then he couldn't use those either, 0:04:12.720 --> 0:04:15.000 So then you just ended up kind of creating characters 0:04:15.040 --> 0:04:17.920 based off of their characters. This actually becomes like an 0:04:17.920 --> 0:04:21.080 extreme blessing for the comic book because I think if 0:04:21.080 --> 0:04:23.279 you're taking those original characters that come with all of 0:04:23.320 --> 0:04:26.160 that backstory, which you know, it can be fun to 0:04:26.160 --> 0:04:30.600 to see alternative universes, um. But to get this straightforward 0:04:31.240 --> 0:04:34.039 look at superheroes, he was able to take multiple heroes 0:04:34.040 --> 0:04:36.000 and make a Rory Shack and comment on what kind 0:04:36.040 --> 0:04:37.560 of comics are you reading, our kind of stories are 0:04:37.600 --> 0:04:39.720 we telling our kids, and who do we view as heroes? 0:04:39.960 --> 0:04:42.520 I think it works much better as a metaphor and 0:04:42.600 --> 0:04:44.920 using the characters a symbolism as opposed to taking those 0:04:44.960 --> 0:04:47.400 direct characters and using them in that way. Yeah. So 0:04:47.440 --> 0:04:52.159 Watchman depicts an alternate history where superheroes are real in 0:04:52.240 --> 0:04:55.040 real life. What it would be like where superheroes emerged 0:04:55.040 --> 0:04:58.360 in the nineteen forties in nineteen sixties sounds a lot 0:04:58.480 --> 0:05:02.920 like The Incredible It is a little a little bit. Yeah, 0:05:03.000 --> 0:05:05.520 that's what I thought of whenever Bradbird had that, because 0:05:05.520 --> 0:05:09.359 it's like set in that fifties style and it's a 0:05:09.400 --> 0:05:11.520 world in which what would happen with superheroes, Well you 0:05:11.520 --> 0:05:13.840 would probably sue them. There would be you know, like 0:05:13.880 --> 0:05:16.280 it's not as pretty as we think it is. It's 0:05:16.320 --> 0:05:18.240 like Superman coming to save the day and we all 0:05:18.240 --> 0:05:20.840 love him. It's like, no, they like, actually, this is 0:05:20.880 --> 0:05:22.920 what it would be like in real life. I often 0:05:22.960 --> 0:05:24.920 think of that with Batman. It's like, would we really 0:05:24.960 --> 0:05:27.719 be okay with a billionaire dressing up in rubber? Definitely 0:05:27.800 --> 0:05:30.400 not beating up people. I mean that was the one 0:05:30.640 --> 0:05:33.360 like good takeaway I did have for The Joker where 0:05:33.360 --> 0:05:36.720 it really did uh kind of addresses that like income 0:05:36.760 --> 0:05:39.680 disparity and got them and like how they viewed it, 0:05:39.839 --> 0:05:41.560 and I was like, that would be I mean, I 0:05:41.600 --> 0:05:44.040 don't think people are ready if we truly do like 0:05:44.200 --> 0:05:46.280 view that, if we got more than just that surface 0:05:46.360 --> 0:05:50.680 layer of like there's poverty here, Yeah, because that that 0:05:50.680 --> 0:05:53.960 would be cool to see how Batman deals with that. 0:05:54.040 --> 0:05:56.719 I feel like the cartoons actually did try and lightweight 0:05:56.760 --> 0:05:59.320 tackle it by making Bruce Wayne so much of a 0:06:00.080 --> 0:06:04.440 lanthropist and it's like, uh so, I think we can 0:06:04.440 --> 0:06:08.200 go beyond that and like see you like you know, 0:06:09.200 --> 0:06:11.400 something like the Court of Vials but real life, like 0:06:11.520 --> 0:06:14.719 you go in and trying to like break down this structure. 0:06:15.400 --> 0:06:18.880 But that's another DC comic. Here we're talking about Watchman, 0:06:18.920 --> 0:06:22.440 which has that if you wanted that insight on the world, 0:06:22.480 --> 0:06:25.159 then uh you go, then Watchman is going to go 0:06:25.200 --> 0:06:28.960 even deeper. Alan Moore very better and I mean that 0:06:29.000 --> 0:06:31.880 in a good way. He has he's better or awake 0:06:31.960 --> 0:06:36.800 if he see Well. What's also funny is like you know, um, 0:06:36.839 --> 0:06:40.720 but he's like like British right, and it's so like 0:06:40.800 --> 0:06:43.520 a lot of these quote unquote takes that he has 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:47.400 a Watchman have to do with you know, overseas, and 0:06:47.440 --> 0:06:49.920 I think that's which you know, we're talking about Stephen 0:06:50.000 --> 0:06:53.719 King not liking the Shining Uh. Alan Moore did not 0:06:53.839 --> 0:06:57.680 like the uh Watchman. He didn't like V for Vendetta either, 0:06:57.760 --> 0:07:00.480 doesn't this series either? Yeah, well, I mean and he could. 0:07:00.520 --> 0:07:03.239 I could care less about the series because mostly because 0:07:03.680 --> 0:07:06.400 I think we did better with this series what we're 0:07:06.440 --> 0:07:09.680 supposed to do. Because yeah, you're you're a Londoner. You 0:07:09.920 --> 0:07:13.640 that's your world. This is America. So if we're really like, 0:07:13.680 --> 0:07:15.440 I like that he's a Londoner coming to like make 0:07:15.480 --> 0:07:18.320 a comment on America. I like the the idea of 0:07:19.200 --> 0:07:21.760 going to another place and examining it with fresh eyes. 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:24.480 And I feel like he's not so to me, it 0:07:24.520 --> 0:07:28.320 doesn't necessarily feel like he's taking the pits out of America. 0:07:28.440 --> 0:07:30.520 You know. It doesn't seem like it's it's degrading to 0:07:30.560 --> 0:07:33.680 America more. It's just like a this is sort of 0:07:33.720 --> 0:07:35.720 the all consuming fear that we all have. And I 0:07:35.760 --> 0:07:37.640 think for a lot of pop culture things, you can 0:07:37.680 --> 0:07:40.200 distill it to America because most of the pop the 0:07:40.240 --> 0:07:43.480 world's pop culture, you know, originates here, like the big stuff, 0:07:43.480 --> 0:07:46.040 the stuff that goes global. I think what I was 0:07:46.040 --> 0:07:48.640 going to say to your point to both of y'all's 0:07:48.640 --> 0:07:51.600 point is that he said it's not anti Americanism, but 0:07:51.720 --> 0:07:55.160 anti Reaganism. So he did want to specify and and 0:07:55.160 --> 0:07:58.200 it definitely that breathes through and I think that's fine too. 0:07:58.240 --> 0:08:00.560 But when you have like a British why London or 0:08:00.640 --> 0:08:03.000 come in, you always have oversight because the one thing 0:08:03.040 --> 0:08:06.200 that Brits love to like try and like harp on 0:08:06.360 --> 0:08:09.800 is like America's racism, totally trying to sidestep the fact 0:08:09.840 --> 0:08:13.400 that they went ahead Africa. As a Nigerian, I always 0:08:13.440 --> 0:08:16.360 have to point that out. But you know, but I 0:08:16.480 --> 0:08:17.920 you know, I will pat them on the back that 0:08:18.000 --> 0:08:21.680 you know, Uh, they still do put more interracial couples 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:25.400 on TV than we have in ever period. I remember 0:08:25.520 --> 0:08:28.280 when I first watched Doctor Who. My first tweet after 0:08:28.320 --> 0:08:31.200 it was like there was more interracial couples on TV 0:08:31.320 --> 0:08:35.160 in one season than we've had in the history of Americans. 0:08:35.240 --> 0:08:37.240 I feel that way about Black Mirror. I'm like, I've 0:08:37.360 --> 0:08:40.520 never seen this many black and brown people period on 0:08:40.559 --> 0:08:43.480 any shows, live in their lives, hanging out and being 0:08:43.520 --> 0:08:46.679 tortured by internet. Um So, Joel, can you walk us 0:08:46.679 --> 0:08:49.440 through some of the iconic characters from The Watchman and 0:08:49.600 --> 0:08:54.880 what they're personalities are, their history. Sure, let's start with 0:08:54.920 --> 0:08:57.920 the Minutemen. This is the original batch of Watchman characters. 0:08:58.040 --> 0:09:03.760 That's you're still expector is your um night Owls? Who 0:09:03.800 --> 0:09:07.760 else is on that team? Oh, my gosh, Billy Banks 0:09:07.840 --> 0:09:10.160 or something like that. He's like basically a mascot for 0:09:10.280 --> 0:09:14.400 the Bank, um, which is amazing. Um. The Minutemen are 0:09:14.400 --> 0:09:18.440 an interesting team. They're started by Hooded Justice. Um kind of. 0:09:18.480 --> 0:09:21.679 He's sort of the Hooded Justice is the first superhero period. 0:09:21.960 --> 0:09:27.320 He stops robbery at a like local Delhi. People are like, 0:09:27.400 --> 0:09:30.520 what is going on? They read the Superman comic. Comic 0:09:30.600 --> 0:09:33.320 comic comes out. He's like, Yo, heroes are dope. I'm 0:09:33.320 --> 0:09:36.000 gonna do that. I don't like defend people. But Hooded 0:09:36.040 --> 0:09:38.920 Justice is sort of like their take on Batman kind 0:09:38.920 --> 0:09:41.960 of in that he's like, I will never reveal my identity. 0:09:42.000 --> 0:09:44.760 Nobody don't talk to me about anything. I have very 0:09:44.840 --> 0:09:47.400 specific missions. He doesn't really get along with the rest 0:09:47.400 --> 0:09:50.960 of the team. He's gay. Um, he's with another member 0:09:50.960 --> 0:09:53.560 of the team. They fight a lot. It's messy. That's 0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:55.679 really cool because I didn't know that about him. So 0:09:55.760 --> 0:09:59.560 this was from the eighties. It's when he or the 0:09:59.559 --> 0:10:04.400 Minute Man and come out like goodness testamentality here. Okay, 0:10:04.400 --> 0:10:08.480 So nineteen thirty something we have the original Superman. The 0:10:08.480 --> 0:10:10.480 Minutemen are like just a few years after that, so 0:10:10.520 --> 0:10:16.480 we're talking late, I think is when he was really queer. Okay, 0:10:16.520 --> 0:10:18.480 so that was part of the reason. I think he 0:10:18.559 --> 0:10:21.880 was not taking off the mask um. And it's like 0:10:22.040 --> 0:10:24.760 they would push him and Silk Specter together in photos 0:10:24.880 --> 0:10:27.600 to make it look like he wasn't. There would be like, oh, 0:10:27.760 --> 0:10:30.839 rumors they're dating Um, and that's how they tried to 0:10:30.840 --> 0:10:33.640 pull that off. But eventually I was founded in nineteen 0:10:33.679 --> 0:10:36.160 thirty nine during the Golden Age, being he does he 0:10:36.160 --> 0:10:39.640 started to night The Minute Men are started in thirty nine. Yes, 0:10:40.040 --> 0:10:42.440 there's a Keen Act of seventy seven. And then in 0:10:42.480 --> 0:10:46.040 the fifties when Carthier is happening, all the superheroes get 0:10:46.040 --> 0:10:47.600 called in and they're like, yo, you guys need to 0:10:47.600 --> 0:10:48.920 tell us who you are. We don't like that you're 0:10:48.920 --> 0:10:52.079 out here fighting crime. That's not really due process of law. 0:10:52.280 --> 0:10:56.040 It's problematic. He was like, listen, not doing it disappears 0:10:56.440 --> 0:10:58.559 um Stil Expector was the first one to kind of 0:10:58.600 --> 0:11:01.200 realize that you could make money off of this, and 0:11:01.240 --> 0:11:03.960 she was like, listen, I can market myself. People like 0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:06.440 it will sell dolls. She tried to make a movie. 0:11:06.679 --> 0:11:10.200 It bombed horribly, and after the disbanding of Superhero, she 0:11:10.240 --> 0:11:12.600 didn't do really well. Her daughter later takes over her 0:11:12.640 --> 0:11:17.240 mantle to varying degrees of effect. Um Night all former 0:11:17.240 --> 0:11:21.360 police officers second Superhero, inspired by Hooded Justice a story. 0:11:21.360 --> 0:11:23.360 He reads it in the paper. He's like, wow, you 0:11:23.400 --> 0:11:25.280 see Superman. He's like, he has to want to do this. 0:11:25.559 --> 0:11:27.360 He writes a book that tells all of them that 0:11:27.400 --> 0:11:29.680 it men's dirty secrets, including the fact that the comedian 0:11:30.040 --> 0:11:35.160 tried to rape Silk specter, so that really hurts the team. Um. 0:11:35.280 --> 0:11:37.360 He's like, yeo, I'm done, I'm out, I'm coming clean. 0:11:37.440 --> 0:11:40.640 They're coming after us anyway, what's the point um, And 0:11:40.679 --> 0:11:42.560 then I'll just finish up with comedian. There's others, but 0:11:42.640 --> 0:11:45.200 we can you guys can read up on this. Comedian 0:11:45.679 --> 0:11:49.320 is like basically a soldier for hire. He starts by 0:11:49.360 --> 0:11:51.840 being this kind of like wears a black mask, very 0:11:51.880 --> 0:11:55.520 like leathery sort of vibes going on. Um, and then 0:11:55.640 --> 0:11:58.480 once the government is like listen, no more superheroes. You 0:11:58.480 --> 0:12:00.199 can come work for us, though, because you're pretty good 0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:02.520 at your job. They dropped him in Vietnam. He is 0:12:02.600 --> 0:12:06.440 having so much fun killing women and children, very disturbing 0:12:06.960 --> 0:12:10.599 until Dr Manhattan is created on accident, joins him and 0:12:10.600 --> 0:12:13.520 now he's a human walking bomb and he is a god. 0:12:13.920 --> 0:12:15.640 He ends the war, and that is sort of what 0:12:15.760 --> 0:12:20.040 starts the retro direction of the history in Watchman. It's 0:12:20.040 --> 0:12:24.640 basically like a parallel universe. But if people became heroes 0:12:25.200 --> 0:12:28.199 and Dr Manhattan en did the war, so America wins 0:12:28.240 --> 0:12:31.560 in Vietnam. It's like a rousing victory. We pick up 0:12:31.640 --> 0:12:35.160 Vietnam as a state and then from there we're like 0:12:35.440 --> 0:12:38.040 booming with technology. Dr Manhattan introduced us this holy world 0:12:38.080 --> 0:12:41.800 of like text. We have electric cars. Now computers are faster. 0:12:42.200 --> 0:12:45.079 It's like a glorious kind of Golden Age with heroes 0:12:45.080 --> 0:12:47.680 back on control. Everyone feels pretty good. Then in the 0:12:48.040 --> 0:12:50.480 seventies you have the next round of superheroes, so you 0:12:50.480 --> 0:12:52.960 have a new night Owl. So it comes back Dr 0:12:53.000 --> 0:12:55.800 Manhattan's fighting. It doesn't last very long. Governments like you 0:12:55.800 --> 0:12:58.960 can't do this. We have actual people to uphold the law, 0:12:59.559 --> 0:13:02.160 and that's what we enter here. Rorshack is like, listen, 0:13:02.200 --> 0:13:03.800 I'll give an e foot any of you say, I'm 0:13:03.800 --> 0:13:05.960 going to still go out here where my weird changing 0:13:06.040 --> 0:13:10.440 mask and uh be a hero? Um, And the book 0:13:10.480 --> 0:13:14.240 kind of takes a really sharp look at again who 0:13:14.280 --> 0:13:16.960 we call a hero? Oh yeah, I forgot to say so. 0:13:17.120 --> 0:13:20.720 The Watchman term comes from a Latin phrase that essentially 0:13:20.760 --> 0:13:26.160 translates as who watches the Watchman? Yes? Right, and it's 0:13:26.200 --> 0:13:29.120 and it it is like that general. I think the 0:13:29.160 --> 0:13:32.440 mythos of the book is just basically Lex Luthor's like 0:13:32.520 --> 0:13:36.920 initial mythos against you know, against Superman, which is like, what, 0:13:37.000 --> 0:13:41.360 we shouldn't trust this powerful alien like in in a 0:13:41.400 --> 0:13:44.720 normal world, Lex Luthor isn't really that much of a 0:13:44.760 --> 0:13:46.840 bad guy. He's just someone with sense where it's like, no, 0:13:46.920 --> 0:13:50.800 we shouldn't let this superpowered alien just do whatever he 0:13:50.880 --> 0:13:54.440 wants and then that drives him mad, uh and money 0:13:54.520 --> 0:13:57.760 and all that. But it is funny how like Lex, 0:13:58.040 --> 0:14:01.880 Yeah he isn't. No, he has a point and yeah 0:14:02.080 --> 0:14:06.040 it is an insight. So the just to talk about 0:14:06.080 --> 0:14:09.000 all the information that went down, is that just sprinkled 0:14:09.000 --> 0:14:12.480 throughout the book or is that all supplemental stuff as well, 0:14:12.600 --> 0:14:15.720 or so if you get I've only ever read Watchman 0:14:15.760 --> 0:14:18.640 as the completed novel, so I know some people who 0:14:18.640 --> 0:14:20.880 have read it separately. I think they still had all 0:14:20.920 --> 0:14:23.680 this little bit of information in the back of each comic. 0:14:23.800 --> 0:14:27.240 There's like either a big magazine or a book that's 0:14:27.320 --> 0:14:32.200 between that gives you all this like very rich history. 0:14:32.200 --> 0:14:34.960 Phil for example, the first night Owl he wrote, The 0:14:35.040 --> 0:14:36.720 parts of the book he wrote are in the first 0:14:36.880 --> 0:14:41.240 two comics, and then there's um, there's a secondary pirate 0:14:41.320 --> 0:14:44.160 comic they write that sort of parallels all of the 0:14:44.200 --> 0:14:49.120 things happening inside of the story. It's about um, a 0:14:49.320 --> 0:14:53.600 big ship that souls basically is that's the one that's 0:14:53.680 --> 0:14:58.240 kind of like popping up throughout the throughout the story. Right. Yeah, 0:14:58.240 --> 0:15:00.760 the kid at the newsstand, he's always listen to the 0:15:00.760 --> 0:15:02.920 news stand treat it which if you're poor and do 0:15:02.920 --> 0:15:04.640 you every went to a comic bookstore just to read 0:15:04.680 --> 0:15:07.000 the comics, he could relate. That was my story. Um, 0:15:07.360 --> 0:15:10.120 and the floor of borders putting bookstores out of business. 0:15:10.120 --> 0:15:14.640 That's what millennials did. Listen, you would have liked to 0:15:14.640 --> 0:15:17.720 have read those. It wasn't just you, it was all 0:15:17.760 --> 0:15:20.720 of us. I don't know why Borders never stopped us 0:15:20.720 --> 0:15:23.400 from reading all those manga on the floorboards, like just 0:15:23.920 --> 0:15:27.960 droves of kids just sitting in the Walden's books, Borders, 0:15:28.280 --> 0:15:33.160 Barnes and Nobles. Really not a single employee said anyway. 0:15:33.680 --> 0:15:35.360 The employees were not paid enough to care in the 0:15:35.360 --> 0:15:37.920 same way that my saw pomping movies at the AM sales, 0:15:37.960 --> 0:15:40.160 like God, bless you have fun kids, I don't have 0:15:40.200 --> 0:15:43.280 the time. Always that one though, there's always that one 0:15:43.320 --> 0:15:46.520 who just feels it's going to get them employee of 0:15:45.760 --> 0:15:48.840 the try it, and then they don't get employee of 0:15:48.880 --> 0:15:52.280 the month. And then they they realize everyone has to learn. 0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:55.480 Everyone does one extra thing at there, like part time 0:15:55.600 --> 0:15:58.840 job and get no recognition for it. And that's when 0:15:58.880 --> 0:16:02.200 you learn, oh, this is useless. I remember, I think 0:16:02.240 --> 0:16:05.920 about mine every Halloween. At Halloween horn nights. I was 0:16:05.960 --> 0:16:08.640 so trying to like I was like trying to stand 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:10.720 out and be like the good one. And like if 0:16:10.760 --> 0:16:13.320 I knew, I knew if I stood out, you know, 0:16:13.400 --> 0:16:15.360 they would they would keep me. And there was a 0:16:15.400 --> 0:16:17.240 guy all he was he was just trying to bring 0:16:17.280 --> 0:16:19.360 in a pipe with some weed. You don't have a 0:16:19.400 --> 0:16:21.240 good night. I don't know why you would try and 0:16:21.280 --> 0:16:24.280 be high in a scary place. That is my worst nightmare. 0:16:24.560 --> 0:16:26.560 But he was. He was doing it, and I caught 0:16:26.600 --> 0:16:28.280 him and he was like he was a young brother too. 0:16:28.280 --> 0:16:29.680 We looked and he tried to keep gave him the 0:16:29.680 --> 0:16:32.360 bro like come on, bro, and I was like, I 0:16:32.440 --> 0:16:35.320 need a job, bro, And I poured him and they 0:16:35.360 --> 0:16:37.200 patted me on the back and then they let me 0:16:37.240 --> 0:16:39.280 go at the end of the season. And that's when 0:16:39.280 --> 0:16:43.520 I learned, never would never show out, never break color lines, 0:16:43.760 --> 0:16:47.720 always employee lines. We have to take a really quick break. 0:16:47.760 --> 0:16:50.600 And they were going to hop back into more of 0:16:50.640 --> 0:17:02.760 The Watchman right after this, and we're back. Was there 0:17:02.800 --> 0:17:06.040 any other characters that we okay, okay, so let's just 0:17:06.080 --> 0:17:08.480 to wrap. There are so many characters, guys, so I apologize. 0:17:08.720 --> 0:17:11.600 So just to recap in our current day, we have 0:17:12.000 --> 0:17:15.120 a version of night Owl. He's new. We're younger, frashure. 0:17:15.240 --> 0:17:17.080 This is all he's ever wanted to do. We have 0:17:17.119 --> 0:17:19.240 Silk Specter. She dresses in the yellow and black. She's 0:17:19.280 --> 0:17:22.120 the daughter of the old Silk Specter. She doesn't really 0:17:22.119 --> 0:17:24.440 want to be here, but she's doing it anyway. When 0:17:24.480 --> 0:17:26.919 she was sixteen, she started looking up with Doctor Manhattan, 0:17:27.000 --> 0:17:32.240 who was like late thirties early forties when she was sixteen? 0:17:33.080 --> 0:17:37.000 Is this from the text the original text very clearly 0:17:37.080 --> 0:17:41.200 she was sixteen free. I was sired to read it 0:17:41.240 --> 0:17:44.640 twice like wait what, um so that happened? Um, but 0:17:45.240 --> 0:17:48.160 they're together for twenty years. It's still weird, but context 0:17:48.200 --> 0:17:51.760 I don't know. Um So. Then Dr Manhattan, big blue 0:17:51.760 --> 0:17:55.560 guy likes to walk around naked and basically a bomb. Um. 0:17:55.800 --> 0:18:00.560 Then you have Rorschach. He has the as iconic. He's 0:18:00.600 --> 0:18:02.760 got the trench coat, the hat, he's sort of designed 0:18:02.760 --> 0:18:06.480 out of off the question, which is a character from DC. UM. 0:18:06.600 --> 0:18:09.399 He had his face changes and uh, he was abused 0:18:09.400 --> 0:18:12.480 as a child, he had a horrible life, and he 0:18:12.520 --> 0:18:15.600 thinks of the mask as his face. Uh. Then you 0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:19.040 have Azzymandias, who it sort of becomes a bad guy. 0:18:19.200 --> 0:18:22.359 Spoiler alert. If you're like liking everything we're talking about, 0:18:22.359 --> 0:18:25.439 like maybe I'll go read this comic, stop like don't listen. 0:18:26.000 --> 0:18:31.960 Um okay, okay, alright, we're good. We just want to 0:18:31.960 --> 0:18:35.320 make sure maybe sometimes you change mind way okay. Um. 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:38.320 This guy basically thinks he's the next coming of Alexander 0:18:38.359 --> 0:18:42.160 the Great. Um. He is a narcissist of the highest order. 0:18:42.760 --> 0:18:46.240 Um is born wealthy, gives all of that up, tracks 0:18:46.280 --> 0:18:50.199 through the desert, follows like Alexander's path, regains all of 0:18:50.280 --> 0:18:53.040 his money, becomes like this marketing genius basically, so he's 0:18:53.040 --> 0:18:56.520 a billionaire. He owns a huge company. He predicts trends. 0:18:57.880 --> 0:19:01.480 At the end of this story, Oh and a year 0:19:01.520 --> 0:19:05.080 before the Keen Act, which outlawed superheroes forever, he revealed 0:19:05.119 --> 0:19:07.040 his identity, which is really important to note because this 0:19:07.080 --> 0:19:09.680 is sort of what makes people trust him. They're like, oh, well, 0:19:09.680 --> 0:19:11.240 he was honest with us, and he told us who 0:19:11.240 --> 0:19:14.040 he is, and he's a good guy's a philanthropist, and 0:19:14.080 --> 0:19:16.040 he's in good shape, and he's white and he's blond. 0:19:16.359 --> 0:19:20.080 He's the best. Also, want to say, the privilege of 0:19:20.119 --> 0:19:22.400 like giving all your money away and still being able 0:19:22.440 --> 0:19:25.800 to get it all back. It was wild. It's a 0:19:26.160 --> 0:19:28.879 wild journey. And so and he's kind of like a 0:19:28.920 --> 0:19:32.120 suave ladies like you, women would want to be with him, 0:19:32.119 --> 0:19:33.440 but we don't see him with a lot of ladies. 0:19:33.440 --> 0:19:35.800 Like that's heard of the persona that he has. Uh. 0:19:35.800 --> 0:19:38.280 In the end, he decides that what the world needs 0:19:38.520 --> 0:19:41.120 UM the whole book is based off the fears of 0:19:41.880 --> 0:19:45.440 an atomic bomb an atomic attack again. Um, and what 0:19:45.480 --> 0:19:49.320 do we do when we're afraid? So his solution is, 0:19:49.359 --> 0:19:52.399 if we're all afraid of different countries and borderlines, what 0:19:52.520 --> 0:19:56.119 if a giant space squid fell from the sky, landed 0:19:56.119 --> 0:19:58.960 on New York killed half the population, start talking about 0:19:58.960 --> 0:20:01.640 three million, three and a half people. Uh, and then 0:20:01.800 --> 0:20:03.400 we would be afraid of space and so we would 0:20:03.760 --> 0:20:07.960 like band together and it picking worked. People were like, yo, 0:20:08.160 --> 0:20:12.200 screw that space alien. We're john with technology, Like, we 0:20:12.240 --> 0:20:14.240 don't want none of that anymore. We need a new 0:20:14.320 --> 0:20:19.960 cowboy in office. Um. So Robert Redford runs for president 0:20:20.040 --> 0:20:24.320 at the end. Um And basically yeah, then he sort 0:20:24.320 --> 0:20:27.920 of gets to get away with it. So so gets 0:20:27.920 --> 0:20:31.120 away with it, right, So here's the thing in the text. 0:20:31.600 --> 0:20:34.200 The final scene is Rorschach, who's been keeping a journal 0:20:34.200 --> 0:20:37.119 of everything, discovers, Oh, this is what he's gonna do, 0:20:38.240 --> 0:20:41.040 writes all of that downtown to into a conservative newspaper. 0:20:41.560 --> 0:20:43.639 Now that's all you know. So it's a very much 0:20:43.640 --> 0:20:45.679 a cliffhanger at the end of the book. If you 0:20:45.800 --> 0:20:49.680 choose to follow the stories Cannon as it travels to television. 0:20:50.040 --> 0:20:52.240 We have answers about how that ends now if you 0:20:52.240 --> 0:20:55.280 want to transition, but I want to talk about too. 0:20:56.720 --> 0:20:59.720 I'm just for some reason, I'm forgetting Dr Manhattan's arc. 0:21:00.280 --> 0:21:03.240 What what ends up happening with? Oh yeah, okay. So 0:21:03.520 --> 0:21:07.160 Dr Manhattan basically decides to leave because he doesn't understand 0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:11.200 humanity anymore. He's become just like higher thought. Basically, he's 0:21:11.240 --> 0:21:13.280 like a dead body has the same atoms as an 0:21:13.320 --> 0:21:16.119 alive body, so there's literally no difference to me. Yeah, 0:21:16.160 --> 0:21:20.280 he's a galaxy brain like the version I'm thinking so 0:21:20.359 --> 0:21:22.760 much further beyond humanity. So he goes to Mars and 0:21:22.800 --> 0:21:24.800 he builds himself little palace. He's having good time there, 0:21:24.840 --> 0:21:27.720 but there is one person he cares about. That's Laurie, 0:21:27.920 --> 0:21:30.800 oksal expector. So he comes back down, grabs her, whisked 0:21:30.800 --> 0:21:32.560 her off to Mars, and it's like, you know, if 0:21:32.600 --> 0:21:34.760 you can convince me to care about these humans, maybe 0:21:34.760 --> 0:21:37.800 I'll come back. Now. Dr Manhattan sees in multiple times, 0:21:37.800 --> 0:21:41.159 so basically anything that's happening to him, it's all happening 0:21:41.200 --> 0:21:43.920 to him at once. If that makes sense. What happened 0:21:45.800 --> 0:21:47.560 eight now it all he can see it all at 0:21:47.560 --> 0:21:49.840 the same time happening to him because in the future 0:21:49.880 --> 0:21:53.800 and the past. Um. But he convinced me, basically convinced me. 0:21:54.240 --> 0:21:57.600 So just as a note on what you just said. Visually, 0:21:57.640 --> 0:22:01.280 it's really cool because you're having these multiple animals showing 0:22:01.359 --> 0:22:04.720 like these different time frames and it's translated within that 0:22:04.760 --> 0:22:07.920 way instead of just outright saying it. As you're watching 0:22:08.200 --> 0:22:11.679 these different moments happen. Listen, I'll read you three panels 0:22:11.760 --> 0:22:14.680 real quick. And this this is Dr Manhattan talking. He's 0:22:14.680 --> 0:22:16.560 on Mars. He's looking at a photograph of him and 0:22:16.600 --> 0:22:19.040 his first wife Janie. He says, the photograph is in 0:22:19.040 --> 0:22:20.840 my hand. It is the photograph of a man and 0:22:20.880 --> 0:22:23.920 a woman. They are an amusement park in nine nine. 0:22:24.600 --> 0:22:27.000 In twelve seconds time, I dropped the photograph to the 0:22:27.000 --> 0:22:29.800 sand at my feet walking away. It's already lying there 0:22:29.880 --> 0:22:33.440 twelve seconds into the future. Ten seconds now. The photograph 0:22:33.480 --> 0:22:35.360 is in my hand. I found it in a derelict 0:22:35.400 --> 0:22:39.160 bar at the Gilla Flatts test based twenty seven hours ago. 0:22:39.440 --> 0:22:41.520 This is how he sees all of time. It's either 0:22:41.640 --> 0:22:45.120 happening now and it's all at the same time. So basically, 0:22:45.160 --> 0:22:48.600 Lori's like, listen, if you love me and the plausibility 0:22:48.640 --> 0:22:52.439 of all of time that I came into being, Like, 0:22:52.520 --> 0:22:55.600 you have to see the miracle that is humanity and 0:22:55.640 --> 0:22:59.680 want to protect that. And he's like, okay, kinda yeah. 0:23:00.160 --> 0:23:02.320 He pops back down to Earth, but he lands like 0:23:02.400 --> 0:23:05.440 two seconds after the squid has already done its job. 0:23:06.320 --> 0:23:08.439 The squid lives for like six seconds, three seconds and 0:23:08.440 --> 0:23:12.280 then dies immediately. Um. It turns out Azzy's head like 0:23:12.320 --> 0:23:14.280 these Basically he said up a bunch of different satellites 0:23:14.280 --> 0:23:16.119 and stuff that would block his ability to see in 0:23:16.160 --> 0:23:19.000 the future, and what he what specifically Ozzy was doing. 0:23:19.760 --> 0:23:22.080 I want to say that I am so floored by 0:23:22.200 --> 0:23:25.000 the fact that he's so inhuman and he still gets 0:23:25.000 --> 0:23:28.159 a ton of booty, Like I mean, I'm listening to 0:23:28.240 --> 0:23:31.200 this and I'm like, this man is a human calculator 0:23:31.920 --> 0:23:34.359 and then he's just like scoring hot, Like we just 0:23:34.400 --> 0:23:37.920 want someone to hold us and respect us, Like, truly, 0:23:37.960 --> 0:23:43.720 how many of of your friends are chasing emotionally unavailable men? Mean, 0:23:45.080 --> 0:23:48.760 I mean, listen, you know what he does. Though he 0:23:48.800 --> 0:23:51.359 probably keeps all his appointments, he doesn't go like he 0:23:51.480 --> 0:23:55.280 probably basicle, if you're super emotional, I prefer a practical 0:23:55.320 --> 0:23:57.280 partner who's like, let's just look at the He's probably 0:23:57.400 --> 0:24:00.760 very time oriented. He can also be multiple places at once, 0:24:00.760 --> 0:24:02.639 so he didn't have as many hands as you would 0:24:02.680 --> 0:24:04.520 need to get the job. He's not going to send 0:24:04.520 --> 0:24:08.439 you ah y w y d text like you know, 0:24:08.960 --> 0:24:11.919 he's going to be considerate anyways, I'm sorry, I'm just 0:24:11.960 --> 0:24:13.800 looking at the pictures of the women that he's that 0:24:13.880 --> 0:24:16.439 makes you feel any better. Lorie leaves him at the 0:24:16.560 --> 0:24:19.600 end of the comic and is off with her owl 0:24:19.600 --> 0:24:23.160 guy um, and they have like a very domestic ending. 0:24:23.200 --> 0:24:26.120 It's cute, um, but to your point, he comes back, 0:24:26.320 --> 0:24:30.199 um Rorschach cannot take the injustice of Azzi Mandius winning. 0:24:30.600 --> 0:24:34.879 So uh, Manhattan snaps him dead basically, and his like, listen, 0:24:35.040 --> 0:24:38.119 you can't be here ruining our plans. We're trying to 0:24:38.400 --> 0:24:40.920 achieved piece at a horrible cost, but it's achieved. Let's 0:24:40.920 --> 0:24:44.760 not because that's what happened. Is Manhattan's kind of like, oh, 0:24:45.040 --> 0:24:47.560 I get what you did, and yeah, He's like, I 0:24:47.560 --> 0:24:49.840 wouldn't have done it, but we're here now, so what 0:24:49.880 --> 0:24:53.919 about yeah, and is losing his mind crying in the 0:24:53.960 --> 0:24:58.280 snow and he's like all right, by Yeah, begs him 0:24:58.320 --> 0:24:59.960 for death. He's like, just do it because this world 0:25:00.119 --> 0:25:03.879 this freaking nuts. Uh. And that is what document. Then 0:25:03.880 --> 0:25:05.159 he goes back to Marks, He's like, yeah, I really 0:25:05.200 --> 0:25:07.800 don't care about anything. Happy to hear Pete out. So 0:25:07.840 --> 0:25:09.360 we have to talk about just a couple of other 0:25:09.440 --> 0:25:11.720 comic stuff before we hop into the movie, which I 0:25:11.720 --> 0:25:13.800 know if he wants to talk about. Um. So there 0:25:13.800 --> 0:25:18.320 were nine prequel mini series in so if you do 0:25:18.920 --> 0:25:21.040 love the comedian I don't know for some reason, and 0:25:21.119 --> 0:25:24.600 you want to read I mean his prequel, um, there's 0:25:24.600 --> 0:25:28.680 an entire comic devoted to him. There's also Doomsday Clock, 0:25:28.720 --> 0:25:31.320 which I heavily, I actually really enjoyed, although it's not 0:25:31.600 --> 0:25:34.520 over like they were dealing with a lot of delays, 0:25:34.760 --> 0:25:40.159 So now you know, okay. So essentially Doomsday Clock is 0:25:41.280 --> 0:25:45.560 was written by Jeff John's and uh art by Gary 0:25:45.600 --> 0:25:48.119 Frank and Color Sprad Anderson. So it was essentially a 0:25:48.160 --> 0:25:54.520 world where what if Dr Manhattan like left this universe? Uh. 0:25:54.560 --> 0:25:57.399 And but what happened with it is that it was 0:25:57.440 --> 0:26:01.720 supposed to affect the rest of d C comics. However 0:26:01.760 --> 0:26:03.639 the rest of d C comics has kind of like 0:26:03.760 --> 0:26:07.640 moved on, So it's like, what are we doing with 0:26:07.680 --> 0:26:11.440 this storyline? Uh. Something cool that happened when the original 0:26:11.440 --> 0:26:13.959 Watchman came out was that it kind of made the 0:26:14.040 --> 0:26:17.240 other DC comics a little bit darker. Uh. This was 0:26:17.280 --> 0:26:20.360 a super dark comic and it kind of influenced Superman 0:26:20.440 --> 0:26:22.960 and Wonder Woman and Batman at the time. So they 0:26:23.080 --> 0:26:27.800 ended up doing a one shot It's called DC Universe Rebirth, 0:26:28.480 --> 0:26:32.879 and that was too essentially essentially explained that Dr Manhattan 0:26:32.880 --> 0:26:37.320 was the reason why that was happening. Yeah, so um, 0:26:37.359 --> 0:26:38.960 and I know this because I talked to our friend 0:26:39.040 --> 0:26:42.359 Hector Navarro, who is like encyclopedic knowledge, and I'm like, 0:26:42.400 --> 0:26:45.359 explain this universe rebirth. It's a fun It's a fun 0:26:45.400 --> 0:26:48.000 rebirth because if you think about the theme of time 0:26:48.040 --> 0:26:50.199 and how the importance of it throughout Watchman and the 0:26:50.240 --> 0:26:53.440 idea that all Moore did fundamentally change the face of comics, 0:26:53.560 --> 0:26:56.760 not yes the Watchman, because now on a literary scale, 0:26:56.800 --> 0:27:00.840 it's comics are now considered, uh being cosidered period, where 0:27:00.840 --> 0:27:02.720 before they were like child's play and I was like, no, 0:27:02.840 --> 0:27:06.359 look great art. Um. So, between this series and Swapman, 0:27:07.160 --> 0:27:09.480 not only did things get darker, but we also started 0:27:09.480 --> 0:27:12.520 taking comic books more seriously. We started looking at artists 0:27:12.560 --> 0:27:16.160 more seriously, and I think that there's something kind of fun, 0:27:16.520 --> 0:27:20.960 especially with the difficult relationship Alan Moore And do you 0:27:21.000 --> 0:27:24.120 see that out of them being like, well, well we'll 0:27:24.160 --> 0:27:27.760 pay homage like many many years too late and after 0:27:27.800 --> 0:27:29.720 making very terrible deals with you, but well we'll try to, 0:27:29.840 --> 0:27:32.520 you know, honor you in in this way. Um. I 0:27:32.600 --> 0:27:34.120 kind of wish I had stuck around and it would 0:27:34.119 --> 0:27:36.639 have been interesting to put that whole layer up. But 0:27:36.640 --> 0:27:38.200 I think there's also a lot of pressure for writers 0:27:38.200 --> 0:27:43.440 to constantly considering this cornerstone work that is constantly making, 0:27:43.880 --> 0:27:46.760 you know, maybe not the greatest statements about superheroes in general. 0:27:46.880 --> 0:27:48.639 To try to work under that umbrella all of the 0:27:48.680 --> 0:27:51.879 time on something you genuinely love might be challenging. Definitely. 0:27:51.960 --> 0:27:55.359 Do you both also know about the button them Facebook? No, 0:27:55.480 --> 0:27:59.159 the comic, Oh yeah, but please explain that to to people, 0:27:59.600 --> 0:28:01.800 Smily is buch is like iconic. I didn't know what 0:28:01.840 --> 0:28:04.040 it was for like the first twelve years of my life. 0:28:04.119 --> 0:28:05.920 The lore of it, to the best of my understanding, 0:28:05.960 --> 0:28:07.400 is this, The smiley face is one of the most 0:28:07.400 --> 0:28:10.840 recognizable symbols. Uh in the United States at the time, 0:28:11.040 --> 0:28:13.280 and because he's a comedian, they were sort of looking 0:28:13.320 --> 0:28:15.560 for like a badge or a symbol for him. Every 0:28:15.600 --> 0:28:19.040 different hero got a badge or a symbol because, um, 0:28:19.200 --> 0:28:21.240 they're trying to god to market them to the larger public. 0:28:21.440 --> 0:28:24.359 So he became the Smiley Face. But if you know 0:28:24.359 --> 0:28:26.199 anything about the comedian, you know that he's laughing at 0:28:26.280 --> 0:28:30.959 literally everything, and that gets very disturbing up to a point. Um, 0:28:31.040 --> 0:28:34.040 and so the opening image for the comic sort of 0:28:34.040 --> 0:28:37.640 that smiley face flattered with blood. It's on the cover. Um, 0:28:37.800 --> 0:28:41.160 it kind of just represents both the comedy and the 0:28:41.160 --> 0:28:44.560 gore that you're about to get into. Yeah. So there 0:28:44.640 --> 0:28:46.920 was a comic that came out called The Button. It 0:28:46.960 --> 0:28:51.240 was comic book crossover. It was actually a storyline where 0:28:51.280 --> 0:28:53.760 Batman in the Flash worked together to uncover the truth 0:28:53.800 --> 0:28:56.440 behind the mysterious button that they found, or that Batman 0:28:56.480 --> 0:28:59.600 found in the bat Cave. Uh So, there's so much 0:29:00.000 --> 0:29:03.880 are honestly behind the Watchman. But we also had a 0:29:03.960 --> 0:29:06.280 film that had a lot of It was released in 0:29:06.280 --> 0:29:08.600 two thousand nine and directed by Zack Snyder, and it 0:29:08.640 --> 0:29:11.040 was based off the comics. I mean, really, there's only 0:29:11.120 --> 0:29:13.600 one thing to really talk about because it is like 0:29:13.640 --> 0:29:17.280 a pretty faithful adaptation. Uh, and you know it has 0:29:17.440 --> 0:29:20.240 it's one of those one uh one of the it's 0:29:20.280 --> 0:29:24.880 the one uh broken clocks being right twice where his 0:29:25.360 --> 0:29:29.120 Zack Snyder's dark vision, you know, totally fits this comic. 0:29:29.400 --> 0:29:32.360 And and this was two thousand nine, so we haven't 0:29:32.360 --> 0:29:35.080 seen in a million times. It was very fresh, you know, 0:29:35.160 --> 0:29:37.920 we're very ready for it. So it's great. Yeah, there's, 0:29:38.760 --> 0:29:40.880 like I said, really nothing to say because it falls it. 0:29:40.960 --> 0:29:43.080 There was only one change and that's why I had 0:29:43.120 --> 0:29:44.520 to bring it up because I have to talk about 0:29:44.560 --> 0:29:47.800 how much I dislike this change. And change was they 0:29:47.840 --> 0:29:50.360 removed the squid that we talked about and everything that 0:29:50.400 --> 0:29:54.520 we explained and changed it to Dr Manhattan exploding in 0:29:54.640 --> 0:29:58.400 New York. And this is what was supposed to, uh 0:29:58.840 --> 0:30:01.400 make you know, all the states that were at odds 0:30:01.520 --> 0:30:06.520 come together. And you know because Doctor Manhattan quote unquote 0:30:06.520 --> 0:30:10.680 went rogue, which which if you know anything about just 0:30:11.200 --> 0:30:13.640 the way politics and the blame game that comes with 0:30:13.800 --> 0:30:17.480 disasters go, that would that just wouldn't happen. And that's 0:30:17.600 --> 0:30:21.600 just a complete lack of like if that happened, no 0:30:21.640 --> 0:30:24.760 one would assume that doctor Man hadn't went wrong rogue, 0:30:24.800 --> 0:30:26.719 it would be looked at as the us at fault. 0:30:27.080 --> 0:30:30.120 It would probably be speculized that maybe they were testing 0:30:30.120 --> 0:30:32.000 it to use on one or the other one, maybe 0:30:32.000 --> 0:30:35.600 even furthering this arms arms race. So the squid was 0:30:35.680 --> 0:30:38.280 perfect as is. And the reason I disliked it is 0:30:38.280 --> 0:30:42.000 because it felt like that very early early two thousand 0:30:42.120 --> 0:30:44.840 nine comic book movie thing of being of thinking, oh, 0:30:44.920 --> 0:30:47.400 this was too silly and it only works in a comic. 0:30:47.520 --> 0:30:50.000 It was exactly that. I remember reading a lot of 0:30:50.040 --> 0:30:52.920 interviews with that kinding like it we can't really do that, 0:30:53.000 --> 0:30:56.360 Like who would a believe it? Or be like I 0:30:56.360 --> 0:30:58.040 think it we came about. I mean, I'm trying to 0:30:58.040 --> 0:31:01.840 thou nine graphics and like what that would physically look like. 0:31:02.040 --> 0:31:03.400 But if you look in the comic, I think it's 0:31:03.400 --> 0:31:05.880 like only two or three panels and all you're seeing 0:31:05.880 --> 0:31:07.880 our tentacles. You have a big eye and a couple 0:31:07.880 --> 0:31:11.760 of tentacles on a building. You have my attention. You know, 0:31:14.160 --> 0:31:17.000 it's been a long day. I have to make our 0:31:17.760 --> 0:31:22.360 all right. Well that and that's pretty much the movie. Okay, 0:31:22.400 --> 0:31:26.800 So the budget was one thirty hundred thirty eight million. 0:31:26.920 --> 0:31:30.520 It actually did make a hundred one five point three 0:31:30.520 --> 0:31:32.320 million of box office, so it did make its money 0:31:32.360 --> 0:31:36.560 back and more. Nice. I mean, it's funny because I 0:31:36.080 --> 0:31:40.480 I've have a strong film opinion about superhero movies, and 0:31:40.480 --> 0:31:43.040 it's funny to think back in those days when you 0:31:43.040 --> 0:31:46.600 were making only like eighty million more when you make 0:31:46.640 --> 0:31:50.760 a superhero movie. Uh you know. I believe superhero movies 0:31:50.760 --> 0:31:54.080 are guaranteed hits now because we they've been so consistent 0:31:54.160 --> 0:31:56.320 for so long that it's trusted that people will at 0:31:56.400 --> 0:31:58.600 least see it, even if it's a spectacle, which is 0:31:58.600 --> 0:32:01.320 why movies like Joker and Venom still do really well, 0:32:01.600 --> 0:32:04.600 even though like everyone's like this, even people online are 0:32:04.640 --> 0:32:07.960 like this can't be that great. Uh so. And my 0:32:07.960 --> 0:32:11.080 my pitch before we move on is that instead of 0:32:11.440 --> 0:32:15.680 trying to hire these like big time you know directors 0:32:15.840 --> 0:32:18.880 who like do it, I think you should pilot newer 0:32:18.960 --> 0:32:23.480 directors on movies and let them. Here's my pitch to 0:32:23.480 --> 0:32:25.840 to double down on that and give them a smaller budget, 0:32:26.240 --> 0:32:29.920 makes small budget, intimate stories with superheroes. We do not 0:32:30.160 --> 0:32:32.880 need an apocalypse at the end of every superhero movie. 0:32:32.920 --> 0:32:36.160 I'm so tired of I mean that's why Aunt Man 0:32:36.240 --> 0:32:38.840 was so refreshing. Yea, you went from these big thing 0:32:38.920 --> 0:32:42.320 to like a small heist and a guy who loves 0:32:42.360 --> 0:32:46.240 his daughter. Same with Homecoming felt so good. Jason Aaron, 0:32:46.280 --> 0:32:48.960 who did that really good run of Hawkeye? I think 0:32:49.000 --> 0:32:52.040 so yeah, do that. I don't understand why that is 0:32:52.120 --> 0:32:54.240 not a movie we've been got yeah yet or even 0:32:54.280 --> 0:32:56.520 like how we don't have a really good like Kamala 0:32:56.600 --> 0:32:59.240 khan As, like you know, a young girl just in 0:32:59.320 --> 0:33:02.000 high school fighting a local bag guy with a killer soundtrack, 0:33:02.120 --> 0:33:05.760 like done, wrap it up. I'm ready. I'm waiting for 0:33:05.880 --> 0:33:08.600 because I think whatever Kamalakan movie comes out, it needs 0:33:08.640 --> 0:33:10.800 to be shot like a teen movie. That's what I'm saying. Like, 0:33:10.800 --> 0:33:12.920 I don't understand how doesn't have an entire line of 0:33:12.960 --> 0:33:14.600 teen movies. I'm so sorry this is really off tracked, 0:33:14.640 --> 0:33:17.200 but just like really quick between her and America Javas 0:33:17.320 --> 0:33:20.160 and both Spider Man, like you've got an entire and 0:33:20.200 --> 0:33:22.600 then you have uh, oh my gosh, what are their 0:33:22.840 --> 0:33:26.600 Young Justice version? Oh you're talking about the New Avengers 0:33:26.760 --> 0:33:30.480 have a Hawkeye and I mean technically Captain Marvel yes, 0:33:30.600 --> 0:33:34.760 in the Little Queer babies give them to me. Um, well, yeah, 0:33:34.800 --> 0:33:36.360 I think that. I think what they're doing though, is 0:33:36.400 --> 0:33:39.040 they want to make sure that everyone goes to Disney Plus. 0:33:39.280 --> 0:33:41.280 So that's why a lot of those and I think 0:33:41.480 --> 0:33:45.080 to their meredit, I mean, for the Mandalorian, they're giving 0:33:45.120 --> 0:33:50.040 them a movie budget, and it's yeah, it's it's really 0:33:50.560 --> 0:33:54.120 cool seeing the stuff that they that they have planned 0:33:54.120 --> 0:33:57.080 for Marvel and taking these like side stories that won't 0:33:57.120 --> 0:34:00.240 be these huge movies, but can explore these stories which 0:34:00.280 --> 0:34:03.240 will hopefully, yes, we'll lead to New Avengers and me 0:34:03.400 --> 0:34:06.880 being cast as cap uh you know, just you know, 0:34:07.000 --> 0:34:08.799 I was you know, I was running out of black 0:34:08.840 --> 0:34:11.160 heroes and then now we're getting so deep in there 0:34:11.200 --> 0:34:16.319 that we can go like new powerman Young Uh. I 0:34:16.320 --> 0:34:19.040 feel bad for forgetting his name, Well it was was 0:34:19.040 --> 0:34:22.480 it Justice? I don't know, Uh, are you talking about Aquel? No, 0:34:22.960 --> 0:34:26.480 I'm talking about even though he were like no, no, 0:34:26.640 --> 0:34:30.120 it's the leader of Young Justice and he's the Isaiah Bradley. 0:34:30.200 --> 0:34:35.359 That Isaiah Bradley, his grandson Elijah Bradley, patriot of the 0:34:35.400 --> 0:34:40.480 Young Avengers. So I was super doubling that they Avengers 0:34:40.520 --> 0:34:42.480 and and Justice have black leads. Were still off tract, 0:34:42.520 --> 0:34:48.840 but it's Young Avengers, not New Avengers. I misspoke and 0:34:49.000 --> 0:34:53.200 Young Justice. I see why. We're okay anyway, Yeah, we digress. 0:34:53.440 --> 0:34:55.200 We have to take a really quick break and then 0:34:55.239 --> 0:34:57.239 we're going to hop into the show. Now if you 0:34:57.280 --> 0:35:00.000 haven't seen it, We're not going to give any huge 0:35:00.040 --> 0:35:02.360 spoilers away. We're just going to kind of talk about 0:35:02.560 --> 0:35:04.120 we're gonna set it up and kind of talk about 0:35:04.120 --> 0:35:06.040 some of the issues that it tackles. Right after this 0:35:13.360 --> 0:35:16.480 and we're back. So Joel, who you are actually doing 0:35:16.640 --> 0:35:20.719 recap for if you have watched the show, or once 0:35:20.760 --> 0:35:22.440 you do watch the show, if this makes you want 0:35:22.480 --> 0:35:24.560 to watch it. Where can people catch your recap? A 0:35:24.719 --> 0:35:28.520 V Club TV club about nine oh five every day 0:35:28.560 --> 0:35:32.800 after the episode airs. Um, we get into heavy spoilers, 0:35:32.840 --> 0:35:35.080 so you know, it's a recap com prepared, but also 0:35:35.080 --> 0:35:36.719 trying my best to try to give you guys enough 0:35:36.760 --> 0:35:39.880 history from the original comic and talk about what's being 0:35:39.920 --> 0:35:44.120 laid over and it makes some wild predictions at the end. Um. 0:35:44.160 --> 0:35:46.360 The message boards on avy Club are amazing, so if 0:35:46.360 --> 0:35:48.520 you guys want to join the conversation, they're giving me 0:35:48.600 --> 0:35:53.640 so much new information. Damon Lindelof. He loves this story 0:35:53.880 --> 0:35:55.399 so much. She's got a quote actually on the back 0:35:55.400 --> 0:35:58.280 of my comic. Uh, the greatest piece of popular fiction 0:35:58.440 --> 0:36:02.160 ever produced. So does a direct quote from Damon about Watchman. Uh. 0:36:02.200 --> 0:36:05.440 This comes out two thousand five, I think so, almost 0:36:05.440 --> 0:36:09.600 twenty years ago. Um. It's amazing to me that he's 0:36:09.600 --> 0:36:14.600 been able to produce such a high quality, such a 0:36:14.920 --> 0:36:19.640 thought provoking, thoughtful, loving like homage to the original comic, 0:36:19.760 --> 0:36:23.280 and still make it polished and updated four viewers today, 0:36:23.480 --> 0:36:26.680 like even just two episodes in. It's it's quite an accomplishment. 0:36:26.719 --> 0:36:28.960 I'm loving the TV series. Yeah, so can you set 0:36:28.960 --> 0:36:32.560 it up for us? What are we walking into thirty 0:36:32.800 --> 0:36:38.680 five years into the future? Roughly? It' um, yeah, from 0:36:38.680 --> 0:36:40.400 the future of watch From the future of Watchman. So 0:36:40.440 --> 0:36:42.840 the Watchman d nineteen eighty five, that's when the squid drops. 0:36:43.080 --> 0:36:46.280 Eleven two is the date they used to describe the event, 0:36:46.760 --> 0:36:51.800 much like our nine eleven. Um. You enter in Tulsa, Oklahoma. 0:36:52.360 --> 0:36:55.160 The cops have just faced what it's called the White Night, 0:36:55.200 --> 0:36:59.000 which is a night where a local white supremacist terrorist 0:36:59.120 --> 0:37:02.279 organization invades all the cops homes and does their best 0:37:02.320 --> 0:37:06.719 to assassinate, murder, remove all of them in a single night. Uh. 0:37:06.760 --> 0:37:09.480 They don't fully succeed, but they get pretty close. The governor, 0:37:09.800 --> 0:37:12.840 along with the police, decide that the best option is 0:37:13.080 --> 0:37:16.640 for them to be masked. So they're essentially a police 0:37:16.640 --> 0:37:18.920 force of superheroes. So they don't view themselves like that 0:37:19.040 --> 0:37:21.680 at all. They're like, we wear the mask for our 0:37:21.719 --> 0:37:26.120 own protection because people try to assassinate us. Um, some 0:37:26.120 --> 0:37:28.440 stuff you can get off of. There's a thing called 0:37:28.920 --> 0:37:33.040 pd PDA which is run by Dale pet of the FBI. 0:37:33.719 --> 0:37:38.840 UM the Operation against Mass Heroes something I can't remember 0:37:39.080 --> 0:37:42.640 the acronym, but basically, the FBI runs an organization that 0:37:42.680 --> 0:37:45.960 helps make sure any vigilantes are immediately snuffed out before 0:37:45.960 --> 0:37:48.839 they take charge. Um. And there you get a bunch 0:37:48.880 --> 0:37:51.480 of like really great information mostly. Uh, what I want 0:37:51.480 --> 0:37:54.840 to focus on today here is that after Doctor Manhattan 0:37:55.400 --> 0:37:58.640 goes back to Mars, there's in the middle of Watchman 0:37:59.080 --> 0:38:02.040 there's a theory that he's causing cancer to those closest 0:38:02.080 --> 0:38:05.040 to He invented a lot of technology that helped move 0:38:05.120 --> 0:38:09.919 them up. The world's up technology technologically, and now people 0:38:09.920 --> 0:38:11.560 are afraid of technology. So in the show, there are 0:38:11.600 --> 0:38:14.120 beepers and still a phone book, and mostly people use 0:38:14.200 --> 0:38:17.640 landlines because they've become terrified of technology and the damage 0:38:17.640 --> 0:38:19.680 that it can do, so much so that companies have 0:38:19.719 --> 0:38:21.680 to be like, listen, we have a new computer and 0:38:21.760 --> 0:38:24.200 you need to use it. It's not dangerous, we promise you, 0:38:24.280 --> 0:38:26.560 like please, please, please, don't be afraid of the technology. 0:38:26.600 --> 0:38:29.399 We need to move forward. It's also the reason cops 0:38:29.440 --> 0:38:31.120 are kind of stuck in the past. Not enough crimes 0:38:31.120 --> 0:38:33.840 are getting solved because we haven't updated to a computer system, 0:38:34.080 --> 0:38:36.359 which means we're still doing everything by hand with old 0:38:36.360 --> 0:38:40.359 giant binders. It's messy, old school police work, which makes 0:38:40.400 --> 0:38:42.680 for a cool, gritty like crime drama because it gives 0:38:42.719 --> 0:38:45.200 you that old school feel and it doesn't feel forced. 0:38:45.680 --> 0:38:47.600 I'm sorry because I review these. I've seen some of 0:38:47.640 --> 0:38:49.359 head and I want to make sure and I give 0:38:49.360 --> 0:38:51.279 you guys, any kind of spoilers or anything. Well, I 0:38:51.320 --> 0:38:54.360 can talk about a side thing that isn't necessarily a spoiler, 0:38:54.400 --> 0:38:57.440 because it wouldn't be an episode of Nerdificent if we 0:38:57.480 --> 0:39:00.239 didn't ruin some Nerds stuff with our s J you 0:39:00.360 --> 0:39:03.160 crap like this takes place in Tulsa, which is known 0:39:03.200 --> 0:39:08.279 for the bombings of Black Wall Street. And I heard 0:39:08.320 --> 0:39:11.759 that they actually do some like some homages akin to 0:39:11.920 --> 0:39:15.200 that to kind of, you know, actually like bring this 0:39:15.320 --> 0:39:17.640 because I think a lot of people don't know that 0:39:17.640 --> 0:39:20.640 that happened. I mean, I definitely was late in life 0:39:21.120 --> 0:39:23.120 when I found it. I spoke about it as if 0:39:23.120 --> 0:39:27.520 I've already died. Uh, But like it's it's it's a 0:39:28.160 --> 0:39:31.640 it's it's funny because it just kind of is a 0:39:31.880 --> 0:39:35.400 such a response to theo why won't the black community 0:39:35.400 --> 0:39:38.040 pull themselves up by their bootstraps? And it's like, WHOA 0:39:38.400 --> 0:39:41.960 we were? And every time we do it, white people 0:39:42.120 --> 0:39:45.279 are there to, you know, come along and just burn 0:39:45.320 --> 0:39:49.280 it to the ground. And and so sorry I didn't 0:39:49.320 --> 0:39:52.080 Well no, let's let's talk about that if you. Because 0:39:52.280 --> 0:39:57.760 this show Watchman has a ninety eight percent certified fresh 0:39:57.840 --> 0:40:00.920 on the Tomato meter, that is by critic. Almost a 0:40:01.000 --> 0:40:06.280 hundred eighty nine reviews have gotten it to audience score 0:40:06.880 --> 0:40:14.919 forty three percent. Um. When you look at WHOA, why 0:40:14.960 --> 0:40:18.760 do we think that critics have Yeah, And it's because 0:40:18.880 --> 0:40:24.319 it is, um, this is what we're talking about. I 0:40:24.360 --> 0:40:26.759 am so upset. I don't know people who vote it 0:40:26.840 --> 0:40:31.600 thumbs down because it's because here's the thing. I am 0:40:31.680 --> 0:40:34.600 patting DC on the back for tackling this. And on 0:40:34.680 --> 0:40:38.040 Immigrant Day I retweeted it they said, immigrants make the 0:40:38.120 --> 0:40:43.839 multiverse better hashtag immigrants. Yes they did. I am so 0:40:43.920 --> 0:40:47.120 happy that they are, like, f y'all, we can't say 0:40:47.160 --> 0:40:50.799 the real thing. Um, you know, they're telling these stories. 0:40:50.920 --> 0:40:53.080 But one thing I kind of want to Sorry, I 0:40:53.080 --> 0:40:54.960 didn't mean to cut you off. I want to touch 0:40:55.000 --> 0:40:57.400 on because something you were saying and with the tomato 0:40:57.440 --> 0:41:00.640 meter that made me think is like the thing that 0:41:00.640 --> 0:41:03.240 that gets me is like, I think, like the people 0:41:03.280 --> 0:41:05.800 who are like dumbing it down and saying as forced 0:41:05.880 --> 0:41:08.439 s j W. They aren't even people I think are 0:41:08.560 --> 0:41:12.000 fully on the right. It really are is this group 0:41:12.040 --> 0:41:15.240 of people who are quote unquote apathetic, who are quote 0:41:15.280 --> 0:41:18.279 unquote in the middle, who are quote unquote And then 0:41:18.920 --> 0:41:22.400 every time I see that sentiment, it always comes. It 0:41:22.400 --> 0:41:25.279 seems to come from that group more than anything. And 0:41:25.400 --> 0:41:27.680 it's very funny because it goes back to that thing 0:41:27.760 --> 0:41:31.080 of like when they say when you don't uh, it's 0:41:31.080 --> 0:41:33.360 the Martin Luther King quote where everyone uses where like 0:41:33.400 --> 0:41:35.640 if you if you don't pick a side, you have 0:41:35.719 --> 0:41:41.560 chosen the side of white supremacy. But it's like, but 0:41:41.600 --> 0:41:43.560 it really does feel that way where it's like you're 0:41:43.600 --> 0:41:45.719 the like cool, you don't want to pick a side, 0:41:45.760 --> 0:41:48.719 but if someone wants to speak out against the you know, oppressor, 0:41:49.120 --> 0:41:51.279 then then you have a problem. I've definitely had some 0:41:51.320 --> 0:41:54.000 of these comments and you know chatter, I mean, like 0:41:54.080 --> 0:41:55.920 I just don't understand. And a lot of times it's 0:41:55.960 --> 0:41:58.919 so funny because their critiques are so very vague. They're 0:41:58.920 --> 0:42:02.120 like something's just like I just feel it's very contrived. Yeah, 0:42:02.239 --> 0:42:05.480 thought was put into it. It is contrived. So I'm sorry, 0:42:05.480 --> 0:42:07.919 but did you read the original comics by a man 0:42:08.040 --> 0:42:11.200 who literally people were saying was anti American. But there's 0:42:11.239 --> 0:42:13.279 also the thing that people walked away thinking Rorschack was 0:42:13.320 --> 0:42:16.160 the hero of this story. So a lot of people 0:42:16.239 --> 0:42:19.160 are not getting and so let's let me wrap. Okay. 0:42:19.160 --> 0:42:21.240 So Nicole Cassell, who was the director of the pilot 0:42:21.239 --> 0:42:25.640 and episode two, the way she shot that opening scene 0:42:26.000 --> 0:42:28.560 was like you felt history come alive in a way 0:42:28.640 --> 0:42:32.200 that I don't think we often get, especially for like 0:42:32.760 --> 0:42:35.120 black people. Like it's sort of it reminded me of 0:42:35.239 --> 0:42:40.200 um Spielberg's saving Private Ryan. Those which are just very 0:42:40.239 --> 0:42:46.360 intimate portrayals of what chaos and catastrophe looks like. Um 0:42:46.400 --> 0:42:48.160 and I think that what the show was giving us. 0:42:48.320 --> 0:42:52.800 In we saw Night Sister, that's Regina King's character, visit 0:42:52.840 --> 0:42:56.480 a museum recently and like learn you could basically just 0:42:56.520 --> 0:43:00.480 look up family history in there, which is I'm like, 0:43:00.960 --> 0:43:03.040 if you know your family history, if you can trace 0:43:03.080 --> 0:43:06.160 it back, that's incredible. So many Black Americans cannot. UM 0:43:06.640 --> 0:43:10.600 my family we've gotten back to I want to say, 0:43:10.640 --> 0:43:14.080 my three grades, so we can track two decades back 0:43:14.120 --> 0:43:17.560 in two people into slavery, back to grandmother's past. That 0:43:17.600 --> 0:43:20.960 there's just not records. We just we were nameless on paper, 0:43:21.280 --> 0:43:23.359 being shifted around in different places. You can't track your 0:43:23.360 --> 0:43:25.200 history like that. So if there was a way to 0:43:25.200 --> 0:43:28.040 have a DNA database to sort of start examining, you know, 0:43:28.120 --> 0:43:29.640 who were your people and where do they come from 0:43:29.640 --> 0:43:32.360 and what does that mean? Like, my god, it's amazing 0:43:32.600 --> 0:43:35.280 the idea of like I know, redfordations are rubbing people 0:43:35.320 --> 0:43:37.680 really the wrong way. That's Robert Redford gives black people 0:43:37.719 --> 0:43:40.759 reparations in the show. And it's still beautiful. Now they 0:43:40.800 --> 0:43:43.120 live in like this thriving metropolis of black people so 0:43:43.160 --> 0:43:46.400 many black extras on this damn show just looking amazing 0:43:46.440 --> 0:43:49.120 living in this like stunning space, a space that I 0:43:49.160 --> 0:43:51.360 think typically would have been gentrified by white people is 0:43:51.360 --> 0:43:52.839 what it looks like, but it's got a whole one 0:43:52.840 --> 0:43:55.719 to like a thriving black community. And I think that 0:43:55.840 --> 0:43:58.120 for David, he was like, if you don't know David 0:43:58.160 --> 0:44:02.040 Lindloff is um creator of Lost, He did um and 0:44:02.200 --> 0:44:05.200 having a brain fart y'all. Lost, Oh Leftovers, Um soosere 0:44:05.200 --> 0:44:07.759 are his two big shows. He does these really thoughtful 0:44:08.120 --> 0:44:11.480 examinations of what it means to basically exist, Like what 0:44:11.520 --> 0:44:13.360 does it mean to be a person, a good person? 0:44:13.800 --> 0:44:16.120 How do we handle ourselves in crisis? For him to 0:44:16.160 --> 0:44:17.960 turn his eye and be like, so, like, what have 0:44:18.040 --> 0:44:22.000 black people been doing under crisis in America forever? Starting 0:44:22.040 --> 0:44:25.440 in but then also going back in the second episode 0:44:25.480 --> 0:44:29.080 to look at black people fighting for um America in 0:44:29.080 --> 0:44:31.839 World War One and what that was like when you 0:44:31.880 --> 0:44:34.839 could not get equal service in America but we're dying 0:44:34.880 --> 0:44:37.880 for your country. How does that like rek havoc on 0:44:37.920 --> 0:44:40.200 the soul? And then more importantly, what does that do 0:44:40.280 --> 0:44:42.120 to your children and their children? And how do we 0:44:42.200 --> 0:44:45.760 carry that? He said very openly, like he was nervous 0:44:45.800 --> 0:44:47.960 about it, but that as a person in a position 0:44:48.000 --> 0:44:51.080 of power, he felt it important. And as a black 0:44:51.080 --> 0:44:53.960 person who loves comics, who's always, you know, very excited 0:44:53.960 --> 0:44:55.800 to go to these movies and see these TV shows 0:44:55.840 --> 0:44:58.480 or whatever, to feel that Lens specifically turned to my 0:44:58.520 --> 0:45:01.799 community in a way that is not looking down upon 0:45:01.960 --> 0:45:05.760 or feeling bad for but just simply examining the circumstances. 0:45:06.000 --> 0:45:09.480 My god, well, to me, it's so telling whenever, like 0:45:09.520 --> 0:45:12.280 you said, examining the circumstances. And when people I literally 0:45:12.320 --> 0:45:16.080 I was reading reviews of it and one said preachy 0:45:16.160 --> 0:45:18.719 and another says forced. And I'm like, why is it 0:45:18.760 --> 0:45:21.960 that when we tell our stories it's forced. It's because 0:45:21.960 --> 0:45:24.480 they're not thinking about it, so it feels forced. It's like, oh, 0:45:24.520 --> 0:45:26.839 because never in your life do you think about this, 0:45:27.239 --> 0:45:30.120 because it doesn't feel forced when people when when you 0:45:30.160 --> 0:45:32.600 watch success and you're like, oh, they're not they're forcing 0:45:32.840 --> 0:45:35.640 this idea that being rich is so bad. Also, don't 0:45:35.680 --> 0:45:37.640 say you have a hard time understanding black stories when 0:45:37.640 --> 0:45:39.239 you're watching all those rich people and you ain't never 0:45:39.280 --> 0:45:41.960 been rich in your life. You know, like it's just 0:45:42.080 --> 0:45:44.720 like it's people that people are always reaching and making 0:45:44.760 --> 0:45:47.920 some sort of excuse or you know, b as to 0:45:48.040 --> 0:45:51.400 like to like try and like shoot down things that 0:45:51.440 --> 0:45:55.600 are trying to say something and to like like and 0:45:55.680 --> 0:45:59.200 we set this a few episodes back to like really 0:45:59.400 --> 0:46:03.400 try and like look at a medium that was really 0:46:03.880 --> 0:46:07.439 uplifted by two Jewish dudes from New York and try 0:46:07.440 --> 0:46:10.560 and be like, oh, it's s j W. Force. It's 0:46:10.600 --> 0:46:14.160 like now it's been literally creating Superman to go fight 0:46:14.360 --> 0:46:18.360 like a monster that was attacking them directly. Like, Also, 0:46:18.880 --> 0:46:20.680 what do you think the Justice League or any of 0:46:20.719 --> 0:46:24.120 these are they are warriors fighting for social justice? Like 0:46:25.080 --> 0:46:27.640 like we get those comments sometimes too iffy and I 0:46:27.640 --> 0:46:30.480 I'm like, well, we're talking about superhero culture. What do 0:46:30.520 --> 0:46:33.960 you think superhero culture is. It's a team of of 0:46:34.040 --> 0:46:36.680 superheroes who are taking on who are trying to write 0:46:37.000 --> 0:46:40.960 the injustice is done to marginalize groups. Well here's what 0:46:40.960 --> 0:46:43.719 what what it is and uh and then after this 0:46:43.760 --> 0:46:46.560 weekend close, But here's what it is is that the 0:46:46.600 --> 0:46:50.520 way every person who reads superhero, the way we the 0:46:50.640 --> 0:46:53.600 idea that we have of a superhero is someone who 0:46:53.640 --> 0:46:58.040 fights for what's important. The problem that that we have that. 0:46:58.120 --> 0:47:01.440 I think that is being lost in translation is the 0:47:01.480 --> 0:47:04.799 idea of what's important to people. If if if the 0:47:05.040 --> 0:47:08.400 if you know, if equality and freedom for all people 0:47:08.560 --> 0:47:10.920 isn't important to you. Every time you see those heroes 0:47:10.960 --> 0:47:13.359 fight that it seems like they're doing something weird, but 0:47:13.400 --> 0:47:16.480 it's like, no, bro, you just never realize. You just 0:47:16.560 --> 0:47:19.480 never paid attention because you've only cared about yourself. You've 0:47:19.480 --> 0:47:21.719 only cared about the things affecting you, and you've let 0:47:21.760 --> 0:47:23.879 that be an excuse and let that make you into 0:47:23.920 --> 0:47:27.880 a whiney, shriveled up person who honestly can't be that good. 0:47:27.920 --> 0:47:31.879 Because if you cannot care for the people who are 0:47:31.920 --> 0:47:34.879 surrounding you, if you cannot care for your fellow human being, 0:47:34.920 --> 0:47:37.279 you have no humanity and you are a villain. You're 0:47:37.320 --> 0:47:39.560 not a hero. Yeah, And I want to say to 0:47:39.600 --> 0:47:41.400 the people that are like, well, just don't change the 0:47:41.440 --> 0:47:43.560 source material. I would like you to go back in 0:47:43.600 --> 0:47:45.400 the time when the source material was made in the 0:47:45.400 --> 0:47:49.000 thirties and forties, and we were not allowed in those stories. 0:47:49.080 --> 0:47:50.839 We were not allowed to be on screen, we were 0:47:50.840 --> 0:47:53.200 not allowed to be on the cover. So yeah, now 0:47:53.239 --> 0:47:55.960 it's going to be reflective. This we were always a 0:47:56.000 --> 0:47:57.839 part of the world, we just weren't allowed to be 0:47:57.880 --> 0:48:01.080 reflected in it. Now we are so sorry that they're 0:48:01.120 --> 0:48:04.719 infusing us into the story. We've always been here, we 0:48:04.800 --> 0:48:07.040 just weren't allowed to be on the cover. How do 0:48:07.080 --> 0:48:08.759 you want better? We'll do whatever we want to the 0:48:08.760 --> 0:48:11.359 source material. You go read the source material. You want 0:48:11.360 --> 0:48:13.080 to read that, go read that. It's there for you. 0:48:13.120 --> 0:48:15.520 It's not getting deleted. I can't encourage you enough if 0:48:15.520 --> 0:48:19.760 you're enjoying this conversation to just keep watching Watchman, because 0:48:20.719 --> 0:48:24.399 the way they're examining the history of comic books and superheroes, 0:48:24.520 --> 0:48:30.160 especially in some of those later episodes, I just you guys, shaken, shaken. 0:48:30.200 --> 0:48:32.960 There's a moment I had to pause and write a review. 0:48:33.360 --> 0:48:35.239 I skipped four reviews to write a review. I was 0:48:35.280 --> 0:48:39.160 so moved by an episode. I was like, you did that, Like, 0:48:39.520 --> 0:48:42.920 I just think it's so important that if you're not 0:48:42.960 --> 0:48:46.160 ready to or don't want to examine your white privilege, 0:48:46.280 --> 0:48:48.959 and or if it makes you uncomfortable to see black 0:48:49.000 --> 0:48:52.160 and brown people in heroic roles, or if it makes 0:48:52.160 --> 0:48:55.560 you uncomfortable to see the destruction and the devastation that 0:48:55.600 --> 0:48:58.160 they faced to take a second, and ask yourself, just 0:48:58.320 --> 0:49:00.319 why are you uncomfortable with that? And do that on 0:49:00.320 --> 0:49:03.840 your own without ruining or or trampling on other people's 0:49:03.880 --> 0:49:06.160 excitement to just see themselves on a screen. You see 0:49:06.200 --> 0:49:08.440 yourself all the time. Take yourself out of it. I 0:49:08.480 --> 0:49:10.640 mean even I think I even want to, even though 0:49:10.680 --> 0:49:13.120 that is a very important message, and yes, clock that 0:49:13.520 --> 0:49:16.359 I even want to take like five steps back and 0:49:16.400 --> 0:49:19.560 just say, if you see someone enjoying something, let them 0:49:19.600 --> 0:49:22.000 have that. Why do you have to Why do you 0:49:22.000 --> 0:49:24.680 have to input the why you didn't like the thing 0:49:24.719 --> 0:49:27.439 they like to the conversation. That's never been fun, It's 0:49:27.440 --> 0:49:29.920 never been cool. And people didn't do that back in 0:49:29.920 --> 0:49:31.879 the day because people wouldn't talk to you. But now 0:49:31.920 --> 0:49:33.719 you have a platform where you can just insert your 0:49:33.800 --> 0:49:36.880 voice and you know, and and and disappear into the 0:49:36.960 --> 0:49:40.640 night behind your anime avatar. It's like if someone's enjoying something, 0:49:40.680 --> 0:49:43.359 and there's tons of things that people enjoy that I 0:49:43.480 --> 0:49:47.560 do not care for, or there are tons of people 0:49:48.080 --> 0:49:54.719 and music rappers, you know, artists that people love and 0:49:54.840 --> 0:50:00.279 I do not for the like of me half of 0:50:00.320 --> 0:50:03.560 a smidgeon, And you know what I do, I just 0:50:03.640 --> 0:50:07.400 keep scrolling pushing because I followed too many anime boobs 0:50:07.400 --> 0:50:09.600 to be wasting time. I'm going with some money on Twitter, 0:50:10.160 --> 0:50:12.480 I do want to say, um, one of these reviews 0:50:12.520 --> 0:50:17.040 said that it was to woke. On that note, Joel 0:50:17.800 --> 0:50:21.840 too woke, Joel, where can everyone catch you? Yeah? Follow 0:50:21.880 --> 0:50:24.799 me over at Twitter at Joel Monique because we find 0:50:24.800 --> 0:50:27.040 all of the things A V club, TV club or 0:50:27.040 --> 0:50:29.200 I hopefully we're revealing a couple more shows coming up. 0:50:29.239 --> 0:50:30.920 I really love that community. So if you want a 0:50:30.960 --> 0:50:34.640 twin in the conversation, we'd love to have you. And finally, 0:50:34.960 --> 0:50:38.799 in the next magazine on Got Guys, uh Cultured Magazine, 0:50:38.960 --> 0:50:42.000 the cover issue it's gonna be um Lena Wait and 0:50:42.040 --> 0:50:43.880 Melina Metsukas. I got to sit down with both of 0:50:43.880 --> 0:50:48.239 them and talk about their new movie, which we will 0:50:48.280 --> 0:50:51.279 be talking about for literally ever. It's so good. It's 0:50:51.280 --> 0:50:54.680 called Queen and Slim. It comes out November sixteenth. I 0:50:54.800 --> 0:50:57.359 think check your local listings by a ticket, be the first. 0:50:57.400 --> 0:50:59.279 Don't wait a second weekend or the ending will be 0:50:59.320 --> 0:51:03.759 spoiled for you. I'm at miss Danny Fernandez and just 0:51:03.800 --> 0:51:06.560 another heads up, I have that Fathom event. If you 0:51:06.600 --> 0:51:08.840 love the Twilight Zone I think they're showing four of 0:51:08.880 --> 0:51:12.960 the original Twilight Zone episodes. It's November four at local theaters, 0:51:13.000 --> 0:51:15.040 so check it out. I think you can just google 0:51:15.040 --> 0:51:18.000 Fathom event twilight Zone and I pop up to talk 0:51:18.040 --> 0:51:21.200 a little bit about Rod Serlin before it starts and 0:51:21.320 --> 0:51:23.799 or in between the episodes. I don't know, you're one 0:51:23.800 --> 0:51:28.319 of those things and you know me, uh next, or 0:51:28.480 --> 0:51:32.560 you're listening to this. So this weekend, if you're in St. Louis, 0:51:32.840 --> 0:51:34.600 me and those guys and white women will be at 0:51:34.640 --> 0:51:38.319 the Flyover Comedy Fest doing some improv. And after that, 0:51:38.560 --> 0:51:41.640 I'm probably gonna be eating some barbecue. So catch me 0:51:41.880 --> 0:51:45.520 at a barbecue spot munching down or on stage, whatever 0:51:45.640 --> 0:51:51.160 have you. I mean, look, we'll have to discuss because 0:51:51.160 --> 0:51:53.520 I'm back on ketos, no sauce on it. I gotta 0:51:53.719 --> 0:52:00.000 I gotta eat it dry. God, Like we always say, 0:52:00.239 --> 0:52:02.240 stay nerdy, stay too woke.