WEBVTT - Thinking Sideways: The Zip-Gun Bomber 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:04.440 Thinking Sideways is not brought to you by Canadian conquistadors. Instead, 0:00:04.480 --> 0:00:06.559 it's brought to you by your local cat and or 0:00:06.680 --> 0:00:09.680 dog shelter. That's all right, we're back on that again. 0:00:09.960 --> 0:00:12.360 And hey, we've got an email from our listeners, Chris 0:00:12.400 --> 0:00:14.800 and Cathy. They told us a really, really great story 0:00:14.800 --> 0:00:17.640 about their dog, Stewie that they adopted from a shelter 0:00:18.320 --> 0:00:22.119 and Stewie worked out great. Another wonderful success story and 0:00:22.160 --> 0:00:24.080 another reason for why you should get down to your 0:00:24.079 --> 0:00:27.200 local shelter and get yourself a cute little four legged 0:00:27.240 --> 0:00:31.000 furry friend. Cat, dog, doesn't matter. But they're out there. 0:00:31.040 --> 0:00:32.839 They need homes, and you know you need them more 0:00:32.840 --> 0:00:35.080 than they need you even So get down there now. 0:00:35.360 --> 0:00:37.560 And if you can't adopt, then you know, give money 0:00:37.640 --> 0:00:40.080 or give your time volunteer. So I get down there now, 0:00:40.120 --> 0:00:41.880 Your a little four legged friend is waiting for you. 0:00:48.840 --> 0:01:04.360 It's quickly far. Well, hey there, and welcome again to 0:01:04.440 --> 0:01:08.080 another episode of Thinking Sideways. I am Steve, of course, 0:01:08.200 --> 0:01:12.640 joined by and Joe, and once again we bring you 0:01:12.720 --> 0:01:16.520 a mystery, a really scary one this week. Well actually 0:01:16.560 --> 0:01:19.600 in some ways, just when it's yeah, there's some there's 0:01:19.640 --> 0:01:22.920 some moments during this one man. Yeah, it's gonna make 0:01:22.920 --> 0:01:25.040 a thing twice before you do a certain thing. It's 0:01:25.120 --> 0:01:27.959 very true. It's true because this week we're gonna be 0:01:27.959 --> 0:01:31.520 talking about a mystery that spans fourteen years and literally 0:01:31.560 --> 0:01:34.800 scared the hell out of postal customers in New York 0:01:34.959 --> 0:01:36.760 for a long time. I think that should be the 0:01:36.760 --> 0:01:40.360 tagline of our show. Scared the hell out of postal customers, 0:01:41.480 --> 0:01:46.720 makes you think twice about doing a thing. I didn't 0:01:46.720 --> 0:01:48.480 want to give away the game by saying what that thing? 0:01:48.640 --> 0:01:51.480 Right yet? Yeah? But actually used to be scared of 0:01:51.520 --> 0:01:53.720 doing all sorts of certain things. Yes, there's a lot 0:01:53.760 --> 0:01:55.760 of certain things that are very scared we'll get you killed. 0:01:55.960 --> 0:02:00.520 This very certain thing is dealing with your mail opening package. 0:02:00.600 --> 0:02:03.720 Because we're going to be talking about the zip gun bomber. 0:02:03.840 --> 0:02:06.000 You guys have heard of that, right of course. Actually, 0:02:06.000 --> 0:02:09.680 I think a lot of people have the ubiquitous bomber. 0:02:10.080 --> 0:02:12.639 I don't know. This guy was like he never got 0:02:12.720 --> 0:02:14.799 quite the publicity at the UNI bomber. Got I was 0:02:14.840 --> 0:02:16.960 gonna say, you think of bombers at the UNI bomber 0:02:17.600 --> 0:02:21.800 zip gun bomber? Yeah, only two? I know. I wanted 0:02:21.919 --> 0:02:24.960 to say that they felt that this guy was envious 0:02:25.000 --> 0:02:28.679 of those other big but I don't know that that's 0:02:28.720 --> 0:02:32.800 really the cases we'll find as we go through this um. 0:02:32.840 --> 0:02:35.520 But I do want to say thank you to Wesley, 0:02:35.520 --> 0:02:38.040 because Wesley is the one who suggested this story to 0:02:38.200 --> 0:02:44.040 us and wish very well played. But as with a 0:02:44.040 --> 0:02:46.120 lot of these kind of stories, for those words, you're like, oh, 0:02:46.160 --> 0:02:48.880 I'll read the first link, I read the second link 0:02:49.360 --> 0:02:53.560 four hours later. I guess I'm covering this story. Yeah. 0:02:53.600 --> 0:02:57.480 My next week is like that too. Yeah. Um so whoever. 0:02:57.520 --> 0:03:02.720 The zip gun bomber was an individual that sent explosive 0:03:02.800 --> 0:03:07.440 packages to people in the New York area and was 0:03:07.639 --> 0:03:11.480 never caught. And so let's let's tell this story. Disclaimer here. 0:03:11.520 --> 0:03:13.560 I think we're going to probably be using the heat 0:03:13.600 --> 0:03:16.840 pronoun for the bomber because it's really a default to that, 0:03:17.160 --> 0:03:19.399 not because we don't think women can also be bombers, 0:03:19.520 --> 0:03:21.600 but just because dudes tend to like to play with 0:03:21.639 --> 0:03:23.680 things that go boom. Dudes are like the ones who 0:03:23.760 --> 0:03:27.800 killed most people. Sorry, not all men, I know, but whatever. Anyway, 0:03:27.840 --> 0:03:30.639 the majority of yes, I will end up using the 0:03:30.680 --> 0:03:33.040 heat pronoun. Actually, I think I think we have to 0:03:33.040 --> 0:03:35.680 stay here or she every time you could say they singular, 0:03:35.760 --> 0:03:38.400 then okay, well I'll let you do that, okay, okay. 0:03:38.400 --> 0:03:44.240 So our story begins on the seventh of May two 0:03:44.960 --> 0:03:48.880 when fifty four year old Joan Kip received a package 0:03:49.000 --> 0:03:52.600 at her home in Bay Ridge, Brooklyn, New York. Joan 0:03:52.680 --> 0:03:57.080 had been a I think Joan actually was a guy. Yeah, 0:03:57.080 --> 0:03:59.920 she still was working, so she was a guidance counsel 0:04:00.000 --> 0:04:03.720 her at a local school. But she was getting ready 0:04:03.760 --> 0:04:06.720 to leave for the weekend with her husband to celebrate 0:04:06.760 --> 0:04:10.920 Mother's Day when a package arrived in that day's mail 0:04:11.320 --> 0:04:14.320 was addressed to her, and so she opened it and 0:04:14.400 --> 0:04:20.560 lo and behold, inside was a cookbook. That's so lucky. Yeah, well, 0:04:20.839 --> 0:04:23.720 and I'm okay. So presumably this as hard back as 0:04:23.760 --> 0:04:26.479 will come to make sense soon. But she believed that 0:04:26.560 --> 0:04:29.160 this was a Mother's Day president and was she she 0:04:29.279 --> 0:04:32.279 was a mother? She was, she has she had several children, 0:04:32.640 --> 0:04:35.240 at least one son and one daughter. I don't know 0:04:35.320 --> 0:04:39.159 exactly how many children she had, but she believed that 0:04:39.200 --> 0:04:42.480 it had to be a present for Mother's Day. So 0:04:42.640 --> 0:04:45.120 she pulled and pulled it out of the box and 0:04:45.320 --> 0:04:47.960 she opened the book. I'm guessing the plan was to 0:04:48.000 --> 0:04:50.520 see if somebody had written on the inside of the cover, 0:04:50.640 --> 0:04:54.640 like people do for for books that are gifts, somebody 0:04:54.680 --> 0:04:57.200 had actually well, I was just gonna say, I feel 0:04:57.240 --> 0:04:59.359 like every time I picked up a book, I opened 0:04:59.360 --> 0:05:02.919 it just just at least looking the inside. Yeah, I 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:05.039 was presuming it, being that she thought it was a 0:05:05.040 --> 0:05:07.279 Mother's Day gift, that there would be some kind of writing. 0:05:07.279 --> 0:05:12.160 But you're right, she probably may have just automatically opened it. Unfortunately, 0:05:12.200 --> 0:05:15.799 when she opened the book, it made a loud bang noise, 0:05:15.880 --> 0:05:20.960 and Joan discovered that she had been shot. Because here's yeah, 0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:24.159 because here's the thing. The book was actually a booby trap, 0:05:24.920 --> 0:05:28.320 and when she opened the front cover she sprang said 0:05:28.400 --> 0:05:33.680 trap and the book literally shot her. What. Yes, Joan 0:05:33.800 --> 0:05:37.000 was taken to the hospital, but unfortunately she died several 0:05:37.040 --> 0:05:40.160 hours later. The report, and this this is one of 0:05:40.200 --> 0:05:42.560 those things with these kind of stories, the reporting berries. 0:05:42.880 --> 0:05:46.080 Some just say that she was shot in the torso 0:05:46.440 --> 0:05:49.800 or abdomen, and other places say that she was shot 0:05:49.839 --> 0:05:54.600 in the heart, which technically is in your to I 0:05:54.680 --> 0:05:56.880 think it's probably more shot little lower down in the gut, 0:05:57.040 --> 0:05:58.520 just because when you help, if you're going to open 0:05:58.560 --> 0:06:00.640 a book, you don't hold it up like heart level 0:06:00.800 --> 0:06:05.560 to open it up unless you're short. There's a whole 0:06:05.560 --> 0:06:07.680 bunch of variables, and we'll talk about that, like how 0:06:07.839 --> 0:06:10.120 things get held when they're open. Well, I mean, here's 0:06:10.160 --> 0:06:11.880 the thing, though, is like this is really the reason 0:06:11.920 --> 0:06:14.599 that we need better gun control, because a book should 0:06:14.600 --> 0:06:17.000 never be able to go out and buy a gun 0:06:17.720 --> 0:06:21.400 and mail itself to the unwitting victim and shoot it. Well, 0:06:21.480 --> 0:06:24.320 that's the whole thing is that it's really just because 0:06:24.360 --> 0:06:26.080 you know, I mean, you know, you can't a book 0:06:26.120 --> 0:06:29.000 cannot be connected to convicted of felowy. How can you 0:06:29.160 --> 0:06:30.919 know if the book is a criminal or not. You 0:06:30.960 --> 0:06:40.040 can't know, Okay, Okay. So the police, of course, they investigate, 0:06:40.120 --> 0:06:43.960 and they're stumped, and so they start investigating everyone close 0:06:44.000 --> 0:06:46.640 to the family because they've got nothing to indicate that 0:06:46.680 --> 0:06:50.200 it's you know, no evidence points to anybody outside of 0:06:50.200 --> 0:06:55.119 the family circle. And they would initially charge Jones's son, 0:06:55.560 --> 0:06:58.880 Craig Kip, with her murder, but they could never really 0:06:58.880 --> 0:07:02.560 put a case together that was comprehensive enough that that 0:07:02.640 --> 0:07:06.880 would stand up to muster, and so that whole case 0:07:07.000 --> 0:07:10.240 fell apart, and they really didn't have anything after that. 0:07:10.960 --> 0:07:14.960 It is actually the police in the initial investigation who 0:07:15.040 --> 0:07:19.840 would name our suspect or unknown suspect the zip gun bomber. 0:07:20.360 --> 0:07:23.480 And that's based simply on the construction of what it 0:07:23.640 --> 0:07:26.080 was that this this bomb was made of. And we 0:07:26.120 --> 0:07:29.000 need to talk about it real quick because it is 0:07:29.000 --> 0:07:34.000 it technically a bomb. Technically that's really I have gone 0:07:34.000 --> 0:07:36.000 back and forth on I think, let me, let me 0:07:36.040 --> 0:07:40.720 explain the weapon, and then people their own conclusions. Our 0:07:40.800 --> 0:07:42.840 listeners are gonna want to build one for themselves. Yeah, 0:07:42.960 --> 0:07:45.600 please do not do this. It is a very dangerous 0:07:45.720 --> 0:07:49.880 thing and you're likely to hurt yourself, if not someone else, 0:07:50.080 --> 0:07:54.800 unintentionally or maybe intentionally. But the point is, don't do this. 0:07:55.000 --> 0:07:57.880 You're leaving out some details on purpose. Actually I know 0:07:57.920 --> 0:07:59.960 how to make I know how to make a certain explode, 0:08:00.160 --> 0:08:02.080 which is why I never't accept a gift from you. 0:08:02.600 --> 0:08:04.280 But but I don't do it. You know, I've never 0:08:04.320 --> 0:08:06.240 done it, even though I know how, because I like 0:08:06.280 --> 0:08:08.640 my hands. I have to have hands. So yeah, don't 0:08:08.680 --> 0:08:10.920 mess it out with explosive guys. So, a couple of 0:08:10.920 --> 0:08:12.640 things that we're gonna talk about here. So let's start 0:08:12.640 --> 0:08:14.920 off the first, which is what is a zip gun. 0:08:15.680 --> 0:08:20.360 A zip gun is an improvised firearmament. In its simplest form, 0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:28.320 it's some kind of metal tube that holds a single bullet. Yeah, 0:08:28.360 --> 0:08:32.079 they're easiest ones. Then something is built into the back 0:08:32.080 --> 0:08:35.800 of that tube to strike the primer on the bullet 0:08:35.960 --> 0:08:40.199 to make a discharge off. Yea yeah, And I was 0:08:40.200 --> 0:08:42.720 gonna say that it can they can be complex. But 0:08:42.800 --> 0:08:47.000 the simplest one I saw literally was a tube with 0:08:47.200 --> 0:08:50.240 something duct taped to it and a rubber band with 0:08:50.320 --> 0:08:52.719 a nail and a piece of metal on it to 0:08:52.840 --> 0:08:56.160 pull back like a sling shot to generate a little 0:08:56.200 --> 0:08:59.360 force to set off a twenty two cartridge. Because the 0:08:59.400 --> 0:09:02.200 thing is rim fire cartridges, twenty two cartridge just don't 0:09:02.240 --> 0:09:04.960 have to have a good, solid direct hit to set 0:09:05.000 --> 0:09:08.600 them off the rim well, but they don't have to 0:09:08.600 --> 0:09:11.400 be a dead center hit, you know, like you like, 0:09:11.520 --> 0:09:13.480 you don't have to hit the primer perfectly to get 0:09:13.520 --> 0:09:15.840 that booger to go. And that's the point. They're easy 0:09:15.920 --> 0:09:19.559 to fire. It's also a very low pressure around, which 0:09:19.640 --> 0:09:21.440 is another reason because to be using a cheap, crappy 0:09:21.440 --> 0:09:23.559 piece of pipe as your barrel and use a high 0:09:23.559 --> 0:09:26.199 pressure around what you're gonna blow yourself up exactly because 0:09:27.720 --> 0:09:30.720 zip guns, bomb or zip guns are not meant to 0:09:30.720 --> 0:09:35.240 be long term weapons. And as Joash said, they they 0:09:35.440 --> 0:09:38.200 will eventually wear out. Even if you build one right, 0:09:38.600 --> 0:09:41.400 they eventually wear out from the pressure and they will 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:45.160 blow open your hands. So no, make one, No make gun. 0:09:45.400 --> 0:09:47.080 Don't do it well, and I decided to do it. 0:09:47.160 --> 0:09:50.240 Research your ammunition to make sure it's low pressure ammo. Yeah, 0:09:50.320 --> 0:09:53.760 that's good point, or you know, just don't do it. 0:09:53.920 --> 0:09:56.160 I just don't do yeah, I like my Yeah, that's right, 0:09:56.200 --> 0:09:59.360 don't do it. Um So zip guns themselves, though, this 0:09:59.440 --> 0:10:03.120 was something that was popular back in the forties and 0:10:03.200 --> 0:10:06.160 the fifties, but of course as the price of guns 0:10:06.240 --> 0:10:10.199 came down and the volume of available guns went up, 0:10:10.640 --> 0:10:13.280 it stopped making sense. Never mind the fact that zip 0:10:13.280 --> 0:10:16.679 guns are really only good for one round. There are 0:10:16.840 --> 0:10:20.280 some designs out there that are quote unquote multiple rounds. 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:23.520 But it's a weird. Yeah, now that you see him 0:10:23.520 --> 0:10:27.040 in prison sometimes for jails and things, and obviously if 0:10:27.040 --> 0:10:29.080 you're in a certain situation where so you're in your 0:10:29.080 --> 0:10:32.000 military occupation, all the guns have been compass card it's 0:10:32.000 --> 0:10:33.720 time to be It's a good idea to know how 0:10:33.760 --> 0:10:35.679 to make yourself as zip guns. Oh yeah, no, did 0:10:35.720 --> 0:10:38.600 you see that one? Um? I was reading imp about 0:10:38.640 --> 0:10:43.079 improvised munitions and I don't remember what website it was, 0:10:43.120 --> 0:10:45.040 and they were talking about somewhere in the Eastern Bloc 0:10:45.120 --> 0:10:49.440 countries and one was found that looked like a nineties 0:10:49.600 --> 0:10:53.600 no Kia cell phone, remember the old nine. Devon will 0:10:53.600 --> 0:10:55.480 probably remember this more than you, Joe, but it was 0:10:55.520 --> 0:10:59.080 the the old Nokia nine thousands something, but it was 0:10:59.160 --> 0:11:02.600 the standard cell phone that everybody had. But if you 0:11:03.000 --> 0:11:06.679 spun the top half open and a barrel was exposed, 0:11:06.960 --> 0:11:09.360 and if you hit a certain keys on the keypad, 0:11:09.440 --> 0:11:12.440 you could fire up to four bullets. Now there's there's 0:11:12.480 --> 0:11:15.240 people that they've made him actually pursull in the US 0:11:15.280 --> 0:11:18.520 too cool little concealed gunst thing. And actually I was. 0:11:18.559 --> 0:11:21.000 I was checking out cool zip gun designs on the webs, 0:11:21.120 --> 0:11:24.280 and course, yeah, they're most of them are crude and crappy, 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:26.400 but there's a there's a few really cool ones that 0:11:26.400 --> 0:11:28.800 I saw too, like this one where the gun was 0:11:28.840 --> 0:11:32.280 designed as a large bolt and so at the end, 0:11:32.320 --> 0:11:33.800 where the where the where the nut, where the nut 0:11:33.840 --> 0:11:36.200 screws on, where the threads are there was a loose 0:11:36.280 --> 0:11:38.240 not just threaded on there just to make it look like, 0:11:38.400 --> 0:11:40.559 you know, something you could leave it in your toolbox, 0:11:40.600 --> 0:11:42.880 you know, it would look like a bolt, don't look 0:11:42.920 --> 0:11:45.360 like a gun. And so that's the end where the 0:11:45.559 --> 0:11:48.640 where the barrel barrel thing is. And at the other 0:11:48.760 --> 0:11:52.320 end the part that the little hex part that yeah, 0:11:52.360 --> 0:11:55.240 that part there, that's the part that you pull out 0:11:55.320 --> 0:11:57.600 and snap and allowed to snap back in the spring 0:11:57.640 --> 0:11:59.839 load and that fires the gun. That's crazy. It was 0:11:59.840 --> 0:12:04.560 a really design genius concealment. Yes, yeah, but that's that's 0:12:04.600 --> 0:12:07.160 not typical for a zip gun. And by the way, 0:12:07.160 --> 0:12:08.959 after point out too, this does not appear to actually 0:12:09.000 --> 0:12:11.280 be a zip gun design. Well, and that's the thing 0:12:11.360 --> 0:12:14.240 is that is the question is, okay, so this is 0:12:14.240 --> 0:12:16.200 what we're talking about zip guns, and how does this 0:12:16.240 --> 0:12:20.959 apply to what Joan Kip received. Um, Well, the book 0:12:21.000 --> 0:12:24.480 itself that she got, the book was hollowed out to 0:12:24.760 --> 0:12:29.040 allow room for the components of a zip gun, because 0:12:29.080 --> 0:12:33.200 as Joe said, it's not really a zip contraption. Yes, 0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:38.600 it's a zip gun like contraption because inside of it, 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:43.280 what is happening is someone has put in a short 0:12:43.400 --> 0:12:47.080 barrel er two and those barrels were apparently made from 0:12:47.360 --> 0:12:52.840 automobile breakline. Then there's at least one two caliber bullet, 0:12:53.280 --> 0:12:56.920 a couple of D cell batteries, some wires, a spring 0:12:57.000 --> 0:13:01.640 from a ballpoint pen and um and then that that 0:13:01.720 --> 0:13:05.160 spring is attached to lid. And how this thing worked 0:13:05.240 --> 0:13:09.320 is that whoever made the bomb used the spring as 0:13:09.360 --> 0:13:11.560 a part of an electrical circuit, So it becomes a 0:13:11.600 --> 0:13:15.200 bit of an i e. D. And improvised explosive device, 0:13:15.440 --> 0:13:18.480 because what happens is when they would lift lid, the 0:13:18.559 --> 0:13:21.760 spring would move, it would complete a circuit that was 0:13:22.280 --> 0:13:27.040 mounted to those batteries. Appears that there was a filament 0:13:27.080 --> 0:13:31.280 like a light filament, like an incandescent light filament on 0:13:31.360 --> 0:13:33.520 the back of the bullets, so that when the circuit 0:13:33.600 --> 0:13:36.439 was completed, that would generate heat which would then set 0:13:36.440 --> 0:13:39.040 off the primer, which would then set off the bullets. 0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:43.120 So it wasn't a physical strike. It was some kind 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:46.040 of electrical SAP. And I don't think that's the way 0:13:46.040 --> 0:13:49.079 they actually did it, because you have to, like you 0:13:49.200 --> 0:13:52.280 have to heat that two two bullet for a while 0:13:52.440 --> 0:13:54.120 to get it to cook off, and they wouldn't all 0:13:54.160 --> 0:13:56.760 go off the same time, so that's one fired at 0:13:56.760 --> 0:13:59.120 that fire, two bullets in different directions, one of which 0:13:59.280 --> 0:14:01.840 hit Jones, the one which flew off in the other direction. 0:14:02.840 --> 0:14:05.520 And so what I think he did is the filament 0:14:05.520 --> 0:14:08.560 was actually an initiator. And there's ways you can do 0:14:08.600 --> 0:14:10.120 that if you want to make your own blasting caps. 0:14:10.200 --> 0:14:12.600 Use lightly. You use a light bulb that you've broken 0:14:12.600 --> 0:14:15.880 the glass off on, and you wrap a paper tube 0:14:15.880 --> 0:14:18.760 around it, poor black powder in there and seal off 0:14:18.800 --> 0:14:21.040 the end, and then you get yourself your blasting cap there. 0:14:21.440 --> 0:14:23.320 And so what I think he did is he had 0:14:23.440 --> 0:14:25.520 like a central little thing that he could screw two 0:14:25.600 --> 0:14:28.200 brake lines on either end. I think what he did 0:14:28.240 --> 0:14:30.240 is he before he screwed this on, he stuffed a 0:14:30.240 --> 0:14:33.480 couple of twenties two caliber bullets into them loose, screwed 0:14:33.520 --> 0:14:35.760 them on, and then the third side before he put 0:14:35.760 --> 0:14:38.520 the initiator, and he poured gunpowder in there, placed his 0:14:38.600 --> 0:14:41.440 initiator in there, and secured it and attached the bat 0:14:41.440 --> 0:14:43.840 and attached the wires to it. And I don't think 0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:46.480 probably given more information than I ever would want to 0:14:46.480 --> 0:14:48.840 give somebody in how to light one of these devices off. 0:14:48.880 --> 0:14:51.480 But the point is it was part of a larger 0:14:51.640 --> 0:14:54.960 circuit that would fire the bullets, and that was what 0:14:55.040 --> 0:14:57.080 made it different from your your typical zip gun is 0:14:57.120 --> 0:15:00.520 that it was electrically initiated, not not by yes, it's 0:15:00.600 --> 0:15:04.320 it is. The electrical initiation is what distinguishes this thing 0:15:04.480 --> 0:15:07.440 from what you know, the rubber band method that we 0:15:07.440 --> 0:15:11.280 were talking about before. One thing that I will say 0:15:11.320 --> 0:15:14.640 that I read this in at least one place that 0:15:14.760 --> 0:15:18.880 I think may be a little weird is that it 0:15:19.080 --> 0:15:22.880 said that the rounds had twice the normal amount of 0:15:23.000 --> 0:15:26.320 gunpowder in them as normal, and that either means that 0:15:26.360 --> 0:15:30.120 what Joe described is correct and or the person that 0:15:30.240 --> 0:15:34.840 did this was packing their own loads and therefore had 0:15:34.920 --> 0:15:37.800 taken and made their own bullets and packed it with 0:15:37.960 --> 0:15:40.600 twice the amount of gunpowder you would normally put in. 0:15:40.720 --> 0:15:43.040 I think that there was some confusion on that because 0:15:43.080 --> 0:15:45.040 they were saying and yeah, it's why it's it's all 0:15:45.040 --> 0:15:46.840 over the map and the way it's described. So I'm 0:15:46.880 --> 0:15:49.040 not a positive Yeah, I think there. I think that 0:15:49.160 --> 0:15:51.440 the reporters you wrote this and there was like they 0:15:51.480 --> 0:15:54.680 were said, they were there, they were double charged. And 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:57.680 so what I took that to me after careful consideration, 0:15:58.160 --> 0:16:00.480 is that each one of those improvised barrels had to 0:16:01.080 --> 0:16:03.640 bullets in it and also more powder. But I mean, 0:16:03.640 --> 0:16:05.880 you can't pull apart like a twenties caliber long rifle 0:16:05.960 --> 0:16:10.520 cartridge and packing twice as much gunpowder. Well, I and 0:16:10.760 --> 0:16:12.720 that's I don't I don't know how this happens. So 0:16:12.760 --> 0:16:16.440 that's why it's it's a weird bit of trivia to me. Yeah, 0:16:16.480 --> 0:16:18.920 it's not that violently impart, but that's what I think happens. 0:16:19.160 --> 0:16:22.160 He put like two bullets in each barrel, and that's 0:16:22.200 --> 0:16:24.040 what they called the double packed and they could have 0:16:24.040 --> 0:16:26.360 just been balls, you know, like like shotgun balls or 0:16:26.400 --> 0:16:29.560 something like that. So strangely in this story, though, what 0:16:29.720 --> 0:16:35.480 happens next is nothing. For eleven whole years, nothing else happens, 0:16:35.520 --> 0:16:38.840 nothing go boom, nothing, nobody gets a package that at 0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:45.120 least this way. Yes, yes it was Kazinsky was out there, 0:16:45.160 --> 0:16:48.400 but the point is no more zip gun bombs were 0:16:48.480 --> 0:16:56.000 found until that is the fifteenth of October when our 0:16:56.160 --> 0:17:00.400 perpetrators handywork shows up again. Uh. There's a gentleman by 0:17:00.400 --> 0:17:03.800 the name of Anthony lens Up. He is on vacation 0:17:03.880 --> 0:17:07.919 at the time with his wife there in Pennsylvania on 0:17:08.000 --> 0:17:10.679 the day that this all goes down from York. They 0:17:10.680 --> 0:17:13.679 were from New York, of course, yes. But what happens 0:17:13.800 --> 0:17:16.320 is on that day their children come to visit them 0:17:16.320 --> 0:17:20.639 in Pennsylvania and they bring the mail from the lenses 0:17:20.720 --> 0:17:23.360 home with them. Say hey, mom, dad, here's all your mail, 0:17:23.359 --> 0:17:27.159 the built up kind of thing. So Anthony, he's a 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:31.320 retired sanitation worker from New York City, but he gets 0:17:31.359 --> 0:17:35.399 the package. He opens it and inside of the box 0:17:35.480 --> 0:17:39.560 he sees what's described as a medallion box. And what 0:17:39.720 --> 0:17:43.000 I can figure out is this is essentially similar to 0:17:43.080 --> 0:17:45.800 a coin box that people will use to hold or 0:17:45.800 --> 0:17:50.359 display their coins. It's yeah, it's a velvet wrap the 0:17:50.400 --> 0:17:56.520 blue velvety wrapped box sticking out east side, not exactly, 0:17:57.760 --> 0:18:00.600 but what's similar to the box the Bok book that 0:18:00.760 --> 0:18:04.919 Joan got is that this box, it's wide and flat, 0:18:04.960 --> 0:18:07.400 but not that tall, you know, maybe an inches inch 0:18:07.520 --> 0:18:12.520 or so high. And so he opens the box and 0:18:12.840 --> 0:18:15.520 he is shot by one of the rounds that comes 0:18:15.560 --> 0:18:18.199 out of it, as well as two other family members, 0:18:18.200 --> 0:18:22.880 because it turns out this thing had three rounds in it, yeah, 0:18:22.960 --> 0:18:27.800 three barrels, and it they hit a person apiece. All 0:18:27.800 --> 0:18:30.000 of the family were and by the way, these went 0:18:30.040 --> 0:18:32.600 in all different directions, which we'll talk about in a second. 0:18:32.640 --> 0:18:35.160 But all of the people were hit, all of them 0:18:35.160 --> 0:18:38.840 were taken to the hospital. They all survived their wounds. 0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:42.760 They weren't massively life threatening. But as we talked about before, 0:18:42.840 --> 0:18:45.320 like Joe had said, is that the one it appears 0:18:45.440 --> 0:18:47.520 and I the reporting is unclear in this, but the 0:18:47.520 --> 0:18:50.639 one that hit Joan, I know it had one round. 0:18:50.880 --> 0:18:53.439 Joe seems to think that maybe it had too. I 0:18:53.560 --> 0:18:56.280 can't confirm that, but we know for sure that this 0:18:56.320 --> 0:19:00.960 one had three three rounds with three barrels, which means 0:19:00.960 --> 0:19:04.600 that whoever was putting this together was trying to hit 0:19:05.160 --> 0:19:11.960 somebody no matter what happens. Because remember, a bullet has 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:14.639 to come out of the side. This box, or this 0:19:14.800 --> 0:19:17.239 medallion box isn't that tall, so it's not as if 0:19:17.240 --> 0:19:19.720 you could stand up a twenty two cartridge round in 0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:22.440 it and have stuff behind it to light it off easily. 0:19:22.880 --> 0:19:24.920 So it had to go out the side. So when 0:19:25.000 --> 0:19:28.239 Joan got her book, you open a book with the 0:19:28.359 --> 0:19:32.720 spine to your left, so likely the first round shot 0:19:32.760 --> 0:19:35.240 out of the bottom of the book to hit her 0:19:35.760 --> 0:19:38.679 the directly south of the spine. To hit her in 0:19:38.720 --> 0:19:41.240 the abdomen, but it also shot out the top, you know, 0:19:41.359 --> 0:19:44.560 which could also Besides, if she opened it from the 0:19:45.119 --> 0:19:47.960 direction or you know, if the guy really hit the jackpot, 0:19:48.000 --> 0:19:49.720 she opens it and somebody else is standing right in 0:19:49.800 --> 0:19:51.840 front of her, then hey, jack pot, you killed two people, 0:19:51.880 --> 0:19:53.960 Which is what happens with the lensa case because it 0:19:54.080 --> 0:19:56.840 had three and I don't know which way he opened it, 0:19:56.840 --> 0:19:59.320 but he must have in some way opened it so 0:19:59.359 --> 0:20:03.200 that one round was at him and then there was people, 0:20:03.480 --> 0:20:04.840 you know, either in front of him or to the 0:20:04.880 --> 0:20:07.240 side of him. However, the case may be so that 0:20:07.320 --> 0:20:11.640 it shot in the opposite directions and hit those two people. Well, 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:14.760 so somebody is very intentionally figuring out the way this 0:20:14.800 --> 0:20:18.600 thing is opening to hit people, like they definitely want 0:20:18.640 --> 0:20:21.719 to take people out. Those cases are usually like books 0:20:21.720 --> 0:20:23.760 and that they have a spine. They have a hinge 0:20:23.960 --> 0:20:26.720 box side, and then there's the three other sides. So 0:20:27.080 --> 0:20:30.440 it's not like I don't think that, Yeah, I think 0:20:30.440 --> 0:20:32.479 the thing is is that they didn't set it up 0:20:32.520 --> 0:20:34.879 so that a round would go out the hinge side. 0:20:35.200 --> 0:20:37.879 That's intention is go out all the other sides because 0:20:37.920 --> 0:20:40.639 likely no matter which way somebody's opening. If it's flat 0:20:40.680 --> 0:20:43.840 to them, it's gonna get up. And that's that's the 0:20:43.960 --> 0:20:46.800 insidious bit of the way that this whole thing was. 0:20:46.880 --> 0:20:50.480 This trap was set to me, and and that that 0:20:50.640 --> 0:20:54.920 whole The use of the filament, the use of multiple rounds, 0:20:55.000 --> 0:20:58.760 the use of pointing of multiple barrels, those are things 0:20:58.840 --> 0:21:03.160 that would become signatures of the zip gun bomber. Another 0:21:03.200 --> 0:21:06.720 thing would be the return address, because the return address 0:21:06.800 --> 0:21:12.720 on the packages would appear to be from major organizations, 0:21:12.760 --> 0:21:15.360 like one of them was from the March of Dimes. 0:21:15.920 --> 0:21:18.840 And there would also be something to indicate something to 0:21:19.040 --> 0:21:22.880 entice the person to open it, like free offer inside 0:21:23.000 --> 0:21:25.919 or free gift or something something in that kind of 0:21:26.000 --> 0:21:30.439 verbiage inside. Yeah, it kind of was a big surprise, 0:21:30.480 --> 0:21:34.080 but something to draw them in. And the second gun 0:21:34.200 --> 0:21:37.960 was it also made of similar stuff. Break line is 0:21:38.000 --> 0:21:40.000 from what I can understand, it was also made from 0:21:40.040 --> 0:21:45.320 brake lines, ballpoint pen, a spring lodged in to make 0:21:45.359 --> 0:21:48.600 the circuits, some batteries in there. Yes, like these things 0:21:48.680 --> 0:21:52.280 all appear to generally be the same, and there are 0:21:52.359 --> 0:21:55.199 some questions that I have, but will address that later on. 0:21:55.280 --> 0:21:58.240 In terms of specifics, the part that makes me curious 0:21:58.280 --> 0:21:59.840 about the whole thing that makes me want to build 0:21:59.840 --> 0:22:01.840 one of these things is I don't know. I I 0:22:01.880 --> 0:22:04.200 totally see how how to build one of these things 0:22:04.200 --> 0:22:07.280