1
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:04,120
Speaker 1: President Donald Trump signs an executive order yesterday establishing the

2
00:00:04,200 --> 00:00:09,000
Speaker 1: Presidential Commission on Election Integrity to examine alleged improper voting

3
00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:12,719
Speaker 1: and voter suppression in federal elections. Trump has claimed without

4
00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:15,480
Speaker 1: proof that his opponent won the popular vote last year

5
00:00:15,480 --> 00:00:18,320
Speaker 1: because of voter fraud, saying that millions of people who

6
00:00:18,400 --> 00:00:24,200
Speaker 1: weren't eligible to vote, particularly undocumented immigrants, cast ballots. We're

7
00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:26,840
Speaker 1: going to protect the integrity of the ballot box, and

8
00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:29,360
Speaker 1: we are going to defend the votes of the American

9
00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:33,880
Speaker 1: citizens so important. Many top democratic and civil rights leaders

10
00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:36,360
Speaker 1: have charged at the effort to clap down on alleged

11
00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:40,080
Speaker 1: voter fraud is intended to suppress voter turnout among minorities,

12
00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:43,400
Speaker 1: the poor, and the elderly by putting up new barriers

13
00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:46,680
Speaker 1: to voting. Trump has named Vice President Mike Pence as

14
00:00:46,760 --> 00:00:50,680
Speaker 1: chairman of the Commission, and Chris Koback, the Kansas Secretary

15
00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:53,720
Speaker 1: of State known for advocating for the strictest voter i

16
00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:57,120
Speaker 1: D laws in the country as vice chairman. Joining us

17
00:00:57,120 --> 00:01:01,040
Speaker 1: our election law experts, Nate Personally, Professor It's Stanford Law School,

18
00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:04,920
Speaker 1: and Richard Refault, Professor at Columbia Law School, Nate, you

19
00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:08,480
Speaker 1: were the research director on the Presidential Commission on Election

20
00:01:08,520 --> 00:01:14,559
Speaker 1: Administration after the election. Tell us about any real evidence

21
00:01:14,840 --> 00:01:20,720
Speaker 1: of widespread voter fraud. Well, there isn't widespread evidence of

22
00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:25,040
Speaker 1: voter fraud. There are any number of irregularities in our

23
00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:30,319
Speaker 1: election system, um coming from you know, machines that don't work,

24
00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:35,160
Speaker 1: voters who are wrongly put on the registered registration rolls,

25
00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:37,600
Speaker 1: dead people on the rolls, people who move. So there

26
00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:40,120
Speaker 1: are all kinds of problems with our election administration system,

27
00:01:40,160 --> 00:01:46,880
Speaker 1: but there is no widespread evidence of fraud. Rich. This

28
00:01:47,080 --> 00:01:49,800
Speaker 1: commission is being built by the White House at least

29
00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:53,160
Speaker 1: as a bipartisan commission. There are at least two Democrats

30
00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:56,240
Speaker 1: on it. What do you think is that? Is this

31
00:01:56,320 --> 00:02:00,280
Speaker 1: going to be an even handed look at America's election laws? Well,

32
00:02:00,280 --> 00:02:02,920
Speaker 1: it's not really being set off that way, uh As

33
00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:05,160
Speaker 1: Natean knows his experience, Nate was the research director of

34
00:02:05,200 --> 00:02:08,679
Speaker 1: the last major commission that looked into the election administration

35
00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:12,080
Speaker 1: system in the US. Typically, these commissions have two chairs,

36
00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:14,799
Speaker 1: and one of a prominent senior Democrat and one of

37
00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:18,600
Speaker 1: a prominent senior Republican. So there was the Carter Baker

38
00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:21,840
Speaker 1: or Baker Carter, Jimmy Carter and James Baker's Republican Secretary

39
00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:24,600
Speaker 1: State the one that Nate was on, the Power Ginsburg.

40
00:02:24,639 --> 00:02:27,280
Speaker 1: They were the top election lawyers of their two different parties.

41
00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:29,840
Speaker 1: This is one of the top two figures of both Republicans.

42
00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:32,480
Speaker 1: The Vice President, Mike Pences the chair, and I believe

43
00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:34,600
Speaker 1: Chris Koback supposed to be the vice chair, and he

44
00:02:35,080 --> 00:02:36,800
Speaker 1: not only is the partisan, but he has taken a

45
00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:41,400
Speaker 1: very um strident efficacy position on a lot of election issues.

46
00:02:41,440 --> 00:02:44,360
Speaker 1: So there may be some Democrats on the commission. I

47
00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:47,440
Speaker 1: think the full membership has not been announced, but it

48
00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:51,480
Speaker 1: is certainly not being set up in the the bipartisan

49
00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:54,360
Speaker 1: way that passed. The commissions that have looked into election

50
00:02:54,440 --> 00:02:59,320
Speaker 1: leader issues have been Nate. We know that Senate Majority

51
00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,560
Speaker 1: Leader Mitch Connell set in February that no federal money

52
00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:07,160
Speaker 1: should be spent investigating voter fraud. Doesn't the commission need

53
00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:12,920
Speaker 1: professional staff with experience dealing with election administration and resources

54
00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:16,320
Speaker 1: to examine any credible evidence? I mean, don't you need

55
00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:19,399
Speaker 1: to put money into this commission? They will put money

56
00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:21,359
Speaker 1: into the commission. I mean, I've looked at the Executive

57
00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:23,600
Speaker 1: Order and it you know, suggests that they'll have all

58
00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:27,000
Speaker 1: the support from the General Services Administration, and Chris Koback

59
00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:29,720
Speaker 1: went on the air last night and said that their

60
00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:33,520
Speaker 1: plan is to match up the voter lists with other

61
00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:36,600
Speaker 1: lists that the federal government has about green card holders

62
00:03:36,680 --> 00:03:40,640
Speaker 1: and other citizenship databases in order to see how many

63
00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:43,120
Speaker 1: non citizens and ineligible voters are on the roles that

64
00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:45,680
Speaker 1: may have voted in the last election. And so this

65
00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:49,640
Speaker 1: will actually be a relatively expensive effort as these things go.

66
00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:52,920
Speaker 1: I mean, we the Presidential Commission that I served under

67
00:03:53,120 --> 00:03:57,520
Speaker 1: UM actually was was very frugal I think, I mean

68
00:03:57,520 --> 00:03:59,120
Speaker 1: there was less than half a million dollars we ended

69
00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:01,080
Speaker 1: up spending, and that was mainly just to have hearings

70
00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:05,040
Speaker 1: around the country. Uh So this commission, yeah, it's a

71
00:04:05,080 --> 00:04:07,200
Speaker 1: it's a real research effort if they undertake a real

72
00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:09,400
Speaker 1: research effort. One thing I would also note that there's

73
00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:12,880
Speaker 1: no UM concluding date for the commission, So this commission

74
00:04:12,920 --> 00:04:14,880
Speaker 1: could be there for a while, perhaps looking into what

75
00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:20,720
Speaker 1: happens in the two thousand eighteen election as well. Rich

76
00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:23,520
Speaker 1: And but just about thirty seconds right now, But what's

77
00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:25,279
Speaker 1: the scope of this commission? Is it going to look

78
00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:29,359
Speaker 1: into allegations of votes suppression as well as allegations of

79
00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:32,440
Speaker 1: voter fraud. It'should be not in the mandate of the charge.

80
00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:36,159
Speaker 1: The mandate is all about election fraud and voter integrity,

81
00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:39,839
Speaker 1: improper voter registration and improper voting. I think if you

82
00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:42,920
Speaker 1: wanted to, you could squeeze it in because the mission

83
00:04:42,960 --> 00:04:46,800
Speaker 1: talks about looking at rules and practices that enhance the

84
00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:49,839
Speaker 1: people American people's confidence in the integrity of the electoral

85
00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:52,600
Speaker 1: system and that undermine it. And you could argue that

86
00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:56,240
Speaker 1: vote suppression devices undermine the integrity. So if somebody really

87
00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:59,600
Speaker 1: wanted to push for looking at those voter suppression issues,

88
00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:02,400
Speaker 1: they they could be stated within. But the overall tenor

89
00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:04,560
Speaker 1: of the mission on the key terms and it all

90
00:05:04,600 --> 00:05:09,640
Speaker 1: seems to be focused on concerns about voting registration and

91
00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:12,000
Speaker 1: voting by people who should not be voting, as opposed

92
00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:14,720
Speaker 1: to mechanisms that make it harder for people who are

93
00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:18,200
Speaker 1: entitled to vote to actually vote. Coming up on Bloomberg law,

94
00:05:18,279 --> 00:05:21,159
Speaker 1: what about the timing of this commission? And the A

95
00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:23,840
Speaker 1: c l U has filed a Freedom of Information Act

96
00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:28,159
Speaker 1: request seeking information that the Trump administration is using as

97
00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:31,839
Speaker 1: the basis for its voter fraud claims go. We're talking

98
00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:35,159
Speaker 1: with two experts in election law, Nate Personally, professor at

99
00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:38,560
Speaker 1: Stanford Law School, and Richard Fall, professor at Columbia Law School,

100
00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:44,520
Speaker 1: about President Donald Trump's Presidential Commission on Election Integrity. Nate,

101
00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:48,280
Speaker 1: as I said, there were many top Democrats who came

102
00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:52,640
Speaker 1: out with statements and civil rights leaders charging that this

103
00:05:52,720 --> 00:05:57,440
Speaker 1: is an effort to uh, really to suppress voter turnout

104
00:05:57,480 --> 00:06:00,960
Speaker 1: among minorities, the poor, and the elder by putting up

105
00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:04,200
Speaker 1: new barriers to voting, such as voter I D S.

106
00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:09,279
Speaker 1: Would a federal commission be able to do that? The

107
00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:11,640
Speaker 1: commission itself won't be able to pass any laws, but

108
00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:16,520
Speaker 1: it will um make recommendations, perhaps of federal legislation. The

109
00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:20,440
Speaker 1: commission I served under, we made recommendations principally to the states,

110
00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:24,120
Speaker 1: because that's where most election law is created, and so

111
00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:28,599
Speaker 1: that was what we viewed as our goal and really

112
00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:31,120
Speaker 1: tried to focus on the best practices from the states

113
00:06:31,160 --> 00:06:35,080
Speaker 1: so that we could improve election administration and performance. But

114
00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:37,680
Speaker 1: let me just we have to pull away the veneer

115
00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:40,120
Speaker 1: a little bit with this executive order in this commission,

116
00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:42,080
Speaker 1: which is that we have to remember that this is

117
00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:46,279
Speaker 1: reverse engineered in order to justify a tweet that happened

118
00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:49,680
Speaker 1: in the wake of President Trump's loss of the popular vote.

119
00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:54,280
Speaker 1: And so these people are appointed and uh, their mission

120
00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:57,919
Speaker 1: is to justify the idea that three to five million

121
00:06:58,200 --> 00:07:00,680
Speaker 1: illegal votes were cast in the last electction. And so

122
00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:03,880
Speaker 1: you can't rip this commission out of that context, especially

123
00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:06,520
Speaker 1: when the Vice president is leading it and he has

124
00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:10,520
Speaker 1: said that he believes that to be true already. Is

125
00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:13,960
Speaker 1: the timing of this suspicious. Many people are saying that

126
00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:19,320
Speaker 1: it's timed to to take attention away from the Comey

127
00:07:19,440 --> 00:07:23,120
Speaker 1: firing and the FBI. I don't think it has. In

128
00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:26,040
Speaker 1: some ways, I could see two stories in that regard.

129
00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:28,960
Speaker 1: One is that it's attempt to distract from the Comey investigation.

130
00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:33,520
Speaker 1: The other is the Comey investigation is distracting from this,

131
00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:35,040
Speaker 1: and so you sort of slip it in at the

132
00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:39,320
Speaker 1: same time that everyone's preoccupied with that. I don't think, um,

133
00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,640
Speaker 1: it's distracting from everything happening with Comey. At least if

134
00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:44,680
Speaker 1: you look at the front pages today, this is really

135
00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:47,840
Speaker 1: below the fold um and you know this is something

136
00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:49,320
Speaker 1: that's going to be going on and on over the

137
00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:53,760
Speaker 1: next few years as they appoint new members and investigate

138
00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:56,600
Speaker 1: the claims of voter front Well, speaking of appointing new

139
00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:59,360
Speaker 1: members and actually putting a commission together, Rich, we have

140
00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:02,240
Speaker 1: a commission here that doesn't really have any you know,

141
00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:05,200
Speaker 1: a full complement of members or a staff or anything else,

142
00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:07,000
Speaker 1: And so it's not clear who's going to end up

143
00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:09,760
Speaker 1: on this. Is there any positive what do you think

144
00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:14,280
Speaker 1: the possibilities are that, you know, Democrats and independent election

145
00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:17,560
Speaker 1: experts would be willing to serve on this commission, giving

146
00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:19,800
Speaker 1: the suspicion, given the suspicions a lot of them have

147
00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:22,600
Speaker 1: about it, it's hard to say. I mean, part of

148
00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:24,480
Speaker 1: the fact, the very fact that it was rushed out

149
00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:26,480
Speaker 1: like this, So those sort of give credence to the

150
00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:29,160
Speaker 1: idea that maybe there was an attempt to distract from

151
00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:33,319
Speaker 1: the comby affair. The commission is not ready, and the

152
00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:35,680
Speaker 1: White House at the President and talking about doing something

153
00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:38,920
Speaker 1: like this for months. Why now when it's not even

154
00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:41,640
Speaker 1: fully done In terms of people joining up, It's hard

155
00:08:41,679 --> 00:08:44,320
Speaker 1: to say. I mean, on the one hand, it's sort

156
00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:47,040
Speaker 1: of it's sort of um resonates to all of the

157
00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:50,240
Speaker 1: statements people are making since November about how valuable would

158
00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:53,520
Speaker 1: be for high quality people to join the Trump administration

159
00:08:53,559 --> 00:08:56,600
Speaker 1: and to contribute their expertise and their knowledge and their

160
00:08:57,000 --> 00:08:59,679
Speaker 1: you know, their commitment to standards. We saw what happened

161
00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:03,560
Speaker 1: with Mr Rosenstein trying to do that. Um, I don't know.

162
00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:05,800
Speaker 1: I mean, I think they're the sense that this is

163
00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:10,040
Speaker 1: clearly a facade, that this is a veiled device designed

164
00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:14,400
Speaker 1: to both Nates suggests to give some kind of support

165
00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:16,760
Speaker 1: for the idea that there were millions of illegal votescast,

166
00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:19,800
Speaker 1: and then maybe going beyond that, to give to provide

167
00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:23,240
Speaker 1: a program to make a tougher to add new restrictions

168
00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:25,760
Speaker 1: on voting going forward. I mean, the Commission itself doesn't

169
00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:27,240
Speaker 1: have the power to do it, but it has the

170
00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:30,800
Speaker 1: bully put have the bully pulpit. Um, it's you know,

171
00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:33,480
Speaker 1: I'm sure they would want to, as some people who

172
00:09:33,559 --> 00:09:37,040
Speaker 1: are not die hard Republicans, to make it look more legitimate,

173
00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:41,679
Speaker 1: but it's not clear that you ever will be legitimate. Nate,

174
00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:44,240
Speaker 1: what's your reaction to the a c L you filing

175
00:09:44,280 --> 00:09:47,920
Speaker 1: a Freedom of Information Act request seeking information that the

176
00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:51,280
Speaker 1: Trump administration is using as the basis for its voter

177
00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:55,239
Speaker 1: fraud claims. Well, I see that mainly as a strategic

178
00:09:55,960 --> 00:09:58,560
Speaker 1: device in order to highlight the fact that they don't

179
00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:01,320
Speaker 1: have the evidence that there's three to five million illegal

180
00:10:01,400 --> 00:10:04,199
Speaker 1: votes cast in the election. Realized that if that had

181
00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:06,680
Speaker 1: been the level of illegal voting in the last election,

182
00:10:07,120 --> 00:10:11,720
Speaker 1: the voter turnout among the undocumented population would have rivaled

183
00:10:11,760 --> 00:10:15,320
Speaker 1: that of citizens. And so it's not as if, um,

184
00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:18,280
Speaker 1: you know, you know, if you had hordes of illegal

185
00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:20,480
Speaker 1: voters of flooding the polling place, you would have had

186
00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:22,640
Speaker 1: a much higher voter turnout than we had in this election,

187
00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:24,760
Speaker 1: and you would have been able to see it left

188
00:10:24,800 --> 00:10:26,760
Speaker 1: and right. And so I see this the a c

189
00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:29,760
Speaker 1: l US attempt here as well as future attempts that

190
00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:32,559
Speaker 1: people are going to lodge under the Federal Advisory Committee Act,

191
00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:34,680
Speaker 1: just a way to try to keep this commission in

192
00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:37,880
Speaker 1: check into continue and needle ith in order to justify

193
00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:41,360
Speaker 1: its mission. Rich given those kinds of efforts, in the

194
00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:45,240
Speaker 1: fact that we don't have a commission put together yet, Um,

195
00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:48,920
Speaker 1: if you had to predict how long the commission's work

196
00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:52,520
Speaker 1: is going to take, how long would it be? It

197
00:10:52,559 --> 00:10:55,439
Speaker 1: really is unpredictable. I mean, they it's it's they don't

198
00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:57,760
Speaker 1: have a full commission, they don't have a staff. The

199
00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:00,000
Speaker 1: Vice President is sharing it, and he has other things

200
00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:02,520
Speaker 1: to do. They do have a very activist and very

201
00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:06,600
Speaker 1: determined of ICE chair, Chris Kodak of Kansas Secretary of State,

202
00:11:06,880 --> 00:11:09,280
Speaker 1: and he may want to push it pretty hard. You know,

203
00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:11,760
Speaker 1: I'm it's hard to say. I mean, I think any

204
00:11:11,880 --> 00:11:14,480
Speaker 1: any number I give would be totally made up. Um,

205
00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:16,800
Speaker 1: you know, bloom Ye, it will be. I mean, as

206
00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:18,880
Speaker 1: Nate points out, they might actually even want to wait

207
00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:21,280
Speaker 1: to pass the twenty eighteen election. They might want to

208
00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:24,360
Speaker 1: come out sometime next year. All the idea that maybe

209
00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:28,880
Speaker 1: to press Congress to pass some restrictive measures that would

210
00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:30,600
Speaker 1: make it hard for people to vote in federal elections.

211
00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:33,839
Speaker 1: It's just impossible to tell thank you both for being

212
00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:37,480
Speaker 1: for being on Bloomberg Law. That's we should Refall professor

213
00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:41,320
Speaker 1: at Columbia Law School and Nate personally, professor at Stanford

214
00:11:41,480 --> 00:11:45,679
Speaker 1: Law School, both election law experts. Coming up on Bloomberg Law.

215
00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:48,839
Speaker 1: We're going to be talking about the Fire Music Festival.

216
00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:51,840
Speaker 1: It was on an exclusive island in the Bahamas. It

217
00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:55,679
Speaker 1: was billed as a luxury experience from start to finish,

218
00:11:55,760 --> 00:11:58,360
Speaker 1: but it finished before it started, and there's a one

219
00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:01,760
Speaker 1: hundred million dollar lass filed saying it was more like

220
00:12:01,880 --> 00:12:04,680
Speaker 1: the Hunger Games. We're going to speak to the plaintiff's

221
00:12:04,760 --> 00:12:07,719
Speaker 1: attorney in that, and later in the show we're going

222
00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:12,160
Speaker 1: to be talking about the EU Commissioner of Anti Trust

223
00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:15,160
Speaker 1: and how she has built a reputation, a sort of

224
00:12:15,200 --> 00:12:20,120
Speaker 1: a star's reputation in Europe. That's coming up on Bloomberg Law.

225
00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:24,000
Speaker 1: I'm June Grosso with Michael Best and Greg Store. You've

226
00:12:24,040 --> 00:12:27,560
Speaker 1: been listening to Bloomberg Law. This is Bloomberg