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Speaker 1: This is Count Fouchet and you're watching Fish on First.

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Speaker 2: This is Fish on Filtered, Episode fifty three on the

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Speaker 2: Fish on First podcast, presented by Jetski Rentals of South

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Speaker 2: Florida and part of the Foul Territory Network. Still getting

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Speaker 2: used to that, still very proud of that. I'm Eli Sausman,

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Speaker 2: the founder of fof bring you the most complete Miami

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Speaker 2: Marlins coverage. So if you're listening to this pod, it's

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Speaker 2: right at the start of what we could refer to

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Speaker 2: a spring breakout week, every single organization playing those prospect

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Speaker 2: focused exhibitions, including the Marlins. This is going to be

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Speaker 2: on Thursday afternoon against the Astros. That coincidentally is going

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Speaker 2: to be the first game that I'm going to see

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Speaker 2: in person so far this spring.

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Speaker 3: Excited for that.

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Speaker 2: Kind of in the spirit of that, it feels like

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Speaker 2: the appropriate time to do a fully prospect focused episode

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Speaker 2: of the pod, which we have not gotten to do

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Speaker 2: in quite a while, certainly not since the new Partnership

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Speaker 2: Without Territory kicked off. So I have had maxfield Lane

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Speaker 2: in my DMS for a few weeks and we finally

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Speaker 2: got on the same page in terms again both him

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Speaker 2: and Owen Riley. They're both co founders of Oyster Analytics.

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Speaker 2: They write for Down on the Farm sub stack, and

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Speaker 2: they have just what I feel is a really unique

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Speaker 2: take and not really a take, but actually dating driven

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Speaker 2: interpretation of prospect value and the future expectations of these

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Speaker 2: players at the big league level. So I thought it would

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Speaker 2: be great just to chop it up with them for

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Speaker 2: a little bit here, specifically on Marlins players. So welcome

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Speaker 2: to both Maxfield and Owen. This should be a fun conversation.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, thanks a lot.

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Speaker 1: Of course.

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Speaker 2: I'll give you a quick trivia question to start off with,

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Speaker 2: given that this is going to be mostly a hitter

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Speaker 2: focus conversation in Marlin's history, Off the top of your head,

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Speaker 2: what year do you think the Marlins had their best

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Speaker 2: offense at the big league level? You know, I'll give

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Speaker 2: you some hints that they won the World Series in

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Speaker 2: ninety seven, they went in two thousand and three. They

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Speaker 2: in the last handful of years they have been propped

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Speaker 2: up by their pitching, so you could kind of rule

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Speaker 2: those out. But if you guys had to pick a

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Speaker 2: particular year that you think takes the takes the cake

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Speaker 2: in terms of their best offensive team.

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Speaker 4: And I mean, before you said anything, I was gonna say,

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Speaker 4: I'll just go I was gonna say two thousand and

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Speaker 4: three because World Series team, good offense and good pitching,

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Speaker 4: I think.

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Speaker 3: But now I'm assuming that's wrong, because that seems obvious.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a few years earlier. I remember, I

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Speaker 1: remember actually seeing that. I saw the Marlins a lot

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Speaker 1: then when I was a little kid, and I remember

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Speaker 1: I remember Skinny Maggie left field, Maggie playing in Pittsburgh

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Speaker 1: one time. I would bet it's a cad. I would say,

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Speaker 1: it's like, oh, one or two.

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Speaker 2: Well you predated Maggie for going in two thousand and one.

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Speaker 2: He was there three to two thousand and seven.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Well, by runs scored, it's the two thousand seven team

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Speaker 2: and right behind them as the twenty seventeen team. And

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Speaker 2: by WRC plus is essentially a tied at one oh one.

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Speaker 2: So for people unfamiliar with way to runs created plus

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Speaker 2: one hundred is league average. The Marlins in their history

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Speaker 2: have never had one above one hundred and one. You know,

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Speaker 2: the pink that the Marlins have gotten from their offense

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Speaker 2: in their thirty three season history to this point is

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Speaker 2: what you could generously say is a slightly above average offense,

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Speaker 2: which is why I felt like you guys were especially

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Speaker 2: fascinating that this whole conversation about the next wave of

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Speaker 2: Marlins hitting talent is really compelling to me because the

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Speaker 2: Marlins as a whole, I have really never had what

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Speaker 2: you described as this really impactful unit coalesce to the

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Speaker 2: big league level, even with most of those guys haven't

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Speaker 2: been homegrown. And hopefully that will change. Maybe that will change.

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Speaker 2: We'll see the Marvels as an organization have approached player

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Speaker 2: development in a different way these last couple of years

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Speaker 2: under Peter Bendix, and they have previously. Right before getting

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Speaker 2: into a particular player, I did want you guys to

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Speaker 2: speak a little bit more specifically about Oyster analytics and

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Speaker 2: what it is that you guys are doing. So, yeah, Owen,

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Speaker 2: and you give us anything that we should know about

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Speaker 2: what it is that leads to your brand of projections

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Speaker 2: that you guys come up with for prospects.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, sure, So yeah, Max and I are former D

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Speaker 4: three college baseball players who you know, after college wanted

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Speaker 4: away to stay involved in the game and do things

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Speaker 4: we love and stay in touch as well, and so

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Speaker 4: one thing that we're really interested in is understanding, you know,

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Speaker 4: prospect value and really trying to quantify that, not just

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Speaker 4: in a way that is statistically rigorous, obviously that's the foundation,

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Speaker 4: but also in a way that's easily communicable to lots

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Speaker 4: of different types of fans with different levels of knowledge

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Speaker 4: about like in depth analytics and different interests. And I

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Speaker 4: think that what we try to do is to you know,

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Speaker 4: optimize our modeling system, the Oyster model, to be as

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Speaker 4: rigorous as possible, but also produce these results where we

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Speaker 4: produce these results about the chances that we think a

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Speaker 4: player has of reaching different war thresholds in their MLB career.

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Speaker 4: And we think that's a cool way to make it

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Speaker 4: really easily digestible, you know what we're saying about a player,

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Speaker 4: and be able to compare players, you know, across the board,

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Speaker 4: within organizations, across organizations really easily. And yeah, we think

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Speaker 4: we've developed, we hope, a pretty unique take on prospects. So,

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Speaker 4: like you said, thanks for that, and yeah, excited to

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Speaker 4: talk about the marlins in there.

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Speaker 2: I know that you got this started a couple of

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Speaker 2: years ago, in twenty twenty four, So even in that

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Speaker 2: period of time, has there anything changed or have there

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Speaker 2: been ways that you've optimized the model just based on

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Speaker 2: what you guys have learned over that period of time.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure.

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Speaker 4: So it's the foundation of the model is a series

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Speaker 4: of I will get two into it, but random forest models,

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Speaker 4: which was after a lot of trial and era of

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Speaker 4: different kind of statistical methods, that's what we found to

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Speaker 4: be most effective, and we've we've stuck with that, but

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Speaker 4: we've diversified how the random forest models are constructed a

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Speaker 4: little bit. And we've also done things like, you know,

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Speaker 4: include park factor and actually, you know, upgrade the granularity

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Speaker 4: of the park factors that we use. We've worked on

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Speaker 4: including better measures of how much a player lifts the ball,

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Speaker 4: so cutting out like in field flag balls, you don't

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Speaker 4: want that to count for lyft. We've done things to

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Speaker 4: ensure that we're able to understand how stack CAAFT metrics,

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Speaker 4: which only become available in triple A, can affect you know,

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Speaker 4: what our model is putting out because obviously you don't

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Speaker 4: have those metrics down in single A. And overall, you know,

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Speaker 4: I think we're we try to be really transparent about

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Speaker 4: the fact that you know, we're gonna get we're gonna

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Speaker 4: get hopefully a lot of stuff right, but we also

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Speaker 4: get stuff wrong, and we try to use those things

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Speaker 4: that we get wrong as learning experiences to also make

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Speaker 4: the model better and better. And we're also in a

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Speaker 4: business right where you're never going to.

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Speaker 3: Get one hundred percent of things right.

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Speaker 4: So I think like holding yourself accountable and being open

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Speaker 4: about that reality, I think is something that we pride

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Speaker 4: ourselves on.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think something else that we try to

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Speaker 1: do that that we we see a lot of merit in,

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Speaker 1: is just simplifying the you know what we show statistically, right,

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Speaker 1: looking at things like contact home runs and gap power

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Speaker 1: and and showing it based on standard deviations, you know,

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Speaker 1: relative to average. It helps contextualize minor league stats.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: The difference in what a good OPS is in you know,

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Speaker 1: different aspects of triple A versus single A versus people

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Speaker 1: who are still in the DSL is very different, and

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Speaker 1: that's you know, super challenging for viewers to be able

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Speaker 1: to understand, you know, is this number good?

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Speaker 3: Right? You know?

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Speaker 1: It depends and so by by simplifying it and bringing

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Speaker 1: it all into this one structure, we're able to have

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Speaker 1: you look at this and say, okay, we can understand

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Speaker 1: what this batting average, you know what these contact figures

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Speaker 1: mean in their context, rather than having to do a

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Speaker 1: lot more research figure out is this good?

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Speaker 3: Is it not?

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Speaker 1: And so on, just you know, we want to deliver

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Speaker 1: it straightforward and to the point, and we think that

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Speaker 1: showing those key areas through the standard deviations relative to

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Speaker 1: the mean is is the best and most simplistic way

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Speaker 1: to do so.

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Speaker 2: Mm We're speaking just the day after you rolled out

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Speaker 2: a top one hundred ranking of hitting prospects according to

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Speaker 2: the Oyster Model, and I want to spend the bulk

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Speaker 2: of the conversation on that because with a lot of

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Speaker 2: these Marlins players, I was quite surprised by where they

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Speaker 2: wind it up. And there's a lot of writing involved

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Speaker 2: with this because they are blurbs on every single one

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Speaker 2: of those players, as well as some additional ones I

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Speaker 2: missed the cut. So we've done a lot of heavy

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Speaker 2: lifting already on that, which I appreciate. But getting even

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Speaker 2: more context behind them, I think would be really useful

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Speaker 2: to people as we head into this season. And we

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Speaker 2: could start off with just going down the list. Five

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Speaker 2: Marlins are in your top one hundred. There are a

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Speaker 2: couple right outside of it and to be really hammered

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Speaker 2: this over it's top one hundred hitting prospects. So everybody

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Speaker 2: is accustomed to seeing top whatever lists of prospects in general,

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Speaker 2: combining pitchers and hitters, and so this will these numbers

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Speaker 2: perhaps will be tricky for people to wrap their minds around,

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Speaker 2: considering that this is in the context of hitters only.

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Speaker 2: All of our World Baseball Classic coverage is brought to

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Speaker 2: you by our friends at Fox one, which is live

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Speaker 2: stream all your Fox favorites together in one place for

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Speaker 2: a few more exhilarating days. That includes all WBC games

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Speaker 2: and after that the best MLB action throughout the twenty

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Speaker 2: twenty sixth season, from the WBC through the World Series

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Speaker 2: to the World's Cup, to NASCAR and IndyCar. With Fox one,

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Speaker 2: today and stream the World Baseball Classic live now through

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Speaker 2: March seventeenth. Go to foxwe dot com for complete terms

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Speaker 2: and conditions. Fox one streaming now with that said, will

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Speaker 2: go one at a time, starting with Owen Casey, who

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Speaker 2: is kind of the Marlin's prospect that has had the

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Speaker 2: most eyeballs on him in every sense of the word lately,

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Speaker 2: just acquired over the offseason into trade with the Cubs.

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Speaker 2: I've talked about him quite a bit on our own

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Speaker 2: podcast over the course of spring training, and generally speaking, I've,

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Speaker 2: in my position relatively known among people in our group

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Speaker 2: at fish on first, I'm the low man on him.

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Speaker 2: I would say, all things considered, and you guys kind

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Speaker 2: of landed him number forty six overall on this list

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Speaker 2: of hitting prospects and the Marlins number one overall. There.

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Speaker 2: So some people are watching this on YouTube, others are listening,

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Speaker 2: and you have these great player cards for everybody that

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Speaker 2: appeared on the list showing just one different attributes. And

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Speaker 2: how as you reference standard deviations away from the mean

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Speaker 2: in each of these categories from his development, speed and

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Speaker 2: contact ability, gap power, home run power, lifts, et cetera.

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Speaker 2: And then right besides that, the distribution of career outcomes.

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Speaker 2: And I think that's a really fascinating way to look

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Speaker 2: at it, specifically when you're looking at the peak war

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Speaker 2: or the prime war for their season potential season at

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Speaker 2: the big league level. Although it performed very well last year,

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Speaker 2: it came from like repeating the Triple A level that

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Speaker 2: he'd spent basically the entire previous season that as well,

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Speaker 2: So it gets a cup of coffee and the majors

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Speaker 2: at the end, and there were I think a lot

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Speaker 2: of arrows pointing in the right direction with his performance.

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Speaker 2: I'm curious how it is that the itself kind of

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Speaker 2: interprets that when somebody has this this improvement across the board,

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Speaker 2: but comes when playing against competition that they had already

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Speaker 2: played at.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, no, you're exactly right. That is something that

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Speaker 4: actually does ding him in the model. Like the combination

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Speaker 4: of the fact that he's not super young for the

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Speaker 4: level and the fact that he's had a lot of

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Speaker 4: time without climbing levels are both things that the model understands,

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Speaker 4: as you know, kind of yellow flags for Casey, and

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Speaker 4: that's why you don't see him higher on the list.

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Speaker 4: I think that what we see in what we see

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Speaker 4: in him is impressive because he does it. You can

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Speaker 4: see on that on that chart you've put up there.

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Speaker 4: You know, he does everything at a significantly above average

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Speaker 4: rate except for avoid striking out. And obviously you know

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Speaker 4: we've been we've been on other podcasts and we often

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Speaker 4: talk about how important it is for prospects to avoid

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Speaker 4: striking out, especially early on, because that's a sign that

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Speaker 4: they have the back to ball skills as the foundation

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Speaker 4: to be you know, a future MLB player with Casey,

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Speaker 4: I think it's not ideal, but he's close enough to

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Speaker 4: the show and facing good enough pitching that the fact

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Speaker 4: fact that he's striking out a lot is not necessarily

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Speaker 4: an indication that he's going to be completely overmatched and

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Speaker 4: a with machine when.

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Speaker 3: He gets to MLB.

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Speaker 4: He's probably just going to be somebody who strikes out

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Speaker 4: more than average, and that's a weak point of his

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Speaker 4: game rather than something that inhibits him from being at

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Speaker 4: all productive. And I think what we like in him

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Speaker 4: is that he's got this really good combination where he's

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Speaker 4: able to hit for a decent average, he's able to

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Speaker 4: get on base with walks, and he's got that lift

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Speaker 4: rate that translates a lot of the power and the

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Speaker 4: evs he has into efficient outcomes. So you have some

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Speaker 4: guys out there who maybe hit for really good evs.

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Speaker 3: But you know, drill the ball into the ground.

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Speaker 4: And you have a lot of guys out there who

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Speaker 4: maybe lyft but maybe don't have the kind of oomph

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Speaker 4: to go behind it, and I think he he's not

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Speaker 4: elite in any of those departments, but he's pretty good,

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Speaker 4: and the combination of all that makes him a strong prospect.

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Speaker 4: But the fact that he's doing this as a not

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Speaker 4: super young player in Triple A who's had a lot

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Speaker 4: of vet bats there, like you say, keeps him from

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Speaker 4: being in that very elite echelon for us.

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Speaker 2: And one elements of the Casey deal this was circulating

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Speaker 2: around the Marlins community as soon as they made the trade,

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Speaker 2: the pretty apparent similarities between his profile and Kyle Stowers

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Speaker 2: and the fact that the Marlins were able to get

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Speaker 2: such an an all Star caliber season out of Kyle

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Speaker 2: Stowers's first full year with the organization at the big

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Speaker 2: league level. In that case, he checked some of the

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Speaker 2: same boxes that he did, So Maxica, if you could

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Speaker 2: explain how it is that the oyster arrives at this

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Speaker 2: comp in particular that just happens to be Kyle Stowers

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty two minor league seasons.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so, I think you know, one of the things

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Speaker 1: that we've worked on with our player comps is is

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Speaker 1: we've always in the past we just looked at kind

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Speaker 1: of a kNN nearest neighbors analysis of what were the

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Speaker 1: most similar seasons to this particular this last season amongst

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Speaker 1: all minor league baseball seasons from twenty ten to today,

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Speaker 1: you know, looking at age level, et cetera. We altered

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Speaker 1: it a little bit to make the first player be

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Speaker 1: somebody that created positive MLB war So instead of it

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Speaker 1: being someone that you know, we don't really know about out,

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Speaker 1: it's someone that we we have a record of being

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Speaker 1: a positive contributor in the bigs. And for Casey, it

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Speaker 1: just happened to be Kyle Stowers. You know, it wasn't

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Speaker 1: we didn't. We didn't rig it. We didn't say, oh,

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Speaker 1: you know, everybody's making this comps, so we're gonna make

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Speaker 1: it too.

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Speaker 4: Uh.

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Speaker 1: The model actually split this out, and I think that's

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Speaker 1: a good sign for Casey. Right, Stowers was able to

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Speaker 1: you know, he's never going to be a guy that's

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Speaker 1: going to get that k rate and have it be

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Speaker 1: a strength. But as long as it's not a game

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Speaker 1: breaking burden, that's what Casey wants to be. Right And

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Speaker 1: and one of the positive things from last season in

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Speaker 1: Triple A was in twenty twenty four is chase rate

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Speaker 1: was twenty nine point seven percent last year went down

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Speaker 1: to twenty five point seven percent last year is content

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Speaker 1: or two years ago. His contact rate was seventy point

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Speaker 1: eight percent in triple A last year was seventy four

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Speaker 1: point one percent. So he's making positive strides there. He's

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Speaker 1: not a player that's repeating the level and doing the

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Speaker 1: same or getting worse, which we've seen with other power

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Speaker 1: over k slug when they reach that triple A threshold.

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Speaker 1: So there's a sign that he's making meaningful improvements and

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Speaker 1: he's able to do so without having the power go

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Speaker 1: down the tubes, which is something that Stowers was able

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Speaker 1: to do at the big league level last year. He

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Speaker 1: was able to mitigate the case, mitigate the chase enough

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Speaker 1: to still be a productive player. And I think it's

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Speaker 1: a good thing for Casey that he's going to a

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Speaker 1: place where they've they've done it before.

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Speaker 2: Right, So he fresh off being eliminated from the WBC,

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Speaker 2: you'll be back in Marlins camp for the final week

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Speaker 2: of the spring, and it seems very likely that he'll

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Speaker 2: make the opening day roster, but not a full guarantee

326
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Speaker 2: quite yet. I took some flak from our fan base

327
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Speaker 2: when I projected him early in the spring as not

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Speaker 2: making the opening day roster and going to Triple A

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Speaker 2: for a third straight year. But they My position is

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Speaker 2: clear at this point that everybody's somewhere on the spectrum

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Speaker 2: in terms of projections, and I hope he proves me wrong.

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Speaker 2: And certainly the WC in some small way kind of

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Speaker 2: helped my confidence a little bit in terms of seeing

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Speaker 2: him do what he does best, which is absolutely mashballs

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Speaker 2: to the poll side and get a lot of good

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Speaker 2: results because of it. Moving on down the list, I

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Speaker 2: do not think many people would have expected that seconds

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Speaker 2: on the Marlins prospects to appear on the top of

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Speaker 2: one hundred would be Andrew Salas, number fifty eight overall,

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Speaker 2: And there's his player card right there. More of a

341
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Speaker 2: mixed bag when terms comes to his individual skills in

342
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Speaker 2: the direction that they'll go an entirely different developmental case

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Speaker 2: because he is just turned eighteen just earlier this month,

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Speaker 2: and he was one of the youngest players at any

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Speaker 2: full season level last year in Minor league baseball and

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Speaker 2: ended up spending almost that entire season playing full season ball.

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Speaker 2: Last year, the surface level stats were pretty yucky. You

348
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Speaker 2: did mention something before about the model and how you

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Speaker 2: try to account for various park factors, and this is

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Speaker 2: somebody that playing at Roger Dean Chevrolet Stadium. It is

351
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Speaker 2: a ballpark that is extreme in some senses, especially when

352
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Speaker 2: it comes to home run suppression among other things. Solace

353
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Speaker 2: was a victim of that, as a guy that does

354
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Speaker 2: not post very high end extive velocities. You only got

355
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Speaker 2: it over the fence a couple of times the entire year,

356
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Speaker 2: despite all the playing time that he received. So the

357
00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:15,119
Speaker 2: where power is the big question here. But there's tremendous

358
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Speaker 2: athleticism overall and versatility, et cetera. So I'm just curious

359
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Speaker 2: about it.

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Speaker 1: Why is that?

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Speaker 2: Do you think he wound up quite this high on

362
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Speaker 2: this list coming off a season where at a sub

363
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Speaker 2: six hundred ops? How much do you how much do

364
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Speaker 2: you think just being so young for the level helped

365
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Speaker 2: him move up in the Oysters case?

366
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it did help a good amount. You know,

367
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Speaker 1: one of the one of our biggest overall tropes is

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Speaker 1: that we think that a lot of people tend to

369
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Speaker 1: underrate age. You know, they by looking at those top

370
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Speaker 1: line stats, people get really in love with those, and

371
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Speaker 1: they often will prioritize someone who's older who had a

372
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Speaker 1: you know, pretty good above average season over someone who's

373
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Speaker 1: very young and was just average. You know, average at

374
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Speaker 1: a young age is you know, you spend two more

375
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Speaker 1: years at the same level, and now you're at the

376
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Speaker 1: same rate as that guy who is older. Right, So

377
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Speaker 1: if you think of somebody being able to repeat a

378
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Speaker 1: level twice, that kind of gets into your head that, oh,

379
00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:19,040
Speaker 1: you know, age is a really big deal here with Sallus.

380
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Speaker 1: The thing that brought him near the top is that obviously,

381
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Speaker 1: as you said, you know, the top line numbers were

382
00:18:24,440 --> 00:18:27,840
Speaker 1: not great, but the underlying factors for him we were

383
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Speaker 1: quite nice. You know, he had a twenty four point

384
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Speaker 1: nine percent line drive rate, forty two point four percent

385
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Speaker 1: five ball rate, kept the ground balls down, struck out

386
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Speaker 1: only twenty four point three percent of the time. That's

387
00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:41,960
Speaker 1: that's a little high for the level, but for seventeen,

388
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Speaker 1: a young seventeen year old in your first full time

389
00:18:45,640 --> 00:18:48,880
Speaker 1: season at that level, you know, that's pretty impressive. And

390
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Speaker 1: the thing for us, with a lot of other prospects

391
00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:54,640
Speaker 1: who probably the vast majority who have a seventy four

392
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Speaker 1: WRC plus and single A, they're not as young as Salas,

393
00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:04,159
Speaker 1: and ultimately, you know, they're overwhelmed, they have lots of ks.

394
00:19:04,480 --> 00:19:06,800
Speaker 1: You know, they're not making good contact, they're just hitting

395
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Speaker 1: balls on the ground. Where if you look at a

396
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Speaker 1: guy like Sauas and you say, okay, he's going to

397
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Speaker 1: be able to add some strength, he's going to hit

398
00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:15,919
Speaker 1: the ball harder, he's going to hit the ball further

399
00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:18,320
Speaker 1: as he ages, and he has plenty of runway to

400
00:19:18,359 --> 00:19:21,320
Speaker 1: do that at age seventeen. You know that's a guy

401
00:19:21,359 --> 00:19:23,639
Speaker 1: where those line drives, that twenty four point nine percent

402
00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:25,800
Speaker 1: line drive rate, those are going to turn into a

403
00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:28,520
Speaker 1: lot more hits. Those five balls are going to turn

404
00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:30,840
Speaker 1: into doubles and triples. And so if you look at

405
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Speaker 1: a guy and you see the underlying factors be that

406
00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:37,879
Speaker 1: strong without showing the real negative red flags of a

407
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Speaker 1: thirty plus percent k rate or a guy who's just

408
00:19:40,760 --> 00:19:43,840
Speaker 1: not hitting the ball at all with really low contact rates,

409
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Speaker 1: you know that's a problem. But the fact that he's

410
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Speaker 1: showing those positive signs makes him a guy that if

411
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Speaker 1: he just adds that strength, that's going to push him

412
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Speaker 1: over the top. That's going to bring all those big

413
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Speaker 1: negatives that you see, all the all the numbers in

414
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Speaker 1: pink that on that chart that's going to bring him

415
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Speaker 1: on right over to the median, right over into a

416
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Speaker 1: positive standard deviation, and we think he can be a

417
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Speaker 1: guy that can make a difference. Obviously, you know, the

418
00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:12,360
Speaker 1: risk is high, and that's shown in some extent by

419
00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:16,359
Speaker 1: the star threshold, you know, dropping off pretty sharply. But

420
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Speaker 1: when a guy just has to add strength to be

421
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Speaker 1: good and that player is only seventeen, you know, that's

422
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Speaker 1: that's a good thing.

423
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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, most of the guys his age are

424
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Speaker 4: in the DSL, or in the complex or in high school, right,

425
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Speaker 4: I mean, it's you know, he's playing against guys in

426
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Speaker 4: a lot of cases where pitchers out of college with

427
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Speaker 4: lots of high level experience a lot more developed than

428
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Speaker 4: he is. So yeah, I think he's got a lot

429
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Speaker 4: of runway for success. But obviously, yeah, far from a guarantee.

430
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Speaker 2: And certainly the expectation is that he'll at least for

431
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Speaker 2: the early portion of the year be repeating the low

432
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Speaker 2: A level and try to build upon these numbers. We

433
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Speaker 2: want to move on to Jill Mack next on here,

434
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Speaker 2: number seventy three overall on the list, and with this

435
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Speaker 2: I'm just most curious how if, I mean, how does

436
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Speaker 2: it come, how does the oyster go about trying to

437
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Speaker 2: encapsulate somebody that is such a standout defender as a catcher.

438
00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:11,680
Speaker 2: Is you want to for what it's worth, you want

439
00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:13,960
Speaker 2: a minor league gold Glove in twenty twenty four, but

440
00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:17,960
Speaker 2: even at twenty twenty five, just the particular things that

441
00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:21,720
Speaker 2: this is something that he's the guy that passes the

442
00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:23,760
Speaker 2: eye test full of flying colors when it comes to

443
00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:26,879
Speaker 2: his defense and his his throwing ability, but also his

444
00:21:27,560 --> 00:21:30,240
Speaker 2: just he checks so many different boxes in terms of

445
00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:32,240
Speaker 2: what he does defensively. Now, I mean it was a

446
00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:35,520
Speaker 2: perfectly fined offensive season for him relative to the position

447
00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:38,040
Speaker 2: and the fact that came at the trip A level

448
00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:40,119
Speaker 2: when he was a twenty two year old for the

449
00:21:40,160 --> 00:21:40,840
Speaker 2: course of that year.

450
00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:43,040
Speaker 1: But yeah, with.

451
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:45,520
Speaker 2: Him, I'm most focused on the defense because also that's

452
00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:47,520
Speaker 2: what the Marlins seem to be most focused on. They

453
00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:50,440
Speaker 2: got horrible catcher defense at the big league level last year,

454
00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:54,440
Speaker 2: and that's where they see macting so valuable to them.

455
00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:57,800
Speaker 2: So if you could tell me about that and how,

456
00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:00,600
Speaker 2: if at all, that comes into play when trying to

457
00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:01,600
Speaker 2: project his future.

458
00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:04,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, So, I mean it is tough to model the defense,

459
00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:08,359
Speaker 4: right because defensive metrics, especially in the minor leagues, are

460
00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:11,160
Speaker 4: are much less available and much less reliable. The way

461
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:13,200
Speaker 4: that it comes into play for our model is that,

462
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:16,399
Speaker 4: you know, we do account for where guys play and

463
00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:19,080
Speaker 4: how often they play those positions and what that looks

464
00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:21,679
Speaker 4: like across different levels. And so while we don't have

465
00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:23,760
Speaker 4: a metric for like how good is Joe Mac actually

466
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 4: doing back there, the fact that he is showing up

467
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:30,280
Speaker 4: as a guy playing every day behind the plate in

468
00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:33,159
Speaker 4: the upper miners, as a really over leveled as a

469
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:36,120
Speaker 4: young player, tells us that he's a guy that they

470
00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:37,800
Speaker 4: have a lot of faith in behind the plate and

471
00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:39,919
Speaker 4: are willing to play in those upper levels. So we

472
00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,440
Speaker 4: can account for say like, oh, he's going to add

473
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,119
Speaker 4: this many runs behind the plate or throw out this

474
00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:48,080
Speaker 4: percent of runners necessarily, But what we can say is

475
00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:50,040
Speaker 4: all the signs point to the fact that this guy

476
00:22:50,119 --> 00:22:52,360
Speaker 4: is going to be a serious catcher in Major League Baseball.

477
00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:54,240
Speaker 4: So that comes into play. And then like you say,

478
00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:56,679
Speaker 4: like the offense I think too is worth talking about

479
00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:59,880
Speaker 4: with Mac. I mean, he's he's a really powerful hitter.

480
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,680
Speaker 4: I think the fact that he's you know, only striking

481
00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:06,080
Speaker 4: out a little bit below you know, league average and

482
00:23:06,119 --> 00:23:08,560
Speaker 4: only walking a little bit below league average, while doing

483
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:11,320
Speaker 4: the power side of things really well and playing against

484
00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:14,640
Speaker 4: older competition for the most part, reflects really well on him.

485
00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:16,720
Speaker 4: And he's also hitting for you know, he's hitting for

486
00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:18,280
Speaker 4: a decent average. So this is a guy that I

487
00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:21,680
Speaker 4: think a lot of things go right for. We don't

488
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,640
Speaker 4: see a lot of people review the power as being

489
00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:27,639
Speaker 4: pretty elite. That doesn't doesn't completely show up in the

490
00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:28,760
Speaker 4: in the game stats.

491
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:29,160
Speaker 3: He doesn't.

492
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:30,879
Speaker 4: You know, if that were the case, we'd see him

493
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:34,040
Speaker 4: more around like the two standard deviations above average versus

494
00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:37,080
Speaker 4: the one point one point one seven that he's at

495
00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:39,600
Speaker 4: right now. So that's what keeps him I think a

496
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:42,080
Speaker 4: little bit further down the list, and also what keeps

497
00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:44,320
Speaker 4: him maybe a little bit further down our list than

498
00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:46,439
Speaker 4: you sometimes you see him a little bit higher up

499
00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:49,560
Speaker 4: these top hundred lists is the fact that the model

500
00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:52,359
Speaker 4: doesn't know that he's won, you know, the gold Glove,

501
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:54,440
Speaker 4: and that his defense gets these really rave reviews.

502
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:58,160
Speaker 3: But we're fans. Yeah, good.

503
00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:01,520
Speaker 2: I leanted to I promise myself I'd be pretty concise

504
00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:03,480
Speaker 2: on this pod. So I will hold myself to that

505
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:06,200
Speaker 2: and move right along to dub glead which might he

506
00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:08,600
Speaker 2: might take up a lot more time than I was expecting.

507
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:11,320
Speaker 2: I wanted to take this graphic years and send it

508
00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:14,119
Speaker 2: to dub Gleed's family and friends, because I don't think

509
00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:16,119
Speaker 2: they ever expected him to be a top one hundred,

510
00:24:17,119 --> 00:24:20,119
Speaker 2: appear on any sort of top one hundred list anywhere.

511
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,520
Speaker 2: This is a player that, if I'm being blunt, the

512
00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 2: Marlins team has minor league organizational depth, and as a

513
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:29,639
Speaker 2: result of that, they found him, they used him in

514
00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:32,560
Speaker 2: a creative way. As he touched on in the blurb

515
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:34,879
Speaker 2: on the list, the fact that he played across He

516
00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:38,639
Speaker 2: climbed three different levels. He started off in the Complex League.

517
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:40,880
Speaker 2: This is a college player, just for anybody that's unclear,

518
00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 2: and he was one of the last players from that

519
00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:48,200
Speaker 2: Marlins class of college picks in twenty twenty four to

520
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:51,119
Speaker 2: actually see time at the full season level. He didn't

521
00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:53,160
Speaker 2: actually get up on to the full season level until

522
00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:55,720
Speaker 2: close to Memorial Day, but then he ended up playing

523
00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:58,680
Speaker 2: quite a bit in Jupiter, and then a lot at

524
00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:02,719
Speaker 2: Double A and then even some Triple A appearances. And

525
00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:06,600
Speaker 2: just based on the quick summary, I imagine that the

526
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:09,480
Speaker 2: fact that he climbed as much as he did may

527
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:13,880
Speaker 2: have gotten him a very favorable interpretation from the model itself.

528
00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:17,119
Speaker 2: There are some skills to like, I'll give you that,

529
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:19,520
Speaker 2: and he's not particularly old. This was just his first

530
00:25:19,520 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 2: full season out of college. But this is yeah, this

531
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:24,960
Speaker 2: is not a player. Just to give you some context,

532
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,679
Speaker 2: He's not even in consideration for our own official and

533
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:30,640
Speaker 2: first top thirty list in terms of top thirty prospects

534
00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:33,480
Speaker 2: in the organization, and yet he winds up number four

535
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 2: among Maron's prospects on this list. So which of you

536
00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:40,800
Speaker 2: can attempt to explain why it is that the Oyster

537
00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:42,240
Speaker 2: is so high on him.

538
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:45,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, I'm sure Maxwell haves stuff to add as well,

539
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:48,800
Speaker 4: but I can start. I think, like I wrote in

540
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:50,679
Speaker 4: the top hundred article on the blurb for him, that

541
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:52,879
Speaker 4: he has he has somewhat gamed our system by climbing

542
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:55,520
Speaker 4: all these levels so quickly. And that's kind of a

543
00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:58,080
Speaker 4: joke but also not completely a joke, which is that

544
00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:00,520
Speaker 4: you know, the way our model works is it wards

545
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,600
Speaker 4: guys who who do climb levels over the course of

546
00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:06,280
Speaker 4: the season, because we've done research that indicates that if

547
00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:09,679
Speaker 4: you climb levels in relatively quick succession, and you do

548
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 4: well or maintain performance while doing that that's a really

549
00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:15,320
Speaker 4: good indicator of future success. And to be fair to him,

550
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:18,240
Speaker 4: like he didn't just climb levels and get worse every

551
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:21,480
Speaker 4: time he got better, Like he got better between hot

552
00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:23,720
Speaker 4: between A and double A. He put up a really

553
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:26,520
Speaker 4: ridiculous complex performance right in his small sample there. I

554
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 4: think his WRC plus was about one sixty. Then that

555
00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:31,360
Speaker 4: you know, got back down to earth and single A

556
00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:33,879
Speaker 4: about a one to eleven WRC plus, And then he

557
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:36,119
Speaker 4: was promoted to double A and spent a decent amount

558
00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:37,400
Speaker 4: of time there and he put up a one twenty

559
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:40,200
Speaker 4: four WRC plus. And I think that with a guy

560
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:42,720
Speaker 4: like Glead, who's not putting that many balls over the fence,

561
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:44,760
Speaker 4: he doesn't get a lot of hype, and he doesn't

562
00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:47,879
Speaker 4: get any hype in most circles. You know, that's not

563
00:26:48,320 --> 00:26:51,240
Speaker 4: necessarily going to convince you. Otherwise it doesn't completely convince me.

564
00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:53,919
Speaker 4: But when the model's looking at this, it's seeing a

565
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:56,560
Speaker 4: guy who's got really good back to ball skills. You know,

566
00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 4: he doesn't strike out that much, and he didn't strike

567
00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:01,240
Speaker 4: out that much at double as a twenty two year old,

568
00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,440
Speaker 4: which is which is pretty impressive. And also somebody who's

569
00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:07,280
Speaker 4: able to get on base and somebody who that home

570
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:09,040
Speaker 4: run power is pretty ugly on the chart there you

571
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,720
Speaker 4: can see it's well below average, but the gap power

572
00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 4: is there, so he's able to get on he's able

573
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:16,680
Speaker 4: to get on second base sometimes, and it really likes

574
00:27:16,680 --> 00:27:19,160
Speaker 4: that about him. I think if we were making our

575
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 4: list personally, he wouldn't be in this spot. And we

576
00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:24,879
Speaker 4: kind of talk about that in the article. But I

577
00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:28,000
Speaker 4: think what this tells us is not, like, you know,

578
00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:30,679
Speaker 4: doub lead is the future of the Marlins necessarily, but

579
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:33,360
Speaker 4: just that there's a kernel of something in there that's

580
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:35,920
Speaker 4: worth keeping an eye on and taking note of, maybe

581
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:37,040
Speaker 4: a bit more than people do.

582
00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 3: I don't know if you want to add anything on that, Max.

583
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:42,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that from from my standpoint too. I

584
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:44,960
Speaker 1: you know, when when I we looked at our rankings,

585
00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 1: saw him, you know, kind of sneaking into the top

586
00:27:47,560 --> 00:27:49,359
Speaker 1: one hundred, and we had a conversation right as a

587
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 1: guy who who we weren't super familiar with in the

588
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:57,920
Speaker 1: you know, previous months, wanted to know what is this?

589
00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:00,439
Speaker 1: Is this guy legit? And and the more look, the

590
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,400
Speaker 1: more we thought, Okay, you know, there's there's a lot here,

591
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:05,520
Speaker 1: right and and one thing that I think is worth

592
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:09,919
Speaker 1: noting is is we based on like our development speed,

593
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:12,359
Speaker 1: We do that based on the amount of games played

594
00:28:12,359 --> 00:28:14,440
Speaker 1: at each level. So the fact that he did play

595
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:18,280
Speaker 1: that one triple A game that doesn't really affect anything

596
00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:22,440
Speaker 1: too much. Yeah, it has a very tiny, tiny impact

597
00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:26,120
Speaker 1: on his dev speed, but obviously, again you know, that

598
00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:29,200
Speaker 1: wasn't one of his strengths, and you know, you look

599
00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:31,199
Speaker 1: at him, I think kind of the thing that is

600
00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:33,280
Speaker 1: the most interesting is trying to figure out what position

601
00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:35,480
Speaker 1: will play. If he does play third base, I think

602
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:38,440
Speaker 1: that that's more flattering than if he ends up as

603
00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 1: a you know, primary first baseman. But guys don't make

604
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:46,760
Speaker 1: that much contact that often, and and he hit a

605
00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:49,840
Speaker 1: lot of doubles, right, so the power wasn't completely absent.

606
00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:53,400
Speaker 1: It just wasn't in that fence clearing aspect. So I think,

607
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:55,480
Speaker 1: you know, when you really look at him, you can

608
00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:59,360
Speaker 1: see a guy that has that utility ceiling and you know,

609
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:03,080
Speaker 1: you see the contributor percentage forty regular forty percent. So

610
00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 1: he's still more likely than not to not put a

611
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:10,680
Speaker 1: positive war in the bigs, right. So so even then

612
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:14,880
Speaker 1: that's where he's at. But I genuinely think there is

613
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:17,640
Speaker 1: you know, there is something there. He's a guy that

614
00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:21,720
Speaker 1: if he adds some strength, he has the contact, he

615
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:24,360
Speaker 1: has that ability to be a good player. I think

616
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:26,720
Speaker 1: that one guy that we looked at, you know, previously,

617
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,640
Speaker 1: that we were higher on, who is obviously way more

618
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 1: hype than dub Glead, was Jacob Wilson. He was a

619
00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:36,600
Speaker 1: guy that initially we had pretty continuously in our top ten,

620
00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:40,440
Speaker 1: if not top five. He never really reached that high

621
00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:43,240
Speaker 1: for anybody else, any of the other you know, people

622
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:46,040
Speaker 1: who are covering prospects, because he was just seen as

623
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:48,000
Speaker 1: a you know, while he has his contact, all he

624
00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 1: does is hit ground balls. But with you know, when

625
00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:54,200
Speaker 1: we've seen at the big league level he's been able

626
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 1: to add that home run power a little bit. He's

627
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 1: been able to find those doubles in addition to those skills.

628
00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:02,600
Speaker 1: And in a very light version of that, I think

629
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 1: we see some similar signs and potential, you know, in

630
00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:08,760
Speaker 1: glee to be able to turn those ground balls, turn

631
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 1: that good contact into into results.

632
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:16,640
Speaker 2: I'll be fascinated, a lot more fascinated than I expected

633
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:19,640
Speaker 2: to actually follow him this season. The Marlins had an

634
00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:21,960
Speaker 2: all college draft class last year. In twenty twenty five

635
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 2: as well, which adds a lot more traffic in terms

636
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:28,720
Speaker 2: of getting all these guys playing time at the high A,

637
00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:32,160
Speaker 2: double A levels moving forward, and i'll'll be curious to

638
00:30:32,200 --> 00:30:34,840
Speaker 2: see if they're gonna give Lee a chance to be

639
00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:39,360
Speaker 2: something close to regular reps down there. I'm still pretty skeptical,

640
00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:45,440
Speaker 2: but this is I appreciate this, Yeah, this alternative, alternative

641
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:48,440
Speaker 2: view of what he could potentially be, because it was

642
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:52,600
Speaker 2: not even something that I remotely considered, so to Glee there.

643
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:56,800
Speaker 2: It is one other Marlin that just cracked the top

644
00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:58,880
Speaker 2: one hundred at number ninety nine, and I'm glad that

645
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,840
Speaker 2: he made the list, and max A Costa just because

646
00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:07,280
Speaker 2: I'd say from a Marlin's perspective, he's kind of fallen

647
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 2: into the bit of the backgrounds quite a bit, just

648
00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:12,680
Speaker 2: because marlds are very satisfied with what they have in

649
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:15,640
Speaker 2: the middle endfield for the foreseeable future, with Xavier Edwards

650
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:18,160
Speaker 2: at second base, Atto Lopez a chorsop. It feels like

651
00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:21,000
Speaker 2: that now, just because they're both still pre arbitration eligible.

652
00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:23,280
Speaker 2: But Marlin's history will say that once those guys get

653
00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:25,880
Speaker 2: into ar but then all of a sudden they're looking

654
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:29,000
Speaker 2: for they're open minded to potentially moving on and seeing

655
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:30,840
Speaker 2: who's next up on the depth chart, and a Costa

656
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 2: got a little bit of big league playing time last

657
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:36,800
Speaker 2: year at I think not only short and second but

658
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 2: even third base, so that versatility could He's expected to

659
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 2: get more opportunities as this upcoming year goes along. And

660
00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:48,160
Speaker 2: with a Coasta, I remember when the Marlins acquired him,

661
00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:52,000
Speaker 2: what was fascinating is how much he had cut down

662
00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 2: on his strikeouts from twenty twenty three to twenty twenty four.

663
00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 2: He made this really unusual improvement in that regard that

664
00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:02,280
Speaker 2: didn't really carry all into twenty twenty five. So I

665
00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:04,360
Speaker 2: guess that element is what I'm most curious about when

666
00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:07,040
Speaker 2: it comes to a Costa. When how do you think

667
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:09,600
Speaker 2: the model used that somebody that had an average ish

668
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 2: strikeout rate a few years ago and then was elite

669
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 2: when it came to that category the next year, and

670
00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:18,640
Speaker 2: then the following year kind of regressed pretty close to

671
00:32:18,800 --> 00:32:20,000
Speaker 2: back where he had previously been.

672
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:23,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think with a Coasta, You're right, I think

673
00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:25,960
Speaker 1: some of what our model sees is a lot of

674
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 1: optimism from that twenty twenty four season, you know, and

675
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:31,760
Speaker 1: in Double A he was able to post you know,

676
00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:35,000
Speaker 1: he's by far his best season. He cut that krate

677
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:39,040
Speaker 1: down from around twenty percent to thirteen point four percent,

678
00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:41,120
Speaker 1: and then it kind of came up to where it's

679
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:43,840
Speaker 1: been pretty much in Triple A with that little added

680
00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:47,600
Speaker 1: inflation that comes from facing high level pitchers. The thing

681
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:50,400
Speaker 1: with the Coasta that gives us a lot of positivity, though,

682
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:51,640
Speaker 1: is that he's still pretty young.

683
00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:52,040
Speaker 3: Right.

684
00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:54,680
Speaker 1: He was twenty two last season, played the full season

685
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:59,040
Speaker 1: in Triple A and in the BIGS, and he was decent.

686
00:32:59,200 --> 00:32:59,280
Speaker 3: Right.

687
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:03,480
Speaker 1: He was a decent hitter who played shortstop, play second base,

688
00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:08,520
Speaker 1: plays third base, and didn't really have any serious flaws

689
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:11,479
Speaker 1: at the plate. And with a guy that young, we're

690
00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:14,160
Speaker 1: we're optimistic about someone like that, right, Someone who is

691
00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:18,360
Speaker 1: able to not have any game breaking flaws in what

692
00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 1: they do is a player that if they can add

693
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:25,160
Speaker 1: or enhance really anything, they start to creep their way

694
00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:27,479
Speaker 1: into that regular territory. If he's a guy who can

695
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:30,080
Speaker 1: get on base a little more, find more walks, that

696
00:33:30,120 --> 00:33:33,520
Speaker 1: could be it. A guy who's able to add some power,

697
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:36,120
Speaker 1: get some more doubles, get some more homers. You know,

698
00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:41,640
Speaker 1: that's another big thing. The thing that also impressed both

699
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:44,400
Speaker 1: us and the model is that in his you know,

700
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,200
Speaker 1: pretty short but still you know, decent played appearance stint

701
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:49,760
Speaker 1: in the Bigs last year, he kept that chase rate

702
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:52,680
Speaker 1: down at twenty five point two percent. That's lower than

703
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 1: it was in Triple A at twenty eight point three percent.

704
00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:58,680
Speaker 1: That's a real positive thing, right. You see so many

705
00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:01,960
Speaker 1: guys make that big step up and then boom, you

706
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:05,440
Speaker 1: know that the kras gets jacked up, contact rate goes

707
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:08,000
Speaker 1: through the floor. He was able to maintain that. And

708
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:11,400
Speaker 1: when we see guys, like we said before, doing average

709
00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:14,719
Speaker 1: things at low at an age much lower than average,

710
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:17,960
Speaker 1: especially in Triple A and the Bigs, you know, that's

711
00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:20,000
Speaker 1: a positive sign. I don't know if he's like a

712
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:23,600
Speaker 1: big player to you know, win you tons of games

713
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:25,720
Speaker 1: and be a stalwart at short stop or second base,

714
00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:29,280
Speaker 1: but we think he has you know, a decent ceiling

715
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:30,880
Speaker 1: there and can be a guy that can contribute in

716
00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:31,840
Speaker 1: a lot of different roles.

717
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:35,760
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718
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733
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Speaker 2: Rentals dot com. I meant to bring this up earlier,

734
00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:29,040
Speaker 2: but this is a broader view about where Marlins players

735
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:32,320
Speaker 2: ranked on this list. And also I love that visual

736
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,120
Speaker 2: in terms of just bringing it down between the likelihood

737
00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:37,240
Speaker 2: of them being a big lead contributor versus a regular

738
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:40,080
Speaker 2: versus a potential star. Right there. So, we've touched on

739
00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:43,920
Speaker 2: Casey saalas Mac Lead and a Costa, and I was

740
00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:47,160
Speaker 2: reassured that Max in particular would have some thoughts about

741
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:50,759
Speaker 2: Davidson Deala Santos as somebody that has a history of

742
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:53,080
Speaker 2: following his career as well. So he was the first

743
00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 2: man on the Marlin side that was on the outside

744
00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:58,480
Speaker 2: looking in at this list. Number one forty three overall

745
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:01,560
Speaker 2: by the Oyster. And just for anybody that's not watching,

746
00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:03,759
Speaker 2: I'll let you know that Brendan Jones is next up

747
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:08,399
Speaker 2: at seventh, Starlin Cabba eighth at Chedry Vargas number nine,

748
00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:11,360
Speaker 2: and that's another i'd say an outlier take based on

749
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:15,240
Speaker 2: how he struggled this past year. And then Kemp Alderman tenth,

750
00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:18,440
Speaker 2: which a name that Marlon Ted's are more much more

751
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:21,879
Speaker 2: familiar with given his outstanding production last year. But among

752
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:23,719
Speaker 2: these guys, I did want to dive in a little

753
00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:27,440
Speaker 2: bit on Davison, somebody that I've My thoughts on him

754
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:29,320
Speaker 2: have fluctuated quite a bit as well since the Marlins

755
00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:32,560
Speaker 2: acquired him in twenty twenty four. He won the Minor

756
00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:35,920
Speaker 2: League home run title in twenty twenty four. As somebody

757
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:38,400
Speaker 2: that was extremely young for the levels of competition he

758
00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:41,160
Speaker 2: was playing at. He was a guy that you could

759
00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:43,239
Speaker 2: have made a case was very close to Bigley call

760
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:45,879
Speaker 2: up late in twenty twenty four, and then last year

761
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:48,520
Speaker 2: it took a big step back in some ways. Not

762
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:50,640
Speaker 2: in every way, but it's certainly in the home run

763
00:36:50,680 --> 00:36:55,279
Speaker 2: production ways. His total was sliced in a third from

764
00:36:55,400 --> 00:37:00,879
Speaker 2: forty to twelve if I remember correctly. Yeah, and where

765
00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:03,200
Speaker 2: it's the state of Davis and Dale Santos undering twenty

766
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:04,560
Speaker 2: twenty six max.

767
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:05,680
Speaker 3: Yeah.

768
00:37:05,719 --> 00:37:08,359
Speaker 1: So Dale Santos I think is one of the one

769
00:37:08,400 --> 00:37:12,360
Speaker 1: of the stranger prospects out there. He's a very unique

770
00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 1: skill set where he's a guy that could possibly have

771
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:20,839
Speaker 1: seventy five maybe even eighty raw power, but cannot lift

772
00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 1: the ball. It's the ball almost exclusively on the ground,

773
00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:28,040
Speaker 1: unlike a lot of other sluggers. His contact rates are decent,

774
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:32,640
Speaker 1: but he never ever walks and he chases a ton.

775
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 1: So it's a very you know, weird, sporadic skill set

776
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:39,760
Speaker 1: for him that he's had a lot of trouble making

777
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:42,799
Speaker 1: it work. Last season, if you had two areas where

778
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:46,200
Speaker 1: he needed to improve, probably it was reducing that k

779
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:49,360
Speaker 1: rate and being able to walk more. And his k

780
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:51,839
Speaker 1: rate was the lowest it's been in a while, and

781
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:54,200
Speaker 1: he walked more than he has in a while, but

782
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:56,760
Speaker 1: the home run power just you know, really went away.

783
00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,120
Speaker 1: Part of that, and part of his forty home run

784
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:01,800
Speaker 1: production was the fact that he played in Double A

785
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:05,640
Speaker 1: al Mario for the Diamondbacks and Triple A Reno. Those

786
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:09,719
Speaker 1: are two super elevated environments having a negative impact on

787
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:13,640
Speaker 1: breaking stuff, which I think is especially key for him

788
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:15,720
Speaker 1: in that you know, he has a lot of trouble

789
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 1: chasing those sliders and also you know, making the ball

790
00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:21,920
Speaker 1: fly further. So I think that has a big effect

791
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:25,879
Speaker 1: in watching him. For I, I'm from Reno, was able

792
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 1: to go see him play probably twenty five games in

793
00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:32,239
Speaker 1: that twenty twenty four season. I would always joke with Owen.

794
00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,640
Speaker 1: I said, almost every deal with Santos at bat was was,

795
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:38,279
Speaker 1: you know, pretty much the same. Like first pitch, he'd

796
00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:41,680
Speaker 1: like take a fastball first right, second pitch he'd swing

797
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:43,480
Speaker 1: at a slider that was probably foot off the play

798
00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 1: for strike two, and he'd foul off a pitch and

799
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:47,920
Speaker 1: then he'd hit the next one like four under and

800
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:51,640
Speaker 1: fifty feet right. That I saw so many different played

801
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:57,200
Speaker 1: appearances where there was some blueprint of that happening, and

802
00:38:57,239 --> 00:38:58,920
Speaker 1: I think you could just see it in that in

803
00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 1: that skill set and again where it's like okay, right,

804
00:39:01,640 --> 00:39:04,200
Speaker 1: the power is obviously there, it's it's you know, at

805
00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:06,920
Speaker 1: probably at an elite level in the major leagues, that

806
00:39:07,120 --> 00:39:10,840
Speaker 1: raw power. But there's so much that has to happen

807
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:14,719
Speaker 1: for him to be able to tap into it. You know.

808
00:39:14,800 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 1: That's that's been the thing that has ultimately kept him

809
00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:23,120
Speaker 1: from doing well in Triple A last season. Right, there's

810
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 1: so many different things we look at, you know, guys

811
00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:29,520
Speaker 1: like you know Casey where you see, okay, if you

812
00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:31,520
Speaker 1: can get that carrate to a point where it's sustainable,

813
00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:34,160
Speaker 1: he's going to be a dude. Right, all those metrics say,

814
00:39:34,200 --> 00:39:36,719
Speaker 1: you know, he's working out. That's all it takes. With

815
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:39,879
Speaker 1: Dala Santos. It has to be he's got to keep

816
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:42,319
Speaker 1: these carrates and walk rates around where they were last year,

817
00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:43,920
Speaker 1: and he has to hit more home runs. And you

818
00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:45,920
Speaker 1: can do that by lifting the ball more. And so

819
00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:48,560
Speaker 1: you know, when there's two or three things that you

820
00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:52,200
Speaker 1: have to do, the road gets a lot tougher. And

821
00:39:52,239 --> 00:39:53,920
Speaker 1: I think one of the strengths of our model is

822
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:56,200
Speaker 1: when we look at these traits, we look at them

823
00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:59,120
Speaker 1: all together, not just what is your home run rate,

824
00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:01,680
Speaker 1: what is your walk rate? And then how does that work?

825
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:04,960
Speaker 1: But how does this combo of home run rate walk rate,

826
00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:08,400
Speaker 1: k rate, all form this one thing of what a

827
00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:12,319
Speaker 1: player is and how hard or easy or fluid is

828
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:14,919
Speaker 1: it for that core to be able to turn into

829
00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:17,799
Speaker 1: something that is successful at the high level. And so

830
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:20,799
Speaker 1: for our model, it's looked at him now, looked at

831
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:23,759
Speaker 1: the age and and those variables and said, you know,

832
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:27,399
Speaker 1: this is gonna be an uphill battle. And the fact

833
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:31,960
Speaker 1: that he is a basically a first baseman and probably

834
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:35,279
Speaker 1: not a great first baseman either, is something that is

835
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:38,239
Speaker 1: further working against him. And it was it was like

836
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 1: that in Reno as well. I also said to Owen

837
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:43,320
Speaker 1: a lot. He's a kind of player where he runs

838
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:47,880
Speaker 1: quite quickly. He's he's genuinely fast, but he he his

839
00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:51,400
Speaker 1: lateral movement and his ability to like bend just you know,

840
00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:55,240
Speaker 1: isn't there is he doesn't he doesn't bend, and it's

841
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:58,200
Speaker 1: it's difficult, right He's he's built like a linebacker. And

842
00:40:58,239 --> 00:41:01,359
Speaker 1: so you know, that'd be interesting. I would, just from

843
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:04,600
Speaker 1: a pure not involved with the Marlin standpoint, I would

844
00:41:04,600 --> 00:41:06,399
Speaker 1: be a little curious to see if he could handle

845
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 1: right field because he can run kind of quickly. But

846
00:41:10,239 --> 00:41:12,680
Speaker 1: I'm sure that's been something they have tried.

847
00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:17,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, on the very last point, I think that's unlikely,

848
00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 2: given that outfield depth is somewhat of the strength of

849
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:22,640
Speaker 2: this organization. Yeah, well, the big league level and the

850
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:26,399
Speaker 2: upper miners right now. Meanwhile, first base is perhaps their

851
00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:29,960
Speaker 2: most glaring need. They're starts to open this season at

852
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:32,520
Speaker 2: the big league level with Christopher Morrell playing first base,

853
00:41:32,600 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 2: a position he has never ever played before and has

854
00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 2: had mixed results in spring training. We're recording shortly after

855
00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:43,040
Speaker 2: Connor Norby made his first ever appearance at first base

856
00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:45,040
Speaker 2: as well, a position that he'd never played in his

857
00:41:45,239 --> 00:41:48,160
Speaker 2: entire life. But they're experimenting with him now just in

858
00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 2: case Christopher Morell doesn't work out, which there's a good

859
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:55,040
Speaker 2: chance it doesn't. On either side of the ball. They

860
00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:58,640
Speaker 2: have Norby there. They have Griffin Conine, a former outfielder

861
00:41:58,640 --> 00:42:01,239
Speaker 2: than they converted to first base, to add depth in

862
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 2: somebody that can be sort of a platoon partner with

863
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:07,400
Speaker 2: whatever right handed hair plays there. They really do not

864
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:10,040
Speaker 2: have an answer unless it's Della Santos in there, So

865
00:42:10,080 --> 00:42:12,479
Speaker 2: they're keeping the door open for he's going to get

866
00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:14,880
Speaker 2: at some point over the course of this year somewhat

867
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:18,279
Speaker 2: of a extended tryout at that position just because of

868
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:20,880
Speaker 2: just because of the lack of alternatives.

869
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:24,799
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I mean, and you know, you know, we

870
00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:27,160
Speaker 4: could see him succeed, right, I mean, there's a reason

871
00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 4: that he's not that far off our top hundred, and

872
00:42:29,840 --> 00:42:31,800
Speaker 4: you know we're giving him, We're still giving him a shot,

873
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:33,840
Speaker 4: so we will see. But I think the thing of

874
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:36,719
Speaker 4: Max saying of when you're one tool away, it's one

875
00:42:36,719 --> 00:42:39,960
Speaker 4: thing when you're kind of this complex mush of things

876
00:42:40,080 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 4: away that it becomes tricky.

877
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:45,080
Speaker 1: One list do, I think is a key area where

878
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 1: if he can lift more, that can start to unlock

879
00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:50,920
Speaker 1: some things and patch over some of those weaknesses in

880
00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 1: a way that some of the other stuff can't. You know,

881
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:55,160
Speaker 1: if he can add a little bit to the average

882
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:58,120
Speaker 1: by turning some of those fifty percent plus ground ball

883
00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:02,440
Speaker 1: rates and the line drives, that's that'll help him.

884
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:04,880
Speaker 2: For what it was worth, it was an encouraging winter

885
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 2: ball stint with him. I'm notorious for paying maybe too

886
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:10,719
Speaker 2: much attention to winter ball, but in the dr he

887
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:13,680
Speaker 2: was one of the better offensive players over there, and

888
00:43:13,719 --> 00:43:17,880
Speaker 2: the reviews were relatively positive from Marlin's coaches. Over the

889
00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:20,279
Speaker 2: course of spring training. He's since already been optioned down

890
00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:22,640
Speaker 2: to Triple A as expected, but in terms of what

891
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:25,880
Speaker 2: he's been doing behind the scenes and the quality of

892
00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:30,160
Speaker 2: his played appearances in limited Grapefruit League action people, I

893
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:32,520
Speaker 2: think what stood out is saying that he's in a

894
00:43:32,600 --> 00:43:35,160
Speaker 2: much better place than he was last year entering spring,

895
00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,120
Speaker 2: when expectations were probably a little bit too high for him.

896
00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 2: One other, one final player that I just wanted your

897
00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:44,799
Speaker 2: take on, who I'd have to scroll quite a bit

898
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 2: on your site Oyster Analytics dot com in order to

899
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:51,120
Speaker 2: get to him, would be Dylan Lewis, who was one

900
00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:56,560
Speaker 2: of the more intriguing I think intriguing is too small

901
00:43:56,600 --> 00:43:59,680
Speaker 2: of a word, like the Marlins were genuinely very excited

902
00:43:59,719 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 2: to acquire him in the Ryan Weathers straight from the Yankees.

903
00:44:02,600 --> 00:44:05,879
Speaker 2: He is number five on our fof Top thirty list.

904
00:44:06,280 --> 00:44:10,399
Speaker 2: Had a really statistically awesome year last season between low

905
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:12,680
Speaker 2: A and high A. If I remember correctly, somebody that

906
00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:17,279
Speaker 2: zero prospect pedigree. Yeah, without going too far in depth,

907
00:44:17,719 --> 00:44:20,239
Speaker 2: why would it be that you think the model is

908
00:44:20,880 --> 00:44:23,000
Speaker 2: he had? He's all the way number twenty seven on

909
00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:27,839
Speaker 2: your rankings of Marlins hitting prospects. So what it is?

910
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:32,320
Speaker 2: Why do you think the model is not particularly convinced

911
00:44:32,360 --> 00:44:35,239
Speaker 2: about the season that he had in twenty twenty five.

912
00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:39,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's it's mainly not because it thinks

913
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:42,359
Speaker 4: he had a bad year, but because it hasn't seen

914
00:44:42,440 --> 00:44:45,400
Speaker 4: him play above High A, and it's seen him play

915
00:44:45,880 --> 00:44:48,440
Speaker 4: a lot last year in Single A and only seventy

916
00:44:48,440 --> 00:44:50,759
Speaker 4: six games in High A, and that's as far as

917
00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:53,640
Speaker 4: he's gotten. And he's twenty two, and so you know,

918
00:44:54,120 --> 00:44:56,200
Speaker 4: we're not personally holding that against him, but for the

919
00:44:56,239 --> 00:44:59,200
Speaker 4: model to be really aggressive about a projection, it has

920
00:44:59,280 --> 00:45:02,080
Speaker 4: to feel like either a player is playing in the

921
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:04,879
Speaker 4: lower levels as a really over leveled player where they're

922
00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:08,759
Speaker 4: playing against much older competition and that really proves how

923
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:11,279
Speaker 4: impressive that performance is, or they have to be doing

924
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:12,680
Speaker 4: that closer to the major leagues.

925
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:13,680
Speaker 3: He's in this kind of.

926
00:45:13,680 --> 00:45:16,840
Speaker 4: Weird area where he had a pretty good all He

927
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:19,640
Speaker 4: had a pretty good but not like incredible offensive season,

928
00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:21,920
Speaker 4: and he did it at twenty two in High A,

929
00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:24,759
Speaker 4: which is it's not like he's super old for the level,

930
00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:27,960
Speaker 4: but he's certainly not super young for the level. And

931
00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:29,840
Speaker 4: so the model looks at that and says, like, Okay,

932
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:34,040
Speaker 4: that's great, but it's not enough to get him into

933
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:36,560
Speaker 4: the upper echelon because we don't know what he's going

934
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:39,080
Speaker 4: to do when he reaches double A triple A, where

935
00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:41,240
Speaker 4: a lot of the elite prospects who are that age

936
00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:43,520
Speaker 4: already are. And so I think he's a guy that

937
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:45,520
Speaker 4: could be a candidate to climb if we see him

938
00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:49,240
Speaker 4: in double A this year, where I expect he'll probably start,

939
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:51,320
Speaker 4: and he does really well, he could climb really quickly.

940
00:45:51,320 --> 00:45:53,080
Speaker 4: But at the same time, you know, that is a

941
00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:55,240
Speaker 4: big jump and a lot of guys struggle with that jump.

942
00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:57,160
Speaker 4: So there's a lot of uncertainty there.

943
00:45:57,760 --> 00:45:59,719
Speaker 1: I think, you know, you think about it in relation

944
00:45:59,840 --> 00:46:03,919
Speaker 1: to Sallas. If Sallas repeated, he would be he would

945
00:46:03,960 --> 00:46:06,680
Speaker 1: be still younger than Dylan Lewis last year if he

946
00:46:06,760 --> 00:46:10,880
Speaker 1: repeated single A five years in a row, right, Yeah,

947
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:13,759
Speaker 1: So you know that's right, that that's a that's a

948
00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:16,120
Speaker 1: big gap. And I think something else that that is

949
00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:19,160
Speaker 1: a little bit you know, concerning to our model, is

950
00:46:19,200 --> 00:46:22,439
Speaker 1: that his ground ball rates were around forty percent, which

951
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:26,560
Speaker 1: is decent, and his fly ball rates were pretty high

952
00:46:26,880 --> 00:46:31,160
Speaker 1: at it was forty three percent in high A last year,

953
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:33,839
Speaker 1: thirty nine percent in single A. But his infield fly

954
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:36,560
Speaker 1: ball rates were very very high. It was twenty six

955
00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:40,440
Speaker 1: percent in A and thirty eight point nine percent in

956
00:46:40,600 --> 00:46:44,280
Speaker 1: High A, and those are things that were our model

957
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:47,160
Speaker 1: is okay with. When it's someone who's pretty young who's

958
00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:50,120
Speaker 1: doing that, that's something that tends to as strength comes,

959
00:46:50,520 --> 00:46:52,680
Speaker 1: you know, they're able to make those corrections and turn

960
00:46:52,719 --> 00:46:55,800
Speaker 1: some of those infield flyballs into more driven hits. But

961
00:46:55,920 --> 00:46:58,520
Speaker 1: for a guy who's that old to be doing that,

962
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:02,280
Speaker 1: it concerns our mind a little bit. One caveat though,

963
00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:04,680
Speaker 1: which I think is important and and could be a

964
00:47:04,719 --> 00:47:07,120
Speaker 1: positive thing for Lewis, is that writing he came from

965
00:47:07,200 --> 00:47:12,200
Speaker 1: Queen's University in Charlotte, you know, very small college, generally

966
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:17,960
Speaker 1: a much lower caliber of opposition than most college draftees

967
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:20,680
Speaker 1: will face, right, and so the fact that for him

968
00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 1: this is a pretty big jump up in in pitcher caliber.

969
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:29,720
Speaker 1: So personally, I think maybe we would extend more grace

970
00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:32,640
Speaker 1: to Lewis than the model is. But I think that

971
00:47:32,680 --> 00:47:34,960
Speaker 1: the peripherals he's almost in a lot of ways really

972
00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:39,839
Speaker 1: the opposite of Andrew Salas, where the peripherals aren't as flattering.

973
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:42,440
Speaker 1: You know, the age is older, but the top line

974
00:47:42,520 --> 00:47:45,400
Speaker 1: numbers are are still pretty good. So you know for

975
00:47:45,440 --> 00:47:49,200
Speaker 1: our model, it likes that younger, unproven guy more than

976
00:47:49,239 --> 00:47:55,480
Speaker 1: that older, slightly more proven guy. It's interesting, right.

977
00:47:55,880 --> 00:47:59,040
Speaker 2: I wanted to close off by shifting away from players

978
00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:02,640
Speaker 2: themselves and points to an organizational trends that really became

979
00:48:03,080 --> 00:48:05,480
Speaker 2: prevalent last year, especially with the Marlins. This is a

980
00:48:05,560 --> 00:48:09,000
Speaker 2: leader board of minor league team stolen bases from twenty

981
00:48:09,080 --> 00:48:12,680
Speaker 2: twenty five, and I've circled the Marlins affiliates. Three of

982
00:48:12,760 --> 00:48:16,279
Speaker 2: the Marlins affiliates ranked in the top eleven across all

983
00:48:16,320 --> 00:48:19,200
Speaker 2: minor league baseball and steels. Hya Baloite was tied for

984
00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 2: first triple A. Jacksonville, which was leading in that race

985
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:25,040
Speaker 2: for a lot of the year, dropped down to six

986
00:48:25,160 --> 00:48:27,359
Speaker 2: and only because Jacob Marshy got promoted to the big

987
00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:29,359
Speaker 2: league team and started doing his thing at the big

988
00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:32,120
Speaker 2: league level, and then hy a low ag Jupiter, I

989
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:35,440
Speaker 2: should say, was number eleventh overall. Andrew Salas had quite

990
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:36,840
Speaker 2: a bit to do with that. But to get to

991
00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:39,879
Speaker 2: these numbers, it speaks to the organization as a whole

992
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:43,600
Speaker 2: just giving so many different players a green light, regardless

993
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:48,120
Speaker 2: of their traditional measurable skills when it comes to stealing bases,

994
00:48:48,520 --> 00:48:52,840
Speaker 2: and it speaks more towards what as far as I understand,

995
00:48:52,880 --> 00:48:56,040
Speaker 2: an organization that has just put a lot of effort

996
00:48:56,120 --> 00:49:01,080
Speaker 2: in towards scouting opponent pitchers and actually picking up their

997
00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:04,640
Speaker 2: tails and stealing a lot of these bases uncontested. So

998
00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:08,080
Speaker 2: from an analytical perspective, I'm just curious what the Oyster

999
00:49:08,200 --> 00:49:11,200
Speaker 2: does with all this. Stolen bases as a whole have

1000
00:49:11,239 --> 00:49:13,400
Speaker 2: gone up quite a bit in the minors to do

1001
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:16,440
Speaker 2: changing in the rules that have made it easier for

1002
00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:19,520
Speaker 2: runners to steal, but even when in addition to that,

1003
00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:23,480
Speaker 2: like the Spike from the Marlins in particular, as it

1004
00:49:23,560 --> 00:49:26,640
Speaker 2: has really changed the way statistically that a lot of

1005
00:49:26,640 --> 00:49:30,719
Speaker 2: prospects that aren't really known for their speed the kind

1006
00:49:30,719 --> 00:49:32,640
Speaker 2: of numbers that they put up as a result of

1007
00:49:32,719 --> 00:49:35,000
Speaker 2: this kind of approach. So yeah, yeah, what do you

1008
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:37,680
Speaker 2: do with this? And how much does the model think

1009
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:40,480
Speaker 2: that minor league stolen bases are going to translate to

1010
00:49:40,520 --> 00:49:41,120
Speaker 2: the big leagues?

1011
00:49:41,680 --> 00:49:45,359
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, honestly, the model does not think much

1012
00:49:45,480 --> 00:49:48,080
Speaker 4: of minor league stolen based numbers in terms of projecting

1013
00:49:48,120 --> 00:49:48,440
Speaker 4: a player.

1014
00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:49,840
Speaker 3: That doesn't mean that it's not important.

1015
00:49:50,040 --> 00:49:51,480
Speaker 4: And I'll turn it over to Max here because he's

1016
00:49:51,480 --> 00:49:54,400
Speaker 4: done a research project on exactly this. Essentially, it is

1017
00:49:54,520 --> 00:49:57,720
Speaker 4: very important to think about stealing in minor league baseball

1018
00:49:57,719 --> 00:49:59,799
Speaker 4: and to develop your players in that regard. But in

1019
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:03,480
Speaker 4: terms of a player in single a's stolen based numbers

1020
00:50:03,520 --> 00:50:07,319
Speaker 4: being an indicator of their holistic production in the show,

1021
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:10,759
Speaker 4: it's not something that grades out as a super significant

1022
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:13,000
Speaker 4: factor when we do our modeling, but it is still

1023
00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:15,359
Speaker 4: important for reasons that max I can flip it over

1024
00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:16,200
Speaker 4: to you for that.

1025
00:50:17,080 --> 00:50:19,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, And so we wanted to look at we'd looked

1026
00:50:19,800 --> 00:50:23,640
Speaker 1: at steels before in regard to hit and runs and

1027
00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:27,839
Speaker 1: whether they really affect someone's positive likelihood of stealing the base,

1028
00:50:27,880 --> 00:50:30,840
Speaker 1: which they generally didn't, and we wanted to look at

1029
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:33,560
Speaker 1: steel's behavior in the miners and just kind of see

1030
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:36,840
Speaker 1: what was going on, what happened, and we ended up

1031
00:50:36,880 --> 00:50:40,719
Speaker 1: with this incredibly interesting finding where teams that stole more,

1032
00:50:41,520 --> 00:50:45,000
Speaker 1: had their players steal more relative to the amount of

1033
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:48,800
Speaker 1: times they're on base, was correlated pretty strongly with improved

1034
00:50:48,880 --> 00:50:54,000
Speaker 1: future Major League Baseball steal success, even when accounting for experience,

1035
00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:57,040
Speaker 1: so years played in the miners, stolen base percentage the

1036
00:50:57,120 --> 00:51:01,080
Speaker 1: year before, and even MLB sprint speed, we don't have

1037
00:51:01,080 --> 00:51:04,400
Speaker 1: their minor league speed that year, but we can extrapolate

1038
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:07,520
Speaker 1: from their MLB sprint speed. So even when controlling for

1039
00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:11,360
Speaker 1: those factors, teams that stole more ended up being better

1040
00:51:11,400 --> 00:51:15,160
Speaker 1: at stealing, when when there are players that stole more

1041
00:51:15,239 --> 00:51:17,520
Speaker 1: ended up being better at stealing when they made it

1042
00:51:17,560 --> 00:51:20,719
Speaker 1: to the show. And I think the thing that was

1043
00:51:20,760 --> 00:51:23,239
Speaker 1: the most striking about it and about steals and how

1044
00:51:23,239 --> 00:51:27,040
Speaker 1: it's really different than any other tool is, unlike basically

1045
00:51:27,040 --> 00:51:30,560
Speaker 1: anything else in baseball, if you get to the bigs

1046
00:51:31,000 --> 00:51:35,080
Speaker 1: and you stink at it, you just stop. You just

1047
00:51:35,080 --> 00:51:37,640
Speaker 1: stop stealing bases, right, and you don't get that little

1048
00:51:37,680 --> 00:51:41,279
Speaker 1: positive bump that you get from stealing right. You can't

1049
00:51:41,280 --> 00:51:43,240
Speaker 1: do that with k raid. If you're striking out, you're

1050
00:51:43,280 --> 00:51:46,040
Speaker 1: gonna keep striking out, and you can't just say let's

1051
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:49,960
Speaker 1: stop doing that now. And so ultimately, in the minors

1052
00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:53,840
Speaker 1: where the wins don't end up mattering as much, teams

1053
00:51:53,880 --> 00:51:57,480
Speaker 1: are incentivized to, you know, push the envelope here, teach

1054
00:51:57,520 --> 00:51:59,279
Speaker 1: your players how to steal. If they're not good at it,

1055
00:51:59,320 --> 00:52:02,080
Speaker 1: they can stop when it matters, right, they can just stop.

1056
00:52:03,120 --> 00:52:05,640
Speaker 1: I think some of that ties into an overall narrative

1057
00:52:05,719 --> 00:52:10,560
Speaker 1: of just teams and coaches and players, you know, really

1058
00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:15,239
Speaker 1: fearing failure and especially fearing public failure. Owen did a

1059
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:18,000
Speaker 1: research piece that was actually the first thing we wrote

1060
00:52:18,000 --> 00:52:21,759
Speaker 1: that it was really brilliant on coaches sending players from

1061
00:52:21,800 --> 00:52:26,840
Speaker 1: second to home on you know, singles, and found that essentially,

1062
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:31,399
Speaker 1: coaches are way, way, way too tentative that in situations

1063
00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:33,920
Speaker 1: with two outs and only a guy in second base,

1064
00:52:34,280 --> 00:52:36,240
Speaker 1: you could have the guy get thrown out at home

1065
00:52:37,560 --> 00:52:41,200
Speaker 1: almost half the time and have it still be worth

1066
00:52:41,239 --> 00:52:44,200
Speaker 1: it from a run value perspective, when in reality those

1067
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:47,080
Speaker 1: runners were safe like ninety two percent of the time.

1068
00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:50,400
Speaker 1: So you know, that's kind of the perfection isn't perfect

1069
00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:53,920
Speaker 1: type narrative. And the Marlins, you know, we wrote this

1070
00:52:53,960 --> 00:52:57,360
Speaker 1: piece in April, pretty early on in the season. Baseball

1071
00:52:57,400 --> 00:53:00,319
Speaker 1: America and May wrote a piece on the Marlins and

1072
00:53:00,360 --> 00:53:03,560
Speaker 1: they were, you know how they were stealing out the wazoo.

1073
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:06,840
Speaker 1: They at the time. As of May twenty sixth, the

1074
00:53:06,880 --> 00:53:10,560
Speaker 1: Marlins had two point twenty seven stolen bases per game

1075
00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:15,840
Speaker 1: as an organization. Second was one point seven to six,

1076
00:53:16,440 --> 00:53:19,520
Speaker 1: so they had you know, almost a full half steal

1077
00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:23,319
Speaker 1: actually over half steal, excuse me more per game than

1078
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:27,440
Speaker 1: the second place team, and it was clear that it

1079
00:53:27,480 --> 00:53:32,160
Speaker 1: was an organizational thing. Rachel Balkovec said, it's a lot

1080
00:53:32,200 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 1: of time and effort in studying on the part of

1081
00:53:34,080 --> 00:53:36,959
Speaker 1: our coaches. We don't view it as you can either

1082
00:53:37,080 --> 00:53:39,640
Speaker 1: steal or you can't. We view it as another thing

1083
00:53:39,680 --> 00:53:41,719
Speaker 1: we can develop. There's going to be a ceiling for

1084
00:53:41,760 --> 00:53:44,600
Speaker 1: each player depending on your physical capabilities, but we're going

1085
00:53:44,640 --> 00:53:48,000
Speaker 1: to max out those physical capabilities as much as possible.

1086
00:53:48,160 --> 00:53:50,160
Speaker 1: And you know that was the thing in our article,

1087
00:53:50,280 --> 00:53:54,920
Speaker 1: right we saw the lack of steals as teams bypassing

1088
00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:58,440
Speaker 1: an opportunity to make their players better and unlike other

1089
00:53:58,520 --> 00:54:02,359
Speaker 1: things where you know, maybe teacher player power and they're

1090
00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:04,319
Speaker 1: not strong enough and now they hit five balls all

1091
00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:06,759
Speaker 1: the time and they're not a good hitter anymore. If

1092
00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:09,480
Speaker 1: you're stealing and you can't make the cut, you.

1093
00:54:09,560 --> 00:54:12,720
Speaker 3: Just stop right.

1094
00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:15,279
Speaker 2: And this is where the conversation goes full circle a

1095
00:54:15,320 --> 00:54:17,600
Speaker 2: little bit. This is a Marlins team that in the

1096
00:54:17,680 --> 00:54:20,759
Speaker 2: traditional sense, is just not hit at a very high

1097
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:23,600
Speaker 2: level ever at the big league level, and one way

1098
00:54:23,600 --> 00:54:26,000
Speaker 2: that you create more runs potentially is if they are

1099
00:54:26,520 --> 00:54:29,000
Speaker 2: that are able to pick up these extra bases, whether

1100
00:54:29,040 --> 00:54:32,480
Speaker 2: it's from stealing bases or whether it's as Owen's other

1101
00:54:32,520 --> 00:54:36,600
Speaker 2: research had pointed to actually being more aggressive on balls

1102
00:54:36,600 --> 00:54:39,799
Speaker 2: and play and taking those extra bases, on going second

1103
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:43,400
Speaker 2: home on singles, first to home on double stuff like that.

1104
00:54:43,520 --> 00:54:46,919
Speaker 2: They're probably going to need to do it, although there's

1105
00:54:46,920 --> 00:54:48,920
Speaker 2: some optimism that their offense this year is going to

1106
00:54:49,080 --> 00:54:51,480
Speaker 2: be on the better side. And I want to do

1107
00:54:51,520 --> 00:54:54,000
Speaker 2: this conversation to look even further ahead to twenty twenty

1108
00:54:54,040 --> 00:54:57,279
Speaker 2: seven and beyond, where more of these players will come

1109
00:54:57,320 --> 00:54:59,840
Speaker 2: to the big league level and when we're not going

1110
00:54:59,920 --> 00:55:03,400
Speaker 2: to even deeper into this total player development reset that

1111
00:55:03,400 --> 00:55:05,400
Speaker 2: the Marlins have undergone the last couple of years and

1112
00:55:05,480 --> 00:55:08,000
Speaker 2: see how that actually bears fruit at the big, big level.

1113
00:55:08,040 --> 00:55:11,600
Speaker 2: We're getting closer and closer it's actually finding that out,

1114
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:14,160
Speaker 2: and I feel a lot more prepared thanks to this

1115
00:55:14,200 --> 00:55:16,879
Speaker 2: conversation with you guys. This is maxfield Lane and Owen

1116
00:55:17,120 --> 00:55:21,040
Speaker 2: Riley from Oyster Analytics and more than writing down on

1117
00:55:21,200 --> 00:55:23,480
Speaker 2: down on the Farms Substack, Down on the farm dot

1118
00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:25,359
Speaker 2: substack dot com. That's where you can find that top

1119
00:55:25,360 --> 00:55:27,640
Speaker 2: one hundred hitters list. I'm going to link those in

1120
00:55:27,719 --> 00:55:30,080
Speaker 2: the podcast show page for you guys to check out

1121
00:55:30,120 --> 00:55:32,759
Speaker 2: as well. Yeah, really great work that you guys are doing,

1122
00:55:32,880 --> 00:55:36,640
Speaker 2: so thanks again for hopping on. And yeah, I know

1123
00:55:36,680 --> 00:55:39,520
Speaker 2: that you guys you've been teasing it that you have

1124
00:55:39,600 --> 00:55:41,960
Speaker 2: some big changes in sore for your own site before

1125
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:46,520
Speaker 2: the as the season is taking off, right, Yeah, we.

1126
00:55:46,520 --> 00:55:48,319
Speaker 1: Got we got some big changes. One of the things

1127
00:55:48,360 --> 00:55:50,799
Speaker 1: where we're going to implement new ways to be able

1128
00:55:50,800 --> 00:55:53,360
Speaker 1: to follow the prospects you're interested in. So if you

1129
00:55:53,400 --> 00:55:55,719
Speaker 1: want to figure out how duble Lead's doing, instead of

1130
00:55:55,719 --> 00:55:58,239
Speaker 1: having to keep keep checking on it, we can we

1131
00:55:58,280 --> 00:56:01,120
Speaker 1: can feed you all the double gleade you want, you know,

1132
00:56:01,280 --> 00:56:05,160
Speaker 1: straight into a custom dashboard and and ultimately, yeah, that's

1133
00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:07,360
Speaker 1: that's what we're going to try to do here. Owen's

1134
00:56:07,360 --> 00:56:10,320
Speaker 1: putting a lot of work as well to have our website,

1135
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:14,319
Speaker 1: oyster Analytics dot com show off our prospects, show off

1136
00:56:14,360 --> 00:56:17,759
Speaker 1: some of our abs challenge related research, and it does

1137
00:56:17,840 --> 00:56:21,080
Speaker 1: so so much quicker than our previous shiny apps. So

1138
00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:23,560
Speaker 1: those are two of a couple of changes that we're

1139
00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:27,560
Speaker 1: hoping to make to uh entice our paid subscribers into

1140
00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:28,480
Speaker 1: supporting us.

1141
00:56:28,840 --> 00:56:30,799
Speaker 4: Yeah, thanks so much for having us. That was really

1142
00:56:30,800 --> 00:56:32,000
Speaker 4: fun conversation.

1143
00:56:32,200 --> 00:56:34,239
Speaker 2: That's that's it for this episode of the show. A

1144
00:56:34,239 --> 00:56:36,359
Speaker 2: whole lot more coverage coming. The next time you'll see

1145
00:56:36,400 --> 00:56:38,920
Speaker 2: and hear from me, I'll be down in Jupiter covering

1146
00:56:39,520 --> 00:56:41,880
Speaker 2: the models themselves with my boots on the ground, and

1147
00:56:42,280 --> 00:56:44,920
Speaker 2: uh I can't wait to bring you all that wherever

1148
00:56:45,200 --> 00:56:47,880
Speaker 2: you get your podcasts and on fish on First dot com, So,

1149
00:56:48,200 --> 00:57:03,280
Speaker 2: as always, go fish

1150
00:57:05,520 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 1: A Bush.