WEBVTT - J.S. Ondara: Knockin' on America's Door 0:00:08.360 --> 0:00:08.840 Pushkin. 0:00:11.240 --> 0:00:13.600 Just a quick note here. You can listen to all 0:00:13.640 --> 0:00:16.400 of the music mentioned in this episode on our playlist, 0:00:16.440 --> 0:00:18.479 which you can find a link to in the show 0:00:18.560 --> 0:00:22.239 notes for licensing reasons, each time a song is referenced 0:00:22.239 --> 0:00:28.760 in this episode, you'll hear this sound effect. All right, enjoyed. 0:00:28.480 --> 0:00:34.800 Episode, Welcome to Broken Record. I'm Bruce Headlam. Some voices 0:00:34.920 --> 0:00:37.960 just grab you right away. That happened to me recently 0:00:38.000 --> 0:00:42.040 when I heard this voice on my car radio. There 0:00:42.120 --> 0:00:45.800 was something just so haunting about his voice, self assured, 0:00:45.880 --> 0:00:48.960 but oddly tentative, like he was still working out the 0:00:49.040 --> 0:00:51.920 meaning of the song while he was singing it. So 0:00:52.040 --> 0:00:54.560 of course we just had to have him Unbroken Record. 0:00:55.520 --> 0:00:57.760 It turns out, like a lot of kids, Jays and 0:00:57.840 --> 0:01:01.480 Dara became fascinated by American UZI by listening to faraway 0:01:01.600 --> 0:01:05.319 radio signals late at night. The difference was that he 0:01:05.440 --> 0:01:09.640 wasn't listening to those signals in Buffalo or Memphis or Duluth, Minnesota. 0:01:10.120 --> 0:01:13.440 He was in Nairobi, Kenya, listening to his parents' radio 0:01:13.520 --> 0:01:17.280 while they slept. That's when he decided his own American 0:01:17.360 --> 0:01:20.640 dream was to come here and become a singer. His 0:01:20.680 --> 0:01:25.480 first album Tales of America is full of great songs, wistful, cautionary, 0:01:25.640 --> 0:01:29.280 even violent songs about leaving home and finding oneself in 0:01:29.319 --> 0:01:33.480 a strange country, pursuing an unknown path. And like a 0:01:33.480 --> 0:01:36.520 lot of newcomers to the States, Jays and Dara can 0:01:36.560 --> 0:01:39.640 sometimes see things more clearly than we can, and he 0:01:39.680 --> 0:01:43.600 can express them in that beautiful, haunting voice. We sat 0:01:43.640 --> 0:01:46.440 down with him recently in an La studio and asked 0:01:46.480 --> 0:02:02.200 him to share his American dream with us. You want 0:02:02.200 --> 0:02:11.280 to start with a torch song? Okay? That is JS 0:02:11.320 --> 0:02:15.240 and Dara. We're sitting together in a studio in La. 0:02:15.480 --> 0:02:19.040 I think if I'm gonna set the scene, I have 0:02:19.120 --> 0:02:22.440 to mention your jacket, which is this tremendous red plaid jacket. 0:02:22.440 --> 0:02:23.160 Where did you get that? 0:02:23.800 --> 0:02:26.360 I believe it? God, this is in Boston. But I 0:02:26.440 --> 0:02:29.120 was drawn to it because this fabric is sort of 0:02:30.000 --> 0:02:34.600 similar to a fabric that a tribe in Kenya where's 0:02:35.000 --> 0:02:37.360 it's called the mass I tribe. And there are some 0:02:37.400 --> 0:02:38.480 fabrill that looks just like. 0:02:38.480 --> 0:02:41.560 This and it goes with red pants it which is 0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:42.120 a bonus. 0:02:42.200 --> 0:02:43.720 I am a big fan of red pants. 0:02:44.000 --> 0:02:47.480 Okay, well you wear them well, so tell me about 0:02:47.520 --> 0:02:47.920 that song. 0:02:49.000 --> 0:02:53.000 Torch song is the name of that. This is This 0:02:53.080 --> 0:02:55.960 is one of the songs that I'm still I'm still 0:02:55.960 --> 0:02:59.440 trying to figure out what the painting behind him is, 0:03:00.280 --> 0:03:05.280 behind behind the song is what those words mean? 0:03:06.440 --> 0:03:10.480 So tell me you how did it come about? 0:03:10.520 --> 0:03:13.120 Then? You know, Todd song was just words that I 0:03:13.160 --> 0:03:15.919 put down and uh and I put a melody on them, 0:03:15.919 --> 0:03:18.880 and you know, now it's a song, And I think, 0:03:18.919 --> 0:03:22.720 how how it happens to me is usually after these 0:03:23.320 --> 0:03:28.000 songs have existed for a while, then slowly their meanings 0:03:28.480 --> 0:03:31.560 gradually reveal themselves to the conscious mind, you know, like 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:34.480 the things that were going in the background of my 0:03:34.600 --> 0:03:36.160 in the background on my head or writing it, they 0:03:36.200 --> 0:03:38.520 sort of revealed themselves. It turns out to be this. 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:41.880 It's like a portrait that just sort of reveals itself 0:03:41.880 --> 0:03:45.200 as you put it, or maybe maybe one of those 0:03:45.360 --> 0:03:48.880 negative photo you put it in underwater and water is 0:03:48.960 --> 0:03:52.640 time and once it stays there within, you know, within 0:03:52.960 --> 0:03:55.600 the sort of scope of time, it reveals itself and 0:03:55.680 --> 0:03:56.800 you see the actual picture. 0:03:58.320 --> 0:04:00.200 You might actually be writing lyrics right now. 0:04:03.440 --> 0:04:07.120 They're just words really, And so I think some of 0:04:07.160 --> 0:04:11.960 the songs in the record I've sort of I'm gradually 0:04:12.400 --> 0:04:16.200 figuring them out by discussing them with people, and some 0:04:16.240 --> 0:04:18.800 of them, like torch Song in particular, it still puzzles 0:04:18.800 --> 0:04:22.599 me as to what those words are referring to. 0:04:22.839 --> 0:04:28.400 You were born in Kenya in Nairobi, right, yes, okay, 0:04:29.440 --> 0:04:31.120 and when was that? 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:33.279 That would have been August of ninety two. 0:04:33.880 --> 0:04:37.080 Right, So what was growing up in Nairobi like then? 0:04:38.000 --> 0:04:42.800 It was? It was great. You know, I think when 0:04:42.800 --> 0:04:45.760 you're when you're a kid, you're just a kid, and 0:04:45.839 --> 0:04:50.640 that's just that, you know, you're very busy being a kid, 0:04:51.160 --> 0:04:56.039 that nothing else is really important, because I mean, it's 0:04:56.080 --> 0:04:58.680 too much time being a child. It's just it's all 0:04:58.720 --> 0:05:00.560 the time in the world, and it's it's it takes 0:05:00.560 --> 0:05:02.599 all the time in the world. And so you know, 0:05:02.720 --> 0:05:06.520 when I think about, you know, my childhood in retrospect, 0:05:06.520 --> 0:05:08.720 and I could see like, hmm, perhaps that might have 0:05:08.760 --> 0:05:12.360 been a difficult time. But then you know, when you're 0:05:12.800 --> 0:05:15.600 back at the time, it was just your child, and 0:05:15.720 --> 0:05:17.640 you know, and you're busy being a child and nothing 0:05:17.640 --> 0:05:19.080 else much other than your. 0:05:20.400 --> 0:05:22.840 What was your first memory of music? 0:05:23.600 --> 0:05:25.440 My family tells this story though when I was about 0:05:25.480 --> 0:05:30.880 seven years old, we always had this family gatherings every 0:05:31.240 --> 0:05:34.120 year where you know, you just everyone meets in one place, 0:05:34.160 --> 0:05:37.000 you know, just all relatives and you you meet this 0:05:37.040 --> 0:05:39.520 guy who was apparently your uncle, but you had no 0:05:39.600 --> 0:05:42.000 idea because you saw him at the store the other day, like, 0:05:42.040 --> 0:05:44.880 oh hey, I'm your uncle, boy. You were just selling 0:05:44.880 --> 0:05:48.520 me potatoes the other day. So so, you know, we 0:05:48.600 --> 0:05:50.680 had these all these gatherings and you know, everyone just 0:05:50.680 --> 0:05:52.839 comes together, and one of these gatherings is about seven 0:05:52.920 --> 0:05:56.599 years old. When we were there, my cousins had this 0:05:56.920 --> 0:06:00.719 terrible idea to give me alcohol. So they gave me, 0:06:01.080 --> 0:06:04.120 you know, I think, some little bit of alcohol, and 0:06:04.480 --> 0:06:07.839 apparently I got inebriated very quickly, as as you do 0:06:07.880 --> 0:06:11.480 when you're seven years old, and I just started, you know, 0:06:11.720 --> 0:06:15.440 singing out loud, just like a crazy person. And I 0:06:15.480 --> 0:06:17.719 was parently singing smells like teen spirit in just the 0:06:17.720 --> 0:06:23.479 wrong words. And you know those are some like the 0:06:23.560 --> 0:06:25.839 aardiest sort of you know slashes. 0:06:26.440 --> 0:06:29.000 You heard the song on the radio, yes, oh okay, 0:06:29.040 --> 0:06:30.880 so you're listening to radio by that point. 0:06:30.839 --> 0:06:33.880 Yeah, yeah, just passively though, you know, you know it's 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:37.080 there because we had this tiny little radio that the 0:06:37.120 --> 0:06:39.839 whole family had to share and sometimes I would just 0:06:39.880 --> 0:06:41.400 wake up in the middle of the night so I 0:06:41.400 --> 0:06:44.559 can steal some extra time. It's like three in the morning, 0:06:44.600 --> 0:06:48.320 everyone's asleep, sneak and then grub the radio and start 0:06:48.400 --> 0:06:51.279 listening for all the songs. So it turned from this 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:53.479 passive thing to like, you know, I want it now 0:06:53.520 --> 0:06:55.440 and I'm sicking. I'm seeing it now. 0:06:55.520 --> 0:06:57.479 You your family didn't speak English at home. 0:06:57.520 --> 0:06:59.800 No, we we spoke. We spoke to Heley in the house. 0:06:59.880 --> 0:07:02.320 Is sort of those you know, it's what, it's what, 0:07:02.480 --> 0:07:03.160 it's what we did. 0:07:03.360 --> 0:07:06.000 So did you with smells like teen Spirit? Were you singing? 0:07:07.120 --> 0:07:08.600 Were you singing it in Swahili? 0:07:09.400 --> 0:07:11.840 I was, well, no, I wasn't singing any words. There 0:07:11.920 --> 0:07:13.320 was just gibberish things. 0:07:13.480 --> 0:07:15.920 It's just can you can you play a few bars 0:07:15.960 --> 0:07:17.000 of how you played it? Then? 0:07:17.960 --> 0:07:22.640 Well, I don't know if it's it's It might probably 0:07:22.680 --> 0:07:27.360 be embarrassing to to try and imitate my seven year 0:07:27.400 --> 0:07:31.240 old self trying to sing smells like teen Spirit with 0:07:31.320 --> 0:07:34.480 no words. It was just so like, who is it 0:07:34.640 --> 0:07:37.160 that he saidanger? 0:07:38.200 --> 0:07:41.520 Just nothing, by the way, that's how everybody's sang. 0:07:41.600 --> 0:07:46.720 It wasn't just absolutely gibberish. 0:07:45.360 --> 0:07:48.280 Yeah, so you started singing, and then you just kept 0:07:48.320 --> 0:07:51.760 singing after that, after the cousins spiked your drink. 0:07:51.960 --> 0:07:56.400 As far as singing, I started practicing my singing, I 0:07:56.400 --> 0:08:01.360 suppose in private, after you know, hearing. It happened in 0:08:01.440 --> 0:08:03.480 two phases. So I heard I had the music of 0:08:03.560 --> 0:08:06.760 Jeff Buckley's just quite accidentally as a kid, and I 0:08:06.800 --> 0:08:07.720 had how. 0:08:07.600 --> 0:08:08.200 Did that come with that? 0:08:09.200 --> 0:08:13.920 So with the sort of advent of CDs, when that 0:08:14.000 --> 0:08:18.400 became a thing, we had all these people, I suppose 0:08:18.400 --> 0:08:20.760 you to call it pirating, who would go on the 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:24.720 Internet and they would just get anything, any music or 0:08:24.840 --> 0:08:27.560 film or whatever. They would just download anything that was 0:08:27.600 --> 0:08:31.200 coming out of the US UK and then they would 0:08:31.360 --> 0:08:36.040 sell them on the streets. So I discovered just a 0:08:36.040 --> 0:08:39.200 crazy amount of music that way that would never be 0:08:39.240 --> 0:08:42.000 on the radio. But you know, for some reason, this 0:08:42.840 --> 0:08:46.319 pirating experts just dug them out somewhere and they were 0:08:46.400 --> 0:08:48.960 just lying about. And so I was already on this 0:08:49.000 --> 0:08:51.960 trajectory where you know, I was drawn to this music. 0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:54.760 So when I figured this out, I would just go 0:08:54.880 --> 0:08:57.679 there all the time and would you know, play me this, 0:08:57.880 --> 0:09:00.520 And then I you know, I found I found some 0:09:00.720 --> 0:09:06.040 Buckley songs that way, and at that point, I was like, whoa, 0:09:06.240 --> 0:09:08.080 what's it? What is it doing with this voice? This 0:09:08.160 --> 0:09:11.400 is amazing? So I tried, you know, start locking myself 0:09:11.400 --> 0:09:12.720 in the room and try to practice that. 0:09:12.800 --> 0:09:15.320 And you know, do you remember which songs of his 0:09:15.520 --> 0:09:16.200 you practice? 0:09:16.200 --> 0:09:19.280 It was Forget Her Forget Yeah, that was that was 0:09:19.320 --> 0:09:20.719 the song I heard, and I was like, well, this 0:09:20.800 --> 0:09:26.080 is great, And I think that sort of began what was, 0:09:26.240 --> 0:09:28.520 you know, me trying to be a singer at all 0:09:28.559 --> 0:09:31.400 in private? And then I think the second phase of that, 0:09:31.400 --> 0:09:35.120 I was listening to Radiohead and how told muses this 0:09:35.200 --> 0:09:38.760 sort of high for such a voice and that, you know, 0:09:38.800 --> 0:09:42.440 and being like, well, how do you what's that? How 0:09:42.480 --> 0:09:44.400 do you why would you do that with your voice? 0:09:44.840 --> 0:09:46.760 And how do you even do that? And so, you know, 0:09:47.520 --> 0:09:50.400 get locked myself in the room and also try to 0:09:50.800 --> 0:09:54.199 go up there, which you know, I still try to 0:09:54.240 --> 0:09:56.000 do that every once in a while, you know, just 0:09:57.440 --> 0:09:59.440 I did. I don't know if I do it well enough, 0:09:59.600 --> 0:10:02.480 but I think I'm still sort of I feel every 0:10:02.480 --> 0:10:05.600 time I'm singing, I feel I'm transported back to that 0:10:05.640 --> 0:10:08.040 moment when I'm a child, and I'm still just trying 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:09.960 to trying to figure out how to sing. 0:10:10.000 --> 0:10:12.080 Because is that a good feeling. 0:10:12.679 --> 0:10:15.360 It's it's nerve racking. It's probably not a good feeling. 0:10:17.280 --> 0:10:21.040 It's still a nerve wracking just because it's this is singing. 0:10:21.040 --> 0:10:23.160 It was not something that was open about and it 0:10:23.240 --> 0:10:27.600 was not something that you know, was encouraged growing up 0:10:27.840 --> 0:10:31.760 in me. So it's something I'm still not confident, you know, 0:10:31.880 --> 0:10:33.920 like I don't I don't feel like a confidence singer really. 0:10:36.120 --> 0:10:39.079 Now, you did tell a funny story once about the 0:10:39.120 --> 0:10:41.640 song Knocking on Heaven's Door. Could you tell us. 0:10:41.520 --> 0:10:44.959 That, Yeah, you know it was this one, this one, 0:10:45.000 --> 0:10:47.160 I remember it quite well. We just left the school 0:10:47.200 --> 0:10:50.440 and were standing outside the school and you know, there's 0:10:51.200 --> 0:10:54.400 there's all this people who are selling all this foods 0:10:54.400 --> 0:10:58.719 out there, and I'm having this talk, you know, fight, pay, 0:10:58.880 --> 0:11:01.280 debate whatever you want to call the friend about, you know, 0:11:01.520 --> 0:11:03.440 about rock and you know, growing up listening to all 0:11:03.440 --> 0:11:05.360 this rock songs, I feel something of an X spot. 0:11:06.679 --> 0:11:08.199 What were the bands you were listening to then? 0:11:08.440 --> 0:11:13.000 Well, you know Nevana a radio had said that, Kiri, Oasis, 0:11:13.840 --> 0:11:15.880 you know, just all that stuff that was coming out 0:11:15.920 --> 0:11:21.480 of late late nineties. Out of two thousands, but yeah, 0:11:21.520 --> 0:11:23.960 Guns of Roses and all that, and so so we 0:11:24.040 --> 0:11:28.040 have this discussion about not can happens o guns and Roses, 0:11:28.600 --> 0:11:33.080 you know, the famous guns and Roses song. So we're 0:11:33.160 --> 0:11:36.920 talking about this and like, yeah, there's guns of Rosas 0:11:36.960 --> 0:11:39.640 song can have his doing it goes well and actually 0:11:40.280 --> 0:11:43.680 that that song was by this other guy He's called 0:11:43.720 --> 0:11:49.240 Bob Dylan. And I'm thinking, well, no, you're wrong, it's 0:11:49.360 --> 0:11:51.720 I know this. I I've been listening for what, I 0:11:51.760 --> 0:11:54.320 know what I'm doing. So we go into this in 0:11:54.360 --> 0:11:57.400 his fight, and then we ended up making a bet, 0:11:57.840 --> 0:12:00.680 you know, for a hundred can you show things just 0:12:01.559 --> 0:12:04.000 you know, there's a bunch of money for me, but 0:12:04.120 --> 0:12:06.880 then not too much money here in American currency. But 0:12:07.760 --> 0:12:11.000 we lost that bad. I lost that bad because I 0:12:11.080 --> 0:12:13.640 ended up finding out that it was actually by this 0:12:14.280 --> 0:12:20.160 cynical Bob Dylan. And that's sort of how I found 0:12:20.600 --> 0:12:24.280 Dylan's music and found folk music that way, and just 0:12:24.280 --> 0:12:26.480 fell into this sort of Rabbi hole that I feel 0:12:26.520 --> 0:12:29.760 like I'm still digging myself deeper into every day and 0:12:30.200 --> 0:12:33.200 I can't see how I'll get out now. 0:12:33.240 --> 0:12:35.560 At this point, you still didn't You didn't play guitar 0:12:35.720 --> 0:12:37.800 at this point or any instment, right, but you were 0:12:37.840 --> 0:12:38.920 still writing songs. 0:12:39.120 --> 0:12:39.960 I was writing songs. 0:12:40.000 --> 0:12:43.679 I was writing words, you know, rewriting melodies with them. 0:12:43.480 --> 0:12:47.640 Sometimes sometimes, but I never, you know, thought much of 0:12:47.640 --> 0:12:50.640 those melodies. You know, I wasn't confident in them, but 0:12:50.679 --> 0:12:53.040 I wrote words. And I think one of the reasons 0:12:53.080 --> 0:12:56.280 why I dove pretty deep into you know, that sort 0:12:56.280 --> 0:12:59.599 of focused rabbit hole and Dylan is because when I 0:12:59.640 --> 0:13:03.440 discuss with Dylan's music and then I was, you know, 0:13:03.760 --> 0:13:06.720 reading his songs, and I'm thinking, well, well, these are 0:13:07.160 --> 0:13:10.560 these these are just stories, their poems with melodies. Maybe 0:13:10.559 --> 0:13:12.839 maybe I can just do this with all these words 0:13:12.840 --> 0:13:14.800 I've I've been writing since I was the child, and 0:13:14.840 --> 0:13:17.480 perhaps I can. I can put some melody on them, 0:13:17.480 --> 0:13:19.439 and maybe we'll call them folks, So maybe I can 0:13:19.480 --> 0:13:20.440 have some kind of career. 0:13:22.679 --> 0:13:30.079 We'll have more with js Andra after this break. We're 0:13:30.120 --> 0:13:34.400 back with js and Dora. Can you play Saying Goodbye 0:13:34.400 --> 0:13:34.719 for us? 0:13:35.040 --> 0:13:35.360 Yes? 0:13:38.800 --> 0:13:42.959 So your next step in your musical development was far 0:13:43.000 --> 0:13:46.240 from Kenya. It was Minneapolis, right, Tell me how you 0:13:46.320 --> 0:13:47.000 ended up there? 0:13:47.840 --> 0:13:51.280 Well. As soon as I found Dylan's music and folk 0:13:51.360 --> 0:13:54.680 music in general, it was a time when I think 0:13:54.840 --> 0:13:57.040 I really needed that as well. I was just a 0:13:57.080 --> 0:13:59.480 bit you know, was in haschool's been lost a bit 0:14:00.040 --> 0:14:04.000 add just you know, being being drawn to this thing 0:14:04.480 --> 0:14:11.240 that just consistently dissuaded by everyone. You know, well, you 0:14:11.280 --> 0:14:13.120 love something so much, but it's probably a taboo for 0:14:13.160 --> 0:14:17.200 you to to love it. That being music just you know, 0:14:17.240 --> 0:14:20.040 it's just it was just not something that was part 0:14:20.160 --> 0:14:20.920 part of the culture. 0:14:20.960 --> 0:14:23.920 Really, what was your family's ambition for you. 0:14:24.800 --> 0:14:29.360 Uh, you know, medicine, law just you know, that was 0:14:29.400 --> 0:14:31.080 that was that was just how it had to be. 0:14:32.320 --> 0:14:35.920 And so with either of your parents lawyers or doctors, not. 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:37.960 Really you know, I think it's it's sort of just 0:14:37.960 --> 0:14:42.920 something that's sort of ingrained by the culture there and 0:14:42.960 --> 0:14:46.200 how they grew up, when they grew up and all 0:14:46.240 --> 0:14:49.440 of that. But so that left me in is a 0:14:49.480 --> 0:14:52.760 place where you know, this thing I wanted I couldn't 0:14:52.760 --> 0:14:53.480 even talk about. 0:14:53.880 --> 0:14:55.600 You were playing guitar by this point, I was not. 0:14:56.600 --> 0:14:59.880 I was not. This is just a stupid dream of 0:15:00.240 --> 0:15:03.240 as a kid. And so the first thing I did 0:15:03.480 --> 0:15:06.560 was applied to the University of Minnesota because I figured 0:15:07.080 --> 0:15:09.120 I wanted to go to Minnesota because of my you know, 0:15:09.360 --> 0:15:12.080 first nation with dealing at the time. So I applied 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:17.280 the University of Minnesota, didn't go well. Tried applying for 0:15:17.680 --> 0:15:20.920 you know, work opportunities in Minnesota. Is trying to find 0:15:20.960 --> 0:15:23.560 ways to come to the States because you know, it's 0:15:23.640 --> 0:15:26.840 quite difficult to move here, and you know, I just 0:15:26.920 --> 0:15:30.320 try this for years and nothing really ever worked until 0:15:30.320 --> 0:15:35.760 one time at Green Courd Entry application the lottery green 0:15:35.840 --> 0:15:38.880 kind thing that was a relative that applied for me 0:15:38.960 --> 0:15:42.440 and a couple of other people and went through. 0:15:43.240 --> 0:15:45.520 Nobody told you about the weather in Minnesota before you. 0:15:45.560 --> 0:15:49.520 Left, not really. No one can tell you that in 0:15:49.560 --> 0:15:52.600 a way that you can conceptualize, right, So you know, 0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:55.720 they'll tell you it's cold, but then you're like, oh cool, 0:15:56.360 --> 0:15:58.720 so because you know cold, I mean I felt cold before. 0:15:58.800 --> 0:16:03.560 It's fine. But you know, whatever, whatever you know transpires 0:16:03.560 --> 0:16:07.320 in Minnesota, there should be a different word for that. 0:16:07.320 --> 0:16:10.440 That's not cold. This is not cold. It's just the 0:16:10.480 --> 0:16:13.200 worst thing you can think of on the other side 0:16:13.240 --> 0:16:13.720 of cold. 0:16:15.320 --> 0:16:18.000 Did you arrive in the winter, right right. 0:16:17.840 --> 0:16:19.520 In the heart of winter? Yeah, I was, you know, 0:16:19.600 --> 0:16:24.320 like mid February as you know, that one winter where 0:16:24.360 --> 0:16:25.880 people were just saying, oh, this is one of the 0:16:25.880 --> 0:16:31.480 worst winters we've ever had. Yeah, So yeah, got there 0:16:31.520 --> 0:16:34.680 right in the middle of winter in February and just 0:16:34.760 --> 0:16:39.480 had this crazy, crazy body shock. 0:16:42.200 --> 0:16:43.840 When did you finally pick up a guitar. 0:16:46.160 --> 0:16:48.840 It was a bit after I landed, so you know, 0:16:49.160 --> 0:16:53.400 I moved there and I had this vision that I 0:16:53.400 --> 0:16:55.120 think I'm going to form a band and I'm going 0:16:55.200 --> 0:16:57.240 to take it on the road. And I've seen things 0:16:57.240 --> 0:17:00.120 online they do this now. I've seen some videos and 0:17:00.160 --> 0:17:03.360 the interwebs, you know, going around with bands and playing 0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.639 songs and good old America. So yeah, I'm moving in. 0:17:06.800 --> 0:17:08.320 This is what I'm trying to do. It is, you know, 0:17:08.400 --> 0:17:12.080 telephone with band, because I can't play anything at this time. 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:13.960 I just have all these words and a couple of 0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:16.560 melodies for them. I'm thinking, maybe, you know, a band, 0:17:16.560 --> 0:17:19.879 can uh sort of put some flesh around it and 0:17:19.920 --> 0:17:23.600 we can go play it out. And then I quickly 0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:28.640 realized that I have I don't know any person who 0:17:29.640 --> 0:17:34.000 who's in music or who can uh form a band 0:17:34.040 --> 0:17:40.000 with me. So I said, okay, that's a short set back. 0:17:40.080 --> 0:17:41.879 Let me see if I can pick up the guitar 0:17:42.000 --> 0:17:44.960 and just accompany myself, you know, because if I don't 0:17:44.960 --> 0:17:46.800 know anyone, what else are you going to do? 0:17:46.800 --> 0:17:48.600 Do you remember the first songs you learned. 0:17:49.200 --> 0:17:51.280 Yeah, I was knocking Heaven's door. 0:17:51.600 --> 0:17:54.920 Oh okay, obviously because because guns and roses. 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:58.040 Because guns and roses, right, so I can Heaven's door 0:17:59.480 --> 0:18:04.720 part of I believe, and also is blowing in the wind. Yeah, 0:18:05.520 --> 0:18:08.680 And I sort of just learned a few songs and 0:18:08.920 --> 0:18:11.679 you know, got some grasp of some chords and then 0:18:12.680 --> 0:18:15.720 just took my words and try to put some melody 0:18:15.720 --> 0:18:18.360 around them. I didn't dive deep into it, and so 0:18:18.480 --> 0:18:20.520 I still just try to to this day. Just full 0:18:20.560 --> 0:18:23.800 around and see where I can find a sound. You 0:18:23.840 --> 0:18:26.679 just fool around with chords and just whatever, see what 0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:29.399 the melody. Yeah, just go where the finger goes and 0:18:29.680 --> 0:18:30.480 see what happens. 0:18:30.640 --> 0:18:32.440 Well, you make it sound all very accidental, but you're 0:18:32.560 --> 0:18:34.880 very resourceful. You couldn't find a band, so you picked 0:18:34.920 --> 0:18:37.119 up a guitar, You learned the chords you needed, So 0:18:37.440 --> 0:18:39.359 you must have been very driven in some ways. 0:18:39.680 --> 0:18:42.720 I think, yeah, I think I was. Yeah, just you know, 0:18:42.760 --> 0:18:44.640 what else are you going to do? You you made 0:18:44.640 --> 0:18:47.480 this huge move. You're you know, very far away from home. 0:18:47.520 --> 0:18:49.959 There is nothing to do then to move forward. 0:18:50.480 --> 0:18:51.960 When did you start playing in front of people? 0:18:54.480 --> 0:18:59.879 Probably maybe three four years ago. So, I mean I learned. 0:19:00.480 --> 0:19:03.040 I was very as soon as I figured out a 0:19:03.080 --> 0:19:05.919 few chords, I was like, okay, good, I've got this 0:19:05.960 --> 0:19:06.480 figured out. 0:19:07.280 --> 0:19:09.960 Mm hmmm. Do you remember the first time you got 0:19:10.040 --> 0:19:10.600 up and did it? 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:12.240 Man? 0:19:12.760 --> 0:19:16.760 I think, yeah, I think so. 0:19:17.480 --> 0:19:18.119 What was it like? 0:19:21.119 --> 0:19:26.400 Oh gosh, just the most bizarre experience in the world. Well, 0:19:26.480 --> 0:19:29.160 you know, you ever do something and you're think, what 0:19:29.200 --> 0:19:31.199 are you doing? You fool? 0:19:33.840 --> 0:19:37.000 Oh man, you were hearing your parents' voice at that point. 0:19:37.119 --> 0:19:40.440 Yeah, exactly, that exactly. That just echoing in my head, 0:19:40.560 --> 0:19:43.560 and I think sometimes I still do. You know, in 0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:47.280 the middle of a show, just playing torch song or something, 0:19:47.320 --> 0:19:49.400 and you know, you hear this voice in the bocahet 0:19:49.480 --> 0:19:51.200 what are you doing? What are you doing? 0:19:53.080 --> 0:19:56.879 Are you your family now? Are they happier your success 0:19:57.000 --> 0:20:00.520 and your selling records and people love your is Does 0:20:00.520 --> 0:20:01.720 that made a difference to them? 0:20:02.040 --> 0:20:07.160 Well? I think it has. It has in a way 0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:11.240 that you know, perhaps they they understand that this is 0:20:11.240 --> 0:20:16.240 something that you know, I'm passionate about, but this the 0:20:16.320 --> 0:20:18.480 sort of the roots of this problem are so deep, 0:20:19.080 --> 0:20:23.040 so ingrained in upbringing and in culture that yeah, I 0:20:23.080 --> 0:20:25.080 think they still don't they still don't understand what it 0:20:25.119 --> 0:20:25.640 is that I do. 0:20:25.920 --> 0:20:27.919 Can we hear another song? Can we hear a good question? 0:20:28.359 --> 0:20:28.560 Yeah? 0:20:28.600 --> 0:20:34.760 Sure, More music and conversation with JS and Dora after 0:20:34.800 --> 0:20:42.960 this break, we're back with more songs and conversation with 0:20:43.119 --> 0:20:47.560 JS and Dora. You talked a lot about Kenya and 0:20:47.680 --> 0:20:52.040 the limitations you felt there. Your first album is called 0:20:52.359 --> 0:20:57.240 Tales of America, right, So first of all, why that title? 0:20:58.359 --> 0:21:00.320 What what made you call that? 0:21:02.359 --> 0:21:05.720 You know, when I was I was a kid and 0:21:05.800 --> 0:21:10.159 I was discovering this music, you know, and I was 0:21:11.040 --> 0:21:16.760 drawn in a way too to America and to the 0:21:16.840 --> 0:21:20.200 West in general. And I think part of the reason why, 0:21:20.320 --> 0:21:23.560 you know, I developed this attachment to these songs is 0:21:23.600 --> 0:21:27.439 because it was just it was like a spaceship for me. 0:21:27.760 --> 0:21:30.240 Just you know, I turned on these songs and they 0:21:30.240 --> 0:21:34.919 took me to just a completely different universe, you know, 0:21:34.960 --> 0:21:38.600 where people spoke a different language, everything was different, it 0:21:38.600 --> 0:21:40.800 looked different, and it was just it was a spaceship 0:21:40.880 --> 0:21:43.800 for me, and it was a magical thing. And you know, 0:21:43.840 --> 0:21:45.439 when I was, when I was a kid and I 0:21:45.480 --> 0:21:54.679 was writing little tales on a book, I imagined that, you know, 0:21:54.720 --> 0:21:59.000 one day I might be in America and maybe I'll 0:21:59.040 --> 0:22:01.280 make maybe I'll make a an album and I'm gonna 0:22:01.280 --> 0:22:04.040 call it Tells of America. But then this is it's 0:22:04.119 --> 0:22:07.080 just it was just a stupid thing. You think as 0:22:07.080 --> 0:22:09.080 a child, the same the same way you think about 0:22:09.119 --> 0:22:13.800 going to Mars or flying a plane or you know, 0:22:14.040 --> 0:22:17.600 you know, just or you know, talking to an imaginary friend. 0:22:17.680 --> 0:22:20.840 You know, as a boy, you dream. It's what you 0:22:20.880 --> 0:22:24.280 do as a boy. You dream about traveling to to 0:22:24.359 --> 0:22:29.120 the moon, and you drive imaginary airplanes around, and then 0:22:29.160 --> 0:22:31.439