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Speaker 1: Philip Conspiracy Realists. We are returning with tonight's classic episode.

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Speaker 1: This is something that remains incredibly sensitive and incredibly important

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Speaker 1: in the modern day. As we all know, statistically, you

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Speaker 1: or a loved one has battled with a group of

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Speaker 1: diseases that we collectively call cancer.

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Speaker 2: Yes, and likely lost people in your life, right, hor horrifying.

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Speaker 2: I know, I have I know you probably have to.

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Speaker 2: There are a lot of human beings who have come

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Speaker 2: along gosh, what do you want to say, guys centuries no,

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Speaker 2: a century maybe where people have come along and said, hey,

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Speaker 2: we've got the cure for you.

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Speaker 1: Here.

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Speaker 2: This is going to get rid of all of that

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Speaker 2: horrifying cancer. We just need lots of money.

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Speaker 1: Right, yes, because each year millions of people across the

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Speaker 1: planet still grapple with these with these medical conditions, and

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Speaker 1: one type of treatment for one type of cancer may

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Speaker 1: not apply to other kinds of cancer. It's very much

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Speaker 1: a real killer, and it's something that some of the

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Speaker 1: smartest people in the world are still attempting to solve. However,

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Speaker 1: as you alluded to there, Matt, it's sadly no surprise

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Speaker 1: that there are a lot of people who claim that

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Speaker 1: they have cured some or all forms of cancer. And

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Speaker 1: there's a lot to wrestle with here, and.

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Speaker 3: There's a lot in the news right now about some

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Speaker 3: truly potentially amazing advancements in that direction. And this isn't

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Speaker 3: something that we want to think about negatively in terms

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Speaker 3: of the conspiracy of it all. But there are certainly

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Speaker 3: those that would take that promise of a cure for

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Speaker 3: cancer and use it to cash in.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure, we're going to talk about it in

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Speaker 2: this episode, So let's get into it.

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Speaker 1: Those to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is riddled

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Speaker 1: with unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn

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Speaker 1: this stuff they don't want you to know. A production

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Speaker 1: of iHeart Radios How Stuff Works.

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Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,

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Speaker 2: my name.

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Speaker 4: Is no One.

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Speaker 1: They call me Ben. We were joined as always with

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Speaker 1: our super producer Paul Mission Control Deck. At most importantly,

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Speaker 1: you are you. You are here, and that makes this

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Speaker 1: stuff they don't want you to know. Another peak behind

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Speaker 1: the curtain. This is the first time in quite a

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Speaker 1: while that the whole crew has been together in the

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Speaker 1: same studio.

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Speaker 4: And another peek behind the curtain. Matt said, his name

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Speaker 4: originally kind of in an odd cadence, and I made

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Speaker 4: him start over and correct it, and then I copied

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Speaker 4: said odd cadence in my sign on. So I'm a jerk.

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Speaker 2: That's so brown town of you, so brownish.

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Speaker 4: So one note and brown note.

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Speaker 1: So how have you guys been doing? Hey?

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Speaker 2: Great, Ben, I hope you're doing well too. You were

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Speaker 2: on the Biggest Adventures. We've recorded one episode since you've returned.

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Speaker 2: And you know, the one thing we haven't actually addressed

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Speaker 2: yet together as a team.

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Speaker 1: What's that, Matt is our.

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Speaker 2: Time out in La We what we got to do

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Speaker 2: with mister Dan Harmon.

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Speaker 1: That's true. We did mention this in previous episodes. We

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Speaker 1: wanted to be transparent, of course, given the kind of

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Speaker 1: show that we do here, and you know, I can't

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Speaker 1: believe it. We actually did it. We went on Harmontown

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Speaker 1: and then we also had Dan over on an episode

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Speaker 1: of Stuff they Don't want you to know, which, by

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Speaker 1: the time this recording comes out should be available now, right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And I just have to say it was incredible,

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Speaker 2: basically starting a conversation on Harmontown on stage, then continuing

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Speaker 2: onto our show where we just kind of kept talking

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Speaker 2: in more depth about the same things.

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Speaker 4: There was even the chapter of the conversation that you

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Speaker 4: were not privy to that was sort of in the

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Speaker 4: dressing room in between the show or before the show,

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Speaker 4: and then after the show, and then we did our show,

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Speaker 4: and then we continue the conversation even still at a

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Speaker 4: little dive bar in Hollywood called the Frolic Room, which

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Speaker 4: is Hollywood institution. Yeah, and it was just the whole

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Speaker 4: thing was kind of surreal and delightful in many many ways.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and we just we hope you enjoyed the episode

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Speaker 2: as you were listening to it. It was a delight

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Speaker 2: for us.

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Speaker 1: So it's a weird one, Yeah, it is. It is

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Speaker 1: definitely a weird one. And to your point, Nol, I'm

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Speaker 1: also wondering how coherent the conversation will be given that

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Speaker 1: several hours of what was essentially a two day episode

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Speaker 1: will not see the light of day.

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Speaker 4: Not to mention, we just now got the preview of

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Speaker 4: that in real time, you know, got the preview of

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Speaker 4: that episode to listen to. We always listen to them

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Speaker 4: before published, and I think we're all a little bit

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Speaker 4: on the edge of our seats wondering what it's actually

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Speaker 4: gonna sound like. You are out there in podcast land

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Speaker 4: already know.

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Speaker 2: Well, yeah, you're gonna get the refined product.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we're in a situation that some English teachers would

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Speaker 1: refer to as dramatic irony, because you, the audience, know

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Speaker 1: something that we do not.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's true.

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Speaker 1: So let's hope. Let's hope it's uh, let's hope it's good.

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Speaker 1: One way or the other. It's done. And I don't

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Speaker 1: think that we've heard the last of Dan Harmon, you know,

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Speaker 1: I mean obviously not, because he's gonna make tons of

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Speaker 1: new shows, but he might be on this show again

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Speaker 1: in the future.

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Speaker 4: So we hope you like it.

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Speaker 1: Today we are talking about something much less, much less enjoyable.

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Speaker 2: Right, Well, actually this could be quite enjoyable because it's

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Speaker 2: possible ways to cure ourselves of things our body is

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Speaker 2: fighting against.

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Speaker 1: That's right, that's true. We do have to say at

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Speaker 1: the top of today's show that nothing we say in

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Speaker 1: this show, and none of the sources we quote, should

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Speaker 1: be taken as medical advice.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, speak to your doctor or your GP, whoever you've

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Speaker 2: got if you want to learn more about any of

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Speaker 2: this stuff.

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Speaker 1: And if you get scared, don't hop on WebMD. Make

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Speaker 1: an appointment go to a doctor.

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Speaker 4: Never hop on WebMD, you guys.

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Speaker 1: Never WebMD. It's cancer. That's that's their name, that's their tagline.

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Speaker 4: Literally, it's like it's like one of those float charts

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Speaker 4: that always ends in cancer.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and today we're exploring one of the most sensitive

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Speaker 1: subjects in human experience, health and of course it's ever

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Speaker 1: present shadowy end result death.

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Speaker 2: I thought you were going to say, wellness, Oh no, wells.

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Speaker 1: Well, that's that's good. Yeah. But they all and so far,

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Speaker 1: the every single study that has ever been conducted on

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Speaker 1: this subject has found that life is a terminal condition

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Speaker 1: with a one rate of death fatality rate. And for

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Speaker 1: the past few thousands of years, our species has made

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Speaker 1: honestly extraordinary strides in the field of medicine. I'm not

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Speaker 1: the most optimistic person, but even I can admit that

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Speaker 1: it was not an easy process. However, there is here's

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Speaker 1: one anecdote that can show us how difficult medical progress is.

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Speaker 1: Have have you all heard of ignos Semelwis?

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Speaker 4: Yes?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think we've mentioned him before on this show,

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Speaker 2: just in passing though.

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Speaker 1: He's one of my favorite illustrations of someone who was

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Speaker 1: called crazy and was right all along. However, you know,

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Speaker 1: we've been in this situation, but no one has died

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Speaker 1: of a result of as a result of people not

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Speaker 1: believing us. Hopefully, ignos Semlviis was roundly ridiculed for the

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Speaker 1: kakammy notion that hey, maybe before doctors assist assist in childbirth,

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Speaker 1: they should wash their hands. Yeah, wash just hands.

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Speaker 2: Well, and it wasn't taken well because a lot of

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Speaker 2: the people that he's speaking to were essentially just offended

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Speaker 2: at the thought of you believe my hands to be

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Speaker 2: dirty too, where I will infect others just by not

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Speaker 2: cleansing them prior to delivering a baby.

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Speaker 1: I am a gentleman, sir, and you have violated my dignity.

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean then that kind of thinking, we have

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Speaker 2: to remember, still exists within the realms of things that

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Speaker 2: are just outside of what is accepted.

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Speaker 4: Well, it was a product of elitism too, right, It's like,

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Speaker 4: you know, how dare you accuse me of being unclean?

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Speaker 4: For I am at a higher station than you, sir, You.

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Speaker 1: Know exactly, like the diseases clearly come from the peasant class. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: when all doctors are considered more patrician. It's so strange

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Speaker 1: because some device was correct a ton of people didn't

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Speaker 1: believe him, even though he had studies that proved he

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Speaker 1: was correct. And his bedside manner was also terrible if

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Speaker 1: you were a D and D character charisma was his

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Speaker 1: dumpstat like he was not good at talking with people

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Speaker 1: in a civil manner because he knew he was right

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Speaker 1: and he was angry about it, and this just exacerbated

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Speaker 1: the situation. The academy turned on him. Eventually, Semmelweis ends

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Speaker 1: up in an asylum at the age of forty seven,

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Speaker 1: and eventually, ironically, he dies of sepsis MM infection in

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Speaker 1: the blood. And this depressing anecdote gives us a window

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Speaker 1: into human nature. Oh also, thank you so much, Samuelweiss

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Speaker 1: for playing such a huge part in us being alive

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Speaker 1: to make the show today. We see some damning things

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Speaker 1: about human psychology in this tale, and we also see

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Speaker 1: some illuminating things about our collective approach to medicine. And

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Speaker 1: we fast forward to twenty nineteen. We've made a lot

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Speaker 1: of hard won medical progress, but some disease remain functionally

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Speaker 1: incurable here in the US. Two of the biggest killers

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Speaker 1: are heart disease, which is treatable, you know, in number

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Speaker 1: of ways. And of course the big C word. Cancer. Doctors,

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Speaker 1: as you listen to this, are literally working day in

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Speaker 1: and day out around the clock to discover new treatments,

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Speaker 1: early detection methods, and more. But here's the thing, fellow

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Speaker 1: conspiracy realists. Some people will tell you that there is

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Speaker 1: a cure for some or all cancers, and that it

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Speaker 1: has been around for much longer than you think. But

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Speaker 1: to figure out the answer to that question, we have

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Speaker 1: to start at the beginning. So here are the facts.

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Speaker 4: What is cancer, you might be asking yourself. First, let's

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Speaker 4: bust a few myths about the term cancer, which actually

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Speaker 4: describes more than one hundred separate diseases, not all of

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Speaker 4: which are created equally, but they are all characterized by

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Speaker 4: an abnormal and unregulated growth of cells. This growth actually

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Speaker 4: destroys surrounding tissue and can spread to other parts of

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Speaker 4: the body through a process called metastasis.

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Speaker 1: And kudos for correctly pronounced that the first try that metastasis.

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Speaker 1: That one's tough for me. I can see metastasize, but

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Speaker 1: having to how do you pronounce it again?

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Speaker 4: Metastasis? Metastas But I also like metastasis. Yeah, that's another

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Speaker 4: thing entirely though. Yeah, it's like meta not moving. I

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Speaker 4: don't know, I know.

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Speaker 1: Right, it's not moving on several levels right in a

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Speaker 1: deep way.

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Speaker 4: Ben, you have a really great analogy, I think, for

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Speaker 4: a way to wrap your head around this idea, don't you?

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Speaker 1: Oh man, I hope it's at least serviceable. It's it

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Speaker 1: felt like a good idea, like three in the morning.

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Speaker 1: So when we hear cancer, just like you said, Nol,

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Speaker 1: we're often we're often taught to think that cancer is

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Speaker 1: itself a specific disease, but that's not the case. As

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Speaker 1: you said, there are more than one hundred different diseases

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Speaker 1: that fit the classification of cancer. So when we hear

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Speaker 1: the word cancer, we should think of it should be

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Speaker 1: like hearing the word clothing, because clothing describes a group

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Speaker 1: of things that all have a couple broad definitions in common,

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Speaker 1: but they also specialize, right, So you have hats for

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Speaker 1: your head, you have gloves just for your hands, and

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Speaker 1: on and on and on and like articles of clothing,

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Speaker 1: cancers specialize in different parts of your body. You wouldn't

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Speaker 1: wear a hat on your foot, and you wouldn't have

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Speaker 1: breast cancer in your prostate, right, these are very different things.

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Speaker 1: So when we look at the most common forms of cancer,

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Speaker 1: at least here in the US. We run into our

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Speaker 1: first Terrible Laundry list, which there are a few in

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Speaker 1: today's episode. There's skin cancer, lung cancer, brain cancer, breast cancer,

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Speaker 1: prostate cancer, colon cancer, ovarian cancer, leukemia, and lymphoma.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm really what we're getting out of here is

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Speaker 2: cancer can develop in any part of the human body.

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Speaker 2: And it's not one of those things that you have

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Speaker 2: to be a certain age where you know maybe cancer

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Speaker 2: will develop. It becomes more likely sometimes depending on your

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Speaker 2: life choices, but it really you can develop cancer at

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Speaker 2: any age, and unlike something like AIDS or the flu,

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Speaker 2: something infectious, let's say tuberculosis, you can't catch cancer from

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Speaker 2: somebody else from being around them. It's not contagious in

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Speaker 2: any way. And generally cancers are caused by damage that

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Speaker 2: occurs at the genetic level inside a cell. Right, That's

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Speaker 2: how you get the single cell that becomes rogue and

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Speaker 2: then begins multiplying and then infecting the other cells through metastasis.

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Speaker 2: It's I mean, it really is as a scary thing

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Speaker 2: because it's like one tiny, less than microscopic part of

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Speaker 2: view that rebels against the programming and then can kill you.

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Speaker 1: And this is interesting. As a side note, there is

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Speaker 1: a provable contagious cancer. It does not occur in humans.

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Speaker 1: It occurs in Tasmanian devils. It's the devil facial tumor disease.

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Speaker 2: Jeez, I've heard of that actually, strangely, I don't know why.

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Speaker 2: Must have seen some kind of mini doc about it

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Speaker 2: or something.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's relatively recent in the literature. It was first

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Speaker 1: described in nineteen ninety six. But it just ran through

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Speaker 1: the population of Tasmanian devils. Luckily, there's nothing like that

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Speaker 1: that we know of were humans so far. And why

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Speaker 1: is that a very lucky thing? That's because cancer is

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Speaker 1: one of the leading causes of death worldwide already. Back

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Speaker 1: in twenty twelve, there were fourteen point one million new

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Speaker 1: cases and eight point two million cancer related deaths across

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Speaker 1: the world. Literally millions of people are dying every year,

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Speaker 1: and we have we have some sobering stats for the

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Speaker 1: US specifically.

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Speaker 4: It's true, and that is according to cancer dot Gov,

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Speaker 4: which estimates that seven hundred and thirty five thousand, three

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Speaker 4: hundred and fifty new cases of cancer were diagnosed in

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Speaker 4: the US in twenty eighteen and six hundred and nine thousand,

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Speaker 4: six hundred and forty people died from the disease. The

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Speaker 4: most common cancers, which are listed here in descending order,

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Speaker 4: according to estimated new cases in twenty eighteen, are breast cancer,

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Speaker 4: lung and bronchus cancer, prostate cancer, colon and rectum cancer,

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Speaker 4: melanoma of the skin, bladder cancer, non Hodgkins lymphoma, kidney

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Speaker 4: and renal pelvis cancer. Then we have endometrial cancer, leukemia,

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Speaker 4: pancreatic cancer, thyroid cancer, and last but not least, liver cancer.

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Speaker 1: But there's good news, thankfully. We're we're also going out

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Speaker 1: of our way to point out moments of good news

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Speaker 1: in this story.

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Speaker 2: There must be silver lining here.

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Speaker 4: Well.

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Speaker 2: The good news is that the cancer rates have actually

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Speaker 2: dropped about twenty seven percent over the last twenty five years.

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Speaker 2: I mean, that's fantastic, and I think, you know, without

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Speaker 2: getting too deep into it right now, it has to

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Speaker 2: do with just the amount of money and effort that's

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Speaker 2: being spent on trying to find a cure. The problem

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Speaker 2: is again that we've kind of discussed before. It's not

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Speaker 2: one thing you can't just throw money at a team

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Speaker 2: of researchers to look at cancer, big C cancer, you

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Speaker 2: have to study each individual part of the body and

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Speaker 2: each individual cancer. But again, death rates dropped twenty seven percent.

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Speaker 2: It translates to about one and a half percent per

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Speaker 2: year and more than two point six million deaths avoided

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Speaker 2: between nineteen ninety one and twenty sixteen.

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Speaker 1: And honestly, go team, Yeah, that's a tremendous improvement right

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Speaker 1: now here. At the end of twenty nineteen, experts expect

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Speaker 1: a total of one million, seven hundred and sixty two thousand,

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Speaker 1: four and fifty new cancer cases and six hundred and

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Speaker 1: six thousand, eight hundred and eighty deaths from cancer cancer

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Speaker 1: related causes. This this means that although rates are dropping,

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Speaker 1: people are still dying and everyone is aware of this.

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Speaker 1: Everyone is aware of this. We know that people are

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Speaker 1: searching continually for a cure. According to researchers like kl Black,

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Speaker 1: the cure for cancer is more a matter of when

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Speaker 1: rather than a matter of if. Because, according to Black

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Speaker 1: and their colleagues, there's been this explosive progress in our

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Speaker 1: understanding of cancer. You know, reducing smoking rates that has

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Speaker 1: a huge impact on cancer rates. You know, early to

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Speaker 1: detection methods are a God send for people who believe

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Speaker 1: in God. And Black says that since we're since we're

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Speaker 1: in an inevitable situation where we will find a cure

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Speaker 1: for some cancers, it really becomes a question of how

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Speaker 1: much we want to prime the pump. Black calls for

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Speaker 1: increased research funding into all aspects of cancer research and

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Speaker 1: says it needs to be at least twice the current

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Speaker 1: levels of funding. But the tragic problem here, simply put,

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Speaker 1: is this for many people curing cancer in twenty thirty

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Speaker 1: or even twenty twenty five, isn't that's not coming soon enough.

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Speaker 1: The clock is already ticking on their lives.

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Speaker 2: And there's a deeper conspiracy there that we will get

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Speaker 2: into about who benefits from cancer not being cured.

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Speaker 1: Gley Bono right. And that, of course assumes that the

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Speaker 1: mainstream narrative is true, that there is sincere ardent research

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Speaker 1: in treating and curing this type of disease and it

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Speaker 1: may just not come soon enough. Unless that is, the

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Speaker 1: cure for cancer already exists.

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Speaker 2: And we'll learn about that right after a word from

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Speaker 2: our sponsor.

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Speaker 1: Here's where it gets crazy.

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Speaker 4: According to a two thousand and eight survey, as much

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Speaker 4: as twenty seven percent of the United States population believes

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Speaker 4: large pharmaceutical interests possess a cure for some or all

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Speaker 4: cancers and actively suppress this treatment in order to boost

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Speaker 4: their profits. We've heard this any number of times when

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Speaker 4: it comes to the farm. I mean, just in terms

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Speaker 4: of cures for all kinds of diseases or alternative medicaid.

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Speaker 4: Why the pharmaceutical lobby fights marijuana legalizations so much. I mean,

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Speaker 4: you know, it's no proof, but the proof is in

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Speaker 4: the putting. It seems pretty clear that's the case.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and these conspiratorial claims. I love that you point

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Speaker 1: that out, because these claims typically follow the same rough pattern,

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Speaker 1: not just for cancer, but for things like HIV or AIDS.

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Speaker 1: The idea is that someone somewhere has invented or discovered

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Speaker 1: a cure for cancer or a treatment that has a

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Speaker 1: very high efficacy rate, right, And this cure, whether it

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Speaker 1: be a simple one and done pill or a series

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Speaker 1: of treatments you know, herbal remedies and so on, this

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Speaker 1: cure is known to big pharma capital B capital P.

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Speaker 1: But releasing it to the public, in this cabal's eyes,

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Speaker 1: is less profitable than letting people slowly die or charging

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Speaker 1: them for a subscription service. There are a couple of

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Speaker 1: things we could unpack. Let's pause for a second. A note.

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Speaker 1: Twenty seven percent. You said twenty seven percent of people pulled.

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Speaker 1: That's almost one out of three US residents believe that

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Speaker 1: there is a cure that has been repressed. That puts

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Speaker 1: this on the level of some of the great widely

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Speaker 1: believed conspiracies in the lore, right, the moon landing, the

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Speaker 1: JFK assassination.

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Speaker 2: Can we just talk about that survey was from two

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Speaker 2: thousand and six, which is almost I don't know what

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Speaker 2: we would call that from an Internet standpoint, but two

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Speaker 2: thousand and six was like that era where I don't

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Speaker 2: know information was really being put out there. I think

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Speaker 2: back to the House Stuff Works website where there are

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Speaker 2: so many people trying to put out so much information

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Speaker 2: and just fill the Internet and fill in all the

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Speaker 2: spaces that could possibly be searched for. And it makes

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Speaker 2: me wonder if that has anything to do with that

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Speaker 2: twenty seven percent number.

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Speaker 1: I see, Yeah, maybe we were still as a country

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Speaker 1: sharpening or critical thinking skills, right.

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Speaker 2: That's what I see, But perhaps I'm incorrect.

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Speaker 1: Well, there's also there's also the compelling argument that from

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Speaker 1: a capitalistic stance, you're putting yourself out of business if

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Speaker 1: you ever actually cure a disease, right, that's one of

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Speaker 1: the commonly cited things.

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Speaker 2: Unless you control the one cure.

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Speaker 4: But then you only have to take it once. Right,

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Speaker 4: Whereas you know, being prescribed medication is like a life

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Speaker 4: sentence of cash flow, you know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And this this jibes with stuff that we know

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Speaker 1: about the economy in general, which is that for more

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Speaker 1: than a decade, US businesses have been moving away from

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Speaker 1: ownership models towards subscription models, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 1: And this is reflected ass the board, whether you're talking

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Speaker 1: about automobiles, whether you're talking about medicine, whether you're talking

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Speaker 1: about even clothing. Right, the ink in your printer, the

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Speaker 1: ink in your printer.

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Speaker 4: Oh, that's insidious when it's all masquerading behind this facade

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Speaker 4: of convenience, when it's really just a matter of getting

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Speaker 4: you on the hook, and you think, oh, it's not

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Speaker 4: that much per month, but then you add it up

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Speaker 4: and then you maybe compare that to how much actual

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Speaker 4: benefits you get from it, and you're really just funneling

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Speaker 4: money into these corporations pockets or these startups or.

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Speaker 2: Whatever until your card gets canceled.

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Speaker 1: Exactly like when Adobe went entirely to a subscription model.

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Speaker 4: We're very lucky we get access to those products through work.

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Speaker 4: But you know, if someone just wants photoshop, you can't.

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Speaker 4: Maybe you can't. I'm not sure how it works. You

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Speaker 4: can't just buy photoshop anymore to my knowledge. You got

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Speaker 4: to pay that ten twelve bucks a month. Then you

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Speaker 4: add that with your Hulu, add that with your Netflix,

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Speaker 4: add that with your prescription drugs. Before you know it,

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Speaker 4: you're out of pocket a whole lot every month.

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Speaker 1: And you don't own a damn thing. That's the strangest part.

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Speaker 1: I know I'm using strong language there, But this suppressed cure,

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Speaker 1: this palliative thing, this panacea could be described as any

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Speaker 1: number of substances or treatments, and not all of the

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Speaker 1: conspiratorial claims agree on what the cure might actually be.

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Speaker 1: There are a couple of categories. They're natural or alternative treatments.

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Speaker 1: That could be stuff like aromatherapy, right, or herbalistic regimens,

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Speaker 1: and then there's homeopathy or even unto shamanistic healing rights,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean. The idea that disease is

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Speaker 1: as much a product of the mind as it is

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Speaker 1: of the body. And there are some interesting studies that

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Speaker 1: show one's cognitive state can have an effect on recuperation

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Speaker 1: from physical trauma.

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Speaker 2: Oh absolutely well, And that leads into every one of

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Speaker 2: these types of treatments when you get to aromatherapy or something,

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Speaker 2: or one of the largest categories that exists in here,

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Speaker 2: which is what you put into your body. Diet based solutions.

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Speaker 2: There are things like the Browse Diet, the Hallelujah Diet,

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Speaker 2: several others. Were going to get into one at the

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Speaker 2: end of this episode. That's out there right now that

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Speaker 2: I'm sure there are a lot of people following that

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Speaker 2: believe it's going to cure them.

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Speaker 1: And I love the name the Hallelujah Diet. I had

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Speaker 1: not heard of it before we begin researching for this.

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Speaker 1: Just for an example, this is a pretty restrictive diet

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Speaker 1: that purports to be biblical. It's based on raw food,

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Speaker 1: and the inventor of the Hallelujah Diet is doing that.

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Speaker 1: Not only am I the president, I'm also a member

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Speaker 1: sure kind of thing because the inventor claim secured his

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Speaker 1: own cancer.

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Speaker 2: A lot of those are vegan based or like a

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Speaker 2: specific thing that you have to eat or refrain from

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Speaker 2: eating to get your body back into some position of

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Speaker 2: I was gonna say stasis, but that's not correct. Just

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Speaker 2: there's harmony. To get harmony back within your body and

438
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:04,840
Speaker 2: all the cells.

439
00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:06,159
Speaker 1: Metastasis.

440
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:07,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, metastasis.

441
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:12,679
Speaker 4: There we go, the best kind of stasis. I don't know,

442
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 4: I walk that one back. Yeahah, what I like it.

443
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:17,000
Speaker 3: Uh.

444
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 1: So we see that, We see that diet can be

445
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 1: a compelling treatment of some sort because we know that

446
00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:31,320
Speaker 1: a vegan diet will tend to be better for you

447
00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:33,959
Speaker 1: than a very heavy red meat diet. Right, as long

448
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:36,120
Speaker 1: as you're an adult, you're not still developing et cetera.

449
00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:38,080
Speaker 2: When it comes Yeah, exactly when it comes to certain

450
00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:39,520
Speaker 2: things and at certain points in your life.

451
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:45,359
Speaker 1: And there are also electromagnetic or energy based cures. Shout

452
00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 1: out to orgone energy, which is still fascinating to me.

453
00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:51,080
Speaker 4: Boy Wilhelm.

454
00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:55,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, mister Reike himself, doctor Reich. He's a doctor of sorts.

455
00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:58,160
Speaker 1: It was easier to be a doctor in those days.

456
00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:00,960
Speaker 1: This cloud doctor. There's a cloud doctor. I love it.

457
00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:02,679
Speaker 4: We talked about him last episode when you were here.

458
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:04,840
Speaker 4: We talked about cloudbusting Daddy dude.

459
00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:07,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm having a weird deja vu moment right here.

460
00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:10,880
Speaker 4: Okay, because of the Kate Bush song that was about

461
00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,719
Speaker 4: Wilhelm Reich and his rain machine No Cloudbuster.

462
00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:18,239
Speaker 1: The Cloudbuster or going energy, which is fascinating. Please if

463
00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:20,760
Speaker 1: you haven't If you haven't heard of this before, do

464
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 1: check out our audio and video episodes on Oregone and

465
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,919
Speaker 1: the strange interaction that Villa Reich had.

466
00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:30,959
Speaker 4: With the FDA.

467
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:34,720
Speaker 1: I think at some point so there are also hybrid

468
00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: regimens that combined two or more treatments from the categories

469
00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:42,159
Speaker 1: that we just mentioned. This belief the big pharma is

470
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:46,119
Speaker 1: suppressing a cure to one or more cancers is very common,

471
00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:50,040
Speaker 1: and it finds fertile soil in the current zeitgeist, in

472
00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:55,320
Speaker 1: the current social climate, because distrust the pharmaceutical companies runs

473
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:58,920
Speaker 1: pretty high nowadays. And I would argue rightly so, especially

474
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:04,840
Speaker 1: given the Opie in the US, which swept through various

475
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:07,879
Speaker 1: regions of the country like a natural disaster.

476
00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:08,639
Speaker 2: And continues to do so.

477
00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then add to that, the US is cartoonishly high,

478
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:17,919
Speaker 1: like ridiculously high, drug costs when compared to literally every

479
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: other developed nation, every single other one, and I know

480
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 1: literally is a word that gets overused so often these days,

481
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:31,640
Speaker 1: just like awesome, right, But in this case, yes, literally

482
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 1: every other developed nation is going to have better drug prices.

483
00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:39,240
Speaker 1: So even without hard proof of a conspiracy in this case,

484
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:42,440
Speaker 1: there are a lot of people who understandably will hear

485
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:46,120
Speaker 1: about the concept of any sort of suppressed medicine or treatment,

486
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:48,400
Speaker 1: and at the very least, even if they're not one

487
00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 1: hundred percent on board with the idea, they'll think, well,

488
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,600
Speaker 1: I uh, I wouldn't put it past them, you know

489
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:58,000
Speaker 1: what I mean. You know, it sound like the kind

490
00:28:58,040 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 1: of screlly thing they'd be into.

491
00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:03,000
Speaker 2: But here's the deal. A lot of times the villain

492
00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:07,040
Speaker 2: in these stories is Big Pharma with the B and

493
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 2: a P. Another villain BP, No, not really a villain

494
00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:16,800
Speaker 2: VP or whatever, just depends on your perspective. But ultimately,

495
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:20,120
Speaker 2: what I'm saying here is the pharmaceutical companies Big Pharma

496
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:23,000
Speaker 2: could not get away with this alone. They would need

497
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:25,120
Speaker 2: to have some cronies there with them, some people who

498
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:27,959
Speaker 2: could get some other things done. They need help from,

499
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:31,240
Speaker 2: you know, the nonprofits that are out there that take

500
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:34,120
Speaker 2: in hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not millions of

501
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:37,800
Speaker 2: dollars government agencies and other independent researchers who are going

502
00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:41,880
Speaker 2: through and either suppressing the research that's out there or

503
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:47,480
Speaker 2: you know, covering up various aspects of certain diets or cures.

504
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:50,400
Speaker 2: Like is it do you guys think it is in

505
00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:53,400
Speaker 2: any way possible that all of these different groups could

506
00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:57,840
Speaker 2: be cooperating so that let's say US eight million people

507
00:29:57,880 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 2: worldwide die each every year.

508
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,880
Speaker 4: Wait a minute, I means some sort of massive cover up,

509
00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:07,280
Speaker 4: conspiracy Hedgemond situation.

510
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:10,840
Speaker 1: Well, ultimately, yeah, if if so, and we're walking through

511
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:14,200
Speaker 1: this hypothetically right, yes, yes, these different institutions would have

512
00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:20,400
Speaker 1: to work together pretty well, right, and they would have

513
00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:24,560
Speaker 1: to have some sort of omerta, some sort of brilliantly

514
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:28,800
Speaker 1: watertight agreement. And you know that number is true. If

515
00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:32,920
Speaker 1: they are actively scheming to in some sort of plan

516
00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 1: that results in eight million people dying every year, this

517
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:40,400
Speaker 1: comes very close to being a case of medical genocide.

518
00:30:40,840 --> 00:30:42,520
Speaker 4: Let's be real for a second. What do you think

519
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:44,240
Speaker 4: the chances are this is actually the case?

520
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,480
Speaker 1: I you know, I'm gonna save it for the end. Okay,

521
00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:50,960
Speaker 1: I'm gonna save I'm gonna save it for the end,

522
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:55,840
Speaker 1: because just with that piece just hypothetically, that's a lot

523
00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 1: of cooperation, you know what I mean.

524
00:30:57,680 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 4: We've been talking about this a lot more lately since

525
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 4: the Harmon thing. When when like, when can you smell

526
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:09,320
Speaker 4: a conspiracy? That's probably there's some has some sand. It's

527
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 4: usually when that level of cooperation benefits all parties. Only

528
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:16,760
Speaker 4: then are people most likely to keep their mouths shut

529
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:22,640
Speaker 4: when the cover up is active and you know, necessary

530
00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 4: to continue to enrich said parties or you know, keep

531
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:31,480
Speaker 4: them from getting caught in some kind of collective lie.

532
00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:35,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, and well, you know, pre Epstein I would have

533
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:38,440
Speaker 1: been much more skeptical about some of these things. In

534
00:31:38,560 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 1: this case, however, there is a big elephant in the room,

535
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 1: which is, let's say it's true. Let's just hypothetically say

536
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,280
Speaker 1: it's true. What happens when one of the conspirators is

537
00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 1: diagnosed with cancer? Right? I mean do they say, well,

538
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:55,240
Speaker 1: for the good or the cause? You've got to continue

539
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 1: on to stage four, buddy, we can't let people know.

540
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:00,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's weird.

541
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 1: I mean, okay, so we did that survey right from

542
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 1: two thousand and six, right, Well, in two thousand and two,

543
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:09,680
Speaker 1: there was a guy named Ted Gansler. This comes to

544
00:32:09,760 --> 00:32:13,000
Speaker 1: us from one of our colleagues, author Dave Russ, writing

545
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:17,880
Speaker 1: over for Houstuff Works. Ted Gansler, at the time was

546
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:22,880
Speaker 1: a strategic director for pathology research with the American Cancer Society.

547
00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:27,360
Speaker 1: He edits the Cancer Journal for clinicians. This guy's his

548
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 1: bona fides, right. He heard this hidden cure, the suppressed

549
00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:35,720
Speaker 1: cure for cancer story so often that in two thousand

550
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:40,160
Speaker 1: and two he conducted a survey about the most common

551
00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 1: misconceptions of cancer, and in this he asked about one

552
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:48,920
Speaker 1: thousand Americans if they believed there was a conspiracy to

553
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 1: hide a cure for cancer. According to Gansler, the result

554
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 1: was even more shocking than he had expected. He found

555
00:32:56,760 --> 00:32:59,320
Speaker 1: and again this two thousand and two, that not only

556
00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:01,600
Speaker 1: did twenty seven ven point three percent of the people

557
00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:05,600
Speaker 1: polled believe that there was a cure for cancer being repressed,

558
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:10,840
Speaker 1: but another fourteen percent said, I don't know. It seems

559
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,320
Speaker 1: like something they would do, though maybe happen.

560
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 2: That's that's crazy, And again that's just kind of what

561
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:21,720
Speaker 2: we've been talking about here. It's another version of this

562
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:25,760
Speaker 2: conspiracy theory, or another aspect to it, is that that

563
00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:28,600
Speaker 2: thought that somebody somewhere has a cancer cure and it's

564
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:30,520
Speaker 2: being kept secret for one reason or another.

565
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:32,440
Speaker 4: Well, but to your question, Ben, I mean, if we're

566
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,200
Speaker 4: staying in the realm of hypotheticals and thought experiments, if

567
00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 4: one of the members of this conspiracy were diagnosed, wouldn't

568
00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:43,160
Speaker 4: by virtue of being in the inner circle. They'd get

569
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:45,600
Speaker 4: the cure and they would just keep it quiet and

570
00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:47,440
Speaker 4: they'd never come out with the fact that this person

571
00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:49,840
Speaker 4: was diagnosed. It would just be business as usual. Isn't

572
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:52,480
Speaker 4: that sort of the argument we make with the super

573
00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:55,800
Speaker 4: elite that potentially possessed technology that's beyond the reach of

574
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 4: us smear mortals, like life extension technology and things like that,

575
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 4: is and that how it would work hypothetically hypothetically.

576
00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, But then we also have to wonder how to

577
00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:09,800
Speaker 1: explain the deaths of people who are billionaires who expired

578
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:13,239
Speaker 1: due to cancer cancer related causes. Is that part of

579
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 1: the cover up too? Do they really die of something

580
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:19,239
Speaker 1: else and they said, okay, call it cancer so that

581
00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:20,920
Speaker 1: the peasants don't know we have the cure.

582
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:24,080
Speaker 4: Well, and they're presumably living on a billionaire island somewhere.

583
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:29,399
Speaker 1: Yes, Yeah, is Warren Buffett like the only billionaire who

584
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:33,080
Speaker 1: has a modest ranch style home he seems like he likes.

585
00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:36,640
Speaker 4: To keep it relatively unostentatious. For the most part. He

586
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:39,520
Speaker 4: spends his money in smart ways and not in showy ways.

587
00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 4: That's a good question, though, Ben.

588
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 1: I don't know. Let us know if you know a

589
00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:49,719
Speaker 1: modest billionaire who can help illuminate our investigation into the

590
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:51,680
Speaker 1: idea of a suppressed cancer cure.

591
00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:55,720
Speaker 2: And maybe pump millions, if not billions into cancer research.

592
00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:59,279
Speaker 1: Right, Like, well, you know what, great example, David Coch

593
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:04,360
Speaker 1: died of cancer. Yeah. Right, So here's another twist to

594
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:09,799
Speaker 1: this story. Not only do about one one in three

595
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:14,600
Speaker 1: Americans believe that there's something fishy here, but there are

596
00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:21,399
Speaker 1: multiple numerous groups, individuals, and institutions who claim not only

597
00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:24,399
Speaker 1: is there a suppressed secure but that they have discovered

598
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 1: this cure or a cure. We could do an entire

599
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 1: series on the various claims involved, but let's take a

600
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:34,719
Speaker 1: break for a word from our sponsor, and then we'll

601
00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:37,479
Speaker 1: come back and we'll look at a couple of let's

602
00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:47,839
Speaker 1: call them notable highlights. Guys. I've got to admit I've

603
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:50,480
Speaker 1: put this first one in here just because I think

604
00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:54,040
Speaker 1: the guy's name is awesome. All of his claims aside,

605
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:58,520
Speaker 1: the name Royal Rife is an amazing name.

606
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 4: Classically good name, so good, somewhere between a news anchor

607
00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:02,759
Speaker 4: and a porn.

608
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:07,719
Speaker 1: Star perhaps perhaps. Yeah, And you know it's it's one

609
00:36:07,719 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 1: of those names that I would use as a different persona,

610
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:13,400
Speaker 1: you know, in like an airport or a strange city.

611
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:17,920
Speaker 4: Royal Raymond Rife, Hey, you go call me roy Royal.

612
00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:20,400
Speaker 4: I mean, the only Royal I know is from the

613
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:24,800
Speaker 4: fictional Royal Tananbombs. His name was Royal, the main character

614
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:26,839
Speaker 4: made by Gene Hackman. I've never met I've never known

615
00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:28,120
Speaker 4: a person named Royal before.

616
00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:32,879
Speaker 1: Well, you know, the future looms vast and welcoming before us,

617
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:35,279
Speaker 1: and the horizon of time rushes towards us.

618
00:36:35,320 --> 00:36:37,800
Speaker 4: Even now you think it's welcoming. I find it quite foreboding.

619
00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:42,440
Speaker 1: I'm you know, I am. I'm trying to manifest the secret,

620
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:43,759
Speaker 1: even if I don't believe in it.

621
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 4: The secret secret, the one from the book.

622
00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:46,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

623
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:49,880
Speaker 4: Subsequent film adaptation is gonna think positive.

624
00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:55,480
Speaker 2: Well, Royal Rife certainly was thinking positive when he developed

625
00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:59,319
Speaker 2: a beam ray that's in quotations.

626
00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:02,040
Speaker 4: There's a beam, yes, what is it a beam or

627
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:02,439
Speaker 4: a ray?

628
00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:03,719
Speaker 1: It's a beam ray.

629
00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:06,960
Speaker 2: It's a beam ray. It's not a weapon. It's a

630
00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:10,560
Speaker 2: you know, a tool to be used to cure certain

631
00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:14,080
Speaker 2: diseases if aimed, you know, in the right place and

632
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:17,280
Speaker 2: used correctly. And one of those things that he thought

633
00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 2: he could cure was cancer. And the way it's done

634
00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:26,600
Speaker 2: is through vibrating the cancerous cells. Vibration essentially is the

635
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:29,399
Speaker 2: means by which Royal Rife believed his beam ray could

636
00:37:29,480 --> 00:37:30,040
Speaker 2: cure cancer.

637
00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:32,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, he built on the work of a fellow named

638
00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:37,759
Speaker 1: doctor Albert Abrams. Abrams thought that every single disease had

639
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:44,040
Speaker 1: a unique electromagnetic frequency, and these men believe that because

640
00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:47,920
Speaker 1: of that, doctors could kill or treat diseased or cancer

641
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:52,880
Speaker 1: cells by sending an electrical impulse identical to that cells

642
00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:57,879
Speaker 1: electromagnetic frequency. This you've heard of this before, if you're

643
00:37:57,880 --> 00:38:01,200
Speaker 1: a longtime listener to this show. This is sometimes called

644
00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:06,040
Speaker 1: radioics r ad ion ICs.

645
00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:11,239
Speaker 2: It's a fascinating concept, right, if you could isolate just

646
00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:13,960
Speaker 2: the bad cells and then take those out.

647
00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:17,560
Speaker 4: There's a very similar and I think if we're head

648
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:20,480
Speaker 4: in the direction, I believe we are similarly debunked technology

649
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:23,600
Speaker 4: that was using forensics called I can't remember the name,

650
00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:28,720
Speaker 4: but it used radioactive isotopes to identify materials in lead

651
00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:32,600
Speaker 4: and bullets, and the concept was that they all had

652
00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:39,240
Speaker 4: these distinctly unique signatures per specific bullet. But it turns

653
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:41,040
Speaker 4: out that wasn't the case at all. It'd be like

654
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:44,680
Speaker 4: the equivalent of picking up a conk shell and saying

655
00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 4: this is you know, this is a unique conk shell,

656
00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:48,920
Speaker 4: but it would actually have a similar signature to like

657
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,560
Speaker 4: every other conk shell that ever existed. So there were

658
00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:53,319
Speaker 4: folks that were put into prison for a very long

659
00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:55,480
Speaker 4: time using this technology, and then it was debunked and

660
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:58,319
Speaker 4: those people were subsequently released Wow.

661
00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:02,400
Speaker 1: But couldn't get their lives back. Also, so we know

662
00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:08,400
Speaker 1: that Rife, similar to Samulwis, was certain that the Academy

663
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:11,400
Speaker 1: had turned on him, right, and he thought, I am

664
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:14,439
Speaker 1: bringing this pioneering cure to the world. I don't want

665
00:39:14,440 --> 00:39:17,759
Speaker 1: to make a ton of money. It's not about the money, right,

666
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:22,200
Speaker 1: It's about saving lives. There was a San Diego Evening

667
00:39:22,280 --> 00:39:26,040
Speaker 1: Tribune article that came out about Rife in nineteen thirty eight,

668
00:39:26,360 --> 00:39:29,920
Speaker 1: and in this he's it's interesting he stopped short of

669
00:39:29,960 --> 00:39:34,080
Speaker 1: saying I can cure cancer, but he says I can

670
00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:38,799
Speaker 1: devitalize disease organisms and living tissue with certain exceptions.

671
00:39:39,160 --> 00:39:40,440
Speaker 2: So it sounds like pr to me.

672
00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:43,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's like, I'm not saying this is a panacea

673
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:48,440
Speaker 1: for everything. But the problem with his beam ray, similar

674
00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:50,640
Speaker 1: to the problem with a lot of radionics experiments and

675
00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:53,640
Speaker 1: a lot of oregone experiments, was that people said it

676
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:58,720
Speaker 1: could not be independently replicated and independent researchers. Then throughout

677
00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:02,120
Speaker 1: the nineteen fifties I edited Rife. You can see his

678
00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 1: obituary in the Daily Californian when he passed away at

679
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:08,600
Speaker 1: the age of eighty three on August fifth, nineteen seventy one,

680
00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:13,319
Speaker 1: and according to the Daily Californian, Rife died penniless and

681
00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:18,840
Speaker 1: convinced that there was there was something rotten afoot in

682
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:19,600
Speaker 1: the Academy.

683
00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:22,840
Speaker 4: Hey, they published it in the much maligned Disgraced column

684
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:24,319
Speaker 4: in the obituaries that day.

685
00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:28,360
Speaker 1: Wow, whatever happened to the disgraced column?

686
00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:32,040
Speaker 4: And now people just it's not PC anymore. Yeah, Yeah,

687
00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:34,919
Speaker 4: I'm joking obviously, But it does seem like they don't

688
00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:38,200
Speaker 4: say things like that in people's obituaries anymore. No, they

689
00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:41,320
Speaker 4: don't even say like suicide. They don't say anything about

690
00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:44,080
Speaker 4: cause of death. It's all just the broad strokes of

691
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:46,360
Speaker 4: who they're you know, who left they left behind and

692
00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 4: all that stuff, which is fine. Sure, it means you

693
00:40:48,840 --> 00:40:50,279
Speaker 4: got to do your homework a little more. Back in

694
00:40:50,320 --> 00:40:51,800
Speaker 4: the day, he used to be able to find everything

695
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,680
Speaker 4: about about it by the dish from their obituary.

696
00:40:55,080 --> 00:40:57,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, there was a certain amount of schaden freud and

697
00:40:57,400 --> 00:40:58,440
Speaker 1: some of those earlier ones.

698
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:00,560
Speaker 4: I think so too better or worse today?

699
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:05,000
Speaker 2: What do you think, oh, bits in general, I'm gonna

700
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:08,800
Speaker 2: say better, Okay, Nope, nope, I'm gonna say worse. Nope,

701
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:14,480
Speaker 2: I'm gonna say neutral. I would say, well, here's the deal.

702
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:17,760
Speaker 2: Almost all obituaries are now written ahead of time unless

703
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:20,720
Speaker 2: it's you know, if it's a person of note, there's

704
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:24,319
Speaker 2: probably an a bit in one at least one major newspaper.

705
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:26,840
Speaker 2: If you are a person of note, that's like trigger

706
00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:29,719
Speaker 2: yeah exactly, and then some stuff will be added to it.

707
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:33,080
Speaker 2: So I would say it's probably more accurate. Obituaries are

708
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:36,600
Speaker 2: probably more accurate for at least people of whatever standing,

709
00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:38,480
Speaker 2: whatever metric we want to get polished.

710
00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:41,400
Speaker 4: Yeah, the final pr statement, how many times do you

711
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:45,200
Speaker 4: think they've updated Jimmy Carter's oh bit on file multiple.

712
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:48,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, every time that poor guy takes a fall. There

713
00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 1: is an editor in chief somewhere who like looks at

714
00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:55,880
Speaker 1: the USB drive or their dropbox or in my you know,

715
00:41:56,040 --> 00:41:59,840
Speaker 1: in in my head. What this editor does is they

716
00:42:00,400 --> 00:42:05,200
Speaker 1: have an alert whenever former President Carter is injured or something.

717
00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:09,279
Speaker 1: And then they look down at their at the like

718
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 1: the bottom third drawer in there, of course, in their

719
00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:16,239
Speaker 1: wooden news desk, and they open that bottom drawer just

720
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:18,680
Speaker 1: a little bit and then they pull out the they

721
00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:21,520
Speaker 1: pull out the one sheet for the obituary, and they

722
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:24,200
Speaker 1: read through it to see if they need to make

723
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:27,640
Speaker 1: any changes. It's probably like a mad libby blank space

724
00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:30,399
Speaker 1: right where they put what actually happened, and then they

725
00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:32,920
Speaker 1: just put it on their desk and they wait to

726
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:35,799
Speaker 1: see what happens. And then you know, the next thing,

727
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:39,440
Speaker 1: you know, next thing, you know, Jimmy is back building

728
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:43,280
Speaker 1: houses with habitat for humanity. So, with a sigh of relief,

729
00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:46,239
Speaker 1: the editor in chief takes that one sheet, they put

730
00:42:46,239 --> 00:42:48,160
Speaker 1: it back in that third drawer.

731
00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:50,160
Speaker 2: And then they pull out Dick Cheney's and put it

732
00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:51,799
Speaker 2: on there and they just hope do.

733
00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:52,799
Speaker 4: A voodoo incantation.

734
00:42:53,160 --> 00:42:58,000
Speaker 1: Right, It's I mean, it's true that it's true that

735
00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:01,800
Speaker 1: this obituary does not seem partly forgiving. In Rife's case,

736
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 1: he did blame the lack of recognition on an actual conspiracy.

737
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:10,000
Speaker 1: He said, the AMA, the American Medical Association, the Department

738
00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:12,600
Speaker 1: of Public Health, and other elements of what he called

739
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:17,399
Speaker 1: organized medicine like that nice dovetail with organized crime. Yeah,

740
00:43:17,520 --> 00:43:20,880
Speaker 1: he said they had brainwashed and intimidated his colleagues, and

741
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:25,359
Speaker 1: so he died seeing himself as a new Semmelweis who

742
00:43:25,480 --> 00:43:28,840
Speaker 1: is destined to be posthumously acknowledged for his work.

743
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:33,160
Speaker 2: Wow. I you know, I love that we brought it

744
00:43:33,160 --> 00:43:37,120
Speaker 2: back to civilvice already, because that is that is a feeling.

745
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:42,040
Speaker 2: I think, no matter what where the truth lies, with

746
00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:43,959
Speaker 2: a lot of these people we're going to be talking about,

747
00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 2: in these cures, like we've said before, nobody believes they're

748
00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:50,800
Speaker 2: a villain, right. I think a lot of these people

749
00:43:50,880 --> 00:43:54,799
Speaker 2: probably believed so deeply in their own version of a

750
00:43:54,880 --> 00:44:00,839
Speaker 2: cure that there was almost maybe again no matter if

751
00:44:00,840 --> 00:44:03,160
Speaker 2: it's true or not, there was magical thinking happening, I

752
00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:06,440
Speaker 2: want to say, in the in their own belief for

753
00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:07,120
Speaker 2: their cure.

754
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:11,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you know, and that's that's a fair point,

755
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:14,399
Speaker 1: and that a lot of people might not want to hear, right,

756
00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:16,839
Speaker 1: especially when you have the sunk costs of spending your

757
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:20,279
Speaker 1: entire life, your entire professional life, trying to pursue this

758
00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:24,040
Speaker 1: in what is a noble way. We can say Royal Rife,

759
00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:28,320
Speaker 1: at the very least was not some kind of flim

760
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:31,680
Speaker 1: flam man. He genuinely believed what he was doing. There

761
00:44:31,880 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 1: there's another example. Well, let's go away from a person

762
00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 1: for a second and let's look at an actual substance.

763
00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:42,160
Speaker 1: There's a thing called latrill, which was widely sold as

764
00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:46,040
Speaker 1: a cure for cancer until was banned by the FDA.

765
00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:49,600
Speaker 1: And when something is banned by the FDA, that gives

766
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 1: a lot of fuel to the fire for people who

767
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:54,960
Speaker 1: believe in suppressed medicine, because then you can say the

768
00:44:55,040 --> 00:44:58,239
Speaker 1: FDA banned it, not because it didn't work.

769
00:44:58,239 --> 00:44:59,400
Speaker 2: Because it was working.

770
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 4: Yeah, And the reason for this ban was that there

771
00:45:03,840 --> 00:45:07,040
Speaker 4: had been extensive clinical trials in the seventies and throughout

772
00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:11,360
Speaker 4: the eighties that proved it had zero effect on cancer

773
00:45:11,440 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 4: whatsoever except the delightful side effect of giving cyanide poisoning

774
00:45:17,480 --> 00:45:21,680
Speaker 4: to folks who attempted this remedy that often proved to

775
00:45:21,719 --> 00:45:26,359
Speaker 4: be fatal. So good on UFDA for taking poison off

776
00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:27,040
Speaker 4: the market, for.

777
00:45:27,040 --> 00:45:29,600
Speaker 1: Doing your job and way to go. But you can

778
00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:32,520
Speaker 1: still find it today. That's the thing about the substance.

779
00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:37,359
Speaker 1: It's not sold under that name. It's sometimes called amygdalen

780
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:39,799
Speaker 1: or vitamin B seventeen.

781
00:45:40,360 --> 00:45:42,760
Speaker 4: That sounds like a really intense vitamin.

782
00:45:42,840 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 1: It's a high class, sophisticated vitamin.

783
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:46,279
Speaker 4: Amygdalen is fun.

784
00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:49,959
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah, like the amygdala. I don't know why

785
00:45:50,040 --> 00:45:53,120
Speaker 2: I know a migdala is different from the medulla oblngata, but

786
00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:56,680
Speaker 2: I always think about that, and I always imagine the

787
00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:58,359
Speaker 2: professor from water Boy.

788
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:02,319
Speaker 1: We also learn about those pieces of the brain, and

789
00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:04,400
Speaker 1: usually in the same day in school.

790
00:46:04,640 --> 00:46:05,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's it.

791
00:46:06,520 --> 00:46:12,920
Speaker 1: So funny story about vitamin B seventeen. There's no such thing. Oh,

792
00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:15,240
Speaker 1: there's not a there's not a vitamin B seventeen.

793
00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:17,680
Speaker 4: How many b's are there? Sixteen?

794
00:46:17,920 --> 00:46:18,640
Speaker 2: No, I'm just kidding.

795
00:46:18,840 --> 00:46:21,960
Speaker 4: Twelve. I know there's twelve B twelve Is that the maximum?

796
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:25,120
Speaker 2: What about maximum B complex?

797
00:46:25,400 --> 00:46:26,759
Speaker 4: Reach peak B?

798
00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:30,239
Speaker 1: We've reached peak B. Finally, let's say there's B one,

799
00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:35,360
Speaker 1: B two, B three. It's definitely B six, B twelve.

800
00:46:37,000 --> 00:46:41,040
Speaker 1: I feel like, now we've got the bueller bueler.

801
00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:44,799
Speaker 4: Oh, No, funny thing is it's not completely sequential. Well,

802
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:49,040
Speaker 4: there's there's eight, right, you've got B one, B two,

803
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:51,839
Speaker 4: B three. Then there's no B four.

804
00:46:52,160 --> 00:46:55,160
Speaker 1: No, it's too funny. There's only they can't there's.

805
00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:57,480
Speaker 4: B six, which is bias N B seven fold eight,

806
00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:00,120
Speaker 4: and then we got no. B eight. Was as that's

807
00:47:00,120 --> 00:47:01,879
Speaker 4: too funny too, I think. So I think B four

808
00:47:01,960 --> 00:47:04,640
Speaker 4: and B eight are just too rife. B nine and

809
00:47:04,640 --> 00:47:06,520
Speaker 4: then we go all the way to twelve, shoot up

810
00:47:06,520 --> 00:47:09,600
Speaker 4: to twelve. BE nine is funny. That would be good.

811
00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:12,240
Speaker 4: Maybe that should have been the one that cured cancer. Right,

812
00:47:13,400 --> 00:47:15,800
Speaker 4: man renders cancer B nine.

813
00:47:16,080 --> 00:47:18,520
Speaker 1: We got here too late, you know what I mean?

814
00:47:18,600 --> 00:47:20,799
Speaker 4: At least for the naming conventions. We really could have

815
00:47:20,840 --> 00:47:22,759
Speaker 4: done some good with that. We could have whiteboarded the

816
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:24,120
Speaker 4: heck out of this man. Man.

817
00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 1: But the problem with this Brian Dunning writes a fairly

818
00:47:29,200 --> 00:47:33,879
Speaker 1: good summation of this over at Skeptoid is that this

819
00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:38,239
Speaker 1: B seventeen case is one of the only cases we

820
00:47:38,239 --> 00:47:41,720
Speaker 1: can find of a product being banned or suppressed, however

821
00:47:41,719 --> 00:47:44,480
Speaker 1: you want to describe it. By FDA, by Big Pharma.

822
00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 1: And that's because the product did have toxic effects on people.

823
00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 1: So that's a real case of a cancer treatment being

824
00:47:53,080 --> 00:47:55,680
Speaker 1: pulled from the market. It was not pulled from the market,

825
00:47:56,040 --> 00:47:59,600
Speaker 1: the story goes, because it was in any way effectively

826
00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:03,040
Speaker 1: treating case. Answer, it was just it was more effective

827
00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:04,640
Speaker 1: at giving people cyanide poisoning.

828
00:48:05,520 --> 00:48:06,080
Speaker 2: There you go.

829
00:48:06,239 --> 00:48:09,480
Speaker 4: I mean, what was the cyanide content of this of

830
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:11,480
Speaker 4: this drug? Twelve percent?

831
00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:11,759
Speaker 1: Nice?

832
00:48:11,800 --> 00:48:14,280
Speaker 2: Oh oh man. They should have known.

833
00:48:14,560 --> 00:48:16,920
Speaker 4: They're always trying to find new uses for cyanide if

834
00:48:16,920 --> 00:48:18,680
Speaker 4: it's gonna gets a bad rap, you know. Yeah, I

835
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:19,440
Speaker 4: think that's the thing.

836
00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:22,440
Speaker 1: Cyanide was the original corn. Right, everything has corn in

837
00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:25,319
Speaker 1: it now and it used to be sid Let's let's

838
00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:30,720
Speaker 1: go back to ko ko or sorry, yes, yeah, yeah, yes,

839
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:35,080
Speaker 1: yep ah. What is that guy's name? Jonathan Davis?

840
00:48:35,400 --> 00:48:37,720
Speaker 4: He plays the bagpipes and has his white boy dreads.

841
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:41,239
Speaker 2: I'm actually like working with him a little bit, like,

842
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:44,080
Speaker 2: you know, in a weird tertiary way.

843
00:48:44,239 --> 00:48:45,720
Speaker 4: Oh cool, are you guys, homies?

844
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:48,560
Speaker 2: No, but he's writing some music for a thing.

845
00:48:48,840 --> 00:48:50,640
Speaker 1: Oh nice, man, congratsund like this.

846
00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:54,160
Speaker 2: It's weird.

847
00:48:54,200 --> 00:48:57,799
Speaker 1: It sounds just like that who does the baselines? Is

848
00:48:57,840 --> 00:49:00,800
Speaker 1: it still the other I feel like, yeah, love those bases.

849
00:49:00,840 --> 00:49:03,320
Speaker 4: He always played his bass like pointing directly. It was

850
00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:08,000
Speaker 4: almost like a cello, very slippity slappity. So there's another

851
00:49:08,040 --> 00:49:10,120
Speaker 4: guy who is not a member of Korn. His name

852
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:13,399
Speaker 4: is Stanislav Brazenski. That would have been cool if there

853
00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:16,120
Speaker 4: was a guy in corn named Stanislav and he got

854
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:21,160
Speaker 4: Fieldy head Monkey, Jonathan Davis and stanislavs. Brazinski.

855
00:49:21,560 --> 00:49:26,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, this guy, this guy has a story. I think

856
00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:30,279
Speaker 2: I've mentioned this before, but I had a cousin out

857
00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:36,240
Speaker 2: in Texas who was working with Stanislav Brazinski, like directly

858
00:49:36,280 --> 00:49:41,840
Speaker 2: with the Foundation in some kind of respect. But she

859
00:49:41,960 --> 00:49:44,480
Speaker 2: wanted us actually to do an episode on this, but

860
00:49:44,560 --> 00:49:48,359
Speaker 2: I kind of turned it down because she was very

861
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:51,319
Speaker 2: adamant and I don't know her position today, but very

862
00:49:51,360 --> 00:49:54,560
Speaker 2: adamant that Stanislav did have the cure for cancer.

863
00:49:55,239 --> 00:50:00,680
Speaker 1: Yeah. There's a documentary about Brazinski called The Cancer Cover Up,

864
00:50:00,719 --> 00:50:03,719
Speaker 1: which is available for free on YouTube. This is not

865
00:50:03,719 --> 00:50:05,880
Speaker 1: an endorsement, but if you want to learn more about

866
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:09,040
Speaker 1: the story, I would check that out. With the knowledge

867
00:50:09,080 --> 00:50:12,320
Speaker 1: that if you couldn't tell from the title, the documentary

868
00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:17,160
Speaker 1: is very much of the opinion that Brazinski is actually

869
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:22,080
Speaker 1: treating cancer with success. His surfaces in the late nineteen

870
00:50:22,160 --> 00:50:26,240
Speaker 1: sixties when he proposes that there is a naturally occurring,

871
00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:30,520
Speaker 1: continuously functioning biochemical system in the body that is different

872
00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:33,520
Speaker 1: and distinct from the immune system, and that this other

873
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:37,799
Speaker 1: system can correct cancer cells by means of special chemicals

874
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:42,240
Speaker 1: that reprogram these cells. And this leads him to create

875
00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:44,320
Speaker 1: what is known as the Brazinski Clinic.

876
00:50:44,560 --> 00:50:48,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, cells that in particular, as we have discussed already,

877
00:50:48,719 --> 00:50:52,319
Speaker 2: the cancer cells, that something has gone haywire within their

878
00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:56,560
Speaker 2: genetics and they're just reproducing and in the inert in

879
00:50:56,600 --> 00:51:01,200
Speaker 2: weird ways and yet reproducing. Basically the stuff would stop

880
00:51:01,280 --> 00:51:04,640
Speaker 2: that turn them back into regular cells. So the clinic

881
00:51:04,680 --> 00:51:07,800
Speaker 2: itself that it's called the Brazenci Clinic. It was founded

882
00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:12,080
Speaker 2: in seventy six and it is in Texas. It just

883
00:51:12,160 --> 00:51:14,560
Speaker 2: kind of goes along with my cousin's story and perhaps

884
00:51:14,600 --> 00:51:17,120
Speaker 2: why she got interested in the first place. And it's

885
00:51:17,160 --> 00:51:21,720
Speaker 2: best known for this controversial therapy known as anti neoplastin

886
00:51:22,080 --> 00:51:27,279
Speaker 2: that sounds a little weird, anti neo plastin, and it

887
00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:30,959
Speaker 2: was developed by Brazinski in the nineteen seventies. Now this

888
00:51:31,239 --> 00:51:35,279
Speaker 2: is his term anti neoplastin for this group of Now

889
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:40,440
Speaker 2: get this urine derived peptides, okay, peptide derivatives as well

890
00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:44,400
Speaker 2: as mixtures that Brazinski named to use in his cancer treatment,

891
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:50,359
Speaker 2: so that those are the substances, the chemicals that would

892
00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:52,640
Speaker 2: get pumped into you if you were undergoing treatment.

893
00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:58,760
Speaker 1: And the clinic has been the focus of some ongoing criticism,

894
00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:03,880
Speaker 1: mainly because of the way this anti neoplastin therapy is promoted,

895
00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:08,600
Speaker 1: also because of the cost for people with cancer participating

896
00:52:08,800 --> 00:52:12,479
Speaker 1: in trials, and then of course there are some other

897
00:52:12,600 --> 00:52:15,759
Speaker 1: medical professionals who object to the way in which these

898
00:52:15,800 --> 00:52:18,840
Speaker 1: trials are run. There have also been legal cases brought

899
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 1: as a result of the sale of this therapy because

900
00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:25,400
Speaker 1: it doesn't have or it didn't have approval from the

901
00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:26,560
Speaker 1: Texas State Board.

902
00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:29,600
Speaker 2: There are also a lot of allegations that the numbers

903
00:52:29,719 --> 00:52:35,799
Speaker 2: are being manipulated about successful cases, survivors, how long, what

904
00:52:35,880 --> 00:52:39,439
Speaker 2: side effects there could be. There's a lot of I mean,

905
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:43,160
Speaker 2: it's what, there's a lot of controversy out there about this,

906
00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:46,200
Speaker 2: and it's certainly worth your time to look into if

907
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:48,759
Speaker 2: you're interested in this kind of thing. Again, we're not

908
00:52:48,800 --> 00:52:52,400
Speaker 2: trying to make anyone believe in or not believe in

909
00:52:52,440 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 2: any of these things. It's just kind of giving you

910
00:52:55,719 --> 00:52:56,400
Speaker 2: what we found.

911
00:52:56,719 --> 00:53:00,560
Speaker 1: And it's important to note examples like this. This is

912
00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:04,520
Speaker 1: just one of many examples, but it's important to note

913
00:53:04,600 --> 00:53:07,920
Speaker 1: this one in particular because it is an ongoing case,

914
00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:10,200
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. It's not something from the

915
00:53:10,239 --> 00:53:12,160
Speaker 1: eighteen hundreds or the nineteen thirties.

916
00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:15,279
Speaker 2: If you go to the website quackwatch dot org, you

917
00:53:15,280 --> 00:53:20,080
Speaker 2: can read a whole bunch about Stanislav Brazinski and the

918
00:53:20,120 --> 00:53:24,160
Speaker 2: treatments and what's supposed to be happening the claims. There

919
00:53:24,200 --> 00:53:26,640
Speaker 2: have been several published clinical studies that you can actually

920
00:53:26,719 --> 00:53:31,399
Speaker 2: read parts of in there. We would highly recommend it absolutely.

921
00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:36,640
Speaker 1: There is one other example then we have to hit

922
00:53:36,680 --> 00:53:40,520
Speaker 1: today because many of our fellow listeners wrote into us

923
00:53:40,719 --> 00:53:45,080
Speaker 1: recently about this case. And this case comes to us

924
00:53:46,400 --> 00:53:49,800
Speaker 1: through strange avenue. It's the story of a man born

925
00:53:49,920 --> 00:53:55,000
Speaker 1: Alfredo Darrington Bowman, but perhaps better known today as doctor Seby.

926
00:53:55,120 --> 00:53:58,440
Speaker 1: I don't know, guys, I don't know why, but my

927
00:53:58,520 --> 00:54:00,839
Speaker 1: cadence keeps falling into this odd ser Lean thing.

928
00:54:00,880 --> 00:54:01,120
Speaker 4: Dude.

929
00:54:01,120 --> 00:54:05,120
Speaker 1: I just was about to say, yeah, yet.

930
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:06,840
Speaker 2: What says doctor sebt sippy?

931
00:54:07,120 --> 00:54:09,400
Speaker 1: It's always been my dream to be that guy you

932
00:54:09,480 --> 00:54:11,600
Speaker 1: already are you are?

933
00:54:12,120 --> 00:54:14,680
Speaker 4: Uh tell us about We actually had a very interesting

934
00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:16,719
Speaker 4: uh and it's funny. It was deja vu for me

935
00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:19,200
Speaker 4: at this point. Matt and I and a ride from

936
00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:22,560
Speaker 4: Lax to our hotel on this last trip we all

937
00:54:22,600 --> 00:54:25,839
Speaker 4: took to la we got into the conversation. But while

938
00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:27,160
Speaker 4: we were there, and so we had this you know,

939
00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:31,760
Speaker 4: conspiracy open minded critical thing approach to conspiracy theories podcasts,

940
00:54:31,760 --> 00:54:34,920
Speaker 4: just how we tend to phrase it. And he asked

941
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:38,840
Speaker 4: if we had heard of doctor Sebbi, and he seemed

942
00:54:38,880 --> 00:54:42,520
Speaker 4: to really stand behind him very much. And I actually, funny,

943
00:54:42,640 --> 00:54:47,160
Speaker 4: had a similar conversation with another lift driver years ago

944
00:54:47,560 --> 00:54:51,319
Speaker 4: and he was like preaching the gospel of Sebi to me. Well,

945
00:54:51,360 --> 00:54:52,839
Speaker 4: I had not heard of the guy at all, but

946
00:54:53,239 --> 00:54:54,759
Speaker 4: now now I know a little bit about him.

947
00:54:54,760 --> 00:54:56,399
Speaker 2: Why do you think we're talking about him right now?

948
00:54:56,880 --> 00:55:00,120
Speaker 2: Because of that? Because of that ride, buddy, So uh, well,

949
00:55:00,160 --> 00:55:01,439
Speaker 2: we'll tell us a little bit.

950
00:55:01,320 --> 00:55:05,120
Speaker 4: About doctor Selby. Absolutely. This comes from a healthline dot

951
00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:08,879
Speaker 4: com article that describes doctor Sebbi as a gentleman who

952
00:55:08,920 --> 00:55:13,160
Speaker 4: claimed that his diet could cure everything from AIDS to

953
00:55:13,239 --> 00:55:17,000
Speaker 4: sickle cell anemia, to leukemia and lupus. But he was

954
00:55:17,040 --> 00:55:20,800
Speaker 4: sued in nineteen ninety three and was ordered to stop

955
00:55:20,960 --> 00:55:22,239
Speaker 4: making these claims.

956
00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:26,000
Speaker 2: But that is it's not the first time that he

957
00:55:26,080 --> 00:55:28,800
Speaker 2: had to go to court with these kinds of things,

958
00:55:28,840 --> 00:55:31,680
Speaker 2: But that nineteen ninety three to one is important again

959
00:55:31,719 --> 00:55:33,560
Speaker 2: because he had to stop saying those things.

960
00:55:33,600 --> 00:55:36,920
Speaker 4: He absolutely had to stop. He was he was required

961
00:55:36,960 --> 00:55:40,759
Speaker 4: by law to cease promotion of his diet because it's

962
00:55:40,760 --> 00:55:44,360
Speaker 4: literally what we would call maybe a fad diet for

963
00:55:44,400 --> 00:55:50,760
Speaker 4: all intents and purposes, involving things like vegetables, fruits, grains, nuts, seeds, oils,

964
00:55:50,760 --> 00:55:55,239
Speaker 4: and herbs, things that he would particularly curate animal products

965
00:55:55,760 --> 00:55:58,759
Speaker 4: big no no, and SEBBI basically promote well, he was

966
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:01,560
Speaker 4: essentially promoting a vegan, yes.

967
00:56:02,000 --> 00:56:06,400
Speaker 2: But along with herb like some supplemental or some herbal

968
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:11,239
Speaker 2: supplements and some other supplements. I would say that they

969
00:56:11,680 --> 00:56:14,640
Speaker 2: it's not that they weren't allowed to continue promoting it,

970
00:56:14,880 --> 00:56:18,160
Speaker 2: you know, or using this diet or selling this kind

971
00:56:18,200 --> 00:56:18,440
Speaker 2: of thing.

972
00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:20,680
Speaker 4: It was just that can't make those claims set in

973
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:24,080
Speaker 4: order to promote it. Right, Yes, yes, it's the same

974
00:56:24,160 --> 00:56:25,960
Speaker 4: kind of stuff that Alex Joneses got in trouble for.

975
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:29,640
Speaker 4: I believe with the bone, yeah, the bone broths and

976
00:56:29,640 --> 00:56:32,960
Speaker 4: all that stuff. I don't think he's allowed to say

977
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:35,040
Speaker 4: some of the things that he once said in terms

978
00:56:35,080 --> 00:56:38,200
Speaker 4: of how those things can you know, prevent you from

979
00:56:38,280 --> 00:56:41,200
Speaker 4: getting irradiated or whatever you know in the apocalypse.

980
00:56:42,320 --> 00:56:45,479
Speaker 2: Here's, in my opinion, one of the reasons why doctor

981
00:56:45,520 --> 00:56:50,800
Speaker 2: Sibby was so successful. It's because the the methodology about

982
00:56:50,840 --> 00:56:55,120
Speaker 2: why these supplements and why this diet worked. It feels

983
00:56:55,200 --> 00:56:58,800
Speaker 2: really simple, and if you're anybody, you can hear someone

984
00:56:58,840 --> 00:57:01,880
Speaker 2: describe this and say, oh, okay, yeah, I could get that.

985
00:57:01,920 --> 00:57:04,839
Speaker 2: I could get behind that. And the whole concept here

986
00:57:04,920 --> 00:57:07,839
Speaker 2: is that all illness within the human body comes from

987
00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:11,840
Speaker 2: high levels of acidity, which then results in mucus production

988
00:57:12,200 --> 00:57:14,400
Speaker 2: and the mucus depending on what part of the body

989
00:57:14,480 --> 00:57:18,040
Speaker 2: is ill. Let's say you've got a bum elbow or something,

990
00:57:18,120 --> 00:57:22,000
Speaker 2: you've got some arthritis in there. Doctor SEBI's belief is

991
00:57:22,040 --> 00:57:24,600
Speaker 2: that there's mucus build up in there from high acidity,

992
00:57:25,000 --> 00:57:28,440
Speaker 2: and his diet is going to be alkaline and reduce

993
00:57:28,480 --> 00:57:32,440
Speaker 2: the acidity and basically get your body back in harmony

994
00:57:32,720 --> 00:57:34,800
Speaker 2: and then your mucus will go away and your illness.

995
00:57:36,080 --> 00:57:43,200
Speaker 4: Does this sound eerily familiar to the medieval quackery of humors, right,

996
00:57:43,280 --> 00:57:46,800
Speaker 4: and and phlam and mucous spile? It was, It was.

997
00:57:46,880 --> 00:57:50,680
Speaker 4: It was all related to the balance of these bodily fluids, right, Yeah.

998
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:54,240
Speaker 2: Is that it certainly comes from an older belief system.

999
00:57:54,400 --> 00:57:56,720
Speaker 1: It does come from an older belief system, but so

1000
00:57:56,920 --> 00:58:01,800
Speaker 1: does the medieval belief in us, the idea that one

1001
00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:03,240
Speaker 1: could be melancholic.

1002
00:58:03,720 --> 00:58:05,320
Speaker 4: Right, I have a great book.

1003
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:07,560
Speaker 1: On that if you guys. Ever, never mind, never mind,

1004
00:58:07,600 --> 00:58:09,640
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna go back and read it. The

1005
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:12,720
Speaker 1: illustrations great. This also, yeah, okay, I'll bring it in.

1006
00:58:13,200 --> 00:58:16,280
Speaker 1: This is also back when one of the forefronts of

1007
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:21,320
Speaker 1: European medicine was to have people pee in glass or

1008
00:58:21,320 --> 00:58:25,760
Speaker 1: transparent beakers and then to hold the urine up to

1009
00:58:25,840 --> 00:58:29,800
Speaker 1: the light and guess what was wrong with the person

1010
00:58:29,960 --> 00:58:33,000
Speaker 1: Based on the interpretations of the europe.

1011
00:58:32,840 --> 00:58:35,240
Speaker 4: Do it like a wine tasting or you switch it around.

1012
00:58:36,080 --> 00:58:38,440
Speaker 1: There was some sniffing, for sure. Yeah, okay, there was

1013
00:58:38,480 --> 00:58:39,400
Speaker 1: some sniffing.

1014
00:58:41,880 --> 00:58:43,640
Speaker 4: Disgusting sound because I'm really sorry.

1015
00:58:43,520 --> 00:58:45,640
Speaker 1: And I don't know how wide spread asparagus was.

1016
00:58:47,520 --> 00:58:50,080
Speaker 4: You know, just not to de real. But not everyone.

1017
00:58:50,320 --> 00:58:53,840
Speaker 4: Not everyone's pee will smell funny when they eat asparagus.

1018
00:58:53,880 --> 00:58:55,840
Speaker 1: It's true. It's kind of like the cilantro things.

1019
00:58:56,000 --> 00:58:58,920
Speaker 2: Or is it that you can't smell it? That's what

1020
00:58:58,960 --> 00:59:01,000
Speaker 2: I'm saying. Not every can smell it. I don't know.

1021
00:59:01,440 --> 00:59:03,320
Speaker 2: Look man science out on that one.

1022
00:59:03,600 --> 00:59:07,000
Speaker 1: Let us know, folks, Let us know. I know there

1023
00:59:07,000 --> 00:59:09,720
Speaker 1: are several people who listened to this show for years

1024
00:59:09,760 --> 00:59:13,400
Speaker 1: wondering when we were going to finally address the elephant

1025
00:59:13,400 --> 00:59:16,800
Speaker 1: in the room of asparagus and urine. So there you are, folks,

1026
00:59:16,840 --> 00:59:18,960
Speaker 1: that's we finally got around to it.

1027
00:59:19,200 --> 00:59:22,400
Speaker 4: There's a brain stuff about that. I know. I'm josh

1028
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:24,800
Speaker 4: there should be Josh. I think it's a Joshua.

1029
00:59:24,880 --> 00:59:28,080
Speaker 2: I know. There you go. So let's uh, let's just

1030
00:59:28,120 --> 00:59:29,920
Speaker 2: get back to Sebbi really fast, because a lot of

1031
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:32,720
Speaker 2: the criticism ends up, well, not a lot of the criticism,

1032
00:59:32,760 --> 00:59:37,960
Speaker 2: but there is criticism to be uh to be levied

1033
00:59:38,080 --> 00:59:42,800
Speaker 2: at doctor Sebbe because the claim basically here is that

1034
00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:45,920
Speaker 2: you can you can heal yourself from literally anything from

1035
00:59:45,960 --> 00:59:48,360
Speaker 2: AIDS to cancer to whatever it is if you follow

1036
00:59:48,400 --> 00:59:51,600
Speaker 2: this diet. Consistently for the rest of your life and

1037
00:59:51,640 --> 00:59:54,000
Speaker 2: it will never come back and you'll be.

1038
00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:54,520
Speaker 4: Good to go.

1039
00:59:54,760 --> 00:59:56,160
Speaker 1: Let your food be your medicine.

1040
00:59:56,320 --> 00:59:59,760
Speaker 2: Yes, And it's again it's one of those things where

1041
00:59:59,760 --> 01:00:02,520
Speaker 2: it was links to profit because there was a company.

1042
01:00:02,600 --> 01:00:04,080
Speaker 2: There is a company right now that you can go

1043
01:00:04,120 --> 01:00:08,440
Speaker 2: to the website for. It's a doctor Sebbi's Sell Food.

1044
01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:14,040
Speaker 2: Doctor SEBI's Sell Food. It offers supplements meant to quote

1045
01:00:14,160 --> 01:00:17,760
Speaker 2: expedite the healing process if you're following along with the diet.

1046
01:00:17,800 --> 01:00:19,480
Speaker 4: And you can check this out for yourself at doctor

1047
01:00:19,560 --> 01:00:24,160
Speaker 4: sebissellfood dot com where he has Nutritional Guy a blog.

1048
01:00:25,160 --> 01:00:28,440
Speaker 4: You know, his whole methodology is his bio and all

1049
01:00:28,480 --> 01:00:30,800
Speaker 4: this stuff. And of course you can purchase these things.

1050
01:00:30,840 --> 01:00:34,000
Speaker 4: And I believe the the basic pack in question here

1051
01:00:34,120 --> 01:00:37,120
Speaker 4: is what like seven hundred and fifty bucks. The advanced package, Oh,

1052
01:00:37,160 --> 01:00:39,560
Speaker 4: the advanced pack, so you can get in for a

1053
01:00:39,560 --> 01:00:41,520
Speaker 4: little you can get in, you know, for maybe a

1054
01:00:41,520 --> 01:00:42,160
Speaker 4: couple hundred.

1055
01:00:43,240 --> 01:00:43,439
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1056
01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:45,120
Speaker 2: I think there's a couple on there that are like

1057
01:00:45,160 --> 01:00:46,760
Speaker 2: in the two hundred and three hundred dollars range.

1058
01:00:46,880 --> 01:00:49,080
Speaker 1: And I'm sure if you did research you could find

1059
01:00:49,200 --> 01:00:53,320
Speaker 1: independent suppliers of the different substances offered in the pack

1060
01:00:53,400 --> 01:00:56,000
Speaker 1: and maybe save money. I'm I haven't done the math

1061
01:00:56,040 --> 01:00:56,280
Speaker 1: on it.

1062
01:00:56,360 --> 01:00:59,920
Speaker 4: No, Well, actually, the Advance pack is sort of the basic.

1063
01:01:00,520 --> 01:01:03,920
Speaker 4: Then there's an all inclusive pack that's fifteen hundred dollars.

1064
01:01:04,120 --> 01:01:06,240
Speaker 1: So there's Advance is the lowest tier.

1065
01:01:06,480 --> 01:01:10,480
Speaker 4: That's the lowest tier of like a whole collection of stuff.

1066
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:14,440
Speaker 4: Then you can buy individual you know, remedies or whatever.

1067
01:01:14,560 --> 01:01:16,840
Speaker 4: There's something called the Booster Package, which is five hundred

1068
01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:19,000
Speaker 4: and seventy five dollars, and you can buy you know,

1069
01:01:19,040 --> 01:01:22,560
Speaker 4: individual things from everything from bromide plus capsules for thirty

1070
01:01:22,560 --> 01:01:27,920
Speaker 4: bucks to doctor SEBI's blood pressure balance herbal tea sixteen bucks.

1071
01:01:27,480 --> 01:01:27,560
Speaker 1: Ye.

1072
01:01:28,520 --> 01:01:31,440
Speaker 2: The point here is that it's not cheap to write

1073
01:01:31,560 --> 01:01:33,800
Speaker 2: to get in on this kind of diet if you're

1074
01:01:33,800 --> 01:01:36,600
Speaker 2: going to follow it and take the supplements provided by

1075
01:01:36,600 --> 01:01:37,120
Speaker 2: the company.

1076
01:01:37,240 --> 01:01:42,280
Speaker 1: However, many people will swear that the program has healed

1077
01:01:42,320 --> 01:01:47,800
Speaker 1: them one ailment or another. At the time of reporting,

1078
01:01:48,440 --> 01:01:52,560
Speaker 1: as far as we could find, no universally acknowledged scientific

1079
01:01:52,600 --> 01:01:56,280
Speaker 1: studies supported these claims. They still live squarely in the

1080
01:01:56,320 --> 01:02:00,520
Speaker 1: realm of the anecdote, which doesn't make them false. Means

1081
01:02:00,560 --> 01:02:03,240
Speaker 1: that at this point they have not held up to

1082
01:02:03,480 --> 01:02:08,160
Speaker 1: scientific rigor. That doesn't mean that there's no sense to it,

1083
01:02:08,520 --> 01:02:11,760
Speaker 1: because clearly some people believe that it has worked.

1084
01:02:11,880 --> 01:02:14,040
Speaker 4: No, And you're absolutely right, Ben, But I will say

1085
01:02:14,040 --> 01:02:16,360
Speaker 4: I think it's a little unusual and not unusual at all,

1086
01:02:16,400 --> 01:02:19,000
Speaker 4: maybe on the nose that the labels on all these

1087
01:02:19,000 --> 01:02:22,000
Speaker 4: products literally look like the kind of labels you would

1088
01:02:22,040 --> 01:02:24,840
Speaker 4: have seen on the snake oil stuff sold out of

1089
01:02:24,960 --> 01:02:28,120
Speaker 4: carts back in the olden days. You know, it's like

1090
01:02:28,120 --> 01:02:30,680
Speaker 4: an old font and says doctor Sebbi is sell food,

1091
01:02:30,720 --> 01:02:32,440
Speaker 4: and like it's got a picture of him in the middle,

1092
01:02:32,720 --> 01:02:35,200
Speaker 4: and it's like tooth powder, you know. I mean, it's

1093
01:02:35,240 --> 01:02:37,840
Speaker 4: like even the names of them. There's like there's something

1094
01:02:37,880 --> 01:02:40,080
Speaker 4: called eye wash and green food.

1095
01:02:40,560 --> 01:02:43,840
Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm just in my opinion, it's as close as

1096
01:02:43,880 --> 01:02:46,920
Speaker 2: you can get to making it look like medicine or

1097
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:50,040
Speaker 2: having the mind go to medicine without claiming that it's

1098
01:02:50,040 --> 01:02:51,120
Speaker 2: actually medicine.

1099
01:02:50,800 --> 01:02:54,640
Speaker 1: Because the FDA will pop you for that. There's also

1100
01:02:54,840 --> 01:02:59,800
Speaker 1: a conspiracy related to doctor sebb that extends beyond his

1101
01:03:00,160 --> 01:03:04,480
Speaker 1: claims to cure cancer, and that is the conspiracy surrounding

1102
01:03:04,560 --> 01:03:07,360
Speaker 1: his passing. Here's how a lot of people found out

1103
01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:11,520
Speaker 1: about doctor Sebbe. It was not through seeking cancer treatments.

1104
01:03:12,000 --> 01:03:15,440
Speaker 1: It was through the interest of the late emce and

1105
01:03:15,680 --> 01:03:19,520
Speaker 1: activist Nipsey Hustle, whom some of our fellow hip hop

1106
01:03:19,560 --> 01:03:22,840
Speaker 1: fans may be familiar with. Hustle, at the time of

1107
01:03:22,880 --> 01:03:26,440
Speaker 1: his own death, was reportedly working on a documentary about

1108
01:03:26,520 --> 01:03:30,720
Speaker 1: doctor Sebbe, and we found a quote from him where

1109
01:03:30,760 --> 01:03:32,880
Speaker 1: he seems to confirm this. He says, I'm working on

1110
01:03:32,960 --> 01:03:36,640
Speaker 1: doing a documentary on the trial in the nineteen eighties,

1111
01:03:37,040 --> 01:03:39,480
Speaker 1: and Hussell says, when doctor Sebbe went to trial in

1112
01:03:39,560 --> 01:03:43,120
Speaker 1: New York, it was because he published in a newspaper

1113
01:03:43,160 --> 01:03:46,760
Speaker 1: that he had cured aids. He beat that case, says Nipsey,

1114
01:03:46,800 --> 01:03:49,000
Speaker 1: but nobody talks about it. I think the story is

1115
01:03:49,040 --> 01:03:53,640
Speaker 1: important if you look into the case. The way that

1116
01:03:53,720 --> 01:03:58,240
Speaker 1: the events broke down was that he was charged in

1117
01:03:58,360 --> 01:04:03,960
Speaker 1: eighty seven with practicing medicine without a license, but he

1118
01:04:04,080 --> 01:04:08,080
Speaker 1: was acquitted because jurors claim the state had failed to

1119
01:04:08,120 --> 01:04:10,680
Speaker 1: show he made an actual medical diagnosis.

1120
01:04:10,880 --> 01:04:14,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, and a claim that he was selling the cure

1121
01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:16,959
Speaker 2: necessarily because it was more about diet right.

1122
01:04:17,400 --> 01:04:22,560
Speaker 1: And after winning that case in the nineteen eighties, he

1123
01:04:22,640 --> 01:04:25,680
Speaker 1: went on to work with various celebrities who believed in

1124
01:04:25,720 --> 01:04:30,040
Speaker 1: his cause. Now, just I'm sure many of us listening

1125
01:04:30,120 --> 01:04:32,520
Speaker 1: know this, but we have to emphasize it. Just because

1126
01:04:32,520 --> 01:04:35,360
Speaker 1: someone happens to be famous does not in any way

1127
01:04:35,440 --> 01:04:38,200
Speaker 1: make them smarter than you. It doesn't make them dumber

1128
01:04:38,240 --> 01:04:41,480
Speaker 1: than you, It doesn't make them special in particular. It

1129
01:04:41,640 --> 01:04:43,560
Speaker 1: just makes them a person, right.

1130
01:04:43,960 --> 01:04:46,840
Speaker 2: And they probably have a better credit card than you.

1131
01:04:47,200 --> 01:04:48,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, they probably have a better credit rating.

1132
01:04:48,960 --> 01:04:51,400
Speaker 4: Yeah, shows really heavy slate ones.

1133
01:04:51,480 --> 01:04:53,600
Speaker 2: No, I didn't say credit rating, I say credit card.

1134
01:04:53,920 --> 01:04:58,920
Speaker 1: Okay, the blacks, Yeah, what the heft. So people like

1135
01:04:58,960 --> 01:05:02,960
Speaker 1: Michael Jackson's and Segal, Eddie Murphy, John Travolta, Lisa Leftie

1136
01:05:03,000 --> 01:05:09,000
Speaker 1: Lopez all swore by doctor Sebi. Lisa Lopez said, I

1137
01:05:09,080 --> 01:05:11,880
Speaker 1: know a man who's been curing aid since nineteen eighty seven.

1138
01:05:12,000 --> 01:05:16,240
Speaker 1: In her vociferous public support of the guy. But shortly afterwards,

1139
01:05:16,320 --> 01:05:19,400
Speaker 1: she was run off the road and died after leaving

1140
01:05:19,440 --> 01:05:23,840
Speaker 1: Sebbi's Usha healing village in Honduras. And some people will

1141
01:05:23,880 --> 01:05:26,320
Speaker 1: tell you, people who believe there's more to the story,

1142
01:05:27,040 --> 01:05:29,800
Speaker 1: they'll tell you that she was also targeted because she

1143
01:05:29,840 --> 01:05:34,320
Speaker 1: had been spreading his healing message. He's also reputed to

1144
01:05:34,360 --> 01:05:38,080
Speaker 1: have worked with Michael Jackson to treat painkiller addiction, and

1145
01:05:38,200 --> 01:05:42,440
Speaker 1: Sebbi later sued Michael Jackson for almost four hundred grand

1146
01:05:42,800 --> 01:05:47,000
Speaker 1: in unpaid bills and then six hundred something in lost revenue.

1147
01:05:47,160 --> 01:05:52,240
Speaker 1: The case was dismissed in twenty fifteen, and a year later,

1148
01:05:52,760 --> 01:05:56,120
Speaker 1: doctor Sebi dies. He's eighty two years old. He's in

1149
01:05:56,160 --> 01:05:59,920
Speaker 1: a jail cell in Honduras. He was arrested for carrying

1150
01:06:00,760 --> 01:06:02,040
Speaker 1: stacks and stacks of cash.

1151
01:06:02,200 --> 01:06:05,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was I think thirty something thousand and forty

1152
01:06:05,600 --> 01:06:10,600
Speaker 2: fifty something thousand in another case. And he couldn't he

1153
01:06:10,600 --> 01:06:13,120
Speaker 2: couldn't say where it came from. That was the big issue.

1154
01:06:13,120 --> 01:06:15,760
Speaker 2: He's like, I just have this money. And he ended

1155
01:06:15,800 --> 01:06:18,920
Speaker 2: up in jail and then got pneumonia and passed away.

1156
01:06:20,320 --> 01:06:24,640
Speaker 1: Or was it pneumonia? Yeah, it's officially pneumonia. But people

1157
01:06:24,680 --> 01:06:29,360
Speaker 1: who believe that the academy or big Pharma was suppressing

1158
01:06:29,440 --> 01:06:32,400
Speaker 1: his work will say that he was murdered by the

1159
01:06:32,480 --> 01:06:35,880
Speaker 1: medical industry to again silence his message.

1160
01:06:36,320 --> 01:06:41,440
Speaker 2: Here's the deal. If big Pharma was going to take

1161
01:06:41,480 --> 01:06:46,200
Speaker 2: out doctor Sebbi, their best chances were in the eighties,

1162
01:06:46,240 --> 01:06:49,440
Speaker 2: probably or prior to the eighties before it was a

1163
01:06:49,480 --> 01:06:52,160
Speaker 2: big deal, and then they had all the way up

1164
01:06:52,200 --> 01:06:54,880
Speaker 2: to twenty sixteen to get the job done. And if

1165
01:06:54,880 --> 01:06:58,920
Speaker 2: they did in fact murder him, just the amount of

1166
01:06:58,960 --> 01:07:02,800
Speaker 2: time and effort, it just doesn't make sense to me.

1167
01:07:03,040 --> 01:07:07,000
Speaker 4: I seriously, you're saying they would have known the efficacy

1168
01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:11,400
Speaker 4: of his claims at earlier and then would have acted accordingly,

1169
01:07:11,440 --> 01:07:13,200
Speaker 4: as opposed to waiting until he got famous.

1170
01:07:13,240 --> 01:07:16,080
Speaker 2: Well, or maybe they couldn't take him out because he

1171
01:07:16,200 --> 01:07:18,720
Speaker 2: was too hot at the time. Whatever. I just I'm

1172
01:07:18,760 --> 01:07:21,840
Speaker 2: trying to gain I'm trying to go down the It

1173
01:07:21,880 --> 01:07:24,040
Speaker 2: doesn't feel like he got killed to me. But that's

1174
01:07:24,080 --> 01:07:24,720
Speaker 2: just my opinion.

1175
01:07:24,960 --> 01:07:29,080
Speaker 1: So with this, what we see is this, these are

1176
01:07:29,240 --> 01:07:35,880
Speaker 1: enormously contentious issues, and there's another conspiracy or a theory

1177
01:07:36,160 --> 01:07:39,680
Speaker 1: that gets ignored, that gets lost in the wash here

1178
01:07:40,040 --> 01:07:43,320
Speaker 1: or in the churn of different narratives, and it's this.

1179
01:07:43,400 --> 01:07:46,200
Speaker 1: It's something that's well, there are two, I would argue

1180
01:07:46,600 --> 01:07:49,560
Speaker 1: both are a little more plausible, and one is disturbing

1181
01:07:49,640 --> 01:07:53,200
Speaker 1: and one is incredibly disturbing. The first is this that

1182
01:07:53,280 --> 01:07:56,320
Speaker 1: there's a huge imbalance between private and public funding of

1183
01:07:56,520 --> 01:07:59,280
Speaker 1: cancer research, and that leads critics to say you know,

1184
01:07:59,360 --> 01:08:03,440
Speaker 1: big pharma may actually be slowing down the search for

1185
01:08:03,520 --> 01:08:06,840
Speaker 1: a cure to cancer. The conspiracy here is not that

1186
01:08:06,920 --> 01:08:11,040
Speaker 1: it exists, but that searching for it is being stymied

1187
01:08:11,240 --> 01:08:14,880
Speaker 1: because these are profit driven entities, and they focus their

1188
01:08:14,920 --> 01:08:19,880
Speaker 1: money on developing patentable single drug treatments and getting someone

1189
01:08:19,880 --> 01:08:23,040
Speaker 1: hooked for life on a pill instead of testing combination

1190
01:08:23,120 --> 01:08:27,559
Speaker 1: therapies or exploring a way to repurpose cheaper generic drugs.

1191
01:08:27,840 --> 01:08:30,000
Speaker 1: And if that's the case, then we're looking at something

1192
01:08:30,040 --> 01:08:34,000
Speaker 1: pretty depressing. It's less of a clever conspiracy by some

1193
01:08:34,040 --> 01:08:36,519
Speaker 1: shadowy cabal, and it's more like a bunch of people

1194
01:08:36,560 --> 01:08:39,960
Speaker 1: bumbling for short term profits because the long term stuff

1195
01:08:40,160 --> 01:08:43,639
Speaker 1: just won't deliver what the stockholders want. The other one

1196
01:08:44,080 --> 01:08:46,200
Speaker 1: and this one we save to the end because I

1197
01:08:46,200 --> 01:08:49,400
Speaker 1: think it's by far the most frightening. What if there

1198
01:08:49,439 --> 01:08:52,400
Speaker 1: is no conspiracy, What if there just is no cure.

1199
01:08:52,880 --> 01:08:57,200
Speaker 1: What if all these things just don't work. That's a

1200
01:08:57,240 --> 01:08:58,960
Speaker 1: world that people don't want to live in.

1201
01:09:00,040 --> 01:09:02,320
Speaker 4: And if anything bad, I mean, the thing that points

1202
01:09:02,360 --> 01:09:05,599
Speaker 4: to that as being the most believable option is the

1203
01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:08,800
Speaker 4: fact that these billionaires die of cancer.

1204
01:09:09,880 --> 01:09:11,920
Speaker 1: And that's hard to walk away from. That's hard to

1205
01:09:11,960 --> 01:09:13,800
Speaker 1: square if any of this stuff is true.

1206
01:09:13,880 --> 01:09:16,639
Speaker 4: I mean, well, I suppose you could take the Epstein

1207
01:09:16,720 --> 01:09:19,559
Speaker 4: approach and you know, like, oh, he died, he's dead,

1208
01:09:19,560 --> 01:09:22,400
Speaker 4: and he died of suicide, and now he's maybe actually

1209
01:09:22,439 --> 01:09:25,920
Speaker 4: secretly living on an island. Perhaps some of these billionaires

1210
01:09:27,000 --> 01:09:29,120
Speaker 4: made it look like they died of cancer when in

1211
01:09:29,160 --> 01:09:31,080
Speaker 4: fact they did receive the care and are now living

1212
01:09:31,120 --> 01:09:33,519
Speaker 4: off the grid. Who knows, how will we prove it.

1213
01:09:33,560 --> 01:09:33,920
Speaker 1: I don't know.

1214
01:09:34,000 --> 01:09:35,320
Speaker 4: I'm just again thought experiment.

1215
01:09:35,479 --> 01:09:39,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And that's the thing. So now we wrap up,

1216
01:09:40,120 --> 01:09:42,760
Speaker 1: and of course we don't have an answer, but this

1217
01:09:42,960 --> 01:09:46,840
Speaker 1: is a huge conversation that it is going to be

1218
01:09:47,320 --> 01:09:50,360
Speaker 1: continuing in some form or another, very very likely for

1219
01:09:50,360 --> 01:09:52,240
Speaker 1: the rest of our lives, unless there is some sort

1220
01:09:52,240 --> 01:09:55,519
Speaker 1: of panas Head discovered. Let's ask ourselves the case for

1221
01:09:55,760 --> 01:09:58,400
Speaker 1: or against conspiracy. So people who argue there is a

1222
01:09:58,439 --> 01:10:01,320
Speaker 1: conspiracy are going to say that it's a profit motive.

1223
01:10:01,520 --> 01:10:03,880
Speaker 1: There may be some Malthusian argument and they are saying

1224
01:10:03,880 --> 01:10:07,040
Speaker 1: that cancer helps cull the population. But cancer takes a

1225
01:10:07,040 --> 01:10:10,200
Speaker 1: while to kill people when it is fatal. Then there's

1226
01:10:10,280 --> 01:10:14,080
Speaker 1: the argument against the conspiracy, which also hinges on profit.

1227
01:10:14,360 --> 01:10:19,400
Speaker 1: Why would a profit motivated entity not instantly jump on

1228
01:10:19,439 --> 01:10:23,160
Speaker 1: the ability to be the exclusive source of a cancer

1229
01:10:23,360 --> 01:10:25,679
Speaker 1: cure that is hand over fist money.

1230
01:10:25,880 --> 01:10:28,599
Speaker 2: And it also would allow those people that you cured

1231
01:10:28,840 --> 01:10:32,479
Speaker 2: to then take whatever other drugs that you're selling that

1232
01:10:32,560 --> 01:10:33,960
Speaker 2: they might need in their lives.

1233
01:10:34,320 --> 01:10:37,439
Speaker 1: Right, yeah, exactly. And there's one thing for sure as

1234
01:10:37,439 --> 01:10:40,400
Speaker 1: we end today, several of the alternative cancer cures being

1235
01:10:40,400 --> 01:10:43,400
Speaker 1: sold to sick people across this planet are themselves the

1236
01:10:43,400 --> 01:10:48,280
Speaker 1: result of true conspiracies, their schemes to exploit the desperate

1237
01:10:48,320 --> 01:10:51,600
Speaker 1: hopes of people who are suffering from horrific disease and

1238
01:10:51,680 --> 01:10:54,760
Speaker 1: to take their money without actually helping them at all,

1239
01:10:54,800 --> 01:10:57,600
Speaker 1: and in some cases, harming them. If you or a

1240
01:10:57,640 --> 01:11:00,920
Speaker 1: loved one are currently battling cancer, please do not give

1241
01:11:01,000 --> 01:11:04,080
Speaker 1: up hope, and please please please be vigilant. If you

1242
01:11:04,200 --> 01:11:07,559
Speaker 1: choose a certain treatment plan, whether tried and true or

1243
01:11:07,600 --> 01:11:12,599
Speaker 1: relatively unorthodox, consult a medical professional, preferably several if you can,

1244
01:11:12,720 --> 01:11:16,639
Speaker 1: before beginning treatment, and make sure that if something may

1245
01:11:16,760 --> 01:11:23,639
Speaker 1: possibly help you, it doesn't also harm you. And that's

1246
01:11:23,760 --> 01:11:27,880
Speaker 1: our classic episode for this evening. We can't wait to

1247
01:11:27,920 --> 01:11:28,519
Speaker 1: hear your thoughts.

1248
01:11:28,520 --> 01:11:30,080
Speaker 4: It's right, let us know what you think you can reach.

1249
01:11:30,080 --> 01:11:32,479
Speaker 4: You to the handle Conspiracy Stuff where we exist on

1250
01:11:32,520 --> 01:11:36,879
Speaker 4: Facebook X and YouTube on Instagram and TikTok or Conspiracy

1251
01:11:36,920 --> 01:11:37,439
Speaker 4: Stuff Show.

1252
01:11:37,479 --> 01:11:39,760
Speaker 2: If you want to call us dial one eight three

1253
01:11:39,840 --> 01:11:44,960
Speaker 2: three STDWYTK. That's our voicemail system. You've got three minutes,

1254
01:11:45,040 --> 01:11:47,240
Speaker 2: give yourself a cool nickname and let us know if

1255
01:11:47,240 --> 01:11:49,320
Speaker 2: we can use your name and message on the air.

1256
01:11:49,640 --> 01:11:51,200
Speaker 2: If you got more to say than can fit in

1257
01:11:51,240 --> 01:11:54,040
Speaker 2: that voicemail, why not instead send us a good old

1258
01:11:54,040 --> 01:11:54,839
Speaker 2: fashioned email.

1259
01:11:55,080 --> 01:11:57,960
Speaker 5: We are the entities that read every single piece of

1260
01:11:58,000 --> 01:12:02,800
Speaker 5: correspondence we receive, aware yet not afraid. Sometimes the void

1261
01:12:02,800 --> 01:12:24,800
Speaker 5: writes back conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

1262
01:12:24,960 --> 01:12:27,000
Speaker 2: Stuff they Don't want you to Know is a production

1263
01:12:27,120 --> 01:12:31,639
Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1264
01:12:31,720 --> 01:12:34,599
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.